The Ridiculous Nyck de Vries Saga
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- Опубликовано: 26 июл 2023
- This is a mess. A complete mess.
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#f1 #formula1 #nyckdevries #danielricciardo 
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he was fired so quickly that we didn't even have time to make him the butt of all our goat jokes
He did at least get a cruel joke name - Nyck Debris
@@digitaldeathsquid3448gotta thank sainz for that one
Engineer: Carlos, De Vries is on the road ahead.
Carlos: What? There's debris on the road?!?
@@HHPYE42 Nah, it's too obvious to attribute to anyone. Hell, even the autogenerated captions in this video do it.
There’s only one GOAT….
GOATIFI
Mazepin - gets a whole season
De Vries - Dropped after 10 races
Money talks.
Mazepin would probably been dropped mid season if he didn’t have money
And Mazepin was getting a second season if it wasn't for some men in Moscow
Well, money and talent
@@galactic_nerd-sk4747yeah, that’s the craziest thing to me, haas wouldn’t have gotten 5th in Bahrain
@@OumuamuaOumuamua Mazepin wouldnt have seen an F1 seat if he didnt have money
The issue was Helmut Marko seemingly being De Vries's only fan at Red Bull. In the F1 Nation podcast right after Ricciardo signed on to AT, Christian Horner said that he was never a fan of De Vries in the first place. De Vries would've been better off in the Williams and probably would've gotten a seat there if he wanted, but he wanted the challenge of being in the AT instead. Him getting only 10 races before being unseated is not ridiculously unprecedented or shocking in the Red Bull pipeline, when it's well known that not only are Red Bull drivers under so much more pressure than drivers on other teams, but they're not averse to relegating drivers after only a half a season in a seat. If you can't take this kind of pressure, you shouldn't drive for Red Bull. Even Albon has stated multiple times that he doesn't want a Red Bull seat and is staying committed to Williams. For some, the pressure is too much and they just cannot excel in those circumstances, and there's no shame in acknowledging that.
Williams never has plan to sign Nyck De Vries since they already prepared Latifi’s seat for Logan in the first place. Nyck got lucky because of Albon’s appendicitis but all Mercedes F1 seat are filled for many years to come. In the end he has to choose between another season of Formula E or Alphatauri seat aka only seat left. Helmet Marko probably thought that with Nyck De Vries having so much experience being test driver for the Mercedes F1. He should be able to fill in and compete with Yuki seamlessly from getgo but that isn’t the case. Replacing him with Ricciardo is sudden but I think their plan all along was to prepare and check if Yuki is worthy for Red Bull seat in 24-25 and it seems Yuki have won all rounds against Nyck.
This, I think, is it. Marko pulled a weird move hiring him on the basis of one race and essentially nothing else - but that's the devil's bargain De Vries entered into: Marko giveth, Marko taketh away. 10 mediocre races in a new (poorly performing) ecosystem within RB doesn't necessarily make him a bad driver all of a sudden - look at how Albon's grown since returning for a very, very relevant comparison - but that's what De Vries kinda bet on managing to avoid.
Marko is such a liability when it comes to RB's personnel decisions.
There is some validity in saying he could've not chosen the RB system, but if it puts such unbearable pressure on superme talents that they fall to pieces in half a year, and since this system has generated two (2) world champions in its entire history for all the great drivers that were binned off in the process... maybe the process needs reassessing. Marko has also repeatedly demonstrated a nigh-on sociopathic lack of interest in his young drivers as people on literally any level other than finishing results, which isn't how you get the best out of most people.
Nick did not come up through the RB Academy so their was nothing invested in him.
@@encinobalboa also an excellent point. Lawson has been fantastic for them and just seems to have a higher ceiling than De Vries. If he wasn't head and shoulders better than Tsunoda off the bat, he was gone by the summer break. I'm not sure a couple more races would've made a difference. An F1 seat is just much too valuable for a project they have no idea is going to pan out when there are a handful of drivers in the Red Bull Academy that are either ready for F1 like Lawson or are at least 8-10 years younger than De Vries and making steady progress.
Ironic how just yesterday I was watching your video on why Nyck deserves to be in F1 💀
In my opionion every f2 chamion need a seat in f1 for some time. But you have to think about HUGE red flag, when your team have no seat for you, but have for ohter drivers. Mercedes prefer Albon than Nyck.
@@mirvan23i wouldn’t say every F2 champion, because you see a lot of people who win only after years of being in F2 like nyck. i would every F2 champion who became champion as a rookie deserves a seat in F1 like Leclerc, Russell, and Piastri. that reflects a lot more than just winning F2
@@noxturne16 No, not rly. The only one champion who had no chance yet in f1 is the last one, so Felipe Drugovich. Rest was or is in f1 (like +/- 10 years). And the second thing, the cars are also not the same. Someone like Mick with piles of money and sponsors have no problem, as a avrage driver, getting top seats. But others need time to get the top f2 team.
@@mirvan23Of course Albon is one of the better drivers on the grid, while DeVris can only compete with Lance stroll.
@@mirvan23Mick wasn’t an average driver. He was at the end of the pack. Like you said he only got a seat because of all the money and marketing he brought. But he wasn’t in a top team. A top team wants a top driver who will win. They wouldn’t take him. Mercedes, Red Bull and Ferrari wouldn’t take him. Now no one will take him anymore, not even a team who needs the money and publicity.
3 things in life are certain. Death. Taxes. Josh Revell content aging like milk
I like that he 100% owns up to it lmao
I've got a long list of things I want Josh to make a video bigging up, starts with Australian cricket.....
@@tobiasz6613 oh no....
@@tobiasz6613 Or the Wallabies chances of winning the Bledisloe Cup.
At least it helps us, if he prospects someone to be decent, then we know that he won't be ))
One factor that isn't talked about enough IMO is that De Vries' miracle race in 2022 was done at Monza of all tracks. There's little arguing about how easy Monza is in terms of capacity of driving, when the cars are close together the whole pack is very close in qualifying because of the nature of the circuit, the driver just cannot big as much of a difference compared to other tracks. Would De Vries have driven at a track he didn't know or at a track that's most technical in his 1 race in 2022, I strongly believe his result would have been meh and he wouldn't have gotten a contract for 2023.
plus everyone knew that monza was going to be the best place for Williams to get points as they were just so fast in a straight line. Devries getting that race only made him look better than he actually was.
Honestly, I’ve heard a lot of people point that out this year.
Plus the fact that GOATifi didn’t score points that race
@@Aurantius_ dw GOATifi had to stop trying otherwise he wouldve lapped the whole field
@@crazydrummer181fr these people are like just reposting it
Nyck is 28 and has lots of accolades outside of F1 to his name already. The expectations were high and he has been horrible. This sucks for Nyck but not surprising.
If it wasn't for Perez underperforming even worse, he'd still have a seat. But Marko should grab a Zoloft once in a while 💊😁
@@sports2hedz542 I agree, if perez was still performing well, danny wouldn't have taken that seat.
but him & max possibly on the same team for 2024 could be interesting, if he performs well at AT
Interesting that Yuki is there literally just as a measuring stick. Can you beat Yuki? Yes? Ok you pass. No? You fail. Yuki is like the 1st level boss LOL.
@@sports2hedz542 Would love to see yuki beat danny & get the RB seat not gonna lie lmao
probably never gonna happen but shit
@@hypnotiqI'm pretty sure they're hesitant to bring him up to RB now since he's a Honda sponsored driver and they've since gone to Aston, so RB don't have much incentive to keep him much longer
Can’t wait for the “how Albon’s appendix won Daniel Ricardo a world championship” video in 1 year
Cant wait for the “ how Alex albon’s appendix won nyck de vries the formula E championship” in 2 years
@@noobmiester4122but nyck already won FE?
@@ralphismyname4940 another title then
@@omegraptorch3624aaand hes back in FE
"Helmut Marko had an eye on him"
Cuz he has only 1 makes it quite hilarious.
Ahahaha
Dropping Nyck after 1/2 a season wasn’t nearly as much about dropping him, as it is about seeing who is going to replace Checo.
Definitely Daniel Riccardo, there is no doubt but then the question is who is going to move to Alpha Tauri
@@MaxK934 i can't see Checo not making it to the end of 24. Even with the poor qf performances he still second in the standings.
Feels like Lawson will make it to AT replacing Tsunoda, except if Ricciardo gets swept this year.
@@MaxK934 Daniel will not replace perez, he is 10x worse than perez
@@Matt.visualz nope if you know anything about F1 and stop fanboying for Perez you’d know Perez is actually not that great of a driver
@@MaxK934ricciardo is a mediocore driver, Yuki has a better shot at the RB seat than him.
Let’s give Josh Revell a warm applause for jinxing Nyck👏🏼
I see you literally everywhere man haha
@@malcolmalexander3352 lol yeah, I love watching vids
I see you in all of nascar and f1 video comments 🤣
@@tvpcore I just love watching videos and also I do the same for mainly IndyCar. Also other racing series lol
@@IanTheMotorsportsMan_YT you have good taste lol me too man
I was skeptical of Nyck being signed for 2023 due to his struggles in Formula e last season (specially compared to Stoffel Vandoorne). But even though he's significantly underperformed with AlphaTauri, I would've given him the full season before getting Lawson (or Iwasa maybe) into the car for '24. RB wanting to put pressure on Checo to perform probably played a big role into bringing Danny Ric into the AT for the rest of the year, but I still feel it was a bit unfair.
About Marko, I'm inclined to agree. He's probably the reason why the Junior Team has been a success, but specially in recent years there have been too many instances of both him and Christian Horner throwing their own drivers under the bus (ex. when Christian said that they weren't worried about Perez and his qualifying struggles cause "he wasn't de Vries"). And that doesn't help at all. Tbh, I wish Marko decides to step aside in the near future and lets someone like Sebastian Vettel take over managing the Junior Team; I feel that, even if Marko remains at a senior position, Seb would be an amazing coach for the JT as well as someone more fit for the time and age we live on.
Seb would be the best mentor for Jr driver in the world but probably doesn’t belong at RB because he wouldn’t fit into their philosophy of the best or nothing all the time. Would almost be more beneficial to seb and the JR driver if he was at a mid field - back marker team like has,Williams,alfa, alpine
You can't compare Nyck to Vandoorne, Vandoorne outdrove Button in 2016 Bahrain GP.
Marko is doing what he can afford to do right now. He has Max, which is what teams can only dream of. So he had his #1 spot locked up and needs to fill
Out other slots.
Devries was awful and proved he wasn’t filling any slots whether it be in AT or as a #2 in RB. He got rid of Devries and brought in DR to see if any them can become a RB#2. Let’s face it, best case Perez drives one more year and won’t be back when his contract is done. So that means they need to see if DR or Yuki can earn that seat. If one of them earns it then they move Lawson up.
The reality is RB is holding all the cards right now and is in complete control. Every other team wishes they were in their situation.
I mostly agree with you, however is Nick a multi-WDC winner in Formula E? I’m pretty sure he is before he got into F1.
I believe the move is more to measure Yuki than everything else. Maybe De Vries was not there or maybe Tsunoda improved a lot... If DR continues ahead of Yuki Alpha Tauri might have new drivers for next year.
Half the current grid owe their F1 careers to Helmut Marko, though.
6 out of 20 is not half my friend, but I get your point.
We can also name Vettel who was on the grid last year which was then 7 out of 20.
But there are more in the pipeline.
@@RodejongCheco wouldn't be on the grid if RB didn't pick him up
@@Evarakeus Hulkenberg wouldn't be on the grid if Hass didn't pick him up. We going to credit Hass with him being an F1 driver? You can a bit, I think, but not full credit for sure, not even close. A lot of people worked with Checo in f1 before Red Bull and if they hadn't he would never have been in a position where Red Bull would have considered him for their seat. Let's get real here, Checo is in the Red Bull because he is a good driver (not a great driver) and he was extremely cheep compared to the alternatives.
Helmut wants the best drivers. If someone is mediocre they're gone. He doesnt want to be an Alpine or a Haas, and rightly so. People are sentimental, Marko is always looking for the next Vettel, the next Verstappen. Sometimes MAYBE he gets rid of guys like Sainz or Albon too quickly, but on the other hand, yeah Alex and Carlos are talented but they aren't exactly Seb or Max level. Gasly isn't either, Tsunoda isn't either, and yeah, probably Lawson and Iwasa aren't it either. They had (have for Iwasa) 2 years in F2, and didn't win the title (not impossible for Iwasa this year, but also not likely). Vettel, Verstappen, Hamilton, Leclerc, Russell, Piastri dominated as rookies in both F3 and F2. Thats the type of level Marko wants. Is the bar high? Yes. But its his team, his money, his choice. He isn't in it to be mediocre, to nurture guys like de Vries or Schumacher, he wants the next superstar, and frankly none of the F2 guys seem to be it. If Ricciardo goes to RB for Perez, Lawson probably gets the second Alpha Tauri seat, and Tsunoda has to show something finally. Iwasa goes to super formula for 2024 probably and with a good season can push Tsunoda out of F1 by 2025. Yuki has had 3-4 years to show what he has, and has done less than Kvyat with it.
I think Nyck had only one tough job: outperform Yuki. He was 28 after all, for him there is no room to 'grow'. He needed to perform right away. And he simply didn't.
You might be right about the shenanigans at Red Bull, but TBH: Nyck would have met a similar fate in other teams. There are just to many promising young drivers eager to have seat that is now taken by an unproven and underperforming experienced driver. Therefore, Nyck will likely never return to F1.
As a fell Dutch person, it would have been nice to see another fellow compatriot drive in F1, but I guess that not to be for now...
I hope he can return to Formula E and do good again
Damn he's 28? He looks young as hell! I thought he was around Yuki's age maybe even a bit younger lol
He'd won F2 and FE, been on the periphery of F1 for a long time but no one had signed him as a full time driver. - I think that says an awful lot. He is 28 and said himself that he isn't a rookie.. he was too slow and made too many mistakes.. on track... but who knows what he was like within the team and behind closed doors.
At least with DR they know what they are getting. I think Marko got too caught up in the hype around a track with barely any corners, with a car that for the last few years is quick in a straight line.... but effectively he can decide who he wants to drive his cars. At least Nyck got to compete in 11 races... it could have easily been 0.
More than that. He was Merc's test driver for YEARS. And when the time came...they jumped through the hoops of loaning Russel out of the Williams to drive for Lewis instead of DeVries.
Considering Alpha Tauri's gonna change their name at the end of the year, might as well rename themselves back to Minardi to match their pace
Hey Minardi at least qualified on the front row once and even led a race!
Zakspeed would make a bigger splash
In that case shouldn't the new name be Ancora Della Barca?
@@PEPSIMaxMusic Maybe Andrea Moda would be better?
At least that summarises what Marko is using that team for and how he seems to be running his operation now.
(Yes. This is meant to be a burn.)
(Trash)Binardi
He got enough time, don't forget he's older than Lando, Max or Charles. Those are the type of drivers RB is looking for. This is F1, supposedly the 20 best drivers (or richest) should be on the grid, Nyck is not one of those. He probably will do well in WEC or touring cars.
De Vries is better than Sergeant though, who you've counted among the 20 best in the world.
While Marco can be an ass, saying that he's underperforming is quite a stretch. The majority of RB Academy drivers went on to become very successful in motorsport in general. While being in RB Academy is hard due to the pressure you're under, if you make it with them, you're destined for a great motorsport career. I mean, 30% of current F1 drivers are products of RB Academy and others such as Buemi, Hartley, Kvyat etc. went on to have good careers in WEC...
I saw the 30% and said that can't be right lol
I mean, hard to argue with those kind of results.
They are successful for others and not for Red Bull. They sure do churn through young drivers.
this just means he’s capable of identifying talent but not fostering it
weak weak weak. There's only 20 seats in the entire world - stand and deliver or sit and spin. OK mixed metaphors, but seriously we aint' talking customer service diversity hire here...
Neither max nor vettel are a product of RB academy,they were picked almost at F1 door
Personally im happy danny is back but nyck deserved more time.
Also those super formula cars look sick.
Nyck doesn’t have time. He’s 28. He’s 3 years older than Verstappen. He’s not some normal rookie you give 3 years to prove themselves. He’ll be 31 in 3 years!
@@theread3480 hes 28??? Fucking hell…
@@theread3480 to be fair any driver over the age of 25 needs to go race in other series ...F1 should be for people 18 - 25 ..theres no reason somebody that is in their mid 20s should take a seat from a youngster!! ..when somebody holds on to a seat for over a decade its not good for the sport! ....F1 is the pinnacle of all motorsport and the drivers should be at the pinnacle age to match.
Nyck deserved nothing. There's a reason he was passed over back then.
@@commanderclaude8781 damn buddy you missed the point haha. How can one be so obnoxious.
People saying it's unfair always conveniently leave out that de Vries is 28. He is not a regular rookie, he said so himself. Marko was making the gamble that he'd be at pace quickly because of his experience, but he didn't. What's the point of keeping him on the team any longer? To have an okay 31-year-old driver in a couple of years? He was only a placeholder for Lawson/Iwasa to begin with, which both were NOT ready for F1 for this season.
I must note that Williams could have gotten nyck in 2020 but got chosen over by Nicholas Latifi. In a parallel universe we could have gotten nyck to be in F1 for 2 years or more, and in that time he could have improved drastically or not.
If you want to find someone to fire for underperforming, look in the mirror.
Well said Josh. Especially after his racism talk against Checo.
RB doesn’t need Marko. Anyone can do his job of figuring out Seb and Max’s talent…
He was dropped because he’s 28, he’s been around forever and was getting annihilated by Yuki who himself is still developing. DR came in, hopped into the car for the first time on the Friday and smashed Yuki to pieces after being punted by Zhou in T1. Also just because the juniors aren’t ready for F1 now doesn’t mean they never will be. Iwasa is improving but he’s not there yet and doesn’t have enough points for a super licence. Liam Lawson does have enough points but he’s better off finishing super formula and getting a seat at the end of the year when DR moves on.
"smashed Yuki to pieces" 🤦. Pfft. Their timing in quali was less than a thousandth off each others, and that's due to the bad traffic at the end of q1. And I guess someone conveniently forgot the bad pit stop and strategy Yuki had in the race huh?
@@darrenho9564 DR was last after the first lap, Yuki was 11th. DR gained positions up to 13th through a call he made and Yuki dropped to 15th. And DR out qualified him after only having two useful sessions in the car and only doing a tyre test in a different car all year.
He was 28 when Marko hired him, I don't believe that was the issue.
@@robinoconnor1203 it is because it means he has no development or more they don’t have time to develop him. With his experience he needed to be on par out ideally outperforming Yuki. At his age he was required to jump in and perform straight away, not next year or the year after.
I don't get why red bull stopped hiring juniors. Last few hires (perez, devries, riccardio) have all been from outsiders from the program
Rookies just don't get enough seat time. No wonder so many oldies are staying in the sport and looking competitive, they joined with 100's of hours seat time and then get a decade to stay up to speed, comapred to now where F2 cars don't translate at all to F1, and rookies have limited testing. He atleast deserved to see the season out
What about George, Lando, Alex, Charles and Max?
"Given I made this video and this prediction on Nyck de Vries, I think I ought to owe the whole world a favour over here and shut my mouth for once." Carries on with another 12 min video... xdd
George, Lando, Alex, Charles, Max (who skipped F2), Ricciardo, Sainz, Stroll, Piastri, Gasly, Zhou and Tsunoda, what are you on about, 12 of the 20 drivers came in the last like 7 years, you could even add Schumacher, Latifi, Giovanazzi and probably more
edit: also F2 has existed since 2009, so that means like 70% of the grid came from F2
@@Hmmmmmmm2 Ric joined in 2011 bro, and Stroll and Zhou are pay drivers (not useless though) so we still have a lot of drivers who have benefited from over a decade of experience and looser rules on private testing back in the day. I didn;t say NO driver can come from F2 and keep their seat, as obviously the extereme talents will make their cases regardless. But in general F1 has churned through multiple promising youths in favour of veterans.
@@SWatchik thats the point, f1 is for extreme talent
I think the difference between Nyck and other rookies is that Nyck was supposed to be a made guy. Even excluding Monza, Nyck is a 27 year old with more experience than half the drivers on the grid. He was supposed to come in and be the reliable points scorer while Yuki continues to improve. We often talk about drivers having an adjustment period to F1, or that they'll continue to develop, but Red Bull (rightfully) saw Nyck as a driver that would come in and be good right away. With Nyck, it's unlikely that he would turn into much more than he is, and with Yuki performing as well as he is, I think RB was justified to drop him so quickly.
Ironically it took Perez a good year to settle down in F1 and start outscoring his teammate.
@@bagofnails6692to be fair, to Shaads point, Checo wasn't a made driver or proven one in the same sense that DeVries was.
@@bagofnails6692 But Perez came as as a total rookie, straight from GP2. That's a big difference
@@MustachioFurioso9134 I agree Nick under performed, but was just pointing out that it often takes people a while to settle in to F1.
@@maglornoldor7493 I agree Nick under performed, but was just pointing out that it often takes people a while to settle in to F1.
Threatening Tsunoda and saying he's not good enough for F1 is INSANE from Marko. Getting ANY points in the worst car on the grid is an achievement, and when Tsunoda doesn't get points, he's usually fighting pretty close to them.
You can't put aside that Danny Ric is a personality. In formula 1 its not all about who is the better driver and who deserves the seat. Danny Ric has an established fanbase and its not small or can be easily overlooked. Its a smart move by RB to get him in that AT seat as it does more than put a talented driver back on the map. he'll earn points, sell merch and market the hell out of RB and AT.
And AT is going to re-band next year. Danny Ric's fanbase and public image will be extremely valuable for potential title sponsors / investors.
It's not about all these meaningless things, it's that Ricciardo is a better driver and Redbull can potentially get their first 1-2 in F1 history if they had a Ricciardo - Max lineup,
It has NOTHING to do with 'fanbase' LOL...F1 is not a popularity contest no matter how much DTS makes you think so.
$140m cost cap, how many Danny Ric baseball caps do you need to spend to make a difference?
"In formula 1 its not all about who is the better driver and who deserves the seat..."
In what universe *should* this be the case?!
Formula 1 is supposed to be the epitome of motorsport, showcasing the best drivers in the world. Talent should be at the forefront!
I'd argue I've seen better drivers than EVERYONE on the grid, let alone half, outside of the sport.
One more note is that Verstappen himself pushed Marko to go for de Vries according to his Monza performance. Maybe that this also was part of deciding to go for de Vries and not a junior driver
I mean Verstappen is also Dutch as well though so does that surprise you?
@@SpeedVaultz The Dutch aren't nationalistic, they are individualistic. If Max supported Nick, it would be for personal reasons. Marko doesn't care for others opinions, he didn't listen to Horner nor Max. This debacle is completely within Marko's MO.
Maybe Max should have been a better mentor and teacher then. Is it not the job of the senior drivers to help the newer drivers on the team?
@@tyfguh1664 whaaat? not nationalistic...do you know any dutch people
De Vries is someone who usually needs a year to get used to a car and a team before he starts performing, but in the Formula1 and at age 28, you just dont get that time, particularly so when theres guys like Ricciardo on reserve and talents like Liam Lawson eager for a shot. Nyck is not a young rookie learning the ropes, he had to perform but he failed massively.
Honestly I thought that this was brutal, even for Red Bull. Like, they've chopped and Changed drivers before, but I've never seen one handled so poorly.
Devris was supposed to be a measuring stick for Yuki and to help with development. He was neither, and so RB dropped him.
You’re forgetting that Nyck essentially wasn’t a rookie. He’s 28, a WC in another series, and already scored points on debut. There’s no comparable driver before for RB to have developed a pattern. They tried something newish (an evolution of the strategy they used with Checo), it didn’t work, they won’t ever do it again. I’m pretty sure Liam Lawson gets that seat as soon as they kick Checo out. RB will return to using academy drivers.
I guess they took Nycks words of saying he didnt want to be treated like a rookie too hard lol
@@lozfreak17 Qwhy would a driver who has no experience in Formula 1 be a yardstick for a driver who has been in the sport for 3 seasons?
Kvyat's demotion was handled way worse imo
Man… your animation has leveled up so much since when you began, I’m so happy to see your progress ❤ keep it going bro, you’re the best!
The situation is getting so messy, Danil Kvyat already licks his lips and waits for a certain phone call.
RUclipsrs never go past the results... it's not just about that, Marko said that De Vries just hasn't show enough race craft, in terms of speed, handling, overtakes. I tend to believe someone with enough racing experience can judge a driver based on other factors than pure pace.
I never fully understood the hype after Monza 2022. In the AM in FP1 he didn't really impress. In the other 2 2022 FP1's he did it wasn't that impressive either.
Marko is not a great judge of driver, his opinions of past drivers proves this. Not saying he is bad, or that I am better, just saying he has dismissed drivers he shouldn't have and shown faith to drivers who didn't have what was needed. The very fact that Red Bull put a lot of time, money and effort into their driver program and are the best known program in F1 and yet they have a Ferrari academy driver next to Max and a driver coming into the latter stages of his career back in the Alpha Tauri, shows that it really isn't all that successful, and Marko is the one making all the hand picks and all the final calls on the talent that program mentors.
I fully believe one of the bigger factors as to why de Vries was fired when he was, had more to do with Checo's lack of performances.
In terms of the championship RB/AT have nothing to lose in regards to swapping de Vries with danny ric. By putting a driver in that they have about a decade worth of data on and a lot more experience with, they can try to see if they potentially have 2 drivers to replace Perez with and put pressure on him that way.
Do I think de Vries deserved to at least sit out the season? yeah
Do I believe he got treated too harshly? yeah a bit
But ultimately I do believe his firing to have more to do with the (lack of) performances from Sergio than those of his own unfortunately.
Agree, to put it another way, if Perez was driving reliably it'd be a non-issue, regardless of Danny or Nyck's performance.
True. I also think there is an element of baselining Yuki's performance against a known driver. One thing for certain, RB won't hesitate to drop Ricciardo once he has played his part in the RB games and the way ahead has been decided. Just because he has been given the seat to put pressure on Checo, doesn't mean he is any guarantee to take the second RB seat.
Are you really blaming Checo for De Vrys demise? Give me a fuckin' break m8
I really think some people forget that he is not a young guy, he is 28 already, and that's a big point
Josh, huge fan of your wit, your writing & your delivery. Add to that a sense of humor, that’s as wicked as your editing is sharp, and every vid is must watch. Keep up the great work.
Remember when Josh Revell said that Yuki would be dropped midseason because Nyck would be destroying him. Well... 💀
You can be at the back of the field or you can have the personality of a brick. But you can't have both.
What made me raise an eyebrow was an interview with Helmut Marco on Austrian TV last weekend. In the span of 20 seconds, he said that de Vries was fired for not living up to expectations and that he should have performed better, and also defended RIcardo's result with, and I quote, "you can't expect better when someone's driving the worst car on the grid."
Old man going a little silly
it's all about Saturday. And RIC beat TSU on saturday
I agree 100% Debris just wasn’t fast enough , Yuki was just having his way with him , so at the end if you don’t perform then you are out , is just business
Riccardo did get P13 and best Yuki, a feat rare for Nyck.
because you can assess a driver’s performance by comparing him to his teammate in the same car
"look in the mirror" may be the greatest line you've delivered in a video.
De Vries had superior expectations than your average recent rookie as he got to test more than someone like Albon when he debuted, he got his chance, did not convince RBR and was yeeted. Sucks, but it is what it is.
Let's hope Mick doesn't get another chance either
Why rag on Marko? He's literally in charge and winning back to back championships with Verstappen who's there thanks to him. The only thing he cares about is to find the eventual Verstappen replacement, which doesn't exist currently.
It still doesn't justify ruining people careers & dreams that their families had shed blood, sweat and tears to foster.
@@fastbuck205 they wouldn't have been dropped had they performed. It's a performance oriented sport. Not everyone can win.
I don't care a lot about De Vries, but I'm really disappointed Ricciardo came back to F1 with all the young talents waiting for a F1 place. F1 is becoming an hospice.
As a New Zealander and Danny Ric fan, I still wish we could’ve seen Liam Lawson take the drive.
Awesome analysis/rant! You never disappoint, sir
Loving these shots at Marco. This has happened too many times under his watch to just be the drivers fault.
Yeah well id say he’s done pretty good has what 4 RB juniors,, Sainz,, Max,, Gasly,, Albon and Danny Ric There are only 20 seats in F1 for the entire world so unless your a pay driver on back Marker you better show sometbing
@@Jrh-rp7np You listed 4 drivers that DONT drive for red bull because he kicked them out or they left because of RBR's toxic atmosphere surrounding the 2nd driver... this wasn't the slam dunk argument you thought it'd be
Verstappen wrecked the grading curve
@@Jrh-rp7np🔔 end
@@B__L so he identified talent that has been retained in formula 1, in fact 7 drivers on the grid have been handpick and invested into, it actually is the slam dunk lol.
Damn Josh!! Marko being the Sith Lord of F1 made me nearly spit out my drink 😂😂😂 never has a more accurate portrayal of that man been said. Well done!
Ultimately Nyck was hired under unreliable circumstances in a one off that flattered him and fault lies all with Marko on this matter.
UH no. The whole “yearly contract” thing is arbitrary. There are only 20 seats in F1, and RB has the luxury of a second team. Sink or swim.
I was literally thinking to myself when Josh posts another video. Quality content as usual
I really hope a few drivers pay closer attention to this if they fancy a move from a Merc power unit to a different power unit. Really can’t help but think that was a considerable part of the issues for both Ricciardo and De Vries. Additionally, I personally think Nyck should have gotten to at least the summer break to if nothing else but give him a chance at a home gp and see if that home court advantage could have boosted him to the quality that we know he can put out.
The problem was between the power unit and steering wheel. A good driver can make any car fast. Yuki makes that terrible AT look fast at moments, because he’s much more talented. Nyck chose Yuki as an opponent, essentially promising that he could beat him. Same with Ricciardo and Norris. They underestimated how good these guys would be in year three.
He is 28. They dont have the time to wait for him to develop. AT is so bad, they need experience in the drive to make sure its not the drivers making garbage set ups and driving like garbage. So they get Danny. And he was instantly faster then Yuki.
DeVries is 27, has had years of experience and won an FE championship.
I think it's fair to assume that the expectations were that he would adapt quickly or at least be on pace with Yuki...
It didnt happen...and as such, I think its fair to bring a more experienced driver like Ricciardo in to A: foster development of the car and B: help push AT to their fullest potential. Yuki and DR are a good pairing, and it allows time for them to sign Lawson for next year and develop him some more.
I remember Monza 2022... Was there, saw Nyck score points for that Williams under the SC. We all had high hopes, yet a year later unforunate things happened☹️
hope you and your channel continue to succeed, you put out some great content.
Its not weird at all that he got the boot after only 10 races, if perez wouldnt be underperforming like he currently is de vries would still be in that seat. Now however RB feel like they need to pressure perez when they have some breathing room in the WCC & WDC, might as well evaluate perez, ricciardo & tsunoda at the same time to see which one will fit the best in the RB seat for next season.
Josh doing a brief run through at his less than half year at alpha tauri.
Just like Nyck’s brief run through at the alpha tauri.
"Look in the mirror" - absolute GOLD
Hey from the future, Daniel Ricardo has been driving even worse than yuki this season
All this hate against Marko makes me laugh. Yeah, the guy who has consistently had 7 drivers he scouted on the f1 grid for almost a decade is bad at his job. I wonder how many drivers merc or Ferrari have axed in the last 5 years before we even knew their name? Didn’t Ferrari basically cull their driver academy in half in the last couple years?
Exactly.
Marko poaching Max alone is enough reason for him to stay if you ask me. I agree with his statement regarding the f2 drivers not being good enough for F1, but that’s just me. RB are still the only team that has actually given their junior drivers a shot at F1, but they can’t give every one of them one either. Their methods are brash, but I still think that they get the drivers. 6 out of the 20 drivers on the grid are part or were part of the RB family in the past.
Other teams have successful programs but they don't have a B team in F1 which makes it way harder to get their drivers in. If you go through the grid you'll find while yes, Red Bull has the most, it's not like they have produced half the grid and most of the drivers on the grid with a couple of exceptions have been involved with a teams driver program on their journey into F1. I would argue the fact Red Bull have a team where they can just throw decent talents in and see how they do with minimal consequence means 6/20 isn't all that impressive.
Man, Netflix producers must be licking their lips in anticipation about this Perez-Ricciardo arc.
Great video, very much on point. It looks to me that Helmut Marko's discovering function ended once they put Max Verstappen on a Red Bull. After that, he didn't really develop the youth ranks and he's butchered every possible replacement. Actually Checo has been the safest choice they've made - although he's underperforming in 2023.
Since he discovered max Marko has been so arrogant of his ability to find great drivers that he can’t see their talent unless they perform from the word go he’s ruined de vries career before he even gave him a chance
He was the one that gave De Vries a chance though unlike Mercedes who were happy to use him as a test driver.
He didn’t discover Max. Max had multiple offers but chose TR as they were willing to put him in straight away rather than a year as a development driver.
@@luttren can we class this as a chance he gave him 10 races in a highly uncompetitive car at least as merc test driver his reputation wasn’t ruined and he had a chance at a f1 seat(like Williams)
Copium bruh, de Vries was a total bust and you know it.
Hops into an F1 car
Kills Latifi’s career
Kills his own career
Leaves
Epic gamer
Ouch! 😂 Great vid Josh ❤
I didn't think I could loose anymore respect for Marko, then this happens. Started all the way back in 2010 when he fully blamed Mark Webber for the Turkey crash, to 2020 when he said that all team personal should catch a brand new virus epidemic so they can carry on racing.
Then again ,he clearly knows what he is doing , is just business after all ,nothing personal with Debris just wasn’t fast enough for F1
I would go backwards a year earlier, when he fired Bourdais (a fine, if "good-but-not-great" driver) and replacing him with DJaime Algersuari 😢
As if Dr. Marko cares if you respect him or not. Heh
Mazepin and Latifi got more of a chance than DeVries did
because they had money to back up their bad performance. he doesn't
Both had rich dads too (Something Nick Doesn't), not exactly the best comparison.
And Red Bull is not a backmarker in need of their money
That’s a horrible comparison.
He was fired so fast we didn't even get to make him into a GOAT
Man, I asked for a closer look at Helmut Marko, and boy did you answer 😌👌🏾 Thanks for this, Josh.
Honestly, I think people should be able to have a lot more seat time before their debut. If a driver is then not able to hit the ground kinda running he is more justified to be dropped.
Devries himself, yeah more races would probably help him... but atleast he got a shot at all. So many great drivers never get a shot at all, and Nyck atleas had a chance at all
But there is not free driving an F1 car , the only way to have time is in the simulator and that’s completely different , a good driver will learn on the spot or be gone
@@hittrewweuy7595 Yeah, back in the day, they had in-season testing. Because of those tests, the role of test drivers was actually useful (now they can only hope a regular driver is unable to participate). If I remember correctly, they banned those tests to save money.
Damn Josh. Tell us how you really feel about Helmut Marko 💀
He just did
I think he held back, honestly.
Him being removed from AT is extremely obvious and logical. Ricciardo has a potential future in the main Red Bull team and De Vries was clearly not part of their plans so they made the efficient decision to prepare for the future instead of letting De Vries prove himself to a team that didn't want him anyway.
I liked the YT subtitles calling him Nick the Fleas
I think it is safe to say you won't be receiving a holiday card from the Marko family this year.
that Helmut Marko rant at the end was gold, RB (Marko) is putting rookies under too much pressure and just discards them when they mentally break
Well it obviously works
Thats the sport of F1 - equal parts of fierce driving talent, incredible engineering and ruthless politics. Welcome to the show!
2012 Mclaren Tooned. “Careful Jenson, Nyck will be driving your car soon” Well, that aged Well.
I still do not understand this whole "Perez is underperforming" bullshit.
Is he doing badly in quali? Yes. Is he doing badly in the races? No.
After the two years Ricciardo spent at McLaren, what makes anyone think he will be better than Perez?
I think one thing a lot of people are choosing to ignore just how long it took him to get through other series. He spent three years in F3, three years in F2, and three years in FE. He was by no means a standout driver. He got decimated by a rookie LeClerc in F2, and very easily could have lost his F3 title if LeClerc didn’t lose pace half way into the season. I was excited for De Vries but I really don’t think he would have gotten that much better if he stayed.
Completely agree with your assessment of Marko. I've said in a comment in another video that he was a liability to Red Bull and was shot down for it. Glad somebody else can see it too, what is the point of the junior programme? That being said I'm really happy to see Danny Ric back, he's been missed from the grid.
Helmuth Marko has one job: find the ONE generational talent for the main RedBull seat. He did it with Vettel and Max. All other 2nd hand drivers like Sainz, Gasly, Albon, etc are disposable.
@lukeearthcrawler896 This 100% the RB academy is not a school where you enter average and emerge undeniably better.
You enter the RB academy because you know its the best chance you'll ever get to get on the F1 grid, but so does every other young driver they sign.
Either you succeed or you get booted out and replaced with someone who can perform, it's always been that way and it clearly worked, they bagged Vettel and Verstappen. If you're the generational driving talent then obviously you go to RB, nowhere else promotes drivers or gives you a real chance to get on the grid
@@ttr_coco Even if you get booted, you still have a career. Sainz, Ricciardo, Albon, Gasly, Yuki and Verstappen are (ex) RB drivers, thats 6 out of 20. No other academy brings so many people up. Vergne, Buemi, Hartley all got carriers in Formula E or WEC. Even if you are not the very next Verstappen, being in Red Bull Academy gives you more carrier opportunities then any other academy. If you dont make it to or in the Red Bull, or even the Alpha Tauri, you still have a Motorsport Carrier, often times with RB helping/sponsoring your drives outside of F1.
I feel like OP didnt have to be such a dick talking about this mans life long dream collapsing. He wasnt that far behind Yuki who is in his 3rd year with the team. Although I have to say I love having Daniel back.
I think it’s mind blowing to me that a driver that hardly was in shape to start his rookie season and was just fast bc he is tiny (less weight) got to keep his seat for two seasons isn’t getting booted faster than De Vries is just… wow…. Insane.
I feel so sorry for the guy, but he should have known what he was walking into when he got offered a seat at Alpha Tauri
He had no choice, Alpha Tauri or no seat in F1
@@MrSniperfox29 then what was Williams doing then?
Marko will never have his authority taken away from him. He can ride the genius that was the scouting of Seb and Max, forever.
Some people are lucky to have one big break with scouting and cultivating talent. Marko discovered two generational talents. He has a job until RB ultimately gets tired of him or he retires...or dies.
Also Sainz, Gasly, Albon, Lawson... Without his keen eye for getting people into F2 we wouldn't have half the grid.
To be fair, in the past, 10 races was about a whole season…
Be great to see you tell the liam lawson story as it moves forward.
Great work as always.
I think the worst part of this is that AT said that Ricciardo would need around 5 races to catch up to Yuki... Danny (8 time race winner with 11 years of Formula 1 experience) gets 5 races while Nyck ( a rookie who said he barely survived his first race in Monza last year) only got 10 races.. I get that Formula 1 is cut throat and you need to deliver but this was messed up from AT and wouldn't happen in any other team besides Redbull.
DeVries is over 2 years older then Verstappen. AT/Redbull didnt get him as a Rookie and certainly cannot give him the time of a rookie. If he doesnt get better with 28, he never will. Danny needed one weekend to be faster then Yuki. They expected 5, they got 1.
Daniel won’t do any better
Lisan al-gaib 😭
The amount of incidents he caused on track was a cluster, was like 2 or 3 races in a row that he straight up drove K. Mag off the track or crashed into him.
I mean, yuki had multiple races where he messed up other people purely due to this own fault last year, and yet he's doing amazing now
@@makisan2596 Yuki wasnt 28 last season.
@@Cloney1337 age doesnt mean anyth, both are rookies bcos they've had 0 f1 experience beforehand. Just bcos nyck raced longer outside f1, that doesn't mean he shldnt still be given that 1 year leeway to learn and adapt
@@makisan2596 age absolutely matters. His age is the whole reason why he was hired and fired in the first place, he's 28, he doesn't have time to develop, he was expected to be ahead of Yuki because he had more experience with racing overall. And Yuki's been in F1 since 2021, he's a hell of a lot a better than he was his rookie season, even placing P4 in Abu Dhabi. What a ridiculous comment you made
De Vries was dropped by McLaren and then sidelined by Mercedes for a reason. He just isn't good enough. He's older than his peers and couldn't beat LeClerc, Norris, Russel and Albon in 2018 for good reason in F2. I'm not saying he's a bad driver, he just isn't good enough. The Formula E title he won was on sheer luck and his F2 title was after the top of the grid went to F1 the year prior.
1:13 I say it wasn't deserved. But seriously, all this shows is that Helmut Marko is suffering without Didi's oversight and the cold relationship with Oliver Mintzlaff is hampering his means to make driver calls. Even Christian was like "This ain't it, doc." Also, Yuki supposedly valued Nyck's amazing feedback. He knew how to diagnose a car setup...just not how to make the car go fast himself.
Classic helmut marco moment, Just throw him away after 10 races.
Nicky boy was shite after 10 races. What difference would another 12 do?
Especially since Danny Ric is already one spot behind him in the standings after one race.
@@chrisjones5411Marco didn't even give him a proper chance... Like josh just said.
@@chrisjones5411And mazepin got more time than him, If maz didn't have the money then he would have been dropped by mid season.
@@FunnierIrishPerson 10 races is a decent chance to show if you were shit or not. And he showed off he was shit.
@@FunnierIrishPerson Steiner knew he was shit, said he was shit and the second they had an opportunity to drop the rapist they did.
I really don't understand this belief that Helmut Marko is somehow incompetent at his job when the Red Bull Junior Team has easily been the most successful of any junior academy in Formula 1. So many drivers over the past few years owe their F1 career to Red Bull, and they support more juniors in the feeder categories than any other F1 team. It's not just about the quantity of drivers they employ, they consistently are able to provide them with the opportunities to show their skills and will absolutely find them an F1 seat if they are deserving of it. However, part of the reason why they are able to do that is because they don't waste time on talents that get them nowhere. There is no point in investing in so many drivers if you are just making a loss out of it. What makes RBJT so much better than other academies is that they own two teams in F1, so providing value to them as a driver doesn't necessarily mean performing at the highest level for the top team.
Gasly was not only under-performing but also difficult to work with, he was almost never going to be given a chance as the second Red Bull driver again. Despite this, he still provided Red Bull with value as an experienced lead driver for AlphaTauri. They kept him employed even though he was taking up a potential seat for another junior, and happily let him go to another team when he get the offer, even though he had a contract. Similarly with Albon, they kept him as a reserve driver and helped him find a seat again with another team even though they had no real obligation or reason to. Formula 2 has one of the most talented grids we've seen in years, and it looks like almost none are going to be promoted because half are signed with junior academies that just don't have the seats. I think being given a small opportunity to perform, even if it doesn't feel like enough time, is significantly better than being given no opportunity at all. Other junior academies don't have to suffer with tough decisions, because they don't make any decisions at all. They just lock their drivers in the simulator until they hopefully fade out of everybody's memories. Lawson had a pretty poor F2 season last year, claiming Marko just looks at results when we know on the record that he watches every single feeder series session and monitors every driver closely is just stupid. Lawson in any other academy would have been out, fortunately, Marko values series like SF and is willing to give him the time he needs to develop.
Nyck's exit was not just because of under-performing but also he simply wasn't the right driver for the circumstances. AlphaTauri desperately needs an experienced driver who can develop the car, and with questions around Checo's future, they also need a driver who can be a suitable benchmark for their juniors. In another situation, Nyck may have gotten more time, but he came in at the wrong time. Maybe before the summer break was a bit harsh, but it's honestly hard to say he wasn't given an opportunity when his previous racing performances show he probably wasn't deserving of a seat in the first place. Like be honest, we all know he was never first choice. Going into the summer break Gasly had a contract, there wasn't even a plan to change the driver line-up until he took the seat at Alpine. I say this as someone who likes Lawson, he was very fortunate to not be given that AlphaTauri seat as he was not the driver they need in there right now. He can develop his skills in an environment without the pressure of someone's promotion banking on his failure. Marko knows this and that's why it's good that he values other series outside of F3/F2. No other junior academy would have given Lawson the opportunities he has right now.
It is not hard. Red Bull had zero invested money in De Vries' junior career, so he was always expendable for them. Given he wasn't better than Tsunoda, he had minimal value for RB and they of course got rid of him when they wanted a way to evaluate DannyRic for 2024 and beyond.
Great work as always
Would love to get your thoughts on the championship showdown in formula e, especially how it all fell apart for your countryman Nick Cassidy over the final two weekends, especially the disasterclass from Envision in the first race in London!
9:20 it says the extremely obvious that is of no surprise to anyone: that they're an extremely cutthroat team who put enormous amounts of pressure on their drivers, and as a result, have won 6 going on 7 drivers' championships and 5 going on 6 constructor's championships in the last 14 years.
Helmut and dropping drivers after giving them not enough time to actually show what they can do
Name a more iconic duo
Something worth noting is that apperently Horner was not convinced about De Vries from the Start, something that surely influenced De Vries early departure.
Sorry to say it, but Helmut is responsible for a lot of talent getting on to the grid. Nyck would never had the chance as the Mercedes junior or at least the past 4 years didn't really prove that. And Ferrari isn't easy either. There is a reason RBR can be credited with the most drivers on the grid being on the grid thanks to them. Nyck how ever horrible it was got a shot to prove his worth in F1. Now it is up to him to get a team to support him.
Red Bull fire an underperforming driver again ... Everyone pretends to be shocked, appalled and surprised. Especially those who spouted "Nick Debris" up till then.
Looks at de vries career Meanwhile laughs in Pastor Maldonado 😂