Looks very obvious to me that hes putting himself out of bounds intentionally. He steps up to the ball, stops before touching it, steps out of bounds, then picks it up. A kick returner who doesn’t know he’s out of bounds would either fall on that ball or pick it up and run with it.
In the NFL, this is a great play. I don't know the NFHS rulebook on it.. but the NFL one calls the player on the paint as out of bounds so when he picks it up.. the ball is OUT OF BOUNDS.. again, don't know the NFHS rule... if it's like... these zebras kicked it badly.
The foul was enforced incorrectly by the crew. It is a loose ball play. K has two choices, accept the foul, and rekick from R-45, or the result of the play which is R 1/10 from the 19, as the ball became dead when it was touched by a player out of bounds. R 1/10 at the 9 1/2 is incorrect.
Regardless which way you're crew decides to enforce this play its important to discuss this type of play and make sure you're enforcing it consistently. I've seen variations of this play on social media at quite a few levels, for quite a few years. it would be nice to have some concrete guidance from the fed to directly address this. That said in this case it looks like the returner for R intentionally hopped out of bounds and then grabbed the ball, so I would support an IP. The official covering was in a great position and saw the whole play and the rule book supports him.
The player took himself off of the field by his own choice and then touched the ball without ever reestablishing himself good call imo, if he had one foot in bounds then it’s a kick out of bounds call.
I’ve seen examples of pro players lying down with a leg OB in order to reach in and touch the ball. The call was free Kick OB. I suppose HS rules could differ but if not then the refs definitely blew the call.
@@Motorfuzz read the enforcement spot for that again in the book... Articles 1,2,3,4a and g are basic spot, not previous. This foul is under article 2.
IP, previous spot enforcement. Looked like R stepped OB intentionally. I think that's what was called, but the enforcement was incorrect. On a free kick, the penalty for a foul by R during the kick is enforced from the previous spot.
if u call this illegal participation then when u hit the ball out of bounds on an onside kick should offials decide if it was intentional and thow more flags
Suppose this were something other than a free kick. If A fumbled near the sideline and a B player goes out of bounds and picks the ball up while out of bounds. How would you rule on that?
It again would depend on if the official determined that the player intentionally had went out of bounds and then participated in the play. If they purposefully went out of bounds then picked up the ball, that's illegal participation. If circumstances brought them out of bounds (e.g., they were blocked out, they were pursuing the play and incidentally went out of bounds, etc.), then no flag and the ball would just be dead where the B player picked it up.
@@majulahagapao Which brings me to this: I think the rule about intentionally going out of bounds really means "went out of bounds on his own and was not blocked out". We know it's OK if he is pushed out and comes back in. The only other option (really) is he went out on his own. Intentionally or accidentally, who can really say for sure? In the case here, he clearly was not blocked out. Did he mean to go out? I think no, but you could say yes.
Why punish the kicking team for the ball not going out of bounds. Regardless, R1 was not forced out of bounds, he went out of bounds on his own and picked up the ball. You have illegal participation. You could also argue illegal touching since he was the first to touch a ball after intentionally going out of bounds.
If we're going by NFHS rules, this absolutely cannot be illegal touching. That's only for ineligible A players who touch a forward pass that hasn't been touched by a B player.
Here's the thing though. If you think R player did this INTENTIONALLY, then it should be 2 flags. There should be the Illegal Participation flag, but by rule it is also a Kick OOB. There should be offsetting flags, and a rekick.
@@brianharrison1055 who caused the ball to be out of bounds? R did. Not a KOB. When R is inadvertently out of bounds and touches the kick, then K caused the ball to be out and it is a KOB. The purposeful act by R is the difference here.
Wrong call. Not OB or illegal touching. Just a ball was touched by R.after R stepped OB and then back in to kill the play. 1st down R at the spot if touching.
Looks very obvious to me that hes putting himself out of bounds intentionally. He steps up to the ball, stops before touching it, steps out of bounds, then picks it up. A kick returner who doesn’t know he’s out of bounds would either fall on that ball or pick it up and run with it.
When the receiver jumps out of bounds he is doing that intentionally. When he touches the ball he commits illegal participation.
this is pretty clearly described in the case book as illegal participation
Rule 9-6-2 No player shall intentionally go out of bounds during the the down and
B) Intentionally Touch the Ball
15 yard Penalty
In the NFL, this is a great play. I don't know the NFHS rulebook on it.. but the NFL one calls the player on the paint as out of bounds so when he picks it up.. the ball is OUT OF BOUNDS.. again, don't know the NFHS rule... if it's like... these zebras kicked it badly.
The foul was enforced incorrectly by the crew. It is a loose ball play. K has two choices, accept the foul, and rekick from R-45, or the result of the play which is R 1/10 from the 19, as the ball became dead when it was touched by a player out of bounds. R 1/10 at the 9 1/2 is incorrect.
Covering official needs to put that flag at the OOB/Foul spot and not throw it 12 feet in the air.
my first thought too
True by prescribed mechanics, but if the enforcement had been done correctly, the spot of the foul wouldn't matter.
This is a wonderful play in NCAA rules but not in NFHS.
Regardless which way you're crew decides to enforce this play its important to discuss this type of play and make sure you're enforcing it consistently. I've seen variations of this play on social media at quite a few levels, for quite a few years. it would be nice to have some concrete guidance from the fed to directly address this. That said in this case it looks like the returner for R intentionally hopped out of bounds and then grabbed the ball, so I would support an IP. The official covering was in a great position and saw the whole play and the rule book supports him.
The player took himself off of the field by his own choice and then touched the ball without ever reestablishing himself good call imo, if he had one foot in bounds then it’s a kick out of bounds call.
It's high school not the nfl. Know the rules before you try to exploit them. Crew got it correct
I’ve seen examples of pro players lying down with a leg OB in order to reach in and touch the ball. The call was free Kick OB. I suppose HS rules could differ but if not then the refs definitely blew the call.
Rules interpreter here.. 100% IP. Crew got this enforcement correct. Covering official needs to place flag at the spot of the foul.
Enforcement was incorrect it’s a loose ball play, previous spot enforcement.
@@Motorfuzz read the enforcement spot for that again in the book... Articles 1,2,3,4a and g are basic spot, not previous. This foul is under article 2.
@@leonmatthewsiv1699 yes, and it’s a loose ball play, so the basic spot is the previous spot.
IP, previous spot enforcement. Looked like R stepped OB intentionally. I think that's what was called, but the enforcement was incorrect. On a free kick, the penalty for a foul by R during the kick is enforced from the previous spot.
if u call this illegal participation then when u hit the ball out of bounds on an onside kick should offials decide if it was intentional and thow more flags
Illegal Participation here. He obviously has seen the RUclipss out there that call this "a smart play."
Suppose this were something other than a free kick. If A fumbled near the sideline and a B player goes out of bounds and picks the ball up while out of bounds. How would you rule on that?
It again would depend on if the official determined that the player intentionally had went out of bounds and then participated in the play. If they purposefully went out of bounds then picked up the ball, that's illegal participation. If circumstances brought them out of bounds (e.g., they were blocked out, they were pursuing the play and incidentally went out of bounds, etc.), then no flag and the ball would just be dead where the B player picked it up.
@@majulahagapao Which brings me to this: I think the rule about intentionally going out of bounds really means "went out of bounds on his own and was not blocked out". We know it's OK if he is pushed out and comes back in. The only other option (really) is he went out on his own. Intentionally or accidentally, who can really say for sure? In the case here, he clearly was not blocked out. Did he mean to go out? I think no, but you could say yes.
Illegal Participation in AZ per our rules interpreter. I believe we have a play of the week on it this year.
NFHS Case 9.6.2C outlines this exact play. Its Illegal Participation
Why punish the kicking team for the ball not going out of bounds. Regardless, R1 was not forced out of bounds, he went out of bounds on his own and picked up the ball. You have illegal participation. You could also argue illegal touching since he was the first to touch a ball after intentionally going out of bounds.
If we're going by NFHS rules, this absolutely cannot be illegal touching. That's only for ineligible A players who touch a forward pass that hasn't been touched by a B player.
I know the rule in the NFL would call it an out of bounds kick.
Reminds me of Randall Cobb in 2012 doing the same thing
Here's the thing though. If you think R player did this INTENTIONALLY, then it should be 2 flags. There should be the Illegal Participation flag, but by rule it is also a Kick OOB. There should be offsetting flags, and a rekick.
Interesting thought.
@@mattandsharoncook6545 I'm a MA official. That is the official interpretation of MA I believe, but it's at least my board's.
@@brianharrison1055 who caused the ball to be out of bounds? R did. Not a KOB. When R is inadvertently out of bounds and touches the kick, then K caused the ball to be out and it is a KOB. The purposeful act by R is the difference here.
Should have kept one foot in bounds.
Go out of bounds, then the first to touch the ball, illegal touching is the right call I believe. Depends on the rules at that level in that state.
Wrong call. Not OB or illegal touching. Just a ball was touched by R.after R stepped OB and then back in to kill the play. 1st down R at the spot if touching.
Do what’s right, not what’s easy!