The whole melody of the piece is so jubilant and celebratory. Frank knew the notes that evoked joy. He came across as a serious sourpuss sometimes, but I think he knew how to tap into his inner joy.
With all that music he had to get out of him, it's no wonder he took life so seriously, come the end, he still had more to do. He was the equivalent of tesla, but in music, as far as am concerned.
Sort of - but no. What is amazing is one person's love and devotion to creating beauty. When you love something so much, you stop thinking about memorization or virtuosity. It's all about passion. We should stop praising musicians for talent. It gives people the wrong idea of what music or musicianship is.
I would describe it as suspenseful with supreme confidence. it's dominated by the 4th/11th and the 6th/13th, both of which are neutral and hence render a sense of mystery and suspense until they resolve to a major or minor. While bearing a major and mostly minor undertones, The Black Page never really resolvers to a major or a minor, so the entire song is suspenseful. Naturally, this does not evoke joy at all IMO, which, truly, is the reason why this is such a unique piece. It is hard to not resolve to major/minor. It resembles background scores like those accompanying stealth missions and serial killer trails from the movies in the late 60s and 70s.
As a drummer, I find this particular performance, amazing. As a listener, inspiring as to how far music can go. It is such a shame that, in most artistic creations, are never realized till further down the road. Frank continues to be my Idol, in approach, and attitude to the art.
@@Berserker26 that's just your opinion. I'm sure someone thinks your favorite band sucks, and there's nothing wrong with that. People look for different things in music and art.
Kinda like the time I played Close To The Edge by Yes for my wife . She couldn't get past the first three minutes . That's why she's now my ex ........
@@Berserker26I agree although it's not rubbish but rather just really overrated,underwhelming,tacky,and pompous most the time but not rubbish by any means and I like some of his music I get the appeal.
J. Lennon took an FZ toon and called it "Ragjam", I can't remember the exact story. But, he (John & Yoyo) jammed with Frank and Gangk the music. Frank did some covers that for this FZ fan were as good or better than the original. Happy Together (live Fillmore East, on the white album, Mud Shu Shu Shark, "can I come on your bus?") Stairway to Heaven (there's so much to be said, not enough time.) Whipping Post (WOW, Duane would have been so honored. Bobby Mars Vocal, maybe one of the best live performances ever.) Thanks, I nominate "Imagine" as the the dumbest piece of music ever written. Muskrat Love was Bach, Beethoven, Mozart in comparison.) Greetings from Colorado Springs Colorado.
Only a master of music could write this. And only a master of music could play this. What an achievement. Wowwwww. Wowwwww. Wowwwww. Even Gregory Peccary's eyes popped out.
I worked front of house audio at a few venues back in the late 2000's. Got to live mix this 2 nights in a row. The case that bozzios setup came in is still the largest road case ive ever seen.
Never thought this vid would make it over 1M views but it did ! I hope some of the people that were not aware of Frank's genius have found music to listen to for the upcoming years. And no, 7 years later, I'm not yet approaching its statistical density but now I'm playing in a band we plan to work on the easy teenage version sometime ! Wish me luck !
I don't know how Bozzio can live without playing this stuff! Surely, as a drummer, you can't get more fun out of your kit than mastering tunes like this? Fucking stunning. I will always love Franks tunes, and I know he used many skilled musicians over the years, but Terry Bozzio brought a different dimension to the Zappa stage. Fantastic. Thanks for sharing shaktidey . . or whatever your pretend name is.
Just so people know, the reason this piece is so complex is because it makes use of nested tuplets. This basically means tuplets within tuplets. For example you could have triplets within triplets, and you work out how that sounds basically by taking the base triplets as a kind of base tempo. In other words, understand them not as triplets, but as normal non-tuplet notes at a higher tempo. The triplets within those triplets then, become triplets relative to those higher tempo normal notes, this is how you calculate the speed at which they are played. It's awkward to explain, and incredibly difficult to do. The result sounds like random notes, but ultimately those nested tuplets return to the master tempo of the song after they're played, so it's possible, but very difficult, to have a steady pulse underneath (as Bozzio achieves with the hi-hat). Of course, nested tuplets become pretty much unplayable at high master tempos, at least with precision anyway, so they're usually beholden to a moderate master tempo. Also worth mentioning is that triplets within triplets is only the tip of the iceberg - I'm pretty sure this piece has triplets nested within quintuplets. It's all very cerebral; Bozzio must be losing years off his life behind that kit.
So... Assuming for example, notes in groupings of 4, at 40bpm. 70bpm for instance, would be in 7 relative to that. Is the next step to assume groupings of 4 at 70bpm, and play for instance, in 7 relative to that? That would lead to playing time signatures with decimals, not really possible for a human. Well... It's getting late, I may be overthinking this, or proposing insane examples. :D
The gimmick that makes Dance of Eternity complex is changing time signatures often. Inside the parts themselves, there's not much complexity, and it conveys zero emotion. Requires a lot of skill to play, for sure, but does not require soul :).
Anthony Genzale Zappa wrote lots of good music. This is just an experimental one. Listen to Cosmic Debis for example, it’s funny and entertaining and there is a great George Duke solo in the middle of it.
I love how it borderline sounds like someone just randomly messing around in a music store in the beginning, but is full of masterful coordination. One weird and thin line for sure
Clearly people don't listen to enough avant-garde classical music. Number one is about the same as a John Cage or Morton Feldman piece: not music to play at a party or anything, but pretty interesting. And number two is dope.
It's cus it sounds unnatural in context of song, it's the same way bucketheads super fast solos kinda sound like garbage cus it sound unnatural and the bars are so complex you just can't follow along
It's all matter of opinion and Zappa understood this. It feels like he wrote a jazz fusion piece for the sake of writing one and having a challenge. Whether you think it's a good song or not isnt the point, but the fact that the performance has to be top notch for it to convey the right emotion. Now, with that being said, I think this song is trash 🤣
There's a ton of FZ's music I love (been listening since the 70's) there is some I don't care for but I think this FZ masterpiece rocks and I think that Dweezel does a damn good job of reproducing his dads music and what could I ever say about Terry ?
I wouldn’t go so far as to say the piece itself sounds incredible, but I would definitely say incredulity is a feeling the piece invokes. It may not be melodic but these guys can play it this exact 100% identical way Every. Single. Time. That blows my mind. The song doesn’t really fit in to anything, you can’t necessarily imagine anyone DOING anything to this song, but the sheer complexity of it and the flawless execution leave me in awe every time.
On purpose. From what I understand, he wrote it as kind of a joke. But with Frank, it's hard to tell. So they proved they could play his "unplayable" composition.
ive been a musician since is was in 5th grade im 56 still playing professionally. this is probably the most amazing piece of music ive ever seen performed by such incredibly gifted players. flabbergasted!
One my faves of Frank's tunes.. and they pulled this off as amazingly as Frank's band (that included Bozzio, of course) did on the original Zappa In New York version. Incredible! I saw Dweez, Bozzio, Vai, et al play this on the first ZPZ tour. So nice to see a recorded version of it posted here, thanks. If you ever have the chance to see ZPZ live, DO IT.
I'm an old time huge Zappa fan. My nephew got me the Zappa Plays Zappa DVD for Christmas and I was completely mind-blown when I watched it. Incredible quality all the way around. Dweezil did his Pops proud!!
What’s great about this is that it’s just on the cusp of being so complicated that it’s trivial and unenjoyable. It’s right there where it’s still actual music you can listen to and not just complex noise that’s complex for the sake of it.
Well said, but music like this really grows on me after I get to know it a bit and can expect the next gesture. At that point it really opens up for me
There's a lot of thumbs down for this.. C'mon people just cuz you can't tap your foot to it doesn't make it any less wonderful. Thank you, Dweezil for keeping the live experience of this prodigious music going...
Is it complex indeed and abstract but FOR a reason : this piece was written by Zappa as a test for drummer Terry Bozzio, in order to see if he had what it takes to play with the master. Then, above the dromsolo, he added the melody which is an amazing feast to my understanding of music. Respect !
had to look it up myself.... ""I'll tell you a really great Vinnie story. He's one of the most amazing sight-readers that ever existed on the instrument. One day we were in a Frank rehearsal, this was early '80s, and Frank brought in this piece of music called "Mo 'N Herb's Vacation." Just unbelievably complex. All the drums were written out, just like "The Black Page" except even more complex. There were these runs of like 17 over 3 and every drumhead is notated differently. And there were a whole bunch of people there, I think Bozzio was there." "Vinnie had this piece of music on the stand to his right. To his left he had another music stand with a plate of sushi on it, okay? Now the tempo of the piece was very slow, like "The Black Page." And then the first riff came in, [mimics bizarre Zappa-esque drum rhythm patterns] with all these choking of cymbals, and hi-hat, ruffs, spinning of rototoms and all this crazy stuff. And I saw Vinnie reading this thing. Now, Vinnie has this habit of pushing his glasses up with the middle finger of his right hand. Well I saw him look at this one bar of music, it was the last bar of music on the page. He started to play it as he was turning the page with one hand, and then once the page was turned he continued playing the riff with his right hand, as he reached over with his left hand, grabbed a piece of sushi and put it in his mouth, continued the riff with his left hand and feet, pushed his glasses up, and then played the remaining part of the bar." "It was the sickest thing I have ever seen. Frank threw his music up in the air. Bozzio turned around and walked away. I just started laughing." - Steve Vai
While virtuosity for virtuosity's sake isn't something I care for, this is very different. I think we've entered this weird cultural phase of absolute levelling in which anything can be art, and sometimes that just feels like a get out clause for people who can't do stuff or are too lazy to learn to do stuff. There's lots of incredible minimal art out there, but there's also a lot of chancers. This is virtuosity (or craft) and art working together, and I think we need to return to such values.
It's one thing as a musician to pick up (or sit behind) an instrument and shred it like a boss, but it's quite another to take an incredible, complex piece of music, written by someone else, note for note and play it like they do. Bozzio does an amazing job with it as do the rest of them here. Fine tribute to an amazing composer. We miss you Frank!
Mark Doney-Mccloud oddly enough I always wanted to be a drummer but in school they talked me into playing the trumpet. I hated it and quit after two weeks. (I wish I woulda kept playing and learned to read music lol) Anyways, around age 15 I taught myself guitar (and still play to this day) but I always had a love for drums. I tried to play them here and there over the years but there’s just too much going on at once for me haha and I can play in time but I shouldn’t be the one keeping the timing going lol So when I see a kit like this I’m just in awe haha
Only Zappa could put together something so magnificently orchestrated, massive respect for him and those he's played with. One of those people gone before I was even born (much too soon at that), that I'd give an arm and a leg to have been able to experience firsthand.
@@sebione3576 Perfect pitch does not have anything to do with the rhythm portion of this song. You definitely cannot play this song correctly without musical knowledge. You can probably go "close enough" by relying on pure memory though.
@@thanussongprasart2568 I feel like memory, understanding practically what you have to play and being able to count can get you through this piece perfectly.
Never been a more intelligent group of musicians than this incarnation of Frank's band. Dweezil is doing this music true honor. I guess it's really in the genes.
Talking Heads. Not a more intelligent but not less influential. Listen to their album Remain in Light, it'll blow your mind. The 2nd and 3rd track - mind blowed for sure. Brian Eno & TH were the giants of creativity as well, as Zappa was.
Absolute brilliance in performance and Zappa's original Black Page score. Seen Frank with the Mothers first time 1973 in Rome. Mind blowing. Overnite Sensation was the gig. I remember it clear as yesterday.
If you didn't know this piece and didn't read the title, you would have no problem picking this out as a Zappa composition. Mad skills there by those talented musicians!
absolutely wonderfully performed by DZ & company... Frank Zappa truly was the quintessential brilliant modern day composer . . .still brings a tear to my eye when listening to this fabulous piece to this day.
Saw Terry with Frank in Houston back in '77. One of the best concerts I have ever been to. Would have been cool to have seen Frank's face when Terry played this for the first time.
That is obviously extremely difficult music to play but is also godawful to listen to. Came in wanting to be blown away and love it. Amazing musicians.
Wow, thank you! Of the thousands of songs written by FZ, this is in my top 5 favorites and my #1 answer when drummers talk about the hardest drum pieces to play, it always ends the conversation. And who better to play it with Zappa plays Zappa but the 1st of 2 drummers to ever play it right...Terry Bozzio
That really depends on what kind of music you like. Zappa was not a pretentious guy. He just liked to push the boundaries of what was generally considered musically acceptable. However, if you don't enjoy experimental music then it's not something that you would probably like. Unlistenable? Maybe to you. Pretentious? Not at all.
My using RUclips started with me watching a film clip of a performance of this from the tour, which lead to me watching a bunch of drum solos on RUclips, and my first experience of regularly using RUclips was watching drum solos. Mostly from Terry Bozzio, but people in comments sections mentioned others.
I got to see Zappa Plays Zappa a couple of times at the Hard Rock Cafe in Vegas around 2009-2010. Once with Terry Bozzio and Steve Vai. They were, of course, incredible (the whole group).
That intro for Vai sounded so much like Frank that I spent the rest of the video searching the guitarists for him. Only then did I read the notes. Good job DZ!
Bebop Tango is just as complex imo. Zappa used these rhythms and melodic tropes throughout his work. But overall, for sheer perverse complexity, I reckon Beefheart has him beat with Frownland.
Zappa could really make you go out there! This is thinking outside the box! Zappa remained an explorer all his life. He wanted to hear the litlle dots on the paper. And he was a master composer, arranjer and performer. Zappa really pushed the boundaries of music and also of our perception of music. He made us understand it a little better. Like George Duke said, "I can't imagine what he would be doing today. I miss him." - I just wanted to say that.
Ah, that explains. This song has odd note grouping. In western, the beats are divided into halves, quarters, 1/8th etc. Sometimes, we divide into 3, called triplets. In eastern music, esp in Carnatic, we divide beats in 3s 5s 7s etc This sort of grouping is used in this song. Also, we use quite bit of polyrhythms as well.
I played in a band with a dude who was a huge Zappa fan and memorized this. He’d play it in the middle of our set as sorta of an interlude. Incredible piece of music.
![Frank Zappa & The Mothers - Live at The Roxy 1973 [extras]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/r7fyyhhuE7c/mqdefault.jpg)
![Frank Zappa & The Mothers - Live at The Roxy 1973 [extras]](/img/tr.png)
I don’t know a thing about music theory or sheet music, but I’m scared. Very scared.
why are you gaeh?
You should be
Me to
Bruh they had to pull out steve vai for it, u should be scared
The nerd power is off the charts.
I don't know about you but, for me, this was ruined by the 27th hemisemidemiquaver in bar 49 being played 2.3 microseconds too early.
I'm totally checking for that
Dude there are no hemisemidemiquavers at all, you must be referring to the quaver in the triplet in the quintuplet
@@Alex23087 Ah yes - that was it!
ahh, I see You noticed as well! Good catch!
Yes, without a subtle augmented 7th, it just doesnt work for me
I'll be humming this all week now.
Best
I know people that will try 🤣
@@raylarkin5004 Tell them not to ..
Hahahahahaha
Are nested tuplets hummable?
What if you wanted to go to heaven, but god said:
NESTED
TUPLETS
What a heritage!
Suddenly eternal damnation doesn't sound so bad.
God might say it, because no one in the audience ever will.
Bible states " ask and you shall receive" just ask for the talent tp knock it out the park. Lots of catches and outs in his words!!
@@Yngsatchvai you are not going to receive the ability to do that without plenty of skills in the bag already.
This is the real life equivalent of "I think it goes bee boo boo bop."
gogogabe9000 LOL
Boopboop beep book?
Yes
Nah man, you’re thinking of the one that goes beep bop boop boop beep
I swear Black Page #2 sounds like it could be in Wii Sports.
Only the best for a Wii Fit Trainer.
Also like Jazz Fusion.
he called it the disco version
Hmm, I'll give you that, but I'd suggest Sega games, quite a few of them.
Ye
Gran Turismo 2 menu music
Absolutely amazing that Bozzio has that memorized.
He knows Frank would stare at him disapprovingly from beyond the grave if he ever messes it up.
If it were you, would you rather (try to) read it?
He had to try soooo often, will prolly never forget it
Arek Hautaluoma; All of them, any of them esp. coming in on no cue after tacets..
Would anyone know if they made a mistake?
This sounds about as good as it looks on paper.
Torture song
Yea just imagine ur front man handing u this to play just because he was trolling u.
I know right, it's amazing
@elissa f idk about this theory 🤣
Terrible
For all of you not in the know, this is NOT improvised. This is a composition.
Also, the original Black Page #1 was played solo by Terry. . . .
It's called "The Black Page" because ther is so much black (so many notes) on the sheet. A musician's insider joke ;o)
"I'm working on a new piece that no human being would ever want to listen to and enjoy." - Frank Zappa
You're quoting Nickelback.
Lol! I love this song but can see where you're coming from
He mustve failed pretty miserably then! :P
I dunno....his full band composition of #1 sounds amazing.
Frank zappa was an alien.
The whole melody of the piece is so jubilant and celebratory. Frank knew the notes that evoked joy. He came across as a serious sourpuss sometimes, but I think he knew how to tap into his inner joy.
I feel dread in this too. He uses some very dark intervals towards the end
With all that music he had to get out of him, it's no wonder he took life so seriously,
come the end, he still had more to do.
He was the equivalent of tesla, but in music, as far as am concerned.
Sort of - but no. What is amazing is one person's love and devotion to creating beauty. When you love something so much, you stop thinking about memorization or virtuosity. It's all about passion. We should stop praising musicians for talent. It gives people the wrong idea of what music or musicianship is.
I would describe it as suspenseful with supreme confidence. it's dominated by the 4th/11th and the 6th/13th, both of which are neutral and hence render a sense of mystery and suspense until they resolve to a major or minor. While bearing a major and mostly minor undertones, The Black Page never really resolvers to a major or a minor, so the entire song is suspenseful. Naturally, this does not evoke joy at all IMO, which, truly, is the reason why this is such a unique piece. It is hard to not resolve to major/minor. It resembles background scores like those accompanying stealth missions and serial killer trails from the movies in the late 60s and 70s.
@@thomasthornton5478lmfao no
And now Frank can rest in peace. This performance is pure perfection. Thank you DZ.
As a drummer, I find this particular performance, amazing.
As a listener, inspiring as to how far music can go.
It is such a shame that, in most artistic creations, are never realized till further down the road.
Frank continues to be my Idol, in approach, and attitude to the art.
It's rubbish.
@@Berserker26 that's just your opinion. I'm sure someone thinks your favorite band sucks, and there's nothing wrong with that. People look for different things in music and art.
Kinda like the time I played Close To The Edge by Yes for my wife . She couldn't get past the first three minutes . That's why she's now my ex ........
@@666RitaRita Damn that was funny :-)
@@Berserker26I agree although it's not rubbish but rather just really overrated,underwhelming,tacky,and pompous most the time
but not rubbish by any means and I like some of his music I get the appeal.
Zappa stole my musical idea......
Said no one, ever.
I ripped off frank zappa...
Also said no one ever lol
Varese?
@@kylezehtabi5452 Weird Al's "Genius In France"?
J. Lennon took an FZ toon and called it "Ragjam", I can't remember the exact story.
But, he (John & Yoyo) jammed with Frank and Gangk the music.
Frank did some covers that for this FZ fan were as good or better than the original.
Happy Together (live Fillmore East, on the white album, Mud Shu Shu Shark, "can I come on your bus?")
Stairway to Heaven (there's so much to be said, not enough time.)
Whipping Post (WOW, Duane would have been so honored. Bobby Mars Vocal, maybe one of the best live performances ever.)
Thanks, I nominate "Imagine" as the the dumbest piece of music ever written. Muskrat Love was Bach, Beethoven, Mozart in comparison.)
Greetings from Colorado Springs Colorado.
@@pablosantander5739 Indeed. Varese, Cage and a few others of their ilk could possibly say something like that.
Dang. Snape killing it on the drums.
+ReubenRabinowitz More like Madam Hooch
"I am this year's Defense Against the Dark Rhythms teacher."
*"Set your bpm to three hundred and ninety-four."*
ITS LIAM NEESONS!
Snape is a real wizard on those drums
This comment did me like Snape did my nigga Dumbles
I got to actually see this live. Best concert I've ever been to.
"How many toms and cymbals do you need?"
"Yes."
@Sweet Jones III I know, but I still like it.
This joke make my day jajajaja. Sweet Jones III pls SHUT UP.
@@spkoftdvl Sweet jones is Sour jones ---
Funny thing , that's Terry's small setup..
You: On a scale of 1-10 how funny was this joke?
Me: No
These guys are tight as hell. Really difficult score, this. They gotta be not only drummers, but mathematicians!
Certainly very good sight readers...
@@kewlfonz and if they weren't, Frank Z would have told them to go back to school. 😂
still sounds like shite
Wow what can you say that hasn't been said. Thank you Dweezil for keeping your fathers brilliance alive. Bozio and Vai just the best.
Only a master of music could write this. And only a master of music could play this. What an achievement. Wowwwww. Wowwwww. Wowwwww. Even Gregory Peccary's eyes popped out.
Y Zappa es , fue y será un genio sin precedente.
‘Pasadena ! Pasadena !’
I can't hear fast enough.
I worked front of house audio at a few venues back in the late 2000's. Got to live mix this 2 nights in a row.
The case that bozzios setup came in is still the largest road case ive ever seen.
It was in 1 case?
@@brandom1953 carried by a dwarf in lederhosen
@@lw1zfog Hahahahaha
Never thought this vid would make it over 1M views but it did ! I hope some of the people that were not aware of Frank's genius have found music to listen to for the upcoming years. And no, 7 years later, I'm not yet approaching its statistical density but now I'm playing in a band we plan to work on the easy teenage version sometime ! Wish me luck !
Nice profile pic
Best of luck, man. I am not sure there is an "easy" version, per se, lol. Maybe less complicated!
@@benp.320 Magma is the best band
Thank you for making this available, it is pure beauty in sound!
I don't know how Bozzio can live without playing this stuff! Surely, as a drummer, you can't get more fun out of your kit than mastering tunes like this? Fucking stunning. I will always love Franks tunes, and I know he used many skilled musicians over the years, but Terry Bozzio brought a different dimension to the Zappa stage. Fantastic. Thanks for sharing shaktidey . . or whatever your pretend name is.
Zappa really did have an amazing collection of technically proficient musicians, all great players in their own right.
уникальные люди, вы правы.
You make it sound like he was collecting magic cards hahaha.... Though now that I think about it back then it wasn't that off.
Dweezil actually sounds like Frank during that intermission. Freaked me out a little haha
The father's son
Just so people know, the reason this piece is so complex is because it makes use of nested tuplets. This basically means tuplets within tuplets. For example you could have triplets within triplets, and you work out how that sounds basically by taking the base triplets as a kind of base tempo. In other words, understand them not as triplets, but as normal non-tuplet notes at a higher tempo. The triplets within those triplets then, become triplets relative to those higher tempo normal notes, this is how you calculate the speed at which they are played. It's awkward to explain, and incredibly difficult to do. The result sounds like random notes, but ultimately those nested tuplets return to the master tempo of the song after they're played, so it's possible, but very difficult, to have a steady pulse underneath (as Bozzio achieves with the hi-hat). Of course, nested tuplets become pretty much unplayable at high master tempos, at least with precision anyway, so they're usually beholden to a moderate master tempo. Also worth mentioning is that triplets within triplets is only the tip of the iceberg - I'm pretty sure this piece has triplets nested within quintuplets. It's all very cerebral; Bozzio must be losing years off his life behind that kit.
So... Assuming for example, notes in groupings of 4, at 40bpm. 70bpm for instance, would be in 7 relative to that. Is the next step to assume groupings of 4 at 70bpm, and play for instance, in 7 relative to that? That would lead to playing time signatures with decimals, not really possible for a human. Well... It's getting late, I may be overthinking this, or proposing insane examples. :D
Yo dawg, I heard ya like tuplets . . .
I wish I knew all this stuff. Sadly I am still pretty musically illiterate when it comes to music notation and all this stuff.
Soundillusions94xyz Doesn't matter. You have appreciation.
that measure where it's like 5 quintuplet quarter notes and within those are tuplets as well...
Suck on that, Dream Theater.
Hahahahahahaja
well they did compose the most complex song ever, but you know...
What song?
dance of eternity
The gimmick that makes Dance of Eternity complex is changing time signatures often. Inside the parts themselves, there's not much complexity, and it conveys zero emotion. Requires a lot of skill to play, for sure, but does not require soul :).
Sooooooooo tight. Those are not mere drummers. Those are three of the greatest percussionists alive... And thank God for all of them.
What a staggeringly complex piece of music. Zappa was a brilliant composer who knew how to pick the best musicians.
I saw this tour. Napoleon Murphy Brock also made cameos. Magical, magical stuff. God Bless Frank Zappa.
Don't try this at home, kids. My brain hurts.
@Draevon May Our ears are used to regular rhythms and consonant harmonies. Can't we all just disagree to agree?
Anthony Genzale Zappa wrote lots of good music. This is just an experimental one. Listen to Cosmic Debis for example, it’s funny and entertaining and there is a great George Duke solo in the middle of it.
“not quite my tempo”
HAHAHAHA!!!!! GREAT!!!👍
I love how it borderline sounds like someone just randomly messing around in a music store in the beginning, but is full of masterful coordination. One weird and thin line for sure
I don't know why people are unironically saying this sounds like trash. It' sounds incredible, not to mention complex as hell
Clearly people don't listen to enough avant-garde classical music. Number one is about the same as a John Cage or Morton Feldman piece: not music to play at a party or anything, but pretty interesting. And number two is dope.
It's cus it sounds unnatural in context of song, it's the same way bucketheads super fast solos kinda sound like garbage cus it sound unnatural and the bars are so complex you just can't follow along
It's all matter of opinion and Zappa understood this. It feels like he wrote a jazz fusion piece for the sake of writing one and having a challenge. Whether you think it's a good song or not isnt the point, but the fact that the performance has to be top notch for it to convey the right emotion.
Now, with that being said, I think this song is trash 🤣
There's a ton of FZ's music I love (been listening since the 70's) there is some I don't care for but I think this FZ masterpiece rocks and I think that Dweezel does a damn good job of reproducing his dads music and what could I ever say about Terry ?
I wouldn’t go so far as to say the piece itself sounds incredible, but I would definitely say incredulity is a feeling the piece invokes. It may not be melodic but these guys can play it this exact 100% identical way Every. Single. Time. That blows my mind. The song doesn’t really fit in to anything, you can’t necessarily imagine anyone DOING anything to this song, but the sheer complexity of it and the flawless execution leave me in awe every time.
this is so ridiculously complex. Three of them going at it on the Black Page? Mic drop....
On purpose. From what I understand, he wrote it as kind of a joke. But with Frank, it's hard to tell. So they proved they could play his "unplayable" composition.
ive been a musician since is was in 5th grade im 56 still playing professionally. this is probably the most amazing piece of music ive ever seen performed by such incredibly gifted players. flabbergasted!
One my faves of Frank's tunes.. and they pulled this off as amazingly as Frank's band (that included Bozzio, of course) did on the original Zappa In New York version. Incredible! I saw Dweez, Bozzio, Vai, et al play this on the first ZPZ tour. So nice to see a recorded version of it posted here, thanks. If you ever have the chance to see ZPZ live, DO IT.
I'm an old time huge Zappa fan. My nephew got me the Zappa Plays Zappa DVD for Christmas and I was completely mind-blown when I watched it. Incredible quality all the way around.
Dweezil did his Pops proud!!
What’s great about this is that it’s just on the cusp of being so complicated that it’s trivial and unenjoyable. It’s right there where it’s still actual music you can listen to and not just complex noise that’s complex for the sake of it.
Well said, but music like this really grows on me after I get to know it a bit and can expect the next gesture. At that point it really opens up for me
A joyous astonishment of compositional and musical brilliance, in a daring disregard for the predictable! AMAZING.
I was humming this tune all the way home.😂😂 Self indulgence personified
I saw it live, it was the best thing I ever seen on stage.
I saw the master 5 times... always great and more!
me too and I agree
Me too, always amazing!
Me too!! I got Bozzios autograph after it!! Best live performance!!!
I saw justin bieber 5 times. Blew me away.
There's a lot of thumbs down for this.. C'mon people just cuz you can't tap your foot to it doesn't make it any less wonderful. Thank you, Dweezil for keeping the live experience of this prodigious music going...
Is it complex indeed and abstract but FOR a reason : this piece was written by Zappa as a test for drummer Terry Bozzio, in order to see if he had what it takes to play with the master.
Then, above the dromsolo, he added the melody which is an amazing feast to my understanding of music.
Respect !
Brilliant piece. Great playing!!! That Lydian sound is so much Zappa's now...
the story of Vinnie Colaiuta sight reading this is pretty great...
had to look it up myself....
""I'll tell you a really great Vinnie story. He's one of the most amazing sight-readers that ever existed on the instrument. One day we were in a Frank rehearsal, this was early '80s, and Frank brought in this piece of music called "Mo 'N Herb's Vacation." Just unbelievably complex. All the drums were written out, just like "The Black Page" except even more complex. There were these runs of like 17 over 3 and every drumhead is notated differently. And there were a whole bunch of people there, I think Bozzio was there."
"Vinnie had this piece of music on the stand to his right. To his left he had another music stand with a plate of sushi on it, okay? Now the tempo of the piece was very slow, like "The Black Page." And then the first riff came in, [mimics bizarre Zappa-esque drum rhythm patterns] with all these choking of cymbals, and hi-hat, ruffs, spinning of rototoms and all this crazy stuff. And I saw Vinnie reading this thing. Now, Vinnie has this habit of pushing his glasses up with the middle finger of his right hand. Well I saw him look at this one bar of music, it was the last bar of music on the page. He started to play it as he was turning the page with one hand, and then once the page was turned he continued playing the riff with his right hand, as he reached over with his left hand, grabbed a piece of sushi and put it in his mouth, continued the riff with his left hand and feet, pushed his glasses up, and then played the remaining part of the bar."
"It was the sickest thing I have ever seen. Frank threw his music up in the air. Bozzio turned around and walked away. I just started laughing." - Steve Vai
@@KevinCorkran LOVE this story!
Damn yeah
Stumbled on to this. I happen to love drums esp. WOW. WOW. omg will listen again. BRAVO!
Get that DVD set. Zappa Plays Zappa. Front to back just incredible!
While virtuosity for virtuosity's sake isn't something I care for, this is very different. I think we've entered this weird cultural phase of absolute levelling in which anything can be art, and sometimes that just feels like a get out clause for people who can't do stuff or are too lazy to learn to do stuff. There's lots of incredible minimal art out there, but there's also a lot of chancers. This is virtuosity (or craft) and art working together, and I think we need to return to such values.
damn well said bro
It's one thing as a musician to pick up (or sit behind) an instrument and shred it like a boss, but it's quite another to take an incredible, complex piece of music, written by someone else, note for note and play it like they do. Bozzio does an amazing job with it as do the rest of them here. Fine tribute to an amazing composer. We miss you Frank!
The first Black Page was written by Frank with Bozzio in mind. So, you could say that it is Bozzio's signature song.
That was one of the best things I've heard in my life.
Bozzio's a genius!
Half the comments are music theory experts 😅
Meanwhile I’m like ”I like toms!”
If it takes you longer to set up your drum kit then it does to sit and play the entire show, it’s gonna be one awesome show.
That's what tech's are for "Hey son wanna learn the kit?"
Mark Doney-Mccloud oddly enough I always wanted to be a drummer but in school they talked me into playing the trumpet.
I hated it and quit after two weeks. (I wish I woulda kept playing and learned to read music lol)
Anyways, around age 15 I taught myself guitar (and still play to this day) but I always had a love for drums.
I tried to play them here and there over the years but there’s just too much going on at once for me haha and I can play in time but I shouldn’t be the one keeping the timing going lol
So when I see a kit like this I’m just in awe haha
what a foolish musical notion!
He died from a cymbalism.
Cymbology?
@@zackarysan7841 that's too high hat for me.
@@aspiringpolymath687 that's timpani..sorry I mean too punny.
Only Zappa could put together something so magnificently orchestrated, massive respect for him and those he's played with. One of those people gone before I was even born (much too soon at that), that I'd give an arm and a leg to have been able to experience firsthand.
I feel like someone with no knowledge of music theory would have a much easier time of playing this.
You can't play this correctly without knowing music theory
@@mamamamamamamable can't? Some people have perfect pitch and near perfect memory. With practice, they can. You should never say can't.
Classically-trained mucisians must hate this
@@sebione3576 Perfect pitch does not have anything to do with the rhythm portion of this song. You definitely cannot play this song correctly without musical knowledge. You can probably go "close enough" by relying on pure memory though.
@@thanussongprasart2568 I feel like memory, understanding practically what you have to play and being able to count can get you through this piece perfectly.
Totally amazing and enjoyable. What an all star band rendition!
It sounds like the soundtrack to every 80's instructional video.
Never been a more intelligent group of musicians than this incarnation of Frank's band. Dweezil is doing this music true honor. I guess it's really in the genes.
Talking Heads. Not a more intelligent but not less influential. Listen to their album Remain in Light, it'll blow your mind. The 2nd and 3rd track - mind blowed for sure. Brian Eno & TH were the giants of creativity as well, as Zappa was.
Absolute brilliance in performance and Zappa's original Black Page score. Seen Frank with the Mothers first time 1973 in Rome. Mind blowing. Overnite Sensation was the gig. I remember it clear as yesterday.
If you didn't know this piece and didn't read the title, you would have no problem picking this out as a Zappa composition. Mad skills there by those talented musicians!
Glad to see and hear Terry, but I wish Ruth Underwood would have made it here. Thanks for sharing.
Ruth could have played it on the marimba
without breaking a sweat.
@@stevebinning977 A true musical genius who really understood and loved Zappa.
Watch live from nerdville with Joe bonamassa ep. 76 -Steve via , near the end ,Steve talks about this song.
Too much camera time on vai. Yes he's a legend. But I want to see more of the drums in the 2 piece.
To be fair, he is the guest there.
Dweezil was playing right along too.
Arguably the most brilliant rock star ever. Unbelievable.
This song is hard to play, and even harder to listen to.
Been listening to this for almost a decade. Always gets me up and moving. This piece is perfect.
absolutely wonderfully performed by DZ & company... Frank Zappa truly was the quintessential brilliant modern day composer . . .still brings a tear to my eye when listening to this fabulous piece to this day.
It has taken me YEARS to realise what an utterly wonderful piece of music this is.
Ive seen ZPZ twice now with ryan brown on drums. Absolutely love his drumming but i would of loved to see bozzio and travers together
I remember just smiling all the way through this on the first 2006 tour when they played Toronto...adore this instrumental! 👍👍👍
Outstanding performance 😀! (How, on Gods green earth, is it possible to memorize all those notes ..;) ?
There are repeating figures in this piece. That and the fact, they're all excellent sight readers including Steve Vai...
Saw Terry with Frank in Houston back in '77. One of the best concerts I have ever been to.
Would have been cool to have seen Frank's face when Terry played this for the first time.
It's really amazing these people dedicated their lives to playing music for autistic kids to appreciate.
Almost brings tears to my eyes. Knowing the Zappa's music will never die! "The present day composer refuses to die."
Edgar Vareze
That is obviously extremely difficult music to play but is also godawful to listen to. Came in wanting to be blown away and love it. Amazing musicians.
It's bloody horrible.
Wow, this is a perfect version. Goosebumps during #2. Love it ! Bravo guys and gal.
Cette synchronicité entre percussionnistes est phénoménale
Wow, thank you! Of the thousands of songs written by FZ, this is in my top 5 favorites and my #1 answer when drummers talk about the hardest drum pieces to play, it always ends the conversation. And who better to play it with Zappa plays Zappa but the 1st of 2 drummers to ever play it right...Terry Bozzio
That really depends on what kind of music you like. Zappa was not a pretentious guy. He just liked to push the boundaries of what was generally considered musically acceptable. However, if you don't enjoy experimental music then it's not something that you would probably like. Unlistenable? Maybe to you. Pretentious? Not at all.
My using RUclips started with me watching a film clip of a performance of this from the tour, which lead to me watching a bunch of drum solos on RUclips, and my first experience of regularly using RUclips was watching drum solos. Mostly from Terry Bozzio, but people in comments sections mentioned others.
Bozzio has this memorized? Wow.
He's been playing it since it was written, in what? 1975? They all have it memorized.
I got to see Zappa Plays Zappa a couple of times at the Hard Rock Cafe in Vegas around 2009-2010. Once with Terry Bozzio and Steve Vai. They were, of course, incredible (the whole group).
That intro for Vai sounded so much like Frank that I spent the rest of the video searching the guitarists for him. Only then did I read the notes. Good job DZ!
I'll used to play this piece on my kit to wake up before going to school in morning. Those were the days...
I mean, this is probably the most complex piece of rock music composition ever. Unbelievable.....
This is not rock. It's more jazz than anything. But to be quite honest this shit was just plain confusing.
Listen to some Shawn Lane stuff....ridiculously complicated as well.
Bebop Tango is just as complex imo. Zappa used these rhythms and melodic tropes throughout his work. But overall, for sheer perverse complexity, I reckon Beefheart has him beat with Frownland.
Jez Creed It's dogshit. Zappa was a fucking pussy.
Yes this is so punk.
For three drummers to play this absolute hellish part in total sync is seriously impressive
Does Dweezil naturally talk like 2:19 or was he impersonating the way his father talked? Because damn, it sounds a hellish lot like Frank
I like to listen to music and clap my hands in unison. Tks Frank!
Discovered this by complete accident, I love it.
Bruford and Bozzio and Peart are my favorite drummers.
Zappa could really make you go out there! This is thinking outside the box! Zappa remained an explorer all his life. He wanted to hear the litlle dots on the paper. And he was a master composer, arranjer and performer. Zappa really pushed the boundaries of music and also of our perception of music. He made us understand it a little better.
Like George Duke said, "I can't imagine what he would be doing today. I miss him." - I just wanted to say that.
+Fora de Cena was zappa ever influenced by the eastern music?
+Vishnu Vardhana Yeah, a lot.
Ah, that explains. This song has odd note grouping. In western, the beats are divided into halves, quarters, 1/8th etc. Sometimes, we divide into 3, called triplets. In eastern music, esp in Carnatic, we divide beats in 3s 5s 7s etc This sort of grouping is used in this song. Also, we use quite bit of polyrhythms as well.
Beautiful piece!
Yeah three percussionists playing at the same time... that way you can't get away with making shit up or fudging it =)
so much beauty in all who collaborated in their own Truth in Expression through the Genius of Zappa
Rumour has it they got the soundcheck down to 65 hours.
I played in a band with a dude who was a huge Zappa fan and memorized this. He’d play it in the middle of our set as sorta of an interlude. Incredible piece of music.
Funny how Zappa wrote this and he wasn’t a drummer but a genius!
Zappa was a drummer and percussionist
Zappa did play drums before he played the guitar. You can see him on Roxy DVD, playing percussion duets with Ruth.
i really like the second part because there's tension then release which is satisfying to listen to