The electric grid is quickly moving away from coal and toward natural gas, solar, and wind power. We really need to stop referring to EVs being charged with coal.
They're using coal as the worst example, they know full well that the grid is quickly moving to 100% solar, wind, hydro + battery storage and that coal, gas and soon, nuclear is and will continue to phase out.
@@byGDurJust remind me, how do you make them batteries? What's the chassis made out of? How many non recyclable parts are contained in the typical EV? EVs might be good for local air quality but hideously bad for everyone involved during its manufacture.
@@mrslowly9985as compared to gas and diesel vehicles that need a portion of their operating mass replaced every few thousand miles, even after all of the casting and machining goes into the parts and extracting and refining goes into the fuel and motor oil
@@byGDur My energy COOP buys it's power from multiple sources, coal being a small slice, gas bigger, but a third is renewables. I have read now that the current data states that even if it were %100 coal, the amount of pollution going into the air would be less from modern electrics than if same folks drove ICE. This is due to the efficiencies now incorporated in newer EVs, to include regenerative braking, which puts energy back into the battery to slow the car down. That function would be meaningless to ICE powered cars.
@@EVRealFacts Doesn't take an hour to charge my car either. Normally I stop for a coffee and or food and charge at the same time. I agree it adds more time to a long trip than with an ICE car but would I go back to ICE? Never!
I once calculated approx how much gas we could hold at all gas stations, and total gas to fill every gas car registered in America, and average time per person to fill. We have enough gas to fill about half the cars in America, and we would have 7+ hour wait to fill our cars. Using the absolute model (like all EV's charge at the same time argument), we don't have the infrastructure for gas cars.
Most Tesla owners recharge overnight according to an owners' club. In central NJ, a solar roof co. says that with batteries or using the battery in your EV, you can power your home from a solar roof and perhaps your car depending on roof area and cloudiness..
@@gregrehkemper8196 something else to consider is it the most usual use case for electric vehicles is that they charge only about 40 mi worth of range per day. Which is about 10 kilowatt hours, or about a $1.20 average per day, about $8.40 per week. And I pay about $30 per week for the same amount of gasoline. And I spend 10 minutes more per week at the gasoline station filling up my car. So it's about $1,000 a year cheaper and 10 hours less of my personal time. For now, it makes more sense for me to finish out my gasoline car but only because my car is so old and new cars have gotten so expensive. But when it is time to buy a new car, there is no way I'm buying a gasoline vehicle.
What you need is a Tom Cruise disaster movie where he owns a Ford F150 lightning and gets caught in a Tornado outage, has to use it rescue a few people and get to safety, and then needs to work out how to get it online and powering the house for a week. That’d persuade quite a few people that EVs might just be useful
There was a pretty good Tesla moment in The Affair in season 3-4. Giant wildfire in CA. Including the classic line ‘Doesn’t this car have some kind of …..’ and shot of ‘Bioweapon defense mode activated’ ‘Thank you’ Very amusing and think we might see some more in the next couple of years.
It may be smart if the truth for battery vehicles are exposed instead of the lies being spread. Most folks do not want these clown cars as it wastes resources and time!
@Waste of resources? How about the waste of resources caused by climate change due in part from the consumption of gasoline! Not to mention the waste of our tax resources in billion on top of billions in government subsidies to the fuel & gas industry. Can't wait for your comments when the cost of fueling your ICE vehicles become financial unsupportable!LWRC
Depending on the state of charge before the tornado, driving it and powering a house for a week might be a tough call. Unless of course Tom has a diesel or gas generator handy to recharge the Lightning. Oh, wait. Maybe all you need is the generator.
The best tribe to belong to in our times is the laws of physics and thermodynamics tribe. It accepts any new member without question. Its laws cannot be overwritten by a theological supreme judicial junta. No nation can escape it's control. Its not dualistic. It has a remarkable ability to resist misuse. All life bows to this tribe in reverence.
Lovely statement and in many ways just part of a larger argument that ultimately all questions have to be adjudicated by some version of the scientific method. I wish that all life actually pledged fealty to scientific principles and the laws of nature. Unfortunately, we mostly pledge fealty to wishful thinking, dominance striving, and the devaluing of those other tribes because everybody knows we are not like them. Most troubling of all, that kind of tribalism concedes control and influence to psychopaths like Hitler, Putin, and Trump.
@douglaswatt1582 You really think Trump is the bigger psychopath than Biden, Warren, AOC and their like? He's a bit full of himself but then he's been successful in many fields and even dodged a bullet. Apply the scientific and reasoned method to the last few years, like Elon has done, and you will reach a very different conclusion (I changed my mind on this- it's not flip flopping, it's called changing your mind when you realise you've been mislead by fake media)
So true. Germany has spend over half a trillion on solar and wind and all they got is 1.3% of their total energy from solar PV and 3% from wind. Of course the share of electricity is higher but who cares, right? Energy is energy. Now that they shut down CO2-free nuclear the share of fossil fuel in making electricity went up by a lot. Turning off one source of energy does not make some solar panel magically produce more somehow. The laws of physics just simply apply.
My sister asked me what sorts of things I had to do to get my Tesla ready for a long trip. This was my response: ---‐---------------- Did pre-trip maintenance on my Tesla yesterday: • Add Nitrogen to the tires • Topped off the windshield washer fluid • Waxed the spark plugs • Polish all the platinum beads inside the Catalytic Perverter • Rotated the oil • Added blinker fluid • Tweaked the Turbo Encabulator • Adjusted the warp coils • Aligned the Dilithium Crystal • Ran a Level 3 Diagnostic • Flushed the Browser Cache Dang, if I knew it would be this much work I would have bought a Ford .....actually, only ONE of those items is true - the others I might have made up.... Windshield Washer Fluid! That's the only regular maintenance I ever need to do. Wiper blades every 2 years too.
We import a lot of electricity from Canada. 52 terawatt-hours in 2022. Hydro-Québec has 37 gigawatts of hydro electric dams. They export a lot of power to NYC and New England. Another $6 billion "Champlain Hudson Power Express" power line is being built for NYC.
US coal mining isn't what it used to be, thousands of jobs have been replaced by strip mining also known as mountain top removal in West Virginia. The PJM electric market is blocking renewables with antiquated queue requirements and keeping coal plants on the grid with expensive capacity payments that pay coal plants to be available but not run, using them like a battery, instead of just installing actual batteries! We won't see a change in the grid until we see a change in the Greed!
welcome to the reality of American politics. Everyone gets 1 vote but corporations are now considered people that can donate millions to campaign funds, while also NOT people when it comes to paying taxes. %90 of congress are now puppets of corporate America and could give a shit about the needs of real folks, so they use their money to invent boogeymen to sway our votes and keep these corporate grifters in power. Donald Trump does it openly and it has been very good to him.
@@TuttleScott Then why not buy your fish from the supermarket? Nobody eats fish from rivers in UK unless it's from areas that don't have agricultural run off. Most coarse fish are bunged in a keep net, weighed if on a competition, then returned whence they came. The idea of fishing is not to catch fish but as an excuse to get out of the house for as long as possible. Once home the angler immediately "takes the dog for a walk", down the pub. Then there's always the allotment for emergencies, or a "garden or potting shed" if the council waiting list is too long. (Interesting facts ... the most popular sport in UK is coarse fishing. This is despite most anglers not catching that much. The second most popular pastime is being a Mason. The more astute will have identified the common thread in these activities. In fact it may be said that angling and being a Mason has saved many more marriages than is generally recognised."
Re Ben's comment on import/export of energy: Actually Canada exports very large quantities of electricity to the USA - mostly due to the huge resources of hydro-electric power generation available across the country.
Robert, Ben said the right-wing party in the UK are the Labour Party. That may be true, but they took over from 14 years of the extreme right-wing Conservative Party… and you didn’t tell Ben any of that.
I really enjoyed this podcast. I had the pleasure of briefly chatting with Ben at a Supercharger station in Carlsbad, CA just when the network became open to Rivian. I have owned a Model S and a Y but I am one of those rare outliers (I guess) who decided to go with something completely different and now own the Lucid Air Pure. It is an amazing car and you're right in that most people go..."never heard of it!". It will also be able to use the Superchargers in 2025. I absolutely credit Tesla with accelerating the move to EV's and still think they are very nice cars but absolutely love the Lucid Air. I did first look at the new Model S, The MB EQS as well as BMW, Hyundai, Kia, Audi, & Porsche and after comparing the efficiency, range, ride and cost, went with the Lucid (the front trunk is enormous!). I am now leasing it for a short time to protect against depreciation and the company possibly having a real downturn. You're right in that the Lucid Air is usually not in most EV buyers radar but I do think the Lucid Gravity will be very popular. I also have the Rivian RS2 in the back of my mind as they are another car brand I really admire and will look forward to its launch. Thanks again!
Ben Sullins said "We don't import electricity from .... Canada ...". Oh yes they do. BC Hydro is an integral part of the electric grid that runs all the way down the west side of the USA and Quebec Hydro is a major supplier down the east coast of the USA.
And, if the guest was ignorant of the imported Canadian power what else did he get wrong? Robert, for goodness sakes at least try to find someone who knows what they're droning on about. In fact most of your guests are not quite the thing ref their alleged expertise. Why not try to find more guests such as that Yasmin Ali? There again some putative knowledgeable guests might steer well clear of your platform for fear of being recognised by their peers? Come on Robert at least try to up your game and start on the hydrogen vehicles we see becoming more popular. Whether you know this or not but we see more hydrogen powered buses entering service in UK, in five cities no less. Why not concede EVs can refer to hydrogen fuel cell vehicles too. Batteries EVs are on their way out, just admit it.
There are a lot of reasons why hydrogen is not the future, the energy that goes into making the hydrogen, then you have to transport the hydrogen, which likes to escape from everything . . . It's much more efficient to have a solar panel or wind turbine put the electrons directly into the battery
@@christopherlawrence7450 Wrong on all counts. Why don't you battery huggers do some research riot to posting? Your post was merely a history lesson in a long line of history lessons. Surely you don't believe R&D ref hydrogen has "levelled out" so to speak? There again perhaps you might be wiser to contact those entities who spend billions on hydrogen research and let them know they're wasting their time. It's pointless posting on here and expecting car and engine manufacturers to take any notice. Can you do that? And if you do then please post their response.
@@t1n4444 - Perhap's the show is not showing hydrogren vehicles due to there being nothing new to show that they haven't covered already. Also, why does the show have to concede a point that they've have already made years back, a point that is just stating the bleeding obvious in the first place (the clue is in the name Hydrogen FCEV). As to why they need to admit to a fallacy of your own making and perversion, I guess you'll forever be frustrated on that particular point. Hydrogen technology simply isn't advancing - car sales have collapsed by 93% now selling only a handful of units a month, hydrogen truck manufacturers are retrenching with the number of manufacturers of battery powered trucks increasing inline with sales and government initiative gowth, similar is occuring in mass transport aswell (buses for example, 4.2% BEV and 0.1% FCEV). A few more hydrogen trial buses in 5 cities is not shifting the hydrogen uptake dial, for example TFL which purchases the majority of new buses each year (47% last year) operate only 20 FCEV buses but haven't procured a new one since 2020. However, since that time TFL have procured 677 new battery electric buses and now operate a total battery electric fleet of 1,398 (some 70 times the size of it's FCEV fleet). It's a similar picture across the UK, which has the largest uptake in zero emissions buses within Europe, and in which battery electric bus uptake is leading and taking the LIon market share. No evidence of Battery EV's are on the way out either, the UK industry figures released today shows YTD growth has increased to 10.5% (up from 9.2% YTD last month) with an overall market share of 16.8% (representing 18.5% of market share of all cars sold in July). Petrol has declined again making it the sixth month this year showing decline dropping to only 1.5% YTD growth (down from 7.5% at the start of the year), diesel continues to decline allround - Hybrid EVs have in effect replaced both Petrol and Diesel in sales.
Robert, your purple light on your right side casts a huge purple tumour onto the side of your head. A very disconcerting look. Love the show, by the way.
One thing that I love about both Robert and Ben is their enthusiasm for innovation. And their straightforward, open approach to tackling misinformation. So it is a real treat to see them together on this show. Kudos! As far as the used EV subsidies goes, I just bought a used Tesla Model Y for an amazing price, using the $4K subsidy. It was easy to do, and it really supports the adoption of EVs in the U.S.
I am looking forward to V2G . I live in Australia we are so very slow to develop this. . The previous federal government was actively arguing against electric vehicles. Even the present government seem to be very very slow to promote evs ,
George, we aren’t quite the Sultans of Sun, as you Aussies are. But here in the Southwestern US, we also have sun but not much oil.We send a lot of our state’s wealth to Texas and Alaska. With solar and wind produced in state, the taxes and wages stay in state!
@@EVRealFacts not true. It's been tested and so long as the charge and discharge rates are fairly modest (5-7KW) it doesn't cause any significant degradation.
Hey Bobby, i thought you would be interested one of the biggest tech channels, Linus Tech Tips, recently posted a video where they directly credited Scrapheap Challenge/Junkyard wars for inspiring their Scrapyard Wars series, where they compete to build the best recycled PCs. And they very much credited that with launching their channel. I'm dead sure they would love to hear form you, and would be very much down with your message - a collab on renewables for Linus' house series (he already drives a Taycan, had a Volt) might be epic, or even a Screpheap Challenge UK.
You can be for something but Not give away Trillions of dollars for it. I am for EV's when they become a economicly viable One for One replacement for Ice. I just do not want any of my Tax Money going to this. @pin65371 Remember the EV is the Future not for Today's Infrastructure.
When are you going to come either to the eastern US or Canada? We would love to have the Everything Electric Show in a place accessible to 200 million people.
Thank you, Robert and Ben. The "energy rating" stars rule would be such a common sense way to help our brains compute the actual cost of owning and running any car. Certainly the UK and Australia would find this easy to understand. Thanks again for a really, really interesting and informative discussion.
Yes I’m a conservative and I love Tesla. However, liberal vs conservative is an urban vs rural divide. Until the battery range issue is resolved, rural will be against EV mandates. When it is resolved rural will be all in since solar and wind are more available in rural areas.
It's not about "Can we separate the art from the artist", it's more like "Actions are more important than words". I care much more about the impact than what the CEO says. I'm very much in favour of Tesla and SpaceX. The companies are much much more than the CEO, thousands of times more. The impact of Tesla is a lot more than people realise. Lowering the dependency on oil has the potential of preventing many future wars and also preventing many health issues due to bad air quality in cities. Meanwhile my Tesla is saving me a lot of money on energy as now I pay for most of it including running appliances at home at 7p/kWh and drive at less than 2p/mile.
Synth, I mostly agree with you about Tesla. As rural people, we rely on Starlink, though there is also a local, slower, landline provider. We are buying a car this year, and given Musk’s increasing support for fascism andauthoritarianism, we are in the process of dumping Starlink and we will not buy a Tesla.
Can you imagine what some of the opinions of histories greatest leaders might have been. If we heard years of the the daily mental whims of George Washington or Martin Luther King or something. I think if a celebrity is on Twitter, they will garner hate.
Bought only 2 year old ICE for last several years, to save money. Going into retirement, decided we should go electric for the convenience and reliability, and to maximize battery longevity I bought new. Now two week long owner of 2024 Hyundai Ioniq 5. Have never been exposed to so many bells and whistles, and mine is just the SEL. This car is the bomb! I agree sticker shock has sway over many, but those who have researched EVs thoroughly understand the return comes over the life of ownership. Most keep their cars 7-10 years now, so calculate the difference from that! Yesterday I had to take my wife's 2012 Ford Edge in for "routine" service. Besides oil and filter, time for spark plugs.... sounds cheap enough....WRONG! The trouble taken to get to the plugs will add another $600 to the task. RIDICULOUS. The service manager is a fair minded likeable person, so I don't blame him. He says the tires are excellent, but he still needs to look at the brakes and find a popping noise from the undercarriage. I can't wait until I can get rid of this ICE - based albatross.
Buying a 2 yo EV is no issue whatsoever since they will lose about 5% of battery capacity in the first few months after being manufactured and then taper off again, at least for the NMC and NCA type of cells, LFP, and LMFP they haven't been used in electric vehicles for too long so there isn't too much data on them yet. Still, they should last at least about 2-3 times as long compared to NMC and NCA cells, but they weigh more, have less energy density, and charge slower, but they are working on it. LMFP for example, is a development of LFP and improves among all these factors But Anyway my Model 3 now has 52000 miles on the clock, is 3 1/2 years old and has lost about 7-8% of it's original capacity but most of it was in the first few month, they use NCM, Hyundai Ioniq 5 uses NMC, I think Tesla uses less Manganese in their cells to improve cost/kWh mainly, the drawback is, that the charging speed at higher states of charge isn't quite as good as with higher manganese content. But it charges up quick enough on road trips the few times a year that we need it. Anyway, have fun with your Ioniq 5, it's a fantastic car. It could be a bit cheaper, but other than that no complaints + the quality is probably a lot better than the American-manufactured Teslas, I just got mine back from the last guarantee works just today. I think there's a good 10-12.000€ of work in it already. Heatpump died, Chargerport got replaced 4 times, Charge port Cable 2 times (it was cracked the 2nd time so it caused all the issues), left headlight (horizontal adjustment was broken), wire harness from the tow hitch, wire harness from the heat pump, + a sensor + some coolant lines, wishbones front and rear, steering column and some paintwork. What I did for maintenance so far 2 sets of new tires (winter and summer), whiper blades after 3 years, although they were still good probably, interior filter and AC cleanup, wheel alignment check, and the rear brakes since they have rusted away + break fluid, front brakes gonna get done next week. So all in all I have had about 2500€ in maintenance incl. tires so far, pretty ok in my opinion. Stock brakes on Teslas a shit tho, they use low quality alloys so they tend to rust very quickly, if they put salt on the roads. So always remember to use your brakes every now and then.
@@LastWish90 Oh sure. If I need a backup in the future I would definitely consider a used EV. By then, used EVs will be based on better tech than the old ones are now. But as the tech continues to evolve, they may REALLY get the range high with batteries that are lighter and safer than ever, so that would also affect my decision.
The legacy carmakers are STILL dragging their feet on electrification precisely because they are painfully aware that EVs will dry up their after-the-sale revenue stream. Like computer printers and their consumables, they can afford to sell vehicles at slim margins or in some cases even a loss because of the incredibly lucrative parts and service business afterward. Except that goes away with EVs. So now they're trying to work out how to build more obsolescence into EVs in order to maintain their profits. Until they have that figured out, they are never genuinely going to be on the bandwagon.
Evie chargers here in Australia have just opened up autocharge. You register your car with the app/your account. You plug the charger into your car and it starts charging. No fussing with apps or rfid cards. How good is that?
You are so behind the times, it’s called Plug and Charge in the rest of the world and we’ve had it for ages IF you sign up to it or your car is compatible
Ben’s observations on the Behavioural Economics involved are just spot on. I’ve driven my car 27,000 miles in one year. How much would I have had to spend on servicing if it were a performance but basic BMW please someone? (Because I’ve had to pay £22.50 to get a slow puncture fixed…..)
Tesla had the brains to realise it was the charging away from home that made the difference. So they built the supercharger network. Here in the UK only this year are we getting close to having good Rapid charging at most places you need so that you do not need to plan anymore. Yes the cars are now good too but most other manufacturers have caught them up, and driving prices down. If Tesla did not build the charging then BEV would never have happened. So thank you Tesla.
Great video with lots of fantastic information. I can't believe this doesn't have a billion views. Thanks to both of you for being so awesome! Less on the "you knows" please, just to make it less irritating to listen to.
A very interesting interview with Ben Sullins, Robert, because I started watching, then looked at the time and thought, I'm never going to get through all this, but I did, very interesting :-)
The voting public is VERY much ignorant. Most people in the US haven't ridden in an EV let alone driven one. They assume the tax incentives are ripping them off when in fact they are helping support jobs for their fellow citizens (maybe even them) with a side-benefit of clean air and less reliance on imported oil. They don't realize how much they are currently paying for fossil fuel subsidies - and they don't realize that despite the US being a net exporter of crude oil - the US cannot refine it's own crude oil at scale. Most refineries were built up in the 1970s and are geared towards refining OPEC heavy-sour crude. The US crude is of the light-sweet variety which lends itself to export to other countries with the right refining capabilities. Saudi Arabia was permitted to buy out the largest refinery complex in 2017 under Trump - and - they are holding their pumping capabilities to 75% of capacity thru 2024 🤔in order to help Trump (by raising US gas prices during an election year) and helping fellow OPEC+ member Russia beat sanctions (again, by keeping crude prices higher which bolsters Russia's war economy). Moral of the story: power and politics make strange bed-fellows.
16:30 not sure if Ban knows or understands... The USA makes enough oil and gas to be totally self-sufficient but: Due to a lack of design and investment (mainly due to vested interests, shareholders/capitalism, no central planning or strategy, all the oil and gas is sold on the open market by privately owned companies, plus a lack of storage and import and export terminals), they have not built a ground-up new oil refinery since 1979, add to this they have the wrong type of oil & gas refineries to change there dirty oil & gas into clean or refined oil and gas that is usable. Hence America has to export their oil elsewhere to have it refined and then import it again as a finished product.
Not sure if @QALibrary knows or understands, is that oil reserves are just that..... reserves. Once you use them, they are gone. The United States military will run off of fossil fuels for the remainder of your life. The country that has the biggest and most thirsty military of all militaries in human history should not be interested in depleting their oil reserves. It is better to use other nation's reserves and reduce your dependency on your own reserves in anyway possible. Full Stop.
In the USA, one and five-year projected fuel costs are required to be printed on a window sticker on every new car. The estimate tends to be a bit wrong, as it is based on national fuel price averages from a few previous years. It gas has gone up or down a lot, the price will be off. But if I recall correctly, the fuel cost estimate includes info on the gas price assumed, so a person can factor in changes pretty easily.
You got the US tax credit info a little wrong. For SUVs and trucks the price limit is $80,000 to qualify for a tax credit. For cars, it's $55,000. This incentive limit was put there to help create profit on lower priced vehicles (as if those are low prices). Before those limits a $120,000 Model S Plaid with INSANE profit taking from Tesla, would have received the benefit. The benefit is described as going to the consumer, but the reality is, the car companies can charge MORE for the cars knowing that their buyers are getting a US government kickback to buy it. This in essence raises the profits on EVs. For those who don't know the gory details, US tax credit schemes can come in two flavors, refundable and non-refundable. Refundable tax credit means that everyone can take that credit regardless of income and when you file you can receive more money back than you paid in taxes. But our EV tax credit is a Non-refundable tax credit, which requires you to have enough tax burden to eclipse the $7500 to receive the full amount. So if you are low income or otherwise owe a low tax payment at the end of the year, you may not be able to take the full amount or any at all. In this way, the US EV tax credit is made only for middle class and above wage earners. Both the $4000 used EV tax credit and the $7500 new car tax credit have an upper income limit to prevent high income earners from collecting it. For a single filer, the used car credit upper income is $75,000.
"Electric cars are charged by coal/oil generated energy". Was Musk lying when he said that Tesla have sold/installed solar energy covering all produced (Tesla) cars - AND Teslas factories need of energy? My solar panels produce energy corresponding to the consumption of five electric cars in a year.
@@That-Guy_ maybe he should invest more in making his companies even better. Not wasting his time on xitter. And treating his employees better not laying them off so he can get a bigger payout?
I cancelled my order. Not sure what to buy now, probably a Polestar 2. But more realistically I’m just going to keep the Guilietta running for a few more years.
You two are taking about Musk (oh Elon oh Elon) as if he was the founder of Tesla HE WAS NOT A FOUDNER He pushed the Tesla founders out. He was the money man. That is all he ever was.
Ben, when you go to Lake Como, stay at Villa D’este because the two of you will love it. Last year, that was the location of my daughter’s destination wedding. The setting is idyllic and unforgettable. Don’t leave early because many weddings on the lake end with a fabulous fireworks show. Sorry, EVs are rare in this part of Italy.
Lake Como is beautiful. One of my favourite places in the world. We're heading down there from the UK this weekend in our Model Y. So looking forward to it.
@@richardcorns8553 Richard, your model Y will be a rare EV at Como. While there, I didn’t see another EV or charging. I hope you’ve got a good charging plan.
@@johnpoldo8817 Never had a problem in the 5 years we've been exploring the area, our Electroverers app shows well over 100 chargers dotted around lake Como. South of the lake even more so.
Trump said he likes EVs but not subsidies. I feel similarly. Esp subsidies for luxury cars. Which is still the reality today. The subsidy isn't enough to make it an economy car yet.
I dislike subsidies too, but the Chinese are looking to steal our car business with high tech quality and low prices. Ford has a nice selection, check it out. Subsides have gotten Ford into competition with the Chinese. GM may still be sleeping.
I have met RJ. He is very humble. It’s refreshing. Musk’s social disability means he can ignore criticism very effectively but also he doesn’t think of long term consequences before he tweets. Blessing and curse.
When I feel really pedantic I want all combustion to be gone and scrapped for electric immediately, but when I'm realistic I actually don't mind nice sounding bubbling petrol motorbikes and oldtimer cars, because the fumes these few vehicles produce are really so irrelevant to the climate and our health. And they could be run on fuel that's not pumped out of the ocean floor. The real danger are the billions of ICE cars, buses, trucks, trains, ships and planes, and the fossil fuel infrastructure they require.
The parallel I like is between the horse in our modern time and the few classic ICE cars that will remain in use in the future. At the time of the change from horses being the primary source of local land transport power and the car, the problem of horse manure related disease in cities was fast approaching a crisis. At the same time, most horses were valued quite low, and treated badly more often than not. When ICE cars came along they were less polluting, in the sense that their pollution was not leading directly to many illnesses. After some time, the car became the normal transport item, and the horse became fairly strictly a highly valued animal for sports use, or for other forms of pleasure, including for some owners, just being a part of the family. When this transition to EVs being the dominant power system is mostly complete, those old ICE cars that are deemed to be worth it, will remain for sporting and occasional pleasure use - and they will be highly prized for that role. But it will be seen as odd to use one to drive to work, or to the shops... just as a horse is seen as odd or inappropriate to use for a trip to the shops now. There is another parallel in terms of the infrastructure. We do not have "hitching rails" in cities to tie horses to, and farriers are as rare as the horses they service. There are few places where hay can be bought. In the future petroleum sales outlets will be as rare as hay lots. And most mechanics will not be trained to work on the very complex ICE engines we have developed - those who can will be members of an elite trade. However all car maintainers will be trained in battery, controller, and motor technology. This move to electric is just another transition to a new technology, and in the history of our time on earth there have seen several transitions. Each transition has seen the best of the old technology retained in small, yet highly valued ways.
@@John.0z "The great horse manure crisis of 1894" refers to the idea that the greatest obstacle to urban development at the turn of the century was the difficulty of removing horse manure from the streets". I had no idea that there was any problem, but I get the impression that they are safe if well cared for.
The reason Hertz is selling their Teslas is because they discovered the people who rented them had no idea how to drive them. There's nothing wrong with the cars.
Well in the USA it's 8 hrs and I must take a 30min break. But we do carry bottles of at least 800 ml for a pinch. Usually the shipper that takes over four hours to load you and with not let the drivers use their facilities.
I've never understood the people who are against EVS who point out that if they get their electricity from a coal fired plant they're not environmentally friendly. Seems an odd argument to make if you're promoting fossil fuels you would want something that needed more of your fossil fuels. We don't import coal or natural gas, but we do import oil,. So on the energy independent front...
It is on the record that Elon Musk opinion is that he is against EV manufacturers Government subsidy of any kind. There goes a whole misinformed video totally wasted. In future please, prepare yourself with the salient facts before you waste our time.
Well depends on what you call a subsidy. He was given Mass tax breaks for moving manufacturing to texas. And then that wasn't enough for him so he moved his location into the countryside to avoid paying taxes that other businesses have to pay. This is the thing about subsidies for the fossil fuel industry 2. Many of them are now structured as tax credits.
Truckers in Europe need a 45 minute rest after 4.5 hours of driving. From what I could find it seems to be 8 hours before a 30 minute break in the US, but not sure. The daily driving time is also lower in Europe with 9 here and 11 in the US. Both have some exceptions like Europe can do 10 hours twice in a week.
In Canada East Asians cut holes in the floor, drive in groups of 3 using same name only one licence so they can drive 24 hours a day without stopping. Mechanics have to pressure wash underneath before any service is done.
@@universeisundernoobligatio3283 Would get them fined pretty high doing that here. The system that is counting hours would catch this, and any modification would be detected during inspections. They do a lot of random inspections here.
We don't realise it, but the modern world as we know it today went mainstream around 1920: cars, radio, telecommunication, electrification, movies, you name it.
There was a comment made that the USA does not import electricity from other countries. This is factually untrue. Canadas power grid is physically connected to the US. Upper state New York and the US in general imports a large amount of power from Canada.
Elon Musk has long ago stated that subsidies for electric vehicles are not needed. He said that “ no subsidies are needed for any type of vehicles” he believes in an open free market He believes in free competition and if you can survive you should not be in that market. The problem comes in where Ice cars have benefited from massive subsidies over the years. He is also concerned with subsidies in other countries who want to enter export markets where there are no subsidies.
For most of us purchasing any car (new, preloved etc) means a trip to the bank - that's why the initial purchase price is important. Licensing, insuring, mainaining, operating & repairing a vehicle comes out of our monthly wages so is "less" of an issue in terms of affordability. I recently saw a YT on electric aviation - could have been a "Just have a think" insert. New battery tech will enable e-short hail flights (short haul flights constitute the majority of trips taken).
All of Lucid's models are extremely efficient, so that in itself is worth everyone getting behind. Lucid plans to produce low price, high volume, cars in the future. Their new, high-end super SUV, Gravity, should sell very well, which should help propel Lucid to the revenue levels needed to support that next model.
In reference to your conversation about bi-directional charging... Using my Tesla, why couldn't I plug a portable battery bank into my Tesla "cigarette lighter" plug to keep it charged, and essentially use my car battery to run stuff in my house as long as it wasn't using more than the wattage rating of the portable battery bank? For that matter, if I needed more wattage, why could I do the same thing but with a bigger portable battery? In other words... Use my Tesla battery to keep the portable battery charged while using it to run my frig (for example) during a power outage, thus making my Tesla (kind-of) bi-directional? What am I missing?
@@kdkd693 Please elaborate because when I was young I got my degree in electronics... back when there was CRT's and vacuum tubes, so I understand amperage and Ohms Law. Fact: I can charge (slowly/low amperage) a external battery bank using my Tesla's DC cigarette plug. Fact: I can use a portable battery bank to temporarily run an appliance. Fact: At a very low amperage, I can charge the battery bank using solar panels. Fact: The battery bank doesn't know the difference between a Tesla and solar panels. lol I have a feeling that I'm missing something with my supposed "facts".
another thing about aviation is most of the co2 emissions are from short haul flights which will eventually turn electric simply because of the lower cost.
You missed the boat on GM. GM produced the EV-1, which was the first production electric vehicle from a major manufacturer. The problem was that it was a lease-only fleet vehicle.
If you want conservatives to accept EVs, there are two limitations: never talk about a mandate to stop the sale of gas vehicles and don’t claim everyone must drive an EV to prevent climate change. Conservative disagree with these issues. EVs should not be a partisan issue. More information is available at EV Politics Project.
I just noticed a Kryten mask discreetly placed on Robert's bookshelf in the top right corner of the screen. You can take the actor out of Red Dwarf, but you can't take Red Dwarf out of Mr Llewellyn's screen, apparently.
48:07 I find this stuff about power outages so weird. I don't remember when my power last went out. Literally never in the last 5 years at least. If the U.S. wasn't so beholden to power corporations, maybe they would regulate their power grid rather better so it was more resilient...
Anyone who enjoys this channel and has the faintest interest in engineering or how to start a new EV company, should be subscribed to the Lucid Motors channel. Not forgetting of course the great interview with Peter Rawlinson right here at the end of August.
the cost of running a car for a year used to be detailed in motoring magazines many years ago...and in the UK the original TOP GEAR did features on this very subject
Ben, the Munroney sticker which is required by law for all retail sale vehicles including EVs in the USA already shows you how much money you will save by using that EV compared to the average car. For example on a BMW i4 eDrive40 it states "You Save $4500 in fuel costs over five years compared to the average new vehicle" The sticker also states "You SPEND $4250" on a 2019 BMW M2 gas car. So the Energy Guide yellow sticker has been there all along. This means anyone in a dealership can stand and compare the EV to the ICE and see those differences; however, the Elon Musk way of being disruptive, people don't see the Monroney sticker, because they don't have dealerships with cars on lots.
Canada provides a lot of electricity to the USA. British Columbia provides it from hydraulic sources (dams), Ontario from its large Candu fleet (heavy water nuclear reactors), and Quebec and Labrador from again hydraulic sources. It's a bit amazing to hear it stated so confidently that Canada does not provide Americans with electricity. In fact, Ontario generates so much nuclear power it sometimes has to pay the Americans to take excess...not often but it becomes a minor scandal whenever it happens. Candus can be throttled, but not fast enough for that.
😄Good day from GOONELLABAH, NSW! 🌏 I like Elon; I am an engineer and entrepreneur who are similar. I am 71 and applied to NASA in 1974 to be an astronaut in the Apollo Space Program. I became an engineer. I have not driven a car since 1994. I have used public transport and an electric scooter since the beginning of 2023. How far does my scooter travel between chargers? 45 kilometres. I'll embark on a six-month journey to circumnavigate Australia in two CYBERTRUCKs and a Tesla Semi, covering 22,000 kilometres at the beginning of February 2025.
Vehicle to grid is so amazingly important. I live in an apartment complex that has 1000 apartments. Everyday, all day there is at least 400 cars parked there. That is a lot of power that can run the apartments during peak times. It just makes sense. If the complex can make a few bucks from it, they will install them.
Robert, did you have an episode on Mullen Automotive and/or Bollinger Motors? I was so excited about those bricky cutesies.. and now they seem to be gone for good .. 😥
The electric grid is quickly moving away from coal and toward natural gas, solar, and wind power. We really need to stop referring to EVs being charged with coal.
Yes, and even if it is from coal, it is still the best for the environment when compared to ICE cars.
They're using coal as the worst example, they know full well that the grid is quickly moving to 100% solar, wind, hydro + battery storage and that coal, gas and soon, nuclear is and will continue to phase out.
@@byGDurJust remind me, how do you make them batteries? What's the chassis made out of? How many non recyclable parts are contained in the typical EV?
EVs might be good for local air quality but hideously bad for everyone involved during its manufacture.
@@mrslowly9985as compared to gas and diesel vehicles that need a portion of their operating mass replaced every few thousand miles, even after all of the casting and machining goes into the parts and extracting and refining goes into the fuel and motor oil
@@byGDur My energy COOP buys it's power from multiple sources, coal being a small slice, gas bigger, but a third is renewables. I have read now that the current data states that even if it were %100 coal, the amount of pollution going into the air would be less from modern electrics than if same folks drove ICE. This is due to the efficiencies now incorporated in newer EVs, to include regenerative braking, which puts energy back into the battery to slow the car down. That function would be meaningless to ICE powered cars.
Thanks for having me!
Enjoying your channel Ben.
Subscribed 👍
This video is so spot on! You guys nailed it!
For quite a while my standard reply to the "How far will it go?" has been "Further than my bladder".
@@EVRealFacts Doesn't take an hour to charge my car either. Normally I stop for a coffee and or food and charge at the same time. I agree it adds more time to a long trip than with an ICE car but would I go back to ICE? Never!
99% of the time I home charge my EV, so 99% of the time there’s no reason to stop at the fuel station…
I once calculated approx how much gas we could hold at all gas stations, and total gas to fill every gas car registered in America, and average time per person to fill. We have enough gas to fill about half the cars in America, and we would have 7+ hour wait to fill our cars. Using the absolute model (like all EV's charge at the same time argument), we don't have the infrastructure for gas cars.
interesting approach :-D, never thought about that
That's actually a really smart way to think about it!!
Most Tesla owners recharge overnight according to an owners' club. In central NJ, a solar roof co. says that with batteries or using the battery in your EV, you can power your home from a solar roof and perhaps your car depending on roof area and cloudiness..
@@gregrehkemper8196 something else to consider is it the most usual use case for electric vehicles is that they charge only about 40 mi worth of range per day. Which is about 10 kilowatt hours, or about a $1.20 average per day, about $8.40 per week.
And I pay about $30 per week for the same amount of gasoline. And I spend 10 minutes more per week at the gasoline station filling up my car.
So it's about $1,000 a year cheaper and 10 hours less of my personal time.
For now, it makes more sense for me to finish out my gasoline car but only because my car is so old and new cars have gotten so expensive. But when it is time to buy a new car, there is no way I'm buying a gasoline vehicle.
What you need is a Tom Cruise disaster movie where he owns a Ford F150 lightning and gets caught in a Tornado outage, has to use it rescue a few people and get to safety, and then needs to work out how to get it online and powering the house for a week. That’d persuade quite a few people that EVs might just be useful
There was a pretty good Tesla moment in The Affair in season 3-4. Giant wildfire in CA. Including the classic line ‘Doesn’t this car have some kind of …..’ and shot of ‘Bioweapon defense mode activated’
‘Thank you’
Very amusing and think we might see some more in the next couple of years.
Convince Ford to pay for the product placement and I bet we could get that.
It may be smart if the truth for battery vehicles are exposed instead of the lies being spread. Most folks do not want these clown cars as it wastes resources and time!
@Waste of resources? How about the waste of resources caused by climate change due in part from the consumption of gasoline! Not to mention the waste of our tax resources in billion on top of billions in government subsidies to the fuel & gas industry. Can't wait for your comments when the cost of fueling your ICE vehicles become financial unsupportable!LWRC
Depending on the state of charge before the tornado, driving it and powering a house for a week might be a tough call. Unless of course Tom has a diesel or gas generator handy to recharge the Lightning. Oh, wait. Maybe all you need is the generator.
The best tribe to belong to in our times is the laws of physics and thermodynamics tribe. It accepts any new member without question. Its laws cannot be overwritten by a theological supreme judicial junta. No nation can escape it's control. Its not dualistic. It has a remarkable ability to resist misuse. All life bows to this tribe in reverence.
Well said?
I like that
Lovely statement and in many ways just part of a larger argument that ultimately all questions have to be adjudicated by some version of the scientific method. I wish that all life actually pledged fealty to scientific principles and the laws of nature.
Unfortunately, we mostly pledge fealty to wishful thinking, dominance striving, and the devaluing of those other tribes because everybody knows we are not like them. Most troubling of all, that kind of tribalism concedes control and influence to psychopaths like Hitler, Putin, and Trump.
@douglaswatt1582 You really think Trump is the bigger psychopath than Biden, Warren, AOC and their like? He's a bit full of himself but then he's been successful in many fields and even dodged a bullet. Apply the scientific and reasoned method to the last few years, like Elon has done, and you will reach a very different conclusion (I changed my mind on this- it's not flip flopping, it's called changing your mind when you realise you've been mislead by fake media)
So true. Germany has spend over half a trillion on solar and wind and all they got is 1.3% of their total energy from solar PV and 3% from wind.
Of course the share of electricity is higher but who cares, right? Energy is energy.
Now that they shut down CO2-free nuclear the share of fossil fuel in making electricity went up by a lot. Turning off one source of energy does not make some solar panel magically produce more somehow. The laws of physics just simply apply.
We had bumper stickers in England saying.
PARTS FALLING OF THIS CAR ARE OF THE HIGHEST BRITISH QUALITY.
My sister asked me what sorts of things I had to do to get my Tesla ready for a long trip. This was my response:
---‐----------------
Did pre-trip maintenance on my Tesla yesterday:
• Add Nitrogen to the tires
• Topped off the windshield washer fluid
• Waxed the spark plugs
• Polish all the platinum beads inside the Catalytic Perverter
• Rotated the oil
• Added blinker fluid
• Tweaked the Turbo Encabulator
• Adjusted the warp coils
• Aligned the Dilithium Crystal
• Ran a Level 3 Diagnostic
• Flushed the Browser Cache
Dang, if I knew it would be this much work I would have bought a Ford
.....actually, only ONE of those items is true - the others I might have made up....
Windshield Washer Fluid! That's the only regular maintenance I ever need to do.
Wiper blades every 2 years too.
Nonsense!
@@JunkerOnDrums - Closer to "noncents" because maintaining a Tesla costs close to nothing.
@@thomasruwart1722 Yes I know - I drive EV, but not a Tesla!
We import a lot of electricity from Canada. 52 terawatt-hours in 2022. Hydro-Québec has 37 gigawatts of hydro electric dams. They export a lot of power to NYC and New England. Another $6 billion "Champlain Hudson Power Express" power line is being built for NYC.
US coal mining isn't what it used to be, thousands of jobs have been replaced by strip mining also known as mountain top removal in West Virginia. The PJM electric market is blocking renewables with antiquated queue requirements and keeping coal plants on the grid with expensive capacity payments that pay coal plants to be available but not run, using them like a battery, instead of just installing actual batteries! We won't see a change in the grid until we see a change in the Greed!
I live in WV and you cant eat any fish you catch in the rivers here. Thanks coal!
welcome to the reality of American politics. Everyone gets 1 vote but corporations are now considered people that can donate millions to campaign funds, while also NOT people when it comes to paying taxes. %90 of congress are now puppets of corporate America and could give a shit about the needs of real folks, so they use their money to invent boogeymen to sway our votes and keep these corporate grifters in power. Donald Trump does it openly and it has been very good to him.
What needs to happen is when a coal strip mine is played out. They build a solar farm on top of the old mine.
@@TuttleScott
Then why not buy your fish from the supermarket?
Nobody eats fish from rivers in UK unless it's from areas that don't have agricultural run off.
Most coarse fish are bunged in a keep net, weighed if on a competition, then returned whence they came.
The idea of fishing is not to catch fish but as an excuse to get out of the house for as long as possible.
Once home the angler immediately "takes the dog for a walk", down the pub.
Then there's always the allotment for emergencies, or a "garden or potting shed" if the council waiting list is too long.
(Interesting facts ... the most popular sport in UK is coarse fishing.
This is despite most anglers not catching that much.
The second most popular pastime is being a Mason.
The more astute will have identified the common thread in these activities.
In fact it may be said that angling and being a Mason has saved many more marriages than is generally recognised."
@@t1n4444 you're obviously someone using AI to generate fud.
Re Ben's comment on import/export of energy: Actually Canada exports very large quantities of electricity to the USA - mostly due to the huge resources of hydro-electric power generation available across the country.
Robert, Ben said the right-wing party in the UK are the Labour Party. That may be true, but they took over from 14 years of the extreme right-wing Conservative Party… and you didn’t tell Ben any of that.
Just because they're not fully on the left, as Corbin's loonies would have it, doesn't make them right wing!
I thought exactly the same. My guess is Robert didn’t catch that. Looks like it was an innocent omission. Great clarification, thought.
All depends how left you are.... I see both the labs and cons close to marxists, but then again I like freedom!
My mistake, sorry! Not well versed in UK politics over here...
@@mrslowly9985I think you like uneducated ignorance tbh.
I really enjoyed this podcast. I had the pleasure of briefly chatting with Ben at a Supercharger station in Carlsbad, CA just when the network became open to Rivian. I have owned a Model S and a Y but I am one of those rare outliers (I guess) who decided to go with something completely different and now own the Lucid Air Pure. It is an amazing car and you're right in that most people go..."never heard of it!". It will also be able to use the Superchargers in 2025. I absolutely credit Tesla with accelerating the move to EV's and still think they are very nice cars but absolutely love the Lucid Air. I did first look at the new Model S, The MB EQS as well as BMW, Hyundai, Kia, Audi, & Porsche and after comparing the efficiency, range, ride and cost, went with the Lucid (the front trunk is enormous!). I am now leasing it for a short time to protect against depreciation and the company possibly having a real downturn. You're right in that the Lucid Air is usually not in most EV buyers radar but I do think the Lucid Gravity will be very popular. I also have the Rivian RS2 in the back of my mind as they are another car brand I really admire and will look forward to its launch. Thanks again!
Ben Sullins said "We don't import electricity from .... Canada ...". Oh yes they do. BC Hydro is an integral part of the electric grid that runs all the way down the west side of the USA and Quebec Hydro is a major supplier down the east coast of the USA.
And, if the guest was ignorant of the imported Canadian power what else did he get wrong?
Robert, for goodness sakes at least try to find someone who knows what they're droning on about.
In fact most of your guests are not quite the thing ref their alleged expertise.
Why not try to find more guests such as that Yasmin Ali?
There again some putative knowledgeable guests might steer well clear of your platform for fear of being recognised by their peers?
Come on Robert at least try to up your game and start on the hydrogen vehicles we see becoming more popular.
Whether you know this or not but we see more hydrogen powered buses entering service in UK, in five cities no less.
Why not concede EVs can refer to hydrogen fuel cell vehicles too.
Batteries EVs are on their way out, just admit it.
There are a lot of reasons why hydrogen is not the future, the energy that goes into making the hydrogen, then you have to transport the hydrogen, which likes to escape from everything . . . It's much more efficient to have a solar panel or wind turbine put the electrons directly into the battery
@@christopherlawrence7450
Wrong on all counts.
Why don't you battery huggers do some research riot to posting?
Your post was merely a history lesson in a long line of history lessons.
Surely you don't believe R&D ref hydrogen has "levelled out" so to speak?
There again perhaps you might be wiser to contact those entities who spend billions on hydrogen research and let them know they're wasting their time.
It's pointless posting on here and expecting car and engine manufacturers to take any notice.
Can you do that?
And if you do then please post their response.
BC hydro imports 20% of their power..
@@t1n4444 - Perhap's the show is not showing hydrogren vehicles due to there being nothing new to show that they haven't covered already. Also, why does the show have to concede a point that they've have already made years back, a point that is just stating the bleeding obvious in the first place (the clue is in the name Hydrogen FCEV). As to why they need to admit to a fallacy of your own making and perversion, I guess you'll forever be frustrated on that particular point.
Hydrogen technology simply isn't advancing - car sales have collapsed by 93% now selling only a handful of units a month, hydrogen truck manufacturers are retrenching with the number of manufacturers of battery powered trucks increasing inline with sales and government initiative gowth, similar is occuring in mass transport aswell (buses for example, 4.2% BEV and 0.1% FCEV).
A few more hydrogen trial buses in 5 cities is not shifting the hydrogen uptake dial, for example TFL which purchases the majority of new buses each year (47% last year) operate only 20 FCEV buses but haven't procured a new one since 2020. However, since that time TFL have procured 677 new battery electric buses and now operate a total battery electric fleet of 1,398 (some 70 times the size of it's FCEV fleet). It's a similar picture across the UK, which has the largest uptake in zero emissions buses within Europe, and in which battery electric bus uptake is leading and taking the LIon market share.
No evidence of Battery EV's are on the way out either, the UK industry figures released today shows YTD growth has increased to 10.5% (up from 9.2% YTD last month) with an overall market share of 16.8% (representing 18.5% of market share of all cars sold in July). Petrol has declined again making it the sixth month this year showing decline dropping to only 1.5% YTD growth (down from 7.5% at the start of the year), diesel continues to decline allround - Hybrid EVs have in effect replaced both Petrol and Diesel in sales.
Robert, your purple light on your right side casts a huge purple tumour onto the side of your head. A very disconcerting look. Love the show, by the way.
"Its's not a tumor!"
@@B0jangle5it’s a rumour
One thing that I love about both Robert and Ben is their enthusiasm for innovation. And their straightforward, open approach to tackling misinformation. So it is a real treat to see them together on this show. Kudos! As far as the used EV subsidies goes, I just bought a used Tesla Model Y for an amazing price, using the $4K subsidy. It was easy to do, and it really supports the adoption of EVs in the U.S.
Great show with Robert and his guests as always. 🙂👍
I am looking forward to V2G . I live in Australia we are so very slow to develop this. . The previous federal government was actively arguing against electric vehicles. Even the present government seem to be very very slow to promote evs ,
George, we aren’t quite the Sultans of Sun, as you Aussies are. But here in the Southwestern US, we also have sun but not much oil.We send a lot of our state’s wealth to Texas and Alaska. With solar and wind produced in state, the taxes and wages stay in state!
Calling it government is excessively flattering?
No one is really going fast enough on V2G. It's a massive opportunity going begging sadly.
@@EVRealFacts I would use my car as a back up when the power fails instead of a generator
@@EVRealFacts not true. It's been tested and so long as the charge and discharge rates are fairly modest (5-7KW) it doesn't cause any significant degradation.
Another great episode Robert, doing such a great job bringing us really interesting stories ❤❤❤
Tesla did absolutely not start the EV revolution. It was GM and Toyota. EV1 and Prius are the cars that started it all. They were cars that worked.
What a great podcast. Thank you guys.
Keep smiling everyone
Hey Bobby, i thought you would be interested one of the biggest tech channels, Linus Tech Tips, recently posted a video where they directly credited Scrapheap Challenge/Junkyard wars for inspiring their Scrapyard Wars series, where they compete to build the best recycled PCs. And they very much credited that with launching their channel.
I'm dead sure they would love to hear form you, and would be very much down with your message - a collab on renewables for Linus' house series (he already drives a Taycan, had a Volt) might be epic, or even a Screpheap Challenge UK.
13:50 Trump says he is for electric cars while saying he will cancel all EV mandates. Hypocrisy. He speaks with a forked tongue.
Because he has no idea what he's doing.
So the only way to support EVs is by mandating them? Those mandates just make people hate EVs.
You can be for something but Not give away Trillions of dollars for it. I am for EV's when they become a economicly viable One for One replacement for Ice. I just do not want any of my Tax Money going to this. @pin65371 Remember the EV is the Future not for Today's Infrastructure.
@@ImLivinSD Tax Money is also given to big oil so is supporting ICE cars in that way!
@@ImLivinSD "economically viable one for one replacement" surely that would be about now wouldn't it?
An excellent interview.😅
Hey Robert, Great podcast with you & Ben. Can't wait for the next one! Cheers.
When are you going to come either to the eastern US or Canada? We would love to have the Everything Electric Show in a place accessible to 200 million people.
Thank you, Robert and Ben. The "energy rating" stars rule would be such a common sense way to help our brains compute the actual cost of owning and running any car. Certainly the UK and Australia would find this easy to understand. Thanks again for a really, really interesting and informative discussion.
Yes I’m a conservative and I love Tesla. However, liberal vs conservative is an urban vs rural divide. Until the battery range issue is resolved, rural will be against EV mandates. When it is resolved rural will be all in since solar and wind are more available in rural areas.
If the EV doesn't have enough range, buy something that does. Hard to beat range on the right Hybrid.
A great and intelligent chat. Loved listening thanks!
It's not about "Can we separate the art from the artist", it's more like "Actions are more important than words". I care much more about the impact than what the CEO says. I'm very much in favour of Tesla and SpaceX. The companies are much much more than the CEO, thousands of times more. The impact of Tesla is a lot more than people realise. Lowering the dependency on oil has the potential of preventing many future wars and also preventing many health issues due to bad air quality in cities. Meanwhile my Tesla is saving me a lot of money on energy as now I pay for most of it including running appliances at home at 7p/kWh and drive at less than 2p/mile.
Synth, I mostly agree with you about Tesla. As rural people, we rely on Starlink, though there is also a local, slower, landline provider. We are buying a car this year, and given Musk’s increasing support for fascism andauthoritarianism, we are in the process of dumping Starlink and we will not buy a Tesla.
Can you imagine what some of the opinions of histories greatest leaders might have been. If we heard years of the the daily mental whims of George Washington or Martin Luther King or something.
I think if a celebrity is on Twitter, they will garner hate.
@@freeheeler09it sounds like you’re cutting your nose off to spite your face.
Bought only 2 year old ICE for last several years, to save money. Going into retirement, decided we should go electric for the convenience and reliability, and to maximize battery longevity I bought new. Now two week long owner of 2024 Hyundai Ioniq 5. Have never been exposed to so many bells and whistles, and mine is just the SEL. This car is the bomb! I agree sticker shock has sway over many, but those who have researched EVs thoroughly understand the return comes over the life of ownership. Most keep their cars 7-10 years now, so calculate the difference from that! Yesterday I had to take my wife's 2012 Ford Edge in for "routine" service. Besides oil and filter, time for spark plugs.... sounds cheap enough....WRONG! The trouble taken to get to the plugs will add another $600 to the task. RIDICULOUS. The service manager is a fair minded likeable person, so I don't blame him. He says the tires are excellent, but he still needs to look at the brakes and find a popping noise from the undercarriage. I can't wait until I can get rid of this ICE - based albatross.
Buying a 2 yo EV is no issue whatsoever since they will lose about 5% of battery capacity in the first few months after being manufactured and then taper off again, at least for the NMC and NCA type of cells, LFP, and LMFP they haven't been used in electric vehicles for too long so there isn't too much data on them yet. Still, they should last at least about 2-3 times as long compared to NMC and NCA cells, but they weigh more, have less energy density, and charge slower, but they are working on it.
LMFP for example, is a development of LFP and improves among all these factors
But Anyway my Model 3 now has 52000 miles on the clock, is 3 1/2 years old and has lost about 7-8% of it's original capacity but most of it was in the first few month, they use NCM, Hyundai Ioniq 5 uses NMC, I think Tesla uses less Manganese in their cells to improve cost/kWh mainly, the drawback is, that the charging speed at higher states of charge isn't quite as good as with higher manganese content.
But it charges up quick enough on road trips the few times a year that we need it.
Anyway, have fun with your Ioniq 5, it's a fantastic car. It could be a bit cheaper, but other than that no complaints + the quality is probably a lot better than the American-manufactured Teslas, I just got mine back from the last guarantee works just today. I think there's a good 10-12.000€ of work in it already.
Heatpump died, Chargerport got replaced 4 times, Charge port Cable 2 times (it was cracked the 2nd time so it caused all the issues), left headlight (horizontal adjustment was broken), wire harness from the tow hitch, wire harness from the heat pump, + a sensor + some coolant lines, wishbones front and rear, steering column and some paintwork.
What I did for maintenance so far 2 sets of new tires (winter and summer), whiper blades after 3 years, although they were still good probably, interior filter and AC cleanup, wheel alignment check, and the rear brakes since they have rusted away + break fluid, front brakes gonna get done next week.
So all in all I have had about 2500€ in maintenance incl. tires so far, pretty ok in my opinion.
Stock brakes on Teslas a shit tho, they use low quality alloys so they tend to rust very quickly, if they put salt on the roads.
So always remember to use your brakes every now and then.
@@LastWish90 Oh sure. If I need a backup in the future I would definitely consider a used EV. By then, used EVs will be based on better tech than the old ones are now. But as the tech continues to evolve, they may REALLY get the range high with batteries that are lighter and safer than ever, so that would also affect my decision.
Yes, it's true...I bought a Megane. The thought of going back to an ICE car would be the same as going back to a steam engine..!
I have 44K miles on my 2022 Model Y with no maintenance costs other than windshield washer fluid and new wiper blades.
Love the chat about realistic charging behaviour. I think the "bladder range" could be coined as "comfort range"
The legacy carmakers are STILL dragging their feet on electrification precisely because they are painfully aware that EVs will dry up their after-the-sale revenue stream. Like computer printers and their consumables, they can afford to sell vehicles at slim margins or in some cases even a loss because of the incredibly lucrative parts and service business afterward. Except that goes away with EVs. So now they're trying to work out how to build more obsolescence into EVs in order to maintain their profits. Until they have that figured out, they are never genuinely going to be on the bandwagon.
Tesla cars are indeed incredible. They are ranked at the bottom of JD Power quality rankings for all manufacturers.
provide proof
Evie chargers here in Australia have just opened up autocharge. You register your car with the app/your account. You plug the charger into your car and it starts charging. No fussing with apps or rfid cards. How good is that?
You are so behind the times, it’s called Plug and Charge in the rest of the world and we’ve had it for ages IF you sign up to it or your car is compatible
Yes, we are definitely slow with EV tech.
@@timoliver8940 thanks Tim for pointing that out. We didn't really realise this until you stated that fact.
"We don't import Electricity from Canada" - Ya, Sullins knows nothing about electricity markets.
Not true,Quebec exports to the USA
Brilliant show 😊
Ben’s observations on the Behavioural Economics involved are just spot on. I’ve driven my car 27,000 miles in one year. How much would I have had to spend on servicing if it were a performance but basic BMW please someone? (Because I’ve had to pay £22.50 to get a slow puncture fixed…..)
Tesla had the brains to realise it was the charging away from home that made the difference. So they built the supercharger network. Here in the UK only this year are we getting close to having good Rapid charging at most places you need so that you do not need to plan anymore.
Yes the cars are now good too but most other manufacturers have caught them up, and driving prices down.
If Tesla did not build the charging then BEV would never have happened. So thank you Tesla.
Yet it's CEO doesn't seem to understand this and lets go of a a large chunk of his Supercharger staff.
Why keeping all the staff if the layouts are done, the factorys build, the processes managed
@@stefanpredl6849 so he doesn’t need to expand the supercharger network? Or plan for new models?
The US imports electricity from Canada.
Excellent show. 👍🏼🇨🇦
Great video with lots of fantastic information. I can't believe this doesn't have a billion views. Thanks to both of you for being so awesome! Less on the "you knows" please, just to make it less irritating to listen to.
A very interesting interview with Ben Sullins, Robert, because I started watching, then looked at the time and thought, I'm never going to get through all this, but I did, very interesting :-)
The voting public is VERY much ignorant. Most people in the US haven't ridden in an EV let alone driven one. They assume the tax incentives are ripping them off when in fact they are helping support jobs for their fellow citizens (maybe even them) with a side-benefit of clean air and less reliance on imported oil. They don't realize how much they are currently paying for fossil fuel subsidies - and they don't realize that despite the US being a net exporter of crude oil - the US cannot refine it's own crude oil at scale. Most refineries were built up in the 1970s and are geared towards refining OPEC heavy-sour crude. The US crude is of the light-sweet variety which lends itself to export to other countries with the right refining capabilities. Saudi Arabia was permitted to buy out the largest refinery complex in 2017 under Trump - and - they are holding their pumping capabilities to 75% of capacity thru 2024 🤔in order to help Trump (by raising US gas prices during an election year) and helping fellow OPEC+ member Russia beat sanctions (again, by keeping crude prices higher which bolsters Russia's war economy). Moral of the story: power and politics make strange bed-fellows.
16:30 not sure if Ban knows or understands...
The USA makes enough oil and gas to be totally self-sufficient but:
Due to a lack of design and investment (mainly due to vested interests, shareholders/capitalism, no central planning or strategy, all the oil and gas is sold on the open market by privately owned companies, plus a lack of storage and import and export terminals), they have not built a ground-up new oil refinery since 1979, add to this they have the wrong type of oil & gas refineries to change there dirty oil & gas into clean or refined oil and gas that is usable.
Hence America has to export their oil elsewhere to have it refined and then import it again as a finished product.
Yea dude is not that smart had to skip forward multiple times on the video ended watching like 5 minutes total.
Not sure if @QALibrary knows or understands, is that oil reserves are just that..... reserves. Once you use them, they are gone. The United States military will run off of fossil fuels for the remainder of your life. The country that has the biggest and most thirsty military of all militaries in human history should not be interested in depleting their oil reserves. It is better to use other nation's reserves and reduce your dependency on your own reserves in anyway possible. Full Stop.
Thanks
Excellent
In the USA, one and five-year projected fuel costs are required to be printed on a window sticker on every new car. The estimate tends to be a bit wrong, as it is based on national fuel price averages from a few previous years. It gas has gone up or down a lot, the price will be off. But if I recall correctly, the fuel cost estimate includes info on the gas price assumed, so a person can factor in changes pretty easily.
i like your videos Robert thanks
You got the US tax credit info a little wrong. For SUVs and trucks the price limit is $80,000 to qualify for a tax credit. For cars, it's $55,000. This incentive limit was put there to help create profit on lower priced vehicles (as if those are low prices). Before those limits a $120,000 Model S Plaid with INSANE profit taking from Tesla, would have received the benefit. The benefit is described as going to the consumer, but the reality is, the car companies can charge MORE for the cars knowing that their buyers are getting a US government kickback to buy it. This in essence raises the profits on EVs.
For those who don't know the gory details, US tax credit schemes can come in two flavors, refundable and non-refundable. Refundable tax credit means that everyone can take that credit regardless of income and when you file you can receive more money back than you paid in taxes. But our EV tax credit is a Non-refundable tax credit, which requires you to have enough tax burden to eclipse the $7500 to receive the full amount. So if you are low income or otherwise owe a low tax payment at the end of the year, you may not be able to take the full amount or any at all. In this way, the US EV tax credit is made only for middle class and above wage earners. Both the $4000 used EV tax credit and the $7500 new car tax credit have an upper income limit to prevent high income earners from collecting it. For a single filer, the used car credit upper income is $75,000.
Can’t wait to get my CCS to CHAdeMO adapter!
"Electric cars are charged by coal/oil generated energy". Was Musk lying when he said that Tesla have sold/installed solar energy covering all produced (Tesla) cars - AND Teslas factories need of energy? My solar panels produce energy corresponding to the consumption of five electric cars in a year.
That's what blows my mind. Musk supports Pumpkinhead, a guy who wants to basically run Tesla into the ground.
@@leftcoaster67
Once he became the richest person on earth (on paper) he started getting hate from the "left" and that pushed him to the right.
@@That-Guy_ maybe he should invest more in making his companies even better. Not wasting his time on xitter. And treating his employees better not laying them off so he can get a bigger payout?
@@leftcoaster67
Twitter was a bad idea.
Loved this chat. Thanks
Elon is destroying his business. I no longer wish to buy Tesla. It’s a tragedy that he has politicised such brilliant products
Exactly this. I won't fund him in any way.
@@chunderground9880 I agree .
Elon is pretty smart, maybe he knows something all us Genius don't?
I cancelled my order. Not sure what to buy now, probably a Polestar 2.
But more realistically I’m just going to keep the Guilietta running for a few more years.
@@ImLivinSD Yes he’s probably a genius, a right wing genius who supports a dictator :)
great to see Ben again. It's been a while since you showed up on my feed.
You two are taking about Musk (oh Elon oh Elon) as if he was the founder of Tesla HE WAS NOT A FOUDNER He pushed the Tesla founders out. He was the money man. That is all he ever was.
Ben, when you go to Lake Como, stay at Villa D’este because the two of you will love it. Last year, that was the location of my daughter’s destination wedding. The setting is idyllic and unforgettable. Don’t leave early because many weddings on the lake end with a fabulous fireworks show. Sorry, EVs are rare in this part of Italy.
Lake Como is beautiful. One of my favourite places in the world. We're heading down there from the UK this weekend in our Model Y. So looking forward to it.
@@richardcorns8553 Richard, your model Y will be a rare EV at Como. While there, I didn’t see another EV or charging. I hope you’ve got a good charging plan.
@@johnpoldo8817 Never had a problem in the 5 years we've been exploring the area, our Electroverers app shows well over 100 chargers dotted around lake Como. South of the lake even more so.
❤ Great conversation 👍
Great episode
Trump said he likes EVs but not subsidies. I feel similarly.
Esp subsidies for luxury cars. Which is still the reality today. The subsidy isn't enough to make it an economy car yet.
I dislike subsidies too, but the Chinese are looking to steal our car business with high tech quality and low prices. Ford has a nice selection, check it out. Subsides have gotten Ford into competition with the Chinese. GM may still be sleeping.
Wonderful! Ben is still around!
He's a grifter. Unfollowed him years and years ago.
I have met RJ. He is very humble. It’s refreshing. Musk’s social disability means he can ignore criticism very effectively but also he doesn’t think of long term consequences before he tweets. Blessing and curse.
Maybe they should block him from Tweeting, or make him sell the company as he's slowly killing it.
Waiting for my Aptera...
When I feel really pedantic I want all combustion to be gone and scrapped for electric immediately, but when I'm realistic I actually don't mind nice sounding bubbling petrol motorbikes and oldtimer cars, because the fumes these few vehicles produce are really so irrelevant to the climate and our health. And they could be run on fuel that's not pumped out of the ocean floor. The real danger are the billions of ICE cars, buses, trucks, trains, ships and planes, and the fossil fuel infrastructure they require.
The parallel I like is between the horse in our modern time and the few classic ICE cars that will remain in use in the future.
At the time of the change from horses being the primary source of local land transport power and the car, the problem of horse manure related disease in cities was fast approaching a crisis. At the same time, most horses were valued quite low, and treated badly more often than not.
When ICE cars came along they were less polluting, in the sense that their pollution was not leading directly to many illnesses. After some time, the car became the normal transport item, and the horse became fairly strictly a highly valued animal for sports use, or for other forms of pleasure, including for some owners, just being a part of the family.
When this transition to EVs being the dominant power system is mostly complete, those old ICE cars that are deemed to be worth it, will remain for sporting and occasional pleasure use - and they will be highly prized for that role. But it will be seen as odd to use one to drive to work, or to the shops... just as a horse is seen as odd or inappropriate to use for a trip to the shops now.
There is another parallel in terms of the infrastructure. We do not have "hitching rails" in cities to tie horses to, and farriers are as rare as the horses they service. There are few places where hay can be bought. In the future petroleum sales outlets will be as rare as hay lots. And most mechanics will not be trained to work on the very complex ICE engines we have developed - those who can will be members of an elite trade. However all car maintainers will be trained in battery, controller, and motor technology.
This move to electric is just another transition to a new technology, and in the history of our time on earth there have seen several transitions. Each transition has seen the best of the old technology retained in small, yet highly valued ways.
@@John.0z "The great horse manure crisis of 1894" refers to the idea that the greatest obstacle to urban development at the turn of the century was the difficulty of removing horse manure from the streets". I had no idea that there was any problem, but I get the impression that they are safe if well cared for.
Thank you Robert!👋
The reason Hertz is selling their Teslas is because they discovered the people who rented them had no idea how to drive them. There's nothing wrong with the cars.
Well in the USA it's 8 hrs and I must take a 30min break. But we do carry bottles of at least 800 ml for a pinch. Usually the shipper that takes over four hours to load you and with not let the drivers use their facilities.
I've never understood the people who are against EVS who point out that if they get their electricity from a coal fired plant they're not environmentally friendly. Seems an odd argument to make if you're promoting fossil fuels you would want something that needed more of your fossil fuels. We don't import coal or natural gas, but we do import oil,. So on the energy independent front...
LOL podcasts are quick and easy....1 1/4 hours later this podcast finishes...😁
It is on the record that Elon Musk opinion is that he is against EV manufacturers Government subsidy of any kind. There goes a whole misinformed video totally wasted. In future please, prepare yourself with the salient facts before you waste our time.
Well depends on what you call a subsidy. He was given Mass tax breaks for moving manufacturing to texas.
And then that wasn't enough for him so he moved his location into the countryside to avoid paying taxes that other businesses have to pay.
This is the thing about subsidies for the fossil fuel industry 2. Many of them are now structured as tax credits.
Truckers in Europe need a 45 minute rest after 4.5 hours of driving. From what I could find it seems to be 8 hours before a 30 minute break in the US, but not sure.
The daily driving time is also lower in Europe with 9 here and 11 in the US. Both have some exceptions like Europe can do 10 hours twice in a week.
In Canada East Asians cut holes in the floor, drive in groups of 3 using same name only one licence so they can drive 24 hours a day without stopping. Mechanics have to pressure wash underneath before any service is done.
@@universeisundernoobligatio3283 Would get them fined pretty high doing that here. The system that is counting hours would catch this, and any modification would be detected during inspections. They do a lot of random inspections here.
We don't realise it, but the modern world as we know it today went mainstream around 1920: cars, radio, telecommunication, electrification, movies, you name it.
&. I'm still watching and enjoying 😃
I have been enjoyed, so thank you for delivering.
There was a comment made that the USA does not import electricity from other countries. This is factually untrue. Canadas power grid is physically connected to the US. Upper state New York and the US in general imports a large amount of power from Canada.
Elon Musk has long ago stated that subsidies for electric vehicles are not needed. He said that “ no subsidies are needed for any type of vehicles” he believes in an open free market
He believes in free competition and if you can survive you should not be in that market. The problem comes in where Ice cars have benefited from massive subsidies over the years. He is also concerned with subsidies in other countries who want to enter export markets where there are no subsidies.
For most of us purchasing any car (new, preloved etc) means a trip to the bank - that's why the initial purchase price is important. Licensing, insuring, mainaining, operating & repairing a vehicle comes out of our monthly wages so is "less" of an issue in terms of affordability.
I recently saw a YT on electric aviation - could have been a "Just have a think" insert. New battery tech will enable e-short hail flights (short haul flights constitute the majority of trips taken).
All of Lucid's models are extremely efficient, so that in itself is worth everyone getting behind. Lucid plans to produce low price, high volume, cars in the future. Their new, high-end super SUV, Gravity, should sell very well, which should help propel Lucid to the revenue levels needed to support that next model.
In reference to your conversation about bi-directional charging... Using my Tesla, why couldn't I plug a portable battery bank into my Tesla "cigarette lighter" plug to keep it charged, and essentially use my car battery to run stuff in my house as long as it wasn't using more than the wattage rating of the portable battery bank? For that matter, if I needed more wattage, why could I do the same thing but with a bigger portable battery? In other words... Use my Tesla battery to keep the portable battery charged while using it to run my frig (for example) during a power outage, thus making my Tesla (kind-of) bi-directional? What am I missing?
Amperage
@@kdkd693 Please elaborate because when I was young I got my degree in electronics... back when there was CRT's and vacuum tubes, so I understand amperage and Ohms Law. Fact: I can charge (slowly/low amperage) a external battery bank using my Tesla's DC cigarette plug. Fact: I can use a portable battery bank to temporarily run an appliance. Fact: At a very low amperage, I can charge the battery bank using solar panels. Fact: The battery bank doesn't know the difference between a Tesla and solar panels. lol I have a feeling that I'm missing something with my supposed "facts".
I think even with TCO shown, for most people it is the upfront and monthly payment amount - that is all they are concerned with.
Buying cars is just plain stupid for the average person. It is now the largest single lifetime expense, more than housing, healthcare, or food.
another thing about aviation is most of the co2 emissions are from short haul flights which will eventually turn electric simply because of the lower cost.
You missed the boat on GM. GM produced the EV-1, which was the first production electric vehicle from a major manufacturer. The problem was that it was a lease-only fleet vehicle.
If you want conservatives to accept EVs, there are two limitations: never talk about a mandate to stop the sale of gas vehicles and don’t claim everyone must drive an EV to prevent climate change. Conservative disagree with these issues. EVs should not be a partisan issue. More information is available at EV Politics Project.
I just noticed a Kryten mask discreetly placed on Robert's bookshelf in the top right corner of the screen. You can take the actor out of Red Dwarf, but you can't take Red Dwarf out of Mr Llewellyn's screen, apparently.
Deboss Garage is working on converting full size pickup trucks to hybrid or electric, also big trucks too.
48:07 I find this stuff about power outages so weird. I don't remember when my power last went out. Literally never in the last 5 years at least.
If the U.S. wasn't so beholden to power corporations, maybe they would regulate their power grid rather better so it was more resilient...
49:41 Ben, do it! Short and in-depth
Anyone who enjoys this channel and has the faintest interest in engineering or how to start a new EV company, should be subscribed to the Lucid Motors channel. Not forgetting of course the great interview with Peter Rawlinson right here at the end of August.
the cost of running a car for a year used to be detailed in motoring magazines many years ago...and in the UK the original TOP GEAR did features on this very subject
Ben, the Munroney sticker which is required by law for all retail sale vehicles including EVs in the USA already shows you how much money you will save by using that EV compared to the average car. For example on a BMW i4 eDrive40 it states "You Save $4500 in fuel costs over five years compared to the average new vehicle" The sticker also states "You SPEND $4250" on a 2019 BMW M2 gas car. So the Energy Guide yellow sticker has been there all along. This means anyone in a dealership can stand and compare the EV to the ICE and see those differences; however, the Elon Musk way of being disruptive, people don't see the Monroney sticker, because they don't have dealerships with cars on lots.
www.bmwpalmsprings.com/inventoryphotos/3239/wby73aw05pfr37533/ip/30.jpg?timestamp=2024-07-01T11:00:46Z&bg-color=FFFFFF&width=1600
Canada provides a lot of electricity to the USA. British Columbia provides it from hydraulic sources (dams), Ontario from its large Candu fleet (heavy water nuclear reactors), and Quebec and Labrador from again hydraulic sources. It's a bit amazing to hear it stated so confidently that Canada does not provide Americans with electricity. In fact, Ontario generates so much nuclear power it sometimes has to pay the Americans to take excess...not often but it becomes a minor scandal whenever it happens. Candus can be throttled, but not fast enough for that.
I believe an ev campervan is the best solution. Slow moving "house" with inbuilt battery and possibly a nice solar array on the top.
😄Good day from GOONELLABAH, NSW! 🌏
I like Elon; I am an engineer and entrepreneur who are similar. I am 71 and applied to NASA in 1974 to be an astronaut in the Apollo Space Program. I became an engineer. I have not driven a car since 1994. I have used public transport and an electric scooter since the beginning of 2023. How far does my scooter travel between chargers? 45 kilometres.
I'll embark on a six-month journey to circumnavigate Australia in two CYBERTRUCKs and a Tesla Semi, covering 22,000 kilometres at the beginning of February 2025.
Actually, the US does import electricity. In 2022, the US imported 56.9 terawatt-hours of electricity from Canada and Mexico.
Vehicle to grid is so amazingly important. I live in an apartment complex that has 1000 apartments. Everyday, all day there is at least 400 cars parked there. That is a lot of power that can run the apartments during peak times. It just makes sense. If the complex can make a few bucks from it, they will install them.
Ben the problem with Rivian is that they only cater for the US market. Rivian cannot compete with Chinese ‘pick ups’ or utilities vechiles globally.
Robert, did you have an episode on Mullen Automotive and/or Bollinger Motors? I was so excited about those bricky cutesies.. and now they seem to be gone for good .. 😥
Does anyone knows why V2G is not allowed in the UK?
incompetence? like everything else here!