Rogue's Chat | Animus Drifter PART 1 [Discussion]
![Leo K [Rogue]](http://yt3.ggpht.com/ytc/AIdro_lU2XPRnoiDY_KR9FankuYDSJC2utR6y9iK6BreeHJD_PA=s48-c-k-c0x00ffffff-no-rj)
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- Опубликовано: 17 июл 2024
- Animus Drifter:
/ @animusdrifter
0:00:00 Intro
0:02:05 AnimusDrifter's First AC was Odyssey!
0:03:14 How did going back to Classic AC from Odyssey feel?
0:05:18 What has AnimusDrifter been playing recently?
0:06:04 Showing The Fun to New Players in Games/Mods
0:10:11 Leo's been playing Destiny (growth and rogue archetypes)
0:11:44 Leo loves Metroidvanias/Soulslikes
0:14:03 Classic Movement is GOOD WITHOUT Mods
0:15:35 ACUFixes vs AC2's Parkour Mod (similar, not the same)
0:17:42 Why do we LOVE Classic Parkour?
0:22:26 Classic vs Modern: Doing Too Much vs Doing Too Little
0:24:02 Spotting and Navigating Volatility
0:25:10 Bordeaux are Legendary for LISTENING and CARING
0:27:36 Good Grappling Hooks are Supplements
0:29:37 Trying to protect players hurts others more
0:33:09 Translating Intent into Gameplay
00:44:08 Mods DON'T "Fix" Movement, they EXTEND your options
0:49:28 Correcting Ezio's Excess Stumbles
0:51:52 AC1 Tips from AnimusDrifter
0:53:29 AC fails to invite players to learn systems
0:57:37 Arkham doesn't shy away from challenge and systems-knowledge
0:59:00 Open world means too many parkour moves can be safely ignored
1:03:50 Pretty animations don't MEAN a move is strong
1:05:29 Apparent Functionality and Adapting to Mission-Contexts
1:09:50 Autopiloting parkour-chains for combat/stealth decision-making
1:11:54 Parkour lets you "fly over" inconvenient terrain easily
1:13:24 Mods do not add ejects (correcting a silly idea)
1:15:01 Skill-Growth across AC paradigms
1:20:38 Ropotopolous is INSANE
1:21:28 Failstates matter because we want more ways to SUCCEED
1:25:00 Discussing the Animus Assist-Mode idea
1:28:01 Discovering unexpected interactions in games
1:29:38 Improving the RPG layer in Assassin's Creed
1:36:19 Getting good at classic AC
1:42:55 Would extra dev time REALLY have made Unity what classic fans want?
1:49:11 How does making videos change how we see games? 
Игры
![Assassin's Creed Unity | No Upgrades [2019]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9b1pV3K8ooY/mqdefault.jpg)
1:49:09 has a second of loud audio distortion that shouldn't be there. Sorry about that.
PART 2 is another hour that I had to render separately due to some technical stuff. Coming soon after.
I thought he was an old timer who just started RUclips recently, but no he's a "new" player who started with Odyssey. That's amazing
Surprised me, for sure.
putting the tuxedo on for this rn
The power of Luka.
Fun fact: In Polygon's "An oral history of Assassin's Creed" piece they did in 2018, Patrice Desilets (creative director for AC1, 2 and Brotherhood) could NOT SHUT UP about how "Nothing is true, everything is permitted" was just as central to the game's design as it was to the Assassins. Through Altaïr's movement the player was meant to embody an ideal of Freedom, and a "go anywhere, do anything" attitude was something the developers really had in mind while putting the game together. They *wanted* players to break the bounds of what was considered acceptable. Hearing his words echoed in your conversation is surreal, and telling -- both of how sharply those themes were communicated in the games, and how knowlegeable you two are about AC as a media object.
That's so cool, I had no idea, and it's crazy how that really did shine through in the final game for players who deeply Care about it and were paying attention. Holy... o_o
Yes, I think it's awesome. You should really give that piece a read if you can! Playing through AC:B knowing that Patrice was obsessed with in-city horse but had to wait 5 years to implement it is kind of funny; but also strangely moving. They really had a very specific vision for the total experience of AC1 they couldn't realize until much later (and some might even say they never did). AC was his baby.
HELL YEAH. I'm saving this one for work tomorrow. Gonna save my entire Friday.
Awesome, hope you have a good day.
Bro Leo vids make for the best lunch breaks!!
An excellent discussion between the two of you. AD is not only (arguably) the best player in terms of hands-to-buttons understanding/ability of Classic AC parkour among those with any sort of public recognition, but is also one of the most cogent thinkers & rhetoricians as pertains to the defence & promotion of the merits of Classic AC’s parkour. Even when it comes to the mods, his ability to foresee potential problems of misuse by the generally uninformed public of the mod’s expanded functionality has consistently been on point and his prophylactic efforts to prevent these in the mod’s promotion have no doubt been instrumental in ensuring that the public perception of the mod is at least largely line with the intentions of its creators.
The impact that parkour choreo has had on the AC skilling scene in just the last 4 years has been remarkable and it’s clear that (at least within the more dedicated communities) the Overton window of parkour discourse has certainly shifted heavily in our favour, evidence of this being that even official Ubisoft products are using community parkour terminology, viz. Mirage eject patch notes. It’ll be interesting to see the effects of this moving forward, especially now with the mod existing as a concrete finished-product model for nigh exactly what we want from AC so long as it maintains the semi-automated movement paradigm it’s had since the beginning. Let’s hope Ubisoft finally takes the right message from the community on this issue.
Wouldn't it be funny Ubisoft sees this outcry for more movement options and all of a sudden removes any and all forms of automated movement in response?
Great comment, Jcers. I hope that all of this "text" around Parkour online nowadays (where "text" is, discussion, videos, choreo, guides, etc) does have some kind of effect on at least conveying, hey, this is an element of play that is Valued and should be invested in beyond the minimum. Would you be fine having a chat on of these yourself, by the way? DM me if that's something that seems fun. I know you're busy most days, but we could probably still find a time a bit later on.
Yoooo, Jcers and Leo K crossover would be crazy. Hoping you guys can get together sometime
Luka is such a smart person and he is an incredible creator that I'm glad is apart of the AC community
I'm glad for that too, honestly.
I'm always surprised that, when talking about movement in classic AC, no one ever mentions that it's camera relative and not character relative. That has caused so much confusion and has affected the image of AC 1-Rev very negatively. The input to do a side eject in those game CHANGES based on where your camera is facing. If you know it, it's an easy thing to get around, but a lot of casual players failed to understand this.
Yeah, I think it's one of those things people who know about it don't really think to mention because it's so intuitive, instinctive and automatic. Like of course you would play that way, it just makes sense to us. But I could see how players who don't know about it would be pretty confused about what their Assassin is doing at times.
You should get the hidden one, the spaniard or the exile as a guest
I should! I've already talked to The Spaniard, technically. That's AltairStealth's second channel.
ruclips.net/video/_YWqsj7R_SE/видео.html
Really happy to hear that it's still possible that someone who started from Odyssey can go back and appreciate and show off the classics. I hope that a good amount of new players coming in with Shadows will follow in these footsteps. I especially loved the way you referenced the Arkham games and how they expanded systems on each iteration, and it makes me all the more frustrated that AC didn't follow suit in the same way.
The main point I'm taking away is that if Ubi ever made an AC game that's just a level designer with the fixed classic parkour system, I would play that game forever.
Excited for part 2 ^_^
A "Mario Maker" style AC game / "Assassin's Creed Maker" would genuinely pop off so unbelievably hard among a certain portion of the playerbase.
2:02:58 I remember this! The choreo experience sure is mysterious. At any rate, this was a great discussion with probably one of the best and most relevant faces of the current wave of classic AC techies. Lots of really great stuff here that touches on a lot of complex issues regarding skill, mechanics, and audience perceptions that are explained almost effortlessly. Looking forward to part 2!
Still feels a bit surreal that we got to talk, yeah. Speaking of, do you want to come chat with me for one of these sometime? DM me on Discord if you think that could be cool.
Hope part 2 renders without issues x_x
Why we love classic AC? Easy.... two words: Puppeteering System!
Mhm, mhm.
Love these discussions always interesting and worth tuning into
Thank you.
@@LeoKRogue yw I think I’m gonna try to make a video worth getting on one of these
This was a very entertaining, insightful and surprisingly relatable talk to listen to! I found myself nodding my head to creating related behavioural patterns a lot more than expected and I'm very glad to see Luka given so much time to react to different questions by translating intent into a stored form of communication that I can and will happily revisit in the future as a reliable point of reference. I vibe a lot with the way these Rogue Chats have naturally developed over the last few months and just like Animus Drifter's parkour runs they were able to quickly become a classic and favourite of mine in terms of new video formats I'm now looking forward to. Thanks to both of you for taking the time to share your thoughts in such an extensive yet amusing and short-winded manner, making even a 2 plus hour long interview feel focused and purposeful.
Thank you so much Broox, I appreciate all of that a great deal. I would say I came away from this talk feeling a little wiser too, and like I'd been taught or reminded of some pretty important concepts. I'm surprised with how well-liked Rogue's Chat has become, and it's not stopping any time soon, I have two more guests coming.
Thank you both for your insight and inspiration :)
You're welcome!
Excited to watch this one, his AC1 video blew my mind!
It was really good.
YOO FINALLY!!!
Never clicked on a video so fast. Looking forward to those movement by AC subseries videos. No pressure 😁
If I ever do it, it'll be a long while from now. xD
Absolutely insane!
1:41:30 the bleeding effect is so real when u havent played in awhile and u do another marathon the muscle memories come back and u slowly start to remember how to parkour and stuff xD
Mhm, and that's definitely something that's the case across most of the series which feels pretty great.
Yup. Perfect start to the work day.
I'm glad.
I'm less than half-way through but great to see these two prophets of AC chat! ^-^
Thanks for listening.
This was a nice discussion I really liked the movement topics in this video. Also I feel 1:56:00 wanting to go for a risky move near the end of a run or spending 3 hours for a 3 minute stealth sequence.
Yup, yup yup.
This video is instantly a better AC parkour video than 99.99% of AC Parkour videos out there despite there being 0 parkour in this video.
That's really funny to think about.
@@LeoKRogue It's simple really. This is better parkour content than the vast 3 button fests you see usually.
Lets GOO! love these rogue chats havent missed a single episode, keep them up leo! ❤
I will.
fym "part 1" after releasing a 2 hour discussion
pinned comment
FINALLY
AC games have different soundtracks for combat, flight, pause menu, main menu etc. I was curious which game has your favorite soundtrack for some of the things listed above. I really like the AC1 Acre combat theme and the AC2 pause theme.
Probably AC1 or Brotherhood.
nice discussion, gonna watch the part 2 next. before that, leo, whats your take on ac shadows? ubisoft are going the right way?? or not...
Going the right way with stealth, everything else, not sure. I don't love most of what I saw.
1:03:40 Sounds like you need to make a new AC Guide to Movement XD
perhaps
Amen
I wonder if u would have a discussion on combat throughout the games because i miss the old style and the new style is starting look like souls/dmc type of combat which is good but i want AC to have its own style and from ac1-rev was going somewhere, at least i had hope.
That could be fun, the advantages and limitations of old combat vs new, and why Ubi decided to move onto this new paradigm. I think it's a bit unfulfilling that neither the old combat nor new combat are particularly great, they're just each 60% good in their own basic ways and don't go any further.
LUKA x LEO 🥶💜
YESSSSSSS
Yes. :)
Can you explain what "stealth reaper" is? Ive seen it on a lot of AC videos and i don't know what it is or how to do it.
It's a stealth kill video that adheres quite strictly to staying unseen, so typically _any_ detection is disallowed. Usually it means all guards in the area die as fast and efficiently as possible as well.
Next up: Rogue chat with darby mcdevitt
Could be interesting, but he's a busy man!
totally unrelated and you may already know this but the resident evil classic trilogy is coming back on GOG, I’d like to see your review or walkthrough or anything about it like your prince of Persia videos
interesting
@@LeoKRogue 😭 yeah, will you be doing it.....
This is a good birthday gift 🥰🥰
Happy birthday.
@@LeoKRoguethanks Leo! Still listening through it. I wanted to say more on mechanics but I’m not sure what’s the word limit on YT. I love this discussion nonetheless with Luka. I hope that the upcoming project would cover that void properly. So many points to cover within this same discussion. ❤❤
Ayy happy birthday Ikraik
@@animusdrifter Thanks Luka!! Loving the discussion so far!
@@ikraikgaming I'm so glad you're enjoying it
Is this like a podcast/is a podcast?
It has naturally evolved into that yeah, it started off as just a way to hang out with creators I like for a little bit but has since landed on this format by happenstance.
Playlist of Previous Guests:
ruclips.net/p/PL36oulzyfYiMj0XU56HoIlOopZH70jbOf
@@LeoKRogue thanks. It's really chill love having it on in the background.
Now I wanna know Leo's secret server name😮😂
It's just SneakyServer, if you mean Discord.
discord.gg/Kz9Quhngzp
@@LeoKRogue Joined🙌
I feel like i enjoy unitys parkour because of how it feels
(Even if i agree that ac 1 to rev is more consistent)
But every time i hear aRnO Do PrEttY twirl meme i get slightly agitated because first it makes me feel like a toddler😅
And second it always shifts the conversation to animation>control discustion which doesnt allow for any discussion on what mechanics unity introduced and how they can be made more precise
(And WAAAY more convos)
But all we always talk about is the same animation>control conversation
Maybe if we can recognize the things that make unity what it is we can reach a point of understanding why people adore it and why others adore ac 1 to rev system
Hell, we might even learn to love them both
(Sorry for the long comment)
I recognize the frustration.
I feel we do a pretty good job of recognizing that ACU does feel convenient and comfy for descending but it kind of ends there because everything else comes stapled to a bruuutal downgrade in feel and function. :(
The real problem is just that, there actually ISN'T much conversation left to pursue there, everyone already knows the state of things and the only people still really talking about it are the ones who haven't heard every argument yet.
Of course the end goal is to make something that looks as nice and has as much general comfort to use without nuking fine control but yeah.
YES COMFORT
That is mainly why unity is my fav.
Also take a couple things (height gaining side ejects where u kind of have three diffrent height (lower than arno, same height as his hands ,higher than his hands) is mainly what im going for)
Then more precision
But who are we kidding
Getting a system that is precise and feels ans comfy and looks as nice as acu WHAT UBISOFT??
We might as well ask for a dragon pet and it wil still be more realistic
@@fazegix7016Unity introduces the things you say but the snap targeting system is broken.
1:44:50 While being a lot more simple in it's animations and movement, Mirage still is worls less reliable than Unity in it's parkour. Despite the fair talk about Unity's inconsistency, at least it makes up for it with different things, like variety in movement, animations and dialonal parkour.
Whether that actually makes up for it is very subjective, though. Both Mirage and Unity are pretty inconsistent but for some players pretty animations and diagonal movement that frankly barely makes a difference in how you actually play moment to moment are simply not enough, which I guess is fair. Like if I were to ask AnimusDrifter, or Jcers, or Lang, or most serious people who've put thousands of hours into these games, "Does this make up for it for you?" they'd probably say no.
only 20 mins in but i need to ask, why do you guys keep acting like its rare for someone to prefer the first 4 games. i thought that was the default view for most ac fans
It's very much not the default for most AC fans, the biggest actual AC playerbase as of now is the RPGs.
It is quite rare nowadays, measurably so both online and in terms of overall sales/reception. By sheer volume, classic fans are a minority compared to the smash hits ACO-Valhalla have been.
trust me its not the default, its just from our perspective of longtime diehard ac fans, we just have this confirmation bias
@@ASPECTICORTRAININGVIDEOS i see what you mean but I got into AC after Odyssey came out and my first game was actually Origins. I think I made the mistake of assuming there's a lot more 'newer' fans that prefer the older games cz that's all I've seen on RUclips and Reddit
@@moxirt7992we are the vocal minority. But the RPG sales numbers speak for themselves.