This is EXACTLY the inner dialogue I've had over the past week, about how anyone can reframe almost any new data to fit old paradigms, and how to go around it. I wanted to get around the presentation of facts somehow because of this, and also since I don't carry Wikipedia around in my head. Rather than introduce data, introduce doubt. Brilliant.
That's a great line ("rather than introduce data, inroduce doubt")--do you mind if I use that sometime in the future? I probably wouldn't be able to credit you for it, however.
Go ahead Anthony, I'd be honored. I'll be binging your entire channel for the next week (month? longer?), and I'll definitely comment some more. Feel free to use whatever you like.
Thank you. That's very nice of you. The content gets rougher as you go backwards in time, but that too might be a learning experience for the observer. I look forward to reading your comments.
I subscribed after watching Anthony on the Atheist Experience, I just wanted to say that an important piece of my deconversion puzzle was seeing representatives of atheism who were not confrontational firebrands like Dawkins et al. and SE seems like a terrific way to shift theists' perception of atheism as either arrogant or angry. While I was a theist, one of my favourite jokes about Richard Dawkins was 'he's a self-made man who worships his creator'. Funnily enough, I now watch his debates and see him as a model of restraint and tolerance in the face of extreme ignorance! It's a reminder for me when I talk to theists that beliefs that seem absurd to me now were 'real' for me then, and aggressive opposition only strengthened my position.
If you're referring to the claims that female oppression is necessarily reinforced by all straight males, you may be correct, so long as both sides could maintain an approach of calm discourse. The more general definition of feminism, however, is harder to argue as being irrational.
Rubin is more political, no? I'm not sure that's a perfect fit. Maybe Gad Saad is a good host, he is also pretty political but is also an evolutionary psychologist who might have interesting opinions on the psychology of SE.
Agaperion Rex Sam Harris is real good at pointing out fallacies but Anthony is real good at getting others to realize them themselves which I think is much more beneficial.
Thank you for championing this approach, Anthony (and for Dr. Bogosian for starting it). When I first started watching your videos, I found them very frustrating because they are so winding and often inconclusive. But now I'm trying to absorb the lessons and use them in my work as a manager. Hoping I get to use this approach with a believer at some point.
+jeffersonianideal Sorry it took a while to make that more clear. I was hoping to draw the connection much earlier with a video of my talk on SE from my Northern California tour months ago, but the footage from that talk proved elusive. As a result, I had to wait a few months before re-introducing the wasp to the ACA in Austin.
I didn't even know the avatar was a hornet. I mistook it for a yellow jacket or the like. I figured there was some hidden meaning in it like: "Bee healthy, put some SE logic in your bonnet".
Thank you for this video, liked and subscribed. I really, really wish I had known about SE 4 years ago when I finally came out to my family as atheist. I won't go into it as it's a fairly long story but I took the super nova approach and it was about as productive as you might expect with a lot of hurt feelings. That wasn't my intent of course, but now relationships are strained if not ruined. At any rate, thank you for this talk and I look forward to catching up on your interesting SE videos.
I just found this video, five years from when it was posted. I'm not necessarily an atheist but I have been working to understand and employ street epistemology while heavily evaluating it and putting it under scrutiny. So far so good!
Thank you, Anthony. Keep up the good work. I think working together we can really make a difference in the mental and emotional health of this world and in this generation.
I just watched this on a train I had never ridden on before. The video lasted exactly the length of the trip. As the applause started, the brakes started to squeal as we arrived at the final station. It was like it was meant to be! hahaha If I was a magical thinker, I'd be really confused. I think belief for some is just built up from coincidences.
Your skillful engineer Anthony is on course to derail irrational beliefs and guide humanity onto the right track. Give a loud Woo-Wooooh to signify the end of aimless woo-woo.
Thank you Anthony. While I came across SE before seeing your videos on you tube - you actually brought it alive and completely changed my approach to interacting with believers, conspiracy theorists, new age hippies etc. It is way more fun doing SE than it is arguing with them and seeing the 'backfire effect' in action. At one of my local churches they started preaching how to defend against SE!
Another great video .. key words “ if the person is honest “ I’m running into folks that are not honest especially once they begin to realize the juxtaposition the dilemma they are headed towards
Anthony, I just wanted to give my condolences to you, since you dedicated this talk to Mary "Kat" Katherine Griffin. It is always tragic when a young person loses their life in a traffic accident.
"I honestly believe that within 5 years, the majority of atheist you know will be using the approach of street epistemology." God, we can only hope. What would you say the difference between street epistemology and the Socratic method is?
Hmm. That's a great question. Off the top of my head, I might say SE includes elements of psychology, whereas the Socratic Method may not. But I'd have to give that some thought. Thank you for helping me think.
Great talk Anthony, as usual ! You will be remembered as one of the pioneers of the global rationality movement, which results in the improvement of mankind.
Im not smart enough for street epistemology... My sister in law went straight to faith to solidify her belief, and I couldn't think straight enough to remember to ask her about other religions who rely on faith.... My hat's off to you Anthony. You do great. I feel like I'm deprogramming myself just by listening to your conversations.
rrosefam Hey there. Thanks for watching and commenting on one of my videos. Don’t beat yourself up too much: it can take some practice to be able to form good questions and all the other stuff. I hope you keep trying if that’s something you want. Links to SE resources and communities in video description.
@@magnabosco210 oh WOW... you ARE a real person lol, who interacts with measly internet people like me! Im not used to anyone responding. Not to blame them tho, I tend to stay pretty quiet online. Im coming from Mormonism, just a heads up. My entire family is still mormon. Im not sure how I escaped, tbh... I bought it all, hook line and sinker like the rest. Yet here I am. 🤷🏻♀️ Going back to it would be like going back to believing in Santa. I just can't do it, even if I wanted to. And I don't. But still.... Here's a sincere thank you for being real. I don't feel so small, somehow.
rrosefam Hey there. I don’t have a lot of time but I just wanted to acknowledge your reply and direct you to the recent interview/guest cohost spot I had on the Atheist Experience with Jenna Belk. We take a call from a young LDS missionary that you may enjoy.
Right around 17 minutes when the hornet flies across the screen. If you edited that in there I thought that was cheesy and funny. I appreciated it haha
I'd already picked up a lot of your method just from your videos, but this was an extremely interesting look into the exact mechanisms. The one thing I might add to your PART dissection would be an additional R for "reacting", for the way you react to their statements. Like the slightly incredulous "Wow!" with the woman who believes in karma, as an example.
After some consideration to your point of it destroying the acronym, maybe that second R could be an S for "surprised", that way it could be PARTS! Ooooor like Linda says, you could talk like a pirate. That works too!
49:22 "Now, we know that this is effective. There are probably people that are in this room because we watched somebody get ridiculed and we thought, 'that's the exact same belief I have and I can't maintain the belief'. We know that it works." Among a large viewing audience, how is ridicule an effective method of de-conversion? Is there evidence to support some believers will apply the harsh criticisms to their own faith, eventually recognize the flaws in their thinking process and abandon their irrational beliefs? How can the established one-on-one SE method be applied or altered in such a way as to be effective for large groups of believers?
Hey Anthony, I really like how your able to quickly and respectfully identify people's justifications for their beliefs. I often wonder if you've outclassed the people you're speaking with by using a honed skill and that they're just looking to stop the probing questions and appear logically consistent after realizing that you don't share their beliefs. Is there a way to prove a lasting change in the strength of their beliefs or at least acceptance of non-belief?
I agree sometimes it feels he comes on a bit too strong. He needs a way to provide a bit of relief every once in a while take the pressure off and relate back to them. Some people form very close relationships with their God and when you are tearing that away from them it hurts provide a bit of comfort
Hey Anthony! I love your videos and your technique for talking with people about their deeply-held beliefs. I'm going to be in San Antonio in late August on a work-related trip. If you're available and willing, I'd love to take you and your family out for dinner there somewhere, eh!
peer pressure and the desire to want to belong to a group is a huge factor in religion.. This is how cults work but religionists do not recognize the fact that they are in a cult.
OK, after a bunch of searches that will probably get me in trouble with the wife, I gotta ask, will you post a link for the "porn kills love" guy? Haha. I can't find it and I thought I had seen all your videos but I don't remember that one.
@17:20 - I would be more likely to respond with, "I hope the airplane mechanics did their jobs properly, because I don't think an Iron-Age Middle Eastern god knows much about airplane mechanics and flight technology."
I once encountered someone who I thought was better off with religion. Through a youtube comments conversation. She had some baggage and couldn't afford therapy. Considering I am an anti-theist I didn't think I'd ever find religion to be the best option.
I heard a young woman talk about how a church helped her (maybe similar to the woman you talked to) because the church had a ministry, a 'therapy outreach' or a drug counseling, whatever it was. But the problem I could see, from what she said, was that her 'co-dependence' problem was not really fixed, but she became 'co-dependent' upon god/jesus! It was merely a transference of her dependence. But of course, she could not see that, and the church counseling isn't going to tell her that.
***** +u2kimbow True. unfortunately there are situations where drugs, religion and suicide are the only options. Not everyone can afford real medical treatment and some problems are too hard to live with honestly, without medical treatment. On a positive note, every day that goes by the more and more people receive the medical help they need. :) What ever good we can do in our daily lives makes the world a better place.
58:53 It is evident from watching Mr. Magnabosco and from the limited interactions I've had with believers, the focus and fascination in the exchange centers on the interlocutor’s answers and waiting for the "aha" moments. It's no longer about counterargument and scoring debate points. SE negates the ME. If that isn't proof of how the ego gets suppressed through the SE method, I don't know what is. I find the neutralizing effect SE has on the facilitator's ego to be nothing short of remarkable. Anyone who is successfully implementing the technique of SE should be able to immediately identify how the process of SE methodically defeats ego.
I think you are focusing in on an important point that I never seriously considered before you mentioned it. This will make for a fun discussion on Blab and/or in the Private Street Epistemology Facebook Group one day.
Weekly AE watcher (but I cling to the "Ridicule" camp). This is clearly good stuff though. Will definitely think on how to work it in to what I do. Thanks!
Love what you do Anthony 🥰 I guess COVID might have slowed things down a bit. I use the clubhouse app to have conversations with people and i hope to see you there sometime 😇 ( unless you already are there and I'm jus not aware )
Hey there Yes I've been on CH, mainly to talk about SE and demonstrate it. There's a room for SE on CH, too. Please check it out if you haven't already.
Is 'The Defend the Faith' lecture in the baptist church in 14:07 actually real? These people seem to refer to themselves as apologetics, which i thought was a term we used to bring to light what they were actually doing. It seems very cynical if he is actually aware that what he was doing was tricking people into accepting religion, instead of it just being his opinion?
You can find a link to an audio-only version of their talk in the video description field, and I would highly recommend listening to it. There are some real gems in there.
+Anthony Magnabosco *Before reading: If you are short on time, feel free to not answer (someone else are very welcome to join) :) you are probably on a huge time constraints being a guy on YT* Iv'e listened to this a couple of times, and you have really opened my eyes to how you convince other people, just in generel actually. It seems most people have 1 or 2 arguments in their heads that are their 'knockdown arguments', arguments which they consider the reason they hold this belief. It seems your strategy is to: 1. Listen to them say it out loud 2. Provide an example where their arguments requirements are fulfilled, but gives another or the exact opposite result than they used to believe. An easy example you gave was with the guy on the plane saying 'i always pray before i take off, because it results in a safe landing'. You then ask: 'Have you considered exactly which kind of people pray the most in flights?', and it probably comes to his mind that people who pray the most are actually the ones crashing :D I've used it myself, but i am not good at it, and people dont answer me back :) Gotta work on that !
There are a variety of approaches people can use while employing SE. Have you considering joining the Private Street Epistemology Facebook Group? Many people are in there, sharing their experiences and techniques.
The most powerful point (at about 58:00) is using SE on SE - it's self-examination (SE) when done right. If you're not a little bit open to the answers you're hearing from people, if you don't doubt your own stance, you're not doing it right. Every one of the people that Anthony interviews has a positive experience with faith of some kind, and ignoring that isn't the way to find the truth. Faith exists for reasons, and they may be not applicable in 2016 or harmful to themselves, but why does it exist? Would faith in SE do harm? That's the true Socratic Method tempered by simple compassion for these people.
About "She's not equipped to defend her belief" and stuff... So people should hold beliefs they're not equipped to defend, even if only to themselves? Street Epistemology isn't about finding all the cracks and ripping a belief open, it's about getting people to see what would be good reasons or bad reasons for holding a belief. If I couldn't defend evolution, I might still believe in it, but I would also not have GOOD reasons to believe it. Should I believe something I don't have good reasons to? In my mind, this is the whole point of this method.
Wow Kiana sounds like a very trustworthy person Because she is seemingly doing her best to be a Good person by reflecting on her actions and holding her self Accountable. Wow I like that in a person. Now if we can just get Our politicians to act like this.
Anthony Magnabosco thanks for the video just by watching it I can already see where I need to adjust. I do the epistemology as much as I can fit it in. Sometimes I forget that correcting people can be annoying All I can say is I'm still learning. And a big 👍🏽s up to you tony.
michael garrido Thanks. Don't forget about the Private Street Epistemology Facebook Group if you are looking to meet others learning and using this technique.
Street Epistemology Discord Server: discord.gg/sKap3zM Street Epistemology Videos | Latest Releases Playlist: A collection of Street Epistemology Videos uploaded within the last four weeks related to the method. Content from new channels may stick around a little longer. tinyurl.com/SELatestReleases Street Epistemology Study Group 1 of 4: Private Group, Restricted Access (open to some) Study group only, no role-play or SE chatting. m.facebook.com/groups/327681890701533 Learn Street Epistemology Group 2 of 4: Private Group, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief) Study group only, no role-play or SE chatting. m.facebook.com/groups/298421410583502 Chat with a Street Epistemologist Group 3 of 4: Private Group, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief) Role-play or engage with someone using SE. m.facebook.com/groups/1138113529619188 Critique Street Epistemology Group 4 of 4: Public Group, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief) Critique for everyone, no role-play or SE chatting. m.facebook.com/groups/1517931244990180 Street Epistemology Facebook Page: Public Page, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief) m.facebook.com/StreetEpistemology/ Street Epistemology Twitter: @STEpistemology tinyurl.com/TW-STEPI Street Epistemology Podcast: pod.link/1117153385 Street Epistemology Reddit: tinyurl.com/REDT-SE Purchase SE-Themed Gear: tinyurl.com/BUYSESTUFF Public SE Resources Drive: tinyurl.com/SE-PUBLIC-DRIVE Interactive SE Survey: se-survey.web.app/ The Street Epistemology Website: tinyurl.com/TSEWEBSITE
Great video. I’m wondering by what method you use to calculate the PART s. In medicine we have what’s called peer review, I don’t know how feasible this is in this situation but if others using SE could evaluate each other’s videos it seems like this might be more objective. I have no idea by what methods you use to determine what constitutes a P, A R or T for example. Just a thought.
I'm thinking of ways this can be used to change perspectives on other beliefs... like the ones that impact human beings every day.... Can SE be used to end homelessness everywhere? If you ask the right questions and possibly direct someones attention to a proper easy access to end homelessness once and for all...
I think probably so - SE is basically Socratic Method and was there at the very start of democracy. Why wouldn't it be useful against economic ideology or class blinders?
The group behind 'The Atheist Experience' was kind enough to invite me on the show that occurred immediately after this talk: ruclips.net/video/gSp_f47cBSM/видео.html
Thanks for the talk. Just so know, I'm included in the number that has changed their approach, so thank you. Also, when will the SE app become available? Thanks again for your efforts!
It is built up like a huge multiple choice test. The questions are quotes of what someone might say to you. Every question has four possible answers -- 2 of them are better and 2 of them are worse, from the SE effectiveness standpoint. When you choose one of them, the app explains why it is a good or a bad answer.
Hmm. Not sure. The closest thing right now would my Twitter (@magnabosco) or my Facebook Page (magnabosco210). Eventually, the SE Website will be a community portal.
I've yet to find Sister Clarice by searching, I've not gone through the entire library though. Is there a compendium somewhere that I can actually search through for names and stuff?
If apologists were to arm believers with "reasons why faith reliably get you to truth", wouldn't this undermine the effectiveness of SE? A bit like putting a pebble in a tank tread.
@@magnabosco210 oh that's a shame. I find too many get stuck on the whole 'Can't know anything to be absolutely true unless X god exists' I don't follow it personally. But he and many others use it to stump people. I'm discovering this argument to be at the heart of many apologists arguments. But I haven't heard a good refutation to it. I have some ideas. Perhaps you have some thoughts or links. +1 for value to me hehe.
mike d It’s quite likely I will run into some presuppositionalists while on campus this year, so you might just see a conversation with somebody who holds that view in the near future.
I am always kinda surprised when I see Anthony - Whatching his interviews you never see him and my mind construct of what he looks like from his voice doesn't match what he actually looks like....
That's funny to read. I've had a few people say (when we meet in person) that I am much taller than they thought--likely because they are used to viewing people from my chest height.
HA! Yeah, I have always found voices create an image in the mind. It is rarely very accurate... To most ost folks (like me) who watch your interviews your a dissembodied voice!
In regards to not reading the RUclips comments, reading the RUclips comments battlefield helped me come out of my Christian belief because I've used some of the arguments that the commenters used. The Atheist Experience helped a lot by seeing the arguments get destroyed and encouraged me not to use them. The Four Horsemen helped a tremendous amount but I have to owe most of my deconversion to The Atheist Experience, The Atheist Voice, and The Thinking Atheist podcast. Now I am producing animated presentations about religion, philosophy and science.
I am in Australia and you would have trouble doing this street epistemology here as you would get "my beliefs? I believe Queensland will win the State of Origin Rungy League! I support my belief by the fact they have won 10 of the last 11 years" or "I believe a good pale ale will make me more ralaxed after a hard day at work" etc.... Unless you stood outside of a church on a Sunday morning you would get bored pretty quickly... Many many people who say they are Catholic or Anglican here mean it in the cultural rather than the religious sense and while 60% of Aussies say they believe there may be a "higher power" only 10% of them are church (or Mosque etc) going religious types. In one way it makes it even worse that the religious have such an influence on politics here are they are not representative of the majority.
ok! thanks Anthony. Great work that you are doing. You should make a tutorial or a video focused on;y on all the different ways we can support you and anyone/everyone doing SE. I would love to support but I'm not sure what the best ways are. Is it talking to people in the streets? Talking to family members? Sharing videos on facebook? Sharing videos to my aggressive atheists? Studying apologetics? Buying/Studying Peter books? Donating to SE related organizations? Getting the atheos app? etc. just so that people know more clearly how we can support since there are lots of different people with different needs/resources/time etc it would b nice to compile this somewhere so that everyone no matter what time constraint/background/resources/economics etc can support in whatever way we can :)
I just meant it could be useful to compile one source that says different ways to support SE (not really as a way to express gratitude but to contribute to the cause), sort of tailoring for different people depending on how they can or want to help. Not everyone might want to donate or do SE but might want to do something else. Just a suggestion. Thanks and keep the good work!
With all due respect, Anthony, SE does not seem to be effective. With that being said, it's probably the most effective technique out there. The nonsense caused by religious indoctrination is mind boggling.
Religious institutions know the power of childhood indoctrination... they count on it for their very existence. It's baked into some of their names, like "Focus on the Family" and "Quiverfull"
Just a comment on the interview with the kid: He says he knows his god is the true god and allah is a false god. Why didn't you ask him if he realized allah was just the arabic term for the same god he believes in? The Abrahamic god of Christianity, Catholocism, Judaism, Islam, etc are all the same god. I know you're trying to ask and not teach, but certainly that could have been a moment to educate.
Why this approach? Why offend or annoy somebody like fking believers who keep ringing your doorbell or preach in the street? Religion isnt a push-topic like any other private thing isnt a push-topic to talk about. Its unpolite to talk to strangers about a variety of personal topics like health, money, any kind of private activities like sex, crimes, beliefs... Things work here on YT because YT is a pull-medium for pull-topics, where the consumer does not have to reveal himself. Beliefs will never go away, we can best cope with that fact as a society by keeping them private. So here is the deal: You stop telling me about your personal beliefs when we meet and I will stop forcing you to stop.
@@petermeyer6873 approaches like street epistemology are important because it helps people reflect on how they reason to their conclusions, conclusions that they then act out on in the real world, affecting other people. This particular version of street epistemology is the on the street interview style. But you don’t have to do it this way. You can learn it and use it anyway you please whenever somebody makes a claim that you think might be worth exploring with them. Check out the free course at navigatingbelief.scom
@@magnabosco210 You really dont get how unpolite this approach is considered somewhere else and this is of course due to a vast difference in culture. Another example: Still, over here in most european countries an american holidaymaker e.g. approaching someone on the street with the most unpolite greeting formula we can imagine: "How are you?", a question obviously intended to find out the other ones weaknesses in health, suited to prepare a physical attack, also an information one historically was only obliged to reveal to the landlord and of course he asked it to find out whether you were still fit to work for him or had become a burden, the usual reaction is "Do we know each other or why dou you dare to demand such private information from me?"
@@petermeyer6873 I get it. I’ve been talking with people around the world who have been practicing street epistemology for about a decade now. You’ll have to make modifications, depending on where you’re at. There are of course cultural differences and adaptations.
I love how you produce these...with the timer showing and typing out unclear speech. Superior work.
This is EXACTLY the inner dialogue I've had over the past week, about how anyone can reframe almost any new data to fit old paradigms, and how to go around it. I wanted to get around the presentation of facts somehow because of this, and also since I don't carry Wikipedia around in my head. Rather than introduce data, introduce doubt. Brilliant.
That's a great line ("rather than introduce data, inroduce doubt")--do you mind if I use that sometime in the future? I probably wouldn't be able to credit you for it, however.
Go ahead Anthony, I'd be honored. I'll be binging your entire channel for the next week (month? longer?), and I'll definitely comment some more. Feel free to use whatever you like.
Thank you. That's very nice of you. The content gets rougher as you go backwards in time, but that too might be a learning experience for the observer. I look forward to reading your comments.
@@magnabosco210 Keep up the great work. Also, thank you for being so awesome!
I subscribed after watching Anthony on the Atheist Experience, I just wanted to say that an important piece of my deconversion puzzle was seeing representatives of atheism who were not confrontational firebrands like Dawkins et al. and SE seems like a terrific way to shift theists' perception of atheism as either arrogant or angry. While I was a theist, one of my favourite jokes about Richard Dawkins was 'he's a self-made man who worships his creator'. Funnily enough, I now watch his debates and see him as a model of restraint and tolerance in the face of extreme ignorance! It's a reminder for me when I talk to theists that beliefs that seem absurd to me now were 'real' for me then, and aggressive opposition only strengthened my position.
Facinating perspective--thanks for sharing it here.
I would like to see SE applied to feminism. That religion is has very negative effects on our culture.
If you're referring to the claims that female oppression is necessarily reinforced by all straight males, you may be correct, so long as both sides could maintain an approach of calm discourse. The more general definition of feminism, however, is harder to argue as being irrational.
On a scale of 1 to 100, how confident are you that that belief is true?
***** Which belief, please?
You need to get your ass on the Rubin Report. You deserve a much bigger audience. This is a superb lecture.
I went to his YT channel and asked him to do just that. Rubin Report in the discussion.
Rubin is more political, no? I'm not sure that's a perfect fit. Maybe Gad Saad is a good host, he is also pretty political but is also an evolutionary psychologist who might have interesting opinions on the psychology of SE.
Agaperion Rex
oh OK, I see, yeah you convinced me. Go Rubin Report! :)
(I was thinking maybe even Sam Harris' podcast might work ;)
Agaperion Rex Sam Harris is real good at pointing out fallacies but Anthony is real good at getting others to realize them themselves which I think is much more beneficial.
As he points out though, there are different tools. Sam Harris has a big audience so the supernova might be the best approach for him.
Excellent talk. I'm sincerely enjoying your videos. Thanks for popularizing this technique, I feel it could make a big difference.
Thank you for championing this approach, Anthony (and for Dr. Bogosian for starting it). When I first started watching your videos, I found them very frustrating because they are so winding and often inconclusive. But now I'm trying to absorb the lessons and use them in my work as a manager. Hoping I get to use this approach with a believer at some point.
So encouraging to hear that apologists are issuing fatwas on atheists !
Love the hornet at 16:18, nice touch and a great video.The PART count is really helpful.
Yes! I love easter eggs like that.
Made me laugh too ahahaha
I finally understand Mr. M's. use of his hornet avatar. Mystery solved.
+jeffersonianideal Sorry it took a while to make that more clear. I was hoping to draw the connection much earlier with a video of my talk on SE from my Northern California tour months ago, but the footage from that talk proved elusive. As a result, I had to wait a few months before re-introducing the wasp to the ACA in Austin.
I didn't even know the avatar was a hornet. I mistook it for a yellow jacket or the like. I figured there was some hidden meaning in it like: "Bee healthy, put some SE logic in your bonnet".
Thank you for this video, liked and subscribed. I really, really wish I had known about SE 4 years ago when I finally came out to my family as atheist. I won't go into it as it's a fairly long story but I took the super nova approach and it was about as productive as you might expect with a lot of hurt feelings. That wasn't my intent of course, but now relationships are strained if not ruined. At any rate, thank you for this talk and I look forward to catching up on your interesting SE videos.
Tom and Tim are worried. That makes me smile.
Honestly can't remember how I stumbled upon SE but it has changed my life!!!
I just found this video, five years from when it was posted. I'm not necessarily an atheist but I have been working to understand and employ street epistemology while heavily evaluating it and putting it under scrutiny. So far so good!
Thank you, Anthony. Keep up the good work. I think working together we can really make a difference in the mental and emotional health of this world and in this generation.
Great talk! Thanks for uploading this. The audio in your recording is a lot better than the one Don Baker posted.
I just watched this on a train I had never ridden on before. The video lasted exactly the length of the trip. As the applause started, the brakes started to squeal as we arrived at the final station.
It was like it was meant to be!
hahaha
If I was a magical thinker, I'd be really confused.
I think belief for some is just built up from coincidences.
I planned it that way.
Praise the great one. Praise Magnabosco (magnus=great, not even joking). Planner of talks of one specific length that happened to fit on one occasion.
Destination: logic.
Woo-Wooooh! (that is a train whistle)
Your skillful engineer Anthony is on course to derail irrational beliefs and guide humanity onto the right track. Give a loud Woo-Wooooh to signify the end of aimless woo-woo.
This was really well done, thanks Anthony.
Thank you Anthony. While I came across SE before seeing your videos on you tube - you actually brought it alive and completely changed my approach to interacting with believers, conspiracy theorists, new age hippies etc. It is way more fun doing SE than it is arguing with them and seeing the 'backfire effect' in action. At one of my local churches they started preaching how to defend against SE!
SE is the best dehypnosis tool I know of. It's a great defense to mind control techniques like religion and propaganda.
Another great video .. key words “ if the person is honest “ I’m running into folks that are not honest especially once they begin to realize the juxtaposition the dilemma they are headed towards
Anthony, I just wanted to give my condolences to you, since you dedicated this talk to Mary "Kat" Katherine Griffin. It is always tragic when a young person loses their life in a traffic accident.
Anthony you are great. I am using this approach. It is awesome to watch people really think!!!!
the PART approach is very effective: more pausing, asking, repeating, less telling... for anything...
"I honestly believe that within 5 years, the majority of atheist you know will be using the approach of street epistemology." God, we can only hope.
What would you say the difference between street epistemology and the Socratic method is?
Hmm. That's a great question. Off the top of my head, I might say SE includes elements of psychology, whereas the Socratic Method may not. But I'd have to give that some thought. Thank you for helping me think.
No problem.
Great talk Anthony, as usual ! You will be remembered as one of the pioneers of the global rationality movement, which results in the improvement of mankind.
This is so good. Just recommended this video to someone
Your channel should have many more subscribers.
Im not smart enough for street epistemology...
My sister in law went straight to faith to solidify her belief, and I couldn't think straight enough to remember to ask her about other religions who rely on faith....
My hat's off to you Anthony. You do great.
I feel like I'm deprogramming myself just by listening to your conversations.
rrosefam Hey there. Thanks for watching and commenting on one of my videos. Don’t beat yourself up too much: it can take some practice to be able to form good questions and all the other stuff. I hope you keep trying if that’s something you want. Links to SE resources and communities in video description.
@@magnabosco210 oh WOW... you ARE a real person lol, who interacts with measly internet people like me!
Im not used to anyone responding. Not to blame them tho, I tend to stay pretty quiet online.
Im coming from Mormonism, just a heads up. My entire family is still mormon. Im not sure how I escaped, tbh... I bought it all, hook line and sinker like the rest. Yet here I am. 🤷🏻♀️
Going back to it would be like going back to believing in Santa. I just can't do it, even if I wanted to. And I don't. But still....
Here's a sincere thank you for being real. I don't feel so small, somehow.
rrosefam Hey there. I don’t have a lot of time but I just wanted to acknowledge your reply and direct you to the recent interview/guest cohost spot I had on the Atheist Experience with Jenna Belk. We take a call from a young LDS missionary that you may enjoy.
@@magnabosco210 thank you!
Right around 17 minutes when the hornet flies across the screen. If you edited that in there I thought that was cheesy and funny. I appreciated it haha
I'd already picked up a lot of your method just from your videos, but this was an extremely interesting look into the exact mechanisms. The one thing I might add to your PART dissection would be an additional R for "reacting", for the way you react to their statements. Like the slightly incredulous "Wow!" with the woman who believes in karma, as an example.
Good idea. I'll give that some thought. Thanks.
But it would destroy the acronym ;)
Not if you talk like a pirate - PARRT!
After some consideration to your point of it destroying the acronym, maybe that second R could be an S for "surprised", that way it could be PARTS! Ooooor like Linda says, you could talk like a pirate. That works too!
Nasuth
Or add an E for Explosions (hopefully stays 0) and you could have PARTER (as in 2-parter or sth ;)
We all will need se not in our tool box against misinformation but as our actual tool set to fight this scourge of lies and believing falsehoods
Anthony -- You're my newest Atheist hero and role model.
49:22
"Now, we know that this is effective. There are probably people that are in this room because we watched somebody get ridiculed and we thought, 'that's the exact same belief I have and I can't maintain the belief'. We know that it works."
Among a large viewing audience, how is ridicule an effective method of de-conversion? Is there evidence to support some believers will apply the harsh criticisms to their own faith, eventually recognize the flaws in their thinking process and abandon their irrational beliefs?
How can the established one-on-one SE method be applied or altered in such a way as to be effective for large groups of believers?
Thank you, Anthony. This is really helpful.
Dude, you're AMAZING
I’ve been realizing this recently
Great vid
Hey Anthony, I really like how your able to quickly and respectfully identify people's justifications for their beliefs.
I often wonder if you've outclassed the people you're speaking with by using a honed skill and that they're just looking to stop the probing questions and appear logically consistent after realizing that you don't share their beliefs.
Is there a way to prove a lasting change in the strength of their beliefs or at least acceptance of non-belief?
I agree sometimes it feels he comes on a bit too strong. He needs a way to provide a bit of relief every once in a while take the pressure off and relate back to them. Some people form very close relationships with their God and when you are tearing that away from them it hurts provide a bit of comfort
Hey Anthony! I love your videos and your technique for talking with people about their deeply-held beliefs. I'm going to be in San Antonio in late August on a work-related trip. If you're available and willing, I'd love to take you and your family out for dinner there somewhere, eh!
peer pressure and the desire to want to belong to a group is a huge factor in religion.. This is how cults work but religionists do not recognize the fact that they are in a cult.
OK, after a bunch of searches that will probably get me in trouble with the wife, I gotta ask, will you post a link for the "porn kills love" guy? Haha. I can't find it and I thought I had seen all your videos but I don't remember that one.
@17:20 - I would be more likely to respond with, "I hope the airplane mechanics did their jobs properly, because I don't think an Iron-Age Middle Eastern god knows much about airplane mechanics and flight technology."
I once encountered someone who I thought was better off with religion. Through a youtube comments conversation. She had some baggage and couldn't afford therapy. Considering I am an anti-theist I didn't think I'd ever find religion to be the best option.
I heard a young woman talk about how a church helped her (maybe similar to the woman you talked to) because the church had a ministry, a 'therapy outreach' or a drug counseling, whatever it was. But the problem I could see, from what she said, was that her 'co-dependence' problem was not really fixed, but she became 'co-dependent' upon god/jesus! It was merely a transference of her dependence. But of course, she could not see that, and the church counseling isn't going to tell her that.
***** +u2kimbow True. unfortunately there are situations where drugs, religion and suicide are the only options. Not everyone can afford real medical treatment and some problems are too hard to live with honestly, without medical treatment.
On a positive note, every day that goes by the more and more people receive the medical help they need. :) What ever good we can do in our daily lives makes the world a better place.
Another superb talk.
58:53
It is evident from watching Mr. Magnabosco and from the limited interactions I've had with believers, the focus and fascination in the exchange centers on the interlocutor’s answers and waiting for the "aha" moments. It's no longer about counterargument and scoring debate points. SE negates the ME. If that isn't proof of how the ego gets suppressed through the SE method, I don't know what is.
I find the neutralizing effect SE has on the facilitator's ego to be nothing short of remarkable. Anyone who is successfully implementing the technique of SE should be able to immediately identify how the process of SE methodically defeats ego.
I think you are focusing in on an important point that I never seriously considered before you mentioned it. This will make for a fun discussion on Blab and/or in the Private Street Epistemology Facebook Group one day.
Can't wait for such a forum to take place. Ego removal is one of SE's add-on benefits.
Weekly AE watcher (but I cling to the "Ridicule" camp). This is clearly good stuff though. Will definitely think on how to work it in to what I do. Thanks!
Really enjoyed this video. The karma clip was great :)
Love what you do Anthony 🥰 I guess COVID might have slowed things down a bit. I use the clubhouse app to have conversations with people and i hope to see you there sometime 😇 ( unless you already are there and I'm jus not aware )
Hey there Yes I've been on CH, mainly to talk about SE and demonstrate it. There's a room for SE on CH, too. Please check it out if you haven't already.
@@magnabosco210 thanks again for all you do :)
Love your work dude!
mike d Thanks!
Is 'The Defend the Faith' lecture in the baptist church in 14:07 actually real? These people seem to refer to themselves as apologetics, which i thought was a term we used to bring to light what they were actually doing.
It seems very cynical if he is actually aware that what he was doing was tricking people into accepting religion, instead of it just being his opinion?
You can find a link to an audio-only version of their talk in the video description field, and I would highly recommend listening to it. There are some real gems in there.
+Anthony Magnabosco *Before reading: If you are short on time, feel free to not answer (someone else are very welcome to join) :) you are probably on a huge time constraints being a guy on YT*
Iv'e listened to this a couple of times, and you have really opened my eyes to how you convince other people, just in generel actually. It seems most people have 1 or 2 arguments in their heads that are their 'knockdown arguments', arguments which they consider the reason they hold this belief. It seems your strategy is to:
1. Listen to them say it out loud
2. Provide an example where their arguments requirements are fulfilled, but gives another or the exact opposite result than they used to believe.
An easy example you gave was with the guy on the plane saying 'i always pray before i take off, because it results in a safe landing'. You then ask: 'Have you considered exactly which kind of people pray the most in flights?', and it probably comes to his mind that people who pray the most are actually the ones crashing :D
I've used it myself, but i am not good at it, and people dont answer me back :) Gotta work on that !
There are a variety of approaches people can use while employing SE. Have you considering joining the Private Street Epistemology Facebook Group? Many people are in there, sharing their experiences and techniques.
Thanks Anthony!
The most powerful point (at about 58:00) is using SE on SE - it's self-examination (SE) when done right. If you're not a little bit open to the answers you're hearing from people, if you don't doubt your own stance, you're not doing it right. Every one of the people that Anthony interviews has a positive experience with faith of some kind, and ignoring that isn't the way to find the truth. Faith exists for reasons, and they may be not applicable in 2016 or harmful to themselves, but why does it exist? Would faith in SE do harm? That's the true Socratic Method tempered by simple compassion for these people.
About "She's not equipped to defend her belief" and stuff...
So people should hold beliefs they're not equipped to defend, even if only to themselves? Street Epistemology isn't about finding all the cracks and ripping a belief open, it's about getting people to see what would be good reasons or bad reasons for holding a belief. If I couldn't defend evolution, I might still believe in it, but I would also not have GOOD reasons to believe it. Should I believe something I don't have good reasons to? In my mind, this is the whole point of this method.
Wow Kiana sounds like a very trustworthy person
Because she is seemingly doing her best to be a
Good person by reflecting on her actions and holding her self
Accountable. Wow I like that in a person. Now if we can just get
Our politicians to act like this.
michael garrido Well said.
Anthony Magnabosco thanks for the video just by watching it
I can already see where I need to adjust.
I do the epistemology as much as I can fit it in.
Sometimes I forget that correcting people can be annoying
All I can say is I'm still learning. And a big 👍🏽s up to you tony.
michael garrido Thanks. Don't forget about the Private Street Epistemology Facebook Group if you are looking to meet others learning and using this technique.
what's the pourcentage you think that you know for a fact in the universe the rest you don't know
Anthony, is there a resource someplace to connect interested people with SE training? Thanks.
Street Epistemology Discord Server:
discord.gg/sKap3zM
Street Epistemology Videos | Latest Releases Playlist:
A collection of Street Epistemology Videos uploaded within the last four weeks related to the method. Content from new channels may stick around a little longer.
tinyurl.com/SELatestReleases
Street Epistemology Study Group 1 of 4:
Private Group, Restricted Access (open to some)
Study group only, no role-play or SE chatting.
m.facebook.com/groups/327681890701533
Learn Street Epistemology Group 2 of 4:
Private Group, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief)
Study group only, no role-play or SE chatting.
m.facebook.com/groups/298421410583502
Chat with a Street Epistemologist Group 3 of 4:
Private Group, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief)
Role-play or engage with someone using SE.
m.facebook.com/groups/1138113529619188
Critique Street Epistemology Group 4 of 4:
Public Group, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief)
Critique for everyone, no role-play or SE chatting.
m.facebook.com/groups/1517931244990180
Street Epistemology Facebook Page:
Public Page, Unrestricted Access (open to all, regardless of belief)
m.facebook.com/StreetEpistemology/
Street Epistemology Twitter: @STEpistemology
tinyurl.com/TW-STEPI
Street Epistemology Podcast:
pod.link/1117153385
Street Epistemology Reddit:
tinyurl.com/REDT-SE
Purchase SE-Themed Gear:
tinyurl.com/BUYSESTUFF
Public SE Resources Drive:
tinyurl.com/SE-PUBLIC-DRIVE
Interactive SE Survey:
se-survey.web.app/
The Street Epistemology Website:
tinyurl.com/TSEWEBSITE
Great video. I’m wondering by what method you use to calculate the PART s. In medicine we have what’s called peer review, I don’t know how feasible this is in this situation but if others using SE could evaluate each other’s videos it seems like this might be more objective.
I have no idea by what methods you use to determine what constitutes a P, A R or T for example.
Just a thought.
drshellking@gmail.com Method? I just listen to the words being said and then attempt to classify it; It’s a rough guideline, not an exact science.
@39:35 could be the most obviously insincere over emphasized "WOW" I have ever heard in my life, and that includes sarcasm.
In hindsight, I probably should have scaled that one back. Could have made Kiana uneasy. But at the time, it was my honest reaction.
The hornets are going to be everywhere!
I'm thinking of ways this can be used to change perspectives on other beliefs... like the ones that impact human beings every day....
Can SE be used to end homelessness everywhere?
If you ask the right questions and possibly direct someones attention to a proper easy access to end homelessness once and for all...
I think probably so - SE is basically Socratic Method and was there at the very start of democracy. Why wouldn't it be useful against economic ideology or class blinders?
Loved the hornet!
Which bogosshian book “ impossible conversations” ?
Great talk. Any chance of you being maybe a co-host on the Atheist experience show sometime in the future?
The group behind 'The Atheist Experience' was kind enough to invite me on the show that occurred immediately after this talk: ruclips.net/video/gSp_f47cBSM/видео.html
Anthony Magnabosco
Nice, can't wait to watch it when I get home tonight. You're doing great work man, thanks again.
love it!
Five more minutes and Miguel would've eaten that bottle.
Who drew that pebble cartoon? My family owns the Sperry trademark and I'd like to chat with them. Joking. I can't think of a better use.
Thanks for the talk. Just so know, I'm included in the number that has changed their approach, so thank you.
Also, when will the SE app become available? Thanks again for your efforts!
Glad to hear it. The Atheos app has been released in Australia and New Zealand already.. Should be in the Apple and Android stores worldwide soon.
The app. Is it SE, counterapologetics, or both?
+Anthony Magnabosco Excellent thanks again
It is built up like a huge multiple choice test. The questions are quotes of what someone might say to you. Every question has four possible answers -- 2 of them are better and 2 of them are worse, from the SE effectiveness standpoint. When you choose one of them, the app explains why it is a good or a bad answer.
Thanks!
Is there some calendar posted somewhere that aggregates talks like these? I'd love to show up when I know they're happening. TIA.
Hmm. Not sure. The closest thing right now would my Twitter (@magnabosco) or my Facebook Page (magnabosco210). Eventually, the SE Website will be a community portal.
Excellent
;~)
I've yet to find Sister Clarice by searching, I've not gone through the entire library though. Is there a compendium somewhere that I can actually search through for names and stuff?
The discussion with Sister Clarice was not released after she emailed me afterwards politely asking that I don't post it.
Anthony Magnabosco Okay, that's fine. Thanks for the response.
If apologists were to arm believers with "reasons why faith reliably get you to truth", wouldn't this undermine the effectiveness of SE? A bit like putting a pebble in a tank tread.
Hi Anthony Magnabosco have you had a talk with Sye Ten Bruggencate?
mike d No.
@@magnabosco210 Would you ever consider engaging with him?
mike d I have considered it. Doesn’t seem like it would be valuable to anyone.
@@magnabosco210 oh that's a shame. I find too many get stuck on the whole 'Can't know anything to be absolutely true unless X god exists' I don't follow it personally. But he and many others use it to stump people. I'm discovering this argument to be at the heart of many apologists arguments. But I haven't heard a good refutation to it. I have some ideas. Perhaps you have some thoughts or links. +1 for value to me hehe.
mike d It’s quite likely I will run into some presuppositionalists while on campus this year, so you might just see a conversation with somebody who holds that view in the near future.
28:10 Another freudian slip, you're on a roll.
you seem pretty tall, whats your height?
I am always kinda surprised when I see Anthony - Whatching his interviews you never see him and my mind construct of what he looks like from his voice doesn't match what he actually looks like....
That's funny to read. I've had a few people say (when we meet in person) that I am much taller than they thought--likely because they are used to viewing people from my chest height.
HA! Yeah, I have always found voices create an image in the mind. It is rarely very accurate... To most ost folks (like me) who watch your interviews your a dissembodied voice!
In regards to not reading the RUclips comments, reading the RUclips comments battlefield helped me come out of my Christian belief because I've used some of the arguments that the commenters used. The Atheist Experience helped a lot by seeing the arguments get destroyed and encouraged me not to use them. The Four Horsemen helped a tremendous amount but I have to owe most of my deconversion to The Atheist Experience, The Atheist Voice, and The Thinking Atheist podcast. Now I am producing animated presentations about religion, philosophy and science.
I am in Australia and you would have trouble doing this street epistemology here as you would get "my beliefs? I believe Queensland will win the State of Origin Rungy League! I support my belief by the fact they have won 10 of the last 11 years" or "I believe a good pale ale will make me more ralaxed after a hard day at work" etc.... Unless you stood outside of a church on a Sunday morning you would get bored pretty quickly... Many many people who say they are Catholic or Anglican here mean it in the cultural rather than the religious sense and while 60% of Aussies say they believe there may be a "higher power" only 10% of them are church (or Mosque etc) going religious types. In one way it makes it even worse that the religious have such an influence on politics here are they are not representative of the majority.
Anthony, do you have the video with sister Clarice?
Brando Miranda No. I never uploaded it at her request.
ok! thanks Anthony. Great work that you are doing. You should make a tutorial or a video focused on;y on all the different ways we can support you and anyone/everyone doing SE. I would love to support but I'm not sure what the best ways are. Is it talking to people in the streets? Talking to family members? Sharing videos on facebook? Sharing videos to my aggressive atheists? Studying apologetics? Buying/Studying Peter books? Donating to SE related organizations? Getting the atheos app? etc. just so that people know more clearly how we can support since there are lots of different people with different needs/resources/time etc it would b nice to compile this somewhere so that everyone no matter what time constraint/background/resources/economics etc can support in whatever way we can :)
Brando Miranda Frankly, the best way you can show your gratitude is to tell other people about the method.
I just meant it could be useful to compile one source that says different ways to support SE (not really as a way to express gratitude but to contribute to the cause), sort of tailoring for different people depending on how they can or want to help.
Not everyone might want to donate or do SE but might want to do something else. Just a suggestion.
Thanks and keep the good work!
With all due respect, Anthony, SE does not seem to be effective. With that being said, it's probably the most effective technique out there. The nonsense caused by religious indoctrination is mind boggling.
Religious institutions know the power of childhood indoctrination... they count on it for their very existence. It's baked into some of their names, like "Focus on the Family" and "Quiverfull"
Just a comment on the interview with the kid: He says he knows his god is the true god and allah is a false god. Why didn't you ask him if he realized allah was just the arabic term for the same god he believes in? The Abrahamic god of Christianity, Catholocism, Judaism, Islam, etc are all the same god.
I know you're trying to ask and not teach, but certainly that could have been a moment to educate.
Needs captions. Hire me. $150. Ok?
Why this approach? Why offend or annoy somebody like fking believers who keep ringing your doorbell or preach in the street?
Religion isnt a push-topic like any other private thing isnt a push-topic to talk about. Its unpolite to talk to strangers about a variety of personal topics like health, money, any kind of private activities like sex, crimes, beliefs...
Things work here on YT because YT is a pull-medium for pull-topics, where the consumer does not have to reveal himself.
Beliefs will never go away, we can best cope with that fact as a society by keeping them private. So here is the deal:
You stop telling me about your personal beliefs when we meet and I will stop forcing you to stop.
@@petermeyer6873 approaches like street epistemology are important because it helps people reflect on how they reason to their conclusions, conclusions that they then act out on in the real world, affecting other people.
This particular version of street epistemology is the on the street interview style. But you don’t have to do it this way. You can learn it and use it anyway you please whenever somebody makes a claim that you think might be worth exploring with them.
Check out the free course at navigatingbelief.scom
@@magnabosco210 You really dont get how unpolite this approach is considered somewhere else and this is of course due to a vast difference in culture. Another example:
Still, over here in most european countries an american holidaymaker e.g. approaching someone on the street with the most unpolite greeting formula we can imagine: "How are you?", a question obviously intended to find out the other ones weaknesses in health, suited to prepare a physical attack, also an information one historically was only obliged to reveal to the landlord and of course he asked it to find out whether you were still fit to work for him or had become a burden, the usual reaction is "Do we know each other or why dou you dare to demand such private information from me?"
@@petermeyer6873 I get it. I’ve been talking with people around the world who have been practicing street epistemology for about a decade now. You’ll have to make modifications, depending on where you’re at. There are of course cultural differences and adaptations.
Atheos app not working!!!!!!!!!
Atheos app not working!!!!!!!!!