Why would you say this is boring? To me this has strong Beethoven-dominant-preparation energy: a slightly stupid, obsessive focus on a single note that still serves as an amazing buildup of tension.
In my perspective, this recording is far from perfect. There's still a LOT that can be improved on, and I'm not talking about technical accuracy. I'm just not interested in refining it further
@@Musicforever60 maybe somewhere in future when you learn full Pars Tertia? (bc imo in order to be interesting this needs context much more than OC cadenzas)
@@toothlesstoeActually, it takes slow, boring readings like yours and the present one to fall behind Tellef Johnson. The latter's account is not only played at the tempo Sorabji favored, but it is also more nuanced, more varied, more powerful and, of course, more exciting. Sorabji would have been thrilled with it but would have stopped both you and Eric mid-way. You have blasted Johnson before. It seems you are jealous of this pianist, who has a commercial recording of a large-scale Sorabji work under his belt (well-reviewed by Jed Distler: "beautifully dispatched through Tellef Johnson’s astoundingly assured hands and fingers..."), and who has been giving public performances of this composer's music. Blocked, so I don't read your useless response.
You’re being way to hard on this piece. I think it does what it set out to do brilliantly. I love the way the chords change colors over the pedal point. I think you did an excellent job. To me this piece has more merit than you give it credit for. Thank you for releasing it, even though it’s not your favorite you played it like it was something you loved anyway I admire that.
I disagree that it's boring, but it is certainly more straightforward than the OC Cadenza I, and doesn't strive to be of the same character as that fantastic movement. That being said, this is the third sub-section of the much much larger seventh movement of the sonata, falling in between VIIb - Preludio-corale sopra 'Dies irae'; and VIId - Fuga libera a 5 voca e 3 soggetti (which itself is over 60 pages). The OC Cadenza is a movement unto itself. So I will hold out a final in-context evaluation of this cadenza for when the whole OA 7th movement is performed. Fantastic job BTW on getting this up to performance speed! I do hope you get to the other OA movements at some point.
It only sounds "more straightforward" here (than OC cadenza) because it is a "boring", one-sided performance. Tellef Johnson is still the best in this piece. Not only is his a faster, more exciting and powerful reading, but it is also more nuanced, with subtle dynamic shadings and tempo fluctuations. Sorabji would have been mighty pleased with it, as he was more interested in the overall grand, passionate interpretation, than a note-perfect boring one - what he contemptuously called, "playing clean through to the wood."
once again performed with prowess that very few could ever match! i guess i'll put out my own request again since people love recommending you more sorabji (as if you don't play enough already lol): perhaps the lovely aria from toccata seconda? from what it sounds like it would probably be a very easy piece to learn (comparatively, that is!)
I just remembered to have read in a book that some Bruckner symphonies are boring to orchestra players, especially of string section. But, as we know, they sound tremendously beautiful. Your performance reminds me that this is the integral part of 𝑷𝒂𝒓𝒔 𝒕𝒆𝒓𝒕𝒊𝒂 𝒆𝒕 𝒖𝒍𝒕𝒊𝒎𝒂: 𝑨𝒓𝒄𝒉𝒊𝒎𝒂𝒈𝒖𝒔. I hope you get all the movements of this monumental work done with pleasure and patience😊.
I still have yet to sit through a full recording of a Bruckner symphony. I haven’t played any of them, but I also have 0 desire to, because they are just so incredibly boring to listen to for the most part. There are a few mvts. that are interesting or fun but overall, I’m bored out of mind listening to Bruckner.
I agree that this cadenza a bit dull, but you still performed it incredibly precisely. Although it is pretty evident in your recording that you don't particularly care for it 😅 Very well played nonetheless, maybe it'll be more fun to play when it's with the rest of the movement
i would agree with the desc while not bad per say its imo not really one of those sorabji pieces you show to people who want to be convinced of his compositional talents it has interesting textures but its just good in the sense of classic sorabji moment nothing more
@@ntyong8069 keep in mind Eric is still working on Garden of Iram and learning&recording these pieces is more of a distraction from tedious 'torture' of progressing through the latter for him, so I wouldn't expect him doing such a substantial single-movement work (at least in terms of duration) before he completes the goal of recording Garden of Iram
This is a fine interpretation of a challenging piece, but those that put it and Kyle Hannenberg's reading above the one by Tellef Johnson don't understand what constitutes a great Sorabji performance. The composer himself favored passion, excitement and unpredictability in his music, above a boring, note-perfect account - he scornfully described the latter as "playing clean through to the wood." Tellef Johnson plays this work (was on YT - I downloaded it) with perfectly timed shadings in dynamics, so that when the fortissimo sections are reached, they are like cataclysms under his hands. It is this aspect as well as his subtle tempo variations, that make the piece so thrilling, more so than the speed of his performance. He makes it sound like the epic it is, and as great as any similar work in OC and others. Sorabji would have been pleased.
Tellef Johnson's recording: www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm28555347 Sure, if his performance were exactly as you say it is, then I'd agree. However, it's clearly not the case. One thing's for certain, losing note clarity and accuracy is bearable to an extent, but too much, then the harmonies themselves start to lose the intended cohesion and the details become a arbitrary blur or are completely lost. As well, through my experience, observation, and experimentation, generally a weak presentation of a consistent pulse (even in impressionistic music) dissolves tension and in fact disallows refined unpredictability. What you hear in his recording feels like excitement and unpredictability because everything is presented formless and imprecise, so you're off-put by the introduction of every phrase. It's largely unrefined unpredictability. This is magnitudes easier to achieve, because it requires much less precision and thus much less consideration into the details. Many works by Sorabji can be played that way (not to my preference), but it's like eating jello vs eating a complex stir fry. The jello is preprocessed, formless, and sweet with some physical oral sensations, but very much one-dimensional and narrow in its flavour. The stir fry, on the other hand, is assembled from purer ingredients, seasoned, texturally varied, flavourfully distinguishable, and crafted meticulously. Tellef's recording sounds like jello. You can have it, but you're deceiving yourself if you think that's what the composer meant regarding note-perfection and passion. And I'm being nice here. EDIT: Tellef has asserted that the recording referenced in this discussion is one in which he mainly sightread this cadenza. For followers of this discussion, interpret that as you wish.
@@Musicforever60 I will follow your example and keep repeating my comment: "Sure", keep repeating the same comment over and over again. "Sure", but I will still take Johnson's live recording over yours and Hannenberg's any day. Get asked to do a commercial recording or perform Sorabji works in concert, instead of just posting on YT, and then we will talk.
Irrelevant. Straw man argument. However, on a completely unrelated note, it would be great to get asked to do a commercial recording or perform Sorabji works in concert, instead of just posting on YT.
@@toothlesstoe You have the ugliest style on the piano I have ever seen. Also, your minimal use of the pedal makes the piece sound very dry and boring. Tellef is way superior in this piece and as a pianist in general. That's why he gives public concerts, and you walk around looking like a hobo escaped from a mental hospital. Blocked.
It doesn't exist and probably if it did, it'll be poorly interpreted and played because the people who have been known to have spent time on it have a record of poor recordings.
Tellef johnson is releasing a full recording sometime in the next few months, he has been releasing it piece by piece in digital recordings but he only has I think one or two more digital releases until it's all out there and he releases the CD recording
Someone enlighten me... this music sounds awful and devilish... it sounds like a genuine piano piece structurally, but as if instead of normal notes someone attributed each note a random note on the piano. I don't see the beauty in it at all.
@@Musicforever60 Ohhhh shit I just checked your "a decade of music performance" video You're crazy man! I guess you would indeed need a more refined sense of musical structure and a lot of analysis to start understanding this kind of music, but it's still awful to me.. By the way, I'm a pianist of 11 years, and the hardest pieces I ever played were some Mereaux pieces I had for the yearly exam once (can't remember exactly which at the moment). I also plan on studying biochemistry, however I have severe issues with time management and even having enough time in general. What's your secret (besides being incredibly talented, it seems), or would you have any advice for someone doing both? And, does your social/family life suffer because of this combo?
![Sorabji: "VIIa. Preludio" from Piano Sonata No.5 ["Opus Archimagicum"] (Eric Xi Xin Liang)](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/z_VIs6uDpv8/mqdefault.jpg)
![Sorabji: "VIIa. Preludio" from Piano Sonata No.5 ["Opus Archimagicum"] (Eric Xi Xin Liang)](/img/tr.png)
Why would you say this is boring? To me this has strong Beethoven-dominant-preparation energy: a slightly stupid, obsessive focus on a single note that still serves as an amazing buildup of tension.
How long until a Sorabji piece is featured on your channel, Sir?
Good encore to Hammerklavier.
@@4grammaton Probably when there's a good recording of any of his works
i cant tell whats harder to comprehend, the sheet music or the fact that this is like 1% of the entire piece
Sorabji’s Piano Sonata No. 5 feels like boss music.
considering it's the grandest finale to his sonata set, it's a given for it to have such vibes!
How long do you want for one bar, Mr.Sorabji?
Sorabji: *Yes.*
I WANT ALL THE BARS!!!!
Sorabji was partly Indian so I wonder if the lengthy nature of Indian classical music influenced him.
This might be one of my favorite sorabji cadenzas! i especially love the chords at 3:17
one of the most powerful cadenzas i've ever witnessed, although i also respect your opinion but i love the intensity and energy it contains
Holy shit what a chad move to say ANYTHING BY SORABJI is the most boring sorabji they've played in years, and you said that about this!
It tru tho
You have the ability to make this music make sense! Bravo sir!
WTF SO FREAKY GREAT
Really amazing performance! Just striking enough!
3:19 until the end its absolutely epic and extraordinary
Listening to every performance of yours, my jaw drops to the floor like a flippin cartoon character. You're amazing.
this is so goddam good… outpaces the other recordings of this by a mile… they don’t even compare!
@@toothlesstoe true true
In my perspective, this recording is far from perfect. There's still a LOT that can be improved on, and I'm not talking about technical accuracy. I'm just not interested in refining it further
@@Musicforever60 maybe somewhere in future when you learn full Pars Tertia? (bc imo in order to be interesting this needs context much more than OC cadenzas)
@@toothlesstoeActually, it takes slow, boring readings like yours and the present one to fall behind Tellef Johnson. The latter's account is not only played at the tempo Sorabji favored, but it is also more nuanced, more varied, more powerful and, of course, more exciting. Sorabji would have been thrilled with it but would have stopped both you and Eric mid-way. You have blasted Johnson before. It seems you are jealous of this pianist, who has a commercial recording of a large-scale Sorabji work under his belt (well-reviewed by Jed Distler: "beautifully dispatched through Tellef Johnson’s astoundingly assured hands and fingers..."), and who has been giving public performances of this composer's music. Blocked, so I don't read your useless response.
@@franksmith541 Ngl I also find Johnson's interpretation much more exciting, even if it's not note-perfect. I guess it's just a matter of taste.
I like this cadenza a lot for some reason, I think it's very digestable
I knew this would be next! This is awesome!
You’re being way to hard on this piece. I think it does what it set out to do brilliantly. I love the way the chords change colors over the pedal point. I think you did an excellent job. To me this piece has more merit than you give it credit for. Thank you for releasing it, even though it’s not your favorite you played it like it was something you loved anyway I admire that.
My favorite thing I know from Sorabji, finally we have a second interpretation, thanks 💕
i enjoyed this performance and musics very much, you're prolly the most amazing 🤩 pianist on the youtubes!! 💪🏻🏆👍🏻😎
is this more difficult to play than Prokofiev's Toccata?
@@leecherlarry yes
😮😮❤❤ I am turning into a fan of Sorabji after Alkan.
Eric my beloved
How can there exist a composer with a style more absolutely unhinged than Ligeti's? O_O
Oh, you're in for a surprise. In fact, probably 50+ surprises.
Thank You
Excellent interpretation, dear Eric!
OH OH OH IT'S HERE
So good!
I disagree that it's boring, but it is certainly more straightforward than the OC Cadenza I, and doesn't strive to be of the same character as that fantastic movement. That being said, this is the third sub-section of the much much larger seventh movement of the sonata, falling in between VIIb - Preludio-corale sopra 'Dies irae'; and VIId - Fuga libera a 5 voca e 3 soggetti (which itself is over 60 pages). The OC Cadenza is a movement unto itself. So I will hold out a final in-context evaluation of this cadenza for when the whole OA 7th movement is performed.
Fantastic job BTW on getting this up to performance speed! I do hope you get to the other OA movements at some point.
It only sounds "more straightforward" here (than OC cadenza) because it is a "boring", one-sided performance. Tellef Johnson is still the best in this piece. Not only is his a faster, more exciting and powerful reading, but it is also more nuanced, with subtle dynamic shadings and tempo fluctuations. Sorabji would have been mighty pleased with it, as he was more interested in the overall grand, passionate interpretation, than a note-perfect boring one - what he contemptuously called, "playing clean through to the wood."
@@franksmith541 I can't seem to locate the TJ rendering of this - can you provide a link?
@@mwsc04 It was on YT but was removed. I downloaded it and can send you the file.
@@mwsc04 I uploaded the recording to the folder.
its certainly not boring but also certainly not remarkable imo
epic
once again performed with prowess that very few could ever match! i guess i'll put out my own request again since people love recommending you more sorabji (as if you don't play enough already lol): perhaps the lovely aria from toccata seconda? from what it sounds like it would probably be a very easy piece to learn (comparatively, that is!)
I just remembered to have read in a book that some Bruckner symphonies are boring to orchestra players, especially of string section. But, as we know, they sound tremendously beautiful.
Your performance reminds me that this is the integral part of 𝑷𝒂𝒓𝒔 𝒕𝒆𝒓𝒕𝒊𝒂 𝒆𝒕 𝒖𝒍𝒕𝒊𝒎𝒂: 𝑨𝒓𝒄𝒉𝒊𝒎𝒂𝒈𝒖𝒔. I hope you get all the movements of this monumental work done with pleasure and patience😊.
I still have yet to sit through a full recording of a Bruckner symphony. I haven’t played any of them, but I also have 0 desire to, because they are just so incredibly boring to listen to for the most part. There are a few mvts. that are interesting or fun but overall, I’m bored out of mind listening to Bruckner.
I agree that this cadenza a bit dull, but you still performed it incredibly precisely. Although it is pretty evident in your recording that you don't particularly care for it 😅 Very well played nonetheless, maybe it'll be more fun to play when it's with the rest of the movement
can you play Transcendental Etude 99?
Hanon exercise number 999
666*
impressive!
Eccellente ! Devi suonare e registrare tutto l'Opus Archimagicum !!!
But it's something like 6 hours long
Una bella maratona!!!
@@therealchipsgocrunchno, it's 8...Which is even longer 😂
What do you think of doing Coda-Stretta from Sonata 4 next? I'm sure i'm not the only one who'd love to hear that in your interpretation)
Fugues are in general tedious to work through for me, but considerable
Wonderful.
i would agree with the desc while not bad per say its imo not really one of those sorabji pieces you show to people who want to be convinced of his compositional talents
it has interesting textures but its just good in the sense of classic sorabji moment nothing more
Also can you do Punta d'Organo from SC?
Will look into it
what is SC?
@@null8295 sequentia cyclica
@@lucaslorentz oh yeah
1:49
I like the accented ascending bass line.
Dude, you are just mega cool! How do you learn this so quickly? I'm shocked!💪🔥🔥🔥
Yes, and Sorabji rules!🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
Nice! Would you consider recording the preceding Preludio Corale?
shh
@@Musicforever60 what does this mean?
@@ntyong8069 keep in mind Eric is still working on Garden of Iram and learning&recording these pieces is more of a distraction from tedious 'torture' of progressing through the latter for him, so I wouldn't expect him doing such a substantial single-movement work (at least in terms of duration) before he completes the goal of recording Garden of Iram
#LETSGOCHAMP
Did you have those arm muscles before starting on all this Sorabji, or only afterwards?
After. Sorabji and I are gym buddies
sounds kinda too reverby at times but asides that great recording!
3:18 those chords....
2:42
I got scared looking at the muscles in his forearms. I hope you didn't break anything
Rudolf Steiner in GA350: The creation of artificial boredom [...] in order to enter the spiritual world.
This is a fine interpretation of a challenging piece, but those that put it and Kyle Hannenberg's reading above the one by Tellef Johnson don't understand what constitutes a great Sorabji performance. The composer himself favored passion, excitement and unpredictability in his music, above a boring, note-perfect account - he scornfully described the latter as "playing clean through to the wood." Tellef Johnson plays this work (was on YT - I downloaded it) with perfectly timed shadings in dynamics, so that when the fortissimo sections are reached, they are like cataclysms under his hands. It is this aspect as well as his subtle tempo variations, that make the piece so thrilling, more so than the speed of his performance. He makes it sound like the epic it is, and as great as any similar work in OC and others. Sorabji would have been pleased.
Tellef Johnson's recording: www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm28555347
Sure, if his performance were exactly as you say it is, then I'd agree. However, it's clearly not the case. One thing's for certain, losing note clarity and accuracy is bearable to an extent, but too much, then the harmonies themselves start to lose the intended cohesion and the details become a arbitrary blur or are completely lost. As well, through my experience, observation, and experimentation, generally a weak presentation of a consistent pulse (even in impressionistic music) dissolves tension and in fact disallows refined unpredictability. What you hear in his recording feels like excitement and unpredictability because everything is presented formless and imprecise, so you're off-put by the introduction of every phrase. It's largely unrefined unpredictability. This is magnitudes easier to achieve, because it requires much less precision and thus much less consideration into the details.
Many works by Sorabji can be played that way (not to my preference), but it's like eating jello vs eating a complex stir fry. The jello is preprocessed, formless, and sweet with some physical oral sensations, but very much one-dimensional and narrow in its flavour. The stir fry, on the other hand, is assembled from purer ingredients, seasoned, texturally varied, flavourfully distinguishable, and crafted meticulously. Tellef's recording sounds like jello. You can have it, but you're deceiving yourself if you think that's what the composer meant regarding note-perfection and passion. And I'm being nice here.
EDIT: Tellef has asserted that the recording referenced in this discussion is one in which he mainly sightread this cadenza. For followers of this discussion, interpret that as you wish.
@@Musicforever60 I will follow your example and keep repeating my comment:
"Sure", keep repeating the same comment over and over again. "Sure", but I will still take Johnson's live recording over yours and Hannenberg's any day. Get asked to do a commercial recording or perform Sorabji works in concert, instead of just posting on YT, and then we will talk.
Irrelevant. Straw man argument. However, on a completely unrelated note, it would be great to get asked to do a commercial recording or perform Sorabji works in concert, instead of just posting on YT.
@@toothlesstoe You have the ugliest style on the piano I have ever seen. Also, your minimal use of the pedal makes the piece sound very dry and boring. Tellef is way superior in this piece and as a pianist in general. That's why he gives public concerts, and you walk around looking like a hobo escaped from a mental hospital. Blocked.
Where can i find and entire execution of the piece? Not just the cadenza
It doesn't exist and probably if it did, it'll be poorly interpreted and played because the people who have been known to have spent time on it have a record of poor recordings.
Tellef johnson is releasing a full recording sometime in the next few months, he has been releasing it piece by piece in digital recordings but he only has I think one or two more digital releases until it's all out there and he releases the CD recording
Interesting.
AAAAAAAAAAA (literally)
s
Someone enlighten me... this music sounds awful and devilish... it sounds like a genuine piano piece structurally, but as if instead of normal notes someone attributed each note a random note on the piano. I don't see the beauty in it at all.
Check out the disclaimer in the description of the video
@@Musicforever60 Ohhhh shit
I just checked your "a decade of music performance" video
You're crazy man!
I guess you would indeed need a more refined sense of musical structure and a lot of analysis to start understanding this kind of music, but it's still awful to me..
By the way, I'm a pianist of 11 years, and the hardest pieces I ever played were some Mereaux pieces I had for the yearly exam once (can't remember exactly which at the moment). I also plan on studying biochemistry, however I have severe issues with time management and even having enough time in general. What's your secret (besides being incredibly talented, it seems), or would you have any advice for someone doing both? And, does your social/family life suffer because of this combo?