I admire the dedication of sharing this attempt publicly, to me that didn't really show confidence in getting the job done but definitely showed you're keen and not full of ego which is a great trait in this industry! You shot yourself in the foot from the start by not picking faster lenses - you'll never get that bokeh and separation at T2.8. The key light should be harsher to get that look as you mentioned at the end, the skin gets washed out. I would get the red look with smaller light sources instead of spreading it everywhere i.e. a couple tubes or the MCs (as you had planned). Given it's an HBO show, I suppose you'll get a gaffer? A gaffer would do this in under an hour with their eyes closed!
I recognize those screen grabs. They're from a documentary about the Nightstalker who was a serial killer that operated in Los Angeles during the '80s. Those men are LAPD or LA Sheriff's detectives.
Need more separation of subject from background. This can be accomplished in a variety of ways but I would use Aputure 60x’s or Dedolights to spot in areas on the background to silhouette the dark side of the face. I also think the eye sockets are too dark. I would use a larger soft source for more wrap and less contrast in eye sockets. Your eyelight/catchlight approach idea is a great. Overall, I think there needs to be more “ punch” in background. Your blackout methods reveal a lack of lighting/grip experience but as a DP, you can often rely on other crew to support in that area. Best of luck on the project and I applaud the bold move of the test shoot. As an aside: I am completely confident this look could be matched by about any specialized cinema camera… most of it is accomplished in lighting, location selection, and art direction. If your client is an Arri fan then awesome… it makes the job easier.
Level up your (black out) grip game: Use hardware store purchased black plastic folded on roll (usually comes in 10’x50’ or 10’x100’ rolls… about $50-$75. It’s lightweight, covers large areas, easy to cut-to-size, 6 mil is full-on black out, easy to clip on to crossbar, etc.
Clicked on this one no noticing how long it was. Thinking I'd only watch a bit of it, I really enjoyed the whole thing. It's good to see that other film makers also take a LONG time to light a scene. Especially solo, it always takes longer than you expect - and usually only looks 7/10 compared to what you hoped for! Thanks for taking the time to put this together. °¬)
As far as if a mere mortal can see the difference between an Arri and other cameras, yes. I hired a DP out of San Francisco who brought his Alexa Mini to shoot my short "Amy's Baby" and when I saw the raw footage, I will admit it brought tears to my eyes. It was so...beautiful.
Cinema graduate here with a lot of C70/FX6 experience, and happily watched the full vid because damn I'm so jelly and this was awesome! I've never had the opprotunity to work with ARRI's but it's so cool to see your planning/pre-production process, and how you're approaching equipment that's out of your normal toolkit. Came here from Sean's community post, but now a fellow subscriber!
As a beginner videographer, just getting started with the whole solo thing, this was incredibly interesting. Fascinating to follow you through your process, i learned a ton and added two bits of kit to my wishlist (the MC Pro lights and a decent high power RGB). Thanks for taking the extra time to share this with us.
Man, I loved this, Luc. No better education than watching a pro think through decisions in real time. Your breakdown at the end was particularly helpful. I knew the look didn't fully match, but I couldn't quite detect why (beyond recognizing the overall difference in contrast). But that was a challenging shot to match. Kudos to you for having the professionalism to prepare so far in advance.
Looking at the image, you was definitely on the right track, The theme to me was more gangster/mafia style, soft red accent background lighting and with definition of where their was so the audience can relate, with a strong key light with specular highlights to make the subject "harsher" than normal, giving them that "hard look". I enjoyed this one very much.
That was super helpful in many ways. As a corporate photographer drifting into the field of videography I am also in a transition phase between areas I know a lot about and areas I know a bit about, trying to learn the new craft. So seeing someone with your track records tackling a new challenge and only reaching 70% of the goal is liberating. It also helps to grasp the concept of trial and error once again (because how are you supposed to get a thing right, when you never got it wrong before?). Also it reminds me time and again to take more time for the light setup. Often enough corporate customers are like "and then we just need that small thingy done quickly, nothing fancy" but when the results don't look like on national TV or an Apple ad everybody's wondering and asking you why … Thanks a ton for being to open and honest and also show your (30%-ish) failures.
You mention using wireless monitoring in your Documentary Cinematography course, and it looked like you really needed this here. Having been on set walking back and forth to the camera when adjusting lights, it gets really tiresome, and I do try to always have wireless transmission with me now. However, I absolutely found the video invaluable, and really enjoyed the long-form approach, similar to the course. Thank you!
I highly respect you taking the time to do an in-depth test shoot. It really shows your commitment and hunger for the craft. Although I personally thought you didn't quite get the correct look from the reference, it doesn't matter because that was the whole point, and most importantly, you are much better than you were before this test.
Seems totally fine to do a test and miss the mark, that's the whole point of doing a test is to see if what you have in your head initially is the right direction. Good job noticing where adjustments are needed and making sure to do this early enough that proper adjustments can be made.
Love it! Tip for the solo lighting: bring a wireless director's monitor so you don't have to walk to your cam. Always use it on solo/small team jobs. Saves a lot of time
Luc, thank you for taking the extra time to document this for your channel. It really answered some questions I had about fill and motivating light. I think you did more like a 90% duplication of the samples you were given. Your attention to detail paid off.
Very enjoyable, as an amateur I’m never going to be in your situation but it was interesting to see what you guys have to go through to get your work. Thank you.
Thanks for sharing man! Definitely your key light is a bit more softer than what they’re going for. In their guide it’s almost like a hard, undiffused spotlight directly overhead.
I'd recommend revisiting some principles of visual language and lighting. 1: your eye will naturally always be drawn to the brightest spot in the frame. If you place a subject and bright spot in frame, the eye will bounce back and forth between the two, becuase your brain is telling it to focus on the subject. Not only do they achieve greater subject separation (this is due to lighting, not lenses- the first is a wide angle, maybe a 35, the second maybe a 85) in the reference visuals but they use tonal contrast to draw the eye. In both visuals, the brightest part of the frame is the subject with the aforementioned source spots on the subjects forehead/face. They're also using the lighting in a way that even though the subject is sitting in the right third of frame and looking camera left, the middle third is well lit compared to the other thirds being low, achieving a tonal contrast and drawing the eye right the center of the frame. Despite you saying that you're unhappy with the light wrap, both references have clear light wrap around the face, possibly utilizing a cove lighting technique with negative fill.
Love seeing these types of videos and learning the nitty gritty details of how to exactly make things work. Definitely want to see the part 2. Want to find out how to lock this up perfectly!
It was awesome to watch your thought process for this! One thing I think really helps those references, especially the wider shot, is the haze! Since the background is dark, it looks like they hazed it to keep the subject the most contrasty thing in the frame without making everything behind him too lit.
Please do the second take as well. I always get to learn a lot about filmmaking and lighting from you. Your hard work will keep on giving you the dividends. ✌️😊
Incredible setup but I do think to get closer to the reference images the key light needs to be brighter and possibly lower down, the eye sockets just look a bit ghoulish and with the background bokeh maybe light the bottles by the bar or throw in some in a string of fairy lights as a option.
Amazing Video. Just to see someone with that much experience still trying out stuff and "playing" with new or unfamiliar Gear is nice to see. I think you analyse at the end also nails it. The Keylight looked super clean but not what the Screenshots looked like. Thank you for the video :D
Nice, those shots look sick! Personally I would have actually pushed that red a bit more so it makes a kicker like the second example. I also would have diffused that kitchen window instead of blacking it out so that there is still a bit of texture in the kitchen. In the end though, I honestly like yours more than the examples.
Hey Luc, this was super helpful... I really got a lot from this video and would encourage you to definitely do a follow up and more of similar videos - one can learn ton from this... being able to see in real time - how you create, adjust and set up the frame - super helpful. Great job..Thanks for this.
Nice job. A dozen more set ups like that and you should have it down to about 20-30 min setups. My first interview took a while but now I like to streamline, do more with less. I love motivated color pops though I know your usual is more real world lighting. I'd have thrown a fast 85 if I could find one. Fun watch! Hope you get it!
I wouldn't have done a better job myself, but... I kept thinking about the wardrobe and hoped you would have tried a jacket/shirt in a more complimentary or neutral color agains the warm tungsten background. That's my backseat driving advice 🤣 Reaĺly enjoyed this video. Thank you and the rest of the guys for the work and extra time it took to take us along.
I agree Luc, the reference image looks like a 2x2 with a grid just out of frame, the harsh fall off while still providing fairly soft nose shadows is a give away, and their angle is definitely more toppy - go fabric to save on grip. As you mentioned, they have more going on in the background too, but it's obviously easier with a gaffer/team (having to walk from the camera to move the light and back over and over really reduces the time you can problem solve creatively). I wouldn't be surprised if the reference on the right used a spotlight mount or two on some small 60w lights giving the checkerboard vibe on the top of the frame, those things do a mountain of work in the BG for bringing out spots of interest in a more controlled manner, and can be feathered off nicely. If I was asked to shoot this from the references I'd ask for 2/3 small 60 watt lights with spotlight mounts (forza 60s are fine). Great for focusing in to backlighting bottles etc, or to strike glasses horizontally without the fall off of a tube/MC - like those specular highlights in the left reference image (probably just fairy lights tho 😆) - keen to see the next one :)
Nice one Louie, I would agree with most of that. I had an Amaran 60x that I should have brought, and some AA fairy lights are already on the way. Spotlight attachments might be a great idea, thanks for the suggestion. The MC's would have helped also, but it's the key I need to figure out. I think it's time for a video deep dive on key lights!
Really enjoyed the video. Seeing the walkthrough and your thought process along the way was enlightening. Well done. As far as the frame, it looked great. It seemed to me that the red in the reference was some sort of red drapery and emulating it with light wasn’t the right “flavor”. At least that is what I perceived on my tiny phone screen.
Nice video Luc! For a fully beginner in this world I think it looks awesome. I learned a lot just by watching this. I may not have the equipment yet, but it has given me a good idea on how to set an interview scenario up. I would love to see a follow up on how it turned out to make it 10/10 Love your work! Thanks for the time you use on making RUclips! Hope you get the job!🤞🏻 Regards Richard
reference frames look like the were shot at f/1.4 or 1.8, making the background noise melt away, and gives the background lighting more pop relative to the foreground, ref. looks like a one light setup with a bounce for fill, time is too expensive on set and these refs look like maybe a 4-5 person crew, between sound, camera, etc. These modern lights make it so much easier than carrying around a case of gels, and huge lights and massive stands, you would have needed a 21' panel van to carry that much grip in the tungsten days... hopefully you can make a video comparing the real shoots to this, I would say you should get the job,
Thank you for such an insightful lighting prep video! Much appreciated. Follow up video please and do you feel soft lighting trending as the goto thing (nowadays) affected your approach instead of opting for harder lighting?
Nice! Love the process. I maybe would have brought a dark suit jacket to test, just to see how the darker jacket on the shoulders stands out from the background or not (as the brown over-shirt automatically creates some separation). The amount of red reflecting on the bar, lower left frame is a bit distracting, so maybe would have also tried to scrim/treat that… and maybe a quick spray of atmosphere aerosol/haze in the background!
It's very impressive you gripped and lit your own scene. I think when the feature hires you as a DP the key grip and gaffer will match any reference frame for you super fast! G&E crew.
I didn't think I had time to sit through a nearly hour long video but apparently I did 🤣 It was cool to watch your process. I wish you luck on getting this new gig. And, yes, I'd love to see the followup video but maybe like the 10-15 minute version of it. Thanks for making this 🙏
Heya, just wanted to hop in here too to add that your talent/actor also determines a lot of the vibe. The reference frames both had old maffiosi, and while @forgelabs is a lovely dude, he wasn’t giving maffioso. To add to that; his coat blended a bit too well with the yellow and red of the background, it didn’t bring any color contrast into the scene in any case, which the blue-ish suit of the men in the reference images did. Ok, those were my two cents on the matter. On another note, I picked up a lot, thanks for putting in the extra effort of making this into a YT vid.
Would only recommend the benefit of a larger monitor on set to help see what you are shooting at least as big as a computer monitor - there really is a transformation that happens from 5" to 25"
Amazing video ,I appreciate your input, approach, and most importantly it's relaxing to watch you work. Often times with DP work I tend to be intimidated since I'm green and often feel pressured by the time crunch but I like this approach of practicing before shoot dates and using failure to grow. Subscribed to keep learning from you!
Hey Luc, first off, congrats on the gig!! Secondly I agree, as a frame I thought you nailed the look and I myself would be happy to shoot an interview in that frame. As an LD I agree with your assessment of the key, Closer without the soft box at about 15% would have nailed it. Also hitting the far BG area with the "Absent lights" also would have helped sell the look. I agree with your assessment. However for a first run with a new camera in a new space I think 70% Is not bad. I would love to see the second go round. Cheers, Charlie
Thank you for sharing. I agree on your assesments of the test you did. Almost all that I saw you pointed out too. 2 things I'd like to add (just for you to look closer - maybe there is something in it, maybe not): - green tint made everything a bit dirty with some vintage feel to it (and I suppose Cooke added up to it too) - almost like you shot on some vintage Snyder-like anamorphic 😂 And the look you seek is more of a Fincher style clean I guess - the only thing I do not like in your lighting is work with red light. It is too subtle for a background accent stylized look. So it is just dirtying the frame. And it is to strong on the bar table... So I'd do a lot of blocking here and there to get it it brighter on the right side but not to spill it on the left side of the frame. Hope this helps and anyway you did a great job 👍
I’m really surprised you didn’t bring the MC Pros. :D At the beginning I thought they were gonna be the background MVP. Thanks for this lighting master class! ;)
Fun to get to tinker like that! The thing irking me in that frame is the big ornate pillar on the bar is not plumb. It’s just off enough that I can’t tell if camera may be slightly out of level, or that thing just isn’t plumb. Then the warm house light that acts as fill on the subject has a weird tint to it. Like it is more yellow than regular 3200k, if that makes sense. Would have liked to see it flagged on the subject, but left on the background. Also the talent’s jacket color was off for the rest of the colors. It clashes with the other yellow/warm colors. A suit jacket like the samples could have added 5-10%!
It would be cool if you mounted the lens to a tripod and PL mount and then rotate out cameras so nothing changes except for the camera body. They're all full frame and all shooting in log formats.
Very cool. I was gonna say most of what you already knew. I saw the reference show. Can't remember what it was but I saw it. Although the images you were working had a look, I think they were too spotty. Hot spots are things we try not to have? IMHO I think somewhere in the middle. Stronger than what you had and tone down what they had. This is cool stuff. If it helped land the job or improve confidence... it certainly was not a waste of time. At all.
Luc Great work! I really appreciate how much effort you expend to educate filmmakers My only thought would be to light the eye sockets a little bit more
Pretty damn fine job, I would perhaps added a little uplift on his left side too. Felt a little too one-sided and he's not popping as much as needed. Also his clothes would have been changed to match the scene. Brown shirt doesn't work, so with a more black/white suit like the reference, it will be much better.. :)
Loved the learning experience of it all, the background bokeh orbs were there, it was just missing intensity. I would've smashed it with harsh cob lights to make it appear vs soft light bars
Great break down. Don't think I've ever had 7 hours to light a scene before except maybe installing a studio grid system, maybe 3 for some narrative work earlier in my career. Pretty good result, at a glance I feel like first area where it feels like you miss matching the source is lens selection (you addressed this in video) but having that slightly wider aperture would have let you do a bit more of that subtle lifting in the background with the lights you did have, not that the look you had was bad just that it feels like the biggest departure from the source and kina fuels the rest of the changes. A wider aperture also might have made the use of bokeh more prominent as that's an element that's not nearly as prevalent in your shot. Also the harder key, but you pretty much nailed all the differences in your own assessment.
I don’t know much about your world, but I would have framed the shot to include some of those gorgeous hanging light fixtures. A missed opportunity to me.
Great Video Luc, aside from what you mentioned. personally I would play with the ambient a bit more and try to control it, breaking it up into zones. The humongous 3200k when the subject is in a a dark green top blends together IMO. More of an edge light could help with this separation. Although you didn’t have the MC’s you could possibly have use the fresnel effect of the metal in the kitchen to create some hot spots with a different source. Finally the Alexa 35 has exceptional colour fidelity and I feel like you are loosing tonal subtlety in the skin tone using that Aputure light as it has a pretty narrow spectrum. An HMI or something like the new 1200x with the BLAIR engine might bring some more dimensionality. Great that you got the job!
great job, gentlemen! The only thing I would complain about is the fact that your location is a bit too obvious in the frame. The references do not clearly show that we are in a bar or restaurant. To sum up, I'm not convinced by your bottles in the frame 🙂
Great video. Love all the self analysis. When I saw your final, I thought it missed the mark as well and you obviously agree. Yes the camera matters. Yes the lenses matter. But in this case, they matter a very small amount compared to the lighting choices. You walked into this shoot like an Aputure commercial. Are you sponsored by them? I love running my lights on Sidus link too but I mix and match when needed. I would have gone less soft on the key. Could have used the thinner diffusion on the light dome and backed it off a little more. Or gone with the f8 fresnel and barn doors on a 600d. Or any other large fresnel and added a touch of diffusion over the lens. But it looks like the key position was the challenge and not the need for an eye light. A touch more frontal to get lights into the eye sockets. And if you were gonna add an eye light, you’re correct, the tube was a bad choice. It actually looks like this DP may have used some 2x2’ panels directly overhead pointing straight down in addition to the key light. I’m fairly certain because I’ve done this look quite a few times before for true crime documentaries. Of course forgetting the MCs was a big setback but using spot lights with barn doors would have been better for those background accents. Also…. Negative fill is your friend. Big neg fill just out of frame would have punched up your contrast while keeping light in the eyes. Also, use patterns and speculars in your background. Adding a row on glasses or bottles in the back and hitting that with a hard light would have added cool texture when out of focus. And don’t forget old school gobos and cookies. An RGB red fresnel through some slates in a cookie could add cool texture, especially when defocused.
One thing I miss after retiring from a TV news network job, was my Sony ENG broadcast camera. I am the DP of a medical corporation, but I really miss the ease of use and the ergonomics of my faithful ENG camera. Have you considered trying one out. They were the mainstay, until the camera makers came out with the cinema platform.
My guess on the orbs in the background on the left reference image is uplit or down lit bottles. If you put the bottles on top of a light it will create an effect like this.
Hoping you get the job! This was such an interesting video! I love learning from your process as well! I personally would've loved to see how you would've had the shot shooting more into the restaurant with the chandeliers in the background! I would personally have framed towards that!
Great video! These videos feels like a tap in the shoulder or a smack in the head that instills in you that the camera is just one piece of the puzzle. The location, depth, framing, audio and moreso the lighting is far more important to deliver the mood/feel you want in your shots. Some people get stuck at the gear rabbit hole and not get opportunities like these. Cheers!
Great video, Luc. Thanks! Would a Spotlight + gobo on the 600C have gotten you closer to the background red effect you wanted (assuming you had them)? The red in your image felt more like fill than the somewhat specular effect in the source images.
Great video, please follow up. I think the sparkling bokeh in the back was really missing in terms of colour and general look. Production design and lighting is more important than the camera maybe at this stage.
Had a blast doing this! Thanks for the invite!
Couldn't have done it without you! Literally, there wouldn't have been anyone to film!
THE GOAT IS HERE
Sean Is a qualified actor
I would never have imagined seeing the Forge Labs on the cinematography side of RUclips lol
Low key explains alot
I admire the dedication of sharing this attempt publicly, to me that didn't really show confidence in getting the job done but definitely showed you're keen and not full of ego which is a great trait in this industry! You shot yourself in the foot from the start by not picking faster lenses - you'll never get that bokeh and separation at T2.8. The key light should be harsher to get that look as you mentioned at the end, the skin gets washed out. I would get the red look with smaller light sources instead of spreading it everywhere i.e. a couple tubes or the MCs (as you had planned). Given it's an HBO show, I suppose you'll get a gaffer? A gaffer would do this in under an hour with their eyes closed!
I recognize those screen grabs. They're from a documentary about the Nightstalker who was a serial killer that operated in Los Angeles during the '80s. Those men are LAPD or LA Sheriff's detectives.
Need more separation of subject from background. This can be accomplished in a variety of ways but I would use Aputure 60x’s or Dedolights to spot in areas on the background to silhouette the dark side of the face. I also think the eye sockets are too dark. I would use a larger soft source for more wrap and less contrast in eye sockets. Your eyelight/catchlight approach idea is a great.
Overall, I think there needs to be more “ punch” in background.
Your blackout methods reveal a lack of lighting/grip experience but as a DP, you can often rely on other crew to support in that area.
Best of luck on the project and I applaud the bold move of the test shoot.
As an aside: I am completely confident this look could be matched by about any specialized cinema camera… most of it is accomplished in lighting, location selection, and art direction. If your client is an Arri fan then awesome… it makes the job easier.
10 out of 10. This is exactly the kind of content I want to watch. Keep ‘em coming! And yes I want to see the second part. Thanks for the great work!!
MY MAN FORGELABS SENT ME HERE this is so cool especially as I want to work with filmmaking and stuff when I’m older
Love that you're walking us through your process. Would love to see more of this kind of stuff! Good luck and I hope you get the gig!
Level up your (black out) grip game:
Use hardware store purchased black plastic folded on roll (usually comes in 10’x50’ or 10’x100’ rolls… about $50-$75. It’s lightweight, covers large areas, easy to cut-to-size, 6 mil is full-on black out, easy to clip on to crossbar, etc.
Thanks, Shane Hurlbut.
Clicked on this one no noticing how long it was. Thinking I'd only watch a bit of it, I really enjoyed the whole thing. It's good to see that other film makers also take a LONG time to light a scene. Especially solo, it always takes longer than you expect - and usually only looks 7/10 compared to what you hoped for! Thanks for taking the time to put this together. °¬)
Oh yeah you’re right it’s almost an hour. Nice. *kicks up feet, lighter flicks*
Literally same
As far as if a mere mortal can see the difference between an Arri and other cameras, yes.
I hired a DP out of San Francisco who brought his Alexa Mini to shoot my short "Amy's Baby" and when I saw the raw footage, I will admit it brought tears to my eyes. It was so...beautiful.
Good Luck, Luc! You're living all of our dreams! Your hard work paid off!
An Arri Alexa 35. Wow.
Cinema graduate here with a lot of C70/FX6 experience, and happily watched the full vid because damn I'm so jelly and this was awesome! I've never had the opprotunity to work with ARRI's but it's so cool to see your planning/pre-production process, and how you're approaching equipment that's out of your normal toolkit. Came here from Sean's community post, but now a fellow subscriber!
Great to have you man!
Arri is like Fx6 or C70 but really heavy and no autocus.
As a beginner videographer, just getting started with the whole solo thing, this was incredibly interesting. Fascinating to follow you through your process, i learned a ton and added two bits of kit to my wishlist (the MC Pro lights and a decent high power RGB). Thanks for taking the extra time to share this with us.
Man, I loved this, Luc. No better education than watching a pro think through decisions in real time. Your breakdown at the end was particularly helpful. I knew the look didn't fully match, but I couldn't quite detect why (beyond recognizing the overall difference in contrast). But that was a challenging shot to match. Kudos to you for having the professionalism to prepare so far in advance.
Looking at the image, you was definitely on the right track, The theme to me was more gangster/mafia style, soft red accent background lighting and with definition of where their was so the audience can relate, with a strong key light with specular highlights to make the subject "harsher" than normal, giving them that "hard look".
I enjoyed this one very much.
agreed!
That was super helpful in many ways. As a corporate photographer drifting into the field of videography I am also in a transition phase between areas I know a lot about and areas I know a bit about, trying to learn the new craft. So seeing someone with your track records tackling a new challenge and only reaching 70% of the goal is liberating. It also helps to grasp the concept of trial and error once again (because how are you supposed to get a thing right, when you never got it wrong before?). Also it reminds me time and again to take more time for the light setup. Often enough corporate customers are like "and then we just need that small thingy done quickly, nothing fancy" but when the results don't look like on national TV or an Apple ad everybody's wondering and asking you why … Thanks a ton for being to open and honest and also show your (30%-ish) failures.
You mention using wireless monitoring in your Documentary Cinematography course, and it looked like you really needed this here. Having been on set walking back and forth to the camera when adjusting lights, it gets really tiresome, and I do try to always have wireless transmission with me now.
However, I absolutely found the video invaluable, and really enjoyed the long-form approach, similar to the course. Thank you!
I highly respect you taking the time to do an in-depth test shoot. It really shows your commitment and hunger for the craft. Although I personally thought you didn't quite get the correct look from the reference, it doesn't matter because that was the whole point, and most importantly, you are much better than you were before this test.
For a production company to send you screen grabs from a random interview, which weren't even that similar, i think you did a great job 👍
Seems totally fine to do a test and miss the mark, that's the whole point of doing a test is to see if what you have in your head initially is the right direction. Good job noticing where adjustments are needed and making sure to do this early enough that proper adjustments can be made.
Great deep dive, nice to see the whole process rather than "5 quick tips". Good one!
Thank you, I'm recent Uni Grad, and my peers didn't understand why I always rented gear just to learn and build my portfolio. Great tips man!
Love it! Tip for the solo lighting: bring a wireless director's monitor so you don't have to walk to your cam.
Always use it on solo/small team jobs. Saves a lot of time
Thank you for sharing this masterful lighting set and comments. Hope you get it together!
Luc, thank you for taking the extra time to document this for your channel. It really answered some questions I had about fill and motivating light. I think you did more like a 90% duplication of the samples you were given. Your attention to detail paid off.
Very enjoyable, as an amateur I’m never going to be in your situation but it was interesting to see what you guys have to go through to get your work.
Thank you.
Thanks for sharing man! Definitely your key light is a bit more softer than what they’re going for. In their guide it’s almost like a hard, undiffused spotlight directly overhead.
I'd recommend revisiting some principles of visual language and lighting. 1: your eye will naturally always be drawn to the brightest spot in the frame. If you place a subject and bright spot in frame, the eye will bounce back and forth between the two, becuase your brain is telling it to focus on the subject. Not only do they achieve greater subject separation (this is due to lighting, not lenses- the first is a wide angle, maybe a 35, the second maybe a 85) in the reference visuals but they use tonal contrast to draw the eye. In both visuals, the brightest part of the frame is the subject with the aforementioned source spots on the subjects forehead/face. They're also using the lighting in a way that even though the subject is sitting in the right third of frame and looking camera left, the middle third is well lit compared to the other thirds being low, achieving a tonal contrast and drawing the eye right the center of the frame. Despite you saying that you're unhappy with the light wrap, both references have clear light wrap around the face, possibly utilizing a cove lighting technique with negative fill.
Love seeing these types of videos and learning the nitty gritty details of how to exactly make things work. Definitely want to see the part 2. Want to find out how to lock this up perfectly!
Best doc filmmaking channel on RUclips.
Thanks for showing us the meat of it all, I loved observing your approach to the frame. Very insightful!
10 out of 10, fantastic breakdown of your thought process and work flow. I need to do these pre-production studies.
Amazing video, love this concept because it's very informative. Hope to see more of these. You definitely my favorite doc youtuber!
This video is filled with incredibly useful information for filmmakers. Thanks for taking us through your process
It was awesome to watch your thought process for this! One thing I think really helps those references, especially the wider shot, is the haze! Since the background is dark, it looks like they hazed it to keep the subject the most contrasty thing in the frame without making everything behind him too lit.
Please do the second take as well. I always get to learn a lot about filmmaking and lighting from you. Your hard work will keep on giving you the dividends. ✌️😊
Definately one of my favourite videos. Learned alot.
Incredible setup but I do think to get closer to the reference images the key light needs to be brighter and possibly lower down, the eye sockets just look a bit ghoulish and with the background bokeh maybe light the bottles by the bar or throw in some in a string of fairy lights as a option.
Amazing Video. Just to see someone with that much experience still trying out stuff and "playing" with new or unfamiliar Gear is nice to see. I think you analyse at the end also nails it. The Keylight looked super clean but not what the Screenshots looked like. Thank you for the video :D
Nice, those shots look sick! Personally I would have actually pushed that red a bit more so it makes a kicker like the second example. I also would have diffused that kitchen window instead of blacking it out so that there is still a bit of texture in the kitchen. In the end though, I honestly like yours more than the examples.
Hey Luc, this was super helpful... I really got a lot from this video and would encourage you to definitely do a follow up and more of similar videos - one can learn ton from this... being able to see in real time - how you create, adjust and set up the frame - super helpful. Great job..Thanks for this.
I just might! Thanks Maros
Nice job. A dozen more set ups like that and you should have it down to about 20-30 min setups. My first interview took a while but now I like to streamline, do more with less. I love motivated color pops though I know your usual is more real world lighting. I'd have thrown a fast 85 if I could find one. Fun watch!
Hope you get it!
Luckily I'll have at least that many attempts!
I wouldn't have done a better job myself, but...
I kept thinking about the wardrobe and hoped you would have tried a jacket/shirt in a more complimentary or neutral color agains the warm tungsten background.
That's my backseat driving advice 🤣 Reaĺly enjoyed this video. Thank you and the rest of the guys for the work and extra time it took to take us along.
Yes the contrast between the costum and background was a fail.
I agree Luc, the reference image looks like a 2x2 with a grid just out of frame, the harsh fall off while still providing fairly soft nose shadows is a give away, and their angle is definitely more toppy - go fabric to save on grip. As you mentioned, they have more going on in the background too, but it's obviously easier with a gaffer/team (having to walk from the camera to move the light and back over and over really reduces the time you can problem solve creatively). I wouldn't be surprised if the reference on the right used a spotlight mount or two on some small 60w lights giving the checkerboard vibe on the top of the frame, those things do a mountain of work in the BG for bringing out spots of interest in a more controlled manner, and can be feathered off nicely. If I was asked to shoot this from the references I'd ask for 2/3 small 60 watt lights with spotlight mounts (forza 60s are fine). Great for focusing in to backlighting bottles etc, or to strike glasses horizontally without the fall off of a tube/MC - like those specular highlights in the left reference image (probably just fairy lights tho 😆) - keen to see the next one :)
Nice one Louie, I would agree with most of that. I had an Amaran 60x that I should have brought, and some AA fairy lights are already on the way. Spotlight attachments might be a great idea, thanks for the suggestion. The MC's would have helped also, but it's the key I need to figure out. I think it's time for a video deep dive on key lights!
Really enjoyed the video. Seeing the walkthrough and your thought process along the way was enlightening. Well done. As far as the frame, it looked great. It seemed to me that the red in the reference was some sort of red drapery and emulating it with light wasn’t the right “flavor”. At least that is what I perceived on my tiny phone screen.
So good to watch and I'm realising that you need more than just good lighting, you need fantastic lighting and more so with the lighting setup.
Wow Luc, so much value in one video, thank you!
Nice video Luc!
For a fully beginner in this world I think it looks awesome. I learned a lot just by watching this. I may not have the equipment yet, but it has given me a good idea on how to set an interview scenario up.
I would love to see a follow up on how it turned out to make it 10/10
Love your work! Thanks for the time you use on making RUclips!
Hope you get the job!🤞🏻
Regards
Richard
Great to hear RIchard!
Really enjoy learning from your workflow process and teaching style Luc. Thanks
reference frames look like the were shot at f/1.4 or 1.8, making the background noise melt away, and gives the background lighting more pop relative to the foreground, ref. looks like a one light setup with a bounce for fill, time is too expensive on set and these refs look like maybe a 4-5 person crew, between sound, camera, etc. These modern lights make it so much easier than carrying around a case of gels, and huge lights and massive stands, you would have needed a 21' panel van to carry that much grip in the tungsten days... hopefully you can make a video comparing the real shoots to this, I would say you should get the job,
Thank you for such an insightful lighting prep video! Much appreciated. Follow up video please and do you feel soft lighting trending as the goto thing (nowadays) affected your approach instead of opting for harder lighting?
Nice! Love the process. I maybe would have brought a dark suit jacket to test, just to see how the darker jacket on the shoulders stands out from the background or not (as the brown over-shirt automatically creates some separation). The amount of red reflecting on the bar, lower left frame is a bit distracting, so maybe would have also tried to scrim/treat that… and maybe a quick spray of atmosphere aerosol/haze in the background!
Great walk through of your processes. Thanks for sharing the good, bad, and ugly of the process.
It's very impressive you gripped and lit your own scene. I think when the feature hires you as a DP the key grip and gaffer will match any reference frame for you super fast! G&E crew.
Its not that impressive because it does not demonstrate the skill of directing crew.
@@sammorganmoore Technically the audience is the crew. We are the crew, he was communicating and telling us how he was shaping the light.
I must say you did definitely a better job than what the reference images looked like.
Love the video and learned a lot. Definitely would like to see round 2!
I didn't think I had time to sit through a nearly hour long video but apparently I did 🤣 It was cool to watch your process. I wish you luck on getting this new gig. And, yes, I'd love to see the followup video but maybe like the 10-15 minute version of it. Thanks for making this 🙏
Heya, just wanted to hop in here too to add that your talent/actor also determines a lot of the vibe. The reference frames both had old maffiosi, and while @forgelabs is a lovely dude, he wasn’t giving maffioso. To add to that; his coat blended a bit too well with the yellow and red of the background, it didn’t bring any color contrast into the scene in any case, which the blue-ish suit of the men in the reference images did. Ok, those were my two cents on the matter. On another note, I picked up a lot, thanks for putting in the extra effort of making this into a YT vid.
The guy in the suit is a cop I'm betting.
Would only recommend the benefit of a larger monitor on set to help see what you are shooting at least as big as a computer monitor - there really is a transformation that happens from 5" to 25"
Oh, you are so close! Both on the lighting and hitting 100K subs. Awesome content.
Amazing video ,I appreciate your input, approach, and most importantly it's relaxing to watch you work. Often times with DP work I tend to be intimidated since I'm green and often feel pressured by the time crunch but I like this approach of practicing before shoot dates and using failure to grow. Subscribed to keep learning from you!
adore this, and your openness about your own hurdles and learnings is fantastic 🔥
Hey Luc, first off, congrats on the gig!! Secondly I agree, as a frame I thought you nailed the look and I myself would be happy to shoot an interview in that frame. As an LD I agree with your assessment of the key, Closer without the soft box at about 15% would have nailed it. Also hitting the far BG area with the "Absent lights" also would have helped sell the look. I agree with your assessment. However for a first run with a new camera in a new space I think 70% Is not bad. I would love to see the second go round. Cheers, Charlie
Amazing Video! You got it pretty close, planning is so important, thanks for reminding us.
Thanks for this walkthrough - very interesting & learned so much!
Thank you for sharing. I agree on your assesments of the test you did. Almost all that I saw you pointed out too.
2 things I'd like to add (just for you to look closer - maybe there is something in it, maybe not):
- green tint made everything a bit dirty with some vintage feel to it (and I suppose Cooke added up to it too) - almost like you shot on some vintage Snyder-like anamorphic 😂 And the look you seek is more of a Fincher style clean I guess
- the only thing I do not like in your lighting is work with red light. It is too subtle for a background accent stylized look. So it is just dirtying the frame. And it is to strong on the bar table... So I'd do a lot of blocking here and there to get it it brighter on the right side but not to spill it on the left side of the frame.
Hope this helps and anyway you did a great job 👍
I’m really surprised you didn’t bring the MC Pros. :D At the beginning I thought they were gonna be the background MVP. Thanks for this lighting master class! ;)
It wasn't on purpose 😉
@@LucForsyth I know, I know :)
Great tutorial! I will definitely be interested in the second attempt.
Great taking us through the process. Best of luck. Go for it Mr.Luc
This real time learning process is hugely helpful. Please film the next test shoot as well!
48:00 love it.. light tests are key, a solid career investment!
Fun to get to tinker like that! The thing irking me in that frame is the big ornate pillar on the bar is not plumb. It’s just off enough that I can’t tell if camera may be slightly out of level, or that thing just isn’t plumb.
Then the warm house light that acts as fill on the subject has a weird tint to it. Like it is more yellow than regular 3200k, if that makes sense. Would have liked to see it flagged on the subject, but left on the background.
Also the talent’s jacket color was off for the rest of the colors. It clashes with the other yellow/warm colors. A suit jacket like the samples could have added 5-10%!
Luc you’re a beast and an inspiration man.
It would be cool if you mounted the lens to a tripod and PL mount and then rotate out cameras so nothing changes except for the camera body. They're all full frame and all shooting in log formats.
Very cool. I was gonna say most of what you already knew. I saw the reference show. Can't remember what it was but I saw it. Although the images you were working had a look, I think they were too spotty. Hot spots are things we try not to have? IMHO I think somewhere in the middle. Stronger than what you had and tone down what they had. This is cool stuff. If it helped land the job or improve confidence... it certainly was not a waste of time. At all.
Luc
Great work!
I really appreciate how much effort you expend to educate filmmakers
My only thought would be to light the eye sockets a little bit more
Pretty damn fine job, I would perhaps added a little uplift on his left side too. Felt a little too one-sided and he's not popping as much as needed. Also his clothes would have been changed to match the scene. Brown shirt doesn't work, so with a more black/white suit like the reference, it will be much better.. :)
Thanks a lot for the feedback!
Prior Preparation Prevents Poor Performance. Case in point! Good Luck Luc!
It was fascinating, and I was totally absorbed in the process and the analysis. Thanks for sharing; I certainly learned a lot.
Wish you all the best 🤞🏽💪🏾
I would love to see the follow up! I really appreciate your insighjs an honesty. Greetings from Germany :)
Loved the learning experience of it all, the background bokeh orbs were there, it was just missing intensity. I would've smashed it with harsh cob lights to make it appear vs soft light bars
Exactly...I left the case of the behind (like a pro), and it really showed
Great break down. Don't think I've ever had 7 hours to light a scene before except maybe installing a studio grid system, maybe 3 for some narrative work earlier in my career. Pretty good result, at a glance I feel like first area where it feels like you miss matching the source is lens selection (you addressed this in video) but having that slightly wider aperture would have let you do a bit more of that subtle lifting in the background with the lights you did have, not that the look you had was bad just that it feels like the biggest departure from the source and kina fuels the rest of the changes. A wider aperture also might have made the use of bokeh more prominent as that's an element that's not nearly as prevalent in your shot. Also the harder key, but you pretty much nailed all the differences in your own assessment.
thanks so much for showing this process start to finish
Well this is a surprising collaboration!
I don’t know much about your world, but I would have framed the shot to include some of those gorgeous hanging light fixtures. A missed opportunity to me.
I’d love to see a follow up attempt. This is great educational content. I’ve learned a lot from you.
Great Video Luc, aside from what you mentioned. personally I would play with the ambient a bit more and try to control it, breaking it up into zones. The humongous 3200k when the subject is in a a dark green top blends together IMO. More of an edge light could help with this separation. Although you didn’t have the MC’s you could possibly have use the fresnel effect of the metal in the kitchen to create some hot spots with a different source. Finally the Alexa 35 has exceptional colour fidelity and I feel like you are loosing tonal subtlety in the skin tone using that Aputure light as it has a pretty narrow spectrum. An HMI or something like the new 1200x with the BLAIR engine might bring some more dimensionality. Great that you got the job!
Great video, would love more in depth videos like this!
great job, gentlemen! The only thing I would complain about is the fact that your location is a bit too obvious in the frame. The references do not clearly show that we are in a bar or restaurant. To sum up, I'm not convinced by your bottles in the frame 🙂
Great video. Love all the self analysis. When I saw your final, I thought it missed the mark as well and you obviously agree. Yes the camera matters. Yes the lenses matter. But in this case, they matter a very small amount compared to the lighting choices. You walked into this shoot like an Aputure commercial. Are you sponsored by them? I love running my lights on Sidus link too but I mix and match when needed.
I would have gone less soft on the key. Could have used the thinner diffusion on the light dome and backed it off a little more. Or gone with the f8 fresnel and barn doors on a 600d. Or any other large fresnel and added a touch of diffusion over the lens. But it looks like the key position was the challenge and not the need for an eye light. A touch more frontal to get lights into the eye sockets. And if you were gonna add an eye light, you’re correct, the tube was a bad choice. It actually looks like this DP may have used some 2x2’ panels directly overhead pointing straight down in addition to the key light. I’m fairly certain because I’ve done this look quite a few times before for true crime documentaries.
Of course forgetting the MCs was a big setback but using spot lights with barn doors would have been better for those background accents.
Also…. Negative fill is your friend. Big neg fill just out of frame would have punched up your contrast while keeping light in the eyes.
Also, use patterns and speculars in your background. Adding a row on glasses or bottles in the back and hitting that with a hard light would have added cool texture when out of focus. And don’t forget old school gobos and cookies. An RGB red fresnel through some slates in a cookie could add cool texture, especially when defocused.
One thing I miss after retiring from a TV news network job, was my Sony ENG broadcast camera. I am the DP of a medical corporation, but I really miss the ease of use and the ergonomics of my faithful ENG camera. Have you considered trying one out. They were the mainstay, until the camera makers came out with the cinema platform.
My guess on the orbs in the background on the left reference image is uplit or down lit bottles. If you put the bottles on top of a light it will create an effect like this.
the moment i see ur with Sean, man ur gonna be great. i know it 😌
Hoping you get the job! This was such an interesting video! I love learning from your process as well! I personally would've loved to see how you would've had the shot shooting more into the restaurant with the chandeliers in the background! I would personally have framed towards that!
Wow I love this style of video! supper helpful. Thank you for sharing
Great video! These videos feels like a tap in the shoulder or a smack in the head that instills in you that the camera is just one piece of the puzzle. The location, depth, framing, audio and moreso the lighting is far more important to deliver the mood/feel you want in your shots. Some people get stuck at the gear rabbit hole and not get opportunities like these. Cheers!
Great video, Luc. Thanks! Would a Spotlight + gobo on the 600C have gotten you closer to the background red effect you wanted (assuming you had them)? The red in your image felt more like fill than the somewhat specular effect in the source images.
Good point on the gobo.
the alexa 35 is the only camera you can buy which is really ahead of other cameras when it comes to image quality.
A class by itself. Other than the 65 I guess.
Great video, please follow up. I think the sparkling bokeh in the back was really missing in terms of colour and general look. Production design and lighting is more important than the camera maybe at this stage.