Mixing with Analog Gear on the Master Explained: is analog master compression better?
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- Опубликовано: 24 авг 2024
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In this video David let us hear the effect of a great 2bus chain used for one of the album he's been working on recently, the Neve 542's tape emulator into the Wes Audio _Dione, SSL Style 2bus stereo compressor. An incredibly sounding 2bus chain that adds saturation, tape color, compression and harmonic distortion in a very musical way.
This video will show you how much difference a 2bus analog chain like this can make when you mix into it from the beginning and really push the hardware. Also a digression on 2bus processing and different ways to approach mix bus compression, saturation and eq. After the with and without example, all the different stages of these two processors are taken in and out to really let you hear what each unit does to the overall sound.
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Hi David! Do you have the name of the band ?? That mix sounds amazing !!
MixbusTV Ok David ! Yes I was talking about the first one :) The mix I heard on your video is just awesome, and I like the song ! So now, I have to listen to the entire album. Thank you for your quick answer. The units you demoed are amazing. I recently bought the Drawmer 1978 after I saw the demo you made ! It’s a pretty awesome units and I found it surprisingly beautiful on the mixbus for an acoustic song!
Please do a dedicated video on the Neve 542's...many thanks!
Some of the coolest backing vocal parts ive ever heard. Sounds like 3rds and 2nds. Amazing.
Top . . . The sound of the Neve is what I am looking for all these years
I own the 542's and they end up on 98% of my mixes... They add that extra 2% of goodness.
All I can say is wow !!! I am definitely picking up a couple of those 542's asap !!! Listening to that just reaffirms that plug-ins a really good they're just not quite there like that hardware !! Great video brother !!
Very nice IN/OUT demo.
The smoothness it brings blend both vocals takes just digital it was off by milliseconds during overdubs but when on it glues everything and add dynamic balance to drums that sounded weak until u activated the tape emulators
After the chorus, and also before, i'm hearing a (loud) ring on snare... It can be heard more obviously while tape emo and compressor are engaged.... beside that... both devices are quite magical. Thank you for comparison David!
First of all, this song is freakin' awesome and second, you did an epic job on the mix. I just recently bought an HRK ST552 Tape Emulator, HRK ST596 Harmonics Processor and a WesAudio Dione and can't wait to get them in the studio.
I own the Dione & the ST552’s - KILLER combo ! Enjoy!
The difference is really impressive!!!
are you still liking these? barely any other videos out there, thanks a lot for yours.
i've been using them for a week and am not really impressed. sure, they thicken things up but they have absolutely none of the openness and high end sparkle found in even consumer grade reel to reel tape, regardless of the settings used. mixing into them is definitely a must but, again, it sounds nothing like tape.
at $500 a piece these would be cool but at $750 they are really overpriced and overhyped, imo.
Normalizing the before and after would make it a more fair comparison, nevertheless it is still evident the units have their value.
This is what we were interested in. The definitely sound larger and more full. But We wonder how much is overall volume versus mix bus processing and compression. Agreed they clearly sound good.
I'm pumped now waiting on my 500 series to come🎉🎉🎉🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎆🎥🎥💿 because i got that type of info from it again thxs
Totally love mixing into, love that concept,😊 do it on every mix
Wowwwww thank u for this real world pro example
sensational skill in the use of distortion to prepare the wes compressor ==well done ! i have heard this 1000 times and cannot believe the difference --not for 3000usd!
No autogain/normalization? Just a sugestiona for a better AB comparison
On my shopping list!!!!
David...I "joined" because I want to see the continuation of how to mix into the 2-bus after "gain staging"...I'm, like you, a hybrid studio...recording to Pro Tools native through a console using outboard gear...then mixing using outboard inserts...!...I'm very interest in learning how to get this right...!...Thanks...!!!
Welcome to the family! That video will be out soon, there are few more in the line, as for the regular content, vids and courses are leased weekly or twice a week (on top of the regular content) Meantime you already have access to all the ones available now for members only. 🙏 enjoy
@@mixbustv I'm looking forward to that my friend...I've followed you channel since it started and have many, many Mixbus Tv videos saved in my favorite's tabs...!...It's great to be here...!!!
Both combination is very good
If you can get your hands on a hardware SSL compressor it would be neat to see a shootout between that and the Dione! Great Video!
sweet, good to know! Thanks!
Keep updating me the combinations of all these 500 series modules
That paramore snare on blast lol
@@mixbustv No matter how you layer that one shot, it's always there. I'm guilty of it too;) Gotta LPF and pull 250Hz out to hide it but even then if you know, you know :-p
Very nice and informative demo. Thanks!
These Neve units look interesting. Have you tried them on software instruments? Like VST synths or sampled drums? Would this make them sound more alive?
Amazing!
Hey, simply edit the audio on the gear in/out punches, take Nugen and normalise each section to some sensible LUFS value. That way we can hear the gear and not the DB jumps. Thanks for the content and please take this as constructive criticism!
Cheers from Berlin
Wow this is amazing! Question are you using the Neve tape as a stereo pair or they are being used separately as mono?
Hello, they are mono units. Plug the left out into one 542 and the right out into the other 542. They are not linked to work as a synced stereo pair they act independently according to the signal they receive.
Shouldn’t it be Compressor into Neve Tape? Like in a full console in a studio, the buss compressor is printed to tape at the end right? Have you tried having the tape as the last stage? Why did you choose to go tape into compressor? Or maybe I’m wrong about the large format console studio signal path…I’m thinking about buying a pair of these place after SSL compressor.
I wouldn't say "should". In a full analog setup you have no choice, tape CAN'T be in any other place because is the recording media. These are like tape but not exactly the same (better if you ask me), so why be tied to path "just becuase" if you can find a better one? The 542's like transient, and the way I use them, they add quite a big "bumb" at the bottom which would be uncontrolled and not tight enough if it was after compression. These are other reasons for me to use them there.
@@mixbustv ohhhh, I see!! That makes complete sense to me! Last question, are you familiar with HRK ST552? They say they’re very close to Neve Tape. A pair for $500!! Love to hear what you think about HRK ST552. Thanks again for your insights!
wow really good - thank you
Love your videos man. Already had a Smart CL1A compressor but I actually went out and got a pair of 542s after watching this and they're incredible. Question: are you going into the 542s first or the WEM? Seems like it's probably good to get some of the soft clipping on the 542 before hitting the compressor so that's how I have it set up now but I could see benefits to both configurations. Thanks again!
hmmm interesting, I was using the 542's at the end of my mix chain, kinda like hitting tape. But this makes sense, comp will kind of enhance some of the subtleties from the 542's too... cheers
Killer video David and just what I'm looking for. Those 542 made a HUGE difference
I would like to add more oomph to my ITB mixes and I was looking at a 2 buss hardware chain.
I'm torn between the Dione and the TK BC501 buss comp. Have you tried them both?
I would also like to use an EQ if I need to sweeten the mix a bit. Did you use one on this mix?
I'm looking for a TK-lizer 500 as well.
What's your take between the Dione vs the TK BC501 2 buss compressors and on the EQ?
thanks
CJ
first the 551, next the 542. cant wait!!! =)
Hi David, I'd love to hear your opinion about running a mix bus into a pair of preamps. Thank you so much in advance!
There are a thousands dedicated saturators out there, running mixes thru preamps is not my first choice for anything. Altho' I just got a new unit today which is kind of that, a preamp but also a dedicated bus saturator. Will try it out this week and the video will be out soon
@@mixbustv Thank you! I'll be waiting for it
Beautiful!
Hi Davide, great video, where you buyed the Dione?
Hi David. Trying to decide between the Dione and the Bettermaker C502V....which would you recommend?
Hi Gavid I have two questions... Do you need two of the 542's on the mix bus and what 500 series rack would you suggest I buy?
Cool vid. I'm using the Neve Portico MBP as outboard 2 bus chain, loving what it does however. I'm trying to learn it more, Whats the best way to record the signal back into the DAW with All of the added outboard processing?
If possible can you show us how u route your 500 series emulators into pro tools and use them on your masterbus
Hi David! Are the Neve 542s able to be plugged into a TITAN rack? Thanks for all you do bro, love your channel!
Yes, 500 series modules can be plugged in any chassis and vice versa
@@mixbustv Thanks bro! My Titan and Dione comes in on Monday, can't wait to get this thing up and running!
Thanks for doing this. I need some new gear now ;-)
We must think alike. I've spent the last few days deciding on my first 500 series order and it's looking like API 512c, Neve 511, Neve542, and a Diode in a Wes Audio 11-slot chassis. It's gonna bend the bank but I'd get them all eventually anyways so why waste time?
1. Would using only 1 tape emulator on the 2bus turn the mix to mono? 2. To use the _dione, do you flip the stereo link switch, and just use one of the available outputs to connect it to the interface? I'm asking because it takes up 2 module slots, giving it 2 ins and 2 outs on the back of the 500 box.
I'm considering the Dangerous Music Convert 2 + as a 2 bus tone machine. The little bit I've heard sounded great, but this combination is amazing too. It would be wonderful to compare the results with both set ups, but quite difficult to do. I wonder if you've heard or used the Convert 2+, and if you think the transformers give as good or even better effect to a final mix.
Thanks for the swift reply. What I've seen on the Convert 2+ is you can bang the input really hard and yet there's a button that prevents clipping, then there's a transformer at the end you can add analogue color with. A friend took a track done by a friend that sounded like a demo and it came out sounding like it was done on a big console. Still, I'm in no rush and will carefully research, so thanks for your thoughtful advice. I loved the combination you were using and will seriously consider that once I get into the lunchbox thing.@@mixbustv
I just got the new UAD Apollo X6. I've had Apollo's for years, but always found the converters fell short. The new one is indistinguishable from many top of the line converters, so I'm fine with that for now. I'd lean toward your set up for sure. @@mixbustv
Hey David/MixbusTv, Wondering what you'd recommend between this Wes Audio Dione NG501 or Heritage Audio Successor?Thanks for your videos and wisdom.
It depends for what and what other machines you have. I have both so for me it's hard to pick one
Hi David!what is the best and multiporpose comp for 2 bus on you opinion,wes audio dione or bettermaker c502?
Hi David, great video, this combo sounds nice! I own the Neve MBP, would it make sense to get the 542’s?
MixbusTV Thank you for the reply David! Did you use this combo on your latest mixes?
How can I use the neve 542 as a pair? In stereo mode?
As long as you have two
Hi David is there no eq on your 2bus chain for this mix? Or just left out for this video? What do you think are the essential elements on a 2bus? In a former reply you said you had 1974 as well as violet on the 2bus so I know you use them nowadays but I’m looking for a minimal setup now for 2bus... what is in your opinion the best setup for mixbus when picking from drawmers 1974 and 1978, Prometheus and Dione? Thanks!
Seems like the 542 drives are complementary to the THD. So you actually use them both instead of one or the other, Or are they sometimes in eachothers way?
I always use both. I feel like saying if you have to leave something out, would be the eq. I do use it but I did mix without one for a long time.
What signal level are you usually sending out of the DAW to the 542s? -6db? -12db? Lower? Thank you.
Anywhere between 12 and 4
Hi David! Just curious why not go into Dione first and then 542's? Sort of like printing to "tape" at the end?
Nice! Thanks for the detailed explanation, just got them and looking decide which route works best for me...*Your Eq at the end is it the Elysia xfilter 500?
Hi David, I'm about to buy my first mastering hardware, 2x542 or Dione?
542's for mastering are a tad too colored to be honest, they're more of a mixing tool than mastering. Between the two I'd go with the Dione, for mixing, I'd go with the 542's first, keep in mind they do have a learning curve, gain staging is everything with them.
@@mixbustv Thanks a lot David! I will go for the Dione first.
Hey David, this set up is so nice 👍🏽
I have the SSL Fusion and waiting on the 7721 stereo compressor to come in next week or so.. although the SSL Fusion sounds really good. Do you think I would be better off getting a neve 5042 with the stereo compressor for more color and saturation on my mix buss only?
Hey David, I don’t use a 500 series rack unfortunately. I just have my regular rack with hardware gear. So far my back end gear is the SSL Fusion, I just wanted a tape simulation piece to compliment it. Was looking at the Zulu. But which one could you recommend? Budget range is 800-1200$
MixbusTV this is why I rock with you man. You keep it 💯 with no extra bs. Thanks 🙏🏽
Sometime in the future I would love to see you put the SSL Fusion up against the Neve MBP! If possible
Hi great content as always! Seeing as how the rnd 542s don’t have stepped controls would this be an issue for affecting the stereo field? If the knobs aren’t exactly matched? Thx!
If the knobs aren't matched the user is the issue 😄 jk no it's not, funny enough one of the differences that makes us like analog is the fact that LR are never digitally perfectly matched.
Lol! Yep wasn't sure how pin point precise unstepped knobs have to be for stereo work. Sounds huge with those units though! Is the RND 542 always last in order in your mixbus chain? @@mixbustv
Which is Better, Im Using Some Hardware, My Vocal Chain Right Now Is A Hardware Pre Amp Thats Going Into A Hardware Compressor . Which Is Better, | Eq Before Comp Or The Other Way. | Im Looking For A Almost Clean Finished Sound . But At The Moment Its , Hardware Pre Amp / Compressor & A Fabfilter Eq Plugin Im Not Getting That Clean Musical Sound. But More Like A Pod Cast Box Sound ? What Am I Doing Wrong
Nice video !
Do you always use the neve 542 before your compression or do you sometimes go from you compression into your neve 542 as well ?
Thanks !
Nope, Neve are first, into Fusion, Wes NG mastering comp, SPL PQ, Spacecraft, sometimes API 5500
@@mixbustv thanks !
What is the band? This song is great
Band is called Lambstone (I mixed and mastered one of their albums, about 6 years ago, NOT the latest or the ones prior)
hi was wondering if you are mixing into the analog gear or do you feed it ihe analog chain after you have finished your mix itb? if that makes sense. thanks
Always mix into your 2bus chain
@@mixbustv thanks !!
Interesting video! I have the Stereo Nieves and they are amazing. I'm wondering why you have the Tape Sat all the way down, but raise the Tape amount. Does that still have a tape effect with the sat all the way down?
Thanks man I needed this! I hit the transformers pretty hard as I found I get a full sound. I'm going to try the method and read the manual again.
Can two neve 543 be used as stereo compressor in a mastering chain?
wow, they actually do have a link switch,
Wes Audio
where can i listen to this song? i like it
MixbusTV ok I'll check them out. Great mix man. try fbomber from slate. I was just messing with it. it's pretty sweet man
Question, do you use the 542s on say vocals on their own ever or do you only use on the 2bus? They seem like something i would want to do some tracking with but not sure? If you mix into them you cant route anything alone correct? Sorry this is my first purchase of outboard gear
No you can't unless you have as many as many channels you want to process with. They would be way too much color to track with them or even put them on multiple tracks.
@@mixbustv Oh ok sounds good thanks for answering so quickly! Just planning what im going to purchase, thank you!
@@mixbustv Ive been wondering since people say blue is great for lows and red is good for highs that you could stem to the color you want and put them together but ive never actually seen anyone do this
@@crayzmusic I really wonder if those people ever used one, or know how to. The xformer is just one of the 3 processes this thing does, and saying blue is good for lows and red for highs makes very little sense and they are just fooled by level and don't match. Blue rolls off highs and bump lows, of a track has too much top end, blue is good for highs in that case, see where I'm going? Red adds a specific sparkle to the top, sometimes is good, sometimes is not, there's no magic ticket that works for everything every time
@@mixbustv I get you makes perfect sense. Thanks for answering I think I understand how you view the best use for them and I trust your way of working. So I was thinking of starting with the ssl fusion going into the 542s. eventually adding a buss compressor after. My question is (I'm so sorry ha) because of course adding mastering hardware along with that setup costs a lot. Would mastering in ozone (the full version) along with waves mercury (own both already) degrade the quality of the real hardware mixed tracks? Guess since I'm barely going out of the box in worried of heavily investing then making it pointless with pure software mastering. All of this is for a new rebuild of studio
Sir i have been watching your tutorials for a long while, is there a possibility if you can mix and master one of my song
Sure I can if you got the budget
What is your opinion on the Overstayer NT-02A VS Neve 542
They're very very different. Neve has real tape heads in it, and it sounds amazing, to be honest I'm not a big fan of the NT while I liked some of their other offerings. Night and day
Does anyone has suggestions on midi instruments that could complement or replace Xpand2 on Pro Tools?
Native instruments komplete 11
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