I have played this combo before, and I rationalized it similar to how the denarians work in the Dresden Files series. My character started as an unwilling warlock(received his powers from touching a cursed tome, like the silver coins in Dresden) who was searching to get out of his pact but having to keep reaching for more power to survive on his quest to do so. Then, he encountered a paladin whose mission it was to destroy cursed objects like the tome using a holy sword (again, like the knights of the cross in Dresden). A big battle ensues with the fiend taking complete control of my character to protect its own interests, resulting in the paladin destroying the tome, but at the cost of his own life. My character then inherits the holy blade to take the paladin’s place and save others who suffered like himself. Mechanically, this resulted in him losing all but 3 levels in warlock (illustrating that he was able to keep some of the power that he was given as it had become a part of his being) but changing to a blade pact from tome, and getting the rest of his levels in paladin. Flavored the warlock magic as now being energized by the good deity as well. (Similar to Dresden losing hellfire but gaining soul fire, in case you can’t tell I’m a big fan of the series lol). Of course, this was before the celestial warlock was a thing, so all of that is kinda unnecessary now, but the story arc was really cool.
Here's a fun one: take Paladin at first level (for heavy armor), take Oath of Conquest, multiclass into Hexblade, take Blade Pact, get Paladin up to level 11 for Improved Smite. You are now Darth Vader. (Alternately, if you don't have Xanathar's Guide, you can do Oath of Vengeance and Fey Pact, and only use the "fear" effect of Fey Presence.)
Yeah, but you can't just /bowtie and win. It's the same principle as the jagoffs who throw on a fedora with their cargo shorts to try to look classy. No bueno.
I've done this before myself, but i actually used the Vengeance Paladin (Bahamut) and Hexblade Warlock (also Bahamut), and it was an amazing experience for me personally as, while i was on this quest for personal revenge, i was also, in my characters mind, bettering the world. But seeing that way definitely makes me interested
Another way of doing is could be the Dresden Files way of you're taking on this pact so that someone else won't be corrupted by this fiend. You're basically imprisoning this thing while trying to fight off any influence it might be gaining over you.
So long as you have a comparable oath and Pact, there's no reason it cannot work. Fiend/Vengeance Fey/Ancients Fey/Devotion (Any)/Crown I've wanted to try a Fallen Aasimar Paladin/Warlock seeking to recover the soul of a loved one a la Dr. Doom.
Paladin (Oath of the Crown) 6 Sorcerer (Favored Soul) 14 is better at smiting and also has the ability to recover slots, the Shield spell, and metamagic. And you can be devoted to Mystra and her causes. If you want, you can still go Paladin 6 Favored Soul 9 Warlock 5 and have up to 6th level slots and two recurring 3rd level slots and up to 5th level spells from the Sorcerer or Cleric spell lists. You're a smiting/buffing/healing machine. Spirit Guardians + Sentinel anyone? Quicken Hold Person/Monster + Double Smite? Fireball? War Caster + Booming Blade?
cool video, it's nice to discuss characters from a personality perspective rather than mechanically. Sounds like a fun, interesting character to play, explore and develop.
Id love to see a paladin warlock or a cleric warlock where either by a third party or a neutral deity has been tasked with making sure their patron and deity get along or have some sort of treaty. and the PC would be the avatar of that treaty. Maybe there was some kind of battle of gods and devils and these inbetweeners are who handle it all.
I had a player fight his patron. The player would not have been able to win as the patron was a either a CR25, or CR30 variant of a phoenix. The pact between them gave the player a portion of the phoenix's power. Had he won, he would have absorbed the rest of the patrons power and in essence, become a new incarnation of that patron. As he leveled, he would have kept gaining warlock levels, and also the memories of his patron...changing the player on both a physical and psychological level.
If I were to strip their warlock powers during a fight against their deity, I would let them replace those levels with something that had to do with their paladin character. Like "Torm smiles upon you in your darkest hour", take 7 levels in paladin,cleric, or something that has to do with whatever god it was that saved them.
I'm playing a Revenant Oathbreaker paladin/Raven queen warlock and its been great so far. She will have/has Great weapon fighting, polearm master, sentinel, darkness with devils sight combo, short rest smites, 3 attacks with hex plus aura of hate which adds charisma damage on top of strength. Its also nice having eldritch blast with agonizing blast because ranged is where the paladin is weak, but not this one. Broke her oath after being killed by a dracolich, when the raven queen offered her revenge and brought her back to unlife
I'm in a game where my devotion paladin is grouped with a warlock. As the shining beacon of light in the group, besides the cleric, he showed the warlock how to pray at the alter of good gods... ironically it was fun
There's also the way to run things when a warlock faces their patron where the warlock abilities don't work *directly* against the patron. You can't Eldritch blast them, but you can take out their minions with it, or cause rubble to fall on them from the ceiling, etc.
I'm going to be playing a tiefling Devotion paladin/fiend Warlock as kind of a Hellboy character. His devilish ancestor gives him the power in hopes of tempting him, and he rejects it for his devotion to helping people.
I was expecting some sort of heavily armoured melee warlock hexblade/blade pact smiting blow monstrosity with the power to dump nuclear strikes on every swing till its spell slots run out. This is pretty nice too though.
@@SovietSeething Maybe though When you get life drinker at 11th you double your charsma damage to 10 instead of 5. damage is +11 using improved pact weapon before HEX
If you were to end up fighting your patron the DM could re-skin the Fiendish pact as a Celestial pact and just reword the abilities to do something exactly the same but flavor them good. Your paladins god would then become your warlock patron partway through the encounter.
About stripping the Warlock of their powers: This is why I enjoy the GOO Warlock. To begin with, who's to say that defiance isn't their actual goal? And if a 'punishment' is what you'll go with, roll a die or two on the madness tables
I really gotta Blue Exorcist feel from this character concept. The kinda "bend to not break" style of compromise as well as the "Satan spawn who's going to beat the crap out of Satan" mind set.
I recently had a player approach me to multiclass his dragon born paladin to a hexblade warlock. His backstory to the rational is that an axe of great power yet to awaken that he had encountered during campaign (which had a different story plan, but hey, going to roll with it) was the origin of his Pact. Character has yet to hit the table since his pact taken but will see how it rolls out.
Its a cool character concept. I do like the idea of having a paladin that had all their attributes switch to Oathbreaker paladin when they make the pact to become a warlock. I would do this build just to give the Paladin Eldritch blast and dump dex altogether.
You guys are great, I love this channel. A suggestion that I already thought in the video of the characters lvl 10, and now I thought again, how about you put a link to the character sheet of this character?
It's an interesting build for sure, but you can make it work. You don't make your paladin's oath until level 3 in the class. So to start as a paladin then switch to a warlock because you were tempted by the dark powers does work. after a time you come back, and go paladin again. Really though most of the time it wouldn't be a conflict of interest unless you are a paladin of a good god and take the fiend patron for warlock.
Since I know you guys are Eberron fans. Building a Devotion paladin/warlock of the undying light themed around his patron being the Silver Flame and that flavor combo seems to mesh well in the offerings as well.
Oath of Vengeance Hexblade Paladin. Guy was killed the Knight Commander of his order, who had become corrupted by evil. Instead of Dieing he ends up getting revived by this great sword, which gives him power. (This ain't even backstory). Now everyone notices that my character is less sociable, and less merciful as he gets closer and closer to the knight commander...OH AND THE GREATSWORD IS SENTIENT. So there will be times where it tells my character to do something and it looks like he is actually going mad. I don't know how far I want him to fall, but it's so much fun to see this spiral of corruption and it interaction.
Could visit the world of Inquisitor and the Warhammer 40k universe: The inquisitor who experiments with the tools of the enemy to enhance their ability to fight off the forces of darkness. Through research of forbidden artifacts the paladin has found a way to bend the will of an evil creature to his own. Now the forbidden knowledge seeks to corrupt him as he wields the dark energies to smite the enemies of good.
i had a relay cool idea for what could happen if you met your evil patron. he could offer you power or an exceedingly powerful magic item in exchange for betraying your friend. the patron could say that you had helped him so much that if you helped him with one last thing, killing your friends, he would let you keep all you power and more and never hear from the patron again.
So, in my last campaign, I played a variant Archfey pact, because I made a pact with a long forgotten lunar goddess, and my character was smitten. Just absolutely head over heels for her, she was incapable of seeing any flaws in her patron whatsoever. ...Until the up until then big bad was defeated at oh, 18th level. And then the ritual the big bad was casting finally brought my patron to full goddess status again. And needless to say, after hearing her plans to destroy the entire rest of the pantheon such that mortals would never forget her again, my poor Warlock offended her gravely, and she was stripped of her warlock levels completely. I was left a level 2 character for a while, while I braved the Shadowfell with my party to make a new pact with the Raven Queen.
Sorcerer inherited a house. Wizard built a house. Warlock bought a house (he got magic, the patron got his soul/whatever). These 3 OWN a house. Cleric and Paladin are renting a house, if they miss the payment it gets taken away from them.
Ophinshtalajiir Jarro - dragonborn conquest paladin + celestial warlock. Jarro's party unwittingly defended the gravesite of Alias from the cult of Talona (lesser deity of disease & plague). Finder Wyvenspur (demigod of music & bards), as a reward, granted the party members access to his power, if they wished to use it. Now there is a distinct possibility that Finder can call upon Jarro to do favors, or Talona's cult will hunt him down.
Whether from offical lore or a game I played in I've always understood that any Paladin or cleric outside of there deities area of influence becomes a warlock. Maybe warlocks are more like charged batteries and cleric and Paladin are more like being directly plugged into a source.
I really like the idea of Sir Percedal of Sadlygrove from the cartoon “Wakfu”. He isn’t exactly a paladin (I could explain, but spoilers!) but he has a demon possessed blade that his knight order has dedicated themselves to guarding. I.e., they wield demon possessed blades for *good* in order to keep the power out of the hands of evil doers. These demons are trapped in the blades and to destroy the blades would set the demons free. They seem to get some nice demonic powers the more familiar they get with the blades and the demons that reside within. However they must be careful, lest they become possessed by the demons and go wild. I am going to style my Orc Paladin after him a bit. (Paladin/Warlock)
Just found this video and omg its perfect... I had just started playing a fallen aasimar paladin. She's only lv2 currently but given the fallen aasimar have lost connection to their deva this works for me. Right now she's suffering from a battlefield trauma amnesia in that she's forgotten she's an aasimar but also the person who had found her kept telling her she's human to the point she'd stated to believe him. The incident on the battlefield was what caused her to lose her deva and become fallen. That's where campaign picked up and it's the out of the abyss module my group is playing in so when my character hits lv7 she going to multi class into warlock and reforge her connection by means of the celestial. Her deva being one it makes sense. So my build will end up looking like this... 16 oath of vengeance paladin / 4 warlock celestial pact of the blade on an arc of vengeance for the fallen and redemption of self.
The first thing that comes to my mind as a "retirement plot" for the character facing off against the patron is something akin to Piers Anthony's Incarnations of Immortality series... Should the character defeat the patron (with the party's help, let's hope it works out), then there's a power vacuum in the hierarchy of the spirit world, and for the sake of the "greater good" the Waradin now finds himself needing to take up the mantle of his former patron, stealing all the patron's power sources and using that position to maintain "order" (such as it may be). Somewhere down the line, we maybe even find out that was the Patron's intent all along, and he'd been pulling this with various "chosen ones" for generations, looking for the one who can take up his mantle and do something worthwhile with it. Of course, then he's locked into this, and has to dump this cursed blessing on some other poor sap, who takes a similar build in a later generation.
Fiend pact is a hard sell, but Hexblade is easy, and offers a Greatsword pact weapon with similar features to the Dispater Mace. Easier sell to your DM, and you get the slight boost from Hex.
I think if you mix the language of the Abjure Enemy Channel Divinity for the Vengeance Paladin with Hurl Through Hell for the Fiendlock, you basically would have the Ghost Rider’s Penance Stare.
Personally I would have his warlock powers become progressively more unstable until they eventually turn off. BUT, I would introduce a new prospective patron into the story. Either a less sinister warlock patron (So he changes warlock archetype) or better yet a rival demon that wishes to see his current patron be toppled.
Oath of conquest Paladin who is multi-classed with a Hexblade Warlock. A Paladin swore an oath to a god of evil, war or conquest to conquer a fallen kingdom and rule over it with an iron fist and power Ganondorf style. But during you campaign you lose a great battle and is forced to retreat and recover. You hide in a dark ruin or a cave and in your rage and shame for losing this battle awakens a slobbering cured sword or some other weapon who promises the power you need to reach your goal to be a ruler. Sorta like an dark version of excaliber. You accept the weapon´s offer, grabs it, free it from it´s seal and the weapon bonds to you and doom you are a dark version of king Arthur. Could that maybe be a good background story for a character?
I took this inspiration of this & let my race decide/create this dilemma... tiefling urchin from childhood, took the deal to give me the power to better my life & became his blade pack warlock "assassin" tiefling little girl who ppl overlook/don't fear... killed & robbed a Noblemen, thus am wanted... upon running away i finally trip over shrine, break down & ask for forgiveness/help from the gods shrine I see b4 me. He reaches down & cast all the "fiendish" influence/lineage from with in me transformation me into a opal tiefling & his paladin champion
Since I started D&D 5E my dream multi- Class character is a Paladin to 2nd level sorcerer the rest, my god the amount of smites per day. I would go Human v and grab hp boost feat or Hill dwarf so you could stay in melee combat.
I've always been under the impression that the patron is more of a teacher than a power source. I imagine that you might be held back from leveling up, or you might be practicing your magic by yourself.
Warlocks are like Spawn. You make your pact, you have your "task" that the patron asked for. Now you have your power. If you turn against your patron, that's on you. But good luck gaining more levels as a Warlock if you fucked your Patron over. The way I DM it is pretty simple. When you want to gain a level in Warlock, you have to make a new deal with your patron. You ask it for more power, you get a task to do (sometimes it's just a ritual you have to perform. sometimes it's a task you have to complete, etc). You don't necessarily have to do the task BEFORE you get the level, but if you don't do the task, then you won't be able to get your next level until you catch up. And if you turn against your Patron, that's just a risk your Patron takes to have an agent in the world.
I would have gone that the character was a undercover agent. And so he learned his Warlock because he had to. And then when he had enough info his Paladin clan moved in and arrested many of the warlocks, maybe one or two got away and are now hunting you down.
12:00 Intern Kyle - " ...it really spoke to me ... evil patron, but a good character " In real life, he works for you guys. I think he's saying you're the monsters, he's the hero ?
another route you could go is not their God giving them a paladin power boost but another patron intervenes giving you the warlock powers back because they want your former patron dead either to ursurp their power or end an ongoing power struggle between the two
I play a 3 Paladin Oath of Conquest/ 1 Warlock Pact of the Celestial. I am a Lawful good paladin that was given additional powers to smite my lords foes. Very simple concept and I will never put more then 1 point into warlock as it was a one time deal with a servant of my lord.
Depends on how you flavor it. I mean you dont have to sell your soul to be a warlock and if you are in a deal Fiends must abide by it. Law is their absolute.
True enough upon listening to the whole video. The flavor seems quality. I say the greatest limiter on this is double smiting is a massive drain on resources. Action Surge Competitive Nova round though
One Warlock I played with had the pact forced upon him as a baby/small child. Although his parents never told him that, "hey son, I got possessed one night and made a deal with a demon for you, ok?" So, he grew up thinking that he was 'special' like a sorcerer. He later became an Oath of Devotion Paladin to try and save his soul once he found out. Also, it was Out of the Abyss so the Demon Lord aspect really freaked the character out
if i was the DM, i would not let his warlock slide. he didn't argue it well enough for me. I would have no problem with a fiend and devotion combo. you could do something fun like sell your soul but your paladin powers come from you double crossing your fiend, so you end up getting warlock powers by saying you're going to betray your god and paladin powers by saying you are going to betray your friend. the player would have to RP both sides well to not have their powers ripped out.
This is really strange. I have a Paladin(Oath of Conquest) at lvl 15, Warlock(Pact of the Blade/The Great Old One) at lvl 5. I use him as a tanky intimidator casting magic and bashing skulls. He is also a Dragonborn(Brass cuz fire) named Rhogar.
Hey guys, i started watching you a few months ago (now i constantly watch your videos), right after i was able to finally plat D&D for the first time (thanks). i have a few questions and i would like some help crafting a character for a new campaing (i had the concept of a magical archer) i wanted to ask where do i write to you? Here? or an email? or which is the best place to ask such a question. Thank you for your time and let me know! Also nice paladin warlock duality concept! hope to see more!
Here's the arcane archer pdf, that should cover the concept pretty well, you might want to take some stuff from the various versions of the ranger to make it work better as an archer. media.wizards.com/2016/dnd/downloads/2016_Fighter_UA_1205_1.pdf
the green orc skull shirt sir where might I find that item please. and with Xander's celestial pack warlock coming out Paladin/Warlock might get another look.
The problem I have with Paladins in many games is the justification that they can only be LG. My current GM believes that the Paladin is supposed to be the same alignment as the god they serve because they are holy knights. I believe this is a better approach to Paladins because it allows Paladins to be used in a more general sense.
Tiefling (Levistus MTOF) that gets +1 con and +2 car. start as Paladin Oath of Conquest (some called hell knights getting powers from devil or demon lords) then make a deal whit the raven queen to get more powers (warlock hexblade whit pact of the blade) :D would go 6lvl paladin and 14 lvl warlock. basically a shadow knight/paladin :D if you read into the Oath of conquest paladin from XGTE some of them are called hell knights and they get their powers from the ruling devils or demons, but are shun by other paladins as they see them as going to far in their quest. and the Hexblade is a nice melee focused patron. or you can go healer pala/lock whit Oath of Devotion and Celestial patron :)
Where can I find the gameplay of the session talked about in this video? I'd like to see this character in action and how the DM interacts with them through the pact entity.
I'm pretty sure most folks rate the Pally/ Warlock as gold tier..i.e., "not in my game." I still don't think its nearly as OP as something like a Sorc/Warlock.
i Wish to do a paladin warlock...but I'm not sure what to do... my idea is as character who have a celestial sealed inside himself so is like both his deity and patron... I'm usure if go to hexblade or celestial warlock
Hey, I was thinking of making a Fallen Aasimar Venge Paladin 6/Hexblade 2/Lore Bard X. He's basically a warchanter, with the flavor being that all his powers come from his war god (Ares or Tyr) and his angel/fey minions. He wouldn't see himself as abandoning his paladin beginnings, just delving into deeper magical mysteries to better complete his mission. My question is, do people think this combination (mostly the lore bard part) works? Or is this too spread out and power-diffuse? He clearly misses an ASI, but the 2 eldritch invocations feel like a good replacement for the lost Feat. Do the bard spell slots make up for the lost higher level abilities of the other classes?
I have played this combo before, and I rationalized it similar to how the denarians work in the Dresden Files series. My character started as an unwilling warlock(received his powers from touching a cursed tome, like the silver coins in Dresden) who was searching to get out of his pact but having to keep reaching for more power to survive on his quest to do so. Then, he encountered a paladin whose mission it was to destroy cursed objects like the tome using a holy sword (again, like the knights of the cross in Dresden). A big battle ensues with the fiend taking complete control of my character to protect its own interests, resulting in the paladin destroying the tome, but at the cost of his own life. My character then inherits the holy blade to take the paladin’s place and save others who suffered like himself. Mechanically, this resulted in him losing all but 3 levels in warlock (illustrating that he was able to keep some of the power that he was given as it had become a part of his being) but changing to a blade pact from tome, and getting the rest of his levels in paladin. Flavored the warlock magic as now being energized by the good deity as well. (Similar to Dresden losing hellfire but gaining soul fire, in case you can’t tell I’m a big fan of the series lol). Of course, this was before the celestial warlock was a thing, so all of that is kinda unnecessary now, but the story arc was really cool.
Here's a fun one: take Paladin at first level (for heavy armor), take Oath of Conquest, multiclass into Hexblade, take Blade Pact, get Paladin up to level 11 for Improved Smite. You are now Darth Vader.
(Alternately, if you don't have Xanathar's Guide, you can do Oath of Vengeance and Fey Pact, and only use the "fear" effect of Fey Presence.)
I best character is Paladin (Devotion) / Warlock (Undying Light). It is pretty much Solaire from Dark Souls
praise the sun
@soviet, i both love and hate you for making that reference.
kinda weird hearing myself talk
Lol you get used to it after a while. My voice is cringey, but Idc it's all about fun haha.
Sean Murphy Well apparently im the bowtie guy now haha
bow ties are cool
for a second i thought you were a ventriloquist doll :).
Yeah, but you can't just /bowtie and win. It's the same principle as the jagoffs who throw on a fedora with their cargo shorts to try to look classy. No bueno.
I've done this before myself, but i actually used the Vengeance Paladin (Bahamut) and Hexblade Warlock (also Bahamut), and it was an amazing experience for me personally as, while i was on this quest for personal revenge, i was also, in my characters mind, bettering the world. But seeing that way definitely makes me interested
Another way of doing is could be the Dresden Files way of you're taking on this pact so that someone else won't be corrupted by this fiend. You're basically imprisoning this thing while trying to fight off any influence it might be gaining over you.
Dresden Files is so good
+1 for agreement.
Is that a weird camera angle or is the guy in the back literally 1/5th the size of the red shirt guy ? ^^
Approximately 40% the size
hell yeah..great video Nerdarchy...I loved the session and it was good to see Kyle on a daily
So long as you have a comparable oath and Pact, there's no reason it cannot work.
Fiend/Vengeance
Fey/Ancients
Fey/Devotion
(Any)/Crown
I've wanted to try a Fallen Aasimar Paladin/Warlock seeking to recover the soul of a loved one a la Dr. Doom.
Mike Gould Don't forget, Great Old One/Devotion
This is an amazing build. Honestly, I love it. I myself am a Warlock/Bard Tiefling.
imagine slaying your patron and receiving it's power... all of it.
that would be a relay cool way of retiring a character. to the status of god.
andrew cole or an arch devil
A PC: The essence of every world, every spell, every thought is power, nothing else matters, because nothing else exists.
With a 5th level spell slot divine smite crit
The new raven queen pact would be excellent for this build.
Paladin (Oath of the Crown) 6 Sorcerer (Favored Soul) 14 is better at smiting and also has the ability to recover slots, the Shield spell, and metamagic. And you can be devoted to Mystra and her causes. If you want, you can still go Paladin 6 Favored Soul 9 Warlock 5 and have up to 6th level slots and two recurring 3rd level slots and up to 5th level spells from the Sorcerer or Cleric spell lists. You're a smiting/buffing/healing machine. Spirit Guardians + Sentinel anyone? Quicken Hold Person/Monster + Double Smite? Fireball? War Caster + Booming Blade?
cool video, it's nice to discuss characters from a personality perspective rather than mechanically. Sounds like a fun, interesting character to play, explore and develop.
Every once in awhile we need to put the crunchy calculations down and pick up the character development kit
Kyle looks like a ventriloquist puppet sitting between you guys. The bowtie doesn't help. lol
Would be funny if one of them has a third hand up Kyle's rectal passage.
Haha... that was my first thought.
'Oh look at the marionette puppet... oh it talks too... oh, OH..It's REAL boy.'
Lmao. In Shrek's Pinocchio voice "I'm a real boy!"
Id love to see a paladin warlock or a cleric warlock where either by a third party or a neutral deity has been tasked with making sure their patron and deity get along or have some sort of treaty. and the PC would be the avatar of that treaty.
Maybe there was some kind of battle of gods and devils and these inbetweeners are who handle it all.
so that's what nerdarchist dave looks like without a beard XD.
Welcome to the team nerdarchist Kyle. :D
He loses a lot of presence without the beard
I had a player fight his patron. The player would not have been able to win as the patron was a either a CR25, or CR30 variant of a phoenix. The pact between them gave the player a portion of the phoenix's power. Had he won, he would have absorbed the rest of the patrons power and in essence, become a new incarnation of that patron. As he leveled, he would have kept gaining warlock levels, and also the memories of his patron...changing the player on both a physical and psychological level.
If I were to strip their warlock powers during a fight against their deity, I would let them replace those levels with something that had to do with their paladin character. Like "Torm smiles upon you in your darkest hour", take 7 levels in paladin,cleric, or something that has to do with whatever god it was that saved them.
I'm playing a Revenant Oathbreaker paladin/Raven queen warlock and its been great so far. She will have/has Great weapon fighting, polearm master, sentinel, darkness with devils sight combo, short rest smites, 3 attacks with hex plus aura of hate which adds charisma damage on top of strength. Its also nice having eldritch blast with agonizing blast because ranged is where the paladin is weak, but not this one. Broke her oath after being killed by a dracolich, when the raven queen offered her revenge and brought her back to unlife
I'm in a game where my devotion paladin is grouped with a warlock. As the shining beacon of light in the group, besides the cleric, he showed the warlock how to pray at the alter of good gods... ironically it was fun
There's also the way to run things when a warlock faces their patron where the warlock abilities don't work *directly* against the patron. You can't Eldritch blast them, but you can take out their minions with it, or cause rubble to fall on them from the ceiling, etc.
I was one of the guys yelling 'Heresy'.
HERESY!!!
HERESY!!!
Office Dullard called it lol
I'm going to be playing a tiefling Devotion paladin/fiend Warlock as kind of a Hellboy character. His devilish ancestor gives him the power in hopes of tempting him, and he rejects it for his devotion to helping people.
I was expecting some sort of heavily armoured melee warlock hexblade/blade pact smiting blow monstrosity with the power to dump nuclear strikes on every swing till its spell slots run out. This is pretty nice too though.
blade pact is too limited
@@SovietSeething Maybe though When you get life drinker at 11th you double your charsma damage to 10 instead of 5. damage is +11 using improved pact weapon before HEX
If you were to end up fighting your patron the DM could re-skin the Fiendish pact as a Celestial pact and just reword the abilities to do something exactly the same but flavor them good. Your paladins god would then become your warlock patron partway through the encounter.
About stripping the Warlock of their powers: This is why I enjoy the GOO Warlock. To begin with, who's to say that defiance isn't their actual goal? And if a 'punishment' is what you'll go with, roll a die or two on the madness tables
I really gotta Blue Exorcist feel from this character concept. The kinda "bend to not break" style of compromise as well as the "Satan spawn who's going to beat the crap out of Satan" mind set.
I've been thinking on a Lockadin lately, myself. Thanks for the added inspiration!
I recently had a player approach me to multiclass his dragon born paladin to a hexblade warlock. His backstory to the rational is that an axe of great power yet to awaken that he had encountered during campaign (which had a different story plan, but hey, going to roll with it) was the origin of his Pact. Character has yet to hit the table since his pact taken but will see how it rolls out.
Kyle looks like a halfling with Ted and Nate close in the foreground.
Its a cool character concept. I do like the idea of having a paladin that had all their attributes switch to Oathbreaker paladin when they make the pact to become a warlock. I would do this build just to give the Paladin Eldritch blast and dump dex altogether.
You guys are great, I love this channel. A suggestion that I already thought in the video of the characters lvl 10, and now I thought again, how about you put a link to the character sheet of this character?
It's an interesting build for sure, but you can make it work. You don't make your paladin's oath until level 3 in the class. So to start as a paladin then switch to a warlock because you were tempted by the dark powers does work. after a time you come back, and go paladin again. Really though most of the time it wouldn't be a conflict of interest unless you are a paladin of a good god and take the fiend patron for warlock.
Since I know you guys are Eberron fans. Building a Devotion paladin/warlock of the undying light themed around his patron being the Silver Flame and that flavor combo seems to mesh well in the offerings as well.
Oath of Vengeance Hexblade Paladin.
Guy was killed the Knight Commander of his order, who had become corrupted by evil. Instead of Dieing he ends up getting revived by this great sword, which gives him power. (This ain't even backstory).
Now everyone notices that my character is less sociable, and less merciful as he gets closer and closer to the knight commander...OH AND THE GREATSWORD IS SENTIENT. So there will be times where it tells my character to do something and it looks like he is actually going mad. I don't know how far I want him to fall, but it's so much fun to see this spiral of corruption and it interaction.
My current character is a Fallen Assamar Fiend Pack Warlock Vengeance Paladin.
Could visit the world of Inquisitor and the Warhammer 40k universe:
The inquisitor who experiments with the tools of the enemy to enhance their ability to fight off the forces of darkness. Through research of forbidden artifacts the paladin has found a way to bend the will of an evil creature to his own. Now the forbidden knowledge seeks to corrupt him as he wields the dark energies to smite the enemies of good.
i had a relay cool idea for what could happen if you met your evil patron. he could offer you power or an exceedingly powerful magic item in exchange for betraying your friend. the patron could say that you had helped him so much that if you helped him with one last thing, killing your friends, he would let you keep all you power and more and never hear from the patron again.
Hehe... the camera angle is odd with the two larger guys sitting closer to the camera. I thought Kyle was a marionette puppet at first.
So, in my last campaign, I played a variant Archfey pact, because I made a pact with a long forgotten lunar goddess, and my character was smitten. Just absolutely head over heels for her, she was incapable of seeing any flaws in her patron whatsoever. ...Until the up until then big bad was defeated at oh, 18th level. And then the ritual the big bad was casting finally brought my patron to full goddess status again. And needless to say, after hearing her plans to destroy the entire rest of the pantheon such that mortals would never forget her again, my poor Warlock offended her gravely, and she was stripped of her warlock levels completely. I was left a level 2 character for a while, while I braved the Shadowfell with my party to make a new pact with the Raven Queen.
Sorcerer inherited a house. Wizard built a house. Warlock bought a house (he got magic, the patron got his soul/whatever). These 3 OWN a house. Cleric and Paladin are renting a house, if they miss the payment it gets taken away from them.
Paladins rent a house, from a strict landlord. If they dont follow the rules, theyre kicked out.
And the bard just kinda walked in and said this is my house now
The Barbarian lost their house and went into a Rage.
Actually you can put a 2x2 lego brick on 1 duplo stud. Therefore, Oath of Devotion Paladins and Fiend Patron Warlocks work perfectly together.
Why not Undying Light patron? You get the goodliness AND you get an extra fuck you bonus to Radiant and Fire damage
Ophinshtalajiir Jarro - dragonborn conquest paladin + celestial warlock. Jarro's party unwittingly defended the gravesite of Alias from the cult of Talona (lesser deity of disease & plague). Finder Wyvenspur (demigod of music & bards), as a reward, granted the party members access to his power, if they wished to use it. Now there is a distinct possibility that Finder can call upon Jarro to do favors, or Talona's cult will hunt him down.
Wow Kyle looks so tiny compared to Ted and Nate! lol
Whether from offical lore or a game I played in I've always understood that any Paladin or cleric outside of there deities area of influence becomes a warlock. Maybe warlocks are more like charged batteries and cleric and Paladin are more like being directly plugged into a source.
I really like the idea of Sir Percedal of Sadlygrove from the cartoon “Wakfu”. He isn’t exactly a paladin (I could explain, but spoilers!) but he has a demon possessed blade that his knight order has dedicated themselves to guarding. I.e., they wield demon possessed blades for *good* in order to keep the power out of the hands of evil doers. These demons are trapped in the blades and to destroy the blades would set the demons free. They seem to get some nice demonic powers the more familiar they get with the blades and the demons that reside within. However they must be careful, lest they become possessed by the demons and go wild. I am going to style my Orc Paladin after him a bit. (Paladin/Warlock)
Just found this video and omg its perfect... I had just started playing a fallen aasimar paladin. She's only lv2 currently but given the fallen aasimar have lost connection to their deva this works for me. Right now she's suffering from a battlefield trauma amnesia in that she's forgotten she's an aasimar but also the person who had found her kept telling her she's human to the point she'd stated to believe him. The incident on the battlefield was what caused her to lose her deva and become fallen. That's where campaign picked up and it's the out of the abyss module my group is playing in so when my character hits lv7 she going to multi class into warlock and reforge her connection by means of the celestial. Her deva being one it makes sense. So my build will end up looking like this... 16 oath of vengeance paladin / 4 warlock celestial pact of the blade on an arc of vengeance for the fallen and redemption of self.
The first thing that comes to my mind as a "retirement plot" for the character facing off against the patron is something akin to Piers Anthony's Incarnations of Immortality series... Should the character defeat the patron (with the party's help, let's hope it works out), then there's a power vacuum in the hierarchy of the spirit world, and for the sake of the "greater good" the Waradin now finds himself needing to take up the mantle of his former patron, stealing all the patron's power sources and using that position to maintain "order" (such as it may be).
Somewhere down the line, we maybe even find out that was the Patron's intent all along, and he'd been pulling this with various "chosen ones" for generations, looking for the one who can take up his mantle and do something worthwhile with it. Of course, then he's locked into this, and has to dump this cursed blessing on some other poor sap, who takes a similar build in a later generation.
I love the challenge of Warlock Palidin. It's my favorite multi class.
Fiend pact is a hard sell, but Hexblade is easy, and offers a Greatsword pact weapon with similar features to the Dispater Mace. Easier sell to your DM, and you get the slight boost from Hex.
I think if you mix the language of the Abjure Enemy Channel Divinity for the Vengeance Paladin with Hurl Through Hell for the Fiendlock, you basically would have the Ghost Rider’s Penance Stare.
Personally I would have his warlock powers become progressively more unstable until they eventually turn off. BUT, I would introduce a new prospective patron into the story. Either a less sinister warlock patron (So he changes warlock archetype) or better yet a rival demon that wishes to see his current patron be toppled.
Oath of ancients + fey is so natural
Oath of conquest Paladin who is multi-classed with a Hexblade Warlock. A Paladin swore an oath to a god of evil, war or conquest to conquer a fallen kingdom and rule over it with an iron fist and power Ganondorf style. But during you campaign you lose a great battle and is forced to retreat and recover. You hide in a dark ruin or a cave and in your rage and shame for losing this battle awakens a slobbering cured sword or some other weapon who promises the power you need to reach your goal to be a ruler. Sorta like an dark version of excaliber. You accept the weapon´s offer, grabs it, free it from it´s seal and the weapon bonds to you and doom you are a dark version of king Arthur. Could that maybe be a good background story for a character?
I took this inspiration of this & let my race decide/create this dilemma... tiefling urchin from childhood, took the deal to give me the power to better my life & became his blade pack warlock "assassin" tiefling little girl who ppl overlook/don't fear... killed & robbed a Noblemen, thus am wanted... upon running away i finally trip over shrine, break down & ask for forgiveness/help from the gods shrine I see b4 me. He reaches down & cast all the "fiendish" influence/lineage from with in me transformation me into a opal tiefling & his paladin champion
Since I started D&D 5E my dream multi- Class character is a Paladin to 2nd level sorcerer the rest, my god the amount of smites per day. I would go Human v and grab hp boost feat or Hill dwarf so you could stay in melee combat.
RAW Kyle is right you can't take the powers away in the standard rules.
Welcome Kyle!
I've always been under the impression that the patron is more of a teacher than a power source. I imagine that you might be held back from leveling up, or you might be practicing your magic by yourself.
Love your channel! LEGO and DUPLO were built to work together.
Good video Kyle. You had a lot of good ideas there.
Aasimar Undying Light Oath of Vengeance Palalock.
Let's rock.
Warlocks are like Spawn. You make your pact, you have your "task" that the patron asked for. Now you have your power. If you turn against your patron, that's on you. But good luck gaining more levels as a Warlock if you fucked your Patron over.
The way I DM it is pretty simple. When you want to gain a level in Warlock, you have to make a new deal with your patron. You ask it for more power, you get a task to do (sometimes it's just a ritual you have to perform. sometimes it's a task you have to complete, etc). You don't necessarily have to do the task BEFORE you get the level, but if you don't do the task, then you won't be able to get your next level until you catch up. And if you turn against your Patron, that's just a risk your Patron takes to have an agent in the world.
Paladin warlock is not even weird now that XGtE brought a downright holy warlock patron: The Celestial.
I would have gone that the character was a undercover agent. And so he learned his Warlock because he had to. And then when he had enough info his Paladin clan moved in and arrested many of the warlocks, maybe one or two got away and are now hunting you down.
12:00 Intern Kyle - " ...it really spoke to me ... evil patron, but a good character "
In real life, he works for you guys. I think he's saying you're the monsters, he's the hero ?
another route you could go is not their God giving them a paladin power boost but another patron intervenes giving you the warlock powers back because they want your former patron dead either to ursurp their power or end an ongoing power struggle between the two
I play a 3 Paladin Oath of Conquest/ 1 Warlock Pact of the Celestial. I am a Lawful good paladin that was given additional powers to smite my lords foes. Very simple concept and I will never put more then 1 point into warlock as it was a one time deal with a servant of my lord.
ddb.ac/characters/4402230/oZLbrY
Rationalize? NE. A paladin that took an oath of conquest and eventually stumbled upon the means to contact an otherworldly being to attain more power.
I don't know Fiend Warlock/Oath of Devotion Paladin sounds pretty BS to me.
Vengeance Sure.
Depends on how you flavor it. I mean you dont have to sell your soul to be a warlock and if you are in a deal Fiends must abide by it. Law is their absolute.
True enough upon listening to the whole video. The flavor seems quality.
I say the greatest limiter on this is double smiting is a massive drain on resources.
Action Surge Competitive Nova round though
One Warlock I played with had the pact forced upon him as a baby/small child. Although his parents never told him that, "hey son, I got possessed one night and made a deal with a demon for you, ok?" So, he grew up thinking that he was 'special' like a sorcerer. He later became an Oath of Devotion Paladin to try and save his soul once he found out. Also, it was Out of the Abyss so the Demon Lord aspect really freaked the character out
if i was the DM, i would not let his warlock slide. he didn't argue it well enough for me.
I would have no problem with a fiend and devotion combo. you could do something fun like sell your soul but your paladin powers come from you double crossing your fiend, so you end up getting warlock powers by saying you're going to betray your god and paladin powers by saying you are going to betray your friend. the player would have to RP both sides well to not have their powers ripped out.
Warlock powers can't be taken back by RAW. You can house rule it but not everyone does.
Strip him and force the party to flee. New quest to become a divine soul warlock.
In the description, you should have written the Dragonborn's name, because it was kinda hard to hear.
This is really strange. I have a Paladin(Oath of Conquest) at lvl 15, Warlock(Pact of the Blade/The Great Old One) at lvl 5. I use him as a tanky intimidator casting magic and bashing skulls. He is also a Dragonborn(Brass cuz fire) named Rhogar.
that bow is so definitely him !
If your using UA the undying warlock works well.
what about the Celestial Patron?
Switching Patrons??
The bow tie and t-shirt combination is... a choice.
Hey guys, i started watching you a few months ago (now i constantly watch your videos), right after i was able to finally plat D&D for the first time (thanks). i have a few questions and i would like some help crafting a character for a new campaing (i had the concept of a magical archer) i wanted to ask where do i write to you? Here? or an email? or which is the best place to ask such a question. Thank you for your time and let me know! Also nice paladin warlock duality concept! hope to see more!
Here's the arcane archer pdf, that should cover the concept pretty well, you might want to take some stuff from the various versions of the ranger to make it work better as an archer.
media.wizards.com/2016/dnd/downloads/2016_Fighter_UA_1205_1.pdf
Easy alternative, move his fiend patron to celestial patron
the green orc skull shirt sir where might I find that item please. and with Xander's celestial pack warlock coming out Paladin/Warlock might get another look.
ArmorClass10.com has some of the best gamer shirts.
Nerdarchist Dave
The problem I have with Paladins in many games is the justification that they can only be LG. My current GM believes that the Paladin is supposed to be the same alignment as the god they serve because they are holy knights. I believe this is a better approach to Paladins because it allows Paladins to be used in a more general sense.
Justin Clowers The 5E has no such alignment restrictions as written.
If anyone tells you otherwise, it's a house rule and not RAW
You guys are freakin awesome
Oathbreaker pally to 11, pact of the blade hexblade lock to 5. Just try it.
Tiefling (Levistus MTOF) that gets +1 con and +2 car.
start as Paladin Oath of Conquest (some called hell knights getting powers from devil or demon lords)
then make a deal whit the raven queen to get more powers (warlock hexblade whit pact of the blade) :D
would go 6lvl paladin and 14 lvl warlock.
basically a shadow knight/paladin :D
if you read into the Oath of conquest paladin from XGTE some of them are called hell knights and they get their powers from the ruling devils or demons, but are shun by other paladins as they see them as going to far in their quest.
and the Hexblade is a nice melee focused patron.
or you can go healer pala/lock whit Oath of Devotion and Celestial patron :)
Where can I find the gameplay of the session talked about in this video? I'd like to see this character in action and how the DM interacts with them through the pact entity.
I'm pretty sure most folks rate the Pally/ Warlock as gold tier..i.e., "not in my game." I still don't think its nearly as OP as something like a Sorc/Warlock.
i Wish to do a paladin warlock...but I'm not sure what to do...
my idea is as character who have a celestial sealed inside himself so is like both his deity and patron...
I'm usure if go to hexblade or celestial warlock
Thoughts/suggestions for a paladin/warlock? (Vengeance/hexblade)
I think the god and the demon are fighting for the character devotion, and the DM should test his faith throug the quest.
Im the edgiest of the edgy and made a Fallen Aasimar Oathbreaker Paladin and am about to multiclass into a warlock xD for some extra edge lols
I like the idea.
I like it
Duplo does actually fit on Lego. By design.
paladin oath of vengens warlock of the raven queen
This is exactly my current character for Out of the Abyss. Paladin 6 (Vengeance)/Warlock 4 (Raven Queen, Tome). Such a fun character to play.
Hey, I was thinking of making a Fallen Aasimar Venge Paladin 6/Hexblade 2/Lore Bard X. He's basically a warchanter, with the flavor being that all his powers come from his war god (Ares or Tyr) and his angel/fey minions. He wouldn't see himself as abandoning his paladin beginnings, just delving into deeper magical mysteries to better complete his mission.
My question is, do people think this combination (mostly the lore bard part) works? Or is this too spread out and power-diffuse? He clearly misses an ASI, but the 2 eldritch invocations feel like a good replacement for the lost Feat. Do the bard spell slots make up for the lost higher level abilities of the other classes?
Hya Kyle!
Art Wood hey!
What warlock 'spell smite' is he talking about that he stacked with his Paladin smite?
Superman isn't awful, just because he's damn near unbeatable doesn't make him a bad character lol
Can the patron take the powers back or is it like ghost rider and he has to get you killed? Nvm u answered it, lol