I recognize those screen grabs. They're from a documentary about the Nightstalker who was a serial killer that operated in Los Angeles during the '80s. Those men are LAPD or LA Sheriff's detectives.
That was super helpful in many ways. As a corporate photographer drifting into the field of videography I am also in a transition phase between areas I know a lot about and areas I know a bit about, trying to learn the new craft. So seeing someone with your track records tackling a new challenge and only reaching 70% of the goal is liberating. It also helps to grasp the concept of trial and error once again (because how are you supposed to get a thing right, when you never got it wrong before?). Also it reminds me time and again to take more time for the light setup. Often enough corporate customers are like "and then we just need that small thingy done quickly, nothing fancy" but when the results don't look like on national TV or an Apple ad everybody's wondering and asking you why … Thanks a ton for being to open and honest and also show your (30%-ish) failures.
Clicked on this one no noticing how long it was. Thinking I'd only watch a bit of it, I really enjoyed the whole thing. It's good to see that other film makers also take a LONG time to light a scene. Especially solo, it always takes longer than you expect - and usually only looks 7/10 compared to what you hoped for! Thanks for taking the time to put this together. °¬)
Need more separation of subject from background. This can be accomplished in a variety of ways but I would use Aputure 60x’s or Dedolights to spot in areas on the background to silhouette the dark side of the face. I also think the eye sockets are too dark. I would use a larger soft source for more wrap and less contrast in eye sockets. Your eyelight/catchlight approach idea is a great. Overall, I think there needs to be more “ punch” in background. Your blackout methods reveal a lack of lighting/grip experience but as a DP, you can often rely on other crew to support in that area. Best of luck on the project and I applaud the bold move of the test shoot. As an aside: I am completely confident this look could be matched by about any specialized cinema camera… most of it is accomplished in lighting, location selection, and art direction. If your client is an Arri fan then awesome… it makes the job easier.
As a beginner videographer, just getting started with the whole solo thing, this was incredibly interesting. Fascinating to follow you through your process, i learned a ton and added two bits of kit to my wishlist (the MC Pro lights and a decent high power RGB). Thanks for taking the extra time to share this with us.
Cinema graduate here with a lot of C70/FX6 experience, and happily watched the full vid because damn I'm so jelly and this was awesome! I've never had the opprotunity to work with ARRI's but it's so cool to see your planning/pre-production process, and how you're approaching equipment that's out of your normal toolkit. Came here from Sean's community post, but now a fellow subscriber!
Level up your (black out) grip game: Use hardware store purchased black plastic folded on roll (usually comes in 10’x50’ or 10’x100’ rolls… about $50-$75. It’s lightweight, covers large areas, easy to cut-to-size, 6 mil is full-on black out, easy to clip on to crossbar, etc.
Looking at the image, you was definitely on the right track, The theme to me was more gangster/mafia style, soft red accent background lighting and with definition of where their was so the audience can relate, with a strong key light with specular highlights to make the subject "harsher" than normal, giving them that "hard look". I enjoyed this one very much.
Amazing Video. Just to see someone with that much experience still trying out stuff and "playing" with new or unfamiliar Gear is nice to see. I think you analyse at the end also nails it. The Keylight looked super clean but not what the Screenshots looked like. Thank you for the video :D
You mention using wireless monitoring in your Documentary Cinematography course, and it looked like you really needed this here. Having been on set walking back and forth to the camera when adjusting lights, it gets really tiresome, and I do try to always have wireless transmission with me now. However, I absolutely found the video invaluable, and really enjoyed the long-form approach, similar to the course. Thank you!
Man, I loved this, Luc. No better education than watching a pro think through decisions in real time. Your breakdown at the end was particularly helpful. I knew the look didn't fully match, but I couldn't quite detect why (beyond recognizing the overall difference in contrast). But that was a challenging shot to match. Kudos to you for having the professionalism to prepare so far in advance.
Love it! Tip for the solo lighting: bring a wireless director's monitor so you don't have to walk to your cam. Always use it on solo/small team jobs. Saves a lot of time
Amazing video ,I appreciate your input, approach, and most importantly it's relaxing to watch you work. Often times with DP work I tend to be intimidated since I'm green and often feel pressured by the time crunch but I like this approach of practicing before shoot dates and using failure to grow. Subscribed to keep learning from you!
Very enjoyable, as an amateur I’m never going to be in your situation but it was interesting to see what you guys have to go through to get your work. Thank you.
Thank you for such an insightful lighting prep video! Much appreciated. Follow up video please and do you feel soft lighting trending as the goto thing (nowadays) affected your approach instead of opting for harder lighting?
Really enjoyed the video. Seeing the walkthrough and your thought process along the way was enlightening. Well done. As far as the frame, it looked great. It seemed to me that the red in the reference was some sort of red drapery and emulating it with light wasn’t the right “flavor”. At least that is what I perceived on my tiny phone screen.
Hey Luc, this was super helpful... I really got a lot from this video and would encourage you to definitely do a follow up and more of similar videos - one can learn ton from this... being able to see in real time - how you create, adjust and set up the frame - super helpful. Great job..Thanks for this.
Fun to get to tinker like that! The thing irking me in that frame is the big ornate pillar on the bar is not plumb. It’s just off enough that I can’t tell if camera may be slightly out of level, or that thing just isn’t plumb. Then the warm house light that acts as fill on the subject has a weird tint to it. Like it is more yellow than regular 3200k, if that makes sense. Would have liked to see it flagged on the subject, but left on the background. Also the talent’s jacket color was off for the rest of the colors. It clashes with the other yellow/warm colors. A suit jacket like the samples could have added 5-10%!
I agree Luc, the reference image looks like a 2x2 with a grid just out of frame, the harsh fall off while still providing fairly soft nose shadows is a give away, and their angle is definitely more toppy - go fabric to save on grip. As you mentioned, they have more going on in the background too, but it's obviously easier with a gaffer/team (having to walk from the camera to move the light and back over and over really reduces the time you can problem solve creatively). I wouldn't be surprised if the reference on the right used a spotlight mount or two on some small 60w lights giving the checkerboard vibe on the top of the frame, those things do a mountain of work in the BG for bringing out spots of interest in a more controlled manner, and can be feathered off nicely. If I was asked to shoot this from the references I'd ask for 2/3 small 60 watt lights with spotlight mounts (forza 60s are fine). Great for focusing in to backlighting bottles etc, or to strike glasses horizontally without the fall off of a tube/MC - like those specular highlights in the left reference image (probably just fairy lights tho 😆) - keen to see the next one :)
Nice one Louie, I would agree with most of that. I had an Amaran 60x that I should have brought, and some AA fairy lights are already on the way. Spotlight attachments might be a great idea, thanks for the suggestion. The MC's would have helped also, but it's the key I need to figure out. I think it's time for a video deep dive on key lights!
Nice! Love the process. I maybe would have brought a dark suit jacket to test, just to see how the darker jacket on the shoulders stands out from the background or not (as the brown over-shirt automatically creates some separation). The amount of red reflecting on the bar, lower left frame is a bit distracting, so maybe would have also tried to scrim/treat that… and maybe a quick spray of atmosphere aerosol/haze in the background!
It's very impressive you gripped and lit your own scene. I think when the feature hires you as a DP the key grip and gaffer will match any reference frame for you super fast! G&E crew.
It was awesome to watch your thought process for this! One thing I think really helps those references, especially the wider shot, is the haze! Since the background is dark, it looks like they hazed it to keep the subject the most contrasty thing in the frame without making everything behind him too lit.
Great video, Luc. Thanks! Would a Spotlight + gobo on the 600C have gotten you closer to the background red effect you wanted (assuming you had them)? The red in your image felt more like fill than the somewhat specular effect in the source images.
Hey Luc, first off, congrats on the gig!! Secondly I agree, as a frame I thought you nailed the look and I myself would be happy to shoot an interview in that frame. As an LD I agree with your assessment of the key, Closer without the soft box at about 15% would have nailed it. Also hitting the far BG area with the "Absent lights" also would have helped sell the look. I agree with your assessment. However for a first run with a new camera in a new space I think 70% Is not bad. I would love to see the second go round. Cheers, Charlie
As far as if a mere mortal can see the difference between an Arri and other cameras, yes. I hired a DP out of San Francisco who brought his Alexa Mini to shoot my short "Amy's Baby" and when I saw the raw footage, I will admit it brought tears to my eyes. It was so...beautiful.
I wouldn't have done a better job myself, but... I kept thinking about the wardrobe and hoped you would have tried a jacket/shirt in a more complimentary or neutral color agains the warm tungsten background. That's my backseat driving advice 🤣 Reaĺly enjoyed this video. Thank you and the rest of the guys for the work and extra time it took to take us along.
Great break down. Don't think I've ever had 7 hours to light a scene before except maybe installing a studio grid system, maybe 3 for some narrative work earlier in my career. Pretty good result, at a glance I feel like first area where it feels like you miss matching the source is lens selection (you addressed this in video) but having that slightly wider aperture would have let you do a bit more of that subtle lifting in the background with the lights you did have, not that the look you had was bad just that it feels like the biggest departure from the source and kina fuels the rest of the changes. A wider aperture also might have made the use of bokeh more prominent as that's an element that's not nearly as prevalent in your shot. Also the harder key, but you pretty much nailed all the differences in your own assessment.
I didn't think I had time to sit through a nearly hour long video but apparently I did 🤣 It was cool to watch your process. I wish you luck on getting this new gig. And, yes, I'd love to see the followup video but maybe like the 10-15 minute version of it. Thanks for making this 🙏
Great walkthrough. I definitely see a lot more opportunities with a gaffer to support, especially with time. I think you would have been even closer with using the 600C as the key light, with the dome diffuser but a lot closer, even with the diffusion and a grid, just being closer can get you more of those specular highlights. You would be in a much better position to match the colour temp of the house lights and balance with a warmer key vs being stuck with a daylight keylight. I could also see some potential like others have said with a smaller source like a 2x2 panel, but honestly, watching the interviews from the film (ruclips.net/video/Mva2nGveYss/видео.html), there is more going on with the keylight that I think it's more likely a much larger source, like shoot through a 6x6 full grid placed out of frame and flagged off so that it lights the full body but still has enough punch for the specular highlights. Heck it might even be a CRLS reflector bouncing a key from a spotlight mount. Could be a 2x2 CRLS just out of frame, with the light on the floor shooting into it. Also it's looks like they used some more vintage lenses because of the classic swirly bokeh you might find in K35's or soviet lenses like the helios, and more recently the arri alfas etc. There are a number of lenses that can produce those swirls, but it's designed to be an artifact and add a vintage look. If you examine the trailer more and the film, you will see a b and maybe even a c camera setup. So keep in mind that while lighting a sign angle may be part of the job, the b and c angles need to sing and match as well, especially in the bg. The B cameras are also moving on a dolly, or a motorized dana dolly. Also review the bts doc netflix made on the doc here : ruclips.net/video/Jao_4SDb3pI/видео.html, you can see a lot more wider frames too in some of the alternative angles just showing that their key lights were likely spaced out more, but still had that punch to light the head and shoulders. You can also see a powerful eyelight too. I think it's also worth reviewing the dp's work. Nicole B Marsh is now primarily directing, but she has a long list of work in the doc space. Not to mention the gaffer on the doc is Mark Belcher. Both are mentioned in the this post instagram.com/p/CKe64tNJLqs/ which shows a little more bts on the lighting and location. I wish it had the keylight in question, but it shows a lot bigger of a key then we may have thought.
Nice video Luc! For a fully beginner in this world I think it looks awesome. I learned a lot just by watching this. I may not have the equipment yet, but it has given me a good idea on how to set an interview scenario up. I would love to see a follow up on how it turned out to make it 10/10 Love your work! Thanks for the time you use on making RUclips! Hope you get the job!🤞🏻 Regards Richard
I’m really surprised you didn’t bring the MC Pros. :D At the beginning I thought they were gonna be the background MVP. Thanks for this lighting master class! ;)
Great video! These videos feels like a tap in the shoulder or a smack in the head that instills in you that the camera is just one piece of the puzzle. The location, depth, framing, audio and moreso the lighting is far more important to deliver the mood/feel you want in your shots. Some people get stuck at the gear rabbit hole and not get opportunities like these. Cheers!
It would be cool if you mounted the lens to a tripod and PL mount and then rotate out cameras so nothing changes except for the camera body. They're all full frame and all shooting in log formats.
Hoping you get the job! This was such an interesting video! I love learning from your process as well! I personally would've loved to see how you would've had the shot shooting more into the restaurant with the chandeliers in the background! I would personally have framed towards that!
Could a Fresnel with barndoors on the key light suite that harder "interrogation" look? would that be less practical for logistical reasons than a 2x2 panel or tube bank like you mentioned, or is it just that the effect would be wrong with a lens on the key light? Very interesting video; very cool to see how you handle the conception of something like this. Thanks for sharing.
Heya, just wanted to hop in here too to add that your talent/actor also determines a lot of the vibe. The reference frames both had old maffiosi, and while @forgelabs is a lovely dude, he wasn’t giving maffioso. To add to that; his coat blended a bit too well with the yellow and red of the background, it didn’t bring any color contrast into the scene in any case, which the blue-ish suit of the men in the reference images did. Ok, those were my two cents on the matter. On another note, I picked up a lot, thanks for putting in the extra effort of making this into a YT vid.
Nice job. A dozen more set ups like that and you should have it down to about 20-30 min setups. My first interview took a while but now I like to streamline, do more with less. I love motivated color pops though I know your usual is more real world lighting. I'd have thrown a fast 85 if I could find one. Fun watch! Hope you get it!
Great Video Luc, aside from what you mentioned. personally I would play with the ambient a bit more and try to control it, breaking it up into zones. The humongous 3200k when the subject is in a a dark green top blends together IMO. More of an edge light could help with this separation. Although you didn’t have the MC’s you could possibly have use the fresnel effect of the metal in the kitchen to create some hot spots with a different source. Finally the Alexa 35 has exceptional colour fidelity and I feel like you are loosing tonal subtlety in the skin tone using that Aputure light as it has a pretty narrow spectrum. An HMI or something like the new 1200x with the BLAIR engine might bring some more dimensionality. Great that you got the job!
Thank you for sharing. I agree on your assesments of the test you did. Almost all that I saw you pointed out too. 2 things I'd like to add (just for you to look closer - maybe there is something in it, maybe not): - green tint made everything a bit dirty with some vintage feel to it (and I suppose Cooke added up to it too) - almost like you shot on some vintage Snyder-like anamorphic 😂 And the look you seek is more of a Fincher style clean I guess - the only thing I do not like in your lighting is work with red light. It is too subtle for a background accent stylized look. So it is just dirtying the frame. And it is to strong on the bar table... So I'd do a lot of blocking here and there to get it it brighter on the right side but not to spill it on the left side of the frame. Hope this helps and anyway you did a great job 👍
My guess on the orbs in the background on the left reference image is uplit or down lit bottles. If you put the bottles on top of a light it will create an effect like this.
Hi Luc, first of all I think the shot you took looks good but I had a couple of thoughts on how to get closer to the reference. I thought the lighting in both reference frames were slightly different to your interpretation, I have done something similar in the past and I achieved the effect by taking a panel light and boomed it over the top of the head (with a c-stand and flag arm) pointing directly down with a soft light at a lower power filling in those panda eyes (similar to your 300d, probably a little more front on, but with still enough angle to get the shadow on one side). I also think that the stop difference between the subject and background is too similar. Traditionally, I was always taught that it should be around 4-stops, but nowadays we don’t do things that extreme, however in the reference I think it is closer to this. Using house lights to generate fill is a good idea but this instance I thought the colour temperature was off and mudding up the colours. I would have taken one of the Infinibars from the back bounced into a wall for the fill. This is a trick I heard Oren Sofer talking about on shooting The Creator and it can really help keep the colours of the room and really soften the light allowing for more control of the shadows. Also, I know that the reference has yellow lights but I think that yours were mixing with the red bringing down the intense saturation that the reference had. This is also mixing with the ‘Cooke Look’ (which is quite warm in my experience) and everything is just becoming more yellow than red. Which muting all the colours (which I think works quite well, but isn’t part of the reference). I don’t know if any of these things are correct (I don’t know how many people will agree) but I maybe something here might spark something that will help if you have another stab at it. I know I have said a lot of words but I do actually like the finished shot and kudos on putting your test out there for idiots like my self to comment on. I not sure I would be so brave.
great job, gentlemen! The only thing I would complain about is the fact that your location is a bit too obvious in the frame. The references do not clearly show that we are in a bar or restaurant. To sum up, I'm not convinced by your bottles in the frame 🙂
Which flowtech are u using ? The 75 ? Do you enjoy the head of it or not ? Because iv found just the sticks for 600 euro , I was gonna go for it but im unsure.
Hi Luc, Will you eventually change to deity Deity TC 1 or another Aperture/Deity family TC lav mic to be in one ecosystem with the app? ( TC 1 are great I own 4 of them much better vs tentacle system) Amazing tutos and video you delivered here! Kudos
2 дня назад+1
the alexa 35 is the only camera you can buy which is really ahead of other cameras when it comes to image quality.
Very cool. I was gonna say most of what you already knew. I saw the reference show. Can't remember what it was but I saw it. Although the images you were working had a look, I think they were too spotty. Hot spots are things we try not to have? IMHO I think somewhere in the middle. Stronger than what you had and tone down what they had. This is cool stuff. If it helped land the job or improve confidence... it certainly was not a waste of time. At all.
Loved the learning experience of it all, the background bokeh orbs were there, it was just missing intensity. I would've smashed it with harsh cob lights to make it appear vs soft light bars
Personally I think its BS production dictating feature film cameras are a must for tv doc,s . Ive shot for Netflix doc with my fx9 , fx6 B camera / gimbal , the other half of the same episode was shot on a Venice , and there is zero difference , no problems or complaints from post / or producers . And I shot the interviews with one light. I think your lighting is better TBH , I mean equally you could get in trouble , or at least makeup would ,for the hot, over exposed burnt out patches on the original clips skin tones . Good luck but I hate those shoots when you want you to match something that isn't that good in the first place . They are way to too bright , and way too much xmas lights in the BG , and red ? really ..
@@sammorganmoore Im sure its a decent production , and they have made a good choice of DP , they just need to let the him do his own work . IMHO . Just saying he should be careful not to get stuck just aping someone's else's work., especially when his own is as good or better.
For reference, I’ve been a commercial photographer for 30+ years. I think your approach was very good however the light bulb in the center of the frame was very distracting. Also, to impress the client a bit more, grabbing a guy off the street (if possible) that matched the men in the reference stills to sit in for a minute would have been a good touch. Overall, the effort was more important than the resulting video.
I think you did great on the whole. But, I think you biggest problem is trying to use the gear that you have in terms of lighting vs the gear that you need. I would wager that a litemat 2 or 4 was the key in that original interview and not something from aperture.. No shade on them, but the higher level shoots (e.g. Netflix) we tend to go with higher level gear and it does make a difference. Also I think there is a lot more hidden grip gear in the references than meets the eye. Wouldn't be surprised either if it was arri lf vs alexa 35 (not a fan of) or Alexa mini. The colors also feel really muddy in you example which i do think is a side effect either of RUclips compression or the aperture lighting. They are fine for lower budget but to be honest thier previous generation lights especially the 300d which I would never key with, left a lot to be desired. Cooke lenses are my favorite but also prob the wrong choice for this. It certainly has a ziess ultra prime / master prime (if s35) or arri signature if large format look.
Great feedback! You're probably right, might make an argument for some more premium lights, but for an unpaid test I think the Aputure stuff worked well enough. Will be interesting to see as their colour science improves how quickly they'll be able to close the gap. Luckily there will be a gaffer on the actual set, so I'll have a pro on hand to help!
@@LucForsyth absolutely. For testing totally perfectly and we are all guilty of budget (looks at the multiple 1200ds on my next order!) also I don't know if you have ever looked into CRMX and something like blackout as a control system but might be much worth it so you can use basically any DMX capable light in one program. Much changed the way I work.
It would be cool for you to try to recreate the look, correct it as you believe you need to, capture it with the Arri, also with your FX6, AND a cell phone for kicks.
![COLOMBIA vs. CHILE [4-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 10](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/TDjN4W3yy1k/mqdefault.jpg)
Had a blast doing this! Thanks for the invite!
Couldn't have done it without you! Literally, there wouldn't have been anyone to film!
THE GOAT IS HERE
Sean Is a qualified actor
I would never have imagined seeing the Forge Labs on the cinematography side of RUclips lol
Low key explains alot
I recognize those screen grabs. They're from a documentary about the Nightstalker who was a serial killer that operated in Los Angeles during the '80s. Those men are LAPD or LA Sheriff's detectives.
That was super helpful in many ways. As a corporate photographer drifting into the field of videography I am also in a transition phase between areas I know a lot about and areas I know a bit about, trying to learn the new craft. So seeing someone with your track records tackling a new challenge and only reaching 70% of the goal is liberating. It also helps to grasp the concept of trial and error once again (because how are you supposed to get a thing right, when you never got it wrong before?). Also it reminds me time and again to take more time for the light setup. Often enough corporate customers are like "and then we just need that small thingy done quickly, nothing fancy" but when the results don't look like on national TV or an Apple ad everybody's wondering and asking you why … Thanks a ton for being to open and honest and also show your (30%-ish) failures.
Clicked on this one no noticing how long it was. Thinking I'd only watch a bit of it, I really enjoyed the whole thing. It's good to see that other film makers also take a LONG time to light a scene. Especially solo, it always takes longer than you expect - and usually only looks 7/10 compared to what you hoped for! Thanks for taking the time to put this together. °¬)
Oh yeah you’re right it’s almost an hour. Nice. *kicks up feet, lighter flicks*
Literally same
Need more separation of subject from background. This can be accomplished in a variety of ways but I would use Aputure 60x’s or Dedolights to spot in areas on the background to silhouette the dark side of the face. I also think the eye sockets are too dark. I would use a larger soft source for more wrap and less contrast in eye sockets. Your eyelight/catchlight approach idea is a great.
Overall, I think there needs to be more “ punch” in background.
Your blackout methods reveal a lack of lighting/grip experience but as a DP, you can often rely on other crew to support in that area.
Best of luck on the project and I applaud the bold move of the test shoot.
As an aside: I am completely confident this look could be matched by about any specialized cinema camera… most of it is accomplished in lighting, location selection, and art direction. If your client is an Arri fan then awesome… it makes the job easier.
10 out of 10. This is exactly the kind of content I want to watch. Keep ‘em coming! And yes I want to see the second part. Thanks for the great work!!
As a beginner videographer, just getting started with the whole solo thing, this was incredibly interesting. Fascinating to follow you through your process, i learned a ton and added two bits of kit to my wishlist (the MC Pro lights and a decent high power RGB). Thanks for taking the extra time to share this with us.
Love that you're walking us through your process. Would love to see more of this kind of stuff! Good luck and I hope you get the gig!
Great deep dive, nice to see the whole process rather than "5 quick tips". Good one!
Good Luck, Luc! You're living all of our dreams! Your hard work paid off!
An Arri Alexa 35. Wow.
Cinema graduate here with a lot of C70/FX6 experience, and happily watched the full vid because damn I'm so jelly and this was awesome! I've never had the opprotunity to work with ARRI's but it's so cool to see your planning/pre-production process, and how you're approaching equipment that's out of your normal toolkit. Came here from Sean's community post, but now a fellow subscriber!
Great to have you man!
Arri is like Fx6 or C70 but really heavy and no autocus.
10 out of 10, fantastic breakdown of your thought process and work flow. I need to do these pre-production studies.
This video is filled with incredibly useful information for filmmakers. Thanks for taking us through your process
MY MAN FORGELABS SENT ME HERE this is so cool especially as I want to work with filmmaking and stuff when I’m older
Level up your (black out) grip game:
Use hardware store purchased black plastic folded on roll (usually comes in 10’x50’ or 10’x100’ rolls… about $50-$75. It’s lightweight, covers large areas, easy to cut-to-size, 6 mil is full-on black out, easy to clip on to crossbar, etc.
Thanks, Shane Hurlbut.
Looking at the image, you was definitely on the right track, The theme to me was more gangster/mafia style, soft red accent background lighting and with definition of where their was so the audience can relate, with a strong key light with specular highlights to make the subject "harsher" than normal, giving them that "hard look".
I enjoyed this one very much.
agreed!
Amazing video, love this concept because it's very informative. Hope to see more of these. You definitely my favorite doc youtuber!
Amazing Video. Just to see someone with that much experience still trying out stuff and "playing" with new or unfamiliar Gear is nice to see. I think you analyse at the end also nails it. The Keylight looked super clean but not what the Screenshots looked like. Thank you for the video :D
Definately one of my favourite videos. Learned alot.
You mention using wireless monitoring in your Documentary Cinematography course, and it looked like you really needed this here. Having been on set walking back and forth to the camera when adjusting lights, it gets really tiresome, and I do try to always have wireless transmission with me now.
However, I absolutely found the video invaluable, and really enjoyed the long-form approach, similar to the course. Thank you!
Man, I loved this, Luc. No better education than watching a pro think through decisions in real time. Your breakdown at the end was particularly helpful. I knew the look didn't fully match, but I couldn't quite detect why (beyond recognizing the overall difference in contrast). But that was a challenging shot to match. Kudos to you for having the professionalism to prepare so far in advance.
Love it! Tip for the solo lighting: bring a wireless director's monitor so you don't have to walk to your cam.
Always use it on solo/small team jobs. Saves a lot of time
Thank you, I'm recent Uni Grad, and my peers didn't understand why I always rented gear just to learn and build my portfolio. Great tips man!
So good to watch and I'm realising that you need more than just good lighting, you need fantastic lighting and more so with the lighting setup.
Amazing video ,I appreciate your input, approach, and most importantly it's relaxing to watch you work. Often times with DP work I tend to be intimidated since I'm green and often feel pressured by the time crunch but I like this approach of practicing before shoot dates and using failure to grow. Subscribed to keep learning from you!
Thanks for showing us the meat of it all, I loved observing your approach to the frame. Very insightful!
Very enjoyable, as an amateur I’m never going to be in your situation but it was interesting to see what you guys have to go through to get your work.
Thank you.
Thank you for such an insightful lighting prep video! Much appreciated. Follow up video please and do you feel soft lighting trending as the goto thing (nowadays) affected your approach instead of opting for harder lighting?
Best doc filmmaking channel on RUclips.
Great taking us through the process. Best of luck. Go for it Mr.Luc
Oh, you are so close! Both on the lighting and hitting 100K subs. Awesome content.
Amazing Video! You got it pretty close, planning is so important, thanks for reminding us.
Really enjoyed the video. Seeing the walkthrough and your thought process along the way was enlightening. Well done. As far as the frame, it looked great. It seemed to me that the red in the reference was some sort of red drapery and emulating it with light wasn’t the right “flavor”. At least that is what I perceived on my tiny phone screen.
Hey Luc, this was super helpful... I really got a lot from this video and would encourage you to definitely do a follow up and more of similar videos - one can learn ton from this... being able to see in real time - how you create, adjust and set up the frame - super helpful. Great job..Thanks for this.
I just might! Thanks Maros
thanks so much for showing this process start to finish
Thanks for this walkthrough - very interesting & learned so much!
Fun to get to tinker like that! The thing irking me in that frame is the big ornate pillar on the bar is not plumb. It’s just off enough that I can’t tell if camera may be slightly out of level, or that thing just isn’t plumb.
Then the warm house light that acts as fill on the subject has a weird tint to it. Like it is more yellow than regular 3200k, if that makes sense. Would have liked to see it flagged on the subject, but left on the background.
Also the talent’s jacket color was off for the rest of the colors. It clashes with the other yellow/warm colors. A suit jacket like the samples could have added 5-10%!
I agree Luc, the reference image looks like a 2x2 with a grid just out of frame, the harsh fall off while still providing fairly soft nose shadows is a give away, and their angle is definitely more toppy - go fabric to save on grip. As you mentioned, they have more going on in the background too, but it's obviously easier with a gaffer/team (having to walk from the camera to move the light and back over and over really reduces the time you can problem solve creatively). I wouldn't be surprised if the reference on the right used a spotlight mount or two on some small 60w lights giving the checkerboard vibe on the top of the frame, those things do a mountain of work in the BG for bringing out spots of interest in a more controlled manner, and can be feathered off nicely. If I was asked to shoot this from the references I'd ask for 2/3 small 60 watt lights with spotlight mounts (forza 60s are fine). Great for focusing in to backlighting bottles etc, or to strike glasses horizontally without the fall off of a tube/MC - like those specular highlights in the left reference image (probably just fairy lights tho 😆) - keen to see the next one :)
Nice one Louie, I would agree with most of that. I had an Amaran 60x that I should have brought, and some AA fairy lights are already on the way. Spotlight attachments might be a great idea, thanks for the suggestion. The MC's would have helped also, but it's the key I need to figure out. I think it's time for a video deep dive on key lights!
Nice! Love the process. I maybe would have brought a dark suit jacket to test, just to see how the darker jacket on the shoulders stands out from the background or not (as the brown over-shirt automatically creates some separation). The amount of red reflecting on the bar, lower left frame is a bit distracting, so maybe would have also tried to scrim/treat that… and maybe a quick spray of atmosphere aerosol/haze in the background!
Great walk through of your processes. Thanks for sharing the good, bad, and ugly of the process.
adore this, and your openness about your own hurdles and learnings is fantastic 🔥
It's very impressive you gripped and lit your own scene. I think when the feature hires you as a DP the key grip and gaffer will match any reference frame for you super fast! G&E crew.
Its not that impressive because it does not demonstrate the skill of directing crew.
@@sammorganmoore Technically the audience is the crew. We are the crew, he was communicating and telling us how he was shaping the light.
Wow Luc, so much value in one video, thank you!
Great video, would love more in depth videos like this!
It was awesome to watch your thought process for this! One thing I think really helps those references, especially the wider shot, is the haze! Since the background is dark, it looks like they hazed it to keep the subject the most contrasty thing in the frame without making everything behind him too lit.
Great video, Luc. Thanks! Would a Spotlight + gobo on the 600C have gotten you closer to the background red effect you wanted (assuming you had them)? The red in your image felt more like fill than the somewhat specular effect in the source images.
Good point on the gobo.
Luc you’re a beast and an inspiration man.
Hey Luc, first off, congrats on the gig!! Secondly I agree, as a frame I thought you nailed the look and I myself would be happy to shoot an interview in that frame. As an LD I agree with your assessment of the key, Closer without the soft box at about 15% would have nailed it. Also hitting the far BG area with the "Absent lights" also would have helped sell the look. I agree with your assessment. However for a first run with a new camera in a new space I think 70% Is not bad. I would love to see the second go round. Cheers, Charlie
This real time learning process is hugely helpful. Please film the next test shoot as well!
As far as if a mere mortal can see the difference between an Arri and other cameras, yes.
I hired a DP out of San Francisco who brought his Alexa Mini to shoot my short "Amy's Baby" and when I saw the raw footage, I will admit it brought tears to my eyes. It was so...beautiful.
I wouldn't have done a better job myself, but...
I kept thinking about the wardrobe and hoped you would have tried a jacket/shirt in a more complimentary or neutral color agains the warm tungsten background.
That's my backseat driving advice 🤣 Reaĺly enjoyed this video. Thank you and the rest of the guys for the work and extra time it took to take us along.
Yes the contrast between the costum and background was a fail.
Great break down. Don't think I've ever had 7 hours to light a scene before except maybe installing a studio grid system, maybe 3 for some narrative work earlier in my career. Pretty good result, at a glance I feel like first area where it feels like you miss matching the source is lens selection (you addressed this in video) but having that slightly wider aperture would have let you do a bit more of that subtle lifting in the background with the lights you did have, not that the look you had was bad just that it feels like the biggest departure from the source and kina fuels the rest of the changes. A wider aperture also might have made the use of bokeh more prominent as that's an element that's not nearly as prevalent in your shot. Also the harder key, but you pretty much nailed all the differences in your own assessment.
I didn't think I had time to sit through a nearly hour long video but apparently I did 🤣 It was cool to watch your process. I wish you luck on getting this new gig. And, yes, I'd love to see the followup video but maybe like the 10-15 minute version of it. Thanks for making this 🙏
Great tutorial! I will definitely be interested in the second attempt.
It was fascinating, and I was totally absorbed in the process and the analysis. Thanks for sharing; I certainly learned a lot.
Great walkthrough. I definitely see a lot more opportunities with a gaffer to support, especially with time. I think you would have been even closer with using the 600C as the key light, with the dome diffuser but a lot closer, even with the diffusion and a grid, just being closer can get you more of those specular highlights. You would be in a much better position to match the colour temp of the house lights and balance with a warmer key vs being stuck with a daylight keylight.
I could also see some potential like others have said with a smaller source like a 2x2 panel, but honestly, watching the interviews from the film (ruclips.net/video/Mva2nGveYss/видео.html), there is more going on with the keylight that I think it's more likely a much larger source, like shoot through a 6x6 full grid placed out of frame and flagged off so that it lights the full body but still has enough punch for the specular highlights. Heck it might even be a CRLS reflector bouncing a key from a spotlight mount. Could be a 2x2 CRLS just out of frame, with the light on the floor shooting into it.
Also it's looks like they used some more vintage lenses because of the classic swirly bokeh you might find in K35's or soviet lenses like the helios, and more recently the arri alfas etc. There are a number of lenses that can produce those swirls, but it's designed to be an artifact and add a vintage look.
If you examine the trailer more and the film, you will see a b and maybe even a c camera setup. So keep in mind that while lighting a sign angle may be part of the job, the b and c angles need to sing and match as well, especially in the bg. The B cameras are also moving on a dolly, or a motorized dana dolly.
Also review the bts doc netflix made on the doc here : ruclips.net/video/Jao_4SDb3pI/видео.html, you can see a lot more wider frames too in some of the alternative angles just showing that their key lights were likely spaced out more, but still had that punch to light the head and shoulders. You can also see a powerful eyelight too.
I think it's also worth reviewing the dp's work. Nicole B Marsh is now primarily directing, but she has a long list of work in the doc space. Not to mention the gaffer on the doc is Mark Belcher. Both are mentioned in the this post instagram.com/p/CKe64tNJLqs/ which shows a little more bts on the lighting and location. I wish it had the keylight in question, but it shows a lot bigger of a key then we may have thought.
Prior Preparation Prevents Poor Performance. Case in point! Good Luck Luc!
Nice video Luc!
For a fully beginner in this world I think it looks awesome. I learned a lot just by watching this. I may not have the equipment yet, but it has given me a good idea on how to set an interview scenario up.
I would love to see a follow up on how it turned out to make it 10/10
Love your work! Thanks for the time you use on making RUclips!
Hope you get the job!🤞🏻
Regards
Richard
Great to hear RIchard!
I’m really surprised you didn’t bring the MC Pros. :D At the beginning I thought they were gonna be the background MVP. Thanks for this lighting master class! ;)
It wasn't on purpose 😉
@@LucForsyth I know, I know :)
Great video! These videos feels like a tap in the shoulder or a smack in the head that instills in you that the camera is just one piece of the puzzle. The location, depth, framing, audio and moreso the lighting is far more important to deliver the mood/feel you want in your shots. Some people get stuck at the gear rabbit hole and not get opportunities like these. Cheers!
I’d love to see a follow up attempt. This is great educational content. I’ve learned a lot from you.
It would be cool if you mounted the lens to a tripod and PL mount and then rotate out cameras so nothing changes except for the camera body. They're all full frame and all shooting in log formats.
Hoping you get the job! This was such an interesting video! I love learning from your process as well! I personally would've loved to see how you would've had the shot shooting more into the restaurant with the chandeliers in the background! I would personally have framed towards that!
Could a Fresnel with barndoors on the key light suite that harder "interrogation" look? would that be less practical for logistical reasons than a 2x2 panel or tube bank like you mentioned, or is it just that the effect would be wrong with a lens on the key light?
Very interesting video; very cool to see how you handle the conception of something like this. Thanks for sharing.
Wish you all the best 🤞🏽💪🏾
the moment i see ur with Sean, man ur gonna be great. i know it 😌
Heya, just wanted to hop in here too to add that your talent/actor also determines a lot of the vibe. The reference frames both had old maffiosi, and while @forgelabs is a lovely dude, he wasn’t giving maffioso. To add to that; his coat blended a bit too well with the yellow and red of the background, it didn’t bring any color contrast into the scene in any case, which the blue-ish suit of the men in the reference images did. Ok, those were my two cents on the matter. On another note, I picked up a lot, thanks for putting in the extra effort of making this into a YT vid.
The guy in the suit is a cop I'm betting.
Nice job. A dozen more set ups like that and you should have it down to about 20-30 min setups. My first interview took a while but now I like to streamline, do more with less. I love motivated color pops though I know your usual is more real world lighting. I'd have thrown a fast 85 if I could find one. Fun watch!
Hope you get it!
Luckily I'll have at least that many attempts!
Great Video Luc, aside from what you mentioned. personally I would play with the ambient a bit more and try to control it, breaking it up into zones. The humongous 3200k when the subject is in a a dark green top blends together IMO. More of an edge light could help with this separation. Although you didn’t have the MC’s you could possibly have use the fresnel effect of the metal in the kitchen to create some hot spots with a different source. Finally the Alexa 35 has exceptional colour fidelity and I feel like you are loosing tonal subtlety in the skin tone using that Aputure light as it has a pretty narrow spectrum. An HMI or something like the new 1200x with the BLAIR engine might bring some more dimensionality. Great that you got the job!
Thank you for sharing. I agree on your assesments of the test you did. Almost all that I saw you pointed out too.
2 things I'd like to add (just for you to look closer - maybe there is something in it, maybe not):
- green tint made everything a bit dirty with some vintage feel to it (and I suppose Cooke added up to it too) - almost like you shot on some vintage Snyder-like anamorphic 😂 And the look you seek is more of a Fincher style clean I guess
- the only thing I do not like in your lighting is work with red light. It is too subtle for a background accent stylized look. So it is just dirtying the frame. And it is to strong on the bar table... So I'd do a lot of blocking here and there to get it it brighter on the right side but not to spill it on the left side of the frame.
Hope this helps and anyway you did a great job 👍
My guess on the orbs in the background on the left reference image is uplit or down lit bottles. If you put the bottles on top of a light it will create an effect like this.
Hi Luc, first of all I think the shot you took looks good but I had a couple of thoughts on how to get closer to the reference.
I thought the lighting in both reference frames were slightly different to your interpretation, I have done something similar in the past and I achieved the effect by taking a panel light and boomed it over the top of the head (with a c-stand and flag arm) pointing directly down with a soft light at a lower power filling in those panda eyes (similar to your 300d, probably a little more front on, but with still enough angle to get the shadow on one side).
I also think that the stop difference between the subject and background is too similar. Traditionally, I was always taught that it should be around 4-stops, but nowadays we don’t do things that extreme, however in the reference I think it is closer to this.
Using house lights to generate fill is a good idea but this instance I thought the colour temperature was off and mudding up the colours. I would have taken one of the Infinibars from the back bounced into a wall for the fill. This is a trick I heard Oren Sofer talking about on shooting The Creator and it can really help keep the colours of the room and really soften the light allowing for more control of the shadows.
Also, I know that the reference has yellow lights but I think that yours were mixing with the red bringing down the intense saturation that the reference had. This is also mixing with the ‘Cooke Look’ (which is quite warm in my experience) and everything is just becoming more yellow than red. Which muting all the colours (which I think works quite well, but isn’t part of the reference).
I don’t know if any of these things are correct (I don’t know how many people will agree) but I maybe something here might spark something that will help if you have another stab at it. I know I have said a lot of words but I do actually like the finished shot and kudos on putting your test out there for idiots like my self to comment on. I not sure I would be so brave.
Wow I love this style of video! supper helpful. Thank you for sharing
great job, gentlemen! The only thing I would complain about is the fact that your location is a bit too obvious in the frame. The references do not clearly show that we are in a bar or restaurant. To sum up, I'm not convinced by your bottles in the frame 🙂
Fantastic..a nice filmmaker's documentary!
Which flowtech are u using ? The 75 ? Do you enjoy the head of it or not ? Because iv found just the sticks for 600 euro , I was gonna go for it but im unsure.
Hi Luc,
Will you eventually change to deity Deity TC 1 or another Aperture/Deity family TC lav mic to be in one ecosystem with the app?
( TC 1 are great I own 4 of them much better vs tentacle system)
Amazing tutos and video you delivered here! Kudos
the alexa 35 is the only camera you can buy which is really ahead of other cameras when it comes to image quality.
A class by itself. Other than the 65 I guess.
Very cool. I was gonna say most of what you already knew. I saw the reference show. Can't remember what it was but I saw it. Although the images you were working had a look, I think they were too spotty. Hot spots are things we try not to have? IMHO I think somewhere in the middle. Stronger than what you had and tone down what they had. This is cool stuff. If it helped land the job or improve confidence... it certainly was not a waste of time. At all.
48:00 love it.. light tests are key, a solid career investment!
Loved the learning experience of it all, the background bokeh orbs were there, it was just missing intensity. I would've smashed it with harsh cob lights to make it appear vs soft light bars
Exactly...I left the case of the behind (like a pro), and it really showed
Have to say your FX3 looks beautiful. Brill
Inspiring video! Wouldn't you be able to ask the DOP's making the reference shots for advice on how they did it?
good fellas .... top soft box with a eggkrate..the fill is bouce up "no light "of the table or somthing else.
Thank u man for this educational . Trust me u ll one get to 1 million subs keep up the hard work and these educational videos
Personally I think its BS production dictating feature film cameras are a must for tv doc,s . Ive shot for Netflix doc with my fx9 , fx6 B camera / gimbal , the other half of the same episode was shot on a Venice , and there is zero difference , no problems or complaints from post / or producers . And I shot the interviews with one light. I think your lighting is better TBH , I mean equally you could get in trouble , or at least makeup would ,for the hot, over exposed burnt out patches on the original clips skin tones . Good luck but I hate those shoots when you want you to match something that isn't that good in the first place . They are way to too bright , and way too much xmas lights in the BG , and red ? really ..
A lot of holes in this production indeed.
@@sammorganmoore Im sure its a decent production , and they have made a good choice of DP , they just need to let the him do his own work . IMHO . Just saying he should be careful not to get stuck just aping someone's else's work., especially when his own is as good or better.
Thank you soo much for this and every video you make it helped me alot. ♥️🙏
I liked this. the behind the lights was cool.
More of this kind of content, thx!
Master-class instructional video. Outstanding! I am feeling a bit dirty watching this....like I should be paying for this! Please film the follow up.
Please film any follow-ups! This was fantastic, very much appreciated! :)
I really enjoyed this. Great insights and tips 👍🏼
An hour long Luc Forsyth video with Arri cameras?! Let me make some coffee and get comfortable lol
Love watching this. I saw what you were saying but I don't know my self other then I know you are a master.
Hope you get the job! Noticed you said F stop, in the breakdown of the reference photos. Are the Cooke lenses not in T stop?
For reference, I’ve been a commercial photographer for 30+ years. I think your approach was very good however the light bulb in the center of the frame was very distracting. Also, to impress the client a bit more, grabbing a guy off the street (if possible) that matched the men in the reference stills to sit in for a minute would have been a good touch. Overall, the effort was more important than the resulting video.
I think you did great on the whole. But, I think you biggest problem is trying to use the gear that you have in terms of lighting vs the gear that you need. I would wager that a litemat 2 or 4 was the key in that original interview and not something from aperture.. No shade on them, but the higher level shoots (e.g. Netflix) we tend to go with higher level gear and it does make a difference. Also I think there is a lot more hidden grip gear in the references than meets the eye. Wouldn't be surprised either if it was arri lf vs alexa 35 (not a fan of) or Alexa mini. The colors also feel really muddy in you example which i do think is a side effect either of RUclips compression or the aperture lighting. They are fine for lower budget but to be honest thier previous generation lights especially the 300d which I would never key with, left a lot to be desired. Cooke lenses are my favorite but also prob the wrong choice for this. It certainly has a ziess ultra prime / master prime (if s35) or arri signature if large format look.
Great feedback! You're probably right, might make an argument for some more premium lights, but for an unpaid test I think the Aputure stuff worked well enough. Will be interesting to see as their colour science improves how quickly they'll be able to close the gap. Luckily there will be a gaffer on the actual set, so I'll have a pro on hand to help!
@@LucForsyth absolutely. For testing totally perfectly and we are all guilty of budget (looks at the multiple 1200ds on my next order!) also I don't know if you have ever looked into CRMX and something like blackout as a control system but might be much worth it so you can use basically any DMX capable light in one program. Much changed the way I work.
Tiny bit of smoke would have done magic. Bit of Christmas lights at the back as well.
So great video, thanks 🎉
It would be cool for you to try to recreate the look, correct it as you believe you need to, capture it with the Arri, also with your FX6, AND a cell phone for kicks.