DOC HARLEY: REUSABLE OIL FILTERS
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- Опубликовано: 6 янв 2021
- Doc Harley from the Service Clinic at Low Country Harley-Davidson to help you with the health of your motorcycle! This week he shares his thoughts on reusable oil filters.
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Doc Harley is a motorcycle technician at Low Country Harley-Davidson with over thirty years working on motorcycles. Over the years at the dealership he has worked on Harley-Davidson, Buell, and Triumph motorcycles with a few other brands here and there from trade-ins. There are thousands of how-to videos out on RUclips and other websites across the world. Doc’s goal is to help solve problems that people run into when using their service manual, share insights only found as a certified Harley® technician, and some of the tips he’s picked up over the years.
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Flo, and DKCustoms have a Nut on the end to twist off the oil filter.
Best benefit of these oil filters is that they passively cool down the oil and they have naturally less flow restriction and therefor have less parasitic drag on the engine.
The metal steel mesh filters consistently to 35 microns. Nothing larger than 35microns will get past it period. Not the same with papermesh. Many of these mesh filters can catch things as low as 20microns, but they are inconsistent. The average filtration size of a paper filter is 30microns.
A human hair is 70microns across. Meaning a steel mesh filter will filter anything that's half the width of a human hair.
For reference, very fine sand, the softest lightest fluffiest sand you can realistically find easily, is 60microns across.
So Steel Filters will catch particles half that size.
The Steel Filters will get all of it, with a 99.9% catch rate. So there is no real risk to running a steel filter what so ever.
They have less parasitic drag on the engine, are just as good at filtering, and only need to be washed off.
The only downside is that they are expensive.
I agree and as things are build to better tolerances and such the particulate becomes less and less.
To be effective a filter must remove abrasives larger than the engine clearances. The clearances between the cam and lifters or the rings and cylinders can be as small as 2 microns. I dont drain oil. My Honda 500 had a Frantz oil cleaner on it. All I use now is Motor Guards Gulf Coasts andthe Australian Jackmaster Classic. I have them on everything with an oil pump. Parasitic loss is when you take oil pressure out of the system such as with a turbo or bypass filter. The oil pump generates an excess of oil pressure unless it or the engine is worn out.
Doc, I really enjoy your wisdom, but if one of those reusable filters has HD embossed on it you would be all for it..
How true lmao 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Got that right 💯
The one on your right hand side (with the fins) comes with extra seal although after over 10 years of use I still have the original one and no leaks at all!
It also comes with a socket (similar to one you was showing) so you won't damage chrome or anodizing.
And finally it was proven on the Harley Davidson stock and highly modified motors over the years!
It's easy to clean unless you are some kind of ignorant knob and it's easy for monitoring the condition of your motor.
So, I believe that you wanna sell me your expensive H-D oil filter with your baloney concerns about it :P No thank you!
I won't say anything about the other one because I never used it but I agree if it was made for cars then it's not good for my Harley.
Oh, I'm not a seller of any of those:) Just a happy user of the one with the fins!
Plus it lowers the oil temperature with its fins.
i have been using my K and P - its stainless so can polish out any scratches if you get any have peace of mind can clean out super easy with brake cleaner dont have to go buy any when many times not available so have to wait for shipping- only remove when doing oil changes and so not taking off much and the rubber seals are still fine after many changes plus are available at my local store
I’ve used K&P filters on both my 2011 Road King (103ci) and my 2004 Big Dog Chopper (107 S&S) for 9 and 11 yrs respectively. They are worth their weight in gold to me. They are clean and function well, and are top quality. O-rings are not an issue and they have never leaked and I’ve replaced them several times.
They come with either their own filter wrench or, like my Harley filter, with a molded nut head on the top of the filter for ease of removal. I’ll never go back to throw-away filters ever. Besides, yes, I NEED to see what is in my oil filters when I clean them out. One other thing you forgot to mention is the magnet inside the K&P filters, similar to the magnet on the drain plugs of your Harleys, an extra great feature. Sorry, Doc. I almost always agree with you but not this time. I do agree with you that the filter needs to be FOR a Harley Davidson, not a car. With that said, I really enjoy your vast knowledge and experience on every subject about my Harley. Keep up the good work, Doc!
Im with you. Ive been a Wix XP Synthetic oil filter guy for my GMC 2500HD. But I have now a 2019 H.D.Road King. This H. D. Filter is what? H.D. gimmicky more money for our no name filter. Lmao! What do you say if I put a WIX XP OR ROYAL PURPLE filter on the bike? My bike will turn into a big firie ball of flames...lol
Great video Doc. I have a Flo on my Electra Glide and it works great. Comes with a extra O ring and has a bolt head on the end for removal. Benefits that are extra are a magnet, fins for cooling, and supposedly less oil drag resulting in a minor horsepower gain. Love mine in black or comes polished.
K&P engineering S4 best filter money can buy, 304 stainless steel micronic cloth filter medium and magnetic pre-filtration. Literally would never use any other filter! DK Custom Oil filter relocation means no mess at all & a filter full to the brim with fresh oil. No mess no fuss!
ditto
I love my K&P filter! bought it from my (independent harley mechanic)when I saw him rebuilding a pretty new 103 that had just sucked the OEM paper filter through the motor and destroyed it ,I've had it on there 6 years and about 50k miles with not one problem and only on my 2nd O ring
I have been using the K&P S4 on my Harley Street Glide for the last 2 years with no issues , also the O ring is reusable and you get a 2nd one in the kit with a oil filter wrench . I use Amsoil Synthetic oil ... Easy clean up with some brake cleaner :)
K&p on my bike comes with extra o rings and filter wrench and they work Awsome!! Better than any other oil filter!!!
I just pick one up for my ultra what sold the this filter it lowers the oil
Temp by 10 degrees
I Bought the K &P 10 yrs ago in Sturgis Iv'e been using it on my 04 Springer softail ever sense it is Far better than the regular throw away ones , Every time I change oil I put a new gasket which all the motorcycle shops in Denver sell them 2.00 ea throw it it a bucket of soapy hot water cleans up easy blow it dry or put it in the sun also save's a shit load ! and you don't have to throw it away..
Thanks Doc. Pretty sure I'll stick to the OEM filters.
I've been using Flo filters on my Harleys for years, no issues, wouldn't have it any other way.
WIX XP Synthetic should work just fine? Not this no name crap HD filter.
K and P engineering give you a cup wrench to get filter off, so thats a non issues with taking it off !
Hi Doc just found your channel and I love it . Thank you so much for sharing all your knowledge. I told all my riding brothers to check your channel out too.
I’m not disagreeing with what he’s saying here but, it’s not like if these filters are discontinued, then the o-rings will also be discontinued. Those are pre-manufactured o rings; they didn’t make them specifically for that application. Even if they quit making the filter, there will be o-rings that will fit undoubtedly.
Not sure if you guys cares but if you guys are stoned like me atm you can watch pretty much all of the new movies and series on InstaFlixxer. Have been streaming with my gf lately xD
@Cain Roberto yea, been using instaflixxer for since november myself =)
Jet airliner no paper filter
I use an Arlen Ness Reusable filter on my Streetglide for 5 years now. no problems. Bought it for the look but works as promised. After 5 changes it pretty much is paid for and Orings are 3 bucks to replace.
You got a link?
@@piercebruneau1284 It's not an Arlen Ness but it's just as good. Just search for the one that fits your bike. www.amazon.com/PC-Racing-PCS4B-Stainless-Filter/dp/B0041Q2BM4/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=reusable+oil+filter&qid=1610346730&sr=8-1
I use a FLO oil filter on all my bikes. It’s got a magnet inside to catch bug metal prices and it’s also got a nut on the case fir easy instal and removal. Also the O ring on it can be replaced with any o ring off a factory pip filter (if you ever needed to replace it). I don’t really know of the little cooling fins on it do anything realistically, but never buying a filter again is great.
I installed the K&P cleanable oil filter in 2014 with no problems whatsoever. It came with a socket for removing the filter and a spare seal. I installed the new seal last year. I ordered replacement seals, which comes with two new seals for ten bucks. I check the filter mainly for cam chain tensioner debris. Love the K&P filter.
Thanks for sharing your good fortune...Doc
Harley oil filters are made in Albion IL by Champion Laboratories, and have been for many years.
AMERICAN MADE !!!!!!!
Yes,,,,always a new stock Harley Davidson oil filter,,,cheap insurance.
Great video.
O-rings are industrial Lego its highly unlikely that the manufacturer had a custom o-ring made.
Great video Doc! Keep up the great work!
Great information again saw a video on this and was wondering what you thought about them thanks for your opinion 👍
Thank You. I Am Just Going To Stay Stock. May You, And All Your Employees, Be Safe, And Stay Healthy. And Have A Groovy Day
Thank you…..Doc
I LOVE "Do you REALLY want to see what's going on in your motor?" Exactly why HD doesn't put oil temp gauges on the bikes. You really DON'T want to see how hot it's getting! I love your videos, and I liked how you handled this topic. In my airplane engines I cut open the filter and inspect the pleats. I run the cleanable filter on my three HD's just because... I also change my oil every 1500 miles, because OIL is CHEAP. If I see crap in my cleanable filter or in my drained oil I know a problem exists!
You are correct though, many riders don't need to be putting wrenches on anything.
I enjoyed this post…..Doc
Somebody need to tell those guys at the factory about how tight oil filters should be. All the factory ones I've removed have been torqued so tight they were damn near impossible to remove.
Valid points, Doc! Thank you!
I put two small holes in my filter before removing it. At end of filter one hole at 12 o'clock position other at 6 o'clock , top one is the vent. Filter drains out 90% of its oil makes less of a mess. Ride Safe
Great idea 💡
Me too, I use a spring loaded center punch.
i'll stay with OEM oil filter .......keep them great tech tips coming Doc !!!
I run the Flo filter on my 2016 Road Glide Special. Came with (2) extra o- rings. Has a bolt on top of filter. Bike runs 10 degrees cooler. When removing filter I use a half gallon plastic milk bottle for over flow oil.
Thanks for the tip on the milk jug.
Being in the automotive field and have seen paper filter come apart,I run a reusable filter made by Hubb, that is a lot like Schaefer oil as they are suppliers to fleets-and gained 5 psi of oil pressure.
Thanks for your experience….Doc
I have been running a K&P oil filter with a relocation kit and it has worked flawlessly for 3 years and provides many benefits to include cooling, better filtration and less drag on the oil pump. I recently cleaned my filter on a road trip in 15 minutes with simple green and used a hotel hair dryer to dry off all the water and simple green solvent.
Thanks for sharing your experience…Doc
Doc, Love the coffee cup! Always enjoy your videos.
Just Wanted To Say, Thank You For, Getting Back To Me. Be Safe, And Stay Healthy, And Have A Groovy Week And Weekend.
Great advice Doc and analogy...the engineers at Harley designed filters for Harleys, thats it....sticking with replacing my filter every 3000 miles
Went with the Arlen Ness filter quality and a nice magnet and no worries about company going out of business. Try a strap wrench.
as per DKC, Hot Bike magazine published that an 8HP gain with 10 lbs. of torque increase on a dyno with the permanent filter installed. I'll wait for more test results before I buy one.
You addressed everything except what I'd hoped you would:
Whether there should be concern over the throwaway paper quality, and whether the bypass valve allows TOO MUCH to bypass.
I don’t think you mentioned, but the filter must also be designed for higher oil temperatures than are typical of automotive applications. I recall talk of folks running cheap auto store filters on a liquid cooled metric tourer- and the adhesive/ sealant securing the edges of the filter media would break down, go into the engine and block passages.
Again Dr
You have done it again. Bravo.
We love ya.
Great video doc Harley it made people that have these filters tell their story I'm glad I made a decision to call Cycle solution and pick up the KP oil filter S44
I have a PCRacing Harley specific oil filter and after 5k miles the oil comes out looking cleaner than it did with a paper filter. If you're told to inspect the magnet on your drain plugs why wouldn't you want to see what may be in the oil filter. PC Racing PCS4C
I have always enjoyed your videos but I wanted to give you my perspective on the life time filter. I have been using a K&P since 2006 on my 03'Heritage Springer. My greatest concern was filtration not the things you brought to the table. Quality, cleaning and performance have been superior over the past 16 years. I respect you and your opinion but I offer a long term real world test example.
Thank you for sharing....Doc
The race aluminum type also cools down the oil and one of the reasons we used it. Majority of you don't even buy the Harley made OEM filters anyhow.
Any particular manufacturer you use with success?…..Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson R. Moody if you can find them. I use OEM and do manufacturer recommended maintenance. My Harleys go well into the 100,000 mileage range. 👍
One thing with the reusable filter is you need to use the correct way to clean it.
It should really be cleaned with an ultrasonic bath.
I'm not sure it is really worth the hassle, although i do use a K&P filter on my KTM !
Very diplomatic response. Appreciate you saying this is your opinion. I run a wix right now, but will be purchasing the DK Customs permanent filter soon. I trust Kevin more than the factory
That's what I enjoy about owning a Harley-Davidson...It is the owner's choice.....Doc
Im not a biker If it was a car I would say the cleanable filters dont clean oil as good as the throw away filters and the throw away filters dont clean oil
There are spin on filters that clean oil but the relief valve is always open when the engine is running. Then you have converted the full flow system to a bypass system.
Great info Doc.
Love your videos keep them coming my question is the reusable ones claim that they help cool the oil did you guys noticed any difference in temperature
We have not checked and recorded as others have. The larger reusable filters may have more surface area to help in cooling. Some even have fins….Doc
Wire mesh filters are fine for racing, for the reasons mentioned. They are not remotely competitive with modern top shelf fiber filters. There are a few vids on RUclips using testing and oil analysis.
If you do use these filters changing the oil more often is advised.
What is up if you have an issue with counter filters not sealing. No obvious damage on ring seal or flange. The old filter was on really tight and now have an issue with drips. 2017 RGS
Right on for this.
Good tip. I'll stick with the original type filter and Amsoil.
.
legitimate reasons doc, thanks
I cut open a HD oil filter. The quality was impressive. Looked just like a WIX filter. Staying with OEM. Thanks Doc!
I like Wix XP. It would work right? My other question. Shouldn't the filter hang down holding oil instead of on it side on the Harley Davidsons? Mm?
@@woodworm3615 you would think but Volkswagen puts them upside down. I think it doesn’t matter.
Factory bias noted. The Factory oil filter location is a total mess at oil change no matter what filter is used. A relocation set-up with a quality reusable system is a win-win.
Thanks for sharing your experience...Doc
Great comments Doc. We are not talking about a lot of money here so why not stick with the OEM filter.
Ride safe from Sydney Australia 🤘
Are you sure? One is a one time purchase while the other is not?? Just saying
Yes, I want to see what's going on in my motor !!!
The Flo reusable oil filter is an awesome filter. It has 1 gasket and its good for up to 5 oil changes, but it comes with 3 more when you buy it. Also has a nut as part of the filter for easy removal, when i got mine I also purchased an extra filter media so i don't have to go and wash and let dry before i go riding again. The filter is awesome and helps reduce the oil temperature along with looks great and hi flow (but it is pricy) but so is Harley's filter and then you have to use their crappy Syn3. I put Amsoil in all 3 of my bikes and in my F150
Those are some strong opinions….Doc
For me, the bottom line: the engine will give you warnings in the filter long before you have total failure. So I have had a K&P on my Road Glide for 7+ years and over 60,000 miles with Amsoil. Yes, it has more than paid for itself, but that wasn't the point. It is nice to see immediately see what is in the basket and whether it is normal wear or not. They are easy to clean and maintain and with diamond cut flutes, the aluminum housing adds additional cooling. My experience with Touring bikes and filter location is that changing the filter gets messy regardless of which filter you are using, so Doc is reaching on that one. Additionally, the last time the dealer (1,000 mile service) changed my oil, they put the filter on so tight it crushed the filter taking it off. No chance of that with the K&P as they come with a wrench and will not crush like an aluminum can. So no, you will not destroy the finish. Again Doc, you are reaching.
That being said, HD OEM oil filters are quality filters. You are more apt to run into pinion runout, sumping problems, and cam plate issues, than oil filter issues. But I want to see inside it each and every time. 3 bikes. All K&P filters.
I enjoy watching your videos. What is your thoughts on oil filter relocation kits? Keep up the great content
There are benifits and possible problems. Remember many are trying to sell you something….Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson And the remote set-up's are, well ...let's just say, umm, less than aesthetically pleasing 😗
Reminds me of when people would install oil pressure gauges on their shovels and evos.
How do you feel about vented dipstick. Thany you for all the videos.
A great question. Swing over to Baxter Garage, he discusses this question with great insight…..Doc
I use the KN filters with the nut on the end. I cut the bottom off a milk jug and run a ratchet extension through the jug opening then slide the jug over the filter, loosen with the wrench and the oil goes into the jug. No mess on the bike.
Drive a long centre punch in top and bottom while the bike is still on stand. Let it drain into another milk jug with a hole cut at the top so you can fit over the filter and also put the drain hole in. I let it drain overnight, not a drop spilt next morning.
Independent tests show that stock 5 micron filters clog around 3k and then you're just running dirty oil through the bypass, while 30-40 micron filters don't clog while still filtering all debris from the oil. Personally I change my oil at 3k anyways but I will be switching to an aftermarket disposable filter around 30 microns.
WIX XP is a Synthetic oil filter. My H.D. runs on Synthetic oil. What is that no name hd filter. Off brand?
@@woodworm3615 I'm going to start running a hi-filtro filter. There's a RUclips channel called Kevin Baxter, he has a video where he talks about independent tests on oil and filters, he also has a bunch of other cool videos like engine teardowns and builds. It's a pretty cool channel.
Dont know of any full flow filters that can filter to 5 microns. Some bypass filters can. My Australian Jackmaster Classic claims 1 micron if you use their filter elements. Most bikers probably dont want a filter that requires hoses. With a spin on 5 micron filter the relief valve would always be open with the engine running. My money would be on the stock filter. Im a clean oil nut case. I would have a Australian Jackmaster Classic on there somewhere. I had a Frantz on my Honda 500. Couldnt find a way to hook up one on the Harley 350 Sprint. The Harley Topper was a 2 cycle golf cart engine powered.
The Harley filter does filter very well. The problem with it is it is plugged long before your 5k service interval. So you are running in bypass filtering no oil for the last 1-2 k or so. Amsoil is a 20 micron and k&n is 25. Are they tight enough? Probably. They also will filter oil all the way to your service interval without restriction and going into bypass. In mho a 10-12 micron is perfect. You will get the total usage out of the filter without going into bypass before your service interval comes up. One option is to spin a new harley filter on at 2500 miles and add some oil. Then go to 5k and do the full service if you want that tight of filtration. I personally use the amsoil filter and oil and have never had any issues. 6 to 1 half dozen to the other. If you filter down that tight you are in bypass for around 1/3 of your interval. If you choose a less restrictive filter you may be cycling some very fine metal through. Your call fellas. Great video doc. Thanks for the information.
How do you determine your HD oil filter is plugged and running on bypass at any mileage?
@@montanaguy The Truth About Oil Filter Micron Ratings
February 27, 2018 / in Cartridge Oil Filters, Oil Filters, Spin-on Oil Filters, Synthetic Oil Filters
One of the most commonly asked questions about oil filters for passenger cars and light-duty trucks is “What is the micron rating of the filter?”. The inquirer is typically seeking information upon which to make a determination as to the quality of the filter and whether it is appropriate for the application under consideration. Often, the concept of “micron rating” and it’s relationship to filter efficiency is not fully understood which can result in an answer that is not meaningful.
What is a Micron Rating?
A micron is a unit of measure in the metric system equal to 1 millionth of a meter in length. For perspective - The average cross-section of a human hair is approximately 50 microns.
A micron rating is used to indicate the ability of an oil filter to remove contaminants by the size of the particles that the filter will collect and retain. For example, a filter with a micron rating of 25 will filter out contaminants of 25 microns or larger in size and a filter with a micron rating of 5 will filter out contaminants of 5 microns or larger in size.
However, in order for a micron rating to be meaningful, two pieces of information must be present - the contaminant particle size (in microns) and the filter’s efficiency percentage.
Filter Efficiency
Filter efficiency refers to a measure of a filter’s ability to collect and retain particles of a specific size. For example, if a filter can collect and retain 95% of particles that are 25 micron-sized or larger, the filter can be said to be 95% efficient at 25 microns. In other words, a micron rating of 25 at 95% efficiency. The same filter may also be able to collect and retain 20% of particles that are 5 microns or larger. In a such case, the filter can be said to be 20% efficient at 5 microns or have a micron rating of 5 at 20% efficiency.
Both pieces of information must be included when stating the micron rating of a filter.
Stating a micron rating without an efficiency is misleading. As noted earlier, a micron rating is used to indicate the ability of an oil filter to remove contaminants by the size of the particles. It is important to remember that a micron rating without an associated efficiency does not fully describe the performance of a filter. For example, the same filter described above could be called a 5-micron filter if its efficiency at collecting 5-micron sized particles was, for example, only 20%. If the recipient of the information only hears “5-micron filter” without the efficiency percentage, the micron rating is misleading and therefore meaningless.
The two most common terms used to describe micron ratings are Nominal and Absolute.
Nominal Micron Rating
Nominal Micron Rating expresses the ability of the filter to capture particles of a specified size in microns at an efficiency of 50%. A nominal rating of 50% at 10 microns simply means that a filter captures 50% of contaminants 10 microns in size. The statement of this efficiency is important to understanding the performance capability of the filter.
Absolute Micron Rating
Absolute Micron Rating describes filter performance that is capable of removing at least 98.7% of a specific size particle. This rating is determined through a standard test in which oil containing measurable particles is passed through the filter. Particles that pass through are measured and counted. This rating is more informative than the nominal micron rating. Again, the particle size and efficiency must be stated.
Passenger car and light-duty truck oil filters typically have an absolute micron rating in the range of 25-30 microns.
Misunderstanding Efficiency and Micron Rating can result in selecting a filter that is not appropriate for the application under consideration. The Micron Rating must be stated in terms of the efficiency of the filter to collect the specific sized particles.
It can be said that the backstop at a baseball field is 100% efficient at collecting baseballs that hit it. The backstop, which is the filter in this case, is therefore 100% efficient at collecting baseball-sized particles. However, if one were to throw marbles at the backstop, there’s a good chance that many of them are going to get through. The backstop may be much less efficient at collecting marble-sized particles. Understanding that efficiency must be stated in terms of particle size is the key to the meaningful interpretation of a micron rating. Without both pieces of information, the actual performance claims of a filter may be misleading. That’s the truth about micron ratings.
Tags: Efficiency, Filter Efficiency, Micron, Micron Rating
Categories: Cartridge Oil Filters, Oil Filters, Spin-on Oil Filters, Synthetic Oil Filters
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@@montanaguy this should help you. I did not give this kind of detail. HD filter has absolute rating at 40 micron. Catches to 5 micron.
My thoughts exactly
DK customs apparently sells one that's pretty good that I've been considering... it also has a hex on the end so you can use a regular socket to take it off and not mar the finish... im in the middle of building my twin cam now so I think I'll get one but I don't have any first had experience to speak of just yet
Email me with a report when finished....Doc
Hey Doc, I have watched a few of your videos now and have really enjoyed them!!! Thank you!!! I've got a 2003 Vulcan 1500 Classic and I'm just finding out it has a re-useable oil filter and I'm wondering if it can be taken off to replace it with a REGULAR type oil filter?! Thanks, and I hope to hear back from you on this!! Don
I’m sure it can. Talk with your local dealer and seek out other owners on the Net…Doc
Ok, thanks! I would THINK I should be able to switch it to a regular type oil filter but... I'd rather learn that I can than find out the wrong way that I can't! Lol. Thanks!! I'll post up on my Vulcan Forums!
Question is it a good idea to install a oil cooler fan on my 2020 Road Glide?
Yes, absolutely….Doc
I feel like I don't need the hassle cleaning out an oil filter, plus that are a bit pricey so don't know if it would make sense to buy for my old vehicle... But I do like that they available if I ever want one and for those that others that really like them.
Good point David…..Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson Doc, It would take more to "break even" on those fancy filters 'cause unless we value our time at two bucks an hour, the whole cleaning process isn't done by someone else's butler 😁 And, the whole process uses brake cleaner, etc., and aside from the cost of that, it's also not exactly environmentally sound to flush the gunk down the drain. Because ...no, the used conventional filter should NOT go in a landfill but be routed to a hazardous waste facility/outfit to be disposed of properly. It's even the law here in California, as it is in some other states; and it SHOUD be.
Ride Forever! ~ 🦅
Arlen Ness is the one I bought. Don’t think they’re going out of business. Strap ratchet for the removal of oil filter.
How about going over and doing engine alignment
Sometimes people are attracted to gadgety items. The main question to ask: Can this item filter the oil better (particle size, pressure drop etc) than a replaceable filter from HD (or Amsoil, etc)? Of all the expenses of owning a motorcycle, I can't imagine that saving money on an oil filter would be worth the worry no matter how tight your finances are.
good points doc, BUT as an HD mech, I will say my oil pressure comes up faster, like right away. oil temp is lower, = a quieter motor. the cost of filters whether from HD or aftermarket keeps rising, and there is noticeable less drag on the motor whether cold or hot temp. I've used a K&P reusable filter for 7 years on different bikes I own including my 77 shovel, yea they make a drop in oil tank filter to replace the paper or mesh ones, and had nothing but great success and service. and checking my eng for debris in my oil is always a priority, with most. I don't have to cut a tin & paper filter open, and the convince of not looking for a conventional replacement is itself worth it. in the long run, I save $.
Thanks for Sharing your good experience...Doc
K&N filters can be "looked" up on Amazon every day of the week - twice on Sunday 😁
@@midnightmc3096 yea and you will be waiting until Sunday to get it, plus shipping
@@martinwall7297 Nope. Here in a day or two ...and...no shipping on Amazon Prime 😁 And less money than pretty much anywhere in the fouling universe. Plus I don't risk doordings or do any wear and tear on myself or my vehicle comin' or goin' ...aaand, my time to go and come back ain't worth only a few bucks per hour, maybe your is.
From southern California ~ Ride Forever!
@@midnightmc3096 try using hi-flotru filters
A recent review on the filter on the left said it's great cause it doesn't have a relief valve. He said a relief valve will put dirty oil in your engine. You don't want a relief valve in your filter. Like you I want a good relief valve rated for HD. When would you not want a relief valve?
Racing….Doc
Although the PC Racing Flo filter is apparently keeping the Eagle Screamin' I'd be concerned that that one as well as the K&P Engineering filter does not, at the end of the day, filter more nor better than a conventional filter. I believe the opposite to be true, in fact, as demonstrated by several very involved tests right here on RUclips. I surmise that the reason Harley-Davidson utilizes the stainless mesh filters in racing is more due to better flow resulting in more horsepower than for longevity's sake. It's rather unlikely that they're concerned with long-term wear issues. And so, after researching this to the moon and back ...and right into the weeds and down the rabbit hole, considering every possible aspect during said journey, I'll have to say that the Doc, after all, is correct on this one, too (｡*‿*｡) The fancy-schmancy re-usable filters flow great for a reason: they don't filter as much and so there's less for the motor/oil pump to labor over, and thus the 5-9 degree lower oil temps. I'd rather have the virtually constant filtration around plus or minus five microns with the HifloFiltro high-quality conventional style filter. Oh, and they have the nut on the end also if you pick that model (as they have two versions). And I have a nifty filter cutter, so no big drama regarding cutting open filters after oil changes to check status.
From southern California ~ Ride Forever! 🦅
ruclips.net/user/shorts1uPniD6xxlU
Oberg Screens were what we used back in the day!
I just ordered the K&P for my 2023 M8 Trike.
Let us know how that works out for you…Doc
I don't think it will be any worse than the Taiwan filters that everyone sells now. I have a new 2023 anniversary Tri-Glide. I do my own work and I just did my 5000 mile inspection. I found the front axle pinch bolt was stripped out in the socket. The brake fluid had almost 4% water content. The heat deflectors didn't have the special nuts crimped, so the lower screws were doing nothing. The sparkplugs wires were not tie straped to the frame under the seat area. The adjuster on the rear axle was 3/16" wider on the right side compared to the left side and the triple tree is a few degrees to the right when the front wheel is straight. So I would say that Harley quality control is not there. Two dealers say that this is normal. I live about 2 hours away from your shop. @@LowCountryHarleyDavidson
You said change the filter every 3000 miles when the owners manual says 5000 miles. Some say if you use synthetic oil you can go longer. Your thoughts?
I’m no mechanic. I only know my bike. I have used HD Syn3 only in all 3 holes. Serviced every 5k miles. I think Synthetic can go longer than that from what I can tell. I just like changing it so I can inspect and try catch an issue early. I have gone 8k before and oil looked same as 5k. This is on my bike 2012 RK with 238k (miles) on it. No engine rebuild yet. Not a bragging statement just this is my experience. Thats a lot of oil chgs. You’ll be fine whatever you decide.
I don’t think that was a unbiased opinion, I guess I would to if I worked in a certain career 😂 in either case. In my opinion. A lot of those problems “concerns” are really not of any concern. It’s not really messy, does not get everywhere and not really hard to clean it completely with no worry of material left in the filter. There are two great company’s that make reusable filters and they are both very creditable. Yes they make them specifically for our bikes. There is a machine shop near me that specifically works on Harley motors, it is well known throughout the country and is creditable as well. He actually turned me to these and I will never buy a filter again….never. Well unless I absolutely have to. I mean there is a filter that is used on cars that has the exact specs and parts in a hd filter for half the cost. My machine shop guy promotes the reusable filters, one company in particular, as well as turned me to the updated oil pump gear ratio. Which I have done to all my bikes and makes a big difference. Off track….The o rings is not a problem, they actually last for a good time. I mean I guess you could buy a whole crap load for the future, but if the case of a company going out of business, I’m sure there will always be someone that makes the o rings of that size. The wrench issue. Well be smart with what you use. I use my hand. Now wanting to know the kind of material in the filter. Myself and I’m sure a lot of other guys that do there own work and or race, need to know what’s going through their motor and can pretty much cipher what needs to be done by looking at the filter.
Thank you for sharing your experience. Should I remove this old video?…..Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson I’m sure you’re adult enough to make that decision. Further more, since these have been out for more than 2 years I’d say this video still pertains to some people. No video is to old.
The snall filter you show is 30 microns according to seller. I have used one briefly on my destroyer it now gathers dust on a shelf and i use stock hd.
Independent tests show that stock filters clog around 3k and then you're just running dirty oil through the bypass, while 30-40 micron filters don't clog while still filtering all debris from the oil.
@@remedialone6987 if a 30 to 50 micron filtered everything it it would clog too. I would like to see those tests.
What about the anti-drain-back function of the oem?
I don’t know of such a function…..Doc
I use normal oil filters , I saw some thing that made me think , Cam timing gears V timing change should i change my 2013 FXDF timing chain for the gear one ?
Wow, that question cam out of left field. Thought we were talking about oil filters. Too many factors to give you an answer. My opinion is Gear Drive is great for racing. Chain drive for street. Thanks ~ Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson Thank you for that because I'm not use to these modern Harley's I'm a Shovel and Evo man . love your channel and your help is appreciated, again thank you.
Personal opinion reviews really don't hold much water, Except when meant to steer towards continued use and purchasing of OEM products which obviously is whats happening in this video. Any company willing to tool up and produce a milled billet reusable oil filter has done their homework on OEM specs and have spent much in R&D to either meet or exceed. As far as cleaning, Come on really? Cleanup and blow dry with air is quick and easy, As far as O-ring i'm gonna guess here that thru all the R&D odds are they chose a standard o-ring size for easy replacement. Ya wanna do a video, Take the filter on your right (For a HD and pit it against the HD filter and lets see real world results such as true micron level of filtration and PSI bypass and flow rate and lets see who's ranks best).
Lionel here in Central California.
Nice video. I understand that the Harley Davidson race team uses the Flo oil filter. Just saying...
Interesting. Did not know. But of course in racing knowledge is everything after every race….Doc
Those on stock off the shelf o-rings. These are the best filters, period. The best part is you don’t need to cut the filter apart to see if you have contaminants.
Thanks for sharing your experience…. Doc
never thought we would use a reusable oil filter but my 103 was using a little oil ,switch to flow from Dk custom and straight 50 oil external breather, problem solved
Great points. What do you think of oil analysis by Blackstone Labs, etc.
I use Blackstone labs almost every oil change. They give good oil analysis that I can understand and they are much better at that than I would be by opening up a filter and trying to tell whats going on in my motor.
I have no experience with this company. Oil analysis is great for those that desire that knowledge. Thanks ~ Doc
Your videos are generally excellent in presentation and information…sorry…you were obviously hokey in this one!!! I know you’ve heard,seen and maybe even used a strap wrench to take off filters etc!!! Permanent filters are not a bad idea if one wants to go that way
Hokey? That’s a new one. Thanks…..Doc
So you just stated “every 3,000 miles”, however I use Harley Synthetic oil and my Harley Davidson dealer tells me that every 5000 miles, when I do the check up as I do religiously, is when I change the oil and the filter. Is my dealership wrong?
Exactly!!!
First of all, I run the cleanable filters and change my oils at 1500 miles max! Second, I dare anyone to see a 5 micron piece of metal. Maybe 50 years ago when I had 20/15 eyes! When you see metal in a filter, it's either on the first oil change and junk was left in there at assembly, or you have parts coming apart! In the aviation world, if we see metal with a part number engraved on it in the oil, we go ahead and ground the aircraft ....LOL
My HD parts guy tried selling me one of those reusable filters exactly like the one you demonstrated.
At $150 each I told him to forget about it.
I'll just go with a regular black OEM conventional filter.
When they sell the reusable ones they market them to say that they have a cooling effect on the oil..What do you think about that and how much it would actually work🤷 I think it would be very minimal if not no different..
DKCustoms has shown it can drop oil temps some 2~5degrees, even more so if you relocate it.
Any drop in oil temp above 270 degrees is very good.
@@FranBunnyFFXII Yeah I've seen their reviews, and they're usually pretty efficient..
THE REAL QUESTION is not really answered in this ,,, of course they plug H-D oil filters BUT as an air cooled engine very much like old airplane and small airplane the very big advantage of a reusable is that you can wash the filtering element in varsol then strain the muck , pass a magnet over the crud and see if your magnet pickup any metal if it does you have to investigate or you may have down the road an expensive failure we did that procedure on all radial engines back then at every 50 hours of flying believe me it did pay off..
Thanks for adding your story in answering THE REAL QUESTION…..Doc
The reusable filters do not have an anti drain back valve... what are your thoughts?
You have to do your research and purchase a quality unit….Doc
@@LowCountryHarleyDavidson how important is the anti-drain-back valve with the filter in the stock horizontal position?
Good video. As i belive the hd filter is the best for our bikes and never really thought of really running anything else. But what's your thought on oil i just bought a new 2020 sg and i know it comes factory filled with the hd 360 conventional oil. Should and do u recommend staying with it or should i switch to the SE synthetic?
I can't tell you anything about the HD 360 oil because I have never used it, but I can give you my thoughts on the Syn3. I have been using Syn3 for several years and have had zero problems with it. You will see people on the forums bashing it, but they never have any real proof to back up their claims. I send a sample of my used Syn3 to Blackstone-Labs in Ft. Wayne, IN every so often to have it analyzed. The analysis has always come back damn near perfect. Blackstone-Labs will not only let you know what shape your oil is in, but they will also let you know if you if your bike is running right, are you using a good oil filter and air filter. They will give you the break down of the metals found in your oil and compare your wear levels to other engines in the same category. They will also let you know if you should go further between oil changes. No sense in wasting money on changing your oil way to soon all the time. Go by what the owners manual says, the manufacture knows your engine way better than some keyboard jockey does. The only time I have ever had something in my oil report that was a little off with the Syn3 is, one time the viscosity was a little higher than what it should have been. That sample had 6,200 miles on it from a cross country and back trip that I did in a week. My thought is, the additive package might have evaporated a little. I use Syn3 in all 3 holes. I carry an extra quart with me on long trips incase something happens and I need oil. Plus, there are HD dealerships all over the country and if I need oil, I don't have to go looking for some other brand that I might be using at the time. As for oil filters, well I seen several cut-away oil filters at a bike shop a few years ago. The HD filters paper element was contained inside what looked like panty hose, to keep the paper fibers from breaking free and running through your engine. The K&N looked like the best built filter to me. I have used them for years and never had a issue with them. One good thing about the K&N is, you can use a 17mm socket to remove the filter and not have to try and get a filter wrench in there to remove the old oil filter. I have been getting my K&N filters on Amazon for just under $11 each. Enjoy that Street Glide!
@@Chaplain161 thanks for you input really appreciate it. I just heard so many different opinions on oil just not sure what to believe i do feel comfortable running the hd oil cause i know its made for are machines just didnt know if synthetic 3 was actually better than the dino oil.
Oil debates could go on forever... just put in recommended oil (service manual), change at recommended intervals and all with be fine. Guy has a youtube channel call Project Farm, he compares oils with tests and pretty much ends all the Amsoil, Mobile1 oil hype.
@@Chaplain161 Blackstone did oil analysis for me last month. Condition of the oil was given in the report.
In my opinion synthetic oil should be used when operating in locations with hi average temperatures such as Texas Arizona and so forth. I use Dino oil for break in and then switch to synthetic since I live in Texas. I use Mobil 1 V-Twin because no matter where I'm at I'm probably never more than 50 miles from a Walmart and can buy it on Sundays and Mondays and after 6 on a weekday unlike Harley products. The most important thing about boil is to have the proper amount in your bike and to change it as recommended.
I have never had a problem with the OEM Harley filters, they are inexpensive and work well! If it aint broke don't fix it! Everyone ride safe!
Been going back and forth for a long time on this issue. It's one thing to have 40-50 years of riding experince and offering advice, But it's a whole new ball game getting advice from someone like yourself, who has both multiple years of riding experience and and expert in your field for 30+ years. I think I will just stick with OEM filters. Thanks for making this video.
Have to disagree because there is too much evidence to the contrary. Takes a good while for the reusable filter to pay for themselves but cleaning them is no biggie. Cooler oil, less drag and not having to find a filter every time is a bonus. To each his own. I want a reusable one myself.
Thanks for sharing...Doc
Don’t think I was being critical because I think you put out very informative videos and very helpful and you deal with all the issues first hand. Thanks
We'll Doc this is were we part company. I always watch your Videos for a reference. I must say this is the first time I completely disagree with your analysis. Heat is the worst enemy our bikes have. The flo filter (the one with the fins) will cool the oil. The fins have to radiate heat. They claim a 10 degree cooling. I have run these filters on 6 or 7 builds. I always use a temp sensor when I stick 10 grand or more in a motor. I have to agree with them. They also claim an 8percent increase in flo rate over a paper filter. Which I have not attempted to test. They are right with the temp so I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. More flo when it's cold, cooler normal operating temp, one time purchase, that filter will pay for it self in 8 changes. Sounds to me like a win win win.
Doc we can disagree. I good with it keep the videos coming.
I appreciate you facts and sharing. I deal with HD products all the time and can not get the good feedback like yours....Doc
Reusable oil filters come with an end cap attachment to remove from the engine.
Fight after this one... How about the disposable paper element oil filters that are twice as long as OEM HD? Let the fights begin!
Reusable Oil Filters... Buy from a Company that has been in business for decades. Buy with the correct features; easy to remove nut or surface to grab onto, magnet metal catcher inside the filter, size, etc.
Why would I get one? To clean the oil better than a paper media filter.
Concerns? Maintaining correct oil pressure at all times.