If it's proven to be ineffective, and has been, wouldn't this be a clear case of false advertising or even fraud and open itself up to legal action from consumers?
They can always claim it was tested for safety, and that the original tests they made for it showed it was effective because of the methodology of the test. _"people were happy with it, we just never re-tested it with the new testing protocols"._ Of course they knew and of course they'll wash their hands clean
@@arothmanmusic The goal would be to get it off the shelves, not to make money. The settlement would likely cover lawyers fees, so there’s at least some incentive for someone to take the case.
It felt like an open secret most people just didn't bother to hear. Since 2005 I've advised anyone I knew was sick to go "get the real medicine" behind the counter.
I would call my doctor and ask for it and how I sounded over the phone would be enough for a diagnosis. I don't think they minded missing out on an opportunity to bill insurance for the appointment because they would rather people not come in while having a cold.
I've been an Urgent Care PA for several years now and was so glad when I saw this news break recently. Providers who are up to date with the literature have known for a long time that PE was useless. And then patients come in thinking they have something really bad going on because it doesn't help. These companies have always known PE didn't work and should be held accountable
Also prescribing decongestants or really even suggesting them is not a good idea. They often don’t work and do nothing to shorten the illness. It’s another bandaid patients are obsessed with because god forbid you tell them to drink some water and get some rest.
Went to urgent care a few years ago and my physician said “that PE stuff doesn’t work. Don’t waste money. Go behind the counter” and then kind of ranted how F’d up healthcare is. When I heard the ineffective drug story break I thought back to what he said.
@@granola_green A mild congestion doesn't last long!* Anything that doesn't make it worse will be just as effective! *Unless you're like me in which case you're almost always congested.
My doctors have been telling me for years not to bother with phenylephrine, and I could tell from personal experience that it did eff all, but I had always assumed it simply worked for some people but not me. Learning that it was actually never good for anyone, period, is astonishing.
It is a weird thing that only people who were alive during that particular meth epidemic are aware that you have to go behind the counter for the effective medicine.
also the people who are trying to actually illegally make meth, The reality is the actually psudoephedrine purchase limits are still enough to make plenty, by the looks of it the only thing moveing it behind the counter did was let a company sell an eye surgury drug as an ineffective decongestant for decades
@@therideneverends1697its not worth it though with how cheap the cartels have made meth as low as 450 dollars an ounce. It would cost you like 20 to 30 dollars a gram by buying sudafed and the other ingredients and it would probably be crapy compared to the huge crystals u would get on the street.
I’m sick and have been taking an off-brand of Sudafed PE the last day or two…and noticed my congestion wasn’t changing so switched to a different med. I thought it was just me. It all makes sense now! Medications that don’t work shouldn’t be on the market. The American public puts their trust into these agencies…how disappointing.
Maybe the American government should put more money into those agencies so they can actually do their jobs, instead of just buying more bombs and fighter jets and whatever...
They demonized pseudoephedrine 20 years ago because of meth. But it really is the only thing that works on colds and flu. So when I get sick, I trudge in to the only pharmacy in my town that sells generic Sudafed. I give them my drivers license and am on a law enforcement reporting list every time I need it. It's a pain, but it's the only med that works!🤷♀️x
i remember when i suffered from chronic congestion. i remember driving to three stores who didn't have anyone on duty at the time to unlock the sudafed case. because of the moronic nature of the war on drugs, it was much easier to get a hold of meth than sudafed
Amphetamine was originally developed as a decongestant. It wasn't ideal for that as it worked in doses that most people found intensely uncomfortable. They used it originally in nasal inhalers.
My sentiments exactly when moving back to the US and trying to refill a prescription for ADD meds. So infuriating coming from a country where I could get either prescription or illicit drugs via delivery. They should just legalise all drugs and treat addiction with education and a decent public health system
....when I was younger, I'd be given these meds when I had a cold or allergy issue, and every time I was like 'it isn't helping' but no one listened to me. so, turns out, I was right all along. that also explains why the meds I picked out for myself when I was older DID help, because I poked around til I found ones that did work, instead of being told 'its working stop complaining.' I think I know if a medicine is making my face hurt less or not!
Not just in the USA, we have it here in Australia as well. How many hoops you must jump through to get pseudoephedrine depends on the state you live in.
In europe we have an alternative called xylometazoline, is that one not available in the US? There are some side effects, but mostly with people who overuse it like it's candy
@@Monjipour According to Wikipedia: "As of 2021, a number of consumer products containing xylometazoline are marketed in the United States." It doesn't say how long ago it was first approved, but we've had OXYmetazoline available as a nasal spray since at least the late 2000s, and I can attest that it works quite well.
Although ORAL phenylephrine does not work, phenylephrine nasal spray is an effective decongestant when used short-term for a cold. A better alternative, however, is oxymetazoline (e.g., Afrin) decongestant nasal spray, which works longer than phenylephrine nasal spray for a cold. Remember, only use these for a few days to avoid rebound congestion associated with chronic use. OTC topical nasal corticosteroid sprays (e.g., Flonase) are remarkably effective for congestion due to allergies. Oral pseudoephedrine is the only oral option for a cold, but OTC antihistamines both oral and nasal sprays might help some patients. Talk to your pharmacist.
Afrin is kind of terrifying and I never found Flonase or Nasacort effective. I have pretty severe mold allergies and the only thing that works is oral antihistamines and avoiding exposure.
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Finally a sensible knowledgeable comment!
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@@francisnopantses1108 There is nothing terrifying about oxymetazoline but using it regularly for allergy relief is a bad idea because over time it will stop working. Afrin (and the gazillion equivalents sold all over the world) is a very effective decongestand designed to be used for a period of a few days during intense cold and phase it out ASAP. That way you can rely on it long term.
Yep. Last cold I had, the real pseudoephedrine worked, but not enough...it wasnt the "right" kind of congestion, I guess. Pseudo works great if I'm truly blocked up/snotty, but if I'm just swollen/drippy, it's a coin toss. I scoured my med cabinet and found some phenylephrine liquid nasal drops, and tried them in spite of the recent "but phenylephrine doesn't work!" news....and it honestly helped quite a bit. The delivery method DOES matter. And you'll notice that the video specifically mentions ORAL phenylephrine as being the med that was looked at/doesn't work, it just didn't highlight that fact.
Xylometazoline or oxymetazoline as well as other nasal sprays isn't so suitable for casual carrying as antiflu variants are, already presented in many dosage forms, from granulated envelopes to liquid sticks. Stability and integrity of the API are vital when compared to general effectiveness. While phenylephrine is completely useless in any possible presentation, point here is that marketing dictates most OTC formulations in pharma industry, so we have them everywhere besides having a terrible reputation between experts.
Like if money in politics wasnt allowerd where the healthcare industry is incentivized to pay politicians to pass laws making healthcare more expensive? That would be super weird
@@tomaccinothis medication is OTC in the UK and AU so how you operate the healthcare system isn’t the issue. Considering a government agency, the FDA, is the issue here.
@@tomaccino Clearly you're not actually European, or you'd know that "universal healthcare" doesn't mean the whole system is nationalized; it just means you get insurance for free. Still a good thing to have, but private, profit-driven businesses shouldn't even be allowed to exist in this space.
The thing is pseudoephedrine is so much harder to come by that one joke scientific journal article proposed a way to synthesize it from meth instead because "it would be of great interest to have a simple synthesis of pseudoephedrine from reagents which can be more readily procured"
I remember when I was younger how effective Sudafed was. As an adult with some worsening allergies, of course I went for Sudafed (PE) because of my memories of it, only to have it be completely useless. Thank goodness I can still get Pseudoephedrine behind the counter, because it actually works.
Phenylephrine is a TOPICAL vasodilator. It generally only works on mucous membranes by direct contact and this was noted when pseudoephedrine was pulled from shelves. I read articles about this ages ago about how PE simply wouldn't work. It's neutralized in stomach acid.
This is why I only buy the behind the counter decongestant. When they moved what I used to by over the counter to behind, I found the over the counter stuff didn’t work. The decongestants keep me from getting sinus infections so I need them to work! Thank you for validating me so many years later!!
A big problem for families with children under 18 is that when one person gets sick, usually others are also sick, whether it’s a respiratory virus or inherited seasonal allergies. But the monthly limit isn’t enough to treat 3 or more people when only 1 or 2 of them is old enough to buy it.
The monthly limit for Pseudophedrine in the US is 9 grams or approximately 300 pills worth. Either your state has a smaller limit or y'all are overusing those pills, just saying, especially if it's being giving to kids.
@@KC-Mitch 9 grams comes to 75 of the 12-hour pills of 120mg each, taken twice a day, and one adult with an ID can get one pack per month, which would be enough to last 2 people only 18 days, assuming neither person is sick enough to need it longer. But it’s not enough for more people than that when everyone in the family gets hit with the same bad virus or seasonal allergies and anyone needs to take it more than 12 days, which is especially common in families that have members with asthma and other conditions that make them develop more serious respiratory symptoms. And people with that higher risk are also less likely to be able to go out and get it separately due to other health conditions. So like many things, it’s often harder to get for the people who need it the most. And it’s the same dose for “kids” 12 and over, but they obviously still can’t buy their own for another 6 years, so, “just saying,” that part of your comment is irrelevant. The flu, RSV, and covid rips through high schools full of “kids.”
You should also be careful, as using too much decongestants can actually cause congestion! They become less effective with overuse (rebound congestion)
In Australia you can only get one box a month but even then they can refuse if they think your using too much. I have to say though any good pharmacist will understand if you have many people and will let you buy more if you run out quickly. you just cant get more than 1 box in a day.
I have no problem going up to the counter to ask for Sudafed, but if you're like me and realize you need medication at 10pm and the pharmacy counter is closed, you're SOL in the US until the next day.
I’ve always knew Phenylephrine never worked, Pseudoephedrine always worked for me and I always try to get when I have severe nasal congestion. The last few years I’ve been diagnosed with Nasal Polyps and awaiting surgery. Pseudoephedrine is still my go to decongestant.
I was mocked for years because i was accused of distrusting over the counter medicine. I didn't distrust it, i just didn't believe it worked for me. Then i started seeing articles like this.
When I worked in a pharmacy back in 2008, part of our training course was about pse and pe. It highlighted how ineffective pe was and that a best recommendation would be an otc medication without pe (such as cough and pain) alongside pse from behind the counter.
I remember trying this once years ago. It didn't do anything, so I've never bought it again. So I have to ask, why do people continue to buy something that doesn't help? Go for the sudaphed instead. It works like a charm.
The peudoephedrine was put "behind the counter", simply not purchaseable unless you interface with the American medical insurance system to get a prescription, with all the costs, wait, and complexity that brings. And pharmacies were ALSO forced by the PATRIOT act to take your ID when you received sudafed and put your name on a list of potential terrorists/drugdealers/witches. If you can't get an appointment until 8 days in the future, and you have an illness that's likely to last 3 more days, there is a very clear message being sent.
I know I've used Vicks vaporub way too many times I've lost count of it. Decongestants allow you to breathe properly without feeling you might be sacrificed for Halloween season.
Wow. I just got over some illness where I was severely congested for almost 2 weeks. I bought multiple oral medications (pills) containing phenylephrine and was complaining about it not working at all. However, I also bought nasal spray phenylephrine and that DID work amazingly. One spray up each nostril and I was breathing within ~15-20 seconds. But the pills were utterly useless.
I have had severe allergies for most of my life and went from one otc to the next. None were more effective than an hour. Then I got cancer but survived happily. After that I decided no more meds. I found 3 things together that basically eliminated allergies from my life for the last 10 years. One, I have "good" air purifiers all over my house and in my office. Just a bit of dust gets me sneezing. My air cleaner can clean the room in 15 minutes. Two, I use sinus rinse like neilmed. Takes about 5 uses to learn how to use it and get used to it but it gives instant symptom relief and good for a few hours. After a few years I feel like my body is now more resistant and the benefits last most of the day instead of a few hours. Finally, I get congested on planes of the flight is more than 4 hours. So in those cases I will take an advil or tylenol or aleeve since all I need is relief from sinus swelling. While still annoying Allergies have not been something I stress over in nearly 10 years. It's more like an itchy bug bite now. Say no to those otc allergy pills.
I remember when the law requiring pseudoephedrine go behind the counter that I immediately felt like phenylephrine was garbage compared to it but then I somehow managed to gaslight myself into thinking I was just noceboing myself and that surely it must work and eventually I came to think/feel that phenylephrine does work which just goes to show the importance of placebo controlled studies.
I figured this out as soon as they made the switch when pseudoephedrine started being rationed and kept behind the counter rather than in the medicine isle. The first time I accidentally bought a product that now contained phenylephrine instead it obviously wasn't working the same.
Thank you for doing this! I think I was duped once. Since then, I insist on Pseudoephedrine even though it's a huge PITA to get. Though, I mainly use loratadine if I have mild-to-moderate cold/drainage symptoms.
You're kinda both wrong - neither the DEA nor the FDA had the proper funding to actually do what needed to be done. It was only until COVID that the relevant health and drug agencies were given the capability to do stuff outside of menial paperwork processing.
I’d agree that the “standard” 5mg dose doesn’t do much, but man are the 10mg tablets a miracle drug. Hands down the MVP of my medicine cabinet during cold season.
Ive spent years taking PE and didnt realize it wasnt working. I bought actual Sudafed the other night and experienced side effects, but also experienced noticeable relief. And the reason I didnt just buy it in the past? Laziness. I didnt wanna wait in a long pharmacy line when i could buy "pretty much the same thing" from a shelf and be done with it.
I could have told you years ago it didn’t work. I realized really quick and started buying the stuff behind the pharmacy counter with the pseudoephedrine in it.
Yeah I had never used anything other than Pseudoephedrine until college. My wife, well girlfriend at the time, was sensitive to it so we got some cold medicine without it. I went back out to get myself something that actually worked after the first time I tried the other stuff. Lol
In Australia you are allowed a box of 12 tablets every 3 days. They take your license and enter it into a national database. People of had issues where a license number has been mistyped and somehow matched theirs meaning they have to wait.
That's basically how it is in most of the states too. You don't need a doc Rx just a government ID and it tracks how much you/your household address buy in a months time.
@@phil2782I bought pseudoephedrine over the counter in Utah today. Only needed my ID. I’ve also bought it without a prescription in South Dakota when I got a cold on vacation
It was a known fact that these decongestants don't work, I always thought it was me, but this is wild. I've gotten far by putting air filters in my house, getting rid of my wall to wall carpet, using sinus rinses, daily antihistamine and pseudoephedrine when my sinus headaches can't break. I give the pharmacist my ID and sometimes they shame me, but I'm the one who's allergic to almost everything.
With pseudoephedrine being behind the counter, it means waiting for the pharmacist and there is always such a long line / wait to even talk to them. When you're just congested, you don't want to deal with that, so it is no wonder phenylephrine became so heavily used. I just wish there was a way we could make it easier for legitimate customers to by the pseudoephedrine and prevent the meth cookers from getting it.
In Canada you can buy it in combination with ibuprofen or acetaminophen or whatever in front of the counter, but the pseudoephedrine-only pills are behind.
My wife had a severe sinus infection headache a couple days ago. Luckily I had heard about the ineffectiveness of oral phenylephrine. A very effective OTC alternative for her was a nasal spray containing oxymetazoline HCL. Took her pain from a 9 down to a 4. For anyone else curious, after researching more, I found some other effective alternatives were pseudoephedrine (as mentioned in the video), and topically applied phenylephrine (like in a nasal spray). I hope whoever needs to hear this gets feeling better soon!
Phenylephrine does work well as a nasal spray however. "Four Way Fast Acting Nasal Spray" is my go to for congestion. Literally 30 seconds and I can breathe again. WalMart has an Equate version too.
In my state, you must go to the pharmacy and show ID to get the " original Sudafed," but in my county, you must have a prescription. I understand the reasons why this step was taken (my county is high on the meth production list), but that doesn't change the fact that it causes a bit of a hardship for anyone wanting effective decongestants. A doctor's visit just to get a prescription for a decongestant can be high in medical costs and, for many, requires time away from work to attend. I don't mind asking at the pharmacy, but requiring a prescription is a step too far.
We can still get it OTC you just have to give a government ID with it and it keep track of how much you buy and if you hit the "ok that's probably enough to make meth" threshold in a month you can't buy it for a while. So your doc doesn't have to write an Rx but it's still a few hoops to cross.
Ever since I've discovered Pseudoephedrine my congestion response changed dramatically. Now I take it for both harsh allergies and strong colds/flus. Basically anything nasal.
3:18 - Codified is NOT pronounced “COD-if-eyed”, it’s “CODE-if-eyed”. Ya know, because it was made into CODE. Why do so many people get this wrong lately?
I read metastudies for fun so I knew phenylephrine was as useless as homeopathy years ago. Told everyone I knew and no one listened to me. Now that it's in the news my friend has sheepishly admitted I was right!
But its not useless. Its seriously the only stuff keeping me alive. I have chronic yeast infections and inflammation in my upper sinuses, and this stuff is the only thing that can touch it. Otherwise I am sniffling non-stop with a nasty headache.
I had to go begging to the pharmacy counter for my asthma inhaler too... Though... they say Sudafed is non-drowsy but it puts me to sleep like a rock in a sock...
In Mexico we can’t even buy Pseudoephedrine and it’s legally banned, so the only option since 2008 it’s been only Phenylephrine so basically we have no options 😢
Walt, what about the entire pharmacies you have all over the place where you can just buy powerful prescription drugs of all manner over the counter???!
After this story came out I was so excited for me or someone in my life to get congestion so I could buy real sudafed again. Wife got it last week so I bought some. Her exact words after feeling much better: "man, no wonder they lock this stuff up."
Pseudoephedrine is banned in my country due to people manufacturing methamphetamine with it. Also cough medicines are now prescibed only by doctors in Australia. Man you guys in the usa are wild
Guaifenesin is the other big thing in that aisle of the pharmacy, and it also doesn't work. It was introduced into Robitussin / dextromethorphan because it induces vomiting in recreational quantitites. The DEA eyed ALL the effective cold medicine and threatened or forced manufacturers to put them behind the counter if they continued to fuel recreational use. So the compromise was to switch or to literally poison them.
Could you point to evidence of this? I don’t recall ever not being able to get dextromethorphan without guaifenesin. I specifically look for one with both because the guaifenesin helps “moisten” a dry cough.
Guaifenesin (Mucinex) does seem to work for me. I take the big 12-hour horespills and they seem to cut back on my congestion. Of course, it's hard to tell scientifically because I've got no control group for my own sinuses. :)
Mucinex works but it's not a drying decongestant. It is not like pseudoephedrine (you can take these together hence the reason for the combo meds). It works to loosen the mucus you already have in your sinuses or lungs so if that is not your issue you won't find relief. Plus you need to take it for a few consecutive days for the ingredient to work. I also agree with another poster in this thread to drink a lot of water with it as it breaks down more effectively in your system.
I don't understand your comment at around 7:30 that you could have gone behind the counter and gotten Pseudoephedrine that worked, but you "didn't know there was anything wrong with Phenylephrine." The only thing "wrong" with Phenylephrine is that it doesn't work, and surely you knew that since you said many times in the video that it did not cure your symptoms like Pseudoephedrine used to. I am annoyed having to get Pseudoephedrine behind the counter: it is pain to keep track of when I am allowed to buy more, and it is hard to buy enough for my large family of kids who are old enough to take it, but not to buy it. But I have little sympathy for people who knew Phenylephrine didn't work for them, but just didn't want to bother buying Pseudoephedrine behind the counter. All the cries of "Why didn't you tell me it didn't work?!?!" when you spent YEARS taking it, knowing full well that it was not doing the one job it was supposed to do.
I made the mistake of buying the PE versions a few times and quickly realized it did jack squat. So, hand over that photo ID and buy the methy circles, and enjoy a congestion free life.
Phil Edwards is a gem and I'm glad to see him both here and on his own channel. I was a little surprised when I found that the decongestant my doctor had recommended was only available behind the counter because reasons explained in this video.
its sad how ineffective our important government systems are due to lack of funding, and how people want take away the meager funding that exists already
They're ineffective because they're the government. The government should not control drugs at all. It should test and verify contents and purity, and prosecute fraud and misrepresentation, but the consumer should decide for themselves.
This. This drug shows the danger of regulation without funding. I personally think there is in general too much regulation today, but for things like food and drugs it makes sense. That being said, if you are choosing to regulate something, then you must fund it appropriately. This type of stagnation and inability to support innovation is appalling. Otherwise you get stories like this one. Sadly, I think this one is a drop in the bucket compared to all the issues out there with insufficiently funded regulatory bodies for their tasked roles.
The answer to that, is Panadol (paracetamol). Which has also been found to be equally or less affective than placebo. I know this because I have pain, and anytime I take it, it does literally nothing.
I tried it once. I have allergies that leave me so congested that even my teeth and hair hurt. After taking sudafed pe and getting absolutely no relief i sent my husband back to the pharmacy to get the stuff that actually works.
This isn't the only class of drugs where consumers routinely overestimate the power of drugs. This topic could be a segue into the strange world of oncology, where physicians and patients become emotionally invested in a product mainly because there aren't many choices. Touch that emotion and be prepared for intense backlash.
Oncology is a different issue... what works and what doesn't depends almost entirely on the cancer type, and in some cases people only have a couple objectively bad choices and nothing else. It *might* work, and so they have no alternative but to go all in on that drug since it's quite literally a matter of life and death.
@@smears6039 chemo is a very large group of many chemicals. In one of my 4th-year biochem classes, we've gone over a couple examples where drugs were tested and only worked in like 20% of patients, and it was later discovered that the 20% they worked in had specific gene mutations in their cancers that made the drug work. They were tried without understanding how or why they worked or didn't, so they were thrown at any patient with what they thought was the right kind of cancer. Unfortunately, you need genetic screening to determine what the actual right kind of cancer is, and that wasn't really economical 20 years ago.
People with long term allergies have known it doesn’t work. When Sudafed went behind the counter, I bought a box of phenylephrine. I was miserable for a couple of days, before I went back for pseudoephedrine. I’ve never bought phenylephrine since.
What I don’t get is that people feel it is ineffective, but keep buying it… first time it didn’t do anything, I researched it, learned the scam, and have been buying the right stuff since…
It Absolutely does work, and I've been a user for 15 years. After the reformulation of Sudafed Sinus Headache medication (which stopped working), a pharmacist told me to take 2 nasal decongestants and 2 acetaminophen. That is is essentially the same, and you know what? It is. This medicine and combination is a lifeline for me, as a chronic sinus headache and congestion sufferer, living in the Ohio Valley; which is one of the most allergen infested areas of America. But is the suffering of millions taken into account, when the FDA apparently has nothing else better to do, and targets a widely used medicine? No. Sufferers are just left to suffer.
Exactly. I have chronic inflammation and yeast infections in my upper sinuses, this is the only thing that can stop me from sniffling and crying constantly. The other stuff makes me extremely sick- makes my heart slow to a crawl and pound like a hammer. Why can't they go after things that are actually harmful and useless? Instead of taking away something that some people do find relief from, just because most people don't.
Three things: 1) Phenylephrine products work for me so long as I take them along with an antihistamine and an expectorant (which I’ve never found all in one product) because taking any of the three alone doesn’t work for me when I have a cold; 2) Why doesn’t this video and your others have one of those give $ buttons (I can’t remember the actual label)?; 3) Pseudoephedrine has always worked wonderfully for me, but it gives me wild insomnia and I was taking it with a bunch of other OTC meds when I had a sinus infection during quarantine and now something is wrong with my heart (something stretched out they said). I’ve heard Pseudoephedrine does greater damage to your system than phenylephrine too, but it works better. You have to pick your poison…🤷🏽♀️
Thats weird. I'm somewhat of a sinus expert (I've suffered maxillary sinusitis of odontogenic origin since 2016ish) and I'm pretty used to nasal congestion and resolving it. Phenylephrine definitely works. I take Tylenol Sinus when Xlear spray alone doesnt handle the congestion. Phenylephrine in tylenol sinus always worked for me, so the video and reactions in comments are puzzling for me. Maybe it works differently for chronic congestion vs acute (cold flu etc)? Very interesting, wish someone does research on this 🤔
Same. In my experience it does not help with colds, but is, not exaggerating, a miracle for my inflammation from chronic yeast infections and various other issues. The other stuff gives me unbearable side effects.
Very educational and dam interesting.I am from the UK and my chemist warned me about these 15 years ago, now his advice makes more sense and although I didn’t understand at the time I do now,thank you for your content.😊🙏
As a doctor, I have been told on a number of occasions "How am I/my child going to get better without medication??" when they come to me with the common cold and I prescribe nothing. Predictably some would never come back to me. There will ALWAYS be a demand for OTC meds for coughs and colds. It doesn't matter if science says it doesn't work. But then there are plenty other things in life that don't work but people say they need them.
Just means you're a bad doctor. I know a lot of supplements that work like a charm, completely remover any symptoms of colds or fevers. The vast majority of Doctors nowadays are just lazy and/or full of themselves. (I'm a scientist/engineer who works for a pharma company, so Im not uneducated, so I can read and research well)
Genuine question and I hope I don't sound so harsh to you. Do you have any concern on prescribing Pseudoephedrine with Paracetamol, CTM and Dextromethorphan? I hope you don't because all of those are OTC medication for combating flu and common cold symptoms and are available outside the US
Is it really that good?? I have used benadryl but i hate it cuz on a busy day it makes me slouchy and drowsy although it helps decongest AND eliminate the allergy reactions i have wanted to use pseudoephedrine but havent found enough people telling me its really works
It is interesting to see the science behind this but as someone who suffers so much with blocked sinuses, I knew that decongestants just didn't seem to work. I will use cold and flu medication, more so for the caffeine and paracetamol but if I need my sinuses clearing, I just use an OTC sinusitis spray and it works wonders
Luckily we can still buy Advil Cold & Sinus "Classic" with pseudoephedrine --you just have to ask for it at the pharmacy and give over your government ID info to get it. 😅 Nothing else works for me.
PPA works much better but was also sold at a much higher dosage for weight loss. 12 strokes out of 5 billion doses and they took it off the market, not just for weight loss but also for congestion.
I always feel so awkward going to the counter and asking for it, though. I especially hate talking to people when I'm sick. At least in Canada you can buy the combination meds in front of the counter. Also, don't forget about the completely unregulated and untested homeopathic sugar pills that are permitted to be sold alongside real medicine on pharmacy shelves. Which sometimes contain unidentified contaminants making them not even safe.
I thought this was common knowledge for years. I remember a bit they did on the Colbert Report about how the OTC version contained "Jack-Squat-acil" and how Stephen needed to go to his local meth dealer to get ingredients to make an effective decongestant.
In Mexico we can’t even buy Pseudoephedrine and it’s legally banned, so the only option since 2008 it’s been only Phenylephrine so basically we have no options.
Doesn't the USA have nasal sprays with Oxymetazoline against nasal congestion? It's still to be used sparingly (tolerance building), but it works quite fast.
I go to the pharmacist and ask for pseudoephedrine. Have for years. Easy. Makes me jittery but dries up my Eustachian tubes when the plane I’m on is descending. Cures the ear pain. Incidentally, in the U.S. code in is a class I drug. In Europe, I buy it over the counter, from the pharmacist… but in U.K. Melatonin is by doctor’s prescription only. So weird.
i’ve been having an awful cold and congested ears for about a week now. i’ve been taking phenylephrine everyday and there’s been ZERO relief. i’m happy to know it’s not all in my head
That finally makes sense. I just thought I hadn't found the right brand that worked for me so I always tried a different one. Nope, just the actual med doesn't work. Cool.
If you want a decongestant which really works, buy nasal spray containing oxymetazoline. That stuff is like a roto rooter going through your sinuses. It works quickly and lasts 12 hours, unlike pseudoephedrine which only works for 4 hours.
I just had a long discussion with my folks about how the does of decongestants I’d taken last night offered me next to NO relief, suffice to say I was miserable. Turns out it was Phenylephrine. Go figure.
The "PE" stands for Placebo Effect.
I love it 🤣
Do you have ED or ...?
I thought it stood for Phil Edwards the producer of this episode
Ayoooo
I laughed so hard at that even though I have been ripped off by it
As somebody who's suffered from allergies my whole life, I've been able to tell you for decades that phenylephrine was worthless.
Have you tried megadosing vitamin D to improve your immune system?
@@CourtneyCoulsonthey have allergies. Their immune system is plenty strong!
Any other drugs that don't work we don't know of?
@@CourtneyCoulson Sounds like a great way to suffer from acute hypervitaminosis
I tried it twice and noticed it did nothing. Never bought it again thereafter.
If it's proven to be ineffective, and has been, wouldn't this be a clear case of false advertising or even fraud and open itself up to legal action from consumers?
lets get a class action!
That’s what I was thinking. It’s expensive and I’m just imagining how much they’ve made off a fraudulent product.
They can always claim it was tested for safety, and that the original tests they made for it showed it was effective because of the methodology of the test. _"people were happy with it, we just never re-tested it with the new testing protocols"._
Of course they knew and of course they'll wash their hands clean
"Have you ever taken any product containing phenylephrine? You could be entitled to roughly 11¢ compensation. Simply complete this form…"
@@arothmanmusic The goal would be to get it off the shelves, not to make money. The settlement would likely cover lawyers fees, so there’s at least some incentive for someone to take the case.
It felt like an open secret most people just didn't bother to hear. Since 2005 I've advised anyone I knew was sick to go "get the real medicine" behind the counter.
Yeah I thought this was common knowledge
I would call my doctor and ask for it and how I sounded over the phone would be enough for a diagnosis. I don't think they minded missing out on an opportunity to bill insurance for the appointment because they would rather people not come in while having a cold.
Same. it was a no brainer
@Luke5100But many people don't have that kind of relationship with a doctor.
What does the doctor prescribe for a decongestant?
I've been an Urgent Care PA for several years now and was so glad when I saw this news break recently. Providers who are up to date with the literature have known for a long time that PE was useless. And then patients come in thinking they have something really bad going on because it doesn't help. These companies have always known PE didn't work and should be held accountable
Wow that's just despicable
Also prescribing decongestants or really even suggesting them is not a good idea. They often don’t work and do nothing to shorten the illness. It’s another bandaid patients are obsessed with because god forbid you tell them to drink some water and get some rest.
It works for me when I have mild congestion. I always buy it.
Went to urgent care a few years ago and my physician said “that PE stuff doesn’t work. Don’t waste money. Go behind the counter” and then kind of ranted how F’d up healthcare is. When I heard the ineffective drug story break I thought back to what he said.
@@granola_green A mild congestion doesn't last long!* Anything that doesn't make it worse will be just as effective!
*Unless you're like me in which case you're almost always congested.
My doctors have been telling me for years not to bother with phenylephrine, and I could tell from personal experience that it did eff all, but I had always assumed it simply worked for some people but not me. Learning that it was actually never good for anyone, period, is astonishing.
It is a weird thing that only people who were alive during that particular meth epidemic are aware that you have to go behind the counter for the effective medicine.
also the people who are trying to actually illegally make meth,
The reality is the actually psudoephedrine purchase limits are still enough to make plenty, by the looks of it the only thing moveing it behind the counter did was let a company sell an eye surgury drug as an ineffective decongestant for decades
This tripped me up for a second because this entire process was already gone through in 1940’s
@@therideneverends1697most meth is imported from overseas factories these days
@@therideneverends1697its not worth it though with how cheap the cartels have made meth as low as 450 dollars an ounce. It would cost you like 20 to 30 dollars a gram by buying sudafed and the other ingredients and it would probably be crapy compared to the huge crystals u would get on the street.
Correct! I have to tell my younger friends that the cold meds that actually work are behind the counter. So many do not know that. 😮
I’m sick and have been taking an off-brand of Sudafed PE the last day or two…and noticed my congestion wasn’t changing so switched to a different med. I thought it was just me. It all makes sense now!
Medications that don’t work shouldn’t be on the market. The American public puts their trust into these agencies…how disappointing.
It's called THEFT.
The companies are disappointing. They always are. The american way.
Also the american way? Class action lawsuits for fraudulent marketing
Maybe the American government should put more money into those agencies so they can actually do their jobs, instead of just buying more bombs and fighter jets and whatever...
@@teagan_p_999something something free market something something that's socialism . (I'm being sarcastic)
They demonized pseudoephedrine 20 years ago because of meth. But it really is the only thing that works on colds and flu. So when I get sick, I trudge in to the only pharmacy in my town that sells generic Sudafed. I give them my drivers license and am on a law enforcement reporting list every time I need it. It's a pain, but it's the only med that works!🤷♀️x
funny how easy it is to get Fentanyl on the street tho.
@@Gee-xb7rt too bad it doesn't work as a decongestant (kidding)
@@cathrinewhite7629it can decongest you permanently
Wait until people realize whata happening with other drugs the media tells them to use
I don't think the average person knows how to make meth. I sure don't. Why they treat everybody like they do is beyond me.
i remember when i suffered from chronic congestion. i remember driving to three stores who didn't have anyone on duty at the time to unlock the sudafed case. because of the moronic nature of the war on drugs, it was much easier to get a hold of meth than sudafed
Does meth help with congestion? Asking for a friend 😂
Amphetamine was originally developed as a decongestant. It wasn't ideal for that as it worked in doses that most people found intensely uncomfortable. They used it originally in nasal inhalers.
My sentiments exactly when moving back to the US and trying to refill a prescription for ADD meds. So infuriating coming from a country where I could get either prescription or illicit drugs via delivery. They should just legalise all drugs and treat addiction with education and a decent public health system
It is not easier to get methamphetamine than Sudafed. This is just a silly dramatization.
@@jakeabc123 It can be.
....when I was younger, I'd be given these meds when I had a cold or allergy issue, and every time I was like 'it isn't helping' but no one listened to me. so, turns out, I was right all along. that also explains why the meds I picked out for myself when I was older DID help, because I poked around til I found ones that did work, instead of being told 'its working stop complaining.' I think I know if a medicine is making my face hurt less or not!
Welcome to the wide world of medical gaslighting. Its a problem with MANY ailments and meds
I'm sorry people invalidated your experience. I'm glad you can do better for yourself now:)
i'm not even a little surprised a useless medication was allowed to stay on shelves in the US
Not just in the USA, we have it here in Australia as well. How many hoops you must jump through to get pseudoephedrine depends on the state you live in.
In europe we have an alternative called xylometazoline, is that one not available in the US?
There are some side effects, but mostly with people who overuse it like it's candy
@@Monjipour According to Wikipedia: "As of 2021, a number of consumer products containing xylometazoline are marketed in the United States." It doesn't say how long ago it was first approved, but we've had OXYmetazoline available as a nasal spray since at least the late 2000s, and I can attest that it works quite well.
Given that homeopathy was written into some of our medical oversight by a congressman who was a practitioner I also am not surprised.
And pushed by medical professionals
Although ORAL phenylephrine does not work, phenylephrine nasal spray is an effective decongestant when used short-term for a cold. A better alternative, however, is oxymetazoline (e.g., Afrin) decongestant nasal spray, which works longer than phenylephrine nasal spray for a cold. Remember, only use these for a few days to avoid rebound congestion associated with chronic use. OTC topical nasal corticosteroid sprays (e.g., Flonase) are remarkably effective for congestion due to allergies. Oral pseudoephedrine is the only oral option for a cold, but OTC antihistamines both oral and nasal sprays might help some patients. Talk to your pharmacist.
Afrin is kind of terrifying and I never found Flonase or Nasacort effective. I have pretty severe mold allergies and the only thing that works is oral antihistamines and avoiding exposure.
Finally a sensible knowledgeable comment!
@@francisnopantses1108 There is nothing terrifying about oxymetazoline but using it regularly for allergy relief is a bad idea because over time it will stop working. Afrin (and the gazillion equivalents sold all over the world) is a very effective decongestand designed to be used for a period of a few days during intense cold and phase it out ASAP. That way you can rely on it long term.
Yep. Last cold I had, the real pseudoephedrine worked, but not enough...it wasnt the "right" kind of congestion, I guess. Pseudo works great if I'm truly blocked up/snotty, but if I'm just swollen/drippy, it's a coin toss.
I scoured my med cabinet and found some phenylephrine liquid nasal drops, and tried them in spite of the recent "but phenylephrine doesn't work!" news....and it honestly helped quite a bit.
The delivery method DOES matter. And you'll notice that the video specifically mentions ORAL phenylephrine as being the med that was looked at/doesn't work, it just didn't highlight that fact.
Xylometazoline or oxymetazoline as well as other nasal sprays isn't so suitable for casual carrying as antiflu variants are, already presented in many dosage forms, from granulated envelopes to liquid sticks. Stability and integrity of the API are vital when compared to general effectiveness.
While phenylephrine is completely useless in any possible presentation, point here is that marketing dictates most OTC formulations in pharma industry, so we have them everywhere besides having a terrible reputation between experts.
It would be weird if we didn’t have problems with the way our healthcare system is structured
that wouldn't be profitable
Like if money in politics wasnt allowerd where the healthcare industry is incentivized to pay politicians to pass laws making healthcare more expensive? That would be super weird
If only USA had universal healthcare like Europe, but nope, that's too socialist for murica 😂
@@tomaccinothis medication is OTC in the UK and AU so how you operate the healthcare system isn’t the issue. Considering a government agency, the FDA, is the issue here.
@@tomaccino Clearly you're not actually European, or you'd know that "universal healthcare" doesn't mean the whole system is nationalized; it just means you get insurance for free. Still a good thing to have, but private, profit-driven businesses shouldn't even be allowed to exist in this space.
The thing is pseudoephedrine is so much harder to come by that one joke scientific journal article proposed a way to synthesize it from meth instead because "it would be of great interest to have a simple synthesis of pseudoephedrine from reagents which can be more readily procured"
I remember when I was younger how effective Sudafed was. As an adult with some worsening allergies, of course I went for Sudafed (PE) because of my memories of it, only to have it be completely useless. Thank goodness I can still get Pseudoephedrine behind the counter, because it actually works.
Phenylephrine is a TOPICAL vasodilator. It generally only works on mucous membranes by direct contact and this was noted when pseudoephedrine was pulled from shelves. I read articles about this ages ago about how PE simply wouldn't work. It's neutralized in stomach acid.
so for it to be effective it would need to be a gel or cream rubbed into the nasal cavities?
@@frishdawgz
Or a nasal spray.
This is why I only buy the behind the counter decongestant. When they moved what I used to by over the counter to behind, I found the over the counter stuff didn’t work. The decongestants keep me from getting sinus infections so I need them to work! Thank you for validating me so many years later!!
Exactly!
A big problem for families with children under 18 is that when one person gets sick, usually others are also sick, whether it’s a respiratory virus or inherited seasonal allergies. But the monthly limit isn’t enough to treat 3 or more people when only 1 or 2 of them is old enough to buy it.
The monthly limit for Pseudophedrine in the US is 9 grams or approximately 300 pills worth. Either your state has a smaller limit or y'all are overusing those pills, just saying, especially if it's being giving to kids.
@@KC-Mitch 9 grams comes to 75 of the 12-hour pills of 120mg each, taken twice a day, and one adult with an ID can get one pack per month, which would be enough to last 2 people only 18 days, assuming neither person is sick enough to need it longer. But it’s not enough for more people than that when everyone in the family gets hit with the same bad virus or seasonal allergies and anyone needs to take it more than 12 days, which is especially common in families that have members with asthma and other conditions that make them develop more serious respiratory symptoms. And people with that higher risk are also less likely to be able to go out and get it separately due to other health conditions. So like many things, it’s often harder to get for the people who need it the most.
And it’s the same dose for “kids” 12 and over, but they obviously still can’t buy their own for another 6 years, so, “just saying,” that part of your comment is irrelevant. The flu, RSV, and covid rips through high schools full of “kids.”
@@KC-Mitch
That's helpful. I apparently worry too much because I buy 36 pills every week to 10 days depending on how often i take them.
You should also be careful, as using too much decongestants can actually cause congestion! They become less effective with overuse (rebound congestion)
In Australia you can only get one box a month but even then they can refuse if they think your using too much. I have to say though any good pharmacist will understand if you have many people and will let you buy more if you run out quickly. you just cant get more than 1 box in a day.
Why wasn’t the word “FRAUD” used in this video?… pretty sure using deception for personal gain is illegal
It's only illegal if you're an individual and not wealthy.
Because America being a wealth cult goes deep. 😅
Vox would probably get hit with a cease and desist from pharm companies
I have no problem going up to the counter to ask for Sudafed, but if you're like me and realize you need medication at 10pm and the pharmacy counter is closed, you're SOL in the US until the next day.
I’ve always knew Phenylephrine never worked, Pseudoephedrine always worked for me and I always try to get when I have severe nasal congestion. The last few years I’ve been diagnosed with Nasal Polyps and awaiting surgery. Pseudoephedrine is still my go to decongestant.
Thank you so much for making this! As someone who has tried hundreds of these, and none of them worked, it means a lot to know why!
I was mocked for years because i was accused of distrusting over the counter medicine. I didn't distrust it, i just didn't believe it worked for me. Then i started seeing articles like this.
When I worked in a pharmacy back in 2008, part of our training course was about pse and pe. It highlighted how ineffective pe was and that a best recommendation would be an otc medication without pe (such as cough and pain) alongside pse from behind the counter.
I remember trying this once years ago. It didn't do anything, so I've never bought it again. So I have to ask, why do people continue to buy something that doesn't help? Go for the sudaphed instead. It works like a charm.
Same. I'm convinced I'm just immune to the placebo effect.
What this person said👆 no1 does proper research and they kinda force it on people. It's called capitalism
Why do so many people continue to be completely convinced that ivermectin is a cure for Covid? Because science and truth don't matter.
The problem is that they are both labeled sudaphed despite having different “active” ingredients.
The peudoephedrine was put "behind the counter", simply not purchaseable unless you interface with the American medical insurance system to get a prescription, with all the costs, wait, and complexity that brings. And pharmacies were ALSO forced by the PATRIOT act to take your ID when you received sudafed and put your name on a list of potential terrorists/drugdealers/witches.
If you can't get an appointment until 8 days in the future, and you have an illness that's likely to last 3 more days, there is a very clear message being sent.
the war on drugs takes another victim: our nasal passages
I know I've used Vicks vaporub way too many times I've lost count of it. Decongestants allow you to breathe properly without feeling you might be sacrificed for Halloween season.
Wow. I just got over some illness where I was severely congested for almost 2 weeks. I bought multiple oral medications (pills) containing phenylephrine and was complaining about it not working at all. However, I also bought nasal spray phenylephrine and that DID work amazingly. One spray up each nostril and I was breathing within ~15-20 seconds. But the pills were utterly useless.
At this point, I think alot of products on the supermarket shelf aren't as advertised.
I have had severe allergies for most of my life and went from one otc to the next. None were more effective than an hour. Then I got cancer but survived happily. After that I decided no more meds. I found 3 things together that basically eliminated allergies from my life for the last 10 years. One, I have "good" air purifiers all over my house and in my office. Just a bit of dust gets me sneezing. My air cleaner can clean the room in 15 minutes. Two, I use sinus rinse like neilmed. Takes about 5 uses to learn how to use it and get used to it but it gives instant symptom relief and good for a few hours. After a few years I feel like my body is now more resistant and the benefits last most of the day instead of a few hours. Finally, I get congested on planes of the flight is more than 4 hours. So in those cases I will take an advil or tylenol or aleeve since all I need is relief from sinus swelling. While still annoying Allergies have not been something I stress over in nearly 10 years. It's more like an itchy bug bite now. Say no to those otc allergy pills.
Can I ask what sort of air purifiers you consider to be good? Considering getting one myself
I remember when the law requiring pseudoephedrine go behind the counter that I immediately felt like phenylephrine was garbage compared to it but then I somehow managed to gaslight myself into thinking I was just noceboing myself and that surely it must work and eventually I came to think/feel that phenylephrine does work which just goes to show the importance of placebo controlled studies.
I figured this out as soon as they made the switch when pseudoephedrine started being rationed and kept behind the counter rather than in the medicine isle. The first time I accidentally bought a product that now contained phenylephrine instead it obviously wasn't working the same.
Thank you for doing this! I think I was duped once. Since then, I insist on Pseudoephedrine even though it's a huge PITA to get. Though, I mainly use loratadine if I have mild-to-moderate cold/drainage symptoms.
So because the DEA didn't do their job, we have this nonsense.
You could say they were doing their job exactly as intended. If their job is to allow drugs companies to make money unimpeded by regulation
@@WhichDoctor1 You're thinking of FDA. I'm referring to DEA.
You're kinda both wrong - neither the DEA nor the FDA had the proper funding to actually do what needed to be done. It was only until COVID that the relevant health and drug agencies were given the capability to do stuff outside of menial paperwork processing.
@@agbarugo exactly, if you don't fund an agency, it can't do it's job
@@agbarugo+++
I’d agree that the “standard” 5mg dose doesn’t do much, but man are the 10mg tablets a miracle drug. Hands down the MVP of my medicine cabinet during cold season.
Ive spent years taking PE and didnt realize it wasnt working. I bought actual Sudafed the other night and experienced side effects, but also experienced noticeable relief. And the reason I didnt just buy it in the past?
Laziness. I didnt wanna wait in a long pharmacy line when i could buy "pretty much the same thing" from a shelf and be done with it.
I could have told you years ago it didn’t work. I realized really quick and started buying the stuff behind the pharmacy counter with the pseudoephedrine in it.
Yeah I had never used anything other than Pseudoephedrine until college. My wife, well girlfriend at the time, was sensitive to it so we got some cold medicine without it. I went back out to get myself something that actually worked after the first time I tried the other stuff. Lol
Same, and I would tell friends the same thing.
In Australia you are allowed a box of 12 tablets every 3 days. They take your license and enter it into a national database. People of had issues where a license number has been mistyped and somehow matched theirs meaning they have to wait.
That's basically how it is in most of the states too. You don't need a doc Rx just a government ID and it tracks how much you/your household address buy in a months time.
What state/when was that? It's all prescription only now. Same as codine
@@phil2782I bought pseudoephedrine over the counter in Utah today. Only needed my ID. I’ve also bought it without a prescription in South Dakota when I got a cold on vacation
What are you talking about? A box of 12 tablets…. Which tablets?
I’ve never seen PE in Australia… Not on the shelf or behind the counter
"People of had"? What happened to (ha)'ve ?
It was a known fact that these decongestants don't work, I always thought it was me, but this is wild. I've gotten far by putting air filters in my house, getting rid of my wall to wall carpet, using sinus rinses, daily antihistamine and pseudoephedrine when my sinus headaches can't break. I give the pharmacist my ID and sometimes they shame me, but I'm the one who's allergic to almost everything.
With pseudoephedrine being behind the counter, it means waiting for the pharmacist and there is always such a long line / wait to even talk to them. When you're just congested, you don't want to deal with that, so it is no wonder phenylephrine became so heavily used. I just wish there was a way we could make it easier for legitimate customers to by the pseudoephedrine and prevent the meth cookers from getting it.
In Canada you can buy it in combination with ibuprofen or acetaminophen or whatever in front of the counter, but the pseudoephedrine-only pills are behind.
The current system isn't exactly keeping them from cooking meth, anyway
My wife had a severe sinus infection headache a couple days ago. Luckily I had heard about the ineffectiveness of oral phenylephrine. A very effective OTC alternative for her was a nasal spray containing oxymetazoline HCL. Took her pain from a 9 down to a 4.
For anyone else curious, after researching more, I found some other effective alternatives were pseudoephedrine (as mentioned in the video), and topically applied phenylephrine (like in a nasal spray). I hope whoever needs to hear this gets feeling better soon!
Phenylephrine does work well as a nasal spray however. "Four Way Fast Acting Nasal Spray" is my go to for congestion. Literally 30 seconds and I can breathe again. WalMart has an Equate version too.
this spray isn’t safe to use every day. i was dependent on it for a long time and couldn’t breathe properly without it
Yep. Nasal spray addiction I heard.
In my state, you must go to the pharmacy and show ID to get the " original Sudafed," but in my county, you must have a prescription. I understand the reasons why this step was taken (my county is high on the meth production list), but that doesn't change the fact that it causes a bit of a hardship for anyone wanting effective decongestants. A doctor's visit just to get a prescription for a decongestant can be high in medical costs and, for many, requires time away from work to attend. I don't mind asking at the pharmacy, but requiring a prescription is a step too far.
Canadians are lucky to get ephedrine over the counter. It works SO WELL
Cuz it has negative effects bro..
@@XTen1000DaysX Cuz people were using it to make meth, bro...
We can still get it OTC you just have to give a government ID with it and it keep track of how much you buy and if you hit the "ok that's probably enough to make meth" threshold in a month you can't buy it for a while. So your doc doesn't have to write an Rx but it's still a few hoops to cross.
And it's bad for your heart.
Ephedrine is available OTC in the USA under the brand name bronkaid
Ever since I've discovered Pseudoephedrine my congestion response changed dramatically. Now I take it for both harsh allergies and strong colds/flus. Basically anything nasal.
So that's why Sudafed doesn't seem to help my sinus congestion anymore. I didn't know the good stuff is behind the counter.
3:18 - Codified is NOT pronounced “COD-if-eyed”, it’s “CODE-if-eyed”. Ya know, because it was made into CODE. Why do so many people get this wrong lately?
Literally about to go to the store to buy some…perfect time LOL
impeccable timing, in fact I couldn't possibly imagine the timing being any less pecced
bring your ID so you can get the stuff that works!
I actually bought the PE yesterday since the congestion was so bad, and then see this in my feed today
Nice. Ask at the pharmacy counter for some lol. Get the good stuff
I use phenylephrine nasal spray and it works every time. It also works for members of my family. So......what is really going on here ???
Tried PE once. Didn’t work. Haven’t used it since. Honestly a little surprised that people actually still use it.
Sudafed nasal spray (at least in the U.K) uses neither but instead uses xylometazoline hydrochloride. From experience it's pretty effective.
i was so grateful when i found that stuff because it was the first decongestant i ever found that actually worked
I read metastudies for fun so I knew phenylephrine was as useless as homeopathy years ago. Told everyone I knew and no one listened to me. Now that it's in the news my friend has sheepishly admitted I was right!
Yeah it’s been a nice vindication!
Lol "but they show adsss Susan "
And you show them the data but... they never listen
The best feeling lol
But its not useless. Its seriously the only stuff keeping me alive. I have chronic yeast infections and inflammation in my upper sinuses, and this stuff is the only thing that can touch it. Otherwise I am sniffling non-stop with a nasty headache.
I had to go begging to the pharmacy counter for my asthma inhaler too...
Though... they say Sudafed is non-drowsy but it puts me to sleep like a rock in a sock...
You ever consider the possibility of having ADHD? Sudafed making you sleepy is a HUGE hint at it, usually.
@@MrMooAndMoonSquirrelToo I do. Just like caffeine just clears the brain fog, it doesn't act as a stimulant at all.
In Mexico we can’t even buy Pseudoephedrine and it’s legally banned, so the only option since 2008 it’s been only Phenylephrine so basically we have no options 😢
I sense a Cartel marketing opportunity...
Walt, what about the entire pharmacies you have all over the place where you can just buy powerful prescription drugs of all manner over the counter???!
Really? There go my plans to visit Mexico.
You may find that the nasal spray decongestants work, but you shouldn't take them for more than 3 days or you may get rebound congestion.
Good ol mint tea lol
After this story came out I was so excited for me or someone in my life to get congestion so I could buy real sudafed again. Wife got it last week so I bought some. Her exact words after feeling much better: "man, no wonder they lock this stuff up."
Pseudoephedrine is banned in my country due to people manufacturing methamphetamine with it.
Also cough medicines are now prescibed only by doctors in Australia. Man you guys in the usa are wild
But you can get pseudoephedrine without a prescription in Aus
I mean most people don't manufacture meth??? So it's not much of a risk to the average person.
Can you please do a part 2 on why Vick's vapo rub is weak now? And how addictive the origonal neocitran was?
Guaifenesin is the other big thing in that aisle of the pharmacy, and it also doesn't work. It was introduced into Robitussin / dextromethorphan because it induces vomiting in recreational quantitites. The DEA eyed ALL the effective cold medicine and threatened or forced manufacturers to put them behind the counter if they continued to fuel recreational use. So the compromise was to switch or to literally poison them.
Could you point to evidence of this? I don’t recall ever not being able to get dextromethorphan without guaifenesin. I specifically look for one with both because the guaifenesin helps “moisten” a dry cough.
Guaifenesin (Mucinex) does seem to work for me. I take the big 12-hour horespills and they seem to cut back on my congestion. Of course, it's hard to tell scientifically because I've got no control group for my own sinuses. :)
It works but only if you stay very well hydrated.
Guaifenesin definitely works for what it does. It's not a decongestant, and not an antitussive.
Mucinex works but it's not a drying decongestant. It is not like pseudoephedrine (you can take these together hence the reason for the combo meds). It works to loosen the mucus you already have in your sinuses or lungs so if that is not your issue you won't find relief. Plus you need to take it for a few consecutive days for the ingredient to work. I also agree with another poster in this thread to drink a lot of water with it as it breaks down more effectively in your system.
I don't understand your comment at around 7:30 that you could have gone behind the counter and gotten Pseudoephedrine that worked, but you "didn't know there was anything wrong with Phenylephrine." The only thing "wrong" with Phenylephrine is that it doesn't work, and surely you knew that since you said many times in the video that it did not cure your symptoms like Pseudoephedrine used to.
I am annoyed having to get Pseudoephedrine behind the counter: it is pain to keep track of when I am allowed to buy more, and it is hard to buy enough for my large family of kids who are old enough to take it, but not to buy it. But I have little sympathy for people who knew Phenylephrine didn't work for them, but just didn't want to bother buying Pseudoephedrine behind the counter. All the cries of "Why didn't you tell me it didn't work?!?!" when you spent YEARS taking it, knowing full well that it was not doing the one job it was supposed to do.
So...can we get our money back from buying meds that don't work?? I know the answer but still, ugh
"It didn't work for me...but I keep taking it every day."
I made the mistake of buying the PE versions a few times and quickly realized it did jack squat. So, hand over that photo ID and buy the methy circles, and enjoy a congestion free life.
Phil Edwards is a gem and I'm glad to see him both here and on his own channel. I was a little surprised when I found that the decongestant my doctor had recommended was only available behind the counter because reasons explained in this video.
its sad how ineffective our important government systems are due to lack of funding, and how people want take away the meager funding that exists already
This has nothing to do with funding or not. It’s typical Corp regulatory capture. No amount of money solves that.
They're ineffective because they're the government. The government should not control drugs at all. It should test and verify contents and purity, and prosecute fraud and misrepresentation, but the consumer should decide for themselves.
This. This drug shows the danger of regulation without funding.
I personally think there is in general too much regulation today, but for things like food and drugs it makes sense. That being said, if you are choosing to regulate something, then you must fund it appropriately. This type of stagnation and inability to support innovation is appalling.
Otherwise you get stories like this one. Sadly, I think this one is a drop in the bucket compared to all the issues out there with insufficiently funded regulatory bodies for their tasked roles.
Makes you wonder what other treatments they push that may be largely ineffective???
The answer to that, is Panadol (paracetamol). Which has also been found to be equally or less affective than placebo.
I know this because I have pain, and anytime I take it, it does literally nothing.
Most vitamins and supplements aren't fda approved and are essentially bunk u less you actually need it.
I tried it once. I have allergies that leave me so congested that even my teeth and hair hurt. After taking sudafed pe and getting absolutely no relief i sent my husband back to the pharmacy to get the stuff that actually works.
How did anyone not notice it did not work? I took it one time, and it was clear the PE stood for Placebo Effect.
Used it for nearly 20 years and it totally worked for me.
This isn't the only class of drugs where consumers routinely overestimate the power of drugs. This topic could be a segue into the strange world of oncology, where physicians and patients become emotionally invested in a product mainly because there aren't many choices. Touch that emotion and be prepared for intense backlash.
Do you have any examples? Chemo, radiation therapy, or surgery are pretty much the only oncological treatments I can think of
Oncology is a different issue... what works and what doesn't depends almost entirely on the cancer type, and in some cases people only have a couple objectively bad choices and nothing else. It *might* work, and so they have no alternative but to go all in on that drug since it's quite literally a matter of life and death.
@@smears6039 chemo is a very large group of many chemicals. In one of my 4th-year biochem classes, we've gone over a couple examples where drugs were tested and only worked in like 20% of patients, and it was later discovered that the 20% they worked in had specific gene mutations in their cancers that made the drug work. They were tried without understanding how or why they worked or didn't, so they were thrown at any patient with what they thought was the right kind of cancer.
Unfortunately, you need genetic screening to determine what the actual right kind of cancer is, and that wasn't really economical 20 years ago.
People with long term allergies have known it doesn’t work. When Sudafed went behind the counter, I bought a box of phenylephrine. I was miserable for a couple of days, before I went back for pseudoephedrine. I’ve never bought phenylephrine since.
What I don’t get is that people feel it is ineffective, but keep buying it… first time it didn’t do anything, I researched it, learned the scam, and have been buying the right stuff since…
It Absolutely does work, and I've been a user for 15 years. After the reformulation of Sudafed Sinus Headache medication (which stopped working), a pharmacist told me to take 2 nasal decongestants and 2 acetaminophen. That is is essentially the same, and you know what? It is. This medicine and combination is a lifeline for me, as a chronic sinus headache and congestion sufferer, living in the Ohio Valley; which is one of the most allergen infested areas of America.
But is the suffering of millions taken into account, when the FDA apparently has nothing else better to do, and targets a widely used medicine? No. Sufferers are just left to suffer.
Exactly. I have chronic inflammation and yeast infections in my upper sinuses, this is the only thing that can stop me from sniffling and crying constantly. The other stuff makes me extremely sick- makes my heart slow to a crawl and pound like a hammer. Why can't they go after things that are actually harmful and useless? Instead of taking away something that some people do find relief from, just because most people don't.
Three things: 1) Phenylephrine products work for me so long as I take them along with an antihistamine and an expectorant (which I’ve never found all in one product) because taking any of the three alone doesn’t work for me when I have a cold; 2) Why doesn’t this video and your others have one of those give $ buttons (I can’t remember the actual label)?; 3) Pseudoephedrine has always worked wonderfully for me, but it gives me wild insomnia and I was taking it with a bunch of other OTC meds when I had a sinus infection during quarantine and now something is wrong with my heart (something stretched out they said). I’ve heard Pseudoephedrine does greater damage to your system than phenylephrine too, but it works better. You have to pick your poison…🤷🏽♀️
I take just the antihistimine for relief.
Thats weird. I'm somewhat of a sinus expert (I've suffered maxillary sinusitis of odontogenic origin since 2016ish) and I'm pretty used to nasal congestion and resolving it. Phenylephrine definitely works. I take Tylenol Sinus when Xlear spray alone doesnt handle the congestion. Phenylephrine in tylenol sinus always worked for me, so the video and reactions in comments are puzzling for me. Maybe it works differently for chronic congestion vs acute (cold flu etc)? Very interesting, wish someone does research on this 🤔
Same. In my experience it does not help with colds, but is, not exaggerating, a miracle for my inflammation from chronic yeast infections and various other issues. The other stuff gives me unbearable side effects.
Just get Decongestant nasal spray, works in seconds.
Decongests for a whole day.
$10 Canadian for a bottle.
That's great for 3 days, what about the other 4?
@@teagan_p_999 1 bottle can last for a month though, 2 squirts a nostril per day. 20-40mL bottle.
Very educational and dam interesting.I am from the UK and my chemist warned me about these 15 years ago, now his advice makes more sense and although I didn’t understand at the time I do now,thank you for your content.😊🙏
As a doctor, I have been told on a number of occasions "How am I/my child going to get better without medication??" when they come to me with the common cold and I prescribe nothing. Predictably some would never come back to me. There will ALWAYS be a demand for OTC meds for coughs and colds. It doesn't matter if science says it doesn't work. But then there are plenty other things in life that don't work but people say they need them.
Just means you're a bad doctor. I know a lot of supplements that work like a charm, completely remover any symptoms of colds or fevers. The vast majority of Doctors nowadays are just lazy and/or full of themselves. (I'm a scientist/engineer who works for a pharma company, so Im not uneducated, so I can read and research well)
If you watched the video why don’t you treat the symptoms and tell them to get Psuedophed from behind the counter?
There will always be people like that
Genuine question and I hope I don't sound so harsh to you.
Do you have any concern on prescribing Pseudoephedrine with Paracetamol, CTM and Dextromethorphan?
I hope you don't because all of those are OTC medication for combating flu and common cold symptoms and are available outside the US
IDC if Nyquil does anything for my cold & flu, as long as it puts me out for 16 hours. So I don't have to be conscious for all of it. 😑
Glad to see Phil Edwards works on Vox! We miss you!
I’ve had really really bad allergies and I want to say that ACTUAL pseudoephedrine works!
Is it really that good?? I have used benadryl but i hate it cuz on a busy day it makes me slouchy and drowsy although it helps decongest AND eliminate the allergy reactions i have wanted to use pseudoephedrine but havent found enough people telling me its really works
It is interesting to see the science behind this but as someone who suffers so much with blocked sinuses, I knew that decongestants just didn't seem to work. I will use cold and flu medication, more so for the caffeine and paracetamol but if I need my sinuses clearing, I just use an OTC sinusitis spray and it works wonders
Luckily we can still buy Advil Cold & Sinus "Classic" with pseudoephedrine --you just have to ask for it at the pharmacy and give over your government ID info to get it. 😅 Nothing else works for me.
Advil Cold & Sinus behind the counter is the holy grail
PPA works much better but was also sold at a much higher dosage for weight loss. 12 strokes out of 5 billion doses and they took it off the market, not just for weight loss but also for congestion.
I always feel so awkward going to the counter and asking for it, though. I especially hate talking to people when I'm sick. At least in Canada you can buy the combination meds in front of the counter.
Also, don't forget about the completely unregulated and untested homeopathic sugar pills that are permitted to be sold alongside real medicine on pharmacy shelves. Which sometimes contain unidentified contaminants making them not even safe.
Military CS gas will clear all your sinuses in a matter of seconds.
I thought this was common knowledge for years. I remember a bit they did on the Colbert Report about how the OTC version contained "Jack-Squat-acil" and how Stephen needed to go to his local meth dealer to get ingredients to make an effective decongestant.
I have used this drug in a nasal spray and it did help when I was congested with covid. In a pill, it's a no.
pseudoephedrine has been a prescription only medicine in my country New Zealand since 2011 because of the precursor effect
In Mexico we can’t even buy Pseudoephedrine and it’s legally banned, so the only option since 2008 it’s been only Phenylephrine so basically we have no options.
@@sergiofranciscomontoyacomp8566Likewise for us here in the PH.
I just bought codral original with pseudoephedrine from the Chemsit warehouse thank god it’s legal now
Always informative. Always interesting
Doesn't the USA have nasal sprays with Oxymetazoline against nasal congestion?
It's still to be used sparingly (tolerance building), but it works quite fast.
Yes we have nasal spray. Works wonders. I can't go without it when I'm sick. I love it
Yes, but as you mentioned it, there's the rebound congestion so you're left with finding another solution on day four or using it into the afterlife 😄
@@niknotnikki you should be slightly better by day 4.
@@niknotnikki You can get refillable nasal sprayers here. just made a saline solution to rinse out the junk :)
I go to the pharmacist and ask for pseudoephedrine. Have for years. Easy. Makes me jittery but dries up my
Eustachian tubes when the plane I’m on is descending. Cures the ear pain.
Incidentally, in the U.S. code in is a class I drug. In Europe, I buy it over the counter, from the pharmacist… but in U.K. Melatonin is by doctor’s prescription only.
So weird.
I only want to be able to breathe again like when I was a kid.
i’ve been having an awful cold and congested ears for about a week now. i’ve been taking phenylephrine everyday and there’s been ZERO relief. i’m happy to know it’s not all in my head
That finally makes sense. I just thought I hadn't found the right brand that worked for me so I always tried a different one. Nope, just the actual med doesn't work. Cool.
If you want a decongestant which really works, buy nasal spray containing oxymetazoline. That stuff is like a roto rooter going through your sinuses. It works quickly and lasts 12 hours, unlike pseudoephedrine which only works for 4 hours.
Do Guaifenesin next. Also proven ineffective.
as far as i understand its only put in cough syrups to prevent recreational use via induction of vomiting
I just had a long discussion with my folks about how the does of decongestants I’d taken last night offered me next to NO relief, suffice to say I was miserable.
Turns out it was Phenylephrine. Go figure.
i took one before a flight once as i had a cold and was so confused as to why my head was still exploding
Do you remember when Vox went viral talking only about higher taxes on M4A and not acknowledging the money saved on healthcare costs?