I was told, by an elderly ,sweet JW woman (regarding the behavior of one of the elders towards me that made me VERY uncomfortable as a single Mom) "Well, if he's no good, Jehovah will remove him, don't worry!" I'm out since 2015; he's still there.
Well this character was removed from you, even though it was you who moved 😆! Just kidding, best wishes on your freedom for all these years, my wife and I are long time exjws, too. Cheers from canada!
@lizstraub6621, And unfortunately, that sweet, elderly JW lady was wrong. Apparently, from what you've said, this man is still a member of the Organization and is probably considered as being in good standing within his congregation and may still be serving as an Elder. This Elder could still be making advances towards other women in his congregation, and they might be too scared to speak out against him for fear of being accused of "trying to cause division within the congregation" or for "trying to bring reproach on Jehovah's good name and reputation". By the way, I'm very sorry for how that creepy Elder behaved toward you, lizstraub6621.
That's horrible how lightly they take these situations. If he's still in the organization next to other kids I can only imagine the horror. I hope he will end behind bars
As long as WT holds tightly onto the "two witness rule", it has not improved. They said they will NEVER change it. WT is only interested in their reputation, nothing else. I love the point you made, why use the word "endeavor?" Good to see you Lloyd!
Thank you for being here for us Lloyd. We love you so much and you have helped so many people with your work. No matter how much time passes between videos it is always a joy seeing a new post from you ❤
Wow!! Your comments are always spot on Lloyd!! Your response was kind and informative as well! I was quite appalled at the speaker’s comment that a repentant individual “may” not be considered for future appointments, such as a ministerial servant. Seems like they are more concerned with their policies on appointments in the congregation than their policies on protecting children! Thank you again for your channel and for everything you do!! 💛
Same I was never a witness, but did study with them. Their stubborn adherence to archaic procedures makes my blood boil! I so admire how balanced & civil all the ex-JWs are. I just can’t! They are such liars & hypocrites
You were instrumental in my learning how to think critically about watchtower. I know you helped countless people. I hope to enjoy more content from you soon!!!
Well said Lloyd. Yes, their half baked language. Its pretty much either yes we are reporting child abuse in very clear terms or they are not. And if they have to play with language,as they always do, then apparrently they have an option then not to report child abuse. Id like to say its surprising, but it never is when I watched this go on even 40 years ago and its still going on. Thank you Lloyd for still being here covering the harder topics. You are missed, but still appreciated for whatever work you do.
@mlove.1376, It's sad, isn't it? And what do you want to bet that in the next 40 to 45 years, the Society will probably still be promoting the same kind of lax policies for handling child sexual abuse instances within their Church (denomination)?
Hi Lloyd, The most kind, the most willing to forgive and forget, the ones truly being a friend unconditionally are according to my experience those who made terrible mistakes or suffered a lot. Those who lived without a problem are those who judge easily. I missed your videos. Anytime you would have a depressive thought, please look at the comments. When I saw this vid, even after many new great exJW RUclips activists arrises, you still own the visible spirit of years of experience in this field. You still have the important place of gratitude in our hearts. I am sure many will agree you are a modern sir N.Winton in our hearts. Does anyone cares about his private life? You have awaken thousands of greatful beings. And your work continues to do it. You saved us decades of wasted live in a cult for each of us. Never let anything to stop you to source a massive joy from this fact. May it will bring back more of your laugh and mockery directed to the org. No matter I have never met you in person, If would, I would give an unpleasantly long and tight hug. May, please, a virtual one be now as tight and warm. 😉
Great response to this very interesting question today---and so good to see you again, Lloyd. Been wondering how you're doing and what you have going on now. Perhaps you can do a video on how you been and what you been up to lately, If I'm not being too noisy.
My thoughts are like a rabid ping pong ball bouncing off everything until I watch a Lloyd Evans episode, then they become still, like a floating tranquil lily pad on a scenic pond. Thank you, Lloyd ❤
Her Aunt is totally missing the bigger point! whether he has priveledges in the Congregation moving forward is neither here not there! he should face criminal prosecution!!!!!
Im very happy to relate my personal experience from march 2023 regarding this very matter whereby the elders most definately had NOT reported child molestation to the police. I phoned the police myself and they said "why have none of your elders reported this? You need to ask them to contact us". I did, and the elders were furious with me. I could see the panic on one of their faces as they said "youve opened up a can of worms". Another called me "presumptuous". I can also relate in detail what 3 different elders told me their interpretation of the guidance on reporting is. One of them directly related to me what the bethel lawyer told them as well
That aunt must be living a pipe dream if she thinks that the Watchtower Society has "fixed" the problem of sexual abuse against children. The first thing that should be done whenever sexual abuse against a child is suspected or has actually occurred is report it to police FIRST and FOREMOST!! Do not report it to the elders in your congregation or to the so-called legal department at the Watchtower Society headquarters. They are not adequately trained to deal with and investigate sexual abuse against children. The police and other law enforcement professionals are. Thank you for exposing the hypocrisy and lies of the Watchtower Society.
It is noteworthy that it is not, repeat not, the exercise of the two-witness rule that prevents elders from reporting CSA. Not reporting CSA is owing to confidentiality. Proverbs 25:9 is cited by the leaders. The GB views the matter as confidential and, as such, elders, qua, elders will never report CSA in obedience to the GB's instructions. This is why the relentless prosecution in the courts of law of the Watchtower leadership must continue until they back down and reverse their policy
In NSW Australia, it has been made law that a mandatory reporter includes: A person in religious ministry or a person providing religion based activities to children (e.g. minister of religion, priest, deacon, pastor, rabbi, Salvation Army officer, church elder, religious brother or sister)
And how does the caller's aunt know that no adult male molester who has engaged in inappropriate behavior with a child in the JW Organization can no longer serve as Elders or as Ministerial Servants at any point in the future, and that every molester is automatically reported to the secular authorities? If she was recently baptized as a Witness, she is either a recent convert, or she must have been an unbaptized publisher for a very long time. As the caller has said, her aunt is now no longer allowed to look at information about the JW denomination that isn't produced by the Society-- whether it be over child molestation or anything else. I'd agree with Lloyd, looking at the Organization's current documents dealing with the handling of members who are found or suspected to have engage in child sexual abuse should tell one everything they need to know about how the Watch Tower Society and Jehovah's Witness culture currently choose to handle this issue. And in my opinion, they're choosing to handle it very badly, and they keep on handling it very badly and why? For what? What good is it doing? Why?
One of the most common excuses that the Watchtower Society/Jehovah's Witnesses use for not reporting cases of sexual abuse against children in their congregations is that doing so would "bring reproach upon Jehovah's name".
Thank you Lloyd, my aging mother still won’t talk about this issue saying it’s none of her concern, what a cop out. But then the religion meant more to her than her own children so I guess some things never change.
@odettesummers8229, Sad, is it not? How can one possibly explain in any palpable sense to strangers about how they prioritize the demands of their religion over having a healthy, loving, fulfilling relationship with their children? How can such behavior be praised by anyone, and furthermore...why should it be?
In some places, like Texas of all places, there are mandatory reporting requirements where they'd have to report. In places where there isn't a mandatory reporting requirement they generally won't
Scary what some of them will say to fix an issue. If a member of the governing body can give misleading info during the australian royal comission 2015, then the sky is the limit......
When will rank-and-file witnesses know about the changes about the Great Tribulation? I've mentioned it to several but they still have no idea. Thanks.
@GregStevens123, You know what I was thinking? If the Society ever starts proclaiming the hailstone message, they cannot take it back. If they do, they're going to have to seriously rework Jehovah's Witness theology from the top down.
There was a child abuse case in my family not long ago it apparently happened in 2012 and the man has only just gone to court this year...so why did it take so long. Of course he denied it so my grandfather who was an elder in his younger days said 'well the stance now is if they deny it and it happened they will not gain everlasting life' so that tells me no safeguards are being put in place or anything
As a faded JW, I was always bemused by the application of the "two witness" rule. I get the principle of it in a general sense but in cases where there are NO witnesses, typically in child abuse cases or even in other one on one sex abuse situations, ,then this principle cant apply. One would think that the leadership would see the folly in applying the "rule" across all scenarios. I recall years ago the brothers saying that christians dont live by rules "per se" but live by principles which is what the message of Jesus and the apostles was. That really was saying that christians were to exercise discretion before doing something. In cases of alleged child sex abuse , how does one verify the voracity of the accusation. We know pedophiles can be very manipulative and persuasive and occasionally maybe false accusations are made for vengeful reasons. So the brothers cant and dont know what the truth of the matter is unless there is a confession or outstanding evidence. The best the elders can do is discuss the matter- separately- with the parties involved as to the consequences of the matter and also the consequences of making a false accusation then they should hand the matter to the police and let the police and authorities manage it. That is not to say that the local elders do nothing- once a case is raised, they should take positive steps in monitoring the matter. For instance in the case of a father being accused or suspected of sex abuse, the family members need to be spoken with ( in a kindly manner for children) individually- almost on a daily basis. It would soon become evident who is lying or hiding the truth.
Nobody ever admitted that was such a thing as child's abuse in the organization, calling them lies, so why improve if there was nothing there in first place?
@JamesBRox-dv1pk, Exactly. The Society is behaving no better than the Holy See (the Vatican) of the Roman Catholic Church about child sexual abuse instances that occur within their own respective denomination. The only way the Society will change their policies about this issue is if governments require them to. Maybe the Society should lose its tax exempt or charitable status in every country where the JW denomination exists and is not suppressed by the government perhaps? Maybe the Governing Body should spend some time in prison for failing to create more substantial child sexual abuse reforms that require the immediate reporting of alleged or known molesters?
It totally depends on the state laws of the individual states but of course it should be the same policy for the entire organization. Not just the United States
Watchtower doesn't speak in absolutes but they expect their followers to behave as though their words are absolute. They give themselves enough room for plausible deniability but will punish the rank and file members for doing the same
@f4rnsworth138, Sort of like how the Governing Body doesn't claim to be prophets, but they expect the Witness community to treat them as if they were a type of inerrant prophet. It's basically wanting all the accoutrements of being a prophet without actually calling yourself a prophet.
@makestraightthewayofthelor664, Maybe Jesus said this, but people have been saying that he would return for nearly 2,000 years, and the end of the present world still hasn't come. Jesus thought it would come in his own disciples' lifetimes, and it didn't. So maybe he was wrong in making such predictions?
I've said it so many times but Lloyd is too good a broadcaster to focus on just religion. Would love to see him as an investigative journalist or something like that. Great broadcasting voice and manner.
Endeavor? Endeavor to cooperate with authorities? Is that the Society's excuse? You try to? How hard is it to make a phone call to the police about a known or probable case of child sexual abuse within a Jehovah's Witness congregation? How hard is that for a JW Elder to do? The Society only complies with the law when it doesn't contradict their doctrine or when the secular authorities force them to comply with national, state/provincial or local law under threat of legal punishment. You shouldn't have to have the authorities force you by law to turn in sex offenders to the police, Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society. You shouldn't have to be told to do that. And when you are forced to do so, you have no one else to blame but yourselves. Why should anyone feel sorry for you because you choose not to do the right thing and turn in child molesters within your religious institution to the police? You're given chance after chance after chance, and you still won't try and make it right. One can only hope that individual rank-and-file Witnesses get fed up with the Society's lax child sexual abuse policies and start filing reports on these molesters to the police themselves if their leaders won't, and then demand that their religious leaders be deleted from further serving in their clerical positions -- and hopefully, if necessary, they sue the Watch Tower Society for allowing the mishandling of child sexual abuse cases in their denomination to continue. The Witness community should ask that the current Governing Body members resign from their positions and then the Witness community themselves appoint someone else in their place -- someone who is willing to reform the Society's current child sexual abuse policies. Oh, I know this sounds like a pipe dream, but you can't blame me for having it can you? By the way, Lloyd, it's nice to see you back.
I know an elder who molested a young woman He was an elder at the time Wasnt only for a few years after he confessed Has been a elder for decades since the molestation
I love Lloyd, but if this were my question that had been posed, I'd be worried that "in the last year" and "article from 2019" would just not work for the discussion with my aunt. But I guess the part where Lloyd suggests her aunt may find a different one and then they can discuss that instead may help
@EmiSuess, The caller's aunt may reject anything that her niece says, unfortunately. Many Witnesses, perhaps most, don't respond to even the remotest constructive criticism of the Watch Tower Society very well...and that includes the Organization's current policies for handling cases of child sexual abuse within the denomination.
@piratecove3323, Some assume that because one is a devout Jehovah's Witness and holds to strict, conservative, almost inflexible moral standards -- and therefore, they cannot possibly commit a horrible crime. Yet, we know that is not true in the slightest degree. Ted Bundy was not one that people could believe to be a serial killer because he was "too handsome", but his story proves that looks can be deceiving. More was lying beneath the surface.
You don't understand sarcasm and life do you. Here is a question for you, nothing to do with trickery. Ask your self how old you are and how old you will be on your next birthday, but before you give your self the answer, you had better make sure it's the right one. I worked out the answer when I was 13yrs old, ask your friends, better still, ask a person of any religion ask any professional person, doctor, a person who thinks that they know everything. There is only one professional who was the closest, and now uses it in her lectures. If you ever get the answer, get back to me, you are reading this thinking that it is rubbish, you are going to start asking yourself your real age. Keep your preaching for your pulpit, but I know you will never get back to me because you can't give an answer to a simple question with a simple answer.
@@piratecove3323 , I knew you were being sarcastic. As for life...life is very complicated and is sometimes rather messy, and I feel that most people don't fully understand it (including myself). Sarcasm can be hard to identify over the internet, though I could quite clearly tell you were being sarcastic in your comment. Also, why would I tell a total stranger I don't know anything about with regard to my age? If only one professional was able to figure out the answer to your "puzzle", then that indicates that perhaps many others don't understand your sense of sarcasm or humor; or maybe they don't find your sarcastic remarks to be funny and do not understand why you find your own sense of sarcastic humor to be amusing. Nobody knows everything -- not a doctor, a professor or a professional of any sort. Anyone that says they do or anyone who thinks they do is either lying to you or to themselves. If people don't understand your sarcasm, then maybe you just don't have an appropriate sense of what should or not be viewed with any amount of humor. I don't know. Either way, your response to me was completely inappropriate. I don't know who you think you're talking to, but I feel that it would be unfair to let you simply getting away with being rude to me without my giving you a reply. It seems that your reply to my reply obviously wasn't meant to be sarcastic, it was just you wanting to act in a denigratory way toward someone else. Outside of this response that I am making: why would I want to further engage with someone who just insulted me because I did not indulge you by giving you the response that you hoped to receive for your sarcastic musings? You insulted me by practically telling me "You're just not that bright because I don't think you understand my sense of humor, so I am now going to counter what I perceive as your stupidity by implying that your age is a factor in your alleged stupidity and assume that you're likely intellectually inferior to me because you don't get my sense of sarcastic humor". You didn't say these exact words, of course, but that is pretty much what you implied in your response to my comment. And yet you have somehow, someway managed to find the gall and the nerve to imply that I'm "juvenile" when you just insulted me because I didn't give you the response that you would have liked to have received for your sarcasm? It seems to me that you may have forgot how to develop a decent set of manners from the time you were 13 years old all the way up to now. If anything, your rude response to me doesn't seem much better than that of a 13-year-old who is disrespectful, immature, has no interest in engaging in polite discussion or debate without making unnecessary insults, and simply just doesn't care about how they treat other people. And your tactless response to me is probably what I would expect to see from a disrespectful, rude, snotty 13-year-old (not that all 13-year-olds act like that). I didn't have a problem with your sarcastic comments regarding the Society's failure for not implementing better child protection policies to protect children in their denomination from potential predators, but I do have a problem with how rude you were to me. Perhaps you don't care, and if that's true...well, that's more a problem with you than with me. It's fine to use sarcasm which naturally involves a bit of mockery as way to get a point across, that I have no problem with. What I do have a problem with is when people use sarcasm as an excuse to disguise their attempts to be unnecessarily rude and insulting towards others for no good reason other than just wanting to acting mean-spirited and then attempting to say the equivalent of, "But it was just a joke" to try and justify their lame behavior -- and I sometimes see people doing that (sometimes a bit too often, especially online); you yourself didn't do that...at least not in your original comment, but when people are actually using sarcasm to do that, it really pisses me off. And maybe, just maybe, perhaps you should engage in some thoughtful self-reflection concerning your behavior toward others before you imply that someone else is childish when you needlessly insult someone else who was merely meditating on a thought you expressed on a public forum because they didn't respond to your sense of sarcasm in a manner in which you would have liked?
Do Not Love the World 15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16 For all that is in the world-the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life-is not of the Father but is of the world. 17 And the world is passing away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever. Deceptions of the Last Hour 18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us. 20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth. 22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also. Let Truth Abide in You 24 Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. 25 And this is the promise that He has promised us-eternal life. 26 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to [f]deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you [g]will abide in Him. The Children of God 28 And now, little children, abide in Him, that [h]when He appears, we may have confidence and not be ashamed before Him at His coming. 29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him.
@makestraightthewayofthelor664, "1 John 2:18-19: Deceptions of the Last Hour "18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us." - New King James Version" And how do you know that you're not one of these so-called antichrists?
@@user-jx4sc6tm6v , What isn't "sinful" in the Society's eyes? Anyone or anything that becomes popular in wider societal culture is a "threat" to their belief system...somehow, and why is that?
@leonej7519, They were so adorable. So was NSYNC. Though I am female, I wasn't a teenage girl at the time, but these all-boy bands in the 1990s and early 2000s were just so adorable. They were for the 1990s what the JACKSON 5 were in the 1960s and 1970s. I like Lloyd's Eminem-style hair, I think it's cute.
Based on that article, and the rather vague language strategically used within it (that Lloyd has pointed out), it is evident that the Watchtower has no intention of changing their policy to prioritise the safety of children. Despite all of the recent bad press for the organisation, protecting corporate image still remains the No. 1 objective of the governing body
@Friarbellows3425, Sadly, I think you're right. They Society will blame everyone else for the Organization's child sexual abuse scandals -- homosexuals, apostates, Satan, demons, sinful humanity, or their implied insinuation that the children of JW parents or guardians who don't dress "modestly" enough or who don't threaten to tell on their assaulter for whatever reason have somehow brought the abuse that they have endured on themselves for not adhering closely to the Society's advice on how to avoid being molested etc., everyone and anyone else is to blame but themselves for creating such negligent and backassward policies.
38Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the [k]remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.”
@makestraightthewayofthelor664, "Acts 2:38-39: Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the [a]remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.” -New King James Version" This was Peter attempting to convert his fellow Jews and Jewish converts to Jesus' sect. As for me, I don't believe in sin, nor do I accept sacrificial atonement involving a torturous death of a Jewish rabbi from 1st century Nazareth as a morally acceptable means of extending forgiveness to one for their wrongdoings.
@SunnyDays1914, And yet, somehow it wasn't wrong for Charles Taze Russell, the founder of the Bible Student movement, to have a beard. If it's wrong for JW men to have beards now, then why wasn't it just as wrong for Russell to have grown out a beard -- neatly trimmed or not -- in the late 19th or early 20th centuries?
Pointless trying to persuade your aunt she is wrong and you are right. If you have left the JW then work your way away from needing to prove you are right (and someone else is wrong) on any issue relative to their beliefs. If you can meet relatives and avoid discussions around faith/beliefs etc then this is great but they have to begin to respect your world views too - and cannot seek to convert you back to the JW. This needs to be the terms of the agreement. No-one needs to be an evangelist - this is where all religion goes wrong. Personally held beliefs are one thing, a crusade to convert the world and preach “hell, fire and damnation” is quite another, and is always destructive with zero positive outcomes. Visit JW relatives if that gives you a positive experience but stonewall them when they seek to engage in any religious discussion - they simply don’t know how to deal with this and it allows you to go home without feeling you’ve upset anyone, or had an argument, or need to prove something to be true or false etc…
Oh, since the people that have been lying said we stopped lying, it must be true. Where do they get off ignoring everything real just to go about their merry way, leaving everyone else to pick up the ruins left in the wake of their destructive cult. Its a deliberately ignorant act and my patience with those who know they are following lying, abusive, sacks of human filth is growing thin.
I was told, by an elderly ,sweet JW woman (regarding the behavior of one of the elders towards me that made me VERY uncomfortable as a single Mom) "Well, if he's no good, Jehovah will remove him, don't worry!" I'm out since 2015; he's still there.
Well this character was removed from you, even though it was you who moved 😆! Just kidding, best wishes on your freedom for all these years, my wife and I are long time exjws, too. Cheers from canada!
@lizstraub6621,
And unfortunately, that sweet, elderly JW lady was wrong. Apparently, from what you've said, this man is still a member of the Organization and is probably considered as being in good standing within his congregation and may still be serving as an Elder. This Elder could still be making advances towards other women in his congregation, and they might be too scared to speak out against him for fear of being accused of "trying to cause division within the congregation" or for "trying to bring reproach on Jehovah's good name and reputation". By the way, I'm very sorry for how that creepy Elder behaved toward you, lizstraub6621.
That's horrible how lightly they take these situations. If he's still in the organization next to other kids I can only imagine the horror. I hope he will end behind bars
His behaviour is disgusting. What a disgrace that they allowed him to carry on there. He should be removed. 😡
A single mom is potshot in the religion. Trust me I know. Sad 😔
As long as WT holds tightly onto the "two witness rule", it has not improved. They said they will NEVER change it. WT is only interested in their reputation, nothing else.
I love the point you made, why use the word "endeavor?"
Good to see you Lloyd!
Thank you for being here for us Lloyd. We love you so much and you have helped so many people with your work. No matter how much time passes between videos it is always a joy seeing a new post from you ❤
Wow, thank you Alyssa!
Phew yes! Thank goodness to hear Lloyd again. I quite appreciate why you’ve stopped your other videos (bullying) but we NEED Lloyd.
❤❤❤ Thank you so much Lloyd! Allways a pleasure to see and hear your insightful videos! ❤ Thank you!!!!!
Good to see you Lloyd 😁 miss you my friend!
@@LloydEvansOf course!
Merry Christmas 🎄 🎅 🌟
Wow!! Your comments are always spot on Lloyd!! Your response was kind and informative as well! I was quite appalled at the speaker’s comment that a repentant individual “may” not be considered for future appointments, such as a ministerial servant. Seems like they are more concerned with their policies on appointments in the congregation than their policies on protecting children! Thank you again for your channel and for everything you do!! 💛
“If this was God’s organization since 1919 …”. EXACTLY! !
I’m so sick of the ridiculousness, hypocrisy & BULLSH*T
Same I was never a witness, but did study with them. Their stubborn adherence to archaic procedures makes my blood boil! I so admire how balanced & civil all the ex-JWs are. I just can’t! They are such liars & hypocrites
You’re exactly right Lloyd!
Thank you as always!!!
You were instrumental in my learning how to think critically about watchtower. I know you helped countless people. I hope to enjoy more content from you soon!!!
You were the one who opened my eyes Lloyd
Mine too! I woke up with Lloyd for 2 years ago...under the lockdown. It,s was amazing! Never coming back to this cult! ❤
🤢
The Tony Morris video mentioning tight pants was my wake up. He decided to go out all guns blazing. I think he didn't want any change.
Really good to hear from you again Lloyd, your well-informed commentary is always appreciated.
Welcome back lloyd,you been missed ,my favorite jw active channel!..havent seen u very active lately,hope everything is well,keep those videos coming!
Well said Lloyd. Yes, their half baked language. Its pretty much either yes we are reporting child abuse in very clear terms or they are not. And if they have to play with language,as they always do, then apparrently they have an option then not to report child abuse. Id like to say its surprising, but it never is when I watched this go on even 40 years ago and its still going on. Thank you Lloyd for still being here covering the harder topics. You are missed, but still appreciated for whatever work you do.
@mlove.1376,
It's sad, isn't it? And what do you want to bet that in the next 40 to 45 years, the Society will probably still be promoting the same kind of lax policies for handling child sexual abuse instances within their Church (denomination)?
You exceptionally helped my spouse deconvert fully. 💔
After i stopped attending meetings your videos gave me the strenght to not go back.thank you.
Good to see YOU LE!!! The caller is extremely correct!! YOU are instrumental!! ❤️
Thank you for your videos, very informative and well spoken.
Wonderful communication skills.
Oh, well if her aunt says it then I guess we don’t have a problem anymore. Problem solved! Thank goodness.
How do you make a compelling argument to someone who quite literally takes the organization's word as the word of God?
They prefer to play dumb.
They will also just cut you off.
You don’t!😮😂 6:15
Hi Lloyd, The most kind, the most willing to forgive and forget, the ones truly being a friend unconditionally are according to my experience those who made terrible mistakes or suffered a lot. Those who lived without a problem are those who judge easily. I missed your videos. Anytime you would have a depressive thought, please look at the comments. When I saw this vid, even after many new great exJW RUclips activists arrises, you still own the visible spirit of years of experience in this field. You still have the important place of gratitude in our hearts. I am sure many will agree you are a modern sir N.Winton in our hearts. Does anyone cares about his private life? You have awaken thousands of greatful beings. And your work continues to do it. You saved us decades of wasted live in a cult for each of us. Never let anything to stop you to source a massive joy from this fact. May it will bring back more of your laugh and mockery directed to the org. No matter I have never met you in person, If would, I would give an unpleasantly long and tight hug. May, please, a virtual one be now as tight and warm. 😉
you tell it like it is Lloyd..thank you.
Great response to this very interesting question today---and so good to see you again, Lloyd. Been wondering how you're doing and what you have going on now. Perhaps you can do a video on how you been and what you been up to lately, If I'm not being too noisy.
My thoughts are like a rabid ping pong ball bouncing off everything until I watch a Lloyd Evans episode, then they become still, like a floating tranquil lily pad on a scenic pond. Thank you, Lloyd ❤
Missed you Lloyd…
Glad to see you back buddy.
Her Aunt is totally missing the bigger point! whether he has priveledges in the Congregation moving forward is neither here not there! he should face criminal prosecution!!!!!
Great video and answer Lloyd! Just by the way, the audio from your mic is almost completely panned to the left.
No the child abuse issue isnt finished and never will be. People's lives have been ruined and can never get their life back. This will never go away.
Re: elders will "endeavor" to follow the local laws regarding reporting...
Like Yoda said, "Do or do not, there is no try."
Right on, Stephen! I was thinking of that very dialogue myself, you posted it before I could, well done! Cheers from canada!
@@greyberet1 Haha!
And hello to you from your southern neighbor in Michigan.
Im very happy to relate my personal experience from march 2023 regarding this very matter whereby the elders most definately had NOT reported child molestation to the police. I phoned the police myself and they said "why have none of your elders reported this? You need to ask them to contact us". I did, and the elders were furious with me. I could see the panic on one of their faces as they said "youve opened up a can of worms". Another called me "presumptuous". I can also relate in detail what 3 different elders told me their interpretation of the guidance on reporting is. One of them directly related to me what the bethel lawyer told them as well
Well done Lloyd.
That aunt must be living a pipe dream if she thinks that the Watchtower Society has "fixed" the problem of sexual abuse against children. The first thing that should be done whenever sexual abuse against a child is suspected or has actually occurred is report it to police FIRST and FOREMOST!! Do not report it to the elders in your congregation or to the so-called legal department at the Watchtower Society headquarters. They are not adequately trained to deal with and investigate sexual abuse against children. The police and other law enforcement professionals are. Thank you for exposing the hypocrisy and lies of the Watchtower Society.
Yes but they are still around kids I was abused as a 7yr old
Maybe you should join the Catholic Church. You might open your eyes to real rampant abuse.
It is noteworthy that it is not, repeat not, the exercise of the two-witness rule that prevents elders from reporting CSA. Not reporting CSA is owing to confidentiality. Proverbs 25:9 is cited by the leaders. The GB views the matter as confidential and, as such, elders, qua, elders will never report CSA in obedience to the GB's instructions. This is why the relentless prosecution in the courts of law of the Watchtower leadership must continue until they back down and reverse their policy
In NSW Australia, it has been made law that a mandatory reporter includes: A person in religious ministry or a person providing religion based activities to children (e.g. minister of religion, priest, deacon, pastor, rabbi, Salvation Army officer, church elder, religious brother or sister)
And how does the caller's aunt know that no adult male molester who has engaged in inappropriate behavior with a child in the JW Organization can no longer serve as Elders or as Ministerial Servants at any point in the future, and that every molester is automatically reported to the secular authorities? If she was recently baptized as a Witness, she is either a recent convert, or she must have been an unbaptized publisher for a very long time. As the caller has said, her aunt is now no longer allowed to look at information about the JW denomination that isn't produced by the Society-- whether it be over child molestation or anything else.
I'd agree with Lloyd, looking at the Organization's current documents dealing with the handling of members who are found or suspected to have engage in child sexual abuse should tell one everything they need to know about how the Watch Tower Society and Jehovah's Witness culture currently choose to handle this issue. And in my opinion, they're choosing to handle it very badly, and they keep on handling it very badly and why? For what? What good is it doing? Why?
One of the most common excuses that the Watchtower Society/Jehovah's Witnesses use for not reporting cases of sexual abuse against children in their congregations is that doing so would "bring reproach upon Jehovah's name".
Thank you Lloyd, my aging mother still won’t talk about this issue saying it’s none of her concern, what a cop out. But then the religion meant more to her than her own children so I guess some things never change.
@odettesummers8229,
Sad, is it not? How can one possibly explain in any palpable sense to strangers about how they prioritize the demands of their religion over having a healthy, loving, fulfilling relationship with their children? How can such behavior be praised by anyone, and furthermore...why should it be?
@@b.w.7588 very sad indeed, takes a lifetime to get over if we ever really do.
@@b.w.7588Your post could not be further from the truth!!!👎🏽
@@odettesummers8229Ridiculous!
What stops them from pairing those abusers out in service with unsuspecting ones?
In some places, like Texas of all places, there are mandatory reporting requirements where they'd have to report. In places where there isn't a mandatory reporting requirement they generally won't
Is it just me or is the first part audio of Lloyd speaking only coming out of the left side of my Airpods Pro?
Yes, sorry about the audio issues on this, I guess one side is better than none! :)
Scary what some of them will say to fix an issue. If a member of the governing body can give misleading info during the australian royal comission 2015, then the sky is the limit......
When will rank-and-file witnesses know about the changes about the Great Tribulation? I've mentioned it to several but they still have no idea. Thanks.
@GregStevens123,
You know what I was thinking? If the Society ever starts proclaiming the hailstone message, they cannot take it back. If they do, they're going to have to seriously rework Jehovah's Witness theology from the top down.
There was a child abuse case in my family not long ago it apparently happened in 2012 and the man has only just gone to court this year...so why did it take so long. Of course he denied it so my grandfather who was an elder in his younger days said 'well the stance now is if they deny it and it happened they will not gain everlasting life' so that tells me no safeguards are being put in place or anything
❤
As a faded JW, I was always bemused by the application of the "two witness" rule. I get the principle of it in a general sense but in cases where there are NO witnesses, typically in child abuse cases or even in other one on one sex abuse situations, ,then this principle cant apply. One would think that the leadership would see the folly in applying the "rule" across all scenarios. I recall years ago the brothers saying that christians dont live by rules "per se" but live by principles which is what the message of Jesus and the apostles was. That really was saying that christians were to exercise discretion before doing something.
In cases of alleged child sex abuse , how does one verify the voracity of the accusation. We know pedophiles can be very manipulative and persuasive and occasionally maybe false accusations are made for vengeful reasons. So the brothers cant and dont know what the truth of the matter is unless there is a confession or outstanding evidence. The best the elders can do is discuss the matter- separately- with the parties involved as to the consequences of the matter and also the consequences of making a false accusation then they should hand the matter to the police and let the police and authorities manage it. That is not to say that the local elders do nothing- once a case is raised, they should take positive steps in monitoring the matter. For instance in the case of a father being accused or suspected of sex abuse, the family members need to be spoken with ( in a kindly manner for children) individually- almost on a daily basis. It would soon become evident who is lying or hiding the truth.
Nobody ever admitted that was such a thing as child's abuse in the organization, calling them lies, so why improve if there was nothing there in first place?
@JamesBRox-dv1pk,
Exactly. The Society is behaving no better than the Holy See (the Vatican) of the Roman Catholic Church about child sexual abuse instances that occur within their own respective denomination. The only way the Society will change their policies about this issue is if governments require them to. Maybe the Society should lose its tax exempt or charitable status in every country where the JW denomination exists and is not suppressed by the government perhaps? Maybe the Governing Body should spend some time in prison for failing to create more substantial child sexual abuse reforms that require the immediate reporting of alleged or known molesters?
It totally depends on the state laws of the individual states but of course it should be the same policy for the entire organization. Not just the United States
Something weird is happening in my congregation, in México Tijuana
Feel muy cell phone Is being hacked
Cults, what do you expect from them, reality, kindness???? 😅
Watchtower doesn't speak in absolutes but they expect their followers to behave as though their words are absolute. They give themselves enough room for plausible deniability but will punish the rank and file members for doing the same
@f4rnsworth138,
Sort of like how the Governing Body doesn't claim to be prophets, but they expect the Witness community to treat them as if they were a type of inerrant prophet. It's basically wanting all the accoutrements of being a prophet without actually calling yourself a prophet.
Matthew chpt.4 17FROM THAT TIME JESUS BEGAN TO PREACH AND TO SAY, REPENT:FOR THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN IS AT HAND
@makestraightthewayofthelor664,
Maybe Jesus said this, but people have been saying that he would return for nearly 2,000 years, and the end of the present world still hasn't come. Jesus thought it would come in his own disciples' lifetimes, and it didn't. So maybe he was wrong in making such predictions?
Shepard the Flock of God book isn't changed recently?
I've said it so many times but Lloyd is too good a broadcaster to focus on just religion.
Would love to see him as an investigative journalist or something like that. Great broadcasting voice and manner.
Endeavor? Endeavor to cooperate with authorities? Is that the Society's excuse? You try to? How hard is it to make a phone call to the police about a known or probable case of child sexual abuse within a Jehovah's Witness congregation? How hard is that for a JW Elder to do? The Society only complies with the law when it doesn't contradict their doctrine or when the secular authorities force them to comply with national, state/provincial or local law under threat of legal punishment. You shouldn't have to have the authorities force you by law to turn in sex offenders to the police, Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society.
You shouldn't have to be told to do that. And when you are forced to do so, you have no one else to blame but yourselves. Why should anyone feel sorry for you because you choose not to do the right thing and turn in child molesters within your religious institution to the police? You're given chance after chance after chance, and you still won't try and make it right. One can only hope that individual rank-and-file Witnesses get fed up with the Society's lax child sexual abuse policies and start filing reports on these molesters to the police themselves if their leaders won't, and then demand that their religious leaders be deleted from further serving in their clerical positions -- and hopefully, if necessary, they sue the Watch Tower Society for allowing the mishandling of child sexual abuse cases in their denomination to continue. The Witness community should ask that the current Governing Body members resign from their positions and then the Witness community themselves appoint someone else in their place -- someone who is willing to reform the Society's current child sexual abuse policies.
Oh, I know this sounds like a pipe dream, but you can't blame me for having it can you?
By the way, Lloyd, it's nice to see you back.
I know an elder who molested a young woman
He was an elder at the time
Wasnt only for a few years after he confessed
Has been a elder for decades since the molestation
I love Lloyd, but if this were my question that had been posed, I'd be worried that "in the last year" and "article from 2019" would just not work for the discussion with my aunt.
But I guess the part where Lloyd suggests her aunt may find a different one and then they can discuss that instead may help
@EmiSuess,
The caller's aunt may reject anything that her niece says, unfortunately. Many Witnesses, perhaps most, don't respond to even the remotest constructive criticism of the Watch Tower Society very well...and that includes the Organization's current policies for handling cases of child sexual abuse within the denomination.
It's the old "polish a turd" routine!
Of course they are! And Ted Bundy was innocent.
@piratecove3323,
Some assume that because one is a devout Jehovah's Witness and holds to strict, conservative, almost inflexible moral standards -- and therefore, they cannot possibly commit a horrible crime. Yet, we know that is not true in the slightest degree. Ted Bundy was not one that people could believe to be a serial killer because he was "too handsome", but his story proves that looks can be deceiving. More was lying beneath the surface.
You don't understand sarcasm and life do you. Here is a question for you, nothing to do with trickery. Ask your self how old you are and how old you will be on your next birthday, but before you give your self the answer, you had better make sure it's the right one. I worked out the answer when I was 13yrs old, ask your friends, better still, ask a person of any religion ask any professional person, doctor, a person who thinks that they know everything. There is only one professional who was the closest, and now uses it in her lectures. If you ever get the answer, get back to me, you are reading this thinking that it is rubbish, you are going to start asking yourself your real age. Keep your preaching for your pulpit, but I know you will never get back to me because you can't give an answer to a simple question with a simple answer.
@@piratecove3323 ,
I knew you were being sarcastic. As for life...life is very complicated and is sometimes rather messy, and I feel that most people don't fully understand it (including myself). Sarcasm can be hard to identify over the internet, though I could quite clearly tell you were being sarcastic in your comment. Also, why would I tell a total stranger I don't know anything about with regard to my age? If only one professional was able to figure out the answer to your "puzzle", then that indicates that perhaps many others don't understand your sense of sarcasm or humor; or maybe they don't find your sarcastic remarks to be funny and do not understand why you find your own sense of sarcastic humor to be amusing.
Nobody knows everything -- not a doctor, a professor or a professional of any sort. Anyone that says they do or anyone who thinks they do is either lying to you or to themselves. If people don't understand your sarcasm, then maybe you just don't have an appropriate sense of what should or not be viewed with any amount of humor. I don't know. Either way, your response to me was completely inappropriate. I don't know who you think you're talking to, but I feel that it would be unfair to let you simply getting away with being rude to me without my giving you a reply. It seems that your reply to my reply obviously wasn't meant to be sarcastic, it was just you wanting to act in a denigratory way toward someone else.
Outside of this response that I am making: why would I want to further engage with someone who just insulted me because I did not indulge you by giving you the response that you hoped to receive for your sarcastic musings? You insulted me by practically telling me "You're just not that bright because I don't think you understand my sense of humor, so I am now going to counter what I perceive as your stupidity by implying that your age is a factor in your alleged stupidity and assume that you're likely intellectually inferior to me because you don't get my sense of sarcastic humor". You didn't say these exact words, of course, but that is pretty much what you implied in your response to my comment.
And yet you have somehow, someway managed to find the gall and the nerve to imply that I'm "juvenile" when you just insulted me because I didn't give you the response that you would have liked to have received for your sarcasm? It seems to me that you may have forgot how to develop a decent set of manners from the time you were 13 years old all the way up to now. If anything, your rude response to me doesn't seem much better than that of a 13-year-old who is disrespectful, immature, has no interest in engaging in polite discussion or debate without making unnecessary insults, and simply just doesn't care about how they treat other people. And your tactless response to me is probably what I would expect to see from a disrespectful, rude, snotty 13-year-old (not that all 13-year-olds act like that).
I didn't have a problem with your sarcastic comments regarding the Society's failure for not implementing better child protection policies to protect children in their denomination from potential predators, but I do have a problem with how rude you were to me. Perhaps you don't care, and if that's true...well, that's more a problem with you than with me. It's fine to use sarcasm which naturally involves a bit of mockery as way to get a point across, that I have no problem with. What I do have a problem with is when people use sarcasm as an excuse to disguise their attempts to be unnecessarily rude and insulting towards others for no good reason other than just wanting to acting mean-spirited and then attempting to say the equivalent of, "But it was just a joke" to try and justify their lame behavior -- and I sometimes see people doing that (sometimes a bit too often, especially online); you yourself didn't do that...at least not in your original comment, but when people are actually using sarcasm to do that, it really pisses me off.
And maybe, just maybe, perhaps you should engage in some thoughtful self-reflection concerning your behavior toward others before you imply that someone else is childish when you needlessly insult someone else who was merely meditating on a thought you expressed on a public forum because they didn't respond to your sense of sarcasm in a manner in which you would have liked?
Do Not Love the World
15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him. 16 For all that is in the world-the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life-is not of the Father but is of the world. 17 And the world is passing away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever.
Deceptions of the Last Hour
18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
20 But you have an anointing from the Holy One, and you[e] know all things. 21 I have not written to you because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and that no lie is of the truth.
22 Who is a liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist who denies the Father and the Son. 23 Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father either; he who acknowledges the Son has the Father also.
Let Truth Abide in You
24 Therefore let that abide in you which you heard from the beginning. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, you also will abide in the Son and in the Father. 25 And this is the promise that He has promised us-eternal life.
26 These things I have written to you concerning those who try to [f]deceive you. 27 But the anointing which you have received from Him abides in you, and you do not need that anyone teach you; but as the same anointing teaches you concerning all things, and is true, and is not a lie, and just as it has taught you, you [g]will abide in Him.
The Children of God
28 And now, little children, abide in Him, that [h]when He appears, we may have confidence and not be ashamed before Him at His coming. 29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him.
@makestraightthewayofthelor664,
"1 John 2:18-19:
Deceptions of the Last Hour
"18 Little children, it is the last hour; and as you have heard that the[d] Antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come, by which we know that it is the last hour. 19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us."
- New King James Version"
And how do you know that you're not one of these so-called antichrists?
Audio is missing
It's not missing but unfortunately it's only working on one side, so you'll need to adjust your headphones or speakers. Sorry!
My left ear enjoyed your comments ;-)
A lot of kids are getting diddled in there.
Yes, many religions have that problem.
What’s with the backstreet boys look ?
@@user-jx4sc6tm6v ,
What isn't "sinful" in the Society's eyes? Anyone or anything that becomes popular in wider societal culture is a "threat" to their belief system...somehow, and why is that?
@leonej7519,
They were so adorable. So was NSYNC. Though I am female, I wasn't a teenage girl at the time, but these all-boy bands in the 1990s and early 2000s were just so adorable. They were for the 1990s what the JACKSON 5 were in the 1960s and 1970s. I like Lloyd's Eminem-style hair, I think it's cute.
She sounds very much like ReallyGraceful, not saying I am right though.
Based on that article, and the rather vague language strategically used within it (that Lloyd has pointed out), it is evident that the Watchtower has no intention of changing their policy to prioritise the safety of children. Despite all of the recent bad press for the organisation, protecting corporate image still remains the No. 1 objective of the governing body
@Friarbellows3425,
Sadly, I think you're right. They Society will blame everyone else for the Organization's child sexual abuse scandals -- homosexuals, apostates, Satan, demons, sinful humanity, or their implied insinuation that the children of JW parents or guardians who don't dress "modestly" enough or who don't threaten to tell on their assaulter for whatever reason have somehow brought the abuse that they have endured on themselves for not adhering closely to the Society's advice on how to avoid being molested etc., everyone and anyone else is to blame but themselves for creating such negligent and backassward policies.
38Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the [k]remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.”
@makestraightthewayofthelor664,
"Acts 2:38-39:
Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the [a]remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.”
-New King James Version"
This was Peter attempting to convert his fellow Jews and Jewish converts to Jesus' sect. As for me, I don't believe in sin, nor do I accept sacrificial atonement involving a torturous death of a Jewish rabbi from 1st century Nazareth as a morally acceptable means of extending forgiveness to one for their wrongdoings.
So tiring with the weasel words, although I’m guilty of it too.
Wow, just heard JWs can now have beards. As per alert himself. 🧔♂️
@SunnyDays1914,
And yet, somehow it wasn't wrong for Charles Taze Russell, the founder of the Bible Student movement, to have a beard. If it's wrong for JW men to have beards now, then why wasn't it just as wrong for Russell to have grown out a beard -- neatly trimmed or not -- in the late 19th or early 20th centuries?
Pointless trying to persuade your aunt she is wrong and you are right. If you have left the JW then work your way away from needing to prove you are right (and someone else is wrong) on any issue relative to their beliefs. If you can meet relatives and avoid discussions around faith/beliefs etc then this is great but they have to begin to respect your world views too - and cannot seek to convert you back to the JW. This needs to be the terms of the agreement. No-one needs to be an evangelist - this is where all religion goes wrong. Personally held beliefs are one thing, a crusade to convert the world and preach “hell, fire and damnation” is quite another, and is always destructive with zero positive outcomes. Visit JW relatives if that gives you a positive experience but stonewall them when they seek to engage in any religious discussion - they simply don’t know how to deal with this and it allows you to go home without feeling you’ve upset anyone, or had an argument, or need to prove something to be true or false etc…
I think this voicemail is a fake😅
@rogermoore3843,
I don't know about that. I'd like to give the caller the benefit of the doubt before making such accusations.
Seed destroyer
Oh, since the people that have been lying said we stopped lying, it must be true. Where do they get off ignoring everything real just to go about their merry way, leaving everyone else to pick up the ruins left in the wake of their destructive cult. Its a deliberately ignorant act and my patience with those who know they are following lying, abusive, sacks of human filth is growing thin.