Long-Term Effects of Manipulation | Rejection, Emotional Numbness, and Personality Disorders
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- Опубликовано: 28 мар 2020
- This video answers the questions: Can I talk with the nature of rejection with the different personality disorders? What is emotional numbness? Does rejection lead to emotional numbness? What is the long-term effect of being manipulated? I will cover all the personality disorders, placing a special emphasis on cluster B personality pathology (antisocial, narcissistic, borderline, and histrionic personality disorders).
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The 10 Personality Disorders:
Cluster A (odd, eccentric)
Paranoid Personality Disorder: pervasive pattern of distrust and hostility
Schizoid Personality Disorder: a tendency to be unresponsive to social dimensions, a loner
Schizotypal Personality Disorder: odd thinking, magical beliefs
Cluster B (erratic, dramatic)
Antisocial Personality Disorder: criminality, irresponsibility, and impulsivity
Borderline Personality Disorder: fear of abandonment, relationship difficulties
Narcissistic Personality Disorder: grandiose sense of self-importance, arrogance, sense of entitlement
Histrionic Personality Disorder: attention seeking and provocative
Cluster C (anxious, fearful)
Avoidant Personality Disorder: not engaging in social situations out of fear of humiliation and rejection
Dependent Personality Disorder: over relying on somebody for support
Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder: perfectionism, rigid adherence to rules
DeWall, C. N., Baumeister, R. F., & Masicampo, E. J. (n.d.). Rejection: Resolving the Paradox of Emotional Numbness after Exclusion. Feeling Hurt in Close Relationships, 123-142. doi:10.1017/cbo9780511770548.008
Roberts, T. (2019). Feeling nothing: Numbness and emotional absence. European Journal of Philosophy, 27(1), 187-198. doi-org.mylibrary.wilmu.edu/1...
LeBlanc, N. J., Dixon, L., Robinaugh, D. J., Valentine, S. E., Bosley, H. G., Gerber, M. W., & Marques, L. (2016). PTSD and Romantic Relationship Satisfaction: Cluster- and Symptom-Level Analyses. Journal of Traumatic Stress, 29(3), 259-267. doi-org.mylibrary.wilmu.edu/1...
Vandervoort, D., & Rokach, A. (2003). Posttraumatic Relationship Syndrome: The Conscious Processing of the World of Trauma. Social Behavior & Personality: An International Journal, 31(7), 675-686. doi-org.mylibrary.wilmu.edu/1...
Vandervoort, D., & Rokach, A. (2006). Posttraumatic Relationship Syndrome. Clinical Case Studies, 5(3), 231-247. doi:10.1177/1534650104264934
Baumeister, R. F., DeWall, C. N., & Vohs, K. D. (2009). Social Rejection, Control, Numbness, and Emotion: How Not to be Fooled by Gerber and Wheeler (2009). Perspectives on Psychological Science, 4(5), 489-493. doi:10.1111/j.1745-6924.2009.01159.x
Rokach, A., & VanderVoort, D. (2007). Posttraumatic Relationship Syndrome: A Treatment Model. Journal of Social Distress and the Homeless, 16(1), 22-48. doi:10.1179/sdh.2007.16.1.22
Vandervoort, D., & Rokach, A. (2004). Abusive relationships: Is a new category for traumatization needed? Current Psychology, 23(1), 68-76. doi:10.1007/s12144-004-1009-y
Gallegos, J. M., & Gasper, K. (2018). Differential effects of rejection and acceptance on feeling shocked, numb, and neutral. Emotion, 18(4), 536-550.
Howard, V. (2019). Recognising Narcissistic Abuse and the Implications for Mental Health Nursing Practice. Issues in Mental Health Nursing, 1-11. doi:10.1080/01612840.2019.1590485
When a narcissist has left your life and is no longer in control of your life it’s feels like coming out of a prison or out of a horrible nightmare. The sunshine of freedom is so sweet and you are far better off without that person.
Well said that’s exactly how I felt like I was in prison! I’m so glad that I finally woke up and left that never ending cycle!
Its not the person that leaves that breaks you ,its the financial fallout ,
@@carolmiles553 yes the financial issue is a big deal too
Spot on.
But now you know how to get along with a narcissist, so, let's you and me get a relationship going! I have the fun kind of narcissism. It's like being in a fun movie, and you're my beautiful redhead costar. We're going to make a blockbuster!!!🍑💨😁😯
The worst thing about this sort of manipulation/abuse is that you generally suffer in silence, it can even be hard to find people that believe you, especially when the abuser makes themselves out to be a victim that is leaving an abuser!
The brain fog and lack of confidence is debilitating and trying to explain to a professional what you're mind is trying to recover from us not just a lack of not wanting to accomplish a specific task. Starting it is outright impossible to get certain areas of life, in my case, banking. It's also an Attention Deficit Disorder. issue, always there prior. To be humiliated by an attorney for ASKING for help from the right person. He decided to end his part in my case in mediation. How many more are out there to reject you for inabilities and disabilities. Oh, the fall I took, I can start to bend over part way now. My abdomen feels like I've done a push up marathon in the past week or more. Sprained wrist on top of two arthritic wrists. I was sent home from the hospitals, x-ray of my back only, no pushing on my abdomen for pain opposite where my back hurts??? And I kid you not, this male nurse, an openly admitted narcissist and absolutely PROUD OF HIMSELF. I think I met a very grandiose NPD, my first of this outright boldness of his traits, and his beliefs ALL IS BLACK OR WHITE. THERE IS NO MIDDLE. When he confirmed to me, there is no grey area, no compromise, negotiation, or working out an equally laid out plan. NOPE, so proud of his arrogant response. It was just what I needed after laying myself up for at least a few days to a week, and absolutely no after care instructions to go home with, only no meds so I don't overdose??? What kind of talk is that to a patient, the last time I was in their hospital was 2009? Not like I visit on a weekly basis? I did something to deserve this treatment, but what?
I was trapped. My mother is a grandiose narcissist. I spent literally most of my life being treatment so badly. Didn't matter who l told i was the problem. I was diagnosed with mental health problems. Spent a long time in and out of psychiatric hospitals. Everyone knows now. Unfortunately for me "to little to late."
@@kathyfrancis9229 Please always remember, we ONLY live in the present instant. The past is DEAD, totally DEAD. If I can remember this, it helps me. 🙏🏽
All very true
When a narcissist discards you, it's the equivalent of the trash taking itself out. Thank God for saving you, block and move on! 🙂 lucky you for real
@Jennifer Klopman
Love, Love, Love and oh so TRUE!
A clean break is ULTRA IMPORTANT!
too many people keep feeding the monster, and they are only degrading themselves in doing so
God does for us what we cannot do for ourselves
You sound insecure lol. Rejected much? 😂😂😂
@@jamesmitchell1614 Not true because why does he set it up in the first place and what about those cases in which this fortunate discarding doesn't happen? Intent good I guess, fallacious statement. (I'm so sour =D )
When I was younger, and well into adulthood, I was paralyzed with fear of making mistakes because of the criticism I received as a child that was always far out of proportion with the actual mistake. In my youth, I reasoned that it was better to fail to do something than to do something and fail and I missed a lot of opportunities because of it. I also learned to very effectively convince myself that I didn't care enough to do that thing. The last part of this video felt like it found a direct channel deep into my brain somehow.
I can TOTALLY relate Brant, may you find happiness and freedom. 🌹
I was so highly criticized in my childhood that I've become overly perfectionistic, but my creativity was almost completely destroyed by my parents and grandparents. My talent that I inherited from my family is in the arts, and, without the freedom to fail in the creative arts, I couldn't start developing my career. I got stuck at lower level jobs for a long time. Now I finally am starting to be able to allow myself to produce pieces without these necessarily having to be the best masterpiece ever made, which is an unattainable goal for a beginner that causes a crippling effect on an artistic nature.
Me too. The amount of ridicule, humiliation, and emotional blackmail combined with physical and verbal abuse from certain family members made me hide in my room or in the woods behind our house. Even then I wasn’t safe, but it was better than exposing myself to potential abuse.
When I was lonely and did try to interact it never went well for long. Then it would take me quite a while before I cared to try again.
I also had such a hard time understanding what I was doing “wrong”. Anything I tried to learn was just a fun time for people to laugh at me and no one to explain. I would get so embarrassed or upset I’d just stop and hide in my room. I didn’t learn to ride a bike until I was 24. 😳
I quit drawing for about 10 years due to an abusive ex, and I’ve only picked it back up about a year and a half ago.
Love to all my fellow stunted learners and abuse and trauma survivors. I hope everyone reading this knows they deserve love and a caring environment where they can learn without judgment. 💕
@@laurahire7208 I can relate to what you said about being lonely and trying to interact. My parents, grandparents, uncles, aunts, and some of the other adults that they brought around would actively ignore me for my whole childhood at every age. Whenever I tried to tell my mother anything that had happened in my life or that I had seen on TV or anything else, she would refuse to make eye contact and start talking to the dogs unnecessarily while we were all just in the house, saying lovey-dovey little endearments to the dogs, interrupting what I was saying.
@@marythompson7874 I’m so sorry that happened to you. I’m glad to hear you are now working on your talents and passions. 💕
Well said. Especially the part about how having relationships with these people may hold you back in your own abilty to grow.
They call that a 'toxic relationship'.
Yes, it's very true that you feel that you are not allowed to make any mistakes! They are dangerous. Very dangerous. They give the narcissist tools to control you and hurt you. Shame you etc. And you probably feel also so tired while trying to survive with the narcissist that you don't even have energy or time to do anything.
i really needed to hear this😭😭
@@annehynynen8153 True bc you constantly have to recover from stabs, hurt, frustrations and rebuild yourself again so the life energy for other people things is minimal.
They cause stagnation and paralization.
@@peaceofmindofpeace1650 Exactly!
The most cruel thing the narcissist can do is to awaken love in someone they have every intention of discarding like garbage to move on to their recycled or new supply. They get bored quickly. Do not let them return and be their recycled goods. Be happy you escaped their clutches and pity the recycled person. The pain ends. With time.
This reminds me of Bob Marley's quote: The biggest coward of a man is to awaken the love of a woman without the intention of loving her
@@regppMD There is an abundance of hurt women in the comments I see. Things sometimes just end or go wrong, it happens, all people can get bored or fed up, not only narcissists
@@regppMD Bob Marley sounds like he was a really good person. Now i want to look up his music.
But woman love the bully right? you make your bed so lay in it.
Sometimes their excuses and lies are pathetic. They expect me to like him after all these? Delusional.
You can still grow. Just not with them. Not next to them.
Exactly. These people stifle your growth, and then once you get away from them, you can heal yourself and start to grow and change for the better. These people don't want you to grow because they want someone to control, as well as for you to be just as dead inside as they are.
@@AishaVonFossen What if you cant get away from them? Life is hell.
@@raphaellavelasquez8144 meditate, treat yourself kind. Show yourself the love you deserve everyday. Reach out to someone you know can live you correctly. A friend, a co-worker, a teacher. Or anyone you feel safe with. If you can't be inspired for yourself, do it for them.
Raphaella Velasquez Exactly. My former husband lives to destroy my life. He stalks and threatens me almost daily. I reported him to the police, but his chief of police cousin did nothing. It’s a nightmare.
@@brandymoore7191 my stepfather was like that when I was a teenager. My mother divorced him and he lived to get revenge. He kidnapped my brother and hid him out of state for a year and a half. I get a lot of help from youtube. I keep journals. "Growth after Abuse" is a good channel. When my phone runs ot of batteries I read my journals. When I read my own words back to myself it seems to make me feel better. Lisa Romano and Melanie Tonia Evans. Also have good channels.❤
When people reject you they want you to over react so when you show no response I think that is stronger because it is unexpected. The Narcissist wants you to suffer, that is why they reject you. Don't stop being you!
Emotional detachment is a good adaptive mechanism
✅
That's only true of malignant narcs
The negative impact of 'silent treatment' (a passive aggressive form of control, i think) on a child from a parent has been incredibly damaging. Knowing I've done something wrong (but not what) and being punished for it through a lack of affection and attention was a constant for me. Walking on egg shells and being anxious all the time in case I did something wrong.
I have consistently 'sought' out people who would scrutinise and emotionally control everything I've done. I've felt an overwhelming fear of making mistakes to the point where I'm almost unable to move (figuratively speaking)... and then been blamed, looked down upon and criticised for lack of achievement! I understand all this now but the patterns and negative self-beliefs are so deeply ingrained it's hard to move forward in a healthy way.
Thanks for this analysis!
My ex used the silent treatment.i was like damn this B. Is cold After awhile it got to me..then I realized her mother does the same thing to her..and probably did since she was a baby, like wow. I know it would have effected my little developing baby brain because it effected my resilient grown man brain.
My dad did this shit all my life. And i let it go on for so long that it made me nervous, a people-pleaser, and just generally low self-esteem. He doesnt and will never apologize, of which i dont expect it. He’s in the hospital rn. Its an auto immune disease, n i can’t help but think its a form of karma being dished out. Buy hes smarter than my mom. She aint any less self-centered and dumber. I started catching her lies years ago. I pray for them, but I pray more for my own sanity. I really beliece im in a cult butthe pathetic Neigborhood is in on it, its pathetic and hilariousignorant narcisists, gossips, hypocritical “christians”.. Now i see why my sister left, and made her own life. I know they should never see this comment, cus its in obscure section on different languge than theirs. CPlus im not “popular” but they will. You an feel it, and react using strawmen. They know they cant directly bring it, becipause then they will end up admitting to their privacy invasion. Lol, its really like a game now. But oh woah woah, im the drugged, schizophrenic, looser. Crimmy.
Stay prayed up folks, we living in some weird times.
Years back I lost my job and was broken up with (over the phone) by my partner of 4 years. And this all happened on my birthday. I don't think I ever felt as emotionally numb as I did that day.
I wish I knew this stuff in high school, it could have spared me so much trouble, thank you Dr. Grande for helping me understand these intriguing subjects.
Right there with you
Back then, schools weren't as versed in psychology as they are now. Geez, I had the worst abusive teachers. I remember there was one kid who just had a mole removed from his back. To punish him, our teacher grabbed him and smashed him up against the wall. We all just sat there stunned and terrified. Yeah, a really great learning environment.
Same
it would be wonderful to have a more in-depth education surrounding the topics of spotting the warning signs of manipulation with malevolent intent , and avoiding group think in general. For a society so built around individualism(no problems with that), you'd think there would be more attention given to teaching one to use the skills of critical thinking and self preservation( I.e. physical, mental, and emotional). Regardless, its a real treasure to have people like Dr. Grande helping the average person understand the psychology behind so many peoples behavior and personality traits. A gold mine of information.
This should be taught in school. All personality disorders so we do not waste years of our lives beliving we have anything to do with the abuse we receive.
I was emotionally & mentally abused all thru my childhood by my manipulative narcissistic mother. She eventually kicked me out on the street at the age of 15. Later in life I had a lot of problems trusting people being close to me. In the end I found a partner I loved who was generally quite loving and caring but she had borderline personality disorder, so she was often lashing out at me and manipulating me in bizarre ways. After a year of emotional chaos I had a breakdown that lead to hospitalisation. Then my family, led by my my manipulative mother began attacking me and my partner emotionally when I was in recovery. My relationship failed from the combination of pressures, it was devastating. I ceased all contact with my family 5 years ago. Since then I have slowly recovered but I have run the whole gamut of emotions from numbness to extreme rage. Dealing with the long term personal results of extreme manipulation at the hands of those who are meant to love you can be a monumental task
:(
I agree 👍 still recovering here, too. God bless you!
Sounds familiar & So true!
My Mother feels no impact or EMPATHY for my LIFETIME of OPPRESSION by famdamnly!
It’s true…monumental from childhood through adulthood and now I’m retired and still recovering and so much more joyful and stable mother and daughter did a number on me and now I’m free of both. It gets so much better once you have a name for it and know it’s not your but a mental disease
This helps me heal and understand why I’m so “stuck” emotionally, I’m not allowing myself mistakes. I have to acknowledge I’m not around narcissistics, I’m safe- this is a stage I can develop out of. 🙂
😭😭😭
I recently started finding positives in my mistakes, and opening myself up to them instead of beating myself up. It's just a start, like months ago.
@@daeneville2157 Thank u 💓 for expressing this.
Being raised in a npd, psychopath & sociopath environment I was unaware that I picked an npd person for a spouse.
You're so spot on with this video. Emotional rejection, criticism and invalidation tactics (to name a few) were typically used to harm in order for my spouse to gain and keep control. It created numbness. . .
Disturbing individual. After seeing the dynamic with my now ex-spouse's family at the time, along with the knowledge I now have- I see the abuse and manipulation and control his mother used so cruelly in their family. It's not an excuse for the abuse to continue, but a definite sign of generational trauma and dysfunction.
TY again for an insightful work.
Isn't it an eye-opening experience to see the person's parent in action and to imagine the horrible effect on a helpless child? You empathize with the person who once was but is no more.
@@kevinhornbuckle Yes. It is true that when you get a glimpse of what people are capable of it becomes somewhat easier to see the harmful behavior perpetuated in other families. Even my own family. I eventually learned to detect it in various forms in people.
The brainwashing by a parent that inflicts their altered perception of reality on others inevitability forces individuals involved to accept reality as morphed.
I don't blame the character disturbed individuals anymore. I realize the lack of insight to change is the deficit they carry.
It brings us though later in life as survivors to a point where we are forced to learn about trauma, do inner child work / self-esteem work and just learn to individuate. Those of us that grew up in it , who survive it hopefully learn our authenticity. Even learning through pain at least we can learn the difference. I mean the essential need for difference, uniqueness in human beings. The same can't be said for the character disturbed. They are stuck in The Matrix of hurt and be hurt by choosing to inflict pain on others.
It may sound a bit pitiful but I'd rather have spent 40 years of my life learning about narcissistic abuse the hard way only to find out that I'm an individual with unique traits. Of course with issues yeah but not abusive, toxic or obstinate to change.
Hi Dr.G, My fathenemy lol father/enemy was similar.He was a norovirus lol, borderline and psychopath which I endured his physical, verbal, sexual and emotional abuse yucky, yikes, ugh and argh.All that left me feeling lonely, numb, bitter, unloved, not feeling wanted, invalidated, sell destructive, rejected and not good enough.Take care and thanks.
@@kevinhornbuckle Still is rather, under the disguise, the armour, the defensive response they are still stuck there... unreachable, other than in the ways they keep repeating and recycling themselves and anyone else that gets too close, through it all over again.
Narcissism - definitely generational. Married to an only child of a notorious malignant; I'd left near 50 yrs. ago, but I've stayed, for "clinically classic" and "other" reasons; it's complicated.
For some odd reason, Dr. Grande’s videos cheer me up. It could be that it’s one of the few constants (at least for me) during turbulent times.
The intellectual understanding seems to facilitate healing.
M Z I feel the same way
I feel the same way. His voice also calms me when I feel anxious.
1000% on the same boat
S. D. Yeah
This videos came into my life at the right time. My abuser would hate when I would watch these, these reminded me of the manipulation I was put under. He told me his manipulation was a self-fulfilling prophecy becasue I educated myself on Vulnerable Narcissism. I watch these types of videos because I was with a diagnosed narc in the past and I want to learn and know and grow. If my most recent partner/abuser wasn't abusive, I'm sure he wouldn't make such a big deal out of me watching this channel. In fact, the only reason he knew is because he monitored my history without my consent. I'm safe now, he's trying to find new supply with my friends. He reached out today, I didn't respond. May he please leave me alone.
Liliana🌺🌸💐🌷🌼
I hope you will remain no contact. Mine has been reaching despite a lack of response on my part.
Good luck, stay strong and keep no contact! You deserve better :) Educating yourself is a great thing to do.
I hope you decide not to have any contact at all, and that you are able to find a counselor or support group to help you through this difficult time. I left my miserable marriage ( of 28 yrs) 8 years ago with no preparation and no money. I had a small overnight bag with clean underwear, socks and my blood pressure medicine. Stayed in a friend's guest room for 6 months and slowly got on my feet. I'm married to a wonderful man (for 3 years now) and happier every day! Life is worth living now! I'm praying for you and others who are suffering to have the peace I have. God bless you
You are absolutely correct! Any non narcissistic people wouldn’t mind you watching these videos. They would watch these videos together with you and comfort you for what you have suffered in the past.
These longer, older video's are super helpful ... Dr. Grande many of us are victims suffering in silence ... I hate being the empath, feel as though I've lost respect for myself ... I'm beyond mentally drained after so many years ... I'm watching these older uploads several times, thank you wholeheartedly .
Yes... I haven't been able to speak. Figuratively yes. Also literally five years ago, three and six months of not speaking and barely throughout that period. And barely throughout my youth. Take care of you. Eat healthy, sleep, rest, exercise, fun stuff, you know it all. Just do it. And look for "healthy" people to connect with. My brain is so warped, I'm not able to distinguish them. So for precaution sake I'm just hermitting life away for now. I'm waiting for "help". So far been alone, doing it alone. The waiting list time was said to be longer than before (global event) and had been set for four months. I'm already waiting 10 months so far... Haven't heard anything from them. Called them once to give my new address. Told my doc wanna stop getting help. I said the hotline for suicide suggested I'd call to see what position I'm at for the waiting list. She said I shouldn't call and she'd contact the social worker, who'm I've been talking to once a week for about two months now. Six days or so after my doc appointment I asked the social worker if the doc called. He said no. And I've been open about the suicide feels, I "had to leave". I told him about my situation as well. I'm just so confused. On top of that my "partner" said a curse word to me three days later while I still was recovering from "the suicide in my mind". I've been depleted, my brain hurt a lot after. I just NEED to go autopilot hermit, it's the only way to stay sane and safe for me. I was waiting for the emdr therapy. I've been diagnosed with depression 11 years ago. Somehow, according to a personal medical file, I saw ptsd when I was a child, but they've put an end date "2019". Did I magically became better without consultation before hand that they cancelled it, or do they write ptsd and an end date for every living being in their medical records??! And why hasn't anyone ever told me??! In 2017 doc said I have acute stress disorder. After -. At that Suffered abuse as a child, yes, only went once to the doc office for it, they've shined light in my eyes, literally, all I can remember from that moment. So last year I cancelled therapy waiting list, because I thought I was better. I did feel a bit better, but was very afraid to go. Now I'm totally not fine in my mind. They (did confirm) diagnosed trauma after the intake with their psychiatrist. They're specialized in trauma. I knew feelings wise since I was a child that this is trauma from my research from books. I even read the dictionary, passion for reading, yeah... Escapism..? When everyone around you pretends abuse is normal somehow... I can't seem to take myself seriously, it takes a lot to even opening up and "ask for help", whatever help means. I do my best to help myself. Which is ironic, cuz I feel my mind is sick. How can a sick person cure... So yeah, the psychiatrist of this social worker said my depression was getting better when I had the intake, he was so wrong..? A month later my feels were overwhelmed when I woke up. That's why I called the suicide hotline and I left without saying something to my partner, I just couldn't. Now I get to see why, the emotional unavailability. I want the healthy kind of support. The one that elevates me. Not the one that keeps knocking me down when I try to get up. Living life blind. I've been gradually going non contact with everyone in my life. When I realized the illusion I made myself to believe I was living in. It has been easy when they've distanced themselves long ago. There was no contact prior the no contact of some sorts. No one even noticed that I left. The one that knew apparently kept it a secret out of shame. Couldn't cry for five years, so much horrific events took place, untill the very bitter end. I was at peace being alone with God when I was younger and I'll be at peace with God now I understand. Thanks for your listening eyes. 👋✌🖖🌌💖💫
It is our duty and a form of taking responsibility to become more emotionally mature and knowledgeable of psychopathy/narcissism as empaths. It is not entirely my fault my past narcissist have broken windows in not only my own home but at others but it is my responsibility to not put myself in those situations with those kind of people or allow myself to be manipulated by those kinds of people to reach such points. I hope you learn to grow and love yourself as well as the gift of empathy we share. 💙
@@bbdn5123 thank you for taking the time to share your experience here. I'm sorry you have struggled so long, and I was hoping you are bit better today. You are not! Alone!🙏🏖️
Moral of the story: be happy with yourself, 'cause chances are you're going to be rejected!
Afonso de Portugal it’s hard to be happy with yourself if you grew up with these people as caregivers and then choose them as partners unknowingly
@@gangstalkingboglims8752 No doubt. But one can learn once he understands that. It will take many years and in some cases therapy, but it's possible.
Afonso de Portugal for sure
I am a very "moral" person.
Yep, been down that road many times. Be okay with yourself, and to hell with what the normies think, because many of them are *NOT* normal people because of the wide spread mal-parenting of children and the huge portion of them with personality disorders.
Every single manipulation tactic all but implies the use of the lying tactic and the gaslighting tactic. I actually dislike it a little calling out gaslighting as a manipulation tactic as it's actually an effect. All manipulation tactics will contribute to it by nature of what manipulation is. Some tactics however certainly take the gaslighting effect to a whole different level. Blatant lies that are so bad they insult your intelligence is one of them. That kind of shit will make you feel like you are in the twilight zone after a while. Here are some of the reasons they do this: To test their control. To feel superior and/or entertainment. This proves to themselves how much control they have over you. In the end, you will give up and you will not leave (trauma bonded). In the process of getting to the giving up stage, you will go through some pretty nasty emotional states ending in massive amounts of cognitive dissonance to swallow all of that. Cognitive dissonance is a trauma defense mechanism where you essentially lie to yourself in various ways so that you can bring back some semblance of equilibrium to the insanity you find yourself unable to escape from. As part of the ‘backing you into an emotional corner’ tactic. This is a tactic where you are manipulated into being emotionally unstable inevitably leading to you losing your shit. This gives the narcissist a big dopamine burst, they feel powerful and superior having so deftly controlled you and manipulated into this emotional state. To finish the little game they play, they make sure to point out how unhinged and unstable you are and suggest that perhaps you need help or medication. Of course, you will internalize all that shame and guilt and the million other raging emotions they have created and swallow all that essentially allowing them to scapegoat their blame and accountability onto you. Bring on some more cognitive dissonance and gaslighting effects. To condition you to expect less respect, and ultimately put up with more abuse. You will tire of the inevitable circular argument trying to convince the narcissist of the blatantly obvious lie and eventually find yourself challenging them less and less as you subconsciously accept the fact that if you do it will just make your life and emotional state more miserable and you will be denied the satisfaction of any kind of ‘win’ even if it is easy to disprove. This is part of the domination process and makes sure all the power in the relationship ends up with them by the end. To turn your mind to mush as the gaslighting effect takes hold more and more over time. This makes you even easier to control. Many times while easy to disprove it requires some kind of concession of some obvious truth that the narcissist can just doggedly refuse to agree with or remember (‘the intentional forgetting’ tactic and the ‘feigned confusion or ignorance’ tactics are often employed for this). So, in fact, it is not so easy to prove when the narcissist refuses to correctly remember what happened 10 min ago or accept sound logic or reasoning. You will just turn blue in the face trying. Of course, in some cases it is indisputable. A phone log or something. My experience is when this kind of stuff happens it wasn’t their intention typically, although sometimes it was. But in these scenarios, you will typically get some sort of angry ‘invalidating’ tactic, with some good old ‘manufactured rage’ and ‘intimidation’ tactics to ‘put you on the defensive’ and get you more susceptible to further manipulation. Maybe something like: “Get over yourself already” followed up by some ‘blame-shifting’ tactics with some good old ‘guilt’ and ‘shame’ tactics, like “Why the hell are you spying on my phone records anyway? What kind of relationship is this? I don’t have any privacy? I don’t know if I can do this anymore! You have major jealousy issues! You need help!” You will walk away as the loser either way. There are resistance tactics that can be used but this is a very difficult tactic to deal with and it is one of their favorites. I won’t get into the counter-tactics here though. The only way to really win in a relationship with a narcissist is to leave them and go no contact. Moreover, Catching a cheating spouse might be difficult, and knowing what local laws say you can and cannot do might be even more difficult. To simplify the process, consider hiring a private investigator to do the sleuthing for you I genuinely appreciate how incredible you are and your work! Thank you for a job well done Metaspyhub@gmail. com,,
My former husband of 22 years left me abruptly with our 2 daughters and left for his mother in another state. I felt emotionally rejected after the death of his dad and felt rejected by his flying monkeys and his birth family since the wedding. Every personality disorder that you have explained I have observed in him. Initially I felt he was fueled by his mother and sisters. This is horrific to experience. He and his mother have held hostage our daughters almost 5 years now and our youngest daughter is disabled. He emotionally abandoned me several years before the physical rejection. Thank you for the explanation.
I was married to a covert narcissist for 16 years.. by the time I left I was on the verge of suicide. Thankfully I had people who actually loved me and took me in.. helping me over a 4 year period to heal.. I will never be the smart out going person I was.. however I am more confident about who actually loves me... my children, siblings and other family members... I have no desire to date.. I don't think I will ever allow another man to get close enough to hurt me.. I am extremely HAPPY with my life and don't want any disruptions to what I want to do.
Wish I had seen this years ago. I thought I was crazy , lazy and flawed . I most definitely stopped growing and caring , being on the edge makes you afraid to be you . Thanks for this one Dr Grande .❤
Severe depression can also cause someone to emotionally reject and them not trying to manipulate. Great video!
Wow...this has been repeated over and over my entire life, since my early childhood. 5 marriages, multiple abusive relationships, etc etc. I have tried everything I know to love and hold together a relationship. I just left another one about 9 days ago. I am scared to death of his retaliation. No one believes the cruelty he has done to me. God is my only hope. I am 69, disabled, and have no money to pay for counseling. What I watch on here is helping me, and by God's grace I pray I can recoup and help my grandchildren get free. Jesus help me.
Then having severe depression goes along with “not caring” for others’ emotional and physical well-being too, because depression does not let you be functional in so many levels , say motherhood, being a wife or another family member. Depressed = escape from responsibility of daily duties.
@@patty100ch very true, now that i don’t suffer from depression anymore..I make a big deal of holidays and birthdays. 🥳
I went years were I didn’t celebrate holidays..people still clap when I show up places.
@@teresawalker7043 Teresa I pray for you and hope things are going well with you and those around you.
Agree with you on emotional support. It took ten years of this from my husband before my body shut down. I stayed with him because of our children. Still with him twenty three years later. The stress my body has indured from lack of emotional support caused physical pain to my body. Eventually my body shut off and I wasn't able to walk. Crawling from the bed to the restroom. Every muscle in my body shut down. It was so painful. Fourteen doctors later I got a diagnosis myofascial pelvic muscle disorder. Total hysterectomy helped since the uterus is a muscle and holds the fetus until birth. This surgery didn't remove all the muscle pain it's still their in the abdominal muscles. It's real! My mother is a narcissistic. I had to distance myself from my mother. My husband and I are in therapy and I'm hopeful. I have gone emotionally numb. My emotional feelings are all over the place. I look like the crazy one. My husband looks like the stable one. Other family members have finally figured out my mother's abuse. When I no longer became her scapegoat she moved on to another family member for her narcissistic abuse. What hurts is not being able to realize what was happening or what was being done to me emotionally at the time. Why didn't I notice this as emotional abuse no support and take up for myself? I blame myself and feel that I wasn't the mother I had wanted to be for my children. They are young adults now. As a family we have never talked about this to our children. I know they suffered and felt abonded. The mother they knew as young children just disappeared overnight. I had to put them in the hands of Him. They always say I love you mama before ending a phone call or walking out the door. So, He did an awesome job raising them when their mother wasn't their for them. Most of their friends come from divorced parents and I could see the damage that does to a child. Our house was the home their friends would come to hang out. I didn't want my children to go through a divorce like most of their friends. I decided to deal with my pain the only way I knew how and that was prayer. It's still an ongoing process with my husband and I. It is real and the stress will get to you. It's not if but when because your body really does keep the score. Blessings to all that are going through this and understand me.
Wise and helpful comment. I understand. Holding understanding for you in my heart. Narc parents, malignant father, covert mother. ♥️👑
Thank you for your comment, I have a Narc mom and a Narc husband I feel emotionally spent. I'm numb to the core and been this way a good part of my life. I see what you are going through and I'm petrified this will be the same for me in years to come. If anyone is reading her comment or mine, please get out it's a trap, they won't change. My husband just tried to bullshit me two days ago, again. You can't keep going through this on loop.
Children are more happy and well rounded if they are brought up by a single parent if the parent they live with is emotionally stable. So you have ruined your life with starting with a narcissist. There is no therapy to cure them. You need therapy to trust yourself and leave him.
Children are more happy and well rounded if they are brought up by a single parent if the parent they live with is emotionally stable. So you have ruined your life with starting with a narcissist. There is no therapy to cure them. You need therapy to trust yourself and leave him.
22 year’s with my narcissistic husband has destroyed my life. I completely understand the emotional numbness primarily the lack of interest in ANYTHING.
My affect has been isolation. I had cut myself off from friends and family to avoid further hurt. I did not have the capacity to deal with put downs, being ignored and over looked so I stopped interacting with them. In my channel i try to work how to get back to interacting, maybe soon I can start opening myself up
I totally understand - but just know - keeping yourself around healthy coworkers does help your mental health. Traumatized ppl tend to do this and it’s called “social thinning”. But it has negative consequences to mental health. Just look it up so you are aware of your own healthy choices 🥰
I’ve been doing it for 5 years.
@@apove1814 That's a dumb thing to write. I don't get to pick my coworkers. If my co-workers weren't all self-indulgent, shallow idiots I wouldn't be here to begin with.
I am sorry but I do understand. I am off loading people who don't show me any care or kindness too. New friends welcome but only kindly ones!
I have dealt with a similar situation. Too much emotion from my partner and there was always something wrong. Eventually I didn't have the energy to reach out as I already had social anxiety throughout my life due to my narcissistic mother and silent treatment father.
Oh ouch! that explanation of the behaviors of a person who's dealt with this kind of trauma hits so hard and so true. "if I don't do anything I can't do anything wrong." Hello to my younger self. It was a schock to have to accept that inaction is in itself an action and is often more harmful than doing something poorly or wrongly.
Same...
Wow. This one hit closer to home than I was explaining. As always, Dr. Grande, thank you for your very rational explanation of emotionally complex topics.
**TOPIC REQUEST** Dr. Grand, can you please discuss “Conversational Vampires” - people who monopolize conversations, unwilling to listen or engage in a give-and-take conversations, who always think of themselves as always right, critical of others, judgmental, narrow- minded, who can talk for an hour or two non-stop without giving the other person a chance to talk or share their views. Thank you!
Yes.. I have dealt with this type of person
This is my mother to a "T". I experienced her monologues my whole life. She would hold court. No one else was allowed to interrupt her. Latterly, I resorted to walking out of the room and doing something else.
@SunCup Stop demonizing people, compassion will allow you to deal with them better.
My Father did this too. People who do this LACK SELF-AWARENESS.
Inject questions and let them know that they are going on & on.
People pleasing them by just listening is hurting both of you!
CURE: AUTHENTIC LISTENING & FEEDBACK. TELL THEM YOU'RE ECHAUSTED & NEGLECTED.
I would love a video on this topic, too. However, I feel like the descriptor you give is more narrow than what “conversational vampire” encompasses. I like the term, and I might self-identify as a conversational vampire. But only because I talk too much sometimes, especially if I have a problem I need to work through. I also apologize a lot and try to give space. I never used to be this way, but it seems to have developed after years with someone who devalued me and never wanted to hear what I had to say or talk about my interests (narcissist?). There was also gaslighting, condescension, embarrassing me in front of friends, and general contempt. I developed this “pressured speech” problem that I attributed to a combination of ADD, anxiety, and the built-up need for emotional support. The conversation hijiacking only occurred with people I felt safe with or who I felt would understand me.
I think it’s important not to paint all people with an annoying quality with the same brush. As another commenter said, start with compassion and a desire to understand. Communicate with the person doing this before nurturing resent. In my case, I always try to make space for the other. I still occasionally hijack, but I try to recognize it and shut up when I do.
Isn't that just NPD?
OMG...I never knew why I could not laugh at myself very well/often until you explained it in the way you did near the end of the video!!!!
You are helping understand and heal after 17 years of NPD abuse. Thank you.
I have never heard about emotional numbing due to the the roller coaster ride of being in a relationship with someone dx with NPD and Antisocial PD. I was in such a relationship for 10 years...and knew full well who I was with and returned 5 times anyway. This time (departing)was number 6. At the end I became so dull and numb I didn't care about him or anything else. I had to detach in some way. Unfortunately it has been 3 months on my own again and I can't get motivated to do anything but (no offense) watch your videos...which I DO find immensely interesting, unbiased and amusing. But I don't enjoy any of the thngs I loved. True...it coincided with the pandemic so that does not help. THanks for all you do. Your topics are diverse and fascinating and I appreciate your perennial impartiality.
Keep smiling, it took me 4 years of being alone with just my supportive family. I am finally on my way..
Texas Panhandle yeah
I understand. I went from one I was with for 10 years, now with someone with OCD. I don't feel anything about anything.
I think the numbness comes right before the acceptance part of healing.
@@Blueflameintegration I think you might be right. I hope so anyway!!!
My narcissistic sister has wanted my life to be hard as possible, no normal care, loyalty, or empathic feelings.its awful when thats all the family one has
Yes it is. I have a sister who has hated and despised me since the day our mother announced she is having another baby. My sister being the oldest of 3. To watch how she is with everybody except for you. Down to how she treats another person dog to how she treats yours, for example. Her passive aggressive remarks about anything you try to do and her saying "oh but thats (whatever negative thing i better worry about) going to be so difficult for you". Or when I did get away from a psycho husband and she let me stay in her kids playhouse (a very nice playhouse). When im trying to start my life over from scratch, with not a pot to piss in and a child and she immediately starts asking me "when are you going to get a practical vehicle". When there was nothing wrong with my jeep wrangler. And immediately after she asked that she asks when Im going to get braces for my then 8 year old who still has many baby teeth. Trying to overwhelm me. But anybody else, who may be experiencing the same thing but has resources, like 150 grand to start their life over and shes the kindest most generous person ever. Anything ive experienced if is nothing more than anybody, especially her has ever experienced. Oh and then theres the "i still want your ex to be successful and so im giving him a truck to come paint my house" (when the ex doesnt take care of our kid, she knows the hell he has put us through, i have a car about to die with 400,000 miles living out in bfe with no cell phone, which i dont expect anything from her its just her bs). Also she has my ex come do this when her husband was across the country working for a few months and was against my ex doing the work and told her this. And so I get treated like shit when it all went down though I had nothing more to do with it than her making a point to call to tell me and i said okay, whatever, its your deal not mine. And my ex didnt finish the job so she went and got her truck back that he thrashed. Sorry, started on that rant. Theres so much more I could add to it. Probably doesnt sound like it but im well aware and past it. Her insecurities arent my problem.
Learned so much from you and especially about my own life. Appreciate your ability to teach and generosity with knowledge about such subjects.
0:47 Rejection, what does it lead to?
• Shock • Neutrality • Numbness
The Numbness Hypothesis
• Absence of feeling
• Unresponse to stimuli
• Perception of meaninglessness
6:40
Psychical - Intense, Instantaneous pain
Emotional - Subtle, Long Term pain, hard to get away from
Both are very harmful
7:53 Personality Disorders with Rejection
8:54 Paranoid Rejection
- Sudden, Suspicious, Surprise
- Spying, Covert Planting Cameras
- Fear & Anxiety
10:16 Scizoid/Scizotypal
Hey, good comment, very helpful!
When someone rejects you especially after using you can hurt your ego and the feelings that come with it are totally normal. Being in chock, angry and disappointed and feeling of guilt, however you need to consider why, maybe because you are not easily manipulated, whatever the reason do not beg and try to move on.
It is such a devastating betrayal, confusing and draining, paralyzing. ♥️
Praying for all of you abuse victims. My daughter just ended a three-year relationship with a Narcissistic Abuser and is in inpatient rehab now, it was so devastating
🙏🏻Blessings! 💛🕊🍃
You very good mother your daughter has a big luck !!!
And how do you know he was a narcissist exactly
I hope your daughter is doing well and recovering . Take care xx
@@thegoldensorcerer9866 it’s later, when one least expects it…
Very insightful analysis Dr. Grande!
I can’t imagine a greater horror than being brought to a place of emotional numbness- it seems paralyzing:(
Thank you so much, always grateful:)
I'd actually prefer emotional numbness instead of what I feel everyday
@@weediestbroom Nothing is easier to achieve than this. There're tons of medication available that have only this one goal, to numb feelings. If psychiatry is good for one thing, it is this.
weediestbroom I couldn’t agree more. The abuse was/is so horrific that I completely dissociated. I’ll take dissociating over remembering any day.
@@brandymoore7191 I developed DDD . Severe depression, anxiety, learned helplessness is what blooms out of the numbness eventually. It becomes much worse than the former. Agoraphobia and hopelessness stuck in quiksand.
Derealization depersonalization disorder..
Don't
@@brandymoore7191 l
Incredible, Dr. Grande, this video could open up so many avenues of discussion! I wonder if “Person B” type people tolerate, even accept the abuse, because they can’t even fathom that a loved one would hurt them, it may not resonate with them as they personally don’t operate in that manner. Because it is not recognized for what it is, the use of denial, self-blame, or self-consoling excuses are made regarding “Person A” until it can no longer be ignored and then hopefully, protective measures would be implemented by “Person B”. One can only hope that the manipulation is recognized sooner than later. Thank you, Dr Grande, for creating awareness.
"..mild rejection actually creates a hypersensitivity to pain, which means the slow-moving emotional starvation type of rejection of the type practised by narcissists, for example.. may be physically more painful than a sudden departure of a romantic partner..emotional rejection.. can take place over.. years..this .. involves rejecting a partner's value, affection and love, it also involves showing disrespect...the intent... isn't necessarily to end the ...relationship- it's often done as a method of control, it can also be thought of as emotional starvation or.. harm.. we see.. avoidance, lack of empathy, colness, manipulation, criticism, and devaluation..this type of rejection... is associated with malice and boundary problems.. emotional rejection .. does damage over a long period of time..when somebody's exposed to it they.. can't escape some of the cognitive distortions.. we see [with NPD] .. manipulation in many forms.. recruits allies against the other person..we see spreading rumours, playing the victim, vicious, unhelpful criticising, emotional invalidation...[narcissist] says that [victim's] emotion isn't valid.. trying to convince [the victim] that [they] are the problem.. trying to restrict the freedom.. a lot of control tactics.. and never taking responsibility.... this kind of rejection often leads to a feeling of numbness... anger, aggression, self-doubt or anxiety.. " Thank you for this
Hi! I'd love to see a vid on the effects of (and reasons for) humiliation, especially in a parent-child relationship. ❤️✨
I've just been read about this. About how shame is one of the primary emotions a child has and feels it whenever attachment between a caregiver is unaligned. We feel it when we talk over one another then we correct alignment and find resonance.
Within some insecure parent/child dyad's shame which is useful for the emotional development of a child can be manipulated into humiliation which can be very damaging. Humiliation can start the development of life long negative traits.
Source: Dan Siegel, The Developing Mind. Chapter 3 Emotions.
@@craigsips8677 thanks for your comment and for listing the source
Dr Grande made an interesting vid on types of humour, did you see it?
It mentions the type of person who uses humiliation as part of their 'humour'
@@HumanimalChannel didn't see it, thanks for the recommendation :)
Dr Grande... I would like to hear about this too.
Humiliation.
Been here. Still trying to find my way back. I hadn't understood why I felt like I was dead inside and unable to even muster thought, thanks for the insight.
i just wanted to leave a comment to say how grateful i am to have found your channel. thank you for your scientific and empathetic insight!
Thank you for your continued dedication to teaching us Dr Grande 💞
Thank you!
I really needed to hear some of this.
Lots of love from someone, who was a victim of a borderliner's lack of self-awareness, and was always mocked for every mistake.
Thanks for keeping up your content - hearing your steady voice and you carrying on as normal is just what I need right now. Keep well.
I was being emotionally rejected. And had to leave phisically because of it. It hurts a lot.
I know what you mean I went threw hurts so bad bad....
Dr. Grande I sure appreciate your willingness not just th o share your expertise but your sources as well. Certainly one of the most legitimate offerings on the tube of u. Thanks.
I found this very thought provoking as to how my parents brought up me & my sister, and who might have been foisting their personality traits onto me. No wonder I fall back on emotional numbness sometimes; it feels like the only way to deal with people who are repeatedly inconsistent and untrustworthy. It all did take a toll on me, but I ended up learning a lesson from that. I do still tend to observe myself wanting to do things like stay in bed all the time or disappear altogether, but I see those symptoms a lot sooner than I used to. The other thing that I seem to have learned is to have more self-compassion and view any emotional hurt the same way I would view physical hurt: if there was an injury visible on an x-ray and there was a lot of blood present, I would rest it until it felt better. I now let myself rest up if I need to, do extra things to make myself feel good, and try to practice patience that it will not happen overnight.
Nice comment, I will adopt some of your nurturing attitudes and actions 🌸
This came at the absolute most perfect time for me.
Thank you.
OMG!!! Thank You!!! That explains a lot about the past two insane decades of my life with my ex-narc & his poorly adapted (traumatized & addicted) cronies of convenience.
You just restructured several closed wounds I had into order instead of scars over blind stitches. THANK YOU!! ... you' ve restored more of me back to myself again. Thank You! ... that was a gift to me.
The reinstated summary boxes on screen are very helpful in absorbing all the information, thanks, Dr Grande, great work as usual 👌
I was discarded by my ex fiance just a month before we started isolation. Now I've spent 2 weeks stuck alone in the home we shared together trying to heal from his emotional abuse. This is so hard. And not hearing a peep from him after telling me he basically never loved me as love does not exist, just makes me feel 10x worse. Not even an are you ok? Feel so desperate for human contact now and that's probably why I'm missing a person that I thought existed but didn't. Need to break these bonds I have with him asap
Hey, I hope you’re doing a lot better now. If you see this, how are you? I’m so sorry your ex treated you so badly. You are absolutely better off without him, but I know it isn’t easy to just stop loving someone, even when they aren’t who we thought they were. Hope you are safe and happy. 💛
Some chick did the same thing to me…
Totally emasculated. If it screwed me this bad….
I bet you went absolutely crazy. Hahaha.
I lost my mind for a bit there.
I'm in this state right now. It's like my depressive episodes but it's not. I don't cry.
As always, thank your the excellent analysis, Dr. Grande!
Embedded within your explanation of the consequences of rejection to person B, you also touched on the behaviors of person A. For me, it showcases how similar those behaviors can be between different PDs in the same cluster.
Another reason to refrain from diagnosing either yourself or someone else, unless you're a trained and qualified professional.
Dr. Todd Grande just wanted to say thank you for these very insightful videos during these strange times. Stay safe🙏
Nicely done!!
I have never been more impressed by the entirety of one of your presentations.
Well reflected!!
Speaking as a survivor, My experience ending my marriage with a person who displayed very intense narcissistic tendencies towards the end, or more pointedly it became more obvious. But I have dealt with years of subtly and slowly being chipped away at. She was very good at saying things that hit all the targets, without being obvious, just enough plausible deny ability, to then turn around and claim I was being too sensitive. This sort of thing and others that I will not recount here, my point is, I had about eight months to prepare before I ended my marriage I had hoped for a little longer , I actually had towards the end hope to work things out, because, as horrible as she had behaved, I suspect that she is suffering a great deal and that is unfortunate. I tried to get her to turn towards her empathy, she used to at least pretend. Forgive me I digress, I knew beforehand that I had to prepare myself for a long hard road. I knew as well as I could do that it would be a struggle, and it has been but I have had forward momentum. But I think one of the biggest challenges, that you did not mention, for folks coming out of these situations is deep shame. I was fortunate to have a sort of epiphany about shame prior to, understanding that I might have to end my marriage. If one cannot get through and passed around and over one’s own shame, one cannot look at one’s self clearly, honestly honestly, and with compassion. Only, when one can look at oneself clearly, both good and bad, and have compassion for oneself, therefore sidestepping, in essence, shame then one can move through one’s own bullshit, and get to a place where one can be present to one’s life, in a real and authentic way because that’s all we can ask for. I think a lot of folks get stuck in that place, of course we are talking about getting out of a narcissistic abusive relationship, but I mean this is true in the world. Shame is bullshit, unless you’ve done something shameful of course LOL. But shame is just a story we tell ourselves over and over again, usually it wasn’t even written by us it was written by our parents, and there’s more written by their parents before them… We get these, generational shaming portfolios… Handed down. And the only wave/through. Forgive my rant it is late. Be well all. And for those of you that are struggling right now. No this, if the party you are currently lamenting was of a narcissistic parents, and did a number on your self-esteem, remember, the reason they chose you was because you are extraordinary. You are attractive, intelligent, and stronger than you realize. That goes for all of you not just those coming out of a dark dark chapter. And I say all of these things, I am a work in progress I say at humbly. I am struggling right along side every other human being on this planet, I’m sure Even the good doctor has its own struggles, being a human at all LOL. Go easy on yourselves. And go easy on each other
So sorry Joshua’s.
Shame is corrosive. It is a self-replicating messaging program that operates in your consciousness and produces pain and misery and distorted thinking and physical ailments. A person who behaves poorly can correct their behavior without shaming themselves or accepting the efforts of others to shame them. This takes work. A good counselor of psychologist can teach how to do it. The narcissists wants you to destroy yourself so that you are as miserable as she/he is. Refuse to let that happen.
My fiancee divorced his narcisctic tic wife after 23years. He said he felt terrible about it because he wanted to be married for life but he was miserable. The narcs lie & ignore your needs. His ex used their daughter to get together after she told the daughter that she'd changed. After a short time, he recalled the narc traits & remembered that they don't change & can't. He pays a large alimony but says it's worth every penny. I'm sorry he endured so much lack of love but grateful to have the rest of our lives together. It's been 40 yrs since we were lovers in college. God is good.
I really appreciate your comments. I can identify so much with this video, especially the later part, competed with over things that had no respect towards charactor, but preference, trying to dodge the critisisms and devaluation, as well as unhealthy competition. It can be destabilising, I still find myself interacting sometimes in a less authentic way. I recognise that I've allowed this to hamper my growth, but have currently distanced myself as much as possible.
Joshua Boden, many thanks for your thoughts, much respect to you x
Watching this video was like one big flashback on my life. I think my angels brought me this today. I've been beating myself up for being stuck in life for so long. Or making progress, but so ridiculously slow, despite my intelligence. My self-doubt and lack of motivation has been like a thick fog to move through and it frustrates me to no end. Yet I have made huge strides over the years from the paralyzed person I used to be and this video helped me to acknowledge everything I have had to overcome. It helped me stop comparing myself to those who don't have this same issue. I saw the "Dependent" issues flash up and might as well have been a mirror. I have been living independently for decades, even started my own business, but still operating from a dependent mindset of doubt. Now I want to start a new business that is more revealing of myself than the past one and feeling major fears and self-criticism sneaking up. Thank you for reminding me of all the crap I have overcome from manipulative, controlling, parents, step-parents, bosses, and then aloof and distracted boyfriends, who were not manipulative, but not supportive or really available either. Yes, I survived that. I may be slow to start something out of my fears, but once I do I'm like a train. I start off slow moving and careful, but then once I get going very hard to stop or slow me down from my intention.
Dr. Grande, thank you for much, particularly the last two minutes of this presentation, which I found eye-opening, nourishing, and potentially rest-of-life-giving.
So interesting! The amount of knowledge and understanding you have with all these complicated layers is incredible!
There is a lot to chew on here. I’m going to listen again. I can relate to so much of it though. It truly helps me understand myself and where I need to grow.
If only the rest of humanity had your attitude.
I agree!
Start growing by growing a pair of balls
@oh ok A) what comment and B) who the fck are you?
when you leave a cult, the degree of „[value]emotion rejection” is intense, the ingroup members disabuse themselves of you further aggravates this.
Always a great healing tool Dr. Grande! I find it therapeutic to watch this videos. Maybe validated something I thought or I felt from my pass.with him. Thank you for sharing your insight Dr! Much needed and appreciated!
It’s tough to process betrayal and all the forms of rejection this entails, I actually went through all of the grief process’s like they died.
Death by a million bee stings! My 15 year marriage was so confusing and crushing to my self esteem right from the start. He was seductive with words to get me and to keep me hooked and controlled while he found constant outside entertainment. I became paralyzed after I lost all hope and it took him finally admitting he was in love with a new, much younger and more special woman he met online and had an affair to rattle me awake. I divorced him quickly and moved 3000 miles away. I’m still having PTSD issues but feel free, more like myself and happy to be alive.
I wish I had known what I was involved with, a Covert Narcissist with OCD, addictions to alcohol, porn and a fetish, hours spent daily seeking online entertainment, etc. He sadistically enjoyed my suffering when he devalued and triangulated, gaslighted and criticized, and raged me into total submission. It was a f*ing nightmare!
I am looking into EMDR or something to quickly rid me of the lingering effects of such long-term mental abuse. I don’t want to give another minute to the painful memories and my own shame for staying so long.
You mean, you fantasized about the man you never had and you grieved the fantasy you created in your head. Been there
I am divorced from a violent serial cheater who relentlessly criticized me during the marriage. Although I know I am better off without him and would never go back to him, I am still stunned by the profound level of rejection I felt. I was better to him than anyone in his life and he was worse to me than anyone in my life.
I feel the very same way…I cannot understand why I would continue loving someone that treated me badly for 33+ years of marriage.
I love this channel. I learn so much and incorporate Dr. Grande's videos to my students in my abnormal psych classes. I'm fascinated with the carnage that people with personality disorders do to their family and children. Both my folks were in Cluster B. At 16 I took a psych class in high school and the light bulb went off. I knew psychology may be the field for me. I was desperate for answers and why I felt like an alien in my own family because I could see the insanity. Now, trying to overcome having been the parentified child and to let go of the pain of emotional rejection.
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When I first starting listening to this I didn't think it applied to me at all! and then as the description continued I started remembering things in my early life that applied and could look at myself in a new light! Thank you Dr. Grande.
I'm a huge fan of your videos!🤗 I love learning about the topics you talk about.❤ I appreciate how you talk about them in a very clear way that makes it easier for me to understand. Excellent job as always!💯👍Your videos make me feel less alone during self isolation.
13 minutes and 22 seconds into this video and my jaw just just about dropped thank you Doctor Grande you are the best
What an absolutely amazing video from you, once again, Dr Grande!
You have provided such high quality contextual examples that make perfect sense, when viewing the respective conflict from the eyes of each individual.
The flow of the video and the consecutive footage is always following up what it promised it would and there is, overall, a lot of insightful information. I am lucky enough to have studied these topics throughout my life and I am very aware of the standpoints of Cluster A and Cluster B Personality disorders, it was a great experience learning more about the possible reactions of Cluster C Individuals in response to criticism.
I think that you made a really good point claiming that the NPD's approach from Person A to Person B would be the utmost devastating for Person B. This is particularly true, when Person B is relatively inexperienced and low on conscientiousness, they might even consider their first romantic relationship with a Narcissist as a representation of how every future romantic relationship will be like, due to their low initiative taking or just the result of their suffering from different sorts of narcissistic abuse, which would decrease general motivation.
thanks!
Glad I saw this - saving so I can discuss with my therapist. I think the last part about lack of growth due to lack of safety in making mistakes hit me particularly hard. Thank you for great content as always!
Thank you! your videos are always so well documented and presented. It is very interesting. 🙂
Seriously dr grande you literally just saved my life. ♥️ helped me to put this together. When I come out the other side of this.. holy shit.. watch out.. positive changes will be made ..
Awe this hit home! I’ve always been so hard on myself and would feel absolutely worthless if I wasn’t “The Best” at an activity I enjoyed. Sometimes to the point of freezing and being unable to finish or start skill building tasks. The manipulation was internalized & had become my own inner critic. I still fight that toxic person in my head.
I just want to say, I've been watching these videos for awhile now, they're very VERY helpful, for this one I just had to say thank you for it, I really appreciated hearing this one today, thank you for what you do here on RUclips
You are definitely raising consciousness.
Game changer.
What an opportunity we all have to live our best lives.
My parents blamed and rejected me my entire life. It's been very painful and heartbreaking....thank God I have a very wonderful husband...weve been married 49 yrs next month
Zelda Zelda,You are beautiful 🌹🌹🌷,hope you are not with a narc 😈!!
This was interesting, educational, and for the experiences I had extremely accurate. Thank you for the insight. In one word the remedy is Action. Taking it and moving past their constant abusive ascertations. If that’s even a word.
Thank you Dr. Grande. I grew up with a narcisistic mom. Your videos are helping me understand why I am the way I am and why my mom is how she is. I'm really growing as a person
Dr. Grande's videos are incredibly insightful and helpful.
Dr. Grande thank you for your explanation of the effects of manipulation long term.
Having 57 years of experience surrounded by cluster B people including 40 in a romantic relationship has molded me into a confused person about so many things.
This video does explain many things I didn't understand why I had my way of dealing with.
Thanks this helps.
I love your work on this platform! Would you consider doing some more videos covering bipolar disorder? I don't find a lot of great information about it on RUclips and your videos are incredibly educating!
Two words here for you
Brilliant & Reverence
As a Psych student, I think you’re brilliant and I have absolute reverence for you & your work
A comprehensive and insightful analysis Dr Grande. Thank you.
This is very helpful. It would also be great to have more segments on this type of analysis in other relationships with narcissistic/cluster B abusers. Because for every narcissist who has a romantic partner, there's at least one who has parents, children, and/ or siblings. So while there may be more people seeking out information about romantic relationships with narcissists, there really is as much of a market for information about this type of psychological abuse in families of origin and friendships, work situations, School situations, and so on. I think helping people recognize what they're seeing and have a better idea of what to expect in the context of different types of relationships would be very helpful. I myself would like to hear a lot more about a broad spectrum of relationships.
Finally you have covered a near universal experience, or as close as you can get to one(40% of adults go through this). Due to the intense coverage of this in TV, movies, books it appears that both partners tend to assign the person A disorders to the other partner regardless of who rejects and who fights rejection, a dilemma that no couples counselor can overcome with their preferred techniques of being neutral when blame and accusations are the only subject important to one or both parties.
Dr. Grande, thank you so much for the education you provide.
I've been in therapy for several years now, and have progressed to the point where I can separate myself from my past familial and personal traumas enough that I can try to understand (with one exception) why people do the things they do. Sometimes I leave my sessions with more analytical questions, and through your channel and the way that you breakdown and explain the information tends to quite often answer my questions entirely, or make it easier to communicate with my therapist in a more productive and insightful manner.
Thank you.
Dr. Grande, my deepest respects to you regarding this subject. Thank you!
I think our society lacks leaders and is hurting us. Leadership is representitive in qualities such as commonalities, direction and looking out for the people rather than rejecting, knowing that we are only strong as our weakest link.
Never reject yourself. If you're not pleased with yourself or you fear rejection than that's a great indicator to work on yourself so improving.
Having dealt with social anxiety most my life i was never good enough, good looking enough etc. When really I am very incredible and good looking... I don't know why it's so hard to believe. I think maybe it has to do with being HSP & empath.
I suffer from envy sometimes. It's usually when I'm around a rejecting person because my parents used to pit my siblings and I against one another. It seemed only one or two could be in their good graces ar any given time. So sad. I can't ever remember one holiday where somebody wasn't left out. And if you left the situation you were labeled uncaring and selfish.
Thank you for your honest insight. Lovely person to coin a phrase.
This is so great. What devastating impact they have. So, so good to learn about this. Thank you.
Top quotes from my covert narc ex:
“I’m not attracted to you anymore.” (I was in my 30’s)
“I’m not withholding words from you. I just don’t think those things about you.”
“I’m just not interested in you, as a person.” (In our 26th year together, a few years after renewing our vows)
“I’m glad you’re suffering. I’ll tell you when you’ve had enough.”
“This [rejection] is temporary. Think of it as a vacation.”
“The Church has it all wrong. They say you can’t leave your spouse. You have to wait for them to leave you. But I say, you can make their life so miserable, they want to leave.”
Sick, gaslighting, sad wounded man.
So so glad I’m free of his abuse.
Fantastic video, with such an interesting topic. I watched it several times to get it! Thank you so much Dr. Grande. Take good care of yourself in this time doc 😃🇳🇱
pocoeagle2 I kept pausing it to think about what he was saying 😂
@Gail McLean lol 😂😂
This is my life to a "T". It was meant for me to see this and I have been considering counseling for the situation I'm in. I am emotionally numb and at a crossroads.
Thank you, again, for this post. I watched it last year, but needed to hear it again. Excellent info.!
Wow, sir; you have enlightened me to things currently at work, that I/I’ve feel/felt but did not have the words!
Thank you very much for this extremely informative topic and discussion. As well as the lesson!
Would really love to see a video on the long term impacts of a narcissistic parent!
You either turn into a narcissist or a codependent
@@patty100ch I’m a codependent my sister a narcissist
Like, right now in my life, I am interacting with someone that is giving me emotional rejection so nonchalantly.
And we stay in the same house and thus can't be separated.
So, I'm just choosing not to interact with her.
She knows what the hell she's doing.
PS: "The gaslighting thing and failure to take responsibility happened a lot. I was just too caught up in emotions to see it."
Whoa sounds familiar
I have try The same , i send my Best thougts to you. Give Yousef attention
Unless you are conjoined twins, you can leave or have them ejected.
@@LisaMaryification in a way.
But it can be a bit more complicated.
Maybe I'm just reading into it a bit too much. I do have a tendency to do that.
But I'm not too sure.
From the little details you are willing to share here so far it only sounds a lot like college roomates sort of situations much more common in this part time job contract work "Big Bang Theory" age. There must be way more to your story too complicated to explain here. Just the thing that narcissists rely on in a court of law.
This is one of your most useful videos Dr G! I miss your mental health content!
Thank you so much for sharing!💖 this is more serious than people know.