They aren't even subtle about it. When the kids want to do their own pursuits they constantly limited by 'does this please Jahoover?' brow beating through disingenuous smiles.
@Adamant Forge Yep. Basically, telling them that if they don't show absolute loyalty to "Big Brother," a.k.a Jehovah that they will not be allowed into paradise whenever the fecal matter hits the rotating air device.
@@ona512 We DO need to teach our kids not to hop into a stranger’s car etc. And we need to teach them to trust their instincts. That being said, everything that Owen said is perfectly true. CSA mostly occurs when the perpetrator and the child know each other, and when there’s trust.
Super gross that they framed it like the child's conscious will protect them. So if something happens, now it's a moral failure on the part of the kid. Atrocious.
@@CaroAbebe Making it about the kids 'conscience' is what upsets me most. The conscience is for knowing what you're doing is right or wrong, generally in the religious sense anyway, not for assessing threats. They used that word on purpose because they almost always frame children or women as 'seducing' their abusers, and being somewhat to blame for their abuse.
@@Jrpyify Ecxactly, I needed to pause on the very first part and make a ranty comment because it just brought a flood of indoctrination messages back to me and I honestly feel sick.
i found it! it is under this video title: "Sonic Says Sexual Harassment is No Good - HQ" and apparently there are 66 of these shorts under this video title: "Sonic Says / Sonic Sez (ALL 66 Shorts)"
JWs seem to create an environment that would make kids particularly vulnerable, too. They teach kids it's normal to have no kid friends, and that friends can be any age, so they're less likely to think anything's weird when a grown adult wants to hang out with them. They teach kids to decide 'who can be their friends' based on religion first and foremost, so literally all someone has to do is be a Jehovah's Witness and they gain their trust. I've heard a lot of groomers tend to use guilt to keep their parents about the time they're spending together, and JWs have so many rules about literally everything, all they have to do is let the kid play with a wizard toy and they'll be afraid of letting their parents know about the entire encounter because 'what if they find out about the wizard toy'.
The worst part in this video is the word "conscience" - this makes the children think that they are morally guilty if they engage in CSA, that they are responsible, that THEY messed up ... which prevents them from speaking up. It is heartbreaking.
I mean, friends CAN be of any age, but honestly, at this point, being friends with older people of the borg is probably more dangerous than having adult friends outside of the borg >.>
Exactly. This PSA/episode/whatever seems tailor-made to make children more likely to trust an abuser than anything. Almost like it's meant to protect the abusers and bring them more easy prey...
@@Nanashi20 While it's obviously not that hard to understand where the current attitude comes from, it is kinda sad how kids having adults in their lifes they'd be close to in any context outside of guardians, educators, or immediate family has become something we'd default to viewing with apprehension.
@@jondoe7036 This right here, even in the context of what you mentioned as outside of it can also be seen as possible apprehension more often than not nowadays.
Wait, this places all the pressure and responsibility on the victims. There are lots of reasons why children don't report CSA: - A child may not fully understand what's going on. - A child may keep quiet because they're afraid or may have been threatened. - A child may feel guilty because they were overpowered or scared and couldn't just "say NO and run away" as in the video. - A child may feel guilty because they may have found certain parts of the abuse physically pleasurable (bodies react) and feel it's their fault. - A child may feel conflicted because the person doing the abuse is someone Watchtower said they cannot disobey. The C&S video completely ignores what if Mommy, Daddy, or an Elder is causing the abuse. Rather than help, it might actually make things worse. That's why Elders need to stop playing judge & jury and report CSA so victims get access to a LCSW or licensed therapist...
The bad part here is with certain religious groups dont want consent or comprehensive sex ed even being taught. This isnt helping. It seems being taught not to question anything is what they want. Your right here of course.
@@tesmith47 Does there need to be? Most people would know that the post refers to young children and a 17 year old “sex worker” would likely be a victim of sex trafficking or of exploitation and is still deserving of help.
Yes, the VAST majority of CSA perpetrators are known to the victims. But even for rare 'stranger danger' attacks, this JW video is awful and dangerous. I WAS a kid who got attacked out of a clear blue sky by a stranger, and when I told my attacker that I didn't want to be touched, he just threatened to throw me off the apartment building to smash to pieces on the concrete below. To be clear, I wasn't molested in a JW context, but my situation is illustrative of what might occur in a 'stranger danger' situation, and how harmful and outright delusional the JW video is in a number of ways: 1) My attacker didn't start out by being obviously creepy or scary like in the JW video - he just asked me politely for directions to a different part of my own apartment building, then pretended not to understand my instructions and asked me to show him the way; this got me to an isolated part of the building where he could switch to using violent coercion without fear of interruption. By the way, asking children (and adult victims) for some kind of assistance is a common tactic used by 'stranger danger' attackers, and one that the JW video did not warn about. 2) At the time of the attack, I was just 7, i.e. physically small compared to an adult, and I had never been taught how to fight an adult (biting, punching below the belt, etc.); on the contrary, for their own convenience, my parents were REALLY strict about my remaining perfectly still when they picked me up, so I was trained to be exceedingly passive; as a result, I wasn't able to get away from my attacker to escape back to the rest of the building. In this regard, the JW video sets up the absurd expectation that victims will always be mentally/physically able to escape, that attackers will just let a chosen victim go, and that victims bear RESPONSIBILITY for escaping (and GUILT if they don't? That's a horrifying, but logical inference from the video). The JW video also contains no physical self-defence strategies whatsoever. 3) My attacker had planned the location of the attack so that there was no one within earshot to hear me cry and scream and say no again and again for 6 hours, and I was forced me to endure CSA using literal death threats. Again, the JW video just doesn't address the fact that 'stranger danger' type attackers tend to use physical isolation and violent coercion, since they are not depending on grooming to lower their victims' resistance. If you're a child being attacked by an adult stranger, by the time you realise the danger, it's likely that your attacker has already ensured that running away and telling your caregivers is no longer an option. The JW video just fails to take into account the lopsided imbalance of power between a child and an adult molester - a little child like Caleb in the video can't just "not let" an attacker hurt them. Not only does the JW video wrongly emphasise 'stranger danger' as the most likely form of CSA to guard against, but it doesn't even address stranger-perpetrated CSA realistically, usefully or caringly. In fact, by presenting escape from a molester as simple to achieve and a matter of "conscience", it sets children up to blame themselves for the devastating abuse inflicted upon them.
I'm so sorry that monster attacked you. You are absolutely correct in all of your assessments of this abysmal Watchtower Society enabling of abusers within their congregations.
Jesus fuck I'm so sorry that happened to you. Thank you for sharing your story and writing such a thoughtful comment explaining how this shit actually occurs. I hate the world why is r*pe so fucking common 😭💔
I am so sorry about your terrible experience. Thank you for your great courage in sharing it. The JW'S really are utterly ignorant of such matters. Higher education, such as Sociology or Psychology would inform them but this too is denied them. Yet they readily use educated lawyers to defend themselves from having to pay compensation to victims. How twisted and unscriptural they really are. ❤
They are knowingly fostering an environment for grooming. I don't think it's because they want to hurt kids, but because rooting out unethical behavior would start to dismantle the system.
“I would say no” “I wouldn’t let them” Oh ffs. That’s not how it works. Children are small and weak, and amazingly enough, try as they might, they can’t always stop bad people just with the power of their words and “conscience.” Because a lot of the bad people don’t have a fkin conscience and don’t really give a crap if they say no or try to stop them. Besides which, this isn’t on the kids to stop; it’s on the adults around them to protect them from. This is the worst kind of propaganda; can you imagine a child abuse victim seeing this? Can you imagine how it would make them feel?
ya i wouldnt LET em? ok so a guy 6 fet tall grabs me i say oh i WONT LET you? what this a cartoon? BAD GUY: ohh im so sorry i didnt mean to do what i did, PLEASE dont tell my wife shes a police officer. LOL i remember from the movie WEIRD SCIENCE garry and wyatt tell the motorcycle gang to leave. one guy says hes sorry and hes a school teacher and doesnt want lose his job
as a person who was assulted as a child who received no help (nobody even told my parents it happened) I'll tell you, it makes me want to knee the elders responsible for this sentiment in the balls and punch them in the face
I work at a daycare, and if a kid takes another kids things or play with something they shouldn't, I have to pry it out of their hands to restore order, and despite having T-rex arms I can do so easily. Seriously, anyone who claims children can excert power over adults is either a liar or someone who's literally never met a child before.
I literally remember my aunt making me, my cousins, and my sibling practice saying no, I was first and got so surprised when she suddenly grabbed my arm and talked harshly with me. I froze because I wasn’t expecting her to be so intense, but she said I had to harshly pull my arm away and firmly say no, so we went through it a few times. I could barely do it because I was so uncomfortable and honestly not a great actor. How in the world was that supposed to protect us from real life predators? All it did was give me low self confidence for a bit. My family was so clueless but at least they were very passionate about preventing CSA I just wish they knew about all the allegations.
Im not a rapist or nothing, But by the age of 7, simply saying “no” to me meant nothing…. And that was me as a 7 year old kid. I knew that words didn’t do anything, so i used to torment the other kids at school, They’d ask me to stop whatever i did to them, and I’d just scoff at them when the best they had was “no, please, don’t” “No please don’t” is code for I CANT DO ANYTHING ABOUT THIS it was easy to impose myself on other kids, admittedly. Im not the wild kid i was back then anymore, But i know what i did, and I’ve actually learned from the things I’ve done in my life, And i know for a fact, words are just words. The only place where words matter is in a court room or in front of the police. This one guy used to bother me on the playground, Funny enough, he did it with words, When i said stop, i was ignored. A couple weeks later, he broke his arm, and was super vulnerable. I chased this guy around for an entire recess at school, doing nothing but whipping rocks at his broken arm while he begged me to stop…. And guess what, His pleas meant nothing. Dude was older than me, but i made him feel small and pathetic. Its that easy. I threw a few stones and ignored some words…. That was kid-on-kid violence. but it still applies. Words mean nothing, and they wont physically make anybody do anything, No matter how pathetically you beg. Its sad, but true.
Telling how it's only sexual abuse and similar crimes targeting the most vulnerable that gets this treatment, no one ever claims you can stop thieves and robbers by telling them to stop and run away.
@thomiatyww You don't have to yell. Telling them to stop wasn't an option because they didn't offer it as an option. You could tell them "no" ad nauseum, but they would ignore it.
How twisted that the elder's handbook instructs elders to call the police if a Kingdom Hall gets vandalized, but if a child is abused, elders are instructed to call the branch office. Sickos!!!!
They use their socialism-for-me-only tax-exemptions to make the socialism-for-me-only police help them for free. The police wouldn't even give me a ride home, as a private "free-hugs" citizen, let alone "guard me for free" because EVEN MY OWN PERSON was vandalized. It's very unfair how corrupt secretive religions are IN-BED with government in pretend-secular polyreligious (only "State/Judge-accepted religions" of course) countries.
@VriskaNines That's exactly what happens. You wait until you get to talk with a guy from Legal Dept. and he'll tell you if the perpetrator is a current Witness, you keep the matter 'in house'. Do not call the Police. If they find that there is a witness to the abuse and the perpetrator is repentant then, once again, don't tell the Police. If he's found guilty and is unrepentant then he gets disfellowshipped. ONLY AT THIS POINT do they allow the child or her parents to tell the Police.
@VriskaNines not kidding. Fact. The book itself "Shepherd the Flock of God" is available online. It should be the reason this cult gets investigated for child abuse across every nation!
They say not to do things someone else asks if it makes you feel uncomfortable, but that's like most thing that JWs do. Like are you comfortable being alienated from the world? Are you comfortable going to people's doors every day and talking to them? Are you comfortable walking on eggshells just to not be shunned forever?
Going to people's doors was absolutely horrific for me. I loved everything else so it was so hard when I realized how not true this supposed truth based religion wasn't. I loved going to the kingdom hall and the watchtower magazine was my favorite reading material. I was also heartbroken losing my friends.....my family was not religious or part of jehovah witnesses. I learned about it later in life and I still miss the kingdom hall but in no way could I ever go back, sadly.
@@lynnjackson8367I’m sorry you lost your friends when you left that church, I hope you can find another community that’s a little more accepting and kind. I recommend Unitarian Universalism!
3:10 No, they know EXACTLY what they're doing: They're making a PSA to "protect children" from obvious, scary threats to simultaneously look like they have children's interests at heart, but also to make sure children and their families aren't able to see the real abusers' real-life approach. They are making this to PROTECT abusers, dude.
I cannot believe in the very first line of their CSA video they’re implying SA is the child/victim’s fault. “Jehovah wants to protect you that’s why he gave you a conscience”. That’s pure victim blaming/shaming! Absolutely repugnant. No one is ever to blame for falling victim to manipulation and grooming.
🤔 HMMM...Why didn't he give a conscience to the abusers who KNEW it's wrong to hurt children? Gimme a break... what about the ELDUHS who are intentionally protecting the PEDOPHILES , but not the CHILD VICTIMS ?!
This feels like a set-up for victim blaming. Imagine telling a child that they shouldn’t have LET someone sexually assault them? SA, especially CSA, is often done by people who are physically stronger and/or in a position of authority over the person. The use of the words “I wouldn’t let them” is SO fucked up.
It is very insulting to victims who were paralysed by fear or threatened with a weapon or even threats, like I've read that many abusers will choose a child with a younger sibling so they can say "if you don't let me, I'll do it to/harm your little bother/sister"
It’s also becoming known worldwide the corruption of this organization. I frequently send exposure videos to Christians I know and they spread it. They are appalled!!!! Better yet, they spread it to countless people. 😎😁
@@BlackCover95 yep, regardless of who and what you are, you will avoid conflict if possible subconsciously, and so you'd avoid the path of most resistence, which is why these people need to be dragged accross the scorching irons that is the consequences of their inaction, in order to force them to take action.
The part of "how many people died of not getting blood transfusions?" hits hard. I am so glad I left before my son ever got sick. He's had two life saving blood transfusions. If I had not left, had he become a JW, he might have refused blood when he needed it. But when because we left, I can right now hear him singing in the next room. He's alive because we left.
the entire religion relies on dampening that "alarm system." By teaching kids that they'll intuitively know when someone wants to do them harm, they won't suspect actual predators in their flock.
i was molested for six years by the son of a family friend. I grew up Southern Baptist, and the pastor found out about what happened,and was nothing but helpful(he banned the guy and his family from church on pain of arrest). I'm now studying to become a Clinical Mental Health counselor so i can help other kids and teens the way i was helped.
A child telling an abuser that they’re gonna tell on them is gonna lead to the abuser at best beating the shit out of and at worst literally murdering the child so they don’t get caught
telling your abuser that you're going to report them is the single WORST thing you could do. the only reason i got away from my father was bc my family showed up completely unannounced with the strongest members to take me away from him. if i had told my father that they were gonna take me and report him, god knows what he would've done.
My Aunt (Who grew up with JW parents, was SA'd by another member of their JW congregation when she was 5. Instead of going to the police they went to the head of the church. Nothing happened to him. My Aunt buried it deep all her life, and recently in therapy it all came out. We never forgave my grandparents.
Oh my goodness 😮😞 I'm sorry about your aunt and I hope she feels better and why did Jehovah witnesses go to their own organization for this I agree they should go to the police for this stuff not the organization cause the organization don't give a crap about the Jehovah witnesses and their problems also I hope watchtower and the Jehovah witnesses falls cause they need to go.
My husband's aunt was raped when she was 8, by a teenaged boy that wanted to become a Catholic priest. The church covered it up, and had her parents agree not to tell anyone or seek treatment. They agreed to it, and to make things worse, her dad was a cop. Her life was tragic, and she died relatively young. But her rapist? He became a priest of course.
This brought up memories of the young people ask book. I dont recall if it was the 1st or 2nd volume. There was a section about molestation. I remember reading it when I was 15 shortly after I experienced a rape by a ministerial servant. It talked about struggling with a guilty conscience and how it was a good thing because it meant you were sorry and didnt want it. I also remember there being a portion on whether or not you faught off the molester or not. As in, if you didnt fight, jehovah could assume it was consensual. There was a little test called,"was it consensual?" It asked questions like, did you say no, did you run away. Did you confess right away? I remember that really messing with my head for a long time. My mom, the elders and even myself for a while tried to gaslight me. I remember after the rape I had to go to the elders and talk about what happened in detail. After that happened I fell into a severe depression and had several suicide attempts. They said my conscience was bothering me. The elders instructed me to to write a letter to my rapist. They wanted me to apologize for my part in it. And I actually did it because I was being manipulated so badly! It's so fucking disgusting. I cant believe they got me to apologize to my rapist. I was basically a sex toy to that pervert, what the fuck do I have to apologize for? It still upsets me to this day how they tried to spin it. It was a rumor in the congregation that we were dating and when he broke up with me I started gossiping, they framed it as I was a jealous ex, yet nobody seemed to care that I was a child and he an adult. I was literally begging for someone to see it was wrong, to care, instead I was labeled a dramatic gossip. Every single one of those people in my old cong are guilty. I consider them accomplaces to child rape and every one of them can get f**ked for all I care.
Your comment touched my heart. I have a daughter. It is awful that they made you do that. I can totally see how that would mess with your head. To my horror, I completely believe it went down just as you said because I was in for so long. That sounds exactly like the sort of thing they would do. I am so so sorry you went through that. I hope you are able to find peace in your life now.
Appreciate your articulate passion and understandable anger. I was appointed an elder at 26. Left 23 years later. Read Crisis of Conscience and went full blown anti WT. Most of my family are still in. Keep up your good videos and clear analysis.
@@ona512 2 reasons that I would guess 1) he came from a long line of "good" JW lineage or 2) congregation was female heavy and there weren't many males qualified or willing to be an elder.
It seems like this is made to scare their parents more than the kids to make them isolate their children and keep them in a closed society and distrust any outsiders.
It's meant I believe as a message to parents as you said and also to obfuscate the whole issue and create the false impression that the organization is proactive.
Here's my suggestion to deal with these on going instances of CSA being covered up by religious organizations: we make a new law that states that all people of religious authority are mandated reporters. For people who don't know, mandated reporters are people who are required by law to report any instances of abuse they hear about, even if it doesn't sound real or they hear it second hand, they have to report it within 24 hours of hearing about it or they will also be held liable, will definitely lose their job and have a massive black mark on their record and I think they can even go to jail in some cases. A couple examples of mandated reporters are anyone who works in a school (teachers, aides, etc.), medical staff (doctors, nurses, etc.), psycologists/psychiatrists, etc..
In Australia: Under the Children, Youth and Families Act, people in religious ministries are mandatory reporters of child abuse to Child Protection Services.
“What if it’s a pastor or an elder that does uncomfortable things to you?” “I’d let them! Because they are close to god and if I don’t let them I won’t get into heaven!” “That’s right Sophia, it’s not assault if it’s done by a preacher!”
JWs are actually so callous and inhumane that they would actually allow harm or even death to be inflicted on themselves and their peers if it meant not going against the cult conditioning. I was in it for 17 years, they are dead serious.
I told my son when he was young that if anyone touched him in certain places to come and tell me. You can't leave it on the kids to say no and stop the abuse from happening. That's why we as parents have to go to the police and let our children know that they can come tell us without fear and that we will take care of the problem.
My mom did this for me too and I can't imagine a parent NOT having that conversation with their kid, unless they don't have their child's best interest at heart... which unfortunately some parents dont, far too many... Well, what my mom said *specifically* was, "if anyone touches you there and you don't like it, come tell me." APPARENTLY what I answered with was, "But what if I like it?" My mom was stunned and then went "Well, tell me anyway!!!" 🤣 I was young enough that I don't remember it at all but a few years ago she told me the story and it was hilarious. I had no idea about sex or anything relating to it except the standard age appropriate knowledge for a 3-4yr old and nothing bad had happened to me, i just... said it. Turned out to be quite prophetic as to the type of person I grew up to be though, haha. Kids say the darndest things
I majored in Psychology, which included criminal psychology, and this... this is absurd. The entire point of grooming is tiny steps, pushing the boundaries and building trust bit by bit so by the time they're asked to do something extreme, they DON'T feel uncomfortable. They trust the predator implicitly. Too often there's also a power dynamic at play as well because it's a close relative or a teacher who has authority over the child, so they may not even see NO as an option. Often it's an ongoing situation from the time they were too young to remember and it seems normal until they get out in the world and find out it's not. All this 90s stranger danger PSA crap isn't coming anywhere near the root of the problem. Someone educate these nitwits. They're not helping.
They won’t listen. I am absolutely certain that after all the cases that they have had to deal with, somebody has suggested educating them about it. They will refuse to listen. They are stuck in their mindset and no one can get them out of it. Anyone who tries most likely gets cast out and subsequently shunned. They are then forbidden to say why someone was cast out therefore, nobody knows why it was done. Word just never gets out. It’s a terrible place. Terrible situation. And your description of how predators get ahold of somebody could just as well be applied to that religion. They push your boundaries little by little and brainwash you little by little until you will do just about anything they ask of you without question thinking it is normal until you get out of there and look back in horror, shame and disgust at what you were doing.
@HappyThife - I don't think they don't know what they're doing, exactly. They're still doing it from a place of ignorance. They still have a strong anti-government stance and don't want "worldly" police getting involved in their cult, and that's where a lot of this comes from, but they still are clueless about how these things really work and what real precautions should be taken. They know what they think they're doing within their doctrine and isolationist/separatist agenda. That much is certain.
"never keep a secret from us" until I disappoint you with something benign like watching a show with magic in it. Then I learn that I have to be really sneaky to enjoy anything I find fun.
I learned very quickly as JW kid to never tell my mother anything. She had an issue with just about everything. Especially anything FUN. I was forced to be sneaky 😒
I'm a CSA victim myself. This "Alarm System" doesn't go off in innocent children. I didn't know what it meant for such a thing to occur. I didn't know anything sexual at all. It just slowly sank into me as I grew into my teens, and it F me up so bad. I looked at the memories and I couldn't helped but berate the child version of me. I hated myself but tried to come into terms with it.
I just wanted to say thank you for making your videos, I was born up JW, horribly abused, ran away from home at 17 im 46 now, and havent looked back and cut all family ties, watching your videos for years now and your content reminds me that I made the right decision. Keep up the god work! 🤘
I remember at my fathers funeral Jehovah's Witnesses greeting everyone outside the funeral home as if they were family members. My mother had to hold me back as I told them to f**k off. That sums up who they are. Great vid Owen!!!
It's so sad because in a vacuum, this wouldn't be that bad, but with the context around it, it's awful "if you get abused, it's because you didn't listen to jehovah's warnings."
@@melissacooper8724 I like how his advice is to just keep telling people about it because so many people of all ages that are afraid to tell people, but it is the only way to stop the offender.
This could also cause so much for guilt who have already been abused. 😢 What if it is a parental figure? There was also no talk of what about if they are threatened. Many children are, and then "not running" can feel like they are "allowing" it. It's not their fault. It never is. And if any of you reading this have past hurts, I'm sorry you went through that. It wasn't your fault.
the JW cartoon made me feel like it was my fault for being gr**med because i didnt see the red flags and do anything about them. "Why couldnt i see it right away? why couldnt i block it off sooner? why are they making it seem so easy? am i just stupid and at fault for letting it happen?" makes it worse that even though the first time i was being gr**med i was able to at least realize it before it got REALLY bad, i was then gr**med again and only realized it was gr**ming a a year after i was able to finally get out of it. it sickens me that they show these to other children (had to censor the words bc youtube deletes comments)
@@thomiatyww . I would never say that a child shouldn't run from an attacker ... but what if that attacker is a parent, or someone trusted that there is no where to run from? There is also the fact that adrenaline can cause fight, flight, or freeze responses. When victims freeze, they can often be blamed for not fighting back, as if their body shutting down in an attempt to save them from danger is their "consent". The blame belongs ENTIRELY on predators. Not an ounce of it should be left on a victim. Poor choice of an emoji.
I have an ex-friend who was once a devout Catholic but the JWs eventually got him. He would go on and on about how awful the Catholic Church is, and when the sex scandal was reveled , he rightly was very critical of the Catholic hierarchy. I don’t believe he has ever commented on the JW scandals & YES, my former friend is an elder.
I'm not a fan of the police as an institution, but from a deeply pragmatic level, they have access to resources laypeople wouldn't in stopping cases of CSA. If you know of an abuse case, call the fucking cops! No questions asked!
I used to babysit a child (don't worry nothing happened to them) of a split parent situation. I worked for mom and never met dad. The deal was two weeks on, two off. Suddenly one evening I received a text from mom asking if I could work every week, and if I was comfortable with "defending" the house. Weird right but I was like "yep! Let's do this!" So I come in the next day, before the kid woke up as usual, and mom shows me where all the guns where in the house, showed me pictures of people to not open the door to, and if they broke in, to defend the kid from. She was so paranoid, so I asked what happened. Well dad raped mom's minor sister 4 years ago. FOUR years ago. And she reported it immediately. FOUR years later the police finally gathered enough to get a warrant and jail him. He hasn't seen trial yet. And why would the child see him for two weeks of every month? Because no matter how hard mom tried, she couldn't get full custody because she was considered too unfit to be a full time mom because she was caught shop lifting with her baby twice. Her fighting only got her 50/50 custody, because it was an alleged rape the year their child was born, and the four years following. I babysat that child while mom went to court with his new arrest, and has full custody pending trial, if he is found innocent, it's possible that kid will have to go back to dad 50/50. I agree, if crime happens call police, but they are so incompetent that a fucking rape kit done less than 24 hours after rape, and a full ass name and address of the attacker takes them four fucking years to send out an arrest warrant!
My catholic school had a similar approach of "oh if they do something that makes you uncomfortable just walk away and tell a grown up" I think it's a tad bit more complicated than that.
I grown in Belgium in the 90's, when 2 serial p*do r*apers were discovered. So it was a big paranoia. My mom took it very seriously. I remember how she scared the shit out me when she told me (I was hery young) that EVERYONE could touch me inappropriately, even people I know and like. She made le regulary repeat what an appropriate touch was (a kiss on rhe cheek to say hello), and what was not (eveything else); when she bathed me, she insisted that noone else was allowed to do so, and made sure I know the name of my body parts (to be able to report precisely an inappeopriate touch). It found it quite funny (as took it as a game), except the freaking scary part about that everyond could hurt me. But I learned the lesson!
I cannot believe they are actually victim blaming the f*cking children. Ffs. And not teaching them the information that helps inoculate kids against sexual abuse means it will keep happening. But now they can blame the kids directly even more than they probably already did. Owen is totally right, most predators don't snatch kids off playgrounds. His video is so much more educational for parents on what child predation usually looks like. But I hate that Jehovah's Witnesses, and especially their kids, won't learn the accurate information. Keeping them ignorant, keeps them easier targets. That's so infuriating. Keep fighting the good fight, Owen! Apostates are getting a much better name these days than Jehovah's Witnesses, for sure. I do know a bit more than average on this because of focusing on child psych back in school. It's great that Owen fit so much accurate information into this debunking. Excellent video, as always!
Yeah I bet most cases happen when the perpetrator has the kid alone. The victim can yell stop all they want but a 30 year plus old man can easily overpower a child. And worst off the kid's fight or flight response will kick in and they might freeze up and be too scared to actually do anything.
I was never able to tell anyone about my abuse. In my 50’s and just now able to talk about it. Still blamed for not saying anything. Watch out for your kids. Protect them. Let them see you protecting them. And listen
They are using the already debunked "stranger danger" message. Zero research when into what they did...they just picked things that pushes the blame away from them. Despicable.
Just the other day I've been thinking about these kinds of PSAs, the ones that portray predators as monsters or as someone obviously dark and alarming. Which is truthful to the reality on some level and can be emotionally effective but it's not like kids getting groomed would know that- the predator is usually very nice to them and isn't a monster, why should they feel alarmed by them? Or should they be weary of anyone being nice to them? Also, "just say no". Because a predator surely would listen. "Just walk away", as if as a child you can just move somewhere, especially in cases with relatives and family friends. "Just tell parents/authority figures", as if they always listen and don't assume that you're making things up. Or are willing to rock the boat if they do. Or can actually do anything if they're themselves are in a weak position compared to the predator and whoever else on the predators side.
This actually makes me grateful that we came forward about our CSA before our family got roped into this cult because now I'm convinced that we would have never gotten any justice and would have been forced to continue living with our abuser for the rest of our life
I would appreciate it if someone could explain how the parents are not held responsible for this kind of thing happening if they refuse to report it to law enforcement or take any sort of corrective action.
If we're talking about IN Utah itself they basically run the state at all levels so it takes another elder being injured to get a SAer kicked out. Otherwise it's victim blame, gas light, threaten, and finally excommunicate the victim while shuttling the predator the same way the Catholics were
Damn, they've got victim blaming down to a fine art. They're essentially telling the kids that if they're too "stupid" and/or "gullible" to know they're being groomed, too afraid to say no or they just end up victimized even if they do everything described in the video then the problem is with them because apparently 100% of children are psychic and can flawlessly judge the intentions of seasoned abusers in positions of power and wave them away with a magic word like a fucking wizard. And, of course, the abusers are always framed as people they don't know from outside the congregation so that they can simultaneously otherize outsiders (to isolate them from the only people who will take them seriously and actually help them like a teacher or the police) and protect abusers inside the organization by making sure the kids view their abusive behavior as legitimate and acceptable exclusively because it's people from inside the organization who are doing it. Of course this commonly leads to suicide-inducing guilt and shame where the child blames themselves for what's happening/happened to them since the abuser and their actions are framed as "good" by default which would mean that any resistance or even discomfort the child experiences is "bad," potentially leading to self-harm and suicide which, of course, solves the church's problem for them. Truly a masterclass in how to *actually* groom children.
I’m not even 5 minutes in yet and I’m already so offended. This reeks of victim blaming. As someone who was groomed at church by an adult, the situation they’re setting up for the kids to watch out for is completely absurd. This is so wrong. I’m really glad you’re calling them out.
I disassociated in December 2021, after the first months of starting my new job as a Residential Child Care Worker in UK. I already was completely inactive for two years prior. I knew already during those years about CSA, but obviously I had only some uncertain ideas about the issue, the scale, and how to handle it. Now I know about the problem, I'm getting the education in college about it as a requirement in my work, and more important - now I know what that does to the young person. The handling the problem in the JW organisation is so harmful, ignorant and immature at so many levels, it's hard to even describe! If I would know about the suspicion of abuse and not report it to my manager - I'm risking of getting into trouble, even of being fired. If I know for certain about the abuse and I do not report it to my manager - I'm not only loosing my job, but I can end up facing the potential charges against me for doing nothing. And my manager can end up even in jail if he doesn't do anything after my report - for him loosing his job is one of the lightest consequences! Yes, I'm potentially treated more harshly due to my type of work. So are the elders in the congretations potentially - because they are the ones who are trusted and they supposed to be the ones who should be approached with every problem. And that's the tragedy. I'm having constant trainings, information, staff meetings, the college education. And yet, I'm not qualified to handle the cases of CSA myself, I'm obliged to report them. I'm working my ass off full time, completely dedicated to my work and education in my college, and still I'm not even close to the psychologists working alongside of the police, who are handling the cases of the CSA. Following the Elder's Manual and the Legal Department will put elders in jail. And maybe this is the only one way of changing something for the better if nothing else works, because: ''In the era of information, ignorance is a choice.'' - dr Joe Dispenza. It's their choice. The choice which children don't have.
The elders manual you mention I believe is titled, Shepherd the Flock of God. It is highly secret; even wives of elders are not allowed to know it exists. From what I do know, the secret instructions on CSA reports, does not allow reporting to the authorities. This itself is unscriptural see Romans 13 1. That the organisation refuses to do this, expounding instead the two witness rule proves 100% their will to protect abusers and their bias against victims. They use the scriptures accordingly. Their secrets must be exposed, and elders arrested, for the sake of all victims, survivors and potential victims.
The biggest issue I had with this video is the presentation of the perp as a ethereal non-human. 2nd is the complete failure to identify unsafe touch. Never mind the problematic extreme indoctrination of obedience and trust. Finally, the appeal to the child's "conscience" to keep themselves safe. Which falls in line with the WBTS history of disfellowshipping or otherwise punishing the victims.
Love your take on all this craziness! Never a witness, but have family that are. Talked me into studying about 25 years ago. So so glad i caught on before it was too late. As a parent of 5 kids....i am so so thankful i never went the next step with this shit. Disgusting!
The parts about becoming an important part of a kid’s life and then isolating them are why so many predators went into Scout leadership. Don’t ask me how I first learned that.
While teaching children that saying no, walking away, and telling someone when they're made to feel uncomfortable is an important lesson to teach, it misses the other half of the equation. The requirement of two witnesses is basically a green light to abuse children as long as the perpetrator can single out and attack children individually. It's sick.
They could do like Muslims and just lie about being witnesses. Seriously though, it’s incredible how often the required two to three Muslims somehow all witness things that the other Muslims are going out of their way to hide.
I was deeply saddened that the settlements from the CSA lawsuits did not destroy the cult. When a cult is forced to sell their HQ that is the literal formal name of the organization I had assumed that would be end of it.
Both times I've been sexually assaulted, it was by friends who tricked me. One even pretended to accept my asexuality and after the sexual assault basically said LGBT deserve to be raped. So a backstabbing friend and a sneaky bigot. Not a stranger in a dark alley like I was raised to believe this type of activity would come from. I think people with sexual consent problems deserve to be sterilized. I think that would help cut down on sexual activity without consent. Don't want this negative consequence to your behavior?. Have consensual sex, it's not that hard.
I am very sorry you had terrible things happen to you, but you might want to stop calling those who hurt you "friends" .... those scumbags were never your friend. They were predators pretending to be your friend.
Sorry you were assaulted. Make sure to get the police. This is delicate, we must be careful , there are all sorts of situations where it is not clear who agreed to what how many times, etc. AND people, young and old, LIE!!
You mean castrated, not sterilized. I agree. I have had to physically remove friends of mine from trying to assault women. I dragged them out the room by hair and ears. I'm sorry this happened to you. Please use your experience to warn young girls. I personally teach girls how to break people's bones.
@@tesmith47 Why is the most emphatic point of your response to say that people lie? Lie about what, being sexually assaulted? Because from your attempt to ambiguate the idea of consent with "it's not clear who agreed to what how many times" I'm getting a very creepy impression of your motive.
I'm kind of paranoid. Is C&S teaching kids the wrong warning signs so the kids don't understand what was done and they can't explain the elders are the abusers?
Tw ! There was a man in our congregation who I believe had a history of assaulting children. I only knew because he was really close to all of the young people (especially girls), and we used to hug him, he’d come over to our house, etc. when I hit puberty my mum told me I could hug him anymore. I asked why and she said that there was something ‘wrong with his brain’ that made him not understand that me being friendly wasn’t romantic interest. He still regularly came over to our house after that, including when my parents weren’t home and it was my sister looking after us. There was no attempts by the elders to let people know or keep him from the young people.
If you put the onus on the victim to prevent abuse, it can translate into self-blame or victim-blaming later. Even if those kids told their parents/elders, nothing would be done - and there lies the problem.
@@onuspromis7166 its more nuanced than this. It's VERY important to teach kids REALITY based reaction,not shit based on either this woke SJW ideals of "ohhhh nothing would be done if the kid told someone/tried to stop the rape so stop telling them to do anything" which is just as demonic and SICK as what Jehovahs do covering up rape and blaming the victims. Are ALL of you so blinded as to not see this?? I feel very bad for kids in this situation but saying give up and take it in the ass is hardly a good answer. No. Teach kids that sometimes adults can try to do things that hurt them,and to run away/try to defend themselves and ask for help from a different adult. And -id even say,it's a good idea to inform kids of the fact that there could be hesitation when they report this- and WHY. Stop acting like kids are fucking dogs they know they got raped they know the adults ain't helping em they're giving up because of people like YOU lordfreerealestate8302 as well Teach them persistence because they may have to tell multiple adults before they are removed from the situation. If you have a problem with this the answer doesn't involve telling kids to not report- it lies in reforming your states judicial system to make this easier.
I asked my international jw missionary family member about the child abuse scandal a few years ago. They said it was taken care of. I couldn't comprehend that response
Im a babysitter and one of the kids i babysit got A-ed by a pastor. It luckily stopped before it could get worse and the dude R-ed him, but makes my blood boil. That was the sweetest kid and went to... a dark place. And the parents did NOTHING
The worst part is, they put the children in the responsibility to not get groomed and violated. In the end they could blame the kid for becoming a victim.
As a very young girl raised as a JW I was molested by a male in the congregation. After it happed a few times I told my mother. She put it all back on me to stop it. I was just a little kid. The next time he tried to molest me, I told him I would tell. He never bothered me again. But the most distressing part, my mother NEVER EVER mentioned it again. She didn’t even ask me if it had stopped or if it was still happening. Nothing. At age 80 now I still can’t believe the reaction of my mother. I left the JW’s at age 18 and never looked back. And so glad I did.
I've not gotten this far in as I'm honestly triggered by the framing of the first sentence of the JW vid, but yeah, it's basically impossible to get things taken seriously in JWs for this subject. They won't want any news to get out as it'll make the religion look bad, so they do their best to keep it quiet. At most, if someone was an outcast, they might find a reason to kick them out if they're also a threat to people's kids, but JWs are pros at isolating each other, so most will keep their kids from a creepy outcast in the religion more readily than they'd kick them out and tell the police. I remember when a high-profile brother was rumoured to SA his kid. Adults talked about it WHILE AT HIS HOUSE WITH THEIR KIDS, but no one did anything. We watched his daughter get increasingly troubled and treated more like a troublemaker when in retrospect, she was neurodivergent, traumatised, and needed safety. She left the religion, found what seemed to be a great husband, and carefully cut us all off for her safety. Even though I'm a safe person (as an ExJW), it's common for those who leave to cut everyone off just because we can't trust who is safe sometimes and have already been shunned by our core family and closest friends... I just hope she's gotten lots of therapy and has a happy family. She, no one, deserved that. She must have heard the adults talking about her while trusting her dad and giving her the stink eye... It was confusing and scary for me, but it must have been so hellish for her. :(
It probably took these children a long time to get up the courage to tell someone what happened to them, and then to be disbelieved, and have to confront the abuser?
The last time I got a visit from the cult, it had been years and the last visit did not go well or them. So I commented that I thought they'd put me on a list or that their hall closed. The reason I thought maybe their hall closed was because they were selling them off to pay the fines for continuing to sheltering child predators. I'd have seized it all as proceeds of a crime.
It's disheartening how persistent the myth of a creep tricking a kid into the back of a van being the majority of youth harmers has been... Can it happen? On very rare occasions, but it's basically unheard of.
Having lived this, the idea that they still pretend I was the problem instead of the abuser who was convicted and went to prison for what he did is sickening and so, so hurtful.. 😢
Wow! I'm floored by the "have the kid talk to the predator" and even having them in the same room! That's insane! They don't even do this in the legal system with full grown adults. A while back, I was the victim of attempted mugging and SA. I defended myself and the guy got arrested. I had to go to court to testify about what happened. Even with that proceeding, they made sure that the perpetrator and his victims (I wasn't the only one) weren't in the same room together, for our own safety as well as comfort. Granted, this doesn't always happen, but it usually does, especially now that we can do legal stuff remotely. Asking a victim to be in the same room as their abuser AND to accuse that person is something difficult even for a strong-willed adult. I can't even imagine doing that to a child. That's just cruel.
I'm a Seventh-day Adventist. I teach the Primary Sabbath School (ages 6 to 9). When they asked me to do the job, I had to go through a background check. And there's another teacher. Two are required because they don't want one alone with the kids. I think this is a fair way to handle things. Jehovah's Witnesses need to do better.
I appreciate your videos and how you use your experience to educate others. It's disgusting to see how witnesses react to child abuse. I like that you allow yourself to get a bit emotional as this is a huge deal and people need to see that.
Here in Australia the govt set up a reparations fund for SA victims that all churches and youth/community organisations are required to join and pay into or face losing their tax free status. The JWs refused and refused and refused. It got to the point where the govt said, 'we have prepared legislation that will delist the JW org as a church and will present it to parliament in the current session.' Suddenly the JWs signed up. I've no idea how much they might have had to pay out in law suits here but lots of churches and organisations are facing ongoing suits for millions.
I remember that too. Amazing - they rolled over for CSA here in Aus, but are prepared to continue to shun in Norway and lose their benefits. Guess disfellowshipping is more important than CSA to them.
The people who gr00med me very much followed the playbook. My siblings and I were often alone with them because our parents trusted them. When I became a teen and could drive myself, I often went over to their house because they made me feel like a grown-up. Later, I realized that they gr00med me to essentially be a parent to the child in the house and to be a "best friend" to the child's mother - I. WAS. A. CHILD. Teenagers are still children, and they need protection from gr00mers and pr3dators as well.
A child is no match for an adult predator. Kids can be outsmarted and overpowered by adults. That’s disgusting to think kids have any power over a situation like that. Parents protect your children. Know who their teachers and caregivers are.
The dad preaching safety to his kids is rly ironic...cuz when we think about it, Caleb and Sophia's parents are grooming them into zealotry
You have a good point
They likely dont want to admit that
They aren't even subtle about it. When the kids want to do their own pursuits they constantly limited by 'does this please Jahoover?' brow beating through disingenuous smiles.
@Adamant Forge Yep. Basically, telling them that if they don't show absolute loyalty to "Big Brother," a.k.a Jehovah that they will not be allowed into paradise whenever the fecal matter hits the rotating air device.
Probably SA too if we are being honest that cult teaches kids that outsiders are bad no wonder why they don’t tell anyone.
So, wait...it's the CHILD'S responsibility to not get molested? Wow, that's a new low Watchtower. 🤬
All stranger danger lessons blame the child tbh
@@ona512 We DO need to teach our kids not to hop into a stranger’s car etc. And we need to teach them to trust their instincts. That being said, everything that Owen said is perfectly true. CSA mostly occurs when the perpetrator and the child know each other, and when there’s trust.
Super gross that they framed it like the child's conscious will protect them. So if something happens, now it's a moral failure on the part of the kid. Atrocious.
@@CaroAbebe Making it about the kids 'conscience' is what upsets me most. The conscience is for knowing what you're doing is right or wrong, generally in the religious sense anyway, not for assessing threats. They used that word on purpose because they almost always frame children or women as 'seducing' their abusers, and being somewhat to blame for their abuse.
@@Jrpyify Ecxactly, I needed to pause on the very first part and make a ranty comment because it just brought a flood of indoctrination messages back to me and I honestly feel sick.
Telling the creepy bad shadow man to just go away is the equivalent of Dora telling Swiper "No Swiping!" So he wouldnt take her shit.
The reason why that works is that Swiper is literally 9 years old.
literally, like do they think the predators gonna go "oh man!!!!" like its a full ass adult in this case, they arent gonna listen to the kid
@@lemonmeat I mean 9 is pretty old for a fox 😂😂
The Christmas special
And that hasn’t worked 100% of the time.
When the Sonic PSA from the 90s is better than your terrible attempt at informing kids about predators, that's no good.
Fr.
Sega does what JW's don't.
i found it! it is under this video title: "Sonic Says Sexual Harassment is No Good - HQ" and apparently there are 66 of these shorts under this video title: "Sonic Says / Sonic Sez (ALL 66 Shorts)"
The only good thing from THAT Sonic show.
First say no then get outa their
JWs seem to create an environment that would make kids particularly vulnerable, too. They teach kids it's normal to have no kid friends, and that friends can be any age, so they're less likely to think anything's weird when a grown adult wants to hang out with them. They teach kids to decide 'who can be their friends' based on religion first and foremost, so literally all someone has to do is be a Jehovah's Witness and they gain their trust. I've heard a lot of groomers tend to use guilt to keep their parents about the time they're spending together, and JWs have so many rules about literally everything, all they have to do is let the kid play with a wizard toy and they'll be afraid of letting their parents know about the entire encounter because 'what if they find out about the wizard toy'.
The worst part in this video is the word "conscience" - this makes the children think that they are morally guilty if they engage in CSA, that they are responsible, that THEY messed up ... which prevents them from speaking up. It is heartbreaking.
I mean, friends CAN be of any age, but honestly, at this point, being friends with older people of the borg is probably more dangerous than having adult friends outside of the borg >.>
Exactly. This PSA/episode/whatever seems tailor-made to make children more likely to trust an abuser than anything. Almost like it's meant to protect the abusers and bring them more easy prey...
@@Nanashi20 While it's obviously not that hard to understand where the current attitude comes from, it is kinda sad how kids having adults in their lifes they'd be close to in any context outside of guardians, educators, or immediate family has become something we'd default to viewing with apprehension.
@@jondoe7036 This right here, even in the context of what you mentioned as outside of it can also be seen as possible apprehension more often than not nowadays.
Wait, this places all the pressure and responsibility on the victims. There are lots of reasons why children don't report CSA:
- A child may not fully understand what's going on.
- A child may keep quiet because they're afraid or may have been threatened.
- A child may feel guilty because they were overpowered or scared and couldn't just "say NO and run away" as in the video.
- A child may feel guilty because they may have found certain parts of the abuse physically pleasurable (bodies react) and feel it's their fault.
- A child may feel conflicted because the person doing the abuse is someone Watchtower said they cannot disobey.
The C&S video completely ignores what if Mommy, Daddy, or an Elder is causing the abuse. Rather than help, it might actually make things worse. That's why Elders need to stop playing judge & jury and report CSA so victims get access to a LCSW or licensed therapist...
The bad part here is with certain religious groups dont want consent or comprehensive sex ed even being taught. This isnt helping. It seems being taught not to question anything is what they want. Your right here of course.
Also the definition of child needs to be clarification there is a big difference between 6/7 yo and 17 yo sex worker.
@@tesmith47 Do you believe it's acceptable to SA a 17yr old? Pretty sick, dude. You should leave the JW cult, it's evil!
@@tesmith47 Does there need to be? Most people would know that the post refers to young children and a 17 year old “sex worker” would likely be a victim of sex trafficking or of exploitation and is still deserving of help.
or rarley the teen will try to do stuff. man hormones...
Yes, the VAST majority of CSA perpetrators are known to the victims. But even for rare 'stranger danger' attacks, this JW video is awful and dangerous. I WAS a kid who got attacked out of a clear blue sky by a stranger, and when I told my attacker that I didn't want to be touched, he just threatened to throw me off the apartment building to smash to pieces on the concrete below. To be clear, I wasn't molested in a JW context, but my situation is illustrative of what might occur in a 'stranger danger' situation, and how harmful and outright delusional the JW video is in a number of ways:
1) My attacker didn't start out by being obviously creepy or scary like in the JW video - he just asked me politely for directions to a different part of my own apartment building, then pretended not to understand my instructions and asked me to show him the way; this got me to an isolated part of the building where he could switch to using violent coercion without fear of interruption. By the way, asking children (and adult victims) for some kind of assistance is a common tactic used by 'stranger danger' attackers, and one that the JW video did not warn about.
2) At the time of the attack, I was just 7, i.e. physically small compared to an adult, and I had never been taught how to fight an adult (biting, punching below the belt, etc.); on the contrary, for their own convenience, my parents were REALLY strict about my remaining perfectly still when they picked me up, so I was trained to be exceedingly passive; as a result, I wasn't able to get away from my attacker to escape back to the rest of the building. In this regard, the JW video sets up the absurd expectation that victims will always be mentally/physically able to escape, that attackers will just let a chosen victim go, and that victims bear RESPONSIBILITY for escaping (and GUILT if they don't? That's a horrifying, but logical inference from the video). The JW video also contains no physical self-defence strategies whatsoever.
3) My attacker had planned the location of the attack so that there was no one within earshot to hear me cry and scream and say no again and again for 6 hours, and I was forced me to endure CSA using literal death threats. Again, the JW video just doesn't address the fact that 'stranger danger' type attackers tend to use physical isolation and violent coercion, since they are not depending on grooming to lower their victims' resistance. If you're a child being attacked by an adult stranger, by the time you realise the danger, it's likely that your attacker has already ensured that running away and telling your caregivers is no longer an option. The JW video just fails to take into account the lopsided imbalance of power between a child and an adult molester - a little child like Caleb in the video can't just "not let" an attacker hurt them.
Not only does the JW video wrongly emphasise 'stranger danger' as the most likely form of CSA to guard against, but it doesn't even address stranger-perpetrated CSA realistically, usefully or caringly. In fact, by presenting escape from a molester as simple to achieve and a matter of "conscience", it sets children up to blame themselves for the devastating abuse inflicted upon them.
I'm so sorry that monster attacked you. You are absolutely correct in all of your assessments of this abysmal Watchtower Society enabling of abusers within their congregations.
I'm sorry this happened to you and really appreciate that you're sharing your experience and knowledge. ❤️
wow, thanks for sharing
Jesus fuck I'm so sorry that happened to you. Thank you for sharing your story and writing such a thoughtful comment explaining how this shit actually occurs. I hate the world why is r*pe so fucking common 😭💔
I am so sorry about your terrible experience. Thank you for your great courage in sharing it. The JW'S really are utterly ignorant of such matters. Higher education, such as Sociology or Psychology would inform them but this too is denied them. Yet they readily use educated lawyers to defend themselves from having to pay compensation to victims. How twisted and unscriptural they really are. ❤
They are knowingly fostering an environment for grooming. I don't think it's because they want to hurt kids, but because rooting out unethical behavior would start to dismantle the system.
It's also about hurting kids. CSA is often a way to enforce the system and also to "profit" off of children who they view as objects
“I would say no”
“I wouldn’t let them”
Oh ffs. That’s not how it works. Children are small and weak, and amazingly enough, try as they might, they can’t always stop bad people just with the power of their words and “conscience.” Because a lot of the bad people don’t have a fkin conscience and don’t really give a crap if they say no or try to stop them. Besides which, this isn’t on the kids to stop; it’s on the adults around them to protect them from. This is the worst kind of propaganda; can you imagine a child abuse victim seeing this? Can you imagine how it would make them feel?
ya i wouldnt LET em? ok so a guy 6 fet tall grabs me i say oh i WONT LET you? what this a cartoon? BAD GUY: ohh im so sorry i didnt mean to do what i did, PLEASE dont tell my wife shes a police officer. LOL i remember from the movie WEIRD SCIENCE garry and wyatt tell the motorcycle gang to leave. one guy says hes sorry and hes a school teacher and doesnt want lose his job
as a person who was assulted as a child who received no help (nobody even told my parents it happened) I'll tell you, it makes me want to knee the elders responsible for this sentiment in the balls and punch them in the face
I work at a daycare, and if a kid takes another kids things or play with something they shouldn't, I have to pry it out of their hands to restore order, and despite having T-rex arms I can do so easily.
Seriously, anyone who claims children can excert power over adults is either a liar or someone who's literally never met a child before.
I literally remember my aunt making me, my cousins, and my sibling practice saying no, I was first and got so surprised when she suddenly grabbed my arm and talked harshly with me. I froze because I wasn’t expecting her to be so intense, but she said I had to harshly pull my arm away and firmly say no, so we went through it a few times. I could barely do it because I was so uncomfortable and honestly not a great actor. How in the world was that supposed to protect us from real life predators? All it did was give me low self confidence for a bit. My family was so clueless but at least they were very passionate about preventing CSA I just wish they knew about all the allegations.
Im not a rapist or nothing,
But by the age of 7, simply saying “no” to me meant nothing…. And that was me as a 7 year old kid.
I knew that words didn’t do anything, so i used to torment the other kids at school,
They’d ask me to stop whatever i did to them, and I’d just scoff at them when the best they had was “no, please, don’t”
“No please don’t” is code for I CANT DO ANYTHING ABOUT THIS
it was easy to impose myself on other kids, admittedly.
Im not the wild kid i was back then anymore,
But i know what i did, and I’ve actually learned from the things I’ve done in my life,
And i know for a fact, words are just words.
The only place where words matter is in a court room or in front of the police.
This one guy used to bother me on the playground,
Funny enough, he did it with words,
When i said stop, i was ignored.
A couple weeks later, he broke his arm, and was super vulnerable.
I chased this guy around for an entire recess at school, doing nothing but whipping rocks at his broken arm while he begged me to stop….
And guess what,
His pleas meant nothing.
Dude was older than me, but i made him feel small and pathetic.
Its that easy.
I threw a few stones and ignored some words….
That was kid-on-kid violence.
but it still applies.
Words mean nothing, and they wont physically make anybody do anything,
No matter how pathetically you beg.
Its sad, but true.
3:59 The adults who assaulted me were established authority figures in my life. Telling them to "stop" wasn't an option.
Telling how it's only sexual abuse and similar crimes targeting the most vulnerable that gets this treatment, no one ever claims you can stop thieves and robbers by telling them to stop and run away.
And I bet even if you did say stop (and you probably did at some point), they didn't listen. Cuz it turns out words aren't ducking magic!
@thomiatyww You don't have to yell.
Telling them to stop wasn't an option because they didn't offer it as an option. You could tell them "no" ad nauseum, but they would ignore it.
@@thomiatyww I'm done with this conversation.
What if you bit them??
The problem is that if their members could identify grooming from a young age, they'd never stay with the cult.
This is planned incompetence.
I mean, cults rely on grooming to attract and keep members in the first place.
HOLY SHIT that is the WORST example of victim blaming EVER JESUS CHRIST
“What if someone tells you something that makes you feel uncomfortable?” You mean, like the tenets of the Watchtower Society?
Yes! U have 2 be honest anyway right?
"No, not like that…" 😑
@@emilyrln but lying is a sin!
Lol
How twisted that the elder's handbook instructs elders to call the police if a Kingdom Hall gets vandalized, but if a child is abused, elders are instructed to call the branch office. Sickos!!!!
They use their socialism-for-me-only tax-exemptions to make the socialism-for-me-only police help them for free. The police wouldn't even give me a ride home, as a private "free-hugs" citizen, let alone "guard me for free" because EVEN MY OWN PERSON was vandalized. It's very unfair how corrupt secretive religions are IN-BED with government in pretend-secular polyreligious (only "State/Judge-accepted religions" of course) countries.
@VriskaNines That's exactly what happens. You wait until you get to talk with a guy from Legal Dept. and he'll tell you if the perpetrator is a current Witness, you keep the matter 'in house'. Do not call the Police. If they find that there is a witness to the abuse and the perpetrator is repentant then, once again, don't tell the Police. If he's found guilty and is unrepentant then he gets disfellowshipped. ONLY AT THIS POINT do they allow the child or her parents to tell the Police.
@VriskaNines not kidding. Fact. The book itself "Shepherd the Flock of God" is available online. It should be the reason this cult gets investigated for child abuse across every nation!
They say not to do things someone else asks if it makes you feel uncomfortable, but that's like most thing that JWs do. Like are you comfortable being alienated from the world? Are you comfortable going to people's doors every day and talking to them? Are you comfortable walking on eggshells just to not be shunned forever?
Going to people's doors was absolutely horrific for me. I loved everything else so it was so hard when I realized how not true this supposed truth based religion wasn't. I loved going to the kingdom hall and the watchtower magazine was my favorite reading material. I was also heartbroken losing my friends.....my family was not religious or part of jehovah witnesses. I learned about it later in life and I still miss the kingdom hall but in no way could I ever go back, sadly.
You know they don't mean that. They just do a little PR so public doesn't know what really goes on in there!!
That was my exact thought when they said that. It seems so uncomfortable to knock on doors for religion.
@@lynnjackson8367I’m sorry you lost your friends when you left that church, I hope you can find another community that’s a little more accepting and kind. I recommend Unitarian Universalism!
@@edvh88 thank you so much ❤️. I will check it out for sure! Thanks again!
3:10 No, they know EXACTLY what they're doing: They're making a PSA to "protect children" from obvious, scary threats to simultaneously look like they have children's interests at heart, but also to make sure children and their families aren't able to see the real abusers' real-life approach. They are making this to PROTECT abusers, dude.
probly written and directed by them
They are totally victim blaming
They're groomers themselves
I cannot believe in the very first line of their CSA video they’re implying SA is the child/victim’s fault. “Jehovah wants to protect you that’s why he gave you a conscience”. That’s pure victim blaming/shaming! Absolutely repugnant. No one is ever to blame for falling victim to manipulation and grooming.
🤔 HMMM...Why didn't he give a conscience to the abusers who KNEW it's wrong to hurt children? Gimme a break... what about the ELDUHS who are intentionally protecting the PEDOPHILES , but not the CHILD VICTIMS ?!
Absolutely
Ur pfp is how I felt when I first heard them say that 💀
This feels like a set-up for victim blaming. Imagine telling a child that they shouldn’t have LET someone sexually assault them? SA, especially CSA, is often done by people who are physically stronger and/or in a position of authority over the person. The use of the words “I wouldn’t let them” is SO fucked up.
It is very insulting to victims who were paralysed by fear or threatened with a weapon or even threats, like I've read that many abusers will choose a child with a younger sibling so they can say "if you don't let me, I'll do it to/harm your little bother/sister"
My man really searched "steps to groom a child" for this video. I salute your courage
I'm sure his government assigned FBI agent understands he researches other contextual topics on child abuse to not raise alarm bells lol
Blaming the victims makes it so much easier to protect the perpetrators.
So true and this is why the Jehovah witnesses must be stopped
It’s also becoming known worldwide the corruption of this organization. I frequently send exposure videos to Christians I know and they spread it. They are appalled!!!! Better yet, they spread it to countless people. 😎😁
@@BlackCover95 yep, regardless of who and what you are, you will avoid conflict if possible subconsciously, and so you'd avoid the path of most resistence, which is why these people need to be dragged accross the scorching irons that is the consequences of their inaction, in order to force them to take action.
much, much easier, and I have been labeled bad associations , a nice apology letter and talks with elders that everything was basically my own fault
@@shawnlizeleatherdale4052 that's so horrible. im sorry you had to experience that.
The part of "how many people died of not getting blood transfusions?" hits hard. I am so glad I left before my son ever got sick. He's had two life saving blood transfusions. If I had not left, had he become a JW, he might have refused blood when he needed it. But when because we left, I can right now hear him singing in the next room. He's alive because we left.
TWO??
Good for you, Rebecca. You made the right choice to get of that cult before your son needed blood transfusions.
the entire religion relies on dampening that "alarm system." By teaching kids that they'll intuitively know when someone wants to do them harm, they won't suspect actual predators in their flock.
6:40 They’re treating predators like swipper from Dora, just gotta say “predators dont touch me” 3 times and they have to leave you alone 😂
i was molested for six years by the son of a family friend. I grew up Southern Baptist, and the pastor found out about what happened,and was nothing but helpful(he banned the guy and his family from church on pain of arrest). I'm now studying to become a Clinical Mental Health counselor so i can help other kids and teens the way i was helped.
Pastor W
So glad somebody supported you.
@@thomiatyww bro hes talking about trauma are you a jw coping or something lol
A child telling an abuser that they’re gonna tell on them is gonna lead to the abuser at best beating the shit out of and at worst literally murdering the child so they don’t get caught
Of course
telling your abuser that you're going to report them is the single WORST thing you could do. the only reason i got away from my father was bc my family showed up completely unannounced with the strongest members to take me away from him. if i had told my father that they were gonna take me and report him, god knows what he would've done.
My Aunt (Who grew up with JW parents, was SA'd by another member of their JW congregation when she was 5. Instead of going to the police they went to the head of the church. Nothing happened to him. My Aunt buried it deep all her life, and recently in therapy it all came out. We never forgave my grandparents.
Oh my goodness 😮😞 I'm sorry about your aunt and I hope she feels better and why did Jehovah witnesses go to their own organization for this I agree they should go to the police for this stuff not the organization cause the organization don't give a crap about the Jehovah witnesses and their problems also I hope watchtower and the Jehovah witnesses falls cause they need to go.
@@submonkey9190 because it's bad for business!! If people hear this before they're so brainwashed they will not join and each jw is$$!!
My husband's aunt was raped when she was 8, by a teenaged boy that wanted to become a Catholic priest. The church covered it up, and had her parents agree not to tell anyone or seek treatment. They agreed to it, and to make things worse, her dad was a cop. Her life was tragic, and she died relatively young. But her rapist? He became a priest of course.
@@someonerandom256 dude wtf is wrong with these people.
@6:41 It's pretty pathetic that they think the Dora the Explorer "Swiper no Swiping" method is gonna stop such horrific actions from happening.
This brought up memories of the young people ask book. I dont recall if it was the 1st or 2nd volume. There was a section about molestation. I remember reading it when I was 15 shortly after I experienced a rape by a ministerial servant. It talked about struggling with a guilty conscience and how it was a good thing because it meant you were sorry and didnt want it. I also remember there being a portion on whether or not you faught off the molester or not. As in, if you didnt fight, jehovah could assume it was consensual. There was a little test called,"was it consensual?" It asked questions like, did you say no, did you run away. Did you confess right away? I remember that really messing with my head for a long time. My mom, the elders and even myself for a while tried to gaslight me.
I remember after the rape I had to go to the elders and talk about what happened in detail. After that happened I fell into a severe depression and had several suicide attempts. They said my conscience was bothering me. The elders instructed me to to write a letter to my rapist. They wanted me to apologize for my part in it. And I actually did it because I was being manipulated so badly! It's so fucking disgusting. I cant believe they got me to apologize to my rapist. I was basically a sex toy to that pervert, what the fuck do I have to apologize for? It still upsets me to this day how they tried to spin it. It was a rumor in the congregation that we were dating and when he broke up with me I started gossiping, they framed it as I was a jealous ex, yet nobody seemed to care that I was a child and he an adult. I was literally begging for someone to see it was wrong, to care, instead I was labeled a dramatic gossip. Every single one of those people in my old cong are guilty. I consider them accomplaces to child rape and every one of them can get f**ked for all I care.
You deserved better
I'm appalled that you had to go through that. Hope your healing continues.
Your comment touched my heart. I have a daughter. It is awful that they made you do that. I can totally see how that would mess with your head. To my horror, I completely believe it went down just as you said because I was in for so long. That sounds exactly like the sort of thing they would do. I am so so sorry you went through that. I hope you are able to find peace in your life now.
I'm sorry that happened to you. It kind of makes me wish there is a hell for them
That’s effed up on so many level, I’m sorry you had to go through that.
Appreciate your articulate passion and understandable anger. I was appointed an elder at 26. Left 23 years later. Read Crisis of Conscience and went full blown anti WT. Most of my family are still in. Keep up your good videos and clear analysis.
how do you get to be an elder that young!?
@@ona512 2 reasons that I would guess 1) he came from a long line of "good" JW lineage or 2) congregation was female heavy and there weren't many males qualified or willing to be an elder.
It seems like this is made to scare their parents more than the kids to make them isolate their children and keep them in a closed society and distrust any outsiders.
It's meant I believe as a message to parents as you said and also to obfuscate the whole issue and create the false impression that the organization is proactive.
Speaking of falseness, everything about this Cult of Crap is FALSE!!
@@Angry20Something That is *exactly* what it is.
@@Angry20Something Perfectly said!!! 👏 👏👏
Growing up in the 80s I remember the whole thing around Stranger Danger. Of course we've learned since very few kids get grabbed by strangers.
I’d love for someone to make a parody series of Caleb and Sophia with all of the truths the series tries to hide.
It would be so funny if they decided to put a villain that is just a normal guy™ with common sense and an average University student. 😂
Nah Owen should be the character, And he also voices himself. And nobody, absolutely nobody fucking notices him.
Here's my suggestion to deal with these on going instances of CSA being covered up by religious organizations: we make a new law that states that all people of religious authority are mandated reporters. For people who don't know, mandated reporters are people who are required by law to report any instances of abuse they hear about, even if it doesn't sound real or they hear it second hand, they have to report it within 24 hours of hearing about it or they will also be held liable, will definitely lose their job and have a massive black mark on their record and I think they can even go to jail in some cases. A couple examples of mandated reporters are anyone who works in a school (teachers, aides, etc.), medical staff (doctors, nurses, etc.), psycologists/psychiatrists, etc..
In Australia: Under the Children, Youth and Families Act, people in religious ministries are mandatory reporters of child abuse to Child Protection Services.
I'd support that!
I've had to sign such a clause. I've had to act on it once so far.
"STOP DOING THAT I'M GONNA TELL ON U"
*dematerializes*
“What if it’s a pastor or an elder that does uncomfortable things to you?”
“I’d let them! Because they are close to god and if I don’t let them I won’t get into heaven!”
“That’s right Sophia, it’s not assault if it’s done by a preacher!”
Not in the eyes of the law
@@Moneyboy_Supreme_Don't matter much if they're never involved.
@Moneyboy Supreme
Religion tends to get a free pass in America when comes to the law, among other things.
@@benoitcecyre7081 Sad but true
JW's don't think they are going to heaven and they don't use the term preacher.
"stop doing that! i'm gonna tell on you" ah yes let's introduce the risk of a predator panicking and hurting the kid or retaliating.
As the old pirate saying goes, "dead men tell no tales".
"I would run away"
Yeah, assuming the other person isn't bigger and stronger than you and doesn't grab you and hurt you. 🤦
JWs are actually so callous and inhumane that they would actually allow harm or even death to be inflicted on themselves and their peers if it meant not going against the cult conditioning. I was in it for 17 years, they are dead serious.
@@SadisticSenpai61 and assuming they don't have proyectiles
I told my son when he was young that if anyone touched him in certain places to come and tell me. You can't leave it on the kids to say no and stop the abuse from happening. That's why we as parents have to go to the police and let our children know that they can come tell us without fear and that we will take care of the problem.
My mom did this for me too and I can't imagine a parent NOT having that conversation with their kid, unless they don't have their child's best interest at heart... which unfortunately some parents dont, far too many...
Well, what my mom said *specifically* was, "if anyone touches you there and you don't like it, come tell me."
APPARENTLY what I answered with was, "But what if I like it?"
My mom was stunned and then went "Well, tell me anyway!!!" 🤣
I was young enough that I don't remember it at all but a few years ago she told me the story and it was hilarious. I had no idea about sex or anything relating to it except the standard age appropriate knowledge for a 3-4yr old and nothing bad had happened to me, i just... said it. Turned out to be quite prophetic as to the type of person I grew up to be though, haha. Kids say the darndest things
Yea you got it straight on. I was almost sold into sex trafficking by a missionary in my school's bible club.
holy shit that’s awful
If they are implying that this is the fault of the children, this is the worst Caleb and Sophia lesson yet... And that's saying a LOT.
That is EXACTLY what they're trying to say.
If its a girl then most definently.
Are you saying a little girl is responsible for SA? I have no clue what your trying to say here@@miscalotastuff733
I majored in Psychology, which included criminal psychology, and this... this is absurd. The entire point of grooming is tiny steps, pushing the boundaries and building trust bit by bit so by the time they're asked to do something extreme, they DON'T feel uncomfortable. They trust the predator implicitly. Too often there's also a power dynamic at play as well because it's a close relative or a teacher who has authority over the child, so they may not even see NO as an option. Often it's an ongoing situation from the time they were too young to remember and it seems normal until they get out in the world and find out it's not. All this 90s stranger danger PSA crap isn't coming anywhere near the root of the problem. Someone educate these nitwits. They're not helping.
They won’t listen. I am absolutely certain that after all the cases that they have had to deal with, somebody has suggested educating them about it. They will refuse to listen. They are stuck in their mindset and no one can get them out of it. Anyone who tries most likely gets cast out and subsequently shunned. They are then forbidden to say why someone was cast out therefore, nobody knows why it was done. Word just never gets out. It’s a terrible place. Terrible situation. And your description of how predators get ahold of somebody could just as well be applied to that religion. They push your boundaries little by little and brainwash you little by little until you will do just about anything they ask of you without question thinking it is normal until you get out of there and look back in horror, shame and disgust at what you were doing.
@@Hun_Uinaq - Oh I know, but it's still absurd. They aren't protecting anyone with this nonsense because they've checked out of reality.
@HappyThife - I don't think they don't know what they're doing, exactly. They're still doing it from a place of ignorance. They still have a strong anti-government stance and don't want "worldly" police getting involved in their cult, and that's where a lot of this comes from, but they still are clueless about how these things really work and what real precautions should be taken. They know what they think they're doing within their doctrine and isolationist/separatist agenda. That much is certain.
"never keep a secret from us" until I disappoint you with something benign like watching a show with magic in it. Then I learn that I have to be really sneaky to enjoy anything I find fun.
I learned very quickly as JW kid to never tell my mother anything. She had an issue with just about everything. Especially anything FUN. I was forced to be sneaky 😒
@@katiebrent3332 you just described my dad. Luckily my mom is the cool one & she tempered his strictness.
I'm a CSA victim myself. This "Alarm System" doesn't go off in innocent children. I didn't know what it meant for such a thing to occur. I didn't know anything sexual at all. It just slowly sank into me as I grew into my teens, and it F me up so bad. I looked at the memories and I couldn't helped but berate the child version of me. I hated myself but tried to come into terms with it.
I just wanted to say thank you for making your videos, I was born up JW, horribly abused, ran away from home at 17 im 46 now, and havent looked back and cut all family ties, watching your videos for years now and your content reminds me that I made the right decision. Keep up the god work! 🤘
I remember at my fathers funeral Jehovah's Witnesses greeting everyone outside the funeral home as if they were family members. My mother had to hold me back as I told them to f**k off. That sums up who they are. Great vid Owen!!!
I’m an ex seventh day Adventist kid, and I have to say the level of anger Owen shows is so visceral and real.
It's so sad because in a vacuum, this wouldn't be that bad, but with the context around it, it's awful
"if you get abused, it's because you didn't listen to jehovah's warnings."
That's really sad and messed up! It's sad when Sonic can give kids better advice on being safe than a trusted religious organization.
Sonic the hedgehog?
@@saragarnica723 yeah, in Sonic Says.
I remember that one!
Sonic: That's no good!
@@melissacooper8724 I like how his advice is to just keep telling people about it because so many people of all ages that are afraid to tell people, but it is the only way to stop the offender.
This could also cause so much for guilt who have already been abused. 😢 What if it is a parental figure? There was also no talk of what about if they are threatened. Many children are, and then "not running" can feel like they are "allowing" it. It's not their fault. It never is.
And if any of you reading this have past hurts, I'm sorry you went through that. It wasn't your fault.
the JW cartoon made me feel like it was my fault for being gr**med because i didnt see the red flags and do anything about them.
"Why couldnt i see it right away? why couldnt i block it off sooner? why are they making it seem so easy? am i just stupid and at fault for letting it happen?"
makes it worse that even though the first time i was being gr**med i was able to at least realize it before it got REALLY bad, i was then gr**med again and only realized it was gr**ming a a year after i was able to finally get out of it.
it sickens me that they show these to other children
(had to censor the words bc youtube deletes comments)
@@thomiatyww . I would never say that a child shouldn't run from an attacker ... but what if that attacker is a parent, or someone trusted that there is no where to run from? There is also the fact that adrenaline can cause fight, flight, or freeze responses. When victims freeze, they can often be blamed for not fighting back, as if their body shutting down in an attempt to save them from danger is their "consent". The blame belongs ENTIRELY on predators. Not an ounce of it should be left on a victim.
Poor choice of an emoji.
I have an ex-friend who was once a devout Catholic but the JWs eventually got him. He would go on and on about how awful the Catholic Church is, and when the sex scandal was reveled , he rightly was very critical of the Catholic hierarchy. I don’t believe he has ever commented on the JW scandals & YES, my former friend is an elder.
I'm not a fan of the police as an institution, but from a deeply pragmatic level, they have access to resources laypeople wouldn't in stopping cases of CSA. If you know of an abuse case, call the fucking cops! No questions asked!
There is nothing more disgusting, despicable, or pathetic than a degenerate child molester.
I used to babysit a child (don't worry nothing happened to them) of a split parent situation. I worked for mom and never met dad. The deal was two weeks on, two off. Suddenly one evening I received a text from mom asking if I could work every week, and if I was comfortable with "defending" the house. Weird right but I was like "yep! Let's do this!" So I come in the next day, before the kid woke up as usual, and mom shows me where all the guns where in the house, showed me pictures of people to not open the door to, and if they broke in, to defend the kid from. She was so paranoid, so I asked what happened. Well dad raped mom's minor sister 4 years ago. FOUR years ago. And she reported it immediately. FOUR years later the police finally gathered enough to get a warrant and jail him. He hasn't seen trial yet. And why would the child see him for two weeks of every month? Because no matter how hard mom tried, she couldn't get full custody because she was considered too unfit to be a full time mom because she was caught shop lifting with her baby twice. Her fighting only got her 50/50 custody, because it was an alleged rape the year their child was born, and the four years following. I babysat that child while mom went to court with his new arrest, and has full custody pending trial, if he is found innocent, it's possible that kid will have to go back to dad 50/50.
I agree, if crime happens call police, but they are so incompetent that a fucking rape kit done less than 24 hours after rape, and a full ass name and address of the attacker takes them four fucking years to send out an arrest warrant!
Child abuse groups are more capable like the FBI. Your local police fumble around too long more than solve problems. Trust me I know..
As a survivor of fundamentalism and CSA, It is SO CATHARTIC to see your anger, especially because you're so proactively helping others every day.
My catholic school had a similar approach of "oh if they do something that makes you uncomfortable just walk away and tell a grown up" I think it's a tad bit more complicated than that.
also, how some parents/guardians you tell will say things like "oh because ur so cute! lol!!" or "i doubt that happened" etc
I grown in Belgium in the 90's, when 2 serial p*do r*apers were discovered. So it was a big paranoia.
My mom took it very seriously. I remember how she scared the shit out me when she told me (I was hery young) that EVERYONE could touch me inappropriately, even people I know and like.
She made le regulary repeat what an appropriate touch was (a kiss on rhe cheek to say hello), and what was not (eveything else); when she bathed me, she insisted that noone else was allowed to do so, and made sure I know the name of my body parts (to be able to report precisely an inappeopriate touch).
It found it quite funny (as took it as a game), except the freaking scary part about that everyond could hurt me. But I learned the lesson!
I cannot believe they are actually victim blaming the f*cking children. Ffs. And not teaching them the information that helps inoculate kids against sexual abuse means it will keep happening. But now they can blame the kids directly even more than they probably already did.
Owen is totally right, most predators don't snatch kids off playgrounds. His video is so much more educational for parents on what child predation usually looks like. But I hate that Jehovah's Witnesses, and especially their kids, won't learn the accurate information. Keeping them ignorant, keeps them easier targets. That's so infuriating.
Keep fighting the good fight, Owen! Apostates are getting a much better name these days than Jehovah's Witnesses, for sure.
I do know a bit more than average on this because of focusing on child psych back in school. It's great that Owen fit so much accurate information into this debunking. Excellent video, as always!
Yeah I bet most cases happen when the perpetrator has the kid alone. The victim can yell stop all they want but a 30 year plus old man can easily overpower a child. And worst off the kid's fight or flight response will kick in and they might freeze up and be too scared to actually do anything.
I love your passionate rage. This is the correct way to deal with injustice and those in power who perpetuate injustice.
I was never able to tell anyone about my abuse. In my 50’s and just now able to talk about it. Still blamed for not saying anything. Watch out for your kids. Protect them. Let them see you protecting them. And listen
They are using the already debunked "stranger danger" message. Zero research when into what they did...they just picked things that pushes the blame away from them. Despicable.
Just the other day I've been thinking about these kinds of PSAs, the ones that portray predators as monsters or as someone obviously dark and alarming.
Which is truthful to the reality on some level and can be emotionally effective but it's not like kids getting groomed would know that- the predator is usually very nice to them and isn't a monster, why should they feel alarmed by them? Or should they be weary of anyone being nice to them?
Also, "just say no". Because a predator surely would listen.
"Just walk away", as if as a child you can just move somewhere, especially in cases with relatives and family friends.
"Just tell parents/authority figures", as if they always listen and don't assume that you're making things up. Or are willing to rock the boat if they do. Or can actually do anything if they're themselves are in a weak position compared to the predator and whoever else on the predators side.
EXACTLY!!! not to mention, making victims feel stupid for not noticing someone is evil right away like the dumb JW PSA shows..
It's about as insulting as the Bush era "Just say no."
What do you suggest as an alternative, "JUST SAY YES"??
This actually makes me grateful that we came forward about our CSA before our family got roped into this cult because now I'm convinced that we would have never gotten any justice and would have been forced to continue living with our abuser for the rest of our life
Telling children to say no when they're uncomfortable with something is really important. But it can't be THE ONLY THING an organization does wtf.
I would appreciate it if someone could explain how the parents are not held responsible for this kind of thing happening if they refuse to report it to law enforcement or take any sort of corrective action.
If we're talking about IN Utah itself they basically run the state at all levels so it takes another elder being injured to get a SAer kicked out. Otherwise it's victim blame, gas light, threaten, and finally excommunicate the victim while shuttling the predator the same way the Catholics were
Damn, they've got victim blaming down to a fine art. They're essentially telling the kids that if they're too "stupid" and/or "gullible" to know they're being groomed, too afraid to say no or they just end up victimized even if they do everything described in the video then the problem is with them because apparently 100% of children are psychic and can flawlessly judge the intentions of seasoned abusers in positions of power and wave them away with a magic word like a fucking wizard. And, of course, the abusers are always framed as people they don't know from outside the congregation so that they can simultaneously otherize outsiders (to isolate them from the only people who will take them seriously and actually help them like a teacher or the police) and protect abusers inside the organization by making sure the kids view their abusive behavior as legitimate and acceptable exclusively because it's people from inside the organization who are doing it. Of course this commonly leads to suicide-inducing guilt and shame where the child blames themselves for what's happening/happened to them since the abuser and their actions are framed as "good" by default which would mean that any resistance or even discomfort the child experiences is "bad," potentially leading to self-harm and suicide which, of course, solves the church's problem for them.
Truly a masterclass in how to *actually* groom children.
I’m not even 5 minutes in yet and I’m already so offended. This reeks of victim blaming. As someone who was groomed at church by an adult, the situation they’re setting up for the kids to watch out for is completely absurd. This is so wrong. I’m really glad you’re calling them out.
I disassociated in December 2021, after the first months of starting my new job as a Residential Child Care Worker in UK. I already was completely inactive for two years prior. I knew already during those years about CSA, but obviously I had only some uncertain ideas about the issue, the scale, and how to handle it. Now I know about the problem, I'm getting the education in college about it as a requirement in my work, and more important - now I know what that does to the young person. The handling the problem in the JW organisation is so harmful, ignorant and immature at so many levels, it's hard to even describe! If I would know about the suspicion of abuse and not report it to my manager - I'm risking of getting into trouble, even of being fired. If I know for certain about the abuse and I do not report it to my manager - I'm not only loosing my job, but I can end up facing the potential charges against me for doing nothing. And my manager can end up even in jail if he doesn't do anything after my report - for him loosing his job is one of the lightest consequences! Yes, I'm potentially treated more harshly due to my type of work. So are the elders in the congretations potentially - because they are the ones who are trusted and they supposed to be the ones who should be approached with every problem. And that's the tragedy. I'm having constant trainings, information, staff meetings, the college education. And yet, I'm not qualified to handle the cases of CSA myself, I'm obliged to report them. I'm working my ass off full time, completely dedicated to my work and education in my college, and still I'm not even close to the psychologists working alongside of the police, who are handling the cases of the CSA. Following the Elder's Manual and the Legal Department will put elders in jail. And maybe this is the only one way of changing something for the better if nothing else works, because: ''In the era of information, ignorance is a choice.'' - dr Joe Dispenza. It's their choice. The choice which children don't have.
Preach 💙 👏🏻
The elders manual you mention I believe is titled, Shepherd the Flock of God. It is highly secret; even wives of elders are not allowed to know it exists. From what I do know, the secret instructions on CSA reports, does not allow reporting to the authorities. This itself is unscriptural see Romans 13 1. That the organisation refuses to do this, expounding instead the two witness rule proves 100% their will to protect abusers and their bias against victims. They use the scriptures accordingly. Their secrets must be exposed, and elders arrested, for the sake of all victims, survivors and potential victims.
The biggest issue I had with this video is the presentation of the perp as a ethereal non-human. 2nd is the complete failure to identify unsafe touch. Never mind the problematic extreme indoctrination of obedience and trust. Finally, the appeal to the child's "conscience" to keep themselves safe. Which falls in line with the WBTS history of disfellowshipping or otherwise punishing the victims.
Love your take on all this craziness! Never a witness, but have family that are. Talked me into studying about 25 years ago. So so glad i caught on before it was too late. As a parent of 5 kids....i am so so thankful i never went the next step with this shit. Disgusting!
Good for you Christine 👏
That's scary, glad to hear you are ok
5 kids? I can barely handle being near 1 toddler!
The parts about becoming an important part of a kid’s life and then isolating them are why so many predators went into Scout leadership.
Don’t ask me how I first learned that.
While teaching children that saying no, walking away, and telling someone when they're made to feel uncomfortable is an important lesson to teach, it misses the other half of the equation. The requirement of two witnesses is basically a green light to abuse children as long as the perpetrator can single out and attack children individually. It's sick.
They could do like Muslims and just lie about being witnesses.
Seriously though, it’s incredible how often the required two to three Muslims somehow all witness things that the other Muslims are going out of their way to hide.
"What if they tell you Jehovah wants you to take off your clothes?"
"I'd DO it! 😊" Way to go, cult....
THIS
What if you go float your b***h a**?
Wtf does your conscience have to do with a predator that is grooming a child! Unbelievable!
I was deeply saddened that the settlements from the CSA lawsuits did not destroy the cult. When a cult is forced to sell their HQ that is the literal formal name of the organization I had assumed that would be end of it.
Both times I've been sexually assaulted, it was by friends who tricked me. One even pretended to accept my asexuality and after the sexual assault basically said LGBT deserve to be raped. So a backstabbing friend and a sneaky bigot. Not a stranger in a dark alley like I was raised to believe this type of activity would come from. I think people with sexual consent problems deserve to be sterilized. I think that would help cut down on sexual activity without consent. Don't want this negative consequence to your behavior?. Have consensual sex, it's not that hard.
I am very sorry you had terrible things happen to you, but you might want to stop calling those who hurt you "friends" .... those scumbags were never your friend. They were predators pretending to be your friend.
Sorry you were assaulted. Make sure to get the police. This is delicate, we must be careful , there are all sorts of situations where it is not clear who agreed to what how many times, etc. AND people, young and old, LIE!!
You mean castrated, not sterilized. I agree. I have had to physically remove friends of mine from trying to assault women. I dragged them out the room by hair and ears. I'm sorry this happened to you. Please use your experience to warn young girls. I personally teach girls how to break people's bones.
@@tesmith47 Why is the most emphatic point of your response to say that people lie? Lie about what, being sexually assaulted? Because from your attempt to ambiguate the idea of consent with "it's not clear who agreed to what how many times" I'm getting a very creepy impression of your motive.
@@shadowatch4767 EXACTLY 💯. You can tell who some of the creeps are as soon as they speak 🙊 .
I'm kind of paranoid. Is C&S teaching kids the wrong warning signs so the kids don't understand what was done and they can't explain the elders are the abusers?
Tw !
There was a man in our congregation who I believe had a history of assaulting children. I only knew because he was really close to all of the young people (especially girls), and we used to hug him, he’d come over to our house, etc. when I hit puberty my mum told me I could hug him anymore. I asked why and she said that there was something ‘wrong with his brain’ that made him not understand that me being friendly wasn’t romantic interest. He still regularly came over to our house after that, including when my parents weren’t home and it was my sister looking after us. There was no attempts by the elders to let people know or keep him from the young people.
"The intellectual gripping of the mind is very hard to recover from."
Aka "We don't want you to think for yourself." 💀
That is just WAY too nuts... I am **SO** glad my son and I got out and away from them.
If you put the onus on the victim to prevent abuse, it can translate into self-blame or victim-blaming later. Even if those kids told their parents/elders, nothing would be done - and there lies the problem.
What's your point??
@@thomiatywwwhat do you think
@@onuspromis7166 its more nuanced than this.
It's VERY important to teach kids REALITY based reaction,not shit based on either this woke SJW ideals of "ohhhh nothing would be done if the kid told someone/tried to stop the rape so stop telling them to do anything" which is just as demonic and SICK as what Jehovahs do covering up rape and blaming the victims. Are ALL of you so blinded as to not see this??
I feel very bad for kids in this situation but saying give up and take it in the ass is hardly a good answer. No. Teach kids that sometimes adults can try to do things that hurt them,and to run away/try to defend themselves and ask for help from a different adult. And -id even say,it's a good idea to inform kids of the fact that there could be hesitation when they report this- and WHY. Stop acting like kids are fucking dogs they know they got raped they know the adults ain't helping em they're giving up because of people like YOU lordfreerealestate8302 as well
Teach them persistence because they may have to tell multiple adults before they are removed from the situation.
If you have a problem with this the answer doesn't involve telling kids to not report- it lies in reforming your states judicial system to make this easier.
It sounds more like this video is trying to stop kids from listening to non JWs and not protect them from predators!
I have a feeling that might be the case
Exactly what I was thinking.
I asked my international jw missionary family member about the child abuse scandal a few years ago. They said it was taken care of. I couldn't comprehend that response
Im a babysitter and one of the kids i babysit got A-ed by a pastor. It luckily stopped before it could get worse and the dude R-ed him, but makes my blood boil. That was the sweetest kid and went to... a dark place. And the parents did NOTHING
It’s awful how many adults will turn a blind eye to assault. It’s “easier”, I guess???
@@edvh88 Yep it is indeed easier....even though its 100% terrible and 100% wrong
The worst part is, they put the children in the responsibility to not get groomed and violated. In the end they could blame the kid for becoming a victim.
"Protect your children... Cause we fuckin' won't."
As a mandated reporter myself this is beyond disgusting 🤮 We are specifically instructed NOT to investigate ANYTHING ourselves prior to reporting!
As a very young girl raised as a JW I was molested by a male in the congregation. After it happed a few times I told my mother. She put it all back on me to stop it. I was just a little kid. The next time he tried to molest me, I told him I would tell. He never bothered me again. But the most distressing part, my mother NEVER EVER mentioned it again. She didn’t even ask me if it had stopped or if it was still happening. Nothing. At age 80 now I still can’t believe the reaction of my mother. I left the JW’s at age 18 and never looked back. And so glad I did.
16:15 These rules are so insane 😂
No wonder a lot of CSA within the congregation aren’t reported.
I've not gotten this far in as I'm honestly triggered by the framing of the first sentence of the JW vid, but yeah, it's basically impossible to get things taken seriously in JWs for this subject. They won't want any news to get out as it'll make the religion look bad, so they do their best to keep it quiet. At most, if someone was an outcast, they might find a reason to kick them out if they're also a threat to people's kids, but JWs are pros at isolating each other, so most will keep their kids from a creepy outcast in the religion more readily than they'd kick them out and tell the police.
I remember when a high-profile brother was rumoured to SA his kid. Adults talked about it WHILE AT HIS HOUSE WITH THEIR KIDS, but no one did anything. We watched his daughter get increasingly troubled and treated more like a troublemaker when in retrospect, she was neurodivergent, traumatised, and needed safety. She left the religion, found what seemed to be a great husband, and carefully cut us all off for her safety. Even though I'm a safe person (as an ExJW), it's common for those who leave to cut everyone off just because we can't trust who is safe sometimes and have already been shunned by our core family and closest friends... I just hope she's gotten lots of therapy and has a happy family. She, no one, deserved that. She must have heard the adults talking about her while trusting her dad and giving her the stink eye... It was confusing and scary for me, but it must have been so hellish for her. :(
It probably took these children a long time to get up the courage to tell someone what happened to them, and then to be disbelieved, and have to confront the abuser?
The last time I got a visit from the cult, it had been years and the last visit did not go well or them. So I commented that I thought they'd put me on a list or that their hall closed.
The reason I thought maybe their hall closed was because they were selling them off to pay the fines for continuing to sheltering child predators. I'd have seized it all as proceeds of a crime.
It's disheartening how persistent the myth of a creep tricking a kid into the back of a van being the majority of youth harmers has been... Can it happen? On very rare occasions, but it's basically unheard of.
As sonic once said, "That's no good."
Having lived this, the idea that they still pretend I was the problem instead of the abuser who was convicted and went to prison for what he did is sickening and so, so hurtful..
😢
Wow! I'm floored by the "have the kid talk to the predator" and even having them in the same room! That's insane! They don't even do this in the legal system with full grown adults.
A while back, I was the victim of attempted mugging and SA. I defended myself and the guy got arrested. I had to go to court to testify about what happened. Even with that proceeding, they made sure that the perpetrator and his victims (I wasn't the only one) weren't in the same room together, for our own safety as well as comfort. Granted, this doesn't always happen, but it usually does, especially now that we can do legal stuff remotely.
Asking a victim to be in the same room as their abuser AND to accuse that person is something difficult even for a strong-willed adult. I can't even imagine doing that to a child. That's just cruel.
I'm a Seventh-day Adventist. I teach the Primary Sabbath School (ages 6 to 9). When they asked me to do the job, I had to go through a background check. And there's another teacher. Two are required because they don't want one alone with the kids.
I think this is a fair way to handle things. Jehovah's Witnesses need to do better.
There's a reason Frollo is considered the scariest Disney Villian - too real.
I appreciate your videos and how you use your experience to educate others. It's disgusting to see how witnesses react to child abuse. I like that you allow yourself to get a bit emotional as this is a huge deal and people need to see that.
Here in Australia the govt set up a reparations fund for SA victims that all churches and youth/community organisations are required to join and pay into or face losing their tax free status. The JWs refused and refused and refused. It got to the point where the govt said, 'we have prepared legislation that will delist the JW org as a church and will present it to parliament in the current session.' Suddenly the JWs signed up. I've no idea how much they might have had to pay out in law suits here but lots of churches and organisations are facing ongoing suits for millions.
I remember that ! It got to the point where Govt. said "Sign up or lose your registration", suddenly they weren't so good at hard-balling !
Is the payment based on the money they have? Like - what is with very small youth organizations, that don't really have money?
I remember that too. Amazing - they rolled over for CSA here in Aus, but are prepared to continue to shun in Norway and lose their benefits. Guess disfellowshipping is more important than CSA to them.
The people who gr00med me very much followed the playbook. My siblings and I were often alone with them because our parents trusted them. When I became a teen and could drive myself, I often went over to their house because they made me feel like a grown-up. Later, I realized that they gr00med me to essentially be a parent to the child in the house and to be a "best friend" to the child's mother - I. WAS. A. CHILD. Teenagers are still children, and they need protection from gr00mers and pr3dators as well.
The C&S video reminds me of the "stranger danger" messages I received in tbe 1980s. I ended up with social anxiety and was still m***sted by an uncle.
You're doing a great service. Accountability is necessary.
A child is no match for an adult predator. Kids can be outsmarted and overpowered by adults. That’s disgusting to think kids have any power over a situation like that. Parents protect your children. Know who their teachers and caregivers are.
WHATS YOUR POINT??? That rape is UNAVOIDABLE and that we should do NOTHING??? 🎉🎉🎉
@@thomiatyww There are literal solutions to this. The "solutions" that JW make, isn't solutions.