Stump Pulling Preparations with Snatch Block Pulleys and Explanation of Physics
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- Опубликовано: 15 фев 2023
- This is the equipment needed, setup information, and physics explanation of using snatch block pulleys to remove tree stumps.
Equipment: (All available on Amazon, but links didn't work.)
2 - 3"x20' Ticonn Tow Straps www.ebay.com/itm/373937855120...
2 - 3"x10' Ticonn Tow Straps www.edealinfo.com/d/000202205...
5 - Ticonn D-ring shackle www.ebay.com/itm/266132457162...
9 - Ticonn 10-ton snatch block www.shopabunda.com/products/t...
3 - 3/8"x100' Synthetic Winch Rope www.vevor.com/winch-cable-c_1...
3 - Factor 55 "The Splicer" factor55.com/product/new-the-...
4 - 3"x8' TGL Tree Saver Tow Strap www.ebay.com/itm/224255462677...
All of these items are available on Amazon, but the links weren't working for me for some reason. 
Игры
This is the best explanation of pulleys and mechanical advantage on RUclips!! Thank you for making this video!
I really appreciate it! I have 7 videos showing it in action.
Great video. I watched a few of the pulling video’s and had to back up to this one to get caught up. Thanks again
No problem, I appreciate you watching. I got bogged down this week with work and planting vegetables, but I’m going to do video #7 probably Wednesday this coming week. Plenty more to do!
Thank you for the detailed explanations and diagrams illustrating simple to complex pulley systems! I stumbled across learning about pulleys and mechanical advantage learning to fell trees and skid logs. Having done some research here at RUclips University - this class has been the best learning concepts. Thank you!
No problem and thanks for watching! I have the two big stumps that I’m going to start pulling tomorrow.
I have watched all of your vidoes because I was curious as to how much force it takes for different types of trees to pull out of the ground. As a civil engineer, I applaud your explaination of mechanical advantage! In a couple of your videos you mentioned using differential equations for finding the many aspects of the loss of force and I could not help but laugh.
Thanks, I’ve done as much as possible to forget diff eqs since I graduated. I don’t need them anymore. I’m starting to pull the big stumps by the house and it’s not going well!
Good explanation! Easy to follow. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks, Dave! I appreciate you watching. I have more videos since this one if you’re interested.
Taught the fellows loading a barge to use that system when their winch wouldn't pull the top closed. They used 3 pulleys. that was 50 years ago. Seems, like many other things, so simple yet so difficult to wrap the head around. Well explained. Great job!
I really appreciate it! It seems by the comments in my videos that no one is taught compound pulley systems anymore. Thanks for watching and I am making videos of using all of the equipment!
My brother needs to pull an old Toyota Land Cruiser out of a dilapidated barn and all 4 wheels are flat, locked up and sunk down to the axles. First try with a winch did not work. Thanks to your videos we think there is hope!
Definitely hope. Has he had a chance to try and pull it out yet?
I want to add my thanks for posting these videos. I've watched most of them and they provide a great service. I think I'm starting to understand how all of this works together. Mechanical systems are hard for me to understand. This video in particular helped me a lot. I'm trying to pull out Black Locust stumps with a More Power Puller. Locust roots are incredibly long. I've had some limited success so far. I think I had a 2:1 system and I'm planning on adding more snatch blocks to get more mechanical advantage. Thank you !
No problem and thanks for watching. I’m doing another video this week. I don’t have any black locusts on the property, but I do have a honey locust I’ve been debating about pulling. The good thing about the 10 ton snatch blocks is that they’re relatively cheap to buy and so far have been lasting very nicely for me.
@@brainhomestead6The honey locust will be interesting if you decide to do it. I don't know if they have the same characteristics as the black locusts. With the black locusts if you don't get all of the roots they grow new trees out of the remaining roots. I've pulled 20+ foot long roots out of some of the trees I've worked on.
@@rtv7236 wow that sounds like a huge pain. My single honey locust on the property is covered in 3” long thorns so although it’s a pretty tree, I’m not a fan of thorns.
Great video! Thank you!
Once the stumps are out, Give them a day or so to dry out, Pick them up with your loader and drop them, Most of the soil will drop off without much effort
Awesome advice! I didn’t think about that, but I’m all for anything that makes my life easier! I have two stumps full of dirt waiting at their holes. I’ll do this before I haul them off.
@@brainhomestead6 if you're able to drop them inverted, so that they would land on the stump. The dirt will drop very easily
@@frankwillis7849 I’ll see what I can do about flipping it around, but I don’t want to do too much damage to the yard with the tractor.
Thank you so much! You are good to be teacher. God bless you! 😊
No problem. I enjoy doing it and hope it’s entertaining enough.
So cool how that works.
These videos should play at lunchtime in our schools.
I really appreciate that! I’m doing tons of these with explanations on these systems. I’ve noticed that few people know simple pulley systems and even fewer know compound pulley systems.
@@brainhomestead6
Well, to be honest, I have a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that the rope doesn't break.
@@joeschlotthauer840 the most vulnerable piece in the system is the tree saver straps, then the pulleys. The most robust piece is actually the synthetic rope!
Brian new sub here, just found your channel.
Great explanation.
Thanks for sharing. Good luck with your channel👍TCT
Thanks a lot! I’ve been going through yours since I saw yours. I appreciate it and I have plenty more to do.
I've been watching the tree pulling videos. Very interesting. It would be helpful to see the fine details of one of the more complex arrangements. I understand the sketches and very much appreciate them, however I get caught up in the actual attachments at each end and don't necessarily understand how the synthetic rope attaches to each other or terminates. The video with the simple and complex systems was extremely helpful.
That’s a great idea. I’ve been trying to do my next video for the last month but weather hasn’t been cooperating. I’ve had a few people make this request and I’m happy to oblige.
Excellent video. How are you anchoring the rope to your tow vehicle? Everything I tried slips when I exert enough force to pull a small stump.
I’m just using another shackle to anchor to toe vehicle. On the third tier of the compound system, the force is very light.
If you have an Amazon Prime account and you copy a link to share with your Prime Account embedded in the link, it will not work for anyone else. Might be why it didn't work... Thanks for all your videos and answers.
Does the Bradford pears put up more of a struggle than the pines?
I’m not sure I haven’t done pines yet. The are a hard wood, so I’m guessing they’ll be harder, but I’m going to start doing pines shortly.
Isn't there a way to introduce two or three sheave snatch blocks and reduce the amount of hardware and connections?
Yes there is but the problem is the sheave. You end up with all of the weight on one sheave and getting one heavy duty enough costs a TON of money. That’s why I bought individual 10 ton pulleys, to split the load across multiple points.
Not sure if it was mentioned, or what you spent on all of that kit? I have a 30cwt (1-1/2ton) Tirfor winch which will do everything you want and more. On the anchor tree, if it is going to be saved, it needs far more protection. On the stump, a suitably rated chain with the hook at the back and led up over the top, will take advantage of the remaining height.
I’ll have to look into that, but I’m not sure a 1.5 ton winch will do what I need it to. These stumps aren’t too bad right now, but they’re just going to get bigger.
@@brainhomestead6 I see nothing my Tirfor wouldn't handle, perhaps with a snatch block to assist.
@@thepotterer3726 is 1.5 ton enough? I’m not second guessing, I just don’t know. It seems like I’d need at least a 6 ton or more to get some of my bigger stumps out.
@@brainhomestead6 They do have a relentless pull, which is one of the reasons they are so effective. I'm in the UK where they're easy to hire, not sure about the US.
Alright then, I’ll definitely look into it. I tried doing a search for it and didn’t get many results, but I’ll keep trying.
So in each pulley setup with the synthetic rope, are you using more than one 100 foot length of rope, i.e. are you fastening 2 100 ft ropes together? Is there a reason why you use the Factor 55 splicer rather than using a purchased rope with closed thimbles at each end? I am making a list of things to order. Love these videos.
Great questions. 100’ long ropes are the longest I can find for a reasonable price, about $1 per foot. Over 100’ I would have to special order them and they become $2.50 per foot. I use the Factor 55 ends because the synthetic ropes I’m using are for winch replacement cables which means one end of the cable has a hook and one end just has a smashed metal thimble that I can’t do anything with, so I had to cut it off and put my own end on to make it usable.
I only want them 100’ long really because I’m making compound systems instead of simple systems. Compound systems require more ropes , but not as long as simple systems.
If I had 8 pulleys and one really long rope, I could make a 9:1 simple system. With 8 pulleys and 2 ropes, I can make a 25:1 compound system (5:1 x 5:1). With 8 pulleys and 3 ropes, I can make a 45:1 (5:1 x 3:1 x 3x1).
There are problems with compound systems over simple systems, but the big advantage is the very high mechanical advantage you can achieve.
What are alternate anchor points if the stump being pulled is not surrounded by other trees ?🤷♂
For me, it’s possible the use the tractor as an anchor point after I dig the bucket into the ground to anchor it. Another option is a winch on a truck and anchor the truck to whatever you can find.
Don't anchor to what you want to pull out. It reduces the force that you are pulling with not increases.
For sure! I noticed in subsequent videos after this one that people were sometimes making this mistake.
you are correct do not anchor to stump. it will pull anchor tree I fould out the hard way@@brainhomestead6
Agreed, all tutorials on utube don’t anchor to the stump they want out . This video was really bothering me so I went back and checked out a bunch, none anchor to the object stump
Looking at the all-new synthetic ropes, high-quality pulleys, and straps..it might be cheaper to rent a backhoe?! those parts are not cheap!!! synthetic winch recovery ropes are like $100 a spool alone 😞
Not too bad. Renting an excavator isn’t too expensive, but I wanted to be able to pull stumps in the future without needing to rent a backhoe again.
Should try the synthetic rope snatch blocks. I have bunch rated 55k I think ya there never going to break.
I saw those too but they were a decent amount more expensive so I stuck with these. I have 6 pulling videos now and they’ve worked great!
You have it backwards. Your start line goes to anchor tree.
It actually depends on how many pulleys you have and which direction you’re pulling. For odd number of pulleys, the cable starts on the anchor tree. For even number of pulleys, it starts on the stump.
at 9:00 minutes there are 2 pulleys. What is the force to each pulley? thanks
The pulley on the stump to the right has 200lb of force on it. The pulley on the left has 200lb of force on it as well. However, the total force on the stump to the right is 300lb because you have the 200lb from the pulley and a final 100lb from the end of the cable that’s connected to it.
So, the stump feels 300lb, the anchor tree feels 200lb, and you’re pulling with 100lb.
@@brainhomestead6 thank you very much. I better understand. so the force on my steel cable is also only 100 lb? interesting..
@@zoba4645 exactly, it will only be as high as the force you’re applying. But remember, in compound systems it changes.
@@brainhomestead6Using two 10 ton snatch blocks, should be connect to D-ring shackles that should also be 10 tons of lifting/pulling force?
@@zoba4645 Shackles have strange ratings. My shackles are only rated at 4.75 tons, BUT a minimum break force of 27 tons. Not sure why they’re rated so low.
Awesome approach for stump extraction. Always important to ensure that all components used are load matched. I Attempted to purchase your Equipment list above. Any chance you can update? Either expired ebay urls or inventory not avail is what I was running into.
I actually got everything off of Amazon but it wouldn’t let me link them to Amazon in the description of the video. If you do a search on Amazon for the description of each piece you’ll get the right things.
@@brainhomestead6 I was able to find it all on Amazon, looking forward to testing/using. I plan on pulling the entire tree over (not just the stump).
@@muskegonhunterscamp awesome! I have 4 more stumps to go then I’m going to start trying it all at once too!
@@brainhomestead6 Should probably include the "Factor 55 Fast FID Rope Splicing Tool - RED" in the inventory.
@@muskegonhunterscamp oh yeah, I forgot to add that one.
I like what I see 😍
Thanks, man. I have a bunch more coming.
Can we get a shopping list?
I can do that. I’ve upgraded to more tree saver straps because one of my videos after this one snapped a chain.
@@brainhomestead6 thanks. Very informative videos. Subscribed. Could you go over what kinds of rope strengths you used and how those numbers are determined? If I'm only pulling 100 pounds of force on one pulley, do I need to scale up the strength of the rope after each pulley set? I hope that makes sense.
@@timma11 no problem at all. I have another video I’m finishing about splicing the synthetic rope I use. I’ll put that info in there.
hmm, but a pulley and skip leg day at the gym? I like it!
I think it could be done with smaller trees…. But I’ll leave that for someone in better shape than me, I’ll use a car or tractor!
why not buy a winch or a chain hoist?
Also your 30:1 is gonna be a 20:1 after friction at best .
(or "at best" and then "after friction" Idk the right order, pls help,lol)
Cant wait to see the pulling😊
You’re right on the money. Friction robs a little at light load and much more at heavier load. Also, since I have to pull at an angle for the complex system, that robs away more. I’m glad I got 8 snatch blocks and 3 winch ropes!
I decided not to buy a winch because I don’t have anything to mount it on, and most of them have a short duty cycle and won’t let me run for over 30 seconds at a time.
I have the first pulling video up, I’ll put a card at the end so you can see it.
@@brainhomestead6 Saw it , worked pretty well👍
Lot of people mount the winch on a base plate and chain it to a tree. But yes , has some disadvantages.
@@williamwallace9620 I figured it would be a large loss altogether, but hoping to get some force meters this year so I know exactly how much force is required.
Good intention on explaining. However it’s a bit confusing with the drawing. Thank you though
Thanks, on some of my later videos I clarified the drawings.
You have a 3 to 1 simple system and a 5 to 1 simple system. They are each self contained and independent of one another except for the single connection that allows one to operate the other, making the whole a compound system rather than a complex. In that light, the math gets easier because you can just multiply the MA numbers from the two simple systems. 3 to 1
x5 to 1
15
Semantics, but important.
The following helps in the figuring. Stationary pulleys do not provide any mechanical advantage. They are just redirects. Only moving pulleys create mechanical advantage.
If your 3 to 1 would have been a rescue Z-rig (RUclips search) added to the haul line of the 5 to 1, then you would have had a complex system. And a very quick way to reset short pulls.
Here’s a fun and cheap rig to build to win bets with.
4 pulleys and 4 ropes will create 16 to 1 MA
HOWEVER…..a couple headaches are involved.
4 anchor points and rather long distances are required.
One pulley attached to the load is a 2 to 1 simple.
Lay the other 3 pulleys next to the first. Create 3 more
2 to 1 simple systems. Each one pulls the one previous to it. Simples operating simples creates multipliers.
2 x 2 x 2 x 2 = 16
Now the fun. The fourth anchor is to be 8 TIMES the distance of the first.
Each rope is twice as long as the previous one but only has to be half as strong.
Yeah, I’m kinda nuts but it actually has come in handy.
I appreciate that! I noticed after I did my first 3 or 4 videos that compound and complex are NOT the same thing and I had incorrectly been using them interchangeably. I corrected my mistake around video #3. Out of the hundreds of comments I’ve gotten on all of my stump pulling videos, you’re the first one to catch this mistake!
Since this video I’ve gotten much quicker with whipping stumps out and I try to use different setups most of the time.
I appreciate you watching the video!
@@brainhomestead6
Good stuff, Boss. 🤜🤛
Perhaps you could help me understand the difference between a fixed pulley and a moving pulley in this situation of stump pulling. I haven't been able to wrap my head around it and can't find a suitable explanation. The stump is the load but it is also a fixed point, non moving pulley. How do you calculate the force on the stump?
@@Ed-ym4tu it’s actually hard for me to tell you because I didn’t learn it as moving pulley vs. fixed pulley. I learned it as a complete system using force vector analysis. I can give you some general rules.
Go to the 6:30 mark in this video. If you’re applying a force around a pulley and there’s no movement, that means the other strand also has the same force on it. In the section at 6:30, I’m pulling with a 100Lb force, so the other strand also has 100lb of force on it. IF the other line didn’t have the same force on it, that means there would be movement somewhere. So, the tree on the right is resisting my 100lb of force with an equal force in the opposite direction. So it’s the same force as mine, meaning there’s no increase in mechanical advantage. However, the tree on the left feels the 100lb of force I’m putting on it, plus it feels the 100lb of force the tree on the right puts on it to resist my pulling force. The result is the tree on the left feels 200lb of force, even though I only put in 100lb of force, so a mechanical advantage of 2.
@@Ed-ym4tu At 8:41 in this video you’ll see multiple pulleys. The person on the left is applying 100lb of force and since there’s no movement in the system, every strand of rope in that simple system MUST have the same tension on it, otherwise there would be movement. So, you can see that the stump on the right has 3 strands of rope pulling on it, each one is 100lb, so 300lb total of force on that stump. At the same time, the anchor tree on the left has 2 strands on it at 100lb each so it’s seeing a force of 200lb. Just something to keep in mind while selecting a tree.
I have 6 videos done already for pulling stumps in action, but I give a description at the beginning of the videos if you want more examples.
I can tell you 5 to 1 is plenty it sucks having keep adjusting ropes.
I have done 6 videos of pulling stumps now and I had to drop the 42:1 because I would pull 90’ and nothing would happen!
Nylon isn't synthetic?????
No, the synthetic and nylon are way different. 3/8” has a working load limit of roughly 350lb. 3/8” synthetic has a working load limit of 6000lb minimum.
I really enjoyed your video. You have a new sub.
Questions:
1: In the 30:1 diagram, does this mean that the first anchor tree will receive 2400lbs of force for every 100lbs of force (ignoring friction and angles)? I ask because you need a very strong first anchor if that is the case...otherwise you may loose the stump and your first anchor.
2: Did you mean to say 100 foot rope vs. 100 lb rope in this description? ruclips.net/video/_oOp1f-9lh0/видео.html
That’s right, the first anchor tree needs to be the beefiest. In the 30:1 scenario, there’s 3000lb of force on the stump, but 2400lb on the first anchor tree.
Now, it’s not quite that easy because this isn’t tensile force, it’s actually rotational force, also known as torque. I put the strap around the anchor tree about 1’ above the ground, so it experiences 2400 ft*lb of torque. Basically you multiply the force by the height above the pivot point (ground). Since I put it 1’ off the ground, it’s just (2400)(1)=2400.
On the stump, I put the strap 3’ off the ground, so the torque on that root ball is (3000)(3)=9000 ft*lb of torque.
It’s only that much at the beginning, as the stump starts coming out, there’s less and less torque and more tensile force. It’s a pretty simple formula too. For torque, you can multiple the torque times sin(theta) where theta is the angle from the pulling force to the angle of the stump to the ground.
Also, you are correct, I meant 100’ rope and in 9 months since I’ve made this video, I never noticed that, so thank you!
WOULDN´T BE EASIER CONTRACTING AN EXCAVATOR??
8:47 most of your arrows are not pointing in the right direction half of them are canceling each other out this is a confusing explanation
I saw that I had some of them wrong after the fact. In subsequent videos, I clarified it.