actually to be fair you can cool a pc using Oil, but thats an Extreme Overclocking thing using Mineral Oil ruclips.net/video/YT_fvSQsJ1Q/видео.html and its not in a loop, the entire PC is dipped in it, with insulation on certain more sensitive parts.
Mineral has about half (I don't want to find my CRC Handbook so I'm assuming from my olden days in school) but part of the whole calculation is also volume so in the case of embedding a whole system you get an order of magnitude more cooling volume. It would still be half as effective at best in the same volume loop.
Oh, I know! People are talking about undervolting and PBO - but it's an ITX build with low air flow AND the CPU survived torture. Just running it normal is a gift! Aaaand... way more risk of undervolting and/or overclocking causing stability issues after all that.
@@Stratos1988 yep, can confirn from my own experience. Have run into plenty of Ryzen 5 3600s that are just dead. Don't think I've run into a 2000 series chip dying yet though, pretty resiliant if anything.
Yeah, that and the fact that he kept trying after the second breaker trip. Not an electrician/electrical engineer. If a breaker goes twice, find and fix the fault.
Hearing the brother describe electrical concepts like "static" and "grounded" gave me so much PTSD from my helpdesk days that I need to order Panda Express for old times sake.
I had a similar issue where my breaker was being tripped randomly, and it was only when my pc was on, and it never did it before, after checking my pc, I was able to track the issue to the wiring of my house. Each room has its own circuit, but when they did my computer room, the circuit was also split to the basement to a single outlet for a freezer, and also to the bathroom for 1 light and the fan. I found if the light and fan were on, my pc and the ac, everything was good until the compressor kicks on from the freezer. That was enough to trip the breaker. Your brother can just have an overloaded circuit and that little extra was enough to trip it.
Damn, your bro is cool. It's cool that he's willing to listen and learn about what's going on, the reasoning behind it, and to be educated. When something breaks in my family, they don't listen because they don't care. As long as it's fixed, they're not interested
If that is one of the original NZXT H1's, you may want to make sure he got the revised PCI-E riser cables, they were prone to shorting out and even CATCHING FIRE 🔥!
That was my first thought. Take everything out and see if it still causes the problem, because a short to ground is not only plausible, but likely in that case.
He should check to see what else is on the same circuit as the PC. I imagine that the circuit could already be overloaded since the breaker is a dumb device and should only trip if the rated current is exceeded. If a small spike from the PC were enough to trip it, it's already overloaded, unless the breaker is defective. Since it's not tripping a breaker at your house, it's clear that there's no electrical fault with the system causing the breaker to trip.
also could check that its breaker that tripped and not ground protection, also some extension cords have over voltage protection and the vacuum can make pretty good voltage at the plastic pipe when vacuuming
@@Caderynwolf Of course there is a limit. Breakers have limits, wiring have limits. No matter if you are in US (110V) or Europe (220-230V), if you go over the rated amperage breaker will trip. It is designed for that purpose, so your wiring won't catch on fire when there is a short and amperage skyrockets. Or if you simply put too much devices on a single circuit and run them at the same time, it may also trip the breaker.
@@GregSalazarGreg, check if your bro's H1 doesn't need a recall. The early ones were shorting on the pcie riser and catching fire. Gamer's nexus had a few episodes about it. It could explain the breaker tripping too. ✌️
LTT has gotten so stale over the last few years. It just feels so corporate and overproduced. Linus just shows up, clearly reads a script written by someone else, and just doesn't seem like any of himself is actually put into any of the videos, which is why most people started watching 10+ years ago.
My MSI 240 AIO did this after 3 months! MSI then refused to repair or replace my AIO! I no longer use any MSI products because of this. Glad to see you are helping your brother out!
And this folks is why I'll avoid using AIO's as long as possible. I just don't want to deal with anything water related in my PC. Air coolers don't have this problem. Thanks for sharing :)
My theory is that AIOs were made with planned obsolescence...because even my Chinese custom loop (with a waterblock that costs $20) has not had any problem like this for 7 years
kind of a wholesome episode, i enjoyed the sibling dynamic. also, interesting choice of words when you said that the CPU was just chilling in the BIOS while it was physically overheating
His gamertag though, hilarious. Gave me a good laugh 🤣🤣 17:51 - If you have a 3D Printer, print an adapter from the NZXT fan to the Heatsink of the be quiet cooler
If his house was built in 1999 or later and the PC is in a bedroom, he has a weak AFCI breaker (arc fault circuit interrupter). The National Electrical Code was updated in 1999 and requires all bedrooms to have these installed. The breakers get weak over time and trip. I've seen this before and replaced several when someone simply tured a lamp on. They are designed to trip when an arc is detected. Not to be confused with a GFCI (ground fault circuit interpreter) which detects a ground fault in wet areas.
Wow! Great comment! I have a computer on a circuit that occasionally trips the breaker. I have kids. Anything could happen on the shared circuit, so I didn't think a ton of it, but knowing older breakers can be an issue? Clutch! I already have a replacement ready! Thanks!
580 watts. Thats what my brand new 7900xtx pulled before my cables melted and the psu shut down without tripping my breaker. It pulled that for a month before crashing. I had done all the proper ddu and driver installs, but something must have gone amiss. After a new ddu and driver install it ran normally. I am so glad that my psu did it because i could have very easily had a fire while playing vr or if i left it running while not home.
IDK Greg? I see these problems over and over with liquid coolers. Every PC I have ever built with liquid coolers. I always recommend air coolers from now on. The air coolers have improved a ton so that is how I go now! Great video!! Thank you for posting! P.S. Your bro looks exactly like your son!! The beat goes on!
Just made my Wife and myself some lunch, sit down to eat it and first episode of Fix or Flop drops. Nice engaging content with a perfect run length, thanks Greg. Me personally I would have re-purposed the AIO fan as the case fan, but that's because I'm cheap.
Yo Greg! As mentioned on one of the previous video... Just holding down the button to enter the bios is enough and less of a hassle compared to spamming it.
@@dexmat3964 Holding it down is a solution? As someone who is a IT field technician reflashing computers more times than I care to count in a week... HOLDING it down instead AND it working would be a GIFT! :D 😂😂😊😊
12:04 It looks like WHAT dude Also I appreciate you taking the time to explain why these use water, Greg. I come here for the hardware or build fuckups, and leave with a bit of extra knowledge about how these things work.
Hi Greg. Since Kyle is in your repair shop, you might have him do all the physical work under your supervision. Removing security screws is no big problem. I bought a box of security screw removal bits with a screwdriver from Harbor Freight. They work great for removal of battery pack security screws.
Plus you don't have too worry about the pump dying. If the fan dies. You can still use the heatsink. The case fans will help the heatsink mostly. Should have a replacement on hand. Or take another case fan from somewhere inside the case and use that. If they are the same size. If not just use it as a temp with zip ties.
I'm glad you have a new season for this series.. I enjoy watching you troubleshoot these systems and the fact that you do it with no charge to the owner is awesome. (of course I wouldn't charge too if it were my sibling). I also enjoy trying to figure out what watch you are wearing. (Omega Speedmaster Racing)
Hahah yeah it spun later on while remaining powered - and admittedly when I wasn't looking for it - but the fact that it never spun upon initial boot was weird. Almost every unit I've worked with spins upon initial boot.
i actually just had to replace my coolermaster aio because it was preventing my PC from posting unless I pinched 1 of the tubes near the radiator, was the weirdest thing i've ever come across in a PC.. i am just glad for 3 things, 1. that it didn't leak anywhere in my system, 2 that it was repeatable and wouldn't let the PC boot, and 3 that it was my system and not someone elses.
I believe his system would GREATLY benefit from a cpu upgrade in AM4 so he can utilize PBO with a -20 to -30 so he can have lower temps and have an overclock
@@Mrwouter1231And that is exactly what happens with undervolts. As soon as local environmental conditions change and with the under-volt is too aggressive………the system crashes.
@@techluvin7691 I have some GPU's and just moving them to another system means they now need a different undervolt/overclock. Getting more for less means adding challenges.
AN AFCI (Arc Fault Circuit Interruptor) circuit breaker can be very sensitive. It will blow when it discovers dangers long before they do damage. It's why they are found in modern bedroom/living quarters. I've seen them trip when a person got a static shock on something on the circuit....
Well i use an H50 since 2013.FX 8350 to R5 2600 then R5 3600 and now i use it to cool an undervolted R7 5700X3D.Put a second fan on it in a push-pull configuration,works like a charm
I used a 120 Corsair AIO way back on my 3570k, that was a bad decision. Unsure how good low profile aircoolers have become in recent years, but I would assume that they are better than a 120 AIO even in such a case.
Agreed. Unless it's going to be in ECO mode or undervolted just put a damn air cooler on it. Even in a SFF Noctua Coolers can do some serious heat dissipation. 😂 90s in the BIOS I knew it was fucked
In the UK, we have switched outlets, so when I vacuum my PC, I plug the power-cord in, keep the PSU & the outlet switched off & use the ground of the power cable to dissipate any static.
I am gonna make one more note, what you SHOULD HAVE done was, take the PC BACK to his house and confirm your findings before ruling out what you think the issue was. You have be a scientist with this kind of stuff and just taking a punch in the dark without start to finish, returning to the scene of the crime, you can't be sure that the CPU temps, or whatever, was the culprit. I'd personally like to see a follow up video showing the results of the PC working at his house back where it all started.
When I work on these systems for any other random viewer, that does NOT happen for obvious reasons. No special exceptions here. I can only test what I can see and we obviously never saw a breaker trip in my office. Implying we aren't being "scientific" because we didn't travel all the way back to his house, plug it in, and wait for however many hours until (or if) the system crashed is a bit outlandish. I fix PC issues. I don't fix house electrical wiring issues.
Makes me feel happy I went with air instead of liquid/aio cooling. Nothing against it, but not worrying about this happening ever is just great for people like me that don't have the best of knowledge with computers
One time a co-worker and I were cutting out grout to replace a tile. I was using a shopvac to catch the grout as he was grinding it out. I was building so much static sucking up that grout that I was getting shocked THROUGH MY SHOES. We were both dying laughing as I jumped every 5 seconds. I never used a vacuum to clean electronics after that.
So this is why I just don't use AIOs at all. It just seems to be too much of a risk and hassle to remedy it. Air cooling is fine, if you think about air flow and don't use overclocking or crazy power hungry cpus
That vacuum static is no joke. Just today I was making dust while drilling into concrete. I used a vacuum to suck up the mess as I ran the drill. All the while my ear would get zapped if I moved too close to the metal post I was bolting to the floor. 👂⚡
Glad to see the series back and it was an excellent episode, crazy we are still seeing AIO's have these issues, especially ones still relatively new. Now just for clarification, when you showed the gunk build up to your brother he did say it looked like "salmon" didn't he and not a bodily fluid?.... 🤣
The accident in Chernobyl... water could have never prevented that accident from happening. The graphite moderators got stuck, and the fission reactions climbed exponentially. The water was flash-vaporized and the whole thing just exploded.
@@imglidinhereChernobyl exploded but not a nuclear explosion! Extremely high pressure steam, ejecting radioactively contaminated water / steam into the atmosphere that spread for 1000km
Yep, but they _did_ reduce the flow of coolant to the reactor core, no? And boiling water certainly doesn't help anything. This is all a bit beside the point, anyway. We use water in reactors for its abundance, heat capacity, etc.
@@GregSalazar I do recall hearing and reading about that, yes. Very poor decision-making on their part. I just hope incidents like that never happen again, because nuclear power generation is extremely useful.
@@57dent yea the test they were doing created very rare circumstances and when the graphite tipped rods were inserted to stop the reaction it did the opposite and created and endless reaction that instantly vaporised the water which created a stupid amount of pressure which exploded.
What else was running on the same circuit? 15A or 20A? Coffee machine or microwave maybe on the same circuit. Hairdryers are notorious for pulling a lot of current.
Connecting the vacuum to earth does not prevent static discharge, but connecting the metal pipe does. But that only works for the pipe. The plastic attachment will still collects charges. Dehumidified compressed air is just way safer.
Yeah, he was just trying to be funny in that moment hahah. I should have kept it in, but right after we cut away from that scene, we both started cracking up hysterically 😂
@@jamb312. Yep absolutely that is too much gpu unless running at 4K. Good news is when he finally gets around to it its pretty cheap to upgrade. Even a $65 ryzen 5500 would be very noticeable
@@astanisystems I know some may be joking, but folks out there are seriously whining about the SSD upgrade and lack of a CPU upgrade... This isn't Upgrade or Flop. We fixed his system, gave him extra storage, and sent him on his way. Why are so many expecting handouts wherever they can justify them? Ruins the playlist.
Whether or not Greg pays for such upgrades for his family members is not something we can verify or need to know - he may well also do it, but regardless, at the very least by not making it a part of the video I think Greg is showing admirable restraint here by not succumbing to nepotism.
Maybe arc-fault circuit (AFCI) probably tripping when the pump did a large current pull trying to push water but suffering way too much resistance. Arc-fault are way more sensitive than a standard older style breaker and only found in newer home constructions. High current spikes will trip them easily.
I just repasted my ryzen 5600x with kingpin thermal interface material. Omg, the difference in temps of b4 and after are insane. I built my pc in sep 22. So it was definitely time. Added 3 more BeQuiet fans to front of the case. My sons pc is next. Both air cooled with BeQuiet tower coolers.
Pure rock lp is underrated. I use one in my htpc on a 12600kf with a lga1700 mounting frame and a 3D printed intake vent in my dan a4 h20. Can pull 126w load with two cores maxing out at 95 rest at 87-88. With system decibles only hitting a max of 40-44 db. I don’t recommend on AMD so much due to the orientation. The vents protrude sideways on AMD you cant make them face up like in a sandwich layout like on intel. Due to how am4/am5 has its mounting plate also how the mount is designed. Also I have seen some am5 backplates being incompatible due to the mount screw heads being to large they extend past the lip of the backplate. You can cut the corners of your back plate or get screws with small heads at a hardware store or the most expensive way get the grizzly slim am5 backplate. Its definitely a little beast cooler.
I'm so thankful that this is a easy fix on aio, I had this issue last year (not shorting though) cleaned block and replaced fluid down to icy temperature
Season 6 is here, yay! I only run air coolers (nice ones)----to me, AIO's just aren't worth the hassle. And totally agreed that the breaker tripping issue is not pc-related. Maybe he just has too many things plugged into one circuit?
Greg the fan did spin as you were taking to us. See time code 6:39 As far as the electrical breaker is concerned the breaker itself could have a GFI built into the breaker. If you see on the breaker a square you push to reset or test, that is it. My old house had one of these and it kept tripping every time I used outdoor equipment. (that was the breaker for outside outlet.) I ended up putting in a standard breaker and placed a GFI breaker outside in the electrical receptacle. Some GFI breaker trip if you look at them wrong. 🙂
I love these videos. Been watching since the first episode. Has given me so many tips and tricks that I didn't know in my many years of building and troubleshooting. So when I build my next pc I can implement alot of this stuff I learned.
This is why I just stick to custom loops, I cant deny the convenience of AIO's and custom loops aren't for everybody but you have so much more control, and if you do have a problem in a custom loop most of the time its actually repairable. Not for everybody though
2000 WAT is the limit on a domestic wall socket in Britain. The kitchen circuit is rated for a higher amp draw for things like cooker hobs, ovens, etc., running at the same time. There is a possible solution with the help of an electrician to have the wall socket next to the computer at the high amp capacity. Great fix video. Thanks.
I've always vacuumed my PCs and have been doing so for the last 28 years of making my own and never had a problem. Wasn't expecting a Big Bang Theory episode though. Nice one.
Re:Breaker...check what else is on that circuit...when temperatures drop at this time of year someone may have plugged in a heater (which by the way should never be plugged into an extension cord or power bar).
Yep, that's about right for the first gen H1... had the exact same issue, the pump died on the AIO in less than a year, and it was only cooling a 5600 non X. Well documented issue with his AIO, unfortunately every single one keeps failing. When I got my replacement (btw the NZXT customer service was excellent) I sold the case as I knew it would fail again within a year, and by that time it would be out of warranty.
Great video. Thermal throttling wouldn't trip the circuit breaker. The circuit breaker tripping could be many things. I would advise your brother to get an electrician to inspect the house wiring and the switchboard(s).
So from what I know about oil and water, water has a much faster heat transfer rate than oil does, meaning it can absorb heat faster. Can someone correct me if I’m wrong? Much love❤😂
There are many things to check, to confirm a power issue. Bad power bar, number of circuits on the breaker, voltage. It could be that one circuit is powering a few outlets and the extra power draw was enough to take it past max Watts. 15Amp circuit is good for aprox 1200 Watts.
8:20 You don't have to lose much or any fluid. Just mount the block upside down on a stand with the plate facing up and the rest of the loop lower. Gravity will keep the fluid in. Clean the fins and re-assemble.
Just bought my first home. First thing i did was hire an electrician to make a stand alone 40 amp dual socket circuit for my computer room so I know I can push my equipment on clean power since this house was built early 70s idk how great the wiring has held up. All I know is before the new circuit instal I would press my power button on one of my PCs and you could faintly see the lights in the room dim and come back real fast lol
Grounded and ESD ground are two different things buddy!! I used to install and test static workshops and clean rooms for British airways bk in the day. They are normally separate and should not join together. You should be on the same electrical level. Esd points on the bench we would install resistors in-line for dissipation, slow the static down. All the static earth would go to a separate earthing panel, mainly they would join in the sub station. ( not an electrician, used to do ESD, PAT Testing, inspection Testing and Emergency lights. Get a sparkie to ck the breaker, he can put a meter onto the circuit and put a load on it, see if the breaker has gone weak. x
Yes, I'm well aware of the difference. My brother was as well - we jokingly planned that line off-camera and laughed hysterically about it right after the cut.
Kyle is so cool, I have been using Tripp-Lite power conditioners with my systems for a long time maybe Kyle should consider hooking this system up to one of those (and the panel as well)
If you use a cheaper surge protector bar it can do this. Didn’t trip my breaker, but computer would shut off once it hit 150-200 watts from the wall. I used low settings to combat it until I realized it was the surge protector and was amazed that was it. Back when I had an old rx 580.
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After the oil comment, Greg showed great restraint by not revealing that his brother is adopted.
actually to be fair you can cool a pc using Oil, but thats an Extreme Overclocking thing using Mineral Oil ruclips.net/video/YT_fvSQsJ1Q/видео.html and its not in a loop, the entire PC is dipped in it, with insulation on certain more sensitive parts.
Mineral has about half (I don't want to find my CRC Handbook so I'm assuming from my olden days in school) but part of the whole calculation is also volume so in the case of embedding a whole system you get an order of magnitude more cooling volume. It would still be half as effective at best in the same volume loop.
Before and after
Cmon he doesnt have to be a genius - hes the good looking brother. PS some oils are used in data centers, it has a high themal conducivity
Put some motor oil in get some zero weight it will work. Mix oil and water you get milk.
I want a video series where Kyle talks about whatever pops into his head while Greg tries to work. 😁
shoutout to that poor CPU for surviving 6 months of torture lol
Oh, I know! People are talking about undervolting and PBO - but it's an ITX build with low air flow AND the CPU survived torture. Just running it normal is a gift!
Aaaand... way more risk of undervolting and/or overclocking causing stability issues after all that.
Watching these series from ep1 were 3000 series ryzen died most often I can say this one was an absolute trooper.
@@Stratos1988 yep, can confirn from my own experience. Have run into plenty of Ryzen 5 3600s that are just dead. Don't think I've run into a 2000 series chip dying yet though, pretty resiliant if anything.
"Mine plugs in. Doesn't run on batteries."
Greg:
Yeah, that and the fact that he kept trying after the second breaker trip. Not an electrician/electrical engineer. If a breaker goes twice, find and fix the fault.
@@kaseyboles30 could always set it up to Fail to Safe so when a fault is had you cant reset it till the fault is cleared......
@@drakeb6168 That's probably what should happen. Though if not required it'd be a cost they'd need a good fiscal reason to expend.
If he would've said "Doesn't run on Energizer batteries" you all may have lost it. 😂
i started to panic when he said that, was like: oh no
Hearing the brother describe electrical concepts like "static" and "grounded" gave me so much PTSD from my helpdesk days that I need to order Panda Express for old times sake.
Cmon he doesnt have to be a genius - hes the good looking brother.
Here Here. Suppose ill do the same. 8 years at the UPS help desk e.o
what's wrong with Static , maybe he meant static IP address and Grounded is when your parents prevent you from leaving the house.
What are you talking about!? Vacuums are great at producing high quantities of static pressure! Sheesh!
haha, reminds me of "the chronicles of george", at least he didn't use the word "havening"
9:25 Greg's brother jumps from AIO to NUCLEAR reactor . What a radical jump in analogy!! His brother is truly in COD Black ops mode . 😅
But he was wrong about the reasons. Water is a great neutron moderator.
@AthosRac ...aaaand water is a great coolant with its relatively high heat capacity + affordability/abundance 😂
Was a decent analogy tbh!
@@LastWizardKing needs fresh water not salt water
@Celician83 thank you. Nice to see someone jump it before me.
I enjoy your brother being live commentary on this too! Congrats on getting this season 6, Greg!
I had a similar issue where my breaker was being tripped randomly, and it was only when my pc was on, and it never did it before, after checking my pc, I was able to track the issue to the wiring of my house. Each room has its own circuit, but when they did my computer room, the circuit was also split to the basement to a single outlet for a freezer, and also to the bathroom for 1 light and the fan. I found if the light and fan were on, my pc and the ac, everything was good until the compressor kicks on from the freezer. That was enough to trip the breaker.
Your brother can just have an overloaded circuit and that little extra was enough to trip it.
Anyone spot the PSU Fan at 6:38
👍
yup
It's funny that a minute later he said the fan never kicked on
Yup
yup was just gonna say that it kicked on for but right back off
Damn, your bro is cool. It's cool that he's willing to listen and learn about what's going on, the reasoning behind it, and to be educated. When something breaks in my family, they don't listen because they don't care. As long as it's fixed, they're not interested
felt that
If that is one of the original NZXT H1's, you may want to make sure he got the revised PCI-E riser cables, they were prone to shorting out and even CATCHING FIRE 🔥!
Oh yeah GN made one go up in flames. I think i would have changed the entire case just because of that.
Oh Yes that is also my first thought if it wasn't shorting out and causing the it to do all this.
That was my first thought. Take everything out and see if it still causes the problem, because a short to ground is not only plausible, but likely in that case.
ngl this should be higher
It's kinda crazy he doesn't know it/mention it.
He should check to see what else is on the same circuit as the PC. I imagine that the circuit could already be overloaded since the breaker is a dumb device and should only trip if the rated current is exceeded. If a small spike from the PC were enough to trip it, it's already overloaded, unless the breaker is defective. Since it's not tripping a breaker at your house, it's clear that there's no electrical fault with the system causing the breaker to trip.
Right, which is exactly what we concluded at the end of this video. No tripping on my end, so the culprit is likely his breaker or wiring.
also could check that its breaker that tripped and not ground protection, also some extension cords have over voltage protection and the vacuum can make pretty good voltage at the plastic pipe when vacuuming
@@GregSalazar overloaded circuit. did he recently move? did he re-arrange his office/house? did a portable air conditioner/heater recently get used?
Confused in European... There's a limit?
@@Caderynwolf Of course there is a limit. Breakers have limits, wiring have limits. No matter if you are in US (110V) or Europe (220-230V), if you go over the rated amperage breaker will trip. It is designed for that purpose, so your wiring won't catch on fire when there is a short and amperage skyrockets. Or if you simply put too much devices on a single circuit and run them at the same time, it may also trip the breaker.
His PC knew what it was about to get into with BO6 the next day and said "Nah your fixing me before I go running that" 🤣
I love the Fix or Flop series. I've learnt so much. Thank you.
Thanks for a new fix or flop video. Always a treat.
Thanks for watching!
@@GregSalazarGreg, check if your bro's H1 doesn't need a recall. The early ones were shorting on the pcie riser and catching fire. Gamer's nexus had a few episodes about it. It could explain the breaker tripping too. ✌️
Ah, time to sit down, eat and watch the latest LTT Vide----FIX OR FLOP SEASON 6??? LETS GOOOO RIGHT ON TIME
LTT has gotten so stale over the last few years. It just feels so corporate and overproduced. Linus just shows up, clearly reads a script written by someone else, and just doesn't seem like any of himself is actually put into any of the videos, which is why most people started watching 10+ years ago.
LTT precision screwdriver made an appearance in this one
@@FlyinRyan2011 Such an overpriced screwdriver
@@spentcasing3990LTT sucks ass, but the screwdriver is well priced. It's been tested to death and compared to the competition. It's well priced
@@Ktmzqw It's $115 Cdn or $82.45 U.S. You can easily find a screwdriver or a whole set that's as good
My MSI 240 AIO did this after 3 months! MSI then refused to repair or replace my AIO! I no longer use any MSI products because of this.
Glad to see you are helping your brother out!
Yeah, I had 2 msi aios do this to me. One that was replaced then another I just said f it and bought an air cooler.
And this folks is why I'll avoid using AIO's as long as possible. I just don't want to deal with anything water related in my PC. Air coolers don't have this problem. Thanks for sharing :)
My theory is that AIOs were made with planned obsolescence...because even my Chinese custom loop (with a waterblock that costs $20) has not had any problem like this for 7 years
Behold everyone! Buff, long haired Greg! 1:26
kind of a wholesome episode, i enjoyed the sibling dynamic.
also, interesting choice of words when you said that the CPU was just chilling in the BIOS while it was physically overheating
His gamertag though, hilarious. Gave me a good laugh 🤣🤣
17:51 - If you have a 3D Printer, print an adapter from the NZXT fan to the Heatsink of the be quiet cooler
I was getting FoF withdrawals.
Thanks for a new episode.
If his house was built in 1999 or later and the PC is in a bedroom, he has a weak AFCI breaker (arc fault circuit interrupter). The National Electrical Code was updated in 1999 and requires all bedrooms to have these installed. The breakers get weak over time and trip.
I've seen this before and replaced several when someone simply tured a lamp on. They are designed to trip when an arc is detected.
Not to be confused with a GFCI (ground fault circuit interpreter) which detects a ground fault in wet areas.
Wow! Great comment! I have a computer on a circuit that occasionally trips the breaker. I have kids. Anything could happen on the shared circuit, so I didn't think a ton of it, but knowing older breakers can be an issue? Clutch! I already have a replacement ready! Thanks!
580 watts. Thats what my brand new 7900xtx pulled before my cables melted and the psu shut down without tripping my breaker. It pulled that for a month before crashing.
I had done all the proper ddu and driver installs, but something must have gone amiss. After a new ddu and driver install it ran normally.
I am so glad that my psu did it because i could have very easily had a fire while playing vr or if i left it running while not home.
12:02
Option A: "It look like salmon"
Option B: "It looks like _____"
i think he said semen
IDK Greg? I see these problems over and over with liquid coolers. Every PC I have ever built with liquid coolers. I always recommend air coolers from now on. The air coolers have improved a ton so that is how I go now! Great video!! Thank you for posting! P.S. Your bro looks exactly like your son!! The beat goes on!
I was yelling at my phone. Upgrade his cpu. Come on. Be a nice brother. Lol
Nah fr I when he said a 20.. that's all i needed to hear to think he needed an upgrade, even a 5600 would be a huge improvement
Just made my Wife and myself some lunch, sit down to eat it and first episode of Fix or Flop drops. Nice engaging content with a perfect run length, thanks Greg. Me personally I would have re-purposed the AIO fan as the case fan, but that's because I'm cheap.
Yo Greg! As mentioned on one of the previous video... Just holding down the button to enter the bios is enough and less of a hassle compared to spamming it.
I can't help myself 😂
No you dont understand, we MUST mash the button repeatedly, MUST
@@dexmat3964 Holding it down is a solution? As someone who is a IT field technician reflashing computers more times than I care to count in a week... HOLDING it down instead AND it working would be a GIFT! :D 😂😂😊😊
IT support for family - the legacy of a YT-er tech. :) Awesome to have your brother there too. Great content. This was always an awesome series.
12:04 It looks like WHAT dude
Also I appreciate you taking the time to explain why these use water, Greg. I come here for the hardware or build fuckups, and leave with a bit of extra knowledge about how these things work.
Hi Greg. Since Kyle is in your repair shop, you might have him do all the physical work under your supervision. Removing security screws is no big problem. I bought a box of security screw removal bits with a screwdriver from Harbor Freight. They work great for removal of battery pack security screws.
This is a good reason to use a good air cooler. No contaminated coolant.
Plus you don't have too worry about the pump dying. If the fan dies. You can still use the heatsink. The case fans will help the heatsink mostly. Should have a replacement on hand. Or take another case fan from somewhere inside the case and use that. If they are the same size. If not just use it as a temp with zip ties.
I'm glad you have a new season for this series.. I enjoy watching you troubleshoot these systems and the fact that you do it with no charge to the owner is awesome. (of course I wouldn't charge too if it were my sibling). I also enjoy trying to figure out what watch you are wearing. (Omega Speedmaster Racing)
Fan definitely spun briefly before you went into talking about the fan not spinning. 6:37
Hahah yeah it spun later on while remaining powered - and admittedly when I wasn't looking for it - but the fact that it never spun upon initial boot was weird. Almost every unit I've worked with spins upon initial boot.
These fix or flops are really invaluable for sharing troubleshooting experience.
19:04 Oh no, you're also getting the... unfortunate shapes on the fans as in the Bitwit video.
🎺 Auf der Heide blüht ein kleines Blümelein 🎺
Almost done watching season 5 of fix or flop this couldn't have come at a better time. :)
i actually just had to replace my coolermaster aio because it was preventing my PC from posting unless I pinched 1 of the tubes near the radiator, was the weirdest thing i've ever come across in a PC.. i am just glad for 3 things, 1. that it didn't leak anywhere in my system, 2 that it was repeatable and wouldn't let the PC boot, and 3 that it was my system and not someone elses.
Wooohooo, new season! I was just thinking yesterday that I missed FoF!
I believe his system would GREATLY benefit from a cpu upgrade in AM4 so he can utilize PBO with a -20 to -30 so he can have lower temps and have an overclock
Yeah, like a 5700x3d
true but be ware my pbo i had to set from -20 to -15 because of stability issues
so start low a build up my got unstable after 6 months
@@Mrwouter1231And that is exactly what happens with undervolts. As soon as local environmental conditions change and with the under-volt is too aggressive………the system crashes.
Yes, but he didn't check for a bios update, which may be required in order for a CPU upgrade swap to work correctly.
@@techluvin7691 I have some GPU's and just moving them to another system means they now need a different undervolt/overclock. Getting more for less means adding challenges.
AN AFCI (Arc Fault Circuit Interruptor) circuit breaker can be very sensitive. It will blow when it discovers dangers long before they do damage. It's why they are found in modern bedroom/living quarters. I've seen them trip when a person got a static shock on something on the circuit....
This is most likely the problem.
120mm aio's should have never existed, imo. Great video, Greg and good to see 'normal' programming has resumed.
Well i use an H50 since 2013.FX 8350 to R5 2600 then R5 3600 and now i use it to cool an undervolted R7 5700X3D.Put a second fan on it in a push-pull configuration,works like a charm
@@Vagelisc1It's still not worth the money. A good air cooler will match or outperform it for less money and last longer.
Yes 120mm AIOs are just a gimmick imo
I used a 120 Corsair AIO way back on my 3570k, that was a bad decision.
Unsure how good low profile aircoolers have become in recent years, but I would assume that they are better than a 120 AIO even in such a case.
Agreed. Unless it's going to be in ECO mode or undervolted just put a damn air cooler on it. Even in a SFF Noctua Coolers can do some serious heat dissipation. 😂 90s in the BIOS I knew it was fucked
In the UK, we have switched outlets, so when I vacuum my PC, I plug the power-cord in, keep the PSU & the outlet switched off & use the ground of the power cable to dissipate any static.
I am gonna make one more note, what you SHOULD HAVE done was, take the PC BACK to his house and confirm your findings before ruling out what you think the issue was. You have be a scientist with this kind of stuff and just taking a punch in the dark without start to finish, returning to the scene of the crime, you can't be sure that the CPU temps, or whatever, was the culprit. I'd personally like to see a follow up video showing the results of the PC working at his house back where it all started.
When I work on these systems for any other random viewer, that does NOT happen for obvious reasons. No special exceptions here. I can only test what I can see and we obviously never saw a breaker trip in my office. Implying we aren't being "scientific" because we didn't travel all the way back to his house, plug it in, and wait for however many hours until (or if) the system crashed is a bit outlandish. I fix PC issues. I don't fix house electrical wiring issues.
Greg has a studio to shoot videos in. His brother may not have a space that he's comfortable sharing.
You should check the PSU
@@GregSalazar exactly. Your viewer comment is unrealistic.
Good lookin' out for a bro! And great way to kick off season 6. 👊😎
Makes me feel happy I went with air instead of liquid/aio cooling. Nothing against it, but not worrying about this happening ever is just great for people like me that don't have the best of knowledge with computers
My favourite sit-down show while having a good meal.
Air Cooling saves the day yet again
till a new AIO upgrade.. lol
One time a co-worker and I were cutting out grout to replace a tile. I was using a shopvac to catch the grout as he was grinding it out. I was building so much static sucking up that grout that I was getting shocked THROUGH MY SHOES. We were both dying laughing as I jumped every 5 seconds. I never used a vacuum to clean electronics after that.
So this is why I just don't use AIOs at all. It just seems to be too much of a risk and hassle to remedy it.
Air cooling is fine, if you think about air flow and don't use overclocking or crazy power hungry cpus
great video greg, these are such interesting videos as someone who likes building computers, my favourite series lol
That vacuum static is no joke.
Just today I was making dust while drilling into concrete. I used a vacuum to suck up the mess as I ran the drill. All the while my ear would get zapped if I moved too close to the metal post I was bolting to the floor.
👂⚡
dust is electrically conductive
@gerydblackmore5484 so is my poor little left ear.
Glad to see the series back and it was an excellent episode, crazy we are still seeing AIO's have these issues, especially ones still relatively new.
Now just for clarification, when you showed the gunk build up to your brother he did say it looked like "salmon" didn't he and not a bodily fluid?.... 🤣
The accident in Chernobyl... water could have never prevented that accident from happening. The graphite moderators got stuck, and the fission reactions climbed exponentially. The water was flash-vaporized and the whole thing just exploded.
You're mistaken, RBMK reactors don't explode.
@@imglidinhereChernobyl exploded but not a nuclear explosion! Extremely high pressure steam, ejecting radioactively contaminated water / steam into the atmosphere that spread for 1000km
Yep, but they _did_ reduce the flow of coolant to the reactor core, no? And boiling water certainly doesn't help anything. This is all a bit beside the point, anyway. We use water in reactors for its abundance, heat capacity, etc.
@@GregSalazar I do recall hearing and reading about that, yes. Very poor decision-making on their part. I just hope incidents like that never happen again, because nuclear power generation is extremely useful.
@@57dent yea the test they were doing created very rare circumstances and when the graphite tipped rods were inserted to stop the reaction it did the opposite and created and endless reaction that instantly vaporised the water which created a stupid amount of pressure which exploded.
What else was running on the same circuit? 15A or 20A? Coffee machine or microwave maybe on the same circuit. Hairdryers are notorious for pulling a lot of current.
Looks like a perfect candidate for a Ryzen 5700X3D, new PSU and eventually a new GPU.
S6 of FoF already? Wohooo, i am looking forward to all of the videos that are comming :D
Everyone show some love and hit that subscribe button. We need to help Greg hit 1M subscribers and get that well deserved gold play button!
Much appreciated!
Connecting the vacuum to earth does not prevent static discharge, but connecting the metal pipe does. But that only works for the pipe. The plastic attachment will still collects charges. Dehumidified compressed air is just way safer.
Yeah, he was just trying to be funny in that moment hahah. I should have kept it in, but right after we cut away from that scene, we both started cracking up hysterically 😂
2700x? You don't love your brother enough to stick a 5600 x3d from microcenter in there lol
2700x seemed a low chip for RX6800
@@jamb312. Yep absolutely that is too much gpu unless running at 4K.
Good news is when he finally gets around to it its pretty cheap to upgrade. Even a $65 ryzen 5500 would be very noticeable
@@astanisystems I know some may be joking, but folks out there are seriously whining about the SSD upgrade and lack of a CPU upgrade... This isn't Upgrade or Flop. We fixed his system, gave him extra storage, and sent him on his way. Why are so many expecting handouts wherever they can justify them? Ruins the playlist.
Whether or not Greg pays for such upgrades for his family members is not something we can verify or need to know - he may well also do it, but regardless, at the very least by not making it a part of the video I think Greg is showing admirable restraint here by not succumbing to nepotism.
well, his brother looks like he can pay for his own stuff lol
6:00 it has not, in fact, been chillin
Great video. Having watched back issues of Flip or Flop there's no way I'd ever consider a liquid cooled CPU system.
Maybe arc-fault circuit (AFCI) probably tripping when the pump did a large current pull trying to push water but suffering way too much resistance. Arc-fault are way more sensitive than a standard older style breaker and only found in newer home constructions. High current spikes will trip them easily.
So moral of story - never buy an AIO?
120mm aios are a waste. An air cooler would be better.
*Great to see the series back!*
I just repasted my ryzen 5600x with kingpin thermal interface material. Omg, the difference in temps of b4 and after are insane. I built my pc in sep 22. So it was definitely time. Added 3 more BeQuiet fans to front of the case. My sons pc is next. Both air cooled with BeQuiet tower coolers.
Goodie, my favorite PC troubleshooting learning course is back.
Pure rock lp is underrated. I use one in my htpc on a 12600kf with a lga1700 mounting frame and a 3D printed intake vent in my dan a4 h20. Can pull 126w load with two cores maxing out at 95 rest at 87-88. With system decibles only hitting a max of 40-44 db. I don’t recommend on AMD so much due to the orientation. The vents protrude sideways on AMD you cant make them face up like in a sandwich layout like on intel. Due to how am4/am5 has its mounting plate also how the mount is designed. Also I have seen some am5 backplates being incompatible due to the mount screw heads being to large they extend past the lip of the backplate. You can cut the corners of your back plate or get screws with small heads at a hardware store or the most expensive way get the grizzly slim am5 backplate. Its definitely a little beast cooler.
I really hope you reach the 1 million sub mark!
Yayyyy Fix or Flop is back!
I'm so thankful that this is a easy fix on aio, I had this issue last year (not shorting though) cleaned block and replaced fluid down to icy temperature
Season 6 is here, yay! I only run air coolers (nice ones)----to me, AIO's just aren't worth the hassle. And totally agreed that the breaker tripping issue is not pc-related. Maybe he just has too many things plugged into one circuit?
Greg the fan did spin as you were taking to us. See time code 6:39 As far as the electrical breaker is concerned the breaker itself could have a GFI built into the breaker. If you see on the breaker a square you push to reset or test, that is it. My old house had one of these and it kept tripping every time I used outdoor equipment. (that was the breaker for outside outlet.) I ended up putting in a standard breaker and placed a GFI breaker outside in the electrical receptacle. Some GFI breaker trip if you look at them wrong. 🙂
I love these videos. Been watching since the first episode. Has given me so many tips and tricks that I didn't know in my many years of building and troubleshooting.
So when I build my next pc I can implement alot of this stuff I learned.
This is why I just stick to custom loops, I cant deny the convenience of AIO's and custom loops aren't for everybody but you have so much more control, and if you do have a problem in a custom loop most of the time its actually repairable. Not for everybody though
2000 WAT is the limit on a domestic wall socket in Britain. The kitchen circuit is rated for a higher amp draw for things like cooker hobs, ovens, etc., running at the same time. There is a possible solution with the help of an electrician to have the wall socket next to the computer at the high amp capacity. Great fix video. Thanks.
I've always vacuumed my PCs and have been doing so for the last 28 years of making my own and never had a problem. Wasn't expecting a Big Bang Theory episode though. Nice one.
Woo! Best series on a new season.
Hopefully the breaker issue is resolved as well. Follow up if it happens again?
Re:Breaker...check what else is on that circuit...when temperatures drop at this time of year someone may have plugged in a heater (which by the way should never be plugged into an extension cord or power bar).
Love the series! Cheers Greg
Yep, that's about right for the first gen H1... had the exact same issue, the pump died on the AIO in less than a year, and it was only cooling a 5600 non X. Well documented issue with his AIO, unfortunately every single one keeps failing. When I got my replacement (btw the NZXT customer service was excellent) I sold the case as I knew it would fail again within a year, and by that time it would be out of warranty.
Finally another fix or flop keep up the great videos I allways learn from them and allways find them very interesting
for the first few mins, im like whoa, buff version of Greg!
22:38 Likely the breaker is weak from age. Hire an electrician to replace the breaker.
Great video.
Thermal throttling wouldn't trip the circuit breaker.
The circuit breaker tripping could be many things.
I would advise your brother to get an electrician to inspect the house wiring and the switchboard(s).
so glad you are doing more of these
Great video to start with for season 6 of fix or flop.
So from what I know about oil and water, water has a much faster heat transfer rate than oil does, meaning it can absorb heat faster. Can someone correct me if I’m wrong? Much love❤😂
There are many things to check, to confirm a power issue. Bad power bar, number of circuits on the breaker, voltage. It could be that one circuit is powering a few outlets and the extra power draw was enough to take it past max Watts. 15Amp circuit is good for aprox 1200 Watts.
8:20 You don't have to lose much or any fluid. Just mount the block upside down on a stand with the plate facing up and the rest of the loop lower. Gravity will keep the fluid in. Clean the fins and re-assemble.
Love too see the new season of the best series :)
It would honestly be interesting to see you regenerate that AIO. Go for it man, it may even be a good tutorial for others
Just bought my first home. First thing i did was hire an electrician to make a stand alone 40 amp dual socket circuit for my computer room so I know I can push my equipment on clean power since this house was built early 70s idk how great the wiring has held up. All I know is before the new circuit instal I would press my power button on one of my PCs and you could faintly see the lights in the room dim and come back real fast lol
Grounded and ESD ground are two different things buddy!! I used to install and test static workshops and clean rooms for British airways bk in the day. They are normally separate and should not join together. You should be on the same electrical level. Esd points on the bench we would install resistors in-line for dissipation, slow the static down. All the static earth would go to a separate earthing panel, mainly they would join in the sub station. ( not an electrician, used to do ESD, PAT Testing, inspection Testing and Emergency lights. Get a sparkie to ck the breaker, he can put a meter onto the circuit and put a load on it, see if the breaker has gone weak. x
Yes, I'm well aware of the difference. My brother was as well - we jokingly planned that line off-camera and laughed hysterically about it right after the cut.
Kyle is so cool, I have been using Tripp-Lite power conditioners with my systems for a long time maybe Kyle should consider hooking this system up to one of those (and the panel as well)
Keep up the good work Greg
I love watching these kinds of troubleshooting videos. I'll give you a sub.
Keep doing vids like this !
I appreciate that! Check out the entire playlist if ya haven't already!
@@GregSalazar sure i'll do it later coz I'm at work haha
If you use a cheaper surge protector bar it can do this. Didn’t trip my breaker, but computer would shut off once it hit 150-200 watts from the wall. I used low settings to combat it until I realized it was the surge protector and was amazed that was it. Back when I had an old rx 580.
perfect timing! its lunch time for me at work!