I've quite partial to Lore, the good vs bad boi thing is fun and interesting. Lore coulda been so much more tho it seems they just didnt know what to do
Dont know if you guys cares but if you're bored like me during the covid times then you can watch pretty much all of the latest series on Instaflixxer. I've been streaming with my brother for the last couple of days :)
And in a similar vein, although Data cannot feel emotions in the same capacity as humans (before he gets the emotion chip anyway), he is still able to experience things like desire, friendship, loss, and trust.
@@PantherMom512 That is essentially the conclusion Spock came to at the end of the first Star Trek movie. He finally resolved the conflict that had always defined him before. When we see him in Wrath of Khan, he's at peace with himself, no longer denying his human half, but integrating it into a whole person.
On the surface, Data is definitely the Spock equivalent in TNG. Both are logical, dead-pan, and literal. But in reality, when you look more in depth at their backgrounds and values, they’re exact opposite sides of the same coin meeting precisely in the middle. Spock is a person who can’t help but feel emotion and humanity, despite wishing to leave them behind and live an entirely logical life. Whereas Data _seeks_ the emotions Spock detests, and is all but unable to live anything BUT a life dictated by logic. And yet they meet in the middle and end up very similar. It’s fascinating to think about.
I think Odo is the DS9 equivalent of the two. Like Spock and Data, he is aware of human niceties, but unlike Spock who struggles with them and Data who wants to embrace them, Odo just chooses to ignore them.
The Kurtzmantrek version would have been: PEW PEW PEW, BOOM, PAM, SOCK, PAFF, BOOM, BOOM, "Agh...sob...everything is miserable, life is pain" "Discrimination, privilege, women are badass" BOOM, PEW, PEW, PEW.
@@Shendue His version makes perfect sense for this period in history, the philosophizing of the TNG era (post cold war) would require a return to values of objectivity and reason which at this point do not exist so what do you have left? you have struggle with material reality which is ultimately hierarchy and the search for hope.
Mccoy was in the pilot as a very old man in his 130's then Mr Spock late in TNG there was Scotty who effectively travelled to the future and retired in the 24th century and finally we had captain Kirk who had a brief visit to the 24th century before ultimately loosing his life to Soran. So that's four of the orginal star cast core cast in the tng and the 24th century at roughly the same time.
@@Coolman13355 That's precisely why the episode was made, and also why Nimoy agreed to appear in it. 1991 was the 25th anniversary of "Star Trek", and Paramount was doing all they could to celebrate the occasion.
@TheVoiceOfTruth Picard had a lot of issues, his dad didn't want him to join Starfleet, his brother had a similar mindset, I don't know much about his mother. And what do you mean 'no family'? His family was gathered aboard the Enterprise for the entire run of the show
@@thedelta4258 At least he worked things out with his brother and as for his mother, from how he reacted to an illusion of her early in season 1 when they were in the place where thoughts become reality, I'd say that he was close to his mother. Usually, when a child butts heads with one parent, they're close to the other. For example, I butted heads with my dad growing up sometimes but I've always been close to my mom so I imagine that Picard was much the same way.
Picard: the analytical abilities of a Vulcan, the honour of a Klingon, the negotiating skills of a Ferengi, the political intelligence of a Romulan and the devotion to duty of a Jem H'adar.
This is among the most Star Trek scenes in spirit: a living personification of multiculturalism in Spock, a man of two worlds, discussing human nature with a synthetically created individual who represents the greatest of human technological potential. It’s a fitting tribute to have this episode dedicated to the man who began this kind of examination of our curious species through this apex of science fiction he began.
Check the circuit: This is more dualism than multiculturalism. In Spock ... And we could discuss what it is in Data ... (Is curiosity make sense without desire, since desire implies emotions ... Data seems to have a "personal" imperative ... how is that? Logico-factually I mean.)
Data has often been compared to Spock, yet here Data perfectly illustrates how very different the 2 of them are. Apart from being extremely intelligent & highly logical, one who is half human has sought his entire life to suppress that side of himself, while the other who is not human at all has sought his entire life to be as human as he possibly can.
Suppress, perhaps, but not abandon. Many humans see the value in logic. I come from a very lovey dovey touchy feely family. Some of them are way too neurotic. Sometimes you have to embrace logic to move forward. You always have time to reflect on things after you're out of the thick of it, as it were.
*"...A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP..."* Leonard Nimoy RIP first science officer Spock.
When Picard said he'd take that opportunity to remove his ears, it was almost symbolic. It's as if he knew that Spock and Data were about to have a conversation so sublime, so special, that it was unfit for human ears to hear. Also, a golden opportunity was lost, to craft a full episode around these two. Imagine both on their way to assist some colonists, their shuttle crashes, and while they await a rescue, both men sit there, conversing about life and the ethics, the logic, and moralities of the universe. Of course it's too late now, but perhaps one of the official Star Trek novelists, like Peter David, or Diane Duane, or Greg Cox, or Michael Jan Friedman, can write such a novel?
@@he11sy A month late, but that's Spock vs Q 2. The first one is practically on a debate stage. I think they're both up on youtube here in some form or another.
There is something very nice and friendly when Data asks if he ask a personal question and Spock says “Please” to the request. He is showing trust, openness, encouragement, and sharing. Somewhat...human emotions and actions. Fascinating.
It was nice to see that he was able to embrace both his sides. In his youth and adulthood he embraced the Vulcan way of life as seen in The Original Series, until he slowly became more and more human until he finally embraced his human side as well, as seen in the Kelvin universe Star Trek movies. He even told his past alternate self about dealing with his human side. Fascinating.
Getting interaction between iconic characters just right is very difficult, especially when in many way they are so similar. I think they succeeded on all point here by allowing the characters to express natural interest and thought toward each other without falling into some form of drama for fan service.
One of the best moments is all of Star Trek. Such mutual respect and desire. Spock wants what Data is by design, and Data seeks to be more human, something that Spock has spent his whole life to get away from. This is what Star Trek is all about.
Also interesting to note this is the second time Data has been approached, that I can think of off the top of my head, appraising Data's goal to be more human. Q basically says the same thing to Data in Deja Q before he takes the shuttle from the Enterprise.
@@SSPerfectChaosRCT Oh yeah, Q says something like, "If it means anything, you'd make a better human than I." Plus, there's Tasha's words to Data at her memorial service, "You see things with the wonder of a child & that makes you human than any of us." Data truly represents the best in humanity, with none of bad & that is what makes him such a worthy role model.
Alexander Krebs nowadays this gets called “fan service” and of done nowadays would no doubt be bad fan fiction. Writers back then were levels above those getting the gigs nowadays.
@Dickum N Lickum the V: Emperor Of RUclips. By writing brand new shows and characters with scenes like this in mind? From the perspective of TNG, Data is the "new" character while Spock came from before. In the new shows they have liberally reused the character of Spock. What prevents the "new" characters from doing the same? I fail to see how he evidences the behavior you accuse him of too. TNG was actually mostly composed of long conversations. Clearly he isn't complaining now about it nor does he sound like he ever complained about TNG.
... and in this moment we see the two ace characters that drove human introspection and examination through the two series. What a interpretive dance they laid out for us to use as a mirror! An understated moment in Trek lore. Thank you Gene Roddenberry.
It also means that even when he embraced his human side he'll always fall into old habits. Which despite said habits being embracing his Vulkan side more, it's still very human.
Shanethefilmmaker Yes good addition. Remember the episode where he gets hit by the psychedelic plant? After he is turned back to normal by Kirk and after the whole ordeal is done, they ask Spock about his feelings on his experience there and he causally says something like "...it was the first time I was truly happy." I might be misremembering some details but you get the idea. I think that moment illustrated a very great deal on the mentality of Vulcans, I love it
I find it interesting that in my mind this is where he realizes the self acceptance that he passes onto his counterpart. That in putting aside logic he was finally able to quiet the warring parts of his mind
It makes me think of Spock's comment in the original series, when Kirk went to have fake Romulan ears taken off: "Captain, please go. Somehow, they are not aesthetically pleasing on humans."
Absolutely. My impression when I watched that scene was that Data was taking a systematic approach, running through routines, each meeting a dead end. I feel that maybe Spock, having seen something like this before, applied some creative thought, maybe he had a hunch. He acted on a kind of randomness that wouldn't have even occurred to Data. His creative approach allowed him to solve the problem quickly, but also quietly implied a spontaneity on his part that might arise from his human self, or his time spent with humans, whether he realises it or not. Of course, this is just me thinking about how we might interpret that moment but I do think it's nice to think of it as an ever so subtle nod to Spock's ongoing character development; logic with an undeniable undercurrent of creativity and spontaneity. Regardless of how I've interpreted it, what a scene! Thoughtful, understated, and played incredibly well.
Spock has more experience, and can approach things illogically even if he prefers not to. The ability to intellectually approach illogic has its virtues and it's easier for a half human than it is for an android.
The complexities of the 43 digit cipher are subordinated to autonomous thought processes, while these two consider an existential paradox 🙂. A fortunate meeting.
One of my favorite scenes in Star Trek 2009 is seeing older Spock meet Kelvin Kirk. He's reached a point in his life where he has found a happy balance of both his Vulcan and human heritage. He’s still a Vulcan but he appreciates and doesn't try to bury his human emotions anymore.
When I first saw TNG as a kid, I at first thought Data as being a cheap knock-off of Spock without Spocks sarcastic wit. But as time went on I realised he was something entirely different. Spock sought , not always succesfully, to transcend his humanity. Data sought, again not always successfully, to achieve humanity. Both incredibly logical and thoughtful beings , but both fired by completely different desires.
There is always a "Spock" character in most star trek series. Spock character being an outsider, whose personality is defined by being very different from the rest of the crew. Data was the one for TNG but despite that, even the "Spock" characters on every series are unique in their motivations, their ambitions, their desires etc., which is why they are some of the best characters in their respective series. I think this scene encapsulates it perfectly
@@skippythealien9627 Ironically in Enterprise, this character wasn't T'Pol. She's a vulcan but relatively approachable and vulnerable. "that" character in enterprise was definitely Doctor Phlox.
Data has always reminded me of Spock and I have always wondered what it would be like if they ever encountered each other. This is was a beautiful episode.
Now I’m sad. I’m proud to have watched this in first run. It’s sad to think Wrath of Khan would not be made today. “It’s just people talking in rooms and the one space battle is just slow, blind shooting in a cloud.”
@@tanizaki funny thing is that’s exactly what people complained about Into Darkness being. I’m with you on the pretense of “just people talking in rooms” as utter nonsense. We need more story than action in Star Trek these days.
Ironically, as Data uses Picard as his role model towards becoming more human....I think in many ways Captain Kirk has been Mr. Spock's role model towards understanding his own humanity. I think his friendship with Kirk really helped Spock to understand and feel emotion.
I love that when Data points out that Spock has tried to abandon his humanity, Spock frowns, pauses uncomfortably and then changes the subject. Such a human response to an awkward question!
Data: "Ambassador, it is on Starfleet record that you were once brought back from the dead." Spock: "That is correct." Data: "May I ask what that was like?" Spock: "It would be impossible to discuss the subject without a common frame of reference." Data: "... I understand, sir." Spock: "That makes one of you." Data: "No, sir. There is another like me. He is my brother."
Spock got owned by Data...and he responds by saying "fascinating"....and comes across as being smart. The next time someone says something to me that leaves me speechless, I am just going to strike a reflective pose and say fascinating.
Oh, imagine an entire episode of Spoke and Data exchanging, sharing, and communicating the philosophy they each aspired to live by. I would watch it over and over again, like I do the scenes between Neo and the Architect and Neo and the Oracle. Fascinating!
Wonderful how with Spock's last line , they underline the irony of the whole thing of Spock having chosen the Vulcan life philosophy. Brilliant script writing...😁🤓🤓🚀🛰🚀
0:50 It was nice to see Spock and Data converse in such a deep and meaningful way. Indeed Data has lived his entire life wanting to become more human while Spock shunned that part from himself. Spock envies Data's ability as an android and Data envies Spock being part Human.
i always feel a little bad watching this because in ST:TMP, Spock had discovered that his humanity was crucial by realizing that a simple feeling of friendship was beyond Vejur's nearly infinite intellect. That emotions were in fact a next -- and necessary -- step in Vejur's evolution.
I think it's more that as Data pointed out, Spock has achieved an unconscious balance between his Human and Vulcan sides. He no longer feels in conflict with himself despite his words, and he only realised it when a being of pure logic easily picked up on the discrepancy.
Data through asking questions created an empathetic understanding of Spock in a very short exchange of conversation. To be able to do so, the act of seeking this, is part of what makes someone human. I agree with Spock here: Fascinating.
Utter perfection. In so many ways Where else in Hollywood etc could this beautiful + philosophical moment occur? Just realised how the computers don't stop making noises throughout the dialogue, like they're listening too and going nuts. Very #nice
I caught a short of this interaction and had to come to this video for the memories. I miss when Star Trek was great like this. The Next Generation may have had its slow moments but the writing was so good.
During the Star Trek: Captain's Summit, Whoppie Goldberg had said that there was no character like Spock on TNG. But then Nemoy had told her that it was told to him that Data was the TNG equivalent of Spock
I would say, personally, that while some shows took longer than others to find their footing, TOS, TNG, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise were all fantastic shows in their own ways. After that, however, is when Star Trek died. Convoluted galactic catastrophes like Hobus and the Burn, Kirk on motorcycles with an overabundance of lense flares, time traveling Iron Man wannabe suits, defeating an antagonist with rock music and gratuitous violence like Icheb's death aren't Trek. Jonathan Archer was the last person to sit in the center seat and truly, Boldly Go Where No Man- No One, Has Gone Before.
This was Star Trek for Trekkies. The writing for this 2-part episode excelled and even tugged on the heart strings at its end. While I never fully appreciated it at the time, these were the golden days of Trek.
@Daniel Appleton I've never really thought about it until now but data is literally tng's spock. Because they didn't have a prominent vulcan on the show data filled that role.
@Daniel Appleton But star trek fans are a different kettle of fish to marvel one's. We won't take too much shit. Picard is only 2 episodes in and it's already fucked over the trek lore and cannon, i won't be giving that show much of a chance to redeem itself before i switch off. I did enjoy some of discovery though, only some.
This episode made me incredibly happy, these are my 2 favourite Star Trek characters ever!
Same here
In this scene, my three favorite. ;)
I've quite partial to Lore, the good vs bad boi thing is fun and interesting. Lore coulda been so much more tho it seems they just didnt know what to do
Yes. Fascinating.
Dont know if you guys cares but if you're bored like me during the covid times then you can watch pretty much all of the latest series on Instaflixxer. I've been streaming with my brother for the last couple of days :)
"Interesting." - Data
"Fascinating." - Spock
*klingon opera chord*
- Please Spock don't tell me you find this fascinating.
- No doctor but it is... Interesting.
Or intriguing.
Riveting
@@sofaking1611 That's too much emotion :D
Spock has never missed his human heritage because he's never really been able to abandon it. Despite his effort and discipline, it stays with him.
Yeah, that's what his use of a very human expression, here, signifies.
And in a similar vein, although Data cannot feel emotions in the same capacity as humans (before he gets the emotion chip anyway), he is still able to experience things like desire, friendship, loss, and trust.
Perhaps Spock recognizes the lessons of James Kirk. That sometimes logic is inadequate, and the human factor can be miraculous. 🖖
@@PantherMom512 That is essentially the conclusion Spock came to at the end of the first Star Trek movie. He finally resolved the conflict that had always defined him before. When we see him in Wrath of Khan, he's at peace with himself, no longer denying his human half, but integrating it into a whole person.
Which explains he’s words of wisdom to his younger alternative counterpart in Star Star Trek 2009
On the surface, Data is definitely the Spock equivalent in TNG. Both are logical, dead-pan, and literal. But in reality, when you look more in depth at their backgrounds and values, they’re exact opposite sides of the same coin meeting precisely in the middle. Spock is a person who can’t help but feel emotion and humanity, despite wishing to leave them behind and live an entirely logical life. Whereas Data _seeks_ the emotions Spock detests, and is all but unable to live anything BUT a life dictated by logic. And yet they meet in the middle and end up very similar. It’s fascinating to think about.
Well said 🖖🏻
@@Jimmy-ci7zn Fascinating 🖖
It's intellectual writing 101 (same number of likes 😆)... I miss that level and era of quality
Intriguing.
I think Odo is the DS9 equivalent of the two. Like Spock and Data, he is aware of human niceties, but unlike Spock who struggles with them and Data who wants to embrace them, Odo just chooses to ignore them.
This is 2 minutes and 41 seconds of pure life fulfillment.
Exactly :)
Fascinating.
The best of the old and the best of the new, even if the new is kind of old now.
The Kurtzmantrek version would have been: PEW PEW PEW, BOOM, PAM, SOCK, PAFF, BOOM, BOOM, "Agh...sob...everything is miserable, life is pain" "Discrimination, privilege, women are badass" BOOM, PEW, PEW, PEW.
@@Shendue His version makes perfect sense for this period in history, the philosophizing of the TNG era (post cold war) would require a return to values of objectivity and reason which at this point do not exist so what do you have left? you have struggle with material reality which is ultimately hierarchy and the search for hope.
So awesome that Nimoy got the chance to reprise Spock on TNG.
Mccoy was in the pilot as a very old man in his 130's then Mr Spock late in TNG there was Scotty who effectively travelled to the future and retired in the 24th century and finally we had captain Kirk who had a brief visit to the 24th century before ultimately loosing his life to Soran. So that's four of the orginal star cast core cast in the tng and the 24th century at roughly the same time.
Absolutely
@@animemanXLKI would have loved to know what Nimoy’s reaction was to Bones’ remarks about Vulcans in that episode!
Crazy to think about, this two parter actually came out about a month before the final TOS movie and directly references it.
@@Coolman13355 That's precisely why the episode was made, and also why Nimoy agreed to appear in it. 1991 was the 25th anniversary of "Star Trek", and Paramount was doing all they could to celebrate the occasion.
Picard, admired by both Vulcans and Klingons for being a paragon of their virtues.
He was rather respected by the Romulans too.
@TheVoiceOfTruth the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.
@TheVoiceOfTruth Picard had a lot of issues, his dad didn't want him to join Starfleet, his brother had a similar mindset, I don't know much about his mother. And what do you mean 'no family'? His family was gathered aboard the Enterprise for the entire run of the show
@@thedelta4258 At least he worked things out with his brother and as for his mother, from how he reacted to an illusion of her early in season 1 when they were in the place where thoughts become reality, I'd say that he was close to his mother.
Usually, when a child butts heads with one parent, they're close to the other. For example, I butted heads with my dad growing up sometimes but I've always been close to my mom so I imagine that Picard was much the same way.
Picard: the analytical abilities of a Vulcan, the honour of a Klingon, the negotiating skills of a Ferengi, the political intelligence of a Romulan and the devotion to duty of a Jem H'adar.
"I have no regrets" = "My humanity has always been there, even if it wasn't apparent"
You can't deny completely what has been part of you since the beginning
"I'll take the opportunity to remove my ears." -- Vincent van Gogh
That’s funny man! You deserve more likes
🤣🤣🤣
😆 Very clever
You mean… Vulcan van Gogh 🙂
This made me snort laugh
This is among the most Star Trek scenes in spirit: a living personification of multiculturalism in Spock, a man of two worlds, discussing human nature with a synthetically created individual who represents the greatest of human technological potential. It’s a fitting tribute to have this episode dedicated to the man who began this kind of examination of our curious species through this apex of science fiction he began.
You. I could have a drink with you.
@NumptyMagnet I call bullshit on you.
@@BenRush Me too.
Yes...fascinating.
Check the circuit: This is more dualism than multiculturalism. In Spock ...
And we could discuss what it is in Data ... (Is curiosity make sense without desire, since desire implies emotions ... Data seems to have a "personal" imperative ... how is that? Logico-factually I mean.)
Data has often been compared to Spock, yet here Data perfectly illustrates how very different the 2 of them are. Apart from being extremely intelligent & highly logical, one who is half human has sought his entire life to suppress that side of himself, while the other who is not human at all has sought his entire life to be as human as he possibly can.
Imagine how would look Q conversation with Spock
@@sebaszwarc6028 A conversation between Worf & Spock would be intriguing as well, given both of them are extremely stoic!
@@jmwoods190 don’t forget about conversation between Data and McCoy about Wolkans 😂
Suppress, perhaps, but not abandon. Many humans see the value in logic. I come from a very lovey dovey touchy feely family. Some of them are way too neurotic. Sometimes you have to embrace logic to move forward. You always have time to reflect on things after you're out of the thick of it, as it were.
Two of the deepest characters in Star Trek. Outstanding. Can't get any better.
Very correct
i didn't find it outstanding . i found it fascinating
@@rayloc420and intriguing
Data and Spock meeting. This really was the pinnacle of Trek.
*"...A life is like a garden. Perfect moments can be had, but not preserved, except in memory. LLAP..."*
Leonard Nimoy
RIP first science officer Spock.
When Picard said he'd take that opportunity to remove his ears, it was almost symbolic. It's as if he knew that Spock and Data were about to have a conversation so sublime, so special, that it was unfit for human ears to hear. Also, a golden opportunity was lost, to craft a full episode around these two. Imagine both on their way to assist some colonists, their shuttle crashes, and while they await a rescue, both men sit there, conversing about life and the ethics, the logic, and moralities of the universe. Of course it's too late now, but perhaps one of the official Star Trek novelists, like Peter David, or Diane Duane, or Greg Cox, or Michael Jan Friedman, can write such a novel?
Man....!!!!!
the spock and q series is very like this, they stuck on a rock if i recall and go down massive rabbit holes. its very good and very funny..
@@he11sy A month late, but that's Spock vs Q 2. The first one is practically on a debate stage. I think they're both up on youtube here in some form or another.
Never thought of that
Yeah, the Spock/Data interaction makes me think of like, Socrates debating Aristotle.
There is something very nice and friendly when Data asks if he ask a personal question and Spock says “Please” to the request. He is showing trust, openness, encouragement, and sharing.
Somewhat...human emotions and actions.
Fascinating.
I have no regrets.=)
He’s loosened up a bit. Took a while but...
It was nice to see that he was able to embrace both his sides. In his youth and adulthood he embraced the Vulcan way of life as seen in The Original Series, until he slowly became more and more human until he finally embraced his human side as well, as seen in the Kelvin universe Star Trek movies.
He even told his past alternate self about dealing with his human side. Fascinating.
Of all the souls I have encountered in my travels, his was the most human.
Cringe
Data: _tilts head_ Interesting.
Spock: _raises eyebrow_ fascinating.
Two of the most brilliant characters ever created for television, or anywhere.
You need to read more books and watch more movies. They're alright.
Agreed. (Interesting sci-fi characters)
Kirk had spock...Picard had daTa... ds9had odo....Voyager had the dr. ALL r assKickers
And Archer had ... well no one actually.
@@aluisious Just trolling huh? lol wow, that's pathetic.
It seemed "logical" to see an interaction between a Vulcan and an android. Just fascinating! This would drive ol' Bones(Dr. McCoy) insane.
When this aired I was really hoping Data would out logic Spock somehow so Spock would finally understand McCoy's frustrations lol
Just for laughs, it would’ve been fun to put Bones in a room with Spock, Data, Odo and Seven of Nine and see which one he found the most irritating.
Why? He had Spock in his head, and McCoy met Data.
@@remychase that would've been a great few episodes for a mini spinoff
Just as bad.
This is the Star Trek I grew up with and fell in love with. The characters, the ideas, we didn't know how good we had it.
I weep for what Star Trek has become, I refuse to watch it.
Such a clever and deep dialogue. The actors in the show, the makers of it.. pure greatness.
🥺🥺🥺
Getting interaction between iconic characters just right is very difficult, especially when in many way they are so similar. I think they succeeded on all point here by allowing the characters to express natural interest and thought toward each other without falling into some form of drama for fan service.
Two LEGENDS with special skills made a team with unique power !
- Interesting.
- Fascinating.
😄
And we have no regrets.
One of the best moments is all of Star Trek. Such mutual respect and desire. Spock wants what Data is by design, and Data seeks to be more human, something that Spock has spent his whole life to get away from. This is what Star Trek is all about.
Also interesting to note this is the second time Data has been approached, that I can think of off the top of my head, appraising Data's goal to be more human. Q basically says the same thing to Data in Deja Q before he takes the shuttle from the Enterprise.
@@SSPerfectChaosRCT Oh yeah, Q says something like, "If it means anything, you'd make a better human than I." Plus, there's Tasha's words to Data at her memorial service, "You see things with the wonder of a child & that makes you human than any of us." Data truly represents the best in humanity, with none of bad & that is what makes him such a worthy role model.
When I saw this air as a teenager I thought it was played out to have spock in TNG but now that I'm older I'm glad he's in it and not forgotten.
R.I.P., Leonard Nimoy. I will never forget your stellar performances in the Star Trek and Transformers franchises.
Hey CBS, take a look at your past work.
No explosion, no dramatic music, no crying, no cringe.
Just two great characters having a conversation.
Alexander Krebs nowadays this gets called “fan service” and of done nowadays would no doubt be bad fan fiction. Writers back then were levels above those getting the gigs nowadays.
And it was free
Yeah, we still got Spock's Brain so don't forget to remove the rose colored glasses once in awhile.
A great scene from STAR TREK
@Dickum N Lickum the V: Emperor Of RUclips. By writing brand new shows and characters with scenes like this in mind? From the perspective of TNG, Data is the "new" character while Spock came from before. In the new shows they have liberally reused the character of Spock. What prevents the "new" characters from doing the same?
I fail to see how he evidences the behavior you accuse him of too. TNG was actually mostly composed of long conversations. Clearly he isn't complaining now about it nor does he sound like he ever complained about TNG.
... and in this moment we see the two ace characters that drove human introspection and examination through the two series. What a interpretive dance they laid out for us to use as a mirror! An understated moment in Trek lore. Thank you Gene Roddenberry.
I see the no regrets reply as his way of saying that his human part has always been with him though he appears very Vulcan.
It also means that even when he embraced his human side he'll always fall into old habits. Which despite said habits being embracing his Vulkan side more, it's still very human.
Shanethefilmmaker Yes good addition. Remember the episode where he gets hit by the psychedelic plant? After he is turned back to normal by Kirk and after the whole ordeal is done, they ask Spock about his feelings on his experience there and he causally says something like "...it was the first time I was truly happy."
I might be misremembering some details but you get the idea. I think that moment illustrated a very great deal on the mentality of Vulcans, I love it
Agree. That is exactly what I waa thinking.
I find it interesting that in my mind this is where he realizes the self acceptance that he passes onto his counterpart. That in putting aside logic he was finally able to quiet the warring parts of his mind
Yes. Spock learned to embrace his human side in The Motion Picture.
"I will take this opportunity to remove my ears......But NOT my wig. That I shall keep henceforth.".
A very quiet scene, low light, no action, and yet one simple word ripples through the whole scene and it moves you to emotion: Fascinating
There is a beauty of spirit that emanates from Mr Nimoy.
Lol Picard saying hes removing his ears will never not be funny
I'm pretty sure that was Patrick Stewart saying that instead of Picard.
"Well, I have nothing to contribute to this endeavour. I best find something else to do." Which is what he was saying.
It makes me think of Spock's comment in the original series, when Kirk went to have fake Romulan ears taken off: "Captain, please go. Somehow, they are not aesthetically pleasing on humans."
I was hoping Spock would have made a comment, as an echo of when he commented on Kirk getting his Vulcan ears switched back in The Enterprise Incident
Rest in peace Leonard. The world is all the darker without you.
It was these little moments that really made the show what it was. Such a good moment.
Rip the great nimoy 🖒
This is a damn good scene, wow, these two were written perfectly here.
Fascinating.
Can we take a moment to consider that Spock in a few minutes broke a code that an android couldn't in hours?
Absolutely. My impression when I watched that scene was that Data was taking a systematic approach, running through routines, each meeting a dead end. I feel that maybe Spock, having seen something like this before, applied some creative thought, maybe he had a hunch. He acted on a kind of randomness that wouldn't have even occurred to Data. His creative approach allowed him to solve the problem quickly, but also quietly implied a spontaneity on his part that might arise from his human self, or his time spent with humans, whether he realises it or not. Of course, this is just me thinking about how we might interpret that moment but I do think it's nice to think of it as an ever so subtle nod to Spock's ongoing character development; logic with an undeniable undercurrent of creativity and spontaneity.
Regardless of how I've interpreted it, what a scene! Thoughtful, understated, and played incredibly well.
@@benredfield6643 Your replies makes me think of different types of search algorithms. Very insightful.
@@benredfield6643or his vast experience gave him a unique insight on the Romulan code.
Spock has more experience, and can approach things illogically even if he prefers not to. The ability to intellectually approach illogic has its virtues and it's easier for a half human than it is for an android.
For years I'd sought out these scenes with Leonard Nimoy, there will never be a better actor for Captain (Ambassador) Spock! Rest In Peace sir.
The complexities of the 43 digit cipher are subordinated to autonomous thought processes, while these two consider an existential paradox 🙂. A fortunate meeting.
I wonder if he could have broken the Zodiac's third cypher.
One of my favorite scenes in Star Trek 2009 is seeing older Spock meet Kelvin Kirk. He's reached a point in his life where he has found a happy balance of both his Vulcan and human heritage. He’s still a Vulcan but he appreciates and doesn't try to bury his human emotions anymore.
Love this generational interaction between these two as well as Scotty and La Forge on the season six episode Relics
When I first saw TNG as a kid, I at first thought Data as being a cheap knock-off of Spock without Spocks sarcastic wit. But as time went on I realised he was something entirely different. Spock sought , not always succesfully, to transcend his humanity. Data sought, again not always successfully, to achieve humanity. Both incredibly logical and thoughtful beings , but both fired by completely different desires.
Seven provided such storylines in Voyager. All three were my favorites from their individual series… Data was my favorite of all of them.
There is always a "Spock" character in most star trek series. Spock character being an outsider, whose personality is defined by being very different from the rest of the crew. Data was the one for TNG
but despite that, even the "Spock" characters on every series are unique in their motivations, their ambitions, their desires etc., which is why they are some of the best characters in their respective series. I think this scene encapsulates it perfectly
To be fair, that's where Data started, but thanks to good writing and Spiner's genius, it didn't end there.
@@skippythealien9627 Ironically in Enterprise, this character wasn't T'Pol. She's a vulcan but relatively approachable and vulnerable. "that" character in enterprise was definitely Doctor Phlox.
Magnificent actors, all three of them. Love these men. 😊
Data has always reminded me of Spock and I have always wondered what it would be like if they ever encountered each other. This is was a beautiful episode.
Makes me sad to think we will never have great writing and moments like this in Star Trek ever again.
Now I’m sad. I’m proud to have watched this in first run. It’s sad to think Wrath of Khan would not be made today. “It’s just people talking in rooms and the one space battle is just slow, blind shooting in a cloud.”
@@tanizaki funny thing is that’s exactly what people complained about Into Darkness being.
I’m with you on the pretense of “just people talking in rooms” as utter nonsense. We need more story than action in Star Trek these days.
This is so much Trek that modern 2020 trek just can’t reach
The Vulcan council inquest in season 3 of Discovery was as Trek as you can get
@@rartu nothing about Discovery or Picard for that matter resembles Trek. Not the heart or core because neirher show has any heart.
@@kendallrivers1119 ruclips.net/video/hfbfZMQeaQk/видео.html they said the same thing about TNG.
Ironically, as Data uses Picard as his role model towards becoming more human....I think in many ways Captain Kirk has been Mr. Spock's role model towards understanding his own humanity. I think his friendship with Kirk really helped Spock to understand and feel emotion.
I love that when Data points out that Spock has tried to abandon his humanity, Spock frowns, pauses uncomfortably and then changes the subject. Such a human response to an awkward question!
Data: "Ambassador, it is on Starfleet record that you were once brought back from the dead."
Spock: "That is correct."
Data: "May I ask what that was like?"
Spock: "It would be impossible to discuss the subject without a common frame of reference."
Data: "... I understand, sir."
Spock: "That makes one of you."
Data: "No, sir. There is another like me. He is my brother."
Spock's the boss every time.
Data is not impressed by Vulcans, though.
Spock got owned by Data...and he responds by saying "fascinating"....and comes across as being smart. The next time someone says something to me that leaves me speechless, I am just going to strike a reflective pose and say fascinating.
It only works if you lift one eyebrow.
Yeah but Spock cracked the cipher...😁
@@kingsman428 Fascinating.
@@TheophilusPWildbeest I want to see a face to face with every Spock 'Fascinating', and every T'ilq 'Indeed'.
I also recommend "That would be an ecumenical matter." should fit in nicely to any conversation.
Just watched this episode last night. First time in years....wow the dialogue between these two.
Oh, imagine an entire episode of Spoke and Data exchanging, sharing, and communicating the philosophy they each aspired to live by. I would watch it over and over again, like I do the scenes between Neo and the Architect and Neo and the Oracle. Fascinating!
There's a scene in the Star Trek: TNG comic book where Spock and Data have a chess match without the chessboard and pieces and Data loses...
That's just awesome 😊
I always thought this was an amazing scene, such a great performance from the two of them.
I regret that there weren’t more interactions with data and Spock.
Wonderful how with Spock's last line , they underline the irony of the whole thing of Spock having chosen the Vulcan life philosophy. Brilliant script writing...😁🤓🤓🚀🛰🚀
“You have abandoned what I’ve sought all my life.”
The piano at the end makes it 1000% better.
0:50 It was nice to see Spock and Data converse in such a deep and meaningful way. Indeed Data has lived his entire life wanting to become more human while Spock shunned that part from himself. Spock envies Data's ability as an android and Data envies Spock being part Human.
i always feel a little bad watching this because in ST:TMP, Spock had discovered that his humanity was crucial by realizing that a simple feeling of friendship was beyond Vejur's nearly infinite intellect. That emotions were in fact a next -- and necessary -- step in Vejur's evolution.
Agreed. Spock has regressed.
I think it's more that as Data pointed out, Spock has achieved an unconscious balance between his Human and Vulcan sides. He no longer feels in conflict with himself despite his words, and he only realised it when a being of pure logic easily picked up on the discrepancy.
This is more Star Trek than anything that came from ST Picard, or ST:D.
There is more true Star Trek in this video than everything released after the cancellation of Enterprise. Gene Roddenberry's vision died after that.
You ain't lying
I've tried so hard to like the new stuff. But it really isn't for me.
I hope whoever it is "for", enjoys it, and that I never meet them.
What an amazing but subdued scene.
This whole conversation is so fascinating...
Yes it is quite unusual to see these two together. I'm glad it happened.
I think Captain Picard has been my role model to be more human too.
I really wish Leeroy Nemo was still alive. He was one of the best actors in Star Wars without a doubt.
Data through asking questions created an empathetic understanding of Spock in a very short exchange of conversation. To be able to do so, the act of seeking this, is part of what makes someone human. I agree with Spock here: Fascinating.
💞The smartest robot meets the most illogical and most loved Vulcan. I'm in heaven 💞
Spock is not the most illogical vulcan. Remember Sybok ?
@@tomf3150 true. I was just quoting Spock for every time he said "illogical captain"
Incredible that Data was able to talk to Spock, McCoy and Scottie
I watched this once and ended up re-watching like 5 times. Fascinating.
Utter perfection. In so many ways
Where else in Hollywood etc could this beautiful + philosophical moment occur? Just realised how the computers don't stop making noises throughout the dialogue, like they're listening too and going nuts.
Very #nice
OUTSTANDING outtake. Well done on posting this!!
I do love the passing the torch moments.
When Star Trek was good.
And before actors became douchebags thanks to social media.
Except for the shoulder pads.
@@Hodaris_Darlin Which actors?
I'm rewatching TNG and believe me, you ought to cast aside the notion that old Trek was always consistently "good".
Data, an advance android with pozitronic brain
Spock: your intellect is... efficient
Really cool seeing Data and Spock have a chat
When the details of this episode broke, the r.a.s groups on Usenet were so eager for a scene like this, and did this story ever deliver. 🙂🖖
I caught a short of this interaction and had to come to this video for the memories. I miss when Star Trek was great like this. The Next Generation may have had its slow moments but the writing was so good.
It's truly awesome... Both iconic star in different star trek series appears on the same scene
God this is good to watch. What an absolute treat.
Rest In Peace Mr Nimoy
I have watched this clip many times. The writers spent a lot of time coming up with the "correct" dialogue. Excellent work.
I love Spock being fascinated by his own response
An iconic moment in Trek history
“I’ll take this opportunity to remove my ears”.
We’ve all wanted to do that at least once in our lives.
During the Star Trek: Captain's Summit, Whoppie Goldberg had said that there was no character like Spock on TNG. But then Nemoy had told her that it was told to him that Data was the TNG equivalent of Spock
We will NEVER see a trek series of the quality of TOS and TNG
Deep Space 9 100%
I would say, personally, that while some shows took longer than others to find their footing, TOS, TNG, DS9, Voyager and Enterprise were all fantastic shows in their own ways. After that, however, is when Star Trek died. Convoluted galactic catastrophes like Hobus and the Burn, Kirk on motorcycles with an overabundance of lense flares, time traveling Iron Man wannabe suits, defeating an antagonist with rock music and gratuitous violence like Icheb's death aren't Trek. Jonathan Archer was the last person to sit in the center seat and truly, Boldly Go Where No Man- No One, Has Gone Before.
This was Star Trek for Trekkies. The writing for this 2-part episode excelled and even tugged on the heart strings at its end. While I never fully appreciated it at the time, these were the golden days of Trek.
If the entire 2-part episodes had been made just to give us this one scene, I would completely understand and be entirely on board.
Spock always finds the most trivial things fascinating.
@Daniel Appleton Data stole it from spock lol
@Daniel Appleton I've never really thought about it until now but data is literally tng's spock. Because they didn't have a prominent vulcan on the show data filled that role.
@Daniel Appleton Yes i remember her, brilliant vulcan eye candy she was. So what's your thoughts on Picard?
@Daniel Appleton You're not missing much fella
@Daniel Appleton But star trek fans are a different kettle of fish to marvel one's. We won't take too much shit. Picard is only 2 episodes in and it's already fucked over the trek lore and cannon, i won't be giving that show much of a chance to redeem itself before i switch off.
I did enjoy some of discovery though, only some.
Logic and Reason. My customer has told me today that I have isolated the issue, after hearing this i'm quite proud of myself.
This scene is better than entire ST Discovery series + JJ Abrams ST movies
This was such a great scene
TNG could have used a couple more crossovers like this.
One of the best written lines ever for the entire franchise.
Fascinating , An even more Human quality