@@justicetrufaux6722 um, no and neither has he unless he’s been to Jade Dragon in China which is the only ski resort over 15,000 feet IN THE WORLD. The peak elevation of Snowbird is 11K and he’s part way down Mineral Basin which means he’s nowhere near 15,000 feet. Oh, sorry. I thought we were having a contest to see who could out-nerd each other at this meeting of the Not-funny Diarrhea Club.
They were coming in trail formation. Hovering to blow away loose snow. rear bird drifts sideways dragging skid which hangs up turning bird over on it's side. Piece of main rotor strikes tail rotor of lead bird, crashing both from a low altitude. No serious injuries reported.
@@michaelyasso8654 The "leg's" that hang down under most small helicopters are called skid's. Oddly enough they have to be picked up onto some type of roller system to be pulled into and out of hangers.
Engines don't care about snow. When you get into a snowball, the pilot has no reference unless his Flight Engineer is on his belly giving drift references. Otherwise you will drift into a snow bank or another helicopter. We practice this often in the military to perfect a bad situation.
We went inadvertent IMC- happens all the time- dudes have been balling choppers since rotary wing flight began. I love Igor Skiorskys input- “too much up flow” No…it actually looked like settling with power. Ahhh the internet
This is exactly how the Iranian hostage rescue ended but with a helicopter pilot blinded by sand kicked up by the rotor wash flying his helicopter into an airplane and that was 42 years ago.
The Iranian rescue had sand as part of the blame, you had Army pilots trained on Night Vision Googles but not on Marine CH-53 aircraft and Marine pilots with no NVG time. Trying to mix crews was bad since the pilot had troubles in the desert environment with altitude and distance he was low time with NVG goggles or now NODs.
What people need to understand is how hard it is to see the ground during the day covered in snow with all that wash out happening, it's almost impossible!
@@noobdernoobder6707 They are most likely picking up the 10th mtn division from a training exercise. thats the only place the could pick them up. in that area.
I believe they train in dust or snowy environments to have a quick decent rate into the LZ to land quickly so you only lose visibility for second or two. I`m not saying there were landing. I have no idea what they were doing other than maybe making a snowstorm for the skiers.
Yes they do, but they are also much smaller helicopters, so the rotor wash is less significant with regards to whiteouts. Section brownout/whiteouts are a real thing, but they carry high risk with them. The key is to fly a profile that allows you to touch down simultaneously before exterior visual references disappear, and usually with enough offset to allow dash 2 to wave off unobstructed. I used to do them in the desert (read: flat terrain), but I don't think I'd ever attempt them onto a sloped LZ.
@@Odhege8262 What model helicopter are you referring to? I can only reference the 60, which I have first-hand experience with, and images and videos I've seen of helicopter skiing, which has always featured small helicopters. I'm not saying you're lying. Just saying I've never seen it. Helicopters are expensive, and large helicopters are VERY expensive. Usually too expensive for recreational operations.
@@Keifsanderson no clue. Check out Matchstick Productions (ski movie film company) or Chugach Powder Guides. Hell, look at the bird Red Bull runs just to give the mountain bikers a lift up during Rampage…Those are huge and very expensive. Thanks for letting me know that helicopters are expensive btw…🤦♂️
More training is not going to fix things. They need to learn what they are not supposed to be doing. Flying close in a white out condition. It's like people who drive fast in a snow blizzard condition. Do you think more training is going to solve it. Nope. People will continue to be pig-headed. I know what I'm doing. I'm a pilot. I've got xxxx amount of hours. Don't talk to me like that.
@@Мирвсем-н5х typo 2002, not a hard Google look up, nor necessary the bravado in text. But you can learn a lot of things from the Internet if you do your own research.
Looks to me like parts of a rotor can be seen flying out of the snow cloud just before the lead machine loses control, at about 41 seconds into the video. If you look quick, you can identify three different pieces.
The lead machine isn’t the one that crashed. The second choppers skids hung up tilting it forward. Then it’s rotors hit the snow slinging parts everywhere.
@@chrisemerson7743wrong. The first helicopter lost sight of the ground and crashed, pieces of blade hit second helicopter forcing it to land hard but without further damage
i ski mammoth all the time(live in bishop,cali)--the marines use mammoth as a training area for their mountain division --i love seeing those young people learning--the osprey helis land at bishop airport all the time,their base is out of Lee Vining-its fun to go over to them and chat when they take a break-those kids seem to give their all--most of never seen mountains like the sierra's before
@@lbco5229 i am 72--they are kids--my friend is retired ex drill sgt,marines(a woman)-my son ex spec forces,night stalkers--won't bore u with my back round or any other of my family history...again,they are kids
Whiteout/brownout/sea spray it's all the same. I've done many whiteouts, brownouts and water deployments in different helicopters. Scariest of all was repeated brownout 6 ship MH-53Js day and night ops with the Rangers at the Mount Site in Savanna. I could feel my heart rate increase and could actually feel it pounding in my chest from IP inbound, didn't help that we were shooting guns as well so you can't hear shit over the intercom. The Isreali pilot that rode with us for one day/night iteration called us "crazy" and "We'd never try that." We took it as a compliment. I actually flew an Isreali 53 in Isreal and they had me do their style of dustout landing. It's a testament to the US military that they do this kind of shit 24/7, 365 with rarely a bad outcome. I did some scary shit in my 40 years of helo and fixed wing flying. Hands down, nothing scarier than formation whiteout/dustout landings. Hope everyone is okay. I figured I would die one night doing formation flight, just one second of inattention by anyone and game over. Shit goes bad quick in a helicopter!!
Reminds me of a retired army/NG helicopter pilot I flew with several times. He was the weakest POS ever - transitioned to fixed-wing, almost flew four of us into a smoking hole one night because his head was always where the sun didn’t shine. Absolutely one of the two worst pilots I ever flew with in my 45-year career.
The one that crashed lost either the tail rotor or had a combination of whiteout and a mechanical failure before it hit. Might have also been a combination of snow on the intake and loss of power too. The altitude of the ski lift might also have had been a contributor. Mountain flying is very dangerous no matter how you shake it. The sheer number of holes in the swiss cheese when flying like this just grows exponentially. I'm sure there is a report that gives the actual reasons but this is what I saw.
You don’t hover like that. It’s a constant glide slope all the way to touchdown. And technique for dash two is to be on the ground before lead so you don’t eat their cloud. In this case, they should’ve gone around.
Not too much upflow it is called whiteout. Improper landing procedures by Blackhawk pilot while landing, if you lose sight with ground pull pitch and climb out of it.
Different Dude has his own gopro. He's voice activating it to start recording. Voice activated is easier to use when it's strapped to your head/chest and you can't easily remove it to turn it on.
It lost its perspective of the ground in the snow cloud it kicked out. I’ve seen this happen in deserts too where the kick up so much dust they lose site of the ground and hit it.
Why put yourself in zero visibility situation so close to people and the ground. I have a private helicopter license. This was a stupid an unnecessary risk.
What? Blackhawk’s have Inlet particle separators on their engines (IPS). In my 24 years of flying Blackhawks and other helicopters, I have never heard of an engine failure being caused by white out conditions. The pilots crashed because of white out conditions and losing sight of their intended landing point. When you white out you become disoriented and crash. They should have done a go around.
@@elvulch Ok, I didnt say it happened here, just saying it has happened. Where I live they had to ground the whole fleet of ambulance helicopters due to a screen that was clogging up in snow causing engine failure. One engine stopped mid air and the other stopped during the emergency landing. Wasnt black hawk though.
@@knut6532 What type of aircraft was that? I could agree with an engine failure due to FOD because the pilot didn’t do a good preflight and pull ice out of an inlet that wasn’t covered when parked, but in all my years of flying, I have never heard of an engine failure due to snow.
@@elvulch it was an airbus EC145. The latest model had an IBF (inlet barrier filter) installed that was suspected to clog up in freezing temperatures combined with snow or fog. Im not sure if they have concluded the investigation but that was the reasons for grounding that model, in freezing temperatures I might add.
@@knut6532 I’ve flown the ec130, 135, and 145. Aren’t the (now airbus) helicopters restricted from moderate icing conditions without engine inlet anti-ice? If an aircraft without windshield anti ice, pitot heat, and engine inlet anti ice are flying in those conditions, it is 100% the pilot’s fault if they crash.
legends say that guy is still trying to get his go pro to start recording
That dude probably never used a go pro again I hear to this day he just vlogs with his dash cam 😂
The mouth breather was so powerful, he blew the Choppa into the snow!
Ever been skiing at 15,000’?
@@justicetrufaux6722 ever hear a joke?
@@justicetrufaux6722 um, no and neither has he unless he’s been to Jade Dragon in China which is the only ski resort over 15,000 feet IN THE WORLD. The peak elevation of Snowbird is 11K and he’s part way down Mineral Basin which means he’s nowhere near 15,000 feet.
Oh, sorry. I thought we were having a contest to see who could out-nerd each other at this meeting of the Not-funny Diarrhea Club.
@@Donschmoodle I'll pick up that mic you just dropped.
It's called a whiteout. Blinded by their own rotor wash, should have immediately climbed out of the blowing snow.
glad I wasn't the only one thinking that, literally could've prevented both from crashing
well, that blows
White out is well understood phenomenon among helo pilots, I can’t imagine what they’re were thinking
He was either trying to turn around or his tail rotor hit something it looks like.
It was an exercise, guess he failed.
They were coming in trail formation. Hovering to blow away loose snow. rear bird drifts sideways dragging skid which hangs up turning bird over on it's side. Piece of main rotor strikes tail rotor of lead bird, crashing both from a low altitude. No serious injuries reported.
I thought the front chopper clipped those trees and crashed. Thanks for the update
Skid?
But why? Seems pilot error and a future ex army helicopter pilot.
@@michaelyasso8654 The "leg's" that hang down under most small helicopters are called skid's. Oddly enough they have to be picked up onto some type of roller system to be pulled into and out of hangers.
@@bigchuckyinkentucky6267 no skids on a Blackhawk 🤦🏻♂️
Crash Mountain Division.
Don't let your engines eat snow.
BTW, kudos for steady recording and use of landscape mode.
Engines don't care about snow. When you get into a snowball, the pilot has no reference unless his Flight Engineer is on his belly giving drift references. Otherwise you will drift into a snow bank or another helicopter. We practice this often in the military to perfect a bad situation.
Can't you rely on your instruments?
@@charmio Instruments can't show drift. That's the pilots' job.
We went inadvertent IMC- happens all the time- dudes have been balling choppers since rotary wing flight began. I love Igor Skiorskys input- “too much up flow”
No…it actually looked like settling with power. Ahhh the internet
Instruments can show drift. What?
Who would have thought blowing the snow with the rotor wash would cause a whiteout? The lights are on but no ones home.
This person got an amazing video!!
Yes! And in landscape mode!
He was like 3ft from the ground. So amazing. NOT. 😆. Very disappointing.
@@miketheyunggod2534 uhhh...what? 🤣🤣
@@sludge801beats I too am confused by MikeTheDumbGods comment
Didn't go to help though ?
This is exactly how the Iranian hostage rescue ended but with a helicopter pilot blinded by sand kicked up by the rotor wash flying his helicopter into an airplane and that was 42 years ago.
I remember that.
Then they obviously learned nothing from that experience
@@errorsofmodernism7331 With today's woke leadership, are you surprised? They probably don't even know about the incident.
The Iranian rescue had sand as part of the blame, you had Army pilots trained on Night Vision Googles but not on Marine CH-53 aircraft and Marine pilots with no NVG time. Trying to mix crews was bad since the pilot had troubles in the desert environment with altitude and distance he was low time with NVG goggles or now NODs.
@@errorsofmodernism7331 160th SOAR was established because of it. They're specially trained for all kinds of special operations, e.g. Osama mission.
Go pro, start recording!
Go pro: naw, I’m good dawg. Just gonna sit this one out.
Sweet new terrain park features
Thank God no injuries!
Thanks for posting the comment.👏
@@ZoofactoryHow do you know he knew there were no injuries ?
After crashing the aircrew members go over extensive physicals and on of them had unknown cancer and it probably saved her life
@@winniethebubbly Blimey, that was a stroke of luck wasn't it ?
What people need to understand is how hard it is to see the ground during the day covered in snow with all that wash out happening, it's almost impossible!
What i dont understand is why they even do such a dangerous maneuver without obvious reason near a public skiing area.
@@noobdernoobder6707 They are most likely picking up the 10th mtn division from a training exercise. thats the only place the could pick them up. in that area.
I mean... heliski pilots do it all day every day
I believe they train in dust or snowy environments to have a quick decent rate into the LZ to land quickly so you only lose visibility for second or two. I`m not saying there were landing. I have no idea what they were doing other than maybe making a snowstorm for the skiers.
Heli-ski operations land in snow all the time. But not two at the same time ... PS thanks for sharing, great video!
Yes they do, but they are also much smaller helicopters, so the rotor wash is less significant with regards to whiteouts. Section brownout/whiteouts are a real thing, but they carry high risk with them. The key is to fly a profile that allows you to touch down simultaneously before exterior visual references disappear, and usually with enough offset to allow dash 2 to wave off unobstructed. I used to do them in the desert (read: flat terrain), but I don't think I'd ever attempt them onto a sloped LZ.
@@Keifsanderson Thanks!
@@Keifsandersonya right. Those helis in AK are massive. Not a Blackhawk, but not a whole lot smaller
@@Odhege8262 What model helicopter are you referring to? I can only reference the 60, which I have first-hand experience with, and images and videos I've seen of helicopter skiing, which has always featured small helicopters.
I'm not saying you're lying. Just saying I've never seen it. Helicopters are expensive, and large helicopters are VERY expensive. Usually too expensive for recreational operations.
@@Keifsanderson no clue. Check out Matchstick Productions (ski movie film company) or Chugach Powder Guides. Hell, look at the bird Red Bull runs just to give the mountain bikers a lift up during Rampage…Those are huge and very expensive. Thanks for letting me know that helicopters are expensive btw…🤦♂️
Thank you for landscape mode
Average cost: 5-10 million dollars per bird
Watching 20 million go up in smoke on a powder day. Priceless.
Over 50% of the USA's Discretionary Budget goes to the Pentagon, to the tune of almost $1 TRILLION each and every year.
@@id10t98 keeping Israel safe isn’t cheap.
That's ok. The Taliban will give them a good deal on some slightly used ones, as they got them for free.
Thanks trump!
Some of the stuff can probibly be salvaged for replacement parts.
pilots need more training for brown/white out conditions. way too close to each other. lucky that there were no injuries. smh
Yep, I have no clue why number 2 would fly right behind lead like that. Recipe for disaster
They train for simultaneous insertions onto a high altitude LZ with poor visibility. It's good they do this training. Hope all are OK.
@@geofffleming12 I know they do but as soon as #2 lost sight of the lead ship it should've stopped moving forward.
From this distance we don’t really know how close they were to one another. We don’t know if they were at the same heighth either.
More training is not going to fix things. They need to learn what they are not supposed to be doing. Flying close in a white out condition.
It's like people who drive fast in a snow blizzard condition. Do you think more training is going to solve it. Nope. People will continue to be pig-headed. I know what I'm doing. I'm a pilot. I've got xxxx amount of hours. Don't talk to me like that.
what a dumb pilot. unbelievable.
Helicopter helicopter...
Hoping for the best outcomes for all.... 🙏😬😪
What crash. Big difference between a crash and a emergency landing. He put the bird on the deck, no bid deal.
If you loose closely, he hit the ground lost a blade, it goes flying. He cannot see clear landing.
The H60 black hawk is not a high altitude helicopter and should never be used in mountain rescue, thought we learned that lesson in may2092 mt hood.
2092 !!!!!??????😮
@@Мирвсем-н5х typo 2002, not a hard Google look up, nor necessary the bravado in text. But you can learn a lot of things from the Internet if you do your own research.
Great catch. 👍👍
For anyone curious, the news report I found said that both Blackhawks crashed, but that there were no injuries and there wasn't even a fuel leak.
LTE in the thin air? Looked like a super quick yaw at the last moment there....
Thats about 1.2 km away according to the sound delay... Thank you metric system for making things so easy!
Looks to me like parts of a rotor can be seen flying out of the snow cloud just before the lead machine loses control, at about 41 seconds into the video. If you look quick, you can identify three different pieces.
The lead machine isn’t the one that crashed. The second choppers skids hung up tilting it forward. Then it’s rotors hit the snow slinging parts everywhere.
@@chrisemerson7743wrong. The first helicopter lost sight of the ground and crashed, pieces of blade hit second helicopter forcing it to land hard but without further damage
@@valerierodger your right, I don't know wtf I was thinking!
Well if you French fry when youre supposed to pizza, you're gonna have a bad time
License to fly helicopters doesn't mean a thing.
That's alright just call up Shabeeb over in Kabul he'll cut you a screaming deal.
I have to wonder why they were that low in a ski area. All those people around could have led to very different results. Crazy.
Maybe trying to clear the snow
i ski mammoth all the time(live in bishop,cali)--the marines use mammoth as a training area for their mountain division --i love seeing those young people learning--the osprey helis land at bishop airport all the time,their base is out of Lee Vining-its fun to go over to them and chat when they take a break-those kids seem to give their all--most of never seen mountains like the sierra's before
@@dethray1000 probably cause there ain’t many like the sierras!
@@dethray1000They’re not ‘kids.’ They’re Soldiers, they’re Marines … they’re MEN (and some women too!).
@@lbco5229 i am 72--they are kids--my friend is retired ex drill sgt,marines(a woman)-my son ex spec forces,night stalkers--won't bore u with my back round or any other of my family history...again,they are kids
"Charlie ! Ici Tango ! Une tempête de neige c'est soudainement levée ! "🙄
Where?
Whiteout/brownout/sea spray it's all the same. I've done many whiteouts, brownouts and water deployments in different helicopters. Scariest of all was repeated brownout 6 ship MH-53Js day and night ops with the Rangers at the Mount Site in Savanna. I could feel my heart rate increase and could actually feel it pounding in my chest from IP inbound, didn't help that we were shooting guns as well so you can't hear shit over the intercom. The Isreali pilot that rode with us for one day/night iteration called us "crazy" and "We'd never try that." We took it as a compliment. I actually flew an Isreali 53 in Isreal and they had me do their style of dustout landing. It's a testament to the US military that they do this kind of shit 24/7, 365 with rarely a bad outcome. I did some scary shit in my 40 years of helo and fixed wing flying. Hands down, nothing scarier than formation whiteout/dustout landings. Hope everyone is okay. I figured I would die one night doing formation flight, just one second of inattention by anyone and game over. Shit goes bad quick in a helicopter!!
Reminds me of a retired army/NG helicopter pilot I flew with several times. He was the weakest POS ever - transitioned to fixed-wing, almost flew four of us into a smoking hole one night because his head was always where the sun didn’t shine. Absolutely one of the two worst pilots I ever flew with in my 45-year career.
Expected the heavy breather to interject, “What are you wearing?” At some point.
Did they live?
Theyd id until hey got back to base and their commanding officer killed them /sarc
We've got a black hawk down... I repeat we've got a black hawk down
10th Mountain is in Ft. Drum New York
wtf were they doing there in the first place ?
Flight training obv
@@SCPMusics training over a ski resort. must be one of those dei ideas
Rookie mistake. Getting caught in a whiteout and losing visual reference while hovering above ground.
The nose is for breathing. The mouth is for eating.
What the hell did they think was going to happen. The new woke military in action.
Not to self
Helicopters need to draw in air for the engine, the intake can become clogged with snow !😳
searched the helicopter song and this showed up
where is that mountain, nice view
Ohh look, 2 indistinct dots. Why the hell did you zoom out?
The one that crashed lost either the tail rotor or had a combination of whiteout and a mechanical failure before it hit. Might have also been a combination of snow on the intake and loss of power too. The altitude of the ski lift might also have had been a contributor. Mountain flying is very dangerous no matter how you shake it. The sheer number of holes in the swiss cheese when flying like this just grows exponentially. I'm sure there is a report that gives the actual reasons but this is what I saw.
Did anyone else see "ABC Utah", "Blackhawk", "crash", and immediately check on HeavyD?
Gosh darn upflow
That makes totally sense to stop recording after the cloud of snow cleared again 👏
You don’t hover like that. It’s a constant glide slope all the way to touchdown. And technique for dash two is to be on the ground before lead so you don’t eat their cloud. In this case, they should’ve gone around.
Wow a beautiful crash and a beautiful thud sound as encore. That gives me an inspiration as I'm having trouble composing a new tune. Thanks
Seems to me a little common sense and this accident could have been avoided.
Not too much upflow it is called whiteout. Improper landing procedures by Blackhawk pilot while landing, if you lose sight with ground pull pitch and climb out of it.
I heard that hit. Hope they are ok.
what game?
DCS
The pilot's were just playing in the snow.
I love the comments. So many experts. Ever heard of an envelope? Lol.
Something is not right here.
Accident happen but thank God no injuries
Chopper dudes shoulda been like, "Helicopter, avoid crashing."
My Staff Sergeants biggest fear.. getting in a helicopter. Had to bail out of two, he said.
Sounds like his biggest fear should be getting out of a helicopter.
IS HE SAYING STOP OR START RECORDING ?
Different Dude has his own gopro. He's voice activating it to start recording. Voice activated is easier to use when it's strapped to your head/chest and you can't easily remove it to turn it on.
Were they trying to Create an Avalanche?
One less loud AF helicopter.
That was crazy!!!!
It lost its perspective of the ground in the snow cloud it kicked out. I’ve seen this happen in deserts too where the kick up so much dust they lose site of the ground and hit it.
Could not see anything?
Was I the only person screaming at my phone when the camera guy zoomed out just before the the crash happened WTF
Nope
I'm just hear to read all the comments from armchair pilots and "experts"
Why put yourself in zero visibility situation so close to people and the ground. I have a private helicopter license. This was a stupid an unnecessary risk.
Bad day at the office.
Some helicopters have filters/mesh on their engine air intake. Known to clog up in heavy snow and cause engine failure.
What? Blackhawk’s have Inlet particle separators on their engines (IPS). In my 24 years of flying Blackhawks and other helicopters, I have never heard of an engine failure being caused by white out conditions. The pilots crashed because of white out conditions and losing sight of their intended landing point. When you white out you become disoriented and crash. They should have done a go around.
@@elvulch Ok, I didnt say it happened here, just saying it has happened. Where I live they had to ground the whole fleet of ambulance helicopters due to a screen that was clogging up in snow causing engine failure. One engine stopped mid air and the other stopped during the emergency landing. Wasnt black hawk though.
@@knut6532 What type of aircraft was that? I could agree with an engine failure due to FOD because the pilot didn’t do a good preflight and pull ice out of an inlet that wasn’t covered when parked, but in all my years of flying, I have never heard of an engine failure due to snow.
@@elvulch it was an airbus EC145. The latest model had an IBF (inlet barrier filter) installed that was suspected to clog up in freezing temperatures combined with snow or fog. Im not sure if they have concluded the investigation but that was the reasons for grounding that model, in freezing temperatures I might add.
@@knut6532 I’ve flown the ec130, 135, and 145. Aren’t the (now airbus) helicopters restricted from moderate icing conditions without engine inlet anti-ice? If an aircraft without windshield anti ice, pitot heat, and engine inlet anti ice are flying in those conditions, it is 100% the pilot’s fault if they crash.
No one was hurt. You can see the debris fly well before the sound of the crash.
Call 911? 🤦♂️
Look at all those ants!
Internal combustion engine need oxygen. Maybe the snow kicked up deprived the engine of oxygen?
least these birds arent that expensive to fix...prolly only a $10M touch eh
Beautiful picture. I’m getting my brushes and watercolors ready!
I never knew blowing snow drew so many gnats!
Hey cleetus, that der the tanth mountain devisionnn
Thanks Boebert!
Typical Gopro performance, surprised it worked on that cold weather.
Those pilots were idiots, blowing the snow about and worst of all was putting skiers in danger.
the mouth breather was all over it.
They created avalanche.
Terrain! Terrain! Terrain!...
Those homers just blew around a 100 Mil of my tax dollars.....what a joke.
Drop in the bucket compared to the 500bil we left in Afghanistan.
We can do this, we’re the guard , ooh rah.
Crash-
Careers ended on that move.
Click bait.
I certainly saw no crash
On/Off button is all you need.
First thought when i saw black hawk and utah i was it wasnt dave sparks and cleetus!!
Spacial awareness !
This was a white-out condition. It's like flying in a snow globe. Zero reference to the outside world.
Too much "upflow",? Not enough downflow.
What a waste of money and potential lives.....
2 Helis in a Whiteblow is not a good Idea.
for most of the video I kept wondering if there are two helicopters or just one with a shadow from the sun
Did they live?