It’s repetitive honestly. It’s either delusional takes from people somehow praising the game OR the usual list of reasons we all know the games dogshit. I honestly haven’t seen an in between conversation as far as commentary goes.
Ironic that in the decades old battle against Diablo, evil incarnate, it turns out that the last boss is Blizzard itself. Sounds like one of their usual "plot twists" actually.
Stew literally skipped over the part of quin saying that "studies show most whales are at risk gamblers and not people who can actually afford it." and stew had 0 response to that. That's pretty damning evidence to me that this shit is predatory.
@@gordonlove5121 they aren't saying that this isn't bad they were saying that choosing this as the reason you know evil exists over all the other fucked up shit is a bit weird no one is saying this isn't evil just not really the benchmark for evil or the best and most decisive evidence to the fact that evil exists.
@@zarthax1750 Yes, but THOSE organizations aren't local and public, like this is. This is right out in the open for everyone to see; the company, itself, publicly mocking criticisms of it.
Its hard for addicts to come to terms with reality Asmon; The issue is every time they are defending their drug of choice and when it comes time to rationalize it they can't do so properly. The game is what it is and it needs controls for children to not fall into the trap of predatory gambling.
Guys like Stew also make thier money off these games. So they are gonna either defend them to the last or have some goddamn integrity like Techtone and tell you exactly what they are upfront and clearly Stew has none.
@@gringoboy701 how much exactly asmon donated in the game? I consider less then 10k. So how many ppl watching asmon? If they wont pay, how much are blizz loses?
How is this guy so chill about saying "Is he upset that he spent 21k and never got a 5 star gem?". The fact that people are so calm about having spent so much money, 10K 20K fucking....100k. Bruh, a fucking game should only cost about $60 at max, unless it's some bundle bullshit. There are people throwing away money that can buy a full steam library of games, or a god damn luxury car. In some cases, life changing money ... on a glorified slot machine that will lose it's value do to the next big slot machine coming up.
This is the part that is disgusting. People should be destroying these dummies for wasting 100k on trash games. "Mobile gamers" sound like gambling addicts that hate charity.
For sure that bit is the most mind blowing bit, no matter what argument you want to make, for someone to spend 15K (USD) and only get "1 of the best item", and then DEFEND that in ANY way, is just wild.
Even if I had that kind of money which 90% of people don't, I still wouldn't put that kind of money into the game. Maybe a couple hundred at the most. And the worst part about Diablo is that people are spending literally 10s of thousands and not getting what they want.
I work in the online gambling and I can say with absolute certainty that Diablo immortal is essentially indistinguishable (for the human brain) form a complex slot game for kids. I would testify that in court if someone called me as an expert witness.
I think these guys are trying to justify their own gambling addiction. They're upset people are trying to take away their fix. Spending 100k on loot boxes for a game is not healthy no matter how you try to frame it.
@@kalych4037 they look happy cause they get in to their addiction you will also see an Heroin addict happy when he gets his hit, does that make him over all happy tho? I doubt it
Diablo Immortal has become the gift that keeps on giving, endless entertainment without having to pay a dime. Who knew I never had to play it be entertained.
let me generalize: the drama surrounding blizzard entertainment for the past like 5 years or so(somewhere around the release of BFA or so) has been an excellent source for entertainment
I grew up on Blizzard games. I remember playing Warcraft 2 and StarCraft with my buddy on dial up all the time. LAN parties playing Diablo 2 late into the night. They inspired me and my friends. In high school me and my friend took programming classes and wanted to start a company like Blizzard. We were going to call it R&S Entertainment. It saddens me what they've turned into. I hope no young developers aspire to be anything like the company they've become.
i agree, i feel the same stephen, it would just change the country but it would be the same history as mine. It looks like they brought people from Market like banks and etc to work in Games companies/producers and it has become this shit
@@DD-ym3nk because this is the way the "games" are going, games are becomeing pay to win, and Diablo was something that fans never would think that would choose/follow this way.
@@DD-ym3nk Gambling for kids! Is it ok for you? There is like 0% doubt that they market games for kids! There is also 100% proven that they have used addiction and behavior experts to maximize the extortion of weak-minded, young, and inexperienced people. Also, the real Diablo fans deserve something much better, also on mobile!
I remember those days. Me and a few of my friends had a lot of fun at the Ian parties. I remember the photos of the blizzard office. It had gone viral back then. It looked like a great work environment. Think about it, the studio of your favorite game was a great place. Blizzard should have been a paradise :) First of all, their partnership with activision, then the harassment allegations against female employees and the addition of diablo 3 and immortal to this, the company destroyed its entire image, unfortunately.
The "don't you guys have mobile phones?" bit still resonates, hahahahha, Blizzard and the shitty road they had ahead back then is like Todd and his "it just works"-Gamebryo engine. It's called auto-flatulatitis: when smelling your own farts becomes harmful to your health... and stock price ;)
The real sickness is f2p'ing a whale's game. Playing an unfair game is one thing, but being the second class, and fodder for whales is entirely a different thing.
Once upon a time, at the start of Smartphones, mobile games looked so promising. Smartphone games would be the killer of handheld consoles. Then the shady, exploitative mobile games started appearing. First slowly. And once the bigger companies started catching on faster and faster. And now we have the shitshow that is mobile games today. Even worse, people find it normal now. It's idiotic. And, for me, proof that "the average person" is a fucking moron who loves to set themselves on fire to support a company or person they like.
@@getwave8041 TRUE. Which I why I wont even install this garbage. I will not become a 2nd class citizen when the whole point of gaming is to actually escape the same shit IRL.
I absolutely despise that condescending attitude that people like Stew have. They aren't having a commentary. They aren't trying to listen to arguments and understand and refute, they are just having a laugh from their own bubble. Him talking about echo chambers from being a big streamer was so ironic as he sits there being validated by his own chat and getting donations. He's literally doing the exact thing he's talking about and doesn't even see it. Its painfully obvious that he's just fishing out buzzwords from Quinn's video and not even trying to understand the context.
You are same for people like Stew. You dont listen to what he says, you just try to force your opinion to him and you dont even see that you do exactly what you hate about him.
It seems Stew is out of touch with modern marketing strategy towards children/teens and gambling with real money in games. Quin gives outrageous examples as he always does lol, but the meaning behind what he is saying is absolutely correct. The mobile gaming business model that companies are adopting (loot boxes etc) is a terrible plague that we need to stamp out before it becomes normalised. As gamers, we understand the industry and we need to educate parents & kids about microtransactions and gambling in games. Asmongold you are doing a great job at pushing back on this topic - keep up the good work dude
Too late. All of this IS normalized. The problem is Diablo Immortal went WAY beyond all the BS that other companies have done with their layers and layers of predatory pricing. It makes BDO and LA and every other Asian P2W grinder games look like kindergarten playtime.
@@ColdNapalm42 was going to say the same. It's gotten so bad that the new OW2 announcement makes me want to keep lootboxes instead because it's less cancer than what it's changing to.
The funny word play about "Never intentionally ignored" is them basically saying "we didn't mean to ignore it we just chose not to notice it and looked away when it was happening so that we could pretend we weren't liable for it" it isn't a denial of it happening, it's just a refusal to accept responsibility for it. As for Diablo immoral getting over 5 million downloads just imagine how many times it's been deleted too. For a "fr33 tW0 pL4y" (I wrote it like that because it's simply not free to play because as of right now it's "Pay to compete" with almost no incentives for anyone to bother playing if they don't plan on spending money) anyways for a ""F2P"" Mobile game it's failing in the market but the thing about mobile games such as Diablo (and there's thousands of them) is that they will always be profitable because there's millions of idiots in the world... I want to add that when everyone talks about this game they should address it by it's true name "Diablo immoral" and not "Immortal".
step 1: hire jeff step 2: explain to jeff that his job is to arrange what the senior execs get to see during their meetings and explain to him *exactly* what that means step 3: goddamnit jeff you never told us? aw shucks thats too bad we'll have to fire jeff (whos contract has a clause now making him a millionaire) and hire bob
I wonder how many people were like me. I downloaded the game overnight, watched a vid in the morning, uninstalled it before even launching it. May have boosted the dl count without actually playing the shit game
@@slimfastsubaru2043 I downloaded for the argument of I played f2p and it's sh*t but I never launch it because I have no reason to. I can spend my time in so many other ways than just grinding for 13hrs to get to an endgame that says "f*ck you for not spending money"
As someone with first hand experience in gaming retail, F2P models like diablo immortal have driven me crazy. I have had multiple parents return to my store after losing thousands of dollars in games with lootbox mechanics or microtransactions. Their child convinces them to add their credit cards to their account without the parent knowing the available security measures to protect themselves from "unauthorised" purchases. This could be for a one-off purchase such as a special skin or to access things such as subscription services. The parents think hey its only $5, and it gets my child of my back for a few minutes and makes them happy. This is where its already to late. The child then sees another skin or "chance to win" an item they want or "i need to get this item because im stuck in the game and dont feel like im progressing, and the game just told me its a great deal" and they know that their parents card details are already saved in the game. Surely their parents wont notice another $5 missing? proceed with payment. How many and how often do new skins, dances, emotes appear in these games? The child is not concerned with the actual physical cost involved, it sounds crazy but they dont understand or cant make the connection that all those $5 payments add up, they only see a Item that they need/want. Whilst I wont give exact details, one lovely customer had their son spend in the area of $1500 over the course of a couple of months to a ForkKnife game, the child only saw skins that he wanted cause his friends didnt have and he wanted to be unique and special, his mother didnt realise till she received her bank statement.
This isn't directly related, but with online banking I'm checking my account a few times a week. I don't even have much coming out or leaving, maybe like 5 things a week (both income and outcome). I guess it'd be hard looking at it if you don't have much in there, but once it's setup it takes like 3 seconds to login. Don't use app, just use website.
Why would any reasonable parent add credit card information to anything their child is doing, especially in games? They deserve the blame to some extent.
@@k4yser Why would a parent think their child is incapable of doing harm to others. They bring up arguments like "My child is different.", "My child would never do such a thing.", "I raised my child properly, the other parents just didn't raise their children properly."
@@k4yser they just think they are making one purchase. They don’t realise that the details stay associated with the account and their kids can just keep buying stuff afterwards.
As a game programmer, I hate the way mobile apps are being designed. So much of them are essentially coded progression addiction cycles, with a few images and some text to make it look more like a game. I really appreciate the indy game scene, where people still want to make games "fun", not just "increased playtime/engagement metrics". It may be less profitable, but it has a lot more heart.
This is VERY interesting and honestly something I wasn’t really aware of until Diablo Immortal. These guys, these “mobile gamers”, as they have self identified, have thoroughly and completely convinced themselves that the ONLY way to enjoy their mobile games is completely dictated by the spending power of their wallet. To them, a mobile game is a game where you MUST spend in order to enjoy it. They hold it like a badge of honor. These are the rules for mobile games and they cannot be different. I’m curious, would they still play the game if it was free? Like actually free? Or is it the act of spending money that they enjoy? And if it is in fact that, can’t they then see why that is a problem?
Now imagine that mobile gaming is by far biggest gaming worldvide scene, bigger than PC + Console combined. So releasing Diablo Immortal really opened eyes to a lot of people who lived in their small PC bubble.
No many are ego maniacs that like ruining the game for others--go look at asmons videos--he has a whale that is laughing like the joker while obliterating people in PVP--no skill they should let these whales fight themselves in PVP--it is also unfair to the casual gamer that does spend some money only to get utterly and mathematically destroyed by some idiot spending thousands on it--p2 win is nothing more then cheating.
@@khronin That whale was Rich, Asmons friend and streamer who plays every gacha. Hard to tell how much of his laugh was faking for cotnent and how much enjoyment of slaying other players but it was also wery low rank where most players wasnt much experienced yet. There is some matchmaking in Diablo Immortal that will pair players based of gear and winrate. When i played pvp in DI i reached silver 2 with 50% winrate and i spent 9 Euro so i was small fish but i never felt like game was more unfair than for example League of Legends.
@@VarietyGamerChannel exactly mobile gaming which guaranteed has waaaayyyy more children and just children in general playing these games especially clash of clans where you pay $100 for cool 500 gems to upgrade your cool base. It’s insane. They’re literally trying to make children future gamblers wasting moneys for a game they won’t touch ever again in a month. I would’ve figured it’d be completely illegal if it weren’t a mature game but the government old hags can’t grasp their heads over technology better than a flip phone.
I played through diablo immortal, I had completed the story, I done multiple rifts side quest, got beyond lucky winning the 1 and only time I played pvp going 5Kills/0Deaths aquired the BP being the only pur hase i had done in the game etc. I had to delete because I got to the point I started to feel I needed to excel in power because I was getting frustrated not getting powerful gear as fast as I would in d3 or d2 . The game is Hella pay to win and even in the shadow clan the leader said who ever is top in rank by july 4th in the shadow clan will get 100$ gift card which I would have been thirst as fuck to get that card and honestly if I hadn't been following asmongold my compulsiveness I would be dropping 100$ just for the one gift card. The fact that immortal wants your money and clans are pushing people secretly to drive them to spend money fucking sucks and backing out was probably the smartest thing I had ever been able to do .
@@x0gucx yeah the shadow clan i use to be with but still had a discord before booting me after realizing i left the clan 3 days later was telling people they needed to start buying the 100$ legendary crest pack every paycheck or what ever was left over from Their checks after bills and removed anyone with no job
11:30 I love how he hears the analogy of how you DONT have to pay to enter a casino, just like you DONT have to pay to play Diablo Immortal, but you are essentially in the middle of a casino, and then he ignores that point completely and responds to the opposite of what he actually said.
@@x0gucx Quinn is a New Zealander right? He's got a "legible" accent with his English imho. As soon as I heard Stew try to pull the "I have no idea what he's saying because of his accent" and basically try to invalidate everything Quinn said, my mind instantly said that Stew was acting a little "r..ist" with that response.
@@Doomweapon66 "I don't understand most of what he's saying" Yet you still respond to his analogies just fine but then again all of them misunderstood or misconstrued.
HE PANICKED! 27:41 : Pauses exactly when a study was going to be mentioned. 29:17 : Skipped forwards after derailing the conversation, skipping the argument entirely.
At this point do we even need analogies. We have statistics about the dangers and harm of gambling addiction. Diablo Immortal is a pay to win game that has had professional behavioural and addiction expert's input for the design so it can manipulate and abuse its players. Individuals who are at risk to gambling addiction (including childen/young adults) fall victim to the clever techniques of Diablo Immortal and suffer from it. We don't need analogies when just looking at reality explains the situation entierly.
Diablo immortal: An analogy Imagine a restaurant where you can enter and eat for "free". you can pay by washing dishes (no money required) The only thing that they don't tell you is that the food that you can eat is only the gunk you wash off the plates You can also eat full course meals if you pay real money to play a slot machine and hit the 777 jackpot (chances on winning are 'balanced') You can also watch other people eat, or have them take big massive dumps on you. that is also free
The real problem here is that people continue to call it "gaming" when it's "gambling". There only difference between a slot machine and diablo immoral is that the later lets you spin for free but without the possibility of winning.
"But that's just mobile gaming. It's supposed to be polluted in gambling." -stew and other whale pods (whales that go from game to game making different whale accounts for each)
Gaming is the activity. A gamer wants to play... Gambling is the addiction. A gambler has to play... Little nuance but both term can be applied on both industries.
As a dad of an 8 year old I can tell you this: YES Diablo Immortal has adds running in every damn piece of kids media. It's actually insane! Where are the god damn lawmakers?!
I’m with you until you call for daddy government. Just effing be a parent: problem solved… wow your kid gets ads for Diablo. Oh, the humanity! I swear, It’s people like you that ruin, literally everything, and bring government into everything. Meanwhile, the problem is easily solvable. Don’t let your kid buy IAP’s…wow, so damn hard…
@@kaydens6964 ah yes, blame the parent for blizzard phychologically manipulating their children (manipulation which was tailored to prey on undeveloped brains by real psychologists) to steal their credit card (which means behind their back). You really shut your brain off on that one, you seem to be trained well.
think that bald guy is intentionally trying to wind everyone in the world up with his bad takes. you'd have to have a negative IQ to think diablo immortal is not p2w
This dude is clearly going in the opposite direction for the same drama chase he blames you for. Also Quinn's annalgy is great. It's not about the gambling it's about the drug dealer tactics the game is pushing. Free samples in the guise of daily log in rewards. Then dangle killer deals to get you hooked and once hooked they offer more and more of the drug untill they don't need to market it to you anymore because you come looking for the fix. Simple addiction logic.
@@chalkboard-4649 didn't say you had to buy anything. Pointing out The tactics to hook you into buying something. Don't have to buy nothing as you say i a non defence. You can make that case for any and all bull shit. Try using your brain a bit instead of leaving it in the drawer to collect dust. Take it out play with it treat it to a book once in a while.
@@chalkboard-4649 yeah but your game experience is severely hampered if you don’t buy anything or play into the gacha mechanics. Look at warframe for example, lots of monetize, 0 gambling. In fact a while back they had a gambling system that let you roll for your dogs fur pattern, saw that one guy spent like hundreds of dollars on it and got rid of it. Like it really isn’t hard to have a good f2p game that makes money and doesn’t rely on gambling.
I understand what Stew is saying with "Its a mobile game, thats why it is like that" and thats the problem. It became accepted that mobile games are cancerous heavily monetized wallet draining "games" and "there is no problem with it"
The thing is though is that there are multiple examples of F2P mobile games that are FAR better experiences than Diablo Immortal. While they might not be liked by absolutely everybody there are games like Azur Lane, Arknights and even Guardian Tales/Cookie Run Kingdom that all fulfill a different niche and have almost zero reason to actually spend money unless you just REALLY want a character while giving multiple ways of obtaining them for free. The only reason why I could see why someone would even play Immortal is due to the lack of mobile games that fit the Diablo experience.
Naah not every mobile game are like these...clash of clans is one of them...where without spending a penny u can beat highest ranker..same with codm too. Diablo is totally gambling based...where maxing out is only possible.after spending 110000 dollars.
Stew is actively trying his hardest to normalize gambling and predatory monetization and pay2win in mobile games. To an extent, it has become pretty normal as far as business practices go, but he's trying to convince players that it's normal to sink hundreds or thousands or tens of thousands of dollars into a mobile game, because it's a mobile game. It's a foundationless tautological argument.
@@Kickinoffthenoobs Clash of Clans is 100% pay to win. Yes, you can EVENTUALLY build up your cards and beat high rankers, but you need to invest time - lots of it If someone else can just pull out their credit card and bypass all of that grinding and time, and max out every card, then that's paying to win. Do you think someone who paid to have a fully maxed out account won't have an advantage over someone who doesn't?
"We checked with your bosses and we have confirmed that the game isn't pay to win" - Diablo Social Media Person All these people defending Diablo Immortal come across like, "I don't have an addiction.. I can' quit any time.... Just as soon as I spend another 5 grand."
I played the story and enjoyed without spending a dollar 🤷🏼 whoever’s looking for solid pvp in a mobile based game, is smoking more crack than those paying to be “good” at a mobile pvp game lmfao.
@@playgroundNW There is no reason why there shouldn't or coudn't be solid pvp in a mobile game. There is no reason why gambling and different currencies have to be in the game. That's why the state of the mobile market is so sad.
They need to make a reality tv show where they group up game developers in a house for a year or so to make an MMO and the challenges are to put viewers requests in there and to agree on different things to put in the game and if the game is successful they hold the job titles + pay...like they have a character design challenge and they vote on who gets cut for the worst one.
Can you imagine how a show like that would go? One getting cut off for having the worst character and the guy going: "without me, there won't ever be another character possible!". Most shows like this are heavily scripted, but I feel like with Blizzard developers there would be no need for a script. They are naturally childish.
So basically hold a show for developers to win a job as game devs (which doesn't pay much to begin with) to make a MMO game in a year (impossible)? What world do you live in?
10:31 "Honestly, I can't understand what he's saying all the time." I don't speak english (I listen a lot, but I don't have anyone to talk to, so I don't), and even I understand both of you perfectly. It's just hard for me to believe that.
I came to say the same thing... it baffles me how English is my second language, but I can understand Quin... yet this man who has been taught and understood the language since he was a baby, can't understand Quin because of his accent? This man is disingenuous at best... a fkn a**hole at worst.
This needs to be attacked relentlessly, otherwise Diablo 4 is absolutely screwed. Keep it up you crazy berserkers. Give them nothing, but take from them everything.
There is no way Diablo 4 will have anything like the microtransactions of Immortal. Diablo 4 won't be free to play and will be PC only. Overwatch 2 is fine and it is F2P
@@thecastledude7634 RMT Auctionhouse is on a different level to Diablo Immortal. They are also different mediums, phone games cannot be compared to PC games. SC2 is F2P and fine, WoW is pay to play and has some overpriced utility transactions but is barely P2W or anything like immortal and Overwatch 2 has ditched lootboxes entirely. Diablo Immortal is an anomaly. Unless you think microsoft and the blizzard internal purge will cause a leaning towards microstransactions?
@@omarcomming722 Yes, it preys on the natural human desire to improve oneself. It would be difficult to make a p2w system morally justifiable. I'm not even talking about gambling yet. We play games to escape reality and have fun. We can improve our characters in the game, which is inherently satisfying. Throwing money at something shouldn't be the way you improve at anything. And it doesn't "need" to be in any game, mobile or not.
"Entropia universe" its literal mmo casino (thou you can technicaly win money and take it out. There used to be people who made living there just trading), it makes diablo immorals look cheap to max. For 100k You can get maybe mothership, some decent (but not best) gear/weapon and some ammo.. You would still be decades and milions of euros away from maxing anything :P If You want feel like kraken there, they asked bout 3mil dollars for Your own planet (probably cheaper to buy one that already exsist and modify it to Your liking). There are monetysasion tricks in entropia that even blizzard have not figured out yet 0_O
yes its is just like a casino, BUT do you let your children go to those casino? I agree that parents need to monitored their child more closely but it also need someone to decided what kind of game should those kids can reach. its goes both way you know? Using ad that have gambling elements on kids contents is stupid, cause they're kids so wtf does they know about it. Sooner or later some of them gonna blow a 10k or maybe 20k on daily in those games and after that the addiction will kick in. Then its just gonna go down more.
@@justsomerandomasiandude4111 I didnt protect diablo, quite oposite XD Just pointed out theres even worse version of online casino that even blzzard could learn. I havent playd blizzard games past 6 or 7 years. And only playd warcraft 2 exstensivly and heartsone, when it came out.
I can't fathom this behavior when what they should be doing is doubling down on how Diablo 4 *wont* have any of that sort of thing. This is actual NPC behavior wtf lmao
@@MeatMonsterMan I just beat Diablo 3 only one character to go and playing Diablo 2 for the first time I really hope they can make it not p2w and just cosmetic or something I love these games but I really don’t even want to support Activision
@@mr.puggin8384 anything that makes pvp or leaderboards rigged I’m out. Ive Been playing a lot of old games d2 and bioshock series they just don’t do it like they used to. I guess I thought when Microsoft bought them it my make them a little less scummy
I was 10 years old when I played Diablo 1 the year it released. The butcher scared the shit out of me. If there had been micro transactions in that game I probably would have been suckered into thinking it was normal to pay to progress in a game.
I do because they've thrown down the current shit and are digging up old school classics. Warcraft 3, Oblivion, Daggerfall, Fall Out 3, Half Life, they even are digging up SNES stuff. I think they've had enough.
"you would never even consider purchasing anything", except that we also made the entire UI push our cash-shop super-hard at every opportunity we can...
I was 13 when Diablo 1 came out, Diablo was never really my type of game though, but it was a lot of my friends type of game, and my friends at that time were in the range of 11-15, so yeah, that would have been the age range they got into Diablo
Let’s just start calling mobile games “Gambling Games” so that when one of these guys says “it’s a mobile game for mobile gamers” we can translate it to “it’s a gambling game for gambling gamblers” and then we can both be right
The 800% bonus box he describes at 3:13 is actually the valuation of the bundle. The creators of the game are implying that the value is worth 800% more. You spend a dollar and receive 60 orbs (this is already the dollar value compared to the orb purchase system.) Also, there is a weapon skin that you’ll receive. Don’t get me wrong it’s enticing & definitely hooks you in to purchase more. P2W show cases in the early game, but end game it is seemingly reasonable. The issue here is that end game is so far away for the F2Ps that most will quit before getting that far.
Quin's analogy was shaky af but he was onto something; just change heeeroeeen (spelt wrong on purpose) to dopamine and it's basically the same thing.. you are still chasing the next hit, and Diablo Immortal is only happy to supply it, provided you got the cash
People like StewGaming are complicit in this hostile takeover of the mainstream gaming space by mobile predatory tactics. To laugh off the obvious fact that a predatory system has already been normalized in one space while it is transitioned into a new one is gaslighting at its finest. Optional systems are not optional when they are designed to exploit vulnerable people.
There should be a legal requirement that games like this have to ask players when they create an account, "is paying money for an advantage in game P2W". Anyone who answers no has their account permanently restricted to free to play and all the P2W aspects hidden. Someone needs to help these poor people.
But then whales will play with other whales and then when a whale realizes he put 20k dollars into the game and still dont win he might Quit ☹️ whales need freebies to feel good about themself so they wanna stay and keep being whales🥰 Blizzard love the whales
@@Michael-zi2qg whales need easy dubs against normal people to feel good about themselves. All that time working a boring job, saving up money and not doing anything with it - they want to feel superior somewhere right? That’s why they spend half their life savings on a digital experience that won’t last forever. For that small amount of time they feel like a king amongst men… on a video game. These people and obviously people with bad impulse control/compulsive purchasing habits are why these whales continue to whale. It’s incredibly sad. The only “legitimate” whales are streamers who want to buy everything for content. But that in itself is promoting this and pushing mentally ill people closer to getting stuck in the whale loop themselves.
would be interesting indeed! though no way the money bags behidn the laws let em sadge id love an otpion to opt out of ever being shown ingame purchases but ohh well
They wouldn’t go for it and they’ll absolutely push against it. P2w in a PvP scenario incentives going p2w because the advantage it gives over f2p players. If p2w players are restricted to p2w matches that advantage is gone. Rather infact, it punishes going p2w if you only want to spend a little. I do like the idea. It’s a good incentive to keep games from being p2w. ideally games just wouldn’t do that though, because splitting a player base can really hurt when player count drops.
25:30 just to clarify Asmon is incorrect when it comes to the claw machine analogy. It is gambling. Claw Machines are in fact rigged and have settings that “hard cap” the holding power of the claw, meaning regardless of your “skill” you are rolling for example a 1/28 chance that the computer will allow the claw its maximum holding power. Even more so if the machine identifies a “win” while the claw is on weak holding for the “pull” the odds can go even further to 1/56 for example.
Some claws are made with tiny springs that have almost no tensile strength, thus making it impossible to hold anything that weighs more than an ounce or two. Always inspect the claw before you play.
That would be considered illegal in many countries. By law, the claw machine must give the same chances to everyone. In other words, it can't have different levels of grip. That can be fixed by giving everyone shit chances of winning. But it cannot be rigged. I mean, it can but that would make it illegal.
He wasn't arguing that they weren't rigged. His argument was that in theory if you are so bad that you always put the claw over an empty zone in the bin, you will lose 100% of the time. So there is some amount of skill, and he believes that makes them different from loot boxes. HOWEVER, I think it should be illegal for anything purchasable by minors to be rigged in the first place. So I disagree with him there. Its not different, its still gambling. But i feel the same way about trading cards, arcades, loot boxes, etc. None of those should be random and incentivize minors to gamble for prizes.
@@andregon4366 Fair enough, but who's going to actually inspect claw games to make sure they're "winnable" ? I assume there's regulations on the book they're "supposed" to follow, but in practice is there any actual accountability? Genuinely curious, as I've never seen anyone performing maintenance on them. How would the average person even be able to tell the difference between the claw machine being "illegally" unwinnable and just ordinarily unwinnable? I can't remember the last time I won anything, or even saw someone else win anything from a claw machine. I just assume they're all rigged, illegally or not.
@@thegrimharvest Hey, all I know is that the law doesn't allow those machines to give different chances if winning. I don't know who is supposed to inspect them or if anyone does.
Never in my life back when I still played Diablo II I would have imagined that Blizzard would turn into one of the shittiest game devs companies in the future, betraying everyone...
"I don't know what to say" He's a gambling junkie trying to justify his gambling to his gambling junkie audience, Asmon, there isn't much else to say..
I love how we think of diablo immortal as having a "mixed reception" when in reality the game came out and made more money than blizzard could have foreseen. To the eyes of blizzard diablo immortal has been a MASSIVE success. why would they really care about "whinny free players"? It's really hard to see these kind of shitty softwares called "games" disappear, because even if most ppl hate them they still generate enough money, probably even more than the games ppl like.
Idk why people are whining about the game as f2p. It’s like catching a plane for free because the rich dudes in first class is paying everything in exchange for best flight experience possible, they can be getting full service from flight attendants all the way through and I wouldn’t be complaining.
That's the sad thing. This literally becomes a beacon for shitty development, because hey, who cares if your 'game' is received badly if it has the gambling mechanics included that make you tons of money? It's just a snowball getting bigger and bigger as time goes on....
@@Qstate you are still playing the game like a human being, it’s just people who pays for the game getting more benefits. Not everyone is a competitive hardcore player especially in the mobile scene, most just kill off time don’t even lvl to max.
@@kaydens6964 Exactly my dude, these people played straight for 48 hours after launch and are salty because those who pay have advantages, they don't even consider playing for fun, they either play to win or hate the game all together.
I'm baffled that anyone tries to reason or counter this Stew guy. When someone is THAT oblivious to the most obvious, there's no reasoning with them. The most obvious proof of predatory design is that JoshStrifeHayes needed to make an extension to his "The immoral monetisation of Diablo Immortal" (or sth like that) video, because after hours of research he still couldn't spot every issue (it was also pointed out by another user in the comments of said extension). The most obvious evidence that StewGaming can't be reasoned with is that in Asmongold's original (I think) stream clip about him he's literally explaining p2w of the game to support his statement that it's not p2w.
22:16 fun fact incognito mode does nothing to already existing cookies, it just disables you getting any from the new pages. but they're not looking for your cookies anyway, your ISP collects that data and sells it to third party clients like YT. its the same reason you could use a completely different account on your phone but still get the same type of ads. tldr: people are scummy. EDIT: he litteraly said it a sec later my bad XD
I think there's a lot left unsaid about how destructive gambling addictions can be to a person and everyone around them, in a sense much like hard drugs. Yes, some people can afford to spend 10k on a game and not mind it. But there are many more who will spend beyond their means, and more extreme examples after that to be sure.
Especially when you watch people around you or people that you care about doing the gambling. You see all the good things they're getting, you see the cool skins or how much more powerful (faster leveling up or just P2W) they are now and you want to be part of it, because most people crave for the feeling of being included.
The way I look at it is this pretty much is like mining companies that say "This is super profitable and eco-friendly, we planted 1000 poplar trees last week and adopted 3 puppies" and meanwhile the communities around need to find new sources of water because the river is no longer a thing. These people defending p2w are destroying gaming for everybody else. If you need positive mental reinforcement you go to the therapist not the car shop. This is the same, games should be competitive and engaging. Games are supposed to be satisfying but I don't think that at the expense of another person. I'd 100% percent wouldn't mind them enjoying their p2w experience but the main problem is that they send the wrong message to the devs are ends affecting the games I do play & enjoy.
Let gamblers and p2w players have their own game. There is no game design reason why the game "needs" to be shared with f2p players, besides MORE PROFIT from feeding the whales.
I love how people say "it is not pay to win" and i ask what id the game centered around? Loot, gear, gems so on. So one would argue getting these things, getting the best equipment is "winning" the game. Then by design if the game let's you buy a higher percentage of chance on gear. You are paying to win if nothing else faster. It is like the level boosts in the new assassin games, like yeah you don't need to buy it but you will be able to get on with the story and game faster than completing boring sidequests/content for 30 hours.
Just play unless playing the game is boring to u then move on to a different game instead of complaining because bootylover69 spent his life savings on a gem that u wanted
I don't get how D:I is supposed to be P2W, just don't rush it and you won't even consider buying anything. I'm currently sitting at 0 hours 0 minutes playtime and not once felt the need to spend money on this incredible game.
@@Thiccems69 I mean, I assume that Blizzard isn't made up of 100% sexual predators and that the overwhelming majority of them are normal people trying to make games
Being from Belgium, I was kinda bummed when I lost access to buying lootboxes in Overwatch. It felt a bit patronizing how I, a working adult, couldn't choose what I would spend my money on. Now that I see how Diablo Immortal has turned out, I completely understand why that law was created and I applaud my country greatly for it.
@@avenderiel no we can’t download it here in Belgium since blizzard decided not to make an alternative version. Was a bit annoyed at first but didn’t bother to much. Now i fully understand why
I'm gonna put my neutral arbitrator hat on for a moment and just say that Stew is not doing himself any favors by skipping over valid points and analogies Quin is bringing up. The thing about "the casino doesn't charge you to enter" made total sense. Just because the entry fee is zero doesn't mean that you aren't surrounded by gambling. Also, how is Diablo * not * market toward kids? We were probably all in our teens, if not younger, when the first game came out and we played it. One of my first pc gaming experiences was Baldur's Gate and I was probably younger than 10 at the time ...
I played Skyrim, Borderlands 2, and Call of Duty when I was growing up. At the time, I would have been like 10-12. If I was playing games where you literally shoot or stab people before I even hit puberty, then surely kids will continue to be able to do so in the future. Sure, the game isn't technically marketed towards children, but children WILL play them because ESRB ratings aren't taken all that seriously anymore.
@@husher5142 right!? I mean I refuse to spend even 99 cents. I just don't play the game altogether. Any game that has any form of P2W I don't play with maybe exception to wow classic but even that is in a way P2W cuz people buy gold and buy gear or arena carry
Micro Transactions are fine. Predatory gambling mechanisms and "Pay to Win" are parasites. The latter can be tougher in some cases, since the discern between "Getting from X to Y faster" and "Pay to Win" is a fine line and it so it can depend on a case by case scenario, but then we have cases like Diablo Immortal where it's very clear: They want to shake you up for your money otherwise you're never going to be able to keep up with the others even if you spend all your day grinding the game, because by the time you do catch up, either the game has been updated with the "new best thing that you can get by buying" or you have no more joy to get out of the game and most people have moved on.
@@justanotherLunny The point is that micro transactions are supposed to be like $1-5 and maybe max out at $20. But these companies are charging $100-200 for mounts and things.
Stew is just being a contrarian to get views, and he's doing a good job at it since asmongold keeps giving him the audience needed. there is no way he think what he thinks. It's the same as the hate watch tiktok shitty videos that makes ppl rage.
@@randomhero6365 I know, I checked out his channel but that doesn't mean he should accept that it is the way mobiles games are, it shouldn't be the way and shouldn't be acceptable.
and it's not a little bit. 10 legendary crests(the bound ones because the not bound ones are not possible without paying) take literal months to get and 10 crests are nothing.
@@akaxjenkins its absolutely ridiculous, and they give this bs corporate response... not to mention all the currencies and the fact you get stuck at a certain level ,so you pay to not grind
At this point, I no longer upset about Diablo Immortal pay-to-win but looking at the profit Blizzard makes. I have lost faith in humanity that people are just gullible to fuel the Activision greed.
What can I say? The game is really good and using money for good games is not bad. I have used only 60$ in the game and thatsy the retail price for many games
Same honestly. Whenever I saw the news of the game before release I thought everyone already knew this was going to be a P2W game with gambling. It'd been reported and warned several times with good and concise evidence. It hurts to see that it's made so much money, it only rewards Blizzard into thinking this is good practice.
It's Activision, look at cod. You have to spend 60 bucks for the game but then when you play what's all the cool cosmetics you get to earn through playing the game? A grand total of nothing! A full priced 60$ game still has micro transactions but at least in that example it's not pay 2 win which at least doesn't make it oppressively bad
@@eggwitheyez The game has plenty of depth for a mobile game, and its quite well balanced; what is irritating is that most of that balance goes out of the window the second a player decides to sink a couple thousand dollars in.
I've never played a souls game and mostly play PC. I doubt I could get Elden Ring running stable. But I know that game would be worth the purchase. If I had a current gen console I would 100% buy it.
There are plenty of games that fit that bill unless you suffer the unreasonable compulsion of only playing newly released games or the need of having every second of gameplay curated and guided by developers. Emulation, sandbox games, flash/unity games, and freeware/abandonware are all worth dumping tens of thousands of hours into if you're even a little bit creative with how you make your own fun with them- and if not I suggest watching movies or doom scrolling social media instead.
@@actually5004 chill. I rarely play games on release. What are you talking about? I never said I didn't have anything to play that doesn't require thousands of dollars. I'm saying that selling me shit in the game is a shit practice.
The reasons this guy so passionately defends this game is because :a) he had invested so much money into it he cannot stand that it is being ridiculed, or b) he is paid by Blizz
A) is not unreasonable at all. (Neither is b) to be fair, but I'm going somewhere with this.) Cost sunk fallacy isn't *simply* a fallacy, (well, an informal fallacy, really,) but it's a cognitive bias. The more you sink into something, the harder it can get to disengage with it. Scientology hooks people using this bias, (they get you to waste time on a psychology test, which itself is a sunk cost,) and its deceptively strong.
Played Genshin since day 1, stopped when content ended around the 6th month, came back for 1 year anniversary and never stopped playing since then, they learnt their lesson and keep churning out events like MMO and keep giving out free gems, because they made so much money (and still making) from the whales and the hordes of casuals, me included. Best thing is that we only at Country#3 out of 7 now :D Look past the waifus and the game keeps giving
The thing about Genshin is that once you have a character, thats it. Constelleations are like no value realistically. There's only like 20~ 5 star characters. There is no further random monetary progression. You can use primos to run another dungeon for an artifact but the value in that is so garbage, I dont even consider it an option. 5 star weapons, given the value, are a waste as well. Especially with weapons like the Catch existing through progression. Their price per gem value is absolute trash, but even so there is like 6-700 dollars worth of primogems to be earned just from base content and exploration, plus another 100+ dollars per patch through events and dailies. As f2p, roughly mathematically, you are guaranteed 5-6 5 stars through base content, a 5 star every patch and a half ish. With Welkin/BP, I think it works out to a guaranteed 5 star per patch. There is maybe a 5 star released every 1.5 patches. Sometimes. And not all are worth it and easy to skip. I have a very strong love/hate relationship with Genshin, and I distain gacha mechanics, but realistically I have to give Genshin credit where due. I'd like to see a price breakdown on what Diablo Immortal gives to f2p based on its own made up price values.
@@unluckytoby Looking for a wrong game. It's weeb BotW and it delievers on what it's supposed to deliever - story, exploration and anime milkers. Game is enormous in size but yes, it's not an MMO. Once you are done with the exploration you are done besides maybe few hours of content every few weeks.
@@TheGosgosh what I do personally has nothing to do with the argument, but just for clarity I have c2 Raiden and c1 Kazuha and an unfortunate c2 Klee. *Marginal upgrades that equate to 100s of dollars in primogem value* are worthless, which is the context you are missing dingus. We are talking value per dollar spent, not your opinion on 3 extra levels in your E ability for 200 dollars. Cope harder friendo
I'm kind of torn, on 1 hand I'm pretty sure you could get to the final hell level eventually without paying, most raids and groups have op people running ahead destroying everything. On the otherhand the loot so far is all minor upgrades. So far no legendary or green set pieces that got me remotely excited. So getting to the end game would be very boring without the p2w items I got a L5 gem and the idea of having to get a bunch more just to level up the one I have has cured me of ever thinking about eternal crests. I got lucky and got it early.
@@benp3485 it was Phoenix Ashes. Great until you find out it's based on Base HP not worn HP. And just thinking about leveling it up made me stop thinking about crests.
I'm a bit out of the loop, but can you sell that 5 star on the marketplace for anything worthwhile? I assume you can't sell it for real money, even though many would happily pay you?
@@RyMaz0 yeah, but most 5 star gems start out with only 2 or 3 starts filled in. You have to level up the gem. Last I saw the sell for about 50 to 75 dollars er platinum at that level. Haven't seen a 5/5 on the market. If the gem is sellable it will have scales in the upper corner
Companies know this, they just don't care. They make more way more money from predatory f2p games with cash shops than they do from a game that's a one off $50-70 sale.
@@Keldiur plants vs zombies was one of those early good mobile games. Man, we took the wrong turn somewhere. In a better parallel-universe, mobile-games are 0,79$ titles that are meant to be played on a bus or at break on work.
In my area, a time ago, the were a coin machines, where you put real coin (0.05$ equivalent or more, whatever), machine rolls 3 numbers, and if there's matches, machine drops some coins to you. So, this coin machines was all over the town, usually just near some markets, and I saw a bunch of kids playing that. There was no regulation of that, because there's no a person between you and coin machine. They were right on the street. Come and play, no restrictions.
At 26:00 I can tell you without a doubt, roughly half or more are rigged. When it comes to claw machines, they can be rigged. There are ones that generally are not, but still can be most definitely, which are generally the UFO crane games that have you poke and lift (1 or 2-pronged) rather than grab and hold (3 to 4-pronged). A significant amount of skill is needed for both. A higher skilled player has a far better chance than a lower or non-skilled player. No matter what, all crane games come down to skill. Meanwhile, slot machines - doesn't matter which (this includes loot boxes) - come down to pure luck. There is no skill in opening a loot box. You just press or click a button and that's it. ZERO skill involved. I know a great deal about crane games, btw. I have a whole garage full of prizes (they're just sitting there in trash bags until the next time I am able to sell them at a convention for cheap).
I think the problem for me is I don't feel a sense of discovery in gaming anymore. There isn't a dramatic change in mechanics or settings that create that same holy shit feeling that I got in the the first couple WoW expansions. And I'm worried I never will get that feeling again because I have set my expectations so high its hard to imagine what a gaming company could do to even create an ounce of that feeling again.
It isn’t that you set your expectations too high, it’s that companies have made an art out of getting the most money out of as little effort as possible. Nothing to do about it but support indie devs(along with the few good sizable companies like FromSoft) who still put real effort into crafting unique and worthwhile experiences. They may be harder to find because of how corporate advertisement is, but they’re still going strong.
2022 society is happening. If just no one would agree to that business model there would not be a discussion about it. Its the people´s choice to support this shit.
@@profanemagic5671 no way. A war is always forced mostly by politicians, if you are in the army you have no choice but to follow orders thats why you sign up for it. BTW you sign up for the army voluntarily. So no one is forcing people to support p2w, they do it on their own to make them self happy while playing a virtual game. Thats it!
This shows that the problem is not from the dev. only but from those players too who like and support all those mecanics. As I said a long time ago, there is already a huge mass of players completly infected by the gacha mobile system. They are like conspiracy seekers, after so many years without anyone pointing the growing problem of mobiles, it's now nearly impossible to talk to them because their logic and vision are already formated. The DI scandal reveals the seize of a bigger problem that is now hard to control.
Hey, dont lump us gacha games players with this fucks! Diablo Immortal apologists are their own special breed of dumb. I play several gacha games and all of them *combined* are not even close to the dumpster fire that is this game.
That is close to the argument, that made addicts criminals. Of course it is not the devs it is the management. And sure, those youtubers feed the machine and they are truly to blame to defend crazy stuff like this.
@@trazyntheinfinite9895 well worse trading cards, you cant trade them between players usually so even though its just cardboard trading cards sometimes have some real life value attached
Better analogy would be skee-ball at Chuck E Cheese and it dispenses tickets, except if you put in $5 instead of a quarter, the holes on the skee ball machine get bigger and it dispenses tickets worth 100 times a regular ticket.
You know...this type of player is exactly the reason mobile games don't improve. the playerbase on mobile has already accepted much lower standards as a requirement for their games to exist at all. if you try to argue they'll just say "well thats just how it is on mobile". and so companies see no reason to change things. People are trying to bring up the standards of mobile gaming at least somewhat close to PC/Console, but the mobile players are for some reason fighting against it.
The funny part is you can legit get EVERYTHING in genshin for free by just playing. You get wishes for FREE just doing the dailies and stuff. Yea its waaaay faster if you pay for stuff but you actually DONT have to. The "Battle Pass" is worth like 5 times what you pay for it if you get it too.
I don't mind gacha games at all, but Genshin is one of the much worse ones in terms of monetisation. There is a monthly sub and a paid battle pass, which is already way too much on its own, but it even goes out of its way to hide this from new players. Everything in the game is designed to steal your time by putting micro-rewards onto everything to keep you playing and get things for "free". The game barely ever gives you things for free actually, and mostly you need to spend your time to get it. There is no daily login to get rewards for "free", dailies take time to get small returns, and most events lock the currency rewards behind a grind. You can claim that you can ignore the gems completely and just "play the game for free", but that's not true at all. There is an entire tier of weapons that is only available from paid gacha, that's almost on the same level of bullshit as Diablo:Immortal, with the only saving grace being that there's an actually affordable pity. Similarly, you obviously have to pay to roll on new characters, otherwise you're just ignoring content. Yes you don't have to get them, but that is like saying you don't have to play half the game to enjoy it if you don't want to spend money. I wouldn't even bring this up since I don't really mind character gacha, and to be fair Genshin has a pretty reasonable pity system compared to other games, but it makes up for it - and becomes much worse than other games - in places you can't see as easily. In Genshin, it is not enough to get the character you want once. You saved up your "free" gems and managed to get the character you wanted with the pity system, great, right? Well not really, since you just got a gimped version of the character with a big part of its toolkit locked behind the constellation system. Want to get the most out of your character? Well I hope you're ready getting the same character 7 times, the reasonable pity isn't going to help you there. Even if you don't go that hard, you want to have at least C1 or the character is just a broken husk of itself that isn't able to do what it was made to do well. I've played a lot of gacha games and I keep up with quite a few, but Genshin has one of the worst monetisations out there, mainly in how it tries to deceive you to think it is actually generous.
Actually crazy that all this is happening right now. Literally just got that game a week ago and my brother told me not to bother since it PTW. I guess he was right for once
The argument is that you can get through the campaign without spending but honestly blizzard is all about the endgame and immortal literally has nothing for f2p players. Once a month you can get 1/10 of a $25 purchase with little to no chance of getting any worthwhile loot.
I am ashamed to say that they got me last night. I’ve been playing Diablo Immortal for a couple weeks on my phone and hadn’t spent a single cent cuz I didn’t want to support the greedy practices. But last night I caved and got that 99¢ beginners bundle. I feel like I need to shower 3 times and file a police report.
INTERVENTION TIME: uninstall now. you changed. you're not the rogga figa I remember. We don't do this to harm you, We just want our homie back :( PepeHands
24:37 That analogy is kinda wacky, but there is something that operates on that model already. Those are strip clubs. They maybe do not have a vending machines, but they got ATMs on the spot and the barman is "the vending machine"
did you gloss over the part where they discussed we need to reach the gamers who dont consume content about these games? or anything down that line of thinking? the fact that hes trying to get politicians or state officials involved in creating some laws around these practices, even if we cant reach those gamers? and how exactly can you prove that the USA was the "most dissatisfied" ? bozo logic.
@@hunterjobrien I agree that bloggers need to work with the audience and point out how bad everything is with mobile gaming. And the main thing is not to stop playing, but to stop paying.
I played Genshin a lot, you can go crazy and spend an arm and a leg, but also just doing 100$ and being fine for months to come. And the revenue shows that it works, you don't have to go the way of Diablo Immortal to make a good profit.
Genshin is a horrible example, it's just a different kind of making profits from players. Most gamers are addicted to the new characters Waifu/Husbandos don't get me wrong they have great designs but they hook you that you start to collect so many that at some point you have so many that you're resources to level them up runs dry and you need to spend money to get more resources. They know this, that's why their events are so strict that if you miss one day you could possible miss out on all of it. They intentionally starve you so you spend money they're really no different than Diablo Immortal or EA. I understand this companies need to make money but these practices they use are just down right dirty.
As a gacha player (Azur Lane) I really like the gacha part here. I never spent a single cent on the game. The game it self is extremly player friendly and gives way too many resources for ppl to get characters + there is "pvp", but its not p2w at all. Yes you can buy few things, but in the end its about getting shipgirls in events. But what the diablo is doing is just a joke
@@NICSU667 dude guardian tales story is a really coster. From generic save the princess link story, harry potter+ghost buster mash up story about students commiting suicide and conspiracy shit to saving people in coal mines and fucking holocoast ovens. One of the best story telling game so far, its like Jojo but a gacha game.
azur lane, arknights, alchemy stars, and revived witch combined aren't this predatory. My friends and I barely spend any money, we often flex who gets the best operator with the least resources.
I don't use IRL currency to buy stuff (mostly because I can't afford to), but saying games like Diablo Immortal isn't pay to win is a blatant lie. While you could argue that a non-paying player could catch up to whales, it would take way too long (at that point the whales probably would have moved on to the next game) for it to actually be considered balanced. As a game dev, I get not wanting to admit that it's pay to win, but even they (and the people defending the game) have to admit that paying gives a player such a huge advantage over those who not only don't pay at all, but those who don't spend a lot of money as well
"Is Blizzard actively going to the malls and skating rinks promoting Diablo Immortal to kids?" has the same energy as "Activision Blizzard investigated itself and found no evidence of intentionally ignoring gender harassment."
It’s also super out of date. It’s not the 1980s, malls are dying because of online retail and Covid has pushed everyone to get used to being inside at home. If you want to reach kids you advertise on RUclips, which is exactly what they do.
@@Chaosqueenngami Shouldn't Raid be the one getting tons of shit than. I only ever see people advertise Raid and they are still doing it. I'm not sure where these kids are getting credit cards to gamble with online. It seems like something rather easy for parents to stop. At least this generation won't have to deal with tons of drinking and driving like my generation did as its big problem. lol
@@unknownsword9042 Raising kids these days has gotten harder not easier. Parents are overworked, single care givers or inattentive because of every thing else going on around. Which is why most just buy their kid a smart phone or tablet and trust that to be the kids time occupier rather than them. It’s also easy for kids with parents in that situation to get away with a lot before the parents find out.
@@unknownsword9042 Raid DOES get a lot of crap. Everyone knows it is a giant scam. The thing is with that is that they are actually really good with their sponsorships and pay out super well to the people they sponsor from what I recall which is super helpful for content creators on here considering how bad youtube can be with actually paying people here and how easy it is to lose monetization for trivial things
Diablo Immortal is pay to win, but free to watch. All the commentary has been incredibly entertaining.
It’s repetitive honestly. It’s either delusional takes from people somehow praising the game OR the usual list of reasons we all know the games dogshit. I honestly haven’t seen an in between conversation as far as commentary goes.
Free to win. I feel like a winner every minute I'm not playing Diablo Immoral.
@@rightful4973 because this isn't an 'in-between" issue.
@@JCascade6065 I feel amazing that I just cleared entire story in 2 days and uninstalled it.
Between this and Amber Heard going down in flame... I can't decide which one is the most entertaining.
Ironic that in the decades old battle against Diablo, evil incarnate, it turns out that the last boss is Blizzard itself.
Sounds like one of their usual "plot twists" actually.
Blizzard going full “lady in the water”
Looking forward to that Diablo game where Diablo, Mephisto and Baal joins us to defeat Activision-Blizzard.
In the lore, isn't Diablo the Lord of Lies ? which make those posts really funny if they're real.
Turns out the real enemy was Greed
@@Mangaka-ml6xo Diablo is the Lord of Terror. Meaning he can not feel fear. The one you're thinking about is Belial, the Lord of Lies.
Stew literally skipped over the part of quin saying that "studies show most whales are at risk gamblers and not people who can actually afford it." and stew had 0 response to that. That's pretty damning evidence to me that this shit is predatory.
This is how you know evil exists in the world
@@billbadson7598 and the slavery, sweat shops, child trafficking, sex trafficking. But also this
@@shlongbongchewy and all this you have in blizzard quarter
@@gordonlove5121 they aren't saying that this isn't bad they were saying that choosing this as the reason you know evil exists over all the other fucked up shit is a bit weird no one is saying this isn't evil just not really the benchmark for evil or the best and most decisive evidence to the fact that evil exists.
@@zarthax1750 Yes, but THOSE organizations aren't local and public, like this is. This is right out in the open for everyone to see; the company, itself, publicly mocking criticisms of it.
Its hard for addicts to come to terms with reality Asmon; The issue is every time they are defending their drug of choice and when it comes time to rationalize it they can't do so properly. The game is what it is and it needs controls for children to not fall into the trap of predatory gambling.
Exactly, many of these games are just straight gambling
Guys like Stew also make thier money off these games. So they are gonna either defend them to the last or have some goddamn integrity like Techtone and tell you exactly what they are upfront and clearly Stew has none.
I love that Diablo Immortal defender. "Mobile games are predatory so it's ok that this mobile game is predatory"
‘Mobile gaming is trash cash vampirism timewasters, that’s just how it is bro’.
@@gringoboy701 what cycle?
@@gringoboy701 how much exactly asmon donated in the game? I consider less then 10k. So how many ppl watching asmon? If they wont pay, how much are blizz loses?
@@gringoboy701 L
Predatory VS a military squad of just a few
“It’s not P2W if you never win!” That is unironically the funniest phrase I’ve heard come out of the diablo memes because of the layer to it
pay to think u can win?
Pay to take. You pay they take. Also known as Heads I win tails you lose, you can flip
HAHAHA they can't even win even tho they are paying therefore not p2w Lmfao
Finally, pay to lose!
pay to shame lol
How is this guy so chill about saying "Is he upset that he spent 21k and never got a 5 star gem?". The fact that people are so calm about having spent so much money, 10K 20K fucking....100k. Bruh, a fucking game should only cost about $60 at max, unless it's some bundle bullshit. There are people throwing away money that can buy a full steam library of games, or a god damn luxury car. In some cases, life changing money ... on a glorified slot machine that will lose it's value do to the next big slot machine coming up.
This is the part that is disgusting. People should be destroying these dummies for wasting 100k on trash games. "Mobile gamers" sound like gambling addicts that hate charity.
Yeah I cannot believe that it’s real.
Gambling is one hell of an addiction. Especially when it's a little per purchase and individual purchases can be easily justified.
For sure that bit is the most mind blowing bit, no matter what argument you want to make, for someone to spend 15K (USD) and only get "1 of the best item", and then DEFEND that in ANY way, is just wild.
Even if I had that kind of money which 90% of people don't, I still wouldn't put that kind of money into the game. Maybe a couple hundred at the most. And the worst part about Diablo is that people are spending literally 10s of thousands and not getting what they want.
I work in the online gambling and I can say with absolute certainty that Diablo immortal is essentially indistinguishable (for the human brain) form a complex slot game for kids. I would testify that in court if someone called me as an expert witness.
I think these guys are trying to justify their own gambling addiction. They're upset people are trying to take away their fix. Spending 100k on loot boxes for a game is not healthy no matter how you try to frame it.
LP
Yeah that's the, it's a mobile game, line.
Those whales dont look upset, they look calm and happy. Upset are people who try to dictate how those whales should spend their money.
@@kalych4037 they look happy cause they get in to their addiction you will also see an Heroin addict happy when he gets his hit, does that make him over all happy tho? I doubt it
@@kalych4037 every addict is happy when consistently obtaining their fix. The unhappiness comes when the fix is no longer available/affordable.
Diablo Immortal has become the gift that keeps on giving, endless entertainment without having to pay a dime. Who knew I never had to play it be entertained.
lol seriously!
Make sure to spit on a blizzard employee today
The content surrounding Diablo Immortal's disgusting monetisation has been an excellent source for entertainment 👍
It's like watching car crash TV.
Sad part is Blizzard wants to be taken seriously, but we are all laughing.. and its not with them
@@Michael-zi2qg ouiiiiii belive me they laughing too : 24 milion in 2 weeks ^^
let me generalize: the drama surrounding blizzard entertainment for the past like 5 years or so(somewhere around the release of BFA or so) has been an excellent source for entertainment
Excellent source of content farming*
I grew up on Blizzard games. I remember playing Warcraft 2 and StarCraft with my buddy on dial up all the time. LAN parties playing Diablo 2 late into the night. They inspired me and my friends. In high school me and my friend took programming classes and wanted to start a company like Blizzard. We were going to call it R&S Entertainment. It saddens me what they've turned into. I hope no young developers aspire to be anything like the company they've become.
i agree, i feel the same stephen, it would just change the country but it would be the same history as mine. It looks like they brought people from Market like banks and etc to work in Games companies/producers and it has become this shit
@@DD-ym3nk because this is the way the "games" are going, games are becomeing pay to win, and Diablo was something that fans never would think that would choose/follow this way.
@@DD-ym3nk Gambling for kids! Is it ok for you? There is like 0% doubt that they market games for kids! There is also 100% proven that they have used addiction and behavior experts to maximize the extortion of weak-minded, young, and inexperienced people.
Also, the real Diablo fans deserve something much better, also on mobile!
I remember those days. Me and a few of my friends had a lot of fun at the Ian parties. I remember the photos of the blizzard office. It had gone viral back then. It looked like a great work environment. Think about it, the studio of your favorite game was a great place. Blizzard should have been a paradise :) First of all, their partnership with activision, then the harassment allegations against female employees and the addition of diablo 3 and immortal to this, the company destroyed its entire image, unfortunately.
The "don't you guys have mobile phones?" bit still resonates, hahahahha, Blizzard and the shitty road they had ahead back then is like Todd and his "it just works"-Gamebryo engine.
It's called auto-flatulatitis: when smelling your own farts becomes harmful to your health... and stock price ;)
its a sickness in the mind to think that it's acceptable for mobile games to be designed to drain your bank account
The real sickness is f2p'ing a whale's game. Playing an unfair game is one thing, but being the second class, and fodder for whales is entirely a different thing.
Once upon a time, at the start of Smartphones, mobile games looked so promising. Smartphone games would be the killer of handheld consoles. Then the shady, exploitative mobile games started appearing. First slowly. And once the bigger companies started catching on faster and faster. And now we have the shitshow that is mobile games today. Even worse, people find it normal now. It's idiotic. And, for me, proof that "the average person" is a fucking moron who loves to set themselves on fire to support a company or person they like.
That or they're too young to remember the games that you could buy on the app store and didn't require microtransactions at all.
@@getwave8041 TRUE. Which I why I wont even install this garbage. I will not become a 2nd class citizen when the whole point of gaming is to actually escape the same shit IRL.
True .
“It’s not pay to win if you never win!” Laugh my ass off gold
I absolutely despise that condescending attitude that people like Stew have. They aren't having a commentary. They aren't trying to listen to arguments and understand and refute, they are just having a laugh from their own bubble. Him talking about echo chambers from being a big streamer was so ironic as he sits there being validated by his own chat and getting donations. He's literally doing the exact thing he's talking about and doesn't even see it. Its painfully obvious that he's just fishing out buzzwords from Quinn's video and not even trying to understand the context.
First videos asmon watched from this guy i was like yea whatever, but now i think Stew is just full on braindead... i cant even...
You are same for people like Stew. You dont listen to what he says, you just try to force your opinion to him and you dont even see that you do exactly what you hate about him.
@@kalych4037 That's a lot of assumptions. 🙃
@@kalych4037 someone’s spent a lot on Diablo immortal and is upset people dislike the game he blew a phat stack on.
@@MagicalMedic That is what Stew thinks about all his haters.
It seems Stew is out of touch with modern marketing strategy towards children/teens and gambling with real money in games.
Quin gives outrageous examples as he always does lol, but the meaning behind what he is saying is absolutely correct.
The mobile gaming business model that companies are adopting (loot boxes etc) is a terrible plague that we need to stamp out before it becomes normalised.
As gamers, we understand the industry and we need to educate parents & kids about microtransactions and gambling in games.
Asmongold you are doing a great job at pushing back on this topic - keep up the good work dude
Too late. All of this IS normalized. The problem is Diablo Immortal went WAY beyond all the BS that other companies have done with their layers and layers of predatory pricing. It makes BDO and LA and every other Asian P2W grinder games look like kindergarten playtime.
@@ColdNapalm42 was going to say the same. It's gotten so bad that the new OW2 announcement makes me want to keep lootboxes instead because it's less cancer than what it's changing to.
The funny word play about "Never intentionally ignored" is them basically saying "we didn't mean to ignore it we just chose not to notice it and looked away when it was happening so that we could pretend we weren't liable for it"
it isn't a denial of it happening, it's just a refusal to accept responsibility for it.
As for Diablo immoral getting over 5 million downloads just imagine how many times it's been deleted too.
For a "fr33 tW0 pL4y" (I wrote it like that because it's simply not free to play because as of right now it's "Pay to compete" with almost no incentives for anyone to bother playing if they don't plan on spending money) anyways for a ""F2P"" Mobile game it's failing in the market but the thing about mobile games such as Diablo (and there's thousands of them) is that they will always be profitable because there's millions of idiots in the world...
I want to add that when everyone talks about this game they should address it by it's true name "Diablo immoral" and not "Immortal".
step 1: hire jeff
step 2: explain to jeff that his job is to arrange what the senior execs get to see during their meetings and explain to him *exactly* what that means
step 3: goddamnit jeff you never told us? aw shucks thats too bad we'll have to fire jeff (whos contract has a clause now making him a millionaire) and hire bob
I wonder how many people were like me. I downloaded the game overnight, watched a vid in the morning, uninstalled it before even launching it. May have boosted the dl count without actually playing the shit game
@@slimfastsubaru2043
I downloaded for the argument of I played f2p and it's sh*t but I never launch it because I have no reason to. I can spend my time in so many other ways than just grinding for 13hrs to get to an endgame that says "f*ck you for not spending money"
As someone with first hand experience in gaming retail, F2P models like diablo immortal have driven me crazy. I have had multiple parents return to my store after losing thousands of dollars in games with lootbox mechanics or microtransactions. Their child convinces them to add their credit cards to their account without the parent knowing the available security measures to protect themselves from "unauthorised" purchases.
This could be for a one-off purchase such as a special skin or to access things such as subscription services. The parents think hey its only $5, and it gets my child of my back for a few minutes and makes them happy.
This is where its already to late.
The child then sees another skin or "chance to win" an item they want or "i need to get this item because im stuck in the game and dont feel like im progressing, and the game just told me its a great deal" and they know that their parents card details are already saved in the game.
Surely their parents wont notice another $5 missing? proceed with payment.
How many and how often do new skins, dances, emotes appear in these games? The child is not concerned with the actual physical cost involved, it sounds crazy but they dont understand or cant make the connection that all those $5 payments add up, they only see a Item that they need/want.
Whilst I wont give exact details, one lovely customer had their son spend in the area of $1500 over the course of a couple of months to a ForkKnife game, the child only saw skins that he wanted cause his friends didnt have and he wanted to be unique and special, his mother didnt realise till she received her bank statement.
This isn't directly related, but with online banking I'm checking my account a few times a week. I don't even have much coming out or leaving, maybe like 5 things a week (both income and outcome).
I guess it'd be hard looking at it if you don't have much in there, but once it's setup it takes like 3 seconds to login. Don't use app, just use website.
Why would any reasonable parent add credit card information to anything their child is doing, especially in games? They deserve the blame to some extent.
@@k4yser Why would a parent think their child is incapable of doing harm to others. They bring up arguments like "My child is different.", "My child would never do such a thing.", "I raised my child properly, the other parents just didn't raise their children properly."
@@k4yser they just think they are making one purchase. They don’t realise that the details stay associated with the account and their kids can just keep buying stuff afterwards.
As a game programmer, I hate the way mobile apps are being designed. So much of them are essentially coded progression addiction cycles, with a few images and some text to make it look more like a game.
I really appreciate the indy game scene, where people still want to make games "fun", not just "increased playtime/engagement metrics". It may be less profitable, but it has a lot more heart.
This is VERY interesting and honestly something I wasn’t really aware of until Diablo Immortal.
These guys, these “mobile gamers”, as they have self identified, have thoroughly and completely convinced themselves that the ONLY way to enjoy their mobile games is completely dictated by the spending power of their wallet. To them, a mobile game is a game where you MUST spend in order to enjoy it. They hold it like a badge of honor. These are the rules for mobile games and they cannot be different. I’m curious, would they still play the game if it was free? Like actually free? Or is it the act of spending money that they enjoy? And if it is in fact that, can’t they then see why that is a problem?
Now imagine that mobile gaming is by far biggest gaming worldvide scene, bigger than PC + Console combined. So releasing Diablo Immortal really opened eyes to a lot of people who lived in their small PC bubble.
@@kalych4037 And consider also that mobile gaming is by far most popular with kids. It's unironically over. We're all going to die.
No many are ego maniacs that like ruining the game for others--go look at asmons videos--he has a whale that is laughing like the joker while obliterating people in PVP--no skill they should let these whales fight themselves in PVP--it is also unfair to the casual gamer that does spend some money only to get utterly and mathematically destroyed by some idiot spending thousands on it--p2 win is nothing more then cheating.
@@khronin That whale was Rich, Asmons friend and streamer who plays every gacha. Hard to tell how much of his laugh was faking for cotnent and how much enjoyment of slaying other players but it was also wery low rank where most players wasnt much experienced yet. There is some matchmaking in Diablo Immortal that will pair players based of gear and winrate. When i played pvp in DI i reached silver 2 with 50% winrate and i spent 9 Euro so i was small fish but i never felt like game was more unfair than for example League of Legends.
@@VarietyGamerChannel exactly mobile gaming which guaranteed has waaaayyyy more children and just children in general playing these games especially clash of clans where you pay $100 for cool 500 gems to upgrade your cool base. It’s insane. They’re literally trying to make children future gamblers wasting moneys for a game they won’t touch ever again in a month. I would’ve figured it’d be completely illegal if it weren’t a mature game but the government old hags can’t grasp their heads over technology better than a flip phone.
I played through diablo immortal, I had completed the story, I done multiple rifts side quest, got beyond lucky winning the 1 and only time I played pvp going 5Kills/0Deaths aquired the BP being the only pur hase i had done in the game etc. I had to delete because I got to the point I started to feel I needed to excel in power because I was getting frustrated not getting powerful gear as fast as I would in d3 or d2 . The game is Hella pay to win and even in the shadow clan the leader said who ever is top in rank by july 4th in the shadow clan will get 100$ gift card which I would have been thirst as fuck to get that card and honestly if I hadn't been following asmongold my compulsiveness I would be dropping 100$ just for the one gift card. The fact that immortal wants your money and clans are pushing people secretly to drive them to spend money fucking sucks and backing out was probably the smartest thing I had ever been able to do .
There are apparently clans actively kicking members who don't spend money because they know they are bringing them down.
@@x0gucx yeah the shadow clan i use to be with but still had a discord before booting me after realizing i left the clan 3 days later was telling people they needed to start buying the 100$ legendary crest pack every paycheck or what ever was left over from Their checks after bills and removed anyone with no job
11:30 I love how he hears the analogy of how you DONT have to pay to enter a casino, just like you DONT have to pay to play Diablo Immortal, but you are essentially in the middle of a casino, and then he ignores that point completely and responds to the opposite of what he actually said.
Because he doesn't have a real rebuttal, except "that is how mobile gaming is!"
The part that got me is when he started exclaiming how chill he is after dissing the guy's accent and disavowing all his statements because of it.
@@x0gucx Quinn is a New Zealander right? He's got a "legible" accent with his English imho. As soon as I heard Stew try to pull the "I have no idea what he's saying because of his accent" and basically try to invalidate everything Quinn said, my mind instantly said that Stew was acting a little "r..ist" with that response.
That was starting to get painful when he just pretends that he opposite thing has just been said
@@Doomweapon66
"I don't understand most of what he's saying"
Yet you still respond to his analogies just fine but then again all of them misunderstood or misconstrued.
HE PANICKED!
27:41 : Pauses exactly when a study was going to be mentioned.
29:17 : Skipped forwards after derailing the conversation, skipping the argument entirely.
Yep; this dude is a total joke. I hope he drives himself to bankruptcy again because of this game.
At this point do we even need analogies. We have statistics about the dangers and harm of gambling addiction. Diablo Immortal is a pay to win game that has had professional behavioural and addiction expert's input for the design so it can manipulate and abuse its players. Individuals who are at risk to gambling addiction (including childen/young adults) fall victim to the clever techniques of Diablo Immortal and suffer from it. We don't need analogies when just looking at reality explains the situation entierly.
Diablo immortal: An analogy
Imagine a restaurant where you can enter and eat for "free". you can pay by washing dishes (no money required)
The only thing that they don't tell you is that the food that you can eat is only the gunk you wash off the plates
You can also eat full course meals if you pay real money to play a slot machine and hit the 777 jackpot (chances on winning are 'balanced')
You can also watch other people eat, or have them take big massive dumps on you. that is also free
sounds about right
Stupid analogy
The real problem here is that people continue to call it "gaming" when it's "gambling". There only difference between a slot machine and diablo immoral is that the later lets you spin for free but without the possibility of winning.
Ironically the gambling industry calls themselves the gaming industry too
"But that's just mobile gaming. It's supposed to be polluted in gambling." -stew and other whale pods (whales that go from game to game making different whale accounts for each)
@@cameronrob5491 You said it before I did! Gambling does call itself the gaming industry and the gap between games and video games is rapidly closing.
Gaming is the activity. A gamer wants to play...
Gambling is the addiction. A gambler has to play...
Little nuance but both term can be applied on both industries.
Well said. I worry for people who can’t see that.
As a dad of an 8 year old I can tell you this: YES Diablo Immortal has adds running in every damn piece of kids media. It's actually insane! Where are the god damn lawmakers?!
Well, Ted Cruz would like to talk with Asmon. So there's that if it actually happens. That might be the only shot we get.
It’s a free game, if your kid steals your credit card for it, then you have failed parenting.
in my yard
I’m with you until you call for daddy government. Just effing be a parent: problem solved… wow your kid gets ads for Diablo. Oh, the humanity! I swear, It’s people like you that ruin, literally everything, and bring government into everything. Meanwhile, the problem is easily solvable. Don’t let your kid buy IAP’s…wow, so damn hard…
@@kaydens6964 ah yes, blame the parent for blizzard phychologically manipulating their children (manipulation which was tailored to prey on undeveloped brains by real psychologists) to steal their credit card (which means behind their back). You really shut your brain off on that one, you seem to be trained well.
This guy should be getting a check from blizzard. He’s working so hard for them.
He has to be getting paid. I don’t think anyone would defend predators this freely without money being involved.
@@reactionninja5819 "never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." - Hanlon's Razor
think that bald guy is intentionally trying to wind everyone in the world up with his bad takes. you'd have to have a negative IQ to think diablo immortal is not p2w
@@jordantyers108 But he does believe it is p2w…
@@Tecolote41 I would hope for humanity sake he’s just acting for views or something
This dude is clearly going in the opposite direction for the same drama chase he blames you for. Also Quinn's annalgy is great. It's not about the gambling it's about the drug dealer tactics the game is pushing. Free samples in the guise of daily log in rewards. Then dangle killer deals to get you hooked and once hooked they offer more and more of the drug untill they don't need to market it to you anymore because you come looking for the fix. Simple addiction logic.
But he'll just blame that on the guy for his unintelligible accent that uses clear English words, never once did I get lost by the guy.
Don’t have to buy nothing
@@chalkboard-4649 didn't say you had to buy anything. Pointing out The tactics to hook you into buying something. Don't have to buy nothing as you say i a non defence. You can make that case for any and all bull shit. Try using your brain a bit instead of leaving it in the drawer to collect dust. Take it out play with it treat it to a book once in a while.
@@chalkboard-4649 yeah but your game experience is severely hampered if you don’t buy anything or play into the gacha mechanics. Look at warframe for example, lots of monetize, 0 gambling. In fact a while back they had a gambling system that let you roll for your dogs fur pattern, saw that one guy spent like hundreds of dollars on it and got rid of it. Like it really isn’t hard to have a good f2p game that makes money and doesn’t rely on gambling.
I understand what Stew is saying with "Its a mobile game, thats why it is like that" and thats the problem. It became accepted that mobile games are cancerous heavily monetized wallet draining "games" and "there is no problem with it"
The thing is though is that there are multiple examples of F2P mobile games that are FAR better experiences than Diablo Immortal. While they might not be liked by absolutely everybody there are games like Azur Lane, Arknights and even Guardian Tales/Cookie Run Kingdom that all fulfill a different niche and have almost zero reason to actually spend money unless you just REALLY want a character while giving multiple ways of obtaining them for free. The only reason why I could see why someone would even play Immortal is due to the lack of mobile games that fit the Diablo experience.
mhmmmmmmmm
Naah not every mobile game are like these...clash of clans is one of them...where without spending a penny u can beat highest ranker..same with codm too. Diablo is totally gambling based...where maxing out is only possible.after spending 110000 dollars.
Stew is actively trying his hardest to normalize gambling and predatory monetization and pay2win in mobile games. To an extent, it has become pretty normal as far as business practices go, but he's trying to convince players that it's normal to sink hundreds or thousands or tens of thousands of dollars into a mobile game, because it's a mobile game. It's a foundationless tautological argument.
@@Kickinoffthenoobs Clash of Clans is 100% pay to win. Yes, you can EVENTUALLY build up your cards and beat high rankers, but you need to invest time - lots of it If someone else can just pull out their credit card and bypass all of that grinding and time, and max out every card, then that's paying to win. Do you think someone who paid to have a fully maxed out account won't have an advantage over someone who doesn't?
"We checked with your bosses and we have confirmed that the game isn't pay to win" - Diablo Social Media Person
All these people defending Diablo Immortal come across like, "I don't have an addiction.. I can' quit any time.... Just as soon as I spend another 5 grand."
I played the story and enjoyed without spending a dollar 🤷🏼 whoever’s looking for solid pvp in a mobile based game, is smoking more crack than those paying to be “good” at a mobile pvp game lmfao.
@@playgroundNW There is no reason why there shouldn't or coudn't be solid pvp in a mobile game. There is no reason why gambling and different currencies have to be in the game. That's why the state of the mobile market is so sad.
"I don't know where to start mocking this" 😂🥇
They need to make a reality tv show where they group up game developers in a house for a year or so to make an MMO and the challenges are to put viewers requests in there and to agree on different things to put in the game and if the game is successful they hold the job titles + pay...like they have a character design challenge and they vote on who gets cut for the worst one.
Can you imagine how a show like that would go? One getting cut off for having the worst character and the guy going: "without me, there won't ever be another character possible!". Most shows like this are heavily scripted, but I feel like with Blizzard developers there would be no need for a script. They are naturally childish.
So basically hold a show for developers to win a job as game devs (which doesn't pay much to begin with) to make a MMO game in a year (impossible)? What world do you live in?
10:31 "Honestly, I can't understand what he's saying all the time."
I don't speak english (I listen a lot, but I don't have anyone to talk to, so I don't), and even I understand both of you perfectly. It's just hard for me to believe that.
I came to say the same thing... it baffles me how English is my second language, but I can understand Quin... yet this man who has been taught and understood the language since he was a baby, can't understand Quin because of his accent?
This man is disingenuous at best... a fkn a**hole at worst.
This needs to be attacked relentlessly, otherwise Diablo 4 is absolutely screwed. Keep it up you crazy berserkers. Give them nothing, but take from them everything.
Diablo 4 is lost buddy
There is no way Diablo 4 will have anything like the microtransactions of Immortal. Diablo 4 won't be free to play and will be PC only. Overwatch 2 is fine and it is F2P
@@NanoLT Your faith runs deep. Deeper than it should, perhaps.
Spoken like a spartan.
@@thecastledude7634 RMT Auctionhouse is on a different level to Diablo Immortal. They are also different mediums, phone games cannot be compared to PC games.
SC2 is F2P and fine, WoW is pay to play and has some overpriced utility transactions but is barely P2W or anything like immortal and Overwatch 2 has ditched lootboxes entirely. Diablo Immortal is an anomaly. Unless you think microsoft and the blizzard internal purge will cause a leaning towards microstransactions?
"It's not P2W"
-Insert clip of Rich Campbell going 44-0 in PvP
Yeah.... not pay to win AT ALL!
If you see Rich clap anyone in PvP you already know something is wrong and the game is P2W.
It's funny because rich even called it p2w lel
@@omarcomming722 Yes, it preys on the natural human desire to improve oneself. It would be difficult to make a p2w system morally justifiable. I'm not even talking about gambling yet. We play games to escape reality and have fun. We can improve our characters in the game, which is inherently satisfying.
Throwing money at something shouldn't be the way you improve at anything. And it doesn't "need" to be in any game, mobile or not.
Quin was on the right track with the casino analogy, it's free to go in but it's gonna cost you to have fun.
Facts he was spot on.
"Entropia universe" its literal mmo casino (thou you can technicaly win money and take it out. There used to be people who made living there just trading), it makes diablo immorals look cheap to max. For 100k You can get maybe mothership, some decent (but not best) gear/weapon and some ammo.. You would still be decades and milions of euros away from maxing anything :P If You want feel like kraken there, they asked bout 3mil dollars for Your own planet (probably cheaper to buy one that already exsist and modify it to Your liking). There are monetysasion tricks in entropia that even blizzard have not figured out yet 0_O
yes its is just like a casino, BUT do you let your children go to those casino? I agree that parents need to monitored their child more closely but it also need someone to decided what kind of game should those kids can reach. its goes both way you know?
Using ad that have gambling elements on kids contents is stupid, cause they're kids so wtf does they know about it. Sooner or later some of them gonna blow a 10k or maybe 20k on daily in those games and after that the addiction will kick in. Then its just gonna go down more.
@@justsomerandomasiandude4111 I didnt protect diablo, quite oposite XD Just pointed out theres even worse version of online casino that even blzzard could learn. I havent playd blizzard games past 6 or 7 years. And only playd warcraft 2 exstensivly and heartsone, when it came out.
@@antssaar863 bro... I was replying to that Taco guy 😂, forgot to tag him in the comment 😅
I can't fathom this behavior when what they should be doing is doubling down on how Diablo 4 *wont* have any of that sort of thing.
This is actual NPC behavior wtf lmao
It will... prepare your angus...
@@MeatMonsterMan I just beat Diablo 3 only one character to go and playing Diablo 2 for the first time I really hope they can make it not p2w and just cosmetic or something I love these games but I really don’t even want to support Activision
They stated that d4 will have a cash shop with cosmetics as for what else it’s a surprise ;) 😂😂💀
@@kylevos8551 then stop supporting them???
@@mr.puggin8384 anything that makes pvp or leaderboards rigged I’m out. Ive Been playing a lot of old games d2 and bioshock series they just don’t do it like they used to. I guess I thought when Microsoft bought them it my make them a little less scummy
The " it's not pay to win if you never win" mentality matches up with blizzards "it's not broken if everything is broken" mentality towards wow pvp 😂
Makes no sense
The only way to make WoW PvP balanced would be to remove all effects of gear. But that would also make it not WoW anymore.
Hearthstone is on beta yet
I was 10 years old when I played Diablo 1 the year it released. The butcher scared the shit out of me. If there had been micro transactions in that game I probably would have been suckered into thinking it was normal to pay to progress in a game.
I was around the same age when I played D1. I remember running for my life when I heard "FRESH MEAT". Had to get creative to survive.
I do because they've thrown down the current shit and are digging up old school classics. Warcraft 3, Oblivion, Daggerfall, Fall Out 3, Half Life, they even are digging up SNES stuff. I think they've had enough.
@@chummer2060 And the most fun co-op move in multiplayer was to block a door and see our mate scream in desperation under the butcher's cleaver.
86ed short bow and some jail bars thanks for coming haha
"you would never even consider purchasing anything", except that we also made the entire UI push our cash-shop super-hard at every opportunity we can...
I was 13 when Diablo 1 came out, Diablo was never really my type of game though, but it was a lot of my friends type of game, and my friends at that time were in the range of 11-15, so yeah, that would have been the age range they got into Diablo
Let’s just start calling mobile games “Gambling Games” so that when one of these guys says “it’s a mobile game for mobile gamers” we can translate it to “it’s a gambling game for gambling gamblers” and then we can both be right
This actually is accurate i remember spending 200$ on 3 microtransactions last week on some other mobile game
Blizzard 2018: "do you guys not have phones?"
Blizzard 2022: "do you guys not have credit cards?"
Also Blizzard 2022: Do you guys not have trust funds?
Fans reaction: "Do you not have shame?"
@@Avatar_of_Chairness More like "Don't you trust us with your funds?" 😋
@@RiseInAfterlife Blizzard cant have my money. Im Dutch😎
The 800% bonus box he describes at 3:13 is actually the valuation of the bundle. The creators of the game are implying that the value is worth 800% more. You spend a dollar and receive 60 orbs (this is already the dollar value compared to the orb purchase system.) Also, there is a weapon skin that you’ll receive. Don’t get me wrong it’s enticing & definitely hooks you in to purchase more. P2W show cases in the early game, but end game it is seemingly reasonable. The issue here is that end game is so far away for the F2Ps that most will quit before getting that far.
That "HERE WE GOO" bit had me crying haha 21:40
😂
Yea that shit was funny
Holy fuck, I was crying laughing on the train looking like a psycho, that was so unexpected, lmao.
Blizzard went from assaulting the employees to assaulting the customers.
What will their apology be now? Will they change the name of another character and call it a day??
Quin's analogy was shaky af but he was onto something; just change heeeroeeen (spelt wrong on purpose) to dopamine and it's basically the same thing.. you are still chasing the next hit, and Diablo Immortal is only happy to supply it, provided you got the cash
21:40 I forget all my problems and drama , I almost died 😂😂😂
People like StewGaming are complicit in this hostile takeover of the mainstream gaming space by mobile predatory tactics. To laugh off the obvious fact that a predatory system has already been normalized in one space while it is transitioned into a new one is gaslighting at its finest. Optional systems are not optional when they are designed to exploit vulnerable people.
There should be a legal requirement that games like this have to ask players when they create an account, "is paying money for an advantage in game P2W". Anyone who answers no has their account permanently restricted to free to play and all the P2W aspects hidden. Someone needs to help these poor people.
But then whales will play with other whales and then when a whale realizes he put 20k dollars into the game and still dont win he might Quit ☹️ whales need freebies to feel good about themself so they wanna stay and keep being whales🥰 Blizzard love the whales
@@Michael-zi2qg whales need easy dubs against normal people to feel good about themselves. All that time working a boring job, saving up money and not doing anything with it - they want to feel superior somewhere right? That’s why they spend half their life savings on a digital experience that won’t last forever. For that small amount of time they feel like a king amongst men… on a video game. These people and obviously people with bad impulse control/compulsive purchasing habits are why these whales continue to whale. It’s incredibly sad. The only “legitimate” whales are streamers who want to buy everything for content. But that in itself is promoting this and pushing mentally ill people closer to getting stuck in the whale loop themselves.
would be interesting indeed! though no way the money bags behidn the laws let em sadge id love an otpion to opt out of ever being shown ingame purchases but ohh well
They wouldn’t go for it and they’ll absolutely push against it. P2w in a PvP scenario incentives going p2w because the advantage it gives over f2p players. If p2w players are restricted to p2w matches that advantage is gone. Rather infact, it punishes going p2w if you only want to spend a little.
I do like the idea. It’s a good incentive to keep games from being p2w. ideally games just wouldn’t do that though, because splitting a player base can really hurt when player count drops.
@@iwonderwho Oh totally agree, it was more of a joke, mostly I think age restrictions would be a good thing, not much you can do though overall...
25:30 just to clarify Asmon is incorrect when it comes to the claw machine analogy. It is gambling. Claw Machines are in fact rigged and have settings that “hard cap” the holding power of the claw, meaning regardless of your “skill” you are rolling for example a 1/28 chance that the computer will allow the claw its maximum holding power. Even more so if the machine identifies a “win” while the claw is on weak holding for the “pull” the odds can go even further to 1/56 for example.
Some claws are made with tiny springs that have almost no tensile strength, thus making it impossible to hold anything that weighs more than an ounce or two.
Always inspect the claw before you play.
That would be considered illegal in many countries.
By law, the claw machine must give the same chances to everyone. In other words, it can't have different levels of grip.
That can be fixed by giving everyone shit chances of winning.
But it cannot be rigged. I mean, it can but that would make it illegal.
He wasn't arguing that they weren't rigged. His argument was that in theory if you are so bad that you always put the claw over an empty zone in the bin, you will lose 100% of the time. So there is some amount of skill, and he believes that makes them different from loot boxes. HOWEVER, I think it should be illegal for anything purchasable by minors to be rigged in the first place. So I disagree with him there. Its not different, its still gambling. But i feel the same way about trading cards, arcades, loot boxes, etc. None of those should be random and incentivize minors to gamble for prizes.
@@andregon4366 Fair enough, but who's going to actually inspect claw games to make sure they're "winnable" ? I assume there's regulations on the book they're "supposed" to follow, but in practice is there any actual accountability?
Genuinely curious, as I've never seen anyone performing maintenance on them.
How would the average person even be able to tell the difference between the claw machine being "illegally" unwinnable and just ordinarily unwinnable?
I can't remember the last time I won anything, or even saw someone else win anything from a claw machine. I just assume they're all rigged, illegally or not.
@@thegrimharvest Hey, all I know is that the law doesn't allow those machines to give different chances if winning.
I don't know who is supposed to inspect them or if anyone does.
Never in my life back when I still played Diablo II I would have imagined that Blizzard would turn into one of the shittiest game devs companies in the future, betraying everyone...
I’m seriously wondering how far these reaction to a reaction to reaction videos can be taken before it opens a portal to another realm.
Who is now going to react to the reaction of the reactor to the reactor reacting to the original clip? My money is on JSH
Can’t even see the gameplay just unlimited cams of the same two faces looking into your soul.
@@kirkvanallen5202 haha
25:57 I have a friend who runs a claw machine and he told me that you can literally set the win rate to a 10th of a percent. They're fully rigged.
"I don't know what to say"
He's a gambling junkie trying to justify his gambling to his gambling junkie audience, Asmon, there isn't much else to say..
He's not even gambling. He plays free to play. He's the krill that the whales eat.
@@Poldovico No, he pays to win. He's a pay to win Andy. He just has a second free to play account, which is even sadder.
@@Poldovico Defending the gambling is just as bad, if not worse.
@@Sneedmeister I agree, but apparently I was wrong about that and he has two accounts, one f2p and one where he gambles.
Never heard of this Stew guy before today, and I have never known a guy to be so wrong about everything
I love how we think of diablo immortal as having a "mixed reception" when in reality the game came out and made more money than blizzard could have foreseen. To the eyes of blizzard diablo immortal has been a MASSIVE success. why would they really care about "whinny free players"?
It's really hard to see these kind of shitty softwares called "games" disappear, because even if most ppl hate them they still generate enough money, probably even more than the games ppl like.
Idk why people are whining about the game as f2p. It’s like catching a plane for free because the rich dudes in first class is paying everything in exchange for best flight experience possible, they can be getting full service from flight attendants all the way through and I wouldn’t be complaining.
That's the sad thing. This literally becomes a beacon for shitty development, because hey, who cares if your 'game' is received badly if it has the gambling mechanics included that make you tons of money? It's just a snowball getting bigger and bigger as time goes on....
Because some people would rather pay for the flight and fly like human beings rather than having only the option of flying in the cargo hall for free.
@@Qstate you are still playing the game like a human being, it’s just people who pays for the game getting more benefits. Not everyone is a competitive hardcore player especially in the mobile scene, most just kill off time don’t even lvl to max.
@@kaydens6964 Exactly my dude, these people played straight for 48 hours after launch and are salty because those who pay have advantages, they don't even consider playing for fun, they either play to win or hate the game all together.
I get more dopamine watching people rage, and watching people defend it than I would ever get by playing
I'm baffled that anyone tries to reason or counter this Stew guy. When someone is THAT oblivious to the most obvious, there's no reasoning with them.
The most obvious proof of predatory design is that JoshStrifeHayes needed to make an extension to his "The immoral monetisation of Diablo Immortal" (or sth like that) video, because after hours of research he still couldn't spot every issue (it was also pointed out by another user in the comments of said extension).
The most obvious evidence that StewGaming can't be reasoned with is that in Asmongold's original (I think) stream clip about him he's literally explaining p2w of the game to support his statement that it's not p2w.
22:16 fun fact incognito mode does nothing to already existing cookies, it just disables you getting any from the new pages.
but they're not looking for your cookies anyway, your ISP collects that data and sells it to third party clients like YT.
its the same reason you could use a completely different account on your phone but still get the same type of ads.
tldr: people are scummy.
EDIT: he litteraly said it a sec later my bad XD
I think there's a lot left unsaid about how destructive gambling addictions can be to a person and everyone around them, in a sense much like hard drugs. Yes, some people can afford to spend 10k on a game and not mind it. But there are many more who will spend beyond their means, and more extreme examples after that to be sure.
Especially when you watch people around you or people that you care about doing the gambling.
You see all the good things they're getting, you see the cool skins or how much more powerful (faster leveling up or just P2W) they are now and you want to be part of it, because most people crave for the feeling of being included.
Teaches some good life lessons focus on yourself not others
@@chalkboard-4649 Ah, we should put this sort of things in schools to teach them early then
0:59 I wonder how long is the "little bit faster" that blizzard was talking about, 3 years? 4 years? just to catch up to a pay to win player?
82.5 years to be exact
Not at all. Once you pay, its not possible for f2p players to catch up to you.
A 2 week playing p2w guy yea
I did the math. It's about 1851 years for a 5-star gem as a f2p player.
So your "3 to 4 years" ballpark is only wrong by about 530x :D
@@profanemagic5671 only 1851? Thats amazing. Not p2w, see?
The way I look at it is this pretty much is like mining companies that say "This is super profitable and eco-friendly, we planted 1000 poplar trees last week and adopted 3 puppies" and meanwhile the communities around need to find new sources of water because the river is no longer a thing. These people defending p2w are destroying gaming for everybody else. If you need positive mental reinforcement you go to the therapist not the car shop. This is the same, games should be competitive and engaging. Games are supposed to be satisfying but I don't think that at the expense of another person.
I'd 100% percent wouldn't mind them enjoying their p2w experience but the main problem is that they send the wrong message to the devs are ends affecting the games I do play & enjoy.
Let gamblers and p2w players have their own game. There is no game design reason why the game "needs" to be shared with f2p players, besides MORE PROFIT from feeding the whales.
@@BeeBird whales won't put money down if they're competing against eachother. Whales want to dunk on F2P players.
I love how people say "it is not pay to win" and i ask what id the game centered around? Loot, gear, gems so on. So one would argue getting these things, getting the best equipment is "winning" the game. Then by design if the game let's you buy a higher percentage of chance on gear. You are paying to win if nothing else faster.
It is like the level boosts in the new assassin games, like yeah you don't need to buy it but you will be able to get on with the story and game faster than completing boring sidequests/content for 30 hours.
Or just play
@@chalkboard-4649 what do you mean?
Just play unless playing the game is boring to u then move on to a different game instead of complaining because bootylover69 spent his life savings on a gem that u wanted
@@chalkboard-4649 ah yes the solution is just to stop wanting and playikg games.
Stop playing games u don’t enjoy
Love how Asmon was reacting to this stew guy reacting to Quin reacting to this stew guy
I don't get how D:I is supposed to be P2W, just don't rush it and you won't even consider buying anything. I'm currently sitting at 0 hours 0 minutes playtime and not once felt the need to spend money on this incredible game.
Had me in the first half lmfao
@@trucid2 play another class or move to another game easy, or go do something productive that is worth the time instead of playing a game lol
@@trucid2 I'm 99% sure that in a month I'll approach this game the same way. As in, I won't.
I was looking forward to Diablo 4 but Blizzard is dead to me now
Only now?.. No judgment but, man, you’re kinda slow.
Lmao Diablo 3 was bad how can you expect anything but worse? It's like people have memory of golden fish.
NOW? all the sexual harassment wasn’t enough? yikes
@@sitrueis4007 Diablo 3 was fun to play, I loved the physics, and it wasn't filled with microtransactions
@@Thiccems69 I mean, I assume that Blizzard isn't made up of 100% sexual predators and that the overwhelming majority of them are normal people trying to make games
Being from Belgium, I was kinda bummed when I lost access to buying lootboxes in Overwatch. It felt a bit patronizing how I, a working adult, couldn't choose what I would spend my money on. Now that I see how Diablo Immortal has turned out, I completely understand why that law was created and I applaud my country greatly for it.
nice
How does that work, do you guys get a different version of the game?
@@avenderiel no we can’t download it here in Belgium since blizzard decided not to make an alternative version. Was a bit annoyed at first but didn’t bother to much. Now i fully understand why
@@avenderiel and as to OW, we can play it, we just can't buy lootboxes.
Good riddance. I hope my country follows!
I'm gonna put my neutral arbitrator hat on for a moment and just say that Stew is not doing himself any favors by skipping over valid points and analogies Quin is bringing up. The thing about "the casino doesn't charge you to enter" made total sense. Just because the entry fee is zero doesn't mean that you aren't surrounded by gambling.
Also, how is Diablo * not * market toward kids? We were probably all in our teens, if not younger, when the first game came out and we played it. One of my first pc gaming experiences was Baldur's Gate and I was probably younger than 10 at the time ...
I played Skyrim, Borderlands 2, and Call of Duty when I was growing up. At the time, I would have been like 10-12. If I was playing games where you literally shoot or stab people before I even hit puberty, then surely kids will continue to be able to do so in the future. Sure, the game isn't technically marketed towards children, but children WILL play them because ESRB ratings aren't taken all that seriously anymore.
Imagine defending micro transactions. Out of this world. Just no words.
they are not even "micro" transactions these days lol
@@husher5142 right!? I mean I refuse to spend even 99 cents. I just don't play the game altogether. Any game that has any form of P2W I don't play with maybe exception to wow classic but even that is in a way P2W cuz people buy gold and buy gear or arena carry
H's a paid shill so what do you expect
Micro Transactions are fine. Predatory gambling mechanisms and "Pay to Win" are parasites. The latter can be tougher in some cases, since the discern between "Getting from X to Y faster" and "Pay to Win" is a fine line and it so it can depend on a case by case scenario, but then we have cases like Diablo Immortal where it's very clear: They want to shake you up for your money otherwise you're never going to be able to keep up with the others even if you spend all your day grinding the game, because by the time you do catch up, either the game has been updated with the "new best thing that you can get by buying" or you have no more joy to get out of the game and most people have moved on.
@@justanotherLunny The point is that micro transactions are supposed to be like $1-5 and maybe max out at $20. But these companies are charging $100-200 for mounts and things.
Stew is just being a contrarian to get views, and he's doing a good job at it since asmongold keeps giving him the audience needed. there is no way he think what he thinks. It's the same as the hate watch tiktok shitty videos that makes ppl rage.
I honestly think he believes the shit he is saying tho, there ARE people like that sadly..
Naw stew actually likes mobile games and doesn't mind their shit tactics. He's made mobile gaming videos for ages now and plays them regularly
I know a person that's like this. They do, in fact, exist. Even tho its hard to grasp for people that are not nutcases.
@@randomhero6365 I know, I checked out his channel but that doesn't mean he should accept that it is the way mobiles games are, it shouldn't be the way and shouldn't be acceptable.
@@NeptuFawkes the guy did this before he got any type of attention from any big streamer. He 100% believes what he's saying.
"If you decided to pay, you would get there a little bit faster"
Thats called pay to win
and it's not a little bit. 10 legendary crests(the bound ones because the not bound ones are not possible without paying) take literal months to get and 10 crests are nothing.
@@akaxjenkins its absolutely ridiculous, and they give this bs corporate response... not to mention all the currencies and the fact you get stuck at a certain level ,so you pay to not grind
At this point, I no longer upset about Diablo Immortal pay-to-win but looking at the profit Blizzard makes. I have lost faith in humanity that people are just gullible to fuel the Activision greed.
It's a game it really isn't that deep 🤣😭🤦♂️
What can I say? The game is really good and using money for good games is not bad. I have used only 60$ in the game and thatsy the retail price for many games
Same honestly. Whenever I saw the news of the game before release I thought everyone already knew this was going to be a P2W game with gambling. It'd been reported and warned several times with good and concise evidence. It hurts to see that it's made so much money, it only rewards Blizzard into thinking this is good practice.
It's Activision, look at cod. You have to spend 60 bucks for the game but then when you play what's all the cool cosmetics you get to earn through playing the game? A grand total of nothing! A full priced 60$ game still has micro transactions but at least in that example it's not pay 2 win which at least doesn't make it oppressively bad
@@eggwitheyez The game has plenty of depth for a mobile game, and its quite well balanced; what is irritating is that most of that balance goes out of the window the second a player decides to sink a couple thousand dollars in.
I seriously wish we could just spend $60 and get a game worth $60. If only that could happen.
Elden Ring was the first in quite a while that I've played that gave me what I paid for
I've never played a souls game and mostly play PC. I doubt I could get Elden Ring running stable. But I know that game would be worth the purchase. If I had a current gen console I would 100% buy it.
Shit I'm willing to pay $100 for a game worth $100
There are plenty of games that fit that bill unless you suffer the unreasonable compulsion of only playing newly released games or the need of having every second of gameplay curated and guided by developers. Emulation, sandbox games, flash/unity games, and freeware/abandonware are all worth dumping tens of thousands of hours into if you're even a little bit creative with how you make your own fun with them- and if not I suggest watching movies or doom scrolling social media instead.
@@actually5004 chill. I rarely play games on release. What are you talking about? I never said I didn't have anything to play that doesn't require thousands of dollars. I'm saying that selling me shit in the game is a shit practice.
"Idk what language this is but Its obviously not American"
Nice
The reasons this guy so passionately defends this game is because :a) he had invested so much money into it he cannot stand that it is being ridiculed, or b) he is paid by Blizz
Neither it's c) he's just that far gone into "that's mobile gaming" mentality. His other videos really support c)
Or just play the game and stop getting tempted by shiny things
A) is not unreasonable at all. (Neither is b) to be fair, but I'm going somewhere with this.) Cost sunk fallacy isn't *simply* a fallacy, (well, an informal fallacy, really,) but it's a cognitive bias. The more you sink into something, the harder it can get to disengage with it. Scientology hooks people using this bias, (they get you to waste time on a psychology test, which itself is a sunk cost,) and its deceptively strong.
@@chalkboard-4649 Some people have addictive personalities, dude. Its even genetic for some. It's not something people control.
@@peppermintgal4302 sounds like a personal problem, dude. Lol
Played Genshin since day 1, stopped when content ended around the 6th month, came back for 1 year anniversary and never stopped playing since then, they learnt their lesson and keep churning out events like MMO and keep giving out free gems, because they made so much money (and still making) from the whales and the hordes of casuals, me included. Best thing is that we only at Country#3 out of 7 now :D Look past the waifus and the game keeps giving
a legit gacha game with actual gameplay
The thing about Genshin is that once you have a character, thats it. Constelleations are like no value realistically. There's only like 20~ 5 star characters. There is no further random monetary progression. You can use primos to run another dungeon for an artifact but the value in that is so garbage, I dont even consider it an option. 5 star weapons, given the value, are a waste as well. Especially with weapons like the Catch existing through progression.
Their price per gem value is absolute trash, but even so there is like 6-700 dollars worth of primogems to be earned just from base content and exploration, plus another 100+ dollars per patch through events and dailies.
As f2p, roughly mathematically, you are guaranteed 5-6 5 stars through base content, a 5 star every patch and a half ish. With Welkin/BP, I think it works out to a guaranteed 5 star per patch. There is maybe a 5 star released every 1.5 patches. Sometimes. And not all are worth it and easy to skip.
I have a very strong love/hate relationship with Genshin, and I distain gacha mechanics, but realistically I have to give Genshin credit where due.
I'd like to see a price breakdown on what Diablo Immortal gives to f2p based on its own made up price values.
@@telkaivokalma cons add no value?
Tell me „I only have c0 chars“ without saying „I only have c0 chars“ xD
@@unluckytoby Looking for a wrong game. It's weeb BotW and it delievers on what it's supposed to deliever - story, exploration and anime milkers. Game is enormous in size but yes, it's not an MMO. Once you are done with the exploration you are done besides maybe few hours of content every few weeks.
@@TheGosgosh what I do personally has nothing to do with the argument, but just for clarity I have c2 Raiden and c1 Kazuha and an unfortunate c2 Klee.
*Marginal upgrades that equate to 100s of dollars in primogem value* are worthless, which is the context you are missing dingus. We are talking value per dollar spent, not your opinion on 3 extra levels in your E ability for 200 dollars. Cope harder friendo
Blizzard:
"Customers deserve no respect. Look, they are still throwing money at the shit that we fed them LOL!"
I'm kind of torn, on 1 hand I'm pretty sure you could get to the final hell level eventually without paying, most raids and groups have op people running ahead destroying everything.
On the otherhand the loot so far is all minor upgrades. So far no legendary or green set pieces that got me remotely excited. So getting to the end game would be very boring without the p2w items
I got a L5 gem and the idea of having to get a bunch more just to level up the one I have has cured me of ever thinking about eternal crests. I got lucky and got it early.
Wow, you indeed are lucky
@@benp3485 it was Phoenix Ashes. Great until you find out it's based on Base HP not worn HP. And just thinking about leveling it up made me stop thinking about crests.
I'm a bit out of the loop, but can you sell that 5 star on the marketplace for anything worthwhile? I assume you can't sell it for real money, even though many would happily pay you?
@@RyMaz0 yeah, but most 5 star gems start out with only 2 or 3 starts filled in. You have to level up the gem. Last I saw the sell for about 50 to 75 dollars er platinum at that level. Haven't seen a 5/5 on the market. If the gem is sellable it will have scales in the upper corner
I already eqiped it. Once you equip it you can't sell it.
19:00 in fact, I had an Diablo Immortal ad before this video and the same ad before Asmosns first play session.
I would actually be down to spend upfront for a well built game. No pay to wins, no premium currency, just a good game with an upfront cost on mobile.
They aren't capable of making good games and nobody would pay $70 for a mobile piece of shit.
Companies know this, they just don't care. They make more way more money from predatory f2p games with cash shops than they do from a game that's a one off $50-70 sale.
@@Nick-zp8wk oh I know they make more off of the current mobile model. Just me wishing. Lol
@@Keldiur yeah there are some out there, you're right. Just finding them is a pain.
@@Keldiur plants vs zombies was one of those early good mobile games.
Man, we took the wrong turn somewhere.
In a better parallel-universe, mobile-games are 0,79$ titles that are meant to be played on a bus or at break on work.
In my area, a time ago, the were a coin machines, where you put real coin (0.05$ equivalent or more, whatever), machine rolls 3 numbers, and if there's matches, machine drops some coins to you. So, this coin machines was all over the town, usually just near some markets, and I saw a bunch of kids playing that. There was no regulation of that, because there's no a person between you and coin machine. They were right on the street. Come and play, no restrictions.
"Chuck E. Cheese's Spin Zone": Come on down and eat some rat pizza at our child casino.
At 26:00 I can tell you without a doubt, roughly half or more are rigged. When it comes to claw machines, they can be rigged. There are ones that generally are not, but still can be most definitely, which are generally the UFO crane games that have you poke and lift (1 or 2-pronged) rather than grab and hold (3 to 4-pronged). A significant amount of skill is needed for both. A higher skilled player has a far better chance than a lower or non-skilled player. No matter what, all crane games come down to skill. Meanwhile, slot machines - doesn't matter which (this includes loot boxes) - come down to pure luck. There is no skill in opening a loot box. You just press or click a button and that's it. ZERO skill involved.
I know a great deal about crane games, btw. I have a whole garage full of prizes (they're just sitting there in trash bags until the next time I am able to sell them at a convention for cheap).
I think the problem for me is I don't feel a sense of discovery in gaming anymore. There isn't a dramatic change in mechanics or settings that create that same holy shit feeling that I got in the the first couple WoW expansions. And I'm worried I never will get that feeling again because I have set my expectations so high its hard to imagine what a gaming company could do to even create an ounce of that feeling again.
Try path of exile
It isn’t that you set your expectations too high, it’s that companies have made an art out of getting the most money out of as little effort as possible. Nothing to do about it but support indie devs(along with the few good sizable companies like FromSoft) who still put real effort into crafting unique and worthwhile experiences. They may be harder to find because of how corporate advertisement is, but they’re still going strong.
Imagine I can't even download Diablo Immortal cus we have laws that regulate gambling to prevent gambling addictions lmao
You man, and your people are protected against bullshit
SPOKEN LIKE A CHAMPION 😂!!!!!!!! (What is happening to gaming??🤧)
2022 society is happening. If just no one would agree to that business model there would not be a discussion about it. Its the people´s choice to support this shit.
@@Icezapp1 Sadly, that's like saying "there would be no war if nobody joined the army" - technically correct, but very unrealistic.
=(
@@profanemagic5671 no way. A war is always forced mostly by politicians, if you are in the army you have no choice but to follow orders thats why you sign up for it. BTW you sign up for the army voluntarily.
So no one is forcing people to support p2w, they do it on their own to make them self happy while playing a virtual game. Thats it!
This shows that the problem is not from the dev. only but from those players too who like and support all those mecanics. As I said a long time ago, there is already a huge mass of players completly infected by the gacha mobile system. They are like conspiracy seekers, after so many years without anyone pointing the growing problem of mobiles, it's now nearly impossible to talk to them because their logic and vision are already formated. The DI scandal reveals the seize of a bigger problem that is now hard to control.
Hey, dont lump us gacha games players with this fucks! Diablo Immortal apologists are their own special breed of dumb.
I play several gacha games and all of them *combined* are not even close to the dumpster fire that is this game.
That is close to the argument, that made addicts criminals. Of course it is not the devs it is the management. And sure, those youtubers feed the machine and they are truly to blame to defend crazy stuff like this.
Gacha is trading cards. Basically.
@@trazyntheinfinite9895 well worse trading cards, you cant trade them between players usually so even though its just cardboard trading cards sometimes have some real life value attached
The state of mobile games is very sad.
Quinn's analogy does not suck. The dopamine hit you get from getting a legendary item is comparable to heroin.
Better analogy would be skee-ball at Chuck E Cheese and it dispenses tickets, except if you put in $5 instead of a quarter, the holes on the skee ball machine get bigger and it dispenses tickets worth 100 times a regular ticket.
You know...this type of player is exactly the reason mobile games don't improve.
the playerbase on mobile has already accepted much lower standards as a requirement for their games to exist at all. if you try to argue they'll just say "well thats just how it is on mobile". and so companies see no reason to change things.
People are trying to bring up the standards of mobile gaming at least somewhat close to PC/Console, but the mobile players are for some reason fighting against it.
The funny part is you can legit get EVERYTHING in genshin for free by just playing. You get wishes for FREE just doing the dailies and stuff. Yea its waaaay faster if you pay for stuff but you actually DONT have to. The "Battle Pass" is worth like 5 times what you pay for it if you get it too.
@@christiangonzalez6945 bingo
I don't mind gacha games at all, but Genshin is one of the much worse ones in terms of monetisation. There is a monthly sub and a paid battle pass, which is already way too much on its own, but it even goes out of its way to hide this from new players. Everything in the game is designed to steal your time by putting micro-rewards onto everything to keep you playing and get things for "free". The game barely ever gives you things for free actually, and mostly you need to spend your time to get it. There is no daily login to get rewards for "free", dailies take time to get small returns, and most events lock the currency rewards behind a grind.
You can claim that you can ignore the gems completely and just "play the game for free", but that's not true at all. There is an entire tier of weapons that is only available from paid gacha, that's almost on the same level of bullshit as Diablo:Immortal, with the only saving grace being that there's an actually affordable pity. Similarly, you obviously have to pay to roll on new characters, otherwise you're just ignoring content. Yes you don't have to get them, but that is like saying you don't have to play half the game to enjoy it if you don't want to spend money. I wouldn't even bring this up since I don't really mind character gacha, and to be fair Genshin has a pretty reasonable pity system compared to other games, but it makes up for it - and becomes much worse than other games - in places you can't see as easily. In Genshin, it is not enough to get the character you want once. You saved up your "free" gems and managed to get the character you wanted with the pity system, great, right? Well not really, since you just got a gimped version of the character with a big part of its toolkit locked behind the constellation system. Want to get the most out of your character? Well I hope you're ready getting the same character 7 times, the reasonable pity isn't going to help you there. Even if you don't go that hard, you want to have at least C1 or the character is just a broken husk of itself that isn't able to do what it was made to do well.
I've played a lot of gacha games and I keep up with quite a few, but Genshin has one of the worst monetisations out there, mainly in how it tries to deceive you to think it is actually generous.
Actually crazy that all this is happening right now. Literally just got that game a week ago and my brother told me not to bother since it PTW. I guess he was right for once
The argument is that you can get through the campaign without spending but honestly blizzard is all about the endgame and immortal literally has nothing for f2p players. Once a month you can get 1/10 of a $25 purchase with little to no chance of getting any worthwhile loot.
I am ashamed to say that they got me last night. I’ve been playing Diablo Immortal for a couple weeks on my phone and hadn’t spent a single cent cuz I didn’t want to support the greedy practices. But last night I caved and got that 99¢ beginners bundle. I feel like I need to shower 3 times and file a police report.
You’re a disgrace. What were you thinking!
Weak
INTERVENTION TIME:
uninstall now. you changed. you're not the rogga figa I remember.
We don't do this to harm you, We just want our homie back :(
PepeHands
24:37 That analogy is kinda wacky, but there is something that operates on that model already. Those are strip clubs. They maybe do not have a vending machines, but they got ATMs on the spot and the barman is "the vending machine"
ironically enough, the region that was the most dissatisfied with monetization is responsible for almost half of the infusion of money into the game.
did you gloss over the part where they discussed we need to reach the gamers who dont consume content about these games? or anything down that line of thinking? the fact that hes trying to get politicians or state officials involved in creating some laws around these practices, even if we cant reach those gamers? and how exactly can you prove that the USA was the "most dissatisfied" ? bozo logic.
@@hunterjobrien it is indeed the most dissatisfied playerbase for the game BUT they provide immortal with 50% of the income already
@@citizenvulpes4562 your point?
@@hunterjobrien I agree that bloggers need to work with the audience and point out how bad everything is with mobile gaming. And the main thing is not to stop playing, but to stop paying.
I played Genshin a lot, you can go crazy and spend an arm and a leg, but also just doing 100$ and being fine for months to come. And the revenue shows that it works, you don't have to go the way of Diablo Immortal to make a good profit.
100$ is still too much, most new paid games are 60$
@@MarkoVuckovic32 u rlly dont even have to pay anything to get a team capable of clearing all the hardest content
@@kanashi6736 the game must be pretty easy if that's all it tales.takes.
@@kanashi6736 it's fine in that case
Genshin is a horrible example, it's just a different kind of making profits from players. Most gamers are addicted to the new characters Waifu/Husbandos don't get me wrong they have great designs but they hook you that you start to collect so many that at some point you have so many that you're resources to level them up runs dry and you need to spend money to get more resources. They know this, that's why their events are so strict that if you miss one day you could possible miss out on all of it. They intentionally starve you so you spend money they're really no different than Diablo Immortal or EA. I understand this companies need to make money but these practices they use are just down right dirty.
As a gacha player (Azur Lane) I really like the gacha part here. I never spent a single cent on the game. The game it self is extremly player friendly and gives way too many resources for ppl to get characters + there is "pvp", but its not p2w at all. Yes you can buy few things, but in the end its about getting shipgirls in events. But what the diablo is doing is just a joke
Another Azur Lane enjoyer 👌👌
@@NICSU667 dude guardian tales story is a really coster. From generic save the princess link story, harry potter+ghost buster mash up story about students commiting suicide and conspiracy shit to saving people in coal mines and fucking holocoast ovens. One of the best story telling game so far, its like Jojo but a gacha game.
azur lane, arknights, alchemy stars, and revived witch combined aren't this predatory. My friends and I barely spend any money, we often flex who gets the best operator with the least resources.
Nice! Another Azur Lane enjoyer.
The youtube diablo immortal ad keeps showing 4.2 ☆'s but the play store shows barely 3☆
I don't use IRL currency to buy stuff (mostly because I can't afford to), but saying games like Diablo Immortal isn't pay to win is a blatant lie. While you could argue that a non-paying player could catch up to whales, it would take way too long (at that point the whales probably would have moved on to the next game) for it to actually be considered balanced. As a game dev, I get not wanting to admit that it's pay to win, but even they (and the people defending the game) have to admit that paying gives a player such a huge advantage over those who not only don't pay at all, but those who don't spend a lot of money as well
"Is Blizzard actively going to the malls and skating rinks promoting Diablo Immortal to kids?" has the same energy as "Activision Blizzard investigated itself and found no evidence of intentionally ignoring gender harassment."
It’s also super out of date. It’s not the 1980s, malls are dying because of online retail and Covid has pushed everyone to get used to being inside at home. If you want to reach kids you advertise on RUclips, which is exactly what they do.
@@Chaosqueenngami Shouldn't Raid be the one getting tons of shit than. I only ever see people advertise Raid and they are still doing it. I'm not sure where these kids are getting credit cards to gamble with online. It seems like something rather easy for parents to stop. At least this generation won't have to deal with tons of drinking and driving like my generation did as its big problem. lol
@@unknownsword9042 Raising kids these days has gotten harder not easier. Parents are overworked, single care givers or inattentive because of every thing else going on around. Which is why most just buy their kid a smart phone or tablet and trust that to be the kids time occupier rather than them. It’s also easy for kids with parents in that situation to get away with a lot before the parents find out.
@@unknownsword9042 have you been living under a rock? The Raid Shadow legends hate train passed through about 2 years ago bud
@@unknownsword9042 Raid DOES get a lot of crap. Everyone knows it is a giant scam. The thing is with that is that they are actually really good with their sponsorships and pay out super well to the people they sponsor from what I recall which is super helpful for content creators on here considering how bad youtube can be with actually paying people here and how easy it is to lose monetization for trivial things