The New MPC's DO NOT sounds as GOOD as Older MPC's???
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- Опубликовано: 8 май 2023
- Whats are your thoughts as for how the New MPC's sound? Leave comment Below! And Sorry for video quality I messed up some settings 😬
Article Link: sovltron.substack.com/p/no-th...
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ESPN presents- Akai: 30 for 30 😂😂😂
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 For Real!!!
@@BoloDaProducer Netflix or Amazon will be great platform to tell this story
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The Social Network movie
I have a theory, that the reason older machines sound fatter is because they are using 2 mono sources for stereo output as opposed to “stereo” sound sources. I think this creates like chorus effect but without the phase issue. The reason I say this is because when I sample into my iPad and use two mono sources instead of a stereo source I noticed it sounded a thicker even when a level matched them. I checked the phase and everything seemed good. Now it just a theory so don’t come at me lol
Can you make a short video for that? Would be interested in that take
this is definitely worth investigating
My clear verdict: I am soooo glad that the new MPCs do NOT sound like the old MPCs. Reason: While the old MPCs had "their sound" you were stuck with that special sound and had no chance to change it. So if you didn't like the 12bit vibe for example you were out of luck. The new MPCs sound clean and really nice and there are enough tools in the standalone MPC even to change the sound any way you want. If that's not enough, then get some outboard gear. The world is you oyster. That said you can change the sound to whatever you like. If you like the 2k sound so much, then f-ing get a 2k. If you like 60 sound, then get a 60. If you want analog sound, then get some analog gear. If you can't make your sound the way you like it, then think about getting some lessons on how to work with sound and how to process it. Such discussions are boring and don't lead anywhere imho.
preach brother!
I"m with ya. I'll take the clean sound. And then dirty it up depending on the project.
Class compliant USB means bring your own converters!. Plug in a Tascam Model 12/24 into USB and you get many channels with analog. Im sure Behringer could easily clone the 60/3000 amp circuit of old if there is such demand.
Facts
I agree with you. If you love the 2kxl sound, get a 2kxl. I did. If you love the 60 sound get a 60, and I will at some point. If you love the 3000 swing, get a 3000. I do and I did. More than complain about a MPC not sounding how you want, if you know which sound you like just get the one that has that sound. That ends the debate lol
It's a miracle that Akai even made stand alone units after 2009 . With the rise of DAWs and a long financial recession around that time , things could have turned out much differently . dawless for life SA
they just put the DAW in the hardware 🤷🏻 $$$$$$$$
STANDALONE AND DAWLESS ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT
@@miscmisc1023 if someone has a hardware only studio based around a modern standalone MPC, would you consider that Dawless? I'm not asking to challenge your opinion. I'm not sure if the MPC, running what's essentially the MPC Software in the unit, "qualifies" as DAWless
@@avace917 the definition of a daw is a digital audio workstation so the 2000 xl is technically a daw
@@miscmisc1023 interesting. I guess you're right. I always thought a DAW music software specifically with a computer meaning Mac or PC. Software that you treat like a multi track recorder. But just by definition, I can see why you view the MPCs as DAWs. I personally didn't up until now. Having said all of that, the newer MPCs (One, Live, X, etc) are definitely DAWs. I just never really thought of them that way. Peace
The Real House Husbands Of Akai
😅😅😅😅😅
I was an Engineer through the end of the Analog phase , into the beginning of the Digital Phase of music, from about 2004 to 2015....You notice the changes in sound , when you think of the Hardware production , vs the Software production.. Now speaking in terms of these Newer MPC Pieces of Hardware, you are correct when you say that , the Newer MPC's still sound better than the Software DAWS.... Its just that Analog Circutry ... The digital phase just won't create the same sounds as Analog... that Warmth of the Analog is just something else... In todays day its all about the Workflow that the people like... and I definitely get that.. hell I love it for everyone... .But that Analog sound is just "music to the ears" ... Prime example is the MPC 3000... you ask producers around the world who have worked with the 3000, and as an engineer, that 3000 was so much fuller than ALL the models... I could tell when a beat was made from a 3000 for a mixing session , before I added anything through protools.... I understand that a lot of the newer generation , might not have started out with the older hardware so they get a little hurt when told what sounds better.... and honestly its not to crap on what's out now... whats out now is respected .. it's just to give a bit of history
100% agree I have both the X and the 3000. It is not just the MPC it is the romplers and live instruments too... there is no way anyone can tell me soft synths sound better than a live Moog. When you hear the sound of the bass coming out the speakers the warmth just hits different.
Have to question this. The ‘digital phase’ of music started way earlier than 2004. Lots of records in the 80s were recorded digitally with digital sound sources. Every sampler ever made is a digital device. The 3000 has a lower bit rate and sampling rate than newer devices which gives it that crunch. To be fair, I’m sure the AD stage might be better quality than newer MPCs. But essentially anyone using ANY MPC is as ‘digital’ as someone using a DAW with an audio interface. There are different grades of digital conversion and that is what is at play in the difference between MPCs. The beatmaking process and the swing is different, but again this is all digital.
Had the 3000. Never thought it sounded better. Sounded good though. No sample time and Maschine is more convenient. If you are going for the exact same sound, OK. I don't get it though. It is the man and not the choice of machine.
I’ve been using Fl studio for 13+ years now, I’ve have had the mpc 500 for about 5 years. I’m definitely going back towards the older analog stuff
I believe that making the music at the time with what available is where the focus should be. Sound quality while can make the difference its still a lower level conversation to nit pick about.
This is what I don't get about all the fussing. The analog sound of the old MPC's was more about the technology that was available in that era. Most of those machines have 16bit converters, in our current age it would be a big step backwards to downgrade your converter to 16bit. I recommend that we all do our research on how to get the same feel.... with what we have. It's about noise harmonics.. once you understand that you can recreate it using plugins. Preamps, compressors, limiters the core of them contain a low level amount of noise on top of what they are designed to actually do. The plugins of today do a very good job at mimicking this noise. I would hate to see people go out and buy gear not really knowing what it does. Those 500 series modules are just as expensive when you have to buy 2 of them each to be able to run stereo. Also I think if Akai contracted with someone to upgrade the converters it's going to add to the cost of manufacturing the machine as well as licensing the tech for the converters. Akai is a business.... they are going to do what makes financial sense to be able to make profit. Adding tubes and circuits or even trying to downgrade converters to support that would be crazy expensive.
i dont think i use my MPC one like most people , i use it like a multi track tape machine , i bring in different tracks from the multitrack to make my music , to me it works great and i love mine , its helped me so much to create my music because i get the workflow , 3 albums in and 2 more on the way , i am not bothered about sample aliasing and bit rates , ill leave that to the hip hop guys , im just happy to have a machine that helps me create whats in my head and make some music
New MPC line is dope af. Period.
I remember when the 2000/2000xl came out, everyone was like "it sound cold/sterile/lifeless/bad". Then the 1000 and 2500, same thing. Then the 5000, then the 4000. Same thing, when they came out "they sound bad". Now people say the 2000 and xl sound warm?
Yoooooo. This is so true. They said the 2000XL was trash for 15 years 😂
2000 is a great box but it’s not warm .. it’s transparent
Akai seems to be focused on workflow, which I can’t lie the new line of MPC”s are much easier to navigate through.
To use the new MPCs for Me would not improve My workflow because I'd be using it with a computer and if I'm doing that then I might as well just stick the the MPK249.
@@HOLLASOUNDS that’s definitely a good point bro, however with a lot of the recent units like the MPC Live II or the X Or X Se you don’t need a computer to run them. The units have enough sounds to get you through gigs trust me. Nevertheless you make a good point and I love these platforms so we can continue these conversations.
@@jroane87 True but to Me the new MPC devices are no different then FL studio or Logic mobile they are full DAWs optimised for tutch screan.
Roger linn hasn’t touched an mpc since the 3000! People said the same thing 25 yrs ago when the 2000 came out. How it didn’t sound the same. Now people praise the “sound” of the 2000 and the XL lol!
So all those swizz beats records don’t “hit as hard” because he used a 2000xl?
Basically people are allowing nostalgia to hit them on the head. If you’ve been around this long enough you know it’s just people’s minds playing tricks on them.
The reality is all the records you hear are mixed on desks. You almost NEVER hear the true sound of any gear on a record. So whatever sauce you think is there is not really in the machine itself.
Mpc is about workflow. That’s the magic. And probably timing, how rigid it was compared to computers. But that’s about it.
Also, was roger linn responsible for the converters on the 3000? I’d imagine they just used what was around at the time. A lot of those parts are just off the shelf components. It’s not magic.
Facts, all facts!
I enjoyed the video. One of my thoughts was Ski comment "I do this for real" Because I have relationships with people who do do this for real I understand a little where he's coming from. It Still doesn't take a way the sting from his words. We all want to do this for for real. To either treated it as a hobby or being made to feel like hobbyist doesn't get us from dreaming to actualize reality. Many of us weather late in life or just starting out have to do what we have to do get what have. The pursuit has left me personally broke, non musically underdeveloped professionally, and very behind in life. I know to many talented people who are left broken that never got their break. Music aside I'm a brilliant political scientist with a Masters Degree from FAMU and people can't understand why I'm struggling. So here I am, after being a wanna be MC, manager, A&R making beats to beat down depression at 51 I feel defeated in life and all I have is music and Ski says "I do this for real" and it hurts. But is his right? The answer is yes.
I had people make beats for the on a casio sampler, 707, and four tracks, I remember when my friend taught me how to use MPC 3000 and gave the book and let me hold it for a month. I remember seeing cakewalk on the computer before windows. I remember going to studio's in NYC, Rockland and Westchester Counties in New York, So i know that sound Ski is talking about. The best I can do is the MPC Studio MK II you don't like LOL There is a lot gear shaming going on. If money wasn't an issue I have a 3000 and X SE. I think they are both dope.
Damn brother. I’m 47 pretty successful in the thing “I do for real”. Your post hit like a Mack truck. Stay up homie.
Sounds like you do this for real too. Just because you haven't attained the success or got the breaks, it doesn't change what's in your heart.
I got mpc 2500 from guitar centers a week after the release, and it was 2800 bucks with stock wack sounds. I still love it even though it's been on the shelf for years
What?! Robbery
Take it Back and buy an XL SE real real talk!
@Shekinah Multimedia Productions that was in 2005. I wanted the 4000 but it was out of stock and I couldn't wait
Bolo: Go get this MPC at zzounds, no credit check. Go get your dept bro. Everybody got debt now, just go get your debt.
You struggling and dreaming about beat making? Your daughter got to eat? You were just fired? no problem just go get your debt.
Because these units sound so DOPE. You CAN'T get this magical sound "coming out of those analog outputs" from just buying a laptop with a daw for a third of the price.
It's that magical cumbersome MPC workflow where you have to load samples in to memory instead of just dragging and dropping them into your daw that makes everything sound magically good. The actual pain in the SSA of the MPC workflow, waiting seconds to load a patch is what makes it sound so good!
The reason so many hits were made with MPC's is because that's what was available at the time. They didnt have cracked FLStudio, kontakt, omnisphere and such...
The reason the roger linn MPC sounded the way it did is because it was a 12bit sampler.
Don't get caught up in the hype.
I feel ya.. but you gotta look a both sides. I’ve used everything as stated in this video. My biggest hit came from Logic… but it took me a lot longer to get the sound I actually wanted. Hence, I had to run tracks through my mpc2500. However, we are making the track only took me eight minutes to make the beat. The workflow part was great, but the overall sound wasn’t. So I totally understand both sides. My thing is I’m fine with how the units sound and the workflow, even though I know that they could possibly sound better. But, I know that will come with an increase in price. You kind of feel what I’m saying?
Thx for the knowledge & keeping it 💯
Bolo Thanks for the article. Informative read. i agree with you about the sound of th mpcs, if you know how to use them doesn't matter which one you get. From floppies to larger media and color screen that's advancement.
I have the mpc key 61 connected to the mpc 4000 via midi. I use the 4000 as a drum sound module. This gives me the best of both worlds. Sound and functionality.
Dope!
Yessir. I use MPC LIVE 2/ ASR10/4000. 🫡
Much needed yt content
6:57 the mpc 2500 is well known for having the thin sound tho, it may have been different - but it wasn't one of the good sounding units (just OK sounding like the 500,1000 and the new ones ).
2500 midrange great low end… eehhh
It ain't what you use, it's the way that you use it.
As someone who's been buying MPC units since 1991, starting with the 60ii, which I still have, - along with my MPC 2000xl SE1, ASQ-10, S950 x2, S3200xl x2, S3000xl, S6000,
- I wouldn't say they "don't sound as good"
- more accurately, they don't sound as inferior.
As, it was the early days of digital music tech back then and the tech, components and proprietary chips used in each brand and model were still in their infancy,
- and that is where all the charm and quirks people like so much come from.
I have the ONE too, but only use it for stereo breakbeats, mostly, maybe some bass, etc,
- I try to use the internal processing as little as possible, and just use my outboard for colour.
The new MPCs' are essentially DAWs' wrapped up in their own controller and audio interface,
- and I don't see anything wrong with that.
If you want them to sound older, more lo-fi, I'd recommend using some lo-fi outboard,
- dbx 118 units are a good, affordable place to start...
_
MPC used to mean
- Midi Production Centre
Now it means,
- Music Production Centre
It's called logical progression.
_
Personally I think they should get some better plugins in the new machines, as most of the saturation plugins are pretty lame,
- that said, I do like to use the Grime Distortion, extremely subtlety,
- usually into an external VCA dbx compressor, usually a 1066, if I want more control, or a 118 > Roland graphic EQ > Drawmer DL251
- love to ALL, feel no hate
🔥🔥💪🏾💪🏾
Yeah, the reverb plugins are bad but there are plenty of other good ones in there to spice things up. Another couple relatively inexpensive outboard options are Electro Harmonix Platform compressor pedal or Zoom ST-224 to sample thru.
Great video Bolo. I've been using MPCs since the early 90s starting with the 60. I bought my first MPC in '97 which was the 2000. I still have and use it till this day. I have 2 of them. I plan on getting an X now that they are very cheap on the used market. I won't jump on the X SE. I definitely love the sound of my 2000. To me it just sounds solid.
Great video man, thank you.
Thank you my brother thank you! For the first time someone has finally mentioned a linear Arrangement screen. Hell yeah we needed that like 5 years ago!😂
word! well said Bolo
Get well soon my man 🙏
Shout out to all the other oldies (like me, lol) out there who remember programming in Basic!
Well I am ignorant of what the old MPC's sounded like. Maybe the new ones sound different but different does not mean worse. I am considering purchasing a MPC X SE. The sound differences between the X SE and the older ones means exactly nothing to me.
Your video is quite interesting. You have a good style and the audio is very good.
I think you should definitely purchase one because you are correct. The new MPCs are great machines and have moved their music production workflow into the modern arena where it belongs. If you’re not an audiophile who is grossly obsessed with sound like many of us old heads then you’re probably in a good spot. Lol. You will not regret your purchase and welcome to the Kingdom of Akai. 🙏🫵💯
Most definitely needed this Bolo I’m a Reason guy just thinking about going to the MPC
Look, the sound of a converter is based on the hardware design and filter tuning. Not the software. Akai could work with DA specialist like Neve, Dangerous Music or other high end companies. For the top of the line unit it would be really good.
The price would be crazy lol
Yes indeed!!
Please say it Louder!!!!!!!
If they did that you would be paying almost 7k to 10k for a mpc is it really worth that price tag
Black lion audio has a mod that upgrades the signal path of tbe MPC X that does just that
I knew this video was coming, especially after Ski and Sights live the other day.
No complaints over here 👍🏾🔥👍🏾
If akai and Roger could work it out, it would be awesome if they made a newer version of the 3000, 2000xl, and the 4000 minus some of the sounds I think everyone would be happy. I’m literally hunting for a 2000xl because I started with it and I know how hard drums sound coming out of it.
Roger Linn is an inventor and already said with the MPCs he been there znd done that. Akai ripped him off of royalties so unless is willing to cut that man a large check he wont even answer the phone. Mr Linn is different type of cat.
Nah, they'll still find sum'n to complain about.
@@thablackkat9905 Hey I'm trying to be positive... HAHAHAHAHA. But I know your right.
Man listen!!!! That’s a perfect scenario
I thought 💭 the 60 was the best ?
Dang it...kinda made the wrong corrections to my original comment....anyway, My brother still has my old MPC 2000XL...Man, back then, that thing was a monster. Still is. I asked him could I get it back from him...lol...he said, "You can come to town an USE it"!! 🤣🤣 being ol skool and getting back into music/the production side of it, I wanted to do something outside of my DAW (no knock on the DAW systems). Familiarized myself with the MPC, then bought a MPC LIVE 2. Used a drum kit from a "certain" producer (lol), in both the DAW and MPC. No effects/mixing or whatever. The sounds weren't just a little different, it was completely different (again, no knock on the DAW, mine will still get used....A LOT). But there was an obvious difference. There is also a difference in the sound from "my brother's" MPC 2000XL and my MPC LIVE 2. Production has come a long way, be it MPC or DAW. I sat in on a session with a friend, and his son is master on the DAW. Speeds up his work flow, yet still produces quality sound. Bu again, I am an ol head, I find my quality in pushing buttons, turning control knobs and TIME! I may never fit in this new way...but you can believe, that one beat I put out, will be worked hard, and every attempt was made to not sound like anything else or anybody lol. Mixing/effects/mastering...in the click of a button or touch of a screen!! Who would have ever thought.....LOL....Keep Pushing!!
When you use the MPC in standalone and when you use the MPC software with the MPC as controller/audio device, does it sound different? And when you use a different DAW, do you still use the MPC as audio device?
@@koraamis5568 In my experience, the beat comes out way more expressive in standalone mode. I always pass beats through UAD Masterdesk when in the DAW to fatter them up. The other day i made a simple beat in standalone and it was definitely louder and fatter.
@@PrimeGalvatron With DAW you mean the MPC in controller mode with the MPC software? or other DAW?
@@koraamis5568 I use the MPC 2 software. That's the DAW I use when using my mpc x in controller mode. From listening to EA Ski and others i started passing the beats through UA plugins and it does fatten the beat. I also use something called drums that knock when i record in Pro Tools to add that extra punch to the drums.
Making beats in standalone sounds better without using filters.
Thanks for the info
Great stuff. Yup, different gear sounds different…lol. I know people want to say different is better or worse.. I just go with different. That said, more important to me is what gears inspires me to make music most. I am actually one of those ppl that will run a mix through tape or tube gear to get vibe. So I sort of work around the sound limitations to get it the way I like.
MPC's are pattern-based sequencers which I prefer because I'm not a keyboard player or a guitar player or a bass player. I'm just a percussionist and drummer, and they finger drummer, that's why MPC's are so popular and that's why they were designed that way, if you want to record in a linear fashion, there are dozens of software sequencers that will do that for you.
Well said bolo salute! 🫡
I really enjoy everything u do from your music... sound... knowledge... teaching... delivery... who u r in front of the cam...your ear overall behind the scene is a talent u display ... im watching 👀 u
Also what people need to consider is that the older mpc where more meant more for drums and basic sampling like one shots and chopping But the new mpc’s are more open architecture which means a wide variation of users and producers . Which means the neutral sound will benefit more. It’s easier to make something sound gritty vs making something sound pretty…
Good, good word Brother Bolo…😎💯👍🏾
Technically, the sound of a machine is made of :
(phono preamp)
analog input stage
AD converter
clock
audio engine
DA converter
analog output stage
Now, if you compromise any of these aspects, you get a compromised sound.
Today's market is all about features and convenience over sound quality. Software has set a new standard in terms of features and convenience that is hard to compete against with standalone machines, especially if you need to build them to a price point.
So, new Akai products look like a compromise : features and convenience (still not as fully featured as computer softwares) in a dedicated machine that has an OK sound (but still not as good as high-end audio equipment).
I like the Ensoniq ASR-10 for its fatness and dimensionality, the MPC4000 for its punch (and timing) and analog gear in general for its sonic texture. Now, nothing can touch software in terms of features and convenience. So, I'm trying to use each machine for its strenghts.
But an all-in-one 1k USD MPC cannot be without compromise, I'm afraid...
Your opinion means allot Bolo thanks. I think I will need Both just to have a piece of History from Legendary producers in the game and the new one in celebrating Akai's long journey and new producers also growing up in this new tech era. I'm excited to see what people will come uo with next when creating music in these new machines.
I use Reason and My Hiphop uses devices in there that basically copy the function of Akai samplers.
Tube amplification for a more warm, rich and full organic sound might be the solution. I personally think the MPC sounds fine. I think I’ll give my tube amplifier theory a try.
E A Ski gave advice in his interview about stuff through a 500 series preamp and compressor if using thr newer units. Might be the same effect as a tube pre? Not sure if 500 series usually have tubes in them.
@@SixteenVoice Notice Tube pre amplifiers price point compared to solid state pre amplifiers. The Vacuum Tube is the sauce. It’s where all that warm saturation comes from. Tubes themselves I just found out are hella pricey depending on the type.
Back in the day, a friend of mine had a Korg ElecTribe ESX-1, it looked kinda cheesy, but it had an adjustable valve stage in its audio path that sounded excellent, it made the percussion sound much more full sounding. It came fitted with 2 Electro-Harmonix 12AX7 tubes. I always thought this was a really cool idea, and it's the only time I've ever seen this kinda thing in a sampler before. I honestly don't know why more modern, high-bitrate digital gear couldn't include this sorta thing in the signal path to warm things up a bit. Plus, 12AX7s last for ages and aren't that expensive, around $38 for a pack of 4.
@@Rr0gu3_5uture it might be a matter of manufacturing. All I know is that these days I’m seeing more and more analog emulation done extremely well to the point that you may want to consider holding on to that $2000 and just download the $35 emulator. Tube compressors etc. Besides you get instant recall of parameters and potential automation.
Tube amp on the way out not the way in … glorious doing this this on my 12 bit sample racks .. enhances the grit
The issue is both in the program/software code and the lack of quality tube-amps and converters. This Friday , when I get to the main studio, I’m gonna be running a test on the MPC Live 2 connected to the ioStaton 24 as an external sound card and (it basically has +$1000 amps) better amps then on any MPC. If it all works out, there should be signaificant sound improvements and hui control fader support. I also find the RCA IO on the Live 2 to be muddy so I’m goin to either use midi or usb. If it works ill implement it to the Force.
Shout out to u bolo.... shid.. u let me rock out on that same mpc2500 in yo capitol Ave studio.. I went and got one the next week... still got it.
🔥🔥💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
👍🏼 well put up with
😂 well put 👍🏼
Bruce Forat put me up on game about the whole situation between Roger and Akai, also people don't know that Bruce Forat played a huge part into the Linn Drum my 4000 sounds better than my live however I'm a engineer 30 years in the game compression and EQ lower the sample rate in the live and can get a simular sound If I want to go back to the 90s I still have my good old Ensoniq EPS 16plus. If I want to go back to the 80s I got to my Behringer 808, 909 clones
To clarify per Roger Linn himself "30 years ago, software (program) had nothing to do with sound because the internal computers weren’t fast enough to process sound in real time. So sample playback was handled by a custom chip that played and pitch-shifted sampled for 16 bit playback." So, programing did not play a role in the sound.
Bro you was greedy with those chicken wings....that's was had happened 😂
Yeah, he needs a couple, cause he's a big boy. I never ate such things. 🤞
Akai could sell an outboard package with pre amps, EQs, converters from the older units for those heads that want that sound, or an MPC XXL that comes with it or smth lol
Roger Linn should make a new drum machine.
I think he has… just hadn’t gotten traction yet
He has the Linnstrument. It's dope.
He needs to remake the 3000
@@BoloDaProducer that linnstrument is not something oli would buy. More specifically a drum machine
@@JEFFMAN90 remake with what changes?
i used to produce all my music on a korg micro sampler , it sounds different to my new stuff on the MPC , its not worse its just different , samplers use different software , so its gonna sound different , i dont need arranger mode , i like the live feel of bringing stuff in from multitracks , like a conductor
Wow I was using gw basic to program games as a kid also. That’s what’s up 💪🏾
Thanks for this video. Good thoughts.
And yes, the new MPCs need a linear song recorder mode.
That Sight and Ea Skit conversation was dope
Yes it was
It would be dope for you to get Roger Linn on here
technically, the real reason why the newer MPC's sound different to the older models is not only because of the electronic components (mainly capcitors and resistors), but also the quality. some people will tell you that the 2000 sounds different or "warmer" than the 2500, because the 2000, 2000XL, and 4000 were the last models made in Japan before Akai Pro was taken over by Numark/Alesis who started making the 1000, 500, 2500, and 5000 (and subsequent models) in Taiwan/China. these newer models (X, Live II, One, KEY 61) use cheap micro-smd components to reduce footprint and production costs.
are the relative cheaper components from today not better than the pricier ones from the past?
@@novalogue Depends on your definition of better. Better could mean more transparent, i.e no harmonic distortion, no noise and therefore less character.
@@callum-testing5064 We are talking about electrical components
@@novalogue Not sure what that means. Components add to audio properties, and specially analog gear.
It’s the sample/bit rate
BOLO i always watch your videos but never sub ... today i did it because of your mindset... Thanks for the positive vibe .
Thanks!
Great!!!! Video!!! ❤️💯👏🏾👏🏾 there definitely needs to be an Akai Movie 🎥 🍿 I agree ☝🏾!!
But mpc heads knew that.. I was there...linn only had something to do with the 60...62...and 3000....the2000s and 2000xls used to get dissed back in the day because they sounded "thin"...it's funny to me the love they get now for that same sound.
Pete rock and Marco Polo. Make magic with the 2000xl
Akai need to get with Rossum because the original sp1200 and the new Rossum sp1200 souds the same
Truth is, every generation of MPC sounds different from the last.
I remember starting out on a 60 Mk2 and not liking the sound of the MPC 3000 at first as my drums sounded compressed and bright.
I later adjusted to it and then hated the sound of the MPC 2000/XL when they came out…
Bolo you brought it Mane. Appreciate Your love for the game and The MPC World to me The 3000 was King Analog tech vs Digital tech. Thanks Bro.
What up my G? 🗣Bolo
Love you Bro and your perspective. I'll be honest, I was only able to listen/watch for about 6:32. Mainly due to your situation after eating the flats. But also because I was listening with my studio headphones on (AKG Open-backs)
Hope you get well soon ✊🏽
Thanks!
I have owned a Roger Linn made 1989 Akai Remix16 unit for 4 years now. The circuitry in that machine emits a phat, warm, thick, full analog sound because of its superb converters and bit rates of 8k, 16k, and 32khz and all metal chassis. i sample into this then I place those samples into my Akai MPC Renaissance...BOOM ! Now I have incredible sounds in an incredible workflow controller for beats, sequences, and songs! The Akai Remix16 was $900 new back in 1989. Try to find one used now...very rare. The older producers are keeping these in their studio because of its sonic pallette.
here's my opinion. Back in the late 90s early 2000s I was using Fruity Loops. I was sending demos everywhere and getting crazy response. But one major reply was you should get better equipment cause these beats sound thin! I was able to land a in-house production gig with Jim Jonsin and the first thing he did was tell me to stop using that program cause the kicks and snares SOUND wack. He gave some of his samples and I loaded them up in Fruity and the beats were good but when we played them back in the monitors they didn't SOUND good. We had to go back and try to redo a lot my tracks with the MPCs... Fast forward to now and FL Studio isn't a factor anymore because like Bolo said, the consumer doesn't care about that any longer. I've sold demos that I did back then on Fruity because the artist said the track sounds bad ass. We usual go and run it through some other plugins to get it to sound FAT and WARM. Every generation onward doesn't know what the others before them enjoyed so what they have is enjoyable. McDees burgers used to be tasty and actual beef but the consumer just want a fast burger so there went fat tasty burgers. Same for music, consumers who dont know what a FAT TASTY beat sounds like, they just want to make beats fast and quickly so there went SOUND.
💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
Bro.. I Lived a similar story!! My name was "Roc" or Roc the Producer. .back in the myspace days or a little after. I was signed to Producer SEVEN AURELIUS and his UMG imprint 700 was set for distribution. I did records for Ja rule, Cassie .. Demos with Some BIG pop stars back then. Worked with Donnie and Dirty Money ect.. SEVENS secret weapon back then was his MPC 4000. I would send my stems to him and get the SAME response. "What are you using roc?" " The track is bangin but the sounds are THIN" Even his engineers would say the same. That's when I got the MPC 60 2 for Drums. It made a HUGE difference. this was 2007-2012 I was working with him. 2013-2015 I was working with Ben Mahadi and Mike Caren over at Atlantic UPG getting some really really good feedback on my records... After a year of not getting enough placements, I hung it up. These were the days when producers were getting Pub deals left and right..lol The MPC for my bottom end and drums. Got me noticed for sure.. Sound does matter..
@@electrowayne2918 #FACTZ!!
@@electrowayne2918 😂 Roc?! Do you remember me? We used to chat back in the MySpace days wowww. I don’t remember much but it was crazy reading your story just now. You never know who’s up in these comments lol hope you’re good!
Now you’re about to have me drop an instrumental album called “Fat and Tasty Beats! 😂😂😂
Dope video! Can you talk about some of the tricks and trades you referred to @20:00? I just copped a Live 2 retro and would love to see how you kick it up a notch.
Use the filters and eq on ya drums
Bro I've been using the MPC Renaissance since it came out. I preferred it to my 2000 XL but I wanna try the 1000
I would watch that MPC movie.
Me too
The 3000 seems to be the king of Akai sound
I have a mpc X and mpc 3000 and I have to say this…. My MPC 3000 sounds better. It is because of the electricity from the analog circuitry…. It sounds fuller…to me. That being said I agree there is something about mpc vs any computer it just sounds better…
I have a 3K and a ASR-10 and will never get rid of them. But I can use the modern MPC to trigger and older units. To me that’s the best of both worlds!
Better components but I do understand Akai’s business model
@@dccarsonmusic That is what I basically use it for and sampling
Akai should make a limited run Of these newer units with the conversion that has the sound some of use want..may be team up with Black lion audio and make a small batch of let's say 100 and see how fast they move.. that would give akai some data and feed back on how to move forward...
Yes but older MPCs can't handle 808 subs like the newer ones.
The new ones don't have any character when you sample or import files. They are neutral you need to season the meat before cooking with it.
I had two 500 mpc one 1000 mpc and yes i had jj work flow is slower didn't really like them but Hits hard but the new mpc are great you have a computer in the box it what you do with them👍🏾
Great information as usual! Sorry about the chicken wing injury bro, I've had a couple myself 😂
Man…that chicken wing did me dirty 🤣
You can definitely run the the new units through other stuff to make it sound proper.
This all day 🙌
Pretty much - we have to LOL
this is suppose to be a standalone you shouldn't have to use different gear to get it sounding "right" the older mpcs didn't need all might as just use a DAW.
@@taylorstep8135 Standalone just means you don't have to use a PC & even the older MPC needed other things since they didn't come with sounds or many FXs if any, so....
There are great interviews with Roger Linn out there about the MPC, both articles and videos. I can highly recommend them.
Post them please!
That article you're referring to has a link to an interesting interview about swing and timing on the MPCs. For videos, a google search should automatically get you there.
Good!
Great video.
100%, a great song recorded with a jank setup is going to be better than a bad song recorded in the best studio in the world. Everything after having a great song and a ~decent recording is a just refnining and playing a "game of inches". Its good for sure, but the icing on top ain't the whole cake.
Would like to see something like an audio analysis of white/pink noise waveforms A/B'ed across a MPC3000 and MPC-X, simple drum pattern timing analysis comparison, etc. Its easy to put on the rose colored glasses and just "remember" my 2000 sounding better than the Live 2, but how much of that is real science, and how much of that is just my emotions and nostalgia?
One of the Reason guys did this kind of waveform analysis, frequency analysis, experiment with his old SP awhile ago and it ~basically came down to adding some EQ, adding some noise, and lowering the sample bit depth, and his Reason combinator quickly had a very similar sound to the SP.
Very good points. That would be a great experiment. Something like how Paul Third or Dan Worrall expose plugins snake oil. AIR Lofi, Flavor, Filter can achieve similar results (find a good fx chain sampling in). Also setting default drum/keygroup program filter to 8pole lowpass.
Thank you for the video Bolo. I would love to have and MPC 2500. I like the set up on it. Reverb has the 3000 and 2000 both for over $4000 each. I am very happy with the MPC X SE. I am getting a great sound and love the workflow. I think for me I have to have both great workflow and great sound. I think the MPC X SE has that. I have used an MPC 3000, I definitely do NOT I like the work flow. How is it working with the MPC 2500?
It's amazing how everyone, including myself, constantly looks for warming software and hardware for modern equipment. We definitely trade convenience and workflow for sound quality, and the few pieces of hardware that do a good job of balancing both are out of many of our price ranges.
Reason sounds great to Me.
@@HOLLASOUNDS I haven't used Reason in 10 years or more, so can't comment either way.
@@verbone Come back to Reason, it's got all the old classics and new stuff, I make somthing cool sounding every time I open it.
@@HOLLASOUNDS Man bruh, I believe you, but no way I'm paying for another DAW/music suite. And my wares days are long behind me.
Yo Bolo this is off topic but, they just dropped logic as an app for the iPad. Thats Dope as hell
I know I got meeting on that today💪🏾
That’s dope, cubasis gotta watch out
I have an MPC 5000, Force and MPC Live, but I make house and synth pop, so I don’t think it matters to me like it does the hip hop folk because I know you have to have a certain spark to your sound…..but I can tell you I love your video and you have the best a great voice, so we’ll worth watching.
According to Andy Mack there is an arranger he has video on it and you can do some type of Linear action in song mode
I did a video on that years ago, I’m not sure but I think mines came out before his
I Agree and disagree, we music producers want the mpc's to have a soul! A modern update to the converters. I am hesitant on getting this new MPC SXL due to the sound quality just like the MPC Ren. The Sound the older models have made studios explode when I played my beats, I was a novice at the time. I got multiple placements on the spot. We like the Sounds (vst's) and added sample time but its harder to sell beats and get placements. I owned a Mpc, 2000, 1000, 5000, Studio 1st gen, MPC Touch and MPC XL. Keep the extra instruments and give us the Sound Quality and Character for the price. I paid $2500 for MPC flagship 5000 in 2008.
Everybody wants cheat codes!!. They want to turn on a MPC, load their thin ass drum sounds, and feel good about the sounds without learning anything. What we get now is a bit more transparent. So much so that you have control over how it will sound coming out. But no one wants that. They want Akai to color their sound for them.
I've been thinking the same thing ever since the arguments about sound quality had been stirring up these past so many days. Cats, who have been spoiled by the older models, want the newer MPC to do all the work instead of doing whatever freaking and tweaking they need to do in order to get a punchier sound. These are the same cats who had to make classic older models do what they do despite their respective limitations. It's like they lost that drive to work around a machine's limits in order to get whatever desired effects they are aiming for.
I HAVE THE X AND I LOVE IT!!! I'M NOT A GEAR HEAD, SO I DON'T BUY SOMETHING BECAUSE IT'S THE NEW THING... ALSO, WITH ALL THE VST ENHANCEMENTS FOR SOUND, IT'S UP TO THE PRODUCER/BEAT MAKER TO MAKE GOOD MUSIC... FOR DRUMS, MAN DIABLO BY CYMATICS WILL HAVE YOUR DRUMS BANGIN'!!! DON'T SLEEP ON THE MPC SOFTWARE.. LEARN IT!!! TRUST ME, YOU'LL BE GLAD YOU DID!!!
My take on this is that in my opinion I do believe the older units sound better but its not just the programming that makes that happen but also the components inside the box. The transistors, the capacitors and all the stuff on the main board of the older units also played a HUGE part in the way they sound. Roger Linn himself has been out of the equation since the 3000 and was not involved in any version after which includes my beloved 4K and 2KXL but.... the components within those mainboards aren't the same as the 3K or 60 (which I also owned) hence why both machines sound different.
At this point in time it would be foolish for Akai to go back to trying to mimic an older device because of where technology is today currently. When you take into consideration the cost of parts, labor, manufacturing and all that would have to go into the production of a unit like that ...the cost would be to great for the consumer and they know that. Technology and features is what the current ask is as you said and another great point you made is that the consumer base is getting younger not older.
In the end as you said this is about the final goal which is the music. I do not dig people getting robbed and their intellectual being taken from them (has happened to myself as well) so I believe they need to come to an agreement with him (Roger Linn) and make it right seeing that its under new leadership now because the reality is that Akai has no flagship device and doesn't exist without him. Have they proven they can continue without him? ..yes..have they made great products without his input?...yes...could they continue to do so in the future? ...yes but......all that was hinged on the 2KXL being a success and frankly if it hadn't been Akai might have died a long time ago...
Just my thoughts.Great topic as always 👍🏾
Nice point!
my boy Bolo went to 240 p lmao love your channel keep doing your thing.
Lol my bad… I was trying something new and messed up
@@BoloDaProducer its all good , i would tune in if it was just the audio ! peace and love Brother .
I really like this video Bolo because you made some really great points/observations.For us old heads and true audiophiles, there are obvious areas that we will focus in on as it pertains to sound.
1. The older units do have better hardware for more accurate and hard hitting sounds and truly did line up with Mr. Linn's original vision. Akai does owe Mr. Linn an apology though and maybe some money (in my opinion).
2. The new units have the advantage of workflow, plugins, speed, storage and so forth and definitely target a younger audience of up and coming producers. Akai is a business and wants that money - we all know this - they got my money - many times over LOL.
3. I think your analogy is spot on when it comes down programming languages and the inability to copyright or patent code and when you alter or flip the code - it becomes an original piece of work.And whoever makes those "code" changes owns it.
4. So, my question to you and the rest of the community is this .... shouldn't that apply to samples when we chop and drop? Musical notes are like code. If we rearrange them and make something brand new - shouldn't it be our "new" creation? Musical notes can't be copyrighted or patented, right? At the end of the day, if you make digital music, you are essentially altering 1's and 0's - it's binary - it's all computer code. Hmmmm ... Let's talk about it.
I feel ya but the dna of sample will still be in code, that’s why that new google thing can find samples even if you chop it less than a sec while being time stretched and pitched. You can cop up a chicken in as many pieces as you want, but when you eat it, it’s still chicken lol
@@BoloDaProducer and I love me some chicken 🍗 😂
The real solution is acknowledging that IP and copyright aren't actual things. And the real solution is to do away with them. But people don't wanna hear that argument
@@K4SET Bruh - I’m hearing you. Trust. 🙏
Copy write for music works differently since their is the composition and the recording element to factor in where as code really has no ownership. This is the reason why you can copy a prompt and paste prompts of chat gpt yet people will sell access to a custom prompt as a loophole for not owning the prompt. With music there was always the ability to recreate a composition to sound as close to the recording as possible but even that is a violation of copywriter infringement which prohibits the right to copy and has nothing to do with sales. Code is also more based on logical and pragmatic approaches and thus harder to copy-write but its easier to copy write components that have a specific function (such as AR heads up display) just as long as your going to go to market with it. Not going to market with copywriten ideas negates its protection. In a nut shell Musical copywriters have two layers of protection (the composition and the recording rights) where as any one can come up with code to solve a problem and thus is harder to copy-write or to protect or prove its uniqueness, which is why you have so many open-source communities in coding but not so much in the recording space as ownership of the modular parts of a composition/recording rights makes it a daunting task.
MPC The Movie... I'll buy tickets! 🎬
Stabbed by his own chicken wing. That’s some gangsta chicken
Mane! It was bad 😬
BOLOOO!!!!! I liked everything about this video but that hat! 😂😂👀 but fr tho, thank you for the video. I agree man. Use what you like, just make the music.
Man Im still amazed at the Mpc live 2. I used to have the 2000 and 2000xl, I love my Mpc live 2 its the truth. As far as sound that's apples and oranges but outboard gear and conversion got that. but I'm secretly digging that ISLA 2400.. maybe people are referencing the swing if any but sound ..no.
The 2400 looks dope! It’s gonna get efx and analog converters.
With the work flow!! Imagine if Roger Linn got involved!!
Hey I think this is a great video and a great perspective I think the real winner and all of this is Akai they get the publicity and people looking into older mpcs
even the old rack units are included in this convo ...they sound fire s950 s2800 s3000 s3000xl pitch stuff down on these old units its magic
Dude, an MPC movie would be wild. Heck yeah.
Lofi plug-in plus the mpc emulators plus the air flavor pro = old school sound