She'd Rather Choose The BEAR?
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- Опубликовано: 12 июн 2024
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Kinda reminds me of the old Steve Irwin quote “Crocodiles are easy. They try to kill and eat you. People are harder. Sometimes they pretend to be your friend first.”
Goes so hard
Common Steve Irwin W.
That quote lives rent free in my brain. Steve Irwin was a treasure.
What about stingrays?
@@Drazzz27
...What about them? Steve didn't say animals don't try to kill you. He said they DO try to. Why the fuck did you bring that up
All the women who chose the bear have obviously never worked the night shift at a haunted pizzeria
I'd say that's all the women who choose the man. That bear is one high-quality piece~
Yeah, that's why she'd be safe, given how (if we're going based off of the games) the Animatronics from the first 2 games are only aggressive towards the night guards because they believe them to be William Afton. Given the version of Freddy Fazbear that is used in memes is from FNAF 1, the women choosing "bear" would be safe.
I dunno. I'd take Freddy fracas over the Shining any day.
@@Soulraven2735
According to the novels, that is untrue. They are aggressive to all adults or older teenagers, attacking Charlie and her friends, who look nothing like William Afton.
@@AD-qc5zd
I've been charged by a bear. I threw my hands up and yelled "Go away!" It went away and left me alone.
One night I was walking home from a 3-11 shift and some older man asked if he could walk with me. I said no 3 times. I crossed the street twice to try to lose him and I broke into a full on run. He yelled "wait up!" And I yelled "go away!" He laughed. The bear wasn't motivated by cruelty and wasn't amused by my fear.
Gotta love the anecdotal experience, a man is just as likely to leave if you start yelling. The real decision is who you want to fight when that doesn't work.
@@anitaremenarova6662 still the bear. The bear won't be trying anything sexual. Read the last sentence of my first comment again. Read it slowly. If you can't see the difference you're part of the reason we pick bear.
@@annme_87 Have fun getting severely maimed at best, you can fight off a man but you'll NEVER do anything to a bear. I don't care about intent, what matters is only the most likely result which is much worse if you pick the bear.
@@anitaremenarova6662the worst a bear can do to you is kill you
@@anitaremenarova6662 The point went entirely over your head.
I saw a woman choose bear, and she said "At least if the bear killed me no one would ask what I was wearing to make it hungry."
As if people wouldn't blame her for going into the woods alone, unarmed (or otherwise unprepared), where there are known to be bears.
Heh, that's actually not a good answer. Someone might ask if you storing your food unsafely to make it approach you. The most typical answer, similar to that is: "If I was attacked by a bear, at least people would believe me."
@@TealJosh The hypothetical does not make any mention of carrying food. It's an irrelevant comment.
@Drazzz27 I can't name anyone that goes hiking in the woods with a rifle, being armed usually isn't necessary unless you're a hunter.
@@NeverKetamine if you go in the woods with bears in it you should probably be prepared in some way. Being armed is one of the options, you can also have a bear spray or something.
Anyway, the point was, that if you got attacked by a bear, you would be found fault with.
As a man who IS a bear, I'm conflicted
Have you eaten salmon from a river recently?
@@yeetusmaximus4525 I find this discorse hard to bear.
"All the rivers run into the sea; yet the sea is not full. Of FIshe." -King Salmon, apparently.
Gaaaaaaaaaaay. (Respectfully)
I do like bears
To be fair if women could tell instantly. You might either get women to be less afraid or somehow infinitely more afraid.
I got drugged when I accidentaly changed beer with a girl at the same table as me. And it was a company party, so we had to work at the same company not knowing who it was.
Jesus Christ. Doing that at a WORK PARTY is extra insane. Just a horrifying level of confidence in getting away with it 😟
I got into a very public brawl with a coworker for doing shit like that. Thankfully man was lose with the evidence and every woman knew to stay away. Never got fired.
@@AOnAcid imagine believing everything a random bimbo tells you online lol,out of every girl i know,friend and relative,somehow none of them had this happen ever
The concept and consequence of the answer to "Man versus bear" is exactly why I chose the industry as I did; driving commercial vehicles expedite over the country these past decade or so. However, for the past year and a half because things went downhill with that last job, I've been mainly living out of my car. I'd rather this solo transient lifestyle than ever again run the risk some creep chooses their desires takes precedence over my dignity.
On another footnote, at the 10:40 you have exactly hit it over the head. My cousin James was murdered by a narcissistic domestic abuser that he took a chance on living in his home thinking the dude would correct his ways if only given a chance. The man shot him dead in cold blood in that same home, making like he lost a liquor bottle in the house moments prior.
@@DanielleCapichano The sad reality is that if men were actually "the logical ones" there wouldn't be an argument about this, they would also just pick the bear lol
The one explanation to give me pause: a woman said she would face more doubt and backlash from reporting a man than a bear.
Oof
That’s a fact💯
Completely true.
Well, here's another, simpler one: Men in comment threads everywhere explaining bears to us like we don't understand what we said and *not even taking 'no' for an answer to a HYPOTHETICAL question* is why 100% of us say "bear." The men are making our point *for* us and they don't even have the self-awareness to see it.
Also bear attacks are rare
Instructions unclear. I wore my hyper lifelike bear costume to a bar to be less threatening and animal control shot me with a tranquiliser dart and left in the middle of the woods 3 states away. :'c
At least these women are that inclusive so they include furries to the party.
Cool! Free vacation!
I'm a trans woman and in my first two weeks of being out in public someone drugged my drink. Thankfully I had made a friend and she kept me safe. TWO WEEKS into presenting as a woman.
What does being drugged feel like?
I feel like Trans women are uniquely more vulnerable to shitty straight man behavior.
@@asherroodcreel640 it feels like that moment when you were dropped on your head as an infant.
@@asherroodcreel640not good, depends on the drug, terrifying, anxiety spiking, the second you feel something wrong in your body like you're getting increasingly tired or dizzy or sick, it's scary
Why are being so unnecessary hostile for man?@@AD-qc5zd
Women: I choose the bear.
Men: What does he have that I don’t?
Bear: HUR HUR HUR HUR HUR HURRR HUR HURRR *hands the woman a slice of 🍕*
No lie if there's a bear out there offering pizza I'm choosing the bear too.
Something something picnic baskets.
Freddy fazbear getting W’s all around
As a furry, I'd choose Freddy Fazbear any day.
Can i assume the hurr is the sound a bear makes?
It's not about "most men." I have no idea of the statistics and it doesn't matter ultimately. It's not about how likely a woman may or may not deal with a violent/abusive man. It's about NOT KNOWING until it's too late. You know immediately the potential danger when you see a bear.
Bingo.
If you know the immediate danger when you see a bear then why the hell choose a 700 pound beast that can destroy you with a single claw swing, literally this hypothetical question by chances you are better off with a random man in the woods than a bear that hunts and kills to survive, BY CHANCES you are better doing that.
As far as I am concerned, people that drug drinks are just free punching practice
I ll help you
count me in too
There’s too many, we need more would-be boxers to help.
Nah nah nah, use them for drug tests
As a man married to a bear... wait, what was I on about?
Reminds me of "I married a Seabear" from SpongeBob
Lucky...
Bauldur's Gate 3, you were telling us about your playthrough.
You will annihilate each other
Girl I feel ya… I’m laying next to a bear myself.
So I'm a 22 year old guy. Who had never been to a club as of last year. Then I started to a new school. On my way home from a movie night I met 2 girls on a bus and they invited me to come with them to a club.
We went to a small place and danced, then went to a large club where both the girls got harassed by multiple guys. I got pushed and cussed at by a guy when I stepped between him and my friend.
After a while of dancing one of the girls started colapsing on the floor. So we left the club, only to realise BOTH of the girls had been drugged.
On my first time ever clubbing. I then spent the night telling guys who cat called to f*** off, holding the hand of the girl who was tripping worse, letting her bite my hand, trying to keep her from running in to the street while her friend called the police and talk to some guards at the central station in the city.
Walking her to the hospital where we left her over night, because she couldn't go back to the dorms with her friend in that condition.
Then I walked the other girl to the buss so she could get back to the dorms safely. After which I walked home cause I don't live at the school.
That was my first time ever clubbing... And I live in Sweden. Those girls NEVER put their drinks to the side. We only drank water all night and it STILL happened. Which is why we assume the bartenders put the stuff in their water.
And being the guy, I obviously didn't get drugged if it wasn't obvious from the story.
If any guy questions womens feelings or fears... They do not know or understand the true extent of what women have to deal with all the time, and that's a fact.
By the way. On that night I walked home alone at like 6AM and I live 40 minutes away from that central station, near a genuinely dangerous area and had to walk through that area where someone actually got murdered just a few weeks ago... where cars have been burnt (you can still see the scorch marks) and drugs are sold... And as a man I never once felt unsafe that night or any other. That would be impossible for any woman...
Do you play fortnite
Yea I'm a pretty scary looking dude. And often hanged out with a mostly female friend group just so they have a long haired bearded big guy to be back up. Stop doing that because it got really creepy even for me. The lengths some serial predators would go to gaslight women was insane.
Det är verkligen sjukt.
I worked as a Red Cross volunteer in Sweden for 13 years. It's insane how must horrible and tragic things that happen even in one of the worlds most progressive and safest countries in the world.
And at least from my experience in the town I worked it was way worse 20 years ago.
I've been catcalled in front of a daycare in the suburbs. At 6 a.m., I don't leave my house to get the goddamn mail.
You, Sir are SoMuchBettterThanABear. I so hope that your experiences will give others tools to work with. Sometimes people just don't know what's happening. I'm old so there are things that started in My generation that are now just Awful for y'alls. On behalf of every woman who's had to navigate those situations alone.....for generations. Thank you. 🐻🐻🐻🐻❄🧸
I had a friend who grew up in the rural Ozarks, and he looked me dead in the eye when I said I was thinking of going camping there and told me "People aren't your friend in those woods. Don't strike up a conversation and keep a pistol on you, but don't tell them about it or show them. Nod respectfully, greet them if they smile and keep your distance but don't let your guard down. There's murderer's, felons on the run, and crazy people living in those woods where nobody can find them, and they won't find you either." Shit haunts me. I'm gonna buy the pistol he recommended too, small enough to be perfectly concealable.
People can turn into the typical bandits and marauders that movies and video games portray when civilization is taken out of the equation. It's just our nature to be suspicious, or outright hostile, of strangers in that context.
Meanwhile, bears are afraid of humans most of the time. As long as they're not starving for a meal, and you're not threatening their young, they'll mostly run away from you. Especially if you raise your arms and kick up a fuss.
Bears are safer than people are outside of civilization; and not just for women.
Mind if I ask the pistol? IMO, don't get hung up on brand. Pick out a size and price range and then compare all the major brands in that size and price range. What you're looking for is a grip angle that points naturally. Pick out a spot on the wall (without pointing it at anybody) and without aiming down the sights, point it at the spot on the wall. Then check your sights. You want one that points naturally for you so that in a self defense scenario you won't even have to aim, just point, because self defense scenarios are typically very, very close range.
My personal top recommendation is a S&W Shield. They are more on the affordable side, especially the original 1.0, but also have options for women like the EZ that is easier to rack the slide on, something women sometimes have difficulty with. Now, all polymer pistols can be unreliable to a new shooter. You have to have a firm grip on the pistol to stop limp wristing it, something new shooters can have a problem with on light weight polymer pistols that they wouldn't have on an all metal frame. Basically what happens is they don't hold the pistol firm enough, and the lower recoils back enough that the slide can't make its full cycle because too much of the recoil went to the lower. All metal guns have a heavy enough lower that it's not a problem. But it's a real easy solution, just keep a firm grip on the lower. The weight savings of a modern polymer pistol is well worth having to learn a proper grip.
Also, if you have the money? Get one that can take a red dot sight or a laser. They make the pistols sooooo much easier to use. Basically they turn it into easy mode. No need to line the sights up properly, just put the dot on the target and squeeze the trigger.
Nice campfire story, definitely happened.
I'm out by the Willamette national forest. Doesn't seem like a likely place, but it's bigger than it looks. What kind of pistol were you recommended?
I feel like this used to be more common knowledge - any outdoorsman or park ranger would tell you that anyone you would encounter who hangs out in the woods would be far more of a threat than any animal, no matter your own gender. It’s crazy that incels have muddied the waters so much by making everything about themselves and the fact they can’t get laid.
So many serial killers start out killing animals out in the woods, which is an easy place to move on up to humans.
I've once read a comment on YT by a guy who expressed annoyance that women are afraid of him, the typical situation would be that they'd cross the street to avoid him late in the evening. He decided to show to one such woman how stupid it is to fear him cause he's NOT one of those guys by... crossing the street after her and following her, catching up with her and going "boo!" as a prank. The woman was pushing a stroller btw, and she was obviously terrified. He didn’t understand when people in replies told him he might be a sociopath with no empathy.
and to this day he will still think hes the hero
Jesus Christ.
Checks out.
A true sociopath or narcissist has no or little empathy and just can't see the others side.
They don't have the mental software.
Funny username, that story definitely happened too.
Jesus. Sadly reminds me of a story Jim Beaver told about how he learned to cross to the other side of the street if he runs into a woman late at night.
Sometimes I forget that Vaush's stream chat is made up of primarily 14-17 year old boys who are too scared to talk to strangers. This was a good reminder.
Wait...
Do you mean the people agreeing or disagreeing with the analogy?
@@laviarray the people who are disagreeing with the analogy and not getting the social context
Honestly I kinda think that's a copout. Men well into adulthood will very commonly still have these same attitudes towards the subject
@@ascii_9727 should've added "and the grown men who act like them."
@@spicytofu6201 You don't have to be a manchild to realize it's a stupid hypothetical.
What’s sad about the wedding story is that I have a close friend that was roofied at a family wedding. They weren’t a plus one surrounded by people they didn’t know. This was their sister’s wedding. So women holding onto their drinks even at family events doesn’t surprise me
I'm from bear country. And we carry fire crackers in our vehicles glove box. Because that's all it takes to scare a bear away.
Does that work on grizzlies?
@@julianmcmillan2867you do realize that grizzlies are not that special? They're just big and act like that but they get alarmed as any other critter to "not wilderness loud sounds". So loud bangs and shit like my preference air horns work well too.
@@CrowQQ Hey, I wasn't being condescending or sarcastic, I was legitimately curious.
I mainly asked because I am experienced with lions. And with lions, loud noises also freak them out, but they're far more likely to become more aggressive than scurry off. We had a PH hunter once and he shot a lion. The lion didn't limp away, it gunned him down and tore him to pieces, for example.
So, I was just wondering if it is a similar situation with grizzlies.
@@julianmcmillan2867Wait.. he shot the lion were for the lion to still torn him down ??
@@FunnyParadox Yeah. The lion died, but it took a while. Shot him in the chest.
The thing with a lion is that they're fucking big, right. Absolute units. So, if you don't have a powerful rifle or firearm that can tear through their chest, you better get a clean headshot. (Not advocating for hunting lions, by the way, just saying that if you happened to find yourself in the bush with a lion and a gun).
Turns out that most large predators can take pretty serious damage and will still attack with the virility of a healthy one.
There's another story of two males that killed one another. Lions prefer to attack an opponent or prey by directly going for the neck; if they get it right, the prey dies quicker and with less of a fight. Anyways, lion A got the arteries in his neck ripped open by lion B. He was on his way to bleeding out. However, he still kept fighting until lion B just overpowered him and finished him off. Lion B lost an eye and a few bad gashes.
So yeah, if it isn't an instantly lethal shot and the lion can still move? Make sure you're fucking outta there.
As a gay man, I often search for bears wandering alone in the woods. 😉
.......same 😏
Carefully, there might be a man among those bears 😰
WAIT A MINUTE-
Me three
This video shows that, while Vaush may enjoy dabbling in misogynistic humor, he’s actually deeply empathetic towards how women under patriarchy feel. His community would go onto giving him so much shit, but he rightfully slapped back at them and accused them of insecurity.
As a woman I appreciate him
I really appreciate that about him too. The way he communicates with Chat, is what hooked me on him. It's like Chat is a person. It reminds me of Internal Family Systems therapy....each 'voice' is an inner character. I just assumed it was "younger than GenX" brain-wiring.....but I don't see anyone else doing it as well has he does.
@@auntiedee9468 people can say what they wish about him, but nobody can take away from the fact that he carries so much integrity with him, even if he's not always correct, he does an amazing job creating a space for informative entertainment and safety for as many as he can.
@@xx_isabel_the_wolf_xx3869 100%
It is insecurity. Did anyone ever imply otherwise? We can still rather people not feel upset in the world. Somebody insulting you also rationally does nothing, they are just words you can ignore, does that makes its impact less real?
when i was 16 i was hanging out with a girl and she noticed a guy was following us, i didn't really think of it much but decided to walk her back home so she feels safer, at some point i noticed how much her hands were shaking and it was probably the biggest wake up call i had as someone who lived most of their life as a guy. it was insane to me that we allow this kind of shit to happen near the center of the second biggest city in the country. and that probably less than a percent of men are aware of it.
This happens to me as well started carrying pepper spray after I was groped one night. Being a girl is great in some ways and blows in others. Yeah not all men are bad but all bears i can get away from but not all men.
You get some serious BetterThanABear points (especially seeing it so young!). Thank you so much for noticing and sharing......others Might not notice or know what to do. 🐻🐻❄🧸
When I was 16 I was walking from my house to my school for a theatre rehearsal. A man in a car started slowly following me down the street. I did what my mom taught me to do and I crossed the road to the other street (it’s difficult for someone to make a u-turn and follow you in the opposite direction). But the man drove to the other road and followed me there. This happened 4 times and I started to panic.
Luckily one of my mom’s coworkers just so happened to be driving down the road at that exact moment. He saw me distressed and rushed over to pick me up and scream at the man. I’ll never forget this.
This is my big problem with the "Man vs Bear" thing. I go walking almost every day, and it's pretty common for women to be afraid of me even though I'm not actually doing anything. This is especially true when I need to turn down a street that they also need to turn down. I absolutely scared girls as badly as that guy scared your girl, but that's just because I existed in the vicinity of women. I can't/won't stop going outside to make random women feel comfortable, but that also means that women are going to continue to be afraid of men outside, which creates a vicious cycle. Ultimately, obviously men need to stop being creeps towards women, but women also need to stop perceiving every man as a creep just for being around them.
It kind of blows my mind how men don't get it or just the possibility that a woman might see them as a potential threat while walking down the street at night. Long before I ever transitioned I would intentionally cross the street to avoid getting too close to a woman at night cause I didn't want them to be afraid. I still do it now even though I pass as a cis woman. The only difference now is that I make more of an effort to avoid men when I'm walking home at night
My 29 y/o female partner got sexually harassed by a 60+ y/o guy who offered to teach them oil painting in a public space literally yesterday, so yeah this happens all the fucking time
I feel like it's kinda revealing that you're pointing out the age difference though. Harassment is just as shitty whether the dude was 90 or 19.
@@tj12711 I know it's bad either way, but it's especially gross when someone does it to someone half their age imo. Plus my partner was lulled into false sense of security by the fact that the guy was old, by that age men's libido goes down, so they didn't expect to be groped in public by him while painting a landscape with oils... That's why I provided ages for context
I was at a club last week and this guy kept complimenting me, asking how old i was, asking to hang after etc. being a creep, i gave him the cold shoulder and walked a loop to loose him and he went off to harass (and i heard later tried to grope) some friends of mine. He ended up getting dragged out by security after making a big scene.
In contrast: a few minutes later another guy came up to me. Opened with a high five (😂 love a quirky bro) gave me a compliment and asked for a dance. I thanked him and declined - I'm lesbian its not gonna happen lol - and he said aight, smiled, we did a fist bump and we went our separately ways. Its OK to ask / flirt with folks, just respect the answer they give you. The first guy could really learn something from guy #2.
Fr. Guy two is a bro.
I taught martial arts for a long time. One of the things I taught, aside from punches/throws/chokes and all that, was to watch your drink and consider it poison if it left your unobstructed view for even a second for any reason. This lesson was surprising to some people, mainly teenagers, and seemed to be a lightbulb moment for high school girls/early college girls in particular. There's unrealistic paranoid fantasy in self-defense, but there's also some pretty messed up reality.
Thank you so much......definitely in the BetterThanABear category. Keep Teachin'.🐻🐻❄🧸
As a guy, I also keep this idea in mind all the time, and have done so since I was very young and knew what poisons were.
I was at a house party and everyone there was someone I considered a friend so I let my guard down. When I got roofied, my (already low) blood pressure crashed and they had to call an ambulance. If I hadn't raised the alarm in front of everyone the minute I felt it (and one of my friends wasn't a first responder), whoever did it would have ended up killing me.
@@b.w.6535 when I was your age, we mostly had to worry about getting too drunk, getting drugged was much less common than today.....it's like a gauntlet out there for you all. I'm so sorry and I'm so glad you had support. You're brave and strong.....like a Bear 🐻
I told my younger sister before she went to her first party to never leave her drink unattended, to call me if she needed me for any reason, and that if anyone offered to get her a drink, make sure it was _unopened_ when they gave it to her.
She told me afterwards that one guy did insist on getting her a beer but got extremely offended when he handed it to her already opened and she refused.
I think women are calculating what kind of man is in the woods alone vs the general population. While men are calculating what kinda bear he’ll encounter.
No.
We are calculating the risk of the bear vs the likelihood that a man alone will be a threat
@@blammela and how are you calculating that?
Probably a guy walking his dog
@@blammela of course everyone is thinking about both but my point is how much time are you on thinking about each one separately.
Kinda eye opening comment for me. I was already on the side of choosing the bear, but realizing it's not just some guy, it's a man alone in the woods, with only you, just brought to mind how easily some can make that choice.
As a trans woman I cannot stress enough how much more dangerous it can be to present femme in public, whether you do or do not pass
Exactly that. I don't even dare to dress in VERY feminine stuff in public without my best friend with me. I dare flared jeans and more feminine images on T-shirts, but no crop tops, no skirts or whatever without my bestie OR I go to a place where everyone dresses "differently" like comic con
Why does it not matter if they pass or not? A trans woman who doesn’t pass will be perceived as male from both men and women, and so they have male privilege. Also women would be weary of a trans woman who doesn’t pass since they’ll just group them in with other males and deem them a threat
@@thatguy6171they explicitly said it didn't matter. Learn to read
literally every trans women tells me this. it’s always cis men, aka people who never live as women, arguing against us on this
@@themightymcb7310 I know that’s what she said, I’m saying passing does matter. Trans women have male privilege if they’re perceived as male
A lot of people who don't understand the question seem to be under the impression that you're going to *actively* fight either the bear or the man. Arguing about how the bear is stronger than the average man is irrelevant. That's not the point.
Yes, the point is to go "MEN BAD! M'LADY I'M ONE OF THE GOOD ONES!"
@@anitaremenarova6662 sorry you can't understand. maybe one day...
Exactly. In a random encounter with a wild animal, I could probably scare off the animal. Animals aren't really interested in humans and would rather avoid us.
@@ButteredToits- I understand fully, just hate how performative everyone including Vaush gets over this stupid hypothetical.
Why this upsets you?@@anitaremenarova6662
This video and discourse reminded me of one Halloween. Think I was in my late teens or around 20. I was at a bar with a group of women. A friend of mine was just chilling and some random dude came out of nowhere and put his hand around her going: "Hey, what's up/You real hot/Wanna go dance." Drunk as a skunk. The friend AND the women around her went: "Nah, not interested. I'm/She's gay." and the dude's reaction was: "Well, is that a problem?" I was just looking at the situation confused as hell about his behavior and I eventually went: "Yeah, I've known her for ages. Believe me, she's not into dudes haha." The dude LOST HIS SHIT just screaming: "Do we have a problem dude? What are you trying, huh?!" Acted like a fucking gorilla thinking I was trying to mate with his partner or something. Later the dude left when one of the friends lied to him that the harassed friend's partner was at the bar getting drinks. But only after he thought she was "already owned" or something. Went to grind on some other random victim on the dancefloor.
I think this moment really made me distance myself from anti-feminist/anti-SJW content back in the day. Just seeing that behavior so blatantly made me realize what things like "toxic masculinity" really meant and the "hysterical" stuff I thought feminists went too far with started to look very sensible. The reactions that dude had were so obviously gendered and ingrained to his interactions with everyone.
Yep, that's totally relevant to encountering either a man or a bear in the woods.
@@kanelives2895 I can't help you become empathetic. You have to do it yourself.
@@kanelives2895if you can’t see how it is, I think you’re just beyond helping
@@nachofast6144you really can’t. If they can’t see it after reading this kind of story over and over again, they never will. Not until they consciously decide to be better.
Im a 32 year old man and I have always said the worst thing you could run into in the woods is another human 100%.
Yeah, our veneer of civilization is paper thin.
It takes almost nothing to strip it away for some humans to reveal the savage predator underneath.
If there were no consequences, I think most people would do bad things; and some would do horrific things.
then you're unfathomably stupid
Those that take the comparison literally are dismissed as "well akshually 🤓" debate bros that have missed the point.
Yet we obviously have lots of people making that point unironically.
You're 32 though, I imagine a lot of the guys saying man instead of bear are young or immature. Humans are among the very few species of animas that kill their own, basically, 'just because'.
@@lisarox4221 how is saying the bear immature? If you take the question literally then the obvious choice is the bear. What percentage of men do you think would SA the woman in this scenario?
when i was 12 i went to a youth church get together, and before i left my mother sat me down and explained how i should never leave my drink, that if i do for even half a minutes i need to pour it out, and to Never accept a drink from a man even if hes my friend, unless its an unopened soda bottle or can that you cant roofie
Or if you like to be gross, one you haven't seen him drink from previously.
I was never drunk and I don't go to places with alcohol drinking culture (like bars etc). I don't vividly remember being taught about leaving drinks open.
I was, however, once, a year or two ago, in a small movie theater (with maybe 3 "rooms" idk what they're called in English). I bought a ticket and I think was asked if I wanted a popcorn or a drink. I said I'd get coca cola but needed to go to the bathroom first. Guy was like "oh ok you can pay now and I'll put it aside for you" because the queue was pretty long. I figured what can happen, seeing how they use closed glass bottles. I proceeded to pay, and he went and opened the bottle (they had one of those metal thingies that you need a bottle opener for) and put it on the counter. They'd open them for people anyway, but like, bro, we just talked about me not wanting to go pee with a bottle in my hand.
I didn't say anything at first because I really needed to go to the bathroom. I basically had to gather all my social courage, too, because I'm a really awkward person and also don't like to inconvenience people, or to "make a scene". But when I returned, I asked for a new one, saying that it wasn't anything personal but basically a matter of principles. Also, even if I didn't think he'd do anything to it, there was a chance he wasn't paying attention to it for a few seconds and someone could've accessed it. I could see he thought I was overreacting (also, he really seemed like a normal, nice guy, not the shady type) but opened a new bottle in front of me.
I was also there by car, so in the unlikely, say, 0.01% scenario where someone would've spiked a random drink in a studio movie theater during a weekend day, I really did NOT want to cause a crash on a highway. But in the end, I never experienced having my (or a friend's) drink spiked and it was still common sense to request a new one. I can't comprehend people who don't understand that, they must live a really carefree life. Good for them I guess.
Vaush needs an analogy to fit his audience "Would you rather meet a bear or order a pizza over the phone"
Okay. You chose the bear, but what if the man was a clown? Imagine you hear his squeaky oversized shoes walking around you.
If anything that would be more terrifying.
I'd rather meet two bears than A CLOWN AT NIGHT IN THE WOODS
@@sebastianbobrowicz2898two bears high-fiving?
@@FelisImpurratorpatrolling the Mojave almost makes me wish for a nuclear winter
Clowns are terrifying!
The most horrifying thing to see deep in the forest will ALWAYS be another human, that’s the primary draw of The Forest after all
mmmmmmm I'm not sure about that one.
Lets call those humanoids instead of humans 😂 I never finished that game tho bc holy f it gave me nightmares
This discourse reminds me of the Gillette shaving commercial that talked about how men should strive to be better towards women, which ended up offending so many people that it set the entire internet on fire for a whole month.
Well that ad was cringe performative bs, wasn't it the one where a dude gets stopped from approaching a woman in the middle of the day on a busy street?
@@anitaremenarova6662 Yeah, that's the one.
@@anitaremenarova6662 Yeah but men should be better, cringe aside. An ad's not going to make them do it, but they should be better.
@@anitaremenarova6662 And as we're seeing, it turns out that Gillette is not good for men with sensitive skin. Thanks for demonstrating.
@@nerag7459 I don't disagree, it's just on the same level as the Kylie Jenner Pepsi ad. They want to pat themselves on the back for being good and heroic more than they actually want any change.
As a trans woman, the first time a man made me uncomfortable by making weird comments, I freaked out to my non binary bestie who was raised as a female. And I was surprised that they didn’t really think of it as a big deal (of course they were still there for me and helped me), but I was just like dude wtf this is crazy, but they have experienced that sort of thing so much they thought of my experience as “just another Tuesday” It woke me up.
I can say as a transwoman, things guys say to you change completely depending on your gender. Even if you’re a guy and know this stuff is real, being on the receiving end of it really changes your perspective
Every guy I had talked to pre-transition would think the fact that guys tell women to “smile more” is so weird and that they had never met someone who would. I had never seen it either. Now I’ve gotten it myself, gotten followed at night, hit on by creeps, all of it. And that’s just a tiny example of something relatively non-threatening.
It’s true that every guy thinks all his friends are just as innocent as himself, never knowing the truth
@@user-hbgpod0d62 Who asked
You don't need to be a woman to the victim or sexual harrassment.
@@user-hbgpod0d62 I'm aware that men don't speak to one another that way; what I mean to say is that men don't think other men treat women that way lol
as a transfem, i'm starting to see women's side of this dynamic and it's really fucking annoying at times especially when my own guy friends' treatment of me is influenced by that dynamic
This is something I've noticed Trans women deal with a lot and bothers me. I know how in some male groups they get talked about too so it's definitely something to be cognizant of.
I had a student transition to male, in their 40s. I was their 'Am I Crazy' person while they were going through the hormonal transition. Their experiences really woke me up to a LOT of misunderstandings I'd had with testosterone beings. It's a perspective I would have Never understood, if they hadn't shared it with me. Thank you for sharing yours also. You'll get the hang of protection strategies......just watch your Sisters. You'll notice more subtleties' in their decisions, now that you understand the context. Be safe and take care of yourself.
I was lucky of being autistic I never give a shit what my "friends" thought
@@moonielivee4836If you're transfem, just make sure you watch out. Doesn't matter if you don't give a shit about what people think; if you're out as a woman, you are genuinely in danger of higher rates of SA and other violent crimes, and a lot of these things can and often do happen from your own male friends who don't even realize and refuse to admit they're harming you. A lot of the time it goes from joking/comments/bs that makes you uncomfy to suddenly one day having a guy you thought was your bro try to put his hand down your pants, or grope your chest. Sometimes it's a male friend coercing you into stuff, but other times it's done without any warning.
Aka it's good that you don't worry about what your friends think! But I'd worry a little More, if possible, or at least be wary and stay aware of the danger in your day to day life. Esp for trans women, being assaulted by a stranger or someone who doesn't know you well can lead to being murdered once an attacker finds out what you have between your legs. But even guys you consider friends can and will treat you differently for being associated with womanhood in any manner.
Same, but I don't really have many male friends
Also, with women liking true crime, it is somewhat connected. Sometimes, people with trauma find other traumatic things safer than something that is safe.
Yep, and the ability to experience those events in a context that is your choice allows for a better feeling of control over an aspect of life that is so far out of the control of most
Plus it's like a schoolbook. You look what tactics did they use to have higher chances to see them.
I was once telling a man about how women know that they could be SA'd by any man they come in contact with, because they are just not strong enough to fight them off. He proceeded to , 100 percent seriously, tell me how hard it is to be a man, and not SA every woman, because they know they can.
Yikes
I call cap.
it is way more likely that he was complaining about being feared and how it makes interaction harder etc. but also was incredibly edgy and stupid about it throwing in a few "I guess we could"s or bragging about his (definetely real and unproblematic) flirting successes
There is no way that that was any sane persons point if it actually was I genuinely apologize and I guess men should need to prove their way out of prison but it is more likely that it wasn't and you missunderstood in some way. I think even an actual (or would be) rapist probably wouldn't say something like that
@@freaki0734 I hate to tell you dude, but he really did say that it is hard to stop yourself raping women all the time. No misunderstanding at all. I wouldn't put it here if I wasn't 100% sure.
There are some creepy fucking guys in this discourse including one that said he was proud that he was scarier to women than a bear
Other guys should collectively despise guys like that. Women's fear only makes dating more difficult for everyone... in ALL of the ways...
The problem with the analogy is that it creates the type of discourse that would lead the average person to say either 'fuck it' or that instead of understanding teh point, especially if they didn't want to understand the point.
Bear vs Man is the trolley problem of patriarchy.
I know, as a woman I love seeing the men outing themselves and proving the entire point lol. bears won't drug your drinks.
@@beybladebaby
It's kind of an esotheric comparison considering there usually won't be any bears in a club. Like, you are more likely to die by slipping on a spilled drink than a bear attack.
The whole "if you bumb into them in the forest" comparison is at least realistic,
I mean that could have been a joke... Not sure why only one side can be using hyperbole to express something here lol.
As a nature nerd who has spent ages in the forest looking for bears. I absolutely understand women wanting to see a bear, they get to see men everyday seeing a bear is speacial.
this is the funniest comment here i love you bear man. i hope you get to see a bear one day (without getting hurt). truly the world is too full of humans and not full enough of bears
Bear conservation is actually a real need tbh. Their numbers are threatened, and forests are being destroyed. It's very upsetting and dangerous for the wildlife balance.
Thank you for this wholesome comment.
Go to a Canadian forest cabin and leave your trash open. Good luck!
Laios Moment
In a sense, good men are victims here as well. When society treats every man like a potential rapist it can lead to increased social isolation which leads to depression and suicide. So evil men being violent hurts everyone, good men and women alike.
Nah because sexism against men is good since women face more oppression. Standards? Principles? Sir this is Twitter
That how I feel on this. I am so angry at these men that made women feel unsafe.
No, not alike.
I understand what you are trying to say, but at most it is "violent men complicate life for good men too".
The possibility of social isolation is not the same as the constant threat against your life, body, and safety that women experience.
It is not even close, not in the same universe.
And I say that as a man who is directly affected by this, since I prefer to socialise with women, and they are understandably wary of me at first.
Just vaguely awkward interactions for a while are not comparable to the women's experiences.
@@JackDespero I'm happy to see a positively additive reply.
@@JackDespero they're both bad
Let's me put it this way for those still unable to see the point of this:
- Bear in the woods: The Revenant
- Man in the woods: Deliverance
Man in the woods: Michael Myers.
Okay you know what....you fucking got me. My (separate) comment is now null in void.
Wait what is this refering to?
@@tempy2440 The scene where a bear has forced... reproduction with a man in Revenant.
Ive had girl, friends for a large part of my life in part cos being pan lends to different social views and the amount of times ive had a first hand experience of friends being roofied and us having to carry them back home is fucking insane. Especially where i used to live in Brussels there were rings of bartenders who would roofy girls and guys for their buddies and then cover up for them. IM PICKING THE BEAR TOO BROTHER
Edit: not to badmouth bx, it's a very progressive city with a lot of very cool people, my sister was a bartender and has met loads of amazing people but holy shit when the "bad apple" is as bad as that it doesn't take much to make the whole batch questionable
And guys? So they were just drugging anyone they could get their hands on?
I never choose bears. I always go for the Twink.
BASED AN TRUE!!
More for me
So you like to be annoyed incessantly.
@@markburns2621 Twink is just a body type, Bears and Twinks can both be annoying if they want to.
@@markburns2621 my twinks are European. Not like the Californian beach boys who’re always like “AHHH! Hiya! Girlfriend!”
I go hiking and I can confidently say having run into both a bear alone and a man alone that I will be picking the bear.
Same
I've been sexually assaulted by both men and women (I'm a man) and the reason it didn't traumatize me, I feel, is that I was able to stop it. And if I needed to escalate it to violence to protect myself I knew that in all those cases I would prevail. It was never a situation like a supervisor or somebody with authority over me where I might feel coerced thank god. Being in those situations and feeling helpless would be sooo traumatic. I also got laughed at by my friends when I told them, but whatever. That's society I guess.
not sure what point youre trying to make
@@bothi00 did you watch the video?
>I also got laughed at by my friends when I told them, but whatever.
The real sad thing isn't even the assaults, it's that you don't have any friends, because those certainly aren't. Unless you count them as Facebook friends. I'm sorry.
@@kanelives2895 Nah, saying they're not friends isn't fair. It is literally a societal problem. Do I agree with what they did and would I do it, no. And this was years ago, now they'd act differently, they are progressing. Which is also why I think it's important to associate with people who think differently than you. Even become friends with these people. Anything to move the needle.
@@yourheadisround I agree. Just look how society treats it when a male student is raped by a female teacher. The prevailing attitude isn't one of horror or disgust; it's one of, as South Park puts it, "niiiiiice."
So i know Vaush is controversial and has had some issues in the past, but i think that this is the kind of thing from him that's really valuable. Taking the time to walk his audience through this is really good and i honestly respect it
Being a lefty guy who didn't jump down women's throats over this crap feels like being Sony watching Microsoft talk about how the new X-Box has to always be online.
Yeah. And to see all the men then go. "But bears are dangerous." Or out right start to insult, haras, dismiss or threaten women over this discussion.
It's just unreal.
I kinda get why straight women be wilding when the people they are intended to pair with start defending this. Every talk of straight women needs two talks about straight men.
@@erikelenstrom9685 I think its a kind of logic lord stance. My first reaction to it framed as a would you rather is "ok i can see why women would all be implicitly more scared of the man, but like... the bear actually is worse". But i had enough social awareness to know that wasn't really the point, so I kind of nodded along instead of "um ackchually"ing the women in my life.
Im glad it was a case of people kind of misrepresenting the whole thing, but also its kind of sad, because it does hamper the effectiveness of the scenario.
My problem is I’ve seen way too many stupid points that have been infuriating to read from people arguing for the bear
Admittedly I just popped up on Facebook and this shit was suddenly there with zero context
My issue is that every time these things come up (like yes all men), all it does is feed into a hostile us versus them dynamic that is an impediment to our goal of creating a safer world, whether offending a decent portion of 50% of the population and turning them off to this being an issue interpersonally, or whether to push for change societally/governmentally
Like also maybe as a European I have a bias of imagining being stuck inside with a bear or a man rather than outside, and I maintain that anyone that would just choose a bear over a random stranger to be around in a confined space is paranoid as fuck and needs mental help
@@erikelenstrom9685 who is threatening?and ofc this is dismissed,because anyone who claims a bear is better are either trolling or have serious mental issues
I saw a a spinoff that was something like, "black women, if you were in a conference room before a meeting would you rather a bunch of white women walk in or white men." black women chose the white man and the white women in the comments section all lost their shit.
Honestly, the most ragebait thing that can be said in most situations is to have a group of people express a strict preference towards a hypothetical situation. Without a baseline situation to refer to, everyone will think that it refers to them or any group they have in common.
I wonder how many white women would also choose white men over white women 🤔
@@apriljk6557 IRL quite a few. Online, 0.
All of these hypotheticals are just to anger the other side and start arguments. There is no intellectual progression here, at least not any that could've been done through better means, just pure mindless rambling.
@@someperson9998finally, someone who gets it.
Bears don't want contact with humans. They'll leave you alone as long as you dont accidentally sneak up on them and startle them. Thats why people in bear country wear "bear bells."
Bears are genuinely safer than men, outside of some very specific circumstances.
Exactly, whatever notion that bears just attack is not true
You can scare away black bears by making a lot of noise. I dunno about grizzly bears though. Those are scary motherfuckers.
@@prozierozie5692 especially black bears, which is all the east coast really has. As long as you ain't between a momma and her cub, every single charge from a black bear is gonna be a false charge. You hold your ground, put your hands up and get loud, and they'll stop and turn off, every single time. If you run, though, they'll keep chasing you. Now, brown bears do not false charge as often, but they still do. White bears never false charge. If a white bear charges you, you're lunch
You're missing the point, people will also not attack you if you cause a scene. The question is who you'd rather have to fend off when scaring them away doesn't work.
@@anitaremenarova6662 men would that the point
I’m a man, and I’d pick the bear. You don’t know what people are actually about until you’re alone with them where the government can’t find either of you. Yeah, bears are dangerous. But, people are insane.
People are also unpredictable. You can meet someone, who may appear charming and nice, only to find out you were only prey to them. Humans are amazing maskers.
I guess I'm the man that's the reason other men pick the bear 😎
Exactly, bears while dangerous are predicable, its goal is either food or at least incapacitate a threat (you). It's not raping and torturing you to death for its pleasure. If you survive, you won't have to worry about running into it back in town because it's stalking you. It won't have a defense attorney who brings up your history of being outside alone or going to the zoo to see a bear willingly as proof you were a willing participant. You won't have other bears angry at you for becoming afraid of all bears after. You won't have people wish that you are mauled again for that fear. You won't have people ask what you did to make the bear want to maul you or will claim you're lying about the mauling just for attention or to hurt an innocent bear
These are all possible outcomes women have to weigh with every interaction, because one 1 in 5 women have been raped at least once, every girl has a story about either them or anyone else beeing roofied, rapes and stalking notoriously go unpublished
To be fair, the other man is probably just as afraid of you as you are afraid of him.
@@KiaStout+
As someone who enjoys hiking, hikers usually stick to a trail to avoid getting lost/requesting help though. If we were to be picked up and dropped on a trail in the middle of the woods with no context, it's safe to assume that it's another hiker. If you were picked up and dropped off in the middle of the woods with no context and no trail, things then become quite suspicious.
The man in the thumbnail gives me massive 'young conservative' vibes. On the other hand, the bear looks friendly and chill. I think I'm going bear on this one because I'd rather be mauled than listen to that guy for more than a minute.
You have to show dominance by debating him therefore placing you at an advantage.
Maybe he's a Libertarian and you can scare him by saying "Sam Seder".
Cute lil bear ears
@@fefelarue2948 It only works if you say it 3 times, fast.
@@fefelarue2948😂😂😂😂😂
I would unironically choose the bear. I know the bear's intentions. It has simple animal instincts and doesn't act on malice. I have no idea what a human's intentions are. Not all men are bad, but ANY could be. That's the point. That's why it's not an argument against men in general.
My brother and his gf went out once and she ordered a drink but then decided she didn’t want to drink, so my brother drank it for her.
It was spiked. Someone slipped something in there while she was camping the drink
I’ve walked alone at night since high school and never once have been harassed(except cops) or tried to be harmed by someone else. When I’ve told this to women they are always shocked and ask if I carry any protection and when I say no, the absolute concern on their faces is earth shattering. Men and women live in two completely different worlds.
Yeah that's wild. I live in a very safe, family friendly neighborhood. I still carry a knife. I've still had a man try to lure me into an alleyway at 2am, claiming there was a hurt cat there- or one chase me down a block away from my house that very same night. Nowhere is truly safe.
My wakeup call was back in early middle school. My friend and i had...developed a bit (boo puberty). We were biking through town in the middle of the day in summer and a car with 4 adult men slowed down to keep pace with us while they catcalled us. We were a block or so away from a relative of mine's house and so we stopped there for protection and got a ride back so we wouldn't be out on our bikes alone. I don't do _anything_ alone in non-neutral places like shops because of it. When i was really young i laughed at the idea of a gaggle of girls all going to the bathroom together but later i realized why that was.
Never split the party
What are you talking about? You know how many men are victims of harassment and violent crime? Just because you have been lucky doesn't make it a general truth.
@@FrenkieWest32 I am 30 I’ve been doing late night walks since I was 14. Majority of those crimes come from beef between other men. rarely just because it’s opportunistic.
If I was a 14 year old girl on a late night walk I would’ve been kidnapped almost immediately.
That’s the difference and I’m living proof of this difference.
@@leftisthindrance Is this some actual statistics or you just say stuff that fits your narrative? Would be rather preposterous if it's the latter. Many men are victims of opportunistic violent crime... And I hate to sound like I am playing down such serious issues, but no 14 year old girls are not immediately kidnapped. Blowing the situation out of proportion to such absurd degrees is not helping anyone. It doesn't make anyone more safe, it does not further the conversation, and it does not get people more focused on solutions. ''My personal life proves how the world works'' is just not even worth addressing.
I’m a male and trail runner that lives in the mountains. I would rather see a bear in the woods than a weird looking man. A mama bear and her cubs, that’s a hard choice.
How about a good looking man?
@@markmilne765 Oh well obviously he's ok *brushes hair out of face*
@@markmilne765 that’s a tough question!?
@@user-cq1oy3lh5z you asking me? 🤣
@user-cq1oy3lh5z then you are pre judging
I was introduced to this hypothetical as “Would you rather be trapped in a forest with a bear or a human,” and just took it for a fun little tjought experiment. Like “oh, haha, the bear is just gonna go do bear things, probably not eat me.” “Oh, but I could probably try and work together with the human… unless they just decide to kill me, they might be worse than the bear.”
Basically how I walked through the thought experiment, too
consider
bears in the woods are normal
humans wandering through the woods is inherently suspicious
@@thesatelliteslickers907I mean the human could be camping, fishing, hunting, a photographer, etc. they’re plenty of normal reasons to be in a forest. But yeah, I get your point.
Helped a woman friend finish a drink someone bought her and ended up roofied. Almost every woman friend I've ever had has at some point told me a story about experiencing sexual violence.
We as a society don't make healthy men and it's a problem.
Something forgotten in the premise is "alone in the woods".
If the same premise is "on a public street with others nearby" probably more worried about the random bear in the street.
I'd pick the bear. There's a 0% chance it'd try to start a conversation.
people always ask if women or men would rather meet a bear in the woods, but nobody ever asks if autists would rather meet a person or a bear in the woods.
I like conversation
😂🧸
"Braaaagh!"
"Look, I like you as a species, but it just won't work."
"Braaaagh?"
"Really. Now just go catch a salmon or something.
"Brah..."
@@lethaldream50definetly bear. Acts in a semi predictable way, probably won't think I'm being agressively quiet and is far less scary than a random person wanting to do smalltalk.
I used to think that women were overstating their troubles too, until I heard a female friend of mine telling how she clutched her keys whenever it got dark. Later, I learned that another friend was being actively stalked by her ex and another one almost got assaulted by a guy we befriended in a bar when he wanted to play games with her.
That was a harsh wake-up call.
why is it that EVERY practical anecdote supporting this argument involves a bar. Don't drink then, don't go to clubs, to a mosque then. Versions of Islam take your argument seriously which leads to a lot of the negative stuff you think about Islam. And I say this as a Muslim. Don't like Islam? Jenovahs Witnesses and the Mormon church also forbid drinks. Bear vs man is an argument that is extremely easy one for right-wingers to twist. Another more obvious one is adding trans women and bathrooms, or saying the man is non-white.
@@jhonshephard921 ???? I think you need to take your own advice about putting down the drinks
Probably half of the men I've been close to have been stalked by an abusive ex, myself included. I've been threatened with violence/mugging multiple times while in broad daylight (in safe cities, too) and sexually harassed on public transit.
I'm not saying women are overstating anything, but I do think people underestimate how often men are victims of random violence and abuse. I also think women are more vigilant than is needed. It's very rare for anyone to be jumped on the street, or followed home by a stranger. It absolutely happens, but not so often that every single woman should be constantly afraid a stranger will attack her in the night.
And I'm a trans man, so I have firsthand experience living as a woman. I was never all that worried. Other women tried to frighten me about what dangers I might face, but I literally never encountered any of them until after I started looking like a man.
've been asked several times what the biggest red flag in a partner is to me, and I always say "if his friends are assholes." I dont care how kind you are as a man, if you let your friends harass others, support your friends cheating, or look away when your friend is drugging a girls drink I want NOTHING to do with you. Unfortunately, behaviors like this are all too common in male friend groups from what Ive seen. If you don't hold your friends accountable for their actions, your complacent in them.
Thank God Vaush doesn't read his comment section on YT, cause he would have an aneurysm for the people who still can't get the point of the hypothetical.
This is like when NonCompete couldn't understand the alien hypothetical.
The inability to not be able to observe social cues and then draw conclusions based on evidential behavior is fucking insane. It should be obvious with a little bit of critical thinking WHY woman fear men.
I honestly don’t see how people are still missing this in the comments when the video is Vaush explaining the point in plain English in the first 5 minutes. I feel like people continuing to be obtuse about this have deeper problems.
I have bad news his reddit also couldn't understand the hypothetical. He was super angry and disappointed when he saw the reddit threads during yesterday's stream.
Oh don't worry if you haven't seen the last stream I beg of you to please please watch it. He goes scorched-earth on the subreddit because they were absolutely quadrupling down. It's nothing to this current comment section. It was so cathartic to watch as he sends two mods from the stream directly to the subreddit to start banning everybody.
The great incel Purge (literally 1984)
@@pikapownsYeah, this hypothetical about putting yourself in the position of a women in our society really broke Reddit to the point where guys thought they could prove women wrong or something, as if they weren’t instead just holding up a big red flag over their head about this. Pretty disappointing to see.
If I had every penny for every time there was a man marrying a bear in Korean mythology, I would have 2 cents, which isn't much, but its weird that it happened twice.
I love this comment.
@@MichaelAronsonSo many layers😅
As a man, I would choose the bear. Because the hypothetical man in the woods could potentially be Shia Lebouf.
Actual cannibal shia labouf???
But can you do ju jistsu?
@@calebharris292 no! I'm caught in a bear trap!
fuck guys, we didn't think to consider this crucial detail
Ok grandpa let's take you back to bed
I'm a guy and my friend (also a guy but somewhat feminine looking from behind) got roofied while we were out celebrating a friends birthday. He got *very* sick, puked out my window the whole ride home, and I nearly had to drive him to the hospital. We did some research on the symptoms after and if the dose were a bit stronger, it could have killed him.
So yeah, the fact that some dudes will just do that means I don't blame anyone for choosing the bear.
Makes total sense, especially because drink spiking is totally a thing in the woods. Totally.
@kanelives2895 ...Drink spiking isn't the only form of unprompted (and often sexually-motivated) violence someone can commit you absolute troglodyte
@@kanelives2895
In the woods there is no witness. Don’t even have to waste time trying to drug them.
Far more terrifying.
I feel like the comment about feeling sad that women automatically see you as a threat isn't a "weepy member of the dominant class" thing. It just generally feels isolating. I'm not going to hold it against anyone, and I'd never bring it up in any way that would make someone feel sorry for me, It just weighs on me, in the background.
I think this is fair. Many men are doing the 'how dare women not choose me' thing in this discourse, but the fact that there are enough bad men in the world that women have an ingrained suspicion of men... it sucks. It is isolating to know on some level you're perceived as a threat, especially if it's not unfounded. It's just another reason why misogyny has to die.
It is that, if your immediate response to women choosing the bear in the hypothetical is that comment. By doing so, you immediately recenter the hypothetical on yourself and your own circumstances. You essentially dismiss what the women are trying to express to you.
It signals a self-centeredness and lack of empathy for the women typical of being a "weepy member of the dominant class".
Just show some empathy, women understand that this sucks for men too, they aren't stupid. It's not personal, it's just something they learn to do to protect themselves. Just reading this comment section should give people ample opportunity to empathize.
@@Fusseliko you should learn reading comprehension
Women also feel isolated by the fear. In the end, you are not the one who feels the fear.
OP, as you can see here, your feelings don't matter, and expressing them is fragile/toxic masculinity.
I HIGHLY recommend having some platonic woman friends.
You will learn so much and they are really cool.
I concur. I have a lot of lady friends, and I learned a lot from them!
Best comment
What if you can't make any platonic female friends (not because you let your attraction take the reigns or view them as objects as opposed to people) but you're autistic, awkward, and unapproachable yourself based on appearance?
No thank you, women scare me.
It's almost like we're human.
As a gay bear, I will always choose the bear over someone of either gender.
Men need to not take everything so personally, the hypothetical isn’t even about an individual (or choosing at all, it was just a way of saying that “it’s scarier to be a woman than you might think”).
I think most people don't like being put in the villain camp. Imagine the question with altered choices that puts you in the villain camp for some characteristic of yours. One can totally appreciate female fear of men and also appriaciate men disliking the responses to this question. They aren't mutually exclusive. You can care about both your sons and daughters and how this question, and what the responses show, in different ways.
The way I saw a woman wxplain it was that a bear showing up has a predictable outcome. A woman running into a guy in the woods has no idea how that interaction is going to go. There's a level of anxiety to that I could never fully grasp.
But do they really have an idea of how the bear will act? There are loads of species of bears, with huge variances in behaviours, and context dependent behaviour that you simply can't deduce. My answer is to this question it would HAVE to be the same.
@@hikelfin5941I think the question's supposing a generalized idea of a bear. So, like, a black bear. Grizzly at absolute worst. So, like, potentially incredibly dangerous, but also not incredibly inclined to hurt a person.
So, like, Not a polar bear, lol.
The crazy part is the implication that you'd be fine trusting a strange woman in the woods at night. A human? Are you nuts?
@@kropotkinnie So in other words not predictable at all lmao.
@@kropotkinnie I'm telling you right now, I'm going hiking tomorrow, and I expect to see many men and women, and I literally will not stop for even 5 seconds to consider my safety. Many women hike out in the woods day after day with strange men they don't know.
Am I really to believe all these people would prefer to come across bears than all the safe people they've come across and for whom they only have positive things to say?
I’ve had men in my life say that they didn’t realize catcalling was so prevalent because they never see it happen. That’s because when a man is out and about with a woman, it doesn’t matter if she’s his partner/friend/coworker/sister/etc, to other men, that woman is “his” and a man won’t disrespect another man like that. Women are catcalled when there are no men next to them.
Same reason “I have a boyfriend” is safer than “I’m not interested”
Also, as a married woman, interactions like these don’t stop. I had a male coworker who thought that the only reason I would be friendly and sociable with him at work was because I was into him. Like, dude knew I’m married, and took my niceness as inherently sexual. Fucking gross
This is such a good point. Many men will not respect your sexuality, your comfort, or your expression of disinterest. But they'll only respect another man "claiming" you.
As one who's been on the receiving end of multiple forms of abuse, I'd 100% say the bear. I'm a non-passing trans woman, so I get all the ire from both genders, and have been straight-up assaulted in bathrooms 4x now. I would never leave my drink either. I try my best to always travel with a friend as well.
Thank you for the commentary on women being labeled as emotional while men are labelled rational …. I can not count how many men Ive been around who yell, punch walls, freak out, maliciously attack anyone who impacts their ego… but thats not “emotional”. UGH! I appreciate you saying it.
As someone who used to hike, other people are some of the most dangerous things to encounter in the outdoors ESPECIALLY in the evening.
My wife just went as far as to say: "I'd choose the bear, at least it'll JUST kill me."
A bear won't just kill you, it will eat you alive. No thank you!
For real. The fact that we haven’t discovered as well preserved female mummies compared to the male because ancient Egypt families waited to let their female relatives bodies decompose to protect them from being abused by embalmers, and that apparently there are horror stories of modern neceophilia in mortuaries, really came to mind during the discourse.
Yeah that's a pretty naive, optimistic fantasy.
This topic is like Groundhog Day of people missing the point. Over and over and over again.
This is pure ignorance. Not all deaths are created equal. In fact, we know exactly what it's like to get eaten by a bear. Google search for "moskalyova bear". But be warned, it's extremely gruesome.
I just wanna be overly pedantic about one thing: the "no man knows a rapist" thing, are man supposed to ask their friends if they ever raped anyone? And if so, do you really expect rapists to tell the truth?
That is the point.
But also a lot of men completely miss all the weird vibes that women absolutely get. Like not noticing how most women do everything to avoid a conversation with their friend alone and a lot of indirectly disturbing statements. Or even how all of their exes are crazy… it goes on and on and on. Every women had actively had to avoid certain men who still seem to have perfectly nice friends who don’t get how creepy they are because they aren’t a women and the subject of the bad behaviour.
@@brotherofthesixth2crazy exes lol. How many men have I met that have had a crazy ex? The difference is - crazy women exes often get away with it. A lot of times people just immediately believe the woman rather than the man.
Bias against men definitely exists.
That's the whole idea though. Women see far more often just how large the portion of men who will try to hurt us if there's no one around to see it is, and when we speak about our rightful fear about it we get told by men that it's exaggerated or didn't happen just because they've never seen it. Of COURSE you haven't seen it.
@@brotherofthesixth2 This is maybe a bit of a tangent, but I have a massive problem with the whole "don't trust men who say their exes are crazy" thing. Like. It smacks of not taking male abuse victims seriously, and really contributes to the problem of us staying silent.
Seriously, I can't tell you how nervous I am to open up about my relationship history/trauma specifically because I _know_ women will assume I'm a narcissistic liar. They've been taught to do that, now.
But my exes literally were crazy! I was stalked by one after breaking up with her and had to threaten police involvement to get her to leave me alone. Multiple people have had to do that with her. The other gaslit me until I had a nervous breakdown, and had severe boundary issues with people close to me, verging on sexually predatory.
Maybe some guys flip the narrative. But a lot of us actually are victims of some really scary, really weird stuff. And it's not common for men to have language to describe trauma or abuse at the hands of women. In my experience, it's not until someone else calls it abuse that we even see it that way, because we're so trained to think of women as helpless. And even then, it feels shameful to say we were a victim. So we say "she was crazy".
It sucks that "believe all victims" becomes "assume manipulation tactics" when the victim is a man. And it double sucks that I can't inform potential partners of my trauma and triggers because they'll then assume I'm secretly planning to abuse _them_ . Either we should extend the same unconditional support to male victims, or we need to keep our standards consistent and exercise a level of skepticism with women making allegations. Otherwise, what the fuck? Only some victims count? Not cool.
Fear is involuntary. It is not anyone’s fault to feel more or less afraid of something or someone than others. Being afraid of a black person over a white person, male over female, priest over teacher, etc can not be blamed on the person having the feeling. If that person treats anyone worse because of those fears; that is a choice.
True, it's also why fear disorders are so hard to deal with.
The fear shortcuts right past your rational mind before you can even react or think.
P.s. Being exposed to what triggers the fear reaction generally dulls it via repetition, so as long as it hasn't gotten pathological repeated positive exposure soon makes it "normal"
@@Virtualblueart exactly. All emotions are normal and human. We just gotta figure out what to do with them and how to deal with them. I am not good at any of this myself but yea lol
the thing is, throughout history and across cultures, one gender has been violent. There is something inherently wrong in men, whereas skin color is, well, skin deep.
@@user-pq4fc1mc7q
People have been violent. Sometimes men, sometimes women. But both genders uphold patriarchy in their own ways. This isn't a thing broken in men, it's a thing working as intended in society. Women are as likely to teach their little boys to not cry, to be tough, to not show weakness etc etc until toxic masculinity is engendered within (no pun intended).
The women love Feddy Fazbear. His lullaby is so soothing. Not a hard choice.
You are walking in the woods, there's no one around and your phone is dead, who would you rather spot? a bear or Shia LaBeouf?
I mean, this conception of the scenario more or less how we end up with the results we are seeing.
@@ms.aelanwyr.ilaicos yeah, i just couldn't help not to make this reference
A clown would be way scarier than either of them.
One time, I was waiting for the bus at around 3am after a night out, and some guy tried to flirt with me. I was alone, half-drunk and still wearing my club outfit at that point, so I was extremely uncomfortable with randomly being approached by a stranger and I felt very vulnerable. Some other guy told him to stop and that he was making me uncomfortable, The second guy and I ended up being on the same bus and I thanked him for stepping in. This second guy proceeded to sit next to me and chat me up the whole time, and asked for my number.
This was one of my least favorite interactions ever. I admit, the second guy didn't actually do anything wrong (he was very polite when I rejected him) but I felt so disgusted at the idea that the only reason this man even stood up for me was because he wanted to shoot his shot. I sometimes wonder whether he would have even bothered if he thought I was less attractive. Obviously not all men, but its hard not to think so when even the "nice" ones are still just trying to get in your pants.
Disgusting of you to treat both of them the same. The first guy was a creep while the second's only sin was lack of social intelligence. Makes me want to socialize with women even less knowing how easily you get lumped in with the scum of the world for such a tiny mistake.
"but its hard not to think so when even the "nice" ones are still just trying to get in your pants."
Obviously you didn't gave more details about this conversation but I could totally see him just trying to make some friends. Of course it's not the best situation for that...
I was in kinda similar situation(but worse for multiple reasons) and I asked girl for a number just to make sure she got to her home safely. And she did.
See, the fact that I understand why women would choose the bear is exactly why, as a dude, I've always been very careful about how I behave around women I'm not friends with. Because I never want to make them scared, knowing how so many women in my life have had awful experiences with dudes. I cannot begrudge women for choosing Bear over Man.
I don't understand why some men are like that. How do they live with themselves, knowing that they're creepazoids?
Men like you are what give me faith in men. The empathy, consideration and compassion is note worthy.
Thank you. We notice the effort.
@@magnarcreed3801I don't do it to be noticed, but your noticing is noticed, and appreciated!
**Double thumbs up** (b^_^)b
to be fair, if i saw a man in the woods i'd be way more scared than of a bear and i'm a man. what the fuck is this dude doing in the woods and why is he approaching me?
The same reason you’re in the woods?
That and the fact that most bears don't want to have anything to do with us unless they're absolutely starving or rabid. (The only exception are Polar Bears; which can and will actively hunt us for food.)
If a man is out in the woods doing god knows what and begins to approach you, you most likely stumbled apon a murderer attempting to hide a body. Only other thing I can think about is a game hunter; which is why they'd never approach you. (Also the fact that they wear bright orange to indicate that they're hunting and to not shoot them.)
Is he approaching you though? Why are we adding additional context that wasn't in the hypothetical?
"Excuse me! Do you have a minute to talk about our lord and savior Jesus Christ?"
okay american
Everytime I see this discourse or anything similar I'm reminded of the bit in a Daniel Sloss special where he says, all women have a story about some creepy guy and if she hasn't told you about it, that says more about you than her. And lost of guys in the audience bood
Watching chat tell on themselves is hilarious
I am all for empathy to women and being a father to two young daughters, these things scare the shit out of me both for the present and the future. However, using such an extreme example as a freaking bear, you have to also be empathetic to men who see themselves compared to literal monsters. Here is the thing about empathy, it applies on everyone including of course, women, but also men. I understand the point these people are trying to make, but when you make it in this bad way, it can also be counterproductive.
bears aren't monsters, men who prey on women are. if they're genuinely that upset that they're not being chosen over a literal mindless animal, maybe they should start acting better than one. it's not hard to understand the analogy and it's not going overboard, insecure men are just fuckin whiny.
As a guy, I don't take offense to it because I know I'm not one of those type of guys.
Plus I would have no survival skills and just complain about the heat lol
@@aceclop would you tell a member of a minority group to not get bothered by stereotypes because they don't apply on him?
@@MegaIronica
There's a huge difference, like any guy who would get offended by this is being a bit sensitive.
Also it depends on what the stereotype is, like if someone was like would you rather be walking in front of a black guy in the inner city or a fat white guy, I would obviously feel safer in front of the fat white guy. And I feel like the majority of black people would agree but the majority of ones who aren't like that wouldn't get offended because they know it's not about them.
@@MegaIronica you're not a minority for being insecure and unliked by women! you're not oppressed! get over yourself!
The Druid Halsin has entered the chat.
Advice for men, be like Mr. Rogers pretend everybody is your close neighbor. One of the qualities Micheal Brooks had that made him so likeable.
Common Mr. Rogers W
Unironically yea. Stop taking relationships like transactions and more like equal connections was a big Mr. Rogers thing. And he's 100% still right.
Nah the best advice is to just leave women alone. In fact I don’t even think men and women should interact, fuck it Segregation 2: Gender Edition.
This is one of the major reasons I am so much happier as an open woman. As much as I now have to be extra vigilant, at least now im a person and not an irredeemable monster to a sizeable portion of the population. Talking with other women is completely different when you're seen as another human being.
It's also why I think I have so much more luck talking to and setting up dates with guys than my cis woman friends: I talk to and treat guys like they are humans and (while still being cautious) don't treat them like rapid animals. And I see the exact same 'all men are naturally predators' rhetoric turned against me and my trans sisters all the time from cis women.
I understand why most other women choose the bear. I would choose it too if I knew it was going to be a violent encounter. I understand many women have trauma related to men. Just remember that demonizing an entire group of people based on something they can't change and treating them as the single worst monster you can think of has unintended consequences.
Consequences like TERFs being able grow and thrive to hurt trans women because we are 'predators in disguise'. Like forcing trans men into the closet because if they leave they know they'll treated like a monsters. And alienating male allies because no matter what they do they'll be treated, at best, as 'docile, for now'.
I've seen people I care about get hurt in all of those ways.
Honestly. The same people who are wholly antagonistic to men are the same people who become TERFs.
it's a crying shame how this problem makes society a more difficult place to be in for women and men. The solution in my IMO is to create closer social spaces and treat creep behaviour with the pushback/punishment it deserves from everybody. So, it's important for guys to do it too.
It's a shame as well how much toxic traits are rewarded in society. Being a sociopath makes you a good businessman, being aggressive as a guy makes you "assertive" and "macho", and putting on a show of strength makes guys "strong". True strength isn't always acknowledged and people like you who talk to everyone like humans are the people most responsible for positive change. I was able to come to terms with my weirdness abt women because of two trans guys in school who just treated me like a normal person when I was at my most awkward ever. Not long later and I came out as trans because I was able to sort through a lot of the mess in my head and acknowledge that most of my weirdness generally came from my upbringing, social isolation and trauma, not some fundamental thing wrong with me.
@@LightningBolt-dr9lz are you implying the only feminism is TERF?
But men CAN change their behavior, they just don't want to.
Funny because treating men not like rabid beasts has gotten me in more danger than my now vigilance.
Have fun sis. It’s a matter of time.
As a frequent hiker, i see men everyday, its boring, Ive only seen a bear once. Id rather see the bear
Depends if I’m wearing Lady Gaga’s meat dress or not… cos then the bear might blame me for what I was wearing. A man would never do that.
The concept and consequence of the answer to "Man versus bear" is exactly why I chose the industry as I did; driving commercial vehicles expedite over the country these past decade or so. However, for the past year and a half because things went downhill with that last job, I've been mainly living out of my car. I'd rather this solo transient lifestyle than ever again run the risk some creep chooses their desires takes precedence over my dignity.
On another footnote, at the 10:40 you have exactly hit it over the head. My cousin James was murdered by a narcissistic domestic abuser that he took a chance on living in his home thinking the dude would correct his ways if only given a chance. The man shot him dead in cold blood in that same home, making like he lost a liquor bottle in the house moments prior.
Another thing I think a lot of guys don’t realize about this hypothetical is that, like… you don’t know the man. In modern society, humans normally aren’t supposed to go outside at night. The bear is supposed to be out there, you’re not. So why is HE there…?
I get the hypothetical but I still really despise it as a black man.
Knowing that this sort of fear will be shown to me like 10x more than most other non-black men makes this hypothetical and the fact that so many people defend women choosing the bear kinda sickening. It’s like you’re not just gonna profile and fear all men equally obviously some men are gonna get it much worse and with worse consequences than other men..
I’m just confused because we always make fun of racists who bring up anecdotal experience and racial statistics of crimes as to make a point of the moral quality of minorities, yet now that men are the target of the criticism this becomes a valid form of social commentary?
Utility. Criticism and hyperbolic arguments against minorities are not used to criticise behaviours and social structures in a way that would involve fixing them. Watch the new vid for more info
@@emilsinclair4190 I’m not just aware of any time hyperbolic arguments have been an effective means of communicating effective criticism to a dominant class. As vaush said many men have taken it the wrong way. And while I do agree with and see the point being made with the analogy, I think it’s willfully ignorant to not know why so many men are taking it the wrong way, potentially making the division and social tensions between the classes worse.
@@emilsinclair4190if you think 99% of the people screaming about men are actively trying to use this to fight some sort of patriarchal structure and aren’t just going it because they’ve found a socially acceptable group to harass then I have a bridge to sell you.
Hypocrisy pure and simple. The "utility" is just a dumb excuse. These same arguments made against minorities would have a ton of utility for someone with a different political bent.
Because the racists have to invent hypotheticals of "Well what if this white person just happened to be victimized by black people all the time?" Whereas EVERY SINGLE WOMAN has personal experience of being victimized by men. Because the racial statistics are influenced by systemic racism whereas men and women are almost 50/50 distribution in every area.
And because there actually IS an essential difference between males and females or people with more testosterone and more estrogen. Sexual dimorphism exists, racial dimorphism does not. Comparing the difference between sexes to the difference between races kinda implies some deeply racist beliefs or a willful ignorance of biological facts. And no, this has nothing to do with gender ID, this only has to do with cis-men because trans-women and trans-men do not benefit from the cultural and systemic biases towards defending male predators.
Bears are awesome. They're great cooks, fun at parties, good company. They can be bitchy at times, and tend to chase twinks, but otherwise, I'll take a bear every time.
One thing that many people seem to forget: Predators are rarely interested in humans.
A predator always has to evaluate the probability of getting hurt when hunting for food. Because an injured predator is a starving predator. That's the main reason why predators often target very young, very old, or sickly prey if they have the option. But from the perspective of a predator, humans don't provide enough value for the risk.
We go upright which makes us look larger than we actually are, but we also don't have a lot of meat on our bones in comparison. We also tend to get pretty loud which is not the behavior of typical prey. We have eyes in the front, not on the sides of our head which signifies that we are very likely another predator. Even to animals that had no contact with humans, we seem potentially dangerous.
Funnily enough, many large herbivores are more dangerous to humans than any predator.
Some of the best advice I have ever received is to assume good faith until shown malice. I really think all the asocial guys in Vaush's audience should attempt to assume that when women say they hate men, it's not an individual hatred of every man or a call to get rid of men. It is a reflection of the objectively awful and widespread affects of (for lack of a better term) toxic masculinity. Women don't hate you. Women hate that being roofied and harassed and stalked and raped are all legitimate concerns, and that so many men treat them as illegitimate. Just, try to be kind and considerate and not a dickhead. It's the best most people can be.
you literally have a Palestine flag in your bio and you don't understand how this argument can be turned into a far-right one? Replace man with Arab man. That is part of Israeli propaganda. Replace man with Mexican man or Black man and that is GOP propaganda. Replace man with trans-woman and that is the reason conservatives give for banning them from bathrooms or sports.