Is A Dreamcast HDMI Mod Needed For The Best RetroTink 4K Experience?
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- When I heard the RetroTink 4K would support HDMI input sources I was excited to get all of my systems upgraded to HDMI to get the best possible experience out of them! Having done so, I have quickly realized that for many systems the experience isn't vastly different from the original cables I had been employing before the mods. Starting with the Sega Dreamcast, I want to show you comparisons between both options and offer my opinion on the matter so you may be better informed before spending more money than you might need to. In this Video, The Black Dog Tech DC Digital, PixelFX DC Digital HW2, and Retro Gaming Cables Dreamcast Component Cables are used with the RetroTink 4K.
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RetroTink 4K Playlist: • RetroTink 4K Showcase ...
RetroTink 4K Product Page: www.retrotink.com/product-pag...
Dreamcast Video Options shown/mentioned in today's video
RGC Component Cables: www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/s...
DCDigital HW2: www.pixelfx.co/product-page/d...
Beharbros Dreamcast Products: www.beharbros.com/dreamcast
Time Stamps:
0:00 - Intro
1:49 - Dreamcast HDMI Mods I Am Covering
2:18 - BDT DC Digital Overview
5:24 - RT4K Profile
5:34 - 240P Test Suite (BDT DC Digital)
5:56 - 240P Test Suite (RGC Component Cables)
7:01 - BDT DC Digital Vs RGC Component Cables Comparisons (Soul Calibur)
9:49 - BDT DC Digital Vs RGC Component Cables Comparisons (Crazy Taxi)
13:36 - BDT DC Digital Vs RGC Component Cables Comparisons (Air Force Delta)
16:43 - BDT DC Digital Vs RGC Component Cables Comparisons (BangaiO)
20:42 - My Thoughts About The 2 Options
21:20 - DC Digital HW2 Overview
23:36 - DC Digiatl HW2 VS RGC Component Cables Comparison (Dead or Alive 2)
27:01 - DC Digiatl HW2 VS RGC Component Cables Comparison (Sega GT)
29:39 - DC Digiatl HW2 VS RGC Component Cables Comparison (Air Force Delta)
32:11 - DC Digiatl HW2 VS RGC Component Cables Comparison (BangaiO)
35:02 - My Thoughts About The 2 Options
35:57 - Dreamcast Video Options
38:23 - Closing Thoughts/Support
Video transitions made by Zachary of andyshat.com
This video was possible thanks to my friends that support me on Patreon.
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For someone like me who stays in a country where retro console mods are virtually nonexistent, I'm glad to see (good)component cable paired with the Tink 4K offer fantastic picture quality. The difference between the HDMI mod and the component is very minimal IMO. One thing I noticed is the audio, the difference was quite noticeable to my ears, HDMI was clean while the component sounded a bit muffled. This was a great video and helped answer some of my questions regarding getting an HDMI mod or not. The only thing left now is to save up for the Tink 4K, happy gaming everyone.
The Hyperkim cable really function very well on moderns tv's for Dreamcast; the Dreamcast is incredible!!! I agree with you, we don't need spend much money on modifications...
Great work on this video.
Thanks for checking it out!
Great video! This is hugely helpful.
I really liked this video. I personally have both devices and have found them to be nice together. Although the RT4K has made these mods unneeded (for video usually anyways), I find they are still amazing for digital audio. Hearing the native 44.1kHz straight from the Dreamcast sounds a lot better in my setup than using the default RCA cables. I've been having really nice similar results with the PS1 HDMI mods.
Audio is the definite winner!
Awesome idea for a video series! Can you elaborate more why you prefer the HW1?
Great video, How are you recording your game plays. Is it straight to the capture card from the RT4 ? My ElGato 4k pro does not look as good as yours when capturing. Wondering what I'm doing wrong. TIA
You alluded to it briefly. But I'd like to add that I have tested a number of Retro-Access cables and RGC cables for mutliple consoles. I have found the Retro-Access cables to be of a significantly higher quality than RGC. RGC does not use 75 ohm coax in their cables which has made them highly susceptible to signal noise / cross-talk. I have experienced audio buzz and picture noise in a number of their cables (mind you I have only tested their SCART cables, I have not had their DC Component cables). Those issues are not present in the Retro-Access equivelants including both the Fortraflex and multicore coax variants.
For context, these tests were conducted using the RetroTink 5X-Pro and the audio extracted via optical cable to an audio DAC for Sennheiser HD-650 headphones.
I know the owner of Retro-Access has fallen on hard times, but it is well worth the price and wait to get his cables.
SIde note for owners of PS1 owners. Regardless which cable you use, you may still have a very tiny small audio buzz during brighter scenes. Mind you this buzz may only be heard if you're using high-end audiophile grade headphone equipment with the volume turned up higher than usual listening volume. However, I have found it is signifantly quieter with Reto-Access cables and the quetest being on the PSone slim model. The 7500 and 5500 models I tried, had a little more noise than the slim. I suspect that any noise that could be introduced by the cable is eliminated with Retro-Access, but the remaining buzz is originating from the console itself.
The RGC cables will have much louder audio buzz and is noticable during normal listening volume and casual speaker equipement (RGC cables introduce additional noise).
I know that was quite the text wall. But I hope the information is helpful.
Points out the importance of cable quality quite nicely!
Does hd retrovision still have plans to release dc component cables?
Yes
@@swungsolid I'd be interested in giving their cables a go once released.
Same
I use the RGC Component cables into my RT5X. Same quality as RGC Scart and HD15-2-Scart adapter using a generic VGA cable into it. It’s about convenience and what you need for your setup. I have component switchers so I sold off the other two and got those.
For anyone dealing with wavy lines in their video signals it’s because 1) you’re using a DreamPSU etc and the included power supply is unshielded garbage so toss it and use a better one or 2) you’re using a cheap Dreamcast to HDMI Adapter which is also likely unshielded. The waves are ground loop interferences.
But for this video I noticed the HDMI modded image was darker right away. Of course the TINK can fix some of that but it shouldn’t be necessary at that price.
If you add the mClassic you get some antialiasing benefits but I wouldn’t recommend it on darker themed games as it can make them harder to see.
The hype was unreal when these hdmi mods came out. I bought into it and have an ultrahdmi, DCdigital, n64digital, PS1Digital, wiidual, and a ps2digital. My feelings on them these days is that the cleaner image you get from removing analog noise is far into the deep end of diminishing returns. Digital audio is worth the trouble. But I don't recommend them to anyone unless it's in an effort to simplify their setup. As in they don't want to even learn what RGB, Scart, or any other retro jargon like that even means. No analog cables and equipment, just hdmi. In that sense it can be absolutely worth it to have setup that's nearly plug and play.
My first hdmi mod was the Ultrahdmi. At the time I didn't have an RGB modded N64 and I was blown away by how good NES and Snes looked with RGB. When I first powered on the Ultrahdmi I thought the thing was broken. It looked so very terrible. It took me a bit, but I figured out the N64 is one of the worst systems for scaling up that there is.
N64 requires the CRT look more than any other systems that's for sure
I have to say what stands out significantly is the audio between hdmi mod and analogue cables. As an audiophile this would definitely be my reason for hdmi modding.
I remember asking mike chi on the mlig live stream and he said the only console that benefits drastically from a hdmi mod is the og xbox.
Prettyuch
There's actually a cheaper digital optical audio mod you can do for the Dreamcast if super clean audio is really all you need.
That's definitely a more beneficial mod if you already have a solid VGA cable
Great video as always. The DCDIGITAL has superior clarity for sure. The other connections look absolutely great but, if we are talking which looks better. Yeah digital to digital at least in this case wins. I do agree with your Gem opinion though, it didn't favor as well, as you pointed out.
Yeah, I'm not going to be nice in the gem video... I will be full on showing how crap it was before they finally managed to get it to this new state of mostly useable.
Just want to throw this in for anyone who reads this, I've seriously been enjoying your videos my guy. I didn't discover you until your Tink videos. Absolutely love what your doing and subscribed. Keep it up.@@ArchadesGames
Much appreciated!
just use a retrotink 5x, a Scart Mamba cable from BeharBros, and boom! super clean crisp dreamcast gaming with 0 lag.
So for the tink4k am I better off grabbing a beharbros box over the RGC component cables? I already own the component cables
Nah, results are actually about the same just stick with the component cables for now
🙂 If I own the PAL Dreamcast version I let it output RGB over SCART. (I live in the UK) 🙂 If I've got the RetroTINK 4K (If I have 4K) then I would scroll down to the TINK 4K's settings so I can get the best out from an upscaler.
Just curious why you got rid of the Toro.
Seems like it may have been a better overall situation than the RGC cable, but I might be wrong here.
I had two HDMI modded Dreamcast and had a friend who needed a new cable for their DC 😅
IMO: consoles where HDMI upgrades would be very useful for scaling purposes
Super NES Jr or non-1-Chip
Genesis (no need for triple bypass)
N64 (bring it from the clutches of composite)
Xbox (noisy and generally bad analog)
Wii (480p pixel fix doesn't work on all consoles)
everything else has decent picture and doesn't need hdmi if it's paired with a scaler. But if you're not using a scaler, absolutely consider HDMI mods.
Genesis would be curious to see! For SNES Jr/N64 RGB mods are also very adequate when paired with a scaler. Xbox/Wii are definitely improved and I would like to add GameCube to the mix since official cables are to expensive!
Greetings! thank you very much for the Video! you have a new subscriber :) i also have an dc digital modded dreamcast and the retrotink 4k....can you please tell me what do you think is the best setting for this? set dc digital output to 480p and use the dc digital sharp profile from firebrand x?? do you think that will bring the best possible picture? and is the 480p output of the dc digital then the correct aspect ratio? because when i set it to 960p the image is wider horizontally..thank you very much!
Set to 480 and use FBX's profile yup!
@@ArchadesGames thank you! so you thin setting the dc digital output to 960p or 1080p makes no sense?
No reason to let another scaler mess with the base image first.
My HW2 shows 2.1.45 as the most recent firmware update. Are you downloading from the "testing" channel or "stable" channel?
You need the testing channel for the direct mode to appear
@@ArchadesGames Alright, I'm going to give that a try when I get back home. I have issues updating firmware on HW2... A lot of checksum errors and failures. I think I'm using the Wi-Fi adapter from HW1. But I don't think that should matter since it says the connection is 100%
I had to try for about half an hour to update to the new version last night after this vid was released. I think it's a hardware problem more than anything.
@@ArchadesGames I've found that I must put HW2 in 'Cable Detect Mode', restart DCDigital, and set resolution to VGA in order to have a successful firmware update. This could be coincidence I suppose but I remember seeing a tweet from PixelFX when HW2 was first released that warned about potentially softbricking the unit if you attempt to update the firmware in 'Force VGA mode'. I don't think that the softbrick is still a concern but it was this tweet that led me to try changing the cable setting and resolution. I've updated the firmware twice now with no issue.
Lol that is so shoddy honestly 😅
What is gen lock and what does it do and when do I select this feature over other options?
The RT4K wiki will give you all the info you need on the sync lock methods!
consolemods.org/wiki/AV:RetroTINK-4K#Sync_Lock
@@ArchadesGames Thanks for your input I really appreciate this you need information like this to really understand what you’re doing to have better quality of your display and to know what works best for every console or cable you have available.
Triple buffer might look or work better than Frame lock in certain situations etc.
Now is there a difference between dc hw2 and dc retro gem? Or is gem just a renamed hw2?
They use the same firmware
Can you talk a little more about why you prefer DCDigitial to DCDigital HW2? Is it primarily due to the way the Retrotink 4K manages the passthrough modes? I don't own a Retrotink 4k but have upgraded from the original DCHDMI to HW2. I prefer the HW2 due to increased options regarding resolution, scanlines, and HDR. If Retrotink 4k was not in the picture, would you still prefer the original DCDigital to HW2? I'm just hoping I didn't downgrade in anyway given my use case scenario which does not involve the Retrotink 4k.
Standalone use is a different discussion to using it with a RT4K and the HW2 is better in that area!
@@ArchadesGamesdo you consider HW1 better in this use case just because it has 480i pass-through? Any other benefits? I'm kind of shocked they haven't rolled out direct mode on these mods before now.
480i passthrough is easier to deal with on HW1 than the direct video mode implementation as it stands today on HW2. Using the HW2 in standalone mode also gives you additional points of trouble with the RT4K if you're not using a perfect integer scale or have interpolation turned on in the HW2 OSD. Pixel FX deinterlacing is also a lower quality than RT4k so using it in standalone for 480i isn't ideal. So better to just deal with direct mode for the RT4K and deal with the momentary quirks.
@@ArchadesGames that's kinda depressing. Oh well I guess that means there is no hurry on upgrading my HW1. I bought HW2, but never got around to plopping it in.
Why use an pricy YPbPr-Cable with a converter in it, if all you need is an VGA-Cable?
Why did you compare two times the same mod in different , flavours .. no , rebrands, that fits, ... so why ?
The RGC cables are terrible you can see wavy lines in the output, I can't use them. The Sega VGA box looks HELLA better and the DC digital looks crispy!!
A good VGA/Scart setup will look 99% as good as the HDMI mods! Even this cable hits about 80% there for me.
Interesting I never noticed wavy lines on mine but I do use a consumer sony trinitron and not an upscaler.
I have to say that every second person who owns them complains about them.
Retro rgbs broke.
Mine came with the rca color connectors mixed up and I had to figure it out with trial and error.
Their quality control sucks.
Mine have been great outside of the color shift on green and slight blurring of VGA sources.
Strong disagree, I don't have any issues like that with mine.
I don’t have any wavy lines, mine look phenomenal. I definitely won’t ever need an HDMI mod on the Dreamcast. Xbox and Wii on the other hand.. yeah
Morning friend!
Gabe when is Half-Life 3 coming out?
When this channel gets to 500k subs!