4 Reasons to Have a Mixer in Your Home Studio
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
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I LOVE having an actual mixer in my studio. In this video I share several reasons why, and I introduce a new video series on the Presonus Studio Live 24 Series III mixer.
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Joe:"Of course live streaming isn't gonna replace going on tour"
COVID-19: "Hi, let me introduce myself"
Me and that Covid feller met about 5 or 6 times he ain't got no wins here? 🤷♂️
Ain't that the truth! Covid is what pushed me into finally buying studio gear!
Dude I laughed so hard when he said that lol oh man. Little did he know. 😂
@@XIIMonkeysMusicGroup same dude
Just exposed cowardice.
Another reason to have a mixer is this : I mainly record myself so to make it as painless as possible I assign each instrument to it's own dedicated channel. Meaning I permanently have all the instruments plugged ready to go. That means apart from picking up the instrument everything is always ready. Elect Guits, Acoustic guit, Bass, Keyboard, Mics for percussion etc. This makes the work flow a breeze!
This is my #1 reason to have a mixer in my home studio as well. I’m a one man band but it sure is nice having several keyboards, vdrums, guitars, mics, setup on the mixer and ready to go by just a few clicks on mixer/power amp. 👍
me too....24 channels...no repatching.
I have a really hard time when I don't have a mixer outside 'the box'...just because of comfort level & familiarity in general since I cut my teeth with them so to speak. But now that I have a great DAW (Studio One) and finally took the leap into full-on computer based tracking, I've loved the integration with my analogue mixer and outboard hardware and my digital environment. And now everyone that have learned to record strictly in the digital environment are trying to learn and understand all the analogue gear and techniques to 'warm up' and add character to their recordings. That's the biggest trend i see in plug-in creation now...all the old console emulations and outboard gear emulations (I just HAD to purchase the REDD & the TG12345)...we're in a truly great time with the tools we have now. I literally got goosebumps just knowing I was using the same EQs and sculpting tools that were used on the music that made me become a musician...Abbey Road...Dark Side...Hendrix & Kramer!!! What a beautiful and amazing thing to be able to use and learn those tools...also to see all the generations of knowledge and technical creation not get lost with the passage of time but all get tied together to form the union of those realms now
@@el_t4931 apart from the fact that mixers of this size are cheaper than a comparable interface
@@el_t4931 I found a 24-in mixer for $450 today. Used, granted, but even a used 8-in interface costs $300 minimum
I had a studer mixer that I had to sell, it was the brain of my entire studio, every audio signal passed through it and it was incredible, I miss the feeling of the faders and the VU meters, you are absolutely right in everything you have said
Damn, sorry you had to sell it.
As a musician, the primary reason I love having a mixer in my home studio is to minimize set up time. I can keep multiple instrument rigs set up all the time, rather than having to set up mics for acoustic instruments, routing keyboards, micing amps or wiring in signal processors. I can just go in and spend time doing what I built my studio for - making music!
The year 2020 - live streaming has replaced going on tour and playing in front of people.
I caught that, too, and had to laugh. And then cry. Now I'm laughing again.
You got it. I'm live streaming and having to dig up my insert cables so I can get some compression and reverb on my guitar and vocals so FB Live doesn't crush everything to death.
ahead of his time
6:50 yep came down here in the comments to say the exact same thing that was right after realizing what year of this was from.
One thing is for sure: Joe loves his mixer. Well so would I.
I still have my 16x4 mixer from 25 years ago and it's still an integral part of my studio. I couldn't live without it. it just makes life easy.
My reasons
#1)
I like to mix by touch when I first dig into a post-production (mixing) session. It allows me to shut off the logical part of my brain for a bit and adjust according to how the song feels best, moving faders as the song plays until it feels right without the screen distracting me and causing me to think. The thinking comes later when I fine-tune everything.
#2)
Automation. Sometimes I want to fade parts in and out the way it feels right, rather than mathematically. I can arm the track(s) to write automation then record my adjustments of the board. Waves Vocal Rider helps level the volume throughout my work these days but some situations call for recording manual adjustments.
#3)
To be honest, its good for business. A lot of artists have no idea what the difference between 1 studio and the next is. I can explain the difference between my Neumann U87 (REAL u87, not that u87ai bullsh!t) and the AT2020 in their friend's bedroom studio, what the Neve 1073 is, and why I chose to a UA system over a cheap Scarlett interface; but that often doesn't get through to them. What DOES impress them is seeing a vocal booth and watching the motorized faders dance.
Don't tell my clients, but 90% of the reason I keep my 64 chan digital console in the studio is so I can charge more. Seriously. I get about double what I used to charge when I just had a mouse and interface, and I basically only use a single stereo channel. A big console in an Argosy is money in the bank.
Haha. "Don't tell my clients." :)
WHAT ABOUT THE WARMTH AND COLORING
hello joe, what you about the sound quality of this PreSonus mixer compared to RME Fireface, or antelope ZEN studio how are converters and the mic pre's, please , i have the Tascam dm 3200, that i want to move it to another studio and i am looking for some thing i can put that space , that will give me a good result and satisfy my client
That is real world wisdom, it's one of the resons i baought an old MX900 , yeah i know it's behringer but most of the people that come in don't give a dime, they like sliders and lights going on and off !!
So true ...I put an old broken 48 channel yamaha mixer, which I got for free , into the studio. It's just to impress my customers. So I can charge more money for the recordings.
I love having a desk in the studio, I use a Soundcraft Ghost 24 paired with two Echo Audiofire 12 interfaces and track to Mixbus 4, I can get buffers down to 128 and the ability to set up effects loops on the desk along with monitor mixes is nice as well
I love using a mixer in my home studio because it allows me so many inputs at once to hear in live sound preset and share with musicians before going to DAW.
I'm with you, Joe... I love having a mixer in the studio... Thank you for posting!
Meeee toooo
Excellent idea. I absolutely believe in keeping my hybrid setup of analog and digital for exactly the reasons you mentioned.
I used to have that latency problems when tracking (especially vocals) when i needed to have that "comfort reverb". A work around was posted in youtube and it worked really well. No latency, at least not like the one latency recording example on your video which was really an annoying one while recording. Now i use a Steinberg UR824 which tracks vocals with no latency and has a built in compressor, EQ and reverb effects that i could use while at the same time tracking/recording the dry sound on my vocal tracks for later processing. So...there you go! Latency problem solved!
Honestly speaking, your points are spot on. One thing i’d like to add is the fact that when tracking vocals, applying a gate and a compressor plus some eq’ing and some pre’s adjustments before hand in the mixer, in an open home studio recording completely eliminates the problem of sending room noise and unnecessary mumble jumble into the recording in the DAW. I personally use an Allen and heath qu32, and it is a beast. Never dealt with latency problems at all on a usb 2.0 connection.
THANKS BODY! IM RECORDING MEXICAN MUSIC FROM ABOUT 20 YEARS AND I SAW THE TRANSITION FROM ANALOG TO DIGITAL AND IM WITH YOU. NOW IM USING A BEHRINGER X32 MIXER IN MY STUDIO IN MEXICO. THANKS FOR SHARING, GOD BLESS YOU. AND HAVING A MIXER IS THE BEST. I LOVE IT
You're so excited you're SCREAMING! :)
Another reason, especially when first starting out - mic preamps. Strangely enough, and particularly if you buy used, it can be cheaper to buy a mixer with 8/12/16 preamps in it, than to buy preamps, even of similar quality, in rack or 500 format. This is a big plus when just starting out, and you need more than the zero, two, or eight preamps that come with your interface.
I'm so glad I caught this video, Joe. Everyone always looks at me funny when I say I'm using a mixer as my audio interface into Studio One. Granted it's not as nice as yours, but hey I'm a beginner (It's a Peavey 6 Channel). One thing I just can't get right is the output or rather the sound of the output. I'm using Behringer STUDIO 50 USB Monitors through the Main output with 1/4" matched cables. Not the most expensive rig out there that is for sure. The monitors never seem to have any bass. Now going through my home theatre (which has a sub) from the control room output on the mixer the music sounds better and is closer to what I'm hearing through the headphones. I suspect you're going to say "Buy some better Monitors" but I have to ask what am I doing wrong because it's driving me crazy. I mean my headphones put out more bass than my monitors???
I also use a mixer but that's because I have several hardware keyboards and I HATE patching and unpatching things. It seems like I never get it right so I solved the problem by having a lot in inputs to get to my computer.I;m running Cubase 10 Pro and have a pair of Kali LP6's. Sadly though, my old Presonus Studiolive 16.4.2 is dying. Now I'm looking at the SL32sc.
Hey just stumbled across this. The reason Why you don‘t hear that much Bass through your Behringer speakers is due to the size of their woofer. I just looked it up, and they only have a 5 inch woofer. Small woofers like that can‘t generate Enough Energy to play those low frequencies that your sub in your home cinema can. I have focal speakers with 7 inch speakers and they Roll Off Right behind 80 hz.
It would not surprise me if the problem with your lack of bass was not so much about those 5" woofers but rather either
1) speakers are wired out-of-phase perhaps (i.e., reversed polarity on one of the speakers) or
2) speakers are too close to the wall or both -- or
3) the speakers are faithfully reproducing your lack of bass in the signal while your headphones are over emphasizing the bass --- or
4) any combination of the above.
So, what has transpired since you commented here?
@@peterbenson4338 I replaced the USB50s with Kali LP 8s. Plenty of Bass now.
You could not be more on point about a mixer. I'm old-skool and love analogue. Digital editing can't be beat.. But combining the worlds brings medicinal magic to any session. Latency is a 4-letter word. Had fortune to touch a Presonus board and do some mixing. Wow!
I finally got my Presonus Studiolive 32SC! I've had to wait 5 months but since my old series 1 died, I've been sad.Now I can play and have fun again the way that I really want to. Thanks for these videos!
In my humble opinion, there is no point in using an external mixer unless you go full analog.
First off analog mixers, except for top tier mixers like SSL, Neve (and some Soundcraft Midas etc) do not have recall ability. You are going to have to capture your settings if you want to replicate that mix. In the old days they used to write them down on xeroxed sheets of paper with images of the knobs. These days we have phones with cameras. Not a huge deal to me, but I can see this is a barrier for some.
Analog mixers can be noisy and develop problems on channel cards, insert jacks and the various dust prone buttons. So maintenance may be an issue.
However Analog mixers do not have latency. A digital mixer like a Presonus has less latency than many soundcards, but it has AD, DSP and DA. It will have latency. That is physics. You may as well get a MOTU or UAD audio interface and use the built in DSP mixing with a control surface.
Also more important to me, analog mixers have a sound. I have been recording digitally for years. One of the things I learned a long time ago is that it's better to get a good sound while recording than try to carve it into a good sound with plugins. Even the best plugins cannot fix crap.
Likewise, mixing through real physical EQ onto a real physical mix buss with all the imperfections has a sound. A good analog mixer has all kinds of non-linear response, but will gel your mix together into a song. No need to reach for that G buss compressor VST.
Of course you sacrifice flexibility. All of the mixes on that board will sound Soundcrafty or Neoteky. You can't just swap out a few plugins and be in SSL-land or Neve-ville.
The other great thing about an analog mixer is that you can stick the computer monitor in the corner and just listen to the music. Many digital mixers have screens that draw you into visual mixing too much. This is a hard habit to break. I know!
Once you have developed muscle memory for your board you don't even need the lights on. Your hand just goes to the EQ knobs, faders and sends.
The downside is that once you get an analog mixer, you are going to want some analog outboard like limiters, and one or two really good reverbs. The price on old reverb boxes has dropped a lot, but it can still be significant outlay, depending on how discerning you are.
Wrong. Presonus makes them that come with software to do it all. I have a Presonus AR16C analog mixer an I love it.
I use my 16 channel API mixer in a hybrid fashion and its amazing. I use both analog gear and plugins together seamlessly. I would hate the idea of working without it.
@@scottbaxendale323 my biggest concern on buying an analog mixer one day is being afraid of not being able to use both analog mixer + plugins. Also the memory, glad it works
You forgot something! It's nice having all the gear you own plugged in and ready to go with your favorite settings. No more plugging shit in and out all the time provided your mixer has that kind of i/o. This was on of the biggest reasons for me. When your constantly having to un-hook something to make room for something else it gets old very quick and most of the time I end up not even using that equipment bc I'm so lazy lol
Yup. Lazy people unite! :)
Daniel DeMayo, you got THAT right!
i got a pristine Mackie 32•8 for $375 in 2009 (NOT "hot"! just a friend itching to go into digital mixers and couldn't get even that much as a trade-in on the new stuff he lusted after), before that i used a Mackie 1402vlz bought new in '98, the 1402 having only 6 xlr ins and 4 stereo trs ins.
I freaking LOVE not having to constantly replug everything when it's just me and my collection of assorted vintage hardware synths, drum machines and other outboard gear!
my interface is a Presonus FireStudio Project, so i just take the 8 sub outs on the big Mackie and run 'em into the Presonus' analog inputs via a 15-foot HOSA 8-channel xlr-trs snake, so i can position the FireStudio to get an eye-level view of the its meters (necessary because I didn't get the Mackie meter bridge at THAT price). I use the DAWs metering to get the finely detailed level reading that the signal present/input/overload LEDs on the individual channels and the 3-segment FireStudio meters can't provide. Use the boards' sub-out assign buttons to route a given channel to a given sub out, as needed. the Mackie sub out meters are great, but they're not in my direct field of vision when i'm concentrating on watching musicians while tracking...
for recording my guitar, I feed my Digitech multiFX into the FireStudio sp/dif for a dry direct feed for re-amping in the box while mixing - because i love the virtual amps and stompboxes in my DAW. I take the analog out of the Digitech into two channels of the board for processed output to listen to while tracking, without choking the computer or bogging the DAW (i don't usually record the processed output, but have the ability to do so if needed.) i also have a couple of small combo amps (80s Marshall Lead 12 and a new Acoustic G35fx for variety, but I tend not to use late at night when i'm usually most productive - I've got tolerant neighbors, but i don't want to wear out my welcome with them.)
MIDI to/from the synths is routed using my 1986-vintage 8-in/10-out JLCooper MIDI routing switchbox feeding the FireStudio MIDI in/outs.
when tracking a full band, i use outboard f/x (Lexicon MPX110, Alesis MIDIVerb and Boss DE100 delay) for fx-to-monitor, which means i don't bog down my DAW (Logic Pro X on a Dell Hackintosh or iMac or even MacBook Pro - got a backup computer for my backup computer!). the Mackies' 6 aux busses give me the ability to make up to 6 custom monitor mixes for each musician.
The Mackies' Split EQ function on the Mix B bus lets me tweeze a 7th monitor feed to keep my bass player from bitching that he can't "feel" his bass, without bottoming out the other musicians' headphones.
FireStudio monitor output jacks feed the Control Room/Studio monitor bus on the Mackie for no-latency playback/cue mixes.
I'm a happy mofo.
Yup that's my reason
Ever heard of a patch bay?
Amen, bro!
I'm not an audio engineer, but I did recording a bunch of times as a musician, and we always used just one session for the entire album. I don't know it's usual or not, but it felt a lot easier from every perspective. We took a 2-3 minute gap between the tracks, set up the tempo at the beginnings and that's it.
Joe, very much thanks for the clarity about Mastering and Recording. This year I started the SE20 (Sound Education 2020) in The Netherlands. I hope to see your work more often. I really can learn a lot! Although I'm not that experienced yet, I follow your explanation easily. Thanks again!
8:13
Hehe 2020 goes BRRRRRR
7:45 this man prophesied about LIVE-STREAMING almost three years later it happened 🤭 wow genius @joegilder
I'm using an old Mitec 1602, which is full analog mixer. It's useful for production process. I mean, when The Producer came in with his/her essential tips and expectations I make some unnoticeable changes on muted channels and than everything sounds better. Anyway, it sounds cool and workflow is smooth. Good to have one for the fun.
I want to see all the other professionals do a video and share all their life experiences and opinions and watch everybody go wow I’m in awe and now my life is complete. Thank you joe for your time. I appreciate the hands on interaction.
:)
You know, I was thinking the same thing. I'd love watching vids from the people who do it differently. The "you suk" responses are pretty much all noise and no signal........
I have always used a 8 bus mixer in my studios since 1983. When I record drums its a lot easier to get my drums sounding the way I want with a twist of a knob. Great Video. Thanks
Love it
So basically this are the 4 reasons...
1. Avoid Latency
2. No software required for everything else other than recording
3. Avoid session loading on DAW
4. Live Streaming Rig ready to go
Sorry but I'm not convinced yet
+Nelson Nelson Fair enough.
How about rehearse and playing a gig without having to turn your PC/MAC on. Im convinced. I was about to cancel my order on an analog mixer but not anymore.
Nahh It´s not a must have
5. Mixing more with your ears instead of your eyes, clicking the shit out of your hand on computer mouse :)
Nelson Nelson yea i mean no 1 is not even true nowadays .asio is good enough its not that exaggerated like in the video and 2-4 is not relevant to me lol.
I completely agree with you!!!!!!......I bought a mixer for my studio!!...and I'm happy to have did it!
I'm using the Allen & Heath SQ 6. I'm loving it.
Amazing to see the comments. Most youngsters today are not used to a mixer. They’d pass out if they had to load a tape machine!!!
Okay boomer
9:53
Anybody else getting Garth Brooks Vibes!? "I really like that" lmfaooo
by the way, that panels on wheels absorbing sound is the best idea I have ever know of.
Thanks to so much enthusiasm sir. Keep it up!
I use a mixer in my small home studio where I’m the drummer using a Roland TD-50 and guitarists I play with use the high end Fractal and also the Helix. The mixer is also USB (Behringer XENYX UFX 1604). Great for mixing into Cubase Pro 10.5. Since I live in an apartment everything is done on headphones. To fix the bass loss you feel by not using full size speakers I use a system of Buttkicker transducers that are installed into the drum thrones that everyone sits on. The transducers vibrate at the low frequencies that are missing from the room with barely any additional audible sound. Also having the computer, CD player and Bluetooth through the mixer we can easily pull up audio from anyone’s phone while we are talking.
Can you make a video about the routing of your mixer and other fancy stuff, please?? I think there are a lot of people who wondering about that.
Not sure, since I don't use it for routing to fancy stuff...but maybe I'll do some experimenting. :)
How about just a video on connecting an analog console to the computer? I'm new to this but I have a 32 channel analog mixer (non powered) and a Behringer PMP 2000. I ran across this video while looking up DAWs and home recording. I want the capability of recording a full rock n roll or blues band. I don't understand how you would connect the two and still have all channels separate in the DAW. I love the real sliders and knobs!
...AND..... when the DAW control feature for S1 is implemented... well, how happy will you be then!!!
No kidding!
This is the only reason I haven't purchased one yet....I'm waiting for this feature and reviews before dropping the 3 grand for the 32 channel. I want to make sure it does what I need it to before I go that route : (
ckjjclan I
Got an X32 but the feature I use the most is the DAW remote!
Hey Joe. I used to record and mix years ago and just got back into it a few years ago because the cost is significantly low.
I have mainly have been practicing mixing via learning all the ins and outs of the Daw.
I have done two full band recordings however.
What I did to not create a dead zone is to save recording ABC 1 and then use save as and name it the next song ABC 2. Then erase all the audio in ABC 2 and your ready to go to record ABC 2.
However you have to keep your head on as this could lead to disaster because you have to remember to save before Save as. I did it though. Since I'm more organized with my templates now, I think I will just go dead. Probably better.
First-most, great informative video! You're correct about the latency issue being a hassle when you are tracking stuff but the more computing power you use to reduce it means less computing power for running plugins or apps for your mix. My latency workaround was to modify my AD/DA converters so the signals pass directly through so I don't deal with the latency issues and this allows me to use the extra computing power for plugins with plenty of headroom on the CPU. Like you, I too like to use a mixer. I'm running a 16 channel analog mixer where I can sub down up to 48 tracks into the board because I'm still old school when it comes to wanting to touch an actual board. If or when I need automation I let the computer handle that for me. Another big plus is that the board allows me to use two external effects units in my rack and even a 3rd effects unit on an individual channel if I need to. Using the external mixer also allows me to run out of it stereo into a stereo tube preamp where I can run it just below tube saturation for a less harsh sound along with some natural compression from the tubes. That signal is passed into my mastering station where it is recaptured at a high sample rate to preserve the audio quality.
... when you have a few hardware synths in studio and want to play or experiment on them... You can do it without switching on the computer...
YES. Great point. Same with guitar amp processors like the Eleven Rack or Kemper.
And, if you have a piano, all you have to do is switch your brain on.....and depend on yourself and acoustics....... :)
If you wanna record that piano, you need at least 2 mics for a stand up, and you need 3 to 4 or maybe even 5 mics for a grand piano. It seems like you are trying to insult people who play hardware synths.
defo they are a must for that
I use 7 different keyboards and drum machines, pads, synths and MULTI mics all together. I would go crazy without a mixer. Yeah it could be done without but why be so stupid. Practice, writing and even recording sooooo much easier with.
It's such a simple add on. Don't even need a full live mixer either. A simple 12-16 channel analog mixer makes life simple and plus you get cheap preamp for practicing and even on-board effects to screw with when writing. Allen and Heath is great, I use a 16 channel mackie, I know a guy that uses a Behringer 22 that is silent and feels pretty good and he uses it on high clientel work and you dont notice it at all. He's got money too but he liked the analog layout and it felt better faderwise than pricier stuff for him. You will benefit from an analog mixer if you dont want to fork out for a digital o e just yet. I use 2 motorized DAw controlers and an analog mixer and I love the control even before I get in the box to add my other toys!💡?🎼??+🎹🎹🎸🎷🎤×🎵×🎧💻🖱+💿=🔊🎶🎶🎶🎶😀😃😅😆🤗🤗🤗🤗🤗
You have all this gear but no treatment in your room? 🤔
JamariousTV - Yes - I was also confused by this. You can hear the echo.
@@willb3698 Also seriously confused at the monitor orientation. His main speakers are facing directly out, where's the triangle?
Essentially, the things that you don't see are not rules! Music is an organic process even with technology added... Your ears will be the most in important "treatment" you'll need.
I was thinking about the same thing. It's kinda awkward
Why should he need treatment if it sounds good and doesn't give him acoustic problems?? The only rule here that applies is "you only treat a room if it sucks" get the point ??
Zoom livetrak 12 happens to be in my Homestudio. Came before I understood what Homestudio means. Love it. I agree with no latency working is priceless. Nice tune played at both start and end of this video
I love my Presonus Ar12-c mixer. I don’t even use it every day but when I need it it is so nice to have!
5-10 minutes to setup a new protools session? Say what? Once the routing I/O is established in song #1, the template/routing can just be imported into the new session in under a minute. Or you can work the other way, resave the current song as a new one, flush out the audio and you're good to go still in under in a minute. This applies to bands.. applies to recording large format orchestra. It's fast. Any serious studio facility should have an I/o tracking template ready to go tying into their analog gear for the most common tracking situations.
Exactly, if it's the next song for the same band with the same setup, I see no reason to not have a template and have the basics all ready to go in a minute.
Just speaking from experience. You can import session data, save templates, all that. Even if it's not 5-10 minutes, I still like the fact that the DAW can be completely turned off and you can pass audio all day long.
I Use Reaper and Just save a project with the mics routed and named. Then when a track is done I save it under a different name and re open the template I saved at the start. Takes like 30 seconds. lol
Well you don't want to flush out the audio and record fresh in the same song renamed, because then you're still writing to the same audio files folder. At end of the session you'll have all the audio files for all the songs in one huge folder and that will be one problematic pain in the ass to deal with at some point down the line. Just have a template ready and use it to open a new session.
I sold my old Mackie 32-08 and now I work with a UAD Apollo that's 8 Pre with almost 0 latency , crazy good plugins and full save and recall of the session and if needed I can hookup my RME Octamic for 8 More inputs pre, That's a small sweet rig for a old man . Thanks for your Great Video
Using the X32 and it is way better to have the Faders to control the DAW, makes mixing way easier...
Yeah the StudioLive will have that feature in the fall.
The X32 is awesome. It fixed all those annoying things we deal with in the studio that Joe mentioned, and a million others that he didn’t. So glad I bought one
x32 is great for studio, however the daw control is a bit crappy on it, unless you use reaper
Samuel Thorogood fortunately, I do!
I love my X32 Compact!!!
I have an SL32 in my studio with ear mixes for monitoring and it really does seem to be zero latency. I used to run monitoring through studio one and even though it was like 2-3 ms of latency (which is pretty low) you could still hear that very subtle “doubling” effect where it’s not a delay but it’s latent enough to tell that something doesn’t sound right. It sounds so immediate and full now. Very happy with Presonus for my studio.
Yep - I've used Presonus mixers in my studio set up for years. Also switched from ProTools to Studio One when 3 came out. So much easier when a band wants to all play together for scratch tracks or rehearse - makes life much easier. Plus, if I need to go mobile, it's not too terrible to pull the mixer and reset afterwards. Keep on!
Thanks for watching, Tim.
I can literally do all of this in UAD console with my Apollo... But physical consoles are still more fun, obviously.
Yeah you can certainly accomplish this with interfaces, it's just an extra piece of software. I like that I can keep my DAW full screen at all times and not have to switch.
I use both mixer and uad. Uad is nice though no latency effects.
Yes - another UAD user here - changed my way of working completely. Much more organic.UAD + Desk is perfect. But without a desk UAD is the closest to that way of working.
jep, once UAD console gets a few upgrades and hardware controller suppor,t it will be smooth sailing from there :) going PTHDX is prohibitively expensive and the plugs are mediocre
For 3 grand! If you want 16 xlr's.
New session takes me 5 seconds. Coffee included ;)
COFFEE
Damned - how u make ur coffee so fast, pray tell? :P :D
Or just Save current song, Save as... to a new folder named Track 02, delete all wavs, and there you go! Don't understand why that would take 5-10 minutes to be honest... O.o
So glad I subscribed and so glad I went with Presonus. I had a Korg D16XD digital multitrack studio, which has been absolutely brilliant over the years but gave up on me this year. Now I have the Presonus 16.0.2 with the Studio One bundle. It's proving to be a great setup.
love that board, we are using the 16.4.2 and are really happy with it
Every single interface you'd use for recording has zero latency monitoring. Same for individual headphone mixes. Plugin latency is low enough that it won't matter for reverbs. You should NEVER do the audio routing inside protools, you'd use the program that comes with the interface that actually has real zero latency monitoring. If it takes you 5 minutes to set up a protools session you need to learn about templets and shortcuts... You could maybe argue convenience, but it's a luxury, and it HURTS MY SOUL that so many people are wasting money on mixers that are just sitting there doing nothing when that money could always be better spent. I am subbed to this channel because I've seen quality videos on here before. This one is very bad advice in my opinion. There are reasons for owning a mixer, but you didn't name any of them.
Sorry for hurting your soul. :) But these are MY reasons. Those are the only reasons I am capable of giving. It's cool if you don't agree.
"There are reasons for owning a mixer, but you didn't name any of them." Care to list your reasons here?
For live applications you really can't get around having a mixer. But if we stick to studio... if you have a really high quality mixer, you can commit to EQ's on the way in to save some time. You can use insert effects on the way in if you really want to. You can be more precise when it comes to driving outboard gear during the mix, and you can do headphone mixes a bit faster, but I'd rather just bus all the inputs to 3-4 outputs inside the interface and then let every musician do their own mix with either whatever small mixers you have lying around, or a dedicated 4-input headphone mixer. We've all heard someone say "I can't hear X" when X is already so loud you're worried about their hearing.
A semi-decent mixer is $3000 down the drain. You get a tiny bit of convenience, but can you honestly say you'd rather have that tiny bit of convenience rather than $3000 worth of microphones, preamps, instruments... A used Macki32-8 is $400. Wasn't that thing like $8000 new? That's what people think about mixers. I'd still rather have 4 SM57's and the extra space than a 32-8.
I guess I never had a problem with latency, not noticeable anyway. And I've used pretty cheap gear.... Line 6 toneport, ni sessions interface, etc, I just set the buffers and freeze the tracks in the daw if they get heavy. But yeah, I could see the point if I was a drummer, anyway, good video
If you click the monitor button in your daw, it's going to go through software and there will be some latency. Any amount of latency is too much for a vocalist. He's right about that. But even PCI 1.0 interfaces form the 90's already had built-in zero latency routing... and not just the professional stuff... anything M-Audio made, anything ESI made... everything I'm aware of had actual zero latency routing within the interface. Certainly everything that you can buy today has it.
I am building a studio and really wanted a "mixer". But the more I looked into it, the more I found consoles were obsolete. I didn't care, I still wanted one, and purchased the Tascam DM4800. I was going to get Presonus, but at the time, was proprietary, and not compatible with other DAWS, just Studio 1. Now, I have the mountainous task of figuring out how to integrate the system for a hybrid application. Tascam uses fire wire to communicate with the DAW..or send audio..I don't know if that will present latency issues or not, but I do know I want both in, and out..of "the box".
Good luck to you, Elvin! Just so you know, Presonus was never proprietary.
Why you don't try a summing device + some pro hardware ?
Elvin Lewis Obsolete for sure!!!!
Joe Gilder Music That's certainly news to me, because I spoke to them directly, and was on the verge of purchasing the CS18AI, but they said it was only compatible with Studio 1. Again, that the reason I did not purchase it.
Hey, Joe - being a bit older - and a bit old school when it comes to recording (haha) -
I'm used to having a mixer and wouldn't want to miss it for the world.
Therefore I agree with your 4 reasons - plus: I could add a few thousand more! :)
Thanks for this. I've just been contemplating using a mixer in my studio for live recording. This has given me more to think about. Cheers.
"UAD enters the chat"
Is latency an actual issue nowadays? There are plenty cheap interfaces nowadays (like 2i2, UR22 etc) that boast low latency as long as you have that ASIO driver installed. I use a Steinberg UR22 with a buffer size of 256 and I never had any latency problems whilst recording...
Yeah everybody has a solution for latency. I just like that I don't need a solution at all with a mixer. I just plug in a mic, and I can hear it. :)
Ah, not so computer-savy, eh? ;)
Plenty of 2i2 and other firewire and usb interfaces suffering from latency on fast machines. Try recording a vocal and guitar simultaneously, or a drummer (who will let you know immediately about latency) too. Add necessary effects being processed on the computer and you will have latency. If recording straight in with processing prior to the interface, and nothing processed on the computer and it's probably not as discernible.
Most of the interfaces, like mine as well, alleviate the issue with direct monitoring. Allowing whatever signal is on the input sent directly back to the microphone, for further processing if desired, while the original signal is still sent to the computer DAW for unprocessed recording.
ASIO is great, but certainly not in and of itself any solution for latency. The thunderbolt and TB 2 come close people say, though I think a full session with stacks of vsts would add dreaded latency as they add up as well.
Input monitoring is nearly impossible on most interfaces that aren't TB.
You must be using direct monitoring. A 256 sample buffer would sound like a slapback echo.
I run 256buffer on a 2i2, on a very modest i3 based laptop, with no audible latency at all (yes, monitoring through the driver). Your systems must be very taxed or running a gob of crap in in the background if that size is producing an echo.
I always wondered what a physical mixer did (but that question wasnt that important) and now I have learned a fff ton about that and as an extra about that whole latency issue and streaming thing
wow thanks a lot!!!!
Having a mixer is extremely useful when it comes to the dreaded issue of latency in digital recording. I found, especially if you do it all yourself in the studio, as you increase tracks things like acoustic instruments and vocals begin to experience latency and that's a huge drag. The mixer enables you to always hear your live signal (hence, no latency) as well as previously recorded tracks.
I don't know what interface you're using that "goes down" when you close the session... Kindaaaa strange...
The streaming definitely is a bitch without a mixer though.
yeah he is still with presonus
Yeah they're sponsoring this series of videos.
SuperPasquale76 😂😂
@@plummetplum I finally dropped Presonus and went to FL Studio and a Yamaha MG10XU mixer.
Uad apollo and softube console 1 and console 1 fader is the new “mixer” for a fraction of the price and infinitely more sonic possibilities, streamlined workflow, no patchbays, no latency ect. Love it.
Joe I completely agree with everything that you've just said. I've always mixed in the box but got rid of my mixer a couple of months ago and have been tracking in the box. You just cannot get a great headphone mix without a mixing desk.
When it comes to any instrument it doesn't bother me at all but when I track vocals I like a bit of reverb on them and when you send the vocals into the DAW and have the reverb come back out, that reverb has a tiny delay.
Also I was rehearsing in the studio on Friday and as it was going well I thought I'd stream it live for my channel. I looked over at the setup and as there's no desk I just couldn't face setting it all up knowing it would not be as good as when I had a desk in there. Needless to say I've spent all weekend looking at mixing desks
I often wonder “who” all these guys are recording?
All these you tube “studio guys”
Local/small bands likely. There are thousands upon thousands of bands that you will never hear of that still release professionally produced records.
I NEVER had any latency issues with my USB 3.0 Interface. Never.
Great!
Joe Gilder Music Currently using a Studio192. Totally recommend it to everyone needing ultra low latency and many tracks!
USB 3 has nothing to do with it, USB 2 is fine
That has nothing to do with latency... Actually interfaces doesnt go well plugged in to a USB 3.0 port
What Interface do you use?
The song at the end is so beautiful!!!
Thanks for the video Joe. You've added more learning for me, and that's helpful. The replies have also helped so it's not just one video and one opinion. Life is full of choices. Nice touch that you have replied to peoples comments too. Our church uses a Behringer mixer with lots of inputs, an oldie but a goodie. One of our pastors, Ian, an electrical engineer has designed and built the power, and matching amps, that drive the speakers in the council meeting hall where we meet. Band, singers, speakers, and stage mics. It all sounds great. P.S. the audio is good too! I use a small Behringer 1202XY mixer, a Focusrite interface, and a Lexicon interface(a sound card on steroids).
i still don't see why you would need it at home. specially if you are recording vocals and guitars only in your home studio.
In his case, I think he's recording full bands. The singer/songwriter, home recordist probably doesn't need a mixer.
Recording bands or just a few weeks ago I did a live acoustic show with two other performers. We ended up using 7 inputs, all through the board, so that was nice.
I think you need an analog mixer for home studio at least for the mic preamps,on board compressor,eq,built in fx for vocals,yeah its handy and improves the sound,oh and the pre amps for the instruments too,its always good to have a mixer to polish your sound before hitting your audio interface.
I agree with you. An analogue mixer for the home studio is a plus. I think the Soundcraft Signature is more suitable than the Presonus. That's what I went with. It's over a third cheaper, the pre amps sound good, the effects on it are great, the EQ is amazing and I can record up to 20 tracks simultaneously on my 22MTK. I've had mine a couple of weeks and it's been a pleasure to record my hardware MIDI set up live in the mix with 10 drum tracks, 2 stereo synths and a mono synth, with space for another mono synth, a polysynth and a mic for vocals that all have their own channel on the board and still have a couple of channels spare.
1. To prop the laptop so your neck does not angle down. 2. To use as a mouse pad. 3. To add ambient light 4. To warm up the room
The mixer as the HEART of the studio.
From the millenium the puter has become the heart of the studio.
You make a good point.
Always had a 24 table but that was when my studio was analog.
My digital mixer luckely does exactly what you say. As long as the puters on
It will produce sound :-)
I just bought a Midas 32r for your first 3 reasons. I started on a 4 track cassette, later on 8 track cassette, later on 24 track 2 inch, then computers ever since. I'm so tired of the laptop and a 2 track interface. I'm so much more creative with the mixer. Plus it's a giant 20 input sound card! Great video.
:)
"That cute little blue fellow" is why I changed over to Focusrite Audio interfaces.
Pete Urbann love my saffire pro 24
Focusrite is why I changed to SSL 2
1 reason not to have one: I dont have money 😔
I still use my Mackie 24 /8-bus mixer for recording, and with one button-push on any mixer-channel I can send it to the desired recording tracks on the interface. (MOTU) I like also send the signals from the mixer directly to my outboard effect units in order to make a quick sound shape for te musicians. This method is fast and works very well for me and the recording musicians during tracking. After tracking they can communicate and playing the next song, meanwhile I set up everything for the next tracking. I mix in the DAW, and sometimes I use also again my outboard effects because the musicians often like the sound of it. Sorry for my poor Englisch ! Keep recording ! Grtz. Will Tranchet - Crosswood-Studio (Belgium)
Running ProTools 10 here with a Midas M32IP for my front end. My PT rig is basically nothing but striping tracks now, I do all of my tracking and mixing on the Midas then bounce out and go back into PT for mastering the 2 track final. Being an old live sound guy for 30+ years it is really nice to be able to mix on faders, plus having the really warm punchy Midas preamps that I am accustomed to reminds me of their old analog consoles I used to tour with. All in all, its a killer set up and a much more tactile feel to the entire recording experience.
Reaper is much lighter and more flexible than Protools. Protip: Get rid of Protools!
Yep. REAPER is great.
Great, great, great.
Yep , Love it..
Reaper is 🐐
Get rid of the standard he says. Let's run a half million dollar ssl or neve through Reason while we are at it! SMH
@@philliplocey258 I agree with you! There's a reason why the big dogs all play in the yard with PT.
Most modern interfaces have direct monitoring while also recording the audio into the computer. It should not be a problem. You don't need a mixer.... period!
Respectively disagree. Production by mouse and software alone is just awful. The art of production is, in part, an organic, hands-on experience that a mouse and software alone just can't match. I feel the same in regards to video editing (my main vocation). Click, click, Clunk! Too much mouse, keyboard, and software strangles creative energy, process, and results.
I HAVE A ALESIS 8 CHANNELMULTIMIX CONNECTED TO MY STUDIO ONE 5 . I WAS THINKING OF SELLING IT AND GET ME ONE OF THOSE LITTLE GUYS INTERFACES LIKE THE ONE YOU HAVE BUT NOW YOU MAKE ME CHANGE MY MIND .THKS I LIKE YOUR VIDEOS MY FRIEND.
great video joe! I use a Studiolive 16.0.2 mixer to track my drums vocals and guitars moving to presonus from my old pci card a M-Audio Delta 10/10 interface took my home studio to the next level no irritating EM noise from a pci card inside my pc plus the added benefits of the gate, limit, compression, eq etc on board the mixer is making our tracks sound so much better!
And it's fun too. :)
And this video was sponsored by Personas.
and people wonder why I still use a Roland vs2480 DVD
Wow i just said the same thing !
I've used a few Daws including protools ,logic and cuebase right now Reason 9.5 and Harrison mixbus is were it's at..but my 2480 gets the most work.i will never to get rid of it..too convenient
Those are workhorses.
I still use the Roland VS 2400 CD along with Reaper with the Logic Pro X mixer theme.My Studio mixer is a Mackie ProFX16.I control reaper with a V-Studio 20 control surface by Cakewalk/Raoland
I didn't know Roland had dvd players.
There is a reason number 6. I mix down with a Toft ATB-32 from Protools into a Masterlink when i want to take advantage of some vintage processors. Since I learned to mix on a Neve Console to a Struder tape drive, (Yes. I am that old), this makes sense to me, plus the added benefit is that I can do a lot of things like re-amping and use real plate or spring reverbs, vintage limiters, compressors or delays and get an overall warmer mix than just running through Protools. I still do "in the box mixing", but there are times when the older stuff just fits a certain song and it is nice to have the options. As with anything else in recording, YMMV.
Joe I agree with what you’re saying absolutely. I just bought the same mixer you have the myself. I am replacing a Tascam DM 4800 because I understand the mixer quality is better with more digital options. We’ll see what happens!!!
2:14 Editing glitch or hidden message ? LOL
HAhaha
Love your channel Joe !
I'm Steinberg Certified Trainer but use Studio One very much too LOL
I think its funny he never actually answered the question lol
Im new to the DAW world after having Tape recorders for many years I can't understand how anyone can mix with a mouse ? After the many years away from the recording studio, due to medical reasons it took me a very long time to heal. from 3 back surgeries. its like I woke up in the twilight zone and I'm having trouble transistorizing into the DAW concept. What I can't understand is these input devices we only meed a max of 4 good mic pre's but we should have at least 16 outs to come back thru our Mixers of which there are many good starter Mixers like a Mackie 15 ch that is also affordable . Instead I keep seeing more inputs than outputs as these makers count the ADAT in & out as 10 more channels as more in & outs and yet none of them offer one of these types of mixers for sale to add on to your systems false advertising ? Maybe Again 4 in's are enough using a mixer you already have mic pre's please ask Pre Sonus to build such a unit or make one modular device if you have a connection with them ..
I never recorded on tape, but all my favorite records were made that way, and I alway though that! I'm starting at music production now and the idea of mixing with a mouse sicks me. I want to get the feel and the sound of tape but with praticity (because I don't plan to be a huge producer) and low cost because here in brazil we don't really have aquisitive power.
I watched this when it came out,still agree.would not have a studio without a mixer.
Thanks to this video now I know that producing without a desk is not that of a big deal, bec it is just for personal interest & collaboration (excluding certain analogue consoles which offer iconic harmonic distortion).
Buy a RME interface. All of those problems solved.
irrelevent
I too prefer a desk / DAW combo and the presonus seems ideal, in that basically it is a large audio interface with knobs and moving faders. Some of us are just more tactile. It doesn't matter what we use, its what we produce that matters. Producer /artist Maria Muldaur expressed it best when she said once said of recording gear "its just the truck delivering the goods".
All very valid points. Nice video. I've used that mixer before for A/V gigs and it's really nice.
Bless you for the great information
And Bless you cause the sneeze looked very painful..Love my Zoom- L20 mixer..very helpful and gives it that "nostalgic" mood..and I get to move faders..good video!!
Hey Joe, very nice video! I had been carrying a few questions about this in my mind for quite some time. You have answered them all.
Love the video mate! I’m in Tasmania Australia and I’m in the process of building a home studio in my backyard and I’ve just purchased a series 3 16 channel mixer and a 32 channel interface. I’ll keep you informed of the progress but after attending a product night on the series 3 gear I’m sold!
You've made me feel so much better about just purchasing the presonus ar12c works
Good prediction on the live streaming lol this video aged very well! I just cane across your channel and been binge watching all this knowledge! Thank you for teaching us 🫡
I definitely use a mixer because of the in depth control of on board eq, aux inputs and warmth than solely depending on getting that feel from just an audio interface alone. My mixer is a Behringer MX8000. When I post my videos, I use a monopiece condenser mic, Art Tube pre amp, 12 channel bahringer 1202 mixer and a Presonus audiobox usb audio interface. Makes a huge difference over most youtubers that do not use a pre amp and mixer on audio
Nice
I use the Legacy 16.4.2 StudioLive board and it is fabulous !!!
Thank you for all your videos.
👍
Good video. Man we were doing live streaming of bands out of the studio back in 2007. So much fun.