It was the pre-2370s refit, but something about how easily and quickly the Enterprise dealt with one Galor in The Wounded tells me that saying two of them were equal to a Galaxy might be just a tad generous.
Yeah there's a reason Picard / Starfleet were so 'generous' in overlooking the fact that Maxwell was completely correct in his assertions... that at that time the Cardassians were reduced to an 'annoyance' to their core worlds and missions rather than a peer. Or put another way, Card's were bringing wooden ships of the line vs Starfleet's ironclads.
I suspect the claim that a Galaxy class was equal to two Galors is about general capabilities rather than just combat power. It’s also worth noting that after The Wounded it became rare to see Galors operating singly. Typically they were seen in groups of 2 or 3 which suggests the Cardassians (and the writers) decided to compensate for their individual weakness with strength of numbers.
@@theodoremccarthy4438 Like in The Chase, for example, where they brought two ships when each of the other powers brought one. It gave a strong sense of the Union focusing on numbers over modern quality, which links in with the idea that the Galor has been in production for a very long time.
When I look at the Galor, I see an attempt by the Cardassians to develop a ship that could take on the Excelsior class, which would have been the primary ship fighting in the border wars. Its the kind of ship that compensates for having weaker technology by being as tough, armored and over-gunned as possible. Of course by the time the Galor entered service, Starfleet had the Ambassador class, so they stayed ahead and won the war.
There are several Galor variants. Type II is from the late 2340s on, and is classified as a Destroyer. The Galor Type II was the Excelsior equivalent and overmatched Mirandas and Constellations. The Type III that came out in the 2360s was the superior ship to the Excelsior and became the mainstay medium cruiser. But, out-performing the Ambassador is not the intent. It is to be slight better on average than the median of Starfleet ships, which in the 2350s was the Excelsior. For facing newer ships like the Ambassador or Nebula, the ticket for a power like Cardassia is not a true arms race, but to simply build more Galors. Two Galor Type IIIs can take out an Ambassador. Even three Type IIs took out the Nebula Class USS Honshu during the Dominion War. That said, the Keldon was being built in the 2360s to be a rough 1-on-1 match for the Ambssador. The Keldon Type II, aka the Obsidian Keldons, were in fact basically a peer of the Ambassador and Nebula.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 I always liked how they just kept revising and beefing-up their one proven ship design (as even the Keldons were Galors with bits stuck on). Very Soviet, like the Soyuz variations.
@@bettyswunghole3310 I bet the Bajoran babes couldn't resist it! Hang on, I'm getting an update... ...Oh, they resisted them off the planet entirely, you say?
In reality the Galor is a great ship for all the reasons things are successful in war. It is important to understand how ship roles form a picture of the whole as well as how naval doctrine works. Galors were never meant to take on peer adversary capital ships one-on-one. They are meant to combat the mean ship of the enemy fleet, and overwhelm the relatively few capital ships with numbers. For example, one doesn't build destroyers to take on battleships one-on-one. Or even using a tank analogy: In WWII the Tiger I was superior to the T-34 or Sherman. However, there weren't many Tigers but lots of Shermans. Moreover, the Sherman is upgradeable, easy to build and maintain and easy to upgrade. So there were always enough Shermans to defeat Tigers. Most importantly, is on its own, the Sherman tank was a great medium tank that was more than a match for the most common German tanks, the medium Panzer IV, or even the T-34. Indeed, by continuous upgrades, the Sherman grew to be a menace, armed with a 17 lb gun, or heavier 76mm cannon that could even take out Tigers one-on-one. The Dominion War Galor Type III is a essentially the Sherman Firefly of the starship world: A rugged, easy to produce and maintain medium sized ship, that was upgraded to be survivable enough, and eventually carried a big-ass gun that made it dangerous alone or in numbers. The Galor Type III which is the average Galor by the Dominion War is a medium cruiser. It is not taking on Vorchas, Nebulas or Galaxies one on one. They face big ships in numbers. Moreover, the Galor Type IIIs are more than credible against ships in their own weight class. The Galors have a big-ass bow cannon that can one-shot kill any ship smaller than a heavy cruiser, as shown a number of times. By the end of the War the Galor was actually a very effective cruiser.
The Wounded is one of my all-time favorite episodes of TNG. The scene at the end where Chief O’Brien and Capt. Maxwell sing “The Minstrel Boy” in Capt. Maxwell’s Ready Room aboard the U.S.S. Phoenix is quite a tearjerker.
They make a similar comparison with the starfleet phaser rifle vs the cardassian in the episode when kira is teaching Ziyal how to fight after Dukat steals the BOP
The Cardassian Union is an interesting one. They're a significant power - greater than the Talarians, say, but nowhere near the superpowers. It gave them a really interesting angle.
They are basically like the first power of the second tier. Like France or the UK now. The Cardassians are small compared to the UFP or Klingons, but far larger than other factions, even the Breen or Gore. And after the Dominion War the Cardassians are actually caught up with tech thanks to the Dominion.
@@janeghudjars3496Huh? Based on at least STO, Cardassia was reduced to a local power with a small self-defence force, and spent much of the next several decades rebuilding their destroyed cities. I don't think they benefited in any way technologically - they were at least partly dependent on the Federation.
I think the general idea behind the Galor was a "strength in numbers" approach. That is, a single Galor could be bested by any number of foes, but Central Command would never send a single Galor for a combat mission. They're deployed in groups and, combined with Hideki Frigates, expected to work as a group to defeat foes who are individually superior to themselves. A more cynical view, of course, would be that the Obsidian Order does not trust individual ship captains not to go rogue, and thus insists that Galors be deployed in groups so that any single ship trying to flee or defect can be taken out by the others.
Very cool video. The Cardassians design a ship that looks like their government symbol? How crazy! That would be like if Federation ships all used big, round circles, or Klingon ships used triangular prog shapes, or Romulans used predatory bird motifs :) :)
@@dariusgreysun Breen always gotta be different. Or maybe the Cardassians just looked at the Big 3 in the Alpha Quadrant and decided to follow their design choices "Here's our symbol, make our ships look like that!"
After the Borg incursion look at just how militaristic Starfleet got. Then the dominion war pushed it farther. Starfleet was backed into a corner and the dominion found out why the Andorians always said “ don’t push the pinkskins into the thin ice”
@@matthewcaughey8898 The Federation just got all their engineering nerds together to solve the problem of 'How do you make things blow up better" along with an unlimited budget and it was going to be a bad time for the opposing side.
This ship was the first ship in a Loot Crate, and I did get one within the first 20 keys I bought. I remember everyone was asking lots of questions about it when I starting using it. It was a fun ship to play with as a tank. I miss the days of the Tier 5 ships being the max level ships, no mastery stuff or ship traits.
A Galaxy is definitely way more powerful than just two Galors. When the Cardassians were introduced, they couldn't even hurt the Enterprise. The Defiant could take out a Keldon without any effort, and Tom Riker was confident that they could defeat three more Keldons without much trouble. It's also funny how these massive ships have such small crew compliments. The biggest cruise ship in the world can hold 7,500 passengers and 2,500 crew. The Galor is at least like 3 times bigger. Even if the Galor's equipment takes up much more room, it should still be able to hold a much bigger crew.
Those 7,500 passengers are put into cabins that are rather tiny and not meant for permanent residence while a Galor has to house all the machinery, the crew equipment, room for freight or dignitaries and I'm prestty sure the crew would like some legroom for themselves as well. Furthermore the ship has room for 2,100 people in emergencies (like evacuating a colony) so filling ALL of the space might not be allowed.
@@JCDFlex Yeah, not like cruise ships have vast amounts of their volume spend on swimming pools, casino's, restaurants, discotheque's, and other ways to keep their passengers OUT of their room and opening their wallet as much as possible. EC Henry and Resurrected Starships did video's on crewsize of the OG Enterprise and the Enterprise-D and even for the Constitution class their crewmembers have unrealistic large levels of crew comfort, to the extend Kirk's quarters on the TV show seems positively small.
@@Tuning3434 Considering that the Constitution was being sent on missions that would see the crews staying aboard for five years straight in uncharted territory, then it makes sense to afford the crew as much space and amenities as they can to keep them from experiencing psychological trauma.
I play "birth of the Federation" to this day and the Cardassians have evolved into my favourite species. The Galor is the heaviest armored and armored battleship and it's an absolute backbone for the Cardassian fleet
Always loved how rugged and simplistic Cardassian ships are, nothing flashy just get the job done, however I think the Cardassian's were misleading themselves about how serious of a threat they were to the federation before the dominion if a Galaxy class (a ship you only have to poke to cause a warp core breach) can take out a Galor class with a small amount of effort and the border wars were handled without Starfleet's full attention I think it's safe to say the Cardassians got lucky that the federation did not go all in.
For those who understand military history, and how military doctrine works, the Galor Class is actually a very realistic ship. It is rugged, easy to produce and maintain thanks to a uniformity of the build. It can be refit constantly and is modular in that respect. It is essentially the T-34 or Sherman of the starship world. It is a very good ship in all the ways that actually matter in war.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 I always got the sense the Cardassians were a bit like North korea military wise they make ships that can work but are outclassed by everyone else because they are so far behind the times and they just claim they can match the rest of the quadrant.
Near-Peer powers are fully capable of bloodying large enemies. The Federation is vast, but takes a lot to defend too. Cardassia is a very dense military power and could concentrate most of their force on one front. Add to that the Galor is plenty competitive with the vast majority of Starships. Forget the Galaxy or even Nebula, there are built in too few numbers to really matter. It is the 90% of Starfleet in 2350s into the 2360s that are Mirandas, Excelsiors, Constellations, New Orleans that is the real measure of Federation strength. In equal numbers with all of the above versus Galor Type 2s and 3s, Starfleet really doesn't;t have an advantage! Whereas Starfleet can trot out the occasional Ambassador, Nebula or Galaxy, the Cardassians can spam more and more Galors. It would take an all out total war to defeat Cardassia and it isn't worth it when negotiation can solve the dispute. But the Cardassians know this. Their tactic is to bleed Starfleet until the people at home say enough.
One thing these ship breakdowns have really highlighted for me - How, if you dig down too deep, utterly disappointing both DS9 and Bridge Commander (and likely other things which I haven't personally experienced) really are in terms of presenting ships, technology, and warfare within Star Trek.
@@Molly-ey6lq Yes, I have, and while *good for the time and budget* and *not at all detracting from the story they were wanting to tell* the space battles (particularly the large fleet battles) by-and-large don't take advantage of the technology of Star Trek. The Romulans especially get the short end of the stick, with the Cardassians close behind, but nobody really comes out looking *that* impressive when compared to the expanded lore when it comes to ship capabilities.
It should be noted the Cardassians knew the Galor was weaker than UFP and KDF ships. So they had them sortie in teams of 2 to 3 called 'Wings'. This turned out to be excellent use of the class, minimizing its weaknesses and maximizing its strengths. Its why they didn't get curb stomped in the Border Wars and how they were able to hold off the Klingons as long as they did. Also DS9 shows that Cardassian computers were pretty advanced compared to everyone except of the UFP, as they are the only other race known to use Isolinear computer technology.
Exactly! Also, in real life this is how warships are designed, around the needed weapon for its class and role. The Galor is actually maybe the best medium cruiser in this regard: No other medium cruiser has the punch of that big Spiral Wave cannon. In packs, the Galor Type 3s are incredibly dangerous to even battleships. That cannon is about as powerful as Starfleet Type XI Phaser Emplacements found on starbases. Even the Type X phasers on a Galaxy Class can't destroy a BOP or Bug Ship with one shot which the Galor does routinely.
I had always wondered where the heck were the nacelles for generating the warp bubble in Spoonhead ships. I have always stuck with the rule for Trek ships that there needs to be coils somewhat towards the outside of the ship in order to be functional, hence most ships placing them somewhat exposed. Its also why I have a gripe with every ship with a single warp nacelle, unless its the ring emitters that the Vulcans use. I understand there can be other ways of emitting a warp field in universe but consistency is key.
Problem with that is that the writers could have run into a few problems mostly revolving around the fact that most ships would have looked the same, and honestly I prefer the variety of other species coming out with their own indigenous design
@@Aahmpower Well most have the coils in pairs, not necessarily in nacelles on pylons, but definitively in pairs. With the Vulcan design the coil basically goes around the ship itself. Its just the oddball design that has a single coil on a nacelle like the Kelvin that really really bugs me.
@@janeghudjars3496 Yes, they have gone for tanky designs, they are after all militaristic. However going by in universe mechanics, warp coils have harmful radiation emissions. Its why the Federation puts them on pylons away from as many people inside. BTW the Klingons don't use coils but plates, it reduces the emissions so they are not as easily detected under cloak, but they are also more exposed and require a larger surface, hence wings.
I have liked the design from the beginning. Must confess... never realised the resemblance with the Cardassian emblem (which I also like the menacing look of).
Thing is even upgraded by the Dominion the Galor couldn't go toe to toe with top of the line Federation or Klingon ships. During the battle to retake DS9 more than once the phasers of War-refit Galaxies and Klingon disruptors would rip right through a Galor's shields as if they weren't there.
Let's remember that a galor has a mass of about 1,5 mil tonnes and a galaxy has a mass of 5 mil tonnes. You cant expect a much lighter ship to perform against a much heavier one.
It is important to understand how ship roles form a picture of the whole as well as how naval doctrine works. Galors were never meant to take on peer adversary capital ships one-on-one. They are meant to combat the mean ship of the enemy fleet, and overwhelm the relatively few capital ships with numbers. For example, one doesn't build destroyers to take on battleships one-on-one. Or even using a tank analogy: In WWII the Tiger I was superior to the T-34 or Sherman. However, there weren't many Tigers but lots of Shermans. Moreover, the Sherman is upgradeable, easy to build and maintain and easy to upgrade. So there were always enough Shermans to defeat Tigers. Most importantly, is on its own, the Sherman tank was a great medium tank that was more than a match for the most common German tanks, the medium Panzer IV, or even the T-34. Indeed, by continuous upgrades, the Sherman grew to be a menace, armed with a 17 lb gun, or heavier 76mm cannon that could even take out Tigers one-on-one. The Dominion War Galor Type III is a essentially the Sherman Firefly of the starship world: A rugged, easy to produce and maintain medium sized ship, that was upgraded to be survivable enough, and eventually carried a big-ass gun that made it dangerous alone or in numbers. The Galor Type III which is the average Galor by the Dominion War is a medium cruiser. It is not taking on Vorchas, Nebulas or Galaxies one on one. They face big ships in numbers. Moreover, the Galor Type IIIs are more than credible against ships in their own weight class. The Galors have a big-ass bow cannon that can one-shot kill any ship smaller than a heavy cruiser, as shown a number of times. By the end of the War the Galor was actually a very effective cruiser.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 NICE! The Sherman Firefly is he perfect analogy of the Dominion War Galor Type 3s: Good but not great armor all around, but with a big ass gun that is he equalizer! Like the Sherman the Galor is rugged, reliable and way easy to repair. also, since the Shermans served into the 1970s, easy to upgrade.
@@Asmodi16 People keep overlooking this! It is like saying the B'rel BOP is junk because it can't solo a D'Deridex. Useless to compare ships out of weight class.
I always got the impression that the Cardassians compensated for this ship's lesser firepower and speed by building a ton of them. They strip-mined Bajor and just cranked these ships out. Often in TNG and DS9 we see Galor-class vessels flying around in groups of three, like a little pod of angry stingrays. This makes sense if you consider the military dictatorship nature of their society. I imagine they had a lot of conscripts and used quantity over quality in many cases.
Cardassians are really held back by their lack of resources. Tech is less so an issue. The federation being more powerful is more so a function of the federation being waaaaay bigger. It's like comparing the US with France. I always liked them, since they're one of the races we got to know a lot about.
Even their tech is lacking compared to the Federation, at least in the TNG and early DS9 era. A Galor class got wiped out in seconds by a Nebula class with it's shields offline.
I think people get too caught up in the tech gap and forget that Starfleet in the 2350s and 2360s was 90% legacy ships. The Galors rated very well compared to their actual peers in their weight class. People who compare a Galor to a Galaxy Class either don't know better, or are being obtuse. Its like knocking a WWII destroyer for not being able to go toe-to-toe with the Yamato.
But also you are correct. The Cardassians actually could and did develop high tech stuff comparable to Starfleet. But, they couldn't mass produce it due to economic weakness. Even so, they were not nearly as weak as the common view portrays. You have actually shown more insight than 90% of people. Here is my speil on why the Galor is actually, from a real military POV, quite good: It is important to understand how ship roles form a picture of the whole as well as how naval doctrine works. Galors were never meant to take on peer adversary capital ships one-on-one. They are meant to combat the mean ship of the enemy fleet, and overwhelm the relatively few capital ships with numbers. For example, one doesn't build destroyers to take on battleships one-on-one. Or even using a tank analogy: In WWII the Tiger I was superior to the T-34 or Sherman. However, there weren't many Tigers but lots of Shermans. Moreover, the Sherman is upgradeable, easy to build and maintain and easy to upgrade. So there were always enough Shermans to defeat Tigers. Most importantly, is on its own, the Sherman tank was a great medium tank that was more than a match for the most common German tanks, the medium Panzer IV, or even the T-34. Indeed, by continuous upgrades, the Sherman grew to be a menace, armed with a 17 lb gun, or heavier 76mm cannon that could even take out Tigers one-on-one. The Dominion War Galor Type III is a essentially the Sherman Firefly of the starship world: A rugged, easy to produce and maintain medium sized ship, that was upgraded to be survivable enough, and eventually carried a big-ass gun that made it dangerous alone or in numbers. The Galor Type III which is the average Galor by the Dominion War is a medium cruiser. It is not taking on Vorchas, Nebulas or Galaxies one on one. They face big ships in numbers. Moreover, the Galor Type IIIs are more than credible against ships in their own weight class. The Galors have a big-ass bow cannon that can one-shot kill any ship smaller than a heavy cruiser, as shown a number of times. By the end of the War the Galor was actually a very effective cruiser.
*_For one thing there are three different variants of the Galor Class that play different roles. Why this is skipped in every video I don't know. It is a very basic fact that is quite important to understanding Cardassian ship-building and tactical doctrine._* And in naval doctrine it is important to define ship roles and equip them for that purpose. *The Galor Type II was the primary Galor Class ship in the Border Wars. It was later assessed as a Heavy Destroyer during the 2360s and 2370s. The newer Galor Type III, which appeared in the early 2360s, was a medium cruiser that was quite a bit more advanced than the Type II.* A Type III was superior to the TNG era Excelsior Class, and yes, two Type IIIs could be a threat to a Galaxy Class. Riker inferred as much in the TNG episode "Ensign Ro." During the Dominion War, the Federation clearly labeled the differences between Type II's "Cardassian destroyers," and Type IIIs "Cardassian cruisers." As demonstrated in the Dominion War, the Type III cruisers could be quite effective. The bow SWD cannon was a real menace, equivalent to a Type XI Phaser emplacement. Moreover, the Galor is a great platform in all the areas that actually mean something in war and not trading card stats: Resources and logistics. It is quick to produce, maintain and refit. It is rugged, reliable and eminently upgradeable. It is the perfect warship for a medium sized power, as simply as a go to warship in the destroyer or cruiser roles. Everyone loves Federation starships with their limited production runs and bespoke design. But in reality, it is a terrible way to run a naval fleet. One looks at history where large numbers of "good enough" usually wins. Like the Sherman or T-34, the Galor Type III is rugged, easy to maintain and can carry a big enough punch. More importantly it exists in such numbers that overall it evens out the technological edge of the Federation because it is more than competitive against the average starship of its day during the Border Wars.
Still couldn't save the Cardassian Union from being almost destroyed and ultimately being dependent on the Federation in their post war democratic reform. The hubris and arrogance of their military, led by Dukat, destroyed what little power they had.
Rick i see a Talespin reference the idol that Molly found inside her plush toy resembles the galor ship in shape and form, episode is molly coddled it had true unknown origins but very similar shape and design too, this is a good ship good for a quick shoot n scoot for tactical uses and alter the transporters to be untraceable cause of older frequencies be able to slip past detectors if altered right and perfect shuttle ships for the ultra large starfleet ships or a connection hub for bothman the combined power would be off the charts.
I ADORE that they made their iconography into a starship design... but looking at that side profile just irks me with how the bridge and tail are so offset from the rest of the ship's level. But this does stand out nicely in Star Trek. No saucer, no avian shape, this is something truly DISTINCT. Even if I am a sucker for the common wing shapings. No one will mistake this for anyone else's ship.
The Cardassians are a really interesting species. They seem to be what you get if you merged the Federation, Klingon's and Romulans into 1. They have parts that show how adaptable they are with tech unlike Klingons. They have a very secretive side like the Romulans, and in battle fight like the Klingons do.
@Rick-I have an idea for a video topic (if you haven't done it already): discuss the OTHER additional things that were thrown into the Delta Quadrant when the Caretaker shifted Voyager to the other sides of the galaxy-Chakotay's ship, the automated Cardassian warhead, the USS Equinox, etc. Are there others?
Love your videos. So mutch detail an passion. As a Treki myself (in Germany) it is hard. Everyone talks about Star Wars. But every one knows any Enterprise whould wipe the floor with the Millenium Falcon. Is there a Video about the scimitar coming up and any idea why it kann Take so many quantums but it takes only 4 for a Borg Sphere? Have a good one 🤙🏼
The main thing I'm talking away from the videos, is a lot alien ships were somehow created but some humans from the 20th. Maybe they found time travel so these races were like...what else are they good at?
I'm curious for your take on the Keldon. You implied it was the next design. Except it can't be. It was never seen again after the Obsidian order borrowed a few to refit and go on an adventure. Also, it was slower than a Galor and available enough it was abtained by an organization with no control over military procurement or ship building. They would have to have used something they could drag out of mothballs or a reserve vessel more easily reassigned. If it was new it would have continued appearing later, and the obsidian order would never have built or requisitioned such a new ship. Especially since the military didn't actually know what they had. You can't misplace that many new bleeding edge ships.
I've always found it interesting how the Cardassians resemble the Soviet Union if they'd continued to follow Stalinism rather than refuting it. Obviously there's the whole thought police thing and "disappearing" of people, but the way they kept beefing-up their one good ship design was also very, very Soviet. Also the way the Cardassians handled state funerals.
When I first heard it I thought he said "subtle as a VORTA'S fart". Lol I thought to myself "I'm not sure Vorta's can fart but I imagine if they did it would be subtle as hell" 😆😅😂 Vorta would be terrified to fart in front of a Founder or a Jem'hadar!
I mean the Galors were meant to fight Miranda and Excelsior. Ok I can see them taking on a Miranda 1v1 and it would still lose 9/10 fights, but the with how good the frame of the Excelsior were for fitting modern tech upgrades I think they could take on multiple galors themselves. And it would Take like 5 galors to pin down a Nebula or Galaxy class and they would still likely lose just cause of the range and speed differences. Galors are like the Klingon D7 refits....they are really just kind of Cannon fodder by the time of TNG who were rolling out Galaxies types to replace the Ambassadors. I think in the end there was also a limit on how far they could push the galor which is why they rolled out the Keldon class in the first place. The Galor was always a generation behind even when it was new vs the greater powers.
So the design was based on a mythical Cardassian cultural figure, eh? Interesting. I had presumed that the designers were just trying to make the Cardassian ships look different from every other major Alpha and Beta Quadrant power, so they went for a "stingray" look. Lol. I couldn't help but notice that the major powers in Star Trek have distinct design themes--the Federation repeats the design of "saucers sitting on a coaster", the Klingons love their "blade in sheath" style, the Romulans build their ships to embody their fiercest predatory birds (as if to say "tremble at how stealthy and scary we are"), the Dominion ships are based on scarabs/beetles/and or scorpions, and the Cardassian ships take after stingrays or bat rays. While one can point out that both the Klingons and the Romulans featured prominently a smaller bird-like design as their main attack ship, i.e. the Bird of Prey, that likely arose out of the two powers sharing tech.
Okay, let's see Starfleet, the KDF, or the Romulan military build a ship based around their emblems? Starfleet couldn't accomplish that until the 32nd century.
Why did they give the Galor a main deflector cannon then not show it in trek? That's like the massive anti-borg torpedo on the stern of the Defiant. Would of been fun to see what that either would of done to a swarm of Jem-Hadar fighters.
DS9 came close to explaining the issue with Cardassian tech but missed the mark a bit. The Cardassians were supposed to be the masters of intel with the Obsidian Order, and the Order had vastly more advanced tech and ships. That hinted at the fact that the Order had access to all the intel from Federation tech but was hording it at the expense of the Union. This saying that the Cardassians were capable of handling the tech, but the Order was holding back the society to keep power.
I don't remember this at all in DS9. All we knew is the Order illegally had a fleet of Keldons, and they were never specified as being specially developed by the Order. I am still amused that as it turned out, the Federation were the ones who had an unsurpassed secret intelligence agency.
@@ffnbbq in DS9 it wasn’t the same as in later series. The DS9 system had the Obsidian Order inside various governments and knew details on the Defiant, but withheld it from the military. That meant they knew of better tech, but did not share. That was shown just before the new ship class was revealed. DS9 and TNG also showed that Starfleet intelligence, the organization, was incredibly weak. The Section 31 was presented as a terrorist cell in the Federation. In DS9 it had few full time members and relied on members of other departments to fill out its ranks and do jobs. It ran separate operations and missions from Starfleet intelligence, and was successful because it literally did not exist in the main federation makeup
I never liked the little head protrusion on the front of it. I feel like it really messes up the lines and look of the ship and it would look better cutting that off. Circumcise your Galor.
I always thought the Cardassian insignia was a stylised hooded cobra, because they're reptilians after all. Or a shrunken manta nailed to a wall. Didn't know it was supposed to be an ancient Egyptian fertility symbol 😂
In the official DS9 technical manual and memory alpha these ships are said to a large aft disruptor wave cannon located between the fork of the scorpion tail. Would have like to hear that touched on because that would give insight into their battle doctrine. The large weapon of the ship being aft mounted to fend of pursuit, give credence to Cardassians preferring to use hit and run tactics rather that a straight up fight. Especially since it takes two to match one galaxy class.
If you look at some Galor models, they have the same bow orange glowing thing assembly on the tail thing. In my head they have a big cannon on the aft too for the reasons you cite.
the Galor was basically the T34 of Star Trek.... cheap, serviceable, and mostly adequate. until the Federation saw right through it and threaded it with a well placed quantum torpedo. ...or was it the other way around?
Love your show Ric long time fan ...but I disagree with your 2 to 1 Galaxy/Galor vs a Galaxy could go up against 2 Romulin Dederidex war birds against Galors even Mark 3s I'd still say a Galaxy dominion war variant could take 4 on its own it was a far far more powerful vessel to any Cardassian comparison......but great as all ways my friend 👍
For one thing he doesn't differentiate between the variants. But, again, people don't seem to understand how ship classes and roles go. Comparing destroyers vs battleships is not useful in analyzing them. Type IIs are destroyers, and Type IIIs are cruisers. Nothing more. But you are right, even two Galor Type IIIs vs a Galaxy is a steep order for the Cardassians. Two Type IIIs is a favorable match against an Ambassador. For capital ships, one wants 3-4 Type IIIs. Or, better yet, use the Keldons.
I kind of wish there was a reason the Galor class was pretty much totally inferior compared to its contemporaries. Like maybe in the Cardassian empire life is cheap compared resources. And instead of concentrating resources in a few technologically advanced warships they spread resources out into a huge fleet of cheap easily constructed and easily replaced ships.
again its was being compared to the big three shows how powerful they are. the fact it could just about match an excelsior is a credit to the Cardassians, especially with their resource issues. Its a regional power they tangled with superpowers
It would actually be more strange if it was on the same level. The more space powers you have that are all within a decade of each other tech wise, the more bizarre it becomes that sooooo many races just happened to reach the same tech at the same time.
Cardassian space is resource poor. That they did as well as they do is a credit to their cleverness. The leveraged the hell out of easy to build/maintain rugged ships that can be upgraded. The Galor Type III was a very effective medium cruiser. Let us remember that 50,000 Shermans and T-34s defeated Tigers and Panthers.
@@Revkor It actually is. In reality, the Galor class is a great concept: Easy to build, maintain and crew. Very easy to upgrade. So what if they, as criusers, are outmatched by battleships? Just use more Galors! Like the Sherman Firefly, the Galor was upgraded to have nearly as much direct firepower as a bigger ship. By the Dominion War the Galor Type IIIs could one shot kill anything smaller than a heavy cruiser.
They aren't inferior. People keep mismatching them out of their weight class like pointing to that fight between the Trager and Enterprise in "The Wounded." Of course a destroyer will struggle with a battleship. It depends on the Galor type. The Galor Type 3 was being built from 2362 onward and superior to the TNG Excelsiors and quite effective in its weight class. Galor Type 3s have a big cannon that can one-shot kill most anything smaller than a heavy cruiser. It is quite effective against other cruisers like Excelsiors, Steamrunners, K'Vorts, Breen Cruisers etc. For battleships the Cardassians either spam the Galors or send the much more powerful Keldon Class. And also the Hutet.
Yeah, but the mispronunciations of "Galor" I can deal with. "Gal-OR," "gah-lore," or the version that rhymes with "valor." Those are usually amusingly annoying, but don't hold a candle to what can happen to the Romulan "D'Deridex." _That_ gets to be nails-on-chalkboard levels of grating. Not entirely sure _why_ I find it so objectionable, but I do.
It was the pre-2370s refit, but something about how easily and quickly the Enterprise dealt with one Galor in The Wounded tells me that saying two of them were equal to a Galaxy might be just a tad generous.
Yeah there's a reason Picard / Starfleet were so 'generous' in overlooking the fact that Maxwell was completely correct in his assertions... that at that time the Cardassians were reduced to an 'annoyance' to their core worlds and missions rather than a peer.
Or put another way, Card's were bringing wooden ships of the line vs Starfleet's ironclads.
I suspect the claim that a Galaxy class was equal to two Galors is about general capabilities rather than just combat power. It’s also worth noting that after The Wounded it became rare to see Galors operating singly. Typically they were seen in groups of 2 or 3 which suggests the Cardassians (and the writers) decided to compensate for their individual weakness with strength of numbers.
@@theodoremccarthy4438 Yeah in the DS9 pilot there were three Galors, but even they made themselves scarce when the Enterprise was in the area.
And a Nebula-class starship equally made short work of another cruiser in the same episode.
And the Defiant just chews through these in The Defiant.
@@theodoremccarthy4438 Like in The Chase, for example, where they brought two ships when each of the other powers brought one. It gave a strong sense of the Union focusing on numbers over modern quality, which links in with the idea that the Galor has been in production for a very long time.
When I look at the Galor, I see an attempt by the Cardassians to develop a ship that could take on the Excelsior class, which would have been the primary ship fighting in the border wars. Its the kind of ship that compensates for having weaker technology by being as tough, armored and over-gunned as possible. Of course by the time the Galor entered service, Starfleet had the Ambassador class, so they stayed ahead and won the war.
There are several Galor variants. Type II is from the late 2340s on, and is classified as a Destroyer. The Galor Type II was the Excelsior equivalent and overmatched Mirandas and Constellations. The Type III that came out in the 2360s was the superior ship to the Excelsior and became the mainstay medium cruiser. But, out-performing the Ambassador is not the intent. It is to be slight better on average than the median of Starfleet ships, which in the 2350s was the Excelsior. For facing newer ships like the Ambassador or Nebula, the ticket for a power like Cardassia is not a true arms race, but to simply build more Galors. Two Galor Type IIIs can take out an Ambassador. Even three Type IIs took out the Nebula Class USS Honshu during the Dominion War. That said, the Keldon was being built in the 2360s to be a rough 1-on-1 match for the Ambssador. The Keldon Type II, aka the Obsidian Keldons, were in fact basically a peer of the Ambassador and Nebula.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 I always liked how they just kept revising and beefing-up their one proven ship design (as even the Keldons were Galors with bits stuck on). Very Soviet, like the Soyuz variations.
Considering how long the Excelsiors served and the evidently relatively short service livrs of the Ambassadors, that's not too surprising.
My first starship. My dad, and I spent the summer of '78 fixing her up. Even drove it to school in my senior year at Obsidian High School
I bet it picked up a few chicks for you!
Manual or automatic?
@@bettyswunghole3310 It's called 'spooning' in their slang.
Was that the beginning of the Obsidian Order then? :)
@@bettyswunghole3310 I bet the Bajoran babes couldn't resist it!
Hang on, I'm getting an update...
...Oh, they resisted them off the planet entirely, you say?
I always really liked the Galor class for how armored and industrial they look. That big cannon too, it’s just cool.
In reality the Galor is a great ship for all the reasons things are successful in war. It is important to understand how ship roles form a picture of the whole as well as how naval doctrine works. Galors were never meant to take on peer adversary capital ships one-on-one. They are meant to combat the mean ship of the enemy fleet, and overwhelm the relatively few capital ships with numbers. For example, one doesn't build destroyers to take on battleships one-on-one. Or even using a tank analogy: In WWII the Tiger I was superior to the T-34 or Sherman. However, there weren't many Tigers but lots of Shermans. Moreover, the Sherman is upgradeable, easy to build and maintain and easy to upgrade. So there were always enough Shermans to defeat Tigers. Most importantly, is on its own, the Sherman tank was a great medium tank that was more than a match for the most common German tanks, the medium Panzer IV, or even the T-34. Indeed, by continuous upgrades, the Sherman grew to be a menace, armed with a 17 lb gun, or heavier 76mm cannon that could even take out Tigers one-on-one. The Dominion War Galor Type III is a essentially the Sherman Firefly of the starship world: A rugged, easy to produce and maintain medium sized ship, that was upgraded to be survivable enough, and eventually carried a big-ass gun that made it dangerous alone or in numbers.
The Galor Type III which is the average Galor by the Dominion War is a medium cruiser. It is not taking on Vorchas, Nebulas or Galaxies one on one. They face big ships in numbers. Moreover, the Galor Type IIIs are more than credible against ships in their own weight class. The Galors have a big-ass bow cannon that can one-shot kill any ship smaller than a heavy cruiser, as shown a number of times. By the end of the War the Galor was actually a very effective cruiser.
It is a flying bunker with phasers!
Always loved the Galor as a design. Its introduction, and that of the Cardassians, gave the setting a much greater sense of scale and complexity.
One thing to note about the Cardassian Galor class ships is that: THERE....ARE....4....LIGHTS!!!!
Sorry, couldn't help it😂
Hey, someone had to do it!
Are you certain? Perhaps you should look again.
💡💡💡💡! 🖖🏻
@@AllknowingUnknown 🤔 Don't you see three lights...
🤣🤣🤣
Hands down, my favorite ship in Trek. I just love how everything about it is boot strapped, to try and compete with the neighbors.
The Wounded is one of my all-time favorite episodes of TNG. The scene at the end where Chief O’Brien and Capt. Maxwell sing “The Minstrel Boy” in Capt. Maxwell’s Ready Room aboard the U.S.S. Phoenix is quite a tearjerker.
Always loved the Galor Class. Can’t wait for a vid on the Kelton Class! Keep up the awesome work.
6:15 Describing the Galor like this made me think of it as basically the starship version of a Kalashnikov rifle (AK-47 and derivatives).
Nyet, Galor is fine, tovarishch.
Rugged, reliable, easy to mass produce. In real war these are virtues.
They make a similar comparison with the starfleet phaser rifle vs the cardassian in the episode when kira is teaching Ziyal how to fight after Dukat steals the BOP
The Cardassian Union is an interesting one. They're a significant power - greater than the Talarians, say, but nowhere near the superpowers. It gave them a really interesting angle.
They are basically like the first power of the second tier. Like France or the UK now. The Cardassians are small compared to the UFP or Klingons, but far larger than other factions, even the Breen or Gore. And after the Dominion War the Cardassians are actually caught up with tech thanks to the Dominion.
@@janeghudjars3496Huh? Based on at least STO, Cardassia was reduced to a local power with a small self-defence force, and spent much of the next several decades rebuilding their destroyed cities. I don't think they benefited in any way technologically - they were at least partly dependent on the Federation.
The Command section looks like it could detach and be a lifeboat, like the Klingons boom section or, of course, Starfleets Saucer separation.
Yeah it definitely looks like it has an impulse engine array on the back
I have Said it many times in this comments, but i say it again. It is great to see all the different classes of Ships. Cheers to you good Lefttennent.
I think the general idea behind the Galor was a "strength in numbers" approach. That is, a single Galor could be bested by any number of foes, but Central Command would never send a single Galor for a combat mission. They're deployed in groups and, combined with Hideki Frigates, expected to work as a group to defeat foes who are individually superior to themselves.
A more cynical view, of course, would be that the Obsidian Order does not trust individual ship captains not to go rogue, and thus insists that Galors be deployed in groups so that any single ship trying to flee or defect can be taken out by the others.
Worked for the Allies in WWII. The Galor is the Sherman or T-34 of warships.
Very cool video. The Cardassians design a ship that looks like their government symbol? How crazy! That would be like if Federation ships all used big, round circles, or Klingon ships used triangular prog shapes, or Romulans used predatory bird motifs :) :)
Or breen making....those uh breenish looking ships!
@@dariusgreysun Breen always gotta be different. Or maybe the Cardassians just looked at the Big 3 in the Alpha Quadrant and decided to follow their design choices "Here's our symbol, make our ships look like that!"
After the Borg incursion look at just how militaristic Starfleet got. Then the dominion war pushed it farther. Starfleet was backed into a corner and the dominion found out why the Andorians always said “ don’t push the pinkskins into the thin ice”
@@matthewcaughey8898 The Federation just got all their engineering nerds together to solve the problem of 'How do you make things blow up better" along with an unlimited budget and it was going to be a bad time for the opposing side.
This ship was the first ship in a Loot Crate, and I did get one within the first 20 keys I bought. I remember everyone was asking lots of questions about it when I starting using it. It was a fun ship to play with as a tank. I miss the days of the Tier 5 ships being the max level ships, no mastery stuff or ship traits.
A Galaxy is definitely way more powerful than just two Galors. When the Cardassians were introduced, they couldn't even hurt the Enterprise. The Defiant could take out a Keldon without any effort, and Tom Riker was confident that they could defeat three more Keldons without much trouble.
It's also funny how these massive ships have such small crew compliments. The biggest cruise ship in the world can hold 7,500 passengers and 2,500 crew. The Galor is at least like 3 times bigger. Even if the Galor's equipment takes up much more room, it should still be able to hold a much bigger crew.
Sure, maybe by volume.
But what about life support? 🤔
Those 7,500 passengers are put into cabins that are rather tiny and not meant for permanent residence while a Galor has to house all the machinery, the crew equipment, room for freight or dignitaries and I'm prestty sure the crew would like some legroom for themselves as well. Furthermore the ship has room for 2,100 people in emergencies (like evacuating a colony) so filling ALL of the space might not be allowed.
@@JCDFlex Yeah, not like cruise ships have vast amounts of their volume spend on swimming pools, casino's, restaurants, discotheque's, and other ways to keep their passengers OUT of their room and opening their wallet as much as possible.
EC Henry and Resurrected Starships did video's on crewsize of the OG Enterprise and the Enterprise-D and even for the Constitution class their crewmembers have unrealistic large levels of crew comfort, to the extend Kirk's quarters on the TV show seems positively small.
When you decide how much crew to put you don‘t ask „how many can fit into the ship?“. You ask: „how many does it take to run the ship?“
@@Tuning3434 Considering that the Constitution was being sent on missions that would see the crews staying aboard for five years straight in uncharted territory, then it makes sense to afford the crew as much space and amenities as they can to keep them from experiencing psychological trauma.
I play "birth of the Federation" to this day and the Cardassians have evolved into my favourite species. The Galor is the heaviest armored and armored battleship and it's an absolute backbone for the Cardassian fleet
I always wondered why the Cardy logo looked like their ships. Turns out I had it backwards. Very interesting.
Thank you. A youtuber finally pronounces the name correctly.
Except even the cardies called it galor with long a
Always loved how rugged and simplistic Cardassian ships are, nothing flashy just get the job done, however I think the Cardassian's were misleading themselves about how serious of a threat they were to the federation before the dominion if a Galaxy class (a ship you only have to poke to cause a warp core breach) can take out a Galor class with a small amount of effort and the border wars were handled without Starfleet's full attention I think it's safe to say the Cardassians got lucky that the federation did not go all in.
I imagined the federation conflict with cardassia was like a extended policing action. They did the bear minimum to deal with them.
@@RA10H56
The bear's minimum was indeed the bare miminmum, lol.
For those who understand military history, and how military doctrine works, the Galor Class is actually a very realistic ship. It is rugged, easy to produce and maintain thanks to a uniformity of the build. It can be refit constantly and is modular in that respect. It is essentially the T-34 or Sherman of the starship world. It is a very good ship in all the ways that actually matter in war.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 I always got the sense the Cardassians were a bit like North korea military wise they make ships that can work but are outclassed by everyone else because they are so far behind the times and they just claim they can match the rest of the quadrant.
Near-Peer powers are fully capable of bloodying large enemies. The Federation is vast, but takes a lot to defend too. Cardassia is a very dense military power and could concentrate most of their force on one front. Add to that the Galor is plenty competitive with the vast majority of Starships. Forget the Galaxy or even Nebula, there are built in too few numbers to really matter. It is the 90% of Starfleet in 2350s into the 2360s that are Mirandas, Excelsiors, Constellations, New Orleans that is the real measure of Federation strength. In equal numbers with all of the above versus Galor Type 2s and 3s, Starfleet really doesn't;t have an advantage! Whereas Starfleet can trot out the occasional Ambassador, Nebula or Galaxy, the Cardassians can spam more and more Galors. It would take an all out total war to defeat Cardassia and it isn't worth it when negotiation can solve the dispute. But the Cardassians know this. Their tactic is to bleed Starfleet until the people at home say enough.
One thing these ship breakdowns have really highlighted for me - How, if you dig down too deep, utterly disappointing both DS9 and Bridge Commander (and likely other things which I haven't personally experienced) really are in terms of presenting ships, technology, and warfare within Star Trek.
What? Have you actually watched Deep Space Nine?
@@Molly-ey6lq Yes, I have, and while *good for the time and budget* and *not at all detracting from the story they were wanting to tell* the space battles (particularly the large fleet battles) by-and-large don't take advantage of the technology of Star Trek. The Romulans especially get the short end of the stick, with the Cardassians close behind, but nobody really comes out looking *that* impressive when compared to the expanded lore when it comes to ship capabilities.
Thanks for these ship breakdowns.
It should be noted the Cardassians knew the Galor was weaker than UFP and KDF ships. So they had them sortie in teams of 2 to 3 called 'Wings'. This turned out to be excellent use of the class, minimizing its weaknesses and maximizing its strengths. Its why they didn't get curb stomped in the Border Wars and how they were able to hold off the Klingons as long as they did. Also DS9 shows that Cardassian computers were pretty advanced compared to everyone except of the UFP, as they are the only other race known to use Isolinear computer technology.
I had noticed early on that you almost never saw one of these ships alone.
I love this ship, I've always thought of it as a big weapon with a ship built around it. Simplicity itself where form equals function.
Exactly! Also, in real life this is how warships are designed, around the needed weapon for its class and role. The Galor is actually maybe the best medium cruiser in this regard: No other medium cruiser has the punch of that big Spiral Wave cannon. In packs, the Galor Type 3s are incredibly dangerous to even battleships. That cannon is about as powerful as Starfleet Type XI Phaser Emplacements found on starbases. Even the Type X phasers on a Galaxy Class can't destroy a BOP or Bug Ship with one shot which the Galor does routinely.
I always thought the design was based upon a sting ray, good informative video
Looking forward to the Keldon class video.
The Cardassians: punching above their weight class the entire time.
I love the galor class it’s my favorite Cardassian ship and great video.
Can´t wait to play this in Star Trek Armada 4.
Also one of the most satisfying model kits I put together at the time..
I had always wondered where the heck were the nacelles for generating the warp bubble in Spoonhead ships.
I have always stuck with the rule for Trek ships that there needs to be coils somewhat towards the outside of the ship in order to be functional, hence most ships placing them somewhat exposed. Its also why I have a gripe with every ship with a single warp nacelle, unless its the ring emitters that the Vulcans use.
I understand there can be other ways of emitting a warp field in universe but consistency is key.
Problem with that is that the writers could have run into a few problems mostly revolving around the fact that most ships would have looked the same, and honestly I prefer the variety of other species coming out with their own indigenous design
@@Aahmpower Well most have the coils in pairs, not necessarily in nacelles on pylons, but definitively in pairs. With the Vulcan design the coil basically goes around the ship itself. Its just the oddball design that has a single coil on a nacelle like the Kelvin that really really bugs me.
Cardies have the right idea. Their nacelles are protected!
@@janeghudjars3496 Yes, they have gone for tanky designs, they are after all militaristic.
However going by in universe mechanics, warp coils have harmful radiation emissions. Its why the Federation puts them on pylons away from as many people inside.
BTW the Klingons don't use coils but plates, it reduces the emissions so they are not as easily detected under cloak, but they are also more exposed and require a larger surface, hence wings.
Thank you for everything you do 😊
cardassian ships are among my favorites, but top spot is ferengi D'kora
I have liked the design from the beginning. Must confess... never realised the resemblance with the Cardassian emblem (which I also like the menacing look of).
Right off the bat, from the top it looks like a fancy shovel.
I love the cardassian ships I love how unique and different it is to other races
Thing is even upgraded by the Dominion the Galor couldn't go toe to toe with top of the line Federation or Klingon ships. During the battle to retake DS9 more than once the phasers of War-refit Galaxies and Klingon disruptors would rip right through a Galor's shields as if they weren't there.
Let's remember that a galor has a mass of about 1,5 mil tonnes and a galaxy has a mass of 5 mil tonnes. You cant expect a much lighter ship to perform against a much heavier one.
It is important to understand how ship roles form a picture of the whole as well as how naval doctrine works. Galors were never meant to take on peer adversary capital ships one-on-one. They are meant to combat the mean ship of the enemy fleet, and overwhelm the relatively few capital ships with numbers. For example, one doesn't build destroyers to take on battleships one-on-one. Or even using a tank analogy: In WWII the Tiger I was superior to the T-34 or Sherman. However, there weren't many Tigers but lots of Shermans. Moreover, the Sherman is upgradeable, easy to build and maintain and easy to upgrade. So there were always enough Shermans to defeat Tigers. Most importantly, is on its own, the Sherman tank was a great medium tank that was more than a match for the most common German tanks, the medium Panzer IV, or even the T-34. Indeed, by continuous upgrades, the Sherman grew to be a menace, armed with a 17 lb gun, or heavier 76mm cannon that could even take out Tigers one-on-one. The Dominion War Galor Type III is a essentially the Sherman Firefly of the starship world: A rugged, easy to produce and maintain medium sized ship, that was upgraded to be survivable enough, and eventually carried a big-ass gun that made it dangerous alone or in numbers.
The Galor Type III which is the average Galor by the Dominion War is a medium cruiser. It is not taking on Vorchas, Nebulas or Galaxies one on one. They face big ships in numbers. Moreover, the Galor Type IIIs are more than credible against ships in their own weight class. The Galors have a big-ass bow cannon that can one-shot kill any ship smaller than a heavy cruiser, as shown a number of times. By the end of the War the Galor was actually a very effective cruiser.
Galors are destroyers and cruisers. They are not in the same weight class as big ships. For their own weight class the Galors are quite effective.
@@crownprincesebastianjohano7069 NICE! The Sherman Firefly is he perfect analogy of the Dominion War Galor Type 3s: Good but not great armor all around, but with a big ass gun that is he equalizer! Like the Sherman the Galor is rugged, reliable and way easy to repair. also, since the Shermans served into the 1970s, easy to upgrade.
@@Asmodi16 People keep overlooking this! It is like saying the B'rel BOP is junk because it can't solo a D'Deridex. Useless to compare ships out of weight class.
I've always really liked how the Galor looked.
I always got the impression that the Cardassians compensated for this ship's lesser firepower and speed by building a ton of them. They strip-mined Bajor and just cranked these ships out. Often in TNG and DS9 we see Galor-class vessels flying around in groups of three, like a little pod of angry stingrays. This makes sense if you consider the military dictatorship nature of their society. I imagine they had a lot of conscripts and used quantity over quality in many cases.
the earwig class
Great video as always
Cardassians are really held back by their lack of resources.
Tech is less so an issue.
The federation being more powerful is more so a function of the federation being waaaaay bigger.
It's like comparing the US with France.
I always liked them, since they're one of the races we got to know a lot about.
Even their tech is lacking compared to the Federation, at least in the TNG and early DS9 era. A Galor class got wiped out in seconds by a Nebula class with it's shields offline.
@@calvinskye You're comparing a heavy cruiser against a destroyer. It is not a surprise that was the outcome.
I think people get too caught up in the tech gap and forget that Starfleet in the 2350s and 2360s was 90% legacy ships. The Galors rated very well compared to their actual peers in their weight class. People who compare a Galor to a Galaxy Class either don't know better, or are being obtuse. Its like knocking a WWII destroyer for not being able to go toe-to-toe with the Yamato.
But also you are correct. The Cardassians actually could and did develop high tech stuff comparable to Starfleet. But, they couldn't mass produce it due to economic weakness. Even so, they were not nearly as weak as the common view portrays. You have actually shown more insight than 90% of people. Here is my speil on why the Galor is actually, from a real military POV, quite good:
It is important to understand how ship roles form a picture of the whole as well as how naval doctrine works. Galors were never meant to take on peer adversary capital ships one-on-one. They are meant to combat the mean ship of the enemy fleet, and overwhelm the relatively few capital ships with numbers. For example, one doesn't build destroyers to take on battleships one-on-one. Or even using a tank analogy: In WWII the Tiger I was superior to the T-34 or Sherman. However, there weren't many Tigers but lots of Shermans. Moreover, the Sherman is upgradeable, easy to build and maintain and easy to upgrade. So there were always enough Shermans to defeat Tigers. Most importantly, is on its own, the Sherman tank was a great medium tank that was more than a match for the most common German tanks, the medium Panzer IV, or even the T-34. Indeed, by continuous upgrades, the Sherman grew to be a menace, armed with a 17 lb gun, or heavier 76mm cannon that could even take out Tigers one-on-one. The Dominion War Galor Type III is a essentially the Sherman Firefly of the starship world: A rugged, easy to produce and maintain medium sized ship, that was upgraded to be survivable enough, and eventually carried a big-ass gun that made it dangerous alone or in numbers.
The Galor Type III which is the average Galor by the Dominion War is a medium cruiser. It is not taking on Vorchas, Nebulas or Galaxies one on one. They face big ships in numbers. Moreover, the Galor Type IIIs are more than credible against ships in their own weight class. The Galors have a big-ass bow cannon that can one-shot kill any ship smaller than a heavy cruiser, as shown a number of times. By the end of the War the Galor was actually a very effective cruiser.
@@calvinskye thats mostly just plot.
*_For one thing there are three different variants of the Galor Class that play different roles. Why this is skipped in every video I don't know. It is a very basic fact that is quite important to understanding Cardassian ship-building and tactical doctrine._* And in naval doctrine it is important to define ship roles and equip them for that purpose. *The Galor Type II was the primary Galor Class ship in the Border Wars. It was later assessed as a Heavy Destroyer during the 2360s and 2370s. The newer Galor Type III, which appeared in the early 2360s, was a medium cruiser that was quite a bit more advanced than the Type II.* A Type III was superior to the TNG era Excelsior Class, and yes, two Type IIIs could be a threat to a Galaxy Class. Riker inferred as much in the TNG episode "Ensign Ro." During the Dominion War, the Federation clearly labeled the differences between Type II's "Cardassian destroyers," and Type IIIs "Cardassian cruisers." As demonstrated in the Dominion War, the Type III cruisers could be quite effective. The bow SWD cannon was a real menace, equivalent to a Type XI Phaser emplacement.
Moreover, the Galor is a great platform in all the areas that actually mean something in war and not trading card stats: Resources and logistics. It is quick to produce, maintain and refit. It is rugged, reliable and eminently upgradeable. It is the perfect warship for a medium sized power, as simply as a go to warship in the destroyer or cruiser roles. Everyone loves Federation starships with their limited production runs and bespoke design. But in reality, it is a terrible way to run a naval fleet. One looks at history where large numbers of "good enough" usually wins. Like the Sherman or T-34, the Galor Type III is rugged, easy to maintain and can carry a big enough punch. More importantly it exists in such numbers that overall it evens out the technological edge of the Federation because it is more than competitive against the average starship of its day during the Border Wars.
He gets it!
Still couldn't save the Cardassian Union from being almost destroyed and ultimately being dependent on the Federation in their post war democratic reform. The hubris and arrogance of their military, led by Dukat, destroyed what little power they had.
I'd love a deep dive on that history
The first ship of the Galore class was called the Blackman and it served with Honor.
So impractical. Why have an overhang over your main disruptor that blocks so many angles of fire? Still, I love the design.
Rick i see a Talespin reference the idol that Molly found inside her plush toy resembles the galor ship in shape and form, episode is molly coddled it had true unknown origins but very similar shape and design too, this is a good ship good for a quick shoot n scoot for tactical uses and alter the transporters to be untraceable cause of older frequencies be able to slip past detectors if altered right and perfect shuttle ships for the ultra large starfleet ships or a connection hub for bothman the combined power would be off the charts.
May we see the bridges please? Like the Bremen and other ships as part of the review?
I ADORE that they made their iconography into a starship design... but looking at that side profile just irks me with how the bridge and tail are so offset from the rest of the ship's level.
But this does stand out nicely in Star Trek. No saucer, no avian shape, this is something truly DISTINCT. Even if I am a sucker for the common wing shapings. No one will mistake this for anyone else's ship.
In some documents it's a battlecruiser, and in a ST:TNG video game (Birth of the Federation), it's a battleship. Confusing.
A surprisingly old class. And then you have Starfleet coming out with a new class of ship every month or so. :)
The Cardassians are a really interesting species. They seem to be what you get if you merged the Federation, Klingon's and Romulans into 1. They have parts that show how adaptable they are with tech unlike Klingons. They have a very secretive side like the Romulans, and in battle fight like the Klingons do.
They are the most human of the lot. They are a mixed bag.
@Rick-I have an idea for a video topic (if you haven't done it already): discuss the OTHER additional things that were thrown into the Delta Quadrant when the Caretaker shifted Voyager to the other sides of the galaxy-Chakotay's ship, the automated Cardassian warhead, the USS Equinox, etc. Are there others?
@Certifiably_Ingame What is the name of that beautiful background piano music?
Now I want a USA Trek ship made to look like our banner.
It'd be hilarious flying around in a giant USA Flag.
You should do a video on the Achilles Class, I’d love to know more since they added it on Star Trek Online, however information is kinda scarce
Love your videos. So mutch detail an passion. As a Treki myself (in Germany) it is hard. Everyone talks about Star Wars. But every one knows any Enterprise whould wipe the floor with the Millenium Falcon.
Is there a Video about the scimitar coming up and any idea why it kann Take so many quantums but it takes only 4 for a Borg Sphere?
Have a good one 🤙🏼
The main thing I'm talking away from the videos, is a lot alien ships were somehow created but some humans from the 20th. Maybe they found time travel so these races were like...what else are they good at?
I really love the Galor class
Straight away, ancient Galor's enemies claimed he cheated with Witchcraft.
Cardassian ships always look like they can take a beating. The low dps tanks of the ST world
star trek armada 4 is being made get ready for it
I always viewed these ships as "goldfish" in space. :)
What about the hybrid from the star trek bridge comander game?
This thing reminds me of a Manta Ray.
Question can you have this as your Ship in Star Trek Online ?.
Respect and keep up the epic work.
Yes you can. But I don't think it's that easy, or cheap, to acquire.
I'm curious for your take on the Keldon. You implied it was the next design. Except it can't be. It was never seen again after the Obsidian order borrowed a few to refit and go on an adventure. Also, it was slower than a Galor and available enough it was abtained by an organization with no control over military procurement or ship building. They would have to have used something they could drag out of mothballs or a reserve vessel more easily reassigned. If it was new it would have continued appearing later, and the obsidian order would never have built or requisitioned such a new ship. Especially since the military didn't actually know what they had. You can't misplace that many new bleeding edge ships.
Cardassian ships galore!
I'm looking forward to the Keldon class.
I've always found it interesting how the Cardassians resemble the Soviet Union if they'd continued to follow Stalinism rather than refuting it. Obviously there's the whole thought police thing and "disappearing" of people, but the way they kept beefing-up their one good ship design was also very, very Soviet. Also the way the Cardassians handled state funerals.
My 3rd favorite ship in the universe
gaylors are fabulous.
nice alien design.
They sparkle for sure
..."As subtle as a Horta's fart."...*facepalm*
When I first heard it I thought he said "subtle as a VORTA'S fart". Lol
I thought to myself "I'm not sure Vorta's can fart but I imagine if they did it would be subtle as hell" 😆😅😂
Vorta would be terrified to fart in front of a Founder or a Jem'hadar!
The obsidian order would like to have Rick as a guest
It took me a long time to figure out which is the front and rear of the ship.
It kind of makes me think of a stingray.
I mean the Galors were meant to fight Miranda and Excelsior. Ok I can see them taking on a Miranda 1v1 and it would still lose 9/10 fights, but the with how good the frame of the Excelsior were for fitting modern tech upgrades I think they could take on multiple galors themselves. And it would Take like 5 galors to pin down a Nebula or Galaxy class and they would still likely lose just cause of the range and speed differences. Galors are like the Klingon D7 refits....they are really just kind of Cannon fodder by the time of TNG who were rolling out Galaxies types to replace the Ambassadors. I think in the end there was also a limit on how far they could push the galor which is why they rolled out the Keldon class in the first place. The Galor was always a generation behind even when it was new vs the greater powers.
We really need a L-Galor class, and not one that would suck (or be just a trait/console delivery vessel).
So the design was based on a mythical Cardassian cultural figure, eh? Interesting. I had presumed that the designers were just trying to make the Cardassian ships look different from every other major Alpha and Beta Quadrant power, so they went for a "stingray" look. Lol. I couldn't help but notice that the major powers in Star Trek have distinct design themes--the Federation repeats the design of "saucers sitting on a coaster", the Klingons love their "blade in sheath" style, the Romulans build their ships to embody their fiercest predatory birds (as if to say "tremble at how stealthy and scary we are"), the Dominion ships are based on scarabs/beetles/and or scorpions, and the Cardassian ships take after stingrays or bat rays. While one can point out that both the Klingons and the Romulans featured prominently a smaller bird-like design as their main attack ship, i.e. the Bird of Prey, that likely arose out of the two powers sharing tech.
Okay, let's see Starfleet, the KDF, or the Romulan military build a ship based around their emblems?
Starfleet couldn't accomplish that until the 32nd century.
I wish this was a playable ship in Star Trek Online.
Why did they give the Galor a main deflector cannon then not show it in trek? That's like the massive anti-borg torpedo on the stern of the Defiant. Would of been fun to see what that either would of done to a swarm of Jem-Hadar fighters.
I rekkon the Boarder wars would make a good star trek show,
somehow
DS9 came close to explaining the issue with Cardassian tech but missed the mark a bit.
The Cardassians were supposed to be the masters of intel with the Obsidian Order, and the Order had vastly more advanced tech and ships.
That hinted at the fact that the Order had access to all the intel from Federation tech but was hording it at the expense of the Union. This saying that the Cardassians were capable of handling the tech, but the Order was holding back the society to keep power.
I don't remember this at all in DS9. All we knew is the Order illegally had a fleet of Keldons, and they were never specified as being specially developed by the Order.
I am still amused that as it turned out, the Federation were the ones who had an unsurpassed secret intelligence agency.
@@ffnbbq in DS9 it wasn’t the same as in later series.
The DS9 system had the Obsidian Order inside various governments and knew details on the Defiant, but withheld it from the military. That meant they knew of better tech, but did not share. That was shown just before the new ship class was revealed.
DS9 and TNG also showed that Starfleet intelligence, the organization, was incredibly weak. The Section 31 was presented as a terrorist cell in the Federation. In DS9 it had few full time members and relied on members of other departments to fill out its ranks and do jobs. It ran separate operations and missions from Starfleet intelligence, and was successful because it literally did not exist in the main federation makeup
I never liked the little head protrusion on the front of it. I feel like it really messes up the lines and look of the ship and it would look better cutting that off.
Circumcise your Galor.
I always thought the Cardassian insignia was a stylised hooded cobra, because they're reptilians after all. Or a shrunken manta nailed to a wall. Didn't know it was supposed to be an ancient Egyptian fertility symbol 😂
I always thought the ship was based on silverfish or another insect.
Do a vid about the bioships.
Galor Class had a big fat blind spot in his butt. Kind of dumb that it couldn't fire backwards.
In the official DS9 technical manual and memory alpha these ships are said to a large aft disruptor wave cannon located between the fork of the scorpion tail. Would have like to hear that touched on because that would give insight into their battle doctrine. The large weapon of the ship being aft mounted to fend of pursuit, give credence to Cardassians preferring to use hit and run tactics rather that a straight up fight. Especially since it takes two to match one galaxy class.
If you look at some Galor models, they have the same bow orange glowing thing assembly on the tail thing. In my head they have a big cannon on the aft too for the reasons you cite.
Where do the Keldar class ships get their name from?
the Galor was basically the T34 of Star Trek.... cheap, serviceable, and mostly adequate.
until the Federation saw right through it and threaded it with a well placed quantum torpedo.
...or was it the other way around?
Love your show Ric long time fan ...but I disagree with your 2 to 1 Galaxy/Galor vs a Galaxy could go up against 2 Romulin Dederidex war birds against Galors even Mark 3s I'd still say a Galaxy dominion war variant could take 4 on its own it was a far far more powerful vessel to any Cardassian comparison......but great as all ways my friend 👍
For one thing he doesn't differentiate between the variants. But, again, people don't seem to understand how ship classes and roles go. Comparing destroyers vs battleships is not useful in analyzing them. Type IIs are destroyers, and Type IIIs are cruisers. Nothing more. But you are right, even two Galor Type IIIs vs a Galaxy is a steep order for the Cardassians. Two Type IIIs is a favorable match against an Ambassador. For capital ships, one wants 3-4 Type IIIs. Or, better yet, use the Keldons.
I kind of wish there was a reason the Galor class was pretty much totally inferior compared to its contemporaries. Like maybe in the Cardassian empire life is cheap compared resources. And instead of concentrating resources in a few technologically advanced warships they spread resources out into a huge fleet of cheap easily constructed and easily replaced ships.
again its was being compared to the big three shows how powerful they are. the fact it could just about match an excelsior is a credit to the Cardassians, especially with their resource issues.
Its a regional power they tangled with superpowers
It would actually be more strange if it was on the same level. The more space powers you have that are all within a decade of each other tech wise, the more bizarre it becomes that sooooo many races just happened to reach the same tech at the same time.
Cardassian space is resource poor. That they did as well as they do is a credit to their cleverness. The leveraged the hell out of easy to build/maintain rugged ships that can be upgraded. The Galor Type III was a very effective medium cruiser. Let us remember that 50,000 Shermans and T-34s defeated Tigers and Panthers.
@@Revkor It actually is. In reality, the Galor class is a great concept: Easy to build, maintain and crew. Very easy to upgrade. So what if they, as criusers, are outmatched by battleships? Just use more Galors! Like the Sherman Firefly, the Galor was upgraded to have nearly as much direct firepower as a bigger ship. By the Dominion War the Galor Type IIIs could one shot kill anything smaller than a heavy cruiser.
They aren't inferior. People keep mismatching them out of their weight class like pointing to that fight between the Trager and Enterprise in "The Wounded." Of course a destroyer will struggle with a battleship. It depends on the Galor type. The Galor Type 3 was being built from 2362 onward and superior to the TNG Excelsiors and quite effective in its weight class. Galor Type 3s have a big cannon that can one-shot kill most anything smaller than a heavy cruiser. It is quite effective against other cruisers like Excelsiors, Steamrunners, K'Vorts, Breen Cruisers etc. For battleships the Cardassians either spam the Galors or send the much more powerful Keldon Class. And also the Hutet.
The space catfish.😊
Auto subtitles "Kardashian Armada".
*facepalms*
It's reliable but stubbornly behind the times. So it's the 1996 Toyota Corolla of the universe?
Galor kind remind me of the Kongo class IJN fast battleship Not Flashy but able to modernized over and over
Yeah, but the mispronunciations of "Galor" I can deal with. "Gal-OR," "gah-lore," or the version that rhymes with "valor." Those are usually amusingly annoying, but don't hold a candle to what can happen to the Romulan "D'Deridex." _That_ gets to be nails-on-chalkboard levels of grating. Not entirely sure _why_ I find it so objectionable, but I do.
assasin's cardassia