In a way the creation of the clone army was designed by Palpatine to be a paradox. Both dispensable and indispensable at the same time. Dispensable as cannon fodder during the orchestrated war and indispensable at the rise of the Empire.
In an alternate universe where the empire never existed, I think the best thing to do with the Clones is to give them their own planet. Is there some uninhabited planet out there that can sustain human life? Maybe use the Clones to colonize uninhabited planets.
I truly hope The Bad Batch show goes into detail about how clones were treated after the war, and what the soldiers felt about being retired and replaced.
Maybe the Clones coulda been persuaded to help fight the Chip's influence more if they'd been treated more like twin soldiers an less twin slaves.. Like after being released to the Jedi theyd been encouraged to own property and take wives have families besides just becoming individuals.. along with the Republic trying to cure their aging after a certain point to where it switches to normal after a time.. such incentives made, along with an infrastructure modified to support whom ever made it to wars end if your was a clone soldier ESPECIALLY if instituted by the Jedi coulda went along way in helping their cause..
"For reasons unknown, sterilizing humans clones and thus removing Factor H from the equation, DRASTICALLY decreased the effectiveness of units." Yeah, somehow I feel like if was sterilized my unit would become less effective, too.
For some reason, I couldn't help but think of Sora's speech from No Game No Life when he said that lol. Basically, all men want a pretty girl to fight for. Konosuba does this to an extent in s1.
I disagree with the whole “ if clones were allowed to procreate at will that it would severely mess up the gene pool for humans”. That might be true if you were talking about earth’s population but we’re talking about an entire galaxy with hundreds of thousands of planets and quadrillions of humans and human-like beings who can procreate with humans. A few million clones would be a tiny drop in the galactic gene pool.
Only problem with that, is that there would have to be far more than a mere few million clones. Like seriously, I dont give a shit about the stupid low ball numbers the clone wars show gave out, an army made to fight in a galaxy populated by quadrillions would itself bare minimum be in the hundreds of billions. There is no way the clone army only consisted of a few million.
@@ryuukeisscifiproductions1818 Supposedly, the clone troopers were meant to be deployed to supplement existing polities fighting forces across the galaxy. Bear in mind that while the galactic republic wasn't allowed to have its own military, this was because each stellar nation or empire was supposed to do so in the first place. Didn't work out like that, of course. Complacency meant that various military unit across the galaxy downgraded to mostly ceremonial pomp and political factions. When the GAR started out it was having to carry the day while being burdened with hordes of hasty conscripts and some 'professional' military help.
@@ryuukeisscifiproductions1818 armies are typically not more than like 3-4% of a given population, so you're probably right in that regard; but I am not good enough stat analyst to say for sure whether or not you're right that it'd be enough to de-diversify the collective gene pool.
yeah what happened to "thousands upon thousands" of habitable worlds in the core alone? according to the karen traviss books there were about 2 million clones at the height of the GAR. I know, I know, it's not canon, but it's as rational a number as any other. Add to the fact that while their phenotype mostly.matched.jango, their genotype was pretty variable after the kaminoans adjusted it. Throw in some merely adequate.geneticists to monitor family trees and you're good to go. Contrary to popular belief, inbreeding doesn't immediately result in birth defects, hemopholia, mental retardation, etc in the first generation. It's when it's done over and over in every generation that you start to see real problems.
@@duskburn I always thought that the numbers in Star Wars and its conflicts are stupidly small. We are talking about a galaxy where a little more than half is inhabited by intelligent life. Only 2 million clones in the army sounds stupidly little to me for a galactic war waged over three years on dozens of worlds. I mean, at WWII there was an estimated total of 70 million fighters throughout the war and in all settings and it was only ONE planet not even as overpopulated at the time as other core worlds in the Star Wars universe. I read there that in reality the true number of clones was almost 30 million and it still seems like a little exaggeration considering the amount of ground they had to cover in a war where dozens of small civil wars were fought around the entire galaxy. Today, the Earth is inhabited by approximately 7.8 billion people. A couple of million clones spread across different planets would not really do that much damage, even more so if they are sent to planets with scant population density or colonies where manpower and people are needed to inhabit the planet. It is not like every planet under the influence of the Republic is inhabited to the ceiling and with economies that cannot hold a push that collapses.
“Considering that I was born years before they approved of the army, that was one of my main contentions. I never actually figured out who commissioned the clone army, and I don’t know much about our genetic template, other than the fact that he and his instructors taught us Mandalorian culture as if it were gospel truth, and he was a pretty big deal of a bounty hunter, and his name was Jango. I am pretty glad that, despite being terrible parents, the Kaminoans left us mostly intact.” -CS/CT-8711-12 “Cheng”, Captain and Scout of the 442nd Siege Battalion
@@chengzhou8711 oh 😅 I actually thought it was a quote from something and I was gonna look it up. I always like reading stories from clones' perspectives. Shame. Ever thought about writing some fanfic? Lol
Something I loved in the Republic Commando novels was when Kal Skirata protected the Null clones from being destroyed, it was just such a powerful moment for me
i really wish the mandalorian was set during the CW era, as the only mandalorians during the CW in canon that we know about is the deathwatch. and if he met with skirata or something and they recanonized him and the nulls i'd be happy
@@ramarblood7697 all droids had them, especially those of the CIS. They were forced to kill aginst their will as well, always under the influence of a protocol like order 66. Think about it, how come that everytime a droid gets cut off or damaged enough to loose its conmection to a main hub or something it simply tries to escape or help the clones?
That's called Slavery. That's the word everyone seems to be avoiding in the whole concept of the Clone Army. The Clone Army was a Slave Army. They had chips in them and everything.
If the Republic had survived, the clones would have most likely ended up a police force in the outer rim. Force knows that whatever presence the Republic had there has been inadequate for centuries and a couple of million dedicated soldiers would have been pretty much the only way they could have cleaned shop by the end of the Clone Wars. Which, come to think of it, is exactly what the Empire did as well. The difference here is that they would probably have ended up running the Outer Rim as an occupation force due to the complete breakdown in Law, Order and the Economy after the fighting ended.
@@laking09_57 Training the next generation to take over from them. And since their role would be more law enforcement than military, they could be encouraged to take their time to train said generation properly. And once they're too old for that, they retire, though what kid of retirement plan would be in place by then is a mystery. Personally though, I always felt that had order 66 not happened and neither the Jedi nor the Republic ended up falling... Well, some of the better treated clones like those from the 501st and the 212th would have just assumed roles in the Jedi temple. Looking after the younglings, escorting their former generals around, training the Padawans in everything from combat to how to tell if a Republic ration pack's gone bad or not, anything. Basically, figuratively babysitting the Jedi they served with and literally babysitting the next generation. Given that the vast majority of Jedi generals were dicks to their men, I don't think those that wanted to serve there would have had much competition for the position.
@@alexandrub8786 That carries a number of complications on multiple levels. For one thing, the offspring are going to have to be very careful about who they get intimate with in the future. For two, even the slightest rumour of coercion would be enough to start the war all over again. And for three, none of the clones have the slightest idea of what a stable family life looks like, which carries a raft of complications for everyone involved.
@@devaneyjohn5349 Good point. In other words the Republic is gonna have to give them a guild book on how to good human beings, how to raise a family, how to make money and etc.
@@zachsuarez1830 They were raised from birth to be soldiers, had no rights, and were seen as "products" of the Republic and Kaminoans. They were child soldiers/slaves from birth to death.
The Galactic Republic’s was going to create a massive problem to the Galaxy, and no doubt many within the Senate didn’t take into account what having a massive clone army. One had to take into account how much food, weapons, armor, and fuel for a massive army of the Grand Army of the Republic, and that just the Clone side of things. Then there are biological flaws of having a clone army of the same person, were they share the same biological makeup, thus having a same physique and body influence. The Senate perhaps would have crash the Galactic Market just by rushing the Clone Army into service, and fell straight into the hands of the banks and later into Palpatine.
Man that would work equally well as either a drama or a comedy. Recovering from the horrors of war in a cold galaxy where at best nobody *really* cares about you and at worst thinks you're little more than a biological combat droid, or... The Office except everyone is played by Bradley Dee Baker.
I'm with Cut Lawquan, screw the republic ima get married on some backwater where no one will find me and live out the rest of my life tending a farm with my wife and kids lol
Another reason the clones would be difficult to integrate into society is the fact that they would have terrible ptsd, the clone wars were awful. Jango Fett sure left quite the legacy.
Yeah. But he did achieve his goal to destroy the Jedi Order (for now). Mission accomplished at any cost, I guess. He didn’t have much love left in his heart except for Boba, after the Jedi hd slaughtered his family and fellow Mandalorians at Galidraan.
Republic: Literally uses sentient human clones as disposable pawns to fight a war Separatists: Uses a droid army to mitigate the loss of life 'In my opinion, the Jedi are evil!'
Lmao the Separatists were notorious for their callousness towards civilian casualties. The decision to use droids was simply common sense: They’re cheap to produce and maintain, and can be mass produced in relatively little time. You don’t need to feed or train a droid, you simply need to keep them charged and point them in the direction of whatever you want dead.
Are you gonna talk about how Cal skirata and the null ARCs found a way to stop the clones accelerated aging, as well as talk about the clones confirmed to have gotten treated and others that could probably have been treated?
In a galaxy with many ecumenopolises like Coruscant the population should be in the trillions. That a few million clones would cause a massive unemployment problem or such is ridiculous. But that's often the problem with star wars. The scales don't make sense.
That's why they were essentially child slaves which is REALLY messed up. What's hypocritical is the republic did outlaw slavery even though they used a slave army.
The clones did not have a mental age of a 10 year old. When they were cloned, their mind grew along with their body. A clone with a 10 year old mindset would not have been able to do what the clones did nearly as effectively. There would be much more desertion, more clone madness, more freezing, and the army would be smashed.
They didn’t have a mental age of 10. And anyway during the war the republic needed more clones so they deployed 9yr old clones meaning they weren’t always as well trained as the first bunch.
Hey Geetsly's, Knowing you're a fan of Star Wars and knowledge in the second world war as seen on your channel The Front, I'm curious on how star wars commanders and factions could do in the ww2 setting. Or any other era of warfare if you're feeling creative. Such as modern, ww1, 1700's, classical, etc... (Note: Said characters/factions must use technology that would be plausible to exist in the time frame their in. Wouldn't be fair if someone just pulled up to the battlefield with a star destroyer or the likes.) What strategies, tactics, and doctrines could translate into 40's technology, which ones can't, what roles would certain notable star wars commanders take/how the factions of star wars would react to the factions of our own world's past, and how could they compare to the real world commanders of the war? Anyone is free to comment in this thread.
@@mill2712 Well in one instance, yes. Each faction if mentioned will receive a landmass of their own to see how how said faction or factions would do such as alliances, enemies, if they'd participate in the war and in what capacity. For individuals, they can be assigned to the land mass of their congruent factions or they can be assigned to an existing faction or just do a versus against a notable figure.
Can't be worse than what happened to British troops after the Napoleonic wars. There were no pensions, absolutely no healthcare or help of any kind for them. After the war Britain had half a million men who's minds were fractured and broken, and they decided to just pack most of them on ships and force them to migrate to their various colonies and essentially just dumped them there.
No one ever mentions the fact that the Clones were effectively a slave army of child soldiers (Being ~10 years old and all). I put that together when I was like 9 and no one seems to acknowledge it.
I love how much depth geetsly get into with clones especially with questions hardly asked (I only know of the universe through movies/ some tv shows and some games )
I think the best way to deal with the clones after the war, is if the republic created a permanent standing army. This would be used to help further stabilize and civilize the edges of the inner rim bordering the outer rim, then steadily introduce trained civilian combatants into the army and slowly phase out the clones. They would eventually all die of old age, service, or settle down, those who wanted to leave would be given the chance to, but have some limitation for how manny ould be allowed to settle down on the same planet.
As hard to swallow as that is, I still love my clone boys! Fives, Rex, Bly, Gre, Echo ,Hevy, Cody, Jessie, hardcase, tup, odd ball, Wolfee, Waxer, boil, 99, Gregor, and to many more to count. For the republic!
@@mechengr1731 Those are the names of men, not clones men, who went above and beyond the call of duty in the name of the republic. They were the best examples to follow by
I would've trained the clones as construction workers and farmers to fix the mass starvation problems of the starwars galaxy its like a tool in each hand leaves no room for drugs lol and it helps peoduce food
I hate RUclips adds but sometimes their timing is hilarious... A bipolar depression add at 5:48... I didn't know if I should laugh, cringe, or face palm.
The clones having their hormonic state changed to being with their brothers is simultaneously the most hilarious and most creepiest thing I've seen out of the clone wars era. Bros really do be before hoes.
Maybe they could make a “Adopt-a-Clone” drive to introduce them into private security or alternative employment. There are also planets that don’t have inhabitants that they could set up as training and retirement communities for the clones to help train the new generations of non-clone soldiers and give them a place to go after they weren’t physically capable of doing the job anymore. Just a thought.
There were over a trillion beings living on coruscant alone. The SW galaxy had millions of populated worlds and over a quadrillion beings. Releasing the GAR into the galaxy wouldn't have been a big deal statistically. I don't think this is a problem at all and would barely even impact civilians. Heck you could send a squad to each planet and they would be picked up as a private security force over night.
the galaxy is a big place, I feel like a few million extra civilians isn't that big of a deal as long as they make a sensible plan for how/where to release them. My suggestion would be to retrain them all as miners or some other primary industry, establish military operated settlements on uninhabited worlds and use their labor to help pay off the war debts until they eventually all die out from natural causes. But yeah a mandatory sterilization would probably be required if they were to just be thrown into the wild.
So slavery until they die to pay the debts of the people that created them to be slaves. Thats almost as unethical as killing them. The clones hated boring. Imagine being a badass in the war, serving as a captain or an arc trooper, then forced into a mine with no rank and millions if people who look identical to you. It's exactly what the clones tried to avoid in the war.
Wanna know something funny? IRL there are 385,000 new humans born every single day. This is just one planet, with a relatively small human population. Keep in mind if we put humans into the same density as found in cities like new york, we'd not take up much room at all and could all fit into a small portion of a country like the US. Now, imagine a galaxy spanning civilization. If they had even 1% of the worlds in their galaxy's habitable planets inhabited, that's verging on 50-million+ worlds, if those words had an average population like Earth's, each likely would have a similar human birth rate. That's 1.925e+13 new human babies per 24 hour period. On a galactic scale, even being super-conservative, a few million wouldn't even be noticed. I honestly do not know how an army as small as only a few million could have helped the republic anyhow, given how big a galaxy is... But if that's the canon numbers, whoever wrote them has no concept of scale. THere realistically should be trillions, quadrillions, near countless numbers of clones to cover a galactic scale war. There would likely be entire solar systems dedicated to producing, arming and feeding these untold numbers. To put it into a real world scale, the USA has a standing armed force of 1.3 million active service members, and another 800k+ in reserve. China has another 2.8 million active, and an unknown reserve. You have another 800k Active and 2 million reserve from Russia. Even small countries like North Korea field an army of 1.3 million active troops. On a galactic scale, even a billion troops would be a joke. I always imagined the GAR to be absolutely massive, in the trillions of troops at least.
@@kauske yeah... star wars scale makes no sense. I remember an episode of the clone wars where an entire planet gets enslaved and transported off world and then a couple episodes later they rescue like 20 people from a single jail cell and call it a job well done
Honestly as far as genetics go, the clones were specifically made from some of the best genes around so thats not necessarily a bad thing. As for the sudden rise in population, that could have been funneled into the rim worlds, having the retired clones act as first wave colonists in dangerous outer rim systems.
Btw if it's a REAL problem, I don't see why the republic wouldn't just sterilize the whole clone army. That solves your gene thing and then ya ship-em off to the rim
Kaminoan: *Explain something complex* Jedi: ...I'm a jedi, not scientist Kaminoan: It basically is toss your coin and hope that it land on "Bro before Hoe", we flip a lot of our table over that hormone Another kaminoan: *Flip another table in anger* Jedi: Huh, I see
I find the act of creating a clone army to be too immoral, especially since they have artificially shortend life, just draft a few million out of the trillions of souls. They could have always quit cloning early on.
In regards to factor H, it makes sense that removing it is a bad idea. It sounds like factor H mainly covers Estrogen and Testostorone. Since both are vital to physical and mental development during puberty cutting out part of it would stunt the growth and development of the clone's body.
I mean if I was a clone then the Clone across from me would be 100% identical to me basically me meaning his right hand would be my right hand Soooooo...
I mean, considering the small number of Fett clones on comparison to the overall galactic human population as well as other compatibile species- just seems like they could spread the clones out across the Republic, this spreading Jango's genes around a vast area as opposed to it coming across like "Eh, we'll just drop them all off here."
Pretty sure Sidious made sure those actually asking these questions among others were either drowned out or silenced...just like he tried his bed to keep the obvious debt the war was running the republic into wasn't talked about or addressed, he wanted the republic bankrupt so that people were desperate and in a state of mind to not resist his taking full financial control (which he did even before wars end by taking over/being given oversight of the banking clan).
Sterilizing the units got rid of testosterone men need testosterone, you ever seen how angry and strong someone can get when hopped up on testosterone supplements
With shorten lifespans, you'd think this would taken care of the problem. Build retirement planets with structured schedules and activities until the last of the clones passed away.
Originally, Lucas was thinking about making Lando a clone, and that Leia would disdain him. This was b4 the clone wars we got. Apparently Lando would be from a planet entirely dominated by clans of clones and the 700 or so nation states they ruled over. The clones would be bizarre and were partially responsible for the then undefined clone war. Ya know, this throw away idea could be retconned into canon. Like a planet of various escaped clones trying to create a world of their own, perhaps even seeking cures for their madness and advanced aging. Who said they would all be Fett Clones, or even human clones? Seps tried to make a small clone army to fight the Jedi. Other people made cheap clones for slaves and cannon fodder. This could retcon a lot of throw away ideas from Pre prequel legends and even Lucas himself.
lets just say for a minute the republic stayed after the clone wars and order 66 never happened , anakin never turned and found out palpatine earlier by accident or something . The republic could segment the clone to old to serve and those not, keeping on the younger ones as a police force and army and the older ones get further sub-divided into groups of about 100,000 and form two initiatives one to find and colonise new worlds which would be the job of some of the clones and the others integrate into society sending about 100,000 to each world. also they could implement a law that clones were only allowed to have one child should they decide to have one at all. that's the best idea i can come up with.
An alternative would've been to to send them on unstable world for all those who still wanted to serve, and even train the republican people to serve in the army as in the old republic or, send them on social missions like farming unarmed world, making contact with new species, discovering and all...
The idea that a huge labor force would have no way to integrate into society is one of the greatest modern myths. In a market without third-party regulation (which there are bound to be in a galaxy) there is ample room, and demand, for labor. The clone army would have been fine. If the republic had won it would have actually been GREAT for the galaxy to have a massive amount of capable and competent labor suddenly entering the market. That is when people with business sense invest large amounts of money into ventures.
You’re absolutely right. This ridiculous myth was also believed after the second World War, which lead to a horrible economic downturn in 1949 from all of the terrible economic policies that were instituted to combat this “problem” (vis a vis maximum wage, etc.).
Clone Trooper Veteran: PTSD, medals, physical wounds, fought in multiple campaigns, and survived. Republic VA: The best we can do is a 30% disability rating.
Just an idea for a video (dunno if you have done it already), how did people in universe tell time. As in we use dates like 10 BBY or 15 ABY, how did people in the galaxy say years before the battle of Yavin? Have there been multiple ways in the course of history and have different civilizations had their own timekeeping measures?
Wait? a government body that fails in taking care of its vets? I thought Star Wars was sci-fi?
Yah the fi is supposed to mean fiction....
Art imitates life.
@@geetslys You need to stop conflating Canon and Legends
@@Autobotmatt428 hmmm idk
@@Autobotmatt428 Who care?
It's not. It's space fantasy.
In a way the creation of the clone army was designed by Palpatine to be a paradox. Both dispensable and indispensable at the same time. Dispensable as cannon fodder during the orchestrated war and indispensable at the rise of the Empire.
A really good point! Their true purpose was Order 66!
And being the first Stormtroopers as recruits might have become mutineers if they had a reason to question Palpatine.
@@geetslys execute order 66sus
In an alternate universe where the empire never existed, I think the best thing to do with the Clones is to give them their own planet. Is there some uninhabited planet out there that can sustain human life? Maybe use the Clones to colonize uninhabited planets.
"Lmao just chuck them to the Unknown Regions."
- Senate
Class-D be like
This would explain the ryanverse
@@Ironhold_Watch oh my god you’re right
Even more simple:
"If you find a job/military career on an outer rim planet, the republic will subsidize your first house there."
I truly hope The Bad Batch show goes into detail about how clones were treated after the war, and what the soldiers felt about being retired and replaced.
Yeah, we never saw that period of the star wars,maybe being replaced by humans, made the bad batch defect.
I guess you got your wish granted :)
Kaminoans: We want our clones to choose bros over hoes.
Jedi: You hear that Anakin?
Anakin couldn't hear cause Padme's cheeks were clapping too loud.
@@geetslys damn 😂
Geetsly's I love your humor!😂
Anakin: *Finishing slicing a youngling* Sorry, what was that?
Maybe the Clones coulda been persuaded to help fight the Chip's influence more if they'd been treated more like twin soldiers an less twin slaves.. Like after being released to the Jedi theyd been encouraged to own property and take wives have families besides just becoming individuals.. along with the Republic trying to cure their aging after a certain point to where it switches to normal after a time.. such incentives made, along with an infrastructure modified to support whom ever made it to wars end if your was a clone soldier ESPECIALLY if instituted by the Jedi coulda went along way in helping their cause..
Veterans are treated poorly in the real world too sadly
All too true.
Anyone that has the balls to run into battle for their nation deserves a good paying job and a home when they return
@@thecrock2474 agreed
US retired forces in a nutshell. Have disdain the way the US treats its soldiers like trash. Also the way it treats the working class!!!
Dont they eat free at appbees they need to be treated good for there work
"For reasons unknown, sterilizing humans clones and thus removing Factor H from the equation, DRASTICALLY decreased the effectiveness of units."
Yeah, somehow I feel like if was sterilized my unit would become less effective, too.
Considering testosterone tends to increase aggression, I could see why it might negatively effect the clones combat performance.
For some reason, I couldn't help but think of Sora's speech from No Game No Life when he said that lol. Basically, all men want a pretty girl to fight for.
Konosuba does this to an extent in s1.
@@dylanhaugen3739 Sterilisation doesn't effect testosterone levels when done correctly.
I disagree with the whole “ if clones were allowed to procreate at will that it would severely mess up the gene pool for humans”. That might be true if you were talking about earth’s population but we’re talking about an entire galaxy with hundreds of thousands of planets and quadrillions of humans and human-like beings who can procreate with humans. A few million clones would be a tiny drop in the galactic gene pool.
And they were present on all if them because of the war right?... they'd fu ck lol
Only problem with that, is that there would have to be far more than a mere few million clones. Like seriously, I dont give a shit about the stupid low ball numbers the clone wars show gave out, an army made to fight in a galaxy populated by quadrillions would itself bare minimum be in the hundreds of billions. There is no way the clone army only consisted of a few million.
@@ryuukeisscifiproductions1818 Supposedly, the clone troopers were meant to be deployed to supplement existing polities fighting forces across the galaxy. Bear in mind that while the galactic republic wasn't allowed to have its own military, this was because each stellar nation or empire was supposed to do so in the first place.
Didn't work out like that, of course. Complacency meant that various military unit across the galaxy downgraded to mostly ceremonial pomp and political factions. When the GAR started out it was having to carry the day while being burdened with hordes of hasty conscripts and some 'professional' military help.
That's true, and this way we can avoid draconian intrusions of privacy.
@@ryuukeisscifiproductions1818 armies are typically not more than like 3-4% of a given population, so you're probably right in that regard; but I am not good enough stat analyst to say for sure whether or not you're right that it'd be enough to de-diversify the collective gene pool.
*Jango Fett's DNA overrepresented in the human genome*
Laughs in Genghis Khan
Right just what I was thinking
*Laughs in random ass Neanderthal*
1\100 people are related to him so umm yeah not seeing a problem with jango getting some overrepresention
yeah what happened to "thousands upon thousands" of habitable worlds in the core alone? according to the karen traviss books there were about 2 million clones at the height of the GAR. I know, I know, it's not canon, but it's as rational a number as any other. Add to the fact that while their phenotype mostly.matched.jango, their genotype was pretty variable after the kaminoans adjusted it. Throw in some merely adequate.geneticists to monitor family trees and you're good to go. Contrary to popular belief, inbreeding doesn't immediately result in birth defects, hemopholia, mental retardation, etc in the first generation. It's when it's done over and over in every generation that you start to see real problems.
@@duskburn I always thought that the numbers in Star Wars and its conflicts are stupidly small. We are talking about a galaxy where a little more than half is inhabited by intelligent life. Only 2 million clones in the army sounds stupidly little to me for a galactic war waged over three years on dozens of worlds. I mean, at WWII there was an estimated total of 70 million fighters throughout the war and in all settings and it was only ONE planet not even as overpopulated at the time as other core worlds in the Star Wars universe. I read there that in reality the true number of clones was almost 30 million and it still seems like a little exaggeration considering the amount of ground they had to cover in a war where dozens of small civil wars were fought around the entire galaxy. Today, the Earth is inhabited by approximately 7.8 billion people. A couple of million clones spread across different planets would not really do that much damage, even more so if they are sent to planets with scant population density or colonies where manpower and people are needed to inhabit the planet. It is not like every planet under the influence of the Republic is inhabited to the ceiling and with economies that cannot hold a push that collapses.
“Considering that I was born years before they approved of the army, that was one of my main contentions. I never actually figured out who commissioned the clone army, and I don’t know much about our genetic template, other than the fact that he and his instructors taught us Mandalorian culture as if it were gospel truth, and he was a pretty big deal of a bounty hunter, and his name was Jango. I am pretty glad that, despite being terrible parents, the Kaminoans left us mostly intact.” -CS/CT-8711-12 “Cheng”, Captain and Scout of the 442nd Siege Battalion
Source?
@@Konaruhi me, consider all comments in this fashion as an “in-character” response.
@@chengzhou8711 oh 😅 I actually thought it was a quote from something and I was gonna look it up. I always like reading stories from clones' perspectives. Shame. Ever thought about writing some fanfic? Lol
@@Konaruhi Yes.
@@chengzhou8711 Have you?
Something I loved in the Republic Commando novels was when Kal Skirata protected the Null clones from being destroyed, it was just such a powerful moment for me
He was a real homie!
i really wish the mandalorian was set during the CW era, as the only mandalorians during the CW in canon that we know about is the deathwatch. and if he met with skirata or something and they recanonized him and the nulls i'd be happy
Fr @@RM-jq5vi
"They desperately hoped the clones would choose bros over hoes." XD
The Jedi were hoping that Anakin would do that to, but he chose the hoes.
@@ramarblood7697 I mean, who wouldnt. Lmao
@@dillanaddington7022 Gay people
We bring the humour.
@@geetslys And we love it
The clones definitely deserved better!
Amen.
Indeed btw I'm your hundredth like Indiana jones
@@deadlystalker7483 thanks
@@indianajones4321 I'm your 113
@@anakinskywalker5254 the force is strong with you
Basically they treated living beings like machines, and when they understood that the clones have emotions, they kept treating them like droids.
I mean the Sentient droids sorta had emotions.
@@ramarblood7697 all droids had them, especially those of the CIS. They were forced to kill aginst their will as well, always under the influence of a protocol like order 66.
Think about it, how come that everytime a droid gets cut off or damaged enough to loose its conmection to a main hub or something it simply tries to escape or help the clones?
That's called Slavery. That's the word everyone seems to be avoiding in the whole concept of the Clone Army. The Clone Army was a Slave Army. They had chips in them and everything.
Poor clones.All they could do was follow orders.
Still, Dmitri,
*_FIRE THE PANZERSHREK_*
Good soldiers follow orders
Blast em!
@@-_melow_-8111 Came here to say this
If the Republic had survived, the clones would have most likely ended up a police force in the outer rim.
Force knows that whatever presence the Republic had there has been inadequate for centuries and a couple of million dedicated soldiers would have been pretty much the only way they could have cleaned shop by the end of the Clone Wars.
Which, come to think of it, is exactly what the Empire did as well.
The difference here is that they would probably have ended up running the Outer Rim as an occupation force due to the complete breakdown in Law, Order and the Economy after the fighting ended.
That’s pretty smart. But when happens when the clones get too old to work. Where would u shove em
@@laking09_57 Training the next generation to take over from them. And since their role would be more law enforcement than military, they could be encouraged to take their time to train said generation properly.
And once they're too old for that, they retire, though what kid of retirement plan would be in place by then is a mystery.
Personally though, I always felt that had order 66 not happened and neither the Jedi nor the Republic ended up falling...
Well, some of the better treated clones like those from the 501st and the 212th would have just assumed roles in the Jedi temple. Looking after the younglings, escorting their former generals around, training the Padawans in everything from combat to how to tell if a Republic ration pack's gone bad or not, anything. Basically, figuratively babysitting the Jedi they served with and literally babysitting the next generation.
Given that the vast majority of Jedi generals were dicks to their men, I don't think those that wanted to serve there would have had much competition for the position.
They could also "republicanize" the confederates by marrying with the natives.
@@alexandrub8786 That carries a number of complications on multiple levels. For one thing, the offspring are going to have to be very careful about who they get intimate with in the future.
For two, even the slightest rumour of coercion would be enough to start the war all over again.
And for three, none of the clones have the slightest idea of what a stable family life looks like, which carries a raft of complications for everyone involved.
@@devaneyjohn5349 Good point. In other words the Republic is gonna have to give them a guild book on how to good human beings, how to raise a family, how to make money and etc.
Could the problem perhaps be that it was extremely unethical to use essentially child slaves to fight a war?
Could the solution be that storm-troopers were more ethical than clones then?
@@ramarblood7697 yeah but clones are cooler
@@ramarblood7697 i
They weren’t child slaves their minds progressed at the same rate as their body
@@zachsuarez1830 They were raised from birth to be soldiers, had no rights, and were seen as "products" of the Republic and Kaminoans. They were child soldiers/slaves from birth to death.
I love this star wars content please keep making more
O.K., but not because you told me too! 😤😤😤
@@geetslys ?
This is all I watch
Blake Nelson
R/whooosh
"Jango Fett's genes would have been disproportionately represented in the human genome"
*Ghengis Khan liked that
The Galactic Republic’s was going to create a massive problem to the Galaxy, and no doubt many within the Senate didn’t take into account what having a massive clone army. One had to take into account how much food, weapons, armor, and fuel for a massive army of the Grand Army of the Republic, and that just the Clone side of things. Then there are biological flaws of having a clone army of the same person, were they share the same biological makeup, thus having a same physique and body influence. The Senate perhaps would have crash the Galactic Market just by rushing the Clone Army into service, and fell straight into the hands of the banks and later into Palpatine.
Imagine trying to solve crime with clones.
Thumbnail is me when my parents ask why I failed spanish
LMAO
Maybe i could help with that
Spanish or vanish
Spanish
You failed spanish?! I passed spanish like if it was nothing!
Anybody notice how the thumbnail predicted the kenobi series
I want a Star Wars show following a clone being integrated into society after the war.
Man that would work equally well as either a drama or a comedy. Recovering from the horrors of war in a cold galaxy where at best nobody *really* cares about you and at worst thinks you're little more than a biological combat droid, or... The Office except everyone is played by Bradley Dee Baker.
@@awittyusernamepleaselaugh7481 i want both.
I'm with Cut Lawquan, screw the republic ima get married on some backwater where no one will find me and live out the rest of my life tending a farm with my wife and kids lol
He knew what was up!
@@geetslys a few others did as well if I remember right. some commandos and arc troopers left before the battle of geonosis. in legends anyway lol
@@KingBobBobBob there's always a bit of truth in legends. So it did happened technically🤔.
@@kingnamor777 legends is just waiting to be canonized
@@LeafBoye True dat👏🏿. At least it's canon in my eyes.
I think the clones would have colonized a second Mandalore.
This hurts more after watching Kenobi episode 2.😭
Another reason the clones would be difficult to integrate into society is the fact that they would have terrible ptsd, the clone wars were awful. Jango Fett sure left quite the legacy.
Yeah. But he did achieve his goal to destroy the Jedi Order (for now). Mission accomplished at any cost, I guess. He didn’t have much love left in his heart except for Boba, after the Jedi hd slaughtered his family and fellow Mandalorians at Galidraan.
Republic: Literally uses sentient human clones as disposable pawns to fight a war
Separatists: Uses a droid army to mitigate the loss of life
'In my opinion, the Jedi are evil!'
Lmao the Separatists were notorious for their callousness towards civilian casualties. The decision to use droids was simply common sense: They’re cheap to produce and maintain, and can be mass produced in relatively little time. You don’t need to feed or train a droid, you simply need to keep them charged and point them in the direction of whatever you want dead.
Are you gonna talk about how Cal skirata and the null ARCs found a way to stop the clones accelerated aging, as well as talk about the clones confirmed to have gotten treated and others that could probably have been treated?
damn that thumbnail looks practically identical to the show...
In a galaxy with many ecumenopolises like Coruscant the population should be in the trillions. That a few million clones would cause a massive unemployment problem or such is ridiculous. But that's often the problem with star wars. The scales don't make sense.
Wait, wouldn’t Kaminoan clones still have the mental age of a 10 year old? If so, that’s messed up.
That's why they were essentially child slaves which is REALLY messed up. What's hypocritical is the republic did outlaw slavery even though they used a slave army.
The clones did not have a mental age of a 10 year old. When they were cloned, their mind grew along with their body. A clone with a 10 year old mindset would not have been able to do what the clones did nearly as effectively. There would be much more desertion, more clone madness, more freezing, and the army would be smashed.
@@lordofspades9222 so they were eleven
It's SUPER messed up.
They didn’t have a mental age of 10. And anyway during the war the republic needed more clones so they deployed 9yr old clones meaning they weren’t always as well trained as the first bunch.
Hey Geetsly's, Knowing you're a fan of Star Wars and knowledge in the second world war as seen on your channel The Front, I'm curious on how star wars commanders and factions could do in the ww2 setting.
Or any other era of warfare if you're feeling creative. Such as modern, ww1, 1700's, classical, etc...
(Note: Said characters/factions must use technology that would be plausible to exist in the time frame their in. Wouldn't be fair if someone just pulled up to the battlefield with a star destroyer or the likes.)
What strategies, tactics, and doctrines could translate into 40's technology, which ones can't, what roles would certain notable star wars commanders take/how the factions of star wars would react to the factions of our own world's past, and how could they compare to the real world commanders of the war?
Anyone is free to comment in this thread.
Will each faction be able to receive their own landmass or do they just appear in some predestined country?
@@mill2712
Well in one instance, yes. Each faction if mentioned will receive a landmass of their own to see how how said faction or factions would do such as alliances, enemies, if they'd participate in the war and in what capacity.
For individuals, they can be assigned to the land mass of their congruent factions or they can be assigned to an existing faction or just do a versus against a notable figure.
That would be unfair, I mean with Thrawn or Tarkin , any Battle would be a Cakewalk
@@Platinum-rm4ce
And why do you think it would be such a cakewalk? Can you explain your reasoning?
"Focusing the clones sexual drives towards unit cohesion" Phwoarr
Reminds me of an old army saying: "what is gayness in civilian life is brotherhood in the army". (Note that this is a tranlation)
Dude... thumbnail really makes sad. Gosh it reminds me of that Simple History video of what the UK did to their Soldiers after WW1.
I've watched the video you're talking about and sadly it still happens all too often today in America
Can't be worse than what happened to British troops after the Napoleonic wars. There were no pensions, absolutely no healthcare or help of any kind for them. After the war Britain had half a million men who's minds were fractured and broken, and they decided to just pack most of them on ships and force them to migrate to their various colonies and essentially just dumped them there.
If I was a clone, I would have deserted and went to the planet Zeltros. Not many questions, really relaxing.
"Overly represented in the human gene pool", so Jango is Star Wars's, Genghis Khan.
No one ever mentions the fact that the Clones were effectively a slave army of child soldiers (Being ~10 years old and all). I put that together when I was like 9 and no one seems to acknowledge it.
Because they are modefied to age faster.
My mom during Christmas: “Have you been naughty or nice this year?”
Me in the thumbnail:
I love how much depth geetsly get into with clones especially with questions hardly asked (I only know of the universe through movies/ some tv shows and some games )
The Thumbnail aged like fine wine
Hits hard too 😭
I love how this thumbnail is now canon
That thumbnail is now canon
Man, who else came here after seeing Kenobi Episode 2?
I did 😢
I think the best way to deal with the clones after the war, is if the republic created a permanent standing army.
This would be used to help further stabilize and civilize the edges of the inner rim bordering the outer rim, then steadily introduce trained civilian combatants into the army and slowly phase out the clones. They would eventually all die of old age, service, or settle down, those who wanted to leave would be given the chance to, but have some limitation for how manny ould be allowed to settle down on the same planet.
Thumbnail really hitting different rn
It's too real 😭
As hard to swallow as that is, I still love my clone boys! Fives, Rex, Bly, Gre, Echo ,Hevy, Cody, Jessie, hardcase, tup, odd ball, Wolfee, Waxer, boil, 99, Gregor, and to many more to count. For the republic!
God, Heavy's death cut deep. Especially when you realize how he got his name.
Of all the clone deaths, his, 99, Fives, and Hardcase hit the hardest.
@@mechengr1731 Those are the names of men, not clones men, who went above and beyond the call of duty in the name of the republic. They were the best examples to follow by
@@Imperial-Athena well said
👏👏👏
I only said Clone deaths to distinguish from Jedi deaths
Dude!!! The thumbnail
I would've trained the clones as construction workers and farmers to fix the mass starvation problems of the starwars galaxy its like a tool in each hand leaves no room for drugs lol and it helps peoduce food
A part of me really hopes there’s a planet that is “heavily influenced” by clone dna
Used to be in the old lore that Mandalore became a safe haven for clones after they were expunged from the military.
@@colbycoolby1592 I think that there was an entire Clan where most clones went. Clan Skirata, I think it was
I hate RUclips adds but sometimes their timing is hilarious... A bipolar depression add at 5:48... I didn't know if I should laugh, cringe, or face palm.
The clones having their hormonic state changed to being with their brothers is simultaneously the most hilarious and most creepiest thing I've seen out of the clone wars era. Bros really do be before hoes.
Cut Lawquane would like to interject.
how does gregor survive into the time of the empire?
Maybe they could make a “Adopt-a-Clone” drive to introduce them into private security or alternative employment. There are also planets that don’t have inhabitants that they could set up as training and retirement communities for the clones to help train the new generations of non-clone soldiers and give them a place to go after they weren’t physically capable of doing the job anymore. Just a thought.
Great video! These were issues I've always thought about in regards to the clones. Thank you so much.
Geetslys, The Lore Master and Star Wars Explained are the best Star Wars Channels.
Spent the weekend watching episodes 1 through 6. Poor clones, they didn't know..
Indeed. Gotta binge TCW to really start sobbing.
@@geetslys gets me every time :'(
"So, uh... hey do you wanna watch Xanadu tonight?
"I _love_ Xanadu!"
There were over a trillion beings living on coruscant alone. The SW galaxy had millions of populated worlds and over a quadrillion beings. Releasing the GAR into the galaxy wouldn't have been a big deal statistically. I don't think this is a problem at all and would barely even impact civilians. Heck you could send a squad to each planet and they would be picked up as a private security force over night.
The idea that the star wars galaxy couldnt handle millions of able bodied 40 somethings in its workforce is ridiculous.
"Bro over hoes" for clones sounds like the navy to me 🤣
the galaxy is a big place, I feel like a few million extra civilians isn't that big of a deal as long as they make a sensible plan for how/where to release them. My suggestion would be to retrain them all as miners or some other primary industry, establish military operated settlements on uninhabited worlds and use their labor to help pay off the war debts until they eventually all die out from natural causes. But yeah a mandatory sterilization would probably be required if they were to just be thrown into the wild.
I would suggest the ex-confederated planets.
So slavery until they die to pay the debts of the people that created them to be slaves. Thats almost as unethical as killing them. The clones hated boring. Imagine being a badass in the war, serving as a captain or an arc trooper, then forced into a mine with no rank and millions if people who look identical to you. It's exactly what the clones tried to avoid in the war.
Wanna know something funny? IRL there are 385,000 new humans born every single day. This is just one planet, with a relatively small human population. Keep in mind if we put humans into the same density as found in cities like new york, we'd not take up much room at all and could all fit into a small portion of a country like the US. Now, imagine a galaxy spanning civilization.
If they had even 1% of the worlds in their galaxy's habitable planets inhabited, that's verging on 50-million+ worlds, if those words had an average population like Earth's, each likely would have a similar human birth rate. That's 1.925e+13 new human babies per 24 hour period. On a galactic scale, even being super-conservative, a few million wouldn't even be noticed.
I honestly do not know how an army as small as only a few million could have helped the republic anyhow, given how big a galaxy is... But if that's the canon numbers, whoever wrote them has no concept of scale. THere realistically should be trillions, quadrillions, near countless numbers of clones to cover a galactic scale war. There would likely be entire solar systems dedicated to producing, arming and feeding these untold numbers.
To put it into a real world scale, the USA has a standing armed force of 1.3 million active service members, and another 800k+ in reserve. China has another 2.8 million active, and an unknown reserve. You have another 800k Active and 2 million reserve from Russia. Even small countries like North Korea field an army of 1.3 million active troops. On a galactic scale, even a billion troops would be a joke. I always imagined the GAR to be absolutely massive, in the trillions of troops at least.
@@kauske so you want a more Warhammer 40k Star Wars?
@@kauske yeah... star wars scale makes no sense. I remember an episode of the clone wars where an entire planet gets enslaved and transported off world and then a couple episodes later they rescue like 20 people from a single jail cell and call it a job well done
In a Galaxy of Trillions I dont think a couple of Million clones would be that big of a deal to integrate into society.
That thumbnail makes me soo bad . I would have gave that clone so many credits if I seen sitting on the street like that
I think retired clones would have made great police forces after the war. Coruscant's underworld is vastly lacking the much needed police presence
Poor Clone, he must have not watched those Wrist Rockets.
"taken out back and put down."
Wow that escalated quickly.
Star Trek: *gets mobile ad into a geetslys video*
Me: *Blasts the skip ad button*
that thumbnail is so damn accurate
Treating clones as humans: exists
The republic: maybe if i don't look at it it'll go away
It is always great to know the Kaminoians wanted all clones to "smash" among themselves
Honestly as far as genetics go, the clones were specifically made from some of the best genes around so thats not necessarily a bad thing.
As for the sudden rise in population, that could have been funneled into the rim worlds, having the retired clones act as first wave colonists in dangerous outer rim systems.
Btw if it's a REAL problem, I don't see why the republic wouldn't just sterilize the whole clone army.
That solves your gene thing and then ya ship-em off to the rim
Oh wow, so they became in part like ancient cultures for example the sacred band of thebes.
Well, what if clones had an option to leave the army or stay, we know there are clones that would stay in the army like Rex
This content is so good.
Also when the clone says “Attention! sergeant on deck!” is he talking about Sergeant Geetsly?
Can't believe it.. A whole planet full of clones
Kaminoan: *Explain something complex*
Jedi: ...I'm a jedi, not scientist
Kaminoan: It basically is toss your coin and hope that it land on "Bro before Hoe", we flip a lot of our table over that hormone
Another kaminoan: *Flip another table in anger*
Jedi: Huh, I see
I wonder how many are out there with Jango genes
I find the act of creating a clone army to be too immoral, especially since they have artificially shortend life, just draft a few million out of the trillions of souls. They could have always quit cloning early on.
In regards to factor H, it makes sense that removing it is a bad idea. It sounds like factor H mainly covers Estrogen and Testostorone. Since both are vital to physical and mental development during puberty cutting out part of it would stunt the growth and development of the clone's body.
Imagine they took out factor h and instead of the deep voice clones have they’d have some squeaky ass voice
@@laking09_57 Dear god that would be funny and sad
I mean if I was a clone then the Clone across from me would be 100% identical to me basically me meaning his right hand would be my right hand Soooooo...
I mean, considering the small number of Fett clones on comparison to the overall galactic human population as well as other compatibile species- just seems like they could spread the clones out across the Republic, this spreading Jango's genes around a vast area as opposed to it coming across like "Eh, we'll just drop them all off here."
Pretty sure Sidious made sure those actually asking these questions among others were either drowned out or silenced...just like he tried his bed to keep the obvious debt the war was running the republic into wasn't talked about or addressed, he wanted the republic bankrupt so that people were desperate and in a state of mind to not resist his taking full financial control (which he did even before wars end by taking over/being given oversight of the banking clan).
Sterilizing the units got rid of testosterone men need testosterone, you ever seen how angry and strong someone can get when hopped up on testosterone supplements
3:22 the framing of this shot makes a shape eerily similar to the imperial insignia
No wonder the clones loved the Empire
Considering all the fail safes Sidious had wouldn't there be like a suicide order for the clones?
Would it really be that big a deal? There's a trillion people on Coruscant alone.
With shorten lifespans, you'd think this would taken care of the problem. Build retirement planets with structured schedules and activities until the last of the clones passed away.
The old sound of the being of the star wars battle one for the PS2 . I was wating for the next beep to go off the ensteed there was words .
> Jango Fett's dna would be massively overepresented.
And thats a bad thing because?
Originally, Lucas was thinking about making Lando a clone, and that Leia would disdain him.
This was b4 the clone wars we got. Apparently Lando would be from a planet entirely dominated by clans of clones and the 700 or so nation states they ruled over.
The clones would be bizarre and were partially responsible for the then undefined clone war.
Ya know, this throw away idea could be retconned into canon. Like a planet of various escaped clones trying to create a world of their own, perhaps even seeking cures for their madness and advanced aging.
Who said they would all be Fett Clones, or even human clones? Seps tried to make a small clone army to fight the Jedi. Other people made cheap clones for slaves and cannon fodder.
This could retcon a lot of throw away ideas from Pre prequel legends and even Lucas himself.
lets just say for a minute the republic stayed after the clone wars and order 66 never happened , anakin never turned and found out palpatine earlier by accident or something . The republic could segment the clone to old to serve and those not, keeping on the younger ones as a police force and army and the older ones get further sub-divided into groups of about 100,000 and form two initiatives one to find and colonise new worlds which would be the job of some of the clones and the others integrate into society sending about 100,000 to each world. also they could implement a law that clones were only allowed to have one child should they decide to have one at all. that's the best idea i can come up with.
An alternative would've been to to send them on unstable world for all those who still wanted to serve, and even train the republican people to serve in the army as in the old republic or, send them on social missions like farming unarmed world, making contact with new species, discovering and all...
The idea that a huge labor force would have no way to integrate into society is one of the greatest modern myths. In a market without third-party regulation (which there are bound to be in a galaxy) there is ample room, and demand, for labor. The clone army would have been fine. If the republic had won it would have actually been GREAT for the galaxy to have a massive amount of capable and competent labor suddenly entering the market. That is when people with business sense invest large amounts of money into ventures.
You’re absolutely right. This ridiculous myth was also believed after the second World War, which lead to a horrible economic downturn in 1949 from all of the terrible economic policies that were instituted to combat this “problem” (vis a vis maximum wage, etc.).
Clone Trooper Veteran: PTSD, medals, physical wounds, fought in multiple campaigns, and survived.
Republic VA: The best we can do is a 30% disability rating.
7:29 you forgot that they’re also highly skilled killers
Wouldn't a few million new workers be a drop in the bucket for the republic?
Just an idea for a video (dunno if you have done it already), how did people in universe tell time. As in we use dates like 10 BBY or 15 ABY, how did people in the galaxy say years before the battle of Yavin? Have there been multiple ways in the course of history and have different civilizations had their own timekeeping measures?
7:12 reminds me of the Massacre of Obedience from Kenshi