Anglican Unscripted 800 - GAFCON IV: What REALLY Happened
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- Опубликовано: 4 окт 2024
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Anglican Unscripted is the only online video newscast in the Anglican Communion. In each episode, Kevin Kallsen and Canon George Conger bring you their unique prospective on news around the globe.
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I watched most of the conference, including the interviews. It was most interesting to hear the Global South Bishops. Arch bishop James Wong said that constitutional matters need to be voted upon and rewritten before a merger of Gafcon and GSFA. Archbishop of Brazil said Lambeth will disappear in the future.They are talking about divorcing Canterbury structures, but it is a matter of timing. Archbishop Wong said 5 months for his own Synod to meet to vote on the matter. Keith Sinclair was fantastic because he made clear the feeling of sadness and betrayal in the Anglican Church, and really, a very sad story to pretend to uphold the sanctity of marriage (Lambeth 97), while actually secretly undermining Canon law. Gafcon said that Archbishop of Canterbury and Lambeth are no longer relevant. A new structure could take some time. That was my take on it!
We need to not vacate the Canterbury situation. What needs to be done, is put an Archbishop in there who will stick with the scriptures, and nothing else besides his/her pastoral care for his or her sheep. You still need a leading archbishop in the UK, and also not a woke version.
The church in the UK will just go further left. They will have full marriage liturgies for gay couples and like the US renaming services written for trans people who change their name. There will be a remnant of Western churches that persist.
I can't bring myself to move to the ANCA and I don't think I can stay in the Episcopal Church. Maybe there is a moderate Lutheran church somewhere near where I can worship. I pray for all of us, please pray for me, I feel lost.
@@MilwaukeeWoman there's great variety in the ACNA, so please don't write it off without looking into a few dioceses that seem most like what you're hoping for.
@@jefformargaretbeaird8917 Sadly most of the bishops in the C of E have abandoned the teaching of the Bible. We don't want a giant schism in the C of E but I would prefer that to pretending any longer that we are walking together with the likes of Justin Welby, Stephen Cottrell and Sarah Mullally, all of whom appear to have abandoned their ordination vows to " banish and drive away all erroneous and strange doctrine contrary to God's Word; and both privately and openly to call upon and encourage others to the same".
I was watching Dominic Steele’s “Heart of GAFCON” coverage and I’ve got to say, when I saw George on the panel I got irrationally excited!😅
George, I am sure all of your supporters were delighted that their donations enabled you to take this trip to Kigale and make such an eloquent and incisive report. Well done dear brother, you have done well and I am sure we all agree it was a worthwhile expedition.
Waiting for a church to collapse can take a long time. Look at TEC-these organizations have seed corn they can eat, assets they can liquidate at a quarter of their value for cash flow, banks that will give them zero interest loans, etc.
So sorry for your loss Kevin, you’re in my prayers 🙏🏼
I’ve just paused to pray for you Kevin as you grieve. Warmly - Dominic.
Nice that there’s more going on than just another communique. Sounds as God was leading. Praise God!
Good episode.
At last! Been wondering where y'all have been!
Absolutely love you guys and yes what you said is true: we sit here watching and listening to you. and we feel like we are in the same room. It's a joy! What stuck in my mind in this episode is what you said about whether or not the Holy Spirit is present..... I am going to think about that a lot, because it applies to all situations in life. It is the best ever yardstick. Living in a distant part of west Wales, Fishguard, if one hopes to fit neatly into a particular religious niche, it is a lost cause. So how to handle that? Ah, the presence of the Holy Spirit.....
I speak as someone born in Scotland, baptised in Minneapolis (when visiting a most Christian american grandfather); given no religious influence, but rather finding my own way as a child - an undefinable draw to the church....All in all, no neat categories! A despair at the woke church in the UK, even worse in Wales.....without the Holy Spirit, this could all get seriously confusing😊.So what you said, about:it is the Holy Spirit which makes a church real, etc - that is really nice and helpful.
Thank you so much, you lovely guys❤
New to this channel; came through searching for something on GAFCON 4. Most enjoyable and informative. Thanks!
Welcome back!! I actually missed this podcast. Thanks for keeping us updated
what amazing news. YOU GUYS ROCK!!!
Congratulations to Calvin Robinson!
Nice to see a new episode. Sorry for your loss, Kevin.
So positive. Thank you.
Welcome back!!!!!
Thank you for your insight on GAFCON.
GAFCON if managed properly according to God's work, is a breath of fresh air...so far so good since it's inception.
Watching from Victoria, British Colombia, Canada, where my daughter is ministering in an ANIC/ACNA church.
Your daughter's ministry goes against the Global South's view of the gospel. I hope she's trained in other work so she has income when she's replaced with a man.
Thx guys, been waiting for this wrap up.
God bless you, thank you
George's description of Stephen Cottrell as a theological lightweight is absolutely correct. It doesn't help that he served his curacy in Southwark diocese, which is notorious for its favouring every sort of teaching that opposes God's Word. He was appointed at Welby's behest to make Welby look almost orthodox by comparison. It doesn't help that Welby is just a 2nd-rate Shell manager, while Mullally is a 2nd-rate National Health Service manager, but neither seem to be faithful shepherds of their flocks. Thankfully a few CofE bishops are still orthodox (like Andrew Watson).
I learned this week that tucker carlson was raised episcopalian. He mentioned it in his heritage foundation speech.
He mentioned, in that speech, his dislike of the direction that denomination has taken.
Congratulations on episode 800! Great wrap up on Kigali! I watched as much as I could. History will tell where G 4 lies in the rank of Church councils! This is a major council. Let’s see what the Holy Spirit does with it!
I agree with gafcon that we need to repent, but I feel they didnt say what we need to repent from. It clearly is the sin on allowing women to be priests and bishops, so unbiblical. I feel even this show doesn't make a hard stance against this evil. How are we going to fix this if we never talk about this?
Correct, the hosts try not to reveal their personal views on this topic. Problem is, it's a global issue.
@@marmeemarch7080 I agree. I feel like the issue isn't talked about enough though. It's hardly ever talked about on this show for instance, and it's clearly the biggest sin in our camp.
Absolutely
George, you mentioned early in the show those who struggle for resources in certain countries... do you have any preferred charities that people could donate to?
1. Welcome back, there's a lot going on that your fans are itching to hear some unscripted comment about, God willing.
2. GAFCON IV reminds me of DEFCON 4 (a defense ready condition level): Above normal readiness characterized by an increased intelligence watch and strengthened security measures.
3. I agree, before singing the Gloria, it's best to intone the Kyrie Eleison.
4. Having Kigali's road signs in both English and a native Rwandan dialect in a formerly French speaking Belgian colony is in direct reaction to the genocide where the Francophones attempted to exterminate the Anglophones. Particularly egregious was the failure of clergy to place the common good over tribal loyalty, as well as the later acknowledgment of complicity by the French government.
5. In response to Archbishop of York Stephen Cottrell's GAFCON speech prioritizing feelings of love in spiritual discernment, I'm with Tina Turner who sang "what's love got to do, got to do with it?"
6. However erudite and prolific the former Archbishop of Canterbury Rowan Williams was during his time of office, he appeared to be in favor of antidisestablishmentarianism.
7. To placate any offense to Gavin Ashenden, I recommend that members of the UK Anglican Ordinariate (A) make their own pilgrimage to Rome, (B) have an audience with Pope Francis and then (C) receive permission for their clergy to celebrate Holy Mass in the Basilica of St. John Lateran as befits their status of communion within the Catholic Church.
8. Oh, and by the way, warden Strother Martin's famous line in Cool Hand Luke was presumed to take place in a FLORIDA prison camp.
I always look for your comments! Re: #5, yes, Tina Turner over John Lennon ANY day, and, well, this time I agree with ALL your points.
@@marmeemarch7080 Thank you. I am relieved that I do not come off as 'smarmy before Marmee' and therefore will not have to 'march to the gallows' a la Berlioz's Symphonie Fantastique. Time for tea!
About your point 5. Stephen Cottrell wouldn't be seen dead at GAFCON, let alone alive. He sees GAFCON as a little local inconvenience rather than the representatives of around 85% of world Anglicans. This is typical of the colonial attitudes common in the West which Cottrell is usually so keen to condemn.
As for point 4, Rwanda was a Belgian, not a French colony and Belgian colonists largely spoke French.
@@andysmith4158 1. Please permit me to quote from my original comment: "... a formerly French speaking Belgian colony ..."
2. Forgive my gaffe placing the Archbishop of York at GAFCON. Belatedly, as we might say here in the American south, "I reckon Cottrell just didn't cotton to that there conference."
3. And last but not least, "Wherefore, I abhor myself and repent in dust and ashes" (Job 42:6, KJV).
Thanks very much for your work and insight - glad to see you are back, but disappointed to realize that the comments section doesn't give George an adequate 'fix'! ;-)
Kevin, George, continue to boast in the Lord😉 Congrats on 800 years with RUclips.😁
ACC is consultative, not executive or legislative. There were no consequences for New Zealand when ACC told it not to re-organize itself into three parts based on ethnicity.
Hello from Verona, Italy.
GAFCON should have given the same ultimatum to the other bishops as a warning. Welby is gone, in the eyes of GAFCON, so should his like minded bishops working under him be. They too are abusing the scripture..well veered away from it.
The question I have is that how can we have evangelical mission when we don't have a church (of England) for newcomers to attend?
Form a house church that can be put under one of the GAFCon bishops? You have to be scrappy (American sense, not sure what a British would say) to plant a new church. You may have to spend several years at mission status before you're really a parish, you may have to rent space in a community hall and use battered folding chairs, and recorded music (I know a small parish in northern Michigan that uses recordings of great organs of European churches to accompany their hymns), you may have to find new ways to do everything, but I promise you, it's possible, and people who have done it are happy to share what they've learned.
The God of the bible is able to combine the attributes of being love _and_ righteous and morally pure. There can be no authentic love without the two latter attributes.
Ah, there you go, being all *Christian* about it. . . ;-)
Francis and Greg Venables both worked in the same geographical area and are best buds. I'm not surprised at Francis at all.
Waiting in Worcestershire England 🏴🏴🏴
William Joyce was born in America, but wangled himself a British passport; he was hung, because it was claimed, the passport meant he owed allegiance to the Crown.
Surely EGGS is a lay movement.
Their yoke is easy too ...
when George says 'Catholic purists' he means 'Catholics'. NO! NO! George...buildings and sacred vessels ARE Holy, Christians have held that for 2,000 years. a shame that the things of the Spirit are dismissed as 'magic'. the point missed here is that protestants are allowed to celebrate their liturgy in St John Lateran but the Traditional Latin Mass (the Mass of the Ages) wouldn't be allowed near. yes Pope Francis is Anglican...sigh. Taylor Marshall is rightly concerned that protestants are using the Sacred Vessels which contain the Body and Blood of Our Lord at Catholic Masses, George doesn't grasp that Anglican orders are considered invalid by us. And if Anglican 'theology' doesn't grasp that Churches are Holy and Sacred....well that seems to sum up Anglican 'theology'.....and 'yes' I'm a convert so I fit into George's theory!
Y'all -- which pope was it who gave the then Archbishop of Canterbury an Episcopal ring? And didn't +Benedict give +Williams a pectoral cross? IOW, didn't that horse leave the stable a while ago?
Pope Francis has forbidden Catholic priests or bishops from offering the Traditional Latin Mass in St Peters or St John Lateran. Apparently it's very difficult for Catholic Priests or Bishops from outside Rome to get permission to offer even a vernacular mass in Rome. That's the source of the anger, especially as Anglican orders are still officially "invalid" according to the Catholic Church. Why does Francis say no to so many Catholic priests but yes to an Anglican and a Copt? Many suspect a Freemasonic connection.
The Catholic Church is heretical and no way based on scripture.
For 2 reasons: On the Anglican Bishop; perhaps it was a miscommunication: They thought the group had been from the Ordinariate for dissent Anglicans allowed by Pope Benedict, or from people considering joining it. The Coptic is because of the current conversations towards full communion between the 2 Churches.
Oh yes, the secret masons, lol. 😂
@@MilwaukeeWoman He was a freemason but left it many years ago.
i found Gavin's commentary on this strange; it confimed me as an Anglican.
Thanks
The American Anglican Council is still doing great work. It's much more behind-the-scenes and boring, not shiny stuff to talk about like evangelism and missions. Canon Ashey is on a very short list of men for whom I'd like to buy a drink.
No re HTB guys. They are silent and although some clergy went to the London DEF mtg they never come out publicly on the gay issue.
Hadn't Gumbel's successor previously been somewhat compromised on LGBT issues somehow? That came out when he got the job? So, HTB being silent is no surprise. Such a shame.
47:23 English is the crème de la crème of languages.
George are you being funny. I love goat.
My impression is that Welby just cares about the coronation.
If every place is holy then no place is holy, for the vast majority of us. If every day is holy then no day is holy; we just aren't that good at practicing our faith in real time (and space). We need set-apart spaces and days to teach and help us to bring the sacred into the here and now. So, as a good Anglican, I'd say on the subject of sacred buildings, it's both/and.
Would it be correct to say that Bishop Keith Sinclair is a Central Churchman?
He is a member of the Church of England Evangelical Council for the Province of York. However his approach to worship may be described as central.
Is that a reference that we should all get a chuckle from?
Not at all -- I'd consider myself a Central Churchman but no longer an Evangelical (at least in the American context of the word).
The rejection of the leadership of the Archbishop of Canterbury after the C of E's vote to "bless" homosexual relations must have legal muscle. Theological muscle doesn't matter to Canterbury.
Greetings from England! Let me add some nuance re HTB. They are reluctant to jump either way on gay issues for 3 reasons:
- the congregation is split. Non-whites mostly lean traditional but some, mostly White British, lean progressive
- The HTB Network of churches is not unanimous on the issue
- They fear the effectiveness of their global mission through Alpha and other ministries will be diminished if they pronounce for or against.
I suspect that the ice-flows are floating apart and they will have to take a choice which way to jump. I think they need our prayers ‘at such a time as this’
Why is there an over 24 hour delay from the RUclips posting until the availability of the podcast. This 4/25 show became available less than an hour ago (4/27, just before 16:00 EDT).
Kevin will look into that.
people have to voluntarily?????
When you said that Lambeth 1998 "turned down the instruments of communion" what did you mean?
I thought you tube had cancelled ypur show.
I read today that the Church of England is celebrating people being single, on the grounds that what was good enough for Jesus should be good enough for them (singletons); that 'Jesus showed us it is no sin to be single'. I gasp!!! the crassness, the totally inappropriate - sacrilegious, I would say.....The Church of England, supposedly the centre of the Anglican world, referring to the SON OF GOD, as 'choosing to be single'. I have never heard such absurd, cringeworthy nonsense.
What you said, so succinctly, about emotionalism regarding Stephen Cottrell's sermon about love...this is even more inappropriate, it is taking the Divine, the mystery of God, yes God made flesh, but NO - not God 'choosing to be single'. Ridiculous, I would actually say blasphemous.
I wonder if those so celebrating would also celebrate Jesus choosing Jewish ethnicity? ...
What good news! So glad for this good gospel news! If there wasn’t a screen in the way, I would smother George in holy kisses!
Choose this day which Kingdom you will be zealous for………
Re Church Times. Legacy media lied about something? I'm shocked, shocked I tell you!
DEAR FRIENDS IN THE FAITH
WHY CAN I NOT FIND ANGLICANS UNSCRIPTED 802?
I DEPEND ON YOU FOR MUCH OF MYINFOMATION ON THE WIDER COMMUNION.
I MISS YOU.
JACK BIGGERS
NORTHERN MALAWI (RET.)
The breaking of Christian unity is a time of grief.
Obviously jesus was answering a question about divorce, same sex blessing does not come into it at all.
I see dog.
If gafcon wish to be a church it as to understand jesus, what he says must not be abused, and gafcon have to stop abusing those who read the gospel in love and not falsely.
The blessing is not contrary, but in line with jesus teaching to love .really what Gafcon assumes is sexual abuse, which of course is rife in the heterosexual community.
"The Gamaliel Test", George? [17:00] We will, indeed, see whether - what has just happened in Kigali - brings more people to Jesus of Nazareth, or puts even more people off him. After all, the same people meeting at Kigali have held sway over the Church for the majority of its existence, since Nicaea: and the contemporary Church Universal is failing to speak to "moderns" in any significant measure. Like you, I have complete distrust in those bishops (you mention Justin Welby and Sarah Mullally) who subscribe to Identity Politics and Globalist-Communism: but nor do I have any trust whatsoever in the ability of the Church assembled at Kigali to speak, and mediate LOVE and HOPE to contemporary people. The problem? 'Scriptural literalism'! Plain and simple. We have the critical tools available to us today to enable the Spirit to bring the person, and message, of that historic young male Jew to real life for today: but the Church assembled at Kigali eschews those tools. Yes, it is another "quest for the historic Jesus"; but Jesus-studies have never been finer; and we have a desperate need to get to the YOUNG MAN in whom the God of Israel was uniquely active.
Somewhere on the internet there's an Eastern Orthodox layman named John Granger who has written extensively and well on the Harry Potter books. He's brought up the four levels of interpreting Scriptures that the early Christians inherited from 2nd Temple Judaism. He applies them to HP, but we can go back to using them on Holy Scriptures. You might be interested in looking into that? I took the scenic route to wind up there, didn't I. . .
@@marmeemarch7080 Love that scenic route, though, Marmee. I'm currently ploughing my way through some David Bentley Hart: himself Orthodox. I was introduced to him by one of the three clerics on the RUclips post 'IRREVEREND'. Not yet sure whether he will add anything to the rather prosaic way I view 'scripture', though.
Repent and return to the Catholic Church. John 17:11 Holy Father, keep them in your name that you have given me, so that they may be one just as we are.
Why join the Catholic Church? As Fr George and Kevin point out, the Catholic Church is gradually becoming Episcopalian.
If you're Episcopalian, you can just stay put and the Catholics will join you.
Do you mean The Roman Catholic Church? Anglicans are Catholic and Reformed. The RC Church needs some repentance itself. This sort of trolling an Anglican page is not at all helpful.
@@johnhudghton3535 Yes, every person and every institution needs to repent -- as discussed in today's video, but within the confines of the one true Church created by Jesus Christ our Saviour. The Reformation and what has happened since in terms of division is scandalous, and what the Church of England has been doing for the past 30 years are just more fruits of the poisonous tree. The Christian Churches are unable to meet today's moral challenges because we are so terribly divided.
Not unless Rome repents and reforms.
The heretical Catholic Church. It is a superstitious idolatrous ideology. Get back to the scriptures.
What happened ! Who the hell cares!!
If you don't care, why the over-the-top reaction? Nobody forced you to watch this. Do you work for the Archbishop of Canterbury?
Kevin: Once you gave my wife a good recommendation for seafood. 🦞😋