Holy shit I just checked it and you're right! I haven't used any of the Helbores since the patch has been released so I didn't notice that before I posted the guide. I really hope that this wasn't intentional as it makes the weapon even more user hostile than it already was with the long pullout time and it letting go of the charge by itself. The weapon feels 10x worse to use now
@@XrayWasTaken I tend to use the mk2 just because of that higher ROF. sights are still crap though. The ones on the mk3 are marginally better. Wish we could modify sights on our weapons to make target acquisition easier.
Great video! These weapons have been a sleeper that can really change the flow of battle for your team, arguably quite a bit more than any other gun in the game given the breakpoints and insane versatility of the MKIII. Fun fact: a well-rolled (near 80% damage and pen) weapon with a +25% carapace damage roll (20% may be enough, haven't spent the time rerolling to test the breakpoint at 20% yet), with The Bigger They Are talent and Focused Fire up doesn't just enable two-shotting Crushers with headshots, it also enables killing a Crusher with a single headshot crit! It's one somewhat persuasive reason to take the +25% crit on Deadshot from the level 25 talents; More frequently one-shotting Crushers has made a substantial difference on some of my Damnation runs where things were getting dicey! Also, if you follow any elite kill immediately with a reload, and so long as your next shot immediately after the reload kills another elite, you'll keep Focus Fire running perpetually, even without any +reload blessings or talents taken. This is tight with a weapon with 80% charge rate (likely would also do fine with the blessing that decreases charge time from multiple shots), so YMMV. But with the right rolls, you're still not giving up the ability to keep your ult running for bigger groups where you'll run out of ammo and a reload will be needed, you just lose some flexibility over the 30% reload speed level talent in return for more frequent kills from that extra crit-provided breakpoint.
Good breakdown of this weapon/build. Love the hellbore since it's buff a while back. Using mostly the same skills, all but the 5 (10% though on HS, (sway and crit) and 30 (60% though back on class skill use). Good video. keep them coming👍
Good work dude! Great edit and really helpful tips. I had a good mk III in my inv, but I was sleeping on it. I speced your build and played some games on Herecy, great fun and the way this thing eats Crushers is a joy on its own.
Sustained fire works on my hellbore 2 I've been using for a while. It confused the hell out of me at first, but it made me get into a rhythm of three charged shot bursts with a short break before the next 'salvo' of charged shots.
I left a message in the upper left about SF being fixed in one of the latest patches when I talk about it. I've been working on this video for about a month before I published it and the fix released way too late for me to re-record that fragment without ruining the flow of the video.
Excellent guide. I tried running it on Damnation several times (I have a stellar MkIII from the Emperor) and the only change was that I subbed in a Power Sword - as it has power cycler and brutal momentum which destroys essentially anything you care to hit with it. I don't dislike the chainswords, I just don't have a good one!
regarding dealing with bulwarks: I like to place a full charge shot on their right arm. That usually staggers them and opens them up for a follow-up headshot. While it can be a bit tricky, it is a very effective way of dealing with them when you're on your own.
This might be kind of a dumb idea, but why not have it start charging when you ADS? Then you'd have a full powered shot without having to hold both buttons. Still have it be able to charge up when hip firing by holding the primary fire like we can today.
Just one more trick that you can use with the mk3 when a shield ogryn attack you. Step dodge the club attack to the left while charging a shot and try to aim for the head. They should suffer from a medium stagger on headshot, which grants you another shot at getting a headshot and get ride of him quickly. Their attack animation leave them open, except their quick shieldbash attack. It's kind of a small window but i've been getting pretty good results using that move on lone bulwarks who can be pretty time consumming to get rid of as the sharpshooter.
I'm running with an MK I variant (& a power sword) with good stats including Onslaught that gives a boost on the charging and Surgical (gives extra range damage on weak spots). And let me tell you those jump shots saved a lot of my damnation runs especially when the elites are mixed in the horde. Basically with camo expert and a good shot and you're good to go. Well, that and because I ALWAYS (if its available) go on top of those covers to get a clear view from the top and it _sometimes_ helps because hounds can't reach you if you're high enough and you can easily spot the bulwark's head even with them facing front. Just wish it wasn't hell to do runs with Lights Out with Helbore. Though It'll be nice to have a nice switch between a bayonet and a flash light with their pros and cons. Here's the talent I'm running btw: 1 1 1 3 1 2
I like the Mk.I more because it was good enough to get the job done, and its bayonet jabs have gotten me out of a pinch quite a few times. Not so with the Mk.III because swinging it like an axe was sluggish and clunky in comparison, but I did like how the iron sights were easier to aim down and appreciated its stopping power.
I use a combination of shadowplay and OBS to record my clips and Filmora 12 as my editing software, although it's hard for me to recommend the latter as it can be a real piece of shit sometimes. I got a lifetime version of it on a sale a couple of years back so I don't have to pay for a subscription, but I don't think it's an option anymore. Edit: I also use Audacity to record the voiceover. Still learning how to use it to edit audio so that it's more listenable.
@@allycxt771 I have no idea why that's happening. I'm pretty inexperienced with OBS myself, so I can't really give you any good advice. I'd look up a guide on how to set the program up for youtube recordings if I were you, here's one that I've used as a point of reference when I was trying to figure out the most optimal settings for myself: ruclips.net/video/muwqdMQptKo/видео.html
If we're talking about High Intensity Shock Troop Gauntlet then I'd say Helbore Lasguns are much better mostly because they're not limited by the overheat mechanic and you have much better ammo efficiency. I wouldn't take the Mk III into Gauntlet missions though, as I've stopped using it after Fatshark removed the ability to cancel charged shots. It just feels too clunky for me to use it. I've converted to using the Mk II Helbore because of how fast it charges, and that thing shreds waves of elites while being extremely ammo efficient, to the point where you can use it against enemy shooters without having to worry about your ammo supply. You can use it both with The Bigger They Are or with Counterfire depending on your preference (I personally pick the former to deal with Bosses and massed Crusher waves). I've also seen some people running the Mk I with Onslaught, although I've yet to get a good roll on it and test it out myself. If you're running regular High Intensity then both of these weapon types are viable, they just bring different advantages to the table. Helbores don't have to worry about managing overheat while the Plasma Gun can shoot through walls and Bulwark Shields and can be pulled out much faster, so you can play around your melee much more. Just pick whatever's more fun for you.
I always run the same curios regardless of the build that I'm using, so let me just tell you what I aim to have on my Veteran instead. I'm currently in the process of grinding out my curios on all of my characters, so I'll give you a miniature curio guide in this comment as I can't really make a quick list of what I'm currently using. *WARNING, WALL OF TEXT IMBOUND* Having a single wound curio is something that I would recommend for all characters with the exception of the Ogryn, as he gets three wounds in his base kit anyway. Even the best players go down from time to time due to how chaotic Tide games are by nature. Having two bars of health means that if you go down once you're stuck with only half of your maximum health after getting revived, and if you lose that health you instantly die. That wound curio lets you go down once and still fight without having to hide behind every box on the way to the medicae station. Taking more than one wound curio is overkill though. I usually take two toughness curios for every other character because of how deadly ranged enemies are on higher difficulties, but since the Veteran has 200 base toughness I take health curios for him instead. That 40% increase in extra health lets you play a lot more aggressively and it saved my bacon multiple times from big bursts of health damage that I took from an unexpected poxburster or a sniper shot that I couldn't dodge. Speaking of which, you can't dodge every single sniper shot. You're gonna get hit by them from time to time, and with how much damage they do it can really ruin your day if you don't take any damage resistance against them, so I'd recommend having one or two curios with that DR slapped on them. Because I'm usually the last one to stay alive whenever I play in pubs I take extra revive speed on all three of my curios. I'll probably replace one of them with something like stamina regen since having three is a bit of an overkill, but they help out a lot whenever I'm forced into a clutch. Extra stamina regen is good to have on all characters, but it's extra important for the Veteran because his stamina takes the longest to start recharging out of all the classes with a 1.25 second delay. This means that using melee weapons which rely on push attacks can be difficult, like a Tactical or a Combat Axe for example. Ideally I'd take one or two stamina regen perks. Damage resistance against gunners is nice to have since you'll be trading damage with them a lot, letting you peek them without getting immediately melted, or go into cover while getting shot without losing all of your toughness if you're caught out of position. I'd take one of those perks and leave some room for other things. I take one corruption resistance against grimoires perk too for when I'm farming weekly challenges. I don't really take that much corruption as a Veteran since I tend to maintain my distance from enemies that inflict it (*cough cough* beast of nurgle *cough cough*). Regular curse resistance is much more necessary for Psykers and Zealots due to one being a glass cannon and the other relying on Holy Revenant a lot. If you have any space left I'd fill it with toughness regen speed. Veteran has amazing toughness regen talents at level 5, so it's not that necessary but still really nice to have if you don't know what else to take.
Very nice and deep video on this weapon. But I dont get that you can use the chain sword with your analytical and pragmatic aproach. Nice on mutants and otherwise its very bad. Power sword is absolutely broken. Charge+double light and repeat. You are clearing through everything when needed esp with slaughteree blessing. And you also doing super high dmg to mutants.
hellbore 2 is best lasgun, id like to love hellbore 3 but at present hellbore 3 is bugged where it doesnt charge when you tap it. its not very responsive with the control. unpopular opinion but this gun is better than kantrael. when i play this on damnation i pretty much wipe out all specials before they even reach my squad if you have a good aim esp in the head this guns for you.
I feel the same way now. I used to love the Mk III back when I was working on that video but I just can't use it anymore. It feels too clunky to use after they've removed the charge cancelling. I actually brought the Mk II Helbore with me into my first ever HI-STG Damnation match a while back and it's definitely my favourite of the three. The ammo efficiency and versatility of it are incredible and I wish I saw more people use it. You can even run it with Counterfire if you want to wipe the floor with shooters, but I still prefer using The Bigger they Are for Crushers and boss DPS. I've also rolled a Mk I for testing purposes yesterday and it seems like a viable alternative to it, but I need to run some more tests to get a strong opinion on it.
@@XrayWasTaken I hope fatshark fixes the mk3. my opinion mk1 is inferior to mk2 because both guns takes 2-3 (most of the elites can be killed with 2 headshots) shots to kill an elite and Mk2 can do the job easily and faster. my playstyle is aim for charged headshot all the time. i've spent like hundreds of hours comparing the 2. I think Mk1 is for players who cannot do consistent headshots and relies on body shots. In those type of playstyle, I would recommend using kantrael mk7 instead of these. my experiments, i believe mk3 can be superior to mk2 if they fix the control issues. but for now i think mk2 is best out of those 3
Mark II is way superior to the other 2 like u can shoot gunners, maniacs and hordes fast and with tier IV onslaught its charge is almost as fast as regular shots and let's u utterly destroy every heavily armored target in the game the only thing my weapon struggles with are mutants but they ain't no biggie tbh
![A Reject's Guide to Slab Shields [Build, Tanking, Attack Patterns, Closing the Distance]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/wT-7mSqqA6Y/mqdefault.jpg)
![A Reject's Guide to Slab Shields [Build, Tanking, Attack Patterns, Closing the Distance]](/img/tr.png)
discharging the shot by releasing the ADS no longer works after the current patch. I hope they revert this.
Holy shit I just checked it and you're right! I haven't used any of the Helbores since the patch has been released so I didn't notice that before I posted the guide. I really hope that this wasn't intentional as it makes the weapon even more user hostile than it already was with the long pullout time and it letting go of the charge by itself. The weapon feels 10x worse to use now
I didn't evwn onw you could do that. I always cancel charged shot with melee cancel switch.
@@XrayWasTaken
I tend to use the mk2 just because of that higher ROF. sights are still crap though. The ones on the mk3 are marginally better. Wish we could modify sights on our weapons to make target acquisition easier.
Great video! These weapons have been a sleeper that can really change the flow of battle for your team, arguably quite a bit more than any other gun in the game given the breakpoints and insane versatility of the MKIII.
Fun fact: a well-rolled (near 80% damage and pen) weapon with a +25% carapace damage roll (20% may be enough, haven't spent the time rerolling to test the breakpoint at 20% yet), with The Bigger They Are talent and Focused Fire up doesn't just enable two-shotting Crushers with headshots, it also enables killing a Crusher with a single headshot crit! It's one somewhat persuasive reason to take the +25% crit on Deadshot from the level 25 talents; More frequently one-shotting Crushers has made a substantial difference on some of my Damnation runs where things were getting dicey!
Also, if you follow any elite kill immediately with a reload, and so long as your next shot immediately after the reload kills another elite, you'll keep Focus Fire running perpetually, even without any +reload blessings or talents taken. This is tight with a weapon with 80% charge rate (likely would also do fine with the blessing that decreases charge time from multiple shots), so YMMV. But with the right rolls, you're still not giving up the ability to keep your ult running for bigger groups where you'll run out of ammo and a reload will be needed, you just lose some flexibility over the 30% reload speed level talent in return for more frequent kills from that extra crit-provided breakpoint.
A very good guide. This is fantastic work. I can tell a lot of thought went into it.
Hope you post more gameplay as well! Love watching skilled players .
Good breakdown of this weapon/build. Love the hellbore since it's buff a while back. Using mostly the same skills, all but the 5 (10% though on HS, (sway and crit) and 30 (60% though back on class skill use). Good video. keep them coming👍
Good work dude! Great edit and really helpful tips. I had a good mk III in my inv, but I was sleeping on it. I speced your build and played some games on Herecy, great fun and the way this thing eats Crushers is a joy on its own.
Sustained fire works on my hellbore 2 I've been using for a while. It confused the hell out of me at first, but it made me get into a rhythm of three charged shot bursts with a short break before the next 'salvo' of charged shots.
I left a message in the upper left about SF being fixed in one of the latest patches when I talk about it. I've been working on this video for about a month before I published it and the fix released way too late for me to re-record that fragment without ruining the flow of the video.
Excellent guide. I tried running it on Damnation several times (I have a stellar MkIII from the Emperor) and the only change was that I subbed in a Power Sword - as it has power cycler and brutal momentum which destroys essentially anything you care to hit with it. I don't dislike the chainswords, I just don't have a good one!
regarding dealing with bulwarks: I like to place a full charge shot on their right arm. That usually staggers them and opens them up for a follow-up headshot. While it can be a bit tricky, it is a very effective way of dealing with them when you're on your own.
This is great it’s really useful info thank you
i waited for this thank you
This might be kind of a dumb idea, but why not have it start charging when you ADS? Then you'd have a full powered shot without having to hold both buttons. Still have it be able to charge up when hip firing by holding the primary fire like we can today.
The virgin Helbore vs the Chad plasma gun
Just one more trick that you can use with the mk3 when a shield ogryn attack you. Step dodge the club attack to the left while charging a shot and try to aim for the head. They should suffer from a medium stagger on headshot, which grants you another shot at getting a headshot and get ride of him quickly. Their attack animation leave them open, except their quick shieldbash attack. It's kind of a small window but i've been getting pretty good results using that move on lone bulwarks who can be pretty time consumming to get rid of as the sharpshooter.
I'm running with an MK I variant (& a power sword) with good stats including Onslaught that gives a boost on the charging and Surgical (gives extra range damage on weak spots). And let me tell you those jump shots saved a lot of my damnation runs especially when the elites are mixed in the horde. Basically with camo expert and a good shot and you're good to go. Well, that and because I ALWAYS (if its available) go on top of those covers to get a clear view from the top and it _sometimes_ helps because hounds can't reach you if you're high enough and you can easily spot the bulwark's head even with them facing front. Just wish it wasn't hell to do runs with Lights Out with Helbore. Though It'll be nice to have a nice switch between a bayonet and a flash light with their pros and cons.
Here's the talent I'm running btw:
1 1 1 3 1 2
I'm hoping more Krieg weapons are added or maybe even a whole DLC around Krieg and other guard regiments like the Mordian Iron Guard
I want the Krieg Grenadier outfit for the Veteran
I like the Mk.I more because it was good enough to get the job done, and its bayonet jabs have gotten me out of a pinch quite a few times. Not so with the Mk.III because swinging it like an axe was sluggish and clunky in comparison, but I did like how the iron sights were easier to aim down and appreciated its stopping power.
perhaps plasma is better suited for killing big guys and other elites? or a bolter?
hi! i love ur video. what do you use to record and edit your clips?
I use a combination of shadowplay and OBS to record my clips and Filmora 12 as my editing software, although it's hard for me to recommend the latter as it can be a real piece of shit sometimes. I got a lifetime version of it on a sale a couple of years back so I don't have to pay for a subscription, but I don't think it's an option anymore.
Edit: I also use Audacity to record the voiceover. Still learning how to use it to edit audio so that it's more listenable.
@@XrayWasTaken ty! im trying to record this game on obs and post to youtube but my videos always come up blurry! do you have any tips
@@allycxt771 I have no idea why that's happening. I'm pretty inexperienced with OBS myself, so I can't really give you any good advice. I'd look up a guide on how to set the program up for youtube recordings if I were you, here's one that I've used as a point of reference when I was trying to figure out the most optimal settings for myself: ruclips.net/video/muwqdMQptKo/видео.html
i wish the iron sight for the lucius was a funyun because then i could actually use it as a sight
What is better now , Plasma or this one?
If we're talking about High Intensity Shock Troop Gauntlet then I'd say Helbore Lasguns are much better mostly because they're not limited by the overheat mechanic and you have much better ammo efficiency. I wouldn't take the Mk III into Gauntlet missions though, as I've stopped using it after Fatshark removed the ability to cancel charged shots. It just feels too clunky for me to use it.
I've converted to using the Mk II Helbore because of how fast it charges, and that thing shreds waves of elites while being extremely ammo efficient, to the point where you can use it against enemy shooters without having to worry about your ammo supply. You can use it both with The Bigger They Are or with Counterfire depending on your preference (I personally pick the former to deal with Bosses and massed Crusher waves). I've also seen some people running the Mk I with Onslaught, although I've yet to get a good roll on it and test it out myself.
If you're running regular High Intensity then both of these weapon types are viable, they just bring different advantages to the table. Helbores don't have to worry about managing overheat while the Plasma Gun can shoot through walls and Bulwark Shields and can be pulled out much faster, so you can play around your melee much more. Just pick whatever's more fun for you.
Dont play Vet but solid vid here is an upvote and a sub
Thank you
What would you recommend for curios in this build?
I always run the same curios regardless of the build that I'm using, so let me just tell you what I aim to have on my Veteran instead. I'm currently in the process of grinding out my curios on all of my characters, so I'll give you a miniature curio guide in this comment as I can't really make a quick list of what I'm currently using. *WARNING, WALL OF TEXT IMBOUND*
Having a single wound curio is something that I would recommend for all characters with the exception of the Ogryn, as he gets three wounds in his base kit anyway. Even the best players go down from time to time due to how chaotic Tide games are by nature. Having two bars of health means that if you go down once you're stuck with only half of your maximum health after getting revived, and if you lose that health you instantly die. That wound curio lets you go down once and still fight without having to hide behind every box on the way to the medicae station. Taking more than one wound curio is overkill though.
I usually take two toughness curios for every other character because of how deadly ranged enemies are on higher difficulties, but since the Veteran has 200 base toughness I take health curios for him instead. That 40% increase in extra health lets you play a lot more aggressively and it saved my bacon multiple times from big bursts of health damage that I took from an unexpected poxburster or a sniper shot that I couldn't dodge.
Speaking of which, you can't dodge every single sniper shot. You're gonna get hit by them from time to time, and with how much damage they do it can really ruin your day if you don't take any damage resistance against them, so I'd recommend having one or two curios with that DR slapped on them.
Because I'm usually the last one to stay alive whenever I play in pubs I take extra revive speed on all three of my curios. I'll probably replace one of them with something like stamina regen since having three is a bit of an overkill, but they help out a lot whenever I'm forced into a clutch.
Extra stamina regen is good to have on all characters, but it's extra important for the Veteran because his stamina takes the longest to start recharging out of all the classes with a 1.25 second delay. This means that using melee weapons which rely on push attacks can be difficult, like a Tactical or a Combat Axe for example. Ideally I'd take one or two stamina regen perks.
Damage resistance against gunners is nice to have since you'll be trading damage with them a lot, letting you peek them without getting immediately melted, or go into cover while getting shot without losing all of your toughness if you're caught out of position. I'd take one of those perks and leave some room for other things.
I take one corruption resistance against grimoires perk too for when I'm farming weekly challenges. I don't really take that much corruption as a Veteran since I tend to maintain my distance from enemies that inflict it (*cough cough* beast of nurgle *cough cough*). Regular curse resistance is much more necessary for Psykers and Zealots due to one being a glass cannon and the other relying on Holy Revenant a lot.
If you have any space left I'd fill it with toughness regen speed. Veteran has amazing toughness regen talents at level 5, so it's not that necessary but still really nice to have if you don't know what else to take.
@@XrayWasTaken thank you
Very nice and deep video on this weapon.
But I dont get that you can use the chain sword with your analytical and pragmatic aproach.
Nice on mutants and otherwise its very bad. Power sword is absolutely broken. Charge+double light and repeat. You are clearing through everything when needed esp with slaughteree blessing. And you also doing super high dmg to mutants.
He has a german accent, I trust him
Uhhhhhh
hellbore 2 is best lasgun, id like to love hellbore 3 but at present hellbore 3 is bugged where it doesnt charge when you tap it. its not very responsive with the control. unpopular opinion but this gun is better than kantrael. when i play this on damnation i pretty much wipe out all specials before they even reach my squad if you have a good aim esp in the head this guns for you.
I feel the same way now. I used to love the Mk III back when I was working on that video but I just can't use it anymore. It feels too clunky to use after they've removed the charge cancelling.
I actually brought the Mk II Helbore with me into my first ever HI-STG Damnation match a while back and it's definitely my favourite of the three. The ammo efficiency and versatility of it are incredible and I wish I saw more people use it. You can even run it with Counterfire if you want to wipe the floor with shooters, but I still prefer using The Bigger they Are for Crushers and boss DPS. I've also rolled a Mk I for testing purposes yesterday and it seems like a viable alternative to it, but I need to run some more tests to get a strong opinion on it.
@@XrayWasTaken I hope fatshark fixes the mk3. my opinion mk1 is inferior to mk2 because both guns takes 2-3 (most of the elites can be killed with 2 headshots) shots to kill an elite and Mk2 can do the job easily and faster. my playstyle is aim for charged headshot all the time. i've spent like hundreds of hours comparing the 2.
I think Mk1 is for players who cannot do consistent headshots and relies on body shots. In those type of playstyle, I would recommend using kantrael mk7 instead of these.
my experiments, i believe mk3 can be superior to mk2 if they fix the control issues. but for now i think mk2 is best out of those 3
The Mk2 (blue) helbore has the most damage per uncharged shot
Mark II is way superior to the other 2 like u can shoot gunners, maniacs and hordes fast and with tier IV onslaught its charge is almost as fast as regular shots and let's u utterly destroy every heavily armored target in the game the only thing my weapon struggles with are mutants but they ain't no biggie tbh
So long story short: don't bother until you are higher level, not a gun for new players both in versatility and semi-reliant on perks and feats.
and using the worst 1 and 5 feat point ;D lol
Hellbore Lasguns are complete dogshit. You can just use a regular lasgun and shoot twice, and do more damage for less ammunition.