Just a few notes on this! You will notice that at around the 58-minute mark the video skips (where the speaker targets elders for his warning about social media). This is because the speaker gives the name of the congregation, and I forgot to bleep this out during editing, so I've snipped it out using the RUclips editor. I am hopeful that one day I can interview one or several of the "20" to hear more of their story, but I understand the situation is quite delicate at the moment. Obviously, you don't get 20 people leaving a congregation all at once without it causing friction. In any case, I'm delighted that so many have found freedom and it is an encouraging sign that online activism really is having a tangible effect on Witness numbers - and Watchtower knows it. Hope you guys enjoy the video! :)
John Cedars I always love your videos and find them so helpful in addressing family who are still believers. I’m looking at doing a video series around women who have left the organisation and their struggles leaving such a misogynistic environment. Do you have anyone you know who might be interested in being part of the project? I have plenty of men volunteer but women seem so much more timid about sharing their experience, and I think it might be helpful to other women questioning the ‘truth’
Hello Lloyd! I was born a JW and I went on being a pioneer and all... Then, about 5 years ago, my boss in the secular job started reasoning with me about my beliefs and about some realities I wasn't aware of... At the beginning I was hurt and angry with him. But my mind has always been too inquisitive for the cult, and I felt very bad about my thoughts and questions, but I couldn't let it go! So I started to investigate a bit more, I read "Crisis of consciousness" (the TRUE eye-opener) and yours was the first channel I ever subscribed as an "apostate"! Needless to say I never went back! So thank you for the way you put things, and the kind way you speak. If you had been an angry person or a vindictive one, I would have never go on listening to you! So, congratulations on your work with people like me, that woke up too late but yet soon enough to start living!
Lloyd, I really like your style. I have no idea what you do for a living, but you’d make an excellent college professor or teacher in some fashion. Your ability to reason with people, in this case Jehovah’s Witnesses, is outstanding. I imagine many of those leaving this cult may have gotten their strength from you to flee. You’re so right about that we, as apostates, are not responsible to give those who leave a new hope. Witnesses are believing a lie and really need to move on to reality. I’m in the U.S. (Arizona), so if you’re ever in this part of the world it would be a pleasure to meet you!
These people would have been stoned to death or had a sword pearced through him for committing such a defiling act. Or adultery. In Exodus an isrealite was pierced through in the process of committing a sinful act with a woman from another tribe in his tent. No questions asked Joshua (l think) pierced them both through in front of all the Isrealites. They all knew God's commandment to them on this subject or other atrocious sexual acts.....
Awesome !!! As a ex elder and bethelite love your reasoning and respectable way of exposing both sides of this fear inspiring pep talk to the blind class! The curtain is being pulled back and there responding .thanks for your dedication to us all!
Just hearing the word "apostates" scared me to death!!..This is the reason why a lot of JWs have a hard time coming out of the org! I started out learning about Mormonism and noticed the similarities of the JWs...Then I branched out and started looking into Seventh Day Adventist, Scientology, Christadelphians, The Brethren, Christian Science.. I started noticing the parallels between all the religions, and it runs deep...no questioning, no doubting and everything comes from the top down.. The rank-and-file are just the followers with no personal self, no individuality and after you wake up and start seeing these things it can take a toll on you, especially if this is the only thing you have known all your life..it is really tough and then the phobias and the different fears, it can mess with a person's mind..and now I see why a lot of people resort to suicide, it is scary but the good thing is there's help!! The internet has played a big part in all of this!!.. Now I look at people as being just human beings trying to do their best..trying to deal with all the stresses and anxieties in this world! John your channel was a lifesaver in my early waking up process!!.. I cannot thank you enough!..Keep up the awesome work!! 💯❤
I also woke up when I made a Mormon friend and began researching the LDS church, history, and then listening to ex-mormon stories of their waking from cult indoctrination. When I realized that anyone born into a religion can believe any crazy doctrine and believe it the One Truth. I began to see JW was just another religion. From there I gained the courage to investigate the history and reality of WTS. John Cedars' videos were a hug part of my waking up from the Doomsday cult.
jenna reed - yeah, its amazing!.. I wasn't questioning the Org at the time.. I just wanted to learn something different.. so I became curious about the Mormons and noticed the similarities...It gave me the courage to look inside the JWs and then I came across the UN and down the rabbit hole I went!!.. It's good to be free! Enjoy your freedom!!
Abigail Parker - awesome!.. I was raised in the Org from 7 years old (40+ years)...I didn't know anything else!.. (Father an Elder and mother a pioneer)... so you know it has been challenging! But, freedom is so sweet!!! 💯💯
Totally agree! It's a huge mind F to leave "the troof." Identity crisis, anger at having been a fool, waisted years, depression and anxiety. 100% worth it! I love Cedars because he notices what I've noticed my whole life. I was just glad that I wasn't the only one to see what I was seeing.
Since we're talking about apostates, john I'd like to say thanks for making videos I had left jws before I saw you but your videos helped me to get over that fear and guilt the organisation hard wires into your mind, just coming up on my fourth year since leaving :)
I just had my judicial meeting. I told them about the apostate definition. They said it doesn’t apply to any religion because it’s not the “true” religion. I started laughing. One funny part is that they tried to compare me to Cain for letting bad thoughts into my mine. So I said about the false prophets like Russel and Rutherford for saying bad dates but said that didn’t apply lol they are all delusional. Thanks Lloyd for the vids!
I know right... Had my judicial meeting because i drank half a bottle of vodka with a friend (ministry servent), and when i bring up the fact that rutherford was an acoholic, the said the same thing "it doesn't apply". And i was using the argument because i had hope they would prove me wrong or show me that i was being stupid... Instead they cemented my doubts and i woke up. 1 year and a half now.
@@Canalbiruta Sul piatto della giustizia dovevi mettere le bottigli di ENTONI MORRIS ,COMUNQUE TUTTE LE BOTTIGLIE NON CI STAVANO SULLA BILANCIA .DA L'ITALIA SALUTI E BUONA VITA A TUTTI SECONDO I VOSTRI DESIDERI.
If JW are not allowed to even listen even a little bit to apostates how can they keep giving talks telling people what apostates are saying? How would they know? Why the double standard for the common JW and the elite? Just like the convention video berating the family that moved into a fancy apartment when the JW had recently also built fancy new headquarters.
Also, how can they then also encourage (like you are 'encouraged' if a weapon is directed at you with the threat of using it occurring!) the congregations to then preach and encourage unbelievers and apostates? Don't the two of them look identical? How could you tell an apostate from an unbeliever?
Frank Mahavolich because the Governing Body is bullet proof. The regular JW can’t even trust themselves to open a letter, they are to throw it directly into the trash without reading it. When I got out I used the example to my family that I would not even go to a movie without consulting a movie review before I spent my money on one, why then would I not also do the same with a religion that I was raised in. I was now going to be raising my kids in this religion and really had not had a great experience with the organization so far so I felt I had a right to do a bit of research for the future of my children and quite frankly for myself and my marriage which was failing because of the stress put on us from the organization.
Lloyd the only problem. I have is that I wish you would give me, an ex Jehovah’s witness and currently a believer in Christ, a break from your atheist beliefs and stick to the important issues of helping JW’s break free and exposing the organization so that I can share your material as unbiased. I have found the that when people leave they either lose all faith and are atheists or they have a true love for God and go on to study the Bible and find the truth there. Either way in response to such a shock and trauma we have been thru is just where we are right now and hopefully we are both living happily and trying to heal from the past. My past was especially hard because like so many I went to the elders with my sexual abuse story and was not even heard. I so appreciate your material your provide and your sense of humor, I am a huge fan. My dad and I have a small apologetic ministry and are trying to decide what way we want to go here near by Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA. We get referrals thru the church from family members and or friends that get involved with the JW’s.
Thanks Lloyd and all other TOTT kinda people here, I am still trying hard to keep my family, my wife knows I'm fully against now, I even spoke with an elder about the child abuse thing and how it affected me (hoping he would know but he didn't). I explained I had some doubts about things to him also. My wife wanted to have our ministry group over for dinner after going d2d (i really hated to do it knowing the real truth, i felt like a hypocrite but I love my family more). I noticed by words being used at the dinner that they knew about my doubts (i am no paranoid person but very observative, the word doubt came along too many times and I received some lectures). I hated that moment I realize I am under the loop. I just hope this won't break my family apart. I am trying so hard to fade ... Lloyd, please keep doing this work, it is very important, for some it takes a long time being awake to gather the courage to finally exit.
Do not fear men,they've got nothing to give you ,just be courageous and fade, you do not owe them your explanation,just do it man you'll never regret it.It's the greatest decision i ever made and i feel so good that i finally did it.
One thing I would like to say about picketing Apostates..... I know that every single one of you is doing what you believe is the best way to reach people. I want to make 2 points: 1. Personally, I started waking up because of seeing a shocking act of activism. I think the shock of it made the event play over and over in my mind until suddenly... I realized what the "Apostates" were saying was true: The generation of 1914 is dead! It was a picketing Apostate involved in this congregation in northern UK.... He was the reason for this talk. 2. It was 2 years ago that I really started asking questions.... it was the John Cedars channel that was instrumental in helping me de-program from Watchtower indoctrination. I love your simple reasoning and especially at first starting to wake up..... I needed to prove that watchtower was indeed NOT the truth beyond any reasonable doubt. This channel as well as others gave me several different perspectives to come to that life changing conclusion. I hope that my experience illustrates the reality of different, even opposed ideologies about waking up JW's, being quite affective. And also about not judging anyone.... I believe without question that everyone working to expose the watchtower are doing it in what they believe is the most effective manner. I have so much respect for the work EVERYONE is doing. I can see in just the last couple of years that the Ex-JW community has taken the upper hand and watchtower is on the ropes. Entire families are waking up... Now it looks like entire congregations...
Thank you Lloyd from the bottom of my heart, for all of your hard work! You are a voice of sanity in all this crazy chaos of this evil cult! Its been destroying my family since 1974. Their shunning and dividing us resulted in 2 of my siblings suicides. My brother in 2011 and my sister in 2014. Today there are only 2 of us left out of a family of 6. Its just my jw mom and my apostate self. I left this nightmare at age 12, moved to my non jw fathers house. I started refusing to go to meetings or out in service and i was NOT going to get baptized like the whole congregation was already expecting me to. I am 55 yrs old today and my mom has pretty much shunned most of my life, until 9 yrs ago 2011. In 2011 after the 1st death, which was my brothers suicide she stopped her silence. She claims its ok now since i was never baptized. What changed? 😢 She is all i have left. She is a sprite healthy 78 yr old who they have brainwashed for the last 46 yrs. I am now 55. I can't reach her. Where do i even start? She will not let me talk about anything that could lead back to WTs bullshit. Ive become extremely worried she may cut me off again. Im worried she would do anything they tell her to. Im worried that as the real 'truth' keeps exposing WT and as the sexual abuse lawsuits keep piling up that those 8 GB con men will tell them to drink the koolaid or swallow a pill. As you know the GB has told them to obey whatever they are told, even if it goes against their human ability to understand. Things are closing in on those 8 bastards and they know it. I would be very appreciative of any advice any of you ex jws apostates can give me. 💔
hi. I recognise this elder’s voice and i know the congregation. i can confirm lots don’t attend, even elders’ family members. i myself are on the way out but can’t do it suddenly for fear of losing family. I’ve never been more convinced that the religion is on the way out. it’s so bad.
Lt i m 1 of the 20 who left my dad is still in the hall it is Bishopauckland and Doug Urquart who gave that vile talk about us it was a marking talk but was given without any of us being visited or spoken to so they didnt even follow their own procedure we all get shunned because of this talk 🙄
Debbie Bowles , ummm , did you read Lloyd’s post at the top of the comments ?? Unless I’m mistaken, He clearly stated that he wanted to keep the location details private, for the sake of individuals involved. 😱
Brilliant video Lloyd! Spot on analysis of the points raised. I was actually discussing a lot of these points with my dad yesterday over the phone - he agrees with our side of the argument and I actually believe he is waking up himself. I'll be sending him the link to this video after I post this comment. As a side point, I was actually labelled as gangrenous during my own apostasy trial 6 months ago.:) Please keep up the fantastic work which is helping so many!
Jersey St Helier Thanks so much- will definitely check that channel out. Re my dad, he's just finished reading CoC and, judging by our daily phone calls, is now 99% awake. Amazing what 2 weeks of research with an open mind can accomplish! If only my wife could now do the same.....
Lloyd your reasoning is sweet music to my ears. I was brought up in the JWs so had no choice but left when I was 14, my Mother and brother are still such believers and refuse to listen to any little fact I bring up. So have to leave it alone but I love your channel it has even opened my eyes even more than ever. Appreciate the great work and research.
I find it interesting that the speaker latches on to the celebration of Halloween. I've personally never met an ex-JW who left the organisation for the freedom to celebrate Halloween. Some may subsequently celebrate it as they gain freedom from the organisation, but it's hardly a pivotal argument. Such arguments make dissenters sound ridiculous and nit-picky, when in fact for many there are strong conscientious reasons for distancing themselves from the teachings of Watchtower. The very idea that concern about handling abuse allegations is churlish 'obsession' is a similar, though more serious, tactic.
I am not, nor ever have been, a JW. But, I am very thankful to have come across your channel over these last few months. Your videos have been highly enlightening about the true nature of the JW faith and have deepened my sympathy for those still trapped within it. I dearly hope that when I next encounter any of them that I can use this new knowledge to help them break free. Keep up the good work.
I always questioned wedding rings and got unsatisfying answers like, 'well they help protect people from being hit on...' Not in my experience they don't
In 1988 in Siracusa - Sicily/Italy, the entire body of elders and its 70 members of a congregation voluntarily abandoned the Organization in 'mass disassociation', All without youtube.
Gabriel Tarditi I went to an Italian congregation in northern NJ USA and they are so brainwashed. The elders do nothing but lie and slander and no one says anything! They are such cowards! Do you remember why the elders and the members in Sicily left the congregation?
7 лет назад
Gabriel Tarditi do you have proof of this or bearing false witness? Exactly. You’re a bad person.
Flagellodeglidei2 - is the name of the channel-testimoni di Geova disassociazione in massa a Siracusa- is the name of the title. On youtube. Here it explains why they did it. The video is in Italian though
I remember being publicly reproved in 1987. I was trying to attempt a come back, but on a Sunday morning I was attending the public talk and Watchtower study. When the meeting ended I went to leave, but noticed I had a flat tire. As others were leaving the meeting, I was dressed in a suit and tie changing a flat tire. All the witnesses leaving glanced over and saw me struggling to change a tire, however, not a single witness offered to help. I was standing in a completely empty parking lot thinking to myself, “How the f’k did I make friends like this?” I changed the tire and never came back. Agapè love at its finest!
Wow. Hearing this kinda crap makes me so angry. I can see this talk being duplicated at a convention next summer. They are sneaky these guys. Pretty much just telling witnesses not to give ear to these arguments and labelling then rubbish before the individual even gets a chance to really hear them. This really devastates me when I hear these kind of talks. I think of my poor mom.. sometimes she says something that gives me hope that she's waking up as she's "discouraged" and doesn't attend all the meetings. But then she goes to a meeting and comes back saying crap like this and I feel like I've just been shot.. and my hopes of her waking up are again shattered. It's this kind of sick propaganda.. it's just so maddening and depressing at the same time :(
Hi, I really feel you, my parents are the same. it makes me so angry to see the bullshit they blindly believe! If you wanna talk about this I'd be happy to, we all need to support each other :)
Now their preaching is to tell people to go to their web site. Starting in Jan of 2018 their door to door work will be to warn people we are half way through the tribulation and Armageddon in imminent. to be saved they have to join the JW organization. LOL This time they didn't set an exact date like they have always done in the past.
Meg, my mom is the same. She'll call me after not hearing from me in weeks and then flip the switch later stating she's not suppose to be talking to me. After so many years of this I now hit her back with I don't call you, you call me. She never has an answer.
Brilliant video, reminds me how elders seem to be picked for their boring voices, or maybe it's just the subject matter. I snored through many a conventional! BTW, can you please call your next book "Seven blokes in New York".
Yes, your right, after 60 yrs in this cult and woke up 5yrs ago cant convince my brother to get out even though he knows there are so many things that dont jive anymore but yes they are afraid and he doesn't what to admit that he waisted his whole life on this conplete con game , its terrible mind control and fear , and he has a mental block so strong he refuses to see it ,also doesn't want to luse all his relatives. Also there flip flopping and cognitive dissonance they put on peoples minds is what keeps them so mind controlled , they really do see black is white and white is black, by the way his 45 year old son who he tryed to bully all this crap in his mind for 45 yrs and never suceeded, finally killed himself last year on april the first ,sending a message to my brother that he always felt like a joke and a fool in my brothers eyes , it was very sad , he just could never get my brother to see his side ,and I hold the org, responsible because my brother and his wife and rest of the family are really fanatics and refused to see his way of choosing to live .I on the other hand was more balanced as to what my children decided to choose as to how they wanted to live there life and wasn't as fanatical, so the cult can and has had a divastating affect on many families and they act like its no big deal when it comes to abusing the kids emotionally, its very sad , glad I woke up , hope my daughter and son in law does soon .
I’ve been out of the religion for 7 years now but finding your channel has been incredibly therapeutic and has given closure on the guilt and mental state you leave a cult with, especially if you were indoctrinated as a child. I had no idea the true history of the organisation, it’s hard not to feel totally lied to and betrayed by the adults who I grew up around but I am thankful I never got baptised. I’ve been binge watching for a week now and the more I see the better I feel.
Just this week, Three major newspaper in England had major stories about Pedophilia in the Organization! The Story is on youtube for those who want to learn about it.
Aha! I’m delighted that so many JW are leaving from my area of the world! I’ve personally spoken with local JW families so everyone’s efforts are paying off 😁
Nice work!...20 x 20 x 20 gonna be big numbers very soon! No one will be left...You know when you tell someone not to do something...thats exactly what they wont do!..They will want to check this out!...This talk may backfire on them... You are doing some great work!
Thanks John for another remarkable coverage and exposure and reminding us, we are adults , we can reach our own conclusions... keep up the good work, shining light on good works and truths..
How many times do believers need to witness a false prediction before they realize that this is all a bunch of bullsh!t? Astonishing...excellent rebuttal Lloyd...i continue to be fascinated by this topic of cult indoctrination and the efforts of former members to try and help those still brainwashed to 'wake up'...you are literally saving lives and i applaud your efforts!
I loved this video, everything is exposed. People need to think for themselves and open their eyes before they sacrifice their entire lives for nothing.
Keen observations as usual. I'm waiting for the GB to have the predictions vs prophecy's talk regarding Deuteronomy 18:20-22. Followed by a stern warning talk entitled "Semantics Mean Everlasting Life." LOL!
Of course the apostates give a new hope for the future...mine is that Watchtower will go bankrupt and fall and millions including me will get their families back before they die !
Regarding the piercing: an earring is good, but not a piercing in the nose? I'm still searching on the Bible for the verse explaining why one is bad and not the other.
I'm quite insulted being called malicious and disaffected. When I disassociated myself I was very careful not to unduly influence my former friends and family. Before I disassociated I even called some of my former friends to explain my reasons and to offer my continued friendship. Although I check in from time to time with them it hurts that they never contact me in return. I feel so sorry and sad for them to be stuck in this manipulative and unloving cult.
Tattooed and proud of it.!!!would never set foot in a kingdom hall!!!!!!this is a shame based religion. this is why people are leaving by the droves!!!!Who wants to be a witness and ruin your life?oh,me. Me me!!!!!
Beards were cool when Russel was around, and not so much after he died, primarily due to the opinions of the one and only Joseph Rutherford. Rutherford believed that Brothers who wore beards, and especially in the style of Russel's beard, ie the old-school minus the mustache look, were performing a form of "Cult of Personality" worship towards Russel. And that belief got his egotistical panties in a bunch so to speak. This and genuine ultra-conservative contempt for "hippie style" facial hair in the 60s and 70s has made beard wearing JW males, especially in the United States, a real rarity.
Yes, Indeed. Don't forget that not only was he obsessed with Biblical chronology and numerology leading to the whole 1975 Jubilee of Mankind/Adams 6000 year birthday/Armageddon fiasco, he also was the undisputed King of the Types and Antitypes. In other words, he was really good at looking at any simple historical narrative in the Bible and automatically assuming that it had deeper meaning which foreshadowed events in modern times. Its really quite sad that Watchtower no longer has Pseudo-Theologians like him, or "Bigger than life" personalities like Rutherford, or Russel around anymore. But then again, there still is, and probably always will be, an abundance of delusional men in authority in the organization who love to get their panties in a bunch over ridiculous things. I once knew of a District Overseer, who for whatever reason, objected to having kingdom songs played at a lower volume in the background at KH halls prior to and after the meetings. (this is now encouraged in the organizations literature) I also knew a CO who stated in so many words to all of the Elders and M.S.s at a meeting that they had no business serving in positions of responsibility if they were not reading every issue of the WT & Awake magazine cover-to-cover. And this was back in the day when there was 2 issues of each printed every month! Now Tony Morris says at the Annual Meeting that if you can't keep up with all of the literature, you are not a horrible person. Whew! What a relief!
howdo- just found you- reccomended by a friend. Im an ex JW out 25 yearsish- rational, secular, atheist etc. Ive been looking at JWs again recently after looking at more the big picture for a long time, and forgetting/recovering from/ them. It's very shocking to see what is going on now. I feel so sorry for all of the people that they have deluded..
When I left in 2007 I completely refused to think about the religion (at first I was still scared that it might be the truth but I couldn't live the life anymore). I raised my kids and went to Uni (which my jw mother is actually really proud of, strangely). I still didn't question anything about the way I was raised although I now didn't believe the teachings. It wasn't until I stumbled across a RUclips video about a year ago that I realised that I had unresolved trauma from my experiences in the organisation and after I left. Watching the videos have been cathartic for me and have helped heal me from hurt and confusion that I didn't realise I was still carrying
Nice. Keep the GB on the run. They’re reacting more and more. It’s funny, the early con artists like Russell and Rutherford had a certain charisma. I just don’t see that ability in their current leaders to do something brilliant to stem the tide against them. Tony seems the most bullish, but he’s more boorish than anything.
Oh if only they would listen to you. Your kind, caring, respectful approach, John, could very well be salve, "ointment" smeared on gaping open, raw wounds Watchtower scorches its members with under the bloody ax stabbing cruel, anti-Christ policies.
Well, the good news is even if they don't get a famous exJW to represent them like Leah is doing for Scientology, it's ok bc Leah is taking on the JWs in the mess ff season of Scientology and the Aftermath 😀 so no matter what, they will get their Leah Remini😂😀
As a child, seeing apostates planted my first seeds of doubt. Hall invasions like 11/5 were peaceful albeit scary to the jw, but can be effective in planting many seeds at once. This type of activism helps people waking up to find channels like yours. I respect your opinion on hall invasions, but believe multiple types of activism are necessary to bring people out of the borg. True, some jw's will become more resolute...but the younger ones are more likely to go online and find TTATT. The WatchTumble is crumbling under the weight of all activism.
Thank u so much for opening the eyes of people all over the world. I'm from Canada, Quebec precisely and had study bible with jw for years but never got baptised. Over these years i observed them and notice so many weird behaviors and non sense resonning thing that i could'nt decide myself to get baptised. 6 month ago i saw your video about child abuse and decide to desociate myself with them.
I recently found out something very disturbing. From a family member that today is a elder. When he was younger he would have young boys do inappropriate things to him even family members. Some of these kids lived as adults have been clearly affected by this. How can a religion let things like that happen and not do anything about it. Who can tell he if still doing this.
46:10 Did I hear him correctly ? “an obsession with child safeguarding issues” ? “the disfellowshipping policy” “financial topics” .....The internal machinery is warning members not to listen to concerns about the unscriptural practices of the organization.
The part in the talk about apostates and "satan's" media attacking "god's" people, and the cop-out - "what else can we expect", are so maddening. The catholic church could use the same excuse then when their were rightly maligned during the scandals when it emerged about their bad handling of abuse; however, the witnesses at the time enjoyed reeling about it as it was a talking point at the preaching door.
Jan. 14, 2018, Sunday, 4:39 pm, San Diego, California: Kudos to you, John ! Just found your youtube channel and LOVE it. You are doing such a good job in all of your videos. I was baptized Mormon in 1984 back in New York. Haven't been active in over 6 yrs, and have no plans on attending ever again. I hear sooooo many familiar behaviors in JW church that match the LDS (Latter Day Saint) church. Cults are cults are cults. They all operate the same way. Blind following, don't question, blah blah blah. The rule of JW church of "must have 2 witnesses to child sexual abuse, rape of an adult" is insane. No pedophile is going to sexually violate a child in front of other "normal" people. Unbelievable. The JW and LDS churches both claim membership climbing, when the TRUTH is the opposite. I said, outloud, during this video when you mentioned 20 JWs left the northern branch. Yeaaaaaa ! Applause Applause Applause !!! And, yes, try to interview any of those 20 who left....when it's "safe" for them to do so. I would love to hear what they were put through.
Lloyd is the man, he is so good at destroying Watchtowers arguments...WITH THEIR OWN PUBLICATIONS! The blood transfusion ban, the 2 witness rule-dealing with criminal acts,& many other things aren't supported by the Bible. But they can at least twist, add to,& take away verses, to justify their nonsense. Even though it's clearly taken out of context, in a completely transparent,& ludicrous way-if you kow the Bible at all. But when you use their own words,& publications against them, they really have no comeback. This is why they try their best to keep JWs from seeing old issues. And great response to people who say you, as an atheist are taking away people's hope. As you said, you don't just give people hope in something you don't believe, just to make them feel good. That's what got them in trouble in the 1st place. I know some are 2ns, or 3rd generation. But the truth about the truth is what's important. And we kow TTATT is that it's dishonest. I've never heard Lloyd say he knows theres no God,& he has all the answers. He says he sees no evidence of a God,& therefore doesn't believe. And he's right-there is no proof. On the flip side, nobody can disprove God,& I don't think he disputes that. What's important is you know the rock solid proof that this cult is untrue. What belief you do, or don't have in God, is up to the individual. I get a lot out of these videos,& respect Lloyds atheist beliefs. But it doesn't affect my own belief in God. I believe because of things I've experienced, but I can't prove it,& don't expect anybody to just believe me. I am a non denominational Christian, who believes in God,& Jesus-but not so much in manmade religion. I have my beliefs, but don't know that if I'm right, or not. Maybe I'm right, o maybe Lloyd is right. Or maybe we are both wrong,& some other religion is right. But what I can say is fact, is the Jehovah Witnesses are a false religion,& destructive cult. Their tactics, deceit, hypocrisy,& constantly changing,& covering up old beliefs, is the proof. And whether you think the Bible,& Jesus were right or wrong, is for you to decide. But it's an absolute provable fact that JW doctrine isn't supported by Jesus, or the Bible. And is often contradicted by both. Despite their claims, they worship those Pharisees in NY,& the corrupt organization, they dominate. Definitely not Jesus, or Jehovah. Great job always Lloyd. Doesn't matter that you are atheist, I believe you are doing God's work, helping these poor cult members.
It's always more tolerable with your rebuttals, and funny cause I just posted some news articles on FB about the cult. They have no power over me or what I do and post! So keep up the great work that you do, I too feel spiritual not religious.
Very interesting talk Lloyd. Your right, if it’s the truth it should stand on its own two feet, and handle any scrutiny. It’s incredible the amount of control Watchtower employs. Thanks again
What i find so amazing is that people are protected against anyone from putting or mentioning a name yet elders can do what ever they please there is no proper appeals process within the organization so that anyone that feels they've been wrongly treated by the elders can not really do much at all and as we know you can't or not supposed to take any legal action as they say do not take your brother to court so total and utter domination by the Watchtower and their henchmen.
A calculated decision to discontinue the YEAR BOOK so that the numbers of new members, Kingdom Halls being built or closing, decreases of membership and those taking the emblems cannot be monitored. Not only is this so that accurate records are not available but essentially it is for financial reasons. Reducing the magazine sizes, how often they are printed and discontinue the year book will make drastic savings.
"building our faith takes years" that us better said "indoctrination takes years...which is why we demand that you sacrifice absolutely ALL of your time to listen to ONLY the WT". Yes, unfortunately, it can take a lifetime
Wonderful video. Ironic isn't it that it's the apostate that's willing to scrutinize information yet the owners of "truth" sprint desperately away from it as this ridiculous talk evidently shows
The key to th the organizations control is creating their own definitions for words we see this in the case of the words: apostate, love, respect, faith and so on. they also create hard-hitting phrases to label various people for example calling someone who is no longer agreeing with their position a "spiritual casualty" or referring to ones in a position of authority as "gifts in Men" and of course the good old fashioned "mentally diseased".
Lloyd, at 21:03 you grinned, but didn't mention the orator's slip of the tongue; There is a paralyzed world-wide work going on (amending paralyzed it to unparalleled). Apparently, the speaker is a bad liar.
JOHN CEDARS, if we the apostates destroy the hope, also we will destroy their $$$money$$$and if no money, no funny. Jijiji I was laughing to death when I heard that recording. This is the deal for the Government Body, if there is not intangible hope or a dream to sell, what money are they going to make?. The entire Jehovah's Witnesses around the world are the money making for the Society, and if they stop dreaming and hoping, that will be the end of the Watch Tower Bible and Track Society.
@33:13, "are they having piercings where they shouldn't have piercings?"...Lloyd ! what verse in the Bible describes where piercings should / shouldn't be...? ;-)
With the bit at 1:05:50 to 1:06:50 I just have to say that doesn't seem "spiritual" to me? I don't know, I mean I know I have all the spirituality of your average house brick but that (very laudable) sentiment seems opposite to the notions of spirituality I've gathered from what I've heard and been given as much as they've made any sense. Spirituality always seemed very self-centered, glorifying ignorance of the world while also holding up fabrications of it as some kind of "ultimate truth". It never seemed to be about anything more than the person and their connection to whatever. Their eternity. Their sanctity. Their perfection. It always seemed to end up being all about the individual and the world can burn for all they cared. I know not everyone is like this, and you can reach such attitudes without appeals to spirituality, but honestly that's all spirituality has ever looked like to me and idea of wanting the best future for, well, the people of the future and wanting them to expand out into the universe and expand their knowledge of that universe seems like a polar opposite of spirituality.
People that don't receive transfusions during surgery, have better outcomes. Is like saying: Fighter pilots that don't deploy their parachutes during flight have higher rates of getting back on the ground alive.
To your point about former JW’s being “Timid” about the label apostate, it is true, but for a different reason than stated. I believe that for many who leave the organization but remain Christian believers, the main issue is the way in which the Watchtower leadership has appropriated the Biblical sense of apostatizing, (one who rejects God and Christ) and applied it to any who reject the teachings of a man-made organization as if they are one and the same thing. They are not. I know this is a distinction emphasized by Ray Franz, Jim Penton, Ron Frye, Peter Gregerson, Ed Dunlap and many others who left the organization but remained in the Christian faith.
I agree about holidays with pegan origins but birthdays are no diférent that marriage anniversaries, they are BOTH celebrations of life or an anniversary of life! One is a birth and the other is a birth starting a new life smh it took me my whole life to realize this..
Not too long ago I saw a clip in your videos of one of the members of the governing body saying it’s too bad they can’t execute members of the family or congregation who become apostates…would anyone be so kind as to let me know which of Lloyd’s videos have this clip? My best friend growing up, both of us born in and both of us having left, is thinking of going back to the organization and I’m trying with all my might to prevent this from happening.
In the Catholic Church "excommunication" means that a person is no longer in communion with Christ and hence ought not receive the Holy Eucharist - which is called Holy Communion - but Catholics do not shun former members. It's possible that a notorious person engaged in child abuse of other heinous crimes may be shunned by some or even many but it is not a policy of the Church to shun family and friends because they have deviated on some matter of doctrine or engaged in conduct that some consider worldly.
![Stromae, Pomme - “Ma Meilleure Ennemie” (from Arcane Season 2) [Official Visualizer]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1F3OGIFnW1k/mqdefault.jpg)
Just a few notes on this! You will notice that at around the 58-minute mark the video skips (where the speaker targets elders for his warning about social media). This is because the speaker gives the name of the congregation, and I forgot to bleep this out during editing, so I've snipped it out using the RUclips editor. I am hopeful that one day I can interview one or several of the "20" to hear more of their story, but I understand the situation is quite delicate at the moment. Obviously, you don't get 20 people leaving a congregation all at once without it causing friction. In any case, I'm delighted that so many have found freedom and it is an encouraging sign that online activism really is having a tangible effect on Witness numbers - and Watchtower knows it. Hope you guys enjoy the video! :)
Thank you for your work Lloyd!!!
If you get an interview with one of the the twenty...wow!!
John Cedars your videos are always eye opening! Great information.
John Cedars I always love your videos and find them so helpful in addressing family who are still believers. I’m looking at doing a video series around women who have left the organisation and their struggles leaving such a misogynistic environment. Do you have anyone you know who might be interested in being part of the project? I have plenty of men volunteer but women seem so much more timid about sharing their experience, and I think it might be helpful to other women questioning the ‘truth’
Same old arguments from the WT...the more you tell people don’t look, the more curious the become. They have a lot to hide!
Hello Lloyd!
I was born a JW and I went on being a pioneer and all... Then, about 5 years ago, my boss in the secular job started reasoning with me about my beliefs and about some realities I wasn't aware of... At the beginning I was hurt and angry with him. But my mind has always been too inquisitive for the cult, and I felt very bad about my thoughts and questions, but I couldn't let it go! So I started to investigate a bit more, I read "Crisis of consciousness" (the TRUE eye-opener) and yours was the first channel I ever subscribed as an "apostate"!
Needless to say I never went back! So thank you for the way you put things, and the kind way you speak. If you had been an angry person or a vindictive one, I would have never go on listening to you!
So, congratulations on your work with people like me, that woke up too late but yet soon enough to start living!
Lloyd, I really like your style. I have no idea what you do for a living, but you’d make an excellent college professor or teacher in some fashion. Your ability to reason with people, in this case Jehovah’s Witnesses, is outstanding. I imagine many of those leaving this cult may have gotten their strength from you to flee. You’re so right about that we, as apostates, are not responsible to give those who leave a new hope. Witnesses are believing a lie and really need to move on to reality. I’m in the U.S. (Arizona), so if you’re ever in this part of the world it would be a pleasure to meet you!
“Obsession with child safeguarding issues” comment left me floored!! Another great video!!
GuillermoVilla Yes they obviously don’t give a shit about children in that religion
I know its not like a big deal! or anything
I know crazy
RIGHT? Cuz how dare we be concerned over the safety of our children. What a terrible message to send. DX
These people would have been stoned to death or had a sword pearced through him for committing such a defiling act. Or adultery.
In Exodus an isrealite was pierced through in the process of committing a sinful act with a woman from another tribe in his tent. No questions asked Joshua (l think) pierced them both through in front of all the Isrealites. They all knew God's commandment to them on this subject or other atrocious sexual acts.....
Awesome !!! As a ex elder and bethelite love your reasoning and respectable way of exposing both sides of this fear inspiring pep talk to the blind class! The curtain is being pulled back and there responding .thanks for your dedication to us all!
We need to get together for that interview ,let me know.Thx
Just hearing the word "apostates" scared me to death!!..This is the reason why a lot of JWs have a hard time coming out of the org!
I started out learning about Mormonism and noticed the similarities of the JWs...Then I branched out and started looking into Seventh Day Adventist, Scientology, Christadelphians, The Brethren, Christian Science.. I started noticing the parallels between all the religions, and it runs deep...no questioning, no doubting and everything comes from the top down.. The rank-and-file are just the followers with no personal self, no individuality and after you wake up and start seeing these things it can take a toll on you, especially if this is the only thing you have known all your life..it is really tough and then the phobias and the different fears, it can mess with a person's mind..and now I see why a lot of people resort to suicide, it is scary but the good thing is there's help!! The internet has played a big part in all of this!!.. Now I look at people as being just human beings trying to do their best..trying to deal with all the stresses and anxieties in this world!
John your channel was a lifesaver in my early waking up process!!.. I cannot thank you enough!..Keep up the awesome work!! 💯❤
It's exactly how I woke up, seeing the parallels. I trust this method and have heard a great number of similar experiences. I trust this method.
I also woke up when I made a Mormon friend and began researching the LDS church, history, and then listening to ex-mormon stories of their waking from cult indoctrination. When I realized that anyone born into a religion can believe any crazy doctrine and believe it the One Truth. I began to see JW was just another religion. From there I gained the courage to investigate the history and reality of WTS. John Cedars' videos were a hug part of my waking up from the Doomsday cult.
jenna reed - yeah, its amazing!.. I wasn't questioning the Org at the time.. I just wanted to learn something different.. so I became curious about the Mormons and noticed the similarities...It gave me the courage to look inside the JWs and then I came across the UN and down the rabbit hole I went!!..
It's good to be free!
Enjoy your freedom!!
Abigail Parker - awesome!.. I was raised in the Org from 7 years old (40+ years)...I didn't know anything else!..
(Father an Elder and mother a pioneer)... so you know it has been challenging!
But, freedom is so sweet!!! 💯💯
Totally agree! It's a huge mind F to leave "the troof." Identity crisis, anger at having been a fool, waisted years, depression and anxiety. 100% worth it! I love Cedars because he notices what I've noticed my whole life. I was just glad that I wasn't the only one to see what I was seeing.
Since we're talking about apostates, john I'd like to say thanks for making videos I had left jws before I saw you but your videos helped me to get over that fear and guilt the organisation hard wires into your mind, just coming up on my fourth
year since leaving :)
Fantastic! So glad my videos have helped get rid of the fear. :)
So true! Discovered him as well after leaving and it has made things so much easier for me. Logic and truth, so much more comforting than “the” truth.
I just had my judicial meeting. I told them about the apostate definition. They said it doesn’t apply to any religion because it’s not the “true” religion. I started laughing. One funny part is that they tried to compare me to Cain for letting bad thoughts into my mine. So I said about the false prophets like Russel and Rutherford for saying bad dates but said that didn’t apply lol they are all delusional. Thanks Lloyd for the vids!
I know right... Had my judicial meeting because i drank half a bottle of vodka with a friend (ministry servent), and when i bring up the fact that rutherford was an acoholic, the said the same thing "it doesn't apply". And i was using the argument because i had hope they would prove me wrong or show me that i was being stupid... Instead they cemented my doubts and i woke up. 1 year and a half now.
Si sirifanno alla Bibbia e poi adottano la propria giustizia ,la giustizia del momento secondo i propri pensieri .
@@Canalbiruta Sul piatto della giustizia dovevi mettere le bottigli di ENTONI MORRIS ,COMUNQUE TUTTE LE BOTTIGLIE NON CI STAVANO SULLA BILANCIA .DA L'ITALIA SALUTI E BUONA VITA A TUTTI SECONDO I VOSTRI DESIDERI.
they are not a religion you cant apostate from a non profit corporation
The cult is bleeding.
Bad!!!💯💯💯
Let it bleed so people may become free.
If only they'd take a transfusion.
After listening to this video, I am tempted to embrace "Gangrene" as my existential nickname on the internet.
If JW are not allowed to even listen even a little bit to apostates how can they keep giving talks telling people what apostates are saying? How would they know? Why the double standard for the common JW and the elite? Just like the convention video berating the family that moved into a fancy apartment when the JW had recently also built fancy new headquarters.
Also, how can they then also encourage (like you are 'encouraged' if a weapon is directed at you with the threat of using it occurring!) the congregations to then preach and encourage unbelievers and apostates? Don't the two of them look identical? How could you tell an apostate from an unbeliever?
Frank Mahavolich
Frank Mahavolich because the Governing Body is bullet proof. The regular JW can’t even trust themselves to open a letter, they are to throw it directly into the trash without reading it. When I got out I used the example to my family that I would not even go to a movie without consulting a movie review before I spent my money on one, why then would I not also do the same with a religion that I was raised in. I was now going to be raising my kids in this religion and really had not had a great experience with the organization so far so I felt I had a right to do a bit of research for the future of my children and quite frankly for myself and my marriage which was failing because of the stress put on us from the organization.
Lloyd the only problem. I have is that I wish you would give me, an ex Jehovah’s witness and currently a believer in Christ, a break from your atheist beliefs and stick to the important issues of helping JW’s break free and exposing the organization so that I can share your material as unbiased. I have found the that when people leave they either lose all faith and are atheists or they have a true love for God and go on to study the Bible and find the truth there. Either way in response to such a shock and trauma we have been thru is just where we are right now and hopefully we are both living happily and trying to heal from the past. My past was especially hard because like so many I went to the elders with my sexual abuse story and was not even heard.
I so appreciate your material your provide and your sense of humor, I am a huge fan. My dad and I have a small apologetic ministry and are trying to decide what way we want to go here near by Green Bay, Wisconsin, USA. We get referrals thru the church from family members and or friends that get involved with the JW’s.
exactly franck,well said
This is amazing. 20 people leaving I one Kingdom Hall.
Thanks Lloyd and all other TOTT kinda people here, I am still trying hard to keep my family, my wife knows I'm fully against now, I even spoke with an elder about the child abuse thing and how it affected me (hoping he would know but he didn't). I explained I had some doubts about things to him also. My wife wanted to have our ministry group over for dinner after going d2d (i really hated to do it knowing the real truth, i felt like a hypocrite but I love my family more). I noticed by words being used at the dinner that they knew about my doubts (i am no paranoid person but very observative, the word doubt came along too many times and I received some lectures). I hated that moment I realize I am under the loop. I just hope this won't break my family apart. I am trying so hard to fade ... Lloyd, please keep doing this work, it is very important, for some it takes a long time being awake to gather the courage to finally exit.
Do not fear men,they've got nothing to give you ,just be courageous and fade, you do not owe them your explanation,just do it man you'll never regret it.It's the greatest decision i ever made and i feel so good that i finally did it.
One thing I would like to say about picketing Apostates..... I know that every single one of you is doing what you believe is the best way to reach people. I want to make 2 points: 1. Personally, I started waking up because of seeing a shocking act of activism. I think the shock of it made the event play over and over in my mind until suddenly... I realized what the "Apostates" were saying was true: The generation of 1914 is dead! It was a picketing Apostate involved in this congregation in northern UK.... He was the reason for this talk. 2. It was 2 years ago that I really started asking questions.... it was the John Cedars channel that was instrumental in helping me de-program from Watchtower indoctrination. I love your simple reasoning and especially at first starting to wake up..... I needed to prove that watchtower was indeed NOT the truth beyond any reasonable doubt. This channel as well as others gave me several different perspectives to come to that life changing conclusion. I hope that my experience illustrates the reality of different, even opposed ideologies about waking up JW's, being quite affective. And also about not judging anyone.... I believe without question that everyone working to expose the watchtower are doing it in what they believe is the most effective manner. I have so much respect for the work EVERYONE is doing. I can see in just the last couple of years that the Ex-JW community has taken the upper hand and watchtower is on the ropes. Entire families are waking up... Now it looks like entire congregations...
Thank you Lloyd from the bottom of my heart, for all of your hard work! You are a voice of sanity in all this crazy chaos of this evil cult! Its been destroying my family since 1974. Their shunning and dividing us resulted in 2 of my siblings suicides. My brother in 2011 and my sister in 2014.
Today there are only 2 of us left out of a family of 6. Its just my jw mom and my apostate self. I left this nightmare at age 12, moved to my non jw fathers house. I started refusing to go to meetings or out in service and i was NOT going to get baptized like the whole congregation was already expecting me to.
I am 55 yrs old today and my mom has pretty much shunned most of my life, until 9 yrs ago 2011.
In 2011 after the 1st death, which was my brothers suicide she stopped her silence. She claims its ok now since i was never baptized. What changed? 😢
She is all i have left. She is a sprite healthy 78 yr old who they have brainwashed for the last 46 yrs.
I am now 55. I can't reach her.
Where do i even start?
She will not let me talk about anything that could lead back to WTs bullshit.
Ive become extremely worried she may cut me off again. Im worried she would do anything they tell her to. Im worried that as the real 'truth' keeps exposing WT and as the sexual abuse lawsuits keep piling up that those 8 GB con men will tell them to drink the koolaid or swallow a pill. As you know the GB has told them to obey whatever they are told, even if it goes against their human ability to understand.
Things are closing in on those 8 bastards and they know it.
I would be very appreciative of any advice any of you ex jws apostates can give me. 💔
hi. I recognise this elder’s voice and i know the congregation. i can confirm lots don’t attend, even elders’ family members. i myself are on the way out but can’t do it suddenly for fear of losing family. I’ve never been more convinced that the religion is on the way out. it’s so bad.
L T the Holy Spirit has left them please Catlito Vida if you want
L T hope you've made it out now x
Lt i m 1 of the 20 who left my dad is still in the hall it is Bishopauckland and Doug Urquart who gave that vile talk about us it was a marking talk but was given without any of us being visited or spoken to so they didnt even follow their own procedure we all get shunned because of this talk 🙄
Debbie Bowles , ummm , did you read Lloyd’s post at the top of the comments ?? Unless I’m mistaken, He clearly stated that he wanted to keep the location details private, for the sake of individuals involved. 😱
Brilliant video Lloyd! Spot on analysis of the points raised. I was actually discussing a lot of these points with my dad yesterday over the phone - he agrees with our side of the argument and I actually believe he is waking up himself. I'll be sending him the link to this video after I post this comment. As a side point, I was actually labelled as gangrenous during my own apostasy trial 6 months ago.:)
Please keep up the fantastic work which is helping so many!
John Gum great news about your Father hope he makes it please watch Carlito Vida if you want too
Jersey St Helier
Thanks so much- will definitely check that channel out. Re my dad, he's just finished reading CoC and, judging by our daily phone calls, is now 99% awake. Amazing what 2 weeks of research with an open mind can accomplish! If only my wife could now do the same.....
Lloyd your reasoning is sweet music to my ears. I was brought up in the JWs so had no choice but left when I was 14, my Mother and brother are still such believers and refuse to listen to any little fact I bring up. So have to leave it alone but I love your channel it has even opened my eyes even more than ever.
Appreciate the great work and research.
I find it interesting that the speaker latches on to the celebration of Halloween. I've personally never met an ex-JW who left the organisation for the freedom to celebrate Halloween. Some may subsequently celebrate it as they gain freedom from the organisation, but it's hardly a pivotal argument. Such arguments make dissenters sound ridiculous and nit-picky, when in fact for many there are strong conscientious reasons for distancing themselves from the teachings of Watchtower. The very idea that concern about handling abuse allegations is churlish 'obsession' is a similar, though more serious, tactic.
Yes, of all the arguments that weren't really arguments at all, that was among the lamest. :)
I am not, nor ever have been, a JW. But, I am very thankful to have come across your channel over these last few months. Your videos have been highly enlightening about the true nature of the JW faith and have deepened my sympathy for those still trapped within it.
I dearly hope that when I next encounter any of them that I can use this new knowledge to help them break free.
Keep up the good work.
2 new videos in two days!!! Let me refill my coffee!
I always questioned wedding rings and got unsatisfying answers like, 'well they help protect people from being hit on...' Not in my experience they don't
In 1988 in Siracusa - Sicily/Italy, the entire body of elders and its 70 members of a congregation voluntarily abandoned the Organization in 'mass disassociation', All without youtube.
Gabriel Tarditi I went to an Italian congregation in northern NJ USA and they are so brainwashed. The elders do nothing but lie and slander and no one says anything! They are such cowards! Do you remember why the elders and the members in Sicily left the congregation?
Gabriel Tarditi do you have proof of this or bearing false witness? Exactly. You’re a bad person.
Flagellodeglidei2 - is the name of the channel-testimoni di Geova disassociazione in massa a Siracusa- is the name of the title. On youtube. Here it explains why they did it. The video is in Italian though
judgmental much?
I remember being publicly reproved in 1987. I was trying to attempt a come back, but on a Sunday morning I was attending the public talk and Watchtower study. When the meeting ended I went to leave, but noticed I had a flat tire. As others were leaving the meeting, I was dressed in a suit and tie changing a flat tire. All the witnesses leaving glanced over and saw me struggling to change a tire, however, not a single witness offered to help. I was standing in a completely empty parking lot thinking to myself, “How the f’k did I make friends like this?” I changed the tire and never came back. Agapè love at its finest!
Your dog is even appalled by this talk!
Lost In Wonderland lol even animals know bless them
Jersey St Helier Haha, so true!
Wow. Hearing this kinda crap makes me so angry. I can see this talk being duplicated at a convention next summer. They are sneaky these guys. Pretty much just telling witnesses not to give ear to these arguments and labelling then rubbish before the individual even gets a chance to really hear them. This really devastates me when I hear these kind of talks. I think of my poor mom.. sometimes she says something that gives me hope that she's waking up as she's "discouraged" and doesn't attend all the meetings. But then she goes to a meeting and comes back saying crap like this and I feel like I've just been shot.. and my hopes of her waking up are again shattered. It's this kind of sick propaganda.. it's just so maddening and depressing at the same time :(
Hi, I really feel you, my parents are the same. it makes me so angry to see the bullshit they blindly believe! If you wanna talk about this I'd be happy to, we all need to support each other :)
Now their preaching is to tell people to go to their web site. Starting in Jan of 2018 their door to door work will be to warn people we are half way through the tribulation and Armageddon in imminent. to be saved they have to join the JW organization. LOL This time they didn't set an exact date like they have always done in the past.
Meg, I agree 100%. The same with my mother. She would say the same thing...she's "discouraged" but then go back.
Meg, my mom is the same. She'll call me after not hearing from me in weeks and then flip the switch later stating she's not suppose to be talking to me. After so many years of this I now hit her back with I don't call you, you call me. She never has an answer.
Wow, 20 left at one time! That's a great number; May it continue throughout as time pass!!!!
Brilliant video, reminds me how elders seem to be picked for their boring voices, or maybe it's just the subject matter. I snored through many a conventional! BTW, can you please call your next book "Seven blokes in New York".
Great Video John😀 your right that so many people are leaving. In still in but only to keep an eye on what’s going on inside. Keep up the good work.
Yes, your right, after 60 yrs in this cult and woke up 5yrs ago cant convince my brother to get out even though he knows there are so many things that dont jive anymore but yes they are afraid and he doesn't what to admit that he waisted his whole life on this conplete con game , its terrible mind control and fear , and he has a mental block so strong he refuses to see it ,also doesn't want to luse all his relatives. Also there flip flopping and cognitive dissonance they put on peoples minds is what keeps them so mind controlled , they really do see black is white and white is black, by the way his 45 year old son who he tryed to bully all this crap in his mind for 45 yrs and never suceeded, finally killed himself last year on april the first ,sending a message to my brother that he always felt like a joke and a fool in my brothers eyes , it was very sad , he just could never get my brother to see his side ,and I hold the org, responsible because my brother and his wife and rest of the family are really fanatics and refused to see his way of choosing to live .I on the other hand was more balanced as to what my children decided to choose as to how they wanted to live there life and wasn't as fanatical, so the cult can and has had a divastating affect on many families and they act like its no big deal when it comes to abusing the kids emotionally, its very sad , glad I woke up , hope my daughter and son in law does soon .
Linda Yeager I just woke up recently. I turned 40 last year
I’ve been out of the religion for 7 years now but finding your channel has been incredibly therapeutic and has given closure on the guilt and mental state you leave a cult with, especially if you were indoctrinated as a child. I had no idea the true history of the organisation, it’s hard not to feel totally lied to and betrayed by the adults who I grew up around but I am thankful I never got baptised. I’ve been binge watching for a week now and the more I see the better I feel.
Thanks Reanna. I'm so glad that watching the channel has been therapeutic for you! :)
Just this week, Three major newspaper in England had major stories about Pedophilia in the Organization! The Story is on youtube for those who want to learn about it.
sara Abraham which three major newspapers are they please?
I'm curious how people who have come out of cults deal with decision making after having so few options most of their lives.
You also have a lot more time when you're not spending 20+ hours a week of meetings and reading and study.
Bang on, Lloyd! Keep the heat on WT. You are as entertaining as you are informative, even though you're not as easy on the eyes as Susan Gaskin. LOL.
Aha! I’m delighted that so many JW are leaving from my area of the world! I’ve personally spoken with local JW families so everyone’s efforts are paying off 😁
Nice work!...20 x 20 x 20 gonna be big numbers very soon! No one will be left...You know when you tell someone not to do something...thats exactly what they wont do!..They will want to check this out!...This talk may backfire on them... You are doing some great work!
Thanks John for another remarkable coverage and exposure and reminding us, we are adults
, we can reach our own conclusions... keep up the good work, shining light on good works and truths..
I'm so happy Jesus is a apostate to, he died because he had different believes then Gods people. All the rabbi's where trowing the first stones.
He also had to appear before a judicial committee....
Creatus
Best. Comment. Ever.!!! I actually can't wait 2 use that at some point, thanks 4 that, it's absolutely indisputable
Amen
Ok yes
Creatus
He had different beliefs than (The others).
Than = comparative / comparison.
How many times do believers need to witness a false prediction before they realize that this is all a bunch of bullsh!t? Astonishing...excellent rebuttal Lloyd...i continue to be fascinated by this topic of cult indoctrination and the efforts of former members to try and help those still brainwashed to 'wake up'...you are literally saving lives and i applaud your efforts!
I loved this video, everything is exposed. People need to think for themselves and open their eyes before they sacrifice their entire lives for nothing.
Keen observations as usual. I'm waiting for the GB to have the predictions vs prophecy's talk regarding Deuteronomy 18:20-22. Followed by a stern warning talk entitled "Semantics Mean Everlasting Life." LOL!
Of course the apostates give a new hope for the future...mine is that Watchtower will go bankrupt and fall and millions including me will get their families back before they die !
Lol!
Regarding the piercing: an earring is good, but not a piercing in the nose? I'm still searching on the Bible for the verse explaining why one is bad and not the other.
Isaac had a nose ring put on rebecca when he married her
The Bible approves nose rings and beards
I'm quite insulted being called malicious and disaffected. When I disassociated myself I was very careful not to unduly influence my former friends and family. Before I disassociated I even called some of my former friends to explain my reasons and to offer my continued friendship. Although I check in from time to time with them it hurts that they never contact me in return. I feel so sorry and sad for them to be stuck in this manipulative and unloving cult.
Tattooed and proud of it.!!!would never set foot in a kingdom hall!!!!!!this is a shame based religion. this is why people are leaving by the droves!!!!Who wants to be a witness and ruin your life?oh,me. Me me!!!!!
Re appearance and beards. Didn’t Charles Taze Russell wear a beard? How do they address that incongruity?
Beards were cool when Russel was around, and not so much after he died, primarily due to the opinions of the one and only Joseph Rutherford. Rutherford believed that Brothers who wore beards, and especially in the style of Russel's beard, ie the old-school minus the mustache look, were performing a form of "Cult of Personality" worship towards Russel. And that belief got his egotistical panties in a bunch so to speak. This and genuine ultra-conservative contempt for "hippie style" facial hair in the 60s and 70s has made beard wearing JW males, especially in the United States, a real rarity.
Yes, Indeed. Don't forget that not only was he obsessed with Biblical chronology and numerology leading to the whole 1975 Jubilee of Mankind/Adams 6000 year birthday/Armageddon fiasco, he also was the undisputed King of the Types and Antitypes. In other words, he was really good at looking at any simple historical narrative in the Bible and automatically assuming that it had deeper meaning which foreshadowed events in modern times. Its really quite sad that Watchtower no longer has Pseudo-Theologians like him, or "Bigger than life" personalities like Rutherford, or Russel around anymore. But then again, there still is, and probably always will be, an abundance of delusional men in authority in the organization who love to get their panties in a bunch over ridiculous things.
I once knew of a District Overseer, who for whatever reason, objected to having kingdom songs played at a lower volume in the background at KH halls prior to and after the meetings. (this is now encouraged in the organizations literature) I also knew a CO who stated in so many words to all of the Elders and M.S.s at a meeting that they had no business serving in positions of responsibility if they were not reading every issue of the WT & Awake magazine cover-to-cover. And this was back in the day when there was 2 issues of each printed every month! Now Tony Morris says at the Annual Meeting that if you can't keep up with all of the literature, you are not a horrible person. Whew! What a relief!
What is reappearance
Robert Tice “Re” is a common abbreviation that means “in reference to”.
Rick Pyle miss read it.
howdo- just found you- reccomended by a friend. Im an ex JW out 25 yearsish- rational, secular, atheist etc. Ive been looking at JWs again recently after looking at more the big picture for a long time, and forgetting/recovering from/ them. It's very shocking to see what is going on now. I feel so sorry for all of the people that they have deluded..
Welcome to the channel. Thanks for checking out the videos. I hope you find them helpful! :)
thanks- interesting stuff
When I left in 2007 I completely refused to think about the religion (at first I was still scared that it might be the truth but I couldn't live the life anymore). I raised my kids and went to Uni (which my jw mother is actually really proud of, strangely). I still didn't question anything about the way I was raised although I now didn't believe the teachings. It wasn't until I stumbled across a RUclips video about a year ago that I realised that I had unresolved trauma from my experiences in the organisation and after I left. Watching the videos have been cathartic for me and have helped heal me from hurt and confusion that I didn't realise I was still carrying
Love your hour long videos!!
One of your best videos yet Loyd! Amazingly done! Bravo
This letter will back fire. Telling people to stay away from social media will just peak their Curiosity even further.
Not inside JW
Listening to that speaker, no wonder they have lost 20
John you are relentless at exlposing Watchtower and what you put together is good
I appreciate it thankyou
The key is to Unite as a movement around the glove, because they are the strongst cult around the best organised and most money.
Nice. Keep the GB on the run. They’re reacting more and more.
It’s funny, the early con artists like Russell and Rutherford had a certain charisma. I just don’t see that ability in their current leaders to do something brilliant to stem the tide against them. Tony seems the most bullish, but he’s more boorish than anything.
Oh if only they would listen to you. Your kind, caring, respectful approach, John, could very well be salve, "ointment" smeared on gaping open, raw wounds Watchtower scorches its members with under the bloody ax stabbing cruel, anti-Christ policies.
The 63 dislikes are people that can't be reasoned with.
Do you think the JW’s will ever get their Leah Remini?
Rick Pyle unfortunately Michael Jackson and Prince are both dead
Well, the good news is even if they don't get a famous exJW to represent them like Leah is doing for Scientology, it's ok bc Leah is taking on the JWs in the mess ff season of Scientology and the Aftermath 😀 so no matter what, they will get their Leah Remini😂😀
*next, lol auto correct
+Sierra B Really? When is that gonna be? I have to watch that!!
It’s wonderful isn’t it?! I love Leah Remini!!!!!
As a child, seeing apostates planted my first seeds of doubt. Hall invasions like 11/5 were peaceful albeit scary to the jw, but can be effective in planting many seeds at once. This type of activism helps people waking up to find channels like yours. I respect your opinion on hall invasions, but believe multiple types of activism are necessary to bring people out of the borg. True, some jw's will become more resolute...but the younger ones are more likely to go online and find TTATT. The WatchTumble is crumbling under the weight of all activism.
Blu Haiku p
Another excellent video...I learn so much from your explanations of WT speak...:)
More lies from the platform... no surprises here. Thanks for sharing!
Teremendous reasoning by you young the Holy Spirit is with you
Thank u so much for opening the eyes of people all over the world. I'm from Canada, Quebec precisely and had study bible with jw for years but never got baptised. Over these years i observed them and notice so many weird behaviors and non sense resonning thing that i could'nt decide myself to get baptised. 6 month ago i saw your video about child abuse and decide to desociate myself with them.
Welp Lloyd I am gonna have to watch this one again for some dates that I know are true. Keep on keeping on brother. I am sure I'm on the radar
I recently found out something very disturbing. From a family member that today is a elder. When he was younger he would have young boys do inappropriate things to him even family members. Some of these kids lived as adults have been clearly affected by this. How can a religion let things like that happen and not do anything about it. Who can tell he if still doing this.
46:10 Did I hear him correctly ? “an obsession with child safeguarding issues” ? “the disfellowshipping policy” “financial topics” .....The internal machinery is warning members not to listen to concerns about the unscriptural practices of the organization.
The part in the talk about apostates and "satan's" media attacking "god's" people, and the cop-out - "what else can we expect", are so maddening.
The catholic church could use the same excuse then when their were rightly maligned during the scandals when it emerged about their bad handling of abuse; however, the witnesses at the time enjoyed reeling about it as it was a talking point at the preaching door.
Jan. 14, 2018, Sunday, 4:39 pm, San Diego, California: Kudos to you, John ! Just found your youtube channel and LOVE it. You are doing such a good job in all of your videos. I was baptized Mormon in 1984 back in New York. Haven't been active in over 6 yrs, and have no plans on attending ever again. I hear sooooo many familiar behaviors in JW church that match the LDS (Latter Day Saint) church. Cults are cults are cults. They all operate the same way. Blind following, don't question, blah blah blah. The rule of JW church of "must have 2 witnesses to child sexual abuse, rape of an adult" is insane. No pedophile is going to sexually violate a child in front of other "normal" people. Unbelievable. The JW and LDS churches both claim membership climbing, when the TRUTH is the opposite. I said, outloud, during this video when you mentioned 20 JWs left the northern branch. Yeaaaaaa ! Applause Applause Applause !!! And, yes, try to interview any of those 20 who left....when it's "safe" for them to do so. I would love to hear what they were put through.
Lloyd is the man, he is so good at destroying Watchtowers arguments...WITH THEIR OWN PUBLICATIONS! The blood transfusion ban, the 2 witness rule-dealing with criminal acts,& many other things aren't supported by the Bible. But they can at least twist, add to,& take away verses, to justify their nonsense. Even though it's clearly taken out of context, in a completely transparent,& ludicrous way-if you kow the Bible at all. But when you use their own words,& publications against them, they really have no comeback. This is why they try their best to keep JWs from seeing old issues.
And great response to people who say you, as an atheist are taking away people's hope. As you said, you don't just give people hope in something you don't believe, just to make them feel good. That's what got them in trouble in the 1st place. I know some are 2ns, or 3rd generation. But the truth about the truth is what's important. And we kow TTATT is that it's dishonest. I've never heard Lloyd say he knows theres no God,& he has all the answers. He says he sees no evidence of a God,& therefore doesn't believe. And he's right-there is no proof. On the flip side, nobody can disprove God,& I don't think he disputes that. What's important is you know the rock solid proof that this cult is untrue. What belief you do, or don't have in God, is up to the individual. I get a lot out of these videos,& respect Lloyds atheist beliefs. But it doesn't affect my own belief in God. I believe because of things I've experienced, but I can't prove it,& don't expect anybody to just believe me. I am a non denominational Christian, who believes in God,& Jesus-but not so much in manmade religion. I have my beliefs, but don't know that if I'm right, or not. Maybe I'm right, o maybe Lloyd is right. Or maybe we are both wrong,& some other religion is right.
But what I can say is fact, is the Jehovah Witnesses are a false religion,& destructive cult. Their tactics, deceit, hypocrisy,& constantly changing,& covering up old beliefs, is the proof. And whether you think the Bible,& Jesus were right or wrong, is for you to decide. But it's an absolute provable fact that JW doctrine isn't supported by Jesus, or the Bible. And is often contradicted by both. Despite their claims, they worship those Pharisees in NY,& the corrupt organization, they dominate. Definitely not Jesus, or Jehovah. Great job always Lloyd. Doesn't matter that you are atheist, I believe you are doing God's work, helping these poor cult members.
Lloyd your rebuttal to this disgusting talk is excellent thank you.and that verse in deut is powerful to point out.
It's always more tolerable with your rebuttals, and funny cause I just posted some news articles on FB about the cult. They have no power over me or what I do and post! So keep up the great work that you do, I too feel spiritual not religious.
Wow, I agree that they are terrified and scrambling!!!!
Very interesting talk Lloyd. Your right, if it’s the truth it should stand on its own two feet, and handle any scrutiny. It’s incredible the amount of control Watchtower employs. Thanks again
The irony in these kinds of talk is what lead me to check them out lol.
What i find so amazing is that people are protected against anyone from putting or mentioning a name yet elders can do what ever they please there is no proper appeals process within the organization so that anyone that feels they've been wrongly treated by the elders can not really do much at all and as we know you can't or not supposed to take any legal action as they say do not take your brother to court so total and utter domination by the Watchtower and their henchmen.
They have discontinued the yearbook I believe
A calculated decision to discontinue the YEAR BOOK so that the numbers of new members, Kingdom Halls being built or closing, decreases of membership and those taking the emblems cannot be monitored. Not only is this so that accurate records are not available but essentially it is for financial reasons. Reducing the magazine sizes, how often they are printed and discontinue the year book will make drastic savings.
You are correct about the moral aspect. Few are the ones finding this narrow and cramped way,
Thank you for another briĺliant video.
"building our faith takes years" that us better said "indoctrination takes years...which is why we demand that you sacrifice absolutely ALL of your time to listen to ONLY the WT". Yes, unfortunately, it can take a lifetime
So glad that my family has awaken from the Witness brain washing.Enough is enough lol Great video
Another very interesting podcast Lloyd! 20 at one time! Outstanding. Shrinking like Scientology. Now that’s “Good News” 😉
Wonderful video. Ironic isn't it that it's the apostate that's willing to scrutinize information yet the owners of "truth" sprint desperately away from it as this ridiculous talk evidently shows
Yep it’s all part of their control. They don’t want others to know what HAS happened to many who left.
Very revealing. Thank you for sharing. It's all going a bit North Korea wouldn't you say? I hope we see more phobias being overcome.
The key to th the organizations control is creating their own definitions for words we see this in the case of the words: apostate, love, respect, faith and so on. they also create hard-hitting phrases to label various people for example calling someone who is no longer agreeing with their position a "spiritual casualty" or referring to ones in a position of authority as "gifts in Men" and of course the good old fashioned "mentally diseased".
Great news that many people left one congregation!
Hey all you exJWs or questioning JWs, come on over to www.reddit.com/r/exjw/ and share your story!
Thank you for all you do John.
what book was it that the founder used the measurements of the inside of the spinks for the end of the world?
Wow that must give you such a boost Lloyd. Keep it up.
Lloyd, at 21:03 you grinned, but didn't mention the orator's slip of the tongue; There is a paralyzed world-wide work going on (amending paralyzed it to unparalleled). Apparently, the speaker is a bad liar.
william sawyer Freudian slip? Maybe someone should contact this guy and help him find the door.
Diana Cryder, I call it a FRAUDIAN slip?
for a minute there I read apostate as a prostate...
JOHN CEDARS, if we the apostates destroy the hope, also we will destroy their $$$money$$$and if no money, no funny. Jijiji
I was laughing to death when I heard that recording. This is the deal for the Government Body, if there is not intangible hope or a dream to sell, what money are they going to make?. The entire Jehovah's Witnesses around the world are the money making for the Society, and if they stop dreaming and hoping, that will be the end of the Watch Tower Bible and Track Society.
@33:13, "are they having piercings where they shouldn't have piercings?"...Lloyd ! what verse in the Bible describes where piercings should / shouldn't be...? ;-)
With the bit at 1:05:50 to 1:06:50 I just have to say that doesn't seem "spiritual" to me? I don't know, I mean I know I have all the spirituality of your average house brick but that (very laudable) sentiment seems opposite to the notions of spirituality I've gathered from what I've heard and been given as much as they've made any sense. Spirituality always seemed very self-centered, glorifying ignorance of the world while also holding up fabrications of it as some kind of "ultimate truth". It never seemed to be about anything more than the person and their connection to whatever. Their eternity. Their sanctity. Their perfection. It always seemed to end up being all about the individual and the world can burn for all they cared.
I know not everyone is like this, and you can reach such attitudes without appeals to spirituality, but honestly that's all spirituality has ever looked like to me and idea of wanting the best future for, well, the people of the future and wanting them to expand out into the universe and expand their knowledge of that universe seems like a polar opposite of spirituality.
People that don't receive transfusions during surgery, have better outcomes.
Is like saying:
Fighter pilots that don't deploy their parachutes during flight have higher rates of getting back on the ground alive.
15:01, If you kick out the people who don't survive, then it's easy to see the statistical improvement in recovery time.
To your point about former JW’s being “Timid” about the label apostate, it is true, but for a different reason than stated. I believe that for many who leave the organization but remain Christian believers, the main issue is the way in which the Watchtower leadership has appropriated the Biblical sense of apostatizing, (one who rejects God and Christ) and applied it to any who reject the teachings of a man-made organization as if they are one and the same thing. They are not. I know this is a distinction emphasized by Ray Franz, Jim Penton, Ron Frye, Peter Gregerson, Ed Dunlap and many others who left the organization but remained in the Christian faith.
I agree about holidays with pegan origins but birthdays are no diférent that marriage anniversaries, they are BOTH celebrations of life or an anniversary of life! One is a birth and the other is a birth starting a new life smh it took me my whole life to realize this..
THANK YOU FOR MORE ENLIGHTENMENT ,
Not too long ago I saw a clip in your videos of one of the members of the governing body saying it’s too bad they can’t execute members of the family or congregation who become apostates…would anyone be so kind as to let me know which of Lloyd’s videos have this clip?
My best friend growing up, both of us born in and both of us having left, is thinking of going back to the organization and I’m trying with all my might to prevent this from happening.
Why make the second greatest mistake of your life. Going back is like committing slow suicide!
In the Catholic Church "excommunication" means that a person is no longer in communion with Christ and hence ought not receive the Holy Eucharist - which is called Holy Communion - but Catholics do not shun former members. It's possible that a notorious person engaged in child abuse of other heinous crimes may be shunned by some or even many but it is not a policy of the Church to shun family and friends because they have deviated on some matter of doctrine or engaged in conduct that some consider worldly.