Throughout my life I've skied either with Nordica or Salomon boots. Working my way through intermediate skiing, I used Nordica because they were comfortable. I had some durability issues and as I became a better skier, I switched to Salomon's high end boots. Absolutely loved the performance! But, now skiing in my 70's and with feet swelling problems, the pain of putting on & taking off the boot ruined my enjoyment of skiing. So, I switched to Nordica Hands Free (modern version of rear entry) and now I look forward to skiing almost every day throughout winter! The right ski boot for the right circumstances.
They are for touring period, going up the hill you need the extra flex when the pitch gets steep the last thing you want to fight is the ability to flex your ankle.
Yep, would never go uphill without it while skinning. And I have this gadget on my resort boots for some reason 😂 in over 15 years of riding those boots, I might have use them like 5 times 😂 also put a booster strap last winter, these things just rule!
@RicketySkiReviews That sounds silly. I might get it in case of Cochise where you get a no compromise skiing boot with tech inserts and walking lever. But selling a leightweight XTD boot as a comfort upgrade is just so wrong. Even the hassle of getting in/out of those boots outweighs all the benefits of better walking comfort.
One other thing to mention on the subject of ski boots. If you boots plastic shell and buckles are in good shape, its worth it to replace the liner, and a lot cheaper. I got 12 years out of my previous Lange's by replacing the liner once or twice. The shell eventually cracked, but the new liners were $199 which is cheaper than new boots. Also, I love booster straps too. Atomic makes something similar now that you can buy and put on any boot, kind of a "super booster" with two zones of adjustment.
Great insight! I would be careful doing this, sometimes they'll make a change year to year, and the liners no longer match with the boots. Or previously I've tried putting newer lace up liners into an older race boot and had it not work very well. So definitely good advice but be careful. You can always check with the manufacturer to make sure it will be a good fit. In my case buying New boots for $310 makes more sense to me because the plastic is starting to break and warp, my guess would be due to warmer winters and sun exposure in the West but I do think it's good advice overall! Thanks for the insightful comment!
Ingmar Stenmark the all time winningest world cup skier until Mikaela broke his record this record tis year, wore the exact same pair Caber Alfa boots for over 10 years, years after they had been discontinued. Make sure you know what you're taking about when you talk about plastic breaking down.
IMO this guy made a big mistake not getting a after market for his Lang boots. He had a shell that fit his foot, the problem was the liner and some 'buckles'. Buckles can be replaced easy enough. His misinformation about after market liners is obvious, these liners are a far superior fit compared to OEM liners. This guy needs to educate himself. Zipfit and Intuition liners are the best and I've used Intuition Power Wrap for 15 years and wouldn't ski in any thing else.
@@rickden8362 Yes, plastic does break down with time and use. It happens slowly so you tend not to notice it until it gets real bad but if you compared your old boots to new ones of the same make and flex, you'll find the new ones to be much stiffer and more responsive. The fact that Stenmark wore the same exact pair for ten years is interesting but doesn't tell us much about breakdown. You said the boots were discontinued. Perhaps he desired new boots but couldn't get more of the same model so he lived with their age instead of switching models or brands entirely and risking a poor fit.
A good shop should definitely give you a moulding and boot fitment for free when you buy the boot. Sometimes they'll charge if you have to come back. But I found that most of them will do at least the initial fitment heat moulding for free
True. My shop won’t charge for fitting work on boots purchased from them even a year later but it’s good to tip our bootfitters either way when they work on it.
Totally agree, the shops I went to that 1.) had boots in stock and 2.) had every type of boot requested, were just kind of a scatter shot of random different ski shops. I couldn't go to my kind of tried and true shop. So I had to bounce around a bit. But some of the shops were pretty unimpressive. Great advice though! Glad to hear you have a good shop local to you.
walk mode for hike-to terrain / side-country (T2 KickingHorse, Baldy Snowbird, the Ridge Taos, Gold Hill Chutes Telluride) or if you have to hike back to the resort after playing out of bounds, and in Europe where you ski into the middle of small towns and explore or take busses and trains and funiculars to get to the slopes, kind of depends on where you ski...
I have last year’s Salomon s pro 130 and I have a normal med arch and thinner to med feet and I love them. Fully heat moldable so I did that and felt perfect all last season. Anyone with a similar foot they are def worth trying.
I had to get rid of that strap thing across the liner instep. After that they felt great. I was coming off some K2 Mindbenders which I liked but got so soft I thought they were broken. Really like the flex pattern in the Salomon. Highly recommend.
Just picked some Salomon S Pro 130's. Super nice boots. Also had some older S-Max's. I love how Salomon gets such high performance out of a lightweight boot and the easy customization of the fit is great.
Your observation about the cruise one twenty was accurate. I owned it 5 seasons. One of the most comfortable boots i've ever been in. It served me well. But it did pack out fairly quickly. And I lost all snap within three or four seasons . (To be fair I'm hard on equipment and flex boots pretty hard ) I upgraded to the technica mach1 130 last year. I purchased them from one of the top boot fitters in lake tahoe. The main fitter there told me that the one twenty cruise Is softer than most true one twenties. After trying on a few more boots recently I believe he is correct. I don't think it's a great choice If you like to rip. But if you're looking for a comfortable cruiser, the cruise one twenty is pretty darn good if it fits you. In my opinion, it's better for a heavier weight less aggressive skier. Even if you're not a particularly big guy, it probably is going to be too soft for you if you're aggressive.
I think that a walk mode is not essential, but it's a VERY nice to have. It adds a lot of flexibility. From a cost perspective, yes, they're more expensive specially when you add the cost of a hybrid touring binding and skins you're talking around 500$ more compared to a normal setup BUT you save in terms of not having to buy 2 different sets of skis and boots if you want to do some touring. So it depends on what is more important. I also think that in terms of flex 110/120 is more than enough for any recreational skier.
I totally agree, mostly I wanted to warn people because when I went to the shops, the touring is just sold as an "upgrade" and I don't think it is necessary for everyone, especially non-touring resort skiers. Great comment, thanks for the insight!
I'm also boot shopping these days! It's quite annoying as my foots are small and wide, so I would need a 24.5 in HV, which is not so common. Last year I ended up in 25.5 MV that even after punching a few times were still giving me foot pain.
Same here. Except I am the dreaded 22/22.5 in HV with chicken leg. My forefoot though, needed a few rounds of punching out even with the HV. When will the wide toe box/barefoot shoe thing catch on with ski boots?
oh crap! That's brutal, sorry to hear. My brother actually has wider feet than me, and likes the Fischer Rangers and the Salomon's. They might be worth trying if that's helpful info! Thanks for watching and sorry to hear about your boots!
I'm moving from renting once a year to taking my kids for their first season and this video was really helpful. I've watched several fitting guides but hearing how you personally navigate things adds another dimension. It also reduces my anxiety about what to expect. I'm in Colorado looking for a boot fitter now as fitting is consistently recommended for a relative newbie like me. I had a bad experience in my last rentals where my calves were in terrible pain. Turns out I have a 15" calf on a 5'7" frame (athletic) and I need to be extra careful which boot I start with. I'll need to see what the fitter says and try them on, but the Atomic Hawx Prime is an early frontrunner along with the Dalbello Panterras, based on a few other folks sharing a positive experience with similar foot/calf sizes. I'll be looking for some internet deals on last year's models too if possible. Great job getting that deal! Maybe I'm missing something, but there aren't enough people on RUclips talking about ski gear like this. There are a few good shops posting videos that aren't just marketing. I've only found one other channel that talks about things like this from a neutral perspective. Keep it up.
Thanks so much for your nice comment! That's actually a super common problem, you can adjust the buckles so that there's more room for the calves on the top 2 buckles.
Totally agree with you on the touring walk mode, so unnecessary for a majority of people. I’m a boot fitter and ski in the Atomic Hawx ultra 120 . Hawx are a fantastic range of ski boots. One I did like last season was the Nordica pro machine. I have also noticed the clogg on the new ultra XTD with boa is different to the original in my opinion. The Salomon s pro alpha is a good boot too and is slightly higher on the instep than it’s big brother the s pro .
Elliot, kudo's for probably your best and most useful video to date. Lot's of good info and insight on boots in this one. A pretty good and typical description of a general consumers boot buying experience (ie.. all over the map). I consider myself close to an expert on boots at this point in my life due to lots of boot buying experience recently and very narrow feet that are hard to find a snug enough boot. My first bit of advice is great purchase and you have Atomic Mimic liners in those boots. Mimic liners "must" be heat molded if you want to optimize them. They have a hard outer surface around the ankles that is designed to be heated and conform to your foot. They may feel fine now, but they will feel better if you heat mold just the liners. Typically you will pay $25 at a shop for that, worth it. Don't need to heat mold the shells, but they are designed for it, so if there are any spots that need to be bigger, put on the local spot padding and heat mold the shells too. I would add on the XTD boots with walk mode, you give up some boot precision due to the use of light weight plastic and the walk mode. Don't buy it unless you need it, like you said. I have a skinning set up, so I have a resort boot (Atomic Redster Club Sport) and the Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD. There is a huge difference in how they ski. The Atomic Redster Club Sport and the Head Raptor are probably the best skiing resort boots on the market. I am a little surprised you don't consider those. It will take your skiing to a new level for sure. They do come in 130 flex and 110 flex. The flex is really about 10 points above what their rated numbers are. So if you want 120 flex, buy the 110. These are all day race boots and not a plug boot. If you have a medium volume/ wider foot you will need some boot work done, so that is a decision for sure in what to buy. My narrow foot slips right in. I have spent most of my life in Langes, like you, and although I still like them, companies like Atomic now offer plug narrow, all day race narrow, narrow, medium, and wide. Something for everyone if the shape agrees with your foot. Heat molding is a game changer allowing boots to expand where needed on your foot. They don't get snugger, but do get looser with heat. A lot of consumers can fit into a narrower boot than before without extensive boot work due to heat molding. As many boots as you evaluated, you probably only touched on 40% of what's on the market. Seems like you got a good boot that will work well for you for a great price. Again, I urge you to heat mold the mimic liner, you will be pleased for sure even if you don't feel like you need it. The hard mimic plastic will not break in to your foot without the heat, like older liners would do. Lastly, I have read from a reliable source that the new Lange Shadow boot needs to be skied to actually "feel" the improvements made in it. Just trying them on in a shop won't feel much different. I think you were a little hasty on your video on those boots. I don't have a good sense of how much better they are, certainly not game changing, but they have been described as softer flexing for the same ski reaction as a stiffer boot. Again, not a huge deal in the overall scheme of things.
Great insight! Thanks for letting me know about the Atomic Liners, I'm sure you've saved me quite a bit of future heartbreak! I didn't try those Redster or Head Boots because they weren't available in any of the local stores I visited. Perhaps in more Race Heavy shops I would see them? I have tried Head raptors years and years ago, and I don't remember the specifics but they didn't quite fit me. I agree 100% about the Lange Shadows. I've reached out to Lange Directly to see if I can get a testing pair to put on snow to give a more full assessment. I'm reluctant to spend $750 on a boot that didn't feel great for my feet in the store. I just wanted to give my initial reaction in the store to say that the flex felt a bit weird and the fit didn't feel quite as onbrand as the LX120. Thanks again for your valuable insight!
I had an athletes “walk mode” break. It wouldn’t stay clamped down. The boot is essentially broken until that piece can be fixed/replaced. Also custom footbeds are crucial for me. But I’ve been on my same sure-foot customs for 13 years. Last Booster straps are definitely the best bang for buck upgrade you can do to a boot.
Got the XTD 130 last spring. My skinny legs need the spoilers to make the boot fit correctly, and these are the first boots that I have the spoilers in. In the past I have had to pay too much attention to not end up in the back seat, and by the time I noticed it, it was time for some wizardy to get back on to the drivers seat. Now with the spoilers i do get an early feel that I might end up tailgunning (too much). One other thing: after initial break-in of the boots for 5-10 days, I suggest get the liners baked. I had mine done, and while it did not make a world of difference, it improved the overall fit close to perfection. The harder plastic at the upper part of the cuff on the liner molds to rounder shape, so it has a more uniform support around the shin. And this helps in keeping the tongue in place, also pushing the heel back slightly better. The heel pocket got tiny adjustment in the making, too, better filling the tiny contours now. The tongue also got the slightest shape adjustment on the ankle.
I'm replacing my k2 recon 120 mv with touring boots that are more resort oriented, the Atomic Hawx XTD 120 and I'm adding the gnar bar (replaces the walk mode lever) atomic sells to make them a stiffer inbounds boot while being able to use them for short out of bounds tours. Decent solution for a resort focused but backcountry curious skier.
i have last years Hawk 130 prime. amazing boot. this year they didn't even change the color lol. same boot. I really like how consistent the flex is no matter the temp. spring skiing at 60 felt basically the same as 0
That's awesome! Isn't that funny? I can remember in 2006/2007 Volkl upgraded their Racetiger skis, and the only difference was on the topsheet instead of having 3 claws by the tiger, the 2007 had 4 claws, lolll
Hey! I also got the Atomic Hawx but mine are the Ultra S 120. I needed the narrow fit, which is the Ultra line, so like you said probably the Prime line are the wider fit. I absolutely love their fit. My shop offered free moulding but I don’t even need it. On the other hand, I did get a footbed in them but for me it was to improve arch support which I usually have orthopédie soles. I don’t want to use them in ski bots because they are super hard and I know my feet would hurt skiing with them. Oh, I also got last years model which for me is not a problem since I need narrow fit in 295. My problem is more that most shops only have a couple models with these specs so I was lucky the Atomics were a good fit.
I have a super high arch and have had trouble with the top of my foot in a lot of boots, trouble getting in and out of boots. My bootfitter recommended Dalbello Panterra 120 because of the liner design. I haven't been out on them, but they feel wonderful so far. YMMV.
I’ve got K2 Mindbender boots. I thought walk mode was going to be awesome for moving around the resort, and wrangling kids. It’s not. It really is a touring specific feature. For the ski-dad, Gripwalk is a meaningful upgrade, but walk modes are not.
I have the normal Hawx prime 120s and radical pros as a touring boot. I don't see why you'd get a crossover boot as a touring boot if you're not an expert and a charger, a real "beefy" touring boot is way better on the ups and decent on the down (and you can usually tilt them forward more if you value the downs). I may get an Hawx prime Xtd 120 or 130 when I retire the current one (for sale in the summer), but not as a touring boot, just to be more comfortable when walking toward a freeride spot in the resort and to drive my qst echo harder in the resort (fitted them with tectons).
I just bought 2022/23 K2 Revolver team they where in store demo but never touched snow for 250.00 CAD/185.00 USD and the price last year was around 600.00 CAD
So i bought the atomic hawx 130 wide (2020 i believe )... I tried on the regular version in the shop and then order the wide version online, because I've had the pinching on the top of the foot as you mentioned and I've also had pinching on a drawn out navicular bone in the past... It turned out to be kind of a huge mistake. I got the 27.5 like always but my foot was moving around in the boots, after a while...I realized it more this season when I got heavier skis. So anyway i ordered a liner sleeve, toung shims and put in a volume reducer just to have them be useable. I like the atomic fit also. My question is:.the prime that you ordered, is it designed for extremely wide feet ?... I had my foot measured and it's 103 wide(at ball) right foot and 99 on left foot..is your foot similar width? I might look into these atomics you are talking about because I definitely need an upgrade and want to hit a home run this time around!!
try the atomic boots in 27.5 prime (102mm) or maybe the ultra (100mm) the widths are for 27.5 sizes and then if they feel ok just head mold the liners and shells for better fit if they feel a bit too narrow. else, just try something from tecnica, nordica or k2. i work in a ski shop and they have a nice feeling from my experience, depends wich one fits you better for your foot shape. k2 also has a more progressive flex feeling. i skied the k2 mindbender 130s and they feel more flexible than my nordica strider 130 elite. just try as many as possible and then custom mold them for your feet or even modify them.
For me, the Solomon felt good in the shop, but on the hill stabbing pain. After putting up with them for one season I sold them and went back to Lange.
I have just had a day on Salomon s/pro 120. Omg they forced me forward when standing in line. This was a bad line day with 30 minute queues and I am in agony. Back of the boot was too high up my calf. All things I didn’t notice in the shop
Omg, that's brutal, I'm sorry hope you both have found better boots. Yeah That's why I'm careful with flex! In the warm ski shop, I feel like an olympic ski racer! But when it's 10 below, I realize I don't need boots too overly stiff.
@@RicketySkiReviews has another day on them and I think it may be the custom insole I was upsold. They lift up the heel so tipping me more forward than the boot alone. To be fair these are great boots while actually skiing
Last year was my first ski season at the age of 34. I walked in a ski shop and got sold the K2 mindbender 100. I didn’t know what I needed at the time. The reason I started skiing is to find something to burn some calories in the rainy season in Vancouver. Alpine skiing for a season actually made my fitness worse. My base fitness was a lot better than my skill so I never got to the stage where I could ski aggressively.By the end of the season, I learned enough about skiing and figured out I could do ski touring. Luckily i don’t have to buy touring boots because my current boots are already compatible with touring
When it comes to boots, besides the naming, also i get really annoyed by the flex number! Why is it so hard to define flex as an industry standard!? My recommendation would be to define it with the help of an L-shaped contraption with a hinge at the corner (similar to a crash test dummy). The vertical lever does get pushed by a horizontal piston / motor at a height of 40cm above the hinge. The force needed to push the artificial shin forward by 15 cm is the flex number. This would mean direct comparability between boots and it is an actually relevant figure... Another thing is the last size: how is it defined? On a ski boot, where fit is so important, I would like to see 4 more sizes for fit: - last height - last width - toebox width - heel width
As a former ski racer why do you not ski a 130flex boot? I'm 5' 10 140lb and I'm in the salomon s pro alpha 130's (downsized to 26.5). Personally I went with 130 because I have extreme ankle and foot flexibility and i have tiny ankles so I gotta downsize in a 98mm last boot. Generally I've found that the 130 boots were better made (though I havent tried too many 120's to say whether or not that holds true but it definitely does vs the 100's) I tried the Lange RX 130 and Redster too, though in the redster i'd probably go down to 120 or 110. About people trying to sell you things, Footbeds are pretty important for some types of feet (especially flexible feet that love to slide) though I'm not sure why a shop would want to sell people inferior walk mode or 50/50 boots who aren't explicitly in the market for them unless theyre trying to move product. It's a shame when people try to sell you junk and a lot of people don't know better. About the Liners though... If they were trying to sell you Zipfit liners, I highly recommend giving those a shot. People have them last over 1000 ski days through multiple shells definitely changes the way bootfitting feels. Definitely recommend looking into them sometime. I get lucky because the shop I go to is generally empty and the bootfitters there are really good and let me try on everything without a fuss. I wish all bootfitters were in the business of getting you the right education and fit than selling you up. They try too hard to sell things instead of just making it easy to want to buy boots. I love booster straps. Atomic's pro strap or whatever its called is basically a booster strap, and I know my salomons came with one that was similar though not as strong. 10:25 you talk about the low instep height. The Spro Alpha came out I believe last year to fix the old Smax fit. They have it with the boa. Did you try the S/Pro Supra 120? (I think thats what it's called) Basically the tongue of the liner should have the white plastic there and you can adjust it to increase the instep height. That thing stabbing you was definitely the tongue. Of course, everything is how it fits your foot, just know that the newest salomons are REALLY adjustable because of so many people having the same fitment issues you did. Good deal on the Atomic boots you got there. Nice. Every "serious (110+ flex alpine)" boot I've tried has seemed pretty solid so it's nice that the industry is in a good spot with boots. Shame how bootfitters can make skiing miserable for people who don't know what theyre doing and it's also hard to support local shops since paying retail for ski boots is highway robbery. Would be interested in you demoing some 3 piece boots like the Full tilts or dalbellos I always wondered why people raved about them despite the performance hits, and I think you looking at Touring boots would be neat.
I’m definitely going to be getting ZipFits when my current stock liners in my Atomic Hawx Ultras begin to pack out. Don’t want to replace them in my fairly new ski boots until necessary though, as that feels wasteful! Heard so many good things about the ZipFits.
Great recommendations and insights, I will try to reply as much as I can. I went with the 120 flex just because it felt like plenty, flex is tricky to gauge when you're trying boots in the summer/ fall (when they're the cheapest). I also ski with my kids and spend long days skiing in the woods, so as much as I love pinning it on the race turns in the groomed runs, I don't need them to be that reactive all the time, and I'd rather have a comfortable flex, that still will get me to the full arc of the turn. I also add the worldcup booster straps onto the boots which adds a bit to the flex, so I kept with the same 120 flex as my Langes (the atomics felt pretty similar flex wise). The upsells were especially noticeable since they started before I even had boots on my feet! Like how do you know I even need half this stuff before we've even started. Thanks so much for your insight! I'm wearing my boots now to try and break them in early!
@sokolva, I have too! I'm only wary of them because I had lace up liners when I raced and really disliked them from a practical level of getting boots on and off, but maybe they've improved since then!
😢help..I have a lot of problems...#1 can I replace the liner with a fur insole,that crap that comes in the boots are not warm enough for me...and CAN I hack off the top half of the boot.. I started skiing in the alps in leather boots and I control my turns with my ankles,not my knees....put me back on the slope again 😢
I have to laugh when you got to the Nordica Cruise, that’s the boot I ended up with for my wide flat feet with its 102 last. I can’t remember but I thought you had narrower feet. Also I like the cruise in 120, I had got another pair just before finding them witch was the dalbello pantera 120, I liked but the cruise fit me better after a half hour. I skied in the cruise open to close one day 9-8pm no problems at all.
That's awesome! I thought my foot was narrow, but as I get older I'm finding it's spreading out more. Yes, I kind of thought the Nordica's wouldn't be a fit, but I wanted to be diligent and try everything so I could give insight for the video. Very well made boot, I liked the smooth flex, just wasn't a good fit for my foot type. Thanks for watching, cheers!
I dont believe in dual purpose boots. If you are a serious about touring your touring boot will be too light for resort skiing. Your resort boot will benefit greatly from higher weights that accompany a durable package. I ski a Tecnica Mach 130 HV and a Salomon MTN S/Lab. Total spend with footbeds is about $1800 canadian. Crazy really. Congratulations on your boot deal. That's an amazing bit of shopping.
Maybe also good to mention that if you go for a tour booth you also want a tour or hybrid binding. So that the save system of the biding really does the job. Which is not always the case if you put a tour booth in a normal alpine binding 😇
Have you tried the Nordica hf 120 Pro? I bought a pair this summer, and the comfort is off the charts but the flex is noticeably softer flex than my other boots (which I am keeping) Nordica Fire Arrow F3. Last winter I also bought a couple of more pairs of skis Rossignol Experience 86 ti (the grip on firm snow was the best I have ever felt, even compared to race skis I have had in the past) and Volkl Blaze 86 (which I found great in the soft spring snow, more smeary in the moguls than the Rossies) but still decent grip on the firm snow. I am concerned that the grip and high speed stability of the Rossies will suffer from the softer flex of the Hf boots. Thinking maybe switching boots during the season depending on conditions. Sorry about the long post.
Hard to say without actually getting on snow, but there are a couple of things I think you can do in the back of the boot for flex, or you could consider throwing some booster straps on! Great ski recommendations, I will definitely try to test this winter if I can.
just because people seen boots get put into a oven in 1 ski related program or video, doesnt mean any custom fitted boot needs to go into one, actually it ruins the integrity of the material a bit so the boot will have a shorter lifetime altering its structural integrity.
I talked to a couple of people who have said it's just as good, if not better to just break in your boots by wearing them. Seems accurate to my experience, but I've never gone the oven route before either lol.
Not every boot is made from material that is designed to but baked in an oven. I have worked with Salomon Custom HD shells that are specifically designed to be heated in an oven. Other brands like Nordica or Tecnica can be heated in certain areas and stretched or punched out if necessary to conform to your feet. We usually recommend you ski a few days if possible then return to customize certain areas that you feel need it. Also not every liner is heat moldable. Usually we heat up heat moldable liners on heat stacks which are like heat guns we don’t put them in the oven. We haven’t had any issues with Salomon Custom HD shells that we have heated in the oven.
I think im gonna try new boots i tried like 8 pairs and still feel minorly uncomfortable in my nordicas and then just slightly better when underload...
When I tried the Mindbenders they said they didn't have the Reckoner in my Size. But I need to go back and get my skis mounted, so maybe I'll see if they have the 2024's in stock and try to report back if I can.
Another thing that is important to remember is that when it comes to skiing, boots are the most important piece of gear. So it's worth spending a bit more on boots, even if that means saving on your other gear. A bad fitting boot can ruin a whole season.
Update: just got a pair of atomic hawx prime 110s at the ski swap. Best heel hold of any boot I tried. The Nordica speed machine 120 was very close. I'm excited to see how they perform this year!
I just got a pair of atomic hawks magna 80, walking around the house it hurts a bit on the top of my foot and I think my left foot is a bit bigger than my right one, if feels like the size is a bit too tight for my left foot.
I noticed last winter that my (very) old Nordicas (Beast 10) liner fillings were shot. So, I bought cheapo new Nordicas (Sportmachine 90x) and put it's liners to my oldies and all was ok, those old ones btw have Boosters on as just normal thing. But the new onese did not have. Both boots fit the same but the new ones were all too upright, so I made my diy spoilers on them and I have skied with those...but still, the old boots are the ones until they really break up somewhere. One thing you did not say: most of boots are now ugly, and if they are not, the colours at least are.
@@RicketySkiReviews Ha, I even took both ones to slope, old and new boots and that way did some valuation, so--> new boot on another and old on another feet. Did not make a swap there thou. That was: "old was plenty better but if I get the angle right, new is skiable"
When I was in my teens(?) I broke the walk mode twice on one pair of boots. Since then, I just see it is something else that can break on a boot. If you don't need it, skip it.
No, I went to like 4 different shops to try everything out there, and then the ones I liked they didn't have any 2023 inventory. If money was no object I would have bought from the shop, but they didn't have 2023 models which were $300 vs $600+. I still bought my skis from that shop and get work done and do my demos with them regularly. As much as it isn't ideal, I still try to support local businesses whenever I can.
I'm pretty surprised to hear you are skiing a 120 after hearing your height, weight and racing background. I'm 6'4" but only 170 and have been skiing the atomic hawx ultra 130. I don't have a racing background and usually end up in the bumps or in the trees. Ps I have a friend who is 5'6 140 and skis a technicia mach 1 130 and is the best bump skier I have ever seen in person. It's interesting to see what people are using.
I agree! I think they're fine if people like them, but like, I hadn't even figured out which boots I would buy! Let alone if they needed an insole upgrade. lol
Do *_NOT_* skimp on ski boots. A good fit needs investment of knowledge, time, and money _(in that order of priority)_ . If you know, you know… for everyone else, find a boot fitter.
Next video will have my unboxing! I agree, though I do think ordering 2023 boots from last season is a good way to save money without compromising on quality.
Ordering online is cool, as long as someone involved in the process knows how to do at least a proper shell fit. Knowing about ski boot mfgr tendencies also helps... some brands better for narrow or wide last, high or low volume foot, high or low calf muscle, etc., etc. Don't think most consumers know when a hotspot can be taken care of, or a different boot should be used. Setting up canting angles not all that important IMHO, unless you really want to feel special about yourself. Again, having boot fitting experience in the loop can make skiers want to stay with it. Cheers.
'Unless you go touring all the time or stand around a lot, do you need walk mode?' No. Who told you that? Let me guess - a salesperson? Isn't it just common sense to only need walk mode if you walk a lot in them? Seems a no-brainer to me.
Unfortunately it's been treated by marketing teams and sales people as an "upgrade" to the base model boot. I wanted to clarify, so that people aren't spending money on gear that won't serve them.
I love my Tecnica boots hate Lange atomic or Salomon. Cochise 130 great boot and I need it for back up backcountry boot side country list goes on. It’s like having a leather man compared to a butter knife. I don’t agree with you because you seem to cater to Salomon and atomic. Atomic boots are garbage and cheap. Touring boots last longer too in regards to the soles. Employee cost is same for Tecnica no matter what flex so the offer a better overall quality than any other company and yes I use to fit boots for a living .
Because as a ski shop guy that Worked out East....you should know better......too many peeps come in and try stuff on and buy online and then take away the ability to do it right! and Our time is worth something right? And your videos are entitled and by god did you not remember what you dealt with? Know that your crushing it on youtube and need content I find your videos not helpful....
I would be all for buying in the shop, but Straight up the price difference is staggering $450 vs $900, because no shop in my area still had 2023 boots available for purchase. I get your point, but just being realistic with you the $450 is a lot of money, and I don't need to have current year boots. If they have it though I'm all for buying local. I bought my Atomic Maverick 88Ti's at my local shop! they let me demo and then use that money towards the purchase, I think it's a great way to buy skis. I support local business when I can, but in this case it wasn't viable.
I have to respond to that. I also worked in sports shops and I hate when people ask you to « encourage » local shops by paying more money for the same product or buying a product that doesn’t fit as well because they don’t have the best one in stock (seen that plenty as well). First off, most local shop where I live have almost nothing left from last year, which means they are selling plenty and doing well financially. If not, then it’s a management problem, which is not my problem. Then, from what I know, nobody is stupid enough to buy the exact same product online AFTER he tried it at the local shop if the shop was selling for the same price. I mean we all prefer leaving with the product in our hands. Also, as he said, he got them as a deal for last years model. You are really saying people should pay more for something (in this case double Tue amount) to « support » local shops? I mean might as well just donate 450$ and still buy the boots online?!?!! Lastly, I went shopping for a very specific need at a few local shops last week. One of them, I waited 20 minutes and wasn’t able to get any help because of all the 5 people there, only one was apparently knowledgeable in skis….it’s a ski shop, that’s all they sell and it was a weekday with only one other client in the place. The second shop wanted to sell me oh a great deal yes but not what I wanted, they just didn’t exactly carry what I was looking for. Then the third one, which is where I purchased most of my stuff locally (never skis though), the guy was again trying to sell me into skiing 110 in the NE because he loves wide skis and that’s all he can sell. Of all the sales guys in all those shops, I found none of them was really trying to guide me towards the best solution, like I see in the Ski Essential reply’s on RUclips. All they try is to push me one of the product that either is usually an easy sell (Enforcers, Bent, etc) or they sell what they personally like. So please drop your narrative of « support » local shops at all costs and work on your customer experience. Then you won’t need to whine and ask for « help » (charity in fact) and people will not only buy but also RECOMMEND your shop.
![Salomon S/Pro Supra Boa Ski Boot - Mens Expert Review [2023]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/x4rQow4Lqtk/mqdefault.jpg)
Throughout my life I've skied either with Nordica or Salomon boots. Working my way through intermediate skiing, I used Nordica because they were comfortable.
I had some durability issues and as I became a better skier, I switched to Salomon's high end boots. Absolutely loved the performance!
But, now skiing in my 70's and with feet swelling problems, the pain of putting on & taking off the boot ruined my enjoyment of skiing. So, I switched to Nordica Hands Free (modern version of rear entry) and now I look forward to skiing almost every day throughout winter!
The right ski boot for the right circumstances.
Totally, I used to not fit Fischer Boots, now they feel pretty good.
They are for touring period, going up the hill you need the extra flex when the pitch gets steep the last thing you want to fight is the ability to flex your ankle.
Totally agree, but unfortunately the local shops are pitching them as an "upgrade" for the boot.
@@RicketySkiReviews fun ski I just bought is black crows mirus cor. Carving freestyle ski. Can’t wait for the snow
Yep, would never go uphill without it while skinning. And I have this gadget on my resort boots for some reason 😂 in over 15 years of riding those boots, I might have use them like 5 times 😂 also put a booster strap last winter, these things just rule!
@RicketySkiReviews That sounds silly. I might get it in case of Cochise where you get a no compromise skiing boot with tech inserts and walking lever. But selling a leightweight XTD boot as a comfort upgrade is just so wrong. Even the hassle of getting in/out of those boots outweighs all the benefits of better walking comfort.
One other thing to mention on the subject of ski boots. If you boots plastic shell and buckles are in good shape, its worth it to replace the liner, and a lot cheaper. I got 12 years out of my previous Lange's by replacing the liner once or twice. The shell eventually cracked, but the new liners were $199 which is cheaper than new boots.
Also, I love booster straps too. Atomic makes something similar now that you can buy and put on any boot, kind of a "super booster" with two zones of adjustment.
Great insight! I would be careful doing this, sometimes they'll make a change year to year, and the liners no longer match with the boots. Or previously I've tried putting newer lace up liners into an older race boot and had it not work very well. So definitely good advice but be careful. You can always check with the manufacturer to make sure it will be a good fit.
In my case buying New boots for $310 makes more sense to me because the plastic is starting to break and warp, my guess would be due to warmer winters and sun exposure in the West but I do think it's good advice overall!
Thanks for the insightful comment!
They lose flex.
Ingmar Stenmark the all time winningest world cup skier until Mikaela broke his record this record tis year, wore the exact same pair Caber Alfa boots for over 10 years, years after they had been discontinued. Make sure you know what you're taking about when you talk about plastic breaking down.
IMO this guy made a big mistake not getting a after market for his Lang boots. He had a shell that fit his foot, the problem was the liner and some 'buckles'. Buckles can be replaced easy enough. His misinformation about after market liners is obvious, these liners are a far superior fit compared to OEM liners. This guy needs to educate himself. Zipfit and Intuition liners are the best and I've used Intuition Power Wrap for 15 years and wouldn't ski in any thing else.
@@rickden8362 Yes, plastic does break down with time and use. It happens slowly so you tend not to notice it until it gets real bad but if you compared your old boots to new ones of the same make and flex, you'll find the new ones to be much stiffer and more responsive.
The fact that Stenmark wore the same exact pair for ten years is interesting but doesn't tell us much about breakdown. You said the boots were discontinued. Perhaps he desired new boots but couldn't get more of the same model so he lived with their age instead of switching models or brands entirely and risking a poor fit.
A good shop should definitely give you a moulding and boot fitment for free when you buy the boot. Sometimes they'll charge if you have to come back. But I found that most of them will do at least the initial fitment heat moulding for free
True. My shop won’t charge for fitting work on boots purchased from them even a year later but it’s good to tip our bootfitters either way when they work on it.
Totally agree, the shops I went to that 1.) had boots in stock and 2.) had every type of boot requested, were just kind of a scatter shot of random different ski shops.
I couldn't go to my kind of tried and true shop. So I had to bounce around a bit. But some of the shops were pretty unimpressive. Great advice though! Glad to hear you have a good shop local to you.
walk mode for hike-to terrain / side-country (T2 KickingHorse, Baldy Snowbird, the Ridge Taos, Gold Hill Chutes Telluride) or if you have to hike back to the resort after playing out of bounds, and in Europe where you ski into the middle of small towns and explore or take busses and trains and funiculars to get to the slopes, kind of depends on where you ski...
Totally agree, also for ski photographers or ski patrol I could see it being useful. Thanks for watching!
I have last year’s Salomon s pro 130 and I have a normal med arch and thinner to med feet and I love them. Fully heat moldable so I did that and felt perfect all last season. Anyone with a similar foot they are def worth trying.
Awesome, the materials and buckles felt very premium when I tested them. Thanks for the info!
I had to get rid of that strap thing across the liner instep. After that they felt great. I was coming off some K2 Mindbenders which I liked but got so soft I thought they were broken. Really like the flex pattern in the Salomon. Highly recommend.
Just picked some Salomon S Pro 130's. Super nice boots. Also had some older S-Max's. I love how Salomon gets such high performance out of a lightweight boot and the easy customization of the fit is great.
Your observation about the cruise one twenty was accurate. I owned it 5 seasons. One of the most comfortable boots i've ever been in. It served me well. But it did pack out fairly quickly. And I lost all snap within three or four seasons . (To be fair I'm hard on equipment and flex boots pretty hard )
I upgraded to the technica mach1 130 last year. I purchased them from one of the top boot fitters in lake tahoe. The main fitter there told me that the one twenty cruise Is softer than most true one twenties. After trying on a few more boots recently I believe he is correct. I don't think it's a great choice If you like to rip. But if you're looking for a comfortable cruiser, the cruise one twenty is pretty darn good if it fits you. In my opinion, it's better for a heavier weight less aggressive skier. Even if you're not a particularly big guy, it probably is going to be too soft for you if you're aggressive.
I think that a walk mode is not essential, but it's a VERY nice to have. It adds a lot of flexibility. From a cost perspective, yes, they're more expensive specially when you add the cost of a hybrid touring binding and skins you're talking around 500$ more compared to a normal setup BUT you save in terms of not having to buy 2 different sets of skis and boots if you want to do some touring. So it depends on what is more important. I also think that in terms of flex 110/120 is more than enough for any recreational skier.
I totally agree, mostly I wanted to warn people because when I went to the shops, the touring is just sold as an "upgrade" and I don't think it is necessary for everyone, especially non-touring resort skiers.
Great comment, thanks for the insight!
110/120? No thanks for this guy. 130's all day and would consider higher. I am large and ski fast on hardpack though.
I'm a fan of Dalbello boots, the strap placement is a little different and pulls your heel right into the pocket.
They didn't have my size, but I will try to find a pair to test next chance I get!
You can increase the flex of you Ultras (by about 7-10%) by adding a second screw above the Achilles tendon. They are pre-drilled for it.
I'm also boot shopping these days! It's quite annoying as my foots are small and wide, so I would need a 24.5 in HV, which is not so common. Last year I ended up in 25.5 MV that even after punching a few times were still giving me foot pain.
Same here. Except I am the dreaded 22/22.5 in HV with chicken leg. My forefoot though, needed a few rounds of punching out even with the HV. When will the wide toe box/barefoot shoe thing catch on with ski boots?
oh crap! That's brutal, sorry to hear. My brother actually has wider feet than me, and likes the Fischer Rangers and the Salomon's. They might be worth trying if that's helpful info! Thanks for watching and sorry to hear about your boots!
I couldn't agree, more, my close friend has Bunions and really struggles with this as well.
@@RicketySkiReviews thanks I'll check it out! I'll just take an appointment at the best boot fitter in the region and hope for the best
I'm moving from renting once a year to taking my kids for their first season and this video was really helpful. I've watched several fitting guides but hearing how you personally navigate things adds another dimension. It also reduces my anxiety about what to expect. I'm in Colorado looking for a boot fitter now as fitting is consistently recommended for a relative newbie like me. I had a bad experience in my last rentals where my calves were in terrible pain. Turns out I have a 15" calf on a 5'7" frame (athletic) and I need to be extra careful which boot I start with. I'll need to see what the fitter says and try them on, but the Atomic Hawx Prime is an early frontrunner along with the Dalbello Panterras, based on a few other folks sharing a positive experience with similar foot/calf sizes. I'll be looking for some internet deals on last year's models too if possible. Great job getting that deal!
Maybe I'm missing something, but there aren't enough people on RUclips talking about ski gear like this. There are a few good shops posting videos that aren't just marketing. I've only found one other channel that talks about things like this from a neutral perspective. Keep it up.
Thanks so much for your nice comment! That's actually a super common problem, you can adjust the buckles so that there's more room for the calves on the top 2 buckles.
Totally agree with you on the touring walk mode, so unnecessary for a majority of people. I’m a boot fitter and ski in the Atomic Hawx ultra 120 . Hawx are a fantastic range of ski boots. One I did like last season was the Nordica pro machine. I have also noticed the clogg on the new ultra XTD with boa is different to the original in my opinion. The Salomon s pro alpha is a good boot too and is slightly higher on the instep than it’s big brother the s pro .
Oh cool, I have the same boot now but in the Prime
Elliot, kudo's for probably your best and most useful video to date. Lot's of good info and insight on boots in this one. A pretty good and typical description of a general consumers boot buying experience (ie.. all over the map). I consider myself close to an expert on boots at this point in my life due to lots of boot buying experience recently and very narrow feet that are hard to find a snug enough boot. My first bit of advice is great purchase and you have Atomic Mimic liners in those boots. Mimic liners "must" be heat molded if you want to optimize them. They have a hard outer surface around the ankles that is designed to be heated and conform to your foot. They may feel fine now, but they will feel better if you heat mold just the liners. Typically you will pay $25 at a shop for that, worth it. Don't need to heat mold the shells, but they are designed for it, so if there are any spots that need to be bigger, put on the local spot padding and heat mold the shells too.
I would add on the XTD boots with walk mode, you give up some boot precision due to the use of light weight plastic and the walk mode. Don't buy it unless you need it, like you said. I have a skinning set up, so I have a resort boot (Atomic Redster Club Sport) and the Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD. There is a huge difference in how they ski.
The Atomic Redster Club Sport and the Head Raptor are probably the best skiing resort boots on the market. I am a little surprised you don't consider those. It will take your skiing to a new level for sure. They do come in 130 flex and 110 flex. The flex is really about 10 points above what their rated numbers are. So if you want 120 flex, buy the 110. These are all day race boots and not a plug boot. If you have a medium volume/ wider foot you will need some boot work done, so that is a decision for sure in what to buy. My narrow foot slips right in.
I have spent most of my life in Langes, like you, and although I still like them, companies like Atomic now offer plug narrow, all day race narrow, narrow, medium, and wide. Something for everyone if the shape agrees with your foot. Heat molding is a game changer allowing boots to expand where needed on your foot. They don't get snugger, but do get looser with heat. A lot of consumers can fit into a narrower boot than before without extensive boot work due to heat molding.
As many boots as you evaluated, you probably only touched on 40% of what's on the market. Seems like you got a good boot that will work well for you for a great price. Again, I urge you to heat mold the mimic liner, you will be pleased for sure even if you don't feel like you need it. The hard mimic plastic will not break in to your foot without the heat, like older liners would do.
Lastly, I have read from a reliable source that the new Lange Shadow boot needs to be skied to actually "feel" the improvements made in it. Just trying them on in a shop won't feel much different. I think you were a little hasty on your video on those boots. I don't have a good sense of how much better they are, certainly not game changing, but they have been described as softer flexing for the same ski reaction as a stiffer boot. Again, not a huge deal in the overall scheme of things.
Great insight! Thanks for letting me know about the Atomic Liners, I'm sure you've saved me quite a bit of future heartbreak! I didn't try those Redster or Head Boots because they weren't available in any of the local stores I visited. Perhaps in more Race Heavy shops I would see them? I have tried Head raptors years and years ago, and I don't remember the specifics but they didn't quite fit me.
I agree 100% about the Lange Shadows. I've reached out to Lange Directly to see if I can get a testing pair to put on snow to give a more full assessment. I'm reluctant to spend $750 on a boot that didn't feel great for my feet in the store. I just wanted to give my initial reaction in the store to say that the flex felt a bit weird and the fit didn't feel quite as onbrand as the LX120.
Thanks again for your valuable insight!
I had an athletes “walk mode” break. It wouldn’t stay clamped down. The boot is essentially broken until that piece can be fixed/replaced. Also custom footbeds are crucial for me. But I’ve been on my same sure-foot customs for 13 years. Last Booster straps are definitely the best bang for buck upgrade you can do to a boot.
Omg this is my biggest fear, it just looks like one more thing to break! What kind of footbeds did you get?
Got the XTD 130 last spring. My skinny legs need the spoilers to make the boot fit correctly, and these are the first boots that I have the spoilers in. In the past I have had to pay too much attention to not end up in the back seat, and by the time I noticed it, it was time for some wizardy to get back on to the drivers seat. Now with the spoilers i do get an early feel that I might end up tailgunning (too much).
One other thing: after initial break-in of the boots for 5-10 days, I suggest get the liners baked. I had mine done, and while it did not make a world of difference, it improved the overall fit close to perfection. The harder plastic at the upper part of the cuff on the liner molds to rounder shape, so it has a more uniform support around the shin. And this helps in keeping the tongue in place, also pushing the heel back slightly better. The heel pocket got tiny adjustment in the making, too, better filling the tiny contours now. The tongue also got the slightest shape adjustment on the ankle.
The wife had the same problem with the s/pro boa 105 on one foot, apparently the adjustable tongue fixed it completely.
I'm replacing my k2 recon 120 mv with touring boots that are more resort oriented, the Atomic Hawx XTD 120 and I'm adding the gnar bar (replaces the walk mode lever) atomic sells to make them a stiffer inbounds boot while being able to use them for short out of bounds tours. Decent solution for a resort focused but backcountry curious skier.
Oh cool, the Gnar bar is new to me, thanks for the info!
i have last years Hawk 130 prime. amazing boot. this year they didn't even change the color lol. same boot. I really like how consistent the flex is no matter the temp. spring skiing at 60 felt basically the same as 0
That's awesome! Isn't that funny? I can remember in 2006/2007 Volkl upgraded their Racetiger skis, and the only difference was on the topsheet instead of having 3 claws by the tiger, the 2007 had 4 claws, lolll
Hey! I also got the Atomic Hawx but mine are the Ultra S 120. I needed the narrow fit, which is the Ultra line, so like you said probably the Prime line are the wider fit. I absolutely love their fit. My shop offered free moulding but I don’t even need it.
On the other hand, I did get a footbed in them but for me it was to improve arch support which I usually have orthopédie soles. I don’t want to use them in ski bots because they are super hard and I know my feet would hurt skiing with them.
Oh, I also got last years model which for me is not a problem since I need narrow fit in 295. My problem is more that most shops only have a couple models with these specs so I was lucky the Atomics were a good fit.
Awesome, great find!
I have a super high arch and have had trouble with the top of my foot in a lot of boots, trouble getting in and out of boots. My bootfitter recommended Dalbello Panterra 120 because of the liner design. I haven't been out on them, but they feel wonderful so far. YMMV.
awesome, I'd be curious to know how Lange fits you.
@@RicketySkiReviews I skied Langes last year, and they fit great once I could get into them. The Dalbello is like putting on slippers in comparison!
I’ve got K2 Mindbender boots. I thought walk mode was going to be awesome for moving around the resort, and wrangling kids. It’s not. It really is a touring specific feature. For the ski-dad, Gripwalk is a meaningful upgrade, but walk modes are not.
That's how it was sold to me as well!
I have the normal Hawx prime 120s and radical pros as a touring boot. I don't see why you'd get a crossover boot as a touring boot if you're not an expert and a charger, a real "beefy" touring boot is way better on the ups and decent on the down (and you can usually tilt them forward more if you value the downs).
I may get an Hawx prime Xtd 120 or 130 when I retire the current one (for sale in the summer), but not as a touring boot, just to be more comfortable when walking toward a freeride spot in the resort and to drive my qst echo harder in the resort (fitted them with tectons).
I just bought 2022/23 K2 Revolver team they where in store demo but never touched snow for 250.00 CAD/185.00 USD and the price last year was around 600.00 CAD
Woah!
So i bought the atomic hawx 130 wide (2020 i believe )... I tried on the regular version in the shop and then order the wide version online, because I've had the pinching on the top of the foot as you mentioned and I've also had pinching on a drawn out navicular bone in the past... It turned out to be kind of a huge mistake.
I got the 27.5 like always but my foot was moving around in the boots, after a while...I realized it more this season when I got heavier skis. So anyway i ordered a liner sleeve, toung shims and put in a volume reducer just to have them be useable.
I like the atomic fit also.
My question is:.the prime that you ordered, is it designed for extremely wide feet ?... I had my foot measured and it's 103 wide(at ball) right foot and 99 on left foot..is your foot similar width? I might look into these atomics you are talking about because I definitely need an upgrade and want to hit a home run this time around!!
try the atomic boots in 27.5 prime (102mm) or maybe the ultra (100mm) the widths are for 27.5 sizes and then if they feel ok just head mold the liners and shells for better fit if they feel a bit too narrow. else, just try something from tecnica, nordica or k2. i work in a ski shop and they have a nice feeling from my experience, depends wich one fits you better for your foot shape. k2 also has a more progressive flex feeling. i skied the k2 mindbender 130s and they feel more flexible than my nordica strider 130 elite. just try as many as possible and then custom mold them for your feet or even modify them.
Prime is MV boot, for LV they have Magna line.
For me, the Solomon felt good in the shop, but on the hill stabbing pain.
After putting up with them for one season I sold them and went back to Lange.
I have just had a day on Salomon s/pro 120. Omg they forced me forward when standing in line. This was a bad line day with 30 minute queues and I am in agony. Back of the boot was too high up my calf.
All things I didn’t notice in the shop
Omg, that's brutal, I'm sorry hope you both have found better boots. Yeah That's why I'm careful with flex! In the warm ski shop, I feel like an olympic ski racer! But when it's 10 below, I realize I don't need boots too overly stiff.
@@RicketySkiReviews has another day on them and I think it may be the custom insole I was upsold. They lift up the heel so tipping me more forward than the boot alone. To be fair these are great boots while actually skiing
Last year was my first ski season at the age of 34. I walked in a ski shop and got sold the K2 mindbender 100. I didn’t know what I needed at the time. The reason I started skiing is to find something to burn some calories in the rainy season in Vancouver. Alpine skiing for a season actually made my fitness worse. My base fitness was a lot better than my skill so I never got to the stage where I could ski aggressively.By the end of the season, I learned enough about skiing and figured out I could do ski touring. Luckily i don’t have to buy touring boots because my current boots are already compatible with touring
That's awesome!
When it comes to boots, besides the naming, also i get really annoyed by the flex number!
Why is it so hard to define flex as an industry standard!?
My recommendation would be to define it with the help of an L-shaped contraption with a hinge at the corner (similar to a crash test dummy). The vertical lever does get pushed by a horizontal piston / motor at a height of 40cm above the hinge. The force needed to push the artificial shin forward by 15 cm is the flex number. This would mean direct comparability between boots and it is an actually relevant figure...
Another thing is the last size: how is it defined? On a ski boot, where fit is so important, I would like to see 4 more sizes for fit:
- last height
- last width
- toebox width
- heel width
Omg what a great idea, and I totally agree it's all over the place.
As a former ski racer why do you not ski a 130flex boot? I'm 5' 10 140lb and I'm in the salomon s pro alpha 130's (downsized to 26.5). Personally I went with 130 because I have extreme ankle and foot flexibility and i have tiny ankles so I gotta downsize in a 98mm last boot. Generally I've found that the 130 boots were better made (though I havent tried too many 120's to say whether or not that holds true but it definitely does vs the 100's) I tried the Lange RX 130 and Redster too, though in the redster i'd probably go down to 120 or 110.
About people trying to sell you things, Footbeds are pretty important for some types of feet (especially flexible feet that love to slide) though I'm not sure why a shop would want to sell people inferior walk mode or 50/50 boots who aren't explicitly in the market for them unless theyre trying to move product. It's a shame when people try to sell you junk and a lot of people don't know better.
About the Liners though... If they were trying to sell you Zipfit liners, I highly recommend giving those a shot. People have them last over 1000 ski days through multiple shells definitely changes the way bootfitting feels. Definitely recommend looking into them sometime.
I get lucky because the shop I go to is generally empty and the bootfitters there are really good and let me try on everything without a fuss. I wish all bootfitters were in the business of getting you the right education and fit than selling you up. They try too hard to sell things instead of just making it easy to want to buy boots.
I love booster straps. Atomic's pro strap or whatever its called is basically a booster strap, and I know my salomons came with one that was similar though not as strong.
10:25 you talk about the low instep height. The Spro Alpha came out I believe last year to fix the old Smax fit. They have it with the boa. Did you try the S/Pro Supra 120? (I think thats what it's called) Basically the tongue of the liner should have the white plastic there and you can adjust it to increase the instep height. That thing stabbing you was definitely the tongue. Of course, everything is how it fits your foot, just know that the newest salomons are REALLY adjustable because of so many people having the same fitment issues you did.
Good deal on the Atomic boots you got there. Nice. Every "serious (110+ flex alpine)" boot I've tried has seemed pretty solid so it's nice that the industry is in a good spot with boots. Shame how bootfitters can make skiing miserable for people who don't know what theyre doing and it's also hard to support local shops since paying retail for ski boots is highway robbery.
Would be interested in you demoing some 3 piece boots like the Full tilts or dalbellos I always wondered why people raved about them despite the performance hits, and I think you looking at Touring boots would be neat.
I’m definitely going to be getting ZipFits when my current stock liners in my Atomic Hawx Ultras begin to pack out. Don’t want to replace them in my fairly new ski boots until necessary though, as that feels wasteful! Heard so many good things about the ZipFits.
Definitely no walk mode
Great recommendations and insights, I will try to reply as much as I can.
I went with the 120 flex just because it felt like plenty, flex is tricky to gauge when you're trying boots in the summer/ fall (when they're the cheapest). I also ski with my kids and spend long days skiing in the woods, so as much as I love pinning it on the race turns in the groomed runs, I don't need them to be that reactive all the time, and I'd rather have a comfortable flex, that still will get me to the full arc of the turn. I also add the worldcup booster straps onto the boots which adds a bit to the flex, so I kept with the same 120 flex as my Langes (the atomics felt pretty similar flex wise).
The upsells were especially noticeable since they started before I even had boots on my feet! Like how do you know I even need half this stuff before we've even started.
Thanks so much for your insight! I'm wearing my boots now to try and break them in early!
@sokolva, I have too! I'm only wary of them because I had lace up liners when I raced and really disliked them from a practical level of getting boots on and off, but maybe they've improved since then!
Flex depends on how you ski and what you want. 120 is an all around great flex for me all mountain.
😢help..I have a lot of problems...#1 can I replace the liner with a fur insole,that crap that comes in the boots are not warm enough for me...and CAN I hack off the top half of the boot.. I started skiing in the alps in leather boots and I control my turns with my ankles,not my knees....put me back on the slope again 😢
Agree with you on the tecnicas. Great boot. Luckily they fit my foot perfectly. Langes do not fit my foot. The instep is higher on Tecnicas.
Oh awesome, a good fitting boot should never be taken for granted! lol
I have to laugh when you got to the Nordica Cruise, that’s the boot I ended up with for my wide flat feet with its 102 last. I can’t remember but I thought you had narrower feet. Also I like the cruise in 120, I had got another pair just before finding them witch was the dalbello pantera 120, I liked but the cruise fit me better after a half hour. I skied in the cruise open to close one day 9-8pm no problems at all.
That's awesome! I thought my foot was narrow, but as I get older I'm finding it's spreading out more.
Yes, I kind of thought the Nordica's wouldn't be a fit, but I wanted to be diligent and try everything so I could give insight for the video.
Very well made boot, I liked the smooth flex, just wasn't a good fit for my foot type.
Thanks for watching, cheers!
I dont believe in dual purpose boots. If you are a serious about touring your touring boot will be too light for resort skiing. Your resort boot will benefit greatly from higher weights that accompany a durable package. I ski a Tecnica Mach 130 HV and a Salomon MTN S/Lab. Total spend with footbeds is about $1800 canadian. Crazy really. Congratulations on your boot deal. That's an amazing bit of shopping.
Woah! Yes, I agree, I think the shops and marketing teams are doing a disservice selling the feature as an "upgrade".
Maybe also good to mention that if you go for a tour booth you also want a tour or hybrid binding. So that the save system of the biding really does the job. Which is not always the case if you put a tour booth in a normal alpine binding 😇
Totally agree, I have just seen it kind of mis-sold to resort skiers as an "upgrade" for comfort in walking around the lodge lol.
Have you tried the Nordica hf 120 Pro? I bought a pair this summer, and the comfort is off the charts but the flex is noticeably softer flex than my other boots (which I am keeping) Nordica Fire Arrow F3. Last winter I also bought a couple of more pairs of skis Rossignol Experience 86 ti (the grip on firm snow was the best I have ever felt, even compared to race skis I have had in the past) and Volkl Blaze 86 (which I found great in the soft spring snow, more smeary in the moguls than the Rossies) but still decent grip on the firm snow. I am concerned that the grip and high speed stability of the Rossies will suffer from the softer flex of the Hf boots. Thinking maybe switching boots during the season depending on conditions. Sorry about the long post.
Hard to say without actually getting on snow, but there are a couple of things I think you can do in the back of the boot for flex, or you could consider throwing some booster straps on! Great ski recommendations, I will definitely try to test this winter if I can.
just because people seen boots get put into a oven in 1 ski related program or video, doesnt mean any custom fitted boot needs to go into one, actually it ruins the integrity of the material a bit so the boot will have a shorter lifetime altering its structural integrity.
I talked to a couple of people who have said it's just as good, if not better to just break in your boots by wearing them. Seems accurate to my experience, but I've never gone the oven route before either lol.
Not every boot is made from material that is designed to but baked in an oven. I have worked with Salomon Custom HD shells that are specifically designed to be heated in an oven. Other brands like Nordica or Tecnica can be heated in certain areas and stretched or punched out if necessary to conform to your feet. We usually recommend you ski a few days if possible then return to customize certain areas that you feel need it. Also not every liner is heat moldable. Usually we heat up heat moldable liners on heat stacks which are like heat guns we don’t put them in the oven. We haven’t had any issues with Salomon Custom HD shells that we have heated in the oven.
I think im gonna try new boots i tried like 8 pairs and still feel minorly uncomfortable in my nordicas and then just slightly better when underload...
What have you tried so far?
I'm looking at a pair of K2 recon 120 LV. They're a steal on L9 right now. Any experience with them? I can't find a ton of reviews on them.
When I tried the Mindbenders they said they didn't have the Reckoner in my Size. But I need to go back and get my skis mounted, so maybe I'll see if they have the 2024's in stock and try to report back if I can.
Another thing that is important to remember is that when it comes to skiing, boots are the most important piece of gear. So it's worth spending a bit more on boots, even if that means saving on your other gear. A bad fitting boot can ruin a whole season.
Update: just got a pair of atomic hawx prime 110s at the ski swap. Best heel hold of any boot I tried. The Nordica speed machine 120 was very close. I'm excited to see how they perform this year!
Haha I know exactly what shop had an hour wait. I didn’t know what I was doing so I waited quite a bit haha
Ha
I just got a pair of atomic hawks magna 80, walking around the house it hurts a bit on the top of my foot and I think my left foot is a bit bigger than my right one, if feels like the size is a bit too tight for my left foot.
oh dang, the place I ordered mine said I could return as long as I don't ski on them, so hoping you're able to return as well if the fit is off.
80 is a very soft flex, for beginners or the park.
Touring boots are for touring... but you use it to take buses?
I noticed last winter that my (very) old Nordicas (Beast 10) liner fillings were shot. So, I bought cheapo new Nordicas (Sportmachine 90x) and put it's liners to my oldies and all was ok, those old ones btw have Boosters on as just normal thing. But the new onese did not have. Both boots fit the same but the new ones were all too upright, so I made my diy spoilers on them and I have skied with those...but still, the old boots are the ones until they really break up somewhere. One thing you did not say: most of boots are now ugly, and if they are not, the colours at least are.
Oh man, swapping liners with shells, you're sailing in dangerous waters, I've seen ski racers cry from trying to do that, but cheers if it works!
@@RicketySkiReviews Ha, I even took both ones to slope, old and new boots and that way did some valuation, so--> new boot on another and old on another feet. Did not make a swap there thou. That was: "old was plenty better but if I get the angle right, new is skiable"
When I was in my teens(?) I broke the walk mode twice on one pair of boots. Since then, I just see it is something else that can break on a boot. If you don't need it, skip it.
My friend coaches big mountain and he said he's seen the same thing happen a few times.
Im in the same area as you and am going to try and get some new boots. Any particular shops you recommend?
Lol I thought this guy was gonna tell me how to tour without a tour boot
If I can figure that out I'll be on a yacht somewhere.
You are so lucky that your feet fell fine without a quality footbed.
Whoa....you used a shop's stock of boots as a personal fitting room and then bought somewhere else?
No, I went to like 4 different shops to try everything out there, and then the ones I liked they didn't have any 2023 inventory. If money was no object I would have bought from the shop, but they didn't have 2023 models which were $300 vs $600+.
I still bought my skis from that shop and get work done and do my demos with them regularly. As much as it isn't ideal, I still try to support local businesses whenever I can.
I'm pretty surprised to hear you are skiing a 120 after hearing your height, weight and racing background. I'm 6'4" but only 170 and have been skiing the atomic hawx ultra 130. I don't have a racing background and usually end up in the bumps or in the trees. Ps I have a friend who is 5'6 140 and skis a technicia mach 1 130 and is the best bump skier I have ever seen in person. It's interesting to see what people are using.
Yeah idk, it seems to work fine for me, I also use the 130 for the touring version of the boot.
@@RicketySkiReviews been loving the channel, keep up the good work. Hoping to hear your opinion of more skis this winter
Insoles.... don't get me started. Every shop pushes them hard. They do improve the feel but they are so overpriced
Best $40 upgrade I ever made to my boots!
I agree! I think they're fine if people like them, but like, I hadn't even figured out which boots I would buy! Let alone if they needed an insole upgrade. lol
@@miamiole $40?… where do you shop? Any shop near me pushes the $80+ custom orthotics
For me with very flat feet insoles are essential. Otherwise I don't have enough volume on the top of my feet to fill the boot
Do *_NOT_* skimp on ski boots. A good fit needs investment of knowledge, time, and money _(in that order of priority)_ . If you know, you know… for everyone else, find a boot fitter.
Next video will have my unboxing! I agree, though I do think ordering 2023 boots from last season is a good way to save money without compromising on quality.
Ordering online is cool, as long as someone involved in the process knows how to do at least a proper shell fit.
Knowing about ski boot mfgr tendencies also helps... some brands better for narrow or wide last, high or low volume foot, high or low calf muscle, etc., etc.
Don't think most consumers know when a hotspot can be taken care of, or a different boot should be used.
Setting up canting angles not all that important IMHO, unless you really want to feel special about yourself.
Again, having boot fitting experience in the loop can make skiers want to stay with it. Cheers.
'Unless you go touring all the time or stand around a lot, do you need walk mode?' No. Who told you that? Let me guess - a salesperson? Isn't it just common sense to only need walk mode if you walk a lot in them? Seems a no-brainer to me.
Unfortunately it's been treated by marketing teams and sales people as an "upgrade" to the base model boot. I wanted to clarify, so that people aren't spending money on gear that won't serve them.
LANGES BABY!
I know, this is my first time leaving lange in 30 years and I'm sweating bullets tbh
I love my Tecnica boots hate Lange atomic or Salomon. Cochise 130 great boot and I need it for back up backcountry boot side country list goes on. It’s like having a leather man compared to a butter knife. I don’t agree with you because you seem to cater to Salomon and atomic. Atomic boots are garbage and cheap. Touring boots last longer too in regards to the soles. Employee cost is same for Tecnica no matter what flex so the offer a better overall quality than any other company and yes I use to fit boots for a living .
Totally she seems like a great skier!
Because as a ski shop guy that Worked out East....you should know better......too many peeps come in and try stuff on and buy online and then take away the ability to do it right! and Our time is worth something right? And your videos are entitled and by god did you not remember what you dealt with? Know that your crushing it on youtube and need content I find your videos not helpful....
I would be all for buying in the shop, but Straight up the price difference is staggering $450 vs $900, because no shop in my area still had 2023 boots available for purchase. I get your point, but just being realistic with you the $450 is a lot of money, and I don't need to have current year boots.
If they have it though I'm all for buying local. I bought my Atomic Maverick 88Ti's at my local shop! they let me demo and then use that money towards the purchase, I think it's a great way to buy skis. I support local business when I can, but in this case it wasn't viable.
I have to respond to that. I also worked in sports shops and I hate when people ask you to « encourage » local shops by paying more money for the same product or buying a product that doesn’t fit as well because they don’t have the best one in stock (seen that plenty as well).
First off, most local shop where I live have almost nothing left from last year, which means they are selling plenty and doing well financially. If not, then it’s a management problem, which is not my problem.
Then, from what I know, nobody is stupid enough to buy the exact same product online AFTER he tried it at the local shop if the shop was selling for the same price. I mean we all prefer leaving with the product in our hands. Also, as he said, he got them as a deal for last years model. You are really saying people should pay more for something (in this case double Tue amount) to « support » local shops? I mean might as well just donate 450$ and still buy the boots online?!?!!
Lastly, I went shopping for a very specific need at a few local shops last week. One of them, I waited 20 minutes and wasn’t able to get any help because of all the 5 people there, only one was apparently knowledgeable in skis….it’s a ski shop, that’s all they sell and it was a weekday with only one other client in the place. The second shop wanted to sell me oh a great deal yes but not what I wanted, they just didn’t exactly carry what I was looking for. Then the third one, which is where I purchased most of my stuff locally (never skis though), the guy was again trying to sell me into skiing 110 in the NE because he loves wide skis and that’s all he can sell. Of all the sales guys in all those shops, I found none of them was really trying to guide me towards the best solution, like I see in the Ski Essential reply’s on RUclips. All they try is to push me one of the product that either is usually an easy sell (Enforcers, Bent, etc) or they sell what they personally like.
So please drop your narrative of « support » local shops at all costs and work on your customer experience. Then you won’t need to whine and ask for « help » (charity in fact) and people will not only buy but also RECOMMEND your shop.
Just another reason to snowboard brother
Oh man, I do miss my snowboarding days, had a Burton Indie board with Flow Bindings, and DC Phantom 3's with the air pump. That was living.