I might have to disagree with one of the points you brought up against the possibility of Raphael having had forced himself onto Hope: the fact that he is a narcissist. Yes, he indeed is. But that doesn't mean he's incapable of SA, quite the opposite, actually. Rape is not only about attraction, it's first and foremost about power. And what does Raphael crave the most? Power.
But forcing someone physically into something isn't really a display of power, but the lack of it. Raphael prefers to worm his way into your brain and make you do something of your own volition. That's how I view it. And even if he did, my biggest point in the video was that it doesn't matter so long as we can differentiate fiction from reality
I agree that narcissists are certainly capable of SA, but I also don’t think classic narcissism is being depicted here. The whole Hope-vs.-Raphael thing seems to be metaphor. If an English teacher ever made you read Young Goodman Brown by Nathaniel Hawthorne, I think this is kind of what the writer intended-a parable about hope and despair that forces the reader or main character to understand a moral dilemma within the story.
From a writer’s perspective, I feel like all of this is intended at much more of a metaphorical level. Because Hope and Raphael are embodied in characters, this reads as a personal conflict, but I think it’s really just intended as a set piece to help the player consider their own and their Tav’s natures. A character who truly embodies hope, as she does, is never going to give in to despair. He needs characters to give in to despair to do deals. There’s so much cat-and-mouse reference in his dialogue about deals. To such a creature, Hope would be the mouse that you can play with forever because it never dies. He even says of both Tav and Mal that they’re eventually going to give in to despair and make the only choices left available to them. He tells Tav that he’d rather they put up a fight until all other options run out. So a hope that doesn’t fade, such as a character who embodies the concept, is a toy perpetually under his claw. Also, I feel like the Haarlep dialogue makes it pretty clear that Raphael literally doesn’t engage in any kind of sexual acts with anyone but himself, or Haarlep’s representation of himself. Sometimes those details are more nuanced, but, in this case, I think it’s a writer setting up a didactic and just telling it like it is. And sometimes details like his “blushing apple” dialogue about Mal are specifically intended to reflect on something about the character who says them-amorality, lack of concern about the potential implications of his words, power-any of that. For some people, that’s going to be triggering, because it’s supposed to be. That’s how well-drawn characters reach us and prompt us to think.
EXCELLENT points. I agree with the vast majority! I don't think that Mol is evil, but she's definitely opportunistic, but she doesn't think things through entirely as she is a child. Media literacy is absolutely DEAD.
awesome video, it got recommended to me when you first posted it but i put it off because i hadn't reached Hope yet. i agree that it seems much more likely that she and other occupants are sometimes made to watch what goes down in the boudoir rather than any assault. and thank you for the bit at the end about fiction vs reality, its great to see someone normal in this fandom lmao
Haha, I appreciate it a lot! The fandom really can get so crazy at times. I started avoiding Tumblr and twitter and instead I stick to my tiktok community only and it's the best thing ever! 💞 Thank you so much again
This is a really interesting and insightful comment and I can't believe you managed to get Andrew's opinion. I don't think he's the type who would try to take something by force, because I feel that would not be seen as an actual victory by him. He's the type who want you to agree (even if the method to reach that agreement might be questionable). I feel the apple comment is merely him making a comment about this is a business opportunity, rather then it have any sexual connotation. Also, he's literally thousands of years old, one can argue even the dark urge can be regarded as a child by him! So I don't feel he sees age, but rather opportunity. But whether he can feel for another being, even a mortal is a bit tricky. As a fanfiction writer, I think we can make the assumption that it's not impossible, but the important thing is to write it in a realistic way. He might have someone that is an exception, but that'll be it. He might not hurt that person, but it does not mean he'll suddenly have a change of character and act in a different way. My take is that while he might be able to care for another he'll definitely still expect to be the centre of attention in that relationship
I'm also writing a fanfic that does have a pairing with him, so I completely understand what you're saying. But in game and especially with Hope, his type of interest in my opinion is used as a narration tool. Hope and a Devil. It's so symbolic. Ever since Act 1 he mentions hope as a feeling and then in Act 2, then in Act 3 and then we discover that Hope is an actual embodiment of hope and she's there with him. 'There is no hell without hope'- says one of the busts. I don't think it was ever supposed to be seen as his potential romantic interest, just a never ending battle of a devil who thrives on desperate people and hope is the opposite of desperation. I wish we had gotten a lot more House of Hope lore and content, but the studio can only do so much with the time and resources they are given
@Claudiiwastaken definitely agree with you about what you say about Hope. Which is why I don't think he'd assault her sexually. I haven't played the game so I can't judge whether Hope's presence have to be. Do you post your fanfiction anywhere? Because I'll really like to read it. 😊 since you clearly has given the characters alot of thought
@ 12:31 “are we listening to the same kind of media????” I feel this so often when looking through Twitter 😂. The same kind of person to deliberately misread Raphael’s line about Mol’s soul is the same kind of person to deliberately misread tweets as something worse. The context couldn’t be more clear with Mol too- he’s literally grooming her to make a deal with him by letting her think she’s more clever than him at strategy via chess. He’s still awful, but he’s a lawful and straightforward awful. He even tells the damn player that’s what he’s doing when he says “she has the free will to choose the only option she has left”! As for the Hope situation, I can see a slightly stronger case for that but only just barely- and even then, the reasons you gave in the video are basically the same as to why I dismissed it regardless. Plus, what would it add to Raphael as a character or the story itself to have that happen to Hope? Being skinned alive is also an extreme violation that hope endured, why add SA on top of that?? It just doesn’t make sense from a writing/character standpoint.
The thing is, being skinned alive is so horrible that in my humble opinion SA doesn't make a huge difference over there. He is already a horrible person and his fans are aware of it so I was truly shocked when I saw people actually reacting negatively to the Hope clip. I understand that this is a different spectrum of abuse, but it's not like Raphael is a kind and gentle devil in general. I'm just shocked that this makes someone talk shit to others on twitter, and from what I've seen - do it directly. Some of the accounts that I follow and check occasionally were victims to a flood of hate messages and comments, it was quite crazy
holy sheesh... you contacting Andrew, diving into files, investigating DnD lore etc. is amazing and scary at the same time. You´ve done your homework. Good job. :O
Hi. Late to this. I mean no offense when I say this, but I don't think it was necessary to include Andrew in to this. (and I know your intention was to hear from the very source itself and I liked his response) He is, from what I have understood/gathered, very new to the whole 'fandom culture' and social media scene, especially when it comes to interacting with fans to this extent. Honestly, I was even a bit worried for him initially (I know I shouldn't have been, he is a grown man and no one shouldn't infantilize anyone over such matter, esp. when he is so intelligent, well spoken and -read) given the potential for people to be weird and overstep boundaries online because that is the unfortunate reality on social media very often. Fortunately, it seems that he has only had pleasant experiences, has enjoyed himself and been a really good sport about everything. But the typical exhausting chronically online 'conversation' that Twitter usually is, I don't know... he doesn't need to know. Because even if it what was said pertains to his character, I don't think it's necessary to inform him about it. After all, he wouldn't even know of it; it's all written text files in the game and what other characters say about Raphael. It would be such a shame if his fond viewing of Raphael were to change retrospectively from the 'devil we love to hate but also hate to love' to 'devil that we should probably just hate'. ((((allthough this comes from a simp-perspective, I don't think being a rapist makes a character bad, like writing wise, even if they are the epitome of bad. First example what came to mind was T-bag from prison break, awful awful character that I hate but a such good character content wise, feels authentic, so well played etc, I am sorry getting side tracked)))) I dunno. He won a freaking well-deserved BAFTA with this character and he has embraced Raphael and the community surrounding him, which is evident in his participation in livestreams, playing along etc. And the whole phenomenon that BG3 and everything surrounding it, he has just enjoyed it. I hope the discourse doesn't make him too careful now/or lessen his engagement in the future esp. with all the "dirty/innuendo" jokes that have been all fun and games and good-natured, because it could be seen as a "confirmation" of Raphael being a perv (and I very much understand of not wanting to embrace that), even if it's just some people that say that. The Raphael 'community' has been amazing so far, more mature than most others (like Astarion's for example, In my opinion) and I have been so engaged with it, even though fandoms are something that I have dreaded in the past, It's great to see Andrew experiencing the positive side of things, and I hope it continues. When it comes to morally grey characters like Raphael (canonically a really, truly evil character, there is no denying that, a literal devil!), it's natural for people to debate whether it's 'right' or 'wrong' to like them. (and that is totally okay and sometimes needed). But like you said, it IS fiction and the rating M of the game should be a reminder to some; if you cannot handle mature themes, maybe it isn't a game for you. If some people view him as a SAer then, well, it's up to them. It wouldn't make the character any less good, like you said; good writing triggers strong emotions! But yeah, maybe I am the one here overthinking and being hypocrite. I agree with what you said and once again I am in awe of your determination and deep dive of Raphael, kudos to you, girl! I really enjoy your content and you have been such a big provider for us Raphael simps, so thank you
Oh and about the RaphxMol scene... it was absolutely ridiculous, people were really digging and diving to see sexual undertones there. He is a devil. Their currency and livelyhood is corruption of the mortals, their souls. They don't discriminate based on age there.. But since the scene dissapeared for atleast 1 patch, I really tought that people had pressed Larian to the point of deleting the scene. I was so pissed. But then I so glad to see the scene returning and it just turned out to be glitched for some reason and not triggering. I love that scene.
@@plsno7364 I totally understand your point of view, but trust me that the whole conversation wasn't included in the video and I can assure you, we had a nice talk about it, he wasn't offended or anything because I even asked him about that and he basically agreed with my views. There are a lot worse things happening that I have heard of concerning him, but I don't want to start another debate based on assumptions Thank you for the nice comment and believe me, I totally get what you mean, because I reacted in the same way when Andrew got his first unhinged 'good girl' request on the stream. I was also worried it would look very bad for the community, but he's been having so much fun with it
@@plsno7364 the way I wrote my latest comment sounds as if something was wrong with Mr.Wincott himself. That's not what I was thinking, I meant the possible weirdos in Raphael community. Just to calm your nerves if I confused you
@@Claudiiwastaken I believe you! To be honest, I was worried before I saw what he wrote back to you, but his response was well crafted, I really liked that counter question for you. (admittedly I am bit jelly of you, he seems such an interesting and smart man to have a discourse with) Can't speak for him, but he really strikes me as someone who enjoys character analyzation, but knowing that we won't get anymore of Raphael (weeping, aching, heartbroken) and his win being a fine conclusion to his own journey, the character, the bg3-experience.. it could be something to leave a sour aftertaste in mouth. I bet it feels a bit weird too, first that people get so enamored with a game that you are part of, then your character, your work, then it extending to a war over it on twitter. I would feel that way, at least, if being completely new to all of it. And yeah, it's always a bit awkward and weird barrier to cross, for the first time, when those request go the real person behind a character. Because it suddenly makes it so personal and some people do really sometimes forget that they are real people. Either they get blinded by parasocial relationships or just lack common manners. But I am all for it if they participate, embrace and have fun with it! I am glad that he is having fun and hope it stays that way :). And I am glad that I don't know about the other concerns, seems I am at the right side then heh! (but I can imagine).
I agree with you and Andrew. Raphael doesn’t seem the type to SA, as for the discourse over Mol. Even your companions say he’s aiming for her soul, he’s just doing what devils do it’s manipulation; he just wants another slave/debtor for his House of Hope. People go too far with misreading into what he’s doing. Also not to mention Haarlep says to you Raphael only enjoyed sex with himself in his normal form or female form.
@@Claudiiwastaken I see two squares. I'm not sure what they are, but my comment was that I agree with you. I can't believe people are arguing over fictional characters. It makes no sense.
I might have to disagree with one of the points you brought up against the possibility of Raphael having had forced himself onto Hope: the fact that he is a narcissist. Yes, he indeed is. But that doesn't mean he's incapable of SA, quite the opposite, actually. Rape is not only about attraction, it's first and foremost about power. And what does Raphael crave the most? Power.
But forcing someone physically into something isn't really a display of power, but the lack of it. Raphael prefers to worm his way into your brain and make you do something of your own volition. That's how I view it. And even if he did, my biggest point in the video was that it doesn't matter so long as we can differentiate fiction from reality
I agree that narcissists are certainly capable of SA, but I also don’t think classic narcissism is being depicted here. The whole Hope-vs.-Raphael thing seems to be metaphor. If an English teacher ever made you read Young Goodman Brown by Nathaniel Hawthorne, I think this is kind of what the writer intended-a parable about hope and despair that forces the reader or main character to understand a moral dilemma within the story.
@@4nn13h7 Yesss! Precisely
From a writer’s perspective, I feel like all of this is intended at much more of a metaphorical level. Because Hope and Raphael are embodied in characters, this reads as a personal conflict, but I think it’s really just intended as a set piece to help the player consider their own and their Tav’s natures. A character who truly embodies hope, as she does, is never going to give in to despair. He needs characters to give in to despair to do deals. There’s so much cat-and-mouse reference in his dialogue about deals. To such a creature, Hope would be the mouse that you can play with forever because it never dies. He even says of both Tav and Mal that they’re eventually going to give in to despair and make the only choices left available to them. He tells Tav that he’d rather they put up a fight until all other options run out. So a hope that doesn’t fade, such as a character who embodies the concept, is a toy perpetually under his claw. Also, I feel like the Haarlep dialogue makes it pretty clear that Raphael literally doesn’t engage in any kind of sexual acts with anyone but himself, or Haarlep’s representation of himself. Sometimes those details are more nuanced, but, in this case, I think it’s a writer setting up a didactic and just telling it like it is. And sometimes details like his “blushing apple” dialogue about Mal are specifically intended to reflect on something about the character who says them-amorality, lack of concern about the potential implications of his words, power-any of that. For some people, that’s going to be triggering, because it’s supposed to be. That’s how well-drawn characters reach us and prompt us to think.
YESSS! My thoughts exactly. Art is supposed to move, BG3 does just that
Fantastic analysis, getting Andrew's opinion and classic d&d understanding of devils brings great insight.
Thank you, I appreciate it a lot!
EXCELLENT points. I agree with the vast majority! I don't think that Mol is evil, but she's definitely opportunistic, but she doesn't think things through entirely as she is a child.
Media literacy is absolutely DEAD.
Hello,
Claudii! Your social media content is what I really need at this time) Thanks for your hard work!
@@FruittyYtya thank you for leaving such a wonderful comment ♥️
awesome video, it got recommended to me when you first posted it but i put it off because i hadn't reached Hope yet. i agree that it seems much more likely that she and other occupants are sometimes made to watch what goes down in the boudoir rather than any assault. and thank you for the bit at the end about fiction vs reality, its great to see someone normal in this fandom lmao
Haha, I appreciate it a lot! The fandom really can get so crazy at times. I started avoiding Tumblr and twitter and instead I stick to my tiktok community only and it's the best thing ever! 💞 Thank you so much again
This is a really interesting and insightful comment and I can't believe you managed to get Andrew's opinion. I don't think he's the type who would try to take something by force, because I feel that would not be seen as an actual victory by him. He's the type who want you to agree (even if the method to reach that agreement might be questionable). I feel the apple comment is merely him making a comment about this is a business opportunity, rather then it have any sexual connotation. Also, he's literally thousands of years old, one can argue even the dark urge can be regarded as a child by him! So I don't feel he sees age, but rather opportunity. But whether he can feel for another being, even a mortal is a bit tricky. As a fanfiction writer, I think we can make the assumption that it's not impossible, but the important thing is to write it in a realistic way. He might have someone that is an exception, but that'll be it. He might not hurt that person, but it does not mean he'll suddenly have a change of character and act in a different way. My take is that while he might be able to care for another he'll definitely still expect to be the centre of attention in that relationship
I'm also writing a fanfic that does have a pairing with him, so I completely understand what you're saying. But in game and especially with Hope, his type of interest in my opinion is used as a narration tool. Hope and a Devil. It's so symbolic. Ever since Act 1 he mentions hope as a feeling and then in Act 2, then in Act 3 and then we discover that Hope is an actual embodiment of hope and she's there with him. 'There is no hell without hope'- says one of the busts. I don't think it was ever supposed to be seen as his potential romantic interest, just a never ending battle of a devil who thrives on desperate people and hope is the opposite of desperation. I wish we had gotten a lot more House of Hope lore and content, but the studio can only do so much with the time and resources they are given
@Claudiiwastaken definitely agree with you about what you say about Hope. Which is why I don't think he'd assault her sexually. I haven't played the game so I can't judge whether Hope's presence have to be.
Do you post your fanfiction anywhere? Because I'll really like to read it. 😊 since you clearly has given the characters alot of thought
@@alices9972 yes, on AO3! I am currently re-writing a few things in the beginning. Would you like a link?
@Claudiiwastaken oh yes please! There's even a chance I might have read it already! 🤭 I'm a lurker there with the BG3 fics
@@alices9972 archiveofourown.org/works/52979905/chapters/134023594
It's called A statement of a soul
@ 12:31 “are we listening to the same kind of media????” I feel this so often when looking through Twitter 😂. The same kind of person to deliberately misread Raphael’s line about Mol’s soul is the same kind of person to deliberately misread tweets as something worse. The context couldn’t be more clear with Mol too- he’s literally grooming her to make a deal with him by letting her think she’s more clever than him at strategy via chess. He’s still awful, but he’s a lawful and straightforward awful. He even tells the damn player that’s what he’s doing when he says “she has the free will to choose the only option she has left”!
As for the Hope situation, I can see a slightly stronger case for that but only just barely- and even then, the reasons you gave in the video are basically the same as to why I dismissed it regardless. Plus, what would it add to Raphael as a character or the story itself to have that happen to Hope? Being skinned alive is also an extreme violation that hope endured, why add SA on top of that?? It just doesn’t make sense from a writing/character standpoint.
The thing is, being skinned alive is so horrible that in my humble opinion SA doesn't make a huge difference over there. He is already a horrible person and his fans are aware of it so I was truly shocked when I saw people actually reacting negatively to the Hope clip. I understand that this is a different spectrum of abuse, but it's not like Raphael is a kind and gentle devil in general. I'm just shocked that this makes someone talk shit to others on twitter, and from what I've seen - do it directly. Some of the accounts that I follow and check occasionally were victims to a flood of hate messages and comments, it was quite crazy
There's some weird audio glitch during the video, I tried cutting it out with YT but I don't think it worked properly. Sorry about that!
holy sheesh... you contacting Andrew, diving into files, investigating DnD lore etc. is amazing and scary at the same time. You´ve done your homework. Good job. :O
Yeah the last paragraph you wrote is so real! This is also the reason why I don't think he would ever get physical with the player
@@Claudiiwastaken I agree but still love to read about it. :D
Hi. Late to this. I mean no offense when I say this, but I don't think it was necessary to include Andrew in to this. (and I know your intention was to hear from the very source itself and I liked his response) He is, from what I have understood/gathered, very new to the whole 'fandom culture' and social media scene, especially when it comes to interacting with fans to this extent. Honestly, I was even a bit worried for him initially (I know I shouldn't have been, he is a grown man and no one shouldn't infantilize anyone over such matter, esp. when he is so intelligent, well spoken and -read) given the potential for people to be weird and overstep boundaries online because that is the unfortunate reality on social media very often. Fortunately, it seems that he has only had pleasant experiences, has enjoyed himself and been a really good sport about everything. But the typical exhausting chronically online 'conversation' that Twitter usually is, I don't know... he doesn't need to know.
Because even if it what was said pertains to his character, I don't think it's necessary to inform him about it. After all, he wouldn't even know of it; it's all written text files in the game and what other characters say about Raphael. It would be such a shame if his fond viewing of Raphael were to change retrospectively from the 'devil we love to hate but also hate to love' to 'devil that we should probably just hate'. ((((allthough this comes from a simp-perspective, I don't think being a rapist makes a character bad, like writing wise, even if they are the epitome of bad. First example what came to mind was T-bag from prison break, awful awful character that I hate but a such good character content wise, feels authentic, so well played etc, I am sorry getting side tracked)))) I dunno. He won a freaking well-deserved BAFTA with this character and he has embraced Raphael and the community surrounding him, which is evident in his participation in livestreams, playing along etc. And the whole phenomenon that BG3 and everything surrounding it, he has just enjoyed it. I hope the discourse doesn't make him too careful now/or lessen his engagement in the future esp. with all the "dirty/innuendo" jokes that have been all fun and games and good-natured, because it could be seen as a "confirmation" of Raphael being a perv (and I very much understand of not wanting to embrace that), even if it's just some people that say that.
The Raphael 'community' has been amazing so far, more mature than most others (like Astarion's for example, In my opinion) and I have been so engaged with it, even though fandoms are something that I have dreaded in the past, It's great to see Andrew experiencing the positive side of things, and I hope it continues.
When it comes to morally grey characters like Raphael (canonically a really, truly evil character, there is no denying that, a literal devil!), it's natural for people to debate whether it's 'right' or 'wrong' to like them.
(and that is totally okay and sometimes needed). But like you said, it IS fiction and the rating M of the game should be a reminder to some; if you cannot handle mature themes, maybe it isn't a game for you. If some people view him as a SAer then, well, it's up to them. It wouldn't make the character any less good, like you said; good writing triggers strong emotions! But yeah, maybe I am the one here overthinking and being hypocrite.
I agree with what you said and once again I am in awe of your determination and deep dive of Raphael, kudos to you, girl! I really enjoy your content and you have been such a big provider for us Raphael simps, so thank you
Oh and about the RaphxMol scene... it was absolutely ridiculous, people were really digging and diving to see sexual undertones there. He is a devil. Their currency and livelyhood is corruption of the mortals, their souls. They don't discriminate based on age there.. But since the scene dissapeared for atleast 1 patch, I really tought that people had pressed Larian to the point of deleting the scene. I was so pissed. But then I so glad to see the scene returning and it just turned out to be glitched for some reason and not triggering. I love that scene.
@@plsno7364 I totally understand your point of view, but trust me that the whole conversation wasn't included in the video and I can assure you, we had a nice talk about it, he wasn't offended or anything because I even asked him about that and he basically agreed with my views.
There are a lot worse things happening that I have heard of concerning him, but I don't want to start another debate based on assumptions
Thank you for the nice comment and believe me, I totally get what you mean, because I reacted in the same way when Andrew got his first unhinged 'good girl' request on the stream. I was also worried it would look very bad for the community, but he's been having so much fun with it
@@plsno7364 the way I wrote my latest comment sounds as if something was wrong with Mr.Wincott himself. That's not what I was thinking, I meant the possible weirdos in Raphael community. Just to calm your nerves if I confused you
@@Claudiiwastaken I believe you! To be honest, I was worried before I saw what he wrote back to you, but his response was well crafted, I really liked that counter question for you. (admittedly I am bit jelly of you, he seems such an interesting and smart man to have a discourse with) Can't speak for him, but he really strikes me as someone who enjoys character analyzation, but knowing that we won't get anymore of Raphael (weeping, aching, heartbroken) and his win being a fine conclusion to his own journey, the character, the bg3-experience.. it could be something to leave a sour aftertaste in mouth. I bet it feels a bit weird too, first that people get so enamored with a game that you are part of, then your character, your work, then it extending to a war over it on twitter. I would feel that way, at least, if being completely new to all of it.
And yeah, it's always a bit awkward and weird barrier to cross, for the first time, when those request go the real person behind a character. Because it suddenly makes it so personal and some people do really sometimes forget that they are real people. Either they get blinded by parasocial relationships or just lack common manners. But I am all for it if they participate, embrace and have fun with it! I am glad that he is having fun and hope it stays that way :). And I am glad that I don't know about the other concerns, seems I am at the right side then heh! (but I can imagine).
@@Claudiiwastaken No not at all! I understood what you meant!
I agree with you and Andrew. Raphael doesn’t seem the type to SA, as for the discourse over Mol. Even your companions say he’s aiming for her soul, he’s just doing what devils do it’s manipulation; he just wants another slave/debtor for his House of Hope. People go too far with misreading into what he’s doing. Also not to mention Haarlep says to you Raphael only enjoyed sex with himself in his normal form or female form.
Say it louder for the people in the back!
🫶🫶
@@Claudiiwastaken I see two squares. I'm not sure what they are, but my comment was that I agree with you. I can't believe people are arguing over fictional characters. It makes no sense.
@@Suzanne_sf Oh! It's a heart emoji! Heart made of hands. Thank you for your comment
@@Claudiiwastaken Thank you! I don't know why my computer is not being cooperative. I know the emoji you're talking about! :)
May I ask who is Raphael's writer ?
twitter.com/noneconomical
@@Claudiiwastaken Thank you!!