German police raid Reichsbürger group
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- Опубликовано: 8 июл 2024
- On 23rd November 2023 police in Germany raided several properties in eight states as part of an ongoing investigation into a group of people from the "Reichsbürger" scene. Who are these people, why is the government so worried about them, and what exactly are they accused of?
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
00:22 Who are the Reichsbürger?
01:42 Who are the Selbstverwalter?
02:12 A growing problem
02:58 Gathering evidence
04:18 Social media to blame?
Music:
"Style Funk" and "Hot Swing"
by Kevin MacLeod incompetech.com
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In the Czech Republic we have similar lunatics who claim that the Czech Republic does not exist and that they are citizens of Czechoslovakia. They also issue their identity cards, license plates and the like. Fortunately they are mostly harmless.
For now
That's the weirdest group I have read about
@@nigerianprinceajani It started in Germany with some harmless idiots too. Now they are dangerous idiots.
@@richardneumann3335I'm that old too and grew up in that region. We went to hike there on school "field trips" (Wandertag), and the teachers had a hard time keeping us from stepping across the border. Not always successful 😂
I am unsure if the border was really *exactly* where the signposts were, though. And I assume there was a fence and guards a bit further in - at least that's what they told us.
Isn't it great that you can just walk across today, the national forests on both sides working together, with a joined network of trails etc.?
@@richardneumann3335 I like that the name rhymes in both Czech and German
Recently there was a Reichdbürger who wanted his pension. A pension, from a state, he doesn't "believe"in. A state where he is not accepting the law. He doesn't have any ID left, because he doesn't see himself as a citizen (but still wants his pension). He went to court. He lost. I love it
Have you tried if he will call the illegitimate and dictatorial fire brigade if you set his house on fire?
But... doesn't that kinda validate his claim that he is not subject to the state? If you don't give him the pension, he immediately doesn't have to pay taxes anymore IMO...
Isn't it funny how they want all the benefits of being a citizen without the responsibility?😂
If thats True that is Hilarious. (And Deserved)
Because dont get me Wrong. I am absolutely in Favor of the Right of any Person to Renounce their Citizenship.
Everyone should be Free to Say that he does not wish to be Associated with a Certain Government or Country.
Now I would of course Advise anyone to First make sure he gets Citizenship in a Different Country then. But hey. Details that People need to take care of themselves *gg*
Funnily enough they do business basing on federal laws, demand money basing on federal laws, and drive on streets paid by federal taxes. The hypocrisy (yeah, I corrected it...).
Doing business in Germany is based on the BGB (Bürgerliches Gesetzbuch) and this initially came into effect in 1900. At least this part of the story is not totally crazy.
Of course it is insane to claim that the state you are living in does not exist. Obviously it does. Being dissatisfied with the existing order does not allow anyone to commit crimes.
(1) It's spelled hipocrisy
(2) The phrase 'basing on' is almost never used in english, generally 'based on' would be more understandable.
(3) From where do you get the impression they 'do business' and 'demand money' based on federal laws? Maybe they demand money and do business based on the old laws, or according to the laws they perceive as natural? Without showing me explamples, this is an empty statement.
*sigh* Where to begin...
(1) If you start teaching people it's always a bad idea to do it wrong, too. It's spelled "hypocrisy", I was just too tired to spell it right.
(2) "Almost never used" doesn't mean it's NOT used, so it makes abundantly clear that you just wanted to troll me on something unimportant.
(3) As long as those people are not living from their land eating their own farmed products, drinking water from their own wells, and producing power from their own grid they are using federal property in one or another way to get their needs fulfilled. I'm pretty sure they don't have their own postal service, either, nor do they pay taxes at their "border" to Germany. They just pick the things that are convenient to them to call their "sovereignty" over them and evade unpleasant duties they should have as citizens, like paying certain fees or follow regulations. If they don't like this country they are free to migrate to another one, there are enough choices all over the world.
"the hypocracy" 🤓
Wenn ich mit Reichsbürgern streite, dann sag ich immer, der letzte legitime bayerische Staat ist für mich die Münchnener Räterepublik von 1919, was sie üblicherweise ziemlich aus dem Konzept bringt.
Whenever I get into an argument with a Reichsbürger, I always tell them that, for me, the last legitimate Bavarian state is the Bavarian Soviet Republic from 1919, which usually throws them off quite a bit.
Reddit
Freikorps voran!
@@yc__ Schleich di, Nazi!
@@yc__ 1913.
@@longiusaescius2537 Ich sag immer das Grundgesetz wurde von Deutschen Bürger 1848 erschaffen, nicht von US Amerikanischen Junglebewohner im Jahre 1948.
The thing I don't understand about the whole "the state is illegitimate"-buisness is that... Its a state. There is no higher power, no "governernment of governments" that decides if a state is legitimate or not. The state only exists because the people believe in it
The origin is in West Berlin which technically wasn't part of any German state but under direct Allied control. This led one individual to theorise some crackpot ideas. It's very complicated.
Yeah, the backstory definitely falls into the 'sometimes truth is stranger than fiction' category.
Reichsbürger often claim that after WW2, no formal peace treaty was signed, and therefore the current constitution is somehow invalid because it was dictated by the Allies, or whatever...yeah, it doesn't really make any sense.
It's a weird kind of magical thinking, I believe. Reichsbürger and similar subcultures like US "sovereign citizens" seem to view legal language as a kind of magic spell. They think the Federal Republic of Germany wasn't properly incantated into existence, and so it doesn't "really" exist, people are just pretending it exists.
The current constitution is the continuation of the old BRD constitution from when Germany was divided after WW2. That version had the reunification day stated as it's expiry date. It was only meant to be a temporal solution to get people through pretty rough times. But upon reunification, that expiry date was scrapped and they just continued using it.
That would be the reasoning I can understand the most - the current constitution is illegitimate insofar as that a previous version of it stated that it shouldn't be used now.
I love it when foreign media calls them "rice burgers"
🤦🏻♂️
Don't mock them, the rice sandwiches gave Kirk Van Houten all that energy!
Recently I heard this saying about it:
"Back in the days, there was an idiotai in every village. No problem so far. Everyone knew him and to not bother with his "ideas". So he went mostly ignored." Poor idiotai.
"Today, idiotes figured out, how to create a socialmedia-bubble an live within it. So we have out of a sudden 23.000 of them "living their dream"."
(btw: this proofs also, that statistically there must have been at least TWO idiotes in every village, because Germany only has about ~10773 municipalities...)
🤣🤣🤣
Good point, actually. 'Normal' people tend to forget, that a certain percentage of the population *will* have personality disorders or mental health issues. We're always quite shocked and dismayed, when confronted with it. When really, we should just assume it as a given and plan ahead for it.
But many municipalities have more than one village in it!
@@justarandomgothamite5466 ...and this is why "Reichsbürgertum" ist not the only association of specially challenged people...
Well, it's not juts "idiotes" creating their own bubble, but also algorithms being designed like "We see you like this. Here's some more!", hence the echo chamber effect.
Yeah, but when they need the state sponsored health insurance or retirement, suddenly they file their claims to the respective offices and institutions of the state that they claimed doesn't exist. 🙄🤦♀️
That's because most of it is not about reviving an older ideal collective where things were "better", but rather a good cover for their deep seated selfishness and "independence". Every time the current state of affairs goes with their interest, don't worry they're fine with it!...
As you mention, the Reichsburgers are a lot like American Sovereign Citizens or British "Freemen On The Land" both in terms of their rhetoric and their beliefs. A RUclips channel called Munecat has a really good video about Sovereign Citizens and their sister movements in other countries and I would really recommend it if you want an overview of the magical thinking and conspiranoia that underpins these movements.
Not only in "..in terms of their rhetoric and their beliefs." as you said, but foremost LEGALLY.
That Politicians and the Mainstream Media is hunting down the German Citizens is because they (the Politicians and Journalists) represent the EU and National-Sovereign-Independent States are of no use for the EU.
I mean thats common knowledge in 2023.. der Zug ist abgefahren, we say in Germany 🙂
Love Munecat even thought she hasn't uploaded in a while.
Glad you brought up the Sovereign citizens in the USA. I call them Leeches on Society. They want all the freedoms and rights that NORMAL people have but they don't want to pay taxes and obey the police, laws or the courts. They are above these petty nuisances. It is agonizing to watch one of these Leeches in a RUclips argue in a courtroom about why the court has no power over them... I do it as little as possible...but some times those damn thumbnails or titles suck me in.
@@macforme Is the USA a occupied Nation with over 200 Foreign Military Bases?
Its even written in the German Basic Laws taht Germany is a occupied zone and also has to pay for the occupation.
Therefore, just like Wolfgang Schäuble said (rip): Germany is not independent or sovereign since 1948: The Winneres lead Germany.
Any thoughts on that?
@@macforme Was it LEGAL to shut down everyone during Lock-Down?
No it wasnt, as the Bundesverfassungsgericht has declared.
Did they have the right to implement Mask-Mandates? No...
That was basic Dictatorship.
What are your thoughts on that?
Believe it or not Russia has a similar problem with a group of people saying that the Russian federation doesn't exist and they are citizens of the Soviet Union
Unfortunately, one of them are Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin
@@Sofus. Indeed
Doesn't Putin shit talk Lenin all the time tho lol, why would the head of state think the state is illegitimate?
@@stratospheric37 Wait seriously?
France has them as well. By now I feel like every state has them and the members are either schizophrenic or search for an excuse to be assholes.
"Conspiracy Myths" please. Framing these nuts as anything other than criminals that recruit by deliberately spreading misinformation is no longer acceptable.
I do not think these are criminals - these people are insane.
A criminal makes the choice to act against the law and knows about the potential consequences
but he does not claim that the law does not exist or applies to him.
@@hermes7587 Criminally insane then. The problem with mixing the terms is, that there should be clarity if individual cases should be handled by judges or doctors. Can't (or really shouldn't) persecute the deluded for being ill while having done nothing. And can't do the opposite either and consistently ignore lesser offenses just because you don't want to feed their collective victim complex.
After reading two specific comments, I'm now probably sure there are also Japaneses who claims they still live in the Japanese Empire😂
Emporer of Japan is Naruhito. He is the 126. Tennō.
They do, kinda. The 1891 constitution was amended, and by amended I mean essentially completely replaced, but still, passed in the method of a constitutional amendment via votes in the House of Peers and House of Representatives and the emperor signed it. The Japanese still have an emperor, even though they are one of the most homogenous states in the world. But in Japan it is not meant to convey the concept of King of Kings like it does in European concepts of emperorship but that of a Heavenly Sovereign, which given that he still does ceremonial Shinto roles, is still reasonably accurate descriptions of what he does. The word Empire in English is tied up in meaning to a Roman conception of it, a state lead by an imperator, commander, leading many different peoples together under the control of a subset of them, but Japanese conception of empire has a lot to do with the Chinese Empires which do not necessarily require that much diversity although it can be.
Well, Japan has a Grundgesetz and is officially still under the wing of the USA. So is South Korea. Germany is also a US Colony, half the Nation knows it, half the Nation is making fun of it.
So.. whats real whats not? Seems like Germany is not the only Nation having legal-status issues, getting shunned for demanding their full sovereign rights back. Lol.. the world has changed alot in the last 3-4 years.. must be the booster shots.
that was a very informative and well written video. Thanks for sharing your information, i never tried looking that much into it because they looked like fools to me. But your points show that they can indeed cause problems and that we should be aware and cautious of them.
Is this like the “freeman of the land” nonsense we have in the UK? They seem to bring up articles of the Magna Carta that have been rescinded hundreds of years ago. Nutters.
Yes. And it's just as stupid. Sometimes i wonder if maybe the best option would be to just give them exactly what they ask for and treat them as foreign nationals. Of a country with no diplomatic presence or contracts. See how they like that.
Many countries have their own version of this, they have different names but they all have bascially the same belief system.
So the Reichsburger is not the German national hamburger? Oh, my. It sounded tasty. I'll just let myself out.....
Some years ago, the leader of such a movement in Austria was sentenced to 14 years of jail for high treason, her deputy to 10 years.
Which raids are you referring to? I couldn't find any current news about Reichsbürger being under new investigations, only stuff that is around 8 months old.
Tagesschau, Spiegel etc. YT scheint sich dagegen zu sträuben.
Sah es aber gestern auch hier.
Tagesschau, Spiegel etc. YT seems to be resisting this. But saw it here yesterday too.
Razzia in 8 Bundesländer.
RUclips tends to eat comments with links in them, but there's Tagesschau article titled _Razzia gegen "Reichsbürger" in acht Bundesländern_ up right now.
@@HeadsFullOfEyeballs found it, thanks!
0:56 - Those passports and ID cards are not _completely useless_ - they can always be recycled.
They are useful for proving that the cardholder is a dumbass lol
"Europe's not real, it's the country called EU."
can you make a video about the word hetze/volksverhetzung? as far as my language knowlegde goes, its quite hard to translate and to understand for non-german speaker and thus its hard to understand what the legal term actually means.
A very short and incomplete and simplified summary: Incitement of the people (§ 130 StGB) occurs when there is public incitement against certain sections of the population, they are maliciously insulted or despised (e.g., 'Disgusting subhumans, these bisexuals') or incited to hatred and violence against these groups (e.g., 'Homosexual scum, just slaughter them'). Publicly approving, trivializing, and denying the Holocaust is also considered incitement of the people. The protected legal interest is public peace.
The main idea is: The protected legal interest is public peace.
Yes it is a legal topic with many mines and traps, which would certainly be worth examining in more detail in a video.
I could help ouy out. Volksverhetzung is targeted actions targeting specific groups of people (e.g. jews or roma people). This is in Germany most oftenly applied to Holocaust denial. Another example of this sort of hate crime is the burnings of the Qur'an in Sweden, which under Swedish law could in theory - and should according to some - fall under "incitement of peoples" (sv: hets mot folkgrupp), this is however not the case in practice. I think that sculpturer who built a Muhammed sculpture as a roundabout statue might have been convicted, but the people burning Qurans haven't been.
To be honest, I don't think you can regulate social media in a way to fight this kind of disinformation while not giving the government the power to censor at whim. I think the way is to educate people outside the social box, in real life.
Yeah, we've had the paper BILD for decades, which is basically Fox News in print form and it's full of lies and hatred. But you can't really ban stuff like that without huge chilling effects.
I'm optimistic it can be done, I just don't know how. But I trust that future generations will find a solution that balances all the competing rights in a sensible way.
Regulation is never an easy task. Still IMO it has to be done. The internet is a public space and if the state was giving up on regulation it would simply mean that somebody else is making the rules and that will be the corporations that own the informational infrastucture.
I am aware that our system is not perfect and I am quite confident that our elected law makers will not always be able to find and implement good solutions to the problems that the rapid and ongoing development of the digital domain is putting before of us and in some aspects those regulations are and will aways be a real mess. However if we do not insist on protecting the integrity of the public space within the the digital world and take strong measures to reclaim the digital domain as a public domain, our democracies will have lost the battle for their sovereignity and without any chance to recover.
@@andreassumerauer5028 Internet is indeed a public space just like any public place, street or park. What you can say there you can say on the internet as simple as that, no new laws needed. The companies running these public spaces to clean the roads are not responsible for what is said on them. Same applies to X, Fb and company. Just like the busdriver is not responsible for what I say on the bus and can't censor me as long my speech does not interfere with the bus transporting.
@@rewboss How about this: Let them make as much propaganda as they want (they'll do that in ANY case using any and all loopholes) and educate the population not to be too trusting. There is no problem with misinformation if people can see through it. Any fact-checking organization or regulatory system must be able to distinguish between misinformation and the rest anyway, so: let's just apply this technique at the level of the individual. You can corrupt an institution, you can't corrupt all individuals.
I even think it's counterproductive to increase trust in media. Trust is the problem.
that's an eye opener... there is a similar movement of USSR citizens, and I always thought that this is very local phenomenon, as they base themselves on the "fact" that the dissolution of USSR was illegal ...
There was a post on r/AskEurope literally twelve hours before this video was posted talking about Reichsbürger and other sovereign citizens.
I wouldn't mind a complete abolishment of social media to be honest.
Or at least a moratorium/lockdown of the platforms until we've fighured out how to ethically limit freedom of speech.
@@MinusMOD98 "ethically limit freedom of speech" I'd say we in Germany are already too far gone. I know what the reason(ing) for this is, but I disagree, strongly.
This development is very scary. These people are thugs and they are dangerous. We really hoped to be past that. I am very embarrassed and I hope that our society will continue to not tolerate that.
"These people are thugs and they are dangerous."
Which ones? Government enforcers conducting a raid sound pretty dangerous to me.
I would argue any modern country, which was founded on older borders has some form of this.
But in my opinion seeing 'Reichsbürger' or similiar groups gain in numbers, or becoming more visible, is a symptom of a deeper problem.
In that case it's discontent with the gouvernment, or rather the whole situation, in which they see themselves and their way of life endangered. And 'Reichsbürger' ar the kind of guys, that promise simpple solutions to complex problems... which seems appealing to some folks.
Can't help but think of a Burger chain whenever I read Reichburger.
Well presented, thanks.
I keep asking, is the video maker a German Citizen with a legal status?
@@germaniatv1870 If one actually want to know something, he doesn't ignore the answer right in front of him. @rewboss told about his German citizenship and his living in Germany before and after that in several videos. You don't even need to watch them, you could just go by title.
But if one awkwardly wants to make a statement, he'll ask repeatedly. And so you did.
@@marcromain64 He is British then? Why not give a simple straight answer? 🤣🤣🤣
@@germaniatv1870 Why don't you look where I kindly directed you?
All right, since you're obviously not the sharpest knife in the drawer: He has German and British citizenship.
@@marcromain64 With all due respect, you dont know how sharp my knife is and you dont know what else is in the drawer.
Next time just give a direct straight answer to the question and dont talk in occultish 😅
The first answer of yours should of been: He is British with a dual Citizenship.
That would of made things easier for you and for me.
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Either way, the EU and its occupational Government over Germany reformed the Staatsangehörigkeit just recently.. we Germans didnt vote for that.
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It looks like Germany is turning in to a US-British Melting Pot Colony.
What is Racism?
Reichsburger? Is that some type of right wing hamburger? 🍔
Coming soon to your McDonald, "Reichsburger Weeks" with the "Reichsburger Menu".🍟🍔😁
2 dots on top of a letter do matter in German.
It's Burger (which has no meaning beside perhaps a relatively rare sir name) vs. Bürger meaning citizen.
Burger vs. Bürger, big difference
you ignore the Umlaut!
Bürger not burger. Although the terms may have the same roots…
@@SD_Alias Ein Wortspiel. Englischer Burger gegen deutschen Bürger. Ähnlich klingende Wörter mit völlig unterschiedlicher Bedeutung. 🤗
GB has as representativ Monarch King Charles III. of Windsor
If the "German Reich" by Royal Law would have a Leader, it would be Georg Friedrich von Preußen and Sophie von Isenburg.
*German Empire
The German Reich is the Weimar Republic or Nazi Germany (which legally are the same).
Interesting that you should show the Kingdom of Germany's leader, as that is the group I am most familiar with, as I knew someone involved with them. They were also an anti-vaxer.
Its illegal, by German Law (especially since after 1919 Spanish Flu) to pressure a German citizen in doing something they dont want to do.
2nd it is illegal to pressure the German citizen into a forced vaxination.
Bundesverfassungshof made that very very clear.
I respect your opinion, but dont yopu ever force me again like you did 2 years ago: its illegal.
And most of all they are anti-sense…
The Reichsbürger-Logic doesn't make much sense when the people would actually think for a sec. Before the Republics back to the Empire _not few_ of our today's laws already existed or were even instated by the Empire. Nowhere in the old Realm is a right that "you can simply do what you want". Quite the opposite, as many Germans left the Empire and settled somewhere else to escape poverty and repression.
The closest I come to this is micronationalism. We refuse to admit anyone who knowingly refuses to pay their taxes, however.
Oh god German sovereign citizens
Anyone who stays here and lives here must abide by our laws. Or he can leave the country.
They can, of course, always try to get the laws changed, in the proper democratic and constitutional way. They can protest the laws. They can do a lot of things - but not decide for themselves to just ignore the laws. Well, not without consequences, that is.
@@KaiHenningsen Democracy does not stand over the Legal System, the Constitution and/or the Civil Rights. Get that in your head, let it sink in.
A Democracy is NOTHING without a Rechtsstaat, Civil Rights and a Verfassung, my homy.
What is Democracy?
@@KaiHenningsen So as far as we understand, Democracy is REGULATING your Constitutional and Civil as Legal Rights.. and that is not the job of a Democracy.
You dig?
@@germaniatv1870 What are you talking about? Of course you can advocate for laws to be changed in a democracy. That is the whole point! A good example is the coming decriminalization of cannabis. It's a crime to possess it today, but thanks to decades of political activism, it will be legal soon.
@@SomePotato So you are saying that Democracy is there to change the Law and the Legal status of a Rechtsstaat?
Yet the German FRG Democracy wants to Legalize Cannabis in a very very obsurce way.
For example, you may have the right to grow 3 Plants, carry 25 to 50 Grams in your pocket. Ok. Yet you are not allowed to share, the Social Clubs are not Pot-Bars where you can smoke.
The most important part of what you call a "Democratic" legalization is the fact that the "Unverletzlichkeit der Wohnung" Article will have a absatz based on Cannabis, which allows authority without Mandate to enter your Homes, like in the USA, based on simple "suspicion".
Now it only needs a "Verdacht", not a Mandate anymore. That is very critical.
So this Democratic legalization of Cannabis is touching the "Grundgesetz". Its adding various zusatzartikel that gives so called Authorities more freedom, for example entering your home based on a Cannabis-Verdacht... but i thought its LEGAL??? what the hell? lol
So you do agree that DEMOCRACY is trying to change the Constitution and the Civil Rights, even if i didnt vote for it because. I didnt vote for it, the majority didnt vote for it, because of that exact reason.
Yet you want DEMOCRACY to pull it off, which means the Rechtsstaat is in your way 🙂
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So the Bundesverfassungsgericht didnt allow the SPD-Cannabis Modell because it touches the Basic-Laws (Civil Rights).
That means it may give you the illusion of a Freedom (Growing Cannabis) but it cuts your Civil Rights FOR ALL CITIZENS in the Grundgesetz as well.
Thats why the Bundesverfassungsgericht refused.
Ask me, im cool with that. Why legalize something but cut down civil-rights at the same time? Makes no dang sense.
All you think about is your Joint.
But now we both understand that you need a Democracy that reforms and changes the Constitution and Civil rights based on majority (actually minority-party vote) Democratic votes.
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Im pretty sure we can attain the legalization of Cannabis in a much ordered and civil way as in the "Democratic" way. Lets say in a German Rechtsstaatlichen way.
See here in Germany there is a difference between Rechtsstaatlichkeit, Volksabstimmung and Demokratie.
And i repeat: Democracy does not stand over the Rechtsstaat, the Constitution & the Civil Rights.
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I rather keep Cannabis illegal and not reform the Civil Rights in a way that gives the STATE more freedom to run down its citizens based on Cannabis.
Whilst legalizing, more Polizei are trained to watch how much you grow and carry. You are not allowed to share your Cannabis you produced and you have a 25-50 G limit at all times. Something is fishy here.
... they will watch and need no mandate anymore.. and that is implemented in the GRUNDGESETZ.
But hey.. you guys want your Democratic Cannabis smoke.. you may have it 🙂
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What is a Democracy Vs Rechtsstaat, Verfassung & Bürgerrecht? ... it is nothing, as it has no foundation, get it?
lol Wikipedia disclaimer.
It's sad, but somewhat funny, that of all people just am member of a noble family which ruled over the one of the smallest states in the German Empire had himself declared as a leader in this movement and he sees himself as the head of state in a new empire.
But maybe it's part of an older and deeper plan which already started, when another member of this family (though of another line) became the second wife of the last German emperor...
Marriage into the the royal family to become the next ruling family has happened all the time.
So if I steal one of these idiot's cars, they will not go to the police to report it? I presume they haven't registered or insured it anyway, so I just claim it as my own and keep driving it, so long as the owner doesn't find it back by chance.
Or.... Are they maybe not as fully independent as they claim, and will they very gladly depend on German law enforcement, fire and healthcare services when it suits their needs?
There's a celebrated case of a Reichsbürger who went to court to try to get a state pension despite having refused to pay any contributions. He lost.
Why don't they go pre prussian overloards or prenapoleonic and want to restore the HRE. I think for example the Welfes never abdicated. It seems so random that they prefer the "second empire".
What is the purpose of this belief? Is it to install a far right government or something alike? And I don’t really get how they think that Federal Republic of Germany wasn’t formed. The old state was defeated in a war and the new state was created as a federation of the governments of the länder which had legitimacy both from the occupiers (USA, France and UK) and from the whole idea of Federations, being that the states together form the federation and, acting collectively, hold sovereignty. I am a micronationalist so I can understand the fun in national simulating but this definitely seems something more sinister... threatening to kill innocent officials working for a democratically elected government, they definitely need to go to trial.
So basically they saw sovereign citizen in the US and thought oh that's great I`ll do that .
5:17 Es ist für uns alle Neuland. 😉
I wouldn't be surprised if France has a similar group were the Franch Empire still exist or indeed the Franch Kingdom.
In France, it is a treasured national hobby to be belligerent towards the government. French souvereign citizens might exist but there's no way to distinguish them from the rest of the population :D
@@-slasht in my country Ireland I don't trust any political parties however, with that said I'm also not in favour of extremists like Len Pen fucking things while there's a war going on in Europe and In the middle East
The state exists when it has the means to apply it's laws. If it can't it, does not. End of story.
der Selbstverwalter. heute habe ich gelernt.
antivaccination isn't a right wing idea it appears in all political groups. prior to covid it actually tended to be more of a fringe left hippi counter culture concept. Sovereign citizen also not exclusively right wing. They are how ever an anarco movement found in both left and right anarchism because it shows up in multiple ways. Tho American Sovereign citizen tend to have far better arguments for their beliefs . Technically these people wouldn't be Sovereign citizens tho. These people would be anarcho monarchists so tactically a right wing ideology, but in the libertrian camp for some reason when they generally don't hold many linertrain beliefs like the lack of compliance with the NAP, free trade among peers, and a heavily limited government.
btw half of what people call Sovereign citizen aren't actually Sovereign citizen. A major key to their ideology is that the government sells your identity via your social security number and through a bunch of very convoluted court cases you can "reclaim ownership of one's self".
If you ever want a rabbit hole to go down read up on what American Sovereign citizens believe; since they're so visible on the internet there's plenty of examples t's a truly insane rabbit hole with some interesting legal arguments other than the whole true self thing. like American Sovereign citizens are right technically the states have no right to issue IDs the only government entities that can are the post office and libraries. Also the post facto law that allows states to issue ID only allows them for commercial use not for private so technically their right you don't need an ID to drive ( the argument doesn't work in court). An other one is the US constitution only allows for the federal government to tax via tariffs and the finding of income tax being constitutional is basically just "well we want more money so it is". I am not a Sovereign citizen for the record I'm a libertrian I hold no association with them.
So like sovereign citizens in the US
Isn't that legally considered treason to deny the existance of the FRG? Some people are unreal. You wanna facepalm yourself all day long
No. But feel free to find the section in the criminal code that makes this treason. I just read those, and didn't find what you think is there.
Thank you to keep us EU citizens up to date on the ins and outs of the most important member of the EU.
Well, if they deny the state's existance and is actively fighting the state. Wouldn't that make them enemy combatants? Aka. shooting practice for the military?
Actually, yes, but since the German state does not adopt these people's delusions, it cannot treat them the way they see themselves.
Yeah no thats a war crime
It's funny that I watch an English channel about Germany even though I'm German
It's a channel by a German, so it's a german channel.
@ isn't he from the UK?
Oh, so Germany has its own version of the sovcit movement? I'll get the popcorn.
well, what do you expect? additionally to the 'the-government-is-evil'-part germany also has a 'the-enemies-are-occupying-us'-component in its history. a _lot of_ potential for some lunatics ... :)
PLUS: a bunch of eastgermans that are 'a few years older' already experienced the collapse of a state within their own lifetime. so, it's not _that_ surprising some think it could/should happen again.
...Honestly, this is the kind of stuff I would expect from Germany. You guys are like, smarter than average when it comes to legal and logic stuff, so I'm not surprised you have to deal with more pseudolegal assholes than most people. Like, I don't say that to imply every German is a legal genius and put undue pressure on you, but from what I understand, you guys understand the value of discipline and rules very well. So it would make sense that the most common type of asshole you deal with is the asshole that thinks they can con others with shoddy paperwork and fake legal stuff.
Probably quite few of them with narcissistic personality disorder.
I found this talk about input and output :
Part 1 of the webinar : "All about input and output"
Part 2 of the webinar : "All about input and output"
Dr. Florencia Henshaw
Criminalize riceburgers!
It is one of the most troublesome subjects in political science; where in the end, the authority of the state is derived from. The common understanding is that it is a philosophical construct called the social contract. It is a fictitious contract that we all sign at the moment of our birth. I found that very unsatisfying an explanation of the origins of state power. I think Mao was more to the point when he stated that state power comes from the barrel of a gun. In the end states are (in my view) coercive, but (unfortunately) necessary to keep the peace and have some wealth and security. Yes I am a political science educated man and a civil-servant. But I urge everybody to keep a good and weary eye on the state. That is good for democracy.
I come from a different point of view. I agree that the state's power comes from the barrel of a gun, and it is coercion, but in contrast I'd say it is illegitimate by nature. But I strongly believe as long as it is a democratic state that allows freedom of expression and doesn't suppress opposition to it, opposition should be voiced in a non-violent and legal way.
That’s the fine thing about democracies. While people can totally disagree about things, up to the legitimacy of the state itself, most will still agree to follow democratic norms, and only use peaceful means to work towards change. I, for example, think there cannot be a legitimate reason to create victimless crimes. I not only doubt the legitimacy of some of our criminal laws, I find them absolutely appalling. But I am not calling for an armed rebellion to change them, even though it has been really frustrating to watch little to no progress in that area in the last two dozen years.
At least the Sovereign Citizens don't just exist in North America lol
They love Putin and all of his works..
Peoples have to be informed.
About what?
And exported from America 🤣
Unless we go back to Charlemagne, a German state has rarely continuously existed for more than 30-50 years (1871,1918, 1933, 1945, 1990: I doubt very much that the Reichsbürger will have any role in ending the present BRD some 33 years old, but sooner or later it will be followed by another State or States with different laws and possibly borders. Hopefully by democratic or at least peaceful means. No armageddon. Business as usual.
The BRD has continuously existed since 1949. In 1990 the DDR simply merged into the BRD, so no new state was created.
@@advocatusdiaboli4861 This is one way to see it. Your basic law actually sees/saw that differently. It originally
demanded in its preamble a proper constitution to be put in place, AFTER reunification. There was never a referendum in East Germany accepting the constitution which is indeed quite a legal quirk. Speed of reunification was favoured over a legally correct solution. As long as only a couple of thousand people contest the procedure this can go on. But as history teaches no state goes on forever. Usually a couple of decades, definitely not for a thousand years as our great-grandparents believed. The same applies to the European Union. It has changed its member states. many added one very important one lost. Institutions are not here to stay. they serve the needs of the people in present times. When these needs change over time they have to change and often even be dismantled. The Reichsbürger are no important movement just like the NDP was not. No reason to worry about either. There are some who say that these movements were actually created by the state to justify restrictions on democracy. And those who said so include the VGH who said so when asked to forbid the NdP, because the NDP was factually run by BND agents.
@@advocatusdiaboli4861And BRD has accepted itself as the successor state of the German Reich, and even nazi germany, though not DDR.
@@Carewolf Indeed, but in this particular case the political regime itself has been preserved since 1949.
What is a Reichsbürger?
He explained it in the video. translated literally imperial citizen…
No problem, it is much overhyped to draw attention away from the real problems. Similiar to the problems with RAF or Brigate Rosso ( Italy) in the 1970ties.
Ah yes Terrorists that kidnapped * a whole plane* are only a distraction.... dont even get me started on the italians
Those people could be Americans ... :-|
Welcome to AMERICA!!!
Oh wait. Germany???
But don't worry, immigration is the only problem we have to worry about 😕
I'd like to draw your attention to the fact that III Reich NEVER surrendered as German State - there were acts of capitulation (on 8th of May 1945 in Reims and on 9th of May in Berlin) signed by Kriegsmarine, Luftwaffe and Wehrmacht , but NEVER by "The German State".
In the said act/ declaration of unconditional surrender (both versions) in point 4. it is said that this act of surrender will be superseded/ substituted, without changing any provisions of it, by a "declaration of general surrender" that will be applicable to ENTIRE GERMANY and German military forces. That "new, improved" act was to be brought up by UN, or "on behalf of UN", but alas, it never happened.
Thus German Federal Constitutional Court (Bundesverfassungsgericht) declared, on 25th of September ,1952 that "German Reich still exist as a political and lawful entity", and on 17th of August, 1956 reiterated its position by saying that despite the "breakdown" of it was never dissolved - and, on 31th of July, 1973, that "despite of unconditional surrender in May 1945 and four years of foreign powers ruling its territory, The German Reich did not cease to exist".
_"Daß das Deutsche Reich den Zusammenbruch 1945 überdauert hat und weder mit der Kapitulation noch durch die Ausübung fremder Staatsgewalt in Deutschland durch die Alliierten noch später untergegangen ist; es besitzt nach wie vor Rechtsfähigkeit, ist allerdings als Gesamtstaat mangels Organisation nicht handlungsfähig. Die BRD ist nicht ‚Rechtsnachfolger‘ des Deutschen Reiches, sondern als Staat identisch mit dem Staat ‚Deutsches Reich‘, - in Bezug auf seine räumliche Ausdehnung allerdings ‚teilidentisch‘." - (Urteil des Bundesverfassungsgerichtes vom 31. Juli 1973 zu den Grundlagenverträgen.)
And then it added that it is the duty of all constitutional organs of BRD to "reinstate/ reinstitute the unity of the state" (2 BvF 1/73)
Therefore, as German Reich was never a signatory to 1945 Potsdam Agreement, the said Agreement and its Terms ARE NOT bounding for German Reich, and The German Reich still exists "within its 1937 borders", even if "some parts of that territory are temporarily outside of its jurisdiction". In other words, the issue is "still open", until a proper Peace Conference and Peace Treaty (~ies) will be signed. Hence, Poland does not have any sovereignty over "Eastern German territories" but it is merely "administering on them" (see for instance "Über die Rückgabe Deutscher Ostgebiete", ruclips.net/video/4VeR6ESPNhI/видео.html)
And yes, they kicked and screamed all the way to the Unification, AGAINST recognition of German-Polish borders, about which Helmut Kohl said OPENLY (and shamelessly) in his memoirs - and -that only- ONLY THAT "it's recognition or there's no Unification" ultimatum from Amies made them sign that act, in which they declared... Now, this is interesting.
They say the devil is in details, and the Poland - Germany treaty "about border" signed on 14th of November 1990 says that "Germany renounces the use of force or threat of force" in order to change existing border, which IS NOT THE SAME as saying "we ACCEPT the existing border" as final, incontestable and indisputable. Instead it was "We merely relinquish the use of force or threat of thereof".
Remember that quite recent poster by SPD? Yes, that one reading "Die Deutsche Einheit ist vollzogen, aber noch nicht vollkommen", showing contour of Germany INCLUDING "Ostgebiete"? Funny they had no balls to include Ostpreußen... Well, for the time being only, I guess...
Therefore, "without further ado" ;-) let us finish this short introductory note and get to the, ehem, "Kreuz of the matter" - those Reichsbürgern are probably seen by the government as idiots and saboteurs who are going to spoil the Grand Plan by their irresponsible skirmishes and jumping "ahead of the line".
Y'see, Ordnung muss sein. QED.
Right of conquest is usually the way you end that issue. Countless states have been obliterated via conquest or defeat in war. In fact this right has been used for thousands of years and pretty normal. The Allies just did their best to try to make it the last time, although it has not always worked like South Vietnam arguably.
Get a life.
@@robertjarman3703 _"Right of conquest is usually the way you end that issue"_ - I'm thinking of how it could be applied to "Israeli-Palestinian question" ("die Endlösung der Palestinian Frage" comes to mind...), especially in the light of the ongoing, right now, engineering works, aka "levelling of Gaza Strip".
Just thinking, y'see...
@@robertjarman3703- The Right of Conquest was abolished in 1946.
This is one of the reasons why Russia holds these fake referendums.
The German-Polish border treaty clearly states that the German-Polish border is accepted and permanent.
Artikel 1
Die Vertragsparteien bestätigen die zwischen ihnen bestehende Grenze, deren Verlauf sich nach dem Abkommen vom 6. Juli 1950 zwischen der Republik Polen und der Deutschen Demokratischen Republik über die Markierung der festgelegten und bestehenden polnisch-deutschen Staatsgrenze und den zu seiner Durchführung und Ergänzung geschlossenen Vereinbarungen (Akt vom 27. Januar 1951 über die Ausführung der Markierung der Staatsgrenze zwischen Polen und Deutschland; Vertrag vom 22. Mai 1989 zwischen der Volksrepublik Polen und der Deutschen Demokratischen Republik über die Abgrenzung der Seegebiete in der Oderbucht) sowie dem Vertrag vom 7. Dezember 1970 zwischen der Volksrepublik Polen und der Bundesrepublik Deutschland über die Grundlagen der Normalisierung ihrer gegenseitigen Beziehungen bestimmt.
Artikel 2
Die Vertragsparteien erklären, daß die zwischen ihnen bestehende Grenze jetzt und in Zukunft unverletzlich ist und verpflichten sich gegenseitig zur uneingeschränkten Achtung ihrer Souveränität und territorialen Integrität.
Lets be honest, when you read REICH it hits you different as reading EMPIRE, right? Empire is Reich, Reich is Empire. May i ask why the word REICH triggers you people so hard but not the word EMPIRE?
🤣🤣🤣
Maybe, just a thought my guy: drittes Reich. That's what the Nazis called their "empire". They called it that in refrence of the previous Reich (Empires) most notably heilliges Römisches Reich Deutscher Nationen. Empire is an okay word because eventhough crimes were commited by diffrent empires they all stand alone with diffrent names attached to them. The word "Reich" however in German is only really used (in modern days) in refrence to the third Reich (aka the Nazis).
So naturally people don't like the word Reich. Well at least if it stands alone. As soon as it is within other words like Kaiserreich or Königreich we are fine with it.
Well, "Deutsches Reich" was officially the name of the country from 1871 until 1949. The Nazis were only in power between 1933 and 1945.
In English, "Deutsches Reich" is translated as "German Empire" for the period up to the abolition of the monarchy in 1918, and thereafter "German Reich" -- so that includes the entire period more popularly known as the "Weimar Republic". While in German "Reich" is a very vague term, in English it's only an "empire" if it is ruled by a monarch with the rank of emperor, so after 1918 "German Empire" was no longer an accurate translation.
@@rewboss I stand corrected.
But my point is still valid. Because the person asked why "Reich" is seen as "off" or inappropriate, and I still think the reason lies in the use of the word by the nazis (as a stand-alone word).
@@rewboss Thank you Sir. But I mean the British Empire (Reich) which deliberately destroyed the Germans and tried to remove the German Citizenship Status.
Exactly, therefore RuStAG is the StAG from the Notsis as the Reich was delibeartely destroyed by Britain so that the Reich of England can rule over Europe.
Thats what i mean 🙂
Exactly, that is why RuStAG turned in to StAG by the so called Notsis.
So the socalled Reichsbürger get their LEGAL status if asking for it.
So if it is a Legal Status.. why is everyone discriminating against Germans who attained their Legal status again? : RuStAG.
And if StAG was implemented by the NSDAP, is the Staatsangehörigkeit "Notsi"?.. remember, Notsi is not a legal term, Reichsbürger is.
So if you dont like the RuStAG you must like the StAG (which you posses i have heard) even less as it was implementd by the NSDAP.
Basically, if you have StAG, you have the Notsi-StAG 😄
Yet its the same StAG as RuStAG, just without the Kaiser, as you realize yourself 🙂
So, historically accurate, the British and the French tried to rempve our Legal status post world war 1 and post world war2.
You know that the Bundesverfassungsgericht, in the past 60 years, have always declared: The German Reich did not perish.
And this is why we still have a LÖegal Status: StAG.. which was enforced by the so called Notsis.
So you have a Notsi-Reich-Legal Status in 2023.. and that status protects all of your "German" rights.
If you are a Born German, you can have the RuStAG, its legal, you can get it, costs maximum 50 Euros.
I see no issue with RuStAG and StAG. Do you? 🙂
Thank you Sir.
@@Judoka26 No, its because of the US and British Propaganda. For example, the NSDAP forbid the use of the word NOTSI as in German it is a slur and derogatory term meaning stupid.
Only post-1945 the definition of the term was broadened and included terms like Racism, Antisemitism ect..
-
Here is the issue: The Barbarians, the Hunns, the Krauts and the Nazis are not legel terms neither are they Ideologies, they are US and British War-Propaganda terms.
I have never ever seen Germany 33-45 with NAZI flags, NAZI stickers, NAZI Manifestos ect... not one speech the Germans call themselves NAZI as they would of called themselves IDIOTS & STUPID. I only read or hear the word NAZI when consuming British and US Propaganda papers/videos.
I doubt that the Germans called themselves a IDIOT-Regime or a STUPID-Party... because that is what NAZI means in the German language and that is why the Germans refused the term NAZI.
And we have our Dictionarys from before 1945 where the term NAZI is registered as a slur and derogatory term since 200 years.
...the more you know...
So people are triggered by the word REICH because of propaganda. The same stands for NAZI in post-1945 world.
So declaration of unilateral independence in Germany is a crime 😂
I don't think that in itself is a crime; it's just pointless, because if you can't get other countries or the UN to officially recognize your independent state and establish diplomatic relations with it, you haven't in fact founded an independent state: you've just said a thing. You can't found a new country simply by speaking it into existence.
But insofar as you are, both de facto and de jure, still subject to German law, you can't ignore German law and expect not to be prosecuted. You can't issue fake ID documents, you can't evade taxes, you can't drive without an officially recognized driving licence. On the flip side, you can't be cut off from the power grid and water supply until you sign a treaty, you can expect the police and fire brigade to come to your aid if you need it, and you don't have to apply for a visa to leave your own house (or spend years negotiating a waiver).
Funny enough, it isn't per se. But it surely is if the territory of your newly founded nation happens to be German territory which you somewhat "occupied" for your venture. Most countries do not respond well to this. 🤣
Well the BrD wasn't formed by the german people but by the allies. Also the regions behind the Oder and Neise we're taken by force and the germans deported. So the BrD wasn't formed legitimatly.
Der Staat musste nicht neu gegründet werden, er ist nie untergegangen!
So I haven't subscribed, I think I left on comment on a short once...but I didn't ask for that short either. You just appeared. And you are an English speaking gent spouting straight down the middle conventional German rhetoric. I hate to be a conspiracy theorist but I can't help think that you are working for the German state and being promoted due to their efforts.
"And you are an English speaking gent spouting straight down the middle conventional German rhetoric. "
Are you aware that rewboss has been living in Germany for more than 30 years? Why do you believe he's working for the German state?
Well, the idea that the German state can directly influence the RUclips algorithm is, sorry to say, quite ludicrous. I don't even make political videos that often: check my profile, it's full of many different types of video on many different subjects relating to Germany.
The algorithm doesn't just serve up videos you specifically asked for: it serves up videos it thinks you may be interested in. It often experiments, by showing videos to people with slightly different, but related, viewing habits; and if those people are interested in them, it starts promoting them all the more to that group of people. This is especially true with Shorts, because people scroll through their Shorts feeds consuming dozens of videos in a very short time, so RUclips can use a kind of "scattergun" approach to find new audiences.
Since you watched and commented on one of my Shorts, the algorithm assumes you're interested in my videos about German politics; so when I published this video, RUclips showed it to you. Now that you've also commented on this one, RUclips assumes it was correct and will probably start showing you more of my videos, especially the ones I make about politics and current affairs. You might even get to see the one where I criticize the government for attempting to ignore its own "debt brake" laws and throwing the entire budget into disarray.
But no: I don't work for the German state, and I wouldn't want to. There is no conspiracy here: I merely refuse to be pressured into siding with one extreme or the other, and I try to be as objective as I possibly can; but don't mistake that as being an apologist for the Establishment. Indeed, I would probably get a lot more views, a lot more subscribers, and a lot more money if I were to continually publish rage-bait, but I refuse to do that as well.
Your comment is the most hilarious thing I have read so far today. 😂
Maybe he is even a vaccinated free mason reptiloid…