Silkland, one of the cable manufacturers we talked about in this video, has reached out to us and updated their product pages to be much clearer about what their DisplayPort 2.1 cables are capable of. 1. Silkland's Amazon listings now correctly state that cables at 2m lengths and longer are only capable of 40 Gbps, not 80 Gbps as previously stated. Cables at 0.5m and 1m length remain at 80 Gbps. This can be seen here and also in other regions (not an affiliate link) www.amazon.com/dp/B0BCQ6FQ33?th=1 Silkland tell us this was an internal communication issue between the product department (who make the cables) and the operations editors (who upload the product listing to retailers). Moving forward, Silkland will be addressing this issue by requiring the product department to give accurate information to the operations team and that these product listings will be clearly detailed with accurate specs. 2. Silkland's cables are now properly listed as VESA Certified for DP80 at 0.5m and 1m lengths, and DP40 at 2m lengths. This can be seen at the VESA website www.displayport.org/product-category/cables-adaptors/?ps&pman%5B0%5D=silkland&pcat%5B0%5D=dp80-certified-cables&pcat%5B1%5D=dp40-certified-cables Silkland tell us they weren't originally listed in the DP40 and DP80 sections because it's VESA's decision what categories products are placed under on their website, but they contacted VESA to have the website updated to reflect the results of certification. 3. Silkland's DisplayPort 2.1 cables over 2m in length have been updated to say they support 40 Gbps speeds, but remain without VESA Certification for DP40. Silkland are claiming these products are actually capable of 40 Gbps but the certification standard is more strict and even if the bandwidth can reach 40 Gbps, it may not pass certification due to other factors like attenuation. However internally they have tested these cables to work at 40 Gbps using both testing equipment and real world monitors like the Samsung Neo G9. At this stage we'd still recommend sticking to certified cables at the lengths you're interested in where possible, anything beyond that you will have to take the manufacturer at their word. 4. Silkland are working on DP54 cables and some existing products (eg. 2m cables) will be upgraded to DP54 spec. DP80 cables certified up to 2 meters in length are also in the research and development phase, though shorter term goals are for 1.5 meters in length followed by 1.8 and 2.0 meters. We're still going to keep an eye on the cable situation but I appreciate Silkland updating things to be more accurate and clear for consumers which was a major concern brought up in this video
New sub here -- Ty for posting this update. I appreciate when companies do this, especially when they reach out and seem to be trying to avoid making people frustrated.. which is more than I can say for most companies these days.
Thanks so much for the clarification. Definitely didn't expect "Vesa Certified Displayport 2.1 cable at 80Gbps" to not necessarily work for UHBR20, due to the lack of a specific DP80 certification... This is messier than HDMI2.1 (where HDMI2.0 speed can also be HDMI 2.1) and USB3.2 (where 5Gbps is also a type of USB3.2)! I can see many consumers making the wrong purchase already.
It's not necessarily that they don't work. Organizations like VESA make their money not by making standards, but rather, by selling certifications. Same with HDR certifications for things like HDR400 and such. So the certifications can help, but they're also kind of meaningless because it's all a money scheme to sell certifications. For example, the LG OLED's didn't have HDR400 certification, but they certainly could do HDR400 and more. To get these certifications, costs 10's if not hundreds of thousands of dollars per product tested. Companies have to send their products off to them, they might only spend 20 minutes looking at it and testing it, and boom....here's a $10,000 bill to the company for the certification. Of course it's not that simple, they make it complex to create a facade to justify the cost. Now you can see why not only are things more expensive, lots of companies simply don't bother with certifications because of the predatory costs associated with getting them. And when it comes to cable makers, who might sell maybe 10,000 cables for 10 dollars, to get certification would be a huge cut of their entire profits.....all just to get certification, for something their cable may be able to do despite lack of certification. That's also why the standards are constantly being trickled up, because it requires a new certification, which makes organizations like VESA a LOT of money. They could have created a singular modular cable design decades ago, one that can handle far into the future, and would also be cheap to mass produce, but that's why we have tons of different cable types. I mean just look at all the things that have been simplified....like headphone jacks and speaker wires. That's because these things existed before overcomplication, and they have no good way of forcing a change on them to make money from them, but if they could they sure would, and you'd have 50 different headphone plugs.
@@peoplez129 thanks for the detailed response! And yes I completely agree with you on the money-making scheme for orgs like VESA. However, as the reality stands, for us consumers who want to make sure our purchase works, a correctly certified one will 99% give us what we want. A non-certified product may also work, as you said, but there is a greater chance that they don't deliver. For this reason, I for one would still buy the certified one to avoid the gamble. But I 100% agree with you that the whole system really should change.
You gotta be aware they they all go down the USB route to make intercomptible with the encoding scheme and possible tranfer speeds. The maximum line tranfer speeds usbd by USB and after a certain point it currently is only unidirectional.
it really fell apart with 1.4, theres no reason to not use 1.5-1.9 but the manufacturers are pushing so hard to get people to switch to usb-c or hdmi and just be happy with mediocrity
You need to have PhD in cables to buy one. Hate that. Not the first time companies does that, this apply to everything today. What a mess. Thank you for sharing this with us, I think this type of content help a lot in many different ways at once
@@odjsjaks no, what you do is program the devices to tell you "hey buddy, your shit is running slow cuz the cables are crap" and refund the cable. this'll work for HDMI, DP, USB, Ethernet, PCI-E, anything. the devices know this because they start out at the high rate and fall back if there're errors, they just don't show you for some reason.
@@odjsjaks thats why i left out USB-PD, it's the one most likely used between dumb devices (eg wall adapter + power bank). then the only solution is keeping logs which a device with a screen can display later.
Its a sham that its allowed to sell those cables, with misleading info. It should be mandatory to show the buyer what said cable spesifically support, like: Bla bla bla : (ticked box) Bla bla bla: (unticked box) Etc.... Also listings should have a link to the vesa website, which also shows you that the cable is indeed supported. Edit: Great two videos! Very good info and it will saves us money.
By that logic, many things have been shams for a few generations now. Hardly the first time we've had this issue. HDMI, USB (before everyone making them became concussion patients) RJ45 as well as others, have had maximum lengths-to-spec considerations before active cables had to be a thing... and not exactly linking to the official boards to explain it all. I think it stands out more now after HDMI and USB in particular have made their moves in recent, but not exactly new overall.
@@MaddJakd mind elaborating on the RJ45 naming issue? Or are you talking about those standards that aren't IEEE ratified? Latest is Cat 7 and that only recently, Cat8 is not, it exists due to data center need, and Amazon products just mislead as product cert doesn't exist so can't enforce. Ethernet standards are some of the most clear tbh, in terms of that they directly state minimum spec / bandwidth, and the different types of shielding and what they're for, so can plan pretty easily once you have a spec sheet. Most homes should just be Cat6 nowadays, since most runs will be
@Masterrunescapeer if you bothered to actually read as opposed to skimming, I was blatantly talking about cable length considerations not being new. Learn how conversations work.... or retake the comprehension portion of english before acting like you have any legit bones to be picked.
so what you're saying is that USB, HDMI and DP have all created a mess of naming schema where the advertised version is functionally meaningless to most end users, with the important things being stuck in the fine print, if there at all... fantastic.
I miss when standards referred to an interface, it was a line of technobabble. Honestly, I feel like *we feel* scammed because things are made 'apparently simple', when they're not. Everything being 'made marketable', is a blight upon the industry. "Wi-Fi 6" WTF is that? Must JustWork^TM with anything else 'Wi-Fi 6' Vs. "IEEE 802.11ax" Oh, it's an IEEE standard; I should probably look into/ask a pro what is and isn't supported on my hardware.
I have purchased a Club3D DP2.1 a month ago. Yes, I can confirm these cables are VERY short. I had to relocate and change the orientation of my PC and Display.
If Cat8 cables for 40 Gbps Ethernet can be certified to 30 meters, surely one can certify something like 80 Gbps DP for 2 meters, unless the DP standard cable/connector design is somewhat questionable to begin with.
@@bot_365 also, i'm not sure this is true, 48V for POE sure, but i doubt it would be 48Vfor signaling, but i could be wrong as i have never worked with cat8 ethernet
@@Tracenji You are correct, 48v is only poe power and not signaling voltage at all. The signal voltage is around +/- 1v on Ethernet differential signal lines.
Still is an issue considering HDMI consortium allowed a bunch of 1.X cables to be 2.0 cables by changing the spec after releasing it. Not as bad as USB but still.
Do you mean 2.1 where everything under the sun can be a 2.1 cable. The bandwidth is just too high for cheep copper look at ethernet cables. You need cat 8 for over 10gbe links. And only up to 100ft. At half the data rate of dp 2.1. Just look up a cat 8 cable termination to see how much extra is put in to the cable. And the cables use sold core copper as well. There are 400gb dac cables but they cost like $200 for 2m and are really short as well.
@@andrewmcewan9145 It's whichever version that came out right before 2013 when I bought my 1080p 3DVision 2 monitor. So, it might be 1.4a that I'm thinking of.
I had this issue when moving to a 1440p/165Hz monitor years back. None of the DisplayPort cables I had would reliably output that, including the one which came in the box with the ViewSonic monitor I bought. I ended up buying a Club 3D one for ~$25 that I'm still using and has never given me any problems - other than the fact that it's about twice as thick as any other display cable I own, so is a little hard to route.
Would be good to see as future content, maybe a once a year thing of cable testing to see if their performance lives up to their names and "certification". Would be a great way to help buyers avoid getting burned the hard way.
Great warning video! Even with HDMI a similar misleading mess occured some years ago. To connect a PC to a 4k OLED TV just 5m away using hdmi, I tried 10m electric cables which allegedly supported 4K at their lengths, yet in spite of their advertised bandwidth capacity they did not work properly. Eventually the only way was to use an hdmi fiber cable. The much more demanding DP 2.1 is likely to go through the exact same misleading advertisement and disappointments for sure.
I'm pleased by the fact i was your source for this video. Many info you're providing clearly come from my 2 month old posts on TPU forum (1.2m max length of DP80 cables, copper vs fiber, DP40 cables sold as DP80, DP80 certification list). Good video, bye.
The lack of standardization in industry "standards" is maddening. How has this been allowed to continue on like this for so many years? I suspect it has everything to do with the fact that lawmakers do not play PC games, so this is not an issue that affects them personally.
it more like we have a lack of 8+k120Hz TVs. since right now all the research is being done to improve contrast instead of resolution. for most 4k is already good enough that jagged edges aren't a problem. the near sighted veiw is a priority over how much of the golden gate bridge you can see in the background.
The issue is not the lack of standards. The issue is the oversimplification for marketing purposes. Before the era of mass consumer proliferation, *you* (the user) had to know what you were plugging in, and what the interface was capable of. Nowadays, we're trained into "Wi-Fi is Wi-Fi, USB is USB, HDMI is HDMI, and DP is DP. It all JustWorks^TM". The 'technobabble' names of old, used to mean "pay the F attention, or find someone who does".
That Club 3D DP80 cable still says only "4K120Hz" in its name at 3:04. On their official page it says "4K240Hz". So why is it not labeled as 4K 320 Hz anywhere? Is your DisplayPort Cable Specs table wrong? The Glory Mark DP80 cable does not mention what combination of resolution and refresh rate it supports anywhere.
Cable Matters has never failed me. I'm sure they'll make one. I have two of their HDMI 2.1 cables, one short copper, one active optical 5m one, and an adapter from DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.1. They're flawless.
Hopefully the fibre optic style cables come out, and are cheap enough to be feasible. I had similar issues with getting a fibre hdmi cable that supported 4k120. Mimimum lengths for that started at 3m going up to 100m. While the price went from £70 up to over £120.
2m DP80 active cables won't necessarily need to be fiber optic cables. It's possible to get slightly more length out of a copper cable with redriver chips. There are already USB4 40Gbps copper cables with active redrivers, and 40Gbps USB4 signalling is very similar to DisplayPort UHBR20 (USB4 has two 20Gbps links in each direction, for 40Gbps bidirectional, whereas DP 2.1 UHBR20 can use all 4 links in one direction for a total of 80Gbps unidirectional).
DP 1.4a had this issue as well but not as terrible. When the RX 5700 XT was having black screen issues, one of the things AMD recommended was to use a Certified DP cable. For some people, this did work to solve the issue. However, Certified DP cables are much shorter then most cables you can purchase. For someone like me, who has a three monitor setup, this isn't going to work easily with a 1.5m cable, as typically your PC tower sits on one side or the other of the monitors. Only having the PC under the desk or in the middle of the desk is going to solve this issue, and not many people will want to return to the 90s. Optical cables are going to be more expensive (likely because it will need transmit/receive hardware inside each of the connectors), and people who are not used to dealing with optical cables are going to likely be crushing them, twisting them, and breaking them in all kinds of ways because they won't be used to dealing with optical cables. It's going to take quiet the pubic service announcement to get people used to dealing with optical.
I feel this is an important area that must be explored when purchasing a monitor - the connection from the monitor to the GPU. Most importantly, what is the difference between all the configurations (including the Mac variants) - so shall I go HDMI or DP and what does each variation give me? Is that a project you have considered?
Theres really only going to be a few situations where there'll be a difference: A. Your monitor configuration exceeds the bandwidth available of your cable so you need to use DSC or reduce resolution/refresh rate/color depth. B. Sleep/hibernate protocols are different for different video ports. What might let you wake your monitor up from power off might not work when using a different cable. C. The individual cable or video port might be broken which can cause artifacting or no connection to be detected on the devices. D. The standards supported on one protocol are different than the standards supported on another (a recent example is HDMI 2.1 on Linux). These are the only circumstances where I'd imagine there'd be a difference. This really isnt enough to make an entire video about.
It does but a) everything you will buy today will be DP 1.4a. b) only difference between DP 1.4 and 1.4a is in improvement in DSC quality (more profiles).
I think he did ... like 2 years ago when HDMI 2.1 was rather new. It's the same issue really, you can have 2.1, but without the full 48 Gbps link speed.
Even active optical cables are no guarantee of signal quality, as I've learned with Fibbr brand DP1.4 active cables. In fact, with their cables, somehow the shorter cables cause MORE dropouts. (What, do they put all the reject transceivers and fibers in the short cables?) It makes me wary of even trying DisplayPort 2.0. 1M cable: dropouts. 2M cable: slightly fewer dropouts. 3.3M cable: even fewer dropouts. 33-meter cable they sent me when I ordered a 3.3-meter cable: no dropouts.
In Germany, you can get only: Cable Matters 80G DisplayPort 2.1 (1m or 1,5 m) there should be a 2m version, but It's nowhere listed even on cable matters. The best cable (available) comes from Club3d: Club3d CAC-1092: 80G DisplayPort 2.1 (1,6 m) (I got 4 items of this, really great cables). This 1,6m version is much better than the 1,2m version which was mentioned in this video: Club3d CAC-1092-1,6 m: 4K240Hz, 8K60Hz and *10K60Hz* (DP80) Club3d CAC-1091-1,2 m: 4K240Hz, 8K60Hz and *10K30Hz* (DP80) A good middle solution: Cable Matters 80G DisplayPort 2.1 *DP54* with 3m (available).
Excellent video!!! Incredible how these retailers decide to lie instead of being honest. Even if it "works" at higher bandwidth... if its not certified at a specific speed, then its not certified. Don't lie to the consumer.
My doubt about using Display stream compression is how noticeable is the difference? I never seen side-by-side comparisons showing the same image/video with/without DSC being used.
The mp3 analogy is sufficient. There will always be the hardcore audience that only want flac files but in the end when you have a standard Logitech speaker no one will hear the difference. Of course for editing it will make a huge difference having uncompressed formats but I doubt that a consumer display can even show that .
There was the same issue with HDMI 2.1 when it first came out. You could only really get cables.up to 6ft in length. I have this gigabyte monitor, and at least for now I can just switch it to DP 1.4 mode in the OSD until the cable situation gets better. I bought this monitor more for Gigabytes superior KVM implementation anyway.
Why don't they switch to optical cables? More bandwidth, can be longer, thinner, as standards improve you'll likely be able to use your old cable for a long time,... are the receivers/transmitters really that expensive?
Thank you. Very informative as always! Are you able to do a recommendation/review on the longer length HDMI 2.1 certification? It would be really useful for a lot of people out there using this current standard. Cheers
It's kinda insane the industry didn't transition to optical cables a long time ago considering bandwidth for digital video has been a problem that existed since the DVI days. But I guess they just couldn't manage to make HDCP annoying enough with optical cables… 🤷♀
While the fibre itself is rather cheap, the transceivers are still expensive. Looking at 40GbE QSFP+ active cables (which have 80Gb total bandwidth), you'd be spending 30-60 Euro for a 5m cable. Bare MPO-12 fibre would be cheaper, but fibre connectors are definitely NOT durable enough for "mass consumer market" use.
Two of my 4 cables I needed 10ft (3m). Certified 2.1 but lower speeds but DSC is fine with me and required no matter what. By time this is all sorted we will have 4k 480hz monitors that need DSC even with UHBR20.
Aren't there optical Displayport 2.1 80Gbps cables already? Cost is higher, but length isn't a factor anymore. I have been using 30m Hdmi 2.1 Optical cables for years.
I bought the Silkland DisplayPort 2.1 Cable 3M [VESA Certified], DP 2.0 Cable [16K@60Hz, 8K@120Hz, 4K@240Hz] 80Gbps HDR, HDCP DSC 1.2a, Display Port 2.1 Cord you described and it replaced a 3m 1'4 cable that was resulting in a black screen for a few seconds on a regular basis. No drop outs and a stable output to my dell oled 3440x 1440 at144hz. good for that output but probably not 80Gps
I recall the struggle getting a reasonable length DP 1.4 cable for my first 144Hz monitor years ago. These days I can't even find an HDMI cable that doesn't cause a intermittent flash artifact between my RTX30 GPU and my LG C2, requiring either a PC restart or a cable re-plug. The least problematic cable so far is the one that came with my PS5 but the GPU and display still won't handshake properly a third of the time.
So, there IS a solution for longer cables... but as ever it is expensive: fiber optic. There are fiber optic DP80 cables out there, and they can go to extremely long lengths. Fiber Command is one that I've personally used, though not at 80gbit speeds. Even there you have to be careful and check to see that it is actually DP80/80gbit certified as there are plenty of them that are only DP40 because they use basically the same transmitters that they do in fiber optic HDMI 2.1 cables. Any that support 80gbits are going to be over $100, so not cheap cables. But if you want high bandwidth Display Port over longer distances right now, it is an option, just an expensive one.
I'm waiting on a company to send me a test sample of their 10ft UHBR20 (DP80) cable. Should be certified, so that's nice - although maybe not the one I'll receive. I believe they're also doing a 6ft option. I didn't double-check with them, but I assume both ends are full size DP. I'd wager if they're working on it, plenty others are, so we should see some improvement to the DP80 cables market in the next few months. Been using fiber options for excessively long runs of HDMI2.1 for a while. Hoping they come out with fiber options for DP80 this year. The 6ft and 10ft options I mentioned are unfortunately copper only for now. Cost-effective, but limited to more typical (and arguably practical) lengths.
Hey man, have you considered reviewing the new msi optix mag274qrf-qd e2 monitor? Ive heard its quite good but i always come to your videos to see if it's really true.
I went through this a few weeks ago, predicted it wouls happen with a 4k high refresh monitor for me, and yes you can't find official VESA certified DP80 longer than a meter YET, but i'm sure a longer one should come out soon
I'm not sure if the issue is (just) the cable. In my experience, most interference / signal reflection issues happen at the *connectors,* where the wires can't be twisted / shielded. And using MiniDP instead of full-size DP might be part of the problem.
There is a reason most high-throughput interconnects use fiber optics, it is just far easier to cram a lot of data into light than a super-high frequency signal on copper.
I can't tell you over the years how many times I bought a cable with terms that should work but don't. I've bought expensive cables that suck, and cheap cables that work well above the spec they list. I feel like you've got a golden opportunity to do the community and world a service of just buying a truckload of cable brands/specs at three or four lengths and posting results with affiliate links for the ones that work. The ones that fail to meet advertised spec regardless of actual certification go to some kind of public wall of shame and we consumers can contact or avoid those companies to improve or go out of business.
It always starts like this, it seems like its usually a few years after a new DP capability before you start seeing 10FT/3M+ cables, I just started being about to get viable ones for 4K144, and I can now get those like 25Ft, im sure they will figure it out with these, if nothing else we will go fiber optic, which really isnt that expensive anymore
Well crap, I was hoping that DisplayPort would see the folly that HDMI pulled did with the 2.1 spec, but instead they went "Yessir, I'll have some of that" and served up a heaping plate of it. It's still early in the lifecycle, and long before I need it for my systems as I'm happy with 1440p/144Hz so things might get better in the future (especially with pieces like this, pointing out the issues and confusion), but I kinda doubt it. Bandwidth and cable length seems to be a gigantic issue industry-wide right now. Try finding a USB4/Thunderbolt4 cable longer than your forearm for instance. That's less of an issue than this 1.2M limit, but still incredibly restrictive. Basically requires you to have your desktop directly behind the monitor, and forget almost any VESA mounts. Maybe some of these new ultra-high-bandwidth standards that aren't providing power (like DP, HDMI & Oculink) need to just bite the bullet and jump over to fiber optic. Active cables can work a bit, but seems more like an intermediary bandage and can be more prone to failures, connection issues and inferior parts being used. It'll certainly make them more expensive and the amount of companies able to make fiber cables is fewer, but it might be worth it in the long run.
I was at least 3 years late to the 4K HDR 120Hz club in my living room, and shocked how hard it was to get a 3m cable that actually managed that. 48Gbps cables are either short, expensive, or just fail to deliver. If it was this bad in late 2023, how bad was it when 4K@120Hz launched way back in 2019?
As someone who has bought 3 DP cables in the past before I finally got my monitor working properly... I appreciate this video a lot. Big Cable wants to sell more cables I guess!? (/s) VESA should honestly feel required to clear things up for consumers.
I’m so confused as to how such a simple piece of hardware can be so difficult to make work. I’ve literally had to purchase 3 different HDMI cables before mine started working, but I never had issues with Display Port. So strange 😅
It is theoretically possible that some of these uncertified cables can achieve 80gbps speeds under certain circumstances (such as in a zero EMI environment), but if they were only certified for a lower bandwidth then it's very unlikely that they can be relied on in a normal home or office environment. VESA really should not be allowing companies to advertise cables as capable of achieving speeds greater than they're certified for.
I've almost always had to buy separate cables for high end displays, audio equipment and lighting. If anything you've highlighted how cheaply most standard cables are manufactured. HDMI gets around this through compression--not better cable quality. This seems odd to people who rarely (if ever) buy high end equipment but the cables provided by high end electronics OEMs are more of a courtesy and for trouble shooting than for use in the end application. It is more common than not that high end electronics applications obligate custom cables and the OEMs don't want to waste money on something they know probably isn't going to get used--same with power cables.
Seeing how goddamn slow alt+tab, or any other mode changes, is with DSC, I'm more than glad that the FO32U2P supports the solution for this insanity and cant wait for new GPUs. I mean it takes several seconds to do a alt+tab out of exclusive fullscreen. Unbelievable. I would lose several seconds of a game intro cutscene, because starting a game does the same. There seems to be indeed no harm in image quality by the DSC, but I have no comparison of course, but the insane slow mode changes are driving me crazy. I'm very, very glad now that the FO32U2P wont be the limiting factor in future.
I thought dsc doesn't result in image quality loss? Is there any downside to using dp1.4a? Why would someone opt for this new standard if there are so many issues?
Great video! I would be interested to see which cables work with the rest of the Gen 3 QD-OLED monitors (DP 1.4 DSC) length wise. I mean I do understand that its easier to drive than DP 2.1 however Ive been getting answers even from VESA certified DP 1.4 manufacturers that users with 3m or even 2m cables have been having problems with signal loss with this 4k 240hz spec even tho theoretically they shouldn't. Could that have something to do with DSC pushing the 1.4 spec to its absolute limits? I would be interested to see if there is a single 3m DP cable that can run that spec.
I am not surprised about pricing and length. Similarly fast QSFP28 DAC (100 GbE) cables cost as much or more. AOC even significantly more. I wonder if we ever switch to QSFP28 for the interface instead of Displayport. We then could use different transceivers to accommodate different needs for cable length / speed, even fiber optics.
My problem is I need a 15 to 20 foot long cable (2 actually) because I have a sit stand desk and there is no way to put my PC on my desk and I dont want to put it under my desk either. The reason for the length I need is so the cables are not spanning free air and there is no risk from moving the desk up, and the PC is on a separate stand off to the side configured in such a way that a 10 foot cable would be too short unless i never lift my desk, and really i need a 16 foot but it seems to only go 15 then 20. I dont need DP 2.1 features I just need somethin that will maintain 165Hz at 1440p with that length due to my new office layout. Can a DP 1.4 cable that is 15 to 20 feet long do 165Hz at 1440p? Assuming it is actually a 1.4 cable and not just claiming it is? Is there something between a 1.4 cable and a 2.1 cable that can do it? I likely will have bought somethin before I get any kind of answer from this but would like to know regardless.
What I noticed when I bought a 240Hz OLED is that the cable that came with it can only do that at 8 bit without DSC, and you need to enable DSC to even get 10 bit color space, so there's definitely a displayport bandwidth problem.
I've just been looking around and noticed the 16K rated DP2.1 cables on Amazon and it'll say in the description 80gbps for the 1m but 40gbps for the 2m and 3m. I've actually been using DP1.4 cables on my 4k 240hz and 4k 144hz monitors. I still get the 4k 240hz on my Neo G8 which is obviously because it's using the upsampling system they have. I'm going to try and swap to newer cables, I can get away with 1m or even 0.5m with my G8 because my PC is on the desk right next to the monitor.
But I got this monitor now and its a pure dream. I got it today evening and I'm still at default settings of the monitor and the defaults are already superb to me.
I think we're starting to get to the point where we might as well start to embrace fibre as a mainstream connectivity solution when it comes to desktop computers and pressure manufacturers to integrate the hardware that's necessary for cheaper passive fibre cables to become the norm. It might increase prices initially, but I believe it'll eventually benefit us all in the long run (fast USB-C cables are also a nightmare and it's not getting any better)
Why we cannot build something like DAC 100GbE connections, in server rooms they work for 5 to 7 meters, and 100GbE is even more than 80Gb? And isn't Radeon 7900 XTX supporting UHBR20?
Pretty sure that the 7000 series only has UHBR13.5. Mentioned in the last video. It’s quite funny now how much AMD advertised the 7000 series with DP 2.1.
Try to create a 3 monitor setup with 1.0 meter cables. You basically have to put the PC behind the center monitor. I suppose I can't use my optical thunderbolt (3) cable either, since that's limited to 40Gbps (or 20? i don't even know)
This type of stuff happens when there is too much focus on manufacturers and not enough on customers in these standards groups. They know what they are doing and it’s intentional to confuse consumers.
It may be down to physics too- I know wifi isn't the exact same thing, but based on the frequency of data transfer the max range of say, 3G is like 100km, while 5G is only like 1km. I assume as the bandwidth of the copper increases, so too does the range decrease. Eventually we may just need new display port standards based on fibre instead of copper.
Very interesting... I am using a 5m DP 1.4 cable (4k 120 Hz), and the connection is... pretty bad. Sometimes there is some "snow" on the screen, sometimes I have to bend the cable a bit, and sometimes I have to change the DisplayPort slot on the GPU. So, it sounds like 5m for DP 2.1 is basically guaranteed to not happen any time soon (unless you spend >$100 for some fiber optics converters or whatever).
Silkland, one of the cable manufacturers we talked about in this video, has reached out to us and updated their product pages to be much clearer about what their DisplayPort 2.1 cables are capable of.
1. Silkland's Amazon listings now correctly state that cables at 2m lengths and longer are only capable of 40 Gbps, not 80 Gbps as previously stated. Cables at 0.5m and 1m length remain at 80 Gbps. This can be seen here and also in other regions (not an affiliate link) www.amazon.com/dp/B0BCQ6FQ33?th=1
Silkland tell us this was an internal communication issue between the product department (who make the cables) and the operations editors (who upload the product listing to retailers). Moving forward, Silkland will be addressing this issue by requiring the product department to give accurate information to the operations team and that these product listings will be clearly detailed with accurate specs.
2. Silkland's cables are now properly listed as VESA Certified for DP80 at 0.5m and 1m lengths, and DP40 at 2m lengths. This can be seen at the VESA website www.displayport.org/product-category/cables-adaptors/?ps&pman%5B0%5D=silkland&pcat%5B0%5D=dp80-certified-cables&pcat%5B1%5D=dp40-certified-cables
Silkland tell us they weren't originally listed in the DP40 and DP80 sections because it's VESA's decision what categories products are placed under on their website, but they contacted VESA to have the website updated to reflect the results of certification.
3. Silkland's DisplayPort 2.1 cables over 2m in length have been updated to say they support 40 Gbps speeds, but remain without VESA Certification for DP40. Silkland are claiming these products are actually capable of 40 Gbps but the certification standard is more strict and even if the bandwidth can reach 40 Gbps, it may not pass certification due to other factors like attenuation. However internally they have tested these cables to work at 40 Gbps using both testing equipment and real world monitors like the Samsung Neo G9.
At this stage we'd still recommend sticking to certified cables at the lengths you're interested in where possible, anything beyond that you will have to take the manufacturer at their word.
4. Silkland are working on DP54 cables and some existing products (eg. 2m cables) will be upgraded to DP54 spec. DP80 cables certified up to 2 meters in length are also in the research and development phase, though shorter term goals are for 1.5 meters in length followed by 1.8 and 2.0 meters.
We're still going to keep an eye on the cable situation but I appreciate Silkland updating things to be more accurate and clear for consumers which was a major concern brought up in this video
Wow, that's a very fast response and action by a manufacturer.
What a great advertisement move.
New sub here --
Ty for posting this update. I appreciate when companies do this, especially when they reach out and seem to be trying to avoid making people frustrated.. which is more than I can say for most companies these days.
Love yea but this all sounds liek greek lol
Lol, I just checked that link, I have set Amazon to German and in German the product listing still says 80Gbps for the longer cables …
the person who thought displayport 2.1 should have like 4 different versions should be fired.
- Are you GPU bound or CPU bound?
- Nah, I'm cable bound...
Kinky.
Nah, I'm user bound!
Imagine still being hard drive bound.
@@TheZoenGaming
kinky
it’s cables unboxed now 😎
cables untangled
Cables Unboxed
Best one 😂
We need this channel. Now.
Monitors are not cheap
Thanks so much for the clarification. Definitely didn't expect "Vesa Certified Displayport 2.1 cable at 80Gbps" to not necessarily work for UHBR20, due to the lack of a specific DP80 certification... This is messier than HDMI2.1 (where HDMI2.0 speed can also be HDMI 2.1) and USB3.2 (where 5Gbps is also a type of USB3.2)! I can see many consumers making the wrong purchase already.
It's not necessarily that they don't work. Organizations like VESA make their money not by making standards, but rather, by selling certifications. Same with HDR certifications for things like HDR400 and such. So the certifications can help, but they're also kind of meaningless because it's all a money scheme to sell certifications. For example, the LG OLED's didn't have HDR400 certification, but they certainly could do HDR400 and more. To get these certifications, costs 10's if not hundreds of thousands of dollars per product tested. Companies have to send their products off to them, they might only spend 20 minutes looking at it and testing it, and boom....here's a $10,000 bill to the company for the certification. Of course it's not that simple, they make it complex to create a facade to justify the cost. Now you can see why not only are things more expensive, lots of companies simply don't bother with certifications because of the predatory costs associated with getting them.
And when it comes to cable makers, who might sell maybe 10,000 cables for 10 dollars, to get certification would be a huge cut of their entire profits.....all just to get certification, for something their cable may be able to do despite lack of certification. That's also why the standards are constantly being trickled up, because it requires a new certification, which makes organizations like VESA a LOT of money. They could have created a singular modular cable design decades ago, one that can handle far into the future, and would also be cheap to mass produce, but that's why we have tons of different cable types. I mean just look at all the things that have been simplified....like headphone jacks and speaker wires. That's because these things existed before overcomplication, and they have no good way of forcing a change on them to make money from them, but if they could they sure would, and you'd have 50 different headphone plugs.
@@peoplez129 thanks for the detailed response! And yes I completely agree with you on the money-making scheme for orgs like VESA. However, as the reality stands, for us consumers who want to make sure our purchase works, a correctly certified one will 99% give us what we want. A non-certified product may also work, as you said, but there is a greater chance that they don't deliver. For this reason, I for one would still buy the certified one to avoid the gamble. But I 100% agree with you that the whole system really should change.
You gotta be aware they they all go down the USB route to make intercomptible with the encoding scheme and possible tranfer speeds. The maximum line tranfer speeds usbd by USB and after a certain point it currently is only unidirectional.
First it was USB, then it was HDMI, and now even Displayport has jumped on the asinine naming/optional features bandwagon. Awesome.
Do I detect sarcasm mayhaps?
@@jemborg no he's completely serious about loving asinine naming conventions
@@Shotblur awesome.
it really fell apart with 1.4, theres no reason to not use 1.5-1.9 but the manufacturers are pushing so hard to get people to switch to usb-c or hdmi and just be happy with mediocrity
It's infuriating, really.
You need to have PhD in cables to buy one. Hate that. Not the first time companies does that, this apply to everything today. What a mess. Thank you for sharing this with us, I think this type of content help a lot in many different ways at once
It’s become the same with USB
@@odjsjaks no, what you do is program the devices to tell you "hey buddy, your shit is running slow cuz the cables are crap" and refund the cable. this'll work for HDMI, DP, USB, Ethernet, PCI-E, anything. the devices know this because they start out at the high rate and fall back if there're errors, they just don't show you for some reason.
@@odjsjaks thats why i left out USB-PD, it's the one most likely used between dumb devices (eg wall adapter + power bank). then the only solution is keeping logs which a device with a screen can display later.
Its a sham that its allowed to sell those cables, with misleading info.
It should be mandatory to show the buyer what said cable spesifically support, like:
Bla bla bla : (ticked box)
Bla bla bla: (unticked box)
Etc....
Also listings should have a link to the vesa website, which also shows you that the cable is indeed supported.
Edit:
Great two videos! Very good info and it will saves us money.
By that logic, many things have been shams for a few generations now.
Hardly the first time we've had this issue.
HDMI, USB (before everyone making them became concussion patients) RJ45 as well as others, have had maximum lengths-to-spec considerations before active cables had to be a thing... and not exactly linking to the official boards to explain it all.
I think it stands out more now after HDMI and USB in particular have made their moves in recent, but not exactly new overall.
@@MaddJakd mind elaborating on the RJ45 naming issue? Or are you talking about those standards that aren't IEEE ratified? Latest is Cat 7 and that only recently, Cat8 is not, it exists due to data center need, and Amazon products just mislead as product cert doesn't exist so can't enforce.
Ethernet standards are some of the most clear tbh, in terms of that they directly state minimum spec / bandwidth, and the different types of shielding and what they're for, so can plan pretty easily once you have a spec sheet. Most homes should just be Cat6 nowadays, since most runs will be
@Masterrunescapeer if you bothered to actually read as opposed to skimming, I was blatantly talking about cable length considerations not being new.
Learn how conversations work.... or retake the comprehension portion of english before acting like you have any legit bones to be picked.
Length is always a problem when it comes to DP.
I see what you did there 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Are we still talking about cables?
@@radiofuture6911 not the kind you think.
@@radiofuture6911Some cables might be involved but not the way it's used in PCs.
The fact you can say "DP" and "length" so many times in one video without cracking is a testament to your steel resolve.
Consumers: "We're tired of being scammed."
Organizations creating standards: "Don't worry, we won't help."
What’s the point of a “standard” if the “standard” has 4 different versions?
vesa moment 💀
@@Frozoken 😂
Do you know what standard even mean?
Intentional obfuscation of product capabilities. Basically they think we are so stupid that they can get away with it.
It is extremely scammy to expect a regular customer to know the difference between the different versions of the 2.1 standard.
so what you're saying is that USB, HDMI and DP have all created a mess of naming schema where the advertised version is functionally meaningless to most end users, with the important things being stuck in the fine print, if there at all... fantastic.
I miss when standards referred to an interface, it was a line of technobabble. Honestly, I feel like *we feel* scammed because things are made 'apparently simple', when they're not.
Everything being 'made marketable', is a blight upon the industry.
"Wi-Fi 6" WTF is that? Must JustWork^TM with anything else 'Wi-Fi 6'
Vs.
"IEEE 802.11ax" Oh, it's an IEEE standard; I should probably look into/ask a pro what is and isn't supported on my hardware.
I have purchased a Club3D DP2.1 a month ago. Yes, I can confirm these cables are VERY short. I had to relocate and change the orientation of my PC and Display.
If Cat8 cables for 40 Gbps Ethernet can be certified to 30 meters, surely one can certify something like 80 Gbps DP for 2 meters, unless the DP standard cable/connector design is somewhat questionable to begin with.
Ethernet cables work on 48 volts.
Display port is 3.3 volts.
@@bot_365 48V is only for PoE, not for data transmission
@@bot_365 Display port 3.0 NOW WITH 48 VOLTS
@@bot_365 also, i'm not sure this is true, 48V for POE sure, but i doubt it would be 48Vfor signaling, but i could be wrong as i have never worked with cat8 ethernet
@@Tracenji You are correct, 48v is only poe power and not signaling voltage at all. The signal voltage is around +/- 1v on Ethernet differential signal lines.
I remember similar problems when HDMI 2.0 came out. Lots of cables were advertised as supporting either 18 Gbps or 4K 60 Hz, but they weren't.
Still is an issue considering HDMI consortium allowed a bunch of 1.X cables to be 2.0 cables by changing the spec after releasing it. Not as bad as USB but still.
Do you mean 2.1 where everything under the sun can be a 2.1 cable.
The bandwidth is just too high for cheep copper look at ethernet cables. You need cat 8 for over 10gbe links. And only up to 100ft. At half the data rate of dp 2.1. Just look up a cat 8 cable termination to see how much extra is put in to the cable.
And the cables use sold core copper as well.
There are 400gb dac cables but they cost like $200 for 2m and are really short as well.
@@andrewmcewan9145 It's whichever version that came out right before 2013 when I bought my 1080p 3DVision 2 monitor. So, it might be 1.4a that I'm thinking of.
@@andrewmcewan9145 It was whichever one came out right before I bought my 3DVision 2 monitor in 2013, so I might be thinking of version 1.4a.
It's still an issue with 2.0 and even more so with 2.1. Buying an HDMI cable is like a lottery.
I had this issue when moving to a 1440p/165Hz monitor years back. None of the DisplayPort cables I had would reliably output that, including the one which came in the box with the ViewSonic monitor I bought. I ended up buying a Club 3D one for ~$25 that I'm still using and has never given me any problems - other than the fact that it's about twice as thick as any other display cable I own, so is a little hard to route.
even worse 144p 144hz HDR10 uses a lot of data.
Would be good to see as future content, maybe a once a year thing of cable testing to see if their performance lives up to their names and "certification". Would be a great way to help buyers avoid getting burned the hard way.
Granted! A person can spend a lot of money searching for the right car.
Exactly same problem I have notice where looked for longer cable for Thunderbolt 4 (or USB C 40GbE)
Cables for TB4 are commonly half the length of TB3
Oh yes, we need the DP 2.1 4x2 3:4:5 80Gb 420Hz Cat 89 with Sonic and Knuckles.
How these people name these things is beyond me.
So is there no solution to getting a long enough 2.1 cables anywhere? Couldn't see anything on the website you suggested
Yes, I agree. I was also surprised by the length of the cable to this monitor. I had to put the computer on the table next to the monitor.
Great warning video! Even with HDMI a similar misleading mess occured some years ago. To connect a PC to a 4k OLED TV just 5m away using hdmi, I tried 10m electric cables which allegedly supported 4K at their lengths, yet in spite of their advertised bandwidth capacity they did not work properly. Eventually the only way was to use an hdmi fiber cable. The much more demanding DP 2.1 is likely to go through the exact same misleading advertisement and disappointments for sure.
Thanks for this clarification! I canceld a cable on Amazon which I ordered few minutes ago. 👍👌
I'm pleased by the fact i was your source for this video.
Many info you're providing clearly come from my 2 month old posts on TPU forum (1.2m max length of DP80 cables, copper vs fiber, DP40 cables sold as DP80, DP80 certification list).
Good video, bye.
The lack of standardization in industry "standards" is maddening. How has this been allowed to continue on like this for so many years? I suspect it has everything to do with the fact that lawmakers do not play PC games, so this is not an issue that affects them personally.
it more like we have a lack of 8+k120Hz TVs. since right now all the research is being done to improve contrast instead of resolution. for most 4k is already good enough that jagged edges aren't a problem. the near sighted veiw is a priority over how much of the golden gate bridge you can see in the background.
The issue is not the lack of standards. The issue is the oversimplification for marketing purposes.
Before the era of mass consumer proliferation, *you* (the user) had to know what you were plugging in, and what the interface was capable of.
Nowadays, we're trained into "Wi-Fi is Wi-Fi, USB is USB, HDMI is HDMI, and DP is DP. It all JustWorks^TM".
The 'technobabble' names of old, used to mean "pay the F attention, or find someone who does".
That Club 3D DP80 cable still says only "4K120Hz" in its name at 3:04. On their official page it says "4K240Hz". So why is it not labeled as 4K 320 Hz anywhere? Is your DisplayPort Cable Specs table wrong?
The Glory Mark DP80 cable does not mention what combination of resolution and refresh rate it supports anywhere.
Cable Matters has never failed me. I'm sure they'll make one. I have two of their HDMI 2.1 cables, one short copper, one active optical 5m one, and an adapter from DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.1. They're flawless.
Hopefully the fibre optic style cables come out, and are cheap enough to be feasible. I had similar issues with getting a fibre hdmi cable that supported 4k120. Mimimum lengths for that started at 3m going up to 100m. While the price went from £70 up to over £120.
2m DP80 active cables won't necessarily need to be fiber optic cables. It's possible to get slightly more length out of a copper cable with redriver chips.
There are already USB4 40Gbps copper cables with active redrivers, and 40Gbps USB4 signalling is very similar to DisplayPort UHBR20 (USB4 has two 20Gbps links in each direction, for 40Gbps bidirectional, whereas DP 2.1 UHBR20 can use all 4 links in one direction for a total of 80Gbps unidirectional).
It was mentioned that an active copper spec is being worked on
Great. Now I need a training course to buy a DP cable thanks VESA.
DP 1.4a had this issue as well but not as terrible. When the RX 5700 XT was having black screen issues, one of the things AMD recommended was to use a Certified DP cable. For some people, this did work to solve the issue. However, Certified DP cables are much shorter then most cables you can purchase. For someone like me, who has a three monitor setup, this isn't going to work easily with a 1.5m cable, as typically your PC tower sits on one side or the other of the monitors. Only having the PC under the desk or in the middle of the desk is going to solve this issue, and not many people will want to return to the 90s.
Optical cables are going to be more expensive (likely because it will need transmit/receive hardware inside each of the connectors), and people who are not used to dealing with optical cables are going to likely be crushing them, twisting them, and breaking them in all kinds of ways because they won't be used to dealing with optical cables. It's going to take quiet the pubic service announcement to get people used to dealing with optical.
I feel this is an important area that must be explored when purchasing a monitor - the connection from the monitor to the GPU. Most importantly, what is the difference between all the configurations (including the Mac variants) - so shall I go HDMI or DP and what does each variation give me?
Is that a project you have considered?
Theres really only going to be a few situations where there'll be a difference: A. Your monitor configuration exceeds the bandwidth available of your cable so you need to use DSC or reduce resolution/refresh rate/color depth. B. Sleep/hibernate protocols are different for different video ports. What might let you wake your monitor up from power off might not work when using a different cable. C. The individual cable or video port might be broken which can cause artifacting or no connection to be detected on the devices. D. The standards supported on one protocol are different than the standards supported on another (a recent example is HDMI 2.1 on Linux). These are the only circumstances where I'd imagine there'd be a difference. This really isnt enough to make an entire video about.
Does DP 1.4 also have sub-categories, the same way 2.1 has DP80, DP40, etc.?
It does but a) everything you will buy today will be DP 1.4a. b) only difference between DP 1.4 and 1.4a is in improvement in DSC quality (more profiles).
@@Meddixi Awesome, thanks!
Thank you for being always so thorough Tim !
Will you make similar videos on the HDMI equivalents? 2.1 listings are problematic
I think he did ... like 2 years ago when HDMI 2.1 was rather new. It's the same issue really, you can have 2.1, but without the full 48 Gbps link speed.
Even active optical cables are no guarantee of signal quality, as I've learned with Fibbr brand DP1.4 active cables. In fact, with their cables, somehow the shorter cables cause MORE dropouts. (What, do they put all the reject transceivers and fibers in the short cables?) It makes me wary of even trying DisplayPort 2.0.
1M cable: dropouts. 2M cable: slightly fewer dropouts. 3.3M cable: even fewer dropouts. 33-meter cable they sent me when I ordered a 3.3-meter cable: no dropouts.
Excellent work, much appreciated. Will pass on the info to other people and look forward to the actual review of that Aorus.
In Germany, you can get only:
Cable Matters 80G DisplayPort 2.1 (1m or 1,5 m) there should be a 2m version, but It's nowhere listed even on cable matters.
The best cable (available) comes from Club3d:
Club3d CAC-1092: 80G DisplayPort 2.1 (1,6 m) (I got 4 items of this, really great cables).
This 1,6m version is much better than the 1,2m version which was mentioned in this video:
Club3d CAC-1092-1,6 m: 4K240Hz, 8K60Hz and *10K60Hz* (DP80)
Club3d CAC-1091-1,2 m: 4K240Hz, 8K60Hz and *10K30Hz* (DP80)
A good middle solution: Cable Matters 80G DisplayPort 2.1 *DP54* with 3m (available).
Excellent video!!! Incredible how these retailers decide to lie instead of being honest. Even if it "works" at higher bandwidth... if its not certified at a specific speed, then its not certified. Don't lie to the consumer.
My doubt about using Display stream compression is how noticeable is the difference?
I never seen side-by-side comparisons showing the same image/video with/without DSC being used.
It's like MP3 or JPEG, most people can't tell the difference.
The mp3 analogy is sufficient. There will always be the hardcore audience that only want flac files but in the end when you have a standard Logitech speaker no one will hear the difference. Of course for editing it will make a huge difference having uncompressed formats but I doubt that a consumer display can even show that .
you will see the difference between real HDR10 and fake HDR with compression.
Check with Blue jeans cables to see if they sell a longer Display port 2.1 compatible cable. All their cables are tested with a Fluke cable tester.
There was the same issue with HDMI 2.1 when it first came out. You could only really get cables.up to 6ft in length.
I have this gigabyte monitor, and at least for now I can just switch it to DP 1.4 mode in the OSD until the cable situation gets better.
I bought this monitor more for Gigabytes superior KVM implementation anyway.
3:53 - i can feel the cable's pain - always let the twists out when pulling it straight like that ...
Glad this is being addressed, thank you Monitors Unboxed!
3:15 Well I can, with absolute certainty, say that my PC and my graphic card ARE in very close proximity! :D
hahaha, thanks, hadn't noticed.
Here's to hoping Steve finds out for a ribbing on next podcast 😆
You needs a 6m PCI riser cable!
The mention of club3d.... That brings me back. If you've been through that era, you know
Why don't they switch to optical cables? More bandwidth, can be longer, thinner, as standards improve you'll likely be able to use your old cable for a long time,... are the receivers/transmitters really that expensive?
Thank you. Very informative as always! Are you able to do a recommendation/review on the longer length HDMI 2.1 certification? It would be really useful for a lot of people out there using this current standard. Cheers
It's kinda insane the industry didn't transition to optical cables a long time ago considering bandwidth for digital video has been a problem that existed since the DVI days.
But I guess they just couldn't manage to make HDCP annoying enough with optical cables… 🤷♀
While the fibre itself is rather cheap, the transceivers are still expensive. Looking at 40GbE QSFP+ active cables (which have 80Gb total bandwidth), you'd be spending 30-60 Euro for a 5m cable.
Bare MPO-12 fibre would be cheaper, but fibre connectors are definitely NOT durable enough for "mass consumer market" use.
You can’t bend optical since it’s glass and glass break.
Two of my 4 cables I needed 10ft (3m). Certified 2.1 but lower speeds but DSC is fine with me and required no matter what. By time this is all sorted we will have 4k 480hz monitors that need DSC even with UHBR20.
I think they already established 120Gbps connections for USB-Alt Mode - wa sthat last year - but yeah who knows if there's even equipment for that. xP
8:15 ....I was looking at that exact cable on amazon (germany) right then 😅
Aren't there optical Displayport 2.1 80Gbps cables already? Cost is higher, but length isn't a factor anymore. I have been using 30m Hdmi 2.1 Optical cables for years.
so comprehensive, thank you!
I bought the
Silkland DisplayPort 2.1 Cable 3M [VESA Certified], DP 2.0 Cable [16K@60Hz, 8K@120Hz, 4K@240Hz] 80Gbps HDR, HDCP DSC 1.2a, Display Port 2.1 Cord you described and it replaced a 3m 1'4 cable that was resulting in a black screen for a few seconds on a regular basis. No drop outs and a stable output to my dell oled 3440x 1440 at144hz. good for that output but probably not 80Gps
I would love to see a full video on cable recommendations for all resolutions and refresh rates. That would be rad!
I recall the struggle getting a reasonable length DP 1.4 cable for my first 144Hz monitor years ago. These days I can't even find an HDMI cable that doesn't cause a intermittent flash artifact between my RTX30 GPU and my LG C2, requiring either a PC restart or a cable re-plug. The least problematic cable so far is the one that came with my PS5 but the GPU and display still won't handshake properly a third of the time.
So, there IS a solution for longer cables... but as ever it is expensive: fiber optic. There are fiber optic DP80 cables out there, and they can go to extremely long lengths. Fiber Command is one that I've personally used, though not at 80gbit speeds. Even there you have to be careful and check to see that it is actually DP80/80gbit certified as there are plenty of them that are only DP40 because they use basically the same transmitters that they do in fiber optic HDMI 2.1 cables. Any that support 80gbits are going to be over $100, so not cheap cables. But if you want high bandwidth Display Port over longer distances right now, it is an option, just an expensive one.
It also has a 'bandwidth configuration' problem in the different UHBR layouts that are not made clear to consumers.
I'm waiting on a company to send me a test sample of their 10ft UHBR20 (DP80) cable. Should be certified, so that's nice - although maybe not the one I'll receive. I believe they're also doing a 6ft option.
I didn't double-check with them, but I assume both ends are full size DP.
I'd wager if they're working on it, plenty others are, so we should see some improvement to the DP80 cables market in the next few months.
Been using fiber options for excessively long runs of HDMI2.1 for a while. Hoping they come out with fiber options for DP80 this year. The 6ft and 10ft options I mentioned are unfortunately copper only for now. Cost-effective, but limited to more typical (and arguably practical) lengths.
Hey man, have you considered reviewing the new msi optix mag274qrf-qd e2 monitor? Ive heard its quite good but i always come to your videos to see if it's really true.
It just a cable... soon they will be no issue... but how long a 4k qd-oled 240hz last?
This was super helpful, thank you!
My gf says the same thing, it's the length thats the issue
You heard the solution: stop being passive and go be active
length doesnt matter if the technic is right
She just has to get a reserve cable if the one being used is too short.
Putting the longer one in a drawer comes to mind.
Try finger, but hole.
Not really an issue imo. It's more about positioning
I went through this a few weeks ago, predicted it wouls happen with a 4k high refresh monitor for me, and yes you can't find official VESA certified DP80 longer than a meter YET, but i'm sure a longer one should come out soon
I'm not sure if the issue is (just) the cable. In my experience, most interference / signal reflection issues happen at the *connectors,* where the wires can't be twisted / shielded. And using MiniDP instead of full-size DP might be part of the problem.
There is a reason most high-throughput interconnects use fiber optics, it is just far easier to cram a lot of data into light than a super-high frequency signal on copper.
I can't tell you over the years how many times I bought a cable with terms that should work but don't. I've bought expensive cables that suck, and cheap cables that work well above the spec they list. I feel like you've got a golden opportunity to do the community and world a service of just buying a truckload of cable brands/specs at three or four lengths and posting results with affiliate links for the ones that work. The ones that fail to meet advertised spec regardless of actual certification go to some kind of public wall of shame and we consumers can contact or avoid those companies to improve or go out of business.
It always starts like this, it seems like its usually a few years after a new DP capability before you start seeing 10FT/3M+ cables, I just started being about to get viable ones for 4K144, and I can now get those like 25Ft, im sure they will figure it out with these, if nothing else we will go fiber optic, which really isnt that expensive anymore
Well crap, I was hoping that DisplayPort would see the folly that HDMI pulled did with the 2.1 spec, but instead they went "Yessir, I'll have some of that" and served up a heaping plate of it.
It's still early in the lifecycle, and long before I need it for my systems as I'm happy with 1440p/144Hz so things might get better in the future (especially with pieces like this, pointing out the issues and confusion), but I kinda doubt it.
Bandwidth and cable length seems to be a gigantic issue industry-wide right now. Try finding a USB4/Thunderbolt4 cable longer than your forearm for instance. That's less of an issue than this 1.2M limit, but still incredibly restrictive. Basically requires you to have your desktop directly behind the monitor, and forget almost any VESA mounts.
Maybe some of these new ultra-high-bandwidth standards that aren't providing power (like DP, HDMI & Oculink) need to just bite the bullet and jump over to fiber optic. Active cables can work a bit, but seems more like an intermediary bandage and can be more prone to failures, connection issues and inferior parts being used. It'll certainly make them more expensive and the amount of companies able to make fiber cables is fewer, but it might be worth it in the long run.
I was at least 3 years late to the 4K HDR 120Hz club in my living room, and shocked how hard it was to get a 3m cable that actually managed that. 48Gbps cables are either short, expensive, or just fail to deliver. If it was this bad in late 2023, how bad was it when 4K@120Hz launched way back in 2019?
As someone who has bought 3 DP cables in the past before I finally got my monitor working properly... I appreciate this video a lot. Big Cable wants to sell more cables I guess!? (/s) VESA should honestly feel required to clear things up for consumers.
I’m so confused as to how such a simple piece of hardware can be so difficult to make work. I’ve literally had to purchase 3 different HDMI cables before mine started working, but I never had issues with Display Port. So strange 😅
It is theoretically possible that some of these uncertified cables can achieve 80gbps speeds under certain circumstances (such as in a zero EMI environment), but if they were only certified for a lower bandwidth then it's very unlikely that they can be relied on in a normal home or office environment. VESA really should not be allowing companies to advertise cables as capable of achieving speeds greater than they're certified for.
I've almost always had to buy separate cables for high end displays, audio equipment and lighting. If anything you've highlighted how cheaply most standard cables are manufactured. HDMI gets around this through compression--not better cable quality.
This seems odd to people who rarely (if ever) buy high end equipment but the cables provided by high end electronics OEMs are more of a courtesy and for trouble shooting than for use in the end application. It is more common than not that high end electronics applications obligate custom cables and the OEMs don't want to waste money on something they know probably isn't going to get used--same with power cables.
I recommend next video to be the dozen of ideas to name display cables. We can wait a month or 2 for the Gigabyte review
Seeing how goddamn slow alt+tab, or any other mode changes, is with DSC, I'm more than glad that the FO32U2P supports the solution for this insanity and cant wait for new GPUs.
I mean it takes several seconds to do a alt+tab out of exclusive fullscreen. Unbelievable. I would lose several seconds of a game intro cutscene, because starting a game does the same.
There seems to be indeed no harm in image quality by the DSC, but I have no comparison of course, but the insane slow mode changes are driving me crazy. I'm very, very glad now that the FO32U2P wont be the limiting factor in future.
I thought dsc doesn't result in image quality loss? Is there any downside to using dp1.4a? Why would someone opt for this new standard if there are so many issues?
What about daisy chaining? If you have two monitors can you use two DP2.1/80 1m cables?
I wonder if you can use a docking station as an intermediary? If so that would be at least 6'.
They could use a repeater build into the cable, wich allows more length of the cable
Great video! I would be interested to see which cables work with the rest of the Gen 3 QD-OLED monitors (DP 1.4 DSC) length wise. I mean I do understand that its easier to drive than DP 2.1 however Ive been getting answers even from VESA certified DP 1.4 manufacturers that users with 3m or even 2m cables have been having problems with signal loss with this 4k 240hz spec even tho theoretically they shouldn't. Could that have something to do with DSC pushing the 1.4 spec to its absolute limits? I would be interested to see if there is a single 3m DP cable that can run that spec.
I am not surprised about pricing and length. Similarly fast QSFP28 DAC (100 GbE) cables cost as much or more. AOC even significantly more. I wonder if we ever switch to QSFP28 for the interface instead of Displayport. We then could use different transceivers to accommodate different needs for cable length / speed, even fiber optics.
My problem is I need a 15 to 20 foot long cable (2 actually) because I have a sit stand desk and there is no way to put my PC on my desk and I dont want to put it under my desk either. The reason for the length I need is so the cables are not spanning free air and there is no risk from moving the desk up, and the PC is on a separate stand off to the side configured in such a way that a 10 foot cable would be too short unless i never lift my desk, and really i need a 16 foot but it seems to only go 15 then 20.
I dont need DP 2.1 features I just need somethin that will maintain 165Hz at 1440p with that length due to my new office layout.
Can a DP 1.4 cable that is 15 to 20 feet long do 165Hz at 1440p? Assuming it is actually a 1.4 cable and not just claiming it is?
Is there something between a 1.4 cable and a 2.1 cable that can do it?
I likely will have bought somethin before I get any kind of answer from this but would like to know regardless.
What I noticed when I bought a 240Hz OLED is that the cable that came with it can only do that at 8 bit without DSC, and you need to enable DSC to even get 10 bit color space, so there's definitely a displayport bandwidth problem.
I've just been looking around and noticed the 16K rated DP2.1 cables on Amazon and it'll say in the description 80gbps for the 1m but 40gbps for the 2m and 3m. I've actually been using DP1.4 cables on my 4k 240hz and 4k 144hz monitors. I still get the 4k 240hz on my Neo G8 which is obviously because it's using the upsampling system they have.
I'm going to try and swap to newer cables, I can get away with 1m or even 0.5m with my G8 because my PC is on the desk right next to the monitor.
Why was I not informed this channel is a thing??? I had no idea it even exists >:(
Always quality content from you guys.
Any reviews of the LG 27GR95UM coming soon?
But I got this monitor now and its a pure dream. I got it today evening and I'm still at default settings of the monitor and the defaults are already superb to me.
I think we're starting to get to the point where we might as well start to embrace fibre as a mainstream connectivity solution when it comes to desktop computers and pressure manufacturers to integrate the hardware that's necessary for cheaper passive fibre cables to become the norm. It might increase prices initially, but I believe it'll eventually benefit us all in the long run (fast USB-C cables are also a nightmare and it's not getting any better)
Why we cannot build something like DAC 100GbE connections, in server rooms they work for 5 to 7 meters, and 100GbE is even more than 80Gb? And isn't Radeon 7900 XTX supporting UHBR20?
Pretty sure that the 7000 series only has UHBR13.5. Mentioned in the last video. It’s quite funny now how much AMD advertised the 7000 series with DP 2.1.
A video testing whether active fiber display cables (DisplayPort, HDMI) add latency or have any other downsides might be beneficial
I think the DP cable spec table can be done better, there is actually different certified levels for DP cable below v1.4
So why they don't use fiber opitc in DP 2.1 20UHBR cables?
Try to create a 3 monitor setup with 1.0 meter cables. You basically have to put the PC behind the center monitor.
I suppose I can't use my optical thunderbolt (3) cable either, since that's limited to 40Gbps (or 20? i don't even know)
This type of stuff happens when there is too much focus on manufacturers and not enough on customers in these standards groups. They know what they are doing and it’s intentional to confuse consumers.
It may be down to physics too- I know wifi isn't the exact same thing, but based on the frequency of data transfer the max range of say, 3G is like 100km, while 5G is only like 1km. I assume as the bandwidth of the copper increases, so too does the range decrease. Eventually we may just need new display port standards based on fibre instead of copper.
I have been asking for this for a while, why dont we have fiber optics cables yet? we had those for toslink Spdif stuff for audio years agao
Will you be reviewing the lg 27gr95um monitor?
Very interesting...
I am using a 5m DP 1.4 cable (4k 120 Hz), and the connection is... pretty bad. Sometimes there is some "snow" on the screen, sometimes I have to bend the cable a bit, and sometimes I have to change the DisplayPort slot on the GPU.
So, it sounds like 5m for DP 2.1 is basically guaranteed to not happen any time soon (unless you spend >$100 for some fiber optics converters or whatever).