According to a recent video I saw from “In An Instant” , if I remember correctly, the films are identical except that there is an extra layer that acts as a ND filter added to the SX 70 film to decrease ISO value.
Correct and this makes sense from a manufacturing perspective. The least amount of change between film type saves on costs. It's all the same film and the SX70 film is 600 film with an integrated filter to bring that to SX70 levels. In an Instant has a video of the Polaroid employees saying this.
Neither film is worthy of the original reputation and could never have made it back in the day. The films have about a 3 stop range and need to be stopped down for full sun shots or inside with flash.
Thank you for the informative video with all the comparisons! But mate, the music is just too loud😂 Sörey, I just had to write this as a suggestion! Hope it helps
So I actually prefer the SX-70 film over the 600. I have shooters that use both but the tonality of colors just gets me every time! I have a bridge that I've shot at sunset abouf 4 or 5 times and out of those the SX-70 has captured that wayyyy better than any of my 600 cameras. I guess it comes down to what you use it for!
For sure! There is definitely a time and place where the SX-70 film will be better - I do admit that I like the shadows a lot better on the SX-70 film than 600. And I'd love to see those shots!
600 film doesn't seem to have more dynamic range, just weaker shadows since there isn't any added shadow detail on those 600 shots. My theory is that is more prone to internal reflections since the pre-exposure sx70 film is darker due to the neutral density mask (sx70 and 600 film are the exact same emulsion) so it doesn't reflect as much light, and the internal reflections cause less damage because of it. that would explain the better color in general as well. Sx70 film just looks it gives better results while the 600 should be a more entry level easy use film due to the speed
I really think the sx-70 is better. I have another that’s converted to 600 but still always grab my sx-70 sonar first. I wonder if the comparison should have been the same camera - just one converted. 🤷🏽.
The real benefit of doing it this way is that I was able to see the two images taken in the exact same conditions. Same light, same subject, same focus, standing in the exact same place. Both cameras were SX-70s, just one was an MiNT SLR670-X, able to shoot either 600 or SX-70 film. So this is really the absolute best conditions for testing the differences between film.
What about using an ND filter? I feel like the most accurate test would come from testing sx70 film in 600 camera (where you have shutter speed control) compared to sx70 in an sx70 camera compared to 600 film in an sx70 camera with an ND filter and 600 film in a 600 camera
I actually used a SX-70 that was modified by MiNT camera to have manual settings. There was no ND filter used in this experiment, so it's purely a side-by-side comparison.
I believe they're actually different films. I've found the results between the two are quite different. SX-70 tends to have much more contrast, while 600 has a more neutral color palette with greens in the shadows. Do you know where you found that info about them being the same film?
@@LearnFilmPhotography hey 👋🏻 yeah there’s a SX70 repair guy who does complete camera tear downs, rebuilds and new circuit boards etc posted this info. On the Polaroid site they don’t specifically state it’s different film so I think he may be right
When I first took a test shot with my Pronto Sonar, I thought the colors looked more vibrant while still maintaining that "dream-like" look to it. I thought it was confirmation bias, but it's good to have ACTUAL confirmation, and I'm happy that I was right...
@@LearnFilmPhotography Tbh, it's kinda like a cheap SX-70, it has a 3 element lens with true autofocus, a shutter cable attachment point, and a tripod mount. It works really well.
I don't usually use exposure compensation, but the new film is actually a little more sensitive than the old SX-70 film was. So using 1/3rd darker exposure compensation is actually advised by Polaroid.
Ok I read the article. I wonder if results using other methods differ. For example the pack filter impossible made. My method of shooting 600 on my sx70 is just using a 28mm nd4 filter so I get the same exposure time as 70 film so idk if that changes the quality. Guess I’d might have to test it at some point. GREAT VIDEO!
Thanks, glad you liked it! You should see the same results using an ND filter as well - the only difference may be a bit of a color cast in the final images, though that's usually only a problem with longer exposure times. I think the main time I would use those ND filters would be if there wasn't any SX-70 film available.
This way I could take as close to the same photo as possible. That way you could see a side by side comparison of photos taken on the two films in the same light, which would not be possible with only one camera. Trying to make it as scientific as possible.
@@LearnFilmPhotography Makes sense. I asked because the cams are different and may have inherent differences in the lenses. Nice vid thanks. I'm getting closer to not getting a conversion, just a meter calibration during service. The SX-70 colours are too good to lose.
You're right, it's not perfect, and that, along with the film's age and storage method are the two factors you can't control - unless you get the film straight off the factory line. But I got as close as possible. When it comes to conversion, I would consider the 600 switch. To be honest, unless you love using a tripod for photos, you'll be able to get good shots in many more dynamic environments. The only time I've regretted shooting 600 film is when taking photos in harsh middle-of-the-day sunlight when 1/2000 is still too slow. But for portraits, 600 almost always comes through.
The music is way too loud on this, I had to put the subtitles on to get everything you said. I was slightly confused by the swapping around of SX70 and 600 with the sample images, so I'm not sure which was which...? Interesting, though I double many will be able to afford the Mint version!
Thanks for the feedback! I am changing the music level for all future videos, and will make sure not to use such a confusing title placement. Unfortunately, I can't go back and edit this one at the moment, but I may go back and re-create a second version of this one. And the MiNT camera is undoubtedly expensive, though the control it gives you over the exposure is phenomenal, but tricky to use since the film has such low latitude. I think most photographers will be better served using a converted SX-70.
@@LearnFilmPhotography I saw after you’d already had loads of comments on the sound so I’m sorry to add. It’s really helpful to know that the Mint one isn’t so good, I couldn’t have afforded it anyway but good to know a regular SX-70 would be the best option.
@@lightninginabottleuk All good! Even though it was a struggle, I'm glad the content was worth turning on the captions to get the message instead of just going to the next video. The regular SX-70s are fantastic cameras that are so much fun to shoot - especially if you have a flash for portraits and a tripod for landscapes. If you get one that doesn't have the tripod socket on the bottom, then Polaroid did make a mod that would allow you to use a tripod, which you can find on eBay as well.
@@LearnFilmPhotography Yes, unfortunately mine isn't working, I bought one on Ebay and got burnt - it arrived filthy and very fragile. I'm talking to a repair centre next week to see if it's salvageable, but I'm feeling pretty down about my 'mistake'. If it turns out to be repairable I was wondering whether to get it modded to 600 at the same time...
@@lightninginabottleuk I'm sorry to hear about that! Since it was on eBay, did you try to open a claim with eBay that the item was not as described? eBay typically sides with the buyer, since the rely on consumer trust to make sales. I almost fell for something like that in the past as well - someone said they had a lot of 4 SX-70s that were "New Old Stock." Went to check them out, and only one of them kind of worked. The other three were full of cracks, bends, and rust. Luckily it was in person, so I could test and turn it down.
Thanks for the comparison. I have both and am also surprised that the SX-70 film is not sharper. You can't compare a negative to a Polaroid positive. At least you must compare with a print of that negative. There is unbearable loud and distracting background music in this clip?!
Thanks for that. SX-70 is more contrasty, which does make it appear sharper. But it's not too significant. And yes, sorry about the music! I wish I could re-upload this with lower volume, but I have lost the editing files unfortunately.
Cool video ...nice to see Polaroid from Kitsilano beach, wen i get back to my brother in Vancouver , i will made some, from this beautiful side from Vancouver
The short answer is yes. However, you can get a decent exposure if you are in bright conditions and you turn the light/dark wheel/switch all the way to "lighter". The shot might be just slightly underexposed. Just remember to do it every time.
Yeah, unfortunately, I don't think that will work very well. 600 cameras will underexpose the image by 2.5 stops, so you might get a little bit of detail on a very bright day when you consider the very small amount of dynamic range on a Polaroid.
Unfortunately, the blue flames or blue lightning, as Polaroid calls it, are completely random. They're caused by the opacifier layer not being spread evenly, which means small areas don't get protected from the light. When you don't have it, it's more luck than anything! The newer film by Polaroid is supposed to be better, but it's always a bit of a toss up.
This was an SX-70 that was modified by MiNT camera to have manual controls and shoot both SX-70 film and 600 film. So for the video I used two SX-70 cameras (one modified, one not) side by side. You can find the links to them in the description.
Hey so I found the video where Polaroid do a factory tour and they tell the presenter it’s the same chemistry, same film and it’s true Iso is 640. Here’s the link ruclips.net/video/a-S8A3CBAjM/видео.html&ab_channel=InAnInstant Also no shade btw, I was just genuinely surprised also as I’d always assumed they were different and always preferred 600 over sx70.
They technically only make one film sensitivity at a chemical level, all SX-70 film is literally just 600 film with an ND filter as part of the negative.
Damn you, that doesn't help me decide!😂 Help me decide! I've taken a lot of pics in the 80s with an sx70. Favourite things included light painting (long exposures) and photo manipulations (steaming the photo, moving the gel around...) please help
If you're used to working on a tripod, SX-70 film is the way to go for sure, especially if you get one of the shutter release buttons. The only thing to note is that the camera can only shoot long exposures up to 20 seconds, so super intricate light painting can be tough.
I'm wondering if SX70 film will work in an i-type camera. I know the exposure will be different but if I meter correctly and use the manual mode in the app I should be able to get correct exposures. Just not entirely sure if the film dimensions are the same for sx70 film and i-type/600 film
The film dimensions are the same, and unlike in the past, the cartridges are the same, if I remember correctly. If there are still some tabs at the bottom of the cartridge to prevent putting the film in the wrong camera, you can easily insert it anyway by briefly covering the bottom of the cartridge with a dark slide as you insert the film. Just remember to use manual mode every time 🙂
For me Polaroids are for portraits and that’s it. Never really taken one single landscape picture with my SX-70 camera. I would love to see a comparison with portraits. SX-70 film seems to have colors that are more saturated and I really like it.
I would agree that SX-70 is a little more saturated. I also see it as a warmer film than the 600, which does make it more flattering for portraits. 600 is constantly being updated by Polaroid, and they're looking to create a true neutral color tone on that film, which isn't always why we shoot Polaroid film.
According to a recent video I saw from “In An Instant” , if I remember correctly, the films are identical except that there is an extra layer that acts as a ND filter added to the SX 70 film to decrease ISO value.
Correct and this makes sense from a manufacturing perspective. The least amount of change between film type saves on costs. It's all the same film and the SX70 film is 600 film with an integrated filter to bring that to SX70 levels. In an Instant has a video of the Polaroid employees saying this.
Just got an slr 690, cant wait to switch to 600 film after using sx-70 film for months! thanks for the side by side comparison, great vid!
how much did you bag the 690 for?
Awesome! How are your photos coming out with the new camera?
Neither film is worthy of the original reputation and could never have made it back in the day. The films have about a 3 stop range and need to be stopped down for full sun shots or inside with flash.
Thank you for the informative video with all the comparisons!
But mate, the music is just too loud😂 Sörey, I just had to write this as a suggestion! Hope it helps
Thanks for the feedback! I'm going to fix this one.
Thank you for this!
Saving up for a 680 now! :)
Nice!! That's a fantastic camera, I'm sure you're going to love it!
So I actually prefer the SX-70 film over the 600. I have shooters that use both but the tonality of colors just gets me every time! I have a bridge that I've shot at sunset abouf 4 or 5 times and out of those the SX-70 has captured that wayyyy better than any of my 600 cameras. I guess it comes down to what you use it for!
For sure! There is definitely a time and place where the SX-70 film will be better - I do admit that I like the shadows a lot better on the SX-70 film than 600. And I'd love to see those shots!
its the same thing
Killer video! I've been waiting for someone to make a good comparison video! Thank you (:
Glad to hear this was helpful for you! I kept looking for the same thing, but could never really find it as well.
600 film doesn't seem to have more dynamic range, just weaker shadows since there isn't any added shadow detail on those 600 shots. My theory is that is more prone to internal reflections since the pre-exposure sx70 film is darker due to the neutral density mask (sx70 and 600 film are the exact same emulsion) so it doesn't reflect as much light, and the internal reflections cause less damage because of it. that would explain the better color in general as well. Sx70 film just looks it gives better results while the 600 should be a more entry level easy use film due to the speed
I really think the sx-70 is better. I have another that’s converted to 600 but still always grab my sx-70 sonar first. I wonder if the comparison should have been the same camera - just one converted. 🤷🏽.
The real benefit of doing it this way is that I was able to see the two images taken in the exact same conditions. Same light, same subject, same focus, standing in the exact same place. Both cameras were SX-70s, just one was an MiNT SLR670-X, able to shoot either 600 or SX-70 film. So this is really the absolute best conditions for testing the differences between film.
What about using an ND filter?
I feel like the most accurate test would come from testing sx70 film in 600 camera (where you have shutter speed control) compared to sx70 in an sx70 camera compared to 600 film in an sx70 camera with an ND filter and 600 film in a 600 camera
I actually used a SX-70 that was modified by MiNT camera to have manual settings. There was no ND filter used in this experiment, so it's purely a side-by-side comparison.
Interesting video!
But it’s the same film tho right, just the sx70 has an ND layer essentially.
I believe they're actually different films. I've found the results between the two are quite different. SX-70 tends to have much more contrast, while 600 has a more neutral color palette with greens in the shadows. Do you know where you found that info about them being the same film?
@@LearnFilmPhotography hey 👋🏻 yeah there’s a SX70 repair guy who does complete camera tear downs, rebuilds and new circuit boards etc posted this info. On the Polaroid site they don’t specifically state it’s different film so I think he may be right
When I first took a test shot with my Pronto Sonar, I thought the colors looked more vibrant while still maintaining that "dream-like" look to it.
I thought it was confirmation bias, but it's good to have ACTUAL confirmation, and I'm happy that I was right...
Those look like cool cameras! I'd never heard of those before. How do you like the Pronto Sonar?
@@LearnFilmPhotography Tbh, it's kinda like a cheap SX-70, it has a 3 element lens with true autofocus, a shutter cable attachment point, and a tripod mount.
It works really well.
@@Logic44 that's cool! Does it have a built in reusable flash? Or is that an accessory?
Nice video, any exposure compensation on any pics? My sx 70 tends to overexpose...one day will convert to 600 one day...thx
I don't usually use exposure compensation, but the new film is actually a little more sensitive than the old SX-70 film was. So using 1/3rd darker exposure compensation is actually advised by Polaroid.
Why the music it's waaay too loud.!
great content, but the background music is tooooooo loud and overkill.
Thanks for that feedback! Fixing that for future videos!
Interesting video, but the “background” music is too loud.
Wait what compensation did you use on the sx70 camera? Did you use the pack filter, a camera mod, or a mod camera?
Ok I read the article. I wonder if results using other methods differ. For example the pack filter impossible made. My method of shooting 600 on my sx70 is just using a 28mm nd4 filter so I get the same exposure time as 70 film so idk if that changes the quality. Guess I’d might have to test it at some point. GREAT VIDEO!
Thanks, glad you liked it! You should see the same results using an ND filter as well - the only difference may be a bit of a color cast in the final images, though that's usually only a problem with longer exposure times. I think the main time I would use those ND filters would be if there wasn't any SX-70 film available.
Thank you very much.
Why shoot them on two cameras? And did you shoot both stocks in both cameras?
This way I could take as close to the same photo as possible. That way you could see a side by side comparison of photos taken on the two films in the same light, which would not be possible with only one camera. Trying to make it as scientific as possible.
@@LearnFilmPhotography Makes sense. I asked because the cams are different and may have inherent differences in the lenses. Nice vid thanks. I'm getting closer to not getting a conversion, just a meter calibration during service. The SX-70 colours are too good to lose.
You're right, it's not perfect, and that, along with the film's age and storage method are the two factors you can't control - unless you get the film straight off the factory line. But I got as close as possible.
When it comes to conversion, I would consider the 600 switch. To be honest, unless you love using a tripod for photos, you'll be able to get good shots in many more dynamic environments. The only time I've regretted shooting 600 film is when taking photos in harsh middle-of-the-day sunlight when 1/2000 is still too slow. But for portraits, 600 almost always comes through.
@@LearnFilmPhotography I'm not made of money but I reckon the way to go for me is to buy a second camera to shoot 600 film.
The music is way too loud on this, I had to put the subtitles on to get everything you said. I was slightly confused by the swapping around of SX70 and 600 with the sample images, so I'm not sure which was which...? Interesting, though I double many will be able to afford the Mint version!
Thanks for the feedback! I am changing the music level for all future videos, and will make sure not to use such a confusing title placement. Unfortunately, I can't go back and edit this one at the moment, but I may go back and re-create a second version of this one.
And the MiNT camera is undoubtedly expensive, though the control it gives you over the exposure is phenomenal, but tricky to use since the film has such low latitude. I think most photographers will be better served using a converted SX-70.
@@LearnFilmPhotography I saw after you’d already had loads of comments on the sound so I’m sorry to add. It’s really helpful to know that the Mint one isn’t so good, I couldn’t have afforded it anyway but good to know a regular SX-70 would be the best option.
@@lightninginabottleuk All good! Even though it was a struggle, I'm glad the content was worth turning on the captions to get the message instead of just going to the next video.
The regular SX-70s are fantastic cameras that are so much fun to shoot - especially if you have a flash for portraits and a tripod for landscapes. If you get one that doesn't have the tripod socket on the bottom, then Polaroid did make a mod that would allow you to use a tripod, which you can find on eBay as well.
@@LearnFilmPhotography Yes, unfortunately mine isn't working, I bought one on Ebay and got burnt - it arrived filthy and very fragile. I'm talking to a repair centre next week to see if it's salvageable, but I'm feeling pretty down about my 'mistake'. If it turns out to be repairable I was wondering whether to get it modded to 600 at the same time...
@@lightninginabottleuk I'm sorry to hear about that! Since it was on eBay, did you try to open a claim with eBay that the item was not as described? eBay typically sides with the buyer, since the rely on consumer trust to make sales.
I almost fell for something like that in the past as well - someone said they had a lot of 4 SX-70s that were "New Old Stock." Went to check them out, and only one of them kind of worked. The other three were full of cracks, bends, and rust. Luckily it was in person, so I could test and turn it down.
Thanks for the comparison. I have both and am also surprised that the SX-70 film is not sharper. You can't compare a negative to a Polaroid positive. At least you must compare with a print of that negative. There is unbearable loud and distracting background music in this clip?!
Thanks for that. SX-70 is more contrasty, which does make it appear sharper. But it's not too significant. And yes, sorry about the music! I wish I could re-upload this with lower volume, but I have lost the editing files unfortunately.
Cool video ...nice to see Polaroid from Kitsilano beach, wen i get back to my brother in Vancouver , i will made some, from this beautiful side from Vancouver
It's an amazing area for photography!
@@LearnFilmPhotographyAbsolutely!.. I'm from Belgium and I go there every time I come to visit my brother at Patisserie Lebeau....
Your brother's bakery is in a fantastic location - I'm around that area a lot. I will definitely go check it out!
This is great. But now, I wanted to see what would happen if you use sx70 film... Inside a 600 box camera. Will it be super underexposed?
The short answer is yes. However, you can get a decent exposure if you are in bright conditions and you turn the light/dark wheel/switch all the way to "lighter". The shot might be just slightly underexposed. Just remember to do it every time.
Yeah, unfortunately, I don't think that will work very well. 600 cameras will underexpose the image by 2.5 stops, so you might get a little bit of detail on a very bright day when you consider the very small amount of dynamic range on a Polaroid.
How did you get no “Blue flame” on some your shots??
Unfortunately, the blue flames or blue lightning, as Polaroid calls it, are completely random. They're caused by the opacifier layer not being spread evenly, which means small areas don't get protected from the light. When you don't have it, it's more luck than anything! The newer film by Polaroid is supposed to be better, but it's always a bit of a toss up.
what camera did you use to shoot the 600 ?
This was an SX-70 that was modified by MiNT camera to have manual controls and shoot both SX-70 film and 600 film. So for the video I used two SX-70 cameras (one modified, one not) side by side. You can find the links to them in the description.
Hey so I found the video where Polaroid do a factory tour and they tell the presenter it’s the same chemistry, same film and it’s true Iso is 640. Here’s the link ruclips.net/video/a-S8A3CBAjM/видео.html&ab_channel=InAnInstant Also no shade btw, I was just genuinely surprised also as I’d always assumed they were different and always preferred 600 over sx70.
I will check that out! Thanks for that.
Cool video!
They technically only make one film sensitivity at a chemical level, all SX-70 film is literally just 600 film with an ND filter as part of the negative.
600 is easier, sx70 is better
Essentially, yes. I do get more keepers with 600 film, but there is really something to love about the look of SX-70 film.
Damn you, that doesn't help me decide!😂 Help me decide! I've taken a lot of pics in the 80s with an sx70. Favourite things included light painting (long exposures) and photo manipulations (steaming the photo, moving the gel around...) please help
If you're used to working on a tripod, SX-70 film is the way to go for sure, especially if you get one of the shutter release buttons. The only thing to note is that the camera can only shoot long exposures up to 20 seconds, so super intricate light painting can be tough.
Excellent work!! I do prefer 600 film to SX-70.
Thanks, Alex! Do you prefer the colors? Or is it mostly the usability of the film?
@@LearnFilmPhotography I’m indifferent towards the colour, I prefer the b&w offerings.
Fair enough! I do love the tonality in their B&W films. I'll have to make a video on that in the future as well.
Looks like in a perfect world we would have SX-70 colour in a 600 speed. Hey ho.
thanks !! )))))
I'm wondering if SX70 film will work in an i-type camera. I know the exposure will be different but if I meter correctly and use the manual mode in the app I should be able to get correct exposures.
Just not entirely sure if the film dimensions are the same for sx70 film and i-type/600 film
The film dimensions are the same, and unlike in the past, the cartridges are the same, if I remember correctly. If there are still some tabs at the bottom of the cartridge to prevent putting the film in the wrong camera, you can easily insert it anyway by briefly covering the bottom of the cartridge with a dark slide as you insert the film. Just remember to use manual mode every time 🙂
That should be doable with manual mode! Have you been able to test it?
For me Polaroids are for portraits and that’s it. Never really taken one single landscape picture with my SX-70 camera. I would love to see a comparison with portraits. SX-70 film seems to have colors that are more saturated and I really like it.
I would agree that SX-70 is a little more saturated. I also see it as a warmer film than the 600, which does make it more flattering for portraits. 600 is constantly being updated by Polaroid, and they're looking to create a true neutral color tone on that film, which isn't always why we shoot Polaroid film.
bro lower the volume of your background music...holy fuck thats fricken loud
Thanks for the feedback, making that change on all future videos.