I think all we’re really looking for is simply just consistent, predictable spawns so the game flows well. I hope they works towards that goal, but either way the War mode should definitely have some decent spawns
Nevermind the spawns. They're always never going to satisfy. The real issue with this game is the Slow TTK. What's the point of slowing it when snipers and shotguns are still going to Insta kill you
MWII had near perfect select spawns (when you werent spawning on a teammate) and no constant flipping like previous titles. If they could just play around with the spawn system in old cods and figure it out/copy it down to new cods itd be nice. Weve been probably asking for it for 5-10 yrs now since BO3.
This and sbmm are the only two factors keeping me from putting my money on it. They seem like simple issues to fix but I believe there's a larger mass market incentive at play here. I mean the matchmaking system has been publicly described as a system used for optimizing play time and mtx purchases. As long as that's the primary directive coming from the top I'm afraid the devs can only change so much about these systems without getting major push back. It's just the sad reality of modern AAA publisher tactics 😮💨
@@zenkoz3158💯, well said. Btw in Aces first example whereby the opponent position flips the spawn location, im not sure whether Ace factored in, whether that opponent represents an SBMM rating of 3 players (3kd rating - assumption), despite only being one person 😂. My biggest beef with sbmm is that if i do well, the AI decides to put me in a ping lobby of 150ms, despite having an entire region of 15million people, with 80ms ping being the closest server, the developers are hell bent on maximizing their profits while screwing my experience. I like Nerocinemas latest insight, where he just backs out 😂, which ive been doing, but the amount of time wasting involved is shocking! How is it that there 80ms ping lobbies, and they put me in American lobbies with 150 -250ms ping just so the algorithm pays out.
@@scotchbarrel4429 true, and yeah I saw him saying he just backs out but honestly I've just started to be able to feel when a match isn't in my control and I just stop competing and just pad out the time doing dumb shit or trying weird gun builds. I get my little bit of xp, idc about my W/L, and hopefully it has the added effect of slight reverse boosting lol. But like I said, if they can't find a way to satisfy corporate and get these problems fixed to a reasonable degree I'm just out. I love cod but I'm not too committed to be subservient to the cycle. Got plenty of other good games to play that respect my time 🤷
I’m nearly positive that a random and chaotic spawn system is the intent these past 4-5yrs. They want players to not be able to read the spawns so that good players can’t use it to their advantage. They want the less skilled players to be able to get some easy kills….and what’s the best way to do that? Allow them to spawn behind people.
This is the perfect explanation of the issues I’ve been having. I love highrise but the amount of times I’ve spawned in the tunnel area under the main map is absurd. That should be very rare, each team should have a strong tie to one of the buildings and only spawn outside if enemies are aggressively pushing deep into the building
This has been going on for too long like ever since BO3 I swear. Although MWII didnt have this. I kind of liked MWIIs spawn system as it reminded me of old MW2s.
that is THE WORST istg, I ran down through the whole lane of a map then the other side of it and not seen a single soul, just to then have someone spawn in a shack next to me or smtn (especially on Highrise, spawns are SO sensitive there)
The spawn system can kill any enjoyment at times. Certain maps in certain gamemodes have no flow to them and just end up being a chickens with their heads cut off simulation, where people are running all over the map with no logic
@@SlurpifiedBlack Ops 3 had perfect spawns except for the Metro map. Even in Metro you could tell “our side vs their side” quite well. I used to love playing Hardcore mode in Black Ops 3 knowing exactly where the enemy team is without any map
Short version of the video: CoD devs need to stop fearing the spawn trap. A light spawn trap (particularly in mods like Dom) is actually healthy for the game and makes things actually flow the way they should. Obviously if people are literally spawning right in front of crosshairs that's not healthy. But people should have to fight to get out of a general 1/3 of a map instead of being gifted the enemy's territory. If that means players occasionally have to put away SMGs/Snipers because they're stuck in their 1/3 of the map and it doesn't play well for SMGs/Snipers, so be it. The old school maps are hammering this point home. Old maps and new spawn logic don't mix. Devs picked to go all in on old maps, they gotta go in on old spawns as well otherwise they have a mess on their hands.
Exactly. MWII did it right with this other than shipment. MWII had near perfect select spawns (when you werent spawning on a teammate) and no constant flipping like previous titles. It reminded me of old MW2s system. If they could just copy down the old spawn systems people have been asking for for about 5-10 years thatd be nice.
I’m one of few who has never played Mw games and only Treyarc Cods, I can’t be the only one who played this beta and though the maps were honestly bad like the design not the spawns, it feels like the 2019 launch maps brah
Spawns are either intentionally designed to be unpredictable to nerf good players, or the people coding spawns are actually just incompetent and should be fired on the spot Now that I think about it, its probably both
I couldn’t even imagine how complicated it would be to code that for every map lol I’m working on my bachelors in computer science and I’m stressing making simple programs 😂🤣
@@Austin-l1jas someone else said, the original maps weren’t designed with this new tweaker movement. We move way too fast and that can complicate spawns. Honestly they should dial back the movement speed. It’s just so fucking ridiculous currently and doesn’t work with these old maps.
I played for 4 hours before i had to get ready for work and i lost count of how many times ive had enemy players spawn literally right behind me while i was on a flank The spawns flipping the way they do causes the match to turn into running around in circles with no purpose at all
I swear it's one of infinity wards (2019 and onward) original "great" ideas to make every match a close game. Think about it. It adds up in the scores making them all "close games" just due to spawning. Makes no sense and takes away any skill to just random tit for tat. Excuse me while I toss my cookies just thinking about that stupid "logic".
@@CrrzyFoxYeah man agreed. The spawns and constant spawn flipping since even BO3 have been horrendous. Although MWII had good select spawn points (when you werent squad spawning). I kinda enjoyed MWII spawns they reminded me of old MW2s. The maps just flowed well other than Shipment and Al Bagra. If they could just simply copy down/play around and figure out the original spawn systems like people have been asking for about 5-10 years itd be a blessing.
@@Slurpified the more I think about it. The more I'm thinking they have a generalized space system that tied into the bigger matches like ground war. There. You don't see as much of the randomness. There's a little bit more logic to it. But take that system and put it in your standard 6v6 map. It turns into a mess. This is the only thing that makes sense. Although I lean towards that dumber end of thought from the devs which is to make it easy for non skilled players that don't know how to run the map with predictable spawns. Why they wouldn't make two separate spawn systems at this point is beyond me. I prefer the older end zone type gameplay loop. Today in the beta I did not have fun. It is a mess and I was like yep. Doesn't play the same at all. Add sbmm into it. I mean holy fuck man. I was raging. I am not the best player and my aim sucks due to chronic shoulder pain from an injury in my life. I had dropped the gamepad play a long time ago so stubbornly stick to kbm. So here I am. Fighting these dudes with laser precision and im just like fuck my whole arm aches it's so hard to beat these guys. I got beat down and beat down some more. Match after match. It didn't leave me with good impressions. I get not everyone has chronic pain but the sbmm system doesn't know this and sbmm is ruthless to me. Hope you are having a better time. Peace and love. -Fox
This video actually made me realize how much the older spawn systems meant. Back in Infinite Warfare, when I started playing CoD a lot, I was a total noob, but I really appreciated the clarity of the spawns. I was horrible at the game, but I loved the feeling of pushing into the middle and getting a couple of kills. The way it is rn, there is no pushing, no safe area, and hardly any significance of capturing B flag in Dom etc.
now that you say that, I can imagine how that really helps a newer player gauge the risk according to his Skill, you know where they spawn roughly so you also know that route might have multiple enemies which you aren't good enough to take on, so you take a different one. I also imagine that this system makes people camp more as it is so uncertain where someone will spawn and they get scared, especially new players.
Great video Ace. It’s needed too, because spawns are very bad. I can’t understand why it’s so hard to get this right on 3 lane maps, especially after 20 years of COD.
I think whats happening here is another example of catering to new / bad players. I remember when I first started playing cod, the worst experience was being spawn trapped. I think what they’re doing is making it impossible for a better team to spawn trap a worse team cause the spawns are so twitchy and will move at the slightest pressure
I have really been trying to get excited for this game, but I have zero interest at this point when they are still trying to get the spawns working correctly weeks before release...an issue they had solved in previous games. God forbid they have weapon balancing issues to deal with. I'll be waiting this year's release out I think -- hopefully next year's release looks a bit more promising.
It is mainly sad that it's with OG maps, so it's not like there's no Data (yeah, player style has changed drastically, I think it'd be best to see it like cooking, the new system is the seasoning and the old is the steak, now we got a steak that is totally overseasoned, we just need more Steak and a little less seasoning to probably have a good middle ground between the old system but adjusted to the new style of players)
The biggest issue I've noticed by far with the spawns, It's not just that you spawn on the "enemies side" but that they have vague control over that and cycle through freely. Where I need a second to grasp where I am and where enemies are. Even with the mind set of "put them in a spot that's the most safe regardless" is actually putting them on a disadvantage. The amount of times I've seen someone just turn a corner and get melted because they are trying to get to the action because they spawned with 3 people around them is just ludicrous. I know it's beta and there will be tweeks, but come on.
@@Dragoonsoul7878 ...just because our vertical slice doesn't have everything in it doesn't mean the actual build it was derived from isn't feature complete. A demo can be a beta. Those aren't exclusive titles.
I’m so glad you made this video. My biggest complaint. This is the reason why I enjoyed Cold War domination so much more. The spawns just make sense. FYI I’ve been playing COD since cod4, and these spawns in the last 5 games ( mostly ) have been absurd. Next biggest issue l, teammates footsteps.
Lots of times playing this beta I've died to someone I had 0 clue was coming, only to watch the killcam and realise "oh, they just spawned there 10 feet behind me". Very frustrating.
@@robertlovesgothgirlz sure feels like that. I was playing a match earlier, Highrise Domination, and someone in voice chat was like "oh boy, I'm going to drop like 60 kills" - the highest kill count in the match after a full game of Dom was like 28 😭
our support for you cannot be overstated dude, the effort you put in to figuring this stuff out is invaluable, i just hope the right people see this video and implement changes.
This perfectly summarizes why the remade og maps in the new games feel so different when compared to the games they originated from. Also, why did they change how the spawns work? It didn't feel like anything was wrong with the older games spawn system.
I do understand a little change as players have evolved drastically, people are way faster, more confident and know where to go, so I'd get a little change for dynamic but this is over-the-top.
Great job explaining this. Put it into words well to show the problem. It’s clear there’s a spawn issue but this did a great job outlining it. Here’s hoping they fix it
Players want consistency. Consistency in time to kill, movement, equipment behaviour etc. Spawns are a big part of this in CoD. If players can't expect where they will spawn and where enemies come from they can't play accordingly and at that point it doesn't matter how they play. It just becomes mindless running and shooting.
Man great point X I hope they're listening to you and fix this issue because people are complaining about this that spawns get very chaotic randomly out of the blue out of nowhere...
Great video! I thought I was losing my mind, but this is such a huge issue. They’re the worst spawns I think I’ve experienced in any call of duty game. Hopefully they get on top of it asap!
As someone who plays rushing all the time, they killed my playstyle. I was finding it strange that I hadn't seen anyone talking about how easy it is to change spawns.
Thanks for taking the time for deep analysis like this. I 100% agree with you on the spawns, and so far I haven't felt any differences in the spawns from weekend 1 to weekend 2. But overall weekend 2 does feel better with some of the other changes they've already made. I commented on your video last week concerning inconsistent hit detection/ttk/ttd, and this weekend, at least for now, that did not seem to be an issue for me, and the higher TTK didn't bother me nearly as much. Maybe I'm just adjusting to it lol. It does seem like they are making good changes so far, and I can say that my experience thus far with weekend 2 has been much better than weekend 1, to the point where I'm having much more fun and I actually want to play it more.
I thought I was losing my mind with this same thing! I was on high rise on the elevator side shooting long range and my bullets weren't hitting the enemy players AT ALL 🤦🏾♂️
Second weekend in they are still feeling chaotic af. Couldn't put my finger on it but man are your clips of map watching insightful. Bloody mad spawns going on, things like Dom flags not tying to spawn points. This is such a major is issue to fix, they could make the perfect game but with a bad spawn system its for nought. Ruins map flow, control, game feel. At least squad spawning is out
Xclusive Ace you're the best COD content creator nowadays because of this sort of content. Spawns are the main reason aside from SBMM thats stopping this game from being great. With these random spawns, it creates zero consistency or map flow. The spawns in Cold War, BO4, BO3 are perfect and it makes the gameplay feel better and maps flow better.
Seems like the spawns are made for you to be killed, ive also noticed that when I am killed or when I get a kill I run into the same exact player that I killed or killed me. Its as if the game wants you to get a revenge kill and keep that cycle going. I would love if you tested this
You’re pin point on this as always Ace. Spawns in this game are the #1 issue by miles. If i have A and B, the enemy should only spawn at C until they get map control and get B. Don’t even get me started on these Revenge kills. Sure it’s funny when i get killed then immediately spawn right behind the guy, but this should not be happening. It’s happened like 50 times now i can’t even count it. Other than spawns im absolutely loving this game.
Two observations. 1.) Seems the spawn logic is kind of going in quadrants - If enemy makes one step into NW, spawn flips to SE. 2.) Perhaps they're flipping spawns so much on domination to encourage constant captures and not just "hold two and lock it down".
with the second weekend only map that feels good is highrise, mainly spawn in the base buildings and some spawns out towards mid near the heli or in the underground part if you get spawned out but not flipped. The other maps dont feel much has changed, there is still a spawn mid-map in skidrow bottom floor inbetween the big door and the side door that you can repeatedly spawn in. Other than that the spawns feel mostly the same as the first weekend
I imagine it will get even worse once more people start using suppressors and ghost. At least now you can see roughly where the enemies are (but given how the spawns currently work, seeing enemies on the map doesn't mean the rest of the team will be anywhere near lol)
yeah the randomness make it a bit odd at times, like in situations as the first Estate example he showed, if I saw two dots show up by the enemy flag after most enemies just died I'd expect to see most people come from that general area, but then they spawn top hill and underneath mansion on the right side, near our spawn.
Man I hope everyone keeps speaking up about this and it's gets fixed quickly. I don't understand why the spawns are this bad, anyone who has played any FPS game will notice it immediately. Is there some kind of rationale for why they are like this? Thanks for all the great work, Ace. You're doin the lords work, man!
This is an excellent analysis and unfortunately the same problems exist currently in weekend 2 of the beta. I think the spawns on Highrise combine the flaws you spotted on Favela and Estate. Firstly, like Favela there is a complete lack of linearity whereas the map is so clearly designed to be a linear end-to-end friendly base vs enemy base map. Secondly, like Estate there seems to be an issue with verticality and the game seems to love spawning players in the middle low section of the map. I found that especially with domination if I was capturing the B flag then someone would always spawn down there and immediately push me no matter where my teammates were or which flags our team currently held. It says a lot that I’m still having fun despite this terrible spawn design and so I think this game can truly be a throwback to the heights of OG mw2 if they return to a much simpler, readable spawn design. As you say, this is literally what the maps were designed to cater for
Estate is hands down the worst map because i feel the spawns make ZERO sense. Its a wide open map and it feels like people just go wherever and i cannot keep track of map flow at all. Rust is def the best map right now because the spawn system works on that map 100% Favela is pretty bad because of the height advantage 100% I feel like this game is going to be held back by spawn system just like VG and MW2 was. Treyarch is the only dev that gets spawns right.
In general, I’ve been seeing a lot of good will towards mwIII, but I wanted to know if anyone else besides myself thinks the game feels… terrible on ps5? I hate to sound hyperbolic but shooting, resolution, and maybe even frame pacing seems weird to me.
Dont have a ps5, I'm on pc. But there definitely is somthething that feels a little off and even running it at 1440x2560 at 165 fps the game just seems a little foggy. I have good frame times but it seems like there's frame skipping regardless of my frame times
@@mrlogic1017 might be a driver issue then since it is in beta. But I wouldn't be surprised if it sticks around. Might even get more broken consodering it's an activison game
I mentioned 2 videos ago the whole thing feels foggy and washed out. The colors aren't very vibrant and contrast isn't good, further exacerbating the inability to discern friend from foe. Can't wait until paid skins make that disparity even larger.
They don’t want little jimmy and Timmy getting spawn trapped, but at the same time, like you said casuals won’t have a feel for where anyone is on their team or the enemy’s. So usually just leads to camping scared to move anywhere
I was playing Highrise today, and at one point of the match, I caught myself wandering why it felt I could not read the spawns most of the time, when clearly the enemy team should be coming from certain spots. Lets see how they handle spawn fixes this year Still, I’m really enjoying the beta
I knew there weren’t in a good place, but after watching this video, hopping on weekend 2 and concentrating more on the spawns…It’s so bad. It’s ruining the entire flow of every match. A real shame.
@@arcticowl1091 Well, in the original MW2 we had ground war be 9v9 on the regular MP maps. These maps are all medium to large, so nowadays "tactical" players will make them feel empty on 6v6...
People are so delusional to think Sledgehammer is going to keep their communication like they're doing now after the game releases. People forget how every single year the devs look like they're 24/7 wanting to help but then disappear, but the COD community can comprehend they are laughing at your face.
I wasn't able to play too much dom last weekend and was hoping for normal spawns in that mode, you broke my hearth saying the spawns are still like MWII, I had to stop playing domination because of that this year.
Well old English used to be book - beek moose meese , they put plural -en exists in several words, including brethren (plural of brother), children, and even men and women and also responsible for goose/geese and tooth/teeth but when they changed to s , es system for some reason they still remains some.
That's an excellent video and a big concern on this franchise that sadly not many people understand how important it is and how it affects the game as much as SBMM can. I would be really curious to have the same analysis on the current spawn system in COD Vanguard to understand how Sledgehammer are working on this subject and which hopes wan we have. Good job Ace ! thanks a lot
Unfortunately, I think the random spawn approach is by design. Cod is evolving towards a game that REDUCES the skill gap. Traditional spawn logic (OG MW2) can be leveraged into an advantage for advanced players who can accurately read, anticipate and take advantage of spawns. Randomizing spawns takes away this ability. Introduces more randomness, reduces the skill gap, rewards camping, moves everyone towards a 1 KD. Gameplay decisions like these are why I haven't consistently played COD for years.
I have been running and clipped into an enemy that was spawning. They literally spawned right in front of me and I was wondering why I was being blocked and then they Striker'd me, I HATE THE SPAWNS SO MUCH
I feel like spawns are like this in MWII but they weren't like that for several months. My favorite game mode used to be hardpoint because you would spawn close to the action, but this last 2 months, the game can send you to the other side of the map when your team is in the point just because a couple of enemies got there. In any other game mode I have the problem that you spawn completely alone in a part of the map without teammates, and then an enemy comes out of nowhere and takes you out. Equally, on that hatchery map is very common to spawn under the roof of that building where snipers usually camp, when there are enemies above.
The revenge spawn thing is terrible. Idk how many times i have killed people in Hardpoint while i or multiple friendlies have our anchor set, only for that enemy to spawn solo 15ft behind our flank. In older games there was clear spawn play/flow for obj modes but in in this game it's just a chaotic mess. That or just spawning mid map right in the line of fire like the game is confused and just decides to play you where ever. I have been getting revenge spawns too, i die to a player then spawn right behind them in illogical locations, it's super cheesy on both sides and feels like the game is trying very hard to hand out revenge kills
Another issue I noticed just from this video, why is there even a spawn in the main estate building??? The spawn should be in the field near it not inside the main building...
Also visibility is a huge issue, I've shot at and been shot at by teammates way too often! It's often very hard to distinguish between enemies and friendly players.
Ok.. what i could play ( got a code, wont buy it until i hear its in good shape ) was good.. didnt get far, level 8, so few guns even have even a single attachment.. gameplay was good.. but.. hit registration was abysmal.. the game crashed, like out to Xbox home screen, 50% of the time, and just back to MW2 home screen, 35% of the time. so yea, 4 out of 5 games, the game froze, then crashed.. i quit Ground war, as EVERY game was crashing a stuttering mess, serious latency AND Packet loss.. like, Vanguard all over again. i CANT be the only person having it crash over and over and over and over. everyone was talking about hit registration being almost non existent. i could see it on both sides, someone had ME dead to rights, i get hit once, turn, while they are STILL SHOOTING ME, and kill them.. High rise.. that sunshine from whatever direction, makes players almost iMPOSSIBLE TO SEE.. change that sun to a 2pm vertical not a near sunset horizontal. players in MP seemed to overall, really be try-hards.. lots of close matches, wins/losses by 1-5 pts total, whether it was 74-75, or 200-197.. not sure if it will stay that sweaty.. guns, mostly feel pretty good. i am going to enjoy one gun thats off everyones radar, and hope it stays that way, cuz its seriously good.
Well you obviously haste been working on this for a while, because spawns were not mentioned as being changed in the what changed notes. Very good feedback.
I get spawn killed more in this game than i did back in the ps3 days. The difference is back then if you were getting spawn trapped it was because your team lost complete control of the map which is a fair punishment, and even though it became "shooting fish in a barrel" at that point it was completely predictable. In this game i or enemy players flat out spawn in bullshit spots. But it's so random and unpredictable that it just feels unfair. I'd rather get stomped and trapped like back in the day than deal with frustrating spawn logic
I REALLY hope SHGames does not ruin the game post-launch with ridiculous content like the leaked news of the EM1 laser returning in an AW season. I also hope SHGames can continue this great support all year and hopefully adds a feature to JUST play the classic MW2 maps to keep them alive and give us at least some kind of MW2 remaster available all the time.
Honestly, I haven’t noticed any changes in weekend 2 (not that I expected any), but Highrise has, by far the WORST spawns out of any map and the game mode doesn’t matter.
Spawns are random because it nerfs good players in 3 ways 1. Random deaths and cheap free kills for shitters 2. Can’t spawn trap 3. When a rusher pushes through and it flips they waste time not killing shitters and have to run around the map to get back. Do this a bunch and you add a ton of down time to players who normally have very high efficiency
I get you’re a more objective channel but I think you’re not nearly angry enough for how outrageously bad these spawns are on maps that have existed for 15+ years already. Between that and the TTK I’m canceling my order
The spawn issues that are prevalent in every release are so easy to demonstrate because we've played these MW2 maps before. Used to be able to show me a minimap and I could tell you the spawn. Ain't happening that way now.
I disagree. While I enjoyed playing back in the day with anchored spawns, front lines and sneaky flankings, there is one thing that we don't have now that was a problem back then. Campers.
Why are u guys crying because u can’t just sit on a head glitch and spawn trap? What fun is that? I’m glad they changed it. I’m a rusher. Get ur skill up. 1 v 1 me bro
I feel like surely with degree of SBMM that modern Cod games have we can therefore get pretty sticky spawns. The issue in old CODs with sticky spawns was always that if the teams were unbalanced you’d have one side having an incredible time and one team having a dreadful one. If you had two matched teams you in fact ended up with a brilliant fight for map control that was often the most intense and fun aspect of a competitive match. But yeah I’m not sure anyone would be happy if we returned to COD4 downpour levels of spawn fixing..
Bro, when people were saying the spawns were bad during the ps beta i thought "eh how bad can it be compared to mw2" and then i tried the pc beta and dear god is it horrendous. I literally had an enemy spawn inside of my own player character. Not only that but you can kill a dude and then have that same dude spawn directly behind you. Its insane and needs fixing asap.
Watching while playing and I was sniping from one corner of Estate and 4 enemies spawned behind me 2 of which I just killed them I died and respawned behind one of their teammates on the other side of the map I couldn't help but laugh out loud
I played last Night for the first time. And got to say worst spawn system I can remember. I hope they can do a hotfix and give us time in game with better spawns so we can give better feed back to tweak the small issues vs trash the whole system.... also always thankful for your video doing this in depth testing
An issue i notcied was when i spectated some1. The Vault edition operator skins return to regular form off death. I wish they stayed the same instead being like DM from Bo4
So this is why every 30 seconds in dom the enemy caps C then A then C then A, seriously wtf is wrong with devs there so annoying changing shit all the time that don’t need changin
in mw2 2022 spawn in domination mode are actually decent and i have no problems predicting where the enemies coming from, if they make the spawns like mw2 it is going to be fine
Dude just hire this guy to be an analyst for infinity ward. Actually knows what's up. Actually played mw2 back in the day and blop3 which are considered goated.
The spawns were the straw that broke the camel’s back for Vanguard for me. I just couldn’t enjoy the game and quit. Allegedly they got better, but I lost patience. Not getting my money this time, but I will watch your videos to see how they do.
Much needed video
Yo jev
Brog located
what up mr jeverson
Fist me d
🐐
I think all we’re really looking for is simply just consistent, predictable spawns so the game flows well. I hope they works towards that goal, but either way the War mode should definitely have some decent spawns
Absolutely. Highrise has horrible spawns.
Nevermind the spawns. They're always never going to satisfy. The real issue with this game is the Slow TTK. What's the point of slowing it when snipers and shotguns are still going to Insta kill you
MWII had near perfect select spawns (when you werent spawning on a teammate) and no constant flipping like previous titles. If they could just play around with the spawn system in old cods and figure it out/copy it down to new cods itd be nice. Weve been probably asking for it for 5-10 yrs now since BO3.
I agree dude atleast war mode is safe from these issues
Why don’t you play with Matt, Tina and Omar please respond. Just give us a simple answer.
This is a much bigger issue than most people realize
The main question is do the devs even realise how important this is?
@@bushmonster1702considering the fact that they got rid of squad spawns, they hopefully do
This and sbmm are the only two factors keeping me from putting my money on it. They seem like simple issues to fix but I believe there's a larger mass market incentive at play here. I mean the matchmaking system has been publicly described as a system used for optimizing play time and mtx purchases. As long as that's the primary directive coming from the top I'm afraid the devs can only change so much about these systems without getting major push back. It's just the sad reality of modern AAA publisher tactics 😮💨
@@zenkoz3158💯, well said. Btw in Aces first example whereby the opponent position flips the spawn location, im not sure whether Ace factored in, whether that opponent represents an SBMM rating of 3 players (3kd rating - assumption), despite only being one person 😂.
My biggest beef with sbmm is that if i do well, the AI decides to put me in a ping lobby of 150ms, despite having an entire region of 15million people, with 80ms ping being the closest server, the developers are hell bent on maximizing their profits while screwing my experience. I like Nerocinemas latest insight, where he just backs out 😂, which ive been doing, but the amount of time wasting involved is shocking! How is it that there 80ms ping lobbies, and they put me in American lobbies with 150 -250ms ping just so the algorithm pays out.
@@scotchbarrel4429 true, and yeah I saw him saying he just backs out but honestly I've just started to be able to feel when a match isn't in my control and I just stop competing and just pad out the time doing dumb shit or trying weird gun builds. I get my little bit of xp, idc about my W/L, and hopefully it has the added effect of slight reverse boosting lol. But like I said, if they can't find a way to satisfy corporate and get these problems fixed to a reasonable degree I'm just out. I love cod but I'm not too committed to be subservient to the cycle. Got plenty of other good games to play that respect my time 🤷
I’m nearly positive that a random and chaotic spawn system is the intent these past 4-5yrs. They want players to not be able to read the spawns so that good players can’t use it to their advantage. They want the less skilled players to be able to get some easy kills….and what’s the best way to do that? Allow them to spawn behind people.
Preach bro, you hit it right on.
Interesting theory 🧐
Trying to keep everyone at a 1.0 kd
Have been wondering same-how can we cripple the good players
That doesn't make sense. Bad players will just be thrown off more by chaotic spawns while good players will adjust better
This is the perfect explanation of the issues I’ve been having. I love highrise but the amount of times I’ve spawned in the tunnel area under the main map is absurd. That should be very rare, each team should have a strong tie to one of the buildings and only spawn outside if enemies are aggressively pushing deep into the building
Agree, my first game was on high rise and i was so disappointed - NO flow in the game what so ever
I spawned in that tunnel like six times in a row at one point and I was about to lose my fucking mind
Just played a couple games this morning and that exact thing happened every other spawn, like clockwork.
Yeah spawns on highrise almost make it unplayable. Might as well just take all gunfights down below cuz that’s where the two heavy spawns are
And what's driving me nuts is that everyone kept voting for High Rise 🤬🤦♂
Is this why sometimes you can lap around the entire map and not find anyone only to get shot in the back by complete surprise?
This has been going on for too long like ever since BO3 I swear. Although MWII didnt have this. I kind of liked MWIIs spawn system as it reminded me of old MW2s.
that is THE WORST istg, I ran down through the whole lane of a map then the other side of it and not seen a single soul, just to then have someone spawn in a shack next to me or smtn (especially on Highrise, spawns are SO sensitive there)
Kinda like they don't want you to run away but incentivize camping.
The spawn system can kill any enjoyment at times. Certain maps in certain gamemodes have no flow to them and just end up being a chickens with their heads cut off simulation, where people are running all over the map with no logic
@@SlurpifiedBlack Ops 3 had perfect spawns except for the Metro map. Even in Metro you could tell “our side vs their side” quite well. I used to love playing Hardcore mode in Black Ops 3 knowing exactly where the enemy team is without any map
Short version of the video: CoD devs need to stop fearing the spawn trap. A light spawn trap (particularly in mods like Dom) is actually healthy for the game and makes things actually flow the way they should. Obviously if people are literally spawning right in front of crosshairs that's not healthy. But people should have to fight to get out of a general 1/3 of a map instead of being gifted the enemy's territory. If that means players occasionally have to put away SMGs/Snipers because they're stuck in their 1/3 of the map and it doesn't play well for SMGs/Snipers, so be it.
The old school maps are hammering this point home. Old maps and new spawn logic don't mix. Devs picked to go all in on old maps, they gotta go in on old spawns as well otherwise they have a mess on their hands.
I agree with this ! Fight your way back to regain map control or continue to get trapped . At least the spawns are far more predictable
Exactly. MWII did it right with this other than shipment. MWII had near perfect select spawns (when you werent spawning on a teammate) and no constant flipping like previous titles. It reminded me of old MW2s system. If they could just copy down the old spawn systems people have been asking for for about 5-10 years thatd be nice.
Any form of spawntrapping is bad, I have spoken.
I’m one of few who has never played Mw games and only Treyarc Cods, I can’t be the only one who played this beta and though the maps were honestly bad like the design not the spawns, it feels like the 2019 launch maps brah
@@Zero05550They do kind of feel a little spaced out like its a bit more hard to get that extra push around corners to survive dying
One thing I notice that’s so weird to me is that the spawns are almost like, sideways?
Edit: yep, you wound up mentioning this in the favela part.
Spawns are either intentionally designed to be unpredictable to nerf good players,
or
the people coding spawns are actually just incompetent and should be fired on the spot
Now that I think about it, its probably both
I couldn’t even imagine how complicated it would be to code that for every map lol I’m working on my bachelors in computer science and I’m stressing making simple programs 😂🤣
@@Austin-l1ji mean if they are gonna use the old maps why not just use the old spawn logic though? better spawns for us and less work for them.
@@TheErikjsm no idea bro I agree with you, it would make it easier to just reuse stuff probably but I’m not game dev
@@Austin-l1jas someone else said, the original maps weren’t designed with this new tweaker movement. We move way too fast and that can complicate spawns. Honestly they should dial back the movement speed. It’s just so fucking ridiculous currently and doesn’t work with these old maps.
They are so lucky to have someone like you who gives pro feedback
And completely ignore it
@@shtaufaker5211and that’s what makes it sad
And completely ignore it but decide to hear "Pro players"
If only someone took the feedback and did something with it
@@dybixs1400clueless because they notoriously don’t listen to the pros
The biggest thing that makes the maps feel bad
You should compare spawns with the MW3 maps with their original versions in MW2(009)
Thatd be cool ngl
He basically did this vid
Ace, tell the devs to find me true love.
Knowing the devs they'll probably give you a hoe for the streets as the love of your life 😅
They’ll fix that in the next update.
@@nukenin5457they will find him the tool, and make em a farmer
Sorry, dawg, they can't do that. But they can sell you a bundle of 🌽
They sell it to you in a bundle
I played for 4 hours before i had to get ready for work and i lost count of how many times ive had enemy players spawn literally right behind me while i was on a flank
The spawns flipping the way they do causes the match to turn into running around in circles with no purpose at all
100 %
I thought that was just me. They had me running circles on favela tryna understand these spawns 😂
I swear it's one of infinity wards (2019 and onward) original "great" ideas to make every match a close game. Think about it. It adds up in the scores making them all "close games" just due to spawning. Makes no sense and takes away any skill to just random tit for tat. Excuse me while I toss my cookies just thinking about that stupid "logic".
@@CrrzyFoxYeah man agreed. The spawns and constant spawn flipping since even BO3 have been horrendous. Although MWII had good select spawn points (when you werent squad spawning). I kinda enjoyed MWII spawns they reminded me of old MW2s. The maps just flowed well other than Shipment and Al Bagra. If they could just simply copy down/play around and figure out the original spawn systems like people have been asking for about 5-10 years itd be a blessing.
@@Slurpified the more I think about it. The more I'm thinking they have a generalized space system that tied into the bigger matches like ground war. There. You don't see as much of the randomness. There's a little bit more logic to it. But take that system and put it in your standard 6v6 map. It turns into a mess. This is the only thing that makes sense. Although I lean towards that dumber end of thought from the devs which is to make it easy for non skilled players that don't know how to run the map with predictable spawns. Why they wouldn't make two separate spawn systems at this point is beyond me. I prefer the older end zone type gameplay loop. Today in the beta I did not have fun. It is a mess and I was like yep. Doesn't play the same at all.
Add sbmm into it. I mean holy fuck man. I was raging. I am not the best player and my aim sucks due to chronic shoulder pain from an injury in my life. I had dropped the gamepad play a long time ago so stubbornly stick to kbm. So here I am. Fighting these dudes with laser precision and im just like fuck my whole arm aches it's so hard to beat these guys. I got beat down and beat down some more. Match after match. It didn't leave me with good impressions. I get not everyone has chronic pain but the sbmm system doesn't know this and sbmm is ruthless to me. Hope you are having a better time. Peace and love. -Fox
This video actually made me realize how much the older spawn systems meant. Back in Infinite Warfare, when I started playing CoD a lot, I was a total noob, but I really appreciated the clarity of the spawns. I was horrible at the game, but I loved the feeling of pushing into the middle and getting a couple of kills. The way it is rn, there is no pushing, no safe area, and hardly any significance of capturing B flag in Dom etc.
now that you say that, I can imagine how that really helps a newer player gauge the risk according to his Skill, you know where they spawn roughly so you also know that route might have multiple enemies which you aren't good enough to take on, so you take a different one.
I also imagine that this system makes people camp more as it is so uncertain where someone will spawn and they get scared, especially new players.
Great video Ace. It’s needed too, because spawns are very bad. I can’t understand why it’s so hard to get this right on 3 lane maps, especially after 20 years of COD.
It’s by design so Litle Timmy’s can get some kills just like sbmm. They go hand in hand
I think whats happening here is another example of catering to new / bad players. I remember when I first started playing cod, the worst experience was being spawn trapped. I think what they’re doing is making it impossible for a better team to spawn trap a worse team cause the spawns are so twitchy and will move at the slightest pressure
I think you are spot on with this. These spawns are designed to reduce spawn traps at all costs.
I have really been trying to get excited for this game, but I have zero interest at this point when they are still trying to get the spawns working correctly weeks before release...an issue they had solved in previous games. God forbid they have weapon balancing issues to deal with. I'll be waiting this year's release out I think -- hopefully next year's release looks a bit more promising.
It is mainly sad that it's with OG maps, so it's not like there's no Data (yeah, player style has changed drastically, I think it'd be best to see it like cooking, the new system is the seasoning and the old is the steak, now we got a steak that is totally overseasoned, we just need more Steak and a little less seasoning to probably have a good middle ground between the old system but adjusted to the new style of players)
Would love to see some analysis of the spawns on highrise.. some of the worst spawns I have ever seen
Highrise seems to have the worst I agree, while Skidrow can be good but can also be totally f-d up - Estate... well.
The biggest issue I've noticed by far with the spawns,
It's not just that you spawn on the "enemies side" but that they have vague control over that and cycle through freely. Where I need a second to grasp where I am and where enemies are.
Even with the mind set of "put them in a spot that's the most safe regardless" is actually putting them on a disadvantage.
The amount of times I've seen someone just turn a corner and get melted because they are trying to get to the action because they spawned with 3 people around them is just ludicrous.
I know it's beta and there will be tweeks, but come on.
He hit reg is just as bad, shooting enemies dead on and hald a mag no kill, other times i insta kill, but half the time im dead in 2 bullets -.-
@@trevoravery9270beta has nothing to do with release or development time.
An app is in beta once it's feature complete. Which MW3 is, so it's a beta.
This has been an issue with cod for years now. Nothing will change at this point
@@Tinfoiltomcat If it is feature complete why are we missing things from the game?
It is a demo, not a beta.
@@Dragoonsoul7878 ...just because our vertical slice doesn't have everything in it doesn't mean the actual build it was derived from isn't feature complete.
A demo can be a beta. Those aren't exclusive titles.
I’m so glad you made this video. My biggest complaint. This is the reason why I enjoyed Cold War domination so much more. The spawns just make sense. FYI I’ve been playing COD since cod4, and these spawns in the last 5 games ( mostly ) have been absurd. Next biggest issue l, teammates footsteps.
As an SnD player, I’m glad I don’t have to worry about this
Lots of times playing this beta I've died to someone I had 0 clue was coming, only to watch the killcam and realise "oh, they just spawned there 10 feet behind me". Very frustrating.
@@robertlovesgothgirlz sure feels like that. I was playing a match earlier, Highrise Domination, and someone in voice chat was like "oh boy, I'm going to drop like 60 kills" - the highest kill count in the match after a full game of Dom was like 28 😭
our support for you cannot be overstated dude, the effort you put in to figuring this stuff out is invaluable, i just hope the right people see this video and implement changes.
This perfectly summarizes why the remade og maps in the new games feel so different when compared to the games they originated from. Also, why did they change how the spawns work? It didn't feel like anything was wrong with the older games spawn system.
I do understand a little change as players have evolved drastically, people are way faster, more confident and know where to go, so I'd get a little change for dynamic but this is over-the-top.
To create randomness
Great job explaining this. Put it into words well to show the problem. It’s clear there’s a spawn issue but this did a great job outlining it. Here’s hoping they fix it
Players want consistency. Consistency in time to kill, movement, equipment behaviour etc. Spawns are a big part of this in CoD. If players can't expect where they will spawn and where enemies come from they can't play accordingly and at that point it doesn't matter how they play. It just becomes mindless running and shooting.
Bro the spawns on highrise are absolutely HILARIOUS.
Man great point X I hope they're listening to you and fix this issue because people are complaining about this that spawns get very chaotic randomly out of the blue out of nowhere...
Great video! I thought I was losing my mind, but this is such a huge issue. They’re the worst spawns I think I’ve experienced in any call of duty game. Hopefully they get on top of it asap!
I wonder if Capture the Flag will be in game. I know its not a very popular mode but its easier to have good spawns with sides.
Nope if the other team is gettin stomped they’ll just spawn them on the enemy flag 😊 gotta protect the noobs
As someone who plays rushing all the time, they killed my playstyle. I was finding it strange that I hadn't seen anyone talking about how easy it is to change spawns.
No they didn't lmao they've killed it since 2019 if you really were rushing
@@medicfdumbo the playstyle i'm talking about is pushing to enemy spawn every time. I could do that on mw19
They killed that way before mw3 bud
Embrace the sentinel
@@roberto9270hardpoint the only mode with somewhat predictable spawns I feel
Thanks for taking the time for deep analysis like this. I 100% agree with you on the spawns, and so far I haven't felt any differences in the spawns from weekend 1 to weekend 2. But overall weekend 2 does feel better with some of the other changes they've already made. I commented on your video last week concerning inconsistent hit detection/ttk/ttd, and this weekend, at least for now, that did not seem to be an issue for me, and the higher TTK didn't bother me nearly as much. Maybe I'm just adjusting to it lol. It does seem like they are making good changes so far, and I can say that my experience thus far with weekend 2 has been much better than weekend 1, to the point where I'm having much more fun and I actually want to play it more.
Clear, structured, compelling vid with lots of efforts into it. You did such an amazing job Ace
anyone else notice that the BAS-B doesnt have any hit registration between its first damage fall off range and its max range?
I thought I was losing my mind with this same thing! I was on high rise on the elevator side shooting long range and my bullets weren't hitting the enemy players AT ALL 🤦🏾♂️
Oh and if you build a minimum range BAS it stops doing damage after 15m
Yup. Literally Ghost bullets. No registration
Second weekend in they are still feeling chaotic af. Couldn't put my finger on it but man are your clips of map watching insightful. Bloody mad spawns going on, things like Dom flags not tying to spawn points.
This is such a major is issue to fix, they could make the perfect game but with a bad spawn system its for nought. Ruins map flow, control, game feel.
At least squad spawning is out
The spawn system is meant to sabotage the strategy of good players!
Good
@@Aegis4521I bet you moan when the toilet water hits your butt hole.
@@Aegis4521 ?
@@quennybird ur mom
Xclusive Ace you're the best COD content creator nowadays because of this sort of content. Spawns are the main reason aside from SBMM thats stopping this game from being great. With these random spawns, it creates zero consistency or map flow. The spawns in Cold War, BO4, BO3 are perfect and it makes the gameplay feel better and maps flow better.
Seems like the spawns are made for you to be killed, ive also noticed that when I am killed or when I get a kill I run into the same exact player that I killed or killed me. Its as if the game wants you to get a revenge kill and keep that cycle going. I would love if you tested this
"payback spawns" (referring to the payback kill bonus that existed back then) have been a thing since the original modern warfare
You’re pin point on this as always Ace. Spawns in this game are the #1 issue by miles. If i have A and B, the enemy should only spawn at C until they get map control and get B. Don’t even get me started on these Revenge kills. Sure it’s funny when i get killed then immediately spawn right behind the guy, but this should not be happening. It’s happened like 50 times now i can’t even count it. Other than spawns im absolutely loving this game.
Two observations. 1.) Seems the spawn logic is kind of going in quadrants - If enemy makes one step into NW, spawn flips to SE. 2.) Perhaps they're flipping spawns so much on domination to encourage constant captures and not just "hold two and lock it down".
with the second weekend only map that feels good is highrise, mainly spawn in the base buildings and some spawns out towards mid near the heli or in the underground part if you get spawned out but not flipped. The other maps dont feel much has changed, there is still a spawn mid-map in skidrow bottom floor inbetween the big door and the side door that you can repeatedly spawn in. Other than that the spawns feel mostly the same as the first weekend
I imagine it will get even worse once more people start using suppressors and ghost. At least now you can see roughly where the enemies are (but given how the spawns currently work, seeing enemies on the map doesn't mean the rest of the team will be anywhere near lol)
yeah the randomness make it a bit odd at times, like in situations as the first Estate example he showed, if I saw two dots show up by the enemy flag after most enemies just died I'd expect to see most people come from that general area, but then they spawn top hill and underneath mansion on the right side, near our spawn.
I get a uav in 3 faster than in any cod
@@morbidzombii That's how it was back then. They bumped it up to 4-5 kills to reduce UAV spam.
@@will_9910 img needing a uav in 2023 who even looks at the map I know I don’t lmfao
Man I hope everyone keeps speaking up about this and it's gets fixed quickly. I don't understand why the spawns are this bad, anyone who has played any FPS game will notice it immediately. Is there some kind of rationale for why they are like this? Thanks for all the great work, Ace. You're doin the lords work, man!
This is an excellent analysis and unfortunately the same problems exist currently in weekend 2 of the beta. I think the spawns on Highrise combine the flaws you spotted on Favela and Estate.
Firstly, like Favela there is a complete lack of linearity whereas the map is so clearly designed to be a linear end-to-end friendly base vs enemy base map.
Secondly, like Estate there seems to be an issue with verticality and the game seems to love spawning players in the middle low section of the map. I found that especially with domination if I was capturing the B flag then someone would always spawn down there and immediately push me no matter where my teammates were or which flags our team currently held.
It says a lot that I’m still having fun despite this terrible spawn design and so I think this game can truly be a throwback to the heights of OG mw2 if they return to a much simpler, readable spawn design. As you say, this is literally what the maps were designed to cater for
good spawns and this might be my favorite Call of Duty since Black Ops 2, Favela, Highrise and Estate Spawns can be REALLY bad.
Estate is hands down the worst map because i feel the spawns make ZERO sense. Its a wide open map and it feels like people just go wherever and i cannot keep track of map flow at all.
Rust is def the best map right now because the spawn system works on that map 100%
Favela is pretty bad because of the height advantage 100%
I feel like this game is going to be held back by spawn system just like VG and MW2 was. Treyarch is the only dev that gets spawns right.
In general, I’ve been seeing a lot of good will towards mwIII, but I wanted to know if anyone else besides myself thinks the game feels… terrible on ps5? I hate to sound hyperbolic but shooting, resolution, and maybe even frame pacing seems weird to me.
Dont have a ps5, I'm on pc. But there definitely is somthething that feels a little off and even running it at 1440x2560 at 165 fps the game just seems a little foggy. I have good frame times but it seems like there's frame skipping regardless of my frame times
Must say I’m having a very similar experience to what you’re describing. Also playing on PS5.
@@mrlogic1017 might be a driver issue then since it is in beta. But I wouldn't be surprised if it sticks around. Might even get more broken consodering it's an activison game
I mentioned 2 videos ago the whole thing feels foggy and washed out. The colors aren't very vibrant and contrast isn't good, further exacerbating the inability to discern friend from foe. Can't wait until paid skins make that disparity even larger.
They don’t want little jimmy and Timmy getting spawn trapped, but at the same time, like you said casuals won’t have a feel for where anyone is on their team or the enemy’s. So usually just leads to camping scared to move anywhere
This looks like a bigger fix than I hoped. Might be next year at best if at all.
Verticality issue is terrible on high rise as well. They just spawn underneath you, run up the steps, and easy two pieces all day long
I was playing Highrise today, and at one point of the match, I caught myself wandering why it felt I could not read the spawns most of the time, when clearly the enemy team should be coming from certain spots. Lets see how they handle spawn fixes this year
Still, I’m really enjoying the beta
The biggest issue is sbmm. I know were tired of talking about it but its egregious and causing me to need breaks. Spawns pale in comparison
I really hope the developers see this. Amazing feedback
Thus video is crazy important, even if they don't fix the spawns, this helps people understand how it works to combat this issue.
I knew there weren’t in a good place, but after watching this video, hopping on weekend 2 and concentrating more on the spawns…It’s so bad. It’s ruining the entire flow of every match. A real shame.
Something that I want to see is 10v10 on launch. It will help give more data on spawns but also provides a more chaotic core MP experience
I think 10v10 with this spawn system would turn into an unplayable spawn die mess
Do you one better; 10v10 Rust.
I raise you 32 v 32 ground war numbers on rust lol@@farenhitegr6493
@@farenhitegr6493 I'm throwing up just thinking about it
@@arcticowl1091 Well, in the original MW2 we had ground war be 9v9 on the regular MP maps. These maps are all medium to large, so nowadays "tactical" players will make them feel empty on 6v6...
This is an AMAZING video!! I'm a WZ guy, but I wholeheartedly appreciate what you do for the MP community as well!
People are so delusional to think Sledgehammer is going to keep their communication like they're doing now after the game releases.
People forget how every single year the devs look like they're 24/7 wanting to help but then disappear, but the COD community can comprehend they are laughing at your face.
Xdefiant is coming out soon. That’s why
I wasn't able to play too much dom last weekend and was hoping for normal spawns in that mode, you broke my hearth saying the spawns are still like MWII, I had to stop playing domination because of that this year.
If it's goose and geese, why isn't it moose and meese? Why is English so weird 🧐
Ace!!! Pin this!!!!!
Because english beats up other languages and rifles through their pockets for spare grammar
Well old English used to be book - beek moose meese , they put plural -en exists in several words, including brethren (plural of brother), children, and even men and women and also responsible for goose/geese and tooth/teeth but when they changed to s , es system for some reason they still remains some.
That's an excellent video and a big concern on this franchise that sadly not many people understand how important it is and how it affects the game as much as SBMM can.
I would be really curious to have the same analysis on the current spawn system in COD Vanguard to understand how Sledgehammer are working on this subject and which hopes wan we have.
Good job Ace ! thanks a lot
Perfectly explained the spawn issues let's hope sledgehammer is watching your videos because the spawns need help bad
Hopefully a dev watches this video and takes action
Unfortunately, I think the random spawn approach is by design. Cod is evolving towards a game that REDUCES the skill gap. Traditional spawn logic (OG MW2) can be leveraged into an advantage for advanced players who can accurately read, anticipate and take advantage of
spawns. Randomizing spawns takes away this ability. Introduces more randomness, reduces the skill gap, rewards camping, moves everyone towards a 1 KD. Gameplay decisions like these are why I haven't consistently played COD for years.
100%
I have been running and clipped into an enemy that was spawning. They literally spawned right in front of me and I was wondering why I was being blocked and then they Striker'd me, I HATE THE SPAWNS SO MUCH
Thank you ACE!!!! 👊🏻
I feel like spawns are like this in MWII but they weren't like that for several months. My favorite game mode used to be hardpoint because you would spawn close to the action, but this last 2 months, the game can send you to the other side of the map when your team is in the point just because a couple of enemies got there.
In any other game mode I have the problem that you spawn completely alone in a part of the map without teammates, and then an enemy comes out of nowhere and takes you out.
Equally, on that hatchery map is very common to spawn under the roof of that building where snipers usually camp, when there are enemies above.
The revenge spawn thing is terrible. Idk how many times i have killed people in Hardpoint while i or multiple friendlies have our anchor set, only for that enemy to spawn solo 15ft behind our flank. In older games there was clear spawn play/flow for obj modes but in in this game it's just a chaotic mess. That or just spawning mid map right in the line of fire like the game is confused and just decides to play you where ever. I have been getting revenge spawns too, i die to a player then spawn right behind them in illogical locations, it's super cheesy on both sides and feels like the game is trying very hard to hand out revenge kills
Another issue I noticed just from this video, why is there even a spawn in the main estate building??? The spawn should be in the field near it not inside the main building...
Also visibility is a huge issue, I've shot at and been shot at by teammates way too often! It's often very hard to distinguish between enemies and friendly players.
We stand by you ace 🔥👍
Ok.. what i could play ( got a code, wont buy it until i hear its in good shape ) was good.. didnt get far, level 8, so few guns even have even a single attachment.. gameplay was good..
but..
hit registration was abysmal..
the game crashed, like out to Xbox home screen, 50% of the time, and just back to MW2 home screen, 35% of the time.
so yea, 4 out of 5 games, the game froze, then crashed.. i quit Ground war, as EVERY game was crashing a stuttering mess, serious latency AND Packet loss.. like, Vanguard all over again.
i CANT be the only person having it crash over and over and over and over.
everyone was talking about hit registration being almost non existent.
i could see it on both sides, someone had ME dead to rights, i get hit once, turn, while they are STILL SHOOTING ME, and kill them..
High rise.. that sunshine from whatever direction, makes players almost iMPOSSIBLE TO SEE.. change that sun to a 2pm vertical not a near sunset horizontal.
players in MP seemed to overall, really be try-hards.. lots of close matches, wins/losses by 1-5 pts total, whether it was 74-75, or 200-197.. not sure if it will stay that sweaty..
guns, mostly feel pretty good. i am going to enjoy one gun thats off everyones radar, and hope it stays that way, cuz its seriously good.
6:47 that rage quit LMAO
Well you obviously haste been working on this for a while, because spawns were not mentioned as being changed in the what changed notes. Very good feedback.
Excellent feedback. I hope the developers make adjustments based on this.
I get spawn killed more in this game than i did back in the ps3 days. The difference is back then if you were getting spawn trapped it was because your team lost complete control of the map which is a fair punishment, and even though it became "shooting fish in a barrel" at that point it was completely predictable. In this game i or enemy players flat out spawn in bullshit spots. But it's so random and unpredictable that it just feels unfair. I'd rather get stomped and trapped like back in the day than deal with frustrating spawn logic
I REALLY hope SHGames does not ruin the game post-launch with ridiculous content like the leaked news of the EM1 laser returning in an AW season.
I also hope SHGames can continue this great support all year and hopefully adds a feature to JUST play the classic MW2 maps to keep them alive and give us at least some kind of MW2 remaster available all the time.
Hearing this feedback was for the first week of the beta, and currently in the second week, I can sadly say not much change has been made..
Honestly, I haven’t noticed any changes in weekend 2 (not that I expected any), but Highrise has, by far the WORST spawns out of any map and the game mode doesn’t matter.
Spawns are random because it nerfs good players in 3 ways
1. Random deaths and cheap free kills for shitters
2. Can’t spawn trap
3. When a rusher pushes through and it flips they waste time not killing shitters and have to run around the map to get back. Do this a bunch and you add a ton of down time to players who normally have very high efficiency
I get you’re a more objective channel but I think you’re not nearly angry enough for how outrageously bad these spawns are on maps that have existed for 15+ years already. Between that and the TTK I’m canceling my order
The spawn issues that are prevalent in every release are so easy to demonstrate because we've played these MW2 maps before. Used to be able to show me a minimap and I could tell you the spawn. Ain't happening that way now.
I disagree. While I enjoyed playing back in the day with anchored spawns, front lines and sneaky flankings, there is one thing that we don't have now that was a problem back then. Campers.
Why are u guys crying because u can’t just sit on a head glitch and spawn trap? What fun is that? I’m glad they changed it. I’m a rusher. Get ur skill up. 1 v 1 me bro
This is the MAIN issue as far as I'm concerned. Great demonstration man, you should really be a consultant or designer on these games.
Literally the only thing I’ve complained about on the game. Really hope they’re fixed by launch but DOUBT IT lol
I feel like surely with degree of SBMM that modern Cod games have we can therefore get pretty sticky spawns.
The issue in old CODs with sticky spawns was always that if the teams were unbalanced you’d have one side having an incredible time and one team having a dreadful one.
If you had two matched teams you in fact ended up with a brilliant fight for map control that was often the most intense and fun aspect of a competitive match.
But yeah I’m not sure anyone would be happy if we returned to COD4 downpour levels of spawn fixing..
Bro, when people were saying the spawns were bad during the ps beta i thought "eh how bad can it be compared to mw2" and then i tried the pc beta and dear god is it horrendous. I literally had an enemy spawn inside of my own player character. Not only that but you can kill a dude and then have that same dude spawn directly behind you. Its insane and needs fixing asap.
Watching while playing and I was sniping from one corner of Estate and 4 enemies spawned behind me 2 of which I just killed them I died and respawned behind one of their teammates on the other side of the map I couldn't help but laugh out loud
I played last Night for the first time. And got to say worst spawn system I can remember. I hope they can do a hotfix and give us time in game with better spawns so we can give better feed back to tweak the small issues vs trash the whole system.... also always thankful for your video doing this in depth testing
The game just feels like a reskinned vanguard. Very unreliable ttk, with a few weapons completely dominating
i played today on PC an HOLY...SPAWNS ARE INDEED HORRIBLE
also 6:16..... damn
One of the worst for spawning was shipment on MW2 as I ended up sometimes spawning right in front of the enemy team..! 🤦🏻♂️ it was so frustrating.
An issue i notcied was when i spectated some1. The Vault edition operator skins return to regular form off death. I wish they stayed the same instead being like DM from Bo4
So this is why every 30 seconds in dom the enemy caps C then A then C then A, seriously wtf is wrong with devs there so annoying changing shit all the time that don’t need changin
in mw2 2022 spawn in domination mode are actually decent and i have no problems predicting where the enemies coming from, if they make the spawns like mw2 it is going to be fine
Dude just hire this guy to be an analyst for infinity ward. Actually knows what's up. Actually played mw2 back in the day and blop3 which are considered goated.
How do these lot make such basic mistakes? They have BO2 as the perfect blue print.
The spawns were the straw that broke the camel’s back for Vanguard for me. I just couldn’t enjoy the game and quit. Allegedly they got better, but I lost patience.
Not getting my money this time, but I will watch your videos to see how they do.
the beta sucks ttk is super slow the ghost perk is only for sweaty players and the dmr takes 3 shots to kill its 1 shot per second thats insane