I think the reason that Starlight went after Twilight is because she's an Alicorn. "When you think your talent is special, you don't see eye to eye" That's what she says to Twilight. She sees HERSELF in Twilight. That's why she's after her.
Also I think because they were opposed at the ideological level, and Starlight saw Twilight's as the primary obstacle to her vision of friendship and equality.
not only an alicorn but a princess of friendship as well, so Starlight probably saw her as the root of all evil. In her eyes, friendship and being special couldn't coexist, but those two things were Twilight's two most notable features.
Luna and Celestia literally raised and lowered the Sun and Moon everyday, literal celestial bodies. Not to mention they are 1000 years old. And Cadance’s own cutie mark is the Crystal Heart, which powers the emotions of the Crystal Ponies. To say they aren’t powerful is just a generally wrong statement
@@MsAmber82 she's not a mother until s 6??? And she did way more than Celestia and Luna, she defeated Chrysalis, Sombra, traveled across equestria to defeat a giant plant worm with Twilight so Discord could feel better even though he was faking, and even after she became a mother she still did stuff.
I think it's poetic how Celestia organizes herself a plot to retire (and not give Luna a chance to govern in her stead) via Twilight, and then Twilight's reign barely lasts a century or two before an ancient alicorn finds out that Celestia is no longer around and comes to take over.
Fluttershy being the Naruto/ Steven universe of the group and talk-no-jutsu all the enemies into reforming would had been hilarious. Specially considering how questionable Discord reform was. I mean, he stopped being malicious, sure, but he kept a somewhat antagonizing role all through the series. In his words (from the comics): "I went from chaotic evil to chaotic neutral"
Since Steven Universe was mentioned, I believe that show has the same issue discused in this video. But it's even WORSE in Steven Universe from what I've heard. I hope I didn't offend anyone by saying this.
Grogar’s line rewritten: I’ve seen your humiliating defeats by the hooves of six puny ponies… *walks past Tirek* an insecure unicorn *points to Chrysalis* three princesses and a dragon *glares at Sombra* and six creatures who should have no business with battles in the first place *Cozy Glow pouts* Yeah I couldn’t include Trixie Thorax and Discord for Chrysalis’s defeat but I don’t think it matters as Chrysalis is never shown to be mad at them (except for Thorax I guess)
But how would Grogar knew on how these three villains were defeated. This line would make fans suspect this wasnt the real grogar from the beginning or even think It was already Discord disguised because I The dont think he just so happens to be there at the exact moment
7:48 THANK YOU! Really if anything Sombra should be more upset that a tiny baby dragon helped defeat him then anything else and find that absurd or humiliating to where he would want revenge on him rather then the Mane 6 especially considering Spike is seen as the hero of the crystal empire so frankly Sombra should be Spikes villain then anything, the two could parallel each other as they were both non ponies raised by ponies. He could have been used as an interesting dark mirror image for Spike but no he doesn't address him at all in s9.
Spike really didnt do anything more than get the crystal closer, Twilight was the one who find it and cadence brought it to the center. Spike was like a tiny spot falling on his death, why the hell he would consider spike his defeater?
@@Amanecer458 If it wasn't for Spike being with Twilight, she would have been stuck in the Nightmare spell Sombra made to keep people away from the heart. Spike ALSO grabbed the Crystal Heart after Twilight pushed it out of the trap she got stuck in. Without Spike, Twilight wouldn't have been able to do as much and Cadance literally wouldn't even have the chance to SEE the Crystal Heart.
@@cameoshadowness7757 This here, also Sombra is definitely the kind of guy who would find the fact that Spike is seen as the hero of the crystal empire to be an insult to him.
@@LegendaryOverfiend 100% its a BABY dragon of all things, not even a full grown dragon or one that hit Molt, a very small dragon who managed to help get the heart to the princess on time! Oh! The painful realization that everything could have worked out if it wasn't for such a little child of all things!
@@Amanecer458 Sombra didn't know Twilights contribution to his defeat. The last thing he saw was Spike and Cadence giving the Crystal heart back to the citizens. So from his perspective, Cadence and Spike should be his #1 enemies.
Don’t get me wrong Starlight was treated unfairly #JusticeForStarlight but the young six were treated just as bad if not worse in my opinion.They literally SAVED ALL OF EQUESTRIA MAGIC and they barely got a pat on the back for it they couldn’t even give them the pink heart medal things.And the fact that Cozy didn’t care for revenge against them is crazy at least Chrysalis still held hatred for Starlight the young six didn’t even get that with Cozy.Honestly I don’t think the show knew what to do with them or Starlight.
@@TheArtisticAloubell. Unfortunately, even Lily Orchard caught what become the show, rather than having friendship being special and only given for those who reciprocate, become treated like the force something vague that you gotta fallow and keep people around. The young six arcs are effectively complete, and starlight could've gone home, but any new material about them would've been very obvious regurgitation for the mane six and sunset adventures(with only marginal differences like each being different species, and starlight Made the town)! Sad?
the reason starlight hated twilight is because twilight is the leader of the mane six, a diverse group of friends who still have all their unique qualities and still get along. starlight became a villain because her friend was more unique than her, powerful and got his cutie mark early and got sent to the magic school. she felt abandoned, and she blamed friendship for that, and since twilight was the opposite of her and the princess of friendship, she hated twilight
I think it's also fair to consider that Starlight was particularly focused on Twilight from the beginning. The instant she met the group, she prioritized converting Twilight because she was a princess. Her status is specifically the thing she wanted to leverage for her cause. The friendship speeches probably held more weight because of that tunnel vision and so you could argue the gaslighting was at herself, convincing herself that Twilight was the reason things fell apart. After all, in order to accept Starlight, we need to accept that a lot of her character is based on lies she tells herself.
It's also likely that she resented Twilight because in both "Amending Fences" and "Cutie Re-Mark, Part 1" Starlight is seen in the background as if seeking something to use against not only Twilight but the Mane 6. In "The Cutie Re-Mark" two-parter she evens tries to prevent the sonic rainboom that caused the initial bond of the Mane 6 and thus disrupt their ever becoming friends
To be fair to Chrysalis, Twilight did lay the groundwork for her original defeat given she freed Cadance. So, in her eyes Twilight could be seen as the root cause of her initial failure despite the fact SH and PC were the ones to actually beat her.
That's part of why I gave Chrysalis' situation some wiggle room X3 It's not like Twilight did NOTHING in her downfall, she's just much lower on the totem pole.
Frankly, despite me also being a fellow Starlight Glimmer fan, i was actually GLAD she wasn't officially recognized as the 7th main character or element. That honor is and always should have been deserved for Spike. I also just thought of something with what you said at 1:37. Spike could still keep the group balance, as the only male/dragon/non-pony, so he's symmetrical to himself.
I really do think the Grogar comment was an in-character choice by Discord. He was pulling these villains into a cohesive threat with the specific purpose of testing Twilight and her friends to prove to them that they were really ready to rule Equestria. The villains knew the truth and held their own grudges, but they believed that it really was Grogar facing them and with his legendary power level they thought better of correcting him with an "Um, actually." As for Starlight in season 5, she's seen spying on the Mane 6 throughout the season to learn about their weaknesses. Being a iron-hooved leader in her village, she likely though that Fluttershy was just acting on Twilight's orders (which she kinda was), so she put the blame with Twilight. Her eventual plan of stopping the rainboom would hurt them all in the end, and she could rub Twilight's defeat in her face while it happened.
I always figured her not making the mane 6 the mane seven {even though Spike makes them seven already) was simply because she isn't properly friends with them. She's reformed, but Twilight's friends aren't necessarily her friends. Like how she isn't really friends with Pinkie and Rarity, she's friends with Maud and Trixie.
@@harleaarmstrong7659 Starlight and the mane 6 are friends, though. She hung out with all of them individually at least twice (on screen) and she went on the friendship camping trip (Spike didn't even attend that)! Even within the mane 6, there are some relationships that aren't as developed as others (to the point that they even had to point out that Rainbow and Rarity don't interact much on screen and yet they are still good friends). I agree that there could have been more casual hang outs with the other mane 6 members shown to us via more episodes, but they are friends with Starlight.
@TheArtisticAloubell That's true, but a lot of those were also technically mandatory for friendship lessons. Its hard to see how much of that is them actually being friends. I am a supporter of fanfictions, though, because the show cant really be continued or edited from G4 otherwise. I'm personally working on one where discrepancies like that get fixed [and adjusments made so that what would be g5 isnt regression back to segregation, like fixing the power sucking vortex that is the EqG world and bringing Sunset back - because its ridiculous to leave Twilight to mantel both Sun and Moon responsibilities, imo.]
It's likely the inclusion of Starlight into the Mane 6 and renamining the group the "Mane 7" was likely to avoid confusing the group with the Rainbooms/Humane 7 from the Equestria Girls spinoff as pre-Friendship Games it was Sunset Shimmer that took Twilight's place as the leader/main focus. If the MLP:FiM group was renamed with Starlight and Trixie (or Discord) becoming tangential parts of the Mane 6, then it could either affect the marketing or create confusion with the MLP:EqG group
I always did just assume that the villains mainly wanted to take out the Mane 6 because they were the biggest threats to their plans and with them out of the way, it'd be easier to take over Equestria. But yeah, Tirek really is the only one who should be directly mad at them, the others are weirdly bent on revenge against *THEM* specifically considering how the Mane 6 didn't defeat them. 😅 I guess I did notice this at some level, but wow, it was even worst than I thought tbh. Like you said, I still love the Mane 6 and MLP, and this writting flaw doesn't make me like it less as a show, but good on you for pointing it out, because I don't think anyone else has before to my knowledge. Let's give credit where credit is due! #JusticeForStarlight ✨
@@Ro994 Yeah, if Grogar had simply said his like differently and phrased it along the lines of they need to take out the Mane 6 mainly because they are the biggest threat and left it at that, it would have been fine. And it would have been great for the villains to have a little vent-fest as they all discuss the ponies/creatures they want to get their revenge against. It truly would have been a good time! Not that it wasn't, but it would have been a better written good time! ✨
@@TheArtisticAloubellI dont know what cosy glow has against the main six, considering they weren't the ones to defeat her. But. Chrysalis and sombra, I understand. If the main six weren't there, they would have taken over. Twilight discovered Chrysalis' plan and found cadence, and then when cadence was stuck to the floor, Twilight freed her so she could go to shining armour and do the love spell. If Twilight wasn't there, her plan would have succeeded. Sombra is quite the same. If the main six didn't help cheer up the crystal ponies, they wouldn't have been able to power the crystal heart. And if Twilight wasn't there, they probably never would have found the crystal heart in the first place. Both of their plans got foild by this small group, even if they weren't the ones to truly finally defeat them. If they weren't there, the villains would have almost definitely won.
@moonbloom2262 Chrysalis I'll give some wiggle room because she did have interactions with Twilight and she understands that she was the one who rescued Cadence. However, Chrysalis and her Changelings still defeated the mane 6. Her issue came with Cadence and Shining Armor. They defeated her. And even if Chrysalis blamed Twilight for that, she still defeated Twilight and her friends again when she infiltrated Ponyville and kidnapped them. At that point, she got her revenge on them. Starlight (and technically Thorax) should be her biggest sources of hate. And regarding Sombra, from his perspective, all he saw was Cadence and Spike with the Crystal Heart. He never witnessed the mane 6 doing anything. Yes they (but mostly Twilight) did all the hard work, but it was Cadence's spell that kept him out of the empire and it was she and Spike who delivered the Crystal Heart. That's all he knows. He didn't even know the mane 6 existed.
for the starlight one , you can argue that twilight is the leader and the one who sent fluttershy to mess up starlight's plan. twilight is also a symbol of what starlight stood against from her point of view. twilight has the friendship starlight has always wanted, she also has influence due to being a princess. twilight's destiny in a way is determined by her cutiemark. to starlight, twilight's cutie mark is what got her all these things, not the years of effort, the trials, the ponies, or her willingness to change from a antisocial bookworm to a social butterfly. starlight probably had many opportunities to make new friends and be a better pony, but she chose to stew in her heartbreak and resentment towards cutiemarks.
Moondancer's another example of what Twilight could have been under different circumstances, the fact Moondancer rejected friendship and chose isolation before Twilight brings in Pinkie Pie was because of Twilight (somehow seems like a later issue with Tempest) abandoning her. In a flashback in "Amending Fences" it's hearing from Minuette and Lemon Hearts that Twilight wasn't showing up which depresses Moondancer and makes her focused on studying, so it's possible outside of studying magic (and not being pushed by Celestia) this makes Starlight a great example of what Twilight's life could have become. Starlight Glimmer: I rejected friendship because my FRIEND abandoned me once he got HIS cutie mark! Nopony should have cutie marks to be special! Moondancer: You abandoned me, Twilight, so I shut everypony else out.
I kind of do like that Starlight isn't officially one of the main girls, because when you think about it,.she see things that the others don't see and works better outside their group With the pony of shadows Starlight was the only one who was fighting to find out if he could be reasoned with or saved Imagine just how pressure would be on her to go along with the other element barers if she had an element herself Just like with Fluttershy in Keep calm and flutter on She helps in unique ways because her past and perspective So she actually is much better being an outside advocate and thinker and maybe even anti-hero who is close with the main 6 and is officially and unofficially part of the group This was was also acknowledged in the episode where she switched Celestia's and Luna's cutie marks, as well
i actually prefer starlight not being a part of the main 6. the 6 are so iconic adding a 7th one would not feel special and would ruin the whole thing. now adding 6 extra character that are best friends that are like. side main 6 if you will.. is an idea i came up with and i love!
You know what we _really_ need? We need justice for Trixie, what happened to Starlight pales in comparison to Trixie, at least in my eyes. Trixie had her home destroyed, became homeless, and was ostracized from every town she went to, while Starlight was forgiven instantly and got all the friends she could've ever wanted. I'm not trying to downplay what happened to Starlight, but it really seems like nobody talks about what happened to Trixie. I see a lot of people say she isn't misunderstood and that she's just narcissistic, but I disagree, the writers tried to make it clear she's not meant to be taken at face value and a lot of people still don't understand that. She has deep-rooted insecurites and loneliness inside her, especially when looking at No Second Prances where she _literally tries to off herself_ when she thinks Starlight doesn't want to be her friend. I know that scene is/was heavily debated when the episode first aired, but I think it's pretty clear what Trixie's intent was, she herself said that she thought the Manticore would eat her alive if Starlight wasn't there to save her, and she did it anyways fully believing she would die. I'm glad you covered Starlight, and I'd love to see you cover Trixie, they're both flawed and insecure in similar ways, and I think that's part of why they work so well together.
1:24 but there exists 7th element of harmony in equestria that we got to see 2 times in the show: - on old depiction of Tree of Harmony - in Spike's hoard when he got greedy (it was till in old stone ball form as it wasn' destroyed by Nightmare moon) No idea wat happened to it later tho :3
Chrysalis's motivations are a mess in general. But let me just get this straightened. Yes, Cadence and Shining were the nail in the coffin in the Season 2 finale, but their actions wouldn't have been possible without Twilight, who was the most suspicious of her and actually saved the real Cadence. Thus, she would have plenty of resentment towards Twilight, which is why we don't see Shining and Cadence again in the Season 6 finale. Similarly, Starlight was the leader of the anti-hero squad that saved everyone in the Season 6 finale, with Starlight being the initiator of Chrysalis's downfall by suggesting that the Changelings give their love to her, which resulted in the betrayal of the hive. But she doesn't blame the Changelings or the Crystal Empire's royalty, she blames the one responsible for those climaxes happening. I know the comics are B-canon, but if you read The Return of Queen Chrysalis, Twilight is in fact the one she resents upon her defeat. It's just that after Season 6, her mind went from being hyperfixated on Twilight to being hyperfixated on Starlight.
It's important for a show to not take too much focus away from its main characters, especially in a show like MLP that's constantly introducing new characters and ideas. However, I see your point that the show often tries to do this too much. Heck, the student 6 don't have nearly as much screen time as Starlight yet they're still given more respect than her. I realized on rewatch that I like them more when the show isn't trying to force the idea that they are the next generation of the elements. They are secondary characters and should be treated as such. Fortunately, Spike is always given his rightful place among the main 6. He deserves it as he's been a staple of the show since day one.
You could say the hesitance to consider her in the main group is her natural consequence for the bad things she did. Even though she was forgiven, did great things, and got the privilege of being Twilight's student, she ultimately couldn't reach the levels of the others because it is the consequence of her actions
@@hearmeout1767 Sunset did bad things as well and still got considered part of the main group in her universe. Starlight was fully forgiven and even took over Twilight's school and castle. With how much focus the show gave her, how often she was the solution, to not officially consider her part of the group just doesn't make sense from what was written.
@@TheArtisticAloubell i think that was more writer choice to show like difference in personalities and everything. Sunset became the "7th" cuz for one, the environment of "equestria girls" allowed it, in fact, the entire series started off becz she stole pony twilight's crown. she had the right personality to grow as part of the iconic group. However, with starlight, her personality makes her a good "learner..?" she learns from the mane 6, she understands from them, her personality.. doesnt actually align well... the way sunset's does.. cuz when i see sunset, she is the one breaking fights, bringing people together cuz her personality allows her to... starlight, on the other hand, struggles ALOT. WHICH MAKES SENSE, as a writer i could totally see why.. she spent an ENTIRE season planning to take down twilight and her friends, Travels BACK IN TIME, changes the future, almost destroying equestria, and all of a sudden.. she doesnt hv flaws? sunset .. i would say... got ?lucky? cuz the human twilight was MORE flawed compared to sunset.. while teaching human twilight, she learnt faster herself while also taking guidance from pony twilight... Starlight had a long way to go, and on the way, she was bound to make friends that incline to her personality more. Trixie, discord, Maud.. all 3 being one of the weirdest characters in the show! its like, she would "relate" to them more than the mane 6, mainly becz each of their flaws and strengths kind of align a lot well then one might think.. Making starlight just like sunset would decrease "inclusion".. one thing about mlp is that they include so many personalities in multiple different characters that if u dont relate with any of the mane 6, you WILL with atleast one of the side characters. the world building.. is... very nice.. imo... LIke.. VERY NICE.. as someone who literally built a world of many characters, i pay a lot of respect to the writers (but then again.. im a noob.. what do i know) IM NOT MUCH OF A YAPPER AND IM STRUGGLIN SO HARD TO PUT WORDS TOGETHER, HOPEFULLY IT MAKES SOMEWHAT SENSE, IM SORRY IF IT SOUNDS TOTAL NONSENSE- to think i wana write storie.....
@@Abyss777 What you wrote didn't sound like nonsense. I understand what you're getting at! ^^ Starlight has a totally unique personality that makes her unique from Sunset. Starlight is snarky, impulsive/trigger happy, insecure, loves to play around with magic in a way that Twilight didn't, has some social incompetence, and is a blossoming leader (as by the end she's grown her leadership skills enough that Twilight left her in charge at the school of friendship). Starlight was never "automatically flawless." If anything, that was Sunset as it seemed like the writers forgot that she used to be a villain and they eventually remembered to give her flaws. Whereas Starlight, in her debut as a good guy, had some attitude and avoidance behaviors where she'd sometimes use manipulation. Yes, Starlight had a lot to learn, but that was to be expected from her background. With her unique personality meshing with the other members of the Mane 6, that would have helped her development. I think Starlight and Sunset both could have represented the same element of harmony. This does NOT mean they have the same personality. Just as the elements have been passed down and evolved in Equestria to individuals with different personalities, so can the two different ponies of Starlight and Sunset both represent empathy/forgiveness. The fact that Starlight was able to connect with individuals that others had a VERY tough time connecting with means she shows more empathy than the other mane 6. Her being a guidance counselor also shows that. So to not make her something like the element of empathy seemed like a missed opportunity to me >_
#JusticeForStarlight I can't say that I ever noticed the gaslighting. But now that you mention it I have to agree with your assessment. You do a good job of noticing the the little details. Much respect!
It's like a reversal of the "main characters do everything" trope- the "main antags target the mains even if it makes no sense". Now thinking about it, as much as I loved the Season 5 finale, I just remembered something- RD's "flashback" also includes Fluttershy. Maybe she goes back in time with Twilight not to just interfere with the Rainboom, but Fluttershy's connection to it as well. What if Fluttershy's bullying wasn't prevented? Or the one who prevented it was Starlight, not Dash or a cloud-fall? #JusticeForStarlight and also #JusticeForFluttershy. (Also seeing how Fluttershy changes in each alt timeline would be better than pseudo-background pony in only the Chrysalis timeline.. which brings another connection between Starlight, Fluttershy, and Changelings.)
There is literally an alternate timeline Starlight creates when she stops it. It can also be argued that her messing with RDs flying in every timeline resulted in RD unable to stop the bullying in her way.
I’ve never watched MLP (except for a few clips that my friends showed me), but you’ve convinced me! #JusticeForStarlight 6:05 I’m not a fan of having to consume multiple forms of media in order to understand what’s going on in a story. In my personal opinion, I think that you can use multiple forms of media to tell your story, just as long as people don’t need to consume them all in order to understand the main story. For example, I think that using other forms of media to tell side stories, give backstories that aren’t necessary to understand the main story, or even tell a sequel story is just fine; and I don’t know if they should be used to do more than that. Also, is the villain group in MLP really called the “Legion of Doom”? I can’t help but think of “Super Friends” whenever I hear you call them that; and since the name of the MLP show is “Friendship Is Magic”, if the villain group really is called the “Legion of Doom”, I wonder if that was done intentionally to reference “Super Friends”.
Twi(and the other Mane 6) getting credit for Crysalis' defeat is probably simply because the writers weren't paid to worry about that consistency. Even if they worked on the show before, they could've forgot, because almost no one on the show every cares about it as specifically as the fandom does.
Here's the real gaslighting (not to mention inconsistent) problems with G4 MLP: The real missed opportunity is that Sunset would've been Twilight's real rival. Since EQGs1, she and Twi had a fitting hero/villain relationship. If Demonic Sunset hadn't thrown that fireball, ensuring her rushed, anti-climatic defeat, she would've abandoned the human world to seek revenge on Celestia, only for Twilight to chase after her. After their final confrontation, Sunset "admits" defeat, only duping Twilight into sapping her magic. The 3 alicorns would've separated them to save Twilight and for Sunset? She teleports her way out of incarceration, as The Mane 6 have not seen the last of Sunset. After that, Sunset becomes a Season 4 threat, possibly working for Tirek. As for the Human World that is Equestria Girls? The portal closed and it was never brought up, nor got any sequels after the first one, which was how it was supposed to be done, without sequels cluttering up FiM's continuity. Because Sunset remaining in Equestria means other villains who have an axe to grind will have their time to resurface (Discord, Trixie, Pony of Shadows [who isn't a nopony named Stygian; thanks a lot, Haber.], Lightning Dust and Queen Chrysalis) to join her in ruling Equestria and destroying The Mane 6 as potential storyline for Season 4. Now, doesn't that sound better than having the portal opened forever for many unneeded sequels? Besides, it being opened forever removes the urgency the 1st Movie had. Again, proving my point on the inconsistencies, and how they can be fixed. The human world serves zero purpose in FiM's storyline, resulting in filler (like the Alpha & Omega movies) and trash episodes like "Pinkie Apple Pie" and "Hearthbreakers" which has one BS arc. Pinkie's no apple to the core. Enough said. Sorry for making this comment long, but it needed to be said.
I agree that EQG wasn't highly needed, but I enjoyed the first 3 movies quite a bit! I don't mind Sunset being in the human world (though I do mind that they never address where human Sunset is). But it was weird to have Sunset be an element in the human world and not address that there is in fact a 7th element and do nothing with it in the pony world. ...Starlight could have solved that issue lol I'm also okay with Sunset staying in human land because we get Starlight in pony world and I'll take Starlight over Sunset any day. XD But yeah, I hear what you're saying and respect your point of view ^_^
@TheArtisticAloubell ...But here's the thing: Sunset showed potential to be a threat (who will change, mind you) in Season 4. And I agree with Starlight better than Sunset (I blame/thank McCarthy for underutilizing Sunset, mostly blame, but that's just me.). But, I found a Diamond in the Rough in the human land (Or should I say Emerald?): Wallflower Blush.
Don't apologize for your long comment. You said what you wanted to say, cause I too write long comments about different opinions on characters and shows.
My main problem with Starlight is not only gaslighting from Twilight, Celestia and Luna, but the fact she was spared and forgiven so easily. Think about it, she held a dictatorship in her town, basically skinned all the cutie marks out of main 6 and almost killed them. Yet they didn't put her in jail for that and she just became their friend. Compare this to Discord, who despite probably being the most innocent creature in the show had to prove himself till the end. And now look at how Sunset Shimmer was literally abandoned both by Celestia, Twilight and the show itself.
Just because you wouldn't forgive someone easily doesn't mean others can't. I welcome quick forgiveness! I don't believe that forgiveness should be earned. If Starlight weren't forgiven and given a chance, then Equestria would be worse off. Showing kindness and love accomplishes a lot more than suspicion and hate. In Equestria, it seems like you really only get locked up or severely punished if you are a threat and have no intentions on reforming. But since Starlight willingly stopped fighting and resolved to be a better person, they welcomed her with open arms and she was made better because of it. As much as I like Discord and his shenanigans, he didn't humble himself like Starlight usually would, and he'd continue to mess with the ponies despite it coming from a non-malicious place. So it's mostly because of his personality that he had a harder time warming up with the others and being fully accepted. And while I don't care about EQG all that much, it is a shame that it never got any closure. Still, though, Sunset was left in a pretty good spot. She has great friends in both worlds and is the leader of her friend group. Canonically, she's doing just fine.
@TheArtisticAloubell "I don't believe forgiveness should be earned" In that case Tirek and Chrysalis should've been forgiven even if they were sadistic and power hungry tyrants. Heck, if we put it that way real world tyrants and serial killers should be forgiven. Why not? They usually had rough childhood, they're all humans after all, even though they decided the fates of countless other people. If we put it way main 6 is just straight up Nazis.
@@ashesGeek Forgiveness doesn't mean letting people do whatever they want or being okay with their bad actions. Forgiveness means you aren't letting that anger take up space in your heart/brain and you aren't holding said resentment over someone's head. You can forgive Chrysalis and Tirek and still stop them/defeat them/put them in jail or whatever. They showed no signs of wanting to change, so they had to be dealt with for everyone's safety. Forgiveness doesn't mean being foolish or letting someone walk all over you. In Starlight's case, she was easily forgiven and went on to show the positive outcomes of that. You can't tell someone else to not forgive someone. If someone wants to forgive, let them forgive. Starlight was no longer a threat and no one held any animosity against her. No reason to not just go in peace.
@TheArtisticAloubell alright let's be it that way, in that case it makes Twilight and Celestia hypocrites for gaslighting Discord for so long. And yeah, I know, he was messing up with them, but he clearly was the most innocent villain they ever ever faced. Also remember Cozy. Sure, she's an egomaniac, but unlike Tirek and Chrysalis she's a child and it wasn't appropriate to send her in Tartar yet alone basically murdering her when turning into stone.
@@ashesGeek The gang had forgiven Discord. It's just that his personality made it hard for them to really wanna hang out with him that often (minus Fluttershy). Plus, he was off on his own most of the time. But even in the early stages of his reformation, Twilight and the other girls (except Fluttershy) were in the wrong for not being friendlier to him. They weren't sincere in their friendship with him which was partially why it was so easy for Tirek to manipulate him. So yes, Twi and co were in the wrong for not giving him a fair chance. After the whole Tirek situation, they knew he was a good guy, but their personalities clashed too much so they didn't hang out much. I actually recently did a video on Cozy! Yes, she wasn't treated fairly either. She was a very weird case. Definitely needed to be isolated from people she could manipulate, but she should have had a fair chance at rehabilitation.
The student six was definitely wasted. They could have been used in the finale possibly with a change to have the mane six LOSE, where the Mean 3 fully drain all the magic. But the student Six don't give up hope and then remind them of their friendship and they get NEW magic, a magic that the bell can absorb BUT has no limit. While the Bell DOES and they reach it. *Friendship being magic, but infinite magic* Bell explodes, all magic gets released even some Grogar took long before that could have been stuck in the bell. Like magic Earth Ponies, Dragons, and Gryphons once had. With the side effect where before the bell turned to dust, it drained the Mean 3 of their magic AND abilities. Tirek loses his ability to drain magic, Cozy Glow loses her flight and cutie mark, and Chrysalis loses her shapeshifting, magic and flight. But I would say that ironically enough Tirek doesn't go old, keeps his body as if he had magic just.. Weak. Cozy would be SO pissed, losing her ability to fly and being a blank flank FOREVER. All of them would be in prisons, but different ones. Tirek gets sent back to Tartarus since his magical knowledge could still be used for evil *Discord would leave a clone there, but not of himself.. Of Pinkie the most annoying pony he could think of* Cozy Glow, would be forced to stay at the school of friendship until she truly learns it. *Her cutiemark wouldn't be able to help her manipulate or lie anymore, OR they force a truth spell on her with tracking* Chrysalis ended up imprisoned in the very castle she once called home, forced to watch how the new changeling kingdom is run. *They still wish she would accept friendship and become their queen again*
I need you to do a video about the implementation of the young six. I personally think that they are completely unnecessary characters, but I want to hear your opinion because I love your MLP analysis ❤️
@@mara0627 Tbh they seem like boring characters to me. Their episodes are a slog to get through. Reminds me of g3. Cozy Glow was much more interesting and I wish she got more screen time.
ehhh i always thought pinkie should've been the one starlight had a problem with or even rainbow (SHE WAS SUSPICIOUS THE WHOLE TIME while flutters wanted to stay there) that being said though the cutie remark is the best of the entire mlp franchise but ya it woulda made it a lot easier if she hadn't declared her rivalry with twilight
Starlight, Spike, Luna and Sunset were the most mistreated main characters in the show, which is especially infuriating since they were the smartest and the most skilled out of all main cast. I swear, the number of gaslighting and straight up physical bullying Spike and Luna went through from their siblings is insane. That's why it was so satisfying to see them outsmart all of the main dummies in season 9 just to save these numbskulls.
Starlight being mistreated? Despite nearly eradicating Equestria by nearly altering the timeline, somehow she got off scott free and was easily forgiven by everybody. Literally no punishment whatsoever and how were the writers mistreating Starlight when they tried to make Starlight shine caused by the characters suddenly becoming dumbed down.
@samsea0489 what I meant by mistreatment is at least she put effort in redeeming herself despite still having a power urge. While I understand why she hasn't become a part of main 6 it's still unfair she had to change while all the others excluding Spike stayed the same petty assholes.
@@ashesGeek Starlight was committing crimes on a terrorist level. It's not the same as the mane six just being flawed/petty. Of course she had to change, she was breaking the universe.
@@asmrtpop2676 Starlight was done dirty for no reason, for sure. At least that's how I feel. I'm sure there was no real malice behind it, but it still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Of course, that could be my bias talking...but still. I'm sure their intention was not to say anything bad about those who identify with Starlight...it just sucks how she was handled.
Great points! But I feel like you missed one when it came to the whole “Discord is Grogar” reveal. Even that plot line confused me and was brushed off way too quickly. If they wanted to show that even a reformed villain can make well-meaning mistakes, there are better ways to do it. It would’ve been more fun to have Grogar actually be a character and fight alongside them during the end episode or maybe even put up a pretty good fight before plot armor or whatever steps in. I’m Just saying 🤷
That twist is the worst thing about the ending. It ruined Discord’s character. All his development to be better and he backstabbed his friends for a “test” is insane. Even villain Discord didn’t do something crazy like that. 💀
The thing about Season 6 that will always drive me nuts and is probably one of the biggest reasons why I can never take this show's story progression seriously has gotta be the very frustrating underutilization of Starlight Glimmer in that season. That season was clearly meant to tackle the themes of reformation as well as Starlight as a whole after Season 5. But it only tackled that topic in just 6 episodes. Six. Out of 26 episodes of an entire season, it only tackled Starlight and her themes in just six of them. And not even six back to back, six episodes spread out over the course of a whole season, that is otherwise filled with many episodes completely unrelated to Starlight. Had me absolutely baffled when I realized that.
I lowkey expected Starlight in S6 to get how Twilight was written in S1, to appear in every episode and learn more about friendship as she reforms. Not the best expectation considering how S2 improved on Twilight's involvement in the episodes moving forward, but Starlight appearing much more in S6 would've not hurt.
@@MrVectorMV The alleged idea that the writers picked up on how controversial Starlight was in the fandom and thus scaled back her prevalence in the story a bit in later seasons is upsetting 😤 But yes, even in Season 6 it would have been nice to see her more!
7:23. Hey, don't forget that Starlight got this medal only six episodes after using magic to enslave her friends in a vain attempt to impress her mentor. I think she got plenty of recognition considering how early in her character arc she was at that point. In the case of Starlight specifically, I can see why she never really become a "Mane 7" character. First, she doesn't really fit into the Mane 6. Her role is redundant to that of Twilight's. Second, she kind of has her own thing going on with collecting side characters and making friends with them. The S6 finale crew, Sunburst, Maud, etc. Third, she was just controversial. The writers would have been aware of this by S7 at the latest. She was written out of the comics completely. The FiM writers liked her enough to keep her around, but I think the fans' reactions to her probably had something to do with her diminishing role in later seasons. I do see your point regarding giving credit where it is due. I do have to say, one of FiM's strengths is letting other ponies besides the main characters take on an important role. This wouldn't be a problem in the first place if the Mane 6 were the only ones doing anything important. At least other characters got to do something, even if the writers promptly forgot about it.
It may have been early into her character development, but that shouldn't matter. Starlight and her friends did a feat just as impressive as anything else the Mane 6, Spike, Cadence, or Shining Armor did and should have gotten a stain glass window at the very least. Starlight and Co did a more advanced version of what Cadence and Shining armor did and yet they didn't get a window. I know it's not about the reward nor should it be, but it rubs me the wrong way to imply that their feat wasn't as imperative when Equestria would be toast without them. Even the Young 6 eventually get a window. Every other notable event gets a window but that one doesnt. It's weird and feels targeted. DX And regarding Starlight specifically, it's still odd how much emphasis they put on her and how important to Equestria's well-being they made her only to say that she's not "main character important." The way she's written is so contrary to what they claim DX But that's just how I see it. I do understand your points and I appreciate you sharing them! I'll always just be salty with how she was handled >_
@@TheArtisticAloubell It is weird how important she was only to be treated as... not important? I mean, she was getting more episodes in S6 and S7 than any of the Mane 6 except Twilight. She was, practically, *the* main character of the show for a while there. But somehow... she doesn't make the cut with things like the stained glass windows.
This is SO,SO ,SO true! Or that is what I used to think but... I actually think I am glad Starlight was not made a mane character. If you really trace the show, Starlight's main focused relationship is always with Twilight and she speaks to all of the main characters in relation to Twilight. This is very prominent by season 8 where you see that she is in more episodes with Trixie, Maud, Mudbryant and Sunburst and I honestly think she very much dissociates from the mane 6. Really the only character from the mane 6 we see her have an individual relationship with is Pinkie Pie and that is in relation to Maud Pie. I think that may be the reason as to why Starlight never became a mane character because she never had to be one. Like you said, she played an integral role in her own way and I kind of really like that. Plus, this distinguishes her from Sunset Shimmer IMO. ALSO SO HAPPY SOMEONE ELSE LOVES STARLIGHT AS MUCH AS MEEEE CAN I BE VICE PRESIDENT OF THE STARLIGHT FAN CLUB?! Edit : OMG I never realized, they never got a stained glass window that is SOOOOOOOOOOOOO dumbbb!!! Edit 2 : Sometimes, it's easier to throw your frustrations to the mane 6 even when they aren't exactly the ones who defeated the villains. It is still THEIR friendship that even allowed characters like Spike or Starlight or the Young 6 to defeat them. If their friendship did not exist, these villains would never have lost. So even then, the mane characters are still actually very strongly involved like the mane characters still matter, they taught the Young 6, mentored Starlight and it was Twilight's sacrifice for Spike to save the day. It's pretty nuanced and interesting.
I forgot to comment this on your last video, but I do really like seeing videos about disliking parts of media that you enjoy. I don’t see a lot of it. But that is what I do constantly with my own things I enjoy.
Starlight being Mane 7 doesn't work. She barely interacts with any of them aside from Twilight. The skills she brings are already covered by Twilight. Making her the leader of the secondary characters was a more inspired idea.
I knew Grogar's line about six puny ponies was not accurate as soon as I heard him say it. But this was a much bigger issue than I thought. I didn't realize this until you pointed it out. Thanks! Also, a better thing would be to say: "I’ve seen each of your humiliating defeats at the clutches of puny ponies and their equally puny allies."
Chrysalis did infact show anger towards starlight. She even mentioned how she was gonna seek revenge on her first. Sombra honestly never really showed anger towards anyone he was mainly focused on getting his crystal ponies back no matter what and left to achieve that on his own but then got defeated once again. Cozy glow just seemed to hate twilight for being so good at making friends and showing lots of power for it so her hate was more envy which is why she tried to take over the school. The other creatures just got in her way cause twilight did teach them about friendship plus the tree helped them as well. Also discord only said that to get them mad at twilight so she could defeat them and have a confidence boost
I know she showed anger towards Starlight--I was also willing to give Chrysalis' case some leeway since she did have previous interactions with Twilight. As for the others, I'm aware of Discord's plan, just not a fan of the wording of what he said and how some things played out.
On a similar note albeit in a different franchise. The Kirby franchise gave more credit to the side characters among the Dream Friends from Star Allies than MLP did to anyone other than the Mane 6. Even up to the trophy stuff did they not leave the supporting characters out.
I'm really sorry, but I never liked the idea of Starlight joining the main friend group. Her actions with Starswirl's time travel spell led to unspeakable atrocities and she never got punished for it. Hell, I'd say her actions were worse than what Cozy Glow did. Maybe if her redemption was written better and didn't feel rushed, my opinion would be different.
@@Hewylewis The point of punishment is to discourage bad behavior from happening again as well as to protect others. Starlight was no longer a threat and she wanted to change to be better. The other ponies knew she was no longer a threat and decided to give her a chance (and all of Starlight's oopsies were either undone or never happened because time travel). Punishments aren't always necessary especially if the behavior won't happen again. I for one welcome quick forgiveness as forgiving someone and giving them a chance can create opportunities for great things! And Starlight did great things for Equestria! I think she had a brilliant redemption arc. Others forgave her but it took a while for Starlight to forgive herself and feel confident again. It took her a while to overcome her trauma and years of isolation and learn how to be properly sociable and learn how to be a respectable leader who truly understands and encourages differences and friendship. Starlight truly wanted to change and even if others weren't mad at her, she still wanted to prove herself to them and herself. She had a beautiful journey! That's how I see it.
Ngl was kinda sad that I was only seeing videos from years ago x.x I was like damn found another interesting, talented artist who not only likes stuff I like but also loves God but isn’t around anymore 😢 I hope you keep itv up x,3
Ngl I thought starling ight gotboff way too easily for what she did and for such a tiny reason that could easily be fixed if she didn’t…stay mentally a child and fixate on ONE person leaving when they were…babies… idk just all she did for such a small reason she got less than a slap on the wrist for that. She got SEVERE gentle parenting avd…idk didn’t change much…and stayed friends…with trixie…idk I guess I’m not a fan. Lol I’m glad you love her tho ❤❤ you are allowed to of course.
I would like to add one more thing to the list, though this call out isn't really to the show but rather the fandom: Luna and Celestia are NOT useless, and i am tired of people thinking they are, so I made a list of arguments as to why celestia and luna are not useless: 1-After lunas banishment, it was celestia who guarded Equestria BY HERSELF for over 1000 years. all while grieving her sister and watching over ponies. generations of ponies. 2-Celestia and Luna are very busy monarchs as showed in season 7 episode 10, with a ton of royal duties to do, so no they cannot fix every last problem for the mane 6 becaues of their duties. 3-Celestia and luna purposely never help during villain attacks or crisis because they have planned for twilight to success them from the start. At the season 9 premiere celestia literally says everything the mane 6 have been through has been a training program. 4-The fandom overestimated celestia and lunas power. no they are not god-like beings who have this insane power. they can lower and raise the sun and moon because their talent is magic (similar to starlight and twilights talent) its their cutie mark magic that lets them raise and lower the sun and moon. its similar to how pinkie pie breaks 4th wall and does crazy things, its her talents that allows her to do so (twilight explains this brifely way back in season 1 in the episode where we meet Trixie). Its also canon that celestia and luna were not born alicorns and in fact were just like twilight, magically gifted unicorns who were taken under starswirls wings. (mentioned in season 6 premiere) so no the princesses cannot just one shot every single villain as that would make them no better then the villains themselves and they literally do not have such power. Yes the princesses are powerful, but they arent gods, they never were . 5-it was never stated that the princesses were the defenders of Equestria. from the begenning of the show, it was the mane 6 who were referred to as the heroes or as the defenders or protectors of Equestria. thats why the mane 6 never questioned why the princesses never helped, because they assumed it was their duty to do so now since they had the elements of harmony with them .
I agree that Celestia and Luna are not useless! Equestria would crumble without them (especially Celestia who had to keep it running by herself for 1000 years!) Just because they're not constantly on the front lines means they're useless >_< (also, G5 confirmed that Luna and Celestia were born alicorns; to be fair, they never said in G4 that they weren't. All they said was that a natural-born alicorn born in Equestria was something they've never seen nor experienced before. Since they were around before Equestria...theoretically...that tracks.)
@@TheArtisticAloubell well, they said and i quote "the birth of an alicorn is something equestria has never seen" and "it is beyond our understanding" that line is proof they don't understand how al alircon could be just born, showing they themselves weren't born as one, now I know g5 has told us they were allegedly born as alicorns, but that would not explain their shock On flurry heart. So I think we could call it a mistake by the writers i'm not sure.
@@billyboleson2830 I know right? the amount of hate I see people (especially Bronies) give celestia and luna for "being useless and never doing anything" annoys me. Like did you even watch the show? or do they just watch the premieres and finales and not see the episodes where they shine? its so annoying to me.
Everyone mentioned starlight sunset and everyone else they all forget Spike but he gets a 7th member of the mainstakes he was there from the start Don't forget him
I'll have to rewatch the ending, but I'd have had the villains target their spcific enemies in order to force the main six to have to split their attention. After all, they work best together. Chrysalis goes after Cadence/the Crystal Empire with Sombra, and Tirek and Cozy after Ponyville. Basically divide an conquer. Someone tell me if this was done in the show and Im just forgetting. It's been.... well, years. 🤔
6:04 Chrysalis literally compared friendship to infection in the frenemies episode so she probably saw it as something permanent,especially when they all changed their looks
Alou, people hawen't gravitated towards starlight cause she did extremely heinous things for petty reasons,was agressively forced next season,and contrived powerboost after her first appearence!
I wouldn’t say this alleged “power boost” was contrived. Starlight already knew powerful magic! Cutie Marks aren’t something that are easy to mess with. The only other times we see magic directly relating to Cutie Marks are Starswirl’s unfinished spell (and Starswirl was hailed as one of the most powerful unicorns in Equestrian History), and Starlight’s later cutie-swap spell. Starlight’s Cutie mark *is* intended to be for magic. And since we don’t see her casting too much, we only got a taste of what she was capable of in the Premier. There was NO contrivance. We already knew she had particularly powerful magic. She just upped her game in the finale.
I agree that Starlight did not great things, but I wouldn't say the reasons are petty... I mean, there was SOME level of pettiness in her getting revenge on Twilight and her friends for taking away her "perfect" village of Our Town, but that pettiness is rooted in trauma. As someone who has been in Starlight's position, losing friends can be traumatizing especially if you have no one around to help you cope through it. I lost my friend group in high school and it broke me and my personality. Even 15 years later I haven't fully recovered. Starlight had only 1 friend and lost him. Her parents weren't present enough to help her and she was so distraught that she couldn't make another friend. All of that anger she had bubbled up for years and years and her social isolation caused her to not grow in her social skills. With her being an otherwise smart, powerful, and unstable unicorn, it's no surprise she did what she did. She created Our Town in response to her trauma and believed she was helping everyone achieve true friendship. Though it was mostly for her to feel better about herself and her situation. It helped her gain control and make sure that traumatic event never happened again. But when Twi and friends rolled up into her village and led to her losing her "friends" again, she was pretty close to snapping and thus hatched her time travel scheme. Even when she found out that her actions might destroy the world, she was so broken that she was ultimately okay with that happening. All that is to say that Starlight was very troubled and you should never downplay someone's situation because you never know what they're going through. Just because you wouldn't feel/react in a certain way doesn't mean others wouldn't. Was it right for Starlight to lie and steal cutie marks? No. Was it right for her to mess with time? No. But the "why" is understandable. She needed help. And like our friend said in the other comment, Starlight was never weak. The fact that she could manipulate cutie marks meant she was already a higher-level magic user. She just became more motivated to learn more spells for her benefit after her initial defeat. As for her being a huge focus after her reformation; I'm not mad about it because I adore her character. Fortunately, I'm not alone in this idea and people have warmed up to Starlight over time. Not everyone loves her, of course, but that's for any character.
@@foxpokemonforever4775. Starlight said she studied that warbly textured shield spell for years, and"boast busters"established that many unicorns can only perform one, maybe two and three tricks, with twilight having firmly implied years worth knowledge,skill,practice,power. Spells that powerful like what starlight used during the season five finale, would've needed simularly lengthy time And dedication, But, many episodes during season five, including"amending fences", showed starlight have been stalking twilight, rather than getting stronger!
4:43 OBJECTION!! without the six cadence wouldnt be able to get out of that cave... lets just say that the mane 6 are the shooters and cadence and shining armor is the gun. you wont call the gun a murderer now would you?
@firerose4495 yeah but n but yeah but n but yeh.... You know what i mean. Justfor the sake of making it long: If the rest of the mane6 didnt leave twilight then she wouldnt have met cadance. But WAIT , if chrysalis left Twilight alone already at that point she wouldve won.
Season 9 is full of gaslighting, especially concerning the princesses retiring and also Ahuizotl’s plot twist. I for one advocate for an official revision of S9 and related media, and I urge anyone who’d like that to join my Save MLP fan campaign to help make it happen.
Idk how or if anyone has pointed this out in the comments but this scene at 4:06 is not the writers trying to gaslight the audience into thinking the mane 6 are the only adversaries of all the remaining villains, but it's Discord disguised as Grogar gaslighting the villains into believing they have a common enemy in the mane 6, particularly Twilight, whom he's pulling this whole charade for as some kind of test of her worthiness to rule Equestria on her own.
It would have made so much sense to have Starlight and her friends celebration at Canterlot since part of that episode was really about Twilight and Celestia and their memories And Starlight and her friends couldve gotten the stained glass there too
With the Starlight and Fluttershy thing, I have a couple of possible reasons she went for Twilight: 1. The writers needed to show all the alternate futures, and how would a Pegasus accomplish that? 2. You f*** with Fluttershy, you f*** with Discord! Did you SEE him when Starlight told him Chrysalis took "Twilight and her friends"?! That dude's SCARY! I think she dodged a bullet by not going for her, honestly.
The annoying thing with the legion of doom is that they could've made it work in actually interesting ways while still centering the mane 6. Grogar was actively trying to start things between specifically them and the mane 6. It would have made the scene between them all really interesting if he had said that line, everyone but Tirek went "actually no" and then they had him kind of manipulate and shift the blame in their minds with contrived logic and plays against their pride. Crysalis would ABSOLUTELY punish a changeling for being "brainwashed". But it could've been interesting to have a plot point abt her not seeing her subjects as people who's opinions she even needs to consider let alone be mad at. She thinks if she can get her revenge and get rid of Starlight and Twilight then she'll get her crown back because that concept and that blame is easier than acknowledging the fact that they are not in the way of her waltzing back into that hive and taking back control and that the thing stopping her is the hive itself. Sombra is literally all pride. He simply would not be okay with being the only one in the room(other than Cozy but that's not better considering she is a CHILD) to have not been beaten by equestrias heros but one of the 3 princesses that always gets one shot and Twilight's baby dragon/secretary.
#JusticeForStarlight I do agree ALOT with your point about Starlight not being proclaimed as part of the Mane 6 for the entire show, although I didn't have a problem with it because I did think the episodes captured her role significantly; your claim made me think about the show lacking addressing Starlight's significance a lot more. However I do think Grogar focusing on the Mane 6 specifically with his lines was fine because The Legion of Doom did acknowledge Starlight being the cause of Chrysalis's hive being reformed, which I think is somewhat true because Starlight took the greatest role in the episode and supported Thorax which led to him being reformed; which led to all the other Changelings being reformed. You're right about Chrysalis getting defeated by Cadence and Shining Armor first, but it happened so early on in the show that realistically everybody's focus would be on Starlight instead of them especially because the Changelings were Chrysalis main source of revenge and planning. I will probably just give the rest of my thoughts on your final point because It is what motivated me to write about this comment this most, I think the reason why Starlight only focused on Twilight and not Fluttershy, was because Twilight is the one who came up with the plan for Fluttershy to sneak up on Starlight in the first place, and Twilight showed Starlight that her power was pretty powerful before Starlight ran off and came back in the Season finale; because of that, it probably led to Starlight realizing how much more powerful Twilight is by her significance to the Tree of Harmony, and Discords defeat in the Season 2 finale being responsible by Twilight; Starlight took like the whole season planning on her revenge on Twilight, and also could've realized it was the Mane 6's friendship including Fluttershy which was strengthened by Twilight that caused her defeat in the first place; compared to something like Fluttershy being the only one responsible for Discord's reformation. And with everything I mentioned, I do think Starlight could've pointed to Twilight being responsible for everything that lead to her defeat; But there's more. I do think Starlight could've been extremely jealous of Twilight because of how well Twilight got her way with friendship compared to Starlight becoming a depressed, bitter pony after Sunburst and her got separated. And because of that, it lead to Starlight targeting Twilight, which I agreed on. I agreed with a lot of your points on this video! Except the last one, which I think is the one I believe was handled well. I really enjoyed hearing your thoughts and I will probably watch your next vid about mlp. ^^
You are right about The Mane 6 taking all the credit. I kind of don’t like S9 for it because they basically give all the credit to them. Not only Grogar only acknowledges them, but even The Mane 6 say they didn’t need help from the princesses even though without Luna warning Starlight, Chrysalis would’ve won for instance. (#JusticeForLuna) And they never admit they had help from others too like The Student 6, Starlight, etc.
I've been out of the MLP loop for a while. Never finished season 9 but i want to. I don't remember or get involved enough to really get at some of your points but this video was interesting! Also it's so cool i found this channel again! I remember you from a couple years or so back, when it was mainly just MLB videos. Not sure what was the first thing i watched from you. But i will definitely be exploring the channel. And you're Christian? Even more cool ❤
show did sombra dirty. i'll always believe his canon to conclude in the comic series. where mane 6 not only weren't the ones to solve sombra crisis for good, they almost ruined everything. sure, they saved the day at the end but it looked more like repentance.
Honestly yeah, justice for Starlight. Girl just had some childhood trauma and didn't have a good outlet to grow from it until the mane 6 came around. Everyone gave her shit and it makes me so sad cuz like, who DOESN'T have childhood trauma? I kinda relate to her a ton too from some irl circumstances :'). AJ will always be my homegirl but Starlight is an incredibly close second
“Oh l’m so sad and traumatised that my friend moved away to some prestigious magic school wa wa wa wa😭.” Losing a friend isn’t traumatising. We don’t even know if her parents helped her through it. And even if they didn’t, that still doesn’t excuse Starlight’s actions. Her backstory is like a person starting a cult where football isn’t allowed because in the past, the friend moved away to do football training at a location a long distance away
Like the villains being solely angry or mad at the main six when they basically did nothing remind me of Winx Club where bloom in season 5 so bad you should moment and got to defeat Titanic when it should have been a moment because what is she a fairy of water so why can't she get to you know beat the villain in the water themed season like what the math ain't mathing here
i say that there should be some great changes make star ligth and sunset the additional main hero and id say make multiple spin offs 1 spin off based on grogar's rein in a history documentary style show where its stated that grogar can sense the most powerufll benevolent indivituals bcs he is the malevolent force of the universe so his line 'at the hoofs of six ponies" makes sense bcs he believes its the superior beings of good that foil the villains plans and show he is a mindless brute so HIS BRIAN ISNT BIG and him being an idiot works 2 i believe that chrysalis is a BAD MOTHER i dont khow who canon it is she just doesnt seem as a LOVING PARENT to me so her not being mad at her kids and just straigth up being "OH THEY BETRAYED ME COOL I DISOWN ALL OF THE MA ND THEY ARE DEAD TO ME" fits her in my eyes
6:58 i mean she could have just hated starlight,but at the same time be aware that twilight is pretty powerfull too,and we know she knows how op elements of harmony are from episode mean six
There was a LOT that needed work…and most of the writers being men has been mentioned many times The Final Problem was not the send off the show deserved
I thought you were going to discuss how Starlight Glimmer gaslighted her village before her reformation. LOL This analysis was about a far more interesting and important matter!
I kinda preferred Starlight not being treated as part of the main group. She always shines a lot more when it's her with just Twilight or Trixie, but that could just be me projecting since I'm not someone who enjoys being in big groups
Starlight in the mane Group would be interesting I like but like Core 7 thing with 7 ponies idk if they would be called Mane 7 or not because of Equestria Girls and sunset Shimmer. Core 7 name is unofficial but its what everyone calls the g3/g3.5 2008 2009 gang.
Since Fluttershy is my favorite of the mane 6 yes I would have loved if her enemy was Starlight. But my friend questioned how she would match Starlight since she has no magic and wouldn't be as much of a threat as Twilight and my answer is the same way she handled Discord. Show Starlight some kindness, make her question herself and everything she has done. She doesn't need to beat her physically.
More than any explanation that can be found for it plot-wise, the reason for why Starlight targeted Twilight is clearly thematical, and it's partly the same reason why Starlight didn't ever become the 7th member. It's because she's a purple pony with a straight bang and a star symbol on her flank. She's not just an ideological, but in every way, a foil to Twilight specifically. And because she looks so much like her, it would be weird for advertisings to put a Twily lookalike with the mane 6. In support of this take is also the fact Sunset could join the mane 6, not just because it was a spin-off, but because she has a design far more distinct from Twily.
Yeah, that bugged me a lot too. It's actually one of the reasons that I stopped watching the show well before the end. There were other reasons too, so many other reasons, but this issue was definitely one of them. It went on for way too long, suffered seasonal rot and really seemed to have lost its purpose, focusing more on selling toys then writing a fun story. It really takes everything I have to not go off on a huge writing rant about the inconsistencies, the missed opportunities, the character degradation and the confused morals that happened the longer the series went on. And Shining Armor. I could rant about all the problems with him for hours. He was just a little microcosm of everything wrong about the show. I don't know if it was misandry or just glaring incompetency, but they did him dirty. Also Twilight was a horrible princess. (And a bad sister).
@hearmeout1767 Bad princess because she was often arrogant and was shown to abuse her position to get her way more than once, mostly when it came to her poorly thought out and unnecessary school. She just voluntells her "friends " to work for her without consideration to their current jobs and responsibilities, and when she rightfully is told by an administrator that her school shouldn't open she just steps over him because she's an alicorn and apparently that means you can just do whatever you want, even if you almost caused a multi international incident. If you count G5, she stole magic from the world which divided the three pony races and potentially caused the extinction of several of the other races. As for the sister thing, everytime she shared screen time with Shining she was either talking down to him, bullying him or ignoring his existence in favor of kissing Cadence's ass. It didn't help any that Shining was a half formed character who didn't really have a properly defined personality and we never see a dynamic between them since every episode with him separated them from each other for the majority of the run time. He's treated as an accessory to Cadence, like a purse puppy, rather than a character and this is reflected in the writing to the detriment of all the characters related to him. The one time her family is given an episode, the writer's, and therefore Twilight, don't treat them much better. She barely spends time with them, not for their sake, but for Cadence's and they are written with the same care as any vapid, wacky background character. To be fair, that whole episode was garbage, but it literally made me hate Twilight and stop watching the show completely. Her parents, brother and niece don't even get cameos in the movie, which starts with her throwing herself a festival. But I guess her "big brother best friend forever" wasn't a good enough friend to be invited to her friendship festival. Twilight only cares about how Celestia and Cadence view her, everyone else is just a tool to gain those two's approval. She steps over anyone who isn't useful to that end. And before anyone tries to excuse any of this, I get what the writers were trying to do with most of these points. They just sucked at it, which caused my overly analytical brain to have a different take than what was intended. It's perfectly fine if you see it the way it was intended and like Twilight just as she is. But to me, Twilight as a princess was awful and Shining Armor had notably some of the worst character writing and it kind of ruined the show for me.
@@aprilvaiarella435 Thank you for taking the time to write this; this definitely interested me since I'm always curious to hear different analysis of one of my favorite shows. And ironically, criticism of MLP helps me love it more.
Again;"the show seriously should've ended with season four"! Afterwards their writing devolved all into;"recycled scripts("look before you sleep"/"starnger than fanfiction"/"the end inn friend"all have the same lesson;"just because someone's personality and tastes not allign with your own doesn't mean you can't make friends"),obvious first drafts,plus blatant fanservice"! Grogar could return from generation One but cozy glow wasn't new wind whistler?
I don't agree. I think we got a lot of awesome things from the second half of the show! But like all shows, nothing is perfect ^^ But I respect your opinion!
@@TheArtisticAloubell. Why not? That was the season where the writing was the tightest;"twilight was logically front and center again,three over arching storylines simultaniously(twilight's identity crisis amidst her new role,the chest mystery,and completely reforming discord),the old writers still around,epic finale with new tirek! Who was this franchise's first villain!
There's also the power scaling that I have an issue with. It has been established from the first episode that alicorns are much more powerful than a regular pony, especially in magic. And yet, Celestia and Luna have so many times so easily been defeated by just about anypony and they never really contribute much to the main villains problems, most likely because the writers want Twilight and her friends to take the spotlight. That last part at least I do understand, but they could've at least made them put up more of a fight to really indicate their power. There's also the fight between Twilight and Starlight, which is a bit weird. Now as unicorns it might make sense that they at least be close equals, but with Twilight as an alicorn, it just shouldn't be up for discussion. The only pony who might challenge alicorns might be Starswirl the Bearded, whom we saw match the strength of the two alicorn sisters' magic in keeping ponyville safe in the last season.
Regarding Starlight, she's just an exceptional/prodigy magic user like Starswirl. Like Twilight, their talent is magic. To think that Starswirl is the only unicorn ever that can be super powerful or match alicorns is unlikely. There will always be newer generations and other unicorns who come along that have incredible magical potential. Starlight might be considered this generations Starswirl. Twi is also a young alicorn, so you can make the argument that she hasn't completely grown into her powers yet. Starlight might have been better while Twi was still young, but Twi probably became more powerful over time. But yes, 100% the show gave us the idea that alicorns are super powerful, but they barely ever prove it lol Maybe their incredibly magic potential just goes towards their talent? Like Luna and Celestia can raise the sun and moon, something other ponies struggle with even with help, so you can imagine how much power that takes. But perhaps they can really only focus that power on their talent and not in, say, combat. Idk, the show is inconsistent X'D
@TheArtisticAloubell the only instances where they have highlighted alicorn magic is with Flurry Heart and Twilight's fight against Tirek. But I just think it's not very consistent 😭
Gaslighting? Starlight was controversial for a reason. Her redemption was 180'd in under a minute and got most fans' sympathy for what was essentially a toddler hissy fit. When that's the foundation you're working with any further development is quite easy to disbelieve or have any faith in. That's what makes her later writing and development extremely weak and why they had to continually force her into a lot of situations she didn't really need to be involved in. At that point they had to complete rewrite her personality and make her an entirely different character all the while pretending her reasoning for her crimes was rational. Starlight had always been a disaster of a character and exactly why I couldn't stand the show any longer.
@@RooftopRose079 I'm not justifying any of her actions, but as someone who experienced what Starlight did, it was traumatizing, so I get where she's coming from. Losing my friends broke me and even after 15 years I still feel it. Starlight had no one to help her cope and she was close to jumping over the edge and taking everyone with her for how much pain she was in and Twilight was able to help her from that. Starlight was shown kindness and was able to change for the better, becoming a positive influence on Equestria. Starlight is only controversial because too many people trivialize her trauma and don't like easy forgiveness. I celebrate easy forgiveness as it can lead to a lot of good.
Exactly and then she somehow just gets stronger because the plot demands it. It was already said she wasn't that good at magic and even her strongest spell did close to nothing to twilight but then suddenly she's able to fight twilight after a few month's? Mind you Twlight is an Alicorn, the element of magic student to Celestia.
@DromusTH When she was a child she wasn't that good at magic. Clearly she got better as she got older. Twilight wasn't that good at magic either when she was a filly when she was first learning. Starlight's talent has always been magic just like Twilight. Since season 1 it's been said how near impossible it is to mess with cutie marks and yet Starlight is the first one shown to be able to expertly manipulate them. That shows incredible talent. Just because Twilight blocked her doesn't mean she was weak. It just meant that Twilight had a better defense. Once Starlight is motivated, there's almost nothing magic-wise that she can't do. And once revenge was on her brain, she was motivated enough to learn more magic. So it wasn't a skill issue, it was a motivational one.
@@TheArtisticAloubell What you experienced similar to Starlight isn’t that traumatising. Most people experienced a friend moving away from them and they quickly got over it because it wasn’t traumatising. Even if no one helped her cope, that’s doesn’t excuse her actions. I’m sorry it just doesn’t moreover her whole major issue was, as Firebrand put it 8 years ago, rushing in like a train wreck. This was what caused Starlight to begin a cult of her own resulting in all the other things that would occur next. And still was a problem for her even when she was reformed. I’m sorry but l don’t think Starlight changed all that much.
@samsea0489 you can't tell someone if they got traumatized or not. You aren't experiencing their feelings or what's going on in their hearts and brain. Just because you weren't hurt as dramatically doesn't mean others weren't. Like I said, losing my friends broke my personality and I never recovered. I, like Starlight, didn't have the help or means to cope, so it stunted my development. Besides, the point of the season 5 finale is that seemingly small things can snowball out of control if not attended to. Had Starlight gotten help early, these things wouldn't have happened. She was completely alone and thus wasn't able to properly develop socially or emotionally and it took Twilight convincing her to not take everyone down with her to finally get her recovering from her past. So yeah, even if you can't empathize, it's still good to sympathize and see when someone is hurt and needs help.
I like to think that Starlight actually wanted to go after Fluttershy at first but decided to go after Twilight first. Glimmy most likely watched all of the Mane 6 to know their weaknesses. She probably switched her target when she saw that Twilight was the only one who seemed to not like Discord and when Pinkie mentioned Time Travel (S5 E22). She then probably went to Canterlot Castle and stole Starswirl's Spell to perfect it. She then heard about the presentation from Twilight, went there, and heard about RD's first Rainboom. I also never really thought about that and the Gaslighting from Season 9. When you think about it, Sombra was the only one who managed to defeat everyone he wanted to defeat. (Got revenge on Cadance and Spike and briefly took over Canterlot when Celestia and Luna were... shomewhere) As for the rest of the Legion of Doom: Chrysalis could've gone for the Changelings by going after Ocellus, which could've gotten tension between Ponies and Changelings, but then Starlight sidetracked her. For Cozy, you could also say that the CMC would also be her target, because they distracted her long enough for the student 6 to get to the Basement of the school. Gallus of Silverstream could've flown to Canterlot to get Cozy to the Mane 6 to get her off their trail and warn their respective Kingdoms. And then there's Tirek... he got revenge on Starswirl and 5 of the Mane 6. I guess they could've made him go for the Christal empire? Cadence, Shining and Flurry could've gotten more involvement like that (They were WAY too underused in the Show in general) I also would've liked for one of the Mean 6 to have survived and been one of the Main antagonists of Season 9 (One can only dream...) It would've made the first S9 fight against Sombra have more stakes, because they don't have all elements and/or have one currupted element of harmony. This video in general made me realize the missed potential the Series had with the villains. It's a very good video #JusticeForStarlight
4:44 - 4:45 Technicically it was season 6 finale.
@@firerose4495 my bad. Thought I caught that XD. Thanks for fact-checking!
@@TheArtisticAloubell Your welcome.
@@TheArtisticAloubell. Won't hold that against you, unlike starlight, honest mistake.
I think the reason that Starlight went after Twilight is because she's an Alicorn. "When you think your talent is special, you don't see eye to eye" That's what she says to Twilight. She sees HERSELF in Twilight. That's why she's after her.
Also I think because they were opposed at the ideological level, and Starlight saw Twilight's as the primary obstacle to her vision of friendship and equality.
And also perhaps because she was the leader of the group that ruined her life and forced her out of her home.
not only an alicorn but a princess of friendship as well, so Starlight probably saw her as the root of all evil. In her eyes, friendship and being special couldn't coexist, but those two things were Twilight's two most notable features.
Another gaslighting part is how the princesses are treated like powerful, wonderful rulers.
THEY GET ONE HITTER NEARLY EVERY SEASON FINALE.
Cadence is a wonderful ruler ☝️😌
Luna and Celestia literally raised and lowered the Sun and Moon everyday, literal celestial bodies. Not to mention they are 1000 years old. And Cadance’s own cutie mark is the Crystal Heart, which powers the emotions of the Crystal Ponies. To say they aren’t powerful is just a generally wrong statement
@@kodicore But in the comics, because in the series is just a mother
@@MsAmber82 she's not a mother until s 6??? And she did way more than Celestia and Luna, she defeated Chrysalis, Sombra, traveled across equestria to defeat a giant plant worm with Twilight so Discord could feel better even though he was faking, and even after she became a mother she still did stuff.
I think it's poetic how Celestia organizes herself a plot to retire (and not give Luna a chance to govern in her stead) via Twilight, and then Twilight's reign barely lasts a century or two before an ancient alicorn finds out that Celestia is no longer around and comes to take over.
Fluttershy being the Naruto/ Steven universe of the group and talk-no-jutsu all the enemies into reforming would had been hilarious.
Specially considering how questionable Discord reform was. I mean, he stopped being malicious, sure, but he kept a somewhat antagonizing role all through the series. In his words (from the comics): "I went from chaotic evil to chaotic neutral"
Since Steven Universe was mentioned, I believe that show has the same issue discused in this video.
But it's even WORSE in Steven Universe from what I've heard.
I hope I didn't offend anyone by saying this.
Grogar’s line rewritten:
I’ve seen your humiliating defeats by the hooves of six puny ponies… *walks past Tirek* an insecure unicorn *points to Chrysalis* three princesses and a dragon *glares at Sombra* and six creatures who should have no business with battles in the first place *Cozy Glow pouts*
Yeah I couldn’t include Trixie Thorax and Discord for Chrysalis’s defeat but I don’t think it matters as Chrysalis is never shown to be mad at them (except for Thorax I guess)
Because otherwise, only have thorax's word for betraying chrysalis, until his big bro entered.
But how would Grogar knew on how these three villains were defeated. This line would make fans suspect this wasnt the real grogar from the beginning or even think It was already Discord disguised because I The dont think he just so happens to be there at the exact moment
7:48 THANK YOU! Really if anything Sombra should be more upset that a tiny baby dragon helped defeat him then anything else and find that absurd or humiliating to where he would want revenge on him rather then the Mane 6 especially considering Spike is seen as the hero of the crystal empire so frankly Sombra should be Spikes villain then anything, the two could parallel each other as they were both non ponies raised by ponies. He could have been used as an interesting dark mirror image for Spike but no he doesn't address him at all in s9.
Spike really didnt do anything more than get the crystal closer, Twilight was the one who find it and cadence brought it to the center.
Spike was like a tiny spot falling on his death, why the hell he would consider spike his defeater?
@@Amanecer458 If it wasn't for Spike being with Twilight, she would have been stuck in the Nightmare spell Sombra made to keep people away from the heart. Spike ALSO grabbed the Crystal Heart after Twilight pushed it out of the trap she got stuck in. Without Spike, Twilight wouldn't have been able to do as much and Cadance literally wouldn't even have the chance to SEE the Crystal Heart.
@@cameoshadowness7757 This here, also Sombra is definitely the kind of guy who would find the fact that Spike is seen as the hero of the crystal empire to be an insult to him.
@@LegendaryOverfiend 100% its a BABY dragon of all things, not even a full grown dragon or one that hit Molt, a very small dragon who managed to help get the heart to the princess on time! Oh! The painful realization that everything could have worked out if it wasn't for such a little child of all things!
@@Amanecer458 Sombra didn't know Twilights contribution to his defeat. The last thing he saw was Spike and Cadence giving the Crystal heart back to the citizens. So from his perspective, Cadence and Spike should be his #1 enemies.
Don’t get me wrong Starlight was treated unfairly #JusticeForStarlight but the young six were treated just as bad if not worse in my opinion.They literally SAVED ALL OF EQUESTRIA MAGIC and they barely got a pat on the back for it they couldn’t even give them the pink heart medal things.And the fact that Cozy didn’t care for revenge against them is crazy at least Chrysalis still held hatred for Starlight the young six didn’t even get that with Cozy.Honestly I don’t think the show knew what to do with them or Starlight.
That's a great point as well!
@@TheArtisticAloubell. Unfortunately, even Lily Orchard caught what become the show, rather than having friendship being special and only given for those who reciprocate, become treated like the force something vague that you gotta fallow and keep people around. The young six arcs are effectively complete, and starlight could've gone home, but any new material about them would've been very obvious regurgitation for the mane six and sunset adventures(with only marginal differences like each being different species, and starlight Made the town)! Sad?
the reason starlight hated twilight is because twilight is the leader of the mane six, a diverse group of friends who still have all their unique qualities and still get along. starlight became a villain because her friend was more unique than her, powerful and got his cutie mark early and got sent to the magic school. she felt abandoned, and she blamed friendship for that, and since twilight was the opposite of her and the princess of friendship, she hated twilight
@@CrazyGreenFluff Fair assessment!
I think it's also fair to consider that Starlight was particularly focused on Twilight from the beginning. The instant she met the group, she prioritized converting Twilight because she was a princess. Her status is specifically the thing she wanted to leverage for her cause. The friendship speeches probably held more weight because of that tunnel vision and so you could argue the gaslighting was at herself, convincing herself that Twilight was the reason things fell apart. After all, in order to accept Starlight, we need to accept that a lot of her character is based on lies she tells herself.
It's also likely that she resented Twilight because in both "Amending Fences" and "Cutie Re-Mark, Part 1" Starlight is seen in the background as if seeking something to use against not only Twilight but the Mane 6. In "The Cutie Re-Mark" two-parter she evens tries to prevent the sonic rainboom that caused the initial bond of the Mane 6 and thus disrupt their ever becoming friends
To be fair to Chrysalis, Twilight did lay the groundwork for her original defeat given she freed Cadance. So, in her eyes Twilight could be seen as the root cause of her initial failure despite the fact SH and PC were the ones to actually beat her.
That's part of why I gave Chrysalis' situation some wiggle room X3 It's not like Twilight did NOTHING in her downfall, she's just much lower on the totem pole.
The first four issues of the IDW comics highlight this and she has more of a vendetta against Twilight, more so than Starlight in later seasons.
Frankly, despite me also being a fellow Starlight Glimmer fan, i was actually GLAD she wasn't officially recognized as the 7th main character or element.
That honor is and always should have been deserved for Spike.
I also just thought of something with what you said at 1:37. Spike could still keep the group balance, as the only male/dragon/non-pony, so he's symmetrical to himself.
I really do think the Grogar comment was an in-character choice by Discord. He was pulling these villains into a cohesive threat with the specific purpose of testing Twilight and her friends to prove to them that they were really ready to rule Equestria. The villains knew the truth and held their own grudges, but they believed that it really was Grogar facing them and with his legendary power level they thought better of correcting him with an "Um, actually."
As for Starlight in season 5, she's seen spying on the Mane 6 throughout the season to learn about their weaknesses. Being a iron-hooved leader in her village, she likely though that Fluttershy was just acting on Twilight's orders (which she kinda was), so she put the blame with Twilight. Her eventual plan of stopping the rainboom would hurt them all in the end, and she could rub Twilight's defeat in her face while it happened.
Very good points!
exactly, discord was trying to unite the villains against a "common" enemy, the ponies who's metal he wanted to test
9:24 “CozyGlow was defeated by a tree” cinema
I always figured her not making the mane 6 the mane seven {even though Spike makes them seven already) was simply because she isn't properly friends with them. She's reformed, but Twilight's friends aren't necessarily her friends. Like how she isn't really friends with Pinkie and Rarity, she's friends with Maud and Trixie.
@@harleaarmstrong7659 Starlight and the mane 6 are friends, though. She hung out with all of them individually at least twice (on screen) and she went on the friendship camping trip (Spike didn't even attend that)!
Even within the mane 6, there are some relationships that aren't as developed as others (to the point that they even had to point out that Rainbow and Rarity don't interact much on screen and yet they are still good friends).
I agree that there could have been more casual hang outs with the other mane 6 members shown to us via more episodes, but they are friends with Starlight.
@TheArtisticAloubell That's true, but a lot of those were also technically mandatory for friendship lessons. Its hard to see how much of that is them actually being friends.
I am a supporter of fanfictions, though, because the show cant really be continued or edited from G4 otherwise. I'm personally working on one where discrepancies like that get fixed [and adjusments made so that what would be g5 isnt regression back to segregation, like fixing the power sucking vortex that is the EqG world and bringing Sunset back - because its ridiculous to leave Twilight to mantel both Sun and Moon responsibilities, imo.]
It's likely the inclusion of Starlight into the Mane 6 and renamining the group the "Mane 7" was likely to avoid confusing the group with the Rainbooms/Humane 7 from the Equestria Girls spinoff as pre-Friendship Games it was Sunset Shimmer that took Twilight's place as the leader/main focus. If the MLP:FiM group was renamed with Starlight and Trixie (or Discord) becoming tangential parts of the Mane 6, then it could either affect the marketing or create confusion with the MLP:EqG group
I always did just assume that the villains mainly wanted to take out the Mane 6 because they were the biggest threats to their plans and with them out of the way, it'd be easier to take over Equestria. But yeah, Tirek really is the only one who should be directly mad at them, the others are weirdly bent on revenge against *THEM* specifically considering how the Mane 6 didn't defeat them. 😅
I guess I did notice this at some level, but wow, it was even worst than I thought tbh. Like you said, I still love the Mane 6 and MLP, and this writting flaw doesn't make me like it less as a show, but good on you for pointing it out, because I don't think anyone else has before to my knowledge. Let's give credit where credit is due! #JusticeForStarlight ✨
@@Ro994 Yeah, if Grogar had simply said his like differently and phrased it along the lines of they need to take out the Mane 6 mainly because they are the biggest threat and left it at that, it would have been fine.
And it would have been great for the villains to have a little vent-fest as they all discuss the ponies/creatures they want to get their revenge against.
It truly would have been a good time!
Not that it wasn't, but it would have been a better written good time! ✨
@@TheArtisticAloubellI dont know what cosy glow has against the main six, considering they weren't the ones to defeat her.
But.
Chrysalis and sombra, I understand. If the main six weren't there, they would have taken over. Twilight discovered Chrysalis' plan and found cadence, and then when cadence was stuck to the floor, Twilight freed her so she could go to shining armour and do the love spell. If Twilight wasn't there, her plan would have succeeded.
Sombra is quite the same. If the main six didn't help cheer up the crystal ponies, they wouldn't have been able to power the crystal heart. And if Twilight wasn't there, they probably never would have found the crystal heart in the first place.
Both of their plans got foild by this small group, even if they weren't the ones to truly finally defeat them. If they weren't there, the villains would have almost definitely won.
@moonbloom2262 Chrysalis I'll give some wiggle room because she did have interactions with Twilight and she understands that she was the one who rescued Cadence. However, Chrysalis and her Changelings still defeated the mane 6. Her issue came with Cadence and Shining Armor. They defeated her.
And even if Chrysalis blamed Twilight for that, she still defeated Twilight and her friends again when she infiltrated Ponyville and kidnapped them. At that point, she got her revenge on them.
Starlight (and technically Thorax) should be her biggest sources of hate.
And regarding Sombra, from his perspective, all he saw was Cadence and Spike with the Crystal Heart. He never witnessed the mane 6 doing anything. Yes they (but mostly Twilight) did all the hard work, but it was Cadence's spell that kept him out of the empire and it was she and Spike who delivered the Crystal Heart. That's all he knows. He didn't even know the mane 6 existed.
for the starlight one , you can argue that twilight is the leader and the one who sent fluttershy to mess up starlight's plan. twilight is also a symbol of what starlight stood against from her point of view. twilight has the friendship starlight has always wanted, she also has influence due to being a princess. twilight's destiny in a way is determined by her cutiemark. to starlight, twilight's cutie mark is what got her all these things, not the years of effort, the trials, the ponies, or her willingness to change from a antisocial bookworm to a social butterfly. starlight probably had many opportunities to make new friends and be a better pony, but she chose to stew in her heartbreak and resentment towards cutiemarks.
@@scorcher69 fair point! ✨
Definitely.
Moondancer's another example of what Twilight could have been under different circumstances, the fact Moondancer rejected friendship and chose isolation before Twilight brings in Pinkie Pie was because of Twilight (somehow seems like a later issue with Tempest) abandoning her. In a flashback in "Amending Fences" it's hearing from Minuette and Lemon Hearts that Twilight wasn't showing up which depresses Moondancer and makes her focused on studying, so it's possible outside of studying magic (and not being pushed by Celestia) this makes Starlight a great example of what Twilight's life could have become.
Starlight Glimmer: I rejected friendship because my FRIEND abandoned me once he got HIS cutie mark! Nopony should have cutie marks to be special!
Moondancer: You abandoned me, Twilight, so I shut everypony else out.
I kind of do like that Starlight isn't officially one of the main girls, because when you think about it,.she see things that the others don't see and works better outside their group
With the pony of shadows Starlight was the only one who was fighting to find out if he could be reasoned with or saved
Imagine just how pressure would be on her to go along with the other element barers if she had an element herself
Just like with Fluttershy in Keep calm and flutter on
She helps in unique ways because her past and perspective
So she actually is much better being an outside advocate and thinker and maybe even anti-hero who is close with the main 6 and is officially and unofficially part of the group
This was was also acknowledged in the episode where she switched Celestia's and Luna's cutie marks, as well
i actually prefer starlight not being a part of the main 6. the 6 are so iconic adding a 7th one would not feel special and would ruin the whole thing. now adding 6 extra character that are best friends that are like. side main 6 if you will.. is an idea i came up with and i love!
The true 7th member will always be Spike, idc what the Sunset and Starlight fans say my goat was there from day 1
And honestly starlight not being part of the mane 6 honestly makes her more unique as a character to be frank
Spike: “SEVEN!”
You know what we _really_ need? We need justice for Trixie, what happened to Starlight pales in comparison to Trixie, at least in my eyes. Trixie had her home destroyed, became homeless, and was ostracized from every town she went to, while Starlight was forgiven instantly and got all the friends she could've ever wanted.
I'm not trying to downplay what happened to Starlight, but it really seems like nobody talks about what happened to Trixie. I see a lot of people say she isn't misunderstood and that she's just narcissistic, but I disagree, the writers tried to make it clear she's not meant to be taken at face value and a lot of people still don't understand that.
She has deep-rooted insecurites and loneliness inside her, especially when looking at No Second Prances where she _literally tries to off herself_ when she thinks Starlight doesn't want to be her friend. I know that scene is/was heavily debated when the episode first aired, but I think it's pretty clear what Trixie's intent was, she herself said that she thought the Manticore would eat her alive if Starlight wasn't there to save her, and she did it anyways fully believing she would die.
I'm glad you covered Starlight, and I'd love to see you cover Trixie, they're both flawed and insecure in similar ways, and I think that's part of why they work so well together.
1:24 but there exists 7th element of harmony in equestria that we got to see 2 times in the show:
- on old depiction of Tree of Harmony
- in Spike's hoard when he got greedy (it was till in old stone ball form as it wasn' destroyed by Nightmare moon)
No idea wat happened to it later tho :3
Chrysalis's motivations are a mess in general. But let me just get this straightened. Yes, Cadence and Shining were the nail in the coffin in the Season 2 finale, but their actions wouldn't have been possible without Twilight, who was the most suspicious of her and actually saved the real Cadence. Thus, she would have plenty of resentment towards Twilight, which is why we don't see Shining and Cadence again in the Season 6 finale.
Similarly, Starlight was the leader of the anti-hero squad that saved everyone in the Season 6 finale, with Starlight being the initiator of Chrysalis's downfall by suggesting that the Changelings give their love to her, which resulted in the betrayal of the hive. But she doesn't blame the Changelings or the Crystal Empire's royalty, she blames the one responsible for those climaxes happening. I know the comics are B-canon, but if you read The Return of Queen Chrysalis, Twilight is in fact the one she resents upon her defeat. It's just that after Season 6, her mind went from being hyperfixated on Twilight to being hyperfixated on Starlight.
11:37 No not Discord! He made this mess to begin with. He’s lucky that he wasn’t turned to stone for his idiocy. Lol
It's important for a show to not take too much focus away from its main characters, especially in a show like MLP that's constantly introducing new characters and ideas. However, I see your point that the show often tries to do this too much. Heck, the student 6 don't have nearly as much screen time as Starlight yet they're still given more respect than her. I realized on rewatch that I like them more when the show isn't trying to force the idea that they are the next generation of the elements. They are secondary characters and should be treated as such. Fortunately, Spike is always given his rightful place among the main 6. He deserves it as he's been a staple of the show since day one.
You could say the hesitance to consider her in the main group is her natural consequence for the bad things she did. Even though she was forgiven, did great things, and got the privilege of being Twilight's student, she ultimately couldn't reach the levels of the others because it is the consequence of her actions
@@hearmeout1767 Sunset did bad things as well and still got considered part of the main group in her universe.
Starlight was fully forgiven and even took over Twilight's school and castle. With how much focus the show gave her, how often she was the solution, to not officially consider her part of the group just doesn't make sense from what was written.
@@TheArtisticAloubell i think that was more writer choice to show like difference in personalities and everything. Sunset became the "7th" cuz for one, the environment of "equestria girls" allowed it, in fact, the entire series started off becz she stole pony twilight's crown. she had the right personality to grow as part of the iconic group.
However, with starlight, her personality makes her a good "learner..?" she learns from the mane 6, she understands from them, her personality.. doesnt actually align well... the way sunset's does..
cuz when i see sunset, she is the one breaking fights, bringing people together cuz her personality allows her to... starlight, on the other hand, struggles ALOT. WHICH MAKES SENSE, as a writer i could totally see why.. she spent an ENTIRE season planning to take down twilight and her friends, Travels BACK IN TIME, changes the future, almost destroying equestria, and all of a sudden.. she doesnt hv flaws?
sunset .. i would say... got ?lucky? cuz the human twilight was MORE flawed compared to sunset.. while teaching human twilight, she learnt faster herself while also taking guidance from pony twilight...
Starlight had a long way to go, and on the way, she was bound to make friends that incline to her personality more. Trixie, discord, Maud.. all 3 being one of the weirdest characters in the show!
its like, she would "relate" to them more than the mane 6, mainly becz each of their flaws and strengths kind of align a lot well then one might think..
Making starlight just like sunset would decrease "inclusion".. one thing about mlp is that they include so many personalities in multiple different characters that if u dont relate with any of the mane 6, you WILL with atleast one of the side characters. the world building.. is... very nice.. imo... LIke.. VERY NICE.. as someone who literally built a world of many characters, i pay a lot of respect to the writers (but then again.. im a noob.. what do i know)
IM NOT MUCH OF A YAPPER AND IM STRUGGLIN SO HARD TO PUT WORDS TOGETHER, HOPEFULLY IT MAKES SOMEWHAT SENSE, IM SORRY IF IT SOUNDS TOTAL NONSENSE- to think i wana write storie.....
@@Abyss777
What you wrote didn't sound like nonsense. I understand what you're getting at! ^^
Starlight has a totally unique personality that makes her unique from Sunset. Starlight is snarky, impulsive/trigger happy, insecure, loves to play around with magic in a way that Twilight didn't, has some social incompetence, and is a blossoming leader (as by the end she's grown her leadership skills enough that Twilight left her in charge at the school of friendship). Starlight was never "automatically flawless." If anything, that was Sunset as it seemed like the writers forgot that she used to be a villain and they eventually remembered to give her flaws. Whereas Starlight, in her debut as a good guy, had some attitude and avoidance behaviors where she'd sometimes use manipulation. Yes, Starlight had a lot to learn, but that was to be expected from her background. With her unique personality meshing with the other members of the Mane 6, that would have helped her development.
I think Starlight and Sunset both could have represented the same element of harmony. This does NOT mean they have the same personality. Just as the elements have been passed down and evolved in Equestria to individuals with different personalities, so can the two different ponies of Starlight and Sunset both represent empathy/forgiveness. The fact that Starlight was able to connect with individuals that others had a VERY tough time connecting with means she shows more empathy than the other mane 6. Her being a guidance counselor also shows that. So to not make her something like the element of empathy seemed like a missed opportunity to me >_
#JusticeForStarlight I can't say that I ever noticed the gaslighting. But now that you mention it I have to agree with your assessment. You do a good job of noticing the the little details. Much respect!
@@StealthyPumpkin Glad I can make known some obscure details lol
Thanks for watching! ✨❤️
It's like a reversal of the "main characters do everything" trope- the "main antags target the mains even if it makes no sense".
Now thinking about it, as much as I loved the Season 5 finale, I just remembered something- RD's "flashback" also includes Fluttershy. Maybe she goes back in time with Twilight not to just interfere with the Rainboom, but Fluttershy's connection to it as well.
What if Fluttershy's bullying wasn't prevented? Or the one who prevented it was Starlight, not Dash or a cloud-fall?
#JusticeForStarlight and also #JusticeForFluttershy.
(Also seeing how Fluttershy changes in each alt timeline would be better than pseudo-background pony in only the Chrysalis timeline.. which brings another connection between Starlight, Fluttershy, and Changelings.)
There is literally an alternate timeline Starlight creates when she stops it. It can also be argued that her messing with RDs flying in every timeline resulted in RD unable to stop the bullying in her way.
#JusticeForFluttershy my brother✊🏽🤝
I’ve never watched MLP (except for a few clips that my friends showed me), but you’ve convinced me! #JusticeForStarlight
6:05 I’m not a fan of having to consume multiple forms of media in order to understand what’s going on in a story. In my personal opinion, I think that you can use multiple forms of media to tell your story, just as long as people don’t need to consume them all in order to understand the main story. For example, I think that using other forms of media to tell side stories, give backstories that aren’t necessary to understand the main story, or even tell a sequel story is just fine; and I don’t know if they should be used to do more than that.
Also, is the villain group in MLP really called the “Legion of Doom”? I can’t help but think of “Super Friends” whenever I hear you call them that; and since the name of the MLP show is “Friendship Is Magic”, if the villain group really is called the “Legion of Doom”, I wonder if that was done intentionally to reference “Super Friends”.
Thank you so much for watching even though you haven't really seen the show. I appreciate it!
Twi(and the other Mane 6) getting credit for Crysalis' defeat is probably simply because the writers weren't paid to worry about that consistency. Even if they worked on the show before, they could've forgot, because almost no one on the show every cares about it as specifically as the fandom does.
Starlight blurs the edge between primary and secondary characters.
Here's the real gaslighting (not to mention inconsistent) problems with G4 MLP: The real missed opportunity is that Sunset would've been Twilight's real rival. Since EQGs1, she and Twi had a fitting hero/villain relationship. If Demonic Sunset hadn't thrown that fireball, ensuring her rushed, anti-climatic defeat, she would've abandoned the human world to seek revenge on Celestia, only for Twilight to chase after her. After their final confrontation, Sunset "admits" defeat, only duping Twilight into sapping her magic. The 3 alicorns would've separated them to save Twilight and for Sunset? She teleports her way out of incarceration, as The Mane 6 have not seen the last of Sunset. After that, Sunset becomes a Season 4 threat, possibly working for Tirek. As for the Human World that is Equestria Girls? The portal closed and it was never brought up, nor got any sequels after the first one, which was how it was supposed to be done, without sequels cluttering up FiM's continuity. Because Sunset remaining in Equestria means other villains who have an axe to grind will have their time to resurface (Discord, Trixie, Pony of Shadows [who isn't a nopony named Stygian; thanks a lot, Haber.], Lightning Dust and Queen Chrysalis) to join her in ruling Equestria and destroying The Mane 6 as potential storyline for Season 4. Now, doesn't that sound better than having the portal opened forever for many unneeded sequels? Besides, it being opened forever removes the urgency the 1st Movie had. Again, proving my point on the inconsistencies, and how they can be fixed. The human world serves zero purpose in FiM's storyline, resulting in filler (like the Alpha & Omega movies) and trash episodes like "Pinkie Apple Pie" and "Hearthbreakers" which has one BS arc. Pinkie's no apple to the core. Enough said. Sorry for making this comment long, but it needed to be said.
I agree that EQG wasn't highly needed, but I enjoyed the first 3 movies quite a bit! I don't mind Sunset being in the human world (though I do mind that they never address where human Sunset is).
But it was weird to have Sunset be an element in the human world and not address that there is in fact a 7th element and do nothing with it in the pony world.
...Starlight could have solved that issue lol
I'm also okay with Sunset staying in human land because we get Starlight in pony world and I'll take Starlight over Sunset any day. XD
But yeah, I hear what you're saying and respect your point of view ^_^
@TheArtisticAloubell ...But here's the thing: Sunset showed potential to be a threat (who will change, mind you) in Season 4. And I agree with Starlight better than Sunset (I blame/thank McCarthy for underutilizing Sunset, mostly blame, but that's just me.). But, I found a Diamond in the Rough in the human land (Or should I say Emerald?): Wallflower Blush.
Don't apologize for your long comment. You said what you wanted to say, cause I too write long comments about different opinions on characters and shows.
@@firerose4495 Thanks. ^_^
My main problem with Starlight is not only gaslighting from Twilight, Celestia and Luna, but the fact she was spared and forgiven so easily.
Think about it, she held a dictatorship in her town, basically skinned all the cutie marks out of main 6 and almost killed them. Yet they didn't put her in jail for that and she just became their friend.
Compare this to Discord, who despite probably being the most innocent creature in the show had to prove himself till the end.
And now look at how Sunset Shimmer was literally abandoned both by Celestia, Twilight and the show itself.
Just because you wouldn't forgive someone easily doesn't mean others can't. I welcome quick forgiveness! I don't believe that forgiveness should be earned. If Starlight weren't forgiven and given a chance, then Equestria would be worse off. Showing kindness and love accomplishes a lot more than suspicion and hate.
In Equestria, it seems like you really only get locked up or severely punished if you are a threat and have no intentions on reforming. But since Starlight willingly stopped fighting and resolved to be a better person, they welcomed her with open arms and she was made better because of it.
As much as I like Discord and his shenanigans, he didn't humble himself like Starlight usually would, and he'd continue to mess with the ponies despite it coming from a non-malicious place. So it's mostly because of his personality that he had a harder time warming up with the others and being fully accepted.
And while I don't care about EQG all that much, it is a shame that it never got any closure. Still, though, Sunset was left in a pretty good spot. She has great friends in both worlds and is the leader of her friend group. Canonically, she's doing just fine.
@TheArtisticAloubell "I don't believe forgiveness should be earned" In that case Tirek and Chrysalis should've been forgiven even if they were sadistic and power hungry tyrants. Heck, if we put it that way real world tyrants and serial killers should be forgiven. Why not? They usually had rough childhood, they're all humans after all, even though they decided the fates of countless other people.
If we put it way main 6 is just straight up Nazis.
@@ashesGeek Forgiveness doesn't mean letting people do whatever they want or being okay with their bad actions. Forgiveness means you aren't letting that anger take up space in your heart/brain and you aren't holding said resentment over someone's head.
You can forgive Chrysalis and Tirek and still stop them/defeat them/put them in jail or whatever. They showed no signs of wanting to change, so they had to be dealt with for everyone's safety. Forgiveness doesn't mean being foolish or letting someone walk all over you.
In Starlight's case, she was easily forgiven and went on to show the positive outcomes of that. You can't tell someone else to not forgive someone. If someone wants to forgive, let them forgive. Starlight was no longer a threat and no one held any animosity against her. No reason to not just go in peace.
@TheArtisticAloubell alright let's be it that way, in that case it makes Twilight and Celestia hypocrites for gaslighting Discord for so long. And yeah, I know, he was messing up with them, but he clearly was the most innocent villain they ever ever faced.
Also remember Cozy. Sure, she's an egomaniac, but unlike Tirek and Chrysalis she's a child and it wasn't appropriate to send her in Tartar yet alone basically murdering her when turning into stone.
@@ashesGeek The gang had forgiven Discord. It's just that his personality made it hard for them to really wanna hang out with him that often (minus Fluttershy). Plus, he was off on his own most of the time.
But even in the early stages of his reformation, Twilight and the other girls (except Fluttershy) were in the wrong for not being friendlier to him. They weren't sincere in their friendship with him which was partially why it was so easy for Tirek to manipulate him. So yes, Twi and co were in the wrong for not giving him a fair chance.
After the whole Tirek situation, they knew he was a good guy, but their personalities clashed too much so they didn't hang out much.
I actually recently did a video on Cozy! Yes, she wasn't treated fairly either. She was a very weird case. Definitely needed to be isolated from people she could manipulate, but she should have had a fair chance at rehabilitation.
#justiceforstarlight they really did her dirty, I feel like they also didn't do queen chrysalis justice when they brought her back
The student six was definitely wasted.
They could have been used in the finale possibly with a change to have the mane six LOSE, where the Mean 3 fully drain all the magic. But the student Six don't give up hope and then remind them of their friendship and they get NEW magic, a magic that the bell can absorb BUT has no limit. While the Bell DOES and they reach it. *Friendship being magic, but infinite magic*
Bell explodes, all magic gets released even some Grogar took long before that could have been stuck in the bell. Like magic Earth Ponies, Dragons, and Gryphons once had.
With the side effect where before the bell turned to dust, it drained the Mean 3 of their magic AND abilities.
Tirek loses his ability to drain magic, Cozy Glow loses her flight and cutie mark, and Chrysalis loses her shapeshifting, magic and flight.
But I would say that ironically enough Tirek doesn't go old, keeps his body as if he had magic just.. Weak.
Cozy would be SO pissed, losing her ability to fly and being a blank flank FOREVER.
All of them would be in prisons, but different ones.
Tirek gets sent back to Tartarus since his magical knowledge could still be used for evil *Discord would leave a clone there, but not of himself.. Of Pinkie the most annoying pony he could think of*
Cozy Glow, would be forced to stay at the school of friendship until she truly learns it. *Her cutiemark wouldn't be able to help her manipulate or lie anymore, OR they force a truth spell on her with tracking*
Chrysalis ended up imprisoned in the very castle she once called home, forced to watch how the new changeling kingdom is run. *They still wish she would accept friendship and become their queen again*
I need you to do a video about the implementation of the young six. I personally think that they are completely unnecessary characters, but I want to hear your opinion because I love your MLP analysis ❤️
@@mara0627 I...have no strong opinions on the Young 6 haha. They're just fine to me. I don't really have much to say about them 😅
@@mara0627 but thank you! I appreciate it! ❤️✨
@@mara0627 Tbh they seem like boring characters to me. Their episodes are a slog to get through. Reminds me of g3.
Cozy Glow was much more interesting and I wish she got more screen time.
ehhh i always thought pinkie should've been the one starlight had a problem with or even rainbow (SHE WAS SUSPICIOUS THE WHOLE TIME while flutters wanted to stay there) that being said though the cutie remark is the best of the entire mlp franchise but ya it woulda made it a lot easier if she hadn't declared her rivalry with twilight
Starlight, Spike, Luna and Sunset were the most mistreated main characters in the show, which is especially infuriating since they were the smartest and the most skilled out of all main cast.
I swear, the number of gaslighting and straight up physical bullying Spike and Luna went through from their siblings is insane. That's why it was so satisfying to see them outsmart all of the main dummies in season 9 just to save these numbskulls.
Starlight being mistreated? Despite nearly eradicating Equestria by nearly altering the timeline, somehow she got off scott free and was easily forgiven by everybody. Literally no punishment whatsoever and how were the writers mistreating Starlight when they tried to make Starlight shine caused by the characters suddenly becoming dumbed down.
@@samsea0489 REAL
@samsea0489 what I meant by mistreatment is at least she put effort in redeeming herself despite still having a power urge. While I understand why she hasn't become a part of main 6 it's still unfair she had to change while all the others excluding Spike stayed the same petty assholes.
@@ashesGeek l don’t think Starlight redeemed herself imo
@@ashesGeek Starlight was committing crimes on a terrorist level. It's not the same as the mane six just being flawed/petty. Of course she had to change, she was breaking the universe.
I headcanon Starlight as autistic like myself because that’s exactly how friendships are for me. Like, am I not part of the main group, guys? No? Oh.
@@asmrtpop2676 Starlight was done dirty for no reason, for sure. At least that's how I feel. I'm sure there was no real malice behind it, but it still leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Of course, that could be my bias talking...but still.
I'm sure their intention was not to say anything bad about those who identify with Starlight...it just sucks how she was handled.
Algorithm boosting comment for non-miraculous content cuz we love u Alou ^^ ❤
Thank you 🥹❤
Great points!
But I feel like you missed one when it came to the whole “Discord is Grogar” reveal. Even that plot line confused me and was brushed off way too quickly. If they wanted to show that even a reformed villain can make well-meaning mistakes, there are better ways to do it.
It would’ve been more fun to have Grogar actually be a character and fight alongside them during the end episode or maybe even put up a pretty good fight before plot armor or whatever steps in.
I’m Just saying 🤷
That twist is the worst thing about the ending. It ruined Discord’s character. All his development to be better and he backstabbed his friends for a “test” is insane. Even villain Discord didn’t do something crazy like that. 💀
@@RhapsodyHC Exactly!
#JusticeforStarlight. I also noticed this problem while watching and, I’m glad I’m not the only one.
If Grogar said "a HANDFUL of puny ponies" it'd probably have stood out less despite the recurring joke about hand-based idioms.
0:00 discord was really just taking his opportunity to throw shade at the other villains lol
The thing about Season 6 that will always drive me nuts and is probably one of the biggest reasons why I can never take this show's story progression seriously has gotta be the very frustrating underutilization of Starlight Glimmer in that season. That season was clearly meant to tackle the themes of reformation as well as Starlight as a whole after Season 5. But it only tackled that topic in just 6 episodes.
Six. Out of 26 episodes of an entire season, it only tackled Starlight and her themes in just six of them. And not even six back to back, six episodes spread out over the course of a whole season, that is otherwise filled with many episodes completely unrelated to Starlight. Had me absolutely baffled when I realized that.
I lowkey expected Starlight in S6 to get how Twilight was written in S1, to appear in every episode and learn more about friendship as she reforms. Not the best expectation considering how S2 improved on Twilight's involvement in the episodes moving forward, but Starlight appearing much more in S6 would've not hurt.
@@BuizelCream It looked like that was exactly what was happening for a time honestly, but with Starlight's own flavor. But they didn't commit to it.
@@MrVectorMV The alleged idea that the writers picked up on how controversial Starlight was in the fandom and thus scaled back her prevalence in the story a bit in later seasons is upsetting 😤
But yes, even in Season 6 it would have been nice to see her more!
@@BuizelCream Terrible idea imo
7:23. Hey, don't forget that Starlight got this medal only six episodes after using magic to enslave her friends in a vain attempt to impress her mentor. I think she got plenty of recognition considering how early in her character arc she was at that point.
In the case of Starlight specifically, I can see why she never really become a "Mane 7" character. First, she doesn't really fit into the Mane 6. Her role is redundant to that of Twilight's. Second, she kind of has her own thing going on with collecting side characters and making friends with them. The S6 finale crew, Sunburst, Maud, etc. Third, she was just controversial. The writers would have been aware of this by S7 at the latest. She was written out of the comics completely. The FiM writers liked her enough to keep her around, but I think the fans' reactions to her probably had something to do with her diminishing role in later seasons.
I do see your point regarding giving credit where it is due. I do have to say, one of FiM's strengths is letting other ponies besides the main characters take on an important role. This wouldn't be a problem in the first place if the Mane 6 were the only ones doing anything important. At least other characters got to do something, even if the writers promptly forgot about it.
It may have been early into her character development, but that shouldn't matter. Starlight and her friends did a feat just as impressive as anything else the Mane 6, Spike, Cadence, or Shining Armor did and should have gotten a stain glass window at the very least. Starlight and Co did a more advanced version of what Cadence and Shining armor did and yet they didn't get a window.
I know it's not about the reward nor should it be, but it rubs me the wrong way to imply that their feat wasn't as imperative when Equestria would be toast without them.
Even the Young 6 eventually get a window. Every other notable event gets a window but that one doesnt. It's weird and feels targeted. DX
And regarding Starlight specifically, it's still odd how much emphasis they put on her and how important to Equestria's well-being they made her only to say that she's not "main character important."
The way she's written is so contrary to what they claim DX
But that's just how I see it. I do understand your points and I appreciate you sharing them! I'll always just be salty with how she was handled >_
@@TheArtisticAloubell It is weird how important she was only to be treated as... not important? I mean, she was getting more episodes in S6 and S7 than any of the Mane 6 except Twilight. She was, practically, *the* main character of the show for a while there. But somehow... she doesn't make the cut with things like the stained glass windows.
This is SO,SO ,SO true! Or that is what I used to think but...
I actually think I am glad Starlight was not made a mane character. If you really trace the show, Starlight's main focused relationship is always with Twilight and she speaks to all of the main characters in relation to Twilight. This is very prominent by season 8 where you see that she is in more episodes with Trixie, Maud, Mudbryant and Sunburst and I honestly think she very much dissociates from the mane 6. Really the only character from the mane 6 we see her have an individual relationship with is Pinkie Pie and that is in relation to Maud Pie. I think that may be the reason as to why Starlight never became a mane character because she never had to be one. Like you said, she played an integral role in her own way and I kind of really like that. Plus, this distinguishes her from Sunset Shimmer IMO.
ALSO SO HAPPY SOMEONE ELSE LOVES STARLIGHT AS MUCH AS MEEEE CAN I BE VICE PRESIDENT OF THE STARLIGHT FAN CLUB?!
Edit : OMG I never realized, they never got a stained glass window that is SOOOOOOOOOOOOO dumbbb!!!
Edit 2 : Sometimes, it's easier to throw your frustrations to the mane 6 even when they aren't exactly the ones who defeated the villains. It is still THEIR friendship that even allowed characters like Spike or Starlight or the Young 6 to defeat them. If their friendship did not exist, these villains would never have lost. So even then, the mane characters are still actually very strongly involved like the mane characters still matter, they taught the Young 6, mentored Starlight and it was Twilight's sacrifice for Spike to save the day. It's pretty nuanced and interesting.
I forgot to comment this on your last video, but I do really like seeing videos about disliking parts of media that you enjoy. I don’t see a lot of it. But that is what I do constantly with my own things I enjoy.
It's can be fun to look at things critically, even your favorites! ✨
Starlight being Mane 7 doesn't work. She barely interacts with any of them aside from Twilight. The skills she brings are already covered by Twilight. Making her the leader of the secondary characters was a more inspired idea.
6:05 PREACH!
I knew Grogar's line about six puny ponies was not accurate as soon as I heard him say it. But this was a much bigger issue than I thought. I didn't realize this until you pointed it out. Thanks!
Also, a better thing would be to say: "I’ve seen each of your humiliating defeats at the clutches of puny ponies and their equally puny allies."
Chrysalis did infact show anger towards starlight. She even mentioned how she was gonna seek revenge on her first. Sombra honestly never really showed anger towards anyone he was mainly focused on getting his crystal ponies back no matter what and left to achieve that on his own but then got defeated once again. Cozy glow just seemed to hate twilight for being so good at making friends and showing lots of power for it so her hate was more envy which is why she tried to take over the school. The other creatures just got in her way cause twilight did teach them about friendship plus the tree helped them as well. Also discord only said that to get them mad at twilight so she could defeat them and have a confidence boost
I know she showed anger towards Starlight--I was also willing to give Chrysalis' case some leeway since she did have previous interactions with Twilight.
As for the others, I'm aware of Discord's plan, just not a fan of the wording of what he said and how some things played out.
@ makes sense
On a similar note albeit in a different franchise.
The Kirby franchise gave more credit to the side characters among the Dream Friends from Star Allies than MLP did to anyone other than the Mane 6. Even up to the trophy stuff did they not leave the supporting characters out.
Even the Kirby anime had the side characters become the crew of a space expedition to take down the main villain........
I'm really sorry, but I never liked the idea of Starlight joining the main friend group. Her actions with Starswirl's time travel spell led to unspeakable atrocities and she never got punished for it. Hell, I'd say her actions were worse than what Cozy Glow did. Maybe if her redemption was written better and didn't feel rushed, my opinion would be different.
@@Hewylewis The point of punishment is to discourage bad behavior from happening again as well as to protect others. Starlight was no longer a threat and she wanted to change to be better. The other ponies knew she was no longer a threat and decided to give her a chance (and all of Starlight's oopsies were either undone or never happened because time travel). Punishments aren't always necessary especially if the behavior won't happen again.
I for one welcome quick forgiveness as forgiving someone and giving them a chance can create opportunities for great things! And Starlight did great things for Equestria!
I think she had a brilliant redemption arc. Others forgave her but it took a while for Starlight to forgive herself and feel confident again. It took her a while to overcome her trauma and years of isolation and learn how to be properly sociable and learn how to be a respectable leader who truly understands and encourages differences and friendship.
Starlight truly wanted to change and even if others weren't mad at her, she still wanted to prove herself to them and herself.
She had a beautiful journey!
That's how I see it.
@@TheArtisticAloubell Agree to disagree.
Ngl was kinda sad that I was only seeing videos from years ago x.x I was like damn found another interesting, talented artist who not only likes stuff I like but also loves God but isn’t around anymore 😢 I hope you keep itv up x,3
Ngl I thought starling ight gotboff way too easily for what she did and for such a tiny reason that could easily be fixed if she didn’t…stay mentally a child and fixate on ONE person leaving when they were…babies… idk just all she did for such a small reason she got less than a slap on the wrist for that. She got SEVERE gentle parenting avd…idk didn’t change much…and stayed friends…with trixie…idk I guess I’m not a fan. Lol I’m glad you love her tho ❤❤ you are allowed to of course.
Thank you for your support ^0^ God bless!
Thanks for more reasons to pretend season 9 doesn’t exist.
I would like to add one more thing to the list, though this call out isn't really to the show but rather the fandom:
Luna and Celestia are NOT useless, and i am tired of people thinking they are, so I made a list of arguments as to why celestia and luna are not useless:
1-After lunas banishment, it was celestia who guarded Equestria BY HERSELF for over 1000 years. all while grieving her sister and watching over ponies. generations of ponies.
2-Celestia and Luna are very busy monarchs as showed in season 7 episode 10, with a ton of royal duties to do, so no they cannot fix every last problem for the mane 6 becaues of their duties.
3-Celestia and luna purposely never help during villain attacks or crisis because they have planned for twilight to success them from the start. At the season 9 premiere celestia literally says everything the mane 6 have been through has been a training program.
4-The fandom overestimated celestia and lunas power. no they are not god-like beings who have this insane power. they can lower and raise the sun and moon because their talent is magic (similar to starlight and twilights talent) its their cutie mark magic that lets them raise and lower the sun and moon. its similar to how pinkie pie breaks 4th wall and does crazy things, its her talents that allows her to do so (twilight explains this brifely way back in season 1 in the episode where we meet Trixie). Its also canon that celestia and luna were not born alicorns and in fact were just like twilight, magically gifted unicorns who were taken under starswirls wings. (mentioned in season 6 premiere) so no the princesses cannot just one shot every single villain as that would make them no better then the villains themselves and they literally do not have such power. Yes the princesses are powerful, but they arent gods, they never were .
5-it was never stated that the princesses were the defenders of Equestria. from the begenning of the show, it was the mane 6 who were referred to as the heroes or as the defenders or protectors of Equestria. thats why the mane 6 never questioned why the princesses never helped, because they assumed it was their duty to do so now since they had the elements of harmony with them .
I agree that Celestia and Luna are not useless! Equestria would crumble without them (especially Celestia who had to keep it running by herself for 1000 years!)
Just because they're not constantly on the front lines means they're useless >_<
(also, G5 confirmed that Luna and Celestia were born alicorns; to be fair, they never said in G4 that they weren't. All they said was that a natural-born alicorn born in Equestria was something they've never seen nor experienced before. Since they were around before Equestria...theoretically...that tracks.)
Its about time someone pointed out that the princesses arent actually that powerful in the grand scheme of things
wasn't it confirmed somewhere in their journal that they were born as alicorns?
@@TheArtisticAloubell well, they said and i quote "the birth of an alicorn is something equestria has never seen" and "it is beyond our understanding" that line is proof they don't understand how al alircon could be just born, showing they themselves weren't born as one, now I know g5 has told us they were allegedly born as alicorns, but that would not explain their shock On flurry heart. So I think we could call it a mistake by the writers i'm not sure.
@@billyboleson2830 I know right? the amount of hate I see people (especially Bronies) give celestia and luna for "being useless and never doing anything" annoys me. Like did you even watch the show? or do they just watch the premieres and finales and not see the episodes where they shine? its so annoying to me.
Everyone mentioned starlight sunset and everyone else they all forget Spike but he gets a 7th member of the mainstakes he was there from the start Don't forget him
I'd say that because this line is technically spoken by Discord (who was defeated by the mane 6) what we are seeing is his biases coming through
(0:22) It’s my favorite animated series too, and I also felt like it has a few issues. LOL
The beginning gave me Mona vibes and then you mentioned her and I was like RIGHT!! 🩷
@@lunasquib 😁❤️
I'll have to rewatch the ending, but I'd have had the villains target their spcific enemies in order to force the main six to have to split their attention. After all, they work best together.
Chrysalis goes after Cadence/the Crystal Empire with Sombra, and Tirek and Cozy after Ponyville.
Basically divide an conquer. Someone tell me if this was done in the show and Im just forgetting. It's been.... well, years. 🤔
6:04 Chrysalis literally compared friendship to infection in the frenemies episode so she probably saw it as something permanent,especially when they all changed their looks
Alou, people hawen't gravitated towards starlight cause she did extremely heinous things for petty reasons,was agressively forced next season,and contrived powerboost after her first appearence!
I wouldn’t say this alleged “power boost” was contrived. Starlight already knew powerful magic! Cutie Marks aren’t something that are easy to mess with. The only other times we see magic directly relating to Cutie Marks are Starswirl’s unfinished spell (and Starswirl was hailed as one of the most powerful unicorns in Equestrian History), and Starlight’s later cutie-swap spell. Starlight’s Cutie mark *is* intended to be for magic. And since we don’t see her casting too much, we only got a taste of what she was capable of in the Premier. There was NO contrivance. We already knew she had particularly powerful magic. She just upped her game in the finale.
I agree that Starlight did not great things, but I wouldn't say the reasons are petty... I mean, there was SOME level of pettiness in her getting revenge on Twilight and her friends for taking away her "perfect" village of Our Town, but that pettiness is rooted in trauma.
As someone who has been in Starlight's position, losing friends can be traumatizing especially if you have no one around to help you cope through it. I lost my friend group in high school and it broke me and my personality. Even 15 years later I haven't fully recovered. Starlight had only 1 friend and lost him. Her parents weren't present enough to help her and she was so distraught that she couldn't make another friend. All of that anger she had bubbled up for years and years and her social isolation caused her to not grow in her social skills. With her being an otherwise smart, powerful, and unstable unicorn, it's no surprise she did what she did.
She created Our Town in response to her trauma and believed she was helping everyone achieve true friendship. Though it was mostly for her to feel better about herself and her situation. It helped her gain control and make sure that traumatic event never happened again. But when Twi and friends rolled up into her village and led to her losing her "friends" again, she was pretty close to snapping and thus hatched her time travel scheme.
Even when she found out that her actions might destroy the world, she was so broken that she was ultimately okay with that happening.
All that is to say that Starlight was very troubled and you should never downplay someone's situation because you never know what they're going through. Just because you wouldn't feel/react in a certain way doesn't mean others wouldn't.
Was it right for Starlight to lie and steal cutie marks? No. Was it right for her to mess with time? No. But the "why" is understandable. She needed help.
And like our friend said in the other comment, Starlight was never weak. The fact that she could manipulate cutie marks meant she was already a higher-level magic user. She just became more motivated to learn more spells for her benefit after her initial defeat.
As for her being a huge focus after her reformation; I'm not mad about it because I adore her character. Fortunately, I'm not alone in this idea and people have warmed up to Starlight over time. Not everyone loves her, of course, but that's for any character.
Yeah I dislike her for those exact same reasons
@romanov3937 . Thanks, thought was alone.
@@foxpokemonforever4775. Starlight said she studied that warbly textured shield spell for years, and"boast busters"established that many unicorns can only perform one, maybe two and three tricks, with twilight having firmly implied years worth knowledge,skill,practice,power. Spells that powerful like what starlight used during the season five finale, would've needed simularly lengthy time And dedication, But, many episodes during season five, including"amending fences", showed starlight have been stalking twilight, rather than getting stronger!
4:43 OBJECTION!! without the six cadence wouldnt be able to get out of that cave... lets just say that the mane 6 are the shooters and cadence and shining armor is the gun. you wont call the gun a murderer now would you?
Objection. It was Twilight who helped Cadance escape the cave.
@firerose4495 yeah but n but yeah but n but yeh.... You know what i mean. Justfor the sake of making it long:
If the rest of the mane6 didnt leave twilight then she wouldnt have met cadance. But WAIT , if chrysalis left Twilight alone already at that point she wouldve won.
@@TheEvilPinkOne Fairpoint.
Season 9 is full of gaslighting, especially concerning the princesses retiring and also Ahuizotl’s plot twist. I for one advocate for an official revision of S9 and related media, and I urge anyone who’d like that to join my Save MLP fan campaign to help make it happen.
So we all forget spike. 7. 8 now. But. All don't want to accept it. I didn't tell this.
Justice for Starlight!
Idk how or if anyone has pointed this out in the comments but this scene at 4:06 is not the writers trying to gaslight the audience into thinking the mane 6 are the only adversaries of all the remaining villains, but it's Discord disguised as Grogar gaslighting the villains into believing they have a common enemy in the mane 6, particularly Twilight, whom he's pulling this whole charade for as some kind of test of her worthiness to rule Equestria on her own.
Can you imagine if the only reason Starlight wasn't added officially, was literally "Main 7 doesn't sound as nice as main 6"
@@Alue_KittyKode 😤😮💨😭🤣
Thanks for the vid and a merry Xmas! Godspeed 😁
@@Listless_Seira Merry Christmas! 🎄✨
It would have made so much sense to have Starlight and her friends celebration at Canterlot since part of that episode was really about Twilight and Celestia and their memories
And Starlight and her friends couldve gotten the stained glass there too
YES.
5:15 OH YEAH, she was mad at Thorax for leaving on his own, but not for taking her throne?! Wtf?
With the Starlight and Fluttershy thing, I have a couple of possible reasons she went for Twilight:
1. The writers needed to show all the alternate futures, and how would a Pegasus accomplish that?
2. You f*** with Fluttershy, you f*** with Discord! Did you SEE him when Starlight told him Chrysalis took "Twilight and her friends"?! That dude's SCARY! I think she dodged a bullet by not going for her, honestly.
@@catbatrat1760 fair enough XD
The annoying thing with the legion of doom is that they could've made it work in actually interesting ways while still centering the mane 6.
Grogar was actively trying to start things between specifically them and the mane 6. It would have made the scene between them all really interesting if he had said that line, everyone but Tirek went "actually no" and then they had him kind of manipulate and shift the blame in their minds with contrived logic and plays against their pride.
Crysalis would ABSOLUTELY punish a changeling for being "brainwashed". But it could've been interesting to have a plot point abt her not seeing her subjects as people who's opinions she even needs to consider let alone be mad at. She thinks if she can get her revenge and get rid of Starlight and Twilight then she'll get her crown back because that concept and that blame is easier than acknowledging the fact that they are not in the way of her waltzing back into that hive and taking back control and that the thing stopping her is the hive itself.
Sombra is literally all pride. He simply would not be okay with being the only one in the room(other than Cozy but that's not better considering she is a CHILD) to have not been beaten by equestrias heros but one of the 3 princesses that always gets one shot and Twilight's baby dragon/secretary.
#JusticeForStarlight I do agree ALOT with your point about Starlight not being proclaimed as part of the Mane 6 for the entire show, although I didn't have a problem with it because I did think the episodes captured her role significantly; your claim made me think about the show lacking addressing Starlight's significance a lot more. However I do think Grogar focusing on the Mane 6 specifically with his lines was fine because The Legion of Doom did acknowledge Starlight being the cause of Chrysalis's hive being reformed, which I think is somewhat true because Starlight took the greatest role in the episode and supported Thorax which led to him being reformed; which led to all the other Changelings being reformed. You're right about Chrysalis getting defeated by Cadence and Shining Armor first, but it happened so early on in the show that realistically everybody's focus would be on Starlight instead of them especially because the Changelings were Chrysalis main source of revenge and planning. I will probably just give the rest of my thoughts on your final point because It is what motivated me to write about this comment this most, I think the reason why Starlight only focused on Twilight and not Fluttershy, was because Twilight is the one who came up with the plan for Fluttershy to sneak up on Starlight in the first place, and Twilight showed Starlight that her power was pretty powerful before Starlight ran off and came back in the Season finale; because of that, it probably led to Starlight realizing how much more powerful Twilight is by her significance to the Tree of Harmony, and Discords defeat in the Season 2 finale being responsible by Twilight; Starlight took like the whole season planning on her revenge on Twilight, and also could've realized it was the Mane 6's friendship including Fluttershy which was strengthened by Twilight that caused her defeat in the first place; compared to something like Fluttershy being the only one responsible for Discord's reformation. And with everything I mentioned, I do think Starlight could've pointed to Twilight being responsible for everything that lead to her defeat; But there's more. I do think Starlight could've been extremely jealous of Twilight because of how well Twilight got her way with friendship compared to Starlight becoming a depressed, bitter pony after Sunburst and her got separated. And because of that, it lead to Starlight targeting Twilight, which I agreed on.
I agreed with a lot of your points on this video! Except the last one, which I think is the one I believe was handled well. I really enjoyed hearing your thoughts and I will probably watch your next vid about mlp. ^^
Thank you for sharing your thoughts! ^_^
You are right about The Mane 6 taking all the credit. I kind of don’t like S9 for it because they basically give all the credit to them. Not only Grogar only acknowledges them, but even The Mane 6 say they didn’t need help from the princesses even though without Luna warning Starlight, Chrysalis would’ve won for instance. (#JusticeForLuna) And they never admit they had help from others too like The Student 6, Starlight, etc.
I've been out of the MLP loop for a while. Never finished season 9 but i want to. I don't remember or get involved enough to really get at some of your points but this video was interesting!
Also it's so cool i found this channel again! I remember you from a couple years or so back, when it was mainly just MLB videos. Not sure what was the first thing i watched from you. But i will definitely be exploring the channel. And you're Christian? Even more cool ❤
Welcome back to the channel
show did sombra dirty. i'll always believe his canon to conclude in the comic series. where mane 6 not only weren't the ones to solve sombra crisis for good, they almost ruined everything. sure, they saved the day at the end but it looked more like repentance.
Comic sombra is blatantly a different character from show sombra its absurd
How did the almost ruin everything? I didn't read the comics
Honestly yeah, justice for Starlight. Girl just had some childhood trauma and didn't have a good outlet to grow from it until the mane 6 came around. Everyone gave her shit and it makes me so sad cuz like, who DOESN'T have childhood trauma? I kinda relate to her a ton too from some irl circumstances :').
AJ will always be my homegirl but Starlight is an incredibly close second
@@aHappyTrashCan yay! Someone else who appreciates Starlight and what she went through 🫂❤️✨
“Oh l’m so sad and traumatised that my friend moved away to some prestigious magic school wa
wa wa wa😭.”
Losing a friend isn’t traumatising. We don’t even know if her parents helped her through it. And even if they didn’t, that still doesn’t excuse Starlight’s actions. Her backstory is like a person starting a cult where football isn’t allowed because in the past, the friend moved away to do football training at a location a long distance away
I really only watched up to the first bit of season 4 but yeah! I can see where you're coming from.
#justiceforstarlight
Like the villains being solely angry or mad at the main six when they basically did nothing remind me of Winx Club where bloom in season 5 so bad you should moment and got to defeat Titanic when it should have been a moment because what is she a fairy of water so why can't she get to you know beat the villain in the water themed season like what the math ain't mathing here
i say that there should be some great changes
make star ligth and sunset the additional main hero
and id say make multiple spin offs
1 spin off based on grogar's rein in a history documentary style show where its stated that grogar can sense the most powerufll benevolent indivituals bcs he is the malevolent force of the universe so his line 'at the hoofs of six ponies" makes sense bcs he believes its the superior beings of good that foil the villains plans and show he is a mindless brute so HIS BRIAN ISNT BIG and him being an idiot works
2 i believe that chrysalis is a BAD MOTHER i dont khow who canon it is she just doesnt seem as a LOVING PARENT to me so her not being mad at her kids and just straigth up being "OH THEY BETRAYED ME COOL I DISOWN ALL OF THE MA ND THEY ARE DEAD TO ME" fits her in my eyes
6:58 i mean she could have just hated starlight,but at the same time be aware that twilight is pretty powerfull too,and we know she knows how op elements of harmony are from episode mean six
There was a LOT that needed work…and most of the writers being men has been mentioned many times
The Final Problem was not the send off the show deserved
I thought you were going to discuss how Starlight Glimmer gaslighted her village before her reformation. LOL
This analysis was about a far more interesting and important matter!
thank you
I kinda preferred Starlight not being treated as part of the main group. She always shines a lot more when it's her with just Twilight or Trixie, but that could just be me projecting since I'm not someone who enjoys being in big groups
Starlight in the mane Group would be interesting I like but like Core 7 thing with 7 ponies idk if they would be called Mane 7 or not because of Equestria Girls and sunset Shimmer. Core 7 name is unofficial but its what everyone calls the g3/g3.5 2008 2009 gang.
Hey the Pink Heart Medal is the MLP version of the Medal of Honor, so don't Knock it!
Since Fluttershy is my favorite of the mane 6 yes I would have loved if her enemy was Starlight. But my friend questioned how she would match Starlight since she has no magic and wouldn't be as much of a threat as Twilight and my answer is the same way she handled Discord. Show Starlight some kindness, make her question herself and everything she has done. She doesn't need to beat her physically.
More than any explanation that can be found for it plot-wise, the reason for why Starlight targeted Twilight is clearly thematical, and it's partly the same reason why Starlight didn't ever become the 7th member. It's because she's a purple pony with a straight bang and a star symbol on her flank. She's not just an ideological, but in every way, a foil to Twilight specifically. And because she looks so much like her, it would be weird for advertisings to put a Twily lookalike with the mane 6.
In support of this take is also the fact Sunset could join the mane 6, not just because it was a spin-off, but because she has a design far more distinct from Twily.
I like that you put a Bible verse near the beginning of the video! Keep expressing your faith, sister in Christ! 🤍
Thank you so much! I'm so glad you appreciate it! ❤️ God bless
Yeah, that bugged me a lot too. It's actually one of the reasons that I stopped watching the show well before the end. There were other reasons too, so many other reasons, but this issue was definitely one of them.
It went on for way too long, suffered seasonal rot and really seemed to have lost its purpose, focusing more on selling toys then writing a fun story.
It really takes everything I have to not go off on a huge writing rant about the inconsistencies, the missed opportunities, the character degradation and the confused morals that happened the longer the series went on.
And Shining Armor. I could rant about all the problems with him for hours. He was just a little microcosm of everything wrong about the show. I don't know if it was misandry or just glaring incompetency, but they did him dirty.
Also Twilight was a horrible princess. (And a bad sister).
A valid perspective!
@@aprilvaiarella435 I'm really curious why/how Twilight was a bad princess/sister
@hearmeout1767 Bad princess because she was often arrogant and was shown to abuse her position to get her way more than once, mostly when it came to her poorly thought out and unnecessary school. She just voluntells her "friends " to work for her without consideration to their current jobs and responsibilities, and when she rightfully is told by an administrator that her school shouldn't open she just steps over him because she's an alicorn and apparently that means you can just do whatever you want, even if you almost caused a multi international incident. If you count G5, she stole magic from the world which divided the three pony races and potentially caused the extinction of several of the other races.
As for the sister thing, everytime she shared screen time with Shining she was either talking down to him, bullying him or ignoring his existence in favor of kissing Cadence's ass. It didn't help any that Shining was a half formed character who didn't really have a properly defined personality and we never see a dynamic between them since every episode with him separated them from each other for the majority of the run time. He's treated as an accessory to Cadence, like a purse puppy, rather than a character and this is reflected in the writing to the detriment of all the characters related to him.
The one time her family is given an episode, the writer's, and therefore Twilight, don't treat them much better. She barely spends time with them, not for their sake, but for Cadence's and they are written with the same care as any vapid, wacky background character. To be fair, that whole episode was garbage, but it literally made me hate Twilight and stop watching the show completely.
Her parents, brother and niece don't even get cameos in the movie, which starts with her throwing herself a festival. But I guess her "big brother best friend forever" wasn't a good enough friend to be invited to her friendship festival.
Twilight only cares about how Celestia and Cadence view her, everyone else is just a tool to gain those two's approval. She steps over anyone who isn't useful to that end.
And before anyone tries to excuse any of this, I get what the writers were trying to do with most of these points. They just sucked at it, which caused my overly analytical brain to have a different take than what was intended. It's perfectly fine if you see it the way it was intended and like Twilight just as she is. But to me, Twilight as a princess was awful and Shining Armor had notably some of the worst character writing and it kind of ruined the show for me.
@@aprilvaiarella435 Thank you for taking the time to write this; this definitely interested me since I'm always curious to hear different analysis of one of my favorite shows. And ironically, criticism of MLP helps me love it more.
@@hearmeout1767 Your welcome and thank you for being willing to listen to other perspectives.
Gaslight
Gatekeep
Girlboss
i loved seeing the verse at the start :) and mlp was literally all of my childhood lol, but i don’t like where they went with the show tbh
Again;"the show seriously should've ended with season four"! Afterwards their writing devolved all into;"recycled scripts("look before you sleep"/"starnger than fanfiction"/"the end inn friend"all have the same lesson;"just because someone's personality and tastes not allign with your own doesn't mean you can't make friends"),obvious first drafts,plus blatant fanservice"! Grogar could return from generation One but cozy glow wasn't new wind whistler?
I don't agree. I think we got a lot of awesome things from the second half of the show! But like all shows, nothing is perfect ^^
But I respect your opinion!
@@TheArtisticAloubell. Why not? That was the season where the writing was the tightest;"twilight was logically front and center again,three over arching storylines simultaniously(twilight's identity crisis amidst her new role,the chest mystery,and completely reforming discord),the old writers still around,epic finale with new tirek! Who was this franchise's first villain!
My personal headcanon is that it's standard for leaders of Equestria to use magic to directly hijack people's minds.
#JusticeForStarlight
One of my favorite characters :>
There's also the power scaling that I have an issue with. It has been established from the first episode that alicorns are much more powerful than a regular pony, especially in magic. And yet, Celestia and Luna have so many times so easily been defeated by just about anypony and they never really contribute much to the main villains problems, most likely because the writers want Twilight and her friends to take the spotlight. That last part at least I do understand, but they could've at least made them put up more of a fight to really indicate their power.
There's also the fight between Twilight and Starlight, which is a bit weird. Now as unicorns it might make sense that they at least be close equals, but with Twilight as an alicorn, it just shouldn't be up for discussion. The only pony who might challenge alicorns might be Starswirl the Bearded, whom we saw match the strength of the two alicorn sisters' magic in keeping ponyville safe in the last season.
Regarding Starlight, she's just an exceptional/prodigy magic user like Starswirl. Like Twilight, their talent is magic. To think that Starswirl is the only unicorn ever that can be super powerful or match alicorns is unlikely. There will always be newer generations and other unicorns who come along that have incredible magical potential. Starlight might be considered this generations Starswirl.
Twi is also a young alicorn, so you can make the argument that she hasn't completely grown into her powers yet.
Starlight might have been better while Twi was still young, but Twi probably became more powerful over time.
But yes, 100% the show gave us the idea that alicorns are super powerful, but they barely ever prove it lol Maybe their incredibly magic potential just goes towards their talent? Like Luna and Celestia can raise the sun and moon, something other ponies struggle with even with help, so you can imagine how much power that takes. But perhaps they can really only focus that power on their talent and not in, say, combat. Idk, the show is inconsistent X'D
@TheArtisticAloubell the only instances where they have highlighted alicorn magic is with Flurry Heart and Twilight's fight against Tirek. But I just think it's not very consistent 😭
Yeah. They probably should have corrected him, but perhaps they were too embarrassed to do so. Who knows?
Gaslighting? Starlight was controversial for a reason. Her redemption was 180'd in under a minute and got most fans' sympathy for what was essentially a toddler hissy fit. When that's the foundation you're working with any further development is quite easy to disbelieve or have any faith in. That's what makes her later writing and development extremely weak and why they had to continually force her into a lot of situations she didn't really need to be involved in. At that point they had to complete rewrite her personality and make her an entirely different character all the while pretending her reasoning for her crimes was rational. Starlight had always been a disaster of a character and exactly why I couldn't stand the show any longer.
@@RooftopRose079 I'm not justifying any of her actions, but as someone who experienced what Starlight did, it was traumatizing, so I get where she's coming from. Losing my friends broke me and even after 15 years I still feel it. Starlight had no one to help her cope and she was close to jumping over the edge and taking everyone with her for how much pain she was in and Twilight was able to help her from that. Starlight was shown kindness and was able to change for the better, becoming a positive influence on Equestria.
Starlight is only controversial because too many people trivialize her trauma and don't like easy forgiveness. I celebrate easy forgiveness as it can lead to a lot of good.
Exactly and then she somehow just gets stronger because the plot demands it. It was already said she wasn't that good at magic and even her strongest spell did close to nothing to twilight but then suddenly she's able to fight twilight after a few month's? Mind you Twlight is an Alicorn, the element of magic student to Celestia.
@DromusTH When she was a child she wasn't that good at magic. Clearly she got better as she got older. Twilight wasn't that good at magic either when she was a filly when she was first learning. Starlight's talent has always been magic just like Twilight. Since season 1 it's been said how near impossible it is to mess with cutie marks and yet Starlight is the first one shown to be able to expertly manipulate them. That shows incredible talent.
Just because Twilight blocked her doesn't mean she was weak. It just meant that Twilight had a better defense. Once Starlight is motivated, there's almost nothing magic-wise that she can't do. And once revenge was on her brain, she was motivated enough to learn more magic.
So it wasn't a skill issue, it was a motivational one.
@@TheArtisticAloubell What you experienced similar to Starlight isn’t that traumatising. Most people experienced a friend moving away from them and they quickly got over it because it wasn’t traumatising. Even if no one helped her cope, that’s doesn’t excuse her actions. I’m sorry it just doesn’t moreover her whole major issue was, as Firebrand put it 8 years ago, rushing in like a train wreck. This was what caused Starlight to begin a cult of her own resulting in all the other things that would occur next. And still was a problem for her even when she was reformed. I’m sorry but l don’t think Starlight changed all that much.
@samsea0489 you can't tell someone if they got traumatized or not. You aren't experiencing their feelings or what's going on in their hearts and brain. Just because you weren't hurt as dramatically doesn't mean others weren't. Like I said, losing my friends broke my personality and I never recovered. I, like Starlight, didn't have the help or means to cope, so it stunted my development.
Besides, the point of the season 5 finale is that seemingly small things can snowball out of control if not attended to. Had Starlight gotten help early, these things wouldn't have happened. She was completely alone and thus wasn't able to properly develop socially or emotionally and it took Twilight convincing her to not take everyone down with her to finally get her recovering from her past.
So yeah, even if you can't empathize, it's still good to sympathize and see when someone is hurt and needs help.
I like to think that Starlight actually wanted to go after Fluttershy at first but decided to go after Twilight first. Glimmy most likely watched all of the Mane 6 to know their weaknesses. She probably switched her target when she saw that Twilight was the only one who seemed to not like Discord and when Pinkie mentioned Time Travel (S5 E22). She then probably went to Canterlot Castle and stole Starswirl's Spell to perfect it. She then heard about the presentation from Twilight, went there, and heard about RD's first Rainboom.
I also never really thought about that and the Gaslighting from Season 9.
When you think about it, Sombra was the only one who managed to defeat everyone he wanted to defeat. (Got revenge on Cadance and Spike and briefly took over Canterlot when Celestia and Luna were... shomewhere)
As for the rest of the Legion of Doom: Chrysalis could've gone for the Changelings by going after Ocellus, which could've gotten tension between Ponies and Changelings, but then Starlight sidetracked her.
For Cozy, you could also say that the CMC would also be her target, because they distracted her long enough for the student 6 to get to the Basement of the school. Gallus of Silverstream could've flown to Canterlot to get Cozy to the Mane 6 to get her off their trail and warn their respective Kingdoms.
And then there's Tirek... he got revenge on Starswirl and 5 of the Mane 6. I guess they could've made him go for the Christal empire? Cadence, Shining and Flurry could've gotten more involvement like that (They were WAY too underused in the Show in general)
I also would've liked for one of the Mean 6 to have survived and been one of the Main antagonists of Season 9 (One can only dream...) It would've made the first S9 fight against Sombra have more stakes, because they don't have all elements and/or have one currupted element of harmony.
This video in general made me realize the missed potential the Series had with the villains. It's a very good video #JusticeForStarlight
Thank you for watching and sharing your thoughts! ❤✨