StarCraft 1: SUPERB PvT MACRO GAME! - Bonyth vs Gypsy | Ascension
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- Опубликовано: 10 май 2023
- Bonyth vs Gypsy vs OctZerg - Group 2, Part 2
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When Arty counted to 8... man, blew my mind. GOAT caster.
That was really one of the predictions ever made
I haven't seen a Starcraft game in years; youtube recommends this video and I am delighted to find an absolute top class caster. Artosis is entertaining, insightful, well spoken, and enthusiastic. I don't play the game, but I want to watch. Thank you for the content.
Artosis is part of my morning routine.
Same, I'm eating my morning sandwich, tuning in to Artosiscasts!
Same
Same
What bout mornings he don't cast? BASS FISHING PRODUCTION???
Can't poop without him. 😂
Also, my morning go is much less stressful without many spammed audible "W", rediculous numbers featuring the number 7, and Mario porn.
Artosis’ knowledge of the game never ceases to amaze me
When when he thought the tank Goliath won the game then immediately flipped the script and said oh now the games wide open
Let's be honest, when artosis titled the video "superb pvt," we all already knew terran won.
Sidenote: gotta love how beautifully arty transitions his persona from raging nerd to giddy fangirl with his streaming vs casting.
I think this might be the first time I'm seeing a late game tvp where terran has more bases
Incredible game. Thanks for casting and hosting this tournament. Im glad to see Gypsy back in a big tournament, i hope to see him play more of these in the future
TvT: Most sophisticated matchup.
PvP: I find this to be the most fun to watch.
ZvZ: Definitely the matchup that makes me laugh the hardest
For me TvZ and PvZ aré the Best
@@blazewarTV Artosis was speaking about mirror
PvP most fun, really ? For me it's the opposite. I'd rather watch ZvZ
TvT is so good.
TvT is a weird one. The position jockeying and fac count openings can be interesting but I tend to find it either goes far too swingy i.e. one person gets caught out or gets ko'd by builds/ scout rax gets bad luck picked off and suddenly you're down 2 factories, or the game devolves into a back and forth grind that just gets boring watching siege lines pick one or 2 tanks here and there and just shift around a bit. I've been playing around with the idea for mass sci vessel/tank for defense matrix unsieged tank pushes and would love to see someone with better execution than me try it out just to see it.
"7 carriers is a pretty good number. 8. 9. 10. 11. 12. 13. 14. 15. 16. 17. So on and so forth is better. But 7 is better than all the numbers below it." - Artosis
The great revelation that 6 < 7 < 8.
Long time didn’t see Gypsy play. I liked his style. At the first 4 mins, Bonnet gave him a hard time but he survived. What an intense match up! Loved to see strong players compete each other. Thank you Artosis for bringing the ascension competition!
What a great game, a proper struggle between two master players
I wonder why Terran don't go for any of the following when facing Carriers:
1. EMP - with one EMP you can bring down all the shields of the whole carrier group. It makes them easier to pick by Goliaths.
2. Battlecruisers - with Yamato you can hit them from far away, where they are protected by Goliaths and tanks.
3. Clocked Wraights - if you snipe observers you can pick few Carriers before they go back to some other detection.
As far as EMP goes -- the shields on the carriers don't matter _that_ much. Obviously very nice to take down shields, but since shields is expensive to upg, those upgs will be far behind the mech atk upg, and since shields are also a lesser part of the hp of a carrier, they go down almost immediately anyway. Since you always focus fire carriers with your gols, the fact that the whole group is emp'ed becomes irrelevant. Nice, but since vessels are very snipable by carriers as well, it's not great.
If you wanna get enough BC's to yamato down a carrier fleet, you need a ludicrous amount of time and money. The toss has the expansion advantage, and they can feasibly start producing carriers before you, so they will always be way ahead of your BC count. If you _do_ take the time and money to make a fleet... then the toss will just use speed advantage and wreck bases wherever your fleet isn't. And if you just go for their main? Carriers snipe two CC's, run back to defend against your BC's, you start trading and with their spawn advantage and your new eco deficiency, they will outlast you.
I think wraiths are a really good addition against carriers. The problem is that if they mix in literally just a couple more observers (having a couple of trailing obs on follow or something is really good, so as to make it hard to snipe all of them) and three corsairs, your wraiths immediately become bad. Having just a handful to avoid getting wrecked by sair splash is not that good either when you're a bit into the game, cus upgs. If you don't upg your wraiths, then they will be ineffective cus the toss sure as hell will upg air. If you upg and use only a few wraiths, it's too expensive to be viable, and if you go hard into wraiths, again, wrecked by sairs.
1) The point is shields are deleted in 5 shots anyway. He had 0 shield upgrades.
2) Battlecruisers take too much time to make.
3) Wraight's range is like 1/2 of Goliath and even Goliaths couldnt take out all observers.
Gypsy went for some kind of map split with patrolling armies like terrans sometimes do against arbiter gateway style, which is insane.
The scan usage and general awareness were brilliant as well, the carriers were pinned at all times.
GG
Lmao Artosis on fire this cast, love it
Great game. Amazing cast. Looking forward to more from Gypsy.
That was a really good game! Looking forward to a rematch soon!
Sweet Jesus, Bonyth went through several Terran's generations of families with those 11 carriers.
Terran's recruiters are gonna start working 3 shifts to replenish those numbers.
I was at the edge of my seat the entire game - that was the most perfect micro from both sides. That game was spectacular!
RT is the best SC commentator! He guessed the killed tank count really amazing.
First game I’ve seen Terran hold against a full control group of Carriers normally they can never get enough Goliath’s and get steam rolled but that was genuinely fun to watch
Arty! Gypsy is definetly best Terran out of Korea for sure, as u state, his mechanics and macro, building placements, reading the maps are on different level. Love to watch it
That was a HELL of a game! Awesome.
Thank you Artosis
Love that shout-out to Geoff "iNcontroL" Robinson. RIP, brother.
No interceptors were -harmed- spared in this game!
What a treat of a game! I cannot believe the micro on both sides.
Both players playing really well this game
If bonyth hadnt lost his first reaver he might have been able to win the game
Brave Leonidas and his 300... carriers.
That was legendary defense with carriers.
Bonyth's so good at making Carriers. Very useful talent to have.
Great match overall, very entertaining and nail-biting towards the end. Wraiths could have caught Bonyth by surprise, but it would have been a big risk from Gypsy, so I don't fault him for going mass Goliath instead. Felt like a safer bet.
man... really wanted to see one lockdown... lol
Hey artosis, I was actually so happy that you cast the games here without your usual saltiness. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy it every now and then and watch your other channel too. Watching BW however, is part of my wholesome self care routine and I love that you contribute to the BW community by sharing your knowledge in a neutral way as well. I hope you are willing to keep your neutrality and positivity in these casts.
Cast Artosis Is always pretty chill. Game artosis is the salt mine, it's an act he does for twitch audiences
Watching Gypsy struggle against Bonyth's 12+ Carriers is such a world away from watching Mihu shut down Bonyth's 12+ Carriers in the BSL finals. Apart from having higher APM, one of the key differences was the consistent EMPs Mihu landed on the entire carrier group, then running at them with Goliaths to pick off one after another until they dwindled from 13 Carriers to I believe 4 or 5.
that game was so fucking good, so impressed by Bonyth's engages... and somehow Artosis casted even better than usual, right in that sweetspot of analytical, salty and funny. Truly enjoyable.
These clips only show up in the morning on my feed
What a banger of a game!
Those last games on terran early loses have one thing in common, in my opinion. Terran fights in the dark without any vision, while bonith chills with observers on top the terran army. I think either vessels or at least some wraiths for scouting. I'm not sure how bonith lost the game, by letting terran take the map.
what a game. what a cast
Damn good game!!!
Amazing match
Needs more Artosis telling me how dumb I am unless I agree with him
25:30 this was the last chance for protoss to win, he needed to take out a couple of terran expansions to have a chance. Everything after that was just prolonging the inevitable.
Quite bizarre how Bonyth didn't make probes. He was at like low 40's and had the opportunity, but nope. I guess he must've just forgotten.
That moment when a game between two foreigners is way better than literally any given game from the last ASL season. GG
Counting wit Artosis
RIP Geoff
I do wish gypsy had gone wraiths when he had big eco. Just a few stealthed ones to mass in the back drop
Very risky and double-edged strat. If protoss has his carriers escorted by many observers you're basically done for. And even if he has a few obs, your wraiths go down very quickly if you whiff.
Wraiths cost 150 min and 100 gas whereas goliaths cost 100 min and 50 gas. You're very gas-starved when you fight carriers.
He had enough econ to do a ridiculous battlecruiser transition, wraiths are a desperation play not something you do when you have such strong econ rolling. But it was obviously way safer to just keep rolling with goliaths since he had em 3/3 pretty quick. When a protoss player leans that heavy into carriers it's the only time BCs are viable. Lots of dangers going BCs vs protoss though...dark archons make a real mess of them.
ZvZ: all about control and balls, as RTS should be.
TvT: chess for people who want build order victories in their chess.
PvP: exists so that only one Toss makes it to the ro8. The victor plays against Zerg.
If you go carrier, you should go Corsair dweb. That makes both terran and zerg pretty much defenseless against your carriers - goliaths, missile turrets, hydras, spores, nothing shoots. Yeah you can try to micro out of the webs but while you are doing that the interceptors are carving up your army. Corsairs can get 2 dwebs off when at full energy, so if you have 6 following your carriers around basically nothing can touch you - not scourge, not wraiths, not mutas. Only threat is from rival protoss players with storm or scouts!
at 28min mark Gypsy playing on 390apm, that is fucking massive improvement, hats down TERRAN KING
No disruption webs? Not the bonyth we know against mihu lol
I need to see the units killed tab
I really like your commentary, Artosis. You display much deeper knowledge of the game than many others and you do this while keeping it easy to understand.
However, I would really appreciate it if you slowed down the camera movement
I'd love to see more terran players go for sky terran in the ultra late game like this🥰arty loves to talk about how nothing outscales carriers, but they do pretty crappy dps and will lose in a straight up fight vs battlecrusiers and/or wraiths? the big downside is that both those units are pretty hard countered by templar, but imagine even just a pair of battlecruisers picking off carriers with yamato cannon whenever they try to abuse terrain!
someone in the last ASL went for a cloaked wraith killsquad to great effect too, which like. yeah if you can pick off the observers that's basically GG
Bonyth sensed the danger of that and churned out like 6 obs near the end, he would have crushed a wraith play. BCs on the other hand..would be extremely strong vs such a carrier heavy protoss. Storm really isn't that good vs BCs..it's the dark archons that can make a mess of them. Storm hurts no doubt but BCs can be split and like you said yamato is the bane of carriers. The issue is doing the transition into them since you'll be very weak for several minutes even if you build 3 starports to get 3 BCs at a time. You also need to keep the BCs alive long enough to get that energy..and dark archon feedback ruins the whole thing.
glad to see goliath beating carriers for once
50 supply of carriers can beat double their supply of goliaths. Even more so when those goliaths insist on not focus-firing the actual carrier and instead hitting the interceptors.
Probably one of the best TvP I've ever seen up there with some of flash games. Wow.
I think surprise valk switch could be really good for gypsy as carrier counts start to grow just to plow all the interceptors like 2 groups of interceptor 1 shotting to stagger.
Nope. It just doesn't do damage. Details in the game mechanics basically leads to "AoE doesn't kill interceptors".
8:20: me if I get attacked by even one unit lol
Should he be going for ghosts and earlier this game? Or vessels with shield disruption?
A few ghosts mixed in would have been awesome, but you need some luck to pick off the obs so your ghosts can get close enough to lockdown.
Damn cucumbers are so hard to deal with! gg.
Pvp is actually good because the rock paper scissor gameplay is fun to watch
How big is Aiur? Because they warp everything from the Motherland so I'm just curious how many Toss are sitting in the pub having a pint then all of a sudden get warped to battle
Artosis: Let's watch the game a bit and see how it unfolds.
Me: No shit Sherlock 😂
I am floored at how close this game was despite Gypsy having nearly twice as many workers as Bonyth for nearly the entire game. Carriers look so infuriating to play against.
So freaking satisfying to see Carriers lost to Terran!
"One that i would definitely curse about on ladder" lel
Yay! another Protoss player with a huge throw.
Hahahah... "Protoss armor Carapace"
Focussing the tanks with the reaver early on instead of just auto-attacking 2 units and killing with 1 dragoon shot each... That killed his potential far too much this game, then loses the shuttle reaver for some S.C.V.s, would have just went back into the main he has no turrets there and if he sieges to defend the natural you quickly drop and shoot. You also split his army between his main resources and pushing out into the natural.
Count carriers with artosis 1, 2, 3, 4, 17 and so on
Is it not worthwhile to put a shield battery in your base to help keep the Carriers' shields up?
not really no, their energy gets depleted so fast, mostly they'd just be taking up space
6:20 Two reaver shots didnt kill that last tank?!?
Why didn't gypsy make vessels for EMPs against carriers?
I would love for Bonyth to replace lost drones sometimes, feels like a lot of games he gets down to 40 and never rebuilds.
Why does the terran not focus on sniping the carriers with the Goliaths instead of fightinh the interceptors? He had a few occasions for that and did nothing.
why not ghosts for lockdown?
That was incredible to watch.
Wonder if Bonyth might have turned it around if he had spent more on air upgrades, think he only had +1 attack and nothing else while the goliaths were all maxed? Then again, probably didn't have the breathing room for that.
What are you talking about? Carriers have maxed attack upgrades.
11:07 +1 attack finished
17:30 +2
22:23 +3
25:41 +1 armor
@@i077 Thanks, was trying to look back after I finished watching but couldn't spot it
guess there was no time or money for +2 armor
Whenever I see almost pure Carriers I wonder if Valkyries would be such a bad choice. Goliaths seem to struggle a lot against them.
It's only because he's fighting the God of carrier micro.
Press F to pay respects to InControl.
How much of bonyth success is due to proper observer management?
A single squadron of wraiths. That is all I ask.
Is it just me or is gypsy not firing a single shot at these carriers and only going for the interceptors? Is that how you do it?
Why the goons have no range?
Bonyth probably died because of the robo cheese.
there are chapters 👍
I dont get why didnt he made 4-5 Valkuries to add . Most of the times the Carries ware pulling away and only havin 1 interceptor left. Thats the time to hit them. He surved that long because the Goliaths can run that fast.
I feel like a tech switch into Lockdown or Wraiths or EMP way earlier would have probably ended it so much sooner. With that amount of income, whats stopping you?
Vessels would die before they got close enough to the carriers, same with ghosts. You would need a good amount of luck to pick off all the obs or catch the carriers in a bad position.
Damn! Bonyth could have won if the reaver didn’t die. What a game!
Carriers outscale everything? 200 supply of carriers versus 200 supply of Marine/Medic on attack move... who wins?
Psi storm crushes that though and he had psi storm. Marine/medic isn't even a consideration against a high level protoss.
Rip incontroL
@18:22 2+2 ?
Carrier deniers in shambles
I like ZvZ but when it comes to Brood War I am definitely Very Stupid.
Whyd you have to remind us incontrol was gone :(
Against High Temps and Carriers why would a pro Terran not get a single EMP vessel the entire game while maintaining 2500+minerals
Emp doesn’t matter unless if they’re going arbitors. Vessels are very dead as soon as they get anywhere near a goon carrier force and emp is low range slow firing. Emp can be ok against templars if they’re bunching up for a recall but otherwise it’s not.
@@charlescook5542 just figured it's helpful against stopping pSi storms raining down on you. So you're saying there's no possible way to beat Protoss is what I'm hearing.
BIG GYP p0g
I dont care what ppl say,gypsy must be at korean lvl ,and also the caster🙃
Gypsy lucking out
WHAT A GAME. Wow. Also - just make BCs. Also - In the start, the Terran player experienced almost game-ending assaults by a reaver and several dragoons - which all of them could have been neutralised by siege - which he cancelled for some weird reason. That said - he probably couldn't have gone BC because of the low gas income during the entire game - so Golliaths was the way. Sheesh. Well played in the end. Wonder what Valkyries could have done against Carriers.
i never seen a ZvZ/TvT/PvP in sc1. would love to tho
TvT is the most interesting mirror, ZvZ is fun because its quick and dirty, and PvP sucks IMO lol
I don't understand, this guys plays SC all day and still can't understand he could snipe half the carriers with a few wraiths?,he had so many resources floating, he could've easily built a few starports