Maybe the reason Darkstalker got so gargantuan is simply because, since dragons are reptiles, he just kept growing as the years went on. Since reptiles are best known for the fact that they never truly stop growing. Sure, their growth slows considerably when they reach maturity. But Darkstalker was in hibernation for 2 millennia. Anything after that point would be humongous.
Yeah, Tui, has confirmed that dragons don’t stop growing as they grow older. I think 4rcane was talking more about the inconsistently with his size and other dragons.
Except not in the conditions he would have been in. Alligators at the very least experience stunted growth if they spend several years in confined spaces. Darkstalker also had no nutrient intake and we only know his immortal just keeps him alive not feeding him. Oh if he was being fed and had space, he could have grown so big.
A plothole i noticed during a reread of book 12, (Please scroll away from this to avoid spoilers if you haven't read books 11-13!) Is that when they were burning the green house full of The Breath of Evil, wouldn't they have inhaled it and then Wasp could control them? Because when Blue and Swordtail inhaled the smoke in book 13, Wasp got them.
@@AllHallowsEve223 I 'think' that cricket was far enough away from the greenhouse, and the gaurds nearby were already injected with the breath of evil from birth
When you were talking about genes you mentioned sunmy should have had black scales, but I believe that tui confirmed that dominant genes come from the mother. Wich actually makes less sense with Hivewings, because I personally believe that they look more like beetlewings then nightwings. But I suppose that instead of the beetle/night hybrids doing it with other nightwings, they did it with other beetlewings wich would make them more beetle-like then night-like. Silkwings actually look more nightwing-like then Hivewings, which is strange to me.
Hive wings aren't half NightWing though, and aren't even hybrids. They've been without any new NightWing genes for 2 millenia, so obviously they'll fade over time. Which is why Sunny doesn't really show any icewing traits
@@jaspergrey4172 I think you misunderstood what i said. Because that's true, and I explained that because of that reason, Hivewings would look more like beetlewings then nightwings.
@@floofyfloof720 Clearsight must’ve had female dragonets which had black scales and those dragons had other females and on and on eventually resulting in the whole HiveWing tribe having some black scales
One small detail. Twins from the same egg CAN be be different genders. And that's just with irl reptiles, so no not a plot hole just misinformation about reptiles.
The plot hole I noticed that bothers me most is in the book 14 when Wren says, “We call ourselves humans” in the dragon language. This is problematic because when Wren learned a word in dragon from Sky in Dragonslayer, she had to point to it and get told what the word was. Therefore, she would think that the dragon word for human is pronounced “scavenger.” How did she come up with the word “human” in the dragon language? The only ideas I can come up with are that perhaps she told them the word “human” in the human language. She is comfortable switching between languages but this just seems like an extra level of complication that wouldn’t work for dragons. I assume letter sounds and word spellings are not consistent between the two languages so she couldn’t have spelled it out. Let me know if this makes any sense or if you noticed this!
Tui mentioned one time that everything is dragon-sized, but the sizes are still inconsistent anyways. With Stonemover, I think he did not make the plans for the tunnels himself, I think he was ordered to do so by Morrowseer and Battlewinner as part of the plan to take over the rainforest, but I do agree, why would you go with the plan involving genocide, kidnapping, torture, keeping a world war going, and more, when there was an easy way to fix all your problems without it? Agreed about Onyx and the HiveWings mostly. I do think that the way Anemone and Mink were raised was a big part of how mature they are since Anemone basically was not given the chance to have a childhood, she wasn't allowed to complain, play with other dragonets, leave her mother's side, or anything, while Glacier loved Mink and tried to make her as happy as possible, but the aging thing is inconsistent. The plothole that bothers me the most is that the HiveWings burned down a forest continent (Tui said it was all forest before the war) and it somehow became a savannah with savannah animals with no negative side effects besides angry LeafWings. I also apologize if I sound nit-picky I love Wings of Fire and reading interviews from Tui!
I THOUGHT ABOUT THE INBREEDING SO MUCH AS WELL I KEPT THINKING “wait but if Clearsight had dragonets with a bunch of other dragons and they soon became a tribe does that mean they bred with each other or did they mate with other red/orange/yellow SilkWings?????”
i'm surprised you didn't mention bumblebee's size, in the book she's able to be tossed around by a human which, according to the graphic novels, are around the size of a large banana (and in the books, one of the humans can comfortably stand on sky's head (unless i'm misremembering))? and in those same graphic novels, newborn dragonets are also around that size (like when we saw auklet hatch) but much thicker
Dragon grow faster than we expected in the books sky was the size of a small rabbit and wren could hold him on her shoulders it was only till a year or two when he got to her hip
What’s weird to me is how sunny isn’t an animus dragon. If you think about it, Darkstalker’s father was an animus, and one of his children had animus blood. Well, stonemover only have 1 child, so all his animus blood would go to hero’s that narrows it down to one question, why isn’t Sunny an animus?
Animus isn't guaranteed in the offspring. I believe animus is recessive, so that would mean not every offspring of an animus dragon will be an animus too. it's possible for the grandchildren to be animus, but that isn't guaranteed either.
Yeah, the animus is Recessive which means it can be carried down for generations before a dragon has the powers. So sunny still has the animus trait but it is dormant and the dominant “not animus” trait is covering it up, it hard to explain without getting all scientific but if sunny had a dragonet it could be a animus and if that dragonet had a child it could be a animus and so on and so on
Though only darkstalker was an Animi, whiteout was the one who ended up retaining the genes in the tribe. And she showed no signs of being an Animi. We do not know (to my knowledge) whether her children were Animi, but I'm guessing that they were and the Animus gene often (but not always) skips a generation. I know nothing Abt genes but I'd guess that you could either have a higher chance of carrying a variant of the gene that skips a generation, or a variant that is more likely to be passed on to any of your children, aka darkstalker.
Snakes can be safely inbred for a few generations, like 3 or so, and since dragons are also reptiles its possible. But after several generations of inbreeding like 6, 7+ snakes get deformities and such
@@StormgemThunder I don't know for snakes, but I know that in birds (who technically are dinosaurs and so reptiles because dinosaurs are their ancestors), at least one specie come from incest. It was due to hybridism, most of them being fertile and impossibly to find partner of one of their parents species. They did nearly go extinct because deformity, though, if I remember correctly. But yeah, they're weird things. Now, they could be related relatively far apart, which mean the black scales may be there more by luck than inbridding, knowing the apparence seems to be determined by the mom. (Typhon is a good counter-exemple of that, but we have... 5 confirmed hybrids outside of hivewing's ancestors, so conclusion [even "mother traits are generally dominants in dragons"] is based on to little datas)
I recon that the hivewings are so deformed that they don't even know what deformed looks like in the tribe. They have existed for 2000 years. They've probably accepted it as a new normal.
@@greattexanbluedragon2773 I'll try not to but it'll probably be a random thing that pops into my brain for the next month. I only wish things like people's names or answers to schoolwork would do that.
The plothole i'm most frustrated about is pyrrhia scale. Like WTF? It is too small for all the dragons. And where are different cities and villages other than castles? And why desert is next to ice kingdom? Where is tundra or something like this?
For the Hivewing incest, maybe that is why they have skinnier wings, or the strange nose horn despite niether nightwings or silkwings having one. And maybe that is why they have thier strange hivewing powers. (like the vemom spraying stinger, or the poisonous wrists.)
Beetlewings actually had venom like rainwings , and also,clearsight had dragonets with beetlewings ,not silkwings , meaning tht it is entirely possible that hivewings just got the nose horn from beetlewings , and that silkwings just lost it and didnt get it from the betlewings , and also same with the venom.
@@claireleibel7106 Hmm, maybe when she lays a clutch of eggs she goes at it again to make more? That's the only explanation i can come up with. Having several clutches in a day.
Very good and interesting video! I enjoyed hearing about the science parts of Hivewings, and was honestly wondering how they would even have black scales at this point lol. I hope that Tui decides to eventually tie some of these plot holes up, as they can take away from the story sometimes.
I think for the stonemover one, the reason he never made the volcano dormant were because 2 reasons. 1. the nightwings didn't want him to go insane, and 2. the nightwing population would skyrocket and there wouldn't be much more space on the island.
Also, didn't they meet when Stonemover was picking out a place for the tunnel, meaning Thorn wasn't the reason the NightWings were building there in the first place... ?
Based on the drawing of smolder and flower , a dragons wingspan is about 100 feet and 18-20 feet so darkstalkers wingspan should be around 300 to 350 feet , and around 60 to 65 feet tall.
There's something I dislike about the idea of Sky being trans, and not because I'm biased or something. I feel like we know too much about his early life to be able to say that. I always felt like Peril, being the twin with less backstory should be the transgender one. Unlike Sky, she had lived in a dragon society that could make her realize how she wanted to be percieved, aside from being a murder machine of course. If I remember correctly from Dragonslayer, Wren started gendering Sky before she could speak to him, so I assume his biological sex was male. Overall, maybe I just prefer having their genders as a plothole, since they were clearly meant to be different genders from the start and that was simply an oopsie from Tui. The retconning of Peril's or Sky's gender would just stink of JK Rowling to me, and her twitter revelations about Dumbledore's sex life. But if Tui decides on making one of them trans, I hope she will put the right amount of effort into portraying a trans person. I'm sure she can do that, but I'm still worried, since she is cis and cis people are often unable to fathom the sole concept of being trans. And I'm not saying that as an insult, that's a fact and it's definitely going to be very hard for her to write, especially if she'll write a trans Sky-centered book. Which most likely will happen, because what is the point of having a trans character in a background with their transness as trivia? If Sky will become trans, he'll get a winglet at the very least. And I'm worried about the execution of a story like that, it can either be too surface-level, like an encyclopedia description of what is happening, or can go deeper than than it should, tackling to many emotions at once and turning a book into a mess.
How does darkstalker know that dragons are speaking under several layers of rock- I guess he could pick it out from their thoughts but how would he tell that they are talking? It just escapes my mind
1:42 they were still a fruit before- now they're just bigger. you can't say "the size of a fruit" when its already a fruit and therefore, the size of a fruit.
For the sky part: eggs in real life are from different embryos so there is a possibility for faternal twins like in a clutch another channal had fastenal snakes from the same egg.
If i remember correctly, SilkWings and HiveWings used to be able to be together until ~500 years ago in the series, which is still meh but definetly better than 2000. Please correct me if i'm wrong!
@@ryoko7778 Yes, i know! But Lady Scarab mentions that HiveWings and SilkWings could be couples 500 years ago before it became forbidden, and since SilkWings (at least most of them) can't be traced back to Clearsight, it wouldn't be too bad. But still, it did become illegal for the tribes to be together, so that's about 500 years of only inbreeding, which isn't that great, but still beats 2000 years
4:01 I think I have an Idea, Stone mover First has a girlfriend in the sad kingdom and second the tunnel might be for getting to the sand kingdom once blister is queen, and why tunnels? If he saved the whole island he would turn to stone at that moment also No nightwing wants to make that long flight so tunnels are more useful.
@@ryoko7778 that's to big for him, I think he did the tunnels before the stone curs, changing the whole island is worthless if he will just kill everyone on it.
I don’t think he meant that literally XD. I plus think that was in response to Darkstalker healing him (from Flame’s attack) and accidentally removing the stone from him + healing the curse.
couldn’t darkstalker have said “I enchant this dragon to have the same DNA and functioning brain and appearance as clear sight, to bring back her sentience, to inherit all of her physical traits, both internal and external, and to maintain the memories of the moment before we left to find Arctic.” or “i enchant the restrictions of animus to loosen, and to have free reign of my power.” Couldn’t Jerboa have said “I enchant any spells Jerboa put on me to cease, with the exception being any that keep me alive.” couldn’t turtle and anemone and dark stalker overrode each other with animus? “I enchant him to die” “I enchant myself to not die” “I enchant any spell darkstalker cast in the past minute to cease to work”. what’s with the overcomplicated “hey, let’s do earrings and not just overlap his magic”? If Fathom and Indigo were right and your soul is based off of your actions, not magic usage, which was kind of the whole moral of the book Darkstalker, then they should be fine.
I think something you need to think about is that dragons aren't perfect in the Wings of Fire world, think about how hard it is to get a spell perfectly right. Also, they made the earrings because they didn't want to use magic that would waste away the Turtle's or Anemone's souls, and they didn't know about the whole "your soul is based off of your actions" at the time, they were being careful because the myth that magic wastes away your soul no matter what was still going around.
The thing with animus magic and the “I enchant [Someone] not to die, no matter what” then someone else saying, “I enchant [Same person] to die” Is really confusing, but how I picture it is, if you enchant something first then enchant it to do the opposite what you said. It would only follow the first command But What do I know
@@kleo6868 I get what you're saying, Tui said something about that a dragon with more experience in animus magic would override another dragon's spell with less experience. But I've never seen an example of this in the series, so who knows, lol.
Boa wanted to just live her life out as a regular dragon. She didn’t want to be immortal anymore. She cast a spell to reset her lifespan. Almost as if after she made that spell she was a newborn dragonet. She would be able to live the entire lifespan of an average dragon from that point on until she dies from old age or a natural death. Only thing is, she wasn’t a newborn dragonet, she still had all her past memories, even the one from when she was immortal. Her lifespan was just set back if she was a newborn dragonet with no prior immortality spells cast on her
after reading book 8-10 for the millionth time i realised that turtle could just enchant his powers to be more powerful than darkstalkers then he could do something
At the end of book 10 Dark stalker is able to read Qibli’s mind despite him having the skyfire when dark stalker says “one thing I like about you is that your brain goes clickidy click and we can get to the fun interesting bits.”
Well, Hivewings weren't their own tribe till 500 years before the current books. During that time beta Hivewings could have breed with beta silkwings since they were considered the same tribe. But then they divided when the Hivewings decided to do so. So for 2500 years the Hivewings could have been breeding with no problems. But then they separated and by breeding amongst themselves they probably got their iconic features. Plus we humans have a similar thing with things such our traits. For example, the mutation for blue eyes happened long ago, and now enough time and genetic shuffling has happened so that two people with blue eyes can get together and not a deformed spawn. I'm more surprised inbreeding isn't a problem for tribes like the nightwings, mudwings or Icewings. Nightwings have low numbers and probaby have too much pride to breed with other tribes or the dragonets are being catered to have dragonets with anyone who isn't a first cousin. Given how mudwings don't even know who their fathers are, we don't know if they know who their cousins are on the dad's side. I can imagine them maybe asking if their potential mate knew their parent's to make sure, bit I doubt it. And with the Icewings and their class system being so strict, they might prefer to breed in their circle, which might be limited.
The biggest plot hole I’ve ever found is how did the Icewing royalty continue without animus magic? In Darkstalker legends they said glacier had a daughter, so how come they don’t have magic? Was it just a coincidence that they don’t have magic? If so, could they really not have an animus in 2 thousand years? You could say it’s because Arctic ran off, but that wouldn’t make sense because the Seawings had two animi recently, both from queen coral, who is definitely not an animus.
There's a chance for an animus to be born if their father was one, dosnt mean there's a 100% chance, so maybe it's just extremely bad luck that they haven't had an ice wing animus. As for turtle and anemone, turtle enchanted her to be an animus to avoid the test thing. Not sorry for the spoilers, the book has been out for how ever long now, you had time to read it.
Idk if someone’s already talked about this- but the dream 👏 visitors 👏 it’s another size issue, in the books/in the comic starflight is seen with the dream visitor and it’s about the size of the palm of his hand- but in DragonSlayer on the cover we see the dream visitor being really small- small enough for a human to hold it. Why would Darkstalker make two Dream Visitors with such a dramatic size difference? It can easily be crushed or lost.
Another dreamvisitor plothole: we know canonically that Darkstalker created them...but in The Dark Secret Starflight says they were made by a SandWing animus. Why.
All hive-wings can are from clear sight, there isn’t any beetle wings also the reason sunny doesn’t have black scales is because the mother in wings of fire is the dominant gene, that’s why sunny is a sand-night not night-sand, the reason hive-wings don’t have to many black scales is just because of the way scales are in wings of fire like genes it’s pretty much hair colour, like bumblebee (I think, maybe some other hive-wing) is shown with mostly black with the yellow stripes
And also that scientifically. Most bee’s are related to eachother so, Hivewings make sense to be written as inbred- it’s still weird but there is a real world reason for it to translate into wings of fire.
About the egg stuff, there was a twin egg hatching I saw on RUclips where the resulting chicks grew up into a hen and a rooster. It's possible, it's just way rarer. Also just because there's some uncomfortable implications about this or that, it doesn't mean the story is bad. Just look at Game of Thrones for even being okay despite it being in the forefront. Even then, lot of real-life people are descended from European royals, which usually had some uncomfortable inbreeding in them. Even in 1800s semi-rural America, it was common practice to marry your cousin to keep the power in the family.
About the animus part, I have come up with rules that would (hopefully) make animi less OP: 1. Animi cannot resurrect dead dragons. 2. Animi cannot give/remove another dragon’s animus powers. 3. Enchantments only work on objects. You cannot enchant a living being. 4. Animus magic cannot directly kill a dragon (ex. You could make a dragon wear an object that makes their lifespan shorter or gradually gives them a serious disease, but you can’t kill or make a dragon kill themself directly). 5. Animi cannot change a dragon’s personality. They can make them more prone to trusting the magic user and other similar acts, but you can’t make a dragon into another dragon (ex. Darkstalker trying to make Fierceteeth into Clearsight). 6. The more powerful the spell, the higher toll it takes on the magic user (I’d think the toll would be physical and/or mental well-being. For example, an animus that gave another dragon a fatal disease would get severely ill, and perhaps die as well). 7. Animi cannot make themselves immortal. They could increase their lifespan drastically (like Jerboa), but cannot live forever. 8. Animi cannot make themselves entirely immune to attacks. They can make their scales stronger or heal faster (with an object, of course), but cannot dodge the injury entirely. Also, about the HiveWing incest. I headcannon that more NightWings fled to Pantala after Clearsight, and that’s why HiveWings aren’t inbred. One thing I see NO ONE talking about is that the Guide to the Dragon World says that some RainWings and SeaWings fled to Pantala alongside the Beetle- and LeafWings…
UHG at least you actually gave us a choice to listen to the science stuff, I get so upset when people cut out the most INTERESTING PART when explaining things! Genes and biology are so cool! Why would I SKIP IT! So thank you for not just cutting it out and acting like you're doing us a "favor" lol
(I'M SORRY IF I SOUND LIKE AN IDIOT I DON'T KNOW IF I REMEMBERED CORRECTLYYYYYY) I've got to mention that Hivewings bred with Silkwings (RIGHT?) till a Queen in history declared them big enough to be their own tribe, separating the tribes and making them now able to reproduce the yellow and black patterns. The black and yellow is probably a result of the black slowly becoming a less dominant gene and yellow starting to come through more?? idk if this solves it though, but i thought it was good to mention that the hivewings didn't just come from Clearsight and her mates, but also her offspring breeding with silkwings.
One plothole that I have noticed while reading is the books (especially book 1), is how MudWing reproduction and MudWing royalty do not align at all. First of all, if MudWing parents do not meet their children at all, then how are royal MudWings supposed to know about their heirs? And even if there is a system for royal MudWing dragonet identification, then how do the royal MudWing groups even gain their way up to the throne? Do they fight the other royal groups for the throne? The only theory I have that can sort this whole thing out is that only the MudWing queen is allowed to have dragonets, while the rest of her sibling group is not allowed. But if this is the case, isn't that a bit immoral to the MudWing queen's siblings? And if they are allowed, then how would've the MudWing heir crisis that was mentioned in book 8 even happened in the first place? Wouldn't the queen's siblings have had many other dragonets, and thus many more heirs? MudWings are pretty weird, huh?
I think darkstalker is about 90ft and the average (fully grown) dragon being about 30-40ft (on average) I think that’s probably the best size estimate I can think of so that’s one plot hole filled as for everything else I’m not sure . So filled have way so a plot gap
The reason Onyx came to jade mountain is because she had nowhere left to go it’s mentioned once or twice in the books (I think) the dragonets said dragons who have no where else to go could live there Onyx might have just joined the school because she was by herself for a long time and probably wanted to interact with others or was just bored Also the trans sky thing same thing with smoulder and blister their twins so same thing with them right?
I think this is more of a mistake rather than a plot hole, but in on of the books I BELEIVE book 15, Tsunami was said to have blue blood TWICE even though in the graphic novels she has red blood, it has never been mentioned in the books before at all, and IceWings are supposed to be the only tribe with blue blood. How after all this time does tsunami have blue blood???
Another tinier plot hole, in book 12, either Tau or Cinnabar had a few black scales according to Cricket. The problem is that they are both silkwings, and the guid to the dragons of pantala states that silkwing scales can be any color but black. My only conclusion is that either she or someone she descended from, was a silkwing hivewing hybrid and passed on those genes, but that seems very unlikely to me.
the best explaination of the Hivewings situation is the fact they didn't really inbreed as much as people think taking on beetlewing/Silkwing mate themselves and likely within clearsights lifetime considering dragons reach maturity at about 7 years a stable hive wing population was formed without the need to inbreed to the point of genetic deformity. and the practise of full tribal separation from the Beeltewings/Silkwings is actually only about 500 years old making the Hivewings actually a rather young tribe and it is this point (approx 4500AS) that they begin to breed within their own tribe exclusively, I'm not sure if genetic dominance can be based on the gender of the parent but that may be a partial explanation why black markings are present in modern hivewings but sunny isn't all black as sunny gestated within a sandwing and was born from a sandwing egg (I looked it up and X-Based Dominant inheretence is a thing). assuming gender plays a role Genetic dominance of black scales it stands to reason especially with female dragons that the trait would survive longer and potentially long enough to propagate a stable genetic base all with the trait to some strength (see bumblebee being very black). though even with 1500 years of genetic diversity in the population having at least one line linking right back to a single individual only 2000 years back and not actively adding more divisity for 500 years of that may lead to some genetic issues given recency however I think that given the tribes didn't exist till the scorching similar but less prominent issues would exist in all tribes (though hybrids likely fix this to some extent) so the Hivewings and just more susceptible to genetic problems, not about to go full Hapsburg
I've noticed something in darkstalker legends (please do not continue reading if you haven't read the book! ⚠) Seawing blood is known to be blue (ofc ✨) though, when queen Lagoon died tui described her passing as: "Fathom turned, thinking he'd seen a flash of silver in the air, and then a line of red sliced slowly, darkly, murderously across Queen Lagoon's throat" as you can tell via the paragraph, her blood was red, not blue as described in the rest of the books-
Another explanation for the aging is that they have different personalities. In the real world, some 12 year olds are much more mature, while some are a lot less. There can be a large variety in maturity, as while people do mature while they get older, they do so starting from different places and at different rates. When I was 12, I didn't relate to or act much like other 12 year olds. People usually thought I was older than I was. I didn't have many friends for that reason. On the other hand, when my uncle was 14, he acted more like a 12 year old. He matured slower. It just goes to show how much of a difference there can be between individuals. This would apply to dragons as well. Even in my currently friend group (I'm 19, and our friend group includes people from 16-22) the oldest person in our friend group (She's 22) seems to act the least mature lack a lot of emotional intelligence compared to everyone else. The person who's most mature, on the other hand, is 19, she's the same age as me.
according to my brother: paper (fire and stuff :p) me: there are references to modern books in wings of fire, although the dragons are likely technologically, in the middle ages
Wait, according to my science teacher inbreeding is how species are created. (Which is really gross) Also, a new species created in a little less that 2.000 years? How is that possible
Ne species are actually usually msde by animals mutating before birth , or 2 related species breeding enough thimes that eventualy the offspring are a different species , and that wouldnt take that long.
I can explain the plot hole of why they created a tunnel to the Sandwing stronghold. The plan was with Sandwing help to take over the forest but when the tunnel was made the Nightwings hadn't decided which Sandwing princess they wanted to win.
I remember Turle imagining Darkstalker as "four times the size of the largest dragon he'd seen" or something like that- maybe "average adult dragon" or something like that but then I see people depicting Moon as, like, up to his shoulders? Like what Additionally, one of the NightWings said in book 4 or 5 that the SandWing tunnel was there so that once Blister became queen, the SandWing tribe could easily assist them to take over the rainforest.
2:15 the plotholes through the "law of conservation" go sooooo much deeper then just darkstalker growing despite being asleep with no nutrients. Sandwings release heat, a form of energy, which makes no sense considering they are said to be able to survive off of little food, despite clearly emitting the most energy out of any tribe as heat. The ice wings on the other side of the spectrum, should barely have to eat with the amount of energy they absorb by taking heat out the air. Don't even start with peril. Having scales that are hot enough to cut chains that are fire proof by acident? bruh she should be dead within minutes of not eating.
Let’s just suspend our disbelief for some time. The very existence of dragons isn’t feasible. We have to accept that they’re probably not going to be scientifically possible. It’s a common problem in Fantasy and sci fi
For the HiveWing one, black scales ARE NOT the dominant trait, it's that mothers in Wings of Fire have the dominant genes instead of fathers, that's why Darkstalker and Whiteout had mostly black scales, Foeslayer had the dominant genes.
for the dominant black scales thing, maybe sunny doesnt have black scales cause he nightwing parent is male, and the mother's traits are more dominant.
not exactly a plot hole, but its strange how sandwings can live off of a lot less food whole having venom in their tail and being able to sustain powered flight. basically sandwings would have to east twice as often as other dragons because venom is expense for an animal to make, especially if they regularly use said venom, which it seems the sandwings do. not pointing out rainwings or hivewings because they could eat more than normal for dragons, and it seems rainwings don't use their venom often, at least compared to sandwings, but hey its a fantasy series, maybe their metabolism works totally differently.
1. hybrid innertribale breeding 2. sunnys ancestery she was decended from whiteout because of her dad so does that mean there will be animuses in the sandwing "royal' bloodline 3.rainwings there simple but the one the used venom on that nightwing(sorry i forgot the name) so why didnt the others use threse 4. silkwings they used to have the "naturl " powers like the hivewings do so why not anymore
twins are not always the same gender, itentical twins are, but if two differnt eggs get fertlised at once you have twins that can be male and female. i always asumed two embroes ended up in the same egg and thats how perils female and Skys male. though some freak mutation
@@forest_beans4673 or Peril is trans, it could be either. I don't think it would make sense for Sky to be trans because he never grew up with any cultural or sociatal perception of gender or any gender norms, so he wouldn't really know that he's born in the wrong body. Peril, on the other hand, was raised within society so she would have an understanding of gender.
Sky wouldn't be trance because of the fact that they call him a male even before they meet adult sky and I'm sure he didn’t decide to be a male at birth
All HiveWings being related is something a lot of people have with the books, but technically, if the genetic goes WAY way back, it won’t even matter if it’s the same genetics. ANYONE in the world with blue eyes are related to one common ancestor, 10000 years ago. My parents both have blue eyes. Technically they are related, but again, it’s so far back it won’t matter.
Why does no one understand that sky and peril are not identical twins they come from the same egg but two different embryos you know when you crack open an egg and you can get multiple yokes same thing here this really bugs me when people don't think farther into this
when did they mention that 2 dragons in the same egg had to be the same gender (like what number in the books) i curious. and if your comparing it to humans i have a twin brother my self. But i get we din’t come from the same egg sooooooooo……
It still would not make sense if sky was trans. When sky comes out of his egg he was male. And if he WAS trans, then he changed genders basically when human children are in the womb. It would make much more sense if Peril is trans because her gender when she hatched was not said.
Why did Clearsight have so many husbands? Why couldn’t she just calm down? I doubt many of her children were truly loved (or noticed) by their mother. I don’t really like her. That’s the main reason why I don’t like her.
Maybe the reason Darkstalker got so gargantuan is simply because, since dragons are reptiles, he just kept growing as the years went on.
Since reptiles are best known for the fact that they never truly stop growing.
Sure, their growth slows considerably when they reach maturity.
But Darkstalker was in hibernation for 2 millennia. Anything after that point would be humongous.
Oh! That was what I assumed.
Plus he is an animagus he probably would have something
Yeah, Tui, has confirmed that dragons don’t stop growing as they grow older. I think 4rcane was talking more about the inconsistently with his size and other dragons.
Except not in the conditions he would have been in. Alligators at the very least experience stunted growth if they spend several years in confined spaces. Darkstalker also had no nutrient intake and we only know his immortal just keeps him alive not feeding him. Oh if he was being fed and had space, he could have grown so big.
I assumed it was like a Game of thrones thing. They keep growing no matter how old they are
A plothole i noticed during a reread of book 12, (Please scroll away from this to avoid spoilers if you haven't read books 11-13!) Is that when they were burning the green house full of The Breath of Evil, wouldn't they have inhaled it and then Wasp could control them? Because when Blue and Swordtail inhaled the smoke in book 13, Wasp got them.
That bit of breath of evil was part of the branch hawthorn modified to only affect hivewings.
@@Tametable Oh, yea, but still wouldn't it have affected Cricket or any guards nearby? I don't remember much from my last re-read ;-;
@@AllHallowsEve223 I 'think' that cricket was far enough away from the greenhouse, and the gaurds nearby were already injected with the breath of evil from birth
That was the modified variant not the original
I reread it yesterday and actually in crickets book when they burnt it basically said “They got away before the smoke got to them.” Soooo no
When you were talking about genes you mentioned sunmy should have had black scales, but I believe that tui confirmed that dominant genes come from the mother. Wich actually makes less sense with Hivewings, because I personally believe that they look more like beetlewings then nightwings. But I suppose that instead of the beetle/night hybrids doing it with other nightwings, they did it with other beetlewings wich would make them more beetle-like then night-like.
Silkwings actually look more nightwing-like then Hivewings, which is strange to me.
Hive wings aren't half NightWing though, and aren't even hybrids. They've been without any new NightWing genes for 2 millenia, so obviously they'll fade over time. Which is why Sunny doesn't really show any icewing traits
@@jaspergrey4172
I think you misunderstood what i said. Because that's true, and I explained that because of that reason, Hivewings would look more like beetlewings then nightwings.
@@floofyfloof720 ah, youre right. sorry!
@@jaspergrey4172
Nah it's ok ^^
I do the exact same thing all the time...
@@floofyfloof720 Clearsight must’ve had female dragonets which had black scales and those dragons had other females and on and on eventually resulting in the whole HiveWing tribe having some black scales
the inbreeding is not a problem since they had 1.5 thousand years before it would be split into a different tribe but black scales yes
One of the plot hole : *Hiving incest*
Case of new species IRL comming from incest between hybrids : guess we're out
Like, that's a possibility
One small detail. Twins from the same egg CAN be be different genders. And that's just with irl reptiles, so no not a plot hole just misinformation about reptiles.
The plot hole I noticed that bothers me most is in the book 14 when Wren says, “We call ourselves humans” in the dragon language. This is problematic because when Wren learned a word in dragon from Sky in Dragonslayer, she had to point to it and get told what the word was. Therefore, she would think that the dragon word for human is pronounced “scavenger.” How did she come up with the word “human” in the dragon language? The only ideas I can come up with are that perhaps she told them the word “human” in the human language. She is comfortable switching between languages but this just seems like an extra level of complication that wouldn’t work for dragons. I assume letter sounds and word spellings are not consistent between the two languages so she couldn’t have spelled it out. Let me know if this makes any sense or if you noticed this!
Huh true I never thought of that before. That is definitely a plot hole
Tui mentioned one time that everything is dragon-sized, but the sizes are still inconsistent anyways. With Stonemover, I think he did not make the plans for the tunnels himself, I think he was ordered to do so by Morrowseer and Battlewinner as part of the plan to take over the rainforest, but I do agree, why would you go with the plan involving genocide, kidnapping, torture, keeping a world war going, and more, when there was an easy way to fix all your problems without it? Agreed about Onyx and the HiveWings mostly. I do think that the way Anemone and Mink were raised was a big part of how mature they are since Anemone basically was not given the chance to have a childhood, she wasn't allowed to complain, play with other dragonets, leave her mother's side, or anything, while Glacier loved Mink and tried to make her as happy as possible, but the aging thing is inconsistent. The plothole that bothers me the most is that the HiveWings burned down a forest continent (Tui said it was all forest before the war) and it somehow became a savannah with savannah animals with no negative side effects besides angry LeafWings.
I also apologize if I sound nit-picky I love Wings of Fire and reading interviews from Tui!
I THOUGHT ABOUT THE INBREEDING SO MUCH AS WELL
I KEPT THINKING “wait but if Clearsight had dragonets with a bunch of other dragons and they soon became a tribe does that mean they bred with each other or did they mate with other red/orange/yellow SilkWings?????”
In the books Clearsite Had dragonets with one beetle wing and those Dragonets had Dragnet with her sisters and brothers and so on and so forth
my personal headcanon is that Clearsight had dragonets with like a dozen different beetlewings
i'm surprised you didn't mention bumblebee's size, in the book she's able to be tossed around by a human which, according to the graphic novels, are around the size of a large banana (and in the books, one of the humans can comfortably stand on sky's head (unless i'm misremembering))? and in those same graphic novels, newborn dragonets are also around that size (like when we saw auklet hatch) but much thicker
The graphic novels arent 100% accurate
Graphic novel…? No a graphic novel has pictures, they don’t have those out yet, unless I’ve somehow been in coma for SEVEN years and didn’t notice
@@Louisechristensen517 the graphic novels for the first arc is out atm i believe, if other arcs have been started then idk them
Dragon grow faster than we expected in the books sky was the size of a small rabbit and wren could hold him on her shoulders it was only till a year or two when he got to her hip
And also sky is 6 or 7 now and skywings are one of the biggest tribes so it easy to say wren can stand on his head
What’s weird to me is how sunny isn’t an animus dragon. If you think about it, Darkstalker’s father was an animus, and one of his children had animus blood. Well, stonemover only have 1 child, so all his animus blood would go to hero’s that narrows it down to one question, why isn’t Sunny an animus?
Animus isn't guaranteed in the offspring. I believe animus is recessive, so that would mean not every offspring of an animus dragon will be an animus too. it's possible for the grandchildren to be animus, but that isn't guaranteed either.
Yeah, the animus is Recessive which means it can be carried down for generations before a dragon has the powers. So sunny still has the animus trait but it is dormant and the dominant “not animus” trait is covering it up, it hard to explain without getting all scientific but if sunny had a dragonet it could be a animus and if that dragonet had a child it could be a animus and so on and so on
Though only darkstalker was an Animi, whiteout was the one who ended up retaining the genes in the tribe. And she showed no signs of being an Animi. We do not know (to my knowledge) whether her children were Animi, but I'm guessing that they were and the Animus gene often (but not always) skips a generation.
I know nothing Abt genes but I'd guess that you could either have a higher chance of carrying a variant of the gene that skips a generation, or a variant that is more likely to be passed on to any of your children, aka darkstalker.
Rebuttal: maybe dragons are immune to weird inbreeding side effects
If that's so, there would be more mudwing offspring
@@jamesng3652 Or venon test in Rainwings wouldn't be a thing
Snakes can be safely inbred for a few generations, like 3 or so, and since dragons are also reptiles its possible. But after several generations of inbreeding like 6, 7+ snakes get deformities and such
@@StormgemThunder I don't know for snakes, but I know that in birds (who technically are dinosaurs and so reptiles because dinosaurs are their ancestors), at least one specie come from incest. It was due to hybridism, most of them being fertile and impossibly to find partner of one of their parents species. They did nearly go extinct because deformity, though, if I remember correctly.
But yeah, they're weird things. Now, they could be related relatively far apart, which mean the black scales may be there more by luck than inbridding, knowing the apparence seems to be determined by the mom. (Typhon is a good counter-exemple of that, but we have... 5 confirmed hybrids outside of hivewing's ancestors, so conclusion [even "mother traits are generally dominants in dragons"] is based on to little datas)
@@StormgemThunder I was gonna mention snakes! Thank you!
I recon that the hivewings are so deformed that they don't even know what deformed looks like in the tribe. They have existed for 2000 years. They've probably accepted it as a new normal.
Yeah, like humans have accepted pugs snouts as normal
That’s what I think. And technically I’m pretty sure that’s what’s happened with humans too 👀
@@greattexanbluedragon2773 ? Which human traits in particular?
@@beybladerkid5489 idk I’m kinda dumb and don’t think about it too much 😳😅
@@greattexanbluedragon2773 I'll try not to but it'll probably be a random thing that pops into my brain for the next month. I only wish things like people's names or answers to schoolwork would do that.
HiveWings multiply like rabbits so im Guessing, GUESSING, that there were so many other dragons were like its a new tribe!!
The plothole i'm most frustrated about is pyrrhia scale. Like WTF? It is too small for all the dragons. And where are different cities and villages other than castles? And why desert is next to ice kingdom? Where is tundra or something like this?
Yea how can they cross the desert in less than a day? Even flying, it should take them at least a couple of days.
@@5rcane Well, Webs is master of that. He flew half of Phyrria there and back in a few hours.
@@VesperCatLover webs is secretly sonic
@@frostmint3584 oh shi-
@@VesperCatLover *gotta go fast*
For the Hivewing incest, maybe that is why they have skinnier wings, or the strange nose horn despite niether nightwings or silkwings having one. And maybe that is why they have thier strange hivewing powers. (like the vemom spraying stinger, or the poisonous wrists.)
Beetlewings actually had venom like rainwings , and also,clearsight had dragonets with beetlewings ,not silkwings , meaning tht it is entirely possible that hivewings just got the nose horn from beetlewings , and that silkwings just lost it and didnt get it from the betlewings , and also same with the venom.
"The largest litter that we know of that isn't from MudWings is three."
Me: Queen Coral begs to differ.
She had a lot of dragonets, but they weren't ALL in the same litter. If i remember correctly, she only had two dragonets at a time.
@@munkin8144 True true, but honestly? That shouldn't be physically possible unless she had more than three in a few litters.
@@claireleibel7106 Yeah, i agree with that.
@@munkin8144 Seriously though, how? Coral, you have 32 sons and 3 daughters, not counting the ones who died. Why?
@@claireleibel7106 Hmm, maybe when she lays a clutch of eggs she goes at it again to make more? That's the only explanation i can come up with. Having several clutches in a day.
Very good and interesting video! I enjoyed hearing about the science parts of Hivewings, and was honestly wondering how they would even have black scales at this point lol. I hope that Tui decides to eventually tie some of these plot holes up, as they can take away from the story sometimes.
Ugh yea. Tui is a great author but her worldbuilding falls flat
would be super fucking dope if hivewings being clearsights descendants is another lie
@@susiepilled good god yeah. the gasps around the book store as everyone’s flipping through the pages for spoilers. insane
I think for the stonemover one, the reason he never made the volcano dormant were because 2 reasons. 1. the nightwings didn't want him to go insane, and 2. the nightwing population would skyrocket and there wouldn't be much more space on the island.
wasnt it described that stonemover made the sand kingdom one to be near Thorn? idk I could be remembering wrong, it's been a really long time
It was stated in the books that the sand tunnel was created so whoever the nightwings sided with could assist them in taking over the rainforest.
Also, didn't they meet when Stonemover was picking out a place for the tunnel, meaning Thorn wasn't the reason the NightWings were building there in the first place... ?
Based on the drawing of smolder and flower , a dragons wingspan is about 100 feet and 18-20 feet so darkstalkers wingspan should be around 300 to 350 feet , and around 60 to 65 feet tall.
There's something I dislike about the idea of Sky being trans, and not because I'm biased or something. I feel like we know too much about his early life to be able to say that. I always felt like Peril, being the twin with less backstory should be the transgender one. Unlike Sky, she had lived in a dragon society that could make her realize how she wanted to be percieved, aside from being a murder machine of course. If I remember correctly from Dragonslayer, Wren started gendering Sky before she could speak to him, so I assume his biological sex was male.
Overall, maybe I just prefer having their genders as a plothole, since they were clearly meant to be different genders from the start and that was simply an oopsie from Tui. The retconning of Peril's or Sky's gender would just stink of JK Rowling to me, and her twitter revelations about Dumbledore's sex life. But if Tui decides on making one of them trans, I hope she will put the right amount of effort into portraying a trans person. I'm sure she can do that, but I'm still worried, since she is cis and cis people are often unable to fathom the sole concept of being trans. And I'm not saying that as an insult, that's a fact and it's definitely going to be very hard for her to write, especially if she'll write a trans Sky-centered book. Which most likely will happen, because what is the point of having a trans character in a background with their transness as trivia? If Sky will become trans, he'll get a winglet at the very least. And I'm worried about the execution of a story like that, it can either be too surface-level, like an encyclopedia description of what is happening, or can go deeper than than it should, tackling to many emotions at once and turning a book into a mess.
How does darkstalker know that dragons are speaking under several layers of rock- I guess he could pick it out from their thoughts but how would he tell that they are talking? It just escapes my mind
He hears them thinking that the other is talking maybe?
1:42 they were still a fruit before- now they're just bigger. you can't say "the size of a fruit" when its already a fruit and therefore, the size of a fruit.
Blue BERRY
@@daviddenardi3886 a berry, is in fact, a fruit
Bananas are a berry and they are a bit big i guess
For the sky part: eggs in real life are from different embryos so there is a possibility for faternal twins like in a clutch another channal had fastenal snakes from the same egg.
Wow, I would've thought you had thousands of subscribers, your editing, your art is awesome!
If i remember correctly, SilkWings and HiveWings used to be able to be together until ~500 years ago in the series, which is still meh but definetly better than 2000.
Please correct me if i'm wrong!
I think by then their gene pool has expanded at that point and 500 years is just 5-10 generations
Hivewing were created by clear sight and that darkstalkers girlfriend so it has to be at least 2000 years.
@@ryoko7778
Yes, i know! But Lady Scarab mentions that HiveWings and SilkWings could be couples 500 years ago before it became forbidden, and since SilkWings (at least most of them) can't be traced back to Clearsight, it wouldn't be too bad.
But still, it did become illegal for the tribes to be together, so that's about 500 years of only inbreeding, which isn't that great, but still beats 2000 years
i rember that to were lady scarab said " my grandmother ( or somthing like that) finaly stopped that mingling in the blood lines
when you were talking about genes i had flashbacks to learning about genes in science class recently
4:01 I think I have an Idea, Stone mover First has a girlfriend in the sad kingdom and second the tunnel might be for getting to the sand kingdom once blister is queen, and why tunnels? If he saved the whole island he would turn to stone at that moment also No nightwing wants to make that long flight so tunnels are more useful.
Stonemover could of recreated the whole island so they could live in peace and property
@@ryoko7778 that's to big for him, I think he did the tunnels before the stone curs, changing the whole island is worthless if he will just kill everyone on it.
another plot hole is
why cant animus enchant themselfs to not go insane?
I'm pretty sure several animus dragons have tried!
@@citrineleaf1815 mhm
dragons are confirmed to mature at 7 and they didn't get together until glory was 7
@@almostjay159 yeah i learned this recently im gonna edit my comment to not spread missinfo
didn't Darkstalker and Fathom try that but it didn't work for Darkstalker
Stonemover made himself stone bc his talons acted like someone else’s not his own
I don’t think he meant that literally XD. I plus think that was in response to Darkstalker healing him (from Flame’s attack) and accidentally removing the stone from him + healing the curse.
I agree with you, 4crane.
That what I mean lol
@@allisonthompson1984 you mean if stone mover turned his talons into stone again? That was dark stalker, not him.
@@zombiepuppu I haven’t read that book in a while so I am probably wrong I checked and your correct
Maybe sandwing scales are dominant over black scales, leading to Sunny's coloration, and the Hivewing pigment gene is recessive.
Just a thought
couldn’t darkstalker have said “I enchant this dragon to have the same DNA and functioning brain and appearance as clear sight, to bring back her sentience, to inherit all of her physical traits, both internal and external, and to maintain the memories of the moment before we left to find Arctic.” or “i enchant the restrictions of animus to loosen, and to have free reign of my power.”
Couldn’t Jerboa have said “I enchant any spells Jerboa put on me to cease, with the exception being any that keep me alive.”
couldn’t turtle and anemone and dark stalker overrode each other with animus? “I enchant him to die” “I enchant myself to not die” “I enchant any spell darkstalker cast in the past minute to cease to work”. what’s with the overcomplicated “hey, let’s do earrings and not just overlap his magic”? If Fathom and Indigo were right and your soul is based off of your actions, not magic usage, which was kind of the whole moral of the book Darkstalker, then they should be fine.
I think something you need to think about is that dragons aren't perfect in the Wings of Fire world, think about how hard it is to get a spell perfectly right. Also, they made the earrings because they didn't want to use magic that would waste away the Turtle's or Anemone's souls, and they didn't know about the whole "your soul is based off of your actions" at the time, they were being careful because the myth that magic wastes away your soul no matter what was still going around.
The thing with animus magic and the “I enchant [Someone] not to die, no matter what” then someone else saying, “I enchant [Same person] to die” Is really confusing, but how I picture it is, if you enchant something first then enchant it to do the opposite what you said. It would only follow the first command But What do I know
@@kleo6868 I get what you're saying, Tui said something about that a dragon with more experience in animus magic would override another dragon's spell with less experience. But I've never seen an example of this in the series, so who knows, lol.
Boa wanted to just live her life out as a regular dragon. She didn’t want to be immortal anymore. She cast a spell to reset her lifespan. Almost as if after she made that spell she was a newborn dragonet. She would be able to live the entire lifespan of an average dragon from that point on until she dies from old age or a natural death. Only thing is, she wasn’t a newborn dragonet, she still had all her past memories, even the one from when she was immortal. Her lifespan was just set back if she was a newborn dragonet with no prior immortality spells cast on her
after reading book 8-10 for the millionth time i realised that turtle could just enchant his powers to be more powerful than darkstalkers then he could do something
Yo! Love your content it was super nice to have as background noise, keep doing what you’re doing! New sub c:
Thanks, will do!
At the end of book 10 Dark stalker is able to read Qibli’s mind despite him having the skyfire when dark stalker says “one thing I like about you is that your brain goes clickidy click and we can get to the fun interesting bits.”
Well, Hivewings weren't their own tribe till 500 years before the current books. During that time beta Hivewings could have breed with beta silkwings since they were considered the same tribe. But then they divided when the Hivewings decided to do so. So for 2500 years the Hivewings could have been breeding with no problems. But then they separated and by breeding amongst themselves they probably got their iconic features. Plus we humans have a similar thing with things such our traits. For example, the mutation for blue eyes happened long ago, and now enough time and genetic shuffling has happened so that two people with blue eyes can get together and not a deformed spawn. I'm more surprised inbreeding isn't a problem for tribes like the nightwings, mudwings or Icewings. Nightwings have low numbers and probaby have too much pride to breed with other tribes or the dragonets are being catered to have dragonets with anyone who isn't a first cousin. Given how mudwings don't even know who their fathers are, we don't know if they know who their cousins are on the dad's side. I can imagine them maybe asking if their potential mate knew their parent's to make sure, bit I doubt it. And with the Icewings and their class system being so strict, they might prefer to breed in their circle, which might be limited.
For the darkstalker thing, it could be something with his enchantment or just dragon biology
Something just dawned on me, isn’t sunny a Sand-Night-Ice Hybrid? Plus she carry’s the animus gene, that’s just insane.
The biggest plot hole I’ve ever found is how did the Icewing royalty continue without animus magic? In Darkstalker legends they said glacier had a daughter, so how come they don’t have magic? Was it just a coincidence that they don’t have magic? If so, could they really not have an animus in 2 thousand years? You could say it’s because Arctic ran off, but that wouldn’t make sense because the Seawings had two animi recently, both from queen coral, who is definitely not an animus.
There's a chance for an animus to be born if their father was one, dosnt mean there's a 100% chance, so maybe it's just extremely bad luck that they haven't had an ice wing animus. As for turtle and anemone, turtle enchanted her to be an animus to avoid the test thing. Not sorry for the spoilers, the book has been out for how ever long now, you had time to read it.
ive been thinking about the hivewing incest stuff since i read that they were all descendants of clearsight, but ive never wanted to bring it up lmao
Idk if someone’s already talked about this- but the dream 👏 visitors 👏 it’s another size issue, in the books/in the comic starflight is seen with the dream visitor and it’s about the size of the palm of his hand- but in DragonSlayer on the cover we see the dream visitor being really small- small enough for a human to hold it. Why would Darkstalker make two Dream Visitors with such a dramatic size difference? It can easily be crushed or lost.
Another dreamvisitor plothole: we know canonically that Darkstalker created them...but in The Dark Secret Starflight says they were made by a SandWing animus. Why.
Well Hivewings are so distantly related that at that point I don’t think it matters. And the mom’s traits are more dominant in dragons.
All hive-wings can are from clear sight, there isn’t any beetle wings also the reason sunny doesn’t have black scales is because the mother in wings of fire is the dominant gene, that’s why sunny is a sand-night not night-sand, the reason hive-wings don’t have to many black scales is just because of the way scales are in wings of fire like genes it’s pretty much hair colour, like bumblebee (I think, maybe some other hive-wing) is shown with mostly black with the yellow stripes
Betcha for the hivewings Tui just got done watching bee movie, remembered the “we’re all cousins.” Part and then just plopped Hivewings into existence
And also that scientifically. Most bee’s are related to eachother so, Hivewings make sense to be written as inbred- it’s still weird but there is a real world reason for it to translate into wings of fire.
Darkstalker is an exception to the law of thermodynamics. He is immortal, does not need food, and therefore probably create his own energy.
About the egg stuff, there was a twin egg hatching I saw on RUclips where the resulting chicks grew up into a hen and a rooster. It's possible, it's just way rarer.
Also just because there's some uncomfortable implications about this or that, it doesn't mean the story is bad. Just look at Game of Thrones for even being okay despite it being in the forefront. Even then, lot of real-life people are descended from European royals, which usually had some uncomfortable inbreeding in them. Even in 1800s semi-rural America, it was common practice to marry your cousin to keep the power in the family.
About the animus part, I have come up with rules that would (hopefully) make animi less OP:
1. Animi cannot resurrect dead dragons.
2. Animi cannot give/remove another dragon’s animus powers.
3. Enchantments only work on objects. You cannot enchant a living being.
4. Animus magic cannot directly kill a dragon (ex. You could make a dragon wear an object that makes their lifespan shorter or gradually gives them a serious disease, but you can’t kill or make a dragon kill themself directly).
5. Animi cannot change a dragon’s personality. They can make them more prone to trusting the magic user and other similar acts, but you can’t make a dragon into another dragon (ex. Darkstalker trying to make Fierceteeth into Clearsight).
6. The more powerful the spell, the higher toll it takes on the magic user (I’d think the toll would be physical and/or mental well-being. For example, an animus that gave another dragon a fatal disease would get severely ill, and perhaps die as well).
7. Animi cannot make themselves immortal. They could increase their lifespan drastically (like Jerboa), but cannot live forever.
8. Animi cannot make themselves entirely immune to attacks. They can make their scales stronger or heal faster (with an object, of course), but cannot dodge the injury entirely.
Also, about the HiveWing incest. I headcannon that more NightWings fled to Pantala after Clearsight, and that’s why HiveWings aren’t inbred.
One thing I see NO ONE talking about is that the Guide to the Dragon World says that some RainWings and SeaWings fled to Pantala alongside the Beetle- and LeafWings…
UHG at least you actually gave us a choice to listen to the science stuff, I get so upset when people cut out the most INTERESTING PART when explaining things! Genes and biology are so cool! Why would I SKIP IT! So thank you for not just cutting it out and acting like you're doing us a "favor" lol
I think that tui didn’t know much about lizards so she mit have thought that they r just like humans
(I'M SORRY IF I SOUND LIKE AN IDIOT I DON'T KNOW IF I REMEMBERED CORRECTLYYYYYY) I've got to mention that Hivewings bred with Silkwings (RIGHT?) till a Queen in history declared them big enough to be their own tribe, separating the tribes and making them now able to reproduce the yellow and black patterns. The black and yellow is probably a result of the black slowly becoming a less dominant gene and yellow starting to come through more?? idk if this solves it though, but i thought it was good to mention that the hivewings didn't just come from Clearsight and her mates, but also her offspring breeding with silkwings.
One plothole that I have noticed while reading is the books (especially book 1), is how MudWing reproduction and MudWing royalty do not align at all. First of all, if MudWing parents do not meet their children at all, then how are royal MudWings supposed to know about their heirs? And even if there is a system for royal MudWing dragonet identification, then how do the royal MudWing groups even gain their way up to the throne? Do they fight the other royal groups for the throne?
The only theory I have that can sort this whole thing out is that only the MudWing queen is allowed to have dragonets, while the rest of her sibling group is not allowed. But if this is the case, isn't that a bit immoral to the MudWing queen's siblings? And if they are allowed, then how would've the MudWing heir crisis that was mentioned in book 8 even happened in the first place? Wouldn't the queen's siblings have had many other dragonets, and thus many more heirs?
MudWings are pretty weird, huh?
I think darkstalker is about 90ft and the average (fully grown) dragon being about 30-40ft (on average) I think that’s probably the best size estimate I can think of so that’s one plot hole filled as for everything else I’m not sure . So filled have way so a plot gap
If you put the subtitles on in the intro, it says "chewy t Sutherland"
The reason Onyx came to jade mountain is because she had nowhere left to go it’s mentioned once or twice in the books (I think) the dragonets said dragons who have no where else to go could live there Onyx might have just joined the school because she was by herself for a long time and probably wanted to interact with others or was just bored
Also the trans sky thing same thing with smoulder and blister their twins so same thing with them right?
I think this is more of a mistake rather than a plot hole, but in on of the books I BELEIVE book 15, Tsunami was said to have blue blood TWICE even though in the graphic novels she has red blood, it has never been mentioned in the books before at all, and IceWings are supposed to be the only tribe with blue blood. How after all this time does tsunami have blue blood???
Another tinier plot hole, in book 12, either Tau or Cinnabar had a few black scales according to Cricket. The problem is that they are both silkwings, and the guid to the dragons of pantala states that silkwing scales can be any color but black. My only conclusion is that either she or someone she descended from, was a silkwing hivewing hybrid and passed on those genes, but that seems very unlikely to me.
I’m so glad I’m not the only one who noticed the inbred HiveWings thing
the best explaination of the Hivewings situation is the fact they didn't really inbreed as much as people think taking on beetlewing/Silkwing mate themselves and likely within clearsights lifetime considering dragons reach maturity at about 7 years a stable hive wing population was formed without the need to inbreed to the point of genetic deformity. and the practise of full tribal separation from the Beeltewings/Silkwings is actually only about 500 years old making the Hivewings actually a rather young tribe and it is this point (approx 4500AS) that they begin to breed within their own tribe exclusively, I'm not sure if genetic dominance can be based on the gender of the parent but that may be a partial explanation why black markings are present in modern hivewings but sunny isn't all black as sunny gestated within a sandwing and was born from a sandwing egg (I looked it up and X-Based Dominant inheretence is a thing). assuming gender plays a role Genetic dominance of black scales it stands to reason especially with female dragons that the trait would survive longer and potentially long enough to propagate a stable genetic base all with the trait to some strength (see bumblebee being very black). though even with 1500 years of genetic diversity in the population having at least one line linking right back to a single individual only 2000 years back and not actively adding more divisity for 500 years of that may lead to some genetic issues given recency however I think that given the tribes didn't exist till the scorching similar but less prominent issues would exist in all tribes (though hybrids likely fix this to some extent) so the Hivewings and just more susceptible to genetic problems, not about to go full Hapsburg
I've noticed something in darkstalker legends (please do not continue reading if you haven't read the book! ⚠)
Seawing blood is known to be blue (ofc ✨) though, when queen Lagoon died tui described her passing as: "Fathom turned, thinking he'd seen a flash of silver in the air, and then a line of red sliced slowly, darkly, murderously across Queen Lagoon's throat" as you can tell via the paragraph, her blood was red, not blue as described in the rest of the books-
5:00 I think stonemover was scared for his soul. Idk 🤷
Lol, one thing I always imagined Darkstalker flying over a Human Village. 😂
Stonemover made a tunnel to the sand kingdom so he could see Thorn easyer.
Same pregnancy fraternal twins that are opposite gender are a thing in our world… who’s to say that’s not what happened with Sky
4rcane! hivewings do have a deformities sometimes that little horn in the middle of their snouts
Another explanation for the aging is that they have different personalities. In the real world, some 12 year olds are much more mature, while some are a lot less. There can be a large variety in maturity, as while people do mature while they get older, they do so starting from different places and at different rates. When I was 12, I didn't relate to or act much like other 12 year olds. People usually thought I was older than I was. I didn't have many friends for that reason. On the other hand, when my uncle was 14, he acted more like a 12 year old. He matured slower. It just goes to show how much of a difference there can be between individuals. This would apply to dragons as well. Even in my currently friend group (I'm 19, and our friend group includes people from 16-22) the oldest person in our friend group (She's 22) seems to act the least mature lack a lot of emotional intelligence compared to everyone else. The person who's most mature, on the other hand, is 19, she's the same age as me.
according to my brother: paper (fire and stuff :p)
me: there are references to modern books in wings of fire, although the dragons are likely technologically, in the middle ages
Wait, according to my science teacher inbreeding is how species are created. (Which is really gross) Also, a new species created in a little less that 2.000 years? How is that possible
Ne species are actually usually msde by animals mutating before birth , or 2 related species breeding enough thimes that eventualy the offspring are a different species , and that wouldnt take that long.
I am on mobile so that is why there are a lot of ling mistakes
I think the sky plot hole has a plot hole but i could be wrong
I love your videos so much and you're going so so good.
I can explain the plot hole of why they created a tunnel to the Sandwing stronghold. The plan was with Sandwing help to take over the forest but when the tunnel was made the Nightwings hadn't decided which Sandwing princess they wanted to win.
U gotz a new subscriber :D
I remember Turle imagining Darkstalker as "four times the size of the largest dragon he'd seen" or something like that- maybe "average adult dragon" or something like that but then I see people depicting Moon as, like, up to his shoulders? Like what
Additionally, one of the NightWings said in book 4 or 5 that the SandWing tunnel was there so that once Blister became queen, the SandWing tribe could easily assist them to take over the rainforest.
I got a ad at 8:43 lol (also im wacthing this video in the background while im drawing so sorry if this is off topic)
2:15 the plotholes through the "law of conservation" go sooooo much deeper then just darkstalker growing despite being asleep with no nutrients. Sandwings release heat, a form of energy, which makes no sense considering they are said to be able to survive off of little food, despite clearly emitting the most energy out of any tribe as heat. The ice wings on the other side of the spectrum, should barely have to eat with the amount of energy they absorb by taking heat out the air. Don't even start with peril. Having scales that are hot enough to cut chains that are fire proof by acident? bruh she should be dead within minutes of not eating.
Sandwing could be like camels
@@ryoko7778 wdym, camels don't release heat for no reason. law of conservation
@@tiberius150 ok
Let’s just suspend our disbelief for some time. The very existence of dragons isn’t feasible. We have to accept that they’re probably not going to be scientifically possible. It’s a common problem in Fantasy and sci fi
@@minecraft6829 thats why its called fantasy, and science fiction.
For the HiveWing one, black scales ARE NOT the dominant trait, it's that mothers in Wings of Fire have the dominant genes instead of fathers, that's why Darkstalker and Whiteout had mostly black scales, Foeslayer had the dominant genes.
About the hivewing thing, they had dragonets with silkings for a loong while
yea and scarabs grandmother stopped "the minngling in the blood lines"
Then why do they still have black scales? That trait wouldn’t have survived 2,000 years without severe incest
Who knew that Clearsight was a genghis khan
this helped me realize that time is a big-ass plothole in my worldbuilding and I dont know how to fix it ;;-;;
for the dominant black scales thing, maybe sunny doesnt have black scales cause he nightwing parent is male, and the mother's traits are more dominant.
not exactly a plot hole, but its strange how sandwings can live off of a lot less food whole having venom in their tail and being able to sustain powered flight. basically sandwings would have to east twice as often as other dragons because venom is expense for an animal to make, especially if they regularly use said venom, which it seems the sandwings do. not pointing out rainwings or hivewings because they could eat more than normal for dragons, and it seems rainwings don't use their venom often, at least compared to sandwings, but hey its a fantasy series, maybe their metabolism works totally differently.
you DO know that how to pronce peril is like, you are in peril. not rill with a per at the start.
1. hybrid innertribale breeding
2. sunnys ancestery she was decended from whiteout because of her dad so does that mean there will be animuses in the sandwing "royal' bloodline
3.rainwings there simple but the one the used venom on that nightwing(sorry i forgot the name) so why didnt the others use threse
4. silkwings they used to have the "naturl " powers like the hivewings do so why not anymore
twins are not always the same gender, itentical twins are, but if two differnt eggs get fertlised at once you have twins that can be male and female. i always asumed two embroes ended up in the same egg and thats how perils female and Skys male. though some freak mutation
one theory my friend has on that is that Sky is trans lol
@@forest_beans4673 or Peril is trans, it could be either. I don't think it would make sense for Sky to be trans because he never grew up with any cultural or sociatal perception of gender or any gender norms, so he wouldn't really know that he's born in the wrong body. Peril, on the other hand, was raised within society so she would have an understanding of gender.
Hivewing arent in-breeding because they have like 1 thousand years between eachother.
Dragons never stop growing. Darkstalker is 2000 years old.
Ok the thing with the hive wing incest is really hard to wrap my head around
Actually in book 12 Lady Scarab says that Clearsight had hundreds of children with many different dragons so no. Hive wings are not inbred
Sky wouldn't be trance because of the fact that they call him a male even before they meet adult sky and I'm sure he didn’t decide to be a male at birth
the sizing thing doen't make sence dragons are the size of whales
All HiveWings being related is something a lot of people have with the books, but technically, if the genetic goes WAY way back, it won’t even matter if it’s the same genetics. ANYONE in the world with blue eyes are related to one common ancestor, 10000 years ago. My parents both have blue eyes. Technically they are related, but again, it’s so far back it won’t matter.
Why does no one understand that sky and peril are not identical twins they come from the same egg but two different embryos you know when you crack open an egg and you can get multiple yokes same thing here this really bugs me when people don't think farther into this
dragons in wof dont exactly stop growing, darkstalker is immortal so his body wouldnt need food to keep functioning
Um, twins can be different genders. You know that right?
when did they mention that 2 dragons in the same egg had to be the same gender (like what number in the books) i curious. and if your comparing it to humans i have a twin brother my self. But i get we din’t come from the same egg sooooooooo……
I love your artstyle
It still would not make sense if sky was trans. When sky comes out of his egg he was male. And if he WAS trans, then he changed genders basically when human children are in the womb. It would make much more sense if Peril is trans because her gender when she hatched was not said.
Why did Clearsight have so many husbands? Why couldn’t she just calm down? I doubt many of her children were truly loved (or noticed) by their mother. I don’t really like her. That’s the main reason why I don’t like her.
RUclips Algorithim stuff
Sky can be a boy because twins can have both genders
Aren’t twins able to be different genders though?