Prof. Stefano Passerini - Low Costs will drive Sodium-Ion Batteries | Battery Podcast
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- Опубликовано: 26 июл 2024
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In the second episode of "Battery Generation" we talk to Prof. #Stefano #Passerini, an Italian chemist. He has been researching #sodium as a #sustainable #battery #material for more than 10 years now. We asked him to display the possibility of #sodium #ion #batteries (#SIBs) replacing nowadays #lithium-based #energy #storage# systems in #EVs and #stationary #batteries.
Bam! In July 2021 the largest #Chinese #manufacturer of #lithium-#ion batteries #CATL ("#Contemporary #Amperex #Technology Co. Limited") unveiled its latest breakthrough technology by releasing its first generation of sodium-ion batteries (SIBs).
Based on a series of #innovations in the chemistry system, CATL’s first generation of SIBs has the advantages of comparatively high-#energy #density, fast-charging #capability, great low-temperature #performance and high-integration #efficiency, among others.
The #energy #density of CATL’s SIB cell can supposedly achieve up to 160Wh/kg, and the battery can charge in 15 minutes to 80% at room temperature. Moreover, in a low-temperature environment of -20°C, the sodium-ion battery has a #capacity retention rate of more than 90%, and its system integration #efficiency can reach more than 80%. These are impressive results when comparing to nowadays #lithium-ion #battery #performance numbers.
We asked our guest Prof. Dr. #Stefano #Passerini to take a stand regarding the latest #research findings on SIBs. What are the main differences concerning the #abundance of the used #materials, #sustainability, #recycling, #price, #energy #density and #safety #issues.
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Nice video. Just subscribed. How do I apply for PhD in electrochemistry and corrosion in your institutions?
www.hiu-batteries.de
@@batterygeneration Thanks for the prompt reply.
P iled
H igher
D eeper
Thank you so much for contributing to the podcast, Prof. Passerini.
More informative. There are ton of videos on youtube regarding this topic but nobody explained in such depth. You deserve more subscribers. 👍
Great prez. 10 months later, end Mar 2023, Stefano's dreams seem to be even a bit modest! CATL now says that their Na-ion has achieved equivalence to LFP batteries and will be in full prod summer 2023, at 160Wh/Kg. They intend to extend a cheaper Na-ion offering across their entire range over next year or so. They also project imminent 200Wh/Kg level.
Great interview and great humble professor! I love this kind of persons.
healthy discussion on renewable energy
Given the increasing need for desalination of seawater in many areas of the world for drinking, industry and agriculture i see a major advantage...currently the brine is a toxic waste product that is difficult to dispose of. If however it becomes a battery making resource it makes both processes more viable and removes much of the
brine disposal problem .
Protecting the marine environment and providing a already concentrated filtered source.
My concerns on these batteries are severely reduced acceleration due to the lower voltage, and also the significantly reduced range, as well as the lead time to get these to scale if the first two problems can be solved.
In my opinion, wrong from the start. Lithium is not limited in quantity in earths core. There are lithium deposits all around the world. It is also reusable so the amount needed is not infinite like need of oil is. The refinery capacity has been limited but it is increasing fast. Natrium is though cheaper than lithium. IMO
Sodium Ion Batteries will help expand Storage to help meet the needs of the Energy Transition
Nice interview! Please do more podcasts on sodium-ion.
Can you find out what the charge rate and speed of charge of Sodium compared to lithium?
Thank you so much for this amazing discussion about sodium-ion batteries. Please, I ask you to talk about zinc-ion sodium. Best regards
Thank you for your comment, Hicham. We will cover Zinc-ion batteries, soon!
A little digression. Prof P. mentions the cost of high-quality graphite for these and other batteries. There's at least 2 companies out there producing technology that directly convert CH4 + electricity + heat => H2 and high-grade graphite BUT NO CO2! So methane can be cleared up from oil driller sites and profitably converted to transition feedstuff: a complete non-polluting replacement for steam-reforming with superior economics!
Not too loud! Once wall st hears about this...salt will be more expensive than gas!
Sodium ion should be a great solution for stationary energy storage.
They could also work well as a daily driver battery in swappable battery cars like Nio. Just swap for higher density batteries for long trips.
Yeah when it comes to small scale storage for homes this could be ideal. It's much safer than Li-ion where the risk of burning down your house is higher.
When it comes to greater scale stationary storage for like big solar and even wind powerplants I think liquid metal batteries are gonna be a better solution.
They are extremely cheap, have little to no risk, are 100% recyclable and ofcourse have high storage capacity.
Downsides are that they have to be ran on high temperatures of 600 degrees Celcius and that they are shortterm storage.
These downsides can be compensated by the scale of the battery storage and location (desert solar plant).
If you are interested in knowing more about this kind of battery watch this video:
ruclips.net/video/ZRyo0Nr7CrY/видео.html&ab_channel=DisruptiveInvesting
You 2 guys and the professor are really great.
Thank you for this video.
I've just discovered your channel and I love it MERCI guys 👌👍
It’s really great to have multiple battery technologies to store all excess generated energy . Imagine removing the Tesla storage and replacing the Lithium packs with Sodium based storage, that would release the older storage to be recycled for performance road vehicles …
Thanks for addressing the 'challenge' of Chlorine production during the extraction of Sodium from sea salt. I have been concerned about that for a while. Your simple explanation goes some way towards explaining what will be done with at least some of the large quantities of that toxic gas which will be produced.
Chlorine is actually a very valuable byproduct, it is used for many reactions for polymers, water treatment, disinfection etc.
Any battery recommendations for a battery in rural cold winter
I think one great advantage of Sodium battery is that it is less prone to catching fire compared to Lithium ion.
On a private sailing vessel or larger boat these could be ideal.
What is the possible future of sodium sulphur batteries?
Sodium sulfur batteries suffer from a really fucked up double shelf discharge curve and low voltage in general. While amp-hour capacity is high, amp-watt is not because of this shitty discharge curve and low voltage. It also isn't effective in terms of watts / kg, and control electronic complexity is high because of this messed up discharge curve.
Did any of these guys see this battery? So we need to imagine this batteries.
Hi RedBlue, thanks for asking. Prof. Passerini is a scientist working on sodium-ion batteries. So yes, he has worked on many of Na+ lab cells on his own. Solid-state, sodium sulfur as well. But of course he visited manufacturers as well. In this podcast we are talking about the scalability of industrial batteries. And yeah, they do already exist 😎 You will soon be able to buy them.
One more thing: As we are a publically funded institute, we cannot advertise a specific battery brand or producer. We agree: We should have shown one of our lab cells, right?
Sorry and how many charge cycles for Sodium
Thank you professor. Is the negative terminal at low potential compared to positive terminal? If so, how would electrons move from low to high potential? Everyone uses water tank analogy to tell us that things move from high to low potential.
Lithium ion batteries can only be charged to about 80% if maximum cycle life is to be achieved. That takes one fifth off the practical energy density. LFP batteries can be charged to 100% and still have good cycle life mitigating the lower energy density disadvantage. How well do sodium ion batteries take charging to 100%? None of the videos I have watched so far answer that question.
Charles they can be drained to 0% without harm so thats a big plus ...also they are less temperature dependent as to the maximum try the Have a think about it video and Asianomics.
LFP actually swell up. But I actually use LFP due to being a lot safer but looking forward to sodium batteries
So wiser not to fully charge them as well.
If the batteries are cheap these things do not matter.
I would have liked to here some ballpark numbers for the seawater batteries.
Thanks, Björn. We will cover seawater batteries again, soon.
I want to learn about sodium batteries, what book should I read or what topics in order to understand everything about sodium battery?. Thank you from Colombia!
Thank you so much for your comment, Manihot. We will see when to cover SIBs again, soon.
Still nothing in the shop next to my house to exchange my lithium batteries of my laptop or my Kickscooter.
😂😂 let‘s talk again in 24 months 🤞🏻🤞🏻
@@batterygeneration I would love to dream of this :)
a few chinese companies are already producing them. and while europeans need to figure out a process how to make a process to come up with a process to build a battery factory, the chinese are scaling up fast!
What about Sodium-Glass batteries?
The new improvement is
Sodium iron with Graphene,
replacing graphite.
Lithium is one of the most abundant elements on earth. Admittedly once extracted there there is substantial refining required to allow it to be incorporated into a battery. Elon has built a lithium refinery in Texas that will produce materials suitable for battery manufacturing. Elon has demonstrated that lithium can be refined in an environmentally acceptable process.
If you are on a low sodium diet, would these cause your head to explode?
Haha 😂 dont try this at home!
Only eat one at a time.
does silicon loading of the graphite anode (sila, sinanode) or growing a 100% silicon "forest" in the anode (amperex) have the same benefits like in lithium ion batteries to increase energy density?
sodium batteries are the future and if you are not researching better chemistry then you are already behind. they are already at 160 kw with the batteries nudging 200kw already . lithium is dead already just look at lithium prices. also cars bursting into flame is still a huge problem.
so this is better for stationary batteries
This Professor is not a "bullshitter"
sodium ion to the moon
🔋Na ion battery
🧞 thanks 🌀🇨🇳
😮😮😮😅😮😮😅😮😮
Why is this company not listed on Robinhood?