I would love the *old* old minecraft cave generation, which was labelled "Swiss Cheese" caves, where they're winding and intertwining and you can easily get lost within them due to how twisting and winding, tight and claustrophobic they are, feels much more like what would fit in the Vintage Story style than Minecraft ever did
Also my problem with fighting drifters isn't combat or anything, but just the *damn rock spam*, I hate it with a passion and 90% of the time I get out unscathed from Drifter combat, but get my HP shredded in half by rocks anyways
That would be dope. Currently my biggest gripe is that most caves don't connect at all and since you absolutely have to have a pickaxe, that limits exploration options early and even then it turns into random digging to find caves.
I feel like rock tossing was added as a bandaid fix to make drifters moreso of a problem. But it's a little nonsensical and immersion breaking. Like an archer skeleton makes more sense than a drifter tossing rocks. It's not very fitting with the eldritch horror theme.
Wolf behavior is just as immersion breaking as bear behavior. In nature, wolves will bark and intimidate an animal until it runs from them which they will relentlessly pursue and attack until the target is too tired to continue, yet they will likely run away if an animal refuses to run at the initial confrontation and instead stands its ground. They are pack pursuit predators, when faced with something that refuses to budge and is ready to stand and fight with no fatigue, they tend to get spooked and will likely not attack.
I think that to make them a literal threat as well (because if a brand new spawning player gets attacked by one they wouldn't stand a chance) is that they should run only if they suffer a certain amount of damage, because if they just stop attacking if you do a 1 damage punch that kinda takes the danger out of the early game. good idea though and it would probably be relatively simple to program that ai.
@@Oscillascape Maybe if they moved and attacked as a pack, and as @deputyhobbs9683 suggested, got spooked after a certain damage threshold, I'd personally find them to be more interesting and convincing. I guess I just find the idea of dealing with a threat that is also thinking about how it's gonna take me down and survive the encounter seems like fun.
Personally, I'd like it if they expanded the survival aspects more. More ways to cook and store food like steaming and maybe even adding pests like mice that you have to be careful to. Taming wolves would also be quite nice and in general, better ways to attract and start animal husbandry.
oooo, adding things like mice and rats that eat your food could make adding and taming wild cats a thing. tame them and they protect your home from smaller pests. taming wolves could protect your your hives and domestic animals like chickens. the trade off being you have to feed them when they don't get their prey.
I don't think "the commoner" class should get a buff if the others do. the whole point is that there's nothing special about it, therefore making it the ideal for challenges/realism.
That's fine! Commoner could remain as is, like Minecraftian choice of just blank Steve that does everything just fine! And if the downsides of other classes are significant it could be reprieve from this as a commoner.
my issue with classes is that even if you turn off class specific recipes, malefactor is the only class that has a chance to pick up cracked vessels, and thus the only class that can sell them to traders.
classes are not meant for single player, they are meant for multiple player cooperation where the roles are split into a comunity. there's literal no point to get a class in single player unless you want a challenge. turning off class recipes is to give freedom to the comunity in the multiplayer to choose a clase they like, not forcing someone to be something they don't really want to make that bow that's slightly better or a special sword or making use of the 9 milion excess stones in the shape of a sling.
I understand that, but they can still be more powerful. Current classes are a bit weak at what they intend to do. The recipes is really the only true thing separating them.
@@JoachimVampire so your issue is the indepth crafting and pre crafting stages of this game XD your stupid, those are what make the game cooler than minecraft. its gonna take time to make ingots and stuff, just like real life, omg lol dont have patience then this IS NOT THE GAME FOR YOU
Something I definitively need from Vintage Story is increased viewing distance like the "Distant Horizons" mod for Minecraft or RUclips user IGoByLotsOfNames's own game where he learns different methods for optimisng a Minecraft-like game for more view distance. View distance just adds so much to the immersion. But that of course needs to go hand in hand with better terrain generation.
@@Oscillascape That's ture. It's my hope, though, that now that it's there it will spark a significant interest in developing and implementing such a feature for Minecraft-like games in generel. Like the RUclips user I mentioned did.
Although what you suggest is pretty good as the game studio would benefit from hiring a specialist for graphics, I've found that the Z mod is pretty good. It essentially crops and zooms in and helps for looking around.
There's a lot I could say, but I actually just want to mention how bizarre it seems to say that shield blocking is not an "active ability" like in minecraft. It is almost identical, the only difference is the keybind. Holding shift to block did seem strange to me at first, but then made perfect sense. Not only does it sell the effect of "hunkering down" behind your shield, and slowing you down to balance the massive defense boost, it does so without using right-click, saving it from any potential conflicts with right-click weapons or tools, something that minecraft's shield has a large problem with.
You are right about it. Upon closer inspection it's not that different. It still feels not right though. Maybe I can't vocalize it well but Minecraft blocking feels so much smoother.
@@Oscillascape a huge improvement and probably an easy one woult be a little time sequence for a perfect block that rewards the player. you dont hold the blocking constantly to simply reduce damage. you have to actively time the block to get the most out of it
Blackguard is the best class because it gives you a really hard early game while providing amazing benefits later on, I absolutely agree though that the classes are not in a good place, the devs feel afraid to commit to the bit leading to them not really mattering. When I made my own custom class, the Phototrophe, I wanted to encourage a docile and outdoors experience where your focused more on processing resources than running around and gathering them. To this end the class can generate food automatically from the sun at a severe cost of gaining far less saturation from food, basically giving them the benefit of foraging berries without having to actively work it. Because clothing and armor blocks off the light, you have to go commando which puts you in a compromising position. I've fallen off modding for the game after having a bit of a falling out with the somewhat cliquey modding scene but i'd like to go back and give the class a rework to make the upsides and downsides a lot more interesting, though it's already in a pretty good place outside the really rough calculation I ended up using for light level calculations which could absolutely do with some optimizing, it could be so much better. One thing I will say is good is that my mods have been operational for years without needing to be updated, and the few times that it has were MAJOR game rewrites where I had to adjust like, 3 or 4 functions max. Saying the game is 'modder friendly' is a huge understatement, you're really given the power to do some wicked stuff and the stability for it to stay that way well beyond its end of service. Due to the open nature of mods it's not uncommon for unmaintained mods to get forked off and kept alive by the community. EDIT: Oh yeah, try out my "Class Flanderization" mod which multiplies all the class up and downsides by 10. It was a joke mod I made to test how the experience changes if you overtune the class traits, never had a chance to try it so let me know what it's like.
Seems like we are in general agreement about the class design. I will definitely check out your mod. The 10x mod might be fun as one of my 100 day playthroughs. Thanks for contributing to the modding scene. This game has a huge future with how awesome and open ended the modding is. I am considering designing a self contained Skyblock mod. Currently doing a testing playthrough that I will post next.
@@Oscillascape Sadly internally the game has a lot of foundational rot. It's not insurmountable but it's definitely holding back its phenomenal potential. A lot of the bad in the gameplay is the direct result of working around the awful internals. When I mean "amazing potential" one guy made a full-on physics engine and I nearly managed to make an electrical simulator. (Canceled due to a really big limitation involving external dlls that aren't mod files and inability to integrate into the gameplay due to terrible implementation of the mechanical power system. Though I was able to make a system that allowed you to work in unloaded chunks by saving the block entites' states to an external list and synchronizing its state when the chunk loads again. Really proud of that one, shame nothing came of it) Heard they're hiring coders, desperately needed. You can tell whenever the intern writes something because the code quality skyrockets.
@@omegahaxors9-11 You seem very familiar with the internals of VS. I have only done minor modding so I can't talk about fundamentals. Hopefully they can get the code reigned in.
@@Oscillascape Mostly the reason I can be so intimate is how open the game is. Not only is most of the code available on their github but you can also very easily decompile the game itself to get access to the inner workings. I only started modding after a pissing match with the head developer in the discord about how terrible the armor system is. It was a natural progression from there. Only difference between you and me as far as development skill is concerned, is time.
@@Oscillascape indeed. I saw in the preview version that they improved hotboxes and body part damage. gives me hope. Really though I can't think of a survival game that does combat well. So they don't have a good example to look at. I think maybe a poise, stagger and focus on maybe a small combos system. I've seen some mods add it but they're for older versions.
@@specrtre Do you know Grounded ? (My favorite Survival Game EVER with Vintage Story and Project Zomboid by the way), in Grounded the combats are really simples but really good !
I really like the "Plains & Valleys" mod for terrain generation. Now, if we could get a "River" mod that creates rivers and streams that do what rivers and streams *actually do* (start at springs in high ground; flow down toward sea level; combine to grow wider and deeper; carve canyons and valleys; form rapids and waterfalls in areas with steep slopes; meander through gentler terrain; widen out to form freshwater lakes; create lush, fertile deltas and rich fishing grounds where they flow into the seas), I'd be really pleased.
That would be nice. Rivers would be a really cool addition. There is certainly plenty of space to improve and enhance world generations. It's your move Anego Studios!
@@bloodgoa139 Yes, I don't know how reasonable some of those things are. Might be a massive technological challenge. Generation seems a lot harder to make than it seems on the surface.
I would definitely appreciate if the world was smoothed out a bit. Exploration is close to being really cool and rewarding, but stumbling through forests is slow and clunky. A little more variety in biomes would be nice too. As far as drifters are concerned, I like the current surface drifters, being somewhat cowards and a general nuisance, but a non-threat if you have as little as a copper falx. Other drifters could definetly use some changes. Maybe make it so surface drifters only melee, deep drifters can throw rocks, and tainted drifters have some sort of bleed or something to do with the sharp metal. corrupted drifters could have a metal needle ranged attack that's more deadly but more avoidable, and maybe nightmare drifters could manipulate temporal stability in a way that makes them dangerous? And double-headed drifters should be reworked into almost a miniboss that appears most temporal storms (med-heavy ones?)
i think temporal rifts especially need more attention, i always play with them off due to the fact that all they do is make annoying noises outside your base
um they are super important for any magic mods, and they are spawn points for the enemies well being a threat to your sanity, it forces you to make a good home and defend your yard to prevent them from being right outside and tourches and other light sources disapates those rifts. but for the magic mod it also makes ferns turn into a magical ingredient and rocks turn into elements of nature for being right next to them
It makes sense to me that it would temporarily cause issue in the area when there is a rift but there should only be bad patches underground. Maybe a minor class that can tolerate it?
I think it would be interesting if you always spawned as a commoner, but by performing certain actions you had the ability to move into certain classes or to delegate points towards a class, with some being mutually exclusive.
The Elders Scroll way! I think it makes perfect sense for this game. I would much prefer if the character development was in game overtime, similar to XSkills mod!
Maybe it feels different to me or we played different versions, but to me the class system is next to unuseable. The downsides totally cripple while the upsides almost have no effect. The strongest upsides is the crafting, as only the hunter gets early game bows. That is also the class that gets more animal loot, which is strong. Then there is the Blackguard who has strong up and downsides, but overall I felt most classes are just punishment and I find myself playing default.
Probably because I played an absolute metric ton of this game and have a lot of experience. I do think it can feel punishing for a newcomer. But I don't find most downsides to really have a major effect in my playthroughs. No worries though! I am ok with them just bumping the upsides.
@@wavehellholeI mainly play VS in servers! And, no, it doesn't really serve for that purpose, as most servers use completely custom classes, or is a hunter/malefactor fest with the VERY OCCASIONAL tailor or clockmaker. Everything other than Hunter/Malefactor sucks enough to make picking anything else sound like deliberately crippling yourself
I would definitely like more animal hunting options like trapping. Steel cooking time is fine, just wish I didn't have to nurse the coal so often. I wouldn't mind if it took all of the coal initially and burned through the entire thing continuously without needing to refill every few days.
you can generally find borax before reaching the bronze age, which is also the moment you can begin to use it. and if you're worried about leather you can just grind limestone, you only truly ever need borax for iron, and by the time you can craft iron you've probably at least found one deposit of borax.
The cave system has a good start I think. If you find surface ore you dig down to find more that may lead to finding secret places. It is too random though. If you find a ruin it should indicate there is something more below like the ore does. Or add it to what you find when using the pro pick. The components are there. They just need to connect them.
Agreed. Just something to make underground caves more accessible if you choose. Right now, often if you can't find an entrance to a cave it's just absolutely random and cave entrances can be rare and sometimes lead to immediate dead ends.
Agreed but then it starts to parallel MC and finding mine shafts and mossy places. There has to be a way that is different. I think using the ruined as an indicator makes sense
@@Andreavorhies2010 Maybe something more like spawning in clusters then? Like if there's 1 ruin underground, then there could be others buried within a certain radius?
I disagree with the caves. I don't want caves to be so common that anywhere you dig you would end up collapsing the ground below you (yes, I play with soil gravity and cave-ins on, and I quarry for stone) but I do want more cave types tho. it'll make caving more interesting and worthwhile, but I don't want the game to "only just" revolve around caves. underground structures would be dope tho, like in-lore underground tunnel systems and not just disconnected ruins that's only one heavily deteriorated room in the middle of an untouched cave
The lore talks about underground settlements and an ability to travel for days underground. That would be nice. Currently most caves terminate in seconds and are not connected. I wish we had a vast interconnected network of caves where you can get hopelessly lost. That is what I want. Not necessarily more caves.
@@Oscillascape maybe somewhere between near-mantle levels and near-surface levels there's a network of connected tunnels in a grid-like pattern. something similar to minecraft's abandoned mineshaft, but instead of boring and barren tunnels with the occasional loot, it features some of the ruin clutters and some abandoned ruins inside, with less loot I guess for balancing, but I guess if it's as deep as I said earlier, you will encounter bells and deep drifters, so it's up to the devs to figure out the risk & reward balancing also, I have managed to find some small underground lakes with a ruined stone dock, and a really big cathedral/catacombs ruin. would be cool if they expanded on that (well, they will expand on that based on what I read on their roadmap, god I love this game's development and roadmap)
@@OscillascapeI had one of those hopelessly cave network experiences once - by settling near a 320 height mountain. It had caves from the peak which interconnected down to bedrock. Each forked 6 times. Had zero loot pretty much all the way down, but boy was it a terror.
I think if they made caves vary wildly based on the geology would be cool. Limestone caves for example are infamous for huge sprawling caverns while you may have a different type of cave in a more volcanic basalt, maybe something like a lava tube.
personally id love to have more Classes and that they have more impact on our gameplay , as well as more animals and enemy types to make the map more lively.
The durability of iron isn’t really bad to me I get plenty of use out of my iron tools but the only bad part is smithing iron blooms without a proper helve setup 😭
To me it feels like they aren't worth the hassle to craft. The iron scythe completely breaks in a single grass harvesting run and its animation makes it barely faster than a flint knife.
@@alliasab4678 Yeah but iron deposits are very large and don't require fiddling with alloy ratios, processing blooms is tedious yes, but once you get a windmill you can easily mass produce iron ingots on a good windy day. From there it's just normal smithing, and you get results with higher durability. Steel on the other hand gives you even more speed and durability, and due to the amount of different materials needed it encourages exploration.
I totally agree with your criticism on classes, combat and worldgen. imo those are def the most urgent things to be worked on. Talking about Jonas devices i'd personally say we keep them as they are. Right now i usually get to make them in the second year of a playthrough. Usually at the point when i got the ores (steel) to be able to mine the metal needed i gathered all the parts i could ever need. Its a nice end game addition (mostly the teleporter that lets you teleport to point of death is sooo worth it).
A much needed video! I especially agree with the bear (wildlife in general) problem. Having tried the option of passive animals in initial worldgen settings, oddly it appears that passivity also applies to the drifters! Such weird choices they made on this front. Would love to see the whole system get some love from the devs.
I built up quite a stock of Jonas parts by focusing on exploring underground ruins, before I had even progressed to steel. Despite having access to them relatively early, most just didn't seem worth it. Sure, the rift ward keeps you safe from drifters... at night, on the surface, in a smallish radius, and at the cost of temporal gears... an expensive, limited solution to a problem most will have long since addressed with simple walls and lanterns. And how often does a rift actually spawn within 30 blocks of the center of your base, anyway? The resonator is even more pointless to craft; why spend 4 Jonas parts, 3 ingots of advanced alloys, etc. on something you can instead buy for 30 gears? But the worst has to be the base return teleporter -- a ridiculous investment for a single-use item with very little purpose. I genuinely don't know what the intended use is; it's hard to imagine what kind of expedition would result in 1) a prohibitively difficult return journey and 2) inventory contents worth more than the teleporter itself. The terminus teleporter and night vision goggles are the only devices that I found offered transformative enough conveniences to be genuinely worth the effort and expense.
Yes they are pretty bad currently. After playing with them creative, I finally understood how bad they are in the real world functionally. Also nobody in their right mind is assembling a resonator that is true. All these devices need to be better and easier to build!
Bears and monsters. Bears would camp but they would also be easily spooked so that should be an option. Also hybrinating? Drifter lvl one should throw stuff but run if charged or targeted like wolves in the long dark. I agree with the assessment of loot sound and block.
I like the sluggish feel of the combat though. It makes the weapons feel more weighty like a dark souls game instead of goofy like Minecraft. I do think the hit sound could be better though.
The "problem" i have with combat is there is no cleave of any kind, and often you fight multiple enemys at once. It just becomes insanely tedious rather than challenging coupled with the slow hit rates. Ranged feels much better in that regard because of the amount of hits you can get out, that it being only single target makes not much of a difference compared to melee. Even in Souls games you can hit multiple enemys at once with slow weapons
"weighty" nonsense, also the game you cited are both extreme goofy and unbeliavable fetishistic. Also video game aren't the standard for weapon, life is. Look up how for example an halleberd is used. None of the goofy fetishistic video game degeneracy where the character act like its a fidget spinners or and it weight 50 tons and is covered in vaseline & could slip out of his hand at any moment.
honestly i think bears being aggressive is fine, as its likely to recreate bears without exposure to humans, but a sound warning is necessary (potentially they make loud crunching sounds while walking) i think the animals should have special attacks as well, personally what i would do is wolves generating with "packs" and being very weak alone, but using numbers and coordinated attacks to overwhelm the player when together boars should stay as they are, but deer and moose should have a charge using their antlers that knocks the player back a bit even if they block, it's a bit absurd how non threatening moose are in vintage story bears are fine as they are, the damage and beefyness is what carries them caves should have a smidge more open areas/variety to how they generate though, going through the same snake paths into the same bubble room is boring until you get a snake tunnel that drops straight down, but i personally think there should be more "special caves" though, like a bear den found in a shallow forest cave, or a thief hideout with a couple tools and gears hiding around would make exploring more fun the one thing i disagree with overall is the generation, i feel that overall its fine as it is, but it definitely needs more smooth/flat plains type areas and the hilly terrain needs to be smoothed out a little. but the minecraft smooth mountains and hills just dont fit vintage story, the rough terrain is what makes travel interesting as you have to think about how to cross a forest and cant just run through it leaving no wolf a chance to catch you. (though i think adjusting oceanic generation to result in less mediterranian type oceans would be great, having massive bodies of water with a few islands littered about would make boats worth using when theyre added)
All fair points. I feel that the variety of terrain is the best. It's ok to have jagged terrain as long as you can find plenty of smooth slopes. And special cages would be dope!
Idk about "Vitriol" toward Minecraft. I loved Minecraft and grew up with it, but I felt like it never went very deep mechanically and as an adult it just feels like an art pallet, not a game. I found Vintage Story by accident and it's everything I WISHED Minecraft had been. I mostly just play Vintage Story now. I only go back to Minecraft because it's more universal for multiplayer xD
Hey I get it. I still love Minecraft and I think it does a lot of things better than Vintage Story. Although it's a little too bloated with features and other junk, and redstone is then worst!
@@Oscillascaperedstone is the one aspect you can't beat minecraft, especially considering vintage story's mechanical power as a point of comparison. It's insanely deep, intimidatingly so imo.
my main issues with the game is the combat and "primitive" tech stages. Enemies can spin around and 360 you, I've seen rams push their head down their own neck and out their ass to kill me. And the multiplayer hit registration has me dying to attacks I was out of range for on my end a lot. (expressly in a game where most things can 1-3 hit you) The prim tech just lack the options they really should have. currently in the game there's no reason to stay pre pottery or copper. Rushing to metal just solves 90% of your problems regardless of your location. The prim stages lack real world tools that made surviving then possible. Its most notable in areas where certain resources aren't available. teching up in the desert or poles is pure luck. And you can't fall back on prim tech cause there isn't much at all. I wanna see more uses for bones, carved wooden buckets, bowls, cups, more uses for unprocessed hides, fishing/trapping. My point being that there's just a lack of alternative tools and crucial strategies due to the lack of primitive tech. That leaves the early game feeling quite lacking and dry on repeated play. Primitive survival remains as one of the most popular mods, and ancient tools remain my favorite mod for the same reason.
That makes sense. The lack of basic features like fishing, trapping and other methods to survive seems odd for a game focused on ancient tech. I would love it if they made the iron transition a lot harder but gave us alternative early game tools to play with.
@@Oscillascape Spit balling here but different tiers of iron based on the production might work? Bloomeries could continue to process bloom but instead the result is sponge iron. Said sponge iron can then be turned into wrought iron in batches. Lots of irl methods that could be adapted to do that, but to make workable ingots you'd need helve hammers. Mass production of workable wrought iron and pig iron used for steel production, could be locked behind a multiblock blast furnace structure. Raise the cost of production for high quality iron. So that before you have blast furnace setup. You're forced to approach iron as a resource in a more strategic fashion. ahh if I knew a lick of programming I might try to make a mod around this.
Giving commoner access to all exclusive recipes is a good choice, as most people pick him as the 'general all arounder' and it makes no sense why that playstyle gets locked out of more recipes than literally all of the other classes. Most players who would go for commoner just disable class recipes anyway, so it wouldn't even change the meta at all.
@@catbatrat1760 it's an option in world creation added in an update bc people kept moaning for it on the discord. You can set the flag via command for existing worlds but it's one of those debug commands that's really hard to use.
caves could stay as they are however. they could add a function to the hammer where you can hit a rock and it'll make a difference in sound the closer it is to another cave.
I'd also love to see some animal threats in the tropics, like tigers or snakes or some such. I played a whole run on a tropical island and never saw a single wild animal until I sailed too far north, got eaten by a bear and literally said to myself, "Oh yeah, I forgot there are wild animals."
Both the tropical regions and Arctic are a bit lacking in terms of animals and extra stuff. They could stand more content but since the game starts you in a temperate region by default, I guess that's the focus.
The completely missing npc footstep sounds after years of development is the real glaring issue. It's a sign of poor judgement that applies to the rest of the game. Enemies, including bears, being able to stealth up and one shot you from behind is outrageous yet also completely ignored. YEARS of ninja bears. I love the game and I use a mod that adds footstep sounds. Things like moving through brush or water remain silent for enemies. The sound design desperately needs improved by the devs. Its beyond unreasonable at this point. I'm hyped for the new story content since I found the story elements don't take much time to go through. Playing the preview 1.20 with no mods was an eye opener of just how much they have left to rot.
I never even thought about it. You are right. There are no footsteps sounds which makes animal planning harder to detect. Also I do agree that the sound design is generally pretty weak. I do love some of the horror themed sounds like rifts spinning and rust sounds, but creature and combat sounds lack a ton.
@@Retanaru This summarizes just the exasperation you feel from all the dropped potential this game suffers from. Some fixes would literally take one line to change and they just don't. Too busy adding 300 butterflies to impress their girlfriend.
For Jonas parts, perhaps you should be able to exchange Jonas parts at traders, maybe even specifically treasure hunter traders. That way if you are missing a specific Jonas part, while having an abundance of a specific other Jonas part, you could trade in the excess parts you have to get the specific part you need. I don't think you should be able to buy them with gears or anything, just exchange parts for other parts.
Wolfes and bear behavior is not "realistic" but immersive and making it more "realistic" would be the wrong choice, the long dark is a good example on how it should be done also asking there to be more enemys sounds a lil un needet being the game tirection and if you want a game with many foes and combat paterns then vintage story doesnt sound like the game to you, or like many have sayd, there are mods for that
The game has stricked a good balance of being a chill, cabin, farming game while on the over world and on most times and a spooky, dangerous, scary place in the under ground and at some times, your ideas how ever have the same issues as the videos made about minecraft of what its missing which is that what you want to see is simply A. Not the game tirection or B. Not the games "point" And indeed if you personally like the game but miss those aspects then mods are your best pet but theres a reason why us players dont know whats the best for the game and if ya havent talked to the game dev about theyr vision or know how game design works then nor to you
I don't think VS feels very immersive with how bears behave. It just feels off to me. I don't mind the difficulty, but it's not very fun. The combat is what it is. I don't hate it, I don't love it.
This is just a discussion video. It's not meant to be prescriptive and I state that openly in my intro. I will ask the devs about these since I intend to interview them on my channel. That we can settle it once and for all.
@@happypants5127what a very corporatist views "hur dur business know best shut up and be obedient" (also unsubtle scammers mindset "oh i got my mnoey well i will do whatever i want now hehehehe") , also complete nonsense and a very unsubtle "please cite everytime a business ignored his customers and decided "it know best" and paid for it dearly" also tell me where it is written when you buy the game is it filled with unbelievable bear that make no sound when moving and that the game "point" is protecting yourself from them? Also by definition "realism" = "immersive" unless you are some kind of hateful degenerate with God complex "who want to remake the world in his image". Also the balance thing don't make any sense, balance are used to mesures weights toward a certain things, most were and are biased toward favoring theirs owners. Yet you try to give them anothers meaning like if they are some kind of magical device to make everything bland and homogenous.
ive yapped about my feelings of animal aggression in the discord before but ill reiterate it here. in a game that seeks realism to the point where we have to craft a steelmaking furnace i hate that predators are reduced to unrealistic hyper aggressive carnivore stereotypes. players need danger, of course, but the game already has mindless monsters in the drifters. why are the wolves and bears behaviorally indistinguishable from them? seraph should be on the menu for wolves in late summer and early fall when their ungulate prey is at peak health and their pups conversely need the MOST food, and peckish bears think seraphs are an easy snack in late fall and early spring as they go into and come out of hibernation. and bears should hibernate in the winter. otherwise they will not be at peak aggression unless provoked by the player- it still should be a bad idea to just run right into their personal space after all.
@@chukyuniqul yes, im aware of lore implications but i still dislike it on the basis of realism. if a game is going to lean into realism the way vintage story does i would rather my carnivore foes act like something with a brain in their head than movie monsters. again we have the movie monsters already. more on the way in 1.20 in fact! give me something different between bears and wolves. im just personally tired of carnivores being portrayed as mindless kill-beasts. it's not make or break it for me just something i'd like to see considered.
@@pharoahcaraboo9610 I am not saying they're perfect, and I do believe the team should (and almost certainly will) add behaviors to them. But their aggression will probably stay, just more complex.
Top 3 biggest concerns for me are the combat, animal behavior and late game. I still havent reached iron age but i really hope there is more to the Jonas devices, exploration, ect... reaching the end game feeling more like... end game.
My main issue with caves & enemies has always been the way they spawn in vintage story. You always end up fighting your way up and down as enemies just spawn anywhere they want. The swinging bell enemy is the worst example of this. Enemies can spawn right in your face, making it much harder to fight without taking damage without giving any telegraphs to the player on why/how this will happen. You can't play around it.
I do find spawning to be quite a bit random in this game. So I can understand the frustration. Perhaps they should rethink their spawn rules and algorithm to make it more consistent. I am not sure what that would look like.
They also need to fix the multiplayer issues. Connecting your PC to host online usually just results in the other player disconnecting every so often (both of our internets are pretty good.) And hosting a server is only available to the European countries and Australia, which causes some extremely high latency and ping issues.
Good point. I have yet to play in multiplayer a single time. I am unfamiliar with how well the net code does. But if your statement is true, they need to make it a huge priority.
@@Oscillascape I can't vouch for other users experiences, but if the majority is indeed similar to mine. I do definitely think that they need to prioritize it as well since they actively advertise the game as a multiplayer experience of up to 8 players. There was also a upgrade server button for server owners to increase the player limit to 16.
Maybe it's just me, but a fix to the ore generation is needed. I have started 3 different games, each with common copper on the surface. 2 out of three the copper deposits are practically zero in 2000 blocks in each direction or more. The third game is common, just as the setting is. And I look in plains areas, so it's easier to find. BTW I'm glad someone else finds the terrain generation to be a problem too.
I get pretty lucky with ore, but yes you can get hosed on this game for sure. I wouldn't be opposed to ore generation revamp or a different system that allows a more deterministic way to find ore in the world outside of prospecting pick.
The base return TP is probably the one Jonas device that seems the most in need of a change, if I actually managed to get ahold of the parts to make one, and finally craft it, it seems like a huge slap in the face for it to just fry itself immediately after. I think it would be nice if it used temporal gears as fuel, or even the Jonas metal scrap, or both. Losing that many parts just to travel back to base is why that is such a pointless device, the death TP ends up paying for itself over time, as you can afford to take MASSIVE risks because of it. I managed to build one after I was in the steel age for some time and got the last part in the archives, and it is probably one of the most unbelievably expensive things to make in the whole game!
Yes, seems like a weird decision to make it one time use only. That's a little too masochistic even for me. They should make it a multi use device 100% considering how difficult it is to assemble.
*They should add a Jonas Turbine upgrade to the Glider.* *Also, the Night Vision goggles should be a permanent item worn in the facemask slot, and remove the seasick motion of the Storm. Everything would be night vision Green to you, but this way you can actually fight Drifters during storms or Portals without all the unnecessary seasick screen action.*
Temporal instability on the surface is SO annoying. Not sure how many times I built my home in the perfect spot to later realize its unstable. And I only play on the public server so there is nothing I can do about it except leave once in a while to restore my stability. Not sure why they have a paper lantern type thing in creative mode but you can't make it in survival. I love how it looks.
Agreed on temporal issues. I think surface instability needs to go away, unless they develop some content and features to go along with it. The underground stability can stay. Some good items/materials exists only in creative. Devs should add them to the game!
About the jonas parts drops, I guess the best improvement for them is having primitive survival or something that makes the parts drop from some drifters AND the mod Cave Content, which add a late-but-not-endgame chance to get them from underground from compacted machinery blocks. The mod is old but STILL WORKS BEAUTIFULLY. That said, yes, some stuff in the game can improve, but nothing can improve a game more than having modding options, not even the very devs. It is an open floodgate of possible improvements that can be fit to everyone's tastes. The one thing I actually hope they do tho is a world config file that can be shared - those could probably be json files since the game already deals with them.
The mods are great, but the devs gotta dev, so I hope they keep making the game progressively better. Like I said in my video, I would love a preset system myself. Since seed number isn't super useful in VS, we need another system to share seeds with the community.
As a hunter i dont mind the bears i can outrun em. They add some sense of danger whith friends is kinda fun although i did see a friend get annoyed by then aswell.... for me the main thing they should focus on is the controll (shift clicking auto organizing and combat) and the late game. More automation food and armor production would be cool
I think the handbook should also show what mobs can drop items, especially items that can only be collected from mob drops like the Jonas parts, on top of that, I think that instead of having the Jonas parts all come from one or two sources, I think thathey should be split between 3 or 4 mobs where each one has a chance to drop 1 of 3 or 4 instead of each dropping 1 of 13, this would make getting the parts less tedious and time consuming since if you need a specific part you (statistically) only have to get the drop at most 3 or 4 times
That would be great. More information is always welcome. Part of the problem with the game is that the wiki is pretty inaccurate and incomplete in many ways.
@Oscillascape I just want to add I am still very new to vintage story, I have only got one world with about 28 hours on it, so Im not very knowledgeable about the game or balancing Im just basing this off of what I do know, and what was said in your video, which I shoulf add is a very good video 👍
@@A_Man427 thanks! Glad you like the video. I think the experience of new players is very important. Vintage Story can definitely do better in that department!
@@Oscillascape Yes, I agree. The game is very unforgiving at times which might scare away new players, for example in my world I often have a wolf problem with them somewhat consistently spawning near my base, also the behavious of the wolves and boars can be a bit strange since in real life they will attack almost anything that gets too close to their pups but they wouldnt go too far in fear that they may leave their pup prey for something else, they most certainly wont chase something to the ends of the earth just because they got a bit too close
I'd like to see a clothing system added to the game, with a loom, maybe even adding in wool from sheep so you can make soft/warm cloths the other thing that needs fixing is the insulation system in your house. Isn't there any way for me to build a warmer house for a winter survival playthrough? More winter gear so I can do a frozen playthrough or just make winters not feel as restrictive. Maybe a Jonas device that gives you warmth not totally warm or requires coal to run idk Also would be nice to have a better windmill, not OP, but just so I don't have to spam out like a silly 4 sided multi tiered windmill tower to get enough torque to drive a few helve hammers. Maybe just a waterwheels, which would be restricted over winter As much as I'm excited for the Elk to ride about on, I worry how hard it's gonna be to traverse the terrain. Especially with current map gen. It's already hard enough trying to ride feverstone wild horses on the plains and valley's map gen mod. Forests suck, and it takes a lot of effort to clear a path through. The natural paths mod might be neat to see added into the vanilla game. Common traveled paths become semi natural roads I would like class improvements, maybe make clockmaker build mechanical parts cheaper, or access to special parts, blackguard could forge blackguard armor, hunters could make primitive survival traps, tailors would have access to spinning wheels or loom or something Towns would be nice, maybe some villagers will ask you to check out a nearby ruins. like some of those mini dungeons from the better ruins mod
Those are all good points. I get annoyed that it's hard to make insulated housing, especially if you want a unique and large design. Most of my builds don't qualify for room retirement 😭 also no amount of current clothes will get you through the Arctic weather. Also a good point on the riding. We will see, but unless moose are good jumpers navigating terrain will be a bitch.
Top stuff bro. I have to agree with you on all of this. I was so excited to get the glider only to find out it sucked bad at best it was falling with style. Be keen to see your take on moose riding.
Vintage story will obviously share a lot of similarities with minecraft because the whole project is very heavily inspired by a mod for minecraft called terrafirmacraft, or guess more accurately vintagecraft which was a less survival focused version of terrafirmacraft, i actually found out about the game because i looked up info about terrafirmacraft
same, it's how i found vintagestory, was looking for info about terrafirma crafty as i had remembered the mod author at one point was going to make a whole new version due some limitations his mod had due to being new to modding when he started. basically it was going to be a full rewrite. i remember he went silent and it seemed dead. so i got curious years later as i wanted to see if he ever came back with it or not. then bam, found vintage story, watched some lets plays and bought it immediately.
I managed to assemble all the of Jonas devices in my session. Wish I could see the amount of time put into it, but I managed to assemble all of them around year 7-8. I go regularly spelunking and killing machines for my town dwellers, so that's usually where I got things. Save for getting extra bits my towns folk handed to me. I feel like they're balanced enough but could use more polish. More sources such like story dungeons, giving more, would be nice though. Otherwise, if you're good at finding random goodies, you'll be rich with bits and bobbles in no time. That aside, you need to remember the Jonas Devices are early tastes of the future of steampunk. As they plan on going full steampunk down the way. Beyond that, more classes, would be nice. Animals are also getting a heavy rework next update, with loads of new animations. Having more drifter-esque enemies for actual variety will nice. I know they're adding the rot beast next update but more genuine variety would be pretty cool.
@@Rexxie44 Year 8 is like 500+ hours, that's a large time commitment for devices that have marginal utility currently. It's not impossible to build them, but they should either be better or easier to get! Plus I want a lot more of them.
@@Oscillascape I don't disagree. To be fair though on my assembly times, I also just never prioritized them. I do think, however, some are too expensive for their worth. Like that one use return home teleporter. That is just madness. The cost for such a thing is obscene and nothing more than vanity. Beyond that, the night vision, and return to death teleporter are balanced enough. As well as the drift ward, I built that by like year 2. Was the first one I made as it was relatively cheap. But yeah, I overarchingly agree they need more work. Some are fine but some just don't feel right. I mean hell, the Drift Ward is only good for 30 blocks, what good is that? I thought it'd be bigger, so I put it on top of my lighthouse/windmill and it was rather underwhelming. Should cover maybe a few chunks around it or something at least. Better yet, give players the ability to tweak it.
18:57 THANKS YOUUUU !!! I am so TIRED of people that said "Just add mods / There is a mod that do that" when I said I want something in the Vanilla game... YES OF COURSE I KNOW there is MODS !! I am talking about my wishes for VANILLA !!!
I do agree on the class need to be unique throughout the game of vintage, so maybe the classes could have a unique technology tree line where they could made certain things that other class can't make. Example of unqiue technology on classes could be on the hunter making greater hunting bows till he able to make a crossbow. However, the unique tech system on the class would be complex to be input on Vintage story.
I feel like the combat being clunky and sluggish can be a good thing, adding to the horror of the game Maybe higher tech weapons could be more wieldy and satisfying to use to accompany their actual power. My first thought was a combat skill, but that feels out of place.
I really don't want Vintage Story to follow the same path as minecraft. And don't forget that the devs might add better features. After all, its in early access
Start watching this channel and got to say its what has me interested in vintage strory, i remember seeing it years ago but forgot about it until watching your videos. The reason i havent picked it up is because of the combat and lack of weapons, the armors are very nice and are varying but not with the weapons. I hope they plan of expanding this, as one if i remember the lore this game takes place in medieval times and there was a lot of weapons back then. And I could just be picky but even if the game play is good, if there is a lack of weapon options and combat animations it's hard for me to really enjoy it, as I want to look and feel cool you know xD.
@Oscillascape I hope they also expand black smithing to something like chiseling, where you have a flat metal plate to hammer into the shape of the weapon you want. That would be pretty neat
biggest problem with large sprawling caves is they cut really hard into big deposits of ressources so the rare metals will get a lot rarer you cant just change caves and ignore ressource generation sadly.....
Perhaps. But truthfully you will see that there is still a lot of free space for these resources underground. In fact they would appear in caves more frequently, making cave diving more lucrative.
I don't really understand the problem people have with bears, being as big as they are, they are usually pretty easy to spot for me, and you have to get relatively close to them for them to go after you, and even then, specially if you're playing with a class that has the 10% speed buff, you can outrun bears in a straight line. The only times I got killed by a bear were when I was trying to put one in a pit or actively fighting one, otherwise I've had as much trouble with them as I have with wolves
I like the bears as they are now. The DEVS reduced the spawn rate (it *absolutely was* a bit outrageous, initially...) but kept them horribly dangerous. They make the world deadly in such a way as to reward cautious game-play while traveling (find a high point and *look ahead*), and forces the player to plan carefully when one appears near a base. They're *so dangerous* that, once spotted, they *must be* dealt with expeditiously. That threat makes the world feel *scary* .
They destroy the gameplay. You'll just be doing your thing then suddenly it's over. Wolves are fun because they throw a wrench into your plans, bears just outright demolish your entire facility. Not only that, they're embarrassingly easy to cheese.
op bears are cool, but throwing near infinite spears is also op, so when people don't abuse spears/bows they can really feel how strong bears are. for anyone reading: travel with a stack of sticks and 2 stacks of stone spear heads, if you need more then bring half a stack of rocks.
Once there was this bear, it was usually 100 blocks away from my house. Until one day i was luring a pig to the farm. I saw the bear a few blocks away running towards me, escaped using the fences as an obstacle. The bear gave up on me, but wasn't going to leave empty-handed, so he decided to kill the pig. As soon as he finished, he turned around and walked back to the area where he usually stayed. I don't know what kind of evil the devs put into this bear, but it needs to stop.
- I don't actually want classes, I want a project Zomboid style Traits Buy Menu where you start as a commoner and can pointbuy Traits and Flaws. Commoner is balanced by slightly making positives more expensive, meaning a "unbalanced" character would overall be worse, but be good at their specialisation. - Character progression in game? The outer worlds would give you optional flaws (for more perk points) when doing certain things in game, like drinking lots of alcohol making you an alcoholic, or taking too much falldamage giving you a phobia near Ledges... or getting mauled by bears repeatedly could give you a Bear-radar. could be fun positives or negatives. - full agree on world generation. I would generally love more content with different biomes. Desert, Ocean, Arctic, Tundra, Jungle, Savanna. - Wild Animals should fear fire.
Funny enough in my recent interview, Tyron who is the lead dev mentioned that they want a trait system in a game. Not fully what you describe, but in the same ballpark!
I guess I didn't know it was an issue. I thought this game was reasonably optimized. I guess not? I would definitely love it if they improved performance for you!
I feel that most of your tweaks would be better options to toggle on and off during world creation than to fundamentally change the base game. I agree that the AI in general could use some tweaks (not just bears), and that combat has a ... uniquely paced? That needs work. But I feel they are hitting a good stride with terrain generation, and that the world creation options really give you a near infinite set of worlds to play. Now, adding more colorful blocks, more clothing options (available to all, and class specific should they keep the class system), more viable options for building things like windmill pumps for moving water in pipes, irrigation and crops feel like they have taken a back seat in a lot of cases, and could be made more robust. Some of the bonuses you are wanting from base classes could be derived from maintaining specific diets. That would give rise to the need to diversify your crops, and encourage foraging of things like mushrooms and berries beyond the hunter-gatherer stage. Again, overall, I think that most of your choices in this video would be better options at world gen than to make the default, or how about giving us the option for customized presets to be saved of world gen options?
Sure, I don't mind if they were baked into customizable settings! I like the idea of getting customization through diet and other means. That could be a fun way to continue to develop your play style outside of classes.
There is a lot of new features, i would love to see walktrough of everything added in pre.1, but if you want you can only make a walktrough of the most important changes.
Good video man! your voice is nice to listen to and you dont speak too fast or slow. You had alot to say and did it in a good time frame, you even stayed on topic for the most part. Good video man looking forward to seeing what you have next! I remember hearing about this game when it was announced and thinking it would be like all the others. Im glad to see it again and see it doing well, im likely to check it out soon.
The game is doing great and rising steadily in popularity by all metrics. Glad you liked the video and thank you for giving me a bit of affirmation about my voice. It's the thing I like the least about myself, but I have improved a bit!
Wow I'm surprised by comments here. For me the most annoying thing in 1.19 is terrain generation. Plains and valleys mod is neat. I wait until devs implement something similar to vanilla. I hope it will be soon, maybe together with rivers
Yes I find it surprising too that people defend the default generation. I think it's rather bad. It makes for a very unnatural looking terrain. For a game that strives for a certain amount of realism it just doesn't fit.
for me biggest problem in this type of games is empty world. I would like to be able to build village with workers that do useful things, build walls to protect them from barbarians and send expeditions. etc.
Those features would be so cool, and I do agree villages would be hella nice and I would prefer them to lean more into NPCs as I discussed in my VS endgame essay.
In my opinion, if they made more enemy varieties other than just rifters, it would be interesting. In addition, they could make an even more focused progression towards advanced technological development, and as time goes by, everything becomes more evolved and the map undergoes these changes, the animals becoming less aggressive and the aggressive ones stronger and the biomes becoming more diverse and developing new types of vegetation and areas to explore.
I would love more drifter varieties, but the evolving world is a great idea. Like some areas becoming more rusted. It does seem like a major feature, so probably won't be anytime soon.
so funny he speaks about reward Drifters with power when Drifters mainly are like that as punishment, another silly thing is bears behavior, although in real life bears behave like they do because they face humanity, in Vintage Story bears are kings, they rule in the nature, they don't have to face anything as strong as them, of culture they won't behave as our bears
I mean bears might have a logical and lore basis to behave the way they do in VS, doesn't mean it's fun or balanced. I would argue they need to be adjusted.
For those who want more drifters, perhaps add a super rare flying drifter which would almost never spawn on its own freely, but instead would emerge from a chest you tried to open in a ruin or something of the sort - the ide being, you are the one who releases it.,
I pretty much agree with everything you said. Vintage Story is an amazing game, but there is a lot that could be improved. I'll start with something that is a major annoyance to me: the player voices. I hate the musical instrument sounds with a passion and I wish they'd replace them with something that sounds more like a human voice. (Yes, I know - your character isn't human but it's also not a tuba or clarinet!) One of my favorite things about the game is the immersive crafting systems. I wish they'd lean into that even more since many things are still just made by arranging ingredients in the crafting grid. A good example of something I'd like to see is a more detailed flax to cloth process that includes some of the real world steps of the process. I'd also like to see more/better POIs in the game. The ruins need an overhaul along the lines of the Better Ruins mod but with less game breaking loot.
Yes I will say that gives are not my favorite part of the game either. But there are defenders of the voice, saying it came from don't starve together or something. I agree that they should be slowly replacing grid recipes with more tactile activities as well. And yes the ruin overhaul made them better but still not that interesting.
@@Oscillascape A bit late, but in Don't Starve the voices are quite melodic, while in VS the instrument voices seem to just blurt out random pitches which I find quite grating; especially on some of the NPCs which honk random noises for waaay too long at a time. Also since Don't Starve's aesthetic is quite unique, finding out your character speaks in notes adds to that "weird" feeling and fits the game perfectly imo. I think instrument voices in VS can work but at the very least they need to be more pleasant to listen to.
I don’t think the design of classes is conducive to a fun single-player experience. Limiting crafts to particular classes, particularly those available to the tailor, feels entirely trivial. I see no reason why being able to customize your equipment should be locked behind a particular class.
I wouldn't put it past them to listen, plus I'll be having a conversation with the lead dev. I'll post it on this channel so people can hear their take!
by the way peak video, skyblock sounds like an interesting challenge, my biggest complaint for the game is that my spears keep getting sent off into the shadow realm, ive lost like 5 spears just from them disappearing whenever i throw them, and i usually throw them to try to get out of dire situations making it even more annoying
i absolutely love how unforgiving the game is and id love more of it. I would even be happy with a more difficult AI. i enjoy the random, unavoidable maulings. i do agree with the point you made about varied bear AI and i 100% support that concept!
My biggest gripe with the game is combat. It’s SO clunky, and it is just straight up not fun. I avoid it whenever possible, until the recent update I was using a no drifters mod, but it doesn’t work anymore. I would absolutely take part in the combat if it was fun, but it just isnt
@@Oscillascape that’s true, I just wish it was smoother is all. Ranged combat is pretty good, although I think the bow could use a little reworking, but melee is what needs fixing
I think temporal stability is a bad mechanic, especially since if you find a cool spot to build, you just have to hope it's temporally stable. The rift ward is okay but it comes way too late and doesn't fix the stability issue itself. I'd also like it if the pottery could be customized as the ancient pots are, and some kind of stone chisel option. Early game is too ugly because you can only use blocky dirt stuff. Strong agree on terrain being hard to traverse, even with 10% upheaval the world is half sheer cliffs and floating mountains. Drifters being spawned by darkness is lame and hard to actually deal with due to the high price of light. IMO they already have the formula in the form of locusts and their nests. Allow drifer nests to spawn (perhaps a few hundred blocks separation at least) and then tick up to a max population that sends out attacks. Then there would be a purpose to base defense.
@@Kalalification I remember a guy on the discord asked what to do if you accidentally build on a good spot that's low stability. They were told to move their base and their next question was "How do I refund?"
Dude! I supposed that Vintage Story is another TerraFirmaCraft mod for about a week until I realized the truth! =) So, this is always about MC What I would welcome is ThaumCraft mod in VS. It's exploration enough, grinding enough, automation enough, end game things enough, decorative enough, etc. It can be easyly incorporated into the lore. This also could be BloodCraft. A temporal rust can open a tunnel to the other affected worlds with extreme or unique conditions (like you gather "templates" in the libraries, combine them, and based on the template stats a tunnel to the most matching world opens during a strong temporal storm). They just need to explore a universe of mods for MC and select the most interesting and authentic.
I don't hate most of the wild animals that spawn and attack Wolfs are very manageable past a certain point of experience with playing but bears are a nightmare So many animal habitats ruined bc the game decided to spawn a bear inside
I agree, I don't mind wolves. Sometimes they get ya and that's ok. But bears just run around and kill anything and anyone on sight. It seems a bit silly!
Sure birds would be fun. Even if it's just to beef up the ambience and they aren't interactable! But if they are interactable that would be even better!!
I think the drifter ranged attack should stay, as it makes them a more interesting foe to face, but maybe the attack should be limited to when they cant find a quick way to reach you or if you are far away.
Terrain: I have bad news for you, devs seem to like their weird terrain, so you have to use mods for more reasonable terrain. Best we can hope is some sort of world setting presets. Animal AI: yes, it is nonsensical. Bears and wolves behave like they are ravenously hungry in middle of harsh winter. In real life normally they are significantly less agresive and do not consider humans their prey. Not that walking close to to wild bear is good idea, mind you. Temporal stability: in principle, I do not oppose having temporally unstable places on surface. But they should have some feedback, because it is very easy to overlook temporally unstable places. I also have complaint about temporal storms. There is reason why half of people just turns it off altogether. Right now they do not add anything to game once their novelty wears off, functioning as "oh no, that time to entomb myself and wait it out again". That's not good. Devices: yes, it it way too hard right now and should be toned down. Especially considering some of these devices are one-time use. Thats just ludicrous.
At least Plains and Valleys mod exists! I guess we agree on most things. I would love if temporal instability affected the visual side of the area with torn features, dead animals/plants etc. Something to signify not to settle there!
I think weird terrain could be used to showcase low temporal stability in the overworld, since it has that same feeling. Also, many people have,.and I will too, explained that animals' heightened aggression is noted in-universe.
I do think vintage story would benefit from a bit of an environmental tweak. I know this is completely genre-bending here but, the game oddrealm features of basic cellular automata system for plants that could be harvested, meaning if a berry bush fruits and isn't harvested after some time it will spread to anywhere between 1 to 4 adjacent tiles, so on and so forth creating essentially self populating patches of plants. This would make it incredibly interesting, given the games realistic direction I feel as though that would also add quite a lot of strategy to the way that players handle resources having certain resources dedicated to only being allowed to grow wild not having a way to cultivate, making it so that players would have to find patches of these plants and build the farms around them to help cultivate them naturally rather than artificial cultivation through seed productivity.
I would be ok with such a system: to propagate berry bushes and mushrooms and etc.That would be a cool direction to take the game. Then include actual cool uses for these resources. Like some type of buffs you can only get from mushrooms that are worth cultivating them.
I would like nature to be a little self regulating. It feels weird that it's so static, and I am often annoyed at how vanilla does not let me be sustainable with my interactions. IE if i chop down a tree, I usually do not get a seed to allow me to replant. Unless I sit there and break every leaf manually, either devoting metal to shears or taking forever by hand. Then all the various plants that you can just break and won't grow back. You just get a static fully fledged one in your inventory. Which I don't mind, as it's convenient. But in vanilla almost all of them are useless, and the ones that aren't can't be reliably regrown or farmed. Which feels odd. They need more uses, and they need to be sustainable. The only issue to tackle with such a system is preventing things from getting TOO overgrown over time, which would just look strange and cluttered. It would make it very apparent that the world did not exist until you generate it, which is not good for immersion. Nature has methods, but a game doesn't unless they're implemented, and it could get quite complex if you aren't careful. Could also theoretically be hard on players computers, if it isn't coded simply. It would be a very fascinating system though. Would make world feel very dynamic and natural.
@@Oscillascape I don't know about their real world durability. Both were temporary measures until metal came along. You can read up on "bone neolithic shovels" -- that should pop up the british study. However, from a game balance perspective, I think they could have similar durability to flint since you can get flint from panning. Unlike flint tho, bone tools would be renewable which would be great for the "small world" VS playthrus (I've watched 32x32 and 64x64 VS play thru videos)
@@macmcleod1188 Makes sense! I didn't consider weird playthrough interactions. In fact working on Skyblock now and learning a lot about what's renewable!
In my opinion the bone tools should be more durable but less effective, but for that they would have to buff the copper weapons/tools and what follows, because there is too little difference between flint and copper to fit an intermediate/alternate tier
@@renatoxico0075 I view flint and bone as alternate equal tiers. The bone is mainly there for renewable settings (like multiplayer servers) to avoid having to pan sand or run 2000 meters to get to a fresh area right away. They really need to add a server command to teleport you to a random spot and set your spawnpoint there.
I, am a little confused on surface instability. Since, as far as my understanding, it randomly fluctuates over time. I've had my base go from none, to low, to high, and back to none over the course of a several days.
That has never been my observation. The unstable areas as far as I can tell are unstable and don't change. But I also heard something similar. I just have never experienced it to be the case myself. Maybe there is some odd stuff going under the hood with it.
@@Oscillascape yeah, it does change, and I know i've never messed with it in terms of creative or the like. but perhaps it's a 3rd party mod doing something. or maybe my world settings. I generally play VS with my worlds set to something similar to MC Peaceful. Drifters and Rifts still spawn, but are essentially neutral mobs. I would probably enjoy playing in Homo Sapien mode more, but I enjoy having traders still
Instead of classes, I would prefer a more item oriented setup like terraria so that I am not locked to one specific play style if I don't enjoy it, and the items can be upgraded or replaced with better items.
Never played terraria although I hear it's a great game. So I am not sure how I feel about your item idea. I am open to different ideas about classes. Currently it's a bit weak as a system though.
@@Oscillascape I highly recommend trying it! It has one of the best progression systems of any game. Basically the idea is that, if implemented in Vintage Story you start off with primitive items like you do now (rudimentary armor, stone tools, basic cooking, etc) and as you upgrade your tools, your furnaces, your home, your farms, etc. you would also be getting the ability to make additional item recipes such as contraptions that could help with physical speed, jump height, damage output, building capability, water breathing resistance, temperature resistance, temporal resistance, etc. and you the player would invest materials in what you'd like and adjust your play style as you progress. In terraria, there are not only different armor/tool tiers (stone, iron, gold, etc), but there are also different "class" types of armor and items. The higher up in tiers you go (from say, iron to Steel for example) the more expensive your crafting recipes become, so choosing wisely on your builds becomes a player choice through the entire game instead of just once at the start. So in VS the idea would be you have the option once you farm enough of an ingredient to build a "mage" steel armor, an "archer" steel armor, a "melee" steel armor, etc. This way you have the option to make whatever you'd like since the class system is based on the items, but still need to put the effort into obtaining the ingredients to make the items so that class difference isn't pointless either. VS already has this with different kinds of armor you can already make from the same material, so it would basically be increasing the scope of items you can make and what benefits they gave the player. Perhaps "extending arms" for longer block reach, or "spring shoes" for jump height, or perhaps "farmers touch" gloves for more fruitful crops when using them. With better ingredients = more dramatic buffs to the player.
"1.20 will add new mobs, and I'm excited to see what the devs are cooking" Man I saw a video on what they made for 1.20 and I don't know if I wanna return to this game anymore LOL
I've never played vintage story but jus from having watch you play it i can see that not only are the animations clunky but also just the combat mechanics in general. Most of the time it doesn't seem like you can avoid taking damage when fighting its bigger health pool wins situation it seems
I would love the *old* old minecraft cave generation, which was labelled "Swiss Cheese" caves, where they're winding and intertwining and you can easily get lost within them due to how twisting and winding, tight and claustrophobic they are, feels much more like what would fit in the Vintage Story style than Minecraft ever did
Also my problem with fighting drifters isn't combat or anything, but just the *damn rock spam*, I hate it with a passion and 90% of the time I get out unscathed from Drifter combat, but get my HP shredded in half by rocks anyways
@@ravenman4228the rocks are so unbelievably annoying. Those little fucks should not be so incredibly laser accurate with their throws 😭😭
@@ravenman4228 build armor and a shield and it solves that problem
That would be dope. Currently my biggest gripe is that most caves don't connect at all and since you absolutely have to have a pickaxe, that limits exploration options early and even then it turns into random digging to find caves.
I feel like rock tossing was added as a bandaid fix to make drifters moreso of a problem. But it's a little nonsensical and immersion breaking. Like an archer skeleton makes more sense than a drifter tossing rocks. It's not very fitting with the eldritch horror theme.
Wolf behavior is just as immersion breaking as bear behavior. In nature, wolves will bark and intimidate an animal until it runs from them which they will relentlessly pursue and attack until the target is too tired to continue, yet they will likely run away if an animal refuses to run at the initial confrontation and instead stands its ground. They are pack pursuit predators, when faced with something that refuses to budge and is ready to stand and fight with no fatigue, they tend to get spooked and will likely not attack.
I don't disagree, that's why I said wolves can probably stand some adjustments too. Would love to see them become more pack oriented.
@@Oscillascape maybe give them the priority of attacking you from the back, like they do in nature
I think that to make them a literal threat as well (because if a brand new spawning player gets attacked by one they wouldn't stand a chance) is that they should run only if they suffer a certain amount of damage, because if they just stop attacking if you do a 1 damage punch that kinda takes the danger out of the early game. good idea though and it would probably be relatively simple to program that ai.
@@Oscillascape Maybe if they moved and attacked as a pack, and as @deputyhobbs9683 suggested, got spooked after a certain damage threshold, I'd personally find them to be more interesting and convincing. I guess I just find the idea of dealing with a threat that is also thinking about how it's gonna take me down and survive the encounter seems like fun.
True I would add It also depends on the wolfpack size.
Personally, I'd like it if they expanded the survival aspects more. More ways to cook and store food like steaming and maybe even adding pests like mice that you have to be careful to. Taming wolves would also be quite nice and in general, better ways to attract and start animal husbandry.
Sure, I think all those things sound nice. I am sure they will progressively add more survival aspects!
oooo, adding things like mice and rats that eat your food could make adding and taming wild cats a thing. tame them and they protect your home from smaller pests. taming wolves could protect your your hives and domestic animals like chickens. the trade off being you have to feed them when they don't get their prey.
We should add the skaven or rat men as common unified enemies
I don't think "the commoner" class should get a buff if the others do. the whole point is that there's nothing special about it, therefore making it the ideal for challenges/realism.
That's fine! Commoner could remain as is, like Minecraftian choice of just blank Steve that does everything just fine! And if the downsides of other classes are significant it could be reprieve from this as a commoner.
And that's why I chose the commoner class.
my issue with classes is that even if you turn off class specific recipes, malefactor is the only class that has a chance to pick up cracked vessels, and thus the only class that can sell them to traders.
classes are not meant for single player, they are meant for multiple player cooperation where the roles are split into a comunity. there's literal no point to get a class in single player unless you want a challenge. turning off class recipes is to give freedom to the comunity in the multiplayer to choose a clase they like, not forcing someone to be something they don't really want to make that bow that's slightly better or a special sword or making use of the 9 milion excess stones in the shape of a sling.
True, perhaps malefactor should have a much higher chance to pick one up, but every other class should have a default chance too.
I understand that, but they can still be more powerful. Current classes are a bit weak at what they intend to do. The recipes is really the only true thing separating them.
You can buy them from traders, can normally make okay money if you keep track of who sells and who buys.
@@JoachimVampire so your issue is the indepth crafting and pre crafting stages of this game XD your stupid, those are what make the game cooler than minecraft. its gonna take time to make ingots and stuff, just like real life, omg lol dont have patience then this IS NOT THE GAME FOR YOU
Something I definitively need from Vintage Story is increased viewing distance like the "Distant Horizons" mod for Minecraft or RUclips user IGoByLotsOfNames's own game where he learns different methods for optimisng a Minecraft-like game for more view distance.
View distance just adds so much to the immersion. But that of course needs to go hand in hand with better terrain generation.
That would be amazing. Although it took a very long time for MC to get a distant horizon mod.
@@Oscillascape That's ture. It's my hope, though, that now that it's there it will spark a significant interest in developing and implementing such a feature for Minecraft-like games in generel. Like the RUclips user I mentioned did.
Although what you suggest is pretty good as the game studio would benefit from hiring a specialist for graphics, I've found that the Z mod is pretty good. It essentially crops and zooms in and helps for looking around.
Bears should hibernate in winter
True. That's a good point.
yeah!! get them outta here!!
And be super hungry in spring?
they could turn around and add polar bears then lol
@@giligamesh There are polar bears ... at the poles.
💯 agree. VS is so close to being THE voxel survival game.
It's dangerously close. A little more cooking time and a bit more exposure and we have a legit rival to that other block game:)
There's a lot I could say, but I actually just want to mention how bizarre it seems to say that shield blocking is not an "active ability" like in minecraft. It is almost identical, the only difference is the keybind. Holding shift to block did seem strange to me at first, but then made perfect sense. Not only does it sell the effect of "hunkering down" behind your shield, and slowing you down to balance the massive defense boost, it does so without using right-click, saving it from any potential conflicts with right-click weapons or tools, something that minecraft's shield has a large problem with.
You are right about it. Upon closer inspection it's not that different. It still feels not right though. Maybe I can't vocalize it well but Minecraft blocking feels so much smoother.
@@Oscillascape a huge improvement and probably an easy one woult be a little time sequence for a perfect block that rewards the player. you dont hold the blocking constantly to simply reduce damage. you have to actively time the block to get the most out of it
which actually *is* identical to bedrock minecraft, where the blocking is linked to shift (crouch)
Blackguard is the best class because it gives you a really hard early game while providing amazing benefits later on, I absolutely agree though that the classes are not in a good place, the devs feel afraid to commit to the bit leading to them not really mattering.
When I made my own custom class, the Phototrophe, I wanted to encourage a docile and outdoors experience where your focused more on processing resources than running around and gathering them. To this end the class can generate food automatically from the sun at a severe cost of gaining far less saturation from food, basically giving them the benefit of foraging berries without having to actively work it. Because clothing and armor blocks off the light, you have to go commando which puts you in a compromising position.
I've fallen off modding for the game after having a bit of a falling out with the somewhat cliquey modding scene but i'd like to go back and give the class a rework to make the upsides and downsides a lot more interesting, though it's already in a pretty good place outside the really rough calculation I ended up using for light level calculations which could absolutely do with some optimizing, it could be so much better.
One thing I will say is good is that my mods have been operational for years without needing to be updated, and the few times that it has were MAJOR game rewrites where I had to adjust like, 3 or 4 functions max. Saying the game is 'modder friendly' is a huge understatement, you're really given the power to do some wicked stuff and the stability for it to stay that way well beyond its end of service. Due to the open nature of mods it's not uncommon for unmaintained mods to get forked off and kept alive by the community.
EDIT: Oh yeah, try out my "Class Flanderization" mod which multiplies all the class up and downsides by 10. It was a joke mod I made to test how the experience changes if you overtune the class traits, never had a chance to try it so let me know what it's like.
Seems like we are in general agreement about the class design. I will definitely check out your mod. The 10x mod might be fun as one of my 100 day playthroughs. Thanks for contributing to the modding scene. This game has a huge future with how awesome and open ended the modding is. I am considering designing a self contained Skyblock mod. Currently doing a testing playthrough that I will post next.
@@Oscillascape Sadly internally the game has a lot of foundational rot. It's not insurmountable but it's definitely holding back its phenomenal potential. A lot of the bad in the gameplay is the direct result of working around the awful internals.
When I mean "amazing potential" one guy made a full-on physics engine and I nearly managed to make an electrical simulator. (Canceled due to a really big limitation involving external dlls that aren't mod files and inability to integrate into the gameplay due to terrible implementation of the mechanical power system. Though I was able to make a system that allowed you to work in unloaded chunks by saving the block entites' states to an external list and synchronizing its state when the chunk loads again. Really proud of that one, shame nothing came of it)
Heard they're hiring coders, desperately needed. You can tell whenever the intern writes something because the code quality skyrockets.
@@omegahaxors9-11 You seem very familiar with the internals of VS. I have only done minor modding so I can't talk about fundamentals. Hopefully they can get the code reigned in.
@@Oscillascape Mostly the reason I can be so intimate is how open the game is. Not only is most of the code available on their github but you can also very easily decompile the game itself to get access to the inner workings. I only started modding after a pissing match with the head developer in the discord about how terrible the armor system is. It was a natural progression from there. Only difference between you and me as far as development skill is concerned, is time.
I really hope they work on how combat is implemented. Since hunting is such an important part as well as cave spelunking.
Agreed, it's passable now, but it would be nice if it was improved overtime.
@@Oscillascape indeed. I saw in the preview version that they improved hotboxes and body part damage. gives me hope. Really though I can't think of a survival game that does combat well. So they don't have a good example to look at. I think maybe a poise, stagger and focus on maybe a small combos system. I've seen some mods add it but they're for older versions.
@@specrtre Do you know Grounded ? (My favorite Survival Game EVER with Vintage Story and Project Zomboid by the way), in Grounded the combats are really simples but really good !
@@LoveJupiter325 grounded did actually feel really good when I played it.
I really like the "Plains & Valleys" mod for terrain generation.
Now, if we could get a "River" mod that creates rivers and streams that do what rivers and streams *actually do* (start at springs in high ground; flow down toward sea level; combine to grow wider and deeper; carve canyons and valleys; form rapids and waterfalls in areas with steep slopes; meander through gentler terrain; widen out to form freshwater lakes; create lush, fertile deltas and rich fishing grounds where they flow into the seas), I'd be really pleased.
That would be nice. Rivers would be a really cool addition. There is certainly plenty of space to improve and enhance world generations. It's your move Anego Studios!
I don't think there's a single game out there that procedurally generates rivers that do all these things in real time
there is a "River" mod.
@@QvixTv Its pretty good, but not perfect. For one it seems to hit my performance pretty hard.
@@bloodgoa139 Yes, I don't know how reasonable some of those things are. Might be a massive technological challenge. Generation seems a lot harder to make than it seems on the surface.
I would definitely appreciate if the world was smoothed out a bit. Exploration is close to being really cool and rewarding, but stumbling through forests is slow and clunky. A little more variety in biomes would be nice too. As far as drifters are concerned, I like the current surface drifters, being somewhat cowards and a general nuisance, but a non-threat if you have as little as a copper falx. Other drifters could definetly use some changes. Maybe make it so surface drifters only melee, deep drifters can throw rocks, and tainted drifters have some sort of bleed or something to do with the sharp metal. corrupted drifters could have a metal needle ranged attack that's more deadly but more avoidable, and maybe nightmare drifters could manipulate temporal stability in a way that makes them dangerous? And double-headed drifters should be reworked into almost a miniboss that appears most temporal storms (med-heavy ones?)
I like all your drifter ideas! Like I said, the design space is unlimited. The bleeding stuff fits so nicely too.
i think temporal rifts especially need more attention, i always play with them off due to the fact that all they do is make annoying noises outside your base
um they are super important for any magic mods, and they are spawn points for the enemies well being a threat to your sanity, it forces you to make a good home and defend your yard to prevent them from being right outside and tourches and other light sources disapates those rifts. but for the magic mod it also makes ferns turn into a magical ingredient and rocks turn into elements of nature for being right next to them
It makes sense to me that it would temporarily cause issue in the area when there is a rift but there should only be bad patches underground. Maybe a minor class that can tolerate it?
Sucks there is nothing you can do to sooth yourself if you go rusty
But they spawn the drifters! I don't mind the rifts, they fit well with the horror theme and that sound.
I agree. Rifts should stay. They are a cool lore component and fit nicely with the theme of the game.
I think it would be interesting if you always spawned as a commoner, but by performing certain actions you had the ability to move into certain classes or to delegate points towards a class, with some being mutually exclusive.
The Elders Scroll way! I think it makes perfect sense for this game. I would much prefer if the character development was in game overtime, similar to XSkills mod!
Maybe it feels different to me or we played different versions, but to me the class system is next to unuseable. The downsides totally cripple while the upsides almost have no effect. The strongest upsides is the crafting, as only the hunter gets early game bows. That is also the class that gets more animal loot, which is strong. Then there is the Blackguard who has strong up and downsides, but overall I felt most classes are just punishment and I find myself playing default.
Probably because I played an absolute metric ton of this game and have a lot of experience. I do think it can feel punishing for a newcomer. But I don't find most downsides to really have a major effect in my playthroughs. No worries though! I am ok with them just bumping the upsides.
@@Oscillascape Over 2k hours in the game and I have yet to see a way classes are worth bothering with in the grand scheme of things.
@@SgtassburglerIn their current implementation they aren't. Commoner can do everything just fine!
@@Sgtassburgler I assume they work much better in a "village" type scenario with each player as a different class top specialize.
@@wavehellholeI mainly play VS in servers! And, no, it doesn't really serve for that purpose, as most servers use completely custom classes, or is a hunter/malefactor fest with the VERY OCCASIONAL tailor or clockmaker. Everything other than Hunter/Malefactor sucks enough to make picking anything else sound like deliberately crippling yourself
We need gear for hunting and trapping animals, a way to find or buy borax, and reducing the steel cooking time.
I think the steel cooking time is fine BUT the amount of steel you get per oxygenation is pretty lackluster.
I would definitely like more animal hunting options like trapping. Steel cooking time is fine, just wish I didn't have to nurse the coal so often. I wouldn't mind if it took all of the coal initially and burned through the entire thing continuously without needing to refill every few days.
True, maybe allow more ingots per furnace instead of just 16.
@@Oscillascape I don't see a problem here at all
We just build 10 furnaces and made 13x13 coal pit :D
you can generally find borax before reaching the bronze age, which is also the moment you can begin to use it. and if you're worried about leather you can just grind limestone, you only truly ever need borax for iron, and by the time you can craft iron you've probably at least found one deposit of borax.
im glad there is more vintage story popularity and discussion recently. I really love this game and want to see it be a masterpiece
Well, I am a vintage story RUclipsr now basically. I love the game. So more stuff like this to come!
The cave system has a good start I think. If you find surface ore you dig down to find more that may lead to finding secret places. It is too random though. If you find a ruin it should indicate there is something more below like the ore does. Or add it to what you find when using the pro pick. The components are there. They just need to connect them.
Agreed. Just something to make underground caves more accessible if you choose. Right now, often if you can't find an entrance to a cave it's just absolutely random and cave entrances can be rare and sometimes lead to immediate dead ends.
With all of the lore about underground communities during the time of the rot, there should absolutely be some underground villages
Agreed but then it starts to parallel MC and finding mine shafts and mossy places. There has to be a way that is different. I think using the ruined as an indicator makes sense
Also holy fan struck moment here! Comments from both Solstin and Oscil!!! Died 😂❤
@@Andreavorhies2010 Maybe something more like spawning in clusters then? Like if there's 1 ruin underground, then there could be others buried within a certain radius?
I disagree with the caves. I don't want caves to be so common that anywhere you dig you would end up collapsing the ground below you (yes, I play with soil gravity and cave-ins on, and I quarry for stone) but I do want more cave types tho. it'll make caving more interesting and worthwhile, but I don't want the game to "only just" revolve around caves. underground structures would be dope tho, like in-lore underground tunnel systems and not just disconnected ruins that's only one heavily deteriorated room in the middle of an untouched cave
The lore talks about underground settlements and an ability to travel for days underground. That would be nice. Currently most caves terminate in seconds and are not connected. I wish we had a vast interconnected network of caves where you can get hopelessly lost. That is what I want. Not necessarily more caves.
@@Oscillascape maybe somewhere between near-mantle levels and near-surface levels there's a network of connected tunnels in a grid-like pattern. something similar to minecraft's abandoned mineshaft, but instead of boring and barren tunnels with the occasional loot, it features some of the ruin clutters and some abandoned ruins inside, with less loot I guess for balancing, but I guess if it's as deep as I said earlier, you will encounter bells and deep drifters, so it's up to the devs to figure out the risk & reward balancing
also, I have managed to find some small underground lakes with a ruined stone dock, and a really big cathedral/catacombs ruin. would be cool if they expanded on that (well, they will expand on that based on what I read on their roadmap, god I love this game's development and roadmap)
@@OscillascapeI had one of those hopelessly cave network experiences once - by settling near a 320 height mountain. It had caves from the peak which interconnected down to bedrock. Each forked 6 times. Had zero loot pretty much all the way down, but boy was it a terror.
I think if they made caves vary wildly based on the geology would be cool. Limestone caves for example are infamous for huge sprawling caverns while you may have a different type of cave in a more volcanic basalt, maybe something like a lava tube.
That seems like a really solid feature for Vintage Story. Considering they pride themselves on realism this makes perfect sense.
personally id love to have more Classes and that they have more impact on our gameplay , as well as more animals and enemy types to make the map more lively.
More classes would be dope. And we seem to agree on most points here!
For me the iron and steel tool durability makes them pointless, I usually just stick with bronze to endgame.
The durability of iron isn’t really bad to me I get plenty of use out of my iron tools but the only bad part is smithing iron blooms without a proper helve setup 😭
I hate doing anything in the game before I get iron. Iron is in a good place. It's the other tools that might need a bump in durability.
Makes sense.
To me it feels like they aren't worth the hassle to craft. The iron scythe completely breaks in a single grass harvesting run and its animation makes it barely faster than a flint knife.
@@alliasab4678 Yeah but iron deposits are very large and don't require fiddling with alloy ratios, processing blooms is tedious yes, but once you get a windmill you can easily mass produce iron ingots on a good windy day. From there it's just normal smithing, and you get results with higher durability. Steel on the other hand gives you even more speed and durability, and due to the amount of different materials needed it encourages exploration.
I totally agree with your criticism on classes, combat and worldgen. imo those are def the most urgent things to be worked on. Talking about Jonas devices i'd personally say we keep them as they are. Right now i usually get to make them in the second year of a playthrough. Usually at the point when i got the ores (steel) to be able to mine the metal needed i gathered all the parts i could ever need. Its a nice end game addition (mostly the teleporter that lets you teleport to point of death is sooo worth it).
Fair enough! Jonas Devices can definitely be the last addressed. I would much rather get the three things you mentioned fixed first.
A much needed video! I especially agree with the bear (wildlife in general) problem. Having tried the option of passive animals in initial worldgen settings, oddly it appears that passivity also applies to the drifters! Such weird choices they made on this front. Would love to see the whole system get some love from the devs.
I appreciate the kind words. Yes the creature and drifter ai can use a lot of improvements. It seems very punishing to newcomers.
I built up quite a stock of Jonas parts by focusing on exploring underground ruins, before I had even progressed to steel. Despite having access to them relatively early, most just didn't seem worth it. Sure, the rift ward keeps you safe from drifters... at night, on the surface, in a smallish radius, and at the cost of temporal gears... an expensive, limited solution to a problem most will have long since addressed with simple walls and lanterns. And how often does a rift actually spawn within 30 blocks of the center of your base, anyway? The resonator is even more pointless to craft; why spend 4 Jonas parts, 3 ingots of advanced alloys, etc. on something you can instead buy for 30 gears? But the worst has to be the base return teleporter -- a ridiculous investment for a single-use item with very little purpose. I genuinely don't know what the intended use is; it's hard to imagine what kind of expedition would result in 1) a prohibitively difficult return journey and 2) inventory contents worth more than the teleporter itself. The terminus teleporter and night vision goggles are the only devices that I found offered transformative enough conveniences to be genuinely worth the effort and expense.
Yes they are pretty bad currently. After playing with them creative, I finally understood how bad they are in the real world functionally. Also nobody in their right mind is assembling a resonator that is true. All these devices need to be better and easier to build!
Bears and monsters. Bears would camp but they would also be easily spooked so that should be an option. Also hybrinating? Drifter lvl one should throw stuff but run if charged or targeted like wolves in the long dark. I agree with the assessment of loot sound and block.
Something should be modified about the bears. I wouldn't mind surface drifters to be toned down a bit either!
Right! Something more interesting though.
I like the sluggish feel of the combat though. It makes the weapons feel more weighty like a dark souls game instead of goofy like Minecraft. I do think the hit sound could be better though.
Fair! There is no size fits all here. You are allowed to enjoy current combat. I don't mind it, but also I don't love it.
The "problem" i have with combat is there is no cleave of any kind, and often you fight multiple enemys at once. It just becomes insanely tedious rather than challenging coupled with the slow hit rates. Ranged feels much better in that regard because of the amount of hits you can get out, that it being only single target makes not much of a difference compared to melee.
Even in Souls games you can hit multiple enemys at once with slow weapons
"weighty" nonsense, also the game you cited are both extreme goofy and unbeliavable fetishistic. Also video game aren't the standard for weapon, life is. Look up how for example an halleberd is used.
None of the goofy fetishistic video game degeneracy where the character act like its a fidget spinners or and it weight 50 tons and is covered in vaseline & could slip out of his hand at any moment.
honestly i think bears being aggressive is fine, as its likely to recreate bears without exposure to humans, but a sound warning is necessary (potentially they make loud crunching sounds while walking)
i think the animals should have special attacks as well, personally what i would do is wolves generating with "packs" and being very weak alone, but using numbers and coordinated attacks to overwhelm the player when together
boars should stay as they are, but deer and moose should have a charge using their antlers that knocks the player back a bit even if they block, it's a bit absurd how non threatening moose are in vintage story
bears are fine as they are, the damage and beefyness is what carries them
caves should have a smidge more open areas/variety to how they generate though, going through the same snake paths into the same bubble room is boring until you get a snake tunnel that drops straight down, but i personally think there should be more "special caves" though, like a bear den found in a shallow forest cave, or a thief hideout with a couple tools and gears hiding around would make exploring more fun
the one thing i disagree with overall is the generation, i feel that overall its fine as it is, but it definitely needs more smooth/flat plains type areas and the hilly terrain needs to be smoothed out a little. but the minecraft smooth mountains and hills just dont fit vintage story, the rough terrain is what makes travel interesting as you have to think about how to cross a forest and cant just run through it leaving no wolf a chance to catch you. (though i think adjusting oceanic generation to result in less mediterranian type oceans would be great, having massive bodies of water with a few islands littered about would make boats worth using when theyre added)
All fair points. I feel that the variety of terrain is the best. It's ok to have jagged terrain as long as you can find plenty of smooth slopes. And special cages would be dope!
A moose should be more dangerous than the bear!
Idk about "Vitriol" toward Minecraft. I loved Minecraft and grew up with it, but I felt like it never went very deep mechanically and as an adult it just feels like an art pallet, not a game.
I found Vintage Story by accident and it's everything I WISHED Minecraft had been. I mostly just play Vintage Story now. I only go back to Minecraft because it's more universal for multiplayer xD
Hey I get it. I still love Minecraft and I think it does a lot of things better than Vintage Story. Although it's a little too bloated with features and other junk, and redstone is then worst!
@@Oscillascaperedstone is the one aspect you can't beat minecraft, especially considering vintage story's mechanical power as a point of comparison. It's insanely deep, intimidatingly so imo.
my main issues with the game is the combat and "primitive" tech stages. Enemies can spin around and 360 you, I've seen rams push their head down their own neck and out their ass to kill me. And the multiplayer hit registration has me dying to attacks I was out of range for on my end a lot. (expressly in a game where most things can 1-3 hit you)
The prim tech just lack the options they really should have. currently in the game there's no reason to stay pre pottery or copper. Rushing to metal just solves 90% of your problems regardless of your location. The prim stages lack real world tools that made surviving then possible. Its most notable in areas where certain resources aren't available. teching up in the desert or poles is pure luck. And you can't fall back on prim tech cause there isn't much at all. I wanna see more uses for bones, carved wooden buckets, bowls, cups, more uses for unprocessed hides, fishing/trapping.
My point being that there's just a lack of alternative tools and crucial strategies due to the lack of primitive tech. That leaves the early game feeling quite lacking and dry on repeated play. Primitive survival remains as one of the most popular mods, and ancient tools remain my favorite mod for the same reason.
That makes sense. The lack of basic features like fishing, trapping and other methods to survive seems odd for a game focused on ancient tech. I would love it if they made the iron transition a lot harder but gave us alternative early game tools to play with.
@@Oscillascape Spit balling here but different tiers of iron based on the production might work?
Bloomeries could continue to process bloom but instead the result is sponge iron. Said sponge iron can then be turned into wrought iron in batches. Lots of irl methods that could be adapted to do that, but to make workable ingots you'd need helve hammers.
Mass production of workable wrought iron and pig iron used for steel production, could be locked behind a multiblock blast furnace structure.
Raise the cost of production for high quality iron. So that before you have blast furnace setup. You're forced to approach iron as a resource in a more strategic fashion.
ahh if I knew a lick of programming I might try to make a mod around this.
Giving commoner access to all exclusive recipes is a good choice, as most people pick him as the 'general all arounder' and it makes no sense why that playstyle gets locked out of more recipes than literally all of the other classes. Most players who would go for commoner just disable class recipes anyway, so it wouldn't even change the meta at all.
For sure, that seems like a no brainer to me. I pretty much always turn off class exclusive recipes in single player myself.
"Most players who would go for commoner just disable class recipes anyway" You can do that?!
@@catbatrat1760 it's an option in world creation added in an update bc people kept moaning for it on the discord. You can set the flag via command for existing worlds but it's one of those debug commands that's really hard to use.
@@catbatrat1760 its an option in the world generation, iirc
caves could stay as they are however. they could add a function to the hammer where you can hit a rock and it'll make a difference in sound the closer it is to another cave.
That's a cool idea! That would allow more spelunking but still would require effort.
We should also get some flying birds
Sure why not!
I'd also love to see some animal threats in the tropics, like tigers or snakes or some such. I played a whole run on a tropical island and never saw a single wild animal until I sailed too far north, got eaten by a bear and literally said to myself, "Oh yeah, I forgot there are wild animals."
Both the tropical regions and Arctic are a bit lacking in terms of animals and extra stuff. They could stand more content but since the game starts you in a temperate region by default, I guess that's the focus.
The completely missing npc footstep sounds after years of development is the real glaring issue. It's a sign of poor judgement that applies to the rest of the game. Enemies, including bears, being able to stealth up and one shot you from behind is outrageous yet also completely ignored. YEARS of ninja bears.
I love the game and I use a mod that adds footstep sounds. Things like moving through brush or water remain silent for enemies. The sound design desperately needs improved by the devs. Its beyond unreasonable at this point. I'm hyped for the new story content since I found the story elements don't take much time to go through. Playing the preview 1.20 with no mods was an eye opener of just how much they have left to rot.
I never even thought about it. You are right. There are no footsteps sounds which makes animal planning harder to detect. Also I do agree that the sound design is generally pretty weak. I do love some of the horror themed sounds like rifts spinning and rust sounds, but creature and combat sounds lack a ton.
@@Retanaru This summarizes just the exasperation you feel from all the dropped potential this game suffers from. Some fixes would literally take one line to change and they just don't. Too busy adding 300 butterflies to impress their girlfriend.
For Jonas parts, perhaps you should be able to exchange Jonas parts at traders, maybe even specifically treasure hunter traders. That way if you are missing a specific Jonas part, while having an abundance of a specific other Jonas part, you could trade in the excess parts you have to get the specific part you need. I don't think you should be able to buy them with gears or anything, just exchange parts for other parts.
Sure I am totally fine with this idea. Anything to facilitate easier Jonas Devices!
The Bear. AI could also be seasonal. More Pacifist in spring and summer. And more aggressive. in autumn and winter.
Yep, that was my suggestion 😄
Wolfes and bear behavior is not "realistic" but immersive and making it more "realistic" would be the wrong choice, the long dark is a good example on how it should be done also asking there to be more enemys sounds a lil un needet being the game tirection and if you want a game with many foes and combat paterns then vintage story doesnt sound like the game to you, or like many have sayd, there are mods for that
The game has stricked a good balance of being a chill, cabin, farming game while on the over world and on most times and a spooky, dangerous, scary place in the under ground and at some times, your ideas how ever have the same issues as the videos made about minecraft of what its missing which is that what you want to see is simply
A. Not the game tirection or
B. Not the games "point"
And indeed if you personally like the game but miss those aspects then mods are your best pet but theres a reason why us players dont know whats the best for the game and if ya havent talked to the game dev about theyr vision or know how game design works then nor to you
I don't think VS feels very immersive with how bears behave. It just feels off to me. I don't mind the difficulty, but it's not very fun. The combat is what it is. I don't hate it, I don't love it.
This is just a discussion video. It's not meant to be prescriptive and I state that openly in my intro. I will ask the devs about these since I intend to interview them on my channel. That we can settle it once and for all.
@@happypants5127what a very corporatist views "hur dur business know best shut up and be obedient" (also unsubtle scammers mindset "oh i got my mnoey well i will do whatever i want now hehehehe") , also complete nonsense and a very unsubtle "please cite everytime a business ignored his customers and decided "it know best" and paid for it dearly" also tell me where it is written when you buy the game is it filled with unbelievable bear that make no sound when moving and that the game "point" is protecting yourself from them? Also by definition "realism" = "immersive" unless you are some kind of hateful degenerate with God complex "who want to remake the world in his image". Also the balance thing don't make any sense, balance are used to mesures weights toward a certain things, most were and are biased toward favoring theirs owners. Yet you try to give them anothers meaning like if they are some kind of magical device to make everything bland and homogenous.
ive yapped about my feelings of animal aggression in the discord before but ill reiterate it here. in a game that seeks realism to the point where we have to craft a steelmaking furnace i hate that predators are reduced to unrealistic hyper aggressive carnivore stereotypes. players need danger, of course, but the game already has mindless monsters in the drifters. why are the wolves and bears behaviorally indistinguishable from them? seraph should be on the menu for wolves in late summer and early fall when their ungulate prey is at peak health and their pups conversely need the MOST food, and peckish bears think seraphs are an easy snack in late fall and early spring as they go into and come out of hibernation. and bears should hibernate in the winter. otherwise they will not be at peak aggression unless provoked by the player- it still should be a bad idea to just run right into their personal space after all.
Fully agree. Hopefully animal ai will get adjusted over time. Currently it's unrealistic and nonsensical. All it adds is frustration to the game.
Didn't anyone on the discord mention that the animal aggression's increase is noted in-universe?
@@chukyuniqul yes, im aware of lore implications but i still dislike it on the basis of realism. if a game is going to lean into realism the way vintage story does i would rather my carnivore foes act like something with a brain in their head than movie monsters. again we have the movie monsters already. more on the way in 1.20 in fact! give me something different between bears and wolves. im just personally tired of carnivores being portrayed as mindless kill-beasts. it's not make or break it for me just something i'd like to see considered.
@@pharoahcaraboo9610 I am not saying they're perfect, and I do believe the team should (and almost certainly will) add behaviors to them. But their aggression will probably stay, just more complex.
Top 3 biggest concerns for me are the combat, animal behavior and late game. I still havent reached iron age but i really hope there is more to the Jonas devices, exploration, ect... reaching the end game feeling more like... end game.
I have a whole video on the end game! I fully agree, but a lot the community did not like my takes on the end game.
My main issue with caves & enemies has always been the way they spawn in vintage story. You always end up fighting your way up and down as enemies just spawn anywhere they want. The swinging bell enemy is the worst example of this. Enemies can spawn right in your face, making it much harder to fight without taking damage without giving any telegraphs to the player on why/how this will happen. You can't play around it.
I do find spawning to be quite a bit random in this game. So I can understand the frustration. Perhaps they should rethink their spawn rules and algorithm to make it more consistent. I am not sure what that would look like.
They also need to fix the multiplayer issues. Connecting your PC to host online usually just results in the other player disconnecting every so often (both of our internets are pretty good.) And hosting a server is only available to the European countries and Australia, which causes some extremely high latency and ping issues.
Good point. I have yet to play in multiplayer a single time. I am unfamiliar with how well the net code does. But if your statement is true, they need to make it a huge priority.
@@Oscillascape I can't vouch for other users experiences, but if the majority is indeed similar to mine. I do definitely think that they need to prioritize it as well since they actively advertise the game as a multiplayer experience of up to 8 players. There was also a upgrade server button for server owners to increase the player limit to 16.
Maybe it's just me, but a fix to the ore generation is needed. I have started 3 different games, each with common copper on the surface. 2 out of three the copper deposits are practically zero in 2000 blocks in each direction or more. The third game is common, just as the setting is. And I look in plains areas, so it's easier to find. BTW I'm glad someone else finds the terrain generation to be a problem too.
I get pretty lucky with ore, but yes you can get hosed on this game for sure. I wouldn't be opposed to ore generation revamp or a different system that allows a more deterministic way to find ore in the world outside of prospecting pick.
@@Oscillascape It's hard. I understand their intent with the prospecting pick but I agree with you.
The base return TP is probably the one Jonas device that seems the most in need of a change, if I actually managed to get ahold of the parts to make one, and finally craft it, it seems like a huge slap in the face for it to just fry itself immediately after.
I think it would be nice if it used temporal gears as fuel, or even the Jonas metal scrap, or both. Losing that many parts just to travel back to base is why that is such a pointless device, the death TP ends up paying for itself over time, as you can afford to take MASSIVE risks because of it. I managed to build one after I was in the steel age for some time and got the last part in the archives, and it is probably one of the most unbelievably expensive things to make in the whole game!
Yes, seems like a weird decision to make it one time use only. That's a little too masochistic even for me. They should make it a multi use device 100% considering how difficult it is to assemble.
i think weapons having a delay before they deal damage makes combat far more interesting than it would be without it
Fair enough. Without trying it the other way, I can't make a good conclusion whether it would feel more or less interesting.
*They should add a Jonas Turbine upgrade to the Glider.*
*Also, the Night Vision goggles should be a permanent item worn in the facemask slot, and remove the seasick motion of the Storm. Everything would be night vision Green to you, but this way you can actually fight Drifters during storms or Portals without all the unnecessary seasick screen action.*
I am down with those ideas. Especially the night vision suggestions! The storm's seasick motion is a bit over the top sometimes.
Temporal instability on the surface is SO annoying. Not sure how many times I built my home in the perfect spot to later realize its unstable. And I only play on the public server so there is nothing I can do about it except leave once in a while to restore my stability. Not sure why they have a paper lantern type thing in creative mode but you can't make it in survival. I love how it looks.
Agreed on temporal issues. I think surface instability needs to go away, unless they develop some content and features to go along with it. The underground stability can stay. Some good items/materials exists only in creative. Devs should add them to the game!
@@Oscillascape Ya there should be a simple but potentially expensive way to remedy it. I don't care if it exists. Just let me adjust it somehow!
I think for the glider they could add a jonas part that works like a fan propelling the glider
Sure that makes perfect physics sense! Perhaps make it run on temporal gears to make it less op.
About the jonas parts drops, I guess the best improvement for them is having primitive survival or something that makes the parts drop from some drifters AND the mod Cave Content, which add a late-but-not-endgame chance to get them from underground from compacted machinery blocks. The mod is old but STILL WORKS BEAUTIFULLY.
That said, yes, some stuff in the game can improve, but nothing can improve a game more than having modding options, not even the very devs. It is an open floodgate of possible improvements that can be fit to everyone's tastes.
The one thing I actually hope they do tho is a world config file that can be shared - those could probably be json files since the game already deals with them.
The mods are great, but the devs gotta dev, so I hope they keep making the game progressively better. Like I said in my video, I would love a preset system myself. Since seed number isn't super useful in VS, we need another system to share seeds with the community.
As a hunter i dont mind the bears i can outrun em. They add some sense of danger whith friends is kinda fun although i did see a friend get annoyed by then aswell.... for me the main thing they should focus on is the controll (shift clicking auto organizing and combat) and the late game. More automation food and armor production would be cool
That's only one class that can outrun them though. Default speed is not fast enough to do that for others.
I think the handbook should also show what mobs can drop items, especially items that can only be collected from mob drops like the Jonas parts, on top of that, I think that instead of having the Jonas parts all come from one or two sources, I think thathey should be split between 3 or 4 mobs where each one has a chance to drop 1 of 3 or 4 instead of each dropping 1 of 13, this would make getting the parts less tedious and time consuming since if you need a specific part you (statistically) only have to get the drop at most 3 or 4 times
That would be great. More information is always welcome. Part of the problem with the game is that the wiki is pretty inaccurate and incomplete in many ways.
@Oscillascape I just want to add I am still very new to vintage story, I have only got one world with about 28 hours on it, so Im not very knowledgeable about the game or balancing Im just basing this off of what I do know, and what was said in your video, which I shoulf add is a very good video 👍
@@A_Man427 thanks! Glad you like the video. I think the experience of new players is very important. Vintage Story can definitely do better in that department!
@@Oscillascape Yes, I agree. The game is very unforgiving at times which might scare away new players, for example in my world I often have a wolf problem with them somewhat consistently spawning near my base, also the behavious of the wolves and boars can be a bit strange since in real life they will attack almost anything that gets too close to their pups but they wouldnt go too far in fear that they may leave their pup prey for something else, they most certainly wont chase something to the ends of the earth just because they got a bit too close
I'd like to see a clothing system added to the game, with a loom, maybe even adding in wool from sheep so you can make soft/warm cloths
the other thing that needs fixing is the insulation system in your house. Isn't there any way for me to build a warmer house for a winter survival playthrough? More winter gear so I can do a frozen playthrough or just make winters not feel as restrictive. Maybe a Jonas device that gives you warmth not totally warm or requires coal to run idk
Also would be nice to have a better windmill, not OP, but just so I don't have to spam out like a silly 4 sided multi tiered windmill tower to get enough torque to drive a few helve hammers. Maybe just a waterwheels, which would be restricted over winter
As much as I'm excited for the Elk to ride about on, I worry how hard it's gonna be to traverse the terrain. Especially with current map gen. It's already hard enough trying to ride feverstone wild horses on the plains and valley's map gen mod. Forests suck, and it takes a lot of effort to clear a path through. The natural paths mod might be neat to see added into the vanilla game. Common traveled paths become semi natural roads
I would like class improvements, maybe make clockmaker build mechanical parts cheaper, or access to special parts, blackguard could forge blackguard armor, hunters could make primitive survival traps, tailors would have access to spinning wheels or loom or something
Towns would be nice, maybe some villagers will ask you to check out a nearby ruins. like some of those mini dungeons from the better ruins mod
Those are all good points. I get annoyed that it's hard to make insulated housing, especially if you want a unique and large design. Most of my builds don't qualify for room retirement 😭 also no amount of current clothes will get you through the Arctic weather. Also a good point on the riding. We will see, but unless moose are good jumpers navigating terrain will be a bitch.
Top stuff bro. I have to agree with you on all of this. I was so excited to get the glider only to find out it sucked bad at best it was falling with style.
Be keen to see your take on moose riding.
Hopefully moose riding will be better than the glider! It has to be right?!
@@Oscillascape bro right it just has to be. Fingers crossed
Vintage story will obviously share a lot of similarities with minecraft because the whole project is very heavily inspired by a mod for minecraft called terrafirmacraft, or guess more accurately vintagecraft which was a less survival focused version of terrafirmacraft, i actually found out about the game because i looked up info about terrafirmacraft
Nonetheless a lot of people in the VS community want to turn a blind eye to Minecraft and pretend like it doesn't exist.
same, it's how i found vintagestory, was looking for info about terrafirma crafty as i had remembered the mod author at one point was going to make a whole new version due some limitations his mod had due to being new to modding when he started. basically it was going to be a full rewrite. i remember he went silent and it seemed dead. so i got curious years later as i wanted to see if he ever came back with it or not. then bam, found vintage story, watched some lets plays and bought it immediately.
minecraft+hytale+survival craft 2= vintage story
sounds like a good combination to me
Sure why not!!
I think they need to hire more devs. More speed + player perspectives would help greatly
They could probably afford it. Although sometimes scaling of devs leads to worse results. As long as they hire intelligibly I am all for it.
I managed to assemble all the of Jonas devices in my session. Wish I could see the amount of time put into it, but I managed to assemble all of them around year 7-8. I go regularly spelunking and killing machines for my town dwellers, so that's usually where I got things. Save for getting extra bits my towns folk handed to me. I feel like they're balanced enough but could use more polish. More sources such like story dungeons, giving more, would be nice though. Otherwise, if you're good at finding random goodies, you'll be rich with bits and bobbles in no time. That aside, you need to remember the Jonas Devices are early tastes of the future of steampunk. As they plan on going full steampunk down the way.
Beyond that, more classes, would be nice. Animals are also getting a heavy rework next update, with loads of new animations.
Having more drifter-esque enemies for actual variety will nice. I know they're adding the rot beast next update but more genuine variety would be pretty cool.
@@Rexxie44 Year 8 is like 500+ hours, that's a large time commitment for devices that have marginal utility currently. It's not impossible to build them, but they should either be better or easier to get! Plus I want a lot more of them.
@@Oscillascape I don't disagree. To be fair though on my assembly times, I also just never prioritized them.
I do think, however, some are too expensive for their worth. Like that one use return home teleporter. That is just madness. The cost for such a thing is obscene and nothing more than vanity. Beyond that, the night vision, and return to death teleporter are balanced enough. As well as the drift ward, I built that by like year 2. Was the first one I made as it was relatively cheap.
But yeah, I overarchingly agree they need more work. Some are fine but some just don't feel right. I mean hell, the Drift Ward is only good for 30 blocks, what good is that? I thought it'd be bigger, so I put it on top of my lighthouse/windmill and it was rather underwhelming. Should cover maybe a few chunks around it or something at least. Better yet, give players the ability to tweak it.
One cool part about this game is that the devs might actually watch, respond too, and act accordingly to well-thought-out critiques like this one.
Yes the devs are lovely and Tyron has responded to me on reddit multiple times! Helps to have a small team.
18:57 THANKS YOUUUU !!! I am so TIRED of people that said "Just add mods / There is a mod that do that" when I said I want something in the Vanilla game... YES OF COURSE I KNOW there is MODS !! I am talking about my wishes for VANILLA !!!
Mods are often used as a cop out and even then, a lot of the features I want don't exist in mod form!
I do agree on the class need to be unique throughout the game of vintage, so maybe the classes could have a unique technology tree line where they could made certain things that other class can't make. Example of unqiue technology on classes could be on the hunter making greater hunting bows till he able to make a crossbow. However, the unique tech system on the class would be complex to be input on Vintage story.
Sure those ideas are great. The bottom line is let's make classes unique and great!
I feel like the combat being clunky and sluggish can be a good thing, adding to the horror of the game
Maybe higher tech weapons could be more wieldy and satisfying to use to accompany their actual power. My first thought was a combat skill, but that feels out of place.
The combat is passable and, if it remains as is, I will still love the game. I don't really know what I want from it, just something more:)
I really don't want Vintage Story to follow the same path as minecraft. And don't forget that the devs might add better features. After all, its in early access
I am not suggesting we follow Minecraft's development. But we can steal a few good features? Is that such a bad thing?!
@@Oscillascape Yeah but I wouldn't like that though. I think the game would be perfect even without stealing a few features.
Start watching this channel and got to say its what has me interested in vintage strory, i remember seeing it years ago but forgot about it until watching your videos. The reason i havent picked it up is because of the combat and lack of weapons, the armors are very nice and are varying but not with the weapons. I hope they plan of expanding this, as one if i remember the lore this game takes place in medieval times and there was a lot of weapons back then. And I could just be picky but even if the game play is good, if there is a lack of weapon options and combat animations it's hard for me to really enjoy it, as I want to look and feel cool you know xD.
There really aren't that many weapon choices at all currently. I agree they should add a ton more.
@Oscillascape I hope they also expand black smithing to something like chiseling, where you have a flat metal plate to hammer into the shape of the weapon you want. That would be pretty neat
biggest problem with large sprawling caves is they cut really hard into big deposits of ressources so the rare metals will get a lot rarer you cant just change caves and ignore ressource generation sadly.....
Perhaps. But truthfully you will see that there is still a lot of free space for these resources underground. In fact they would appear in caves more frequently, making cave diving more lucrative.
I don't really understand the problem people have with bears, being as big as they are, they are usually pretty easy to spot for me, and you have to get relatively close to them for them to go after you, and even then, specially if you're playing with a class that has the 10% speed buff, you can outrun bears in a straight line. The only times I got killed by a bear were when I was trying to put one in a pit or actively fighting one, otherwise I've had as much trouble with them as I have with wolves
I was out minding my own business and got killed by a bear that was stealthing behind a tree and hadn't made any noise
I like the bears as they are now.
The DEVS reduced the spawn rate (it *absolutely was* a bit outrageous, initially...) but kept them horribly dangerous.
They make the world deadly in such a way as to reward cautious game-play while traveling (find a high point and *look ahead*), and forces the player to plan carefully when one appears near a base.
They're *so dangerous* that, once spotted, they *must be* dealt with expeditiously. That threat makes the world feel *scary* .
They destroy the gameplay. You'll just be doing your thing then suddenly it's over. Wolves are fun because they throw a wrench into your plans, bears just outright demolish your entire facility. Not only that, they're embarrassingly easy to cheese.
op bears are cool, but throwing near infinite spears is also op, so when people don't abuse spears/bows they can really feel how strong bears are. for anyone reading: travel with a stack of sticks and 2 stacks of stone spear heads, if you need more then bring half a stack of rocks.
Once there was this bear, it was usually 100 blocks away from my house.
Until one day i was luring a pig to the farm. I saw the bear a few blocks away running towards me, escaped using the fences as an obstacle. The bear gave up on me, but wasn't going to leave empty-handed, so he decided to kill the pig. As soon as he finished, he turned around and walked back to the area where he usually stayed.
I don't know what kind of evil the devs put into this bear, but it needs to stop.
- I don't actually want classes, I want a project Zomboid style Traits Buy Menu where you start as a commoner and can pointbuy Traits and Flaws. Commoner is balanced by slightly making positives more expensive, meaning a "unbalanced" character would overall be worse, but be good at their specialisation.
- Character progression in game? The outer worlds would give you optional flaws (for more perk points) when doing certain things in game, like drinking lots of alcohol making you an alcoholic, or taking too much falldamage giving you a phobia near Ledges... or getting mauled by bears repeatedly could give you a Bear-radar. could be fun positives or negatives.
- full agree on world generation. I would generally love more content with different biomes. Desert, Ocean, Arctic, Tundra, Jungle, Savanna.
- Wild Animals should fear fire.
Funny enough in my recent interview, Tyron who is the lead dev mentioned that they want a trait system in a game. Not fully what you describe, but in the same ballpark!
What about making it run on low end PCs? Like your normal 4 gb laptop that most people have as a pc?
I guess I didn't know it was an issue. I thought this game was reasonably optimized. I guess not? I would definitely love it if they improved performance for you!
I liked this video on the thumbnail alone, but I'm enjoying this well thought out critique of my favorite game.
Glad you liked it! I just want to have a discussion.
It would be cool for a way for the commoner class to develop abilities of one or multiple different classes over a period of time
That would be interesting. Just gotta make sure it still feels balanced. We don't want there to be the defacto strongest class.
I feel that most of your tweaks would be better options to toggle on and off during world creation than to fundamentally change the base game. I agree that the AI in general could use some tweaks (not just bears), and that combat has a ... uniquely paced? That needs work. But I feel they are hitting a good stride with terrain generation, and that the world creation options really give you a near infinite set of worlds to play.
Now, adding more colorful blocks, more clothing options (available to all, and class specific should they keep the class system), more viable options for building things like windmill pumps for moving water in pipes, irrigation and crops feel like they have taken a back seat in a lot of cases, and could be made more robust. Some of the bonuses you are wanting from base classes could be derived from maintaining specific diets. That would give rise to the need to diversify your crops, and encourage foraging of things like mushrooms and berries beyond the hunter-gatherer stage.
Again, overall, I think that most of your choices in this video would be better options at world gen than to make the default, or how about giving us the option for customized presets to be saved of world gen options?
Sure, I don't mind if they were baked into customizable settings! I like the idea of getting customization through diet and other means. That could be a fun way to continue to develop your play style outside of classes.
@@Oscillascape thank you for responding. I am surprised you made heads or tails of that post. I was half asleep when I typed it. 😂
I really like this type of videos, will you record one about 1.20 pre.1?
You want a walkthrough of all the new features? What exactly would you want me to make!?
There is a lot of new features, i would love to see walktrough of everything added in pre.1, but if you want you can only make a walktrough of the most important changes.
Good video man! your voice is nice to listen to and you dont speak too fast or slow. You had alot to say and did it in a good time frame, you even stayed on topic for the most part. Good video man looking forward to seeing what you have next! I remember hearing about this game when it was announced and thinking it would be like all the others. Im glad to see it again and see it doing well, im likely to check it out soon.
The game is doing great and rising steadily in popularity by all metrics. Glad you liked the video and thank you for giving me a bit of affirmation about my voice. It's the thing I like the least about myself, but I have improved a bit!
@@Oscillascape as an American I find your accent nice to listen to :)
Temporal stability should have an effect on the passage of time.
That would be super cool!
Wow I'm surprised by comments here. For me the most annoying thing in 1.19 is terrain generation. Plains and valleys mod is neat. I wait until devs implement something similar to vanilla. I hope it will be soon, maybe together with rivers
Yes I find it surprising too that people defend the default generation. I think it's rather bad. It makes for a very unnatural looking terrain. For a game that strives for a certain amount of realism it just doesn't fit.
for me biggest problem in this type of games is empty world. I would like to be able to build village with workers that do useful things, build walls to protect them from barbarians and send expeditions. etc.
Those features would be so cool, and I do agree villages would be hella nice and I would prefer them to lean more into NPCs as I discussed in my VS endgame essay.
i'd love to see you build a steampunk type airship (and/or a ship port/town) for one of your end builds...
I probably will!
@@Oscillascape ye
In my opinion, if they made more enemy varieties other than just rifters, it would be interesting.
In addition, they could make an even more focused progression towards advanced technological development, and as time goes by, everything becomes more evolved and the map undergoes these changes, the animals becoming less aggressive and the aggressive ones stronger and the biomes becoming more diverse and developing new types of vegetation and areas to explore.
I would love more drifter varieties, but the evolving world is a great idea. Like some areas becoming more rusted. It does seem like a major feature, so probably won't be anytime soon.
@@Oscillascape This game is very complex, and great!
It has a lot of growth potential and absurd potential.
so funny he speaks about reward Drifters with power when Drifters mainly are like that as punishment, another silly thing is bears behavior, although in real life bears behave like they do because they face humanity, in Vintage Story bears are kings, they rule in the nature, they don't have to face anything as strong as them, of culture they won't behave as our bears
I mean bears might have a logical and lore basis to behave the way they do in VS, doesn't mean it's fun or balanced. I would argue they need to be adjusted.
For those who want more drifters, perhaps add a super rare flying drifter which would almost never spawn on its own freely, but instead would emerge from a chest you tried to open in a ruin or something of the sort - the ide being, you are the one who releases it.,
Sure why not! It would be an interesting idea to have "trapped" chests like in Dark Souls.
I pretty much agree with everything you said. Vintage Story is an amazing game, but there is a lot that could be improved. I'll start with something that is a major annoyance to me: the player voices. I hate the musical instrument sounds with a passion and I wish they'd replace them with something that sounds more like a human voice. (Yes, I know - your character isn't human but it's also not a tuba or clarinet!) One of my favorite things about the game is the immersive crafting systems. I wish they'd lean into that even more since many things are still just made by arranging ingredients in the crafting grid. A good example of something I'd like to see is a more detailed flax to cloth process that includes some of the real world steps of the process. I'd also like to see more/better POIs in the game. The ruins need an overhaul along the lines of the Better Ruins mod but with less game breaking loot.
Yes I will say that gives are not my favorite part of the game either. But there are defenders of the voice, saying it came from don't starve together or something. I agree that they should be slowly replacing grid recipes with more tactile activities as well. And yes the ruin overhaul made them better but still not that interesting.
@@Oscillascape A bit late, but in Don't Starve the voices are quite melodic, while in VS the instrument voices seem to just blurt out random pitches which I find quite grating; especially on some of the NPCs which honk random noises for waaay too long at a time. Also since Don't Starve's aesthetic is quite unique, finding out your character speaks in notes adds to that "weird" feeling and fits the game perfectly imo. I think instrument voices in VS can work but at the very least they need to be more pleasant to listen to.
I don’t think the design of classes is conducive to a fun single-player experience. Limiting crafts to particular classes, particularly those available to the tailor, feels entirely trivial. I see no reason why being able to customize your equipment should be locked behind a particular class.
Luckily there is a config option to disable class specific recipes. I always disable them myself. Thus, I agree with your take!
i like the crazy mountains
Fair point! There is nothing wrong with enjoying the default generation. It just doesn't look that good and hard to traverse for me personally.
Man I hope the devs see this and consider some of these changes. They do seem pretty active on adding new systems though! Such an amazing game!
I wouldn't put it past them to listen, plus I'll be having a conversation with the lead dev. I'll post it on this channel so people can hear their take!
the timestamps on this video could really use some tweaking, they start and end 15-30 seconds off the next topic
by the way peak video, skyblock sounds like an interesting challenge, my biggest complaint for the game is that my spears keep getting sent off into the shadow realm, ive lost like 5 spears just from them disappearing whenever i throw them, and i usually throw them to try to get out of dire situations making it even more annoying
They were automatically generated. I didn't even know they were there. I will fix them tonight.
i absolutely love how unforgiving the game is and id love more of it. I would even be happy with a more difficult AI. i enjoy the random, unavoidable maulings. i do agree with the point you made about varied bear AI and i 100% support that concept!
Haha, I like things hard too. But bears just need to be better telegraphed or less aggressive.
@Oscillascape agreed!
My biggest gripe with the game is combat. It’s SO clunky, and it is just straight up not fun. I avoid it whenever possible, until the recent update I was using a no drifters mod, but it doesn’t work anymore. I would absolutely take part in the combat if it was fun, but it just isnt
Agreed on combat feeling clunky. Although there seem to be proponents of current combat too. I suppose you can't, please everyone.
@@Oscillascape that’s true, I just wish it was smoother is all. Ranged combat is pretty good, although I think the bow could use a little reworking, but melee is what needs fixing
I think temporal stability is a bad mechanic, especially since if you find a cool spot to build, you just have to hope it's temporally stable. The rift ward is okay but it comes way too late and doesn't fix the stability issue itself.
I'd also like it if the pottery could be customized as the ancient pots are, and some kind of stone chisel option. Early game is too ugly because you can only use blocky dirt stuff.
Strong agree on terrain being hard to traverse, even with 10% upheaval the world is half sheer cliffs and floating mountains.
Drifters being spawned by darkness is lame and hard to actually deal with due to the high price of light.
IMO they already have the formula in the form of locusts and their nests. Allow drifer nests to spawn (perhaps a few hundred blocks separation at least) and then tick up to a max population that sends out attacks. Then there would be a purpose to base defense.
I wouldn't mind that solution to the drifters. The current light based spawning solution is a bit impressive I do agree.
@@Kalalification I remember a guy on the discord asked what to do if you accidentally build on a good spot that's low stability. They were told to move their base and their next question was "How do I refund?"
You can disable it if you don't like it.
Dude! I supposed that Vintage Story is another TerraFirmaCraft mod for about a week until I realized the truth! =) So, this is always about MC
What I would welcome is ThaumCraft mod in VS. It's exploration enough, grinding enough, automation enough, end game things enough, decorative enough, etc. It can be easyly incorporated into the lore. This also could be BloodCraft. A temporal rust can open a tunnel to the other affected worlds with extreme or unique conditions (like you gather "templates" in the libraries, combine them, and based on the template stats a tunnel to the most matching world opens during a strong temporal storm). They just need to explore a universe of mods for MC and select the most interesting and authentic.
I don't hate most of the wild animals that spawn and attack
Wolfs are very manageable past a certain point of experience with playing but bears are a nightmare
So many animal habitats ruined bc the game decided to spawn a bear inside
I agree, I don't mind wolves. Sometimes they get ya and that's ok. But bears just run around and kill anything and anyone on sight. It seems a bit silly!
I wish they would add birds of prey to the game. It would be awesome to train a pet owl or hawk to help you hunt :-)
Sure birds would be fun. Even if it's just to beef up the ambience and they aren't interactable! But if they are interactable that would be even better!!
I think the drifter ranged attack should stay, as it makes them a more interesting foe to face, but maybe the attack should be limited to when they cant find a quick way to reach you or if you are far away.
I am fine with that idea. I think it is worth trying to make drifters more interesting and more unpredictable and thus more dangerous!
Terrain: I have bad news for you, devs seem to like their weird terrain, so you have to use mods for more reasonable terrain. Best we can hope is some sort of world setting presets.
Animal AI: yes, it is nonsensical. Bears and wolves behave like they are ravenously hungry in middle of harsh winter. In real life normally they are significantly less agresive and do not consider humans their prey. Not that walking close to to wild bear is good idea, mind you.
Temporal stability: in principle, I do not oppose having temporally unstable places on surface. But they should have some feedback, because it is very easy to overlook temporally unstable places. I also have complaint about temporal storms. There is reason why half of people just turns it off altogether. Right now they do not add anything to game once their novelty wears off, functioning as "oh no, that time to entomb myself and wait it out again". That's not good.
Devices: yes, it it way too hard right now and should be toned down. Especially considering some of these devices are one-time use. Thats just ludicrous.
At least Plains and Valleys mod exists! I guess we agree on most things. I would love if temporal instability affected the visual side of the area with torn features, dead animals/plants etc. Something to signify not to settle there!
I think weird terrain could be used to showcase low temporal stability in the overworld, since it has that same feeling.
Also, many people have,.and I will too, explained that animals' heightened aggression is noted in-universe.
I do think vintage story would benefit from a bit of an environmental tweak. I know this is completely genre-bending here but, the game oddrealm features of basic cellular automata system for plants that could be harvested, meaning if a berry bush fruits and isn't harvested after some time it will spread to anywhere between 1 to 4 adjacent tiles, so on and so forth creating essentially self populating patches of plants. This would make it incredibly interesting, given the games realistic direction I feel as though that would also add quite a lot of strategy to the way that players handle resources having certain resources dedicated to only being allowed to grow wild not having a way to cultivate, making it so that players would have to find patches of these plants and build the farms around them to help cultivate them naturally rather than artificial cultivation through seed productivity.
I would be ok with such a system: to propagate berry bushes and mushrooms and etc.That would be a cool direction to take the game. Then include actual cool uses for these resources. Like some type of buffs you can only get from mushrooms that are worth cultivating them.
I would like nature to be a little self regulating. It feels weird that it's so static, and I am often annoyed at how vanilla does not let me be sustainable with my interactions. IE if i chop down a tree, I usually do not get a seed to allow me to replant. Unless I sit there and break every leaf manually, either devoting metal to shears or taking forever by hand.
Then all the various plants that you can just break and won't grow back. You just get a static fully fledged one in your inventory. Which I don't mind, as it's convenient. But in vanilla almost all of them are useless, and the ones that aren't can't be reliably regrown or farmed. Which feels odd. They need more uses, and they need to be sustainable.
The only issue to tackle with such a system is preventing things from getting TOO overgrown over time, which would just look strange and cluttered. It would make it very apparent that the world did not exist until you generate it, which is not good for immersion. Nature has methods, but a game doesn't unless they're implemented, and it could get quite complex if you aren't careful. Could also theoretically be hard on players computers, if it isn't coded simply.
It would be a very fascinating system though. Would make world feel very dynamic and natural.
watching this while trying to attract some sheeps to my enclosure lol
Joyous pfp
Since neolithic bone shovels that look *exactly* like flint shovels really existed... I hope they add bone tools.
Would they be stronger than obsidian/flint tools or weaker?
@@Oscillascape I don't know about their real world durability. Both were temporary measures until metal came along. You can read up on "bone neolithic shovels" -- that should pop up the british study.
However, from a game balance perspective, I think they could have similar durability to flint since you can get flint from panning. Unlike flint tho, bone tools would be renewable which would be great for the "small world" VS playthrus (I've watched 32x32 and 64x64 VS play thru videos)
@@macmcleod1188 Makes sense! I didn't consider weird playthrough interactions. In fact working on Skyblock now and learning a lot about what's renewable!
In my opinion the bone tools should be more durable but less effective, but for that they would have to buff the copper weapons/tools and what follows, because there is too little difference between flint and copper to fit an intermediate/alternate tier
@@renatoxico0075 I view flint and bone as alternate equal tiers. The bone is mainly there for renewable settings (like multiplayer servers) to avoid having to pan sand or run 2000 meters to get to a fresh area right away.
They really need to add a server command to teleport you to a random spot and set your spawnpoint there.
I, am a little confused on surface instability. Since, as far as my understanding, it randomly fluctuates over time. I've had my base go from none, to low, to high, and back to none over the course of a several days.
That has never been my observation. The unstable areas as far as I can tell are unstable and don't change. But I also heard something similar. I just have never experienced it to be the case myself. Maybe there is some odd stuff going under the hood with it.
@@Oscillascape yeah, it does change, and I know i've never messed with it in terms of creative or the like. but perhaps it's a 3rd party mod doing something. or maybe my world settings. I generally play VS with my worlds set to something similar to MC Peaceful. Drifters and Rifts still spawn, but are essentially neutral mobs. I would probably enjoy playing in Homo Sapien mode more, but I enjoy having traders still
Instead of classes, I would prefer a more item oriented setup like terraria so that I am not locked to one specific play style if I don't enjoy it, and the items can be upgraded or replaced with better items.
Never played terraria although I hear it's a great game. So I am not sure how I feel about your item idea. I am open to different ideas about classes. Currently it's a bit weak as a system though.
@@Oscillascape I highly recommend trying it! It has one of the best progression systems of any game.
Basically the idea is that, if implemented in Vintage Story you start off with primitive items like you do now (rudimentary armor, stone tools, basic cooking, etc) and as you upgrade your tools, your furnaces, your home, your farms, etc. you would also be getting the ability to make additional item recipes such as contraptions that could help with physical speed, jump height, damage output, building capability, water breathing resistance, temperature resistance, temporal resistance, etc. and you the player would invest materials in what you'd like and adjust your play style as you progress.
In terraria, there are not only different armor/tool tiers (stone, iron, gold, etc), but there are also different "class" types of armor and items. The higher up in tiers you go (from say, iron to Steel for example) the more expensive your crafting recipes become, so choosing wisely on your builds becomes a player choice through the entire game instead of just once at the start.
So in VS the idea would be you have the option once you farm enough of an ingredient to build a "mage" steel armor, an "archer" steel armor, a "melee" steel armor, etc. This way you have the option to make whatever you'd like since the class system is based on the items, but still need to put the effort into obtaining the ingredients to make the items so that class difference isn't pointless either.
VS already has this with different kinds of armor you can already make from the same material, so it would basically be increasing the scope of items you can make and what benefits they gave the player.
Perhaps "extending arms" for longer block reach, or "spring shoes" for jump height, or perhaps "farmers touch" gloves for more fruitful crops when using them. With better ingredients = more dramatic buffs to the player.
"1.20 will add new mobs, and I'm excited to see what the devs are cooking"
Man I saw a video on what they made for 1.20 and I don't know if I wanna return to this game anymore LOL
Are you afraid of spiders? 🙃
@@Oscillascape I do not think these qualify as spiders. These are *much worse.*
I've never played vintage story but jus from having watch you play it i can see that not only are the animations clunky but also just the combat mechanics in general. Most of the time it doesn't seem like you can avoid taking damage when fighting its bigger health pool wins situation it seems
Backpedalling is pretty much the only combat tactic at the moment, other than that, it's who has better armor and weapons, not a ton of finesse there.