Betrayer - Guilliman confronts Angron || Voice Over
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
- Another Guilliman piece. What can I say, GW keeps giving him fantastic scenes!
This is often one that is seen as a fantastic retort by Guilliman but I do almost believe Angron has more of a point here out of the two.
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Warhammer 40k belongs to Games Workshop, Betrayer is by Aaron Dembski Brown
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Thank you for watching!
It has been longer than I wanted but, here it is! Hopefully I actually have a few more to edit and upload now and I can get back on some sort of schedule. My thanks for your patience!
I tend to see this scene quoted a lot in regards to Guilliman and and amazing 40k insults and it is a solid retort but I do tend to think Angron has a point here. His actions might not show it quite as well but he isn't wrong!
I was also going for a sort of in-between of a Demon and 'Human' Angron voice to show his switching allegiance but I think I leaned a little further into Demon than I would like. Hopefully I can polish it going forward with any other Angron excerpts.
If you enjoyed it please do the usual, like comment and subscribe!
My thanks for watching!
Both brothers raised good points. Guilliman definitely had probably the easiest and best childhood amongst all primarchs, while Angron one of the worst. Guillimans idea of courage and honour come from a point of privilege and pompous confidence nearing arrogance, while Angron had to fight for his life since he came out of his capsule. However, Angrons inability to look forward (in great part because of the nails and because of the Emperor) instead of backwards made him a slave to his own mind, unable to rise from his tragedy.
In conclusion, fuck Erebus.
I take Angrons side on this debate. Yes, while Guilliman was right about Angron being stuck in the past, Guilliman has no place to lecture Angron at all. So yes, fuck Erebus
Yeah it's all erebus fault
I mean telling someone to just get over the past is like telling an amputee to just get over there disability. Even if they try good luck trying to have a normal life with a missing arm or leg. Cause every moment is going to be a constant reminder of what you lost. You cant just "look forward and leave the past" also by blue berries own logic he should just stop hating his traitor brothers and just look ahead
Guilliman’s idea of honor and glory come’s from his actions and what benefit it brings to the imperium and mankind as a whole. While Angron’s comes from mindless butchery of those he sees unfit.
Guilliman seeks to further humanity to the path of greatness. And his abilities speak for themselves. He is not “arrogant” or “pompous”(he is pompous as in “solemn/noble”
“ which is a positive thing)… nor is he “privileged”.
If anything Angron is the pompous and privileged one. Since he met the emperor, Angron has only cared about himself and what he wants. His self importance knows no bounds.
While every other primearch was looked up to as a leader and a commander, ONLY Angron got to sit and do nothing of the sort. He butchered his sons for no reason and he wallowed in his despair his entire life. A pathetic excuse of a primearch.
There’s only so much sympathy and understanding he can be given… but no. He was afforded centuries of doing whatever the fuck he wanted, while every other primearch actually did something.
@@badassgibusdifference being, the future blue boy wants is without chaos. And his brothers are an obstacle in that. Furthermore, he doesn’t hate them… he got over that. Now he just laments the situation.
Yet, after all the losses and hardship he has suffered… unlike Angron, he moves forward. He does all he can to further the interest of mankind and the imperium.
Most of his loyal brothers chased down their own vandetas. He was the only one to stay level headed and salvage the situation.
He lost far more then Angron… afterall, Angron really didn’t care about anyone other then his band of slaves.
"Which one of us had to rise up against kingdom with nothing more than horde of starving slaves?"
"Corvus, for example. Sounds like skill issue"
"and mortarion too. and he had to breathe fart smells while he did it. and conrad had actually zero help at all in conquering his homeworld, not even starving slaves. while being arguably more damaged psychologically than you were when you fought your masters."
Corvus had thermonuclear bombs
Angron had gladiator weapons
@@gokuuzumaki70 yeah, slaves are knows for having those is their pockets. Corvus managed to rally them to take some ground and used nukes so his people would't die, something Angron couldn't do
@@feris2137 Corvus has bullshit shadow meld powers Angron was an empath with half of his brain removed. Your argument still sucks ass.
Angron has always had the cruellelst handicap of being partially lobotomized with a torture stick in his brain. He has none of the wit and charisma other primarchs possess. Angron is the least capable primarch because of this. He is as powerful as one, but primarchs are more than that. Angron is playing a shooter but his mouse is broken, essentially.
I like seeing both sides, and although I heavily sympathize with Angron, becoming traitor was NOT the only choice and certainly not the best.
Despite everything that happens however, his confrontation with Sanguinius at the Eternity Gate emphasizes that he knew, to some extent, that his choice was the worst one.
i mean, becoming a traitor was probably the only viable option for someone like angron, but why the fuck did he then align himself with the only option out there that is somehow worse than the imperium?
like, its true that the imperium is a slave state, the emperor is the ultimate tyrant and angron had probably the rightest reasons to rebel, but to then go onto the same side as horus and to fight a war at the side of lorgar of all the people he could choose from can only be the result of a truly damaged brain.
Imagine if it would have been Corvus who confronted Angron. While everyone looks at Corvus and says Konrad is his dark reflection I would say Angron fits that role just as well if not better.
This is one of those moments that has me on the fence on who to support and you executed this marvelously!
Thank you very much! I always like seeing more of the good reasonings from the traitors in the heresy. Making that decision as tough and grey as possible is fantastic!
and, my thanks for watching once again!
Yes this is one of my favorite moments in the lore. It shows that angron has real, genuine, cause to hate the emperor and the imperium. That he's not just a raging berserker
Big blue didn't go through half as much angron did so early in life, the eldar attack, getting enslaved, the butcher's nails, then forced to be taken away from your people.
Great video. Can you please make a video about Guilliman's mother? I know there are some conversations between Guilliman and his mom. I would love to hear their voice over 👀
I agree. I’d love to hear a rendition of one of Roboute and Tarasha’s conversations.
This is a great idea! I had some ideas for videos she would be in but I shall certainly add some more where she is more prominent as I do love those excerpts!
My thanks for watching!
Anagron is like Konrad a handcuffed monster to the hatred and excuse to fight against Big E rather then move on they had a bad past but going down the path of chaos caused more pain and violence upon them
It’s hard to really weigh in on this debate because we’re dealing with super humans but let’s take a moment to consider some factors.
For one Angron should have been killed the moment he was rediscovered. His existence was nothing but unnecessary suffering and risk but the Emperor decided otherwise. Angron was grown in a society were it was nothing but killed or be killed and even then he managed to organize a revolt that ultimately was futile, he chose to die with those slaves in what I view as the ultimate display of his humanity. However when the emperor “saved” Angron, the primarch was unable to superimpose the humanity he felt for the slaves he fought for onto the people of the imperium and his sons. Leaving more reminiscent of a solider who lost his platoon.
Guilliman was raised in what was waring nations by one of the leading executives of a Republic who instilled the concept of building institutions and respecting them above our own personal selfishness. It made Guilliman into the ultimate leader, someone who builds to see those who will be safe in its walls not for the vanity of its creation. But when he was given the Ultimate test he chose the institution over his personal feelings when his father was murdered which created a primarch with the most grounded understanding of his role only rivaled by Rogal and whose humanity was rivaled to even vulkans.
To me this makes there conversation mostly pointless. Guilliman is 100% right when he says Angron is too spiteful to prosper/rise and extend his humanity to the rest of regular people of the imperium and his sons, but at the same time this argument only has weight maybe during the first 10 years of his rejoining of the imperium, at this point Angron is no longer contemplating how he feels or how right he is, he is entrenched in his way of thinking and anything at this point is going to just sound pompous coming from Guilliman.
Excellent work as always! Flipping between colours and logos for the two was interesting, it might just be me but it felt like the timing was a bit off in places? The vocal work was just as outstanding as always though.
That is certainly rather possible aha, I like adding the extra little visuals when I feel it would match but I have been a little rushed as of late when editing.
My thanks still, for the watch and the comment!
I pity Angron. I pity all brothers who fell to the Ruinous Powers. They ought to have remained together against the evils of the universe.
And while Angron truly raised some very good points, Guilliman was right at the end about him.
While it will never happen for reasons, I would love to see all fallen sons be redeemed in some way or form.
Love every single one of your vids!
Thank you very much! That means a lot!
Ngl angron kinda had a point here, it’s really easy for guilliman to sit there and act all high and mighty when he has absolutely no idea what it’s like to grow up in the situation angron did.
Edit: I wasn’t comparing the two or saying which was better, I was saying the principle behind guillimans argument was narrow minded, just dismissing everything angron went through was a bit odd coming from a character who I consider to be one of if not the most rational and intelligent primarchs.
True, but its also true that Angron is a slave to his anger.
Is it better to be a prisoner of regret and what had already happened or is it better to move on and die a honorable death vs Chaos
He really didn’t… his shit life as a child is no excuse to be a brain dead berserk his whole life. He had 100-200 years to get over his past. He didn’t manage to do so… issue wasn’t his shitty life… Issue was him.
Guilliman was righteous and honorable to most people that knew of him. Same can not be said for Angron. Those who knew of him saw him as nothing but a mindless butcher or a tool. Any semblance of reputation he had was from the fact that he was a primearch… through glories and honors won by his brothers he was held in a higher regard then he should have ever been.
To quote Kratos "be better".
@@Channel-23sdie
Angron says that Guilliman and his sons know nothing of courage or honor when they're literally doing the exact things he's claiming only HE has done. I remember one of the Ultramarines, Orfeo I think was literally surrounded by Kharn, Argel Tal and their buddies and he was ready to take them all on even though his company was dying around him.
It's not about where you came from but where you choose to go after.
Angron's justification, while understandable, still isn't justifiable.
He is essentially saying, because, through really no fault of anybody of relevance involved, he ended up having a harsh "growing up environment", whereas Guilliman, ended up luckier, and landed on a more welcoming and hospitable planet/system, then that justifies Angron essentially destroying billions of lives, destroying the imperium, and betraying those he had sworn and chosen to protect and fight for.
it is essentially the same, to some degree, as a person who was born and raised in a bad family environment, with bad parents, and justifying them for ending up becoming a serial killer or something along those lines. Sure you understand how it can happen, but it still isn't the right decision to make (unless you actually do truly hate the imperium).
Please do full audiobooks. I am sure GW would be looking for such great talent
I would love to for sure! Perhaps in the future I can delve more into audio books.
My thanks for watching!
@@danielquintonvoI second this. Very immersive voice-overs.
Angron’s capsule landing in one of the worst places is no excuse to destroy imperium and endangering trillions.
Sure Robute got lucky at landing but that doesn’t make him wrong.
Angron stans are crazy.
People seem to forget angron was once even with the nails in his brain a man of , honor, courage, and respect, but he was never loyal to the Emperor not after what he did, ripping the man away from his family his brothers and sisters as they got overwhelmed with the seven army's of his home world , that was mistake number one on making him not a loyal warrior, number two was forcing him a man of honor who fought warriors with only a Crude weapon to kneel to him( the emperor) spitting on his honor angron the world eater was never loyal because the emperor killed the man he once was a kind man who fed his army of slaves his own blood from his gains and would die with them but the emperor broke that vow broke him
Having a shitty childhood doesn't give you the right to be an asshole. Hitler and Stalin had a rough childhood, yet it's no excuse for what they did. Angron did the same thing, only on countless more planets
Guilliman calls Angron Childish. Angron responds by lashing out at Guilliman for a bunch of stuff that happened centuries ago that Guilliman had no control over. I’m not surprised that Angron thought he was being clever here, given that his brain was chopped into bits. I AM surprised that anyone with a functioning, non-mutiliated brain could think this was anything other than a childish temper tantrum.
The emperor was a hypocritical tyrant who let an army of slaves die to slave owning overlords.
He then ordered all of his forces to massacre entire civilisations and conscript millions upon millions of people into a life of slaves as soldiers.
A childish temper tantrum? Your morality is fcked beyond belief if you think none of these reasons is a good one to revolt.
The irony is that gilly is also a slave. A slave to the ideals of the future and unable to see in the moment. It was his slavery to the future that made him bring pointless mass destruction to the imperium with his beloved codex that crippled its main means of protection, all for a "future". which wasnt even a guarantee. If he had had been blinded by his future ideals the imperium would be prospering rather than crumbling and he is still to blind to change. Just look at how he took on fulgrim then mortarian
to be fair breaking up the legions was the smartest thing to do, without the Primarchs the legions would have been far more susceptible to corruption (as we've seen with entire Chapters going renegade) now imagine what would happen once ALL the Primarchs were gone and the Legions were still around, all it would take is one Legion Master getting corrupted to start another Heresy
A leaderless imperium the codex did its good they remain standing for 10k years imagine full legions becoming corrupted post heresy era
@@nicholasbrown668they became corrupt due to not having proper history and pointless struggle for being under powered
You are a slave to your own idea.
Clapped
Guilliman lost his adopted father when the co-consul Gallan launched a revolt that would oppressed the common people and ensure the rich would hoard the wealth. Guilliman had to fight to put the revolt down. Guilliman might have been raised with a silver spoon but he's adopted father installed him with values and responsibility. Angron while his enslavement in Nuceria is understandable doesn't excuse for claiming Guilliman had an easy life.
Guilliman has the "It didn't happen to me so it's irrelevant" mentality.
Hmm...
Angron got a point
Excellent
My thanks!
This sounds like Angron in Demon form, Didnt Guilliman crush one of the skulls that fell from Angron bandloeer ?
This occurs prior to Angron's transformation. Guilliman steps on one of the skulls and Angron goes berserk and nearly kills him. I forget how Guilliman survives; most likely saved by his marines.
mhm, I attempted to do a sort of thematic 'middle ground' with the voice to show his switching allegiance and temptation by Lorgar and Chaos but I think I went a little far with it.
Still, my thanks for watching!
@danielquintonvo question when are you going back to vampire masquerade I know you took small break but I know you want to comeback do you have estimated date or time that you think you going to make more video on vampire masquerade?
All the primarchs were born to be tools. Not too many stayed that way even when the truth came to them.
Even the Emperor himself is a tool, in the Jaghatai novel there is a discussion between Jaghatai and Malcador where Malcador says "We are all Instruments" to which Jaghatai says "Except for Him" but Malcador says "Oh no, very much Him".
The Emperor has sacrificed everything in order to be an instrument of our species.
It's not a surprise some of Roboute's brothers disliked him. Lion, Angron, Konrad, Mortarion.
He was a privillaged one that acted with pomp second only to Fulgrim. Pointed out flaws and thought only through logic which made him look like he lacked sympathy and when he could of given even a fraction of sympathy like talking it out with Lorgar over Monarchia he stood there aloof, did nothing but watch it all burn down.
Angron had a point from his perspective, unlike his brothers who swore their allegiance or liked the Emperor, he was among the few who experienced the Emperor's blunt logical action of saving him because despite being a broken tool, he was still useful to a degree.
@theredditexperience1quote from Guiliman: "Ours is the better way"
Guiliman was a very humanitarian primarch, but he was confident to the point of arrogance, much like Magnus. Plus, the fact that his mistakea had reasons makes them no less of mistakes. Angron joining Horus, Magnus breaking the edict of Nikea, Dorn accepting the iron cage, Lion exiling Luther, Russ sparing Horus, all of these were done for good reasons and we dont excuse those, do we now
@theredditexperience1Guilliman wasn't really humble when you think about it, he was all about the appearances of his Legion which is why he methodically forged his Legion into basically the exact opposite of what the Emperor wanted. he was and is an Empire builder
also your qoute DOES show how Guilliman is arrogant as is the Imperial Truth, there was no other way only His way no negotiation no assimilation of culture, only the Truth
Angron really is faultless. Once the nails were put in him, there was no hope. The Emperor really should’ve granted him a merciful death instead of gambling on him not falling to Khorne.
Zero empathy with Angron, a complete and total failure, I have seen in my own life people lose their entire family in tragic accidents but after some time they are able to live and love again. Angron is a primarch, built to be a weapon of our species and yet he acts like a spoiled child longing for his old friends who died on the sands. The most honorless of all the traitors, truly pathetic.
Oooh i like this! Under rated comment!
Bro he literally got lobotomised and forced to conquer and subjugate, when his entire life was spent rebelling against tyrants exactly like the emperor percieved. But my guy he’s literally got BRAIN SLUSH that removed his empathy ability
Angron is right, Guilliman started out with an Empire. He has the least impressive homeworld story out of all the other Primarchs. Also Guilliman has a brass neck to poke Angron saying he never conquered his homeworld, lets see how he would act with the butchers nails, he'd be the same slobbering beast as Angron.
To moan about your childhood when your purpose and destiny was something far larger is pathetic. The primarchs might be near mortal. What happened by accident is pathetic.
My exact thoughts, well said!