This is a super helpful video that puts all the different ideas and protocols I have been hearing for the last 2-3 years into action. It is very convincing and systematic! Thank you for making it clear and concise with the notes running in the background. Probably, it is a trivial detail, but I needed to make sure... The only points I had to stop were around 3:36 and 4:20. These two plots display the same data (also given in numbers at 7:24) referenced to either MVC-7 or BW, aren't they?
Great video, thanks for the info! Why do you say that the CF test is more of an anaerobic endurance test? My understanding is that the CF test was designed exactly to find your aerobic endurance, by finding the threshold at which you can maintain an effort aerobically. Lattice themselves from what I know use the 60/70/80% curve estimation only as an approximation when they can’t just directly test someone’s CF. Would be very interested to understand what I’m missing :)
Hi! That depends on how you define CF. If you're measuring CF with a 24-rep 4-minute test, that's too short. Your pulling force will keep declining after 4 minutes. This has already been researched - there's a paper on that. The authors of the paper concluded that if you take 80% of the CF measured in a 4-minute all-out test, then most people should be able to maintain this force for 12 minutes of 7/3 Repeaters. However, the paper was on passive pulls. Active curls are more energy-consuming, so it's harder. If you can do 36 Active Curl reps at 80% CF measured in the 4-minute all-out tests, then that's a really good result. Regarding the original 80/60%/45% passive hang test, I think it's much more relevant for aerobic endurance. I think Lattice Training don't use it that much because it's more complicated to explain to the client, but I personally like it too. Both tests complete one another and allow us to see a bigger picture.
Very good video and analysis!! Just for clarification, you suggest to combine AC FSR for strenght and AC ER for endurance within the same session? Wouldn't it be better to separate these somehow?
@@ivanmiljak964 It depends on your schedule, separating could be better, but the AC FSR are not that fatiguing, so it's perfectly fine to combine. If you're going to climb or boulder, then just do 2-3 sets of AC FSR, otherwise your performance will suffer.
Love the video! When Mikhail does the wall crawl exercise, does he have specific holds in mind that he wants to hit? If I wanted to incorporate wall crawls into my training, what type of holds should I be looking for?
Thanks! So we had slightly different approaches to wall crawls, I asked Misha to favor tiny holds, but for what I know, he put his own twist on the exercise and added difficult and awkward moves on big holds, like Gaston's, etc. He said it was very helpful. On my Patreon you can listen to our full conversation, where his training is explained more thoroughly.
Thank you for the very informative video! I have a question about the Active Curl Endurance Repeaters. At the beginning of the topic you mention starting at 60% CF then progressing until 80% CF is easy and your last rep can go way above the target. You then follow it up with the drills which seem to contradict your previous statement. In the drill portion of the topic you mention starting the 1st set at a higher load (70-80% CF) then dropping it to (60-65% CF) by the third set. Perhaps I misunderstood. Could you please provide clarification?
At the beginning of the cycle, start with 60 - 65%. Do 1-3 sets per session. As you improve, increase the intensity to 70-75%. At one point you'll get to 80%, but it's going to be hard. Incorporate that into your sessions, and do the first set at 80% and the for the next sets lower the intensity. At one point you'll be able to comfortably complete the exercise at 80% and still have a lot of gas left on the tank - at this point retest your CF and start over. Does that make more sense?
Tyler Nelson has advocated Active exercises for a long time as an alternative to passive hangs or pulls. There's an article on that on my website: strengthclimbing.com/dr-tyler-nelsons-new-active-finger-strength-training-protocols/ Active Curls demand more energy, and some authors claim they induce a stronger physiological response. At the same time, there is less tissue damage to the muscles than eccentrics, so you need less time to recover.
very interesting, i would have guessed that the CF gains from the tindeq would carry over much more significantly to the hangboard CF test. Wouldve expected at least 5-8% increase there. I mean with 6min intervals i wouldve expected to tax the aerobic system heavily. Im curious how you go about working his hangboard CF now, even longer sets of 10-20 minutes? Very interesting, thanks for the detailed analysis, big fan of ur channel ❤️
Yes, I thought the same, that's why we started that protocol! It turns out if you want to improve 20 minute CF, you need much longer drills. One way is to do Endurance Repeaters Pyramids at CF, but that's boring and it doesn't develop technique. So now we do easy routes back to back, like three, four in a row. That works great, I already measured significant gains myself. I'm also experimenting with BFR cuffs - climbing super easy stuff with occlusion - I'll have some results soon! The final thing you could try is to lower the intensity further and do the Tindeq drill. Go for 50 - 60 reps - it should move the gains further towards the aerobic end.
@ Also, have you done any testing on CARCING? I mean you mustve seen the video from lattice where the guy gained 10% CF in a month doing curls with the grip trainer for 3h a week..
Yes, but it's not very climbing-specific. You can do it as long as it doesn't interfere with your climbing, but I wouldn't swap a climbing session for squeezing a grip tool.
That depends on what your training week looks like. But the great thing about the active curl protocols is that they take less time to recover from. If you're in a finger strength training cycle, you can probably do these exercises 2 - 3 times per week, depending on the overall training volume, your level, age, etc.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
This is a super helpful video that puts all the different ideas and protocols I have been hearing for the last 2-3 years into action. It is very convincing and systematic! Thank you for making it clear and concise with the notes running in the background. Probably, it is a trivial detail, but I needed to make sure... The only points I had to stop were around 3:36 and 4:20. These two plots display the same data (also given in numbers at 7:24) referenced to either MVC-7 or BW, aren't they?
@@boramavis2227 Thanks a lot, I hope it'll help you improve! Yes, you're correct about the plots - same data referred to either MVC-7 or BW.
I bought a tindeq 150 today so this video was very inspiring.
Great, have fun with it, it's a very useful tool!
Dear collegue, thanks a LOT for sharing! Hope we'll collaborate one day.
Thank you, yes of course, I would like to :)
Great video, thanks for the info! Why do you say that the CF test is more of an anaerobic endurance test? My understanding is that the CF test was designed exactly to find your aerobic endurance, by finding the threshold at which you can maintain an effort aerobically. Lattice themselves from what I know use the 60/70/80% curve estimation only as an approximation when they can’t just directly test someone’s CF. Would be very interested to understand what I’m missing :)
Hi! That depends on how you define CF. If you're measuring CF with a 24-rep 4-minute test, that's too short. Your pulling force will keep declining after 4 minutes. This has already been researched - there's a paper on that. The authors of the paper concluded that if you take 80% of the CF measured in a 4-minute all-out test, then most people should be able to maintain this force for 12 minutes of 7/3 Repeaters. However, the paper was on passive pulls. Active curls are more energy-consuming, so it's harder. If you can do 36 Active Curl reps at 80% CF measured in the 4-minute all-out tests, then that's a really good result.
Regarding the original 80/60%/45% passive hang test, I think it's much more relevant for aerobic endurance. I think Lattice Training don't use it that much because it's more complicated to explain to the client, but I personally like it too. Both tests complete one another and allow us to see a bigger picture.
@ that makes sense, thank you very much!
Very good video and analysis!! Just for clarification, you suggest to combine AC FSR for strenght and AC ER for endurance within the same session? Wouldn't it be better to separate these somehow?
@@ivanmiljak964 It depends on your schedule, separating could be better, but the AC FSR are not that fatiguing, so it's perfectly fine to combine. If you're going to climb or boulder, then just do 2-3 sets of AC FSR, otherwise your performance will suffer.
Love the video!
When Mikhail does the wall crawl exercise, does he have specific holds in mind that he wants to hit?
If I wanted to incorporate wall crawls into my training, what type of holds should I be looking for?
Thanks! So we had slightly different approaches to wall crawls, I asked Misha to favor tiny holds, but for what I know, he put his own twist on the exercise and added difficult and awkward moves on big holds, like Gaston's, etc. He said it was very helpful. On my Patreon you can listen to our full conversation, where his training is explained more thoroughly.
I always plan the holds. And trying to swith boulders from fingery style to more reachy, shouldery moves.
💪🏻💪🏻
Thank you for the very informative video! I have a question about the Active Curl Endurance Repeaters. At the beginning of the topic you mention starting at 60% CF then progressing until 80% CF is easy and your last rep can go way above the target. You then follow it up with the drills which seem to contradict your previous statement. In the drill portion of the topic you mention starting the 1st set at a higher load (70-80% CF) then dropping it to (60-65% CF) by the third set. Perhaps I misunderstood. Could you please provide clarification?
At the beginning of the cycle, start with 60 - 65%. Do 1-3 sets per session. As you improve, increase the intensity to 70-75%. At one point you'll get to 80%, but it's going to be hard. Incorporate that into your sessions, and do the first set at 80% and the for the next sets lower the intensity. At one point you'll be able to comfortably complete the exercise at 80% and still have a lot of gas left on the tank - at this point retest your CF and start over. Does that make more sense?
@@strengthclimbing yes thank you!
For what reasons is the "active pulling" easier to recover from (compare to passive pulls) ? Thx
Tyler Nelson has advocated Active exercises for a long time as an alternative to passive hangs or pulls. There's an article on that on my website: strengthclimbing.com/dr-tyler-nelsons-new-active-finger-strength-training-protocols/
Active Curls demand more energy, and some authors claim they induce a stronger physiological response. At the same time, there is less tissue damage to the muscles than eccentrics, so you need less time to recover.
very interesting, i would have guessed that the CF gains from the tindeq would carry over much more significantly to the hangboard CF test.
Wouldve expected at least 5-8% increase there.
I mean with 6min intervals i wouldve expected to tax the aerobic system heavily.
Im curious how you go about working his hangboard CF now, even longer sets of 10-20 minutes?
Very interesting, thanks for the detailed analysis, big fan of ur channel ❤️
Yes, I thought the same, that's why we started that protocol! It turns out if you want to improve 20 minute CF, you need much longer drills. One way is to do Endurance Repeaters Pyramids at CF, but that's boring and it doesn't develop technique. So now we do easy routes back to back, like three, four in a row. That works great, I already measured significant gains myself. I'm also experimenting with BFR cuffs - climbing super easy stuff with occlusion - I'll have some results soon! The final thing you could try is to lower the intensity further and do the Tindeq drill. Go for 50 - 60 reps - it should move the gains further towards the aerobic end.
@ Also, have you done any testing on CARCING? I mean you mustve seen the video from lattice where the guy gained 10% CF in a month doing curls with the grip trainer for 3h a week..
Yes, but it's not very climbing-specific. You can do it as long as it doesn't interfere with your climbing, but I wouldn't swap a climbing session for squeezing a grip tool.
how many times per week would you recommend the acfsr and wall crawls?
That depends on what your training week looks like. But the great thing about the active curl protocols is that they take less time to recover from. If you're in a finger strength training cycle, you can probably do these exercises 2 - 3 times per week, depending on the overall training volume, your level, age, etc.
@@strengthclimbing ok great! thanks for the quick response!
I didnt get why you opt to do the CF test with active curling instead of passive pulling ?
I wanted to have an active curl reference for the exercises.