I don't think he adapted. He got ruthless quicker, but the psychological adaptation was never there. In fact, Rick being able to shoot the reanimated Sophia shows that Rick had mentally adapted quicker.
@@Ares99999 But he didn't see the world how it was Shane did Shane was mentally prepared before everyone was it's his obsession with Lori that made him go insane
Shane 100% died in that parking lot with Otis. It was the right thing to do, it saved Carl, but he couldn't handle killing an innocent man even if was justifiable. Any "what if Shane survived" scenario leads to him dying in a few months unless it includes Carl never getting shot by Otis and maybe Shane leaves with Andrea? Either way, having to kill Otis was the point of no return for his sanity.
This is a good way to finally silence the debate, considering many people still think Shane was better in the early seasons. Shane was great, but he wasn’t Rick Grimes.
the thing here is Shane would've been better than Rick if he wasn't obsessed with Lori plus don't forget he sacrificed someone even if he didn't want to
@@Idk98268I like Shane better but I do think Rick was a better leader. I think Shane is better in fights and handling rough situations especially early on as he was already up to speed in this new world. I really wish he would have lived and been a great right hand man. That is his true role in my opinion.
@@LegoCityBuilderBob he handled rough situations terribly, Rick was ALWAYS better at handling those situations, Shane nearly got the group kicked off the farm more than once or nearly caused a violent skirmish between Hershel’s family and the group
@jackthm5069 just checked, and the highest capacity 500 I saw was 8+1, and it has a pretty long mag tube. You would need a mag tube over 3 feet to hold 20 2 inch shells
Wasn’t there an interview where. Robert Kirkman, said Shane would’ve gotten the group killed. Also, Dixon would’ve left the group. With Merle, he wouldn’t have been down. With Shane murder plot.
We don't need Kirkman to see Shane would have gotten the group killed in like 6 months TOPS if he managed to kill Rick lol. Only the biggest Shane fanboy could deny that and I love me some Shane. Great character but he was way too mentally unhinged by that point.
@@Papa_Burton Kirkman worked on the show as a writer and authored the original comic series. His view of a character within the series is basically akin to the word of "god". His comment about Superman is different, because he doesn't write Superman comics. He's wrong about Supes, but right about Shane because Shane is literally his character.
Though Shane brought bravado to the series, like I've mentioned previously in other video postings of yours ,Shane is a damaged individual. Emotional, irrational, vengeful, undisciplined and finally a sad lonely wreck. Anything could set him off. Literally anything.
Man definitely wasn’t emotional or irrational. He was impulsive yeah, but wasn’t ruled by emotion. He was willing to make calls that Rick was too weak to make, and even Hershel proved that to be true.
Except literally everybody would be if they were in his position, I'd argue more than he was. Rick showed up out of nowhere and usurped Shane's leadership role, and his first decision was to go against Shane and try to rescue Merle, which resulted in 80% of the group dying. Despite this, Rick still forces himself into the leadership position. Rick wants to spare Randall, Shane says no because he'd lead his group to the farm. What do we later find out? When Carl sneaked in to the shed Randall made it clear that he indeed intended to bring his group to the farm...Once again, a decision Rick made against Shane's wishes that would have got the whole group killed. Sophia. Once again, Shane was right but Rick kept putting the group in danger to look for her. The ONLY reason this risk to others in the group stopped was because Shane refused to have a group of walkers right outside the groups door. During all of this, Lori is emotionally abusing the man, so much so that Shane decides its best he just leaves. What does Lori do? Mind F with him to stay. Then he finds out Lori is pregnant with his child. Reaction? Steal his child to be from him before it's even outside of the womb. Shane was not only right but he was absolutely right to take Rick in to that field and end him. What was it Shane said? "I don't think you got what it takes to keep them safe." There's 3 people of the original group that have survived Rick's leadership, out of about 50+. Shane was absolutely right.
Shane in a fight definitely wins especially H2H since as Theo said, Shane’s got a more compact robust build and did overpower Rick in their fist fight. Rick only won the second round because he got the jump on Shane’s back.
Shane proved much less mentally stable than Rick. I do wonder why though... we should keep in mind that Shane lived through the apocalypse where-as Rick was suddenly transported into it. It's like his mind has jet-lag. If Rick had never been shot, would Shane and Rick together, experiencing the world end while mutually supporting one another, have both survived long term? An alternate series of events where both best friends mutually support one another and Rick's family, there is no accidental affair, no love triangle. Both men and Lori and Carl might stay together and alive for long term.
@@y0ungspanish318 That is true Shane for those early months witness some horrible shit and the end of the world in real time. Rick just got the 28 day later treatment into it. Like you wake up one morning everything is also fine, but the next day you think is gonna be the same as any other day. Only to find out all hell broken out in the world.
Shane is a perfect right hand man. Imagine a Walking Dead World, where Rick would not get shot and Rick and Shane would leave Atlanta together with Lori and Carl. I think in that case, Shane would have been a great uncle typ of guy for Carl and I also think, he wouldnt have felt in love with Lori. Maybe he would have felt in love with Andrea. This would have been an insane strong group.
Two of them would've made the group stronger imo, especially if Shane was around in season 3 and he and Rick could've ended the Governor sooner. Lori was messing with his head though. Lori: stay away, no i want you around.
In Shane defense: He wasn't lying when he thought Rick was dead. Lori thought Rick was but he ain't. She wasn't in the Hospital when the army came in started executing all the Doctors and patients. An Shane could barely do anything but attempt to save Ricks life and only by a 50/50 chance Rick survived. For all Shane knew Rick probably got a bullet at that point. If that ain't the case then the Napalm bombing the took place later by the air force probably killed Rick something Lori witness, and no doubt she assumes Rick is also dead after all that. An her playing Shane left and right after for 3 months he's been protecting her and Carl all that time.
When I first watched the show, back when I was like in high school, I was team Shane. But with some maturity, and with a few rewatches, I realized Rick was always better.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84 Just because you have a different opinion doesn't mean what others say is a "lie". It's subjective who the best character was. Rick without a doubt was a lot more interesting and cooler than Shane.
@@rafayg7376 And that's exactly why your arguing with me because you think Rick is better then Shane , if I had said Rick you would have nothing to say.
Had Shane still been the leader of the group when Rick arrived, the group wouldn’t have made it passed season 2. Remember back in season 1 Shane wanted to go to Fort Benning but Rick insisted that they go to the CDC which resulted in them getting more information about what was happening to the world. In season 2 when Rick, Glenn and Hershel met Tony and Dave, they found out that Fort Benning was overrun with Walkers so had they listened to Shane from the start, they all would’ve died.
Honestly it kind of annoys me when people say Shane had better survival instincts. He was trying to be a foil to Rick and push back against him in any way he could, and occasionally he was right about certain points. Rick however often knew the outcome ahead of time and did it anyways as he combined things together. Him going back to the city was not JUST about saving merle, but winning over Daryl, and getting a bag of guns, as well as getting in to contact with other survivors such as the people he initially met. He wanted to go and see if he could get equipment from tanks, vehicles, helicopters, the police headquarters and other locations. Rick always saw the bigger picture and combined multiple instances of things together. While looking for sophia, they find the Barn, and get off of the main road which was just begging for them to be attacked by raiders or killed by walkers. Looking for sophia was not just about sophia, but also about keeping the group mentally sane, and getting them off of the main roads and deeper in to the woods where they eventually found the farm. Rick knew that to survive you had to explore, go on missions, figure stuff out. Each mission was a reconnaissance mission to find more information and expand. Finally Shane was wrong for killing otis. The amount of time they fought and the fact they only had to go a bit further to escape meant that Otis was right that they could make it without one of them dying. Shane was clearly losing it and not thinking clearly. Otis insists that Shane try to look for more weapons, not rush in to the facility, to take their time etc. and he refused. Shane jumped from the building and got his own leg twisted, and then shot otis over this. Shane made rash, impulsive decisions that later lead to more problems down the road. Otis was calm, collected and smart and shane rushed in guns blazing and nearly was killed multiple times but otis saved him. Shane was losing his mind, and Otis was only going along with shane as he felt guilty. He even tried to convince shane to gather more supplies and ammunition and he refused. Further, Shane almost never kills a walker or zombie with a melee weapon. I'm not sure if he does it one time. Even rick tells shane he needs to start killing them with melee weapons and shane seems queasy about it, like he can't bring himself to do it. There's no reason why, with a machete, shane couldn't have killed hundreds of walkers if he needed to, but he was too scared to do it, and this is why he ultimately was unable to be as good of a survivor. He made rash, impulsive, emotional decisions and this is why he was ultimately killed.
@@enriqueperezarce5485 they could have use melee weapons to kill walkers, and he could have hopped on one foot and likely made it over the fence, he spent like 30 seconds fighting with otis which was enough time to escape honestly. They also could have used anything else as a distraction like a flare
@@everybodydothatdinosaur519 Yea fight a horde of walkers which for someone reason are super strong for their decaying state. Couple that with your partner not being athletic. They were cooked, Shane did the logically choice there but was messed up emotionally and mentally from it
@@everybodydothatdinosaur519 Shane was not outrunning the walkers with gear and a messed up ankle, Otis was basically wraps given the gear he was carrying and how tired he was. Basically one of them was going to die almost guaranteed unless outside interference occurs. Also Shane mindset sealed the deal on Otis dying.
I think one aspect of Shane that affected his leadership is he got emotional, which would affect his decision making, while Rick would generally try to make choices logically, only time I can think where Rick acted on emotion was when he asked Hershel to stay on the farm, due to Lori being pregnant
The 590 does not hold 10 to 20 shells, if that were the case, the gun would be freakishly longer. It can hold 8+1 at most based on the configuration we see
Shane and Rick are both dangerous men. Rick is capable but he has a history of getting his ass handed to him in hand to hand fights in both TV and comics. Shane had the attitude, the determination and was capable of leading as there were time the group was willing to listen to him over Rick when he bothered leading. T-Dog and Andrea were willing to agree with Shane more even Daryl was willing to follow him. However Rick was way too agreeable with people willing to compromise way too much rather than make cold decisive decisions, Rick was way too moral. Shane was also way too angry while he was a capable leader and got into arguments far more than he needed to he should have acted rather than just debating with Rick. Shane's weakness was his love for Lori Carl and even Rick. Shane went along with many decisions Rick made rather than going with what he wanted as far back as Season 1 out of loyalty and respect for his brotherhood. As a leader he should have made far more decisive decisions rather than be diplomatic with Rick. Shane let his dysfunctional relationship with Lori constantly stress him out. Which caused him to be far too angry when he should have been rational. Also his love for Carl was the penultimate turning point for him. When he saw Carl was adapting enough to the new world and becoming fearful it worried. So much that it lead to him trying to put aside whatever beef he ad with Rick in order to fix that. Rick refusing to listen or even hear Shane out himover the edge. Which is what lead to him deciding to kill Rick.
what do you mean 10 to 20 shells? The full-length magazine tube holds up to seven 3" shells or eight 2¾" shells. Switching over to a full load-out of 1¾"-long mini shells brings the magazine capacity up to 13 rounds.
@@TheRealCaptainGold yes you did because detachable box magazine fed shotguns can hold that amount but not magazine tubes, but everything else you said is right
@@TheRealCaptainGoldcomparing a handgun to a shotgun is kinda dumb regardless. two different tools for two completely different purposes. u shouldve compared ricks python to shane’s glock. much more interesting comparison
Another great video! I’ve gotta say I completely agree. Although he had a better survival mindset in the beginning, his mental state deteriorated and he became mired in dangerous to the group than anything. Rick had a more slow and steady growth
The thing with Shane is he adjusted to the new world to fast. All the stress from the chaos of the apocalypse basically taking care of Lori and Carl, his kind wasn’t given enough time to fully process what’s happened to the world definitely made his mind unstable. I think given enough time to sit down and rest to take it all in, he would’ve become a great survivor or leader
Rick was able to be compassionate and ruthless, he showed compassion to the people he loved but was able to make that switch against his enemies for his people's survival that's what makes him better than Shane. Shane had the right idea of doing what it took to survive but he was also reckless and controlled by his emotions which made him dangerous and caused his downfall unlike Rick who was able overcome moments when he experienced loss and pain.
@@SAGETAKES he does but their only fight was in season 2 and obviously Rick has gotten better since then, plus the CRM hand to hand combat training AND the metal arm.
Very great points, I feel like this video really put all the right points together in one place. In theory it would have been great if Rick and Shane stayed a duo and didn't have all the hangups of Shane being with Lori and such. Basically, would have probably stayed what Rick and Daryl turned into or became a trio of power.
Aaron once remarked to Rick that he had stopped the end of the world and had instead started a new one. A hell of a thing to say: that rick Grimes had defeated the apocalypse itself. It takes a certain kind of man to not only be a fighter but a true leader. I think i may have commented in the poll, that Shane could command but Rick could Rally and even inspire. You could even say that they are analogous to Negan and Simon-- a notion that i think has merit but theres very little to go on to illustrate it And thats the big issue with this debate is we simply dont have Shane around long enough to see how he would handle some of the more radical, desperate and wild situations Rick was faced with. But what he did was prepare Rick for the road ahead. He walked so Ricky Dicky Doodah could run Edit: like, share, fuck and subscribe? YES SIR
Shane was never a leader; he gave a fuck about two people only and was at most muscle. Even then Shane stood out as a fighter only because he adapted early, once everyone adjusted he's really only average. Dude would've just ended up as walker dinner at the fall of the farm or one of the Governor's head trophies if he didn't try to kill Rick lmao Love the character, by the way, but Shane fans need to get real
@@v7qow Shane was clearly unhinged by the end of his short apocalypse life, dude would have gotten them all killed at some point. The fact Rick has lasted so long shows he's the more head strong survivor regardless of your feelings on the plot.
I honestly feel like if Lori had treated Shane better after Rick came back then he wouldn’t have become so unstable afterwards, likely either ending up with him leaving and regrouping with them later on or staying with the group and co-parenting with Rick after Lori dies.
Gotta say, it was a making or breaking point for Rick in season 7 when Negan made Rick his bitch. And that was the time when Rick either proves Shane right or wrong, to an extent, Rick was built for this world at first, but he adapted a bit and plot armor helped at times.
Thank u both for this vid because too many people was picking Shane they needed a in-depth explanation fr Kirk even says it himself lmao ofc there’s things Shane was right about to but overall Rick💯.
I feel like if Shawn lived he would have not survived season 3 he can probably make it the the half way mark but the Lori situation plus the extra 2 tramas he'd have by now would make him worse than Rick at that point leading to more losses.
Shane was ready, no one else was. Shane died because he did what weak ones couldn't. Who else would have stood up to rick at the time? NO ONE. Shane made Rick.
Shane was very ahead of the curve like you said especially considering how early on in the apocalypse he adjusted to the new circumstances but he had a fatal flaw in the fact he was too narcissistic and self-serving to actually work in a group setting. That's because he abandoned Rick at the hospital and told his family he was dead which proves that point lol. Sure initially he worked well (in the leading role) but that was based purely off his "previous occupation as a police officer". it built trust with Dale and the others and also worked with Lori since he knew her pre-fall, he was very capable and had the voice to make those hard calls like we saw with Jim. The issue is once Rick entered the picture he was never going to be the same asset for the group like he was. I wish he didn't let Lori lead him on so much he would've been a great member on the team during the Governor arc and probably would've led to a lot of people surviving like T-dog and Oscar.
tbh I think Shane would have made an amazing right hand man to rick in later seasons Rick can make better decisions and think things through vs Shane who will do what needs to be done even if it's objectify Wrong. If Shane wasn't so crazy over Lori and we saw shane and rick working together that would have been amazing
THing is with Shane, yes he was ahead of the curve, but he would have also gotten into unnecessary fights with others which would have caused many casualties among his own. Whereas Rick wanted to avoid a fight where possible, but defend themselves if it comes to that
I miss shane broke my heart when Rick had that dream of them both in the police car talking about Shanes daughter and Rick telling him he was sorry 😞 in death Shane become the man he used to be so sad 😞
Shane would’ve been a good leader for the group if he could let go of his attachment to Lori and Carl. I think if Shane and Rick were able to work out their differences in season 2 the group would’ve been unstoppable in later seasons with Rick and Shane in the same side.
HELL NO. Shane always let his emotions get ahead of him. Most of the time Shane displayed good character, judgement and leadership, but his emotions always put the group in danger.
Shane is my favorite character but he did let his emotions get the better of him. He got way too angry too quickly snd got into fights far more often then being a leader. Shane shouldn't have been so agreeable with Rick back in season 1. Shane was the leader but because he cared for Rick he went along with decisions Rick made when he should have vetoed it right away. Shane was the leader but because he wasn't willing to assert his position early on lead to group listening to Rick instead of him.
@@JohnnyDominion So you stopped watching after season 2? My favorite character is Rick. You know, the guy who gutted Shane like a fish and then went on to be the main character for the next seven seasons.
Pretty much agree with this regarding Shane. Though I think if Shane lived instead of Rick the outcome would have been way different. Sure they would have found the prison, and let’s say they did clear it with out incident, Shane would have killed all the prisoners on site thus not allowing Andrew to set off the alarm that caused the chaos. He probably wouldn’t have saved Hershel and He definitely would have killed the governor right when he became a problem. Eventually the prison would fall though. Now if both Rick and Shane were on the same page, the show definitely would have been different. For one, they would have stayed at the farm as there would be no gun shot to draw the walkers in. They might have stayed there though out the winter and maybe in to the spring but eventually it would have fallen unless they did an Alexandra and built a wall around the farm.
10:25 this part I heavily disagree with because Rick killed in self defense and to put a group member out of their misery while Shane killed a friend to survive and he heard him slowly die so it makes perfect sense that Shane would lose his mind while Rick just shrugged it off
As a leader, who is better? My take: Shane: Was emotional, and irrational. He made decisions largely based on emotion, or attachment. (I.e. Only searching for, or attending to those he cared about personally). Rick: Rick made decisions based on logic, but always went the extra mile, to rescue, extract, or help those who were a part of the group. Even if he had no personal attachment. He was also strategic, and calculated. Conclusion: Rick's characteristics are better for leadership than Shane's.
When it comes to one on one fights, both men have weaknesses and strengths so it isn't a matter of who is better, it is just a matter of who you want as the winner and I personally choose Shane because later down the road Officer Friendly did morally bad things which Shane would NOT do
@@Ares99999 The writers purposely made Them even in their one-on-one fight in s2, they made it so that there is no clear winner so that We, the viewers, get to choose the winner for ourselves
Quick note I'd like to add regarding the Shotgun vs Revolver, but I don't think it changes the fact that Shane was not as good a leader (even if I liked him more). Shotguns are wildly undersold on distance thanks to video games. Shotguns are lethal with buckshot up to about 40 yards (longer shots have been made, but I'm using general rules and not exceptions). Slugs can go up to 100 some yards. In urban environments, low visibility conditions, or when dealing with Walkers this is largely a non-issue. Rick's Python may have a range of 200 yards, but this is insanely hard to line up. With only 6 shots and a lengthy reload... You may not even want to risk taking that shot in the first place. Funnily enough, though, when we get into *melee* range I'd much rather have the Python. Might be able to use the shotgun as a bludgeon, but the Python won't get in your way. The shotgun is likely to be grabbed or pinned, requires two hands to fire, and is generally unwieldly that close. The Python is also significantly easier to fire in awkward positions, like when Rick was under a bus. TL;DR: Revolvers are not common service weapons anymore for a reason, several actually. Any advantage the Python has over the Mossberg is an advantage afforded by being a handgun, not specifically the Python... And Shane also has a Glock, which is far more versatile than the Python's raw power (which largely doesn't matter).
i know Shane was planning to kill rick or force him to kill him but do you think Shane was finally proud rick finally had the guts to do what needed to be done cause in ricks hallucinations he seemed okay with his death and him looking out for Judith.
Shane was good in the short term, Rick was better in the long term. Eventually everyone would adopt Shane's thought processes after surviving for x amount of months. Shane's way of thinking only worked in the earlier seasons because noone had it figured out but would've failed in the later seasons because it would require more finesse.
I love Rick but Shane was willing to do bad things to make his groups lives better. But much like negan and the governor, bad guys live good lives until a good guy finds out
Shane was smart but he wasn't emotionally stable. Many of Shane's views and opinions made so much sense but he went about it the wrong way. He allowed Rick to make unilateral decisions way too early out of respect to his friendship, he didn't be direct and lay out what happened at the hospital with Lori immediately, he didn't focus on getting others in the group to focus on his priorities and get them on his side. He couldn't let go of Lori and Carl which was his biggest weakness.
@@JohnnyDominion some of Shane decisions were unilateral as well seen in the video they both had pros & cons but Rick was still better tactical. It was ultimately Shane emotions that led to his downfall. Rick even agreed with Shane view on Randall it shows that they could’ve been an exceptional duo that learned from each other. Shane wasn’t 100% correct and neither was Rick. Obviously Rick was shown to be a better leader but Shane was no slouch & could’ve been second in command but he wasn’t cooperative Rick had a family in the end of his season while Shane led the group it would’ve bin just him Lori and Carl because that’s all he cared about & yea de would’ve died lmao.
This question isnt fair in the slightest, Shane was only on the show for two seasons and was by far the best character at that point in time. Rick grimes is the main character so of course he is going to have a slight edge over shance especially being in the show for 7 seasons longer.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84 This video is clearly about Rick in seasons 1-2. So, it’s a totally fair comparison. Shane was a great character, yes, but Rick was the better overall survivor even at that early stage.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84 As a character. Not as a survivor. “It’s just your opinion” and your statement isn’t an opinion? Lol Mine is based on feats and facts, yours is based on the popularity of a character and not their actual traits with regards to the topic at hand. (Meaning your argument isn’t even coherent). Try harder man.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Try harder? Lol I don't have to do anything, The show is available for everyone to see for themselves, yes it's my opinion that Shane was the best character on the show up until he died then Rick! Daryl and hershel.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84 My point is that you don’t understand the topic of the video lol we aren’t discussing which character is the most entertaining, we’re talking about which is the best overall survivor in-universe. Your whole point has been about how popular Shane is. That literally has nothing to do with the topic at hand lol your comment is literally incoherent.
In regards to the physical combat, I think at the time Rick was held back by some muscle dystrophy. He'd just woken up from a 45ish day coma. It's going to take a bit of time to gain that back. If they were both at peak fitness, Shane would be stronger, but Rick's agility might be able to make up for it.
Shane had the right instinct and mindset to survive but he wasn’t a leader. Which meant the group would slowly get whittled down as Shane prioritized Lori and Carl over everyone else. Shane was also aggressive when he needed to be which is a tactical advantage but could easily be a strategic disadvantage. Had Shane not lost his mind and accepted his relationship with Lori was over he and Rick would have been an unstoppable powerhouse. I think the Prison would have stood against the governor if Shane had been there with Rick. I think Shane’s fall is a great example that even the strongest of us are not immune to the realities of such a dark world. And that the strongest of us are in just as much danger of falling into abyss as anyone else.
I'd compare Rick and Shane to Rodimus Prime and Ultra Magnus. Shane and Ultra Magnus were perfect for Snap Decisions that were for "The Moment" Rick and Rodimus Prime always looked at the"Big Picture"
Events wouldn’t have even happened the same if Shane lived so when anyone is like the governor or whoever would’ve merked him, they could’ve went another direction entirely with Shane’s involvement etc etc etc
I wish the show would have had Shane leave the group and have his own adventure in the show. Then Rick and Shane meet way later when Rick is very similar to Shane
I agree but for survival instincts Shane is better at identifying a threat and knowing how to take care of one. Bringing up the mental state of the two is not survival instinct it's just their mental state. Sure Shane's mental state was very bad but if u were to compare what Rick and Shane have been through and are going through then it's obvious that Shane would lose it. Shane had to unfortunately kill Otis which eats at him. Rick never had to do that. Shane also lost trust of the group almost immediately as Rick came back so basically his purpose to the group was just taken away. Lori and Shane situation was terrible and both sides are equally to blame but with that happening Shane felt even more alone than he alr was. Not to mention Rick and Shanes relationship. After the fight they both had Rick completely disregarded Shane (which is understandable) and that made Shane 100% alone. Basically if Shane didn't go through half of that in such a short time I guarantee Shane would have been a better survivor in general. Also if Shane wasn't insane I could see Rick and Shane both leading the group which would be a very good duo. But in general yes Rick was better and I'm not saying Shane would be better than Rick later on but I'm saying Shane is better in early days of the apocalypse. I believe that mainly because if Rick and Shane had no group with them I very much believe Shane lasts longer than Rick but yes Rick was better than Shane in the long term for the group. This video is more "who's the better leader" but still awesome video keep up the great work
The end of season 2 and start of season 3 (ricktatorship) was a 9-month timeskip, and honestly, I would believe Shane would have let seveal in the main Atlanta group die in the first 4 months. Shane was a great character, but a bad leader. He always fumbled with big decisions, on the other hand, Rick, once decided, actually can pull through with his decision. hence, the ricktatorship
I’m sorry a mossburg 590 could never hold 10-20 rounds of standard shells! Maybe with the half shells and a tube extender on it I would say if your lucky 10 or 12.
I got to be boring and say that Shane is the better survivor but Rick is a lot better for the group and is building for the future. Shane would last forever but only in a survival sense it would be dirty but 100% effective, where as Rick works ~75% of the time but not be immoral and rules through charisma and skill rather than fear and safety.
With the communities they faced and people like negan I don’t see Shane being able to survive stability wise on his own especially with how emotional he was over Lori. It’s better to have a community to have food and a roof under your head. Or he could’ve been like carol 😭 he could probably survive until the end like that lmao if no one comes to raid him. We saw how difficult it was for the group on the road in season 5.
@@Depressing_joe shane was right all along rick even admitted it what shit are you on the man rick is today is because of Shane well cope its gonna be hard for you to digest that 😂
@@RickGrimezTWD i just hate that statement thats all 😂 shane is right in some cases but not everything. If you watch the video above you will know it lol. The man rick is today is thanks to a lot of people.
It was a pleasure being on the channel thank you for having me! 🙏🏼
Shane adapted quicker but Rick is better and wiser
I don't think he adapted. He got ruthless quicker, but the psychological adaptation was never there. In fact, Rick being able to shoot the reanimated Sophia shows that Rick had mentally adapted quicker.
@@Ares99999exactly. Shane had a “bulldoze through everything” type mentality
@@Ares99999 But he didn't see the world how it was Shane did Shane was mentally prepared before everyone was it's his obsession with Lori that made him go insane
@@z.incognito6259 He did adapt quickly though
@@thedecipher346 Sounds kinda maladaptive to me
Shane 100% died in that parking lot with Otis. It was the right thing to do, it saved Carl, but he couldn't handle killing an innocent man even if was justifiable. Any "what if Shane survived" scenario leads to him dying in a few months unless it includes Carl never getting shot by Otis and maybe Shane leaves with Andrea? Either way, having to kill Otis was the point of no return for his sanity.
That's where you're wrong Shane died when he left Rick in the hospital and he took care of his family while he was gone
@@deandre15no he fucking didn’t?
@@deandre15 Shane couldn't have saved him
Indeed.
@@deandre15 OR when he took aim at Rick's back when they were patrolling the forest near their first camp...
This is a good way to finally silence the debate, considering many people still think Shane was better in the early seasons. Shane was great, but he wasn’t Rick Grimes.
Fr
the thing here is Shane would've been better than Rick if he wasn't obsessed with Lori plus don't forget he sacrificed someone even if he didn't want to
@@susanoo3695no he wouldn’t have, he was still impulsive and hot headed and simply not as smart as Rick
@@Idk98268I like Shane better but I do think Rick was a better leader. I think Shane is better in fights and handling rough situations especially early on as he was already up to speed in this new world. I really wish he would have lived and been a great right hand man. That is his true role in my opinion.
@@LegoCityBuilderBob he handled rough situations terribly, Rick was ALWAYS better at handling those situations, Shane nearly got the group kicked off the farm more than once or nearly caused a violent skirmish between Hershel’s family and the group
You don’t have to do Otis that dirty man lol
He did otis like shane did him lol
I came down the comments looking for this. LAND WHALE- REALLY!??? hahaha
He was a glorified land whale though and less we forget shot poor whiney Coooorrrrllll lol
Shane early but Rick on overall but I think Shane made Rick a better person
You should def do more character comparisons like this. 💯
Saying the shotgun can hold "10-20" rounds made me have a stroke
Came to the comments for this
Mossbergs actual website states they can hold between 6 and 20 shells
mini shells exist. if i remember correctly, the mossberg 590 holds like 13 mini shells.
@jackthm5069 just checked, and the highest capacity 500 I saw was 8+1, and it has a pretty long mag tube. You would need a mag tube over 3 feet to hold 20 2 inch shells
@@i4ott who the hell just has a ton of mini shells laying around 😭
Shane could've had his own spin off
Wasn’t there an interview where. Robert Kirkman, said Shane would’ve gotten the group killed. Also, Dixon would’ve left the group. With Merle, he wouldn’t have been down. With Shane murder plot.
We don't need Kirkman to see Shane would have gotten the group killed in like 6 months TOPS if he managed to kill Rick lol. Only the biggest Shane fanboy could deny that and I love me some Shane. Great character but he was way too mentally unhinged by that point.
Merle would be down
for whatever. 😂
This the same guy who said Invincible beats Superman with ease?
@@Papa_Burton Kirkman worked on the show as a writer and authored the original comic series. His view of a character within the series is basically akin to the word of "god". His comment about Superman is different, because he doesn't write Superman comics. He's wrong about Supes, but right about Shane because Shane is literally his character.
@@Papa_Burton I get the vibe he's trolling powerscale nerds by insisting that lmao
Though Shane brought bravado to the series, like I've mentioned previously in other video postings of yours ,Shane is a damaged individual. Emotional, irrational, vengeful, undisciplined and finally a sad lonely wreck. Anything could set him off. Literally anything.
Man definitely wasn’t emotional or irrational. He was impulsive yeah, but wasn’t ruled by emotion. He was willing to make calls that Rick was too weak to make, and even Hershel proved that to be true.
Impulsivity often stems from emotion. I'm not sure this is great argument to make. @SAGETAKES
Except literally everybody would be if they were in his position, I'd argue more than he was.
Rick showed up out of nowhere and usurped Shane's leadership role, and his first decision was to go against Shane and try to rescue Merle, which resulted in 80% of the group dying.
Despite this, Rick still forces himself into the leadership position.
Rick wants to spare Randall, Shane says no because he'd lead his group to the farm. What do we later find out? When Carl sneaked in to the shed Randall made it clear that he indeed intended to bring his group to the farm...Once again, a decision Rick made against Shane's wishes that would have got the whole group killed.
Sophia. Once again, Shane was right but Rick kept putting the group in danger to look for her. The ONLY reason this risk to others in the group stopped was because Shane refused to have a group of walkers right outside the groups door.
During all of this, Lori is emotionally abusing the man, so much so that Shane decides its best he just leaves. What does Lori do? Mind F with him to stay.
Then he finds out Lori is pregnant with his child. Reaction? Steal his child to be from him before it's even outside of the womb.
Shane was not only right but he was absolutely right to take Rick in to that field and end him. What was it Shane said? "I don't think you got what it takes to keep them safe."
There's 3 people of the original group that have survived Rick's leadership, out of about 50+.
Shane was absolutely right.
Shane in a fight definitely wins especially H2H since as Theo said, Shane’s got a more compact robust build and did overpower Rick in their fist fight. Rick only won the second round because he got the jump on Shane’s back.
Love the content man. Very unique and inviting. Great humor. Please don’t stop releasing videos!! We still love the walking dead
Shane proved much less mentally stable than Rick. I do wonder why though... we should keep in mind that Shane lived through the apocalypse where-as Rick was suddenly transported into it. It's like his mind has jet-lag. If Rick had never been shot, would Shane and Rick together, experiencing the world end while mutually supporting one another, have both survived long term?
An alternate series of events where both best friends mutually support one another and Rick's family, there is no accidental affair, no love triangle. Both men and Lori and Carl might stay together and alive for long term.
Best comment you bring up point that’s everyone mostly forgets
@@y0ungspanish318 That is true Shane for those early months witness some horrible shit and the end of the world in real time. Rick just got the 28 day later treatment into it. Like you wake up one morning everything is also fine, but the next day you think is gonna be the same as any other day. Only to find out all hell broken out in the world.
Shane is a perfect right hand man. Imagine a Walking Dead World, where Rick would not get shot and Rick and Shane would leave Atlanta together with Lori and Carl. I think in that case, Shane would have been a great uncle typ of guy for Carl and I also think, he wouldnt have felt in love with Lori. Maybe he would have felt in love with Andrea. This would have been an insane strong group.
Two of them would've made the group stronger imo, especially if Shane was around in season 3 and he and Rick could've ended the Governor sooner. Lori was messing with his head though. Lori: stay away, no i want you around.
In Shane defense: He wasn't lying when he thought Rick was dead. Lori thought Rick was but he ain't. She wasn't in the Hospital when the army came in started executing all the Doctors and patients. An Shane could barely do anything but attempt to save Ricks life and only by a 50/50 chance Rick survived. For all Shane knew Rick probably got a bullet at that point.
If that ain't the case then the Napalm bombing the took place later by the air force probably killed Rick something Lori witness, and no doubt she assumes Rick is also dead after all that. An her playing Shane left and right after for 3 months he's been protecting her and Carl all that time.
When I first watched the show, back when I was like in high school, I was team Shane. But with some maturity, and with a few rewatches, I realized Rick was always better.
That's easy to say when Rick was on the show longer.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84
Im referring to Rick in the earlier seasons my dude. lol Not Murder Jacket Rick or CRM Rick or Savior War Rick or whatever.
@@501stDank well then that's a lie because in the first 2 seasons Shane was easily the best character up until he died.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84 Just because you have a different opinion doesn't mean what others say is a "lie". It's subjective who the best character was. Rick without a doubt was a lot more interesting and cooler than Shane.
@@rafayg7376 And that's exactly why your arguing with me because you think Rick is better then Shane , if I had said Rick you would have nothing to say.
I love the zomboid music in the background
Had Shane still been the leader of the group when Rick arrived, the group wouldn’t have made it passed season 2. Remember back in season 1 Shane wanted to go to Fort Benning but Rick insisted that they go to the CDC which resulted in them getting more information about what was happening to the world. In season 2 when Rick, Glenn and Hershel met Tony and Dave, they found out that Fort Benning was overrun with Walkers so had they listened to Shane from the start, they all would’ve died.
Yeah dude. If Rick and Shane were on the same page they would have been a serious problem for anyone looking for trouble.
Love the Project Zomboid music subtlety playing in the background
Bruh the Ricktator 🤣 I would give anything to watch this show in it’s hay day again. It was amazing
Honestly it kind of annoys me when people say Shane had better survival instincts. He was trying to be a foil to Rick and push back against him in any way he could, and occasionally he was right about certain points. Rick however often knew the outcome ahead of time and did it anyways as he combined things together. Him going back to the city was not JUST about saving merle, but winning over Daryl, and getting a bag of guns, as well as getting in to contact with other survivors such as the people he initially met. He wanted to go and see if he could get equipment from tanks, vehicles, helicopters, the police headquarters and other locations. Rick always saw the bigger picture and combined multiple instances of things together.
While looking for sophia, they find the Barn, and get off of the main road which was just begging for them to be attacked by raiders or killed by walkers. Looking for sophia was not just about sophia, but also about keeping the group mentally sane, and getting them off of the main roads and deeper in to the woods where they eventually found the farm. Rick knew that to survive you had to explore, go on missions, figure stuff out. Each mission was a reconnaissance mission to find more information and expand.
Finally Shane was wrong for killing otis. The amount of time they fought and the fact they only had to go a bit further to escape meant that Otis was right that they could make it without one of them dying. Shane was clearly losing it and not thinking clearly. Otis insists that Shane try to look for more weapons, not rush in to the facility, to take their time etc. and he refused. Shane jumped from the building and got his own leg twisted, and then shot otis over this. Shane made rash, impulsive decisions that later lead to more problems down the road. Otis was calm, collected and smart and shane rushed in guns blazing and nearly was killed multiple times but otis saved him. Shane was losing his mind, and Otis was only going along with shane as he felt guilty. He even tried to convince shane to gather more supplies and ammunition and he refused. Further, Shane almost never kills a walker or zombie with a melee weapon. I'm not sure if he does it one time. Even rick tells shane he needs to start killing them with melee weapons and shane seems queasy about it, like he can't bring himself to do it. There's no reason why, with a machete, shane couldn't have killed hundreds of walkers if he needed to, but he was too scared to do it, and this is why he ultimately was unable to be as good of a survivor. He made rash, impulsive, emotional decisions and this is why he was ultimately killed.
Otis would’ve never made it or Shane. One of them was going to die given their vehicle was parked farther from the school so they can sneak on foot.
@@enriqueperezarce5485 they could have use melee weapons to kill walkers, and he could have hopped on one foot and likely made it over the fence, he spent like 30 seconds fighting with otis which was enough time to escape honestly. They also could have used anything else as a distraction like a flare
@@everybodydothatdinosaur519 Yea fight a horde of walkers which for someone reason are super strong for their decaying state. Couple that with your partner not being athletic. They were cooked, Shane did the logically choice there but was messed up emotionally and mentally from it
@@enriqueperezarce5485 given how far away they were and how long they fought they problably could have escaped
@@everybodydothatdinosaur519 Shane was not outrunning the walkers with gear and a messed up ankle, Otis was basically wraps given the gear he was carrying and how tired he was. Basically one of them was going to die almost guaranteed unless outside interference occurs. Also Shane mindset sealed the deal on Otis dying.
You can see it as, shane being "superior" in some aspects, But Rick was "better" overall.
Really thoughtful observations. I love that there is still more to contemplate about this mostly-good series.
I think one aspect of Shane that affected his leadership is he got emotional, which would affect his decision making, while Rick would generally try to make choices logically, only time I can think where Rick acted on emotion was when he asked Hershel to stay on the farm, due to Lori being pregnant
The 590 does not hold 10 to 20 shells, if that were the case, the gun would be freakishly longer. It can hold 8+1 at most based on the configuration we see
appreciate the use of Project Zomboid music, was playing it while listening and thought my audio was glitching lol.
BASED PROJECT ZOMBOID MUSIC DETECTED
that comment at 4:43 was outta pocket
not really
Shane and Rick are both dangerous men. Rick is capable but he has a history of getting his ass handed to him in hand to hand fights in both TV and comics.
Shane had the attitude, the determination and was capable of leading as there were time the group was willing to listen to him over Rick when he bothered leading.
T-Dog and Andrea were willing to agree with Shane more even Daryl was willing to follow him.
However Rick was way too agreeable with people willing to compromise way too much rather than make cold decisive decisions, Rick was way too moral.
Shane was also way too angry while he was a capable leader and got into arguments far more than he needed to he should have acted rather than just debating with Rick.
Shane's weakness was his love for Lori Carl and even Rick. Shane went along with many decisions Rick made rather than going with what he wanted as far back as Season 1 out of loyalty and respect for his brotherhood. As a leader he should have made far more decisive decisions rather than be diplomatic with Rick.
Shane let his dysfunctional relationship with Lori constantly stress him out. Which caused him to be far too angry when he should have been rational.
Also his love for Carl was the penultimate turning point for him. When he saw Carl was adapting enough to the new world and becoming fearful it worried. So much that it lead to him trying to put aside whatever beef he ad with Rick in order to fix that. Rick refusing to listen or even hear Shane out himover the edge. Which is what lead to him deciding to kill Rick.
Ah, a hardcore Shane fan in denial that Rick was better.
If only Shane never list his mind, he and Rick would've been a force to reackon with.
what do you mean 10 to 20 shells? The full-length magazine tube holds up to seven 3" shells or eight 2¾" shells. Switching over to a full load-out of 1¾"-long mini shells brings the magazine capacity up to 13 rounds.
I may have lumped the 590 and 590m together, since they’re in the same family.
@@TheRealCaptainGold yes you did because detachable box magazine fed shotguns can hold that amount but not magazine tubes, but everything else you said is right
@@TheRealCaptainGoldcomparing a handgun to a shotgun is kinda dumb regardless. two different tools for two completely different purposes. u shouldve compared ricks python to shane’s glock. much more interesting comparison
@@bobduncanvevo6969
That’s fair. But that Glock wasn’t Shane’s signature weapon. I think Rick used other handguns more than his own python lol
@@gerardmcquade9102 the 590 that shane used can hold like 13+ mini shells so technically hes not wrong.
Another great video! I’ve gotta say I completely agree. Although he had a better survival mindset in the beginning, his mental state deteriorated and he became mired in dangerous to the group than anything. Rick had a more slow and steady growth
The thing with Shane is he adjusted to the new world to fast. All the stress from the chaos of the apocalypse basically taking care of Lori and Carl, his kind wasn’t given enough time to fully process what’s happened to the world definitely made his mind unstable. I think given enough time to sit down and rest to take it all in, he would’ve become a great survivor or leader
Don’t forget that Rick was in a fucking coma and was built like starvin marvin when he woke up
In the long run, shane would have won. But that's just "if"
3:49 this is way funnier than it needs to be 🤣
Rick was able to be compassionate and ruthless, he showed compassion to the people he loved but was able to make that switch against his enemies for his people's survival that's what makes him better than Shane. Shane had the right idea of doing what it took to survive but he was also reckless and controlled by his emotions which made him dangerous and caused his downfall unlike Rick who was able overcome moments when he experienced loss and pain.
Imagine Shane vs CRM Rick. That would be over so fast in a fist fight
What are some strength feats CRM Rick, cause Rick’s got a terrible record in fist fights
@@SAGETAKES he does but their only fight was in season 2 and obviously Rick has gotten better since then, plus the CRM hand to hand combat training AND the metal arm.
Glad i found this channel. the production quality is really good for only 11k subs.
Shane had the survival instincts against the undead, Rick had them against the living
Rick Grimes is my favorite character but i also love shane too because he was funny and helped rick become feral
Shane was to Rick as Simon was to Negan
Very great points, I feel like this video really put all the right points together in one place.
In theory it would have been great if Rick and Shane stayed a duo and didn't have all the hangups of Shane being with Lori and such. Basically, would have probably stayed what Rick and Daryl turned into or became a trio of power.
Aaron once remarked to Rick that he had stopped the end of the world and had instead started a new one. A hell of a thing to say: that rick Grimes had defeated the apocalypse itself.
It takes a certain kind of man to not only be a fighter but a true leader. I think i may have commented in the poll, that Shane could command but Rick could Rally and even inspire. You could even say that they are analogous to Negan and Simon-- a notion that i think has merit but theres very little to go on to illustrate it
And thats the big issue with this debate is we simply dont have Shane around long enough to see how he would handle some of the more radical, desperate and wild situations Rick was faced with. But what he did was prepare Rick for the road ahead. He walked so Ricky Dicky Doodah could run
Edit: like, share, fuck and subscribe? YES SIR
When bro said Theo I thought Theo Von was gonna explain shit in a weird way 😂😂
In terms of morals and respect, obviously Rick. But in terms of survival instincts, at least up until the Governor came around, I give it to Shane
Shane was never a leader; he gave a fuck about two people only and was at most muscle. Even then Shane stood out as a fighter only because he adapted early, once everyone adjusted he's really only average. Dude would've just ended up as walker dinner at the fall of the farm or one of the Governor's head trophies if he didn't try to kill Rick lmao
Love the character, by the way, but Shane fans need to get real
Love your videos man
Ima watch the video, but the answer is obvious. Rick is alive like 15 years later lol
We don’t care lil bro we’re talking about 2010-2011
@@v7qow No, we definitely care.
@@Ares99999 so you’re telling me that you’re comparing a protagonist with an antagonist that died from 2011 because of some comic book 🤣
@@v7qow Shane was clearly unhinged by the end of his short apocalypse life, dude would have gotten them all killed at some point. The fact Rick has lasted so long shows he's the more head strong survivor regardless of your feelings on the plot.
I honestly feel like if Lori had treated Shane better after Rick came back then he wouldn’t have become so unstable afterwards, likely either ending up with him leaving and regrouping with them later on or staying with the group and co-parenting with Rick after Lori dies.
MAYBE WE CAN WIN THIS 🗣🗣🗣🗣🗣💥💥💥💥💥
And the thing is he proved shane wrong shane said "you d see ricks not built for this world"but now look at him
Gotta say, it was a making or breaking point for Rick in season 7 when Negan made Rick his bitch. And that was the time when Rick either proves Shane right or wrong, to an extent, Rick was built for this world at first, but he adapted a bit and plot armor helped at times.
Thank u both for this vid because too many people was picking Shane they needed a in-depth explanation fr Kirk even says it himself lmao ofc there’s things Shane was right about to but overall Rick💯.
I'ma say Shane was way ahead of curve but his mental break was his downfall
Felt lol
I feel like if Shawn lived he would have not survived season 3 he can probably make it the the half way mark but the Lori situation plus the extra 2 tramas he'd have by now would make him worse than Rick at that point leading to more losses.
Shane was ready, no one else was. Shane died because he did what weak ones couldn't. Who else would have stood up to rick at the time? NO ONE. Shane made Rick.
Shane was very ahead of the curve like you said especially considering how early on in the apocalypse he adjusted to the new circumstances but he had a fatal flaw in the fact he was too narcissistic and self-serving to actually work in a group setting. That's because he abandoned Rick at the hospital and told his family he was dead which proves that point lol. Sure initially he worked well (in the leading role) but that was based purely off his "previous occupation as a police officer". it built trust with Dale and the others and also worked with Lori since he knew her pre-fall, he was very capable and had the voice to make those hard calls like we saw with Jim.
The issue is once Rick entered the picture he was never going to be the same asset for the group like he was. I wish he didn't let Lori lead him on so much he would've been a great member on the team during the Governor arc and probably would've led to a lot of people surviving like T-dog and Oscar.
tbh I think Shane would have made an amazing right hand man to rick in later seasons Rick can make better decisions and think things through vs Shane who will do what needs to be done even if it's objectify Wrong. If Shane wasn't so crazy over Lori and we saw shane and rick working together that would have been amazing
THing is with Shane, yes he was ahead of the curve, but he would have also gotten into unnecessary fights with others which would have caused many casualties among his own. Whereas Rick wanted to avoid a fight where possible, but defend themselves if it comes to that
I miss shane broke my heart when Rick had that dream of them both in the police car talking about Shanes daughter and Rick telling him he was sorry 😞 in death Shane become the man he used to be so sad 😞
Shane would’ve been a good leader for the group if he could let go of his attachment to Lori and Carl. I think if Shane and Rick were able to work out their differences in season 2 the group would’ve been unstoppable in later seasons with Rick and Shane in the same side.
The farm was done for regardless there was a massive group of zombies on the way
HELL NO. Shane always let his emotions get ahead of him. Most of the time Shane displayed good character, judgement and leadership, but his emotions always put the group in danger.
Shane is my favorite character but he did let his emotions get the better of him. He got way too angry too quickly snd got into fights far more often then being a leader.
Shane shouldn't have been so agreeable with Rick back in season 1. Shane was the leader but because he cared for Rick he went along with decisions Rick made when he should have vetoed it right away. Shane was the leader but because he wasn't willing to assert his position early on lead to group listening to Rick instead of him.
@@JohnnyDominion So you stopped watching after season 2? My favorite character is Rick. You know, the guy who gutted Shane like a fish and then went on to be the main character for the next seven seasons.
@Ares99999 No I watched the whole show. I don't know how you assumed that, I pointed out Shane's weaknesses that is all.
I was on team Gleen at the beginning hahaha
Shane Fans out here sniffing the COPIUM.
Pretty much agree with this regarding Shane. Though I think if Shane lived instead of Rick the outcome would have been way different. Sure they would have found the prison, and let’s say they did clear it with out incident, Shane would have killed all the prisoners on site thus not allowing Andrew to set off the alarm that caused the chaos. He probably wouldn’t have saved Hershel and He definitely would have killed the governor right when he became a problem. Eventually the prison would fall though.
Now if both Rick and Shane were on the same page, the show definitely would have been different. For one, they would have stayed at the farm as there would be no gun shot to draw the walkers in. They might have stayed there though out the winter and maybe in to the spring but eventually it would have fallen unless they did an Alexandra and built a wall around the farm.
10:25 this part I heavily disagree with because Rick killed in self defense and to put a group member out of their misery while Shane killed a friend to survive and he heard him slowly die so it makes perfect sense that Shane would lose his mind while Rick just shrugged it off
10 to 20 shells in a mossberg 590? Shotguns in this universe are stacked I guess
Nah I made a mistake, not double checking my work on the different versions of the Mossberg 590.
Calling him a land whale was great. Wish i could sub twice
As a leader, who is better?
My take:
Shane: Was emotional, and irrational. He made decisions largely based on emotion, or attachment. (I.e. Only searching for, or attending to those he cared about personally).
Rick: Rick made decisions based on logic, but always went the extra mile, to rescue, extract, or help those who were a part of the group. Even if he had no personal attachment. He was also strategic, and calculated.
Conclusion: Rick's characteristics are better for leadership than Shane's.
When it comes to one on one fights, both men have weaknesses and strengths so it isn't a matter of who is better, it is just a matter of who you want as the winner and I personally choose Shane because later down the road Officer Friendly did morally bad things which Shane would NOT do
Salty Shane fan, eh?
@@Ares99999 The writers purposely made Them even in their one-on-one fight in s2, they made it so that there is no clear winner so that We, the viewers, get to choose the winner for ourselves
People who voted for Shane wouldn't last a week in an Apocalypse.
Quick note I'd like to add regarding the Shotgun vs Revolver, but I don't think it changes the fact that Shane was not as good a leader (even if I liked him more).
Shotguns are wildly undersold on distance thanks to video games. Shotguns are lethal with buckshot up to about 40 yards (longer shots have been made, but I'm using general rules and not exceptions). Slugs can go up to 100 some yards. In urban environments, low visibility conditions, or when dealing with Walkers this is largely a non-issue. Rick's Python may have a range of 200 yards, but this is insanely hard to line up. With only 6 shots and a lengthy reload... You may not even want to risk taking that shot in the first place.
Funnily enough, though, when we get into *melee* range I'd much rather have the Python. Might be able to use the shotgun as a bludgeon, but the Python won't get in your way. The shotgun is likely to be grabbed or pinned, requires two hands to fire, and is generally unwieldly that close. The Python is also significantly easier to fire in awkward positions, like when Rick was under a bus.
TL;DR: Revolvers are not common service weapons anymore for a reason, several actually. Any advantage the Python has over the Mossberg is an advantage afforded by being a handgun, not specifically the Python... And Shane also has a Glock, which is far more versatile than the Python's raw power (which largely doesn't matter).
i know Shane was planning to kill rick or force him to kill him but do you think Shane was finally proud rick finally had the guts to do what needed to be done cause in ricks hallucinations he seemed okay with his death and him looking out for Judith.
Shane versus Negan. Shane wouldn't stand on the nees.
Shane was good in the short term, Rick was better in the long term.
Eventually everyone would adopt Shane's thought processes after surviving for x amount of months.
Shane's way of thinking only worked in the earlier seasons because noone had it figured out but would've failed in the later seasons because it would require more finesse.
I always thought Shane was tougher ,I don't think better is a good qualifier ,I was Team Shane 💥💖
I love Rick but Shane was willing to do bad things to make his groups lives better. But much like negan and the governor, bad guys live good lives until a good guy finds out
If Shane was so smart, how come he's dead?
Shane was smart but he wasn't emotionally stable. Many of Shane's views and opinions made so much sense but he went about it the wrong way. He allowed Rick to make unilateral decisions way too early out of respect to his friendship, he didn't be direct and lay out what happened at the hospital with Lori immediately, he didn't focus on getting others in the group to focus on his priorities and get them on his side. He couldn't let go of Lori and Carl which was his biggest weakness.
@@JohnnyDominion some of Shane decisions were unilateral as well seen in the video they both had pros & cons but Rick was still better tactical. It was ultimately Shane emotions that led to his downfall. Rick even agreed with Shane view on Randall it shows that they could’ve been an exceptional duo that learned from each other. Shane wasn’t 100% correct and neither was Rick. Obviously Rick was shown to be a better leader but Shane was no slouch & could’ve been second in command but he wasn’t cooperative Rick had a family in the end of his season while Shane led the group it would’ve bin just him Lori and Carl because that’s all he cared about & yea de would’ve died lmao.
This question isnt fair in the slightest, Shane was only on the show for two seasons and was by far the best character at that point in time. Rick grimes is the main character so of course he is going to have a slight edge over shance especially being in the show for 7 seasons longer.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84
This video is clearly about Rick in seasons 1-2. So, it’s a totally fair comparison. Shane was a great character, yes, but Rick was the better overall survivor even at that early stage.
@@TheRealCaptainGold No he wasn't it's just simply your opinion, Shane stole the show for the first two seasons.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84
As a character. Not as a survivor. “It’s just your opinion” and your statement isn’t an opinion? Lol Mine is based on feats and facts, yours is based on the popularity of a character and not their actual traits with regards to the topic at hand. (Meaning your argument isn’t even coherent). Try harder man.
@@TheRealCaptainGold Try harder? Lol I don't have to do anything, The show is available for everyone to see for themselves, yes it's my opinion that Shane was the best character on the show up until he died then Rick! Daryl and hershel.
@@Marvel_vs_Capcom84
My point is that you don’t understand the topic of the video lol we aren’t discussing which character is the most entertaining, we’re talking about which is the best overall survivor in-universe. Your whole point has been about how popular Shane is. That literally has nothing to do with the topic at hand lol your comment is literally incoherent.
I'm going to go with Rick but I will say imagine what they could have did if Shane was still alive in the end together Daryl Carol Maggie
In regards to the physical combat, I think at the time Rick was held back by some muscle dystrophy. He'd just woken up from a 45ish day coma. It's going to take a bit of time to gain that back. If they were both at peak fitness, Shane would be stronger, but Rick's agility might be able to make up for it.
Shane had the right instinct and mindset to survive but he wasn’t a leader. Which meant the group would slowly get whittled down as Shane prioritized Lori and Carl over everyone else. Shane was also aggressive when he needed to be which is a tactical advantage but could easily be a strategic disadvantage.
Had Shane not lost his mind and accepted his relationship with Lori was over he and Rick would have been an unstoppable powerhouse.
I think the Prison would have stood against the governor if Shane had been there with Rick.
I think Shane’s fall is a great example that even the strongest of us are not immune to the realities of such a dark world. And that the strongest of us are in just as much danger of falling into abyss as anyone else.
A lot of people think survival is the only goal, and they think shane was the tippity top of badassary. If survival is the goal, then Rick wins.
I'd compare Rick and Shane to
Rodimus Prime and Ultra Magnus.
Shane and Ultra Magnus were perfect for Snap Decisions that were for "The Moment"
Rick and Rodimus Prime always looked at the"Big Picture"
A Mossberg pump, 10-20 shells? what universe is this?
Clearly Rick cuz Rick was no
Simp imagine dying 3 month in apoc
Events wouldn’t have even happened the same if Shane lived so when anyone is like the governor or whoever would’ve merked him, they could’ve went another direction entirely with Shane’s involvement etc etc etc
I wish the show would have had Shane leave the group and have his own adventure in the show. Then Rick and Shane meet way later when Rick is very similar to Shane
teen team shane, adult team rick and now team dale XD
I agree but for survival instincts Shane is better at identifying a threat and knowing how to take care of one. Bringing up the mental state of the two is not survival instinct it's just their mental state. Sure Shane's mental state was very bad but if u were to compare what Rick and Shane have been through and are going through then it's obvious that Shane would lose it. Shane had to unfortunately kill Otis which eats at him. Rick never had to do that. Shane also lost trust of the group almost immediately as Rick came back so basically his purpose to the group was just taken away. Lori and Shane situation was terrible and both sides are equally to blame but with that happening Shane felt even more alone than he alr was. Not to mention Rick and Shanes relationship. After the fight they both had Rick completely disregarded Shane (which is understandable) and that made Shane 100% alone. Basically if Shane didn't go through half of that in such a short time I guarantee Shane would have been a better survivor in general. Also if Shane wasn't insane I could see Rick and Shane both leading the group which would be a very good duo. But in general yes Rick was better and I'm not saying Shane would be better than Rick later on but I'm saying Shane is better in early days of the apocalypse. I believe that mainly because if Rick and Shane had no group with them I very much believe Shane lasts longer than Rick but yes Rick was better than Shane in the long term for the group. This video is more "who's the better leader" but still awesome video keep up the great work
Lori is not equal to blame shane SA her
Rick overpowered Shane at the CDC and disarmed him
The end of season 2 and start of season 3 (ricktatorship) was a 9-month timeskip, and honestly, I would believe Shane would have let seveal in the main Atlanta group die in the first 4 months. Shane was a great character, but a bad leader. He always fumbled with big decisions, on the other hand, Rick, once decided, actually can pull through with his decision. hence, the ricktatorship
🎯 Key points for quick navigation:
00:00 *约翰·伯恩萨尔对肖恩·沃尔什的演绎为《行尸走肉》增添了复杂性，令观众受益匪浅。*
01:08 *肖恩早期表现为反英雄，但到第二季末，他已成为公认的反派。*
02:18 *肖恩的悲剧在于他虽然迅速适应新世界，却无法心理上承受。*
04:03 *他对杀死最好朋友的犹豫显示出他内心的挣扎和无法面对现实的困扰。*
05:13 *肖恩认为实际上无法保证罗瑞和卡尔的安全，导致了他对瑞克的敌意。*
06:38 *罗瑞未能给予肖恩父亲的权利，加剧了他的精神崩溃。*
08:12 *罗瑞的行为在某种程度上促成了肖恩的反派化，尽管肖恩最终需要为自己的行为负责。*
11:21 *肖恩的需求和动机虽然有误，但并不完全疯狂。*
14:32 *肖恩的生存本能很强，但他的冲动和情绪常常导致错误判断。*
16:27 *肖恩的故事充满层次，其复杂性往往被两派观众忽视。*
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I think they're meant to be 2 sides of the same coin.
I’m sorry a mossburg 590 could never hold 10-20 rounds of standard shells! Maybe with the half shells and a tube extender on it I would say if your lucky 10 or 12.
I got to be boring and say that Shane is the better survivor but Rick is a lot better for the group and is building for the future. Shane would last forever but only in a survival sense it would be dirty but 100% effective, where as Rick works ~75% of the time but not be immoral and rules through charisma and skill rather than fear and safety.
Yeah, Shane would be a lonely, utterly insane survivor that people would put down upon meeting. Last forever my ass.
With the communities they faced and people like negan I don’t see Shane being able to survive stability wise on his own especially with how emotional he was over Lori. It’s better to have a community to have food and a roof under your head. Or he could’ve been like carol 😭 he could probably survive until the end like that lmao if no one comes to raid him. We saw how difficult it was for the group on the road in season 5.
Rick turned into Shane. Shane was right all along.
😂😂😂😂
@@Depressing_joe what's so funny?
@@drewwhezzy they make this video so there is no more "shane is right all along" comment. And then there is you commenting this lmao
@@Depressing_joe shane was right all along rick even admitted it what shit are you on the man rick is today is because of Shane
well cope its gonna be hard for you to digest that 😂
@@RickGrimezTWD i just hate that statement thats all 😂 shane is right in some cases but not everything. If you watch the video above you will know it lol. The man rick is today is thanks to a lot of people.