Our grandma used to say; "Always investigate a smell of burning." She wasn't thinking of jet aircraft but I think the same applies. RIP Nana RIP Swiss Air 111
I lost a close friend to suicide a few years ago. I spoke to him the night before, and something seemed like it wasn't right. I have run that conversation through my head hundreds of times over the years wondering if there was anything I could have done differently. I can only imagine what Mr.Pickerell has gone though over the years. Even if you know nothing could have been done differently, your mind always searches for a way, and it is impossible to find peace. My heart goes out to him.
Im sorry fornyour loss. Bargaining can be very difficult. Im a nurse and ive been there in many situations of 'could Inhave acted differently for a different outcome'. Please take care of yourself.xx
@@johncenator3146 Amen. 🙏 There's so much that I don't understand in this world and in this life, but the one solid rock I cling to is the fact that Jesus Saves.
I live in Nova Scotia. There was a co-worker at a job I had in the 2000's that had volunteered to assist in the recovery effort. He said he has never been the same since. The sight of recovering the body parts traumatized him. He has struggled with mental health issues ever since and talks to a psychiatrist regularly, he also said he has frequent nightmares from what he saw.
That's horrible. Sounds like the 9/11 first responders if not worse. I don't want to imagine what your co-worker experienced and saw. Imagine all the people involved in that situation and the negative affects on them. 😢
@@arcticgoddess Yeah but, you’re not guaranteed to go through PTSD. If you do then yes science tells you it can mess you up. Generally speaking Americans get horrified and devastated too easily. I’ve seen numerous horrible images of dead soldiers in Middle East and Ukraine. Sure they were just “pictures”, but I didn’t lose a pint of appetite. Some people just deal w/ it better.
The Swiss tennis player Marc Rosset was supposed to be on that ill-fated flight following his first round exit at the US Open that year but changed his plans in the last minute and stayed in New York for a little longer and notified his coach that he needs more practice, when the news of the crash hit home in Geneva he phoned his family and friends while watching the news on TV from his hotel room that he's still in New York alive and in good shape. Change of plans could save your life.
The same with R&B singer Patti Austin on September 11, 2001. She was planning to fly on United Airlines Flight 93 (a 5-year-old Boeing 757-200 built in 1996 and took off from Newark Liberty International Airport enroute to San Francisco and crashed in Shanksville, Pennsylvania) that day, but an impending stroke suffered by her mother changed plans, prompting Patti to cancel her ticket to that flight.
I’ve seen this a couple of times and this one shakes me up because I knew two very nice people that were on that plane. I sold the man two vehicles in the 90’s. Super nice guy. He would always come to my desk and hang out when in for service and his wife ran a doctors office and my wife saw the doctor and I took her a couple of times. We weren’t best friends but it shook me to this day. Very nice couple. R.I.P. Don and Diane Sheer 😢
@@ifrahabi4834 thank you, friend. You’re very kind. As I stated, we weren’t the best of friends but it shook me, knowing them both. He was a scientist and was going to some conference in Geneva, Switzerland. Super nice people, maybe in their 40’s. Shame.
@@User_92020 What are you talking about? The crew unfortunately failed to grasp the seriousness of the situation. They didn’t give ATC ANY indication that they were in an emergency situation until it was far too late. Swissair’s ludicrously long ‘checklists’ are as much at fault as anything else
Yeah given that he tried to absolve himself of his incompetency. If you have a fire onboard, LAND. LAND the JET will not break apart. You must land, Pilots and ATC caused this disaster 100% and killed 350.
I was deployed as recovery for this accident. The amount of parts and luggage we found was startling. You’d never guess a plane could be in that many pieces.
These days protocol dictates if smoke is detected, the flight must immediately divert to the nearest airport. They don’t waste a precious second. I guess lessons were learned from this tragedy.
says in the video that they would not have made it anyway, but I mean that should have been common sense protocol probable was suggested at first but opted for whatever would cause the least amount of damage to revenue.
From the time the smoke was first detected to loss of instruments was about 15 minutes and 21 minutes to impact. No matter how directly they'd tried to land, there wouldn't have been enough time. However, if they'd had, say, a little extra time, those delays may have factored in. It certainly points out how quickly things can turn to disaster and you how you need to get the plane on the ground.
@@JonahJayTaylor it doesnt say that it says if they didnt waste time in the air and landed immediately. They detected the smoke late if there was a detector they definitely would have made it
I was 3 when SwissAir 111 went down - mom told me when the plane hit the water she thought it was a loud clap of thunder. Another relative was on one of those Navy vessels that responded. They weren’t recovering full bodies. They were recovering parts. I can’t even imagine.
@@mrsx7944 Agreed. You're addressing bigdee and their smug arrogant insensitivity shoving their political religious views into everyone else's experiences, right? Agreed.
@@theultimatereductionist7592 No. I'm addressing the OP. And one comment isn't forcing religious views on you lol. Are you that weak minded that a comment by a total stranger has that much control over you? ?😂😂😂 And there was nothing "political" about the comment. Nice try.
My dad was just about sent out to this air crash to search and rescue for survivors but then was told to stand down due to it was a recovery mission my dad was a Canadian military combat medic both armed/unarmed, flight medic, and a field medic when we lived in Trenton, Ontario, Canada 1998
It was a good thing that he didn't go there. It would've been traumatic to see the bodies or what was left from them. If there were any survivors that died later, I am very sorry for them.
@LucasBoss6354 my dad has seen soo much over seas when he was deployed that he doesn't talk about it that he has combat PTSD from all his missions as an unarmed/armed combat medic
I live in Canada, Im aircrew and recall this happening . I often ask my colleagues what they think about dumping the fuel. Why didnt SA just go in heavy and not dump fuel? Its the less of 2 evils. Its unreal they dumped, and didnt get that plane down asap, given the situation. My heart breaks everytime I see this show. God rest them all.
It seemed in that the pilots were very non nonchalant about the smoke in the episode. Originally picking Boston 300 miles away instead of Halifax 60 miles away. Seems like he didn't understand the urgency of the situation.
I don't know why this tragedy haunts me... I lived in Ontario when it happened. When I was wedded at Peggy's Cove in 2004, I threw my bouquet into the ocean to honour the beloved.
For me its haunting because they had plenty of time to get the plane on the ground, and its the "safety procedures" that doomed them. Maybe when the fire broke out they should have decompressed the cabin, who knows.
Who is supposed to pay the millions per victim, though? The airline went bankrupt, so who's next -- raise the price of all tickets to cover added insurance costs? Raise taxes worldwide?
Bill, you did the absolute best you could do with all the information and understanding you had at that time and you did a good job! You can't save every patient. That's something those of us who have to deal with emergencies sometimes have to learn to accept because we are all doing the best that we can with the information we have at the time. Good job!
the thing that puzzles me with this one is they had a fire on board and they never seemed to consider they were in mortal danger. A fire can be a nothing burger or go bad very very quickly. They should have got low ASAP and close to the runway in case things started to spiral
😮 Why this episode refused to point out the time when ALL 3 of them initially stated they smelled smoke but dismissed it as the Air Conditioner, they had time to put the plane on the ground. The Captain made several mistakes with this situation, so did the ATC guy who said "Could I have done something different". The captain flies PAST Boston just because he wanted a airport he was familiar with, ARE YOU SERIOUS. If your boss tells you that your schedule will have you flying to Virginia are you gonna say "Well I'm not familiar with that airport so I'd rather take my passengers to Tennessee because I know that airport. The captain decides to waste time he doesn't have by wanting to dump fuel. The ATC tells them to turn around and fly in circles to dump fuel instead of giving them a direct approach to closest airport. The captain stays at a ridiculous high altitude wasting time when he was cleared for 3,000 feet for Gods sake. The captain turns the plane in the opposite direction of Halifax to dump fuel when his First Officer told him thats a bad idea "Lets Just Land". The captain declares an emergency so late during the event by the time he does his cockpit is a bonfire. The captains common sense never kicks in and says "I'm on borrowed time, I should get this plane on the ground now. Terrible CRM, the captain should have listened to his first officer. You have people's lives in your hands and you would rather stay at a higher altitude and fly in circles to do something that was not necessary to do. Plus the guy at the end who abandoned his wife and other family members, to use that as an excuse to leave your wife was a cowardly thing to do. You don't own the market on grief, stay and comfort your wife and family instead of running away.
I've been watching a lot of these episodes and in most of them I don't understand why the pilots don't declare emergency earlier. I know it messes up a lot of things and also there is airlines pressure as well but if you're seeing smoke means there is a fire, declare emergency and land asap.
@@SpoiledBadgerMilk Huh? What G-Forces? The aircraft was not experiencing excessive G-forces until impact. No one was unconscious when that plane impacted the sea, neither from (absent) g-forces nor from smoke inhalation as no evidence for it could be found. Luckily, no one realized the impact either nor saw it coming due to total darkness outside of the aircraft, as it happened faster than the brain could have processed anything. They were in a dive until suddenly, it was all over.
I'm not a pilot. That said, I've wondered why pilots don't immediately get the plane down as fast as the airframe will allow. If there's smoke in the cockpit, there's a fire - or at least something smoldering somewhere. Regardless. Get down now. No?
IMHO this is incredibly criminal neglect, in the Apollo 1 accident in 1967 there was a fatal fire that was fumed by flammable material within the capsule. Now many decades later, there is no collective learning from this and there is highly flammable material in critical parts of the airframe structure ... WOW 😵💫 In my opinion McDonnell Douglas and Swissair stand clearly responsible for the tragic death of 229 people. My heart cries out for the families, friends and relatives 💔
If I could have a place anywhere on the planet, it would be Halifax. I have never been there but the peaceful look just stole my heart. Not to mention, I think Canadian's are awesome.
I've been in a house fire, in 2 minutes the entire ceiling was on fire and thick black smoke was down to waist height. I can't imagine being in a plane on fire with no immediate way out. RIP to all the victims 💕
RIP Flight 111. Lesson: on an airplane, where there is smoke, there is fire. At the first sign of trouble, they should have kept looking for the source and if they couldn't find it after 5 minutes, start your landing protocols and keep looking. I'm not a pilot, just someone who thinks that if something seems wrong, there probably is something wrong especially on a flying piece of metal that you hope others had put together correctly. Again, RIP to the crew and passengers, condolences to their families and all those affected by that tragic event.
Same issue as always.. There is a lot of money lost when they do any type of landning. Esp unplanned ones . The preassure is on the pilots, higher up from the company due to the enormous costs involved. And then we see how often the same people who makes all the bad decisions, always try to blame the pilots when something bad happens..
It's a problem if you over react or under react. I think they followed proper procedure but the fire spread way too fast, after they realized something WAS actually Burning. So sorry for the lost lives and familys and those who helped recovery and now suffer trauma!! Excellent detailed presentation of this sad & horrific malfunction and loss!!
@@kevinlynch1227 Thing is... if you look for a source of fire and easily find it, THEN you can make an easy decision, but if you CAN'T find it? ...... too much risk to stay int he air.
When it comes to airplane fire, this keeps happening. The problem with airplane fires is that the pilots cannot think about the source of fire because it is agreed upon that after the first 20 minutes, you almost always will lose the airplane.
It's terrible to think the last moments of everyone despite being in the same situation, are so far apart. Air travel is more safe but it is always a bitter pill that it's modified from the loss of innocent lives
it's good that this video has been uploaded that many times so the public can stay informed. Also too Honor the victims and to keep people from forgetting. R.I.P to everyone who lost their lives in this tragedy.
Terrible tragedy. A woman that I directly worked with for years was on the flight. She was traveling to join her husband for a European vacation. They had only been married for a few months.
I know a Swiss airplane engineer who had full access to all data of flight SR 111. He us convinced that an immediate descent ("the only option is this situation"), with fuel dumped immediately, maximum speed and of course no levelling off could have saved the plane and the people on board.
I was on a flight once and alerted flight crew to some smoke smell from entertainment system and I remember first officer even coming back to check it out everything turned out okay fortunately.
I was born in Nova Scotia currently live in the United States since I was about four years old. My brother and I are planning a trip back to Nova Scotia and I want to visit his restaurant SHAW,’s landing.
Excellent information and narration. This is a very tragic story. Condolences to the families of the deceased and the loved ones. I salute the father who opened up a restaurant near the bay just to be close to his daughter who was a victim of this tragedy. I being a father myself can understand his feelings. More power to you Sir...
This was a very sad and unfortunate accident. While l am not blaming the pilots, it baffles me why they didn't desend quickly to 3,000 feet considering the emergency situation, but choose to stay at 8,000 feet for cabin clearance. Surely, descending quickly was a priority given the emergency situation. May all their souls rest in peace🙏
This is by far the most terrifying and horrific flight ever. The fact that even if everything would have been done perfectly, they still wouldn't have survived... and that only 1 body was intact. All of this just from a faulty IFE-system, insane.
No, this is new. Mayday has cursed hundreds of air disasters to recur like Groundhog Day. The pilots and passengers must relive the horror every year or so in horrific perpetuity. I think us viewers have got it lucky.
The check list for fire said turn off air con in the cockpit. It was this which was fanning the flames back over the passenger cabin. Once this was turned off the flames concetrated over the cockpit. Leaving the ac on, may have given them more time, but they didn't know this... tragic.
1:12-1:15 What caused the fire IS NOT a mystery. IT WAS unknown (not even a mystery) at the time. Today everybody knows what the cause was. These documentaries have an inordinate fondness for the word mystery, which gives kind of religious atmosphere to the stories they tell. Some small quirks apart, it is an excellent documentary. They took too long, FGS, they took too long. The Captain was following company's policies, but that doesn't change the fact that he took too long. It's so heartbreaking.
That ATC reminds me of a time when I was a kid and almost cut my thumb off. It was bleeding pretty bad but we had been almost ready to have dinner when it happened and my Dad said "well we might as well eat before we go to the hospital".
I travelled on this Swiss Air flight in the mid 1990s so often I'd have to look up how many times I flew from NY to Geneva. It's pretty terrifying to think about but I have to say I never felt more secure on a plane than when I was taking Swiss Air in those days.
One of the lead investigators claimed there was ample evidence of an incendiary device on board the aircraft, but this information was suppressed by TSB Canada.
Just the smoke in the cockpit is automatically an emergency. It does not have to be a fire. It directly effects the pilots capacity to perform. If the smoke gets worst they will not be able to see anything even with the mask on. The cockpit door should have been kept open.
I have read this case many many times but still cant understand capt zimmer logic to dump fuel before landing becoz the aircraft was burning and he should have moved to airport irrespective of the fact the aircraft was heavy on fuel or not
Don’t u understand it was already determined that even if he headed straight for the airport at the first sign of a problem he would have stilled crashed 3 minutes of the runway killing many more people on the ground 💁♂️🤦♂️
Canada is home to the greatest tragedies in history... Titanic, Titan, Swissair 111, Ocean Ranger, Empress of Ireland, The Halifax Explosion, and so many more...
I have watched this tragedy more than 5 times. It is very sad and captivating. I asked myself "could they have landed safely had they dived in straight to the runway? Was 10 mints enough for a passenger plane to dive in safety?
Why did the pilot think that smoke emanating from the air conditioning system was no big deal, and how could he make the assumption that it was the air conditioning? That seems reckless.
Me too, it's the first Mayday episode I saw and having been born in Switzerland in the early 90s, this was the first big crash I remember and our national carrier too. The MD83 is still absolutely despised in the country even though in this one it wasn't the liners fault.
Thank goodness for the incessant dramatic music permeating this 'report'. Without such emotive-stirring hints I'm sure viewers may well be totally lost about how to feel.
They wasted valueable time. They should not have dismissed the initial detection of smoke in the cockpit as mere air conditioner malfunction and shut the vents. It is appalling that they were oblivious of how badly the fire was building until all the instruments were gone - it is too late by then !
And in Scotland, the shooting by a scoutmaster of _15_ _five_year old children, and _1_ _six_year old boy, and their teacher* (who* was shot 16 times as she tried to protect two of the little girls nearest to her - all three died where they lay) at Dunblane Primary School ... It led to our UK government banning the deemed unnecessary ownership of certain handguns, following the 'Snowdrop Petition' started by the grieving parents of the dead children, which collected nearly 8000 signatures... The new gun ownership laws helped to prevent such horrific events from happening again, though not all, sadly... Hungerford, and Whitehaven, were two more towns (in different parts of England) where mass shootings occurred, which remain in our collective British memory. R.I.P. Dunblane, Hungerford and Whitehaven.
I remember seeing this news on CNN which was a newly launched satellite channel in India at that time. It was very tragic. The uncertainty of a plane go missing.
Seems like the pilots did not take the situation as seriously as they should have. Smoke means fire. Fire in a pressurized aluminum tube filled with air and fuel at 39k feet is not a situation to take your time in. Immediately dump fuel, lose altitude and land.
Common “smoke” traces from air-conditioning, if not fire (quite uncommon) that ‘smoke’ is likely hydraulic fluid from fittings near end of service life. Seems likely that many ‘suspicious’ smells are hydraulic spraying of lubricant fluid.
So was it a "Sense of Control" or was it really a "Lack of Urgency"? I'm looking at the final flight path on wikipedia, when the F.O asked about dumping fuel they were only 22nm from the airport traveling at 426kt(ground speed) so 4 mins. When they Pan Pan'd had they begun decent at that point there was almost no reason why they couldn't have landed. Who here would rather get slightly injuried over dying becuase the capitan decended faster then they normally would've?
"Intrinsic harmonic distortion is the culprit" ….. in an environment charged full of ultra sonic vibration will localize all over available space where multiple objects come into contact into different conditions.
Air traffic controller in this episode was in an episode of macgyver. It was one of my favs. He makes a bomb at Mac's Alma Mater and Mac has to diffuse it.
![Jack Harlow - Hello Miss Johnson [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Q86_nlRoIGw/mqdefault.jpg)
Our grandma used to say; "Always investigate a smell of burning." She wasn't thinking of jet aircraft but I think the same applies.
RIP Nana
RIP Swiss Air 111
hey u boi
@greatestvideos3496 Hi🙂
@@splinterbyrd where u from lol
@@greatestvideos3496 Berkshire UK. Why?
I lost a close friend to suicide a few years ago. I spoke to him the night before, and something seemed like it wasn't right. I have run that conversation through my head hundreds of times over the years wondering if there was anything I could have done differently. I can only imagine what Mr.Pickerell has gone though over the years. Even if you know nothing could have been done differently, your mind always searches for a way, and it is impossible to find peace. My heart goes out to him.
Im sorry fornyour loss. Bargaining can be very difficult. Im a nurse and ive been there in many situations of 'could Inhave acted differently for a different outcome'.
Please take care of yourself.xx
They are grey worked hard all. T life where there is want there is a way 28:09
@@jesterr7133 Only Jesus Christ can save
@@johncenator3146 Amen. 🙏 There's so much that I don't understand in this world and in this life, but the one solid rock I cling to is the fact that Jesus Saves.
fake
I live in Nova Scotia. There was a co-worker at a job I had in the 2000's that had volunteered to assist in the recovery effort. He said he has never been the same since. The sight of recovering the body parts traumatized him. He has struggled with mental health issues ever since and talks to a psychiatrist regularly, he also said he has frequent nightmares from what he saw.
That's horrible. Sounds like the 9/11 first responders if not worse. I don't want to imagine what your co-worker experienced and saw. Imagine all the people involved in that situation and the negative affects on them. 😢
Ptsd. Is quite real and painful to deal with.. my bad ptsd. Has been destroying my life
I am sorry for people that also have these issues..❤❤
Some people are just soft. I would have not enjoyed seeing gruesome stuff either but I would have been just fine a few weeks later.
@frankyhonnolus5528 Oh stop, "tough guy". We know the science on PTSD. It has nothing to do with mental strength and conditioning.
@@arcticgoddess Yeah but, you’re not guaranteed to go through PTSD. If you do then yes science tells you it can mess you up. Generally speaking Americans get horrified and devastated too easily. I’ve seen numerous horrible images of dead soldiers in Middle East and Ukraine. Sure they were just “pictures”, but I didn’t lose a pint of appetite. Some people just deal w/ it better.
The Swiss tennis player Marc Rosset was supposed to be on that ill-fated flight following his first round exit at the US Open that year but changed his plans in the last minute and stayed in New York for a little longer and notified his coach that he needs more practice, when the news of the crash hit home in Geneva he phoned his family and friends while watching the news on TV from his hotel room that he's still in New York alive and in good shape. Change of plans could save your life.
It wasn't his time.
@motherofthreeb6337 nicely said . When your time comes you will notice 😊
those same change of plans could get you killed
The same with R&B singer Patti Austin on September 11, 2001. She was planning to fly on United Airlines Flight 93 (a 5-year-old Boeing 757-200 built in 1996 and took off from Newark Liberty International Airport enroute to San Francisco and crashed in Shanksville, Pennsylvania) that day, but an impending stroke suffered by her mother changed plans, prompting Patti to cancel her ticket to that flight.
Others changed their plans and were on that flight as a result.
I’ve seen this a couple of times and this one shakes me up because I knew two very nice people that were on that plane. I sold the man two vehicles in the 90’s. Super nice guy. He would always come to my desk and hang out when in for service and his wife ran a doctors office and my wife saw the doctor and I took her a couple of times. We weren’t best friends but it shook me to this day. Very nice couple.
R.I.P. Don and Diane Sheer 😢
I’m sorry. It’s definitely affected so many people around the world 😢
😢
It’s sad to know one of the victims. We are all dead people walking. Sorry to hear that. The best people always dies and leave us
@@ifrahabi4834 thank you, friend. You’re very kind. As I stated, we weren’t the best of friends but it shook me, knowing them both. He was a scientist and was going to some conference in Geneva, Switzerland. Super nice people, maybe in their 40’s. Shame.
@@ifrahabi4834 It is NOT always the best people who leave the planet.
Man these actors who play pilots are just amazing
Yes, I agree. The actors, who played the Pilots, were amazing. RIP, to everyone who perished, in this aviation disaster.😢🙏
It was noble of the ATC guy to agree to be interviewed.
@galacticambitions1277
He's partly at fault though
@@User_92020 What are you talking about? The crew unfortunately failed to grasp the seriousness of the situation. They didn’t give ATC ANY indication that they were in an emergency situation until it was far too late. Swissair’s ludicrously long ‘checklists’ are as much at fault as anything else
@@User_92020 I don't think so, they had sealed their fate that that point. Even if he had given them immediate vectors it was too late.
Yeah given that he tried to absolve himself of his incompetency. If you have a fire onboard, LAND. LAND the JET will not break apart. You must land, Pilots and ATC caused this disaster 100% and killed 350.
@@dashcan8479 229 killed but yeah same idea
I was deployed as recovery for this accident. The amount of parts and luggage we found was startling.
You’d never guess a plane could be in that many pieces.
That crash was so shocking and sad. Every time I drive out to Peggy’s Cove I always visit the memorial. God bless those poor souls 🙏🏻
I go to the memorial every so often in Peggy’s cove😢 it’s such a tragedy. Rest in peace to those lost. We haven’t forgotten ❤
And yet you did forget. You're still flying Boeing.
@@HellStr82 WHAT? Where did u see I’m flying anywhere??
@@HellStr82 this memorial is accessible, by my car, in Halifax, where I live.
@@taylorhughes6003 Just ignore the trolls. Engaging with them never helps, and if you ignore them, they'll eventually go away.
@@HiddenWindshield ahahah I’m just genuinely confused where they’re getting this information from 😂😂 I am tired of people
These days protocol dictates if smoke is detected, the flight must immediately divert to the nearest airport. They don’t waste a precious second. I guess lessons were learned from this tragedy.
says in the video that they would not have made it anyway, but I mean that should have been common sense protocol probable was suggested at first but opted for whatever would cause the least amount of damage to revenue.
From the time the smoke was first detected to loss of instruments was about 15 minutes and 21 minutes to impact. No matter how directly they'd tried to land, there wouldn't have been enough time. However, if they'd had, say, a little extra time, those delays may have factored in. It certainly points out how quickly things can turn to disaster and you how you need to get the plane on the ground.
Ya, they started doing that after this happened.. 🤨
@@JonahJayTaylor it doesnt say that it says if they didnt waste time in the air and landed immediately. They detected the smoke late if there was a detector they definitely would have made it
@@nga839 39:30 says they would have never made it because the fire would have taken out the ability of the pilots to fly the plane.
I was 3 when SwissAir 111 went down - mom told me when the plane hit the water she thought it was a loud clap of thunder. Another relative was on one of those Navy vessels that responded. They weren’t recovering full bodies. They were recovering parts. I can’t even imagine.
horrible fate for those poor souls on that flight!.
@@KRLE2582- may God have mercy on their souls....in the holy name of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior. AMEN
@@mrsx7944 stop trolling.
@@mrsx7944 Agreed. You're addressing bigdee and their smug arrogant insensitivity shoving their political religious views into everyone else's experiences, right? Agreed.
@@theultimatereductionist7592 No. I'm addressing the OP. And one comment isn't forcing religious views on you lol. Are you that weak minded that a comment by a total stranger has that much control over you? ?😂😂😂
And there was nothing "political" about the comment. Nice try.
After I found this channel and have been binge watching it, I thank God I’ve survived from numerous flights over the years.
It is absolutely amazing that the inspections were able to find the cause of the fire.
Just returned from a trip to Peggy Cove,couldn’t just stopped thinking about those who lost their lives! God bless their souls.
Smoke anywhere means land, anchor, dock, or anything else immediately. No questions asked!
My dad was just about sent out to this air crash to search and rescue for survivors but then was told to stand down due to it was a recovery mission my dad was a Canadian military combat medic both armed/unarmed, flight medic, and a field medic when we lived in Trenton, Ontario, Canada 1998
Wow. Sound like a cool dad.
@anon-wr3dh he is I grew up in a very big military family from both sides of the border US and Canadian
It was a good thing that he didn't go there. It would've been traumatic to see the bodies or what was left from them. If there were any survivors that died later, I am very sorry for them.
@LucasBoss6354 my dad has seen soo much over seas when he was deployed that he doesn't talk about it that he has combat PTSD from all his missions as an unarmed/armed combat medic
@@Albertan1984 I am very sorry for him. I hope he will be happier from now and that he will defeat his PTSD.
This hurt to watch.
What an amazing technique they used to find that single little piece of wire at the bottom of the sea that caused the fire!
@LauraiRoss they knew where the fire started from that point they could zoom in and look for anything that can start the fire
I live in Canada, Im aircrew and recall this happening . I often ask my colleagues what they think about dumping the fuel. Why didnt SA just go in heavy and not dump fuel? Its the less of 2 evils. Its unreal they dumped, and didnt get that plane down asap, given the situation. My heart breaks everytime I see this show. God rest them all.
It was less risk just to even to land in in the sea,
My first thoughts exactly! Everyone knows smoke means FIRE. I don't understand that at all
It seemed in that the pilots were very non nonchalant about the smoke in the episode. Originally picking Boston 300 miles away instead of Halifax 60 miles away. Seems like he didn't understand the urgency of the situation.
I don't know why this tragedy haunts me... I lived in Ontario when it happened. When I was wedded at Peggy's Cove in 2004, I threw my bouquet into the ocean to honour the beloved.
For me its haunting because they had plenty of time to get the plane on the ground, and its the "safety procedures" that doomed them. Maybe when the fire broke out they should have decompressed the cabin, who knows.
I just looked it up and I think each family only got like $137,000 each I just feel like that is no where near enough
137κ Τόσο αξίζει μια ζωή για την εταιρεία ?
Well how much is a life worth
Well no amount of money would make people go “oh that’s okay I’m ok with that”
Who is supposed to pay the millions per victim, though? The airline went bankrupt, so who's next -- raise the price of all tickets to cover added insurance costs? Raise taxes worldwide?
@@gangstilicious1021 no amount of money is enough for a life
Bill, you did the absolute best you could do with all the information and understanding you had at that time and you did a good job! You can't save every patient. That's something those of us who have to deal with emergencies sometimes have to learn to accept because we are all doing the best that we can with the information we have at the time. Good job!
the thing that puzzles me with this one is they had a fire on board and they never seemed to consider they were in mortal danger. A fire can be a nothing burger or go bad very very quickly. They should have got low ASAP and close to the runway in case things started to spiral
They wasted so much time . Dumping fuel with a fire on board? There are times when you need to throw the book out the window. Poor people.
😮 Why this episode refused to point out the time when ALL 3 of them initially stated they smelled smoke but dismissed it as the Air Conditioner, they had time to put the plane on the ground. The Captain made several mistakes with this situation, so did the ATC guy who said "Could I have done something different". The captain flies PAST Boston just because he wanted a airport he was familiar with, ARE YOU SERIOUS. If your boss tells you that your schedule will have you flying to Virginia are you gonna say "Well I'm not familiar with that airport so I'd rather take my passengers to Tennessee because I know that airport. The captain decides to waste time he doesn't have by wanting to dump fuel. The ATC tells them to turn around and fly in circles to dump fuel instead of giving them a direct approach to closest airport. The captain stays at a ridiculous high altitude wasting time when he was cleared for 3,000 feet for Gods sake. The captain turns the plane in the opposite direction of Halifax to dump fuel when his First Officer told him thats a bad idea "Lets Just Land". The captain declares an emergency so late during the event by the time he does his cockpit is a bonfire. The captains common sense never kicks in and says "I'm on borrowed time, I should get this plane on the ground now. Terrible CRM, the captain should have listened to his first officer. You have people's lives in your hands and you would rather stay at a higher altitude and fly in circles to do something that was not necessary to do. Plus the guy at the end who abandoned his wife and other family members, to use that as an excuse to leave your wife was a cowardly thing to do. You don't own the market on grief, stay and comfort your wife and family instead of running away.
@@TheJustUsLeague just my thoughts. Spot on.
Seeing an airplane crash is my worst fear I'm terrified of them. May all that lost their lives Rest in peace ❤️
Thank you for this detailed and serious production. It is always heartbreaking to recall such a tragedy
Amazing how the investigation team found that single piece of wire that started the fire.
I've been watching a lot of these episodes and in most of them I don't understand why the pilots don't declare emergency earlier. I know it messes up a lot of things and also there is airlines pressure as well but if you're seeing smoke means there is a fire, declare emergency and land asap.
The horror that the passengers must have felt as their plane dove into the ocean…in dark! Dang. SMH
At those g forces they where probably unconscious.
@@SpoiledBadgerMilkI hope so
@@SpoiledBadgerMilk
Huh?
What G-Forces?
The aircraft was not experiencing excessive G-forces until impact.
No one was unconscious when that plane impacted the sea, neither from (absent) g-forces nor from smoke inhalation as no evidence for it could be found.
Luckily, no one realized the impact either nor saw it coming due to total darkness outside of the aircraft, as it happened faster than the brain could have processed anything.
They were in a dive until suddenly, it was all over.
@NPC_-mf4dw they said they felt 650Gs at impact..they had Gs before impact. What would indicate not excessive for you? This is UNREAL.
I'm not a pilot. That said, I've wondered why pilots don't immediately get the plane down as fast as the airframe will allow. If there's smoke in the cockpit, there's a fire - or at least something smoldering somewhere. Regardless. Get down now. No?
Unfortunately, air travel isn't that simple. You need clearance to land regardless of whether it is an emergency.
IMHO this is incredibly criminal neglect, in the Apollo 1 accident in 1967 there was a fatal fire that was fumed by flammable material within the capsule. Now many decades later, there is no collective learning from this and there is highly flammable material in critical parts of the airframe structure ... WOW 😵💫
In my opinion McDonnell Douglas and Swissair stand clearly responsible for the tragic death of 229 people. My heart cries out for the families, friends and relatives 💔
May all the victims rest in peace.
Except the wef woman. wef = EVIL
If I could have a place anywhere on the planet, it would be Halifax. I have never been there but the peaceful look just stole my heart. Not to mention, I think Canadian's are awesome.
I've been in a house fire, in 2 minutes the entire ceiling was on fire and thick black smoke was down to waist height. I can't imagine being in a plane on fire with no immediate way out. RIP to all the victims 💕
This happened very close to where I grew up. My parents heard the loud bang when it hit the water. RIP all who died 😢
Watched this on TV as a kid. The pilots did their best with what they had.
RIP Flight 111. Lesson: on an airplane, where there is smoke, there is fire. At the first sign of trouble, they should have kept looking for the source and if they couldn't find it after 5 minutes, start your landing protocols and keep looking. I'm not a pilot, just someone who thinks that if something seems wrong, there probably is something wrong especially on a flying piece of metal that you hope others had put together correctly. Again, RIP to the crew and passengers, condolences to their families and all those affected by that tragic event.
Same issue as always..
There is a lot of money lost when they do any type of landning. Esp unplanned ones . The preassure is on the pilots, higher up from the company due to the enormous costs involved. And then we see how often the same people who makes all the bad decisions, always try to blame the pilots when something bad happens..
@@ingridakerblom7577they were late but it was very bad situation anyways so I wouldn't put a sentence on them
It's a problem if you over react or under react. I think they followed proper procedure but the fire spread way too fast, after they realized something WAS actually Burning.
So sorry for the lost lives and familys and those who helped recovery and now suffer trauma!!
Excellent detailed presentation of this sad & horrific malfunction and loss!!
@@kevinlynch1227 Thing is... if you look for a source of fire and easily find it, THEN you can make an easy decision, but if you CAN'T find it? ...... too much risk to stay int he air.
When it comes to airplane fire, this keeps happening. The problem with airplane fires is that the pilots cannot think about the source of fire because it is agreed upon that after the first 20 minutes, you almost always will lose the airplane.
Any fire on an aircraft must be terrifying.
It's terrible to think the last moments of everyone despite being in the same situation, are so far apart. Air travel is more safe but it is always a bitter pill that it's modified from the loss of innocent lives
it's good that this video has been uploaded that many times so the public can stay informed. Also too Honor the victims and to keep people from forgetting. R.I.P to everyone who lost their lives in this tragedy.
Terrible tragedy. A woman that I directly worked with for years was on the flight. She was traveling to join her husband for a European vacation. They had only been married for a few months.
What was her name ?
@@Kattycorner59 Rhonda Donaldson from Atlanta, GA.
I know a Swiss airplane engineer who had full access to all data of flight SR 111. He us convinced that an immediate descent ("the only option is this situation"), with fuel dumped immediately, maximum speed and of course no levelling off could have saved the plane and the people on board.
I was on a flight once and alerted flight crew to some smoke smell from entertainment system and I remember first officer even coming back to check it out everything turned out okay fortunately.
I can imagine how hard it was for Ian Shaw losing his daughter. I got to say it was nice he moved to Canada and opened his own restaurant.
Where there is smoke, there is fire.
The narrator said that harmless smoke traces from the air-conditioning system were common on airplane jets.
@@poplap9241 why were the pilots alarmed by it if it were so common?
@@stellarwind1946because it smelt, whereas the smoke from the air conditioning unit doesn't smell
@@stellarwind1946because smoke is fire? Lol just cuz somethings common doesnt mean theyre not alarmed to other not as common issues..
@@dana102083 so the pilots are commonly smelling smoke in the cockpit? How do they distinguish which smoke is bad?
I was born in Nova Scotia currently live in the United States since I was about four years old. My brother and I are planning a trip back to Nova Scotia and I want to visit his restaurant SHAW,’s landing.
ok
What are we supposed to do with this information we didn't ask for.?
@@willankhatter this reminds me... i should call her
@@willankhatter- And your comment we didn't ask for.
Another illegal canadian immigrant 🤦🏻♂️ posting useless info
How horrifying! Going down in the dark knowing the ocean is below..😕
Probably only the pilots and a few passengers knew the ocean was below
Excellent information and narration. This is a very tragic story. Condolences to the families of the deceased and the loved ones. I salute the father who opened up a restaurant near the bay just to be close to his daughter who was a victim of this tragedy. I being a father myself can understand his feelings. More power to you Sir...
"Gambling system." Losing money on the fly.
Right off my local seashore. Heartbreaking for all
This was a very sad and unfortunate accident. While l am not blaming the pilots, it baffles me why they didn't desend quickly to 3,000 feet considering the emergency situation, but choose to stay at 8,000 feet for cabin clearance. Surely, descending quickly was a priority given the emergency situation. May all their souls rest in peace🙏
This is by far the most terrifying and horrific flight ever. The fact that even if everything would have been done perfectly, they still wouldn't have survived... and that only 1 body was intact.
All of this just from a faulty IFE-system, insane.
The people that died will be missed...
Horrible crash. R.I.P to the victims.
I think this is the 111th time this video has been uploaded
😂😂😂 I was just about to ask if we had already watched this one 😅 I was hopeful
Been on a number of TV channels here in NZ. If Sky get hold of it, you can expect many repeats.
Yeah.. but its “new and improved” with a different narrator!
I just lol
No, this is new.
Mayday has cursed hundreds of air disasters to recur like Groundhog Day. The pilots and passengers must relive the horror every year or so in horrific perpetuity. I think us viewers have got it lucky.
The check list for fire said turn off air con in the cockpit. It was this which was fanning the flames back over the passenger cabin. Once this was turned off the flames concetrated over the cockpit. Leaving the ac on, may have given them more time, but they didn't know this... tragic.
I was a frequent trans Atlantic (business) traveler back in 1998. This crash hit hard.
The pilot underestimated the problem not knowing it could lead to their death
I'm familiar with this incident and have watched many videos about it, but it always makes me feel sad. RIP
1:12-1:15 What caused the fire IS NOT a mystery. IT WAS unknown (not even a mystery) at the time. Today everybody knows what the cause was. These documentaries have an inordinate fondness for the word mystery, which gives kind of religious atmosphere to the stories they tell.
Some small quirks apart, it is an excellent documentary.
They took too long, FGS, they took too long. The Captain was following company's policies, but that doesn't change the fact that he took too long. It's so heartbreaking.
I managed C & D Checks for Gemin I Air Cargo and we replaced the lining on all 5 MD11 aircraft per the FAA AD. It was C/W in 2002 nd 2003.
So they issued a PAN PAN PAN but someone decided it wasn't much of an emergency at one point?🤦🏻♀️
Made no difference
That ATC reminds me of a time when I was a kid and almost cut my thumb off. It was bleeding pretty bad but we had been almost ready to have dinner when it happened and my Dad said "well we might as well eat before we go to the hospital".
Brilliant work, thank you.
It is amazing that they leave no stone unlearned to find answers and learn. I do not like to fly at all
Man up
@@red-eye-traveller9218 Real
I travelled on this Swiss Air flight in the mid 1990s so often I'd have to look up how many times I flew from NY to Geneva. It's pretty terrifying to think about but I have to say I never felt more secure on a plane than when I was taking Swiss Air in those days.
One of the lead investigators claimed there was ample evidence of an incendiary device on board the aircraft, but this information was suppressed by TSB Canada.
Yes, the device even had a name, it is called the entertainment system.
Just the smoke in the cockpit is automatically an emergency. It does not have to be a fire. It directly effects the pilots capacity to perform. If the smoke gets worst they will not be able to see anything even with the mask on. The cockpit door should have been kept open.
I have read this case many many times but still cant understand capt zimmer logic to dump fuel before landing becoz the aircraft was burning and he should have moved to airport irrespective of the fact the aircraft was heavy on fuel or not
Should you initiate an emergency water landing when the plane is on fire?
@JimAllen-Personastill a better choice, they would have emergency crews to deal with that. They needed to declare mayday and land immediately.
@@magnoliap5824 If the plane broke on touchdown and ignited all that fuel, emergency crews wouldn't be able to save them
@@monikar.5490 I know. 3 did survive so far.
Don’t u understand it was already determined that even if he headed straight for the airport at the first sign of a problem he would have stilled crashed 3 minutes of the runway killing many more people on the ground 💁♂️🤦♂️
Canada is home to the greatest tragedies in history... Titanic, Titan, Swissair 111, Ocean Ranger, Empress of Ireland, The Halifax Explosion, and so many more...
Gander, arrow air
Tuning in now! ❤
I have watched this tragedy more than 5 times. It is very sad and captivating.
I asked myself "could they have landed safely had they dived in straight to the runway?
Was 10 mints enough for a passenger plane to dive in safety?
Science is really amazing like how thy found the coz of plane crash
Why did the pilot think that smoke emanating from the air conditioning system was no big deal, and how could he make the assumption that it was the air conditioning? That seems reckless.
This was the first disaster I ever watched when I was younger it so sad how this happened
Me too, it's the first Mayday episode I saw and having been born in Switzerland in the early 90s, this was the first big crash I remember and our national carrier too. The MD83 is still absolutely despised in the country even though in this one it wasn't the liners fault.
I'm not sure if it was the first for me, but I'm certain its one of the first.
This is tragic 😥 what a horrible way to go.
Thank goodness for the incessant dramatic music permeating this 'report'. Without such emotive-stirring hints I'm sure viewers may well be totally lost about how to feel.
They wasted valueable time. They should not have dismissed the initial detection of smoke in the
cockpit as mere air conditioner malfunction and shut the vents.
It is appalling that they were oblivious of how badly the fire was building until all the instruments were gone - it is too late by then !
They died so that others may live. The flammable insulation that lined the MD-11 has been phased out of all commercial aircraft.
28:00 My heart breaks for any parent that loses a child.
Yes definitely. That's how parents of children killed at Colmbine High School felt.
ok
And in Scotland, the shooting by a scoutmaster of _15_ _five_year old children, and _1_ _six_year old boy, and their teacher* (who* was shot 16 times as she tried to protect two of the little girls nearest to her - all three died where they lay) at Dunblane Primary School ...
It led to our UK government banning the deemed unnecessary ownership of certain handguns, following the 'Snowdrop Petition' started by the grieving parents of the dead children, which collected nearly 8000 signatures... The new gun ownership laws helped to prevent such horrific events from happening again, though not all, sadly...
Hungerford, and Whitehaven, were two more towns (in different parts of England) where mass shootings occurred, which remain in our collective British memory.
R.I.P. Dunblane, Hungerford and Whitehaven.
20 minutes to complete the checklist seems awfully long for one that isn't before departing :0
I remember seeing this news on CNN which was a newly launched satellite channel in India at that time. It was very tragic. The uncertainty of a plane go missing.
I thought if there's smoke then they land asap. Like no fuel dumping or even check list.
Yeah they made a major mistake!!!
That came after this crash. But there is always a checklist. It's very short now though and any smoke is treated as a fire.
My friend’s sister-in-law died in this crash.
What was her name?
i was there. i survived
If you see smoke coming out from an airplane, forget about dumping fuel.
The pilots were supposed to go straight to the airport and land the plane.
The narrator said that harmless smoke traces from the air-conditioning system were common on airplane jets
They followed policy and the checklist they were supposed to.
@paulettewaldorf6659 The policy and checklist cost them their lives.
Aww it's cute how Swiss pilots hold hands during take-off
Seems like the pilots did not take the situation as seriously as they should have. Smoke means fire. Fire in a pressurized aluminum tube filled with air and fuel at 39k feet is not a situation to take your time in. Immediately dump fuel, lose altitude and land.
Common “smoke” traces from air-conditioning, if not fire (quite uncommon) that ‘smoke’ is likely hydraulic fluid from fittings near end of service life. Seems likely that many ‘suspicious’ smells are hydraulic spraying of lubricant fluid.
So was it a "Sense of Control" or was it really a "Lack of Urgency"? I'm looking at the final flight path on wikipedia, when the F.O asked about dumping fuel they were only 22nm from the airport traveling at 426kt(ground speed) so 4 mins. When they Pan Pan'd had they begun decent at that point there was almost no reason why they couldn't have landed. Who here would rather get slightly injuried over dying becuase the capitan decended faster then they normally would've?
They also said a fully fueled plane can break up on landing
You can't land at that speed, they would've had to reduce speed and altitude gradually even if they had chosen not to dump fuel.
One of my ancestors was a lieutenant on the CSS Chicora in Charleston harbor.
The captain's decision to go to Boston killed everybody.
Yep
Yup.
This is so sad. The plane could of made the airport in Halifax if the pilots had known the gravity of the situation
Ummm no it couldn't. Were you not listening?
I believe they did make it, they just turned around to go dump fuel.
They would have had a much much better chance had they decided to go straight in while dumping
Haha niagah
@@Ranger-tq9iy I`ve often wondered the same thing.
"Intrinsic harmonic distortion is the culprit" ….. in an environment charged full of ultra sonic vibration will localize all over available space where multiple objects come into contact into different conditions.
Shaw put a live lobster in boiling water toward the last minutes of this video, He didn't learn.
💀
My dad worked on the Canadian sub that went to the plane crash
This guy is telling the truth. I know because I was the sub.
@@11matt555woah, that's so cool!
COOL!
@@11matt555😂😂😂😂sub man, sub man, yeah that's you....
I always find it funny how they call it “Moncton New Brunswick” where as with American cities it’s just “Newark” or “Washington”
Air traffic controller in this episode was in an episode of macgyver. It was one of my favs. He makes a bomb at Mac's Alma Mater and Mac has to diffuse it.