ONE TO RULE THEM ALL?: Niche Duo vs DF83 V2 Review!
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- Опубликовано: 5 июн 2024
- Hope you enjoyed the video!
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Time Cues:
0:00- Fellowship of the Burr
1:15- Niche Legacy
3:06- Niche Duo
15:29- DF83 V2
22:35- Burr Talk w/ BurrMan
31:38- What Should You Get? 
Развлечения
Great video agaain, how do you manage to get so much content out? Contentaholic!
Forgot to tag you in the caption! Will pin this comment. Everyone- this is the creator of the 3rd party df83 parts!
Its his job ?
@@dickcheneyx36:48 “passion project”
pretty much all DF parts, not just 83 :P @@LanceHedrick
@@dickcheneyx It's not his full time job actually. That's something he does outside his job, which kudos to him!
Kinda let down by not having “in the darkness GRIND them”
Came to the comments exactly to say this! 😂
IT WAS RIGHT THERE
I'm embarrassed enough
As long as it’s consensual
I usually comment on the products reviewed rather than the reviewer, but Lance, this presentation really is exceptional. Fantastic skill in clearly presenting complex information in an engaging way. Top banana.
Well done. You work very hard to bring content. That's admirable. Thank you. We love you. ❤️
Thanks for another great, in-depth video! Really appreciate your work.
The Introvert bellows for the Niche Duo are brilliant! Fixes the popcorning issue and the bellows mean zero retention and mess. Only extra I needed for the Duo and costs less than $30.
Thanks for the recommendation, just bought it!
The bellows from introvert Vancouver Canada?
@@dricedt yes, those are the ones
why popocorning? i see the video and they use after grinding...do you put it before grind?
For anyone concerned about the Niche motor, i have a zero that had a motor failure after about 3 years. Not great but after contacting niche they responded quickly and sold me a new motor (they're not that expensive) which was easy to install, so not such a big deal.
Danke to you Lance from Austria, your content REALLY rocks 🤘!
I've been using an ancient Mazzer Major (83mm burrs) for years - one of the first Mazzer grinders to ever be imported to the USA by La Cara in San Francisco. About 20 years ago I installed new burrs and set it up for single dosing by building a base that tips it forward similar to how these are tipped. I tested several materials for the spout and ended up making a spout out of paper as that gives me the least trouble with static cling. Some day I would l like to rig up a motor speed control but I have been very happy with the grind I get and it is very low retention with the mods I made to it.
Man i like your reviews feels like your talking directly to me ,,, well done 🎉🎉🎉
Lance, thanks for the review. I love my DF. Some annoyances needed to be fixed - and that’s what I did! Moved the power lead to the rear and added a main power switch to kill the blue light…..keep your content coming!
Do you thing the stock burrs are fine ?
You are extremely good at reading the pulse of your viewers, I was wondering about exactly this, and then I looked down at my phone and you made a video on it
Thanks for doing this comparison Lance
For me, Duo static + dosing efficiency improved a lot after seasoning (espresso) burrs with ~2kg of beans or so. I havent needed RDT at all, and the spout/burr chamber seems to stay cleaner than on the Zero.
Also: "not sure why i havent had to pay import duties" --> this happens if cost of the imported good is over $800. if you get the duo with both burrs, you're pretty close, and fluctuations in the dollar vs. GBP can push you over the limit. I didn't have to pay import duties for the Zero, but did for the Duo.
I have uncoated 83mm SSP Lab Sweet for my Duo. I’m glad you validated my purchase.
I got the DF83v2 with the SSP cast V2 burrs earlier this year after I saw your review of the DF83v1 which was pretty positive. Really enjoyed them for making espresso. Thanks for the recommendation!
How do you like the cast burrs ? I do americanos with medium roast most the time. Thoughts?
Excellent review as always, I am still lusting after the Zerno. Makes my day when I see a new Hedrick in the queue.
The "my precious" at the start was chef's kiss quality! Lance is an underrated beatboxer haha
I’m very excited for what you plan to do with that Nurri in the background
Excellent review! You’re incredibly thorough. Thank you! Any plans to review Ceado Life?
Love the DF83, glad to hear about the burr’s as I am about ready to upgrade.
Hello Lance amazing video ! 😀When you talk about the taste profile of ssp cast lab sweet in the video, is it also valid for espresso ?
You say that 83 MP is not significantly better than 64 MP , Do you think the same for 83 and 64 cast ? (I've just buy DF64V with ssp cast, mainly for espresso, so with this 83 cast and the v3 cast I was starting to feel the FOMO syndrome... 😅😅)
been loving my df64 V2 so far. hope to see a review in a few months. never had the v1 but the improvements I saw from the previous model are definitely noticeable for a first-time DF owner. even without the angled cup holder its super mess free and their ionizer works very well to remove static, I find that RDT makes pretty much no difference. I think its a very very hard value proposition to beat - a very simple 64mm grinder that stays super clean with the v2 improvements. I think it's probably the best 64mm machine on the market right now for the price. its the type of machine that feels like (in a good way) it's taking the best advantage of what modern manufacturing can produce at the lowest price possible.
In the U.S., you pay import duty if the value is $800… so buying Niche with one burr usually means no import duty.
The 83 is awesome using it for 3-4 months now and 0 problems. Also easy to dial in :)
Great comparison both are good
My Only my precious 😂😂😂😂 My older daughter's reaction, great review. Greetings from Poland.
How on earth this is just a side project for you is beyond me. Thanks for the minutiae
35:33 “I urge you to try chafe on its own” 😂😂
Perfect timing on this video, was looking to upgrade my Niche zero
What’s your choice?
I think I'm gonna go with the DF64V and stay with the stock burrs a little bit and then switch for ssp mp (at 600 rpm to get more clarity, for filter at least). Tho I heard I don't know where that there will be a DF83V and I don't know if I should wait? I was really debating on getting the DF83 or the DF64V.
Also thank you very much Lance for putting so much efforts into your videos! Always fun to watch! :)
Great video lance.
which burr perform the best for espresso only on the niche duo?
Stock? Cast ? Or high uniformity?
Thanks for confirming you live in Portugal, it's been a mister for me for the last couple of months and all my internet searches resulted inconclusive. Had to say it.
Thank you Lance.
What about the espresso side of things with 83mm LS vs 64mm LS? I love my 64mm LS and am wondering if I should put 83mm LS in my Df83.
First DF83 (v1) is fine for me, no issues without an ionizer, not much static at all, but did find an improvement in flavor clarity but reduction in body when I removed one layer of the declumper screen. Also for the DF83 you have a funnel which comes with it to prevent that over-spray. The only problem is, it might rattle.
Great Video, thanks. What I am missing a bit in it is noice pollution. Is there a relevant difference between those two? Thanks!
Hardest working man in the biz puts out another banger of a vid
loved the video Lance!
Respect for boy Lance here singlehandedly keeping my FOMO in check.
man rewatching LOTR hits deep every time, it is the quintessential epic, quintessential trilogy
@LanceHedrick great video as always! Question, will you be reviewing the La Marzocco Pico Grinder any time soon? Was about to put an order down for the Option-O Lagom P64, then La Marzocco popped the Pico out, but havne’t heard any reviews yet other than their own promos
Probably not. The specs aren't impressive for the price point. Go p64 between those two
Lance with the amazing content as always.
In the darkness grind them
What a missed opportunity
Great info Lance, I went with the DF 64 Gen 2. I'll play around with the stock burrs but might upgrade to SSP MPs. I primarily make espressos but but sure how much of a gain I'll get over stock. I still have lots to learn but you're a phenomenal resource for me!
How are you liking your new grinder? I just ordered and kept std burrs.
@@kenroman777 I am looking at ordering the DF64 Gen 2 w/ DLC. Did you go with the DLC? How are you liking it?
@@samuelnagel922 I went with DLC burrs. I'm a material scientist and I know DLC is an amazing surface coating that greatly increases the strength and durability of the burr edge. It also protects it against corrosion and increases lubricity so hopefully helps with retention as well.
As for the grinder, I've had it for about 3-4 months now and am loving it. I never had any higher end grinders but coming from a baratsa ESP, the differences are significant. The grind is very consistent and easy to dial in. The adjustments are predictable and I don't have any clogging issues. I'm very satisfied with my DF64 Gen 2.
@@kenroman777 I'm loving it. I got the DLC burrs. Coming from a baratsa ESP, the DF64 v2 is so much better. I might play around with some SSP burrs in the future but so far these are quite good.
cool editing with the burrs!at 22:40
man not sure why i am listening to this but stuff like what you said at 18:50 makes me crack up. I just saw some old vid of you and you looked much more polished...not sure what happened to you over time :p keep up the good work
It's convenient for the manufacturer to keep saying x and y will void your warranty, but at least in the UK, I don't think changing the burrs could ever void the warranty.
Lance, I have the DF83v2 that I pair with a Flair58. I like med to dark roast that I make lattes with. Which burrs do you recommend exclusively for espresso? I don't like the extra dark beans that start getting oily if that matters.
About to take delivery of a Duo today. Excellent video timing. (Haven’t watched it all yet)
Same. Next week.
I hope the motor doesn’t fail 🙈
Great video Lance!
I bought my df 83 v2 about a month ago and waiting for it in the weeks to come. I'm only having espresso drinks so i invested that extra 90$ for those DLC espresso burrs. What about that choice? ..how is their profile? ..are they worth it? You definatly seem to say that the stock ones or amazing, did i did well in doing that investment!? 🤔
I also placed an order on a argos odyssey with a 6bars lever spring. What can i expect out of such a combo ?
Amaizing chanel, thx a lot dude!
Great video Lance, love LOTR! I am gathering my pennies to buy a df83 right now. One question! Would the df83 cause any problem if used as a single dose in a commercial environment?
Lance thanks for the video. Can you please list out the burrs discussed particularly those non ssp/italmill one that most of us wont be familiar with. I tried googling based on what i heard but cant find the particular brew burr i am curious about at 28:11
Not much more exciting than a new Lance vid ❤🎉
Hi Lance..Will you be doing a follow up long term review of the Vostok Lever Machine? Looking forward.
Shouldn't it be "In the darkness GRIND them"? 😁. Another great vid.
Thanks lance, would be better the df83 or the df64v? Im just trying to decide which one without spending extra in burrs
I might have missed it Lance, but it seems like you hold the MP as the benchmark burr for filter and espresso? Just that others get close enough that it may not be worth the extra for home use?
Knowing the 64mm ssp and 83mm are similar in performance has relieved me of fomo. Thx lance
Thank you for your review and let me ask a question - what is better for Turkish coffee?
Hey Lance, I bought the DF83 V2 after watching this video. I’m having some issues with it, however. I’ve been dialing in at home for a while now and I work at a coffee shop, so I don’t think it’s any inexperience in that area. I find that my grind size will jump and I get very inconsistent shot times between shots even on the same grind setting. There’s a little sharpie mark inside the machine indicating that the people who sent it to me must have it aligned, at least enough to where I don’t have to marker test it. I’m a little frustrated with its performance after spending that much on it. Do you think I could be doing anything wrong that isn’t related to the grinder?
I'm looking to buy an electric filter coffee grinder next, atm I'm using C40 + niche zero for my espresso. Any reco? I was looking at EK43 (I know) it's huge 😂 will p64 be a good choice for filter coffee? thanks🙏🙏🙏
awesome video!
Lance you can compare grinders but nothing can compare to my love for your channel thanks boss.
I bought a 2nd-hand Niche Duo that came with only the espresso burr set. I emailed Niche to ask about availability of additional burr sets for sale from Niche and they replied saying "We do not currently have plans to sell the burrs separately at this time, so we would recommend that if you want both burr sets in the future to order both burr sets now."
Hopefully, a 3rd party will offer compatible burr carriers for us to experiment with additional burr sets without separating the stock burrs from the stock burr carrier.
Hi Lance, great in depth video. Do you know how the 151g Mazzers compare to the 151f?
I've been considering getting a grinder for years, and I really like the look of the Niche. Now with some amount of FOMO I can't really decide what to get. I probably would drink mostly filter coffee but the idea of getting a espresso machine at home, like the Gaggia Classic Pro, has also been on my want list. Would you say that it is absolutely necessary to have the filter burr set or can the espresso burr set do a good enough job on filter coffee for a noob like me? Or is there no such thing as a espresso + filter grinder that does it all.
EDIT: I should add that what I've been leaning towards is the Niche Duo with just the espresso burrs, not both.
Love the videos, been binging quite a few over the past weeks. Keep e'm coming. :)
I can't believe I've found someone who going through the same predicaments as me! I really like the Duo but it doesn't seem to be as good as the DF83v2. I'm only doing aeropress atm but will get a machine in the near future.
Have either of you bitten the bullet / gotten any experience or answers to your questions?
Great video. Now I am on the edge of p64 vs df83❤
Lovely review Lance, I got the Duo because my better half liked the look better, so don’t underestimate partner’s preference. I did look at the other, but after this review I honestly think it sounds lot like mute differences, especially once you use bellows. It seem you have a bit more static issues then I do, but we also have like 80% humidity so I suspect might be why. The chaff clinging to my outside grinder is actually not really happening and using bellows is 0.1-0.2. I checked the chamber and it’s minor. But I definitely say bellows is recommended just to avoid potential grinds buildup, but I heard similarly from other df83 v2 users.
Mine was piss poor zeroed though. I also agree with the little annoying beans fragment having a trip under the lid down on the counter, I heard some who never experienced it and it seem like it’s somehow related to density of the beans, all I asked and head who dos lights seem to have that issue, while I heard the darker roast crowd say they don’t experience it.
But really think it’s missed mark on Niche not to toss a ioniser in it… I think that might actually would have removed much the minor issue there.
I speculate that the wing underneath the lower burrcarrier that are there to minimise retention under burr might actually be why you think it might not keep alignment because it’s one side so the carrier isn’t a balanced piece..
Anyway thanks for the review and the burr upgrade was helpful.
Great video Lance thanks, really good comparison (Niche Zero owner here)
What is the difference between the modern style espresso you mentioned in the video and the traditional style?
Instead of either of these two I am thinking of just single dose modding a Mazzer Major and using bellows. How do you think that setup would compare?
My DF83 order has been stuck in customs for a month, really looking forward to it!
@LanceHedrick I'm totally lost with the Burr talk, I'm going for the DF83v2 as my first, and probably only grinder for a long time.
Right now I'll use it only for Moka Pot, and probably soon for espresso, I might use it for pour over but with darker roasted coffee.
What burr can you recommend for this setup? I"m completely new at this and don't want to spend too much money on this if no necessary.
I saw the "Stainless Steel", "DLC espresso,", "standard" ... Several SSP.... I have no idea.
If I eventually want to upgrade a SSP HU on either Niche DUO/DF83, which one you recommend between Zerno vs those two?
Where do you buy Burr Carriers for Niche Duo. I can't find any online. Its nice to have extra burrs installed in different carries rather than removing old stock burrs and replacing them with others and then aligning them seems like a lot of work just to put in new burrs.
Re: giveaways, if you're in portugal, are any giveaways appropriate for US/110v?
How are they compared to a handgrinder like Commandante C40 red click? Is it a big step up in quality in your cup (Both espresso and filter)?
Is your point at the end that its better to either use the DF64 + MP/HU or go with a Zerno and that either the Niche/DF83 are really less ideal than either one of those in the appropriate price bucket? I'm looking to upgrade from my Specialita and wondering if the DF64v2 + HU is enough or whether the DF83 with a similar set up is substantially better for the jump in price.
Lance great video but lots of info. Any chance you can do a score card when comparing burrs? Compare on acidity, sweetness, texture, etc
Hi Lance, not sure if you'll see this but figured I might as well try. I'm considering buying the Weber Key and I keep hearing that even if it's a conical grinder it has certain "flat burr like" properties. But which flat burr would be the closest to the 83 Mazzers in the Key in your opinion? Thanks!
Thanks for this, Lance! I'm a traditional/body forward espresso drinker, but the Niche Zero is about 2x the price (shipping/exchange rate) of a DF64P locally to me. Can you recommend a 64mm burr that would compete with the NZ on body?
Stock burrs on the df64 compete with it tbh. Body isn't great on niche imho
Love flying by the seat of my pants 😅😅😅
I bought a Niche Duo with espresso burrs, but lately I've really been enjoying pour overs so have been thinking about getting some different burrs for the Duo to try out for filter. Should I be able to put filter centric burrs in the espresso burr carrier? Is there a difference other than colour between the carriers? And what considerations/steps do I need to take if I do it? Would love to see you do a short video/reel about this process if it's more involved than just swapping the burrs out of the carrier :) Thanks
I have the duo with both burrs. The carrier fits either of the burrs. I honestly am not totally in love with two burrs for the duo. My main issue is dialing in takes forever once you swap about burrs.
@@briani812yeah I wouldn’t be swapping often, I’ll go through a month or two where I’m really into one or the other, and I have a baratza encore esp that I could use for basic espresso blends while using duo for filter, and a jmax to use for pour over while using duo for espresso. But I’m also considering just getting a zp6 for pour over and saving myself the hassle.
Did you get a chance to compare the original ssp brew burrs to the newer ssp mp burrs?
My experience with the DF83 is that it works better WITHOUT RDT with hot start. The chute collects a lot of grounds if you RDT.
Took me a couple of hours to watch this video just cause I had to pause a few times since I was making and drinking my coffee with breakfast.
Thank you Lance for putting out this video. I’m going to start building my first espresso set up in about four months and, because I don’t want to have to deal with two grinders (I already have the Encore), I was looking at the Duo. I’m really glad you put out a video about the Duo and more importantly, it was a comparison video.
Question. Do you think the Duo would be a good grinder when paired with the Bambino Plus? I’m looking at getting that machine as my first.
thank you burr man
Where can you buy the new stock DF83 V2 burrs in the EU? Seems like a reasonably priced 'upgrade' to the italmill ones in my V1
Would either of these be an upgrade from Vario+steel if I'm chasing espresso clarity?
Lance, we need you to do a large conical comparison .
Kafatek Monolith
Weber Key
Aries
Deep breaths, can I live with my bar after this video or will upgraditis whip me into submission? Let’s find out
every Friday morning should start with a grinder showoff!!! WOOHOO
Hi Lance! Just out of curiosity, do you live in Porto because of work?
good comparison
So what is the best please for just espresso, P64 or the Zerno? Thank You!
Hi Lance. Tks sooo much for your effort in educating us. Ever since you announced about this video, i have been checking daily for its release :) I drink both esspresso and pour over. Currently i only own a 1Zpresso J Max hand grinder. I would like to get the best tasty coffee, and i am ok with either hand grinder or 64 or 83 flat burr grinders. So for pour over, is 1zpress ZP6 the best grinder i can get? For espresso , will i get better coffee if i buy DF64, DF83 or Niche Duo?
Same question 🙈
Hello I think it's depend what you are looking for filter, If you are more clarity focus the Pietro Probrew is maybe better than zp6 or SSP MP (more like ULF style). If you want more juicy/blended brew Timemore 078 or zp6 (more budget friendly) seems to be great according to Lance.
@@jorisfassina3789 tks for your post. really appreciate it. actually i am just a beginner in coffee... came from instant coffee... i heard LAnce saying that people are using hand grinder during filter coffee competition, and he always praise ZP6.. hence i thought ZP6 could be even better than those electric grinders using SSP etc.. anyway not many RUclipsrs compare hand grinder to electric ones..
Is the HU better then the Mazzer stock for espresso?
I have bought the df83 v2 it came with that new black burr as well but i am facing a serious issue i can only grind with the range 5 down to zero to get proper time in the shot once i go higher than 5 it mostly gonna be under extracted shot ! Its well aligned with marker test I don’t know what’s wrong with it! if it was the same for grind very to zero let me because I bought this grinder to more range in espresso grind and to go more fine to do a proper pre infusion and i cant do that because i cant go more finer and is this weird to me .
Any comments well be very helpful for me thanks
"And in the darkness, grind them."
i just watched lotr three weeks ago for the first time in like 10 years lol
i'm up baking sourdough at home twice a week without sleep while full time solo parenting and sometimes yt vids and coffee aren't enough to keep me going lol
My wife and I just finished rewatching for the first time in like 5 years. Extended edition. So good.
gandalf's fireworks in the first one make me smile so much every single time
Love the LTR.
So, what is the best burr to put in a DF83 for predominantly expresso use?