oh, I think real people can queerbait. However, they shouldn’t be criticized for it because criticising someone for queerbaiting is actually just policing queerness and is harmful for queer people
@@chloe-fy4wc influencers can, but people who just live and like??? happen to be a man who started to wear nail polish for some reason??? I don't think it's it. Even if this man got a tik tok account and started getting attention from having femme style. Like come on, we queers make everything better and our style is the best cuz it's literally the style of FREEDOM. If we gonna think that people are always queerbating than we won't get the world we are fighting for I think people should start having more fun exploring their sexuality and expression, even if it will turn out that they're not queer.
even if Kit Conner was straight they did such an amazing job already casting actors who are part of the lgbtqia community. Sure I get it stinks that shows don't have queer actors play queer characters a whole lot but the fact that almost all the actors in the show are part of the community I really wouldn't care if one or two people weren't.
Especially when the actor does such a good job. Kit fits the role so well that when I saw the first trailer for the show I was like "damn that boy IS nick nelson". Couldn't have been better casting (in hindsight too with him actually being Bi.)
EXACTLY !!! Even if kit was straight, he didn’t disrespect the community, he did his role perfectly, and that’s it. What’s important is the message the show gives
being part of the lgbt community should't even matter, we have so many amazing shows with queer ppl playing straight characters and straight ppl playing queer characters, so no, i don't get that it ''stinks''. What matters is their acting skills and suitable appearance (and if they are decent people in real life). And i agree, Kit did such a good job, he really stood out for me in the show :)
@@wikslu the part that stinks is that actual queer actors get overlooked or deliberately ignored in favor of cishet actors. It's not that they're bad at their jobs, it's that shows will have queer characters which obviously brings in queer viewership, but then sideline real queer actors in favor of straight ones. They'll use queer characters as a marketing tactic and nothing more, because they never cared about actual queer people. This hasn't happened with Heartstopper obviously, but there are so many shows, most actually, where they only include queer people for views and shun queer actors. It's very disingenuous. Hollywood, Disney, Nickelodeon, basically everyone with any real sway in the film/show making industry are all still stupidly homophobic. James Somerton made a video about the Kit situation where he points about that his career might have just been destroyed or at least stunted because of how much homophobia is still in Hollywood. Kit IS going to miss out on roles, simply because he's an out queer person.
This is why I have always been iffy about the whole "queer characters must be portrayed by queer actors" argument. I understand the idea behind it - Hollywood has a particular historical problem of applauding straight actors for LGBTQIA+ roles that could easily just be given to those who are LGBTQIA+ - but you don't actually know if these actors actually are straight or not, and you shouldn't really because that is a personal part of one's identity that you are not entitled to know about. There are many reasons why one would choose not to be open about their sexuality including protecting their careers and also the fact that even though it is 2022, there are still many people who want all queer people dead. Also, it is really ironic in a sad sense that his character was allowed to come out in the show when he was ready to yet the actor portraying him was not given that same experience. This entire thing was really triggering as a bisexual who has been accused of faking their identity just for being in a heterosexual relationship and I really feel sorry for him. Everyone who contributed to forcing him to come out should be ashamed of themselves.
Part of the longer history here is important. Back in the 1970s and 1980s, actors plying gay characters in prominent projects would go out of the way to publicize that they were "really straight" (see, notably, Michael Ontkean and Harry Hamlin when "Making Love" was released in 1982). That obviously does not excuse the appalling way Kit was treated here--there is no excuse for it--but it is part of the background be hind the push for queer characters to be played by queer actors. And, yes, everyone who forced Kit to come out should be ashamed of themselves.
@@chimaxx The problem is that sexuality is not something that is visible. We can never truly know if someone is queer or not. Even back in the 70s and 80s. Part of the reason many denied their sexuality was to protect themselves. The world was even more vicious back then. Tevin Campbell called himself had to hide his sexuality and only recently came out as gay. Then, sometimes people think they are straight but may be questioning and they may decide to play a queer character to discover themselves. The kid who played Cyrus on Andi Mack used to ID as straight but after playing a gay kid he realized he was bi. If the representation is not bad, then what is the problem with some people? Part of the issue back then is that straight actors would portray gay people in a negative light. Now we are getting better rep. Although I think queer actors deserve more opportunities, sometimes you never know who actually is queer in the first place.
Thank you so much for calling out the biphobia and bi erasure that seems VERY baked into Kit's harassment. Bi people in straight passing relationships are not queerbaiting - we are just living our lives as bisexuals! Good lord. 🙄
I really cannot believe what happened. It's incredible how the Heartstopper fandom totally misunderstood the message Alice Oseman wanted to share with their story. I hate this fandom so much right now, I'm so disappointed on this community.
It is a VERY small minority. I frankly believe it is middle school kids (OR adults with that maturity level) taking the opportunity to bully. Frankly, it is likely that it could be ANY group of immature folks be they in the queer community, or even not. Since Kit, and Joe are the main characters they are the easiest targets for those who simply want to hate on people. It was obvious that it was a group of entitled, immature folks who were targeting people specifically. They aren't so much even concerned about corporations doing actual real queer bating. They were looking for anything mean, and hateful enough, and using tactics to hurt one of the nicest, most modest people in the entertainment industry I have seen. He is very young, just out of high school age, and has said many times he is introverted off screen. He is very protective of his friends...you can see this in his body language during interviews...he is sensitive...and he allowed these hateful, immature, moronic group of (and I use this term loosely) people to hurt him. You can obviously tell by his tweet that he is angry, and hurt. Which I would be too...MY sincerest hope is that is able to rebound past this incredible nonsense, and not give up on acting or Heartstopper which has more seasons left!!!! KIT, if you are out there, and actually able to see all of the absolutely loving, and supportive people out there who adore you have your back! Don't give in to the hate! I would watch shows you were in if you were a purple, one celled amoebae who was straight, bi, asexual....you get the point I hope! MUCH love buddy. Brian
I know what happened was absolutely unacceptable and disgusting, but blaming the entire fandom isn't fair either. Most of us were defending Kit against the haters. There were actually quite a few people outside the fandom who were starting with the whole "queerbaiting" shit.
For a fandom centered around an lgbtq show, it’s insane how little of the fans understand what bisexuality is and how you’re still a valid part of the queer community if you are in a hetero relationship as a bi or pan person. Bisexual people do not need to “validate” their queerness by entering a queer relationship and it disgusts me that so many people don’t respect that.
As a bi person, I am so upset by this I can't even start to explain. At 18 I get shunned and ex-communicated by my family and community for being bi. After that I searched out the queer community, only to find that I wasn't welcome there other, for not being gay enough, bi people constantly every day gets reminded that we are too gay for straight people and not gay enough for queer people. It is so isolating and lonely I can't even explain. It's not even that long ago since we weren't welcome at pride parades. This once again shows that we are only accepted in the community if we are in a same sex relationship. Even now, where I am single, one of the first questions I always get is 'have you even dated a woman before'. I am just... so so tired
I had no idea how much lesbians basically bullied me into the closet. I was out and proud with straight people, none of them cared, but the shit lesbians would feel comfortable saying to me.. "lesbian wannabe" "yeah but you're not like actually gay, you're half gay" Sexualized by men, ignored and demonized by women. I stopped trying for women on dating apps bc every single lesbian's bio said "no bi girls". Yeah, we're just as annoyed about couples looking for unicorns as you are, we're not with them. We just want a pretty girlfriend 😔
@@lachlanmccall1012 I honestly think it's the power. Some of y'all were mistreated and now all too happy to have their own punching bags. Lesbians bullied me into a closet I'd never been in before, cuz the straight people in my life were so accepting, I never really came out. I was just already out. But lesbians taught me how to build the closet and stay inside. Where they want us. Sorry.. I'm not bitter I swear 😅
What bothers me the most about this is that if he WAS actually straight everyone would have reacted so terribly, when really he was great in the role and there are a lot of queer cast members and I feel like it shouldn’t matter that much
I never heard of this show until this happened. Story of my life. As a bisexual woman who dared marry a man, I’ve been accused of faking more times than I care to even think about. I don’t want to be super mad because these are kids being their naturally immature selves, but then again, I knew better at that age so I’m torn. ALSO - so gay and bisexual people can’t play straight people now? That’s not a thing. Edit: oh it’s about his real life relationship. Even more silly. Actors aren’t their characters and also, that’s how bisexual works. It’s not only valid when the relationship is same sex…
I honestly think this is why a lot of bi people stay in the closet. Yes, there’s fear of coming out to the hetero community and being shamed. But it’s also made quite clear by a lot of the queer community that bi people don’t count (unless they are openly in a same-sex relationship). Why come out to only get hate from both sides?
This is the issue I have with "only queer people should play queer characters." It's a good idea, but the reality is that sexuality is hard and complicated and lots of people aren't 100% their label, whatever they choose. When these movements actively hurt the people they're trying to promote and protect it's no longer worth it.
It’s more than that tho. In today’s standards and how how society is with queer representation, we can agree that their is a lack of queer roles and even so some queer roles either perpetuate stereotypes or are not good representations. Queer people playing queer roles is important because although in characters their is diversity, in the cast their isn’t. If cis het people keep playing these roles then it’s sending the message to the younger generation that although you represented in this character, outside of that character you will never be represented in the cast.
@@jaylinbenno8075 so should every actor be outed? Is it healthy to police identity that way? Do you think Kit Connor was queerbaiting? Do you think he should have been removed from the show? I agree that it's complicated.
Exactly! I mean look at Rebel Wilson, she identified as straight until she met her girlfriend. I didn’t come to terms with my sexuality until I was almost 30. Looking back now I can see the signs from when I was a kid, but I was so repressed, I ignored it until it started eating away at me. Also, does that mean that queer people can only play queer characters? So we don’t get a Barney in How I Met Your Mother or Jonathan Groff in Mindhunter?? Society already sees things so black and white and places people boxes, can’t we just fight for good representation that avoids stereotypes regardless of the actor portraying it?
@@jaylinbenno8075 I understand where you're coming from, but the issue is with the industry, not with the actors. The key is to move away from attacking individual and instead go for the machine that creates these discrepancies. I don't care if someone straight is playing a queer role so long as it's done well. I DO care that queer people don't have the same volume of opportunities that straight people do, but you don't change that by going after individuals.
@@jcwebb264 This is so well said. I support queer people getting more roles, regardless of the sexual orientation of the CHARACTER. Of course we want queer people involved in queer storytelling. But siloing it off from het actors just perpetuates the narrative that being queer is different from the norm. I love to see casts with all ranges of diversity in them, instead of isolating the queer community from the hetero community.
I hate the expectation media stunts have created, that actors must date their co-stars!!! Like f--- all the way off with that. It also infest fandom spaces so much! Like a portion of fandom people make 0 difference between actor and character it is scary!
This is so so awful. When I first heard, I was so angry. I'm a queer teacher who works with kids his age and younger. Not only do I know from my own experience how anxiety inducing queer self-discovery is, especially since I came out as an adult, and am still doing so, but I see the gravity of these kinds of things every single day with my own kids. No one should be forced to come out, EVER. Not a public figure, not a teen, not an adult. No one. I cannot believe the vitriol he got for allegedly not being his character in real life essentially. While I love Heartstopper and the fact that young queer teens can see themselves celebrated and represented in media, this also highlights the danger of giving kids with zero nuance unrestricted access to the internet and their favorite celebrities, who are also essentially children. I only hope he is able to surround himself with people who actually love him and support him in real life. And that this can spark a dialogue with these younger fans about how harmful this kind of behavior can be (although that was basically the premise of the show so....who knows). Either way, my heart goes out to him and I'm glad so many people are coming to his defense.
why can't people understand that an actor is not their role? Not only with Kit's role as Nick, but any role he plays or has ever played. If a character he plays likes cheese and then a different one doesn't, that doesn't mean he is cheesebaiting. Being an actor is his job, people seem to forget that
Also also, this is why I am sick of the "I'm angry that the bisexual character ended up with someone of the opposite sex!!" crowd. I'm sick of it. Sure, it's uncommon for them to end up in a same-sex relationship. But they aren't magically straight just because they're in a different sex relationship now, and it isn't queerbaiting. They're bisexual; they will continue to be bisexual no matter the relationship they "end up" in.
This is just so appalling. Neither my s*xual nor my gender identity were solidified at that age, and I don't feel like they even are now. Internet bullying really has become a huge problem.
why is it that when timothee chalamet and armie hammer who have publicly stated that they're straight never got shit on or cancelled or bullied for portraying gay characters in cmbyn? some fantastic gay characters have been played by actors who publicly identified as straight at the time of release. I can't picture anyone besides erana james playing toni on the wilds, and I think zendaya did an amazing job portraying rue on euphoria. Not sure if fivel stewart is bi but assuming she's straight, she was the perfect Izzy on atypical; same goes for maya hawke as robin on ST, the bathroom coming out to steve scene was perfect. all I can say is poor kit, my heart breaks for him. internet users especially younger ones need to stop feeling entitled to treat people like this i hope everyone who tweeted under this hashtag is deeply ashamed
Thanx for helping us to understand the context. I am upset by this bullying of a talented young man. This is more than people misunderstanding the meaning of a word or projecting onto characters. There is also meanness and people feeling entitled to gather a pack of vigilantes and threaten harm. This is unacceptable in any fandom, let alone in the Heartstopper fandom.
This reminds me of the Harry Styles discourse surrounding his sexuality. We aren't owed ANY information about a person, full stop. Celebrities who might be LGBTQ+ don't owe you clarification on their identity. They should be afforded the same option to come out on their own terms that we have as private people. Speaking on LGBTQ+ oppression and issues doesn't say anything about who a person is beyond being a good person. We should _want_ people of all walks of life supporting us, but look at what people do when celebrities try to help. They get eviscerated online until they are forced to come out, effectively scaring anyone else who wants to speak up for us without publicizing their identity. This isn't what progress looks like.
14:40 I hate that this has happened and I worry that Kit won't enjoy S2 and S3 as much because of the harassment. I want him to have a long and happy career in acting.
the main lessons that can be learned from this upsetting situation are. 1. don't force people to come out 2. don't assume other peoples identities😪 3. and don't get yourself involved in other peoples personal life. ps. doing these things makes you no better than people who would rather the LGBTQIA+ never existed.
“Individuals cannot queer-bait. They cannot queer-bait with their personal lives” THANK YOU. I hear people tossing this term around all the time when a celebrity that is super supportive of the community or dabbles in queer culture doesn’t immediately come out and be super public about their identity. I hear it a lot about Harry styles and Taylor Swift. Like them or not, it’s a valid opinion either way, you are not entitled to someone’s sexuality.
I'm bisexual, and the coming out for us is eternal in the LGBT+ comunnity, never ends is really annoying, so this only happen because have rumors of Kit dating Maia, people assuming he is straight and he trying to get clout from LGBT community to get more success, this is f* absurd.
i completely agree. and also if you go back to being motivated to do the heartstopper essay, i would 100% watch that avidly. I found out about heartstopper before the show and i am currently caught up with the comic and loved the show so much.
The fact that all of this happened over him literally just holding someone's hand only adds to how awful this is. Also, I can speak from personal experience that coming out of the closet due to pressure sucks (not even remotely the same, for me it was well-meaning, and not due to people being cruel).
Thank you so much for clarifying 'queerbaiting', I'm bi and have been in mostly straight presenting relationships, but I have really felt rocky about the term and actually disagreed with it quite strongly. Mainly because being bi is very confusing, I am attracted to the opposite gender, which of course is not questioned or judged by others but figured out over time that it didn't stop there, when I see 'celebs' or people with large followings alluding to being in gay-presenting relationships or wanting to be, I see that as them testing the water, or wanting to open up but not feeling ready yet and the term 'queerbaiting' most commonly throws them back in the closet, mostly led by the people in the community they believed would be first to understand and support them. The corporate thing makes SO MUCH more sense! I feel more knowledgeable and more reassured. I don't hate the term now, just hate that it's incorrectly used, thanks for a great vid as usual!
I agree with you 100%, Brennan. Everybody, even actors, have a right to privacy, and people shouldn't be forced to come out until or unless they're ready.
Kit Conner deserves a proper apology for being forced to come out and people need to genuinely understand their wrong doing. If you don't own up to your mistakes than you'll never learn from them and repeatedly practice it consciously and subconsciously. At least that's what i think.
Can I hear an amen!?! He really is still basically a child who had made it clear that he didn't want to label himself and he should have been able to go through his own journey at his own pace. Those people really learned absolutely nothing from Heartstopper. The whole point of the first season is that no one should have to come out as anything before they're ready. And that sexuality is a spectrum.
Thank you for articulating how I’ve been feeling since Monday. I agree 100% with everything you said. The whole thing especially hurts as I am also bi and involved with someone of the opposite sex. Really brings the biphobia home. Also no one should ever be forced into coming out, ESPECIALLY not a kid of barely 18. I hope this doesn’t have long term ramifications for him personally, or for his career. He deserves all the love and support in the world.
Beautifully said and thoroughly explained! I hope some of those kids see this video and understand the major error they made! I was heartbroken by the news. Poor Kit! As a pan person, I know the struggle to feel apart of any community, but especially the queer community. I hope he knows the majority of us would never push him like this and accept his whole self as queer, even in straight passing. Hugs to him! I love your videos, Brennen. Keep up the excellent work!
I'd heard about him having to come out but I didn't know anything about the actor since I don't watch that series. So horrible to see queer people being forced out of the closet by our own communities, but like you said this is something we really need to band together on and show we are above such behavior. I'm sure a lot of those children will realize their error in time, even if it takes some maturing. Anyone who's a grown adult or or an old hat in the community though, way to go bullying a child you sure did something.
well Heartstopper still has a generally positive image, and generally positive fandom. And aside from those children most fans are not like this The twilight backlash was on a monumental, cult-like scale
I absolutely agree! What happened to this kid is shameful ! This shouldn't happen to any actor, or celebrity, or really, anyone at all! As a regular person we can come out to who ever we choose. One or two people here and there. Over a period of time. Over a lifetime. This 18 year old kid was bullied into coming out to the f***Ing planet. Shame on the individuals that did this!
can we also point to the fact that none of this energy is given to the actors that play Elle and Tao, or the actors that play Tara and Darcy? None of them are dating yet people don't harass anyone, I haven't seen anyone trying to get Corinna to prove she's a lesbian. It REEKS of mlm fetishization
I'm not on twitter but hearing about this made me so sad because like Heartstopper was the first piece of media that I felt truly represented how confusing it can be to come out as bi! Like its the first time I've felt like my coming out experience has been represented in a piece of media. To see him bullied for being private about his sexuality is like so fucked. Also makes me glad I decided twitter is not the place for me to spend my mental energy.
This video is excellent! As a 48-year-old pan in a long-term straight passing relationship, the bi/pan phobia is so frustrating! Noone should be forced to come out, regardless of age. (I was in my 30's when I realised and understood I was LGBTQ+).
Really enjoy your take on this, Brennen ! As a bisexual person, I’ve always thought it strange how the lgbt community holds on to and recapitulates the idea of monosexuality in the same way as monogamy when the whole point of the lgbt community is about redefining relationships with more honesty. To everyone reading this, you are valid, if you want to date more than one gender, at the same time, different times, it’s up to you, and you can share about yourself whenever and however, you’re ready 🪬💚🪬
Poor kit. He didn’t deserve this at all I hope he’s okay. He’s a very talented actor with a bright future ahead of him I hope he doesn’t let this get him down to much.
I agree with you. This was a cruel thing to do to him. This crazy concept of "queerbaiting" is infuriating. It makes no sense that straight actors can't play queer people--they are ACTORS after all. The corollary to that idea is that a queer actor cannot play a straight role. That, of course, would put most actors out of a job. The bullies who attacked Kit most likely are self-loathing or have some kind of "chip on the shoulder" that has them regress to primitive defense mechanisms like reaction formation. Anyway, Kit Connor did not deserve this. (BTW, there are some boomers in the fan base, too.)
I think you’re right that this is more about some fans punishing for not BEING Nick. This is a phenomenon happening a lot, where fans can’t separate the fantasy of a show (or even, dare I say… pop idol 😬) from the reality of the human being who plays that role. They want the fantasy to be reality and get upset when it doesn’t happen.
A bi person being with someone of the opposite sex doesn’t mean they’re not queer anymore. That’s the meaning of BISEXUAL !! and I seriously think people did not see kit as bi at all, they just wanted to see him as gay but the thing is that he IS NOT gay, he is BI. People just wanted to know his sexuality that’s it, the « queer bating » argument was just to hide the want of some toxic fans ( that are WOMEN). And this is not okay
i agree with all ur points except the one abt women, as a woman myself who supports kit and shares every pont made in this video. the fans gender has nothing to do with any of this and it's kinda sexist for u to assume ppl who hold those opinions are women
I had an oppertunity to be part of a popular Boy-Band in the 90's but ultimately declined because I was afraid of being outed to the world. It didn't stop me coming out in highschool because I was forced out ultimately but I can imagine what its like. I hope Kit Connor has a long amazing career.
Extraordinary depiction of the whole story. The way you skillfully break down a topic and provide much needed context reminds me of Rachel Maddow. Thank you for posting.
Thank you for saying everything I had on my mind! I have been frustrated about it for a full 2 weeks until I poured my heart out to a very good friend who heard about Kit's outing (being forced out of the closet is not coming out, it's not the same imo). Now I know I can come back here for future reference. :D
Thank you for sharing this... Kit Connor deserves respect. I completely agree with everything that you said. He was queerbaiting at all... Like you said, he is a kid. I listened to that podcast where he talks about him saying that he is comfortable with his sexuality that he doesn't need to label himself. He is not his characters.
I am 46 and this show really helped me in my situation. I really found Nick nelsons story to REALLY hit home. Thank you kit I love you and I hope you have all the best.. When ppl talk about you tell them to get bent it is none of there business Love ya big guy!
Thank you, Brennan! Looking forward to your Heartstopper in depth, when you get to it. Oh, and isn't Joe Locke dating Bash Croft? Or at the least they are very comfortable being physical in public. So, there's a real life story about how the people playing the characters on Heartstopper have really DIFFERENT lives than their characters do.
I am so tired of the demand to know what celebs' sexualities are. I don't mean this in the homophobic "whatever" way, I mean this in the "I am a bisexual who hates talking about my sexuality even with people I'm close to because I know I'm being judged for not being "gay enough"' (my one partner has been my ex husband, and I get comments from both subtly homophobic siblings and my well meaning bisexual sister.) I can only imagine how much more pressure celebs are under, when their sexuality is being torn apart and scrutinized by hundreds of thousands of people who liked you just a minute ago. This happened a lot in the BookTube community when people weaponized the otherwise fantastic OwnVoices hashtag and outed a number of authors. I'm just so sick of it. If there are adullts joining in on this, I hope they feel terrible after Kit's tweet.
Thank you, thank you for doing this video.I'm a HUGE fan of "Heartstopper" having watched it at least 4 times and I'm actually reading the graphic novel series. As a gay Black-American man, I've never understood the discrimination against our bisexual brothers and sisters. Consequently, the outing of Kit Connor is beyound grotesque. I'm actually a Gen Xer but have completely and totally fallen in love with the show AND the graphic novel series.
I don’t think there really is a way to have a fandom and not have it blow up in insanity. I’ve never seen a “cool” fandom. They all end up toxic, rabid, and honestly gross. It’s sad.
They are all actors - they play a role. And that does not give anyone the right to know personal circumstances..... Also, why cant a straight actor play a gay/bi role? If he is the best person, and supports LBGTQ+ then that is way more preferential than having a Bi (based on the rules being applied, a gay actor could not play the Bi role.....) actor who does not fit the role. And where does this go - if you take it to the nth degree, Bi's can only be played by Bi, a Gay actor cannot play a straight or Bi role. Kit has done nothing but support the community, but that community in the minority is slagging him off. I just cant believe it. Kit, you have our full support, and so sorry this hate has forced you to do something you would prefer not to have done.
i'm an older millennial bi and i was absolutely CRUSHED by this situation. i'm a huge fan of heartstopper, but not involved in the fandom at all because i'm like twice as old as the intended audience of the show. i definitely projected my own issues onto kit connor being forced to come out of the closet at 18 (EIGHTEEEEEEN, a CHILD). when i was his age i was terrified of my attraction to women because biphobia was rampant everywhere. the only out bi people (both girls) i knew got hit with "you're just doing it for attention" and "bisexuality isn't real" and "eventually you'll realize you're really straight" and "you just need to meet the right man" and a bunch of other nonsense, and i internalized it so much that i wasn't comfortable coming out until my late 20s, although i knew MUCH earlier. it's devastating to see biphobic harassment still prevalent within the queer community. the idea that "only queer people should play queer characters" is positive on the surface, a nice sentiment, but it doesn't hold up. it leaves out actors who prefer keeping their dating life private (which is a reasonable and normal thing to want!), actors who are questioning or unsure, and actors whose identity is fluid. i definitely think there's a problem with, say, self-professed straight dudes playing gay and getting pelted with all the highest awards in acting for it while queer actors do not get the same recognition, but i don't think gatekeeping queerness is the right answer to that problem. if i'd been unable to interact with and loudly enjoy queer art while i was in the closet, i don't know if i would have ever had the courage to come out. also, queerbaiting is not something real people can do, because people do not owe the disclosure of their sexuality to anyone! queerbaiting is rizzoli and isles! ugh.
this is so upsetting and disappointing... oh my god. literally, i remember looking into the cast and being so happy to see how many WERE queer themselves, and how the show very CLEARLY valued that kind of representation... so imagine my surprise when one young actor (read: CHILD), who did a fantastic job, was on record saying they *didn't want to use a label* , and people really couldn't take a damn hint??? like, the odds were so high he was either queer or questioning irl, especially given the whole vibe of production etc, and HOW did no one just agree to LEAVE HIM TF ALONE??? so, what, an 18 year old kid needs to have all these complex feelings 100% "figured out" (i.e. labelled confidently for OUR consumption & comfort) just because... you saw them on tv? in what universe is that fair?? the irony of the blatant biphobia too, given the obvious coverage of these topics IN THE TEXT OF THE SHOW, is simply astounding. we have truly all lost our damn minds, lost all sense of media literacy i guess, AND most importantly lost any sense of decency and empathy towards real-life people. damn.
I really just feel like it’s the young fans who don’t understand fully how bisexuality works…. So sad, as a bisexual woman it’s hard to be labeled “not gay enough” when your with a person of the opposite sex. I’ve been in his shoes, people genuinely not understanding how much their words can hurt and the power behind them 😢
This is so crazy. I remember when a read that the main couple of Outlander (who played Jamie and Claire) were having trouble with fans who where pissed of because the actors didn't were a couple in real life. It's like...dude...they are PLAYING a couple...people don't seems to understand the difference...
Some people were also mad at Sam Heughan for not being scottish enough to play Jamie. The guy was born and raised in scottland, that's as scottish as it gets. Although it really dosn't matter either way. It's absolutly riddiculous what people are getting angry about. It's like they just want to hate on the actors for the sake of it.
This whole situation really shows what people think of as queer, and I'm pretty sure that wouldn't include me. I'm not validated by relationships or gender expression, because I'm aroace and non-binary, but I don't really make an effort to "look" non binary, whatever that means. People's queerness cannot be defined by what kind of relationships they are in or their outward appearance or you're cutting off a lot of people, closeted or out.
Wow I’m just now hearing of this. It’s so disheartening honestly. Does anyone know if he’s talked any more about it? Like if he’s okay from this situation. I can’t imagine it makes him feel as great about the show because of the awful fans 😢 I hope he’s alright.
I don't get the whole 'queerbaiting' accusation in the first place. How is it queerbaiting to have an actor play a bisexual role where a queer relationship happens, when the actor himself has not come out? I'm literally confused as an old person (millennial). To me queerbaiting is when a film or piece portrays queer traits in a character, but then doesn't acknowledge that that character is queer through some evidence in the piece. To me _Fried Green Tomatoes_(1991) was queerbaiting, not Kit Connor being a human.
Thank you for this very succinct explanation of what queerbaiting actually is. I hate that this happened to Kit, he didn’t deserve this, the show didn’t deserve this, Alice Oseman didn’t deserve this! This was a really interesting conversation and I’m glad you made this video
Ok people should get this straight Nick Nelson is just a character amd Kit just acts the character out he is not Nick himself. He has a life of his own , just because this show gave him fame doesn't mean hell transform into that character.
I think your observations were spot on. The fandom is very young and at times very immature. I choose not to engage with them as I am much older and as an older bi woman I appreciate that I have more experience and knowledge of the world and queer community. Really enjoyed your video, you explained everything really clearly and useful information too. 💕
There is a rumour going around (and I really hope that it’s not true) that Kit has decided because of all this recent hassle, not to get involved in season 3 of ‘Heartstopper’. If that’s the case, then it’ll be a disaster for the show.
It kind of makes me think English classes need an overhaul. A big reason high schoolers still have English classes despite usually knowing how to read and write at that point is so that they can analyse media and recognise propaganda. However, students aren’t told this outright so they might not learn to apply their analytical skills to gain media literacy. In one of my final years of high school English class, we had to analyse political cartoons and point out the logical fallacies and manipulation in them. This was a great thing but I didn’t appreciate it or even realise what the teachers were doing until years later. I fear a lot of kids think English class is just for school and not someone you can apply to all art forms that you come across in real life. Due to this, they struggle to differentiate between media and reality. Some of them have these media literacy skills, they just don’t know how or when to apply them.
Yep it really sucked the way a few bad apples could do what they did to Kit Connor. I'm a gen x and love Heartstopper! My 18 year old inner child fan girls for Nick Nelson and Kit, Joe, Bash, all of them! ❤️❤️❤️🌈
I really hope he's ok, he should've been allowed to come out on his own terms at his own pace. People are ridiculous. Listen we all had our Suspicions, they did ask the cast when auditioning to have the same sexuality/ gender as their character, but even still he has the right to come out on his own terms. Do they forget what happened to Charlie in the books when he was outed and forced to come to terms with it before he was ready... people need to get a grip
couldnt agree more, just so horrible. It kind of reminds me of when people essentially forced cavetown to come out. People will come out when they're ready, and some people may not want to be out publicly, may want to be 'stealth' etc and us queer people of all people should understand and respect that. It's disappointing to see
Yes, I think it absolutely understandable that people are interested and not just because of parasocial relationships but because of the age old interest teen idols (and the dreams of some teens of marrying their idols) and also because many crave representation (and the community needs representation). However, Kit owned no one anything. The movie industry is vicious and not particularly open to “perceived to be” homosexual leading men (which some industry heads will think of when they think of an actor being bi). Also, Kit is young. My sexuality was an open question at that age and it took experience for me to realise I was not bi, though physically attracted to the opposite gender too, because I didn’t want to continue to sleep with people I wasn’t romantically attracted to. For some people, their sexual and romantic attraction is bi or it’s one but not the other and they still identify as bi. That’s up to them. (Others don’t get to tell us how we identify.) For all we know, Kit might later identify as straight (or gay) for the same reason I now identify as a lesbian. And then there’s the bi-erasure in their claims of queer baiting. When I believed myself bi and was married to a man, I was not queer baiting by being married to a man. I remained attracted to women. Bi people do in fact exist. No young person should feel forced to out themselves to protect their reputation, the show, or their fellow cast mates. No person should feel forced to out themselves period. The only people I believe in outing are politicians who vote against the LGBTQ community and otherwise demonize us.
![[DRAGON BALL LEGENDS REVEALS ＆ STUFF] LEGENDS FESTIVAL 2024 Special Edition Part 1](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/mV5bGIswTtQ/mqdefault.jpg)
1) Actors are not their characters
2) REAL PEOPLE CAN'T QUEERBAIT MY GOD LEARN THE MEANING OF BUZZWORDS PEOPLE
A THOUSAND TIMES THIS THANK YOU !!! god we really can't let the internet hear any terminology ever if we don't want it to be immediately bastardized.
oh, I think real people can queerbait. However, they shouldn’t be criticized for it because criticising someone for queerbaiting is actually just policing queerness and is harmful for queer people
@@chloe-fy4wc influencers can, but people who just live and like??? happen to be a man who started to wear nail polish for some reason??? I don't think it's it. Even if this man got a tik tok account and started getting attention from having femme style.
Like come on, we queers make everything better and our style is the best cuz it's literally the style of FREEDOM. If we gonna think that people are always queerbating than we won't get the world we are fighting for
I think people should start having more fun exploring their sexuality and expression, even if it will turn out that they're not queer.
even if Kit Conner was straight they did such an amazing job already casting actors who are part of the lgbtqia community. Sure I get it stinks that shows don't have queer actors play queer characters a whole lot but the fact that almost all the actors in the show are part of the community I really wouldn't care if one or two people weren't.
Especially when the actor does such a good job. Kit fits the role so well that when I saw the first trailer for the show I was like "damn that boy IS nick nelson". Couldn't have been better casting (in hindsight too with him actually being Bi.)
EXACTLY !!! Even if kit was straight, he didn’t disrespect the community, he did his role perfectly, and that’s it. What’s important is the message the show gives
EXACTLY
being part of the lgbt community should't even matter, we have so many amazing shows with queer ppl playing straight characters and straight ppl playing queer characters, so no, i don't get that it ''stinks''. What matters is their acting skills and suitable appearance (and if they are decent people in real life). And i agree, Kit did such a good job, he really stood out for me in the show :)
@@wikslu the part that stinks is that actual queer actors get overlooked or deliberately ignored in favor of cishet actors. It's not that they're bad at their jobs, it's that shows will have queer characters which obviously brings in queer viewership, but then sideline real queer actors in favor of straight ones. They'll use queer characters as a marketing tactic and nothing more, because they never cared about actual queer people. This hasn't happened with Heartstopper obviously, but there are so many shows, most actually, where they only include queer people for views and shun queer actors. It's very disingenuous. Hollywood, Disney, Nickelodeon, basically everyone with any real sway in the film/show making industry are all still stupidly homophobic. James Somerton made a video about the Kit situation where he points about that his career might have just been destroyed or at least stunted because of how much homophobia is still in Hollywood. Kit IS going to miss out on roles, simply because he's an out queer person.
This is why I have always been iffy about the whole "queer characters must be portrayed by queer actors" argument. I understand the idea behind it - Hollywood has a particular historical problem of applauding straight actors for LGBTQIA+ roles that could easily just be given to those who are LGBTQIA+ - but you don't actually know if these actors actually are straight or not, and you shouldn't really because that is a personal part of one's identity that you are not entitled to know about. There are many reasons why one would choose not to be open about their sexuality including protecting their careers and also the fact that even though it is 2022, there are still many people who want all queer people dead. Also, it is really ironic in a sad sense that his character was allowed to come out in the show when he was ready to yet the actor portraying him was not given that same experience. This entire thing was really triggering as a bisexual who has been accused of faking their identity just for being in a heterosexual relationship and I really feel sorry for him. Everyone who contributed to forcing him to come out should be ashamed of themselves.
I agree. I should have read this before I wrote my comment. 🙂
Part of the longer history here is important. Back in the 1970s and 1980s, actors plying gay characters in prominent projects would go out of the way to publicize that they were "really straight" (see, notably, Michael Ontkean and Harry Hamlin when "Making Love" was released in 1982).
That obviously does not excuse the appalling way Kit was treated here--there is no excuse for it--but it is part of the background be hind the push for queer characters to be played by queer actors.
And, yes, everyone who forced Kit to come out should be ashamed of themselves.
@@chimaxx The problem is that sexuality is not something that is visible. We can never truly know if someone is queer or not. Even back in the 70s and 80s. Part of the reason many denied their sexuality was to protect themselves. The world was even more vicious back then. Tevin Campbell called himself had to hide his sexuality and only recently came out as gay. Then, sometimes people think they are straight but may be questioning and they may decide to play a queer character to discover themselves. The kid who played Cyrus on Andi Mack used to ID as straight but after playing a gay kid he realized he was bi. If the representation is not bad, then what is the problem with some people? Part of the issue back then is that straight actors would portray gay people in a negative light. Now we are getting better rep. Although I think queer actors deserve more opportunities, sometimes you never know who actually is queer in the first place.
It's just bi erasure and biphobia/monosexism as always, not at all surprising to me.
I hate how not surprising it is.
Thank you so much for calling out the biphobia and bi erasure that seems VERY baked into Kit's harassment. Bi people in straight passing relationships are not queerbaiting - we are just living our lives as bisexuals! Good lord. 🙄
I really cannot believe what happened. It's incredible how the Heartstopper fandom totally misunderstood the message Alice Oseman wanted to share with their story. I hate this fandom so much right now, I'm so disappointed on this community.
Same. I think the fandom is actually infested with straight women who fetishize gay men.
I’m very sorry but not all of us are like this
Exactly
It is a VERY small minority. I frankly believe it is middle school kids (OR adults with that maturity level) taking the opportunity to bully. Frankly, it is likely that it could be ANY group of immature folks be they in the queer community, or even not. Since Kit, and Joe are the main characters they are the easiest targets for those who simply want to hate on people. It was obvious that it was a group of entitled, immature folks who were targeting people specifically. They aren't so much even concerned about corporations doing actual real queer bating. They were looking for anything mean, and hateful enough, and using tactics to hurt one of the nicest, most modest people in the entertainment industry I have seen. He is very young, just out of high school age, and has said many times he is introverted off screen. He is very protective of his friends...you can see this in his body language during interviews...he is sensitive...and he allowed these hateful, immature, moronic group of (and I use this term loosely) people to hurt him. You can obviously tell by his tweet that he is angry, and hurt. Which I would be too...MY sincerest hope is that is able to rebound past this incredible nonsense, and not give up on acting or Heartstopper which has more seasons left!!!! KIT, if you are out there, and actually able to see all of the absolutely loving, and supportive people out there who adore you have your back! Don't give in to the hate! I would watch shows you were in if you were a purple, one celled amoebae who was straight, bi, asexual....you get the point I hope! MUCH love buddy. Brian
I know what happened was absolutely unacceptable and disgusting, but blaming the entire fandom isn't fair either. Most of us were defending Kit against the haters. There were actually quite a few people outside the fandom who were starting with the whole "queerbaiting" shit.
For a fandom centered around an lgbtq show, it’s insane how little of the fans understand what bisexuality is and how you’re still a valid part of the queer community if you are in a hetero relationship as a bi or pan person. Bisexual people do not need to “validate” their queerness by entering a queer relationship and it disgusts me that so many people don’t respect that.
As a bi person, I am so upset by this I can't even start to explain.
At 18 I get shunned and ex-communicated by my family and community for being bi. After that I searched out the queer community, only to find that I wasn't welcome there other, for not being gay enough, bi people constantly every day gets reminded that we are too gay for straight people and not gay enough for queer people. It is so isolating and lonely I can't even explain. It's not even that long ago since we weren't welcome at pride parades.
This once again shows that we are only accepted in the community if we are in a same sex relationship.
Even now, where I am single, one of the first questions I always get is 'have you even dated a woman before'.
I am just... so so tired
💙💜💖 as a fellow bi, it gets better I promise
❤️❤️❤️ I’m so sorry we as gay people haven’t supported bi people or shown the solidarity and inclusion in the queer community bi people deserve.
Right there with you. I'm bi too and just left a comment very similar to yours. I'm so tired.
I had no idea how much lesbians basically bullied me into the closet. I was out and proud with straight people, none of them cared, but the shit lesbians would feel comfortable saying to me.. "lesbian wannabe" "yeah but you're not like actually gay, you're half gay"
Sexualized by men, ignored and demonized by women.
I stopped trying for women on dating apps bc every single lesbian's bio said "no bi girls". Yeah, we're just as annoyed about couples looking for unicorns as you are, we're not with them. We just want a pretty girlfriend 😔
@@lachlanmccall1012 I honestly think it's the power. Some of y'all were mistreated and now all too happy to have their own punching bags.
Lesbians bullied me into a closet I'd never been in before, cuz the straight people in my life were so accepting, I never really came out. I was just already out. But lesbians taught me how to build the closet and stay inside. Where they want us.
Sorry.. I'm not bitter I swear 😅
What bothers me the most about this is that if he WAS actually straight everyone would have reacted so terribly, when really he was great in the role and there are a lot of queer cast members and I feel like it shouldn’t matter that much
Yeah he’s been nothing but supportive of the show and it’s impact in all the interviews and press so like you said, why should his sexuality matter.
I never heard of this show until this happened. Story of my life. As a bisexual woman who dared marry a man, I’ve been accused of faking more times than I care to even think about. I don’t want to be super mad because these are kids being their naturally immature selves, but then again, I knew better at that age so I’m torn.
ALSO - so gay and bisexual people can’t play straight people now? That’s not a thing.
Edit: oh it’s about his real life relationship. Even more silly. Actors aren’t their characters and also, that’s how bisexual works. It’s not only valid when the relationship is same sex…
I honestly think this is why a lot of bi people stay in the closet. Yes, there’s fear of coming out to the hetero community and being shamed. But it’s also made quite clear by a lot of the queer community that bi people don’t count (unless they are openly in a same-sex relationship). Why come out to only get hate from both sides?
This is the issue I have with "only queer people should play queer characters." It's a good idea, but the reality is that sexuality is hard and complicated and lots of people aren't 100% their label, whatever they choose. When these movements actively hurt the people they're trying to promote and protect it's no longer worth it.
It’s more than that tho. In today’s standards and how how society is with queer representation, we can agree that their is a lack of queer roles and even so some queer roles either perpetuate stereotypes or are not good representations.
Queer people playing queer roles is important because although in characters their is diversity, in the cast their isn’t. If cis het people keep playing these roles then it’s sending the message to the younger generation that although you represented in this character, outside of that character you will never be represented in the cast.
@@jaylinbenno8075 so should every actor be outed? Is it healthy to police identity that way? Do you think Kit Connor was queerbaiting? Do you think he should have been removed from the show? I agree that it's complicated.
Exactly! I mean look at Rebel Wilson, she identified as straight until she met her girlfriend. I didn’t come to terms with my sexuality until I was almost 30. Looking back now I can see the signs from when I was a kid, but I was so repressed, I ignored it until it started eating away at me.
Also, does that mean that queer people can only play queer characters? So we don’t get a Barney in How I Met Your Mother or Jonathan Groff in Mindhunter??
Society already sees things so black and white and places people boxes, can’t we just fight for good representation that avoids stereotypes regardless of the actor portraying it?
@@jaylinbenno8075 I understand where you're coming from, but the issue is with the industry, not with the actors. The key is to move away from attacking individual and instead go for the machine that creates these discrepancies. I don't care if someone straight is playing a queer role so long as it's done well. I DO care that queer people don't have the same volume of opportunities that straight people do, but you don't change that by going after individuals.
@@jcwebb264 This is so well said. I support queer people getting more roles, regardless of the sexual orientation of the CHARACTER. Of course we want queer people involved in queer storytelling. But siloing it off from het actors just perpetuates the narrative that being queer is different from the norm. I love to see casts with all ranges of diversity in them, instead of isolating the queer community from the hetero community.
I hate the expectation media stunts have created, that actors must date their co-stars!!!
Like f--- all the way off with that.
It also infest fandom spaces so much! Like a portion of fandom people make 0 difference between actor and character it is scary!
gays and lesbians stop being biphobic challenge
They forgot bi people could have a relationship with the opposite sex
This is so so awful. When I first heard, I was so angry. I'm a queer teacher who works with kids his age and younger. Not only do I know from my own experience how anxiety inducing queer self-discovery is, especially since I came out as an adult, and am still doing so, but I see the gravity of these kinds of things every single day with my own kids. No one should be forced to come out, EVER. Not a public figure, not a teen, not an adult. No one. I cannot believe the vitriol he got for allegedly not being his character in real life essentially. While I love Heartstopper and the fact that young queer teens can see themselves celebrated and represented in media, this also highlights the danger of giving kids with zero nuance unrestricted access to the internet and their favorite celebrities, who are also essentially children. I only hope he is able to surround himself with people who actually love him and support him in real life. And that this can spark a dialogue with these younger fans about how harmful this kind of behavior can be (although that was basically the premise of the show so....who knows). Either way, my heart goes out to him and I'm glad so many people are coming to his defense.
why can't people understand that an actor is not their role? Not only with Kit's role as Nick, but any role he plays or has ever played. If a character he plays likes cheese and then a different one doesn't, that doesn't mean he is cheesebaiting. Being an actor is his job, people seem to forget that
Also also, this is why I am sick of the "I'm angry that the bisexual character ended up with someone of the opposite sex!!" crowd. I'm sick of it. Sure, it's uncommon for them to end up in a same-sex relationship. But they aren't magically straight just because they're in a different sex relationship now, and it isn't queerbaiting. They're bisexual; they will continue to be bisexual no matter the relationship they "end up" in.
This is just so appalling. Neither my s*xual nor my gender identity were solidified at that age, and I don't feel like they even are now. Internet bullying really has become a huge problem.
why is it that when timothee chalamet and armie hammer who have publicly stated that they're straight never got shit on or cancelled or bullied for portraying gay characters in cmbyn? some fantastic gay characters have been played by actors who publicly identified as straight at the time of release. I can't picture anyone besides erana james playing toni on the wilds, and I think zendaya did an amazing job portraying rue on euphoria. Not sure if fivel stewart is bi but assuming she's straight, she was the perfect Izzy on atypical; same goes for maya hawke as robin on ST, the bathroom coming out to steve scene was perfect.
all I can say is poor kit, my heart breaks for him. internet users especially younger ones need to stop feeling entitled to treat people like this i hope everyone who tweeted under this hashtag is deeply ashamed
Thanks for sharing this. Kit deserved SO much better. I feel terrible for him.
REAL👏PEOPLE👏 CAN'T 👏QUEER👏BAIT
💯
poor guy, so upsetting to see this happen. we really need to do better. internet culture can get really outta control. i hope he’s doing okay.
Thanx for helping us to understand the context. I am upset by this bullying of a talented young man. This is more than people misunderstanding the meaning of a word or projecting onto characters. There is also meanness and people feeling entitled to gather a pack of vigilantes and threaten harm. This is unacceptable in any fandom, let alone in the Heartstopper fandom.
This reminds me of the Harry Styles discourse surrounding his sexuality. We aren't owed ANY information about a person, full stop. Celebrities who might be LGBTQ+ don't owe you clarification on their identity. They should be afforded the same option to come out on their own terms that we have as private people. Speaking on LGBTQ+ oppression and issues doesn't say anything about who a person is beyond being a good person. We should _want_ people of all walks of life supporting us, but look at what people do when celebrities try to help. They get eviscerated online until they are forced to come out, effectively scaring anyone else who wants to speak up for us without publicizing their identity. This isn't what progress looks like.
As a bi woman who's not publicly out yet, this makes me angry, sad, disappointed and terrified af.
14:40 I hate that this has happened and I worry that Kit won't enjoy S2 and S3 as much because of the harassment. I want him to have a long and happy career in acting.
the main lessons that can be learned from this upsetting situation are.
1. don't force people to come out
2. don't assume other peoples identities😪
3. and don't get yourself involved in other peoples personal life.
ps. doing these things makes you no better than people who would rather the LGBTQIA+ never existed.
Okay now I really want the Heartstopper Video. Like I would watch the raw footage.
Ikr like please give me 8 hours of heartstopper appreciation
This whole situation is horrible, I can't imagine how devastating all this has been for him.
“Individuals cannot queer-bait. They cannot queer-bait with their personal lives” THANK YOU. I hear people tossing this term around all the time when a celebrity that is super supportive of the community or dabbles in queer culture doesn’t immediately come out and be super public about their identity. I hear it a lot about Harry styles and Taylor Swift. Like them or not, it’s a valid opinion either way, you are not entitled to someone’s sexuality.
I'm bisexual, and the coming out for us is eternal in the LGBT+ comunnity, never ends is really annoying, so this only happen because have rumors of Kit dating Maia, people assuming he is straight and he trying to get clout from LGBT community to get more success, this is f* absurd.
i completely agree. and also if you go back to being motivated to do the heartstopper essay, i would 100% watch that avidly. I found out about heartstopper before the show and i am currently caught up with the comic and loved the show so much.
The fact that all of this happened over him literally just holding someone's hand only adds to how awful this is. Also, I can speak from personal experience that coming out of the closet due to pressure sucks (not even remotely the same, for me it was well-meaning, and not due to people being cruel).
Thank you so much for clarifying 'queerbaiting', I'm bi and have been in mostly straight presenting relationships, but I have really felt rocky about the term and actually disagreed with it quite strongly. Mainly because being bi is very confusing, I am attracted to the opposite gender, which of course is not questioned or judged by others but figured out over time that it didn't stop there, when I see 'celebs' or people with large followings alluding to being in gay-presenting relationships or wanting to be, I see that as them testing the water, or wanting to open up but not feeling ready yet and the term 'queerbaiting' most commonly throws them back in the closet, mostly led by the people in the community they believed would be first to understand and support them. The corporate thing makes SO MUCH more sense! I feel more knowledgeable and more reassured. I don't hate the term now, just hate that it's incorrectly used, thanks for a great vid as usual!
I agree with you 100%, Brennan. Everybody, even actors, have a right to privacy, and people shouldn't be forced to come out until or unless they're ready.
Kit Conner deserves a proper apology for being forced to come out and people need to genuinely understand their wrong doing. If you don't own up to your mistakes than you'll never learn from them and repeatedly practice it consciously and subconsciously. At least that's what i think.
Can I hear an amen!?! He really is still basically a child who had made it clear that he didn't want to label himself and he should have been able to go through his own journey at his own pace. Those people really learned absolutely nothing from Heartstopper. The whole point of the first season is that no one should have to come out as anything before they're ready. And that sexuality is a spectrum.
I feel bad for kit why are people like this hopefully they grow up
Thank you for articulating how I’ve been feeling since Monday. I agree 100% with everything you said. The whole thing especially hurts as I am also bi and involved with someone of the opposite sex. Really brings the biphobia home. Also no one should ever be forced into coming out, ESPECIALLY not a kid of barely 18. I hope this doesn’t have long term ramifications for him personally, or for his career. He deserves all the love and support in the world.
Beautifully said and thoroughly explained! I hope some of those kids see this video and understand the major error they made! I was heartbroken by the news. Poor Kit! As a pan person, I know the struggle to feel apart of any community, but especially the queer community. I hope he knows the majority of us would never push him like this and accept his whole self as queer, even in straight passing. Hugs to him! I love your videos, Brennen. Keep up the excellent work!
I'd heard about him having to come out but I didn't know anything about the actor since I don't watch that series. So horrible to see queer people being forced out of the closet by our own communities, but like you said this is something we really need to band together on and show we are above such behavior. I'm sure a lot of those children will realize their error in time, even if it takes some maturing. Anyone who's a grown adult or or an old hat in the community though, way to go bullying a child you sure did something.
i wouldn't blame him if he pulled a robert pattinson and heartstopper became his twilight
well Heartstopper still has a generally positive image, and generally positive fandom.
And aside from those children most fans are not like this
The twilight backlash was on a monumental, cult-like scale
I absolutely agree! What happened to this kid is shameful ! This shouldn't happen to any actor, or celebrity, or really, anyone at all! As a regular person we can come out to who ever we choose. One or two people here and there. Over a period of time. Over a lifetime. This 18 year old kid was bullied into coming out to the f***Ing planet. Shame on the individuals that did this!
Yeah I’m still livid about this situation and I’m glad you brought up the queer baiting thing. It’s really terrible that this happened to him.
can we also point to the fact that none of this energy is given to the actors that play Elle and Tao, or the actors that play Tara and Darcy? None of them are dating yet people don't harass anyone, I haven't seen anyone trying to get Corinna to prove she's a lesbian. It REEKS of mlm fetishization
I'm not on twitter but hearing about this made me so sad because like Heartstopper was the first piece of media that I felt truly represented how confusing it can be to come out as bi! Like its the first time I've felt like my coming out experience has been represented in a piece of media. To see him bullied for being private about his sexuality is like so fucked.
Also makes me glad I decided twitter is not the place for me to spend my mental energy.
The biphobia is so gross and makes me so mad as a bi person.
Very, very well said. I was so upset at the situation, but really have no platform to express. Thank you for putting it into words.
I’m so sad that the happened. I love heartstopper and Kit Conner and I’m so so upset at everyone right now
This video is excellent! As a 48-year-old pan in a long-term straight passing relationship, the bi/pan phobia is so frustrating! Noone should be forced to come out, regardless of age. (I was in my 30's when I realised and understood I was LGBTQ+).
Really enjoy your take on this, Brennen ! As a bisexual person, I’ve always thought it strange how the lgbt community holds on to and recapitulates the idea of monosexuality in the same way as monogamy when the whole point of the lgbt community is about redefining relationships with more honesty.
To everyone reading this, you are valid, if you want to date more than one gender, at the same time, different times, it’s up to you, and you can share about yourself whenever and however, you’re ready 🪬💚🪬
Poor kit. He didn’t deserve this at all I hope he’s okay. He’s a very talented actor with a bright future ahead of him I hope he doesn’t let this get him down to much.
A disgusting situation, those who were pestering him should be ashamed.
I agree with you. This was a cruel thing to do to him. This crazy concept of "queerbaiting" is infuriating. It makes no sense that straight actors can't play queer people--they are ACTORS after all. The corollary to that idea is that a queer actor cannot play a straight role. That, of course, would put most actors out of a job. The bullies who attacked Kit most likely are self-loathing or have some kind of "chip on the shoulder" that has them regress to primitive defense mechanisms like reaction formation. Anyway, Kit Connor did not deserve this. (BTW, there are some boomers in the fan base, too.)
Finally a legitimate video explaining the situation for the masses. THANK YOU!!!
I think you’re right that this is more about some fans punishing for not BEING Nick. This is a phenomenon happening a lot, where fans can’t separate the fantasy of a show (or even, dare I say… pop idol 😬) from the reality of the human being who plays that role. They want the fantasy to be reality and get upset when it doesn’t happen.
A bi person being with someone of the opposite sex doesn’t mean they’re not queer anymore. That’s the meaning of BISEXUAL !! and I seriously think people did not see kit as bi at all, they just wanted to see him as gay but the thing is that he IS NOT gay, he is BI. People just wanted to know his sexuality that’s it, the « queer bating » argument was just to hide the want of some toxic fans ( that are WOMEN). And this is not okay
i agree with all ur points except the one abt women, as a woman myself who supports kit and shares every pont made in this video. the fans gender has nothing to do with any of this and it's kinda sexist for u to assume ppl who hold those opinions are women
I had an oppertunity to be part of a popular Boy-Band in the 90's but ultimately declined because I was afraid of being outed to the world. It didn't stop me coming out in highschool because I was forced out ultimately but I can imagine what its like. I hope Kit Connor has a long amazing career.
Extraordinary depiction of the whole story. The way you skillfully break down a topic and provide much needed context reminds me of Rachel Maddow. Thank you for posting.
Thank you for saying everything I had on my mind! I have been frustrated about it for a full 2 weeks until I poured my heart out to a very good friend who heard about Kit's outing (being forced out of the closet is not coming out, it's not the same imo). Now I know I can come back here for future reference. :D
Thank you for sharing this... Kit Connor deserves respect. I completely agree with everything that you said. He was queerbaiting at all... Like you said, he is a kid. I listened to that podcast where he talks about him saying that he is comfortable with his sexuality that he doesn't need to label himself. He is not his characters.
I did not know Cuban Girl’s guide to tea and tomorrow was getting an adaptation on Netflix!!! That’s exciting! I love that book and he’ll be great!
I am 46 and this show really helped me in my situation. I really found Nick nelsons story to REALLY hit home. Thank you kit I love you and I hope you have all the best.. When ppl talk about you tell them to get bent it is none of there business Love ya big guy!
Thank you, Brennan! Looking forward to your Heartstopper in depth, when you get to it.
Oh, and isn't Joe Locke dating Bash Croft? Or at the least they are very comfortable being physical in public. So, there's a real life story about how the people playing the characters on Heartstopper have really DIFFERENT lives than their characters do.
I am so tired of the demand to know what celebs' sexualities are. I don't mean this in the homophobic "whatever" way, I mean this in the "I am a bisexual who hates talking about my sexuality even with people I'm close to because I know I'm being judged for not being "gay enough"' (my one partner has been my ex husband, and I get comments from both subtly homophobic siblings and my well meaning bisexual sister.) I can only imagine how much more pressure celebs are under, when their sexuality is being torn apart and scrutinized by hundreds of thousands of people who liked you just a minute ago. This happened a lot in the BookTube community when people weaponized the otherwise fantastic OwnVoices hashtag and outed a number of authors. I'm just so sick of it. If there are adullts joining in on this, I hope they feel terrible after Kit's tweet.
The Kit Connor tweet was the reason it took me to this August to watch it
protect kit connor at all costs my GOD
literally days before alexander avila uploaded a video about this, kit connor tweets that. sad
Thank you, thank you for doing this video.I'm a HUGE fan of "Heartstopper" having watched it at least 4 times and I'm actually reading the graphic novel series. As a gay Black-American man, I've never understood the discrimination against our bisexual brothers and sisters. Consequently, the outing of Kit Connor is beyound grotesque. I'm actually a Gen Xer but have completely and totally fallen in love with the show AND the graphic novel series.
Phenomenal video as always 👏👏 so happy i discovered your channel
I don’t think there really is a way to have a fandom and not have it blow up in insanity. I’ve never seen a “cool” fandom. They all end up toxic, rabid, and honestly gross. It’s sad.
They are all actors - they play a role. And that does not give anyone the right to know personal circumstances..... Also, why cant a straight actor play a gay/bi role? If he is the best person, and supports LBGTQ+ then that is way more preferential than having a Bi (based on the rules being applied, a gay actor could not play the Bi role.....) actor who does not fit the role. And where does this go - if you take it to the nth degree, Bi's can only be played by Bi, a Gay actor cannot play a straight or Bi role. Kit has done nothing but support the community, but that community in the minority is slagging him off. I just cant believe it. Kit, you have our full support, and so sorry this hate has forced you to do something you would prefer not to have done.
This was so beautifully said, ty
i'm an older millennial bi and i was absolutely CRUSHED by this situation. i'm a huge fan of heartstopper, but not involved in the fandom at all because i'm like twice as old as the intended audience of the show. i definitely projected my own issues onto kit connor being forced to come out of the closet at 18 (EIGHTEEEEEEN, a CHILD). when i was his age i was terrified of my attraction to women because biphobia was rampant everywhere. the only out bi people (both girls) i knew got hit with "you're just doing it for attention" and "bisexuality isn't real" and "eventually you'll realize you're really straight" and "you just need to meet the right man" and a bunch of other nonsense, and i internalized it so much that i wasn't comfortable coming out until my late 20s, although i knew MUCH earlier. it's devastating to see biphobic harassment still prevalent within the queer community.
the idea that "only queer people should play queer characters" is positive on the surface, a nice sentiment, but it doesn't hold up. it leaves out actors who prefer keeping their dating life private (which is a reasonable and normal thing to want!), actors who are questioning or unsure, and actors whose identity is fluid. i definitely think there's a problem with, say, self-professed straight dudes playing gay and getting pelted with all the highest awards in acting for it while queer actors do not get the same recognition, but i don't think gatekeeping queerness is the right answer to that problem. if i'd been unable to interact with and loudly enjoy queer art while i was in the closet, i don't know if i would have ever had the courage to come out.
also, queerbaiting is not something real people can do, because people do not owe the disclosure of their sexuality to anyone! queerbaiting is rizzoli and isles! ugh.
there are definitely people in fandom that struggle with fiction versus reality. i feel like this incident is an extension of that.
This is my first video of yours that I've watched today. Great job!
this is so upsetting and disappointing... oh my god.
literally, i remember looking into the cast and being so happy to see how many WERE queer themselves, and how the show very CLEARLY valued that kind of representation...
so imagine my surprise when one young actor (read: CHILD), who did a fantastic job, was on record saying they *didn't want to use a label* , and people really couldn't take a damn hint??? like, the odds were so high he was either queer or questioning irl, especially given the whole vibe of production etc, and HOW did no one just agree to LEAVE HIM TF ALONE???
so, what, an 18 year old kid needs to have all these complex feelings 100% "figured out" (i.e. labelled confidently for OUR consumption & comfort) just because... you saw them on tv? in what universe is that fair??
the irony of the blatant biphobia too, given the obvious coverage of these topics IN THE TEXT OF THE SHOW, is simply astounding. we have truly all lost our damn minds, lost all sense of media literacy i guess, AND most importantly lost any sense of decency and empathy towards real-life people. damn.
I really just feel like it’s the young fans who don’t understand fully how bisexuality works…. So sad, as a bisexual woman it’s hard to be labeled “not gay enough” when your with a person of the opposite sex. I’ve been in his shoes, people genuinely not understanding how much their words can hurt and the power behind them 😢
This is so crazy. I remember when a read that the main couple of Outlander (who played Jamie and Claire) were having trouble with fans who where pissed of because the actors didn't were a couple in real life. It's like...dude...they are PLAYING a couple...people don't seems to understand the difference...
Some people were also mad at Sam Heughan for not being scottish enough to play Jamie. The guy was born and raised in scottland, that's as scottish as it gets. Although it really dosn't matter either way. It's absolutly riddiculous what people are getting angry about. It's like they just want to hate on the actors for the sake of it.
Seriously great video👏🏼👏🏼 cannot be said too many times that real people can’t queerbait
This whole situation really shows what people think of as queer, and I'm pretty sure that wouldn't include me. I'm not validated by relationships or gender expression, because I'm aroace and non-binary, but I don't really make an effort to "look" non binary, whatever that means. People's queerness cannot be defined by what kind of relationships they are in or their outward appearance or you're cutting off a lot of people, closeted or out.
Wow I’m just now hearing of this. It’s so disheartening honestly. Does anyone know if he’s talked any more about it? Like if he’s okay from this situation. I can’t imagine it makes him feel as great about the show because of the awful fans 😢 I hope he’s alright.
James Sommerton’s podcast on this is really great as well for anyone who wants to hear more
how could people say go away from heartstopper 😪 I just feel really bad for him...
I don't get the whole 'queerbaiting' accusation in the first place. How is it queerbaiting to have an actor play a bisexual role where a queer relationship happens, when the actor himself has not come out? I'm literally confused as an old person (millennial). To me queerbaiting is when a film or piece portrays queer traits in a character, but then doesn't acknowledge that that character is queer through some evidence in the piece. To me _Fried Green Tomatoes_(1991) was queerbaiting, not Kit Connor being a human.
Thank you for this very succinct explanation of what queerbaiting actually is. I hate that this happened to Kit, he didn’t deserve this, the show didn’t deserve this, Alice Oseman didn’t deserve this! This was a really interesting conversation and I’m glad you made this video
Ok people should get this straight Nick Nelson is just a character amd Kit just acts the character out he is not Nick himself. He has a life of his own , just because this show gave him fame doesn't mean hell transform into that character.
Thank you for putting this video together. It’s ridiculous and awful that people are attacking Kit Connor.
I think your observations were spot on. The fandom is very young and at times very immature. I choose not to engage with them as I am much older and as an older bi woman I appreciate that I have more experience and knowledge of the world and queer community. Really enjoyed your video, you explained everything really clearly and useful information too. 💕
There is a rumour going around (and I really hope that it’s not true) that Kit has decided because of all this recent hassle, not to get involved in season 3 of ‘Heartstopper’. If that’s the case, then it’ll be a disaster for the show.
I would still watch that four hour heartstopper video essay lol
Imagine the show without Kit Conner I would probably stop watching it, lol.
love the background. Im a marvel and heartstopper fan too,..
It kind of makes me think English classes need an overhaul. A big reason high schoolers still have English classes despite usually knowing how to read and write at that point is so that they can analyse media and recognise propaganda. However, students aren’t told this outright so they might not learn to apply their analytical skills to gain media literacy. In one of my final years of high school English class, we had to analyse political cartoons and point out the logical fallacies and manipulation in them. This was a great thing but I didn’t appreciate it or even realise what the teachers were doing until years later. I fear a lot of kids think English class is just for school and not someone you can apply to all art forms that you come across in real life. Due to this, they struggle to differentiate between media and reality. Some of them have these media literacy skills, they just don’t know how or when to apply them.
Yep it really sucked the way a few bad apples could do what they did to Kit Connor. I'm a gen x and love Heartstopper! My 18 year old inner child fan girls for Nick Nelson and Kit, Joe, Bash, all of them! ❤️❤️❤️🌈
Kit Connor was the best casting choice for Nick Nelson. I’m so disappointed in the way he has been treated.
I really hope he's ok, he should've been allowed to come out on his own terms at his own pace. People are ridiculous. Listen we all had our Suspicions, they did ask the cast when auditioning to have the same sexuality/ gender as their character, but even still he has the right to come out on his own terms. Do they forget what happened to Charlie in the books when he was outed and forced to come to terms with it before he was ready... people need to get a grip
reminds me of what happened with fans and the skam og cast(if ur old enough to remember skam haha)
couldnt agree more, just so horrible. It kind of reminds me of when people essentially forced cavetown to come out. People will come out when they're ready, and some people may not want to be out publicly, may want to be 'stealth' etc and us queer people of all people should understand and respect that. It's disappointing to see
I've been bullied way more by members of the queer community than by the straight community.
Yes, I think it absolutely understandable that people are interested and not just because of parasocial relationships but because of the age old interest teen idols (and the dreams of some teens of marrying their idols) and also because many crave representation (and the community needs representation). However, Kit owned no one anything.
The movie industry is vicious and not particularly open to “perceived to be” homosexual leading men (which some industry heads will think of when they think of an actor being bi).
Also, Kit is young. My sexuality was an open question at that age and it took experience for me to realise I was not bi, though physically attracted to the opposite gender too, because I didn’t want to continue to sleep with people I wasn’t romantically attracted to. For some people, their sexual and romantic attraction is bi or it’s one but not the other and they still identify as bi. That’s up to them. (Others don’t get to tell us how we identify.) For all we know, Kit might later identify as straight (or gay) for the same reason I now identify as a lesbian.
And then there’s the bi-erasure in their claims of queer baiting. When I believed myself bi and was married to a man, I was not queer baiting by being married to a man. I remained attracted to women. Bi people do in fact exist.
No young person should feel forced to out themselves to protect their reputation, the show, or their fellow cast mates. No person should feel forced to out themselves period. The only people I believe in outing are politicians who vote against the LGBTQ community and otherwise demonize us.