One thing I'm hoping for is like a mini open top bus parade simulation at the end of a successful season with the cups on display, players dancing, and maybe even a press conference-esque part where your manager model is holding a megaphone with a number of options to choose from what to say
It's always so dangerous to compare graphics to other, similar titles running on the same engine. An engine itself doesn't make the graphics but a lot of people seem to think it does. There's a whole different team working on it that uses different resources, using different mechanics... It'll look way different from Top Eleven or whatever.
I tend to agree. It’s a much bigger team and they can do a lot more. You raise a good point about difference between engine and graphics, but I think the two are so intertwined even if they are separate teams. Animations, lighting and shadows, and more handled by the engine. I do also think looking at what others have managed with the engine; both in terms of football games and otherwise, is useful, as it can set a benchmark for what’s possible.
I'm excited about the new FM game, it felt like we've seen the same game being released for the last 20 years or so, so it's nice with a fresh restart or whatever. :)
Great video! As a software engineer and game dev hobbyist with unity i have a take on this: The Unity side has only been in dev for 3 years(2021) which started with 2 folk. So realistically the game wont have any of this(Maybe 3d stadiums/shadows on field), but the face and full 3D match engine will be a constant work in progress that takes years to polish to the standard we expect these days, we need to expect a more polished spreadsheet manager like FM24 and if we get anything near to nordeous topeleven 3D engine then id be happy...as a start. I want to point out that the team at FM do an outstanding job at consistency so if anything not 100% miles wont push it out, i give them massive applause for that.
Just want it to look some what real, the first incarnations of the 3d engine worked well and somehow looked better than current engine. At some point they made the graphics a bit more cartoony, just want it to go back to being a bit more real. Would also be good if they can incoperate AI or use AI face images for regens.
I've been playing since CM03/04 and I have to say the developers are no pushovers, they're stubborn toward major changes and that kept this game alive for 20 years or so, I don't think we'll see drastic changes in any new FM as it will always be subtle and calculated. Graphics is one area you can expect to see any drastic changes, however Im sure thats a topic of discussion in the SI team for years. Im sure their concern is how they could transition into a nextgen graphics without taking anything away anything from the current ME. But with AI anything is up for grabs. I just know those developers are very careful towards changes, I remebered when they move in the interface slightly the hardcore went MAD and that just triggered the whole skinning community.
They called FM24 the end of an era since the first FM. That indicates they are pretty confident this will be a bit change I think. Announcing it a whole year earlier was a big indication of that. It’ll still be the same game at its core I’m sure; they have a highly addictive game that people for the most part love and is growing year on year (10mil for this years game).
@@SiMaggio I think there was some interview where they said the new game that will be FM25 was meant to be ready in 23/24 so hopefully they've been testing it at least to some degree since then. I know for most players the graphics aren't really an issue, but I think to get new players they'll have to improve that. I'm sort of hoping it will be easier for people to do their own mods like creating custom challenges or something like that (similar to what they used to have before when you could take over a team with a load of injuries or who were bottom at Christmas). I'd love to be able to play seasons/tournaments where it would be like an alternate reality or something and you can play as England and have to try to win an old World Cup or something like that. Not everybody can play for load of seasons so having a little scenario challenge that wouldn't take up weeks and you could play in a few evenings would be great and potentially whoever does the database for it could sell it or get donations for their time
@@SiMaggio I mean I'd just like the graphic fidelity, and better animations. Obviously not the engine and the momentum, ball physics etc. But FM calcutates all that before hand anyway.
Great video, very insightful. I always get slightly worried when a game changes engine, particularly after seeing the latest rendition of FIFA and PES 😂. Really looking forward to see what it looks like though.
Beklediğim ve umduğum şey. Tıpkı fifa, pes futbol oyunlarındaki gibi görünen bir maç motoru ve kendi seçtiğimiz bir oyuncuyu yöneterek oyunun içinde olabilmektir. Umarım fifa da kariyer modunda bir oyuncuyu yönetebildiğimiz gibi. Football manager oyununda da bir oyuncuya hükmedebiliriz. 🎉🎉🎉
I'm a bit concerned that SI might start monetizing their games like EA Sports does. Personally, I find it hard to pay for a subscription month to month for a game. If that happens, I think FM24 could become like PES 6, with the modding community keeping it alive and updated for years to come.
It'll be a big mistake, they just needed to bring in some gifted coders to fix up the graphics side of their current engine, an engine that has been fine-tuned with an extraordinary feel for a long, long time.
@@SiMaggio I would imagine the first version will be porting as much as they can over to the new engine intact - UI stuff in Unity isn't that great and I recall reading they have reworked the UI system, so that should hopefully be smooth. Either way it will be a very interesting release imho
Dots means more can be done with less resources looking better. Genius move to move to unity. Contrary to popular believe unity3d takes less of a cut than unreal and other competitors
Does the unity engine mean they can process leagues more efficiently in game? I turn off most of the graphics and would be happy with fm12 graphics. I just really want a massive database with as many leagues and players loaded while the game is still playable. Or more complex tactics.
They already improved that a lot with fm24. It’s possible they could streamline things further; the game should get quicker and quicker with newer tech anyway.
during opposition corners, if my goalkeeper catches the ball, NEVER ONCE he throws the ball to my wingers to start a counter attack. i think the realism and the details are more important than high end graphics.
I played it- there’s another video on my channel. It’s not really a 3d match engine, it only shows you highlights and they are sort of preset animations as far as I can tell. It also doesn’t do as much behind the scenes.
I've got a strong suspicion that the graphics are going to disappoint and will highlight existing issues with the match engine. But I will buy it anyway...
Seemed an odd move to me, Unity doesn't automatically give you better graphics or performance, FM looks the way it does because of low poly models and low resolution textures, so regardless of the engine everything will have to be re-done from scratch. In any case I'd be more concerned whether they can bring across all the code from the previous games and have it be as stable and fast as previous versions. I assume they will be calling their old C++ code from DLLs (I can't see a way it can all be ported to C# in two years) and then it's case of how quickly and seamlessly they can bring that data into the Unity C# layer to be displayed to the player. They have to be rolling their own UI engine as well because the built-in UI in Unity is not optimized for hundreds of text boxes and controls on a screen. So there's a lot of work to do and get right before the question of whether the 3D engine is going to look significantly better, if the game is laggy and buggy it won't matter if the match looks like FIFA.
I dont believe we need FIFA level graphics. I think just an upgrade to the matrch engine would be great to look a bit more realistic. I watched a video of a match from FM12 and the match engine looked much better. I also think the AI needs a lot of work. Some of the "issues" that players come at you with are a bit stupid. Like signing a 16 year old who gets mad at you for not including him in your CL squad is a bit unrealistic. I have also sometimes found when I'm just playing around with the game and holidaying, the players have lost trust in me due to broken promises or for another reason, I wasnt there mate, I was sunning myself if Greece, take it up with the Ass. Man. Even just a shake up of responses to media, players etc. I've played FM since FM2004 and for the longest time I did EVERY press conference, but over the last 5 years I've not seen any real change to the questions asked, the responses I can give. You cant really create any kind of personality for your manager. You're just this generic robot, dull manager. Let me be a 'Special One' let me be controversial and actually make it have a proper affect on the game and how the media, players, agents interact with me.
The fm12 graphics look better only cause of the pitch lighting I think. When you actually watch the football animations it’s way worse. But yeah lots of little bits to improve
I used to play football manager back in collage days 2015 onward but being a fifa head i couldn’t really get into the game as much as I would of liked - I think football manager could turn a lot of fifa heads because career mode is awful! The money they about to make they might hit a jackpot if the graphic is good! 💰
Depends what your laptop is. They did say the minimum requirements are going up. However- Unity might make it easier to run on weaker but newer devices
I want HUGE graphical changes but then giving people like you the option not to have them turned on. The game has been held back graphically for too long!
pes club manager had the best match engine by far. Player movement, physics, passing, shooting and tackling looked amazing for a mobile game. Konami decided to kill the game to create eFootball... well lets just say it was not a good idea. I would love if fm25 match engine looked and played at least that great. I don't think what will be the case.
The match engine for fm is already doing more than Pes (or fifa) for most things. It’s the graphical representation of it that’s behind. I think it’ll be interesting to see what they come up with
@@SiMaggioSorry for the delay, didn't get a notification. I'm not talking about pes or fifa, pec club manager was it's own game with its own match engine(ME) and graphic representation(GR). I know that FM ME is good. Pes club manager had it own ME and its own GR, different from PES. From what I remember (it's kind of hard to check) ME was good for the mobile game, players could do tricks, bump into each other and even try diving. And GR was the best to this day, I'm sure match engine didn't had player feelings impacting a match and many attributes were not there, but my entire point was about GR and how good it was in a mobile game from 2015, how GR got better from year to year(ME as well), Let's be honest, FM GR was left in the dust, it looks like from a 2005 game. Don't get me wrong I love FM, that's a reason why I'd love to have GM from pes club manager in FM ME. Watch some gameplay from pes club manager, you will understand what I mean.(and remember that matches were quick so treat it as a key highlight). Have a great one.
@@SiMaggio I'm not sure. You don't have direct control so I think it was made for the game. They for sure used normal pes as a reference. But in the end, I'd love for FM to look like that.
@@SiMaggio the rivalry here in Brazil is just to big hahahhah. Anyway, it’s cool to see a jersey from Brazil even if it’s from our rival. São Paulo fan here 💪
As i knew player who has just done his first season since lma 2006 i qas suprised that i could win the leauge with arsenal with no knowledge of the game
who cares how the game looks cos thats not its issue its not FIFA its a Football Management game. The game is broken in so many ways, the attributes of both players and staff are not reflected in performances/style of play etc the games finances are nothing short of a joke the game is just not fun to play and no matter how good it might look, thats what matters.
Something I should be clearer about in the video is the difference between Match Engine and graphics. They are two separate but intertwined parts.
One thing I'm hoping for is like a mini open top bus parade simulation at the end of a successful season with the cups on display, players dancing, and maybe even a press conference-esque part where your manager model is holding a megaphone with a number of options to choose from what to say
It's always so dangerous to compare graphics to other, similar titles running on the same engine. An engine itself doesn't make the graphics but a lot of people seem to think it does. There's a whole different team working on it that uses different resources, using different mechanics... It'll look way different from Top Eleven or whatever.
I tend to agree. It’s a much bigger team and they can do a lot more.
You raise a good point about difference between engine and graphics, but I think the two are so intertwined even if they are separate teams. Animations, lighting and shadows, and more handled by the engine.
I do also think looking at what others have managed with the engine; both in terms of football games and otherwise, is useful, as it can set a benchmark for what’s possible.
I'm excited about the new FM game, it felt like we've seen the same game being released for the last 20 years or so, so it's nice with a fresh restart or whatever. :)
😂😂 temper your expectations my friend it’s only heartache/anger and disappointment with fm
@@Mase1882 haha, I know, I've played thousands of hours every game since 96.
@@RuthlessMetalYTthat’s nothing to be proud of
@@BridgeStamford Being a Chelsea fan is worse.
@@RuthlessMetalYT is it though?
Great video! As a software engineer and game dev hobbyist with unity i have a take on this: The Unity side has only been in dev for 3 years(2021) which started with 2 folk. So realistically the game wont have any of this(Maybe 3d stadiums/shadows on field), but the face and full 3D match engine will be a constant work in progress that takes years to polish to the standard we expect these days, we need to expect a more polished spreadsheet manager like FM24 and if we get anything near to nordeous topeleven 3D engine then id be happy...as a start. I want to point out that the team at FM do an outstanding job at consistency so if anything not 100% miles wont push it out, i give them massive applause for that.
Just want it to look some what real, the first incarnations of the 3d engine worked well and somehow looked better than current engine. At some point they made the graphics a bit more cartoony, just want it to go back to being a bit more real. Would also be good if they can incoperate AI or use AI face images for regens.
Pure nostalgia... as someone that hasnt played fm since 2015... the animations and graphics are 100x better now.
I'd love it if they introduced a fantasy team like they used to do in the lma manager games
I've been playing since CM03/04 and I have to say the developers are no pushovers, they're stubborn toward major changes and that kept this game alive for 20 years or so, I don't think we'll see drastic changes in any new FM as it will always be subtle and calculated.
Graphics is one area you can expect to see any drastic changes, however Im sure thats a topic of discussion in the SI team for years. Im sure their concern is how they could transition into a nextgen graphics without taking anything away anything from the current ME.
But with AI anything is up for grabs. I just know those developers are very careful towards changes, I remebered when they move in the interface slightly the hardcore went MAD and that just triggered the whole skinning community.
They called FM24 the end of an era since the first FM. That indicates they are pretty confident this will be a bit change I think. Announcing it a whole year earlier was a big indication of that.
It’ll still be the same game at its core I’m sure; they have a highly addictive game that people for the most part love and is growing year on year (10mil for this years game).
@@SiMaggio I think there was some interview where they said the new game that will be FM25 was meant to be ready in 23/24 so hopefully they've been testing it at least to some degree since then. I know for most players the graphics aren't really an issue, but I think to get new players they'll have to improve that.
I'm sort of hoping it will be easier for people to do their own mods like creating custom challenges or something like that (similar to what they used to have before when you could take over a team with a load of injuries or who were bottom at Christmas). I'd love to be able to play seasons/tournaments where it would be like an alternate reality or something and you can play as England and have to try to win an old World Cup or something like that. Not everybody can play for load of seasons so having a little scenario challenge that wouldn't take up weeks and you could play in a few evenings would be great and potentially whoever does the database for it could sell it or get donations for their time
@@mauddib1761 yeah it’s in the blog announcement. Even earlier I think (21 or 22).
Yeah I wonder how much this changes the custom db/skinning, etc
03/04 was the last “new” game I think
The dream for me is still, the Fifa/EA FC engine combined with Football Manager. I won't hold my breath though.
i dont think itll be fifa/ea fc. Mainly the FM engine calculates a lot more even if you dont visually see it
@@SiMaggio I mean I'd just like the graphic fidelity, and better animations. Obviously not the engine and the momentum, ball physics etc. But FM calcutates all that before hand anyway.
@esinach Fifa manager used to be a thing on pc... it was really good. Had better graphics than today football manager.
@@hebisty4163 fifa managr isnt footbal manager though
@@hebisty4163 yes but your tasctics had zero effect on games
Great video, very insightful. I always get slightly worried when a game changes engine, particularly after seeing the latest rendition of FIFA and PES 😂. Really looking forward to see what it looks like though.
Very reserved. If they are using a new engine a lot of things can go wrong.
Beklediğim ve umduğum şey.
Tıpkı fifa, pes futbol oyunlarındaki gibi görünen bir maç motoru ve kendi seçtiğimiz bir oyuncuyu yöneterek oyunun içinde olabilmektir.
Umarım fifa da kariyer modunda bir oyuncuyu yönetebildiğimiz gibi.
Football manager oyununda da bir oyuncuya hükmedebiliriz. 🎉🎉🎉
Really good video. I've subscribed!
Thanks
Nice work Si 👏👏
Thanks Stinger. Hoping it’s a good game and we hear more soon.
I'm a bit concerned that SI might start monetizing their games like EA Sports does. Personally, I find it hard to pay for a subscription month to month for a game.
If that happens, I think FM24 could become like PES 6, with the modding community keeping it alive and updated for years to come.
I think Miles confirmed it wont but I cant remember
It'll be a big mistake, they just needed to bring in some gifted coders to fix up the graphics side of their current engine, an engine that has been fine-tuned with an extraordinary feel for a long, long time.
I think we’ll see a complete overhaul tbh. But I’m sure they aren’t starting from scratch
@@SiMaggio I would imagine the first version will be porting as much as they can over to the new engine intact - UI stuff in Unity isn't that great and I recall reading they have reworked the UI system, so that should hopefully be smooth. Either way it will be a very interesting release imho
Dont get carried away. SI will definitely fuck it up. Just look at 24, 23, 22......
24 is good. And I think Covid and this change is why we’ve not seen so much Based on what they’ve said about it I’m certain this will be a big refresh
Dots means more can be done with less resources looking better. Genius move to move to unity. Contrary to popular believe unity3d takes less of a cut than unreal and other competitors
Does the unity engine mean they can process leagues more efficiently in game?
I turn off most of the graphics and would be happy with fm12 graphics. I just really want a massive database with as many leagues and players loaded while the game is still playable.
Or more complex tactics.
I would like to have more tactics added.
They already improved that a lot with fm24. It’s possible they could streamline things further; the game should get quicker and quicker with newer tech anyway.
during opposition corners, if my goalkeeper catches the ball, NEVER ONCE he throws the ball to my wingers to start a counter attack. i think the realism and the details are more important than high end graphics.
Absolutely!
Since Apple's vision pro is also using unity engine, I think future fm will be available in vision pro with AR view. What do you think?
Interesting. Personally I’m not sure they’ll go the AR route - I don’t think there’s enough adoption
Great vid SiMaggio
Cheers NSeaBear - looking forward to new game
Imagine if it was on UE one day...
They certainly had a choice of engines. UE has great graphics but that’s not the focus point of FM.
@@SiMaggio my point wasn't about the graphics. It was more that I hope that the changes will not affect the core quality of FM
@@ivanlimzgI doubt it. Each engine has advantages and disadvantages. Unreal Engine games are rarely FM style games
We are football, an amazing indie football manager game implemented a 3D match engine this year and it is a million times better than FM's
I played it- there’s another video on my channel. It’s not really a 3d match engine, it only shows you highlights and they are sort of preset animations as far as I can tell. It also doesn’t do as much behind the scenes.
I've got a strong suspicion that the graphics are going to disappoint and will highlight existing issues with the match engine.
But I will buy it anyway...
Surely looking for graphics akin to FIFA 09 (15 years ago) isn’t all that out of the question?
Great little vid 🙂
Thanks 😁
Seemed an odd move to me, Unity doesn't automatically give you better graphics or performance, FM looks the way it does because of low poly models and low resolution textures, so regardless of the engine everything will have to be re-done from scratch.
In any case I'd be more concerned whether they can bring across all the code from the previous games and have it be as stable and fast as previous versions. I assume they will be calling their old C++ code from DLLs (I can't see a way it can all be ported to C# in two years) and then it's case of how quickly and seamlessly they can bring that data into the Unity C# layer to be displayed to the player. They have to be rolling their own UI engine as well because the built-in UI in Unity is not optimized for hundreds of text boxes and controls on a screen. So there's a lot of work to do and get right before the question of whether the 3D engine is going to look significantly better, if the game is laggy and buggy it won't matter if the match looks like FIFA.
theyve been bringing it over for a while so should be good
Chill out man, it's never going to look like FIFA.
Great vid! 👏
Glad you enjoyed it
I dont believe we need FIFA level graphics. I think just an upgrade to the matrch engine would be great to look a bit more realistic. I watched a video of a match from FM12 and the match engine looked much better. I also think the AI needs a lot of work. Some of the "issues" that players come at you with are a bit stupid. Like signing a 16 year old who gets mad at you for not including him in your CL squad is a bit unrealistic.
I have also sometimes found when I'm just playing around with the game and holidaying, the players have lost trust in me due to broken promises or for another reason, I wasnt there mate, I was sunning myself if Greece, take it up with the Ass. Man. Even just a shake up of responses to media, players etc. I've played FM since FM2004 and for the longest time I did EVERY press conference, but over the last 5 years I've not seen any real change to the questions asked, the responses I can give. You cant really create any kind of personality for your manager. You're just this generic robot, dull manager. Let me be a 'Special One' let me be controversial and actually make it have a proper affect on the game and how the media, players, agents interact with me.
The fm12 graphics look better only cause of the pitch lighting I think. When you actually watch the football animations it’s way worse.
But yeah lots of little bits to improve
I used to play football manager back in collage days 2015 onward but being a fifa head i couldn’t really get into the game as much as I would of liked - I think football manager could turn a lot of fifa heads because career mode is awful! The money they about to make they might hit a jackpot if the graphic is good! 💰
I think its a different kind of game. If it can tap into the football itch sure - but somtimes you want to play as the team
I just want a game that can play on a laptop easy, cause i travel alot, hopefully not too many graphical changes.
Depends what your laptop is. They did say the minimum requirements are going up. However- Unity might make it easier to run on weaker but newer devices
I want HUGE graphical changes but then giving people like you the option not to have them turned on. The game has been held back graphically for too long!
the fact that we haven't seen nothing , in my opinion isn 't a good thing...
Last year it was around this time and it was early. Normally it’s later in the year (2022 was Sep)
pes club manager had the best match engine by far. Player movement, physics, passing, shooting and tackling looked amazing for a mobile game. Konami decided to kill the game to create eFootball... well lets just say it was not a good idea. I would love if fm25 match engine looked and played at least that great. I don't think what will be the case.
The match engine for fm is already doing more than Pes (or fifa) for most things. It’s the graphical representation of it that’s behind. I think it’ll be interesting to see what they come up with
@@SiMaggioSorry for the delay, didn't get a notification. I'm not talking about pes or fifa, pec club manager was it's own game with its own match engine(ME) and graphic representation(GR). I know that FM ME is good. Pes club manager had it own ME and its own GR, different from PES. From what I remember (it's kind of hard to check) ME was good for the mobile game, players could do tricks, bump into each other and even try diving. And GR was the best to this day, I'm sure match engine didn't had player feelings impacting a match and many attributes were not there, but my entire point was about GR and how good it was in a mobile game from 2015, how GR got better from year to year(ME as well), Let's be honest, FM GR was left in the dust, it looks like from a 2005 game. Don't get me wrong I love FM, that's a reason why I'd love to have GM from pes club manager in FM ME. Watch some gameplay from pes club manager, you will understand what I mean.(and remember that matches were quick so treat it as a key highlight). Have a great one.
@@botjoe1048 I’ll check it out. I’d assumed it did the fifa thing and just ported over the in game match engine with a few tweaks
@@SiMaggio I'm not sure. You don't have direct control so I think it was made for the game. They for sure used normal pes as a reference. But in the end, I'd love for FM to look like that.
Great video. Why using Palmeiras T-Shirt tho? 😠😠
Haha sorry. I have a collection of different teams. Which team should it be?
@@SiMaggio the rivalry here in Brazil is just to big hahahhah. Anyway, it’s cool to see a jersey from Brazil even if it’s from our rival. São Paulo fan here 💪
@@ericgroppe2095 i dont have a Sao Paulo one yet. That'll have to be next!
As i knew player who has just done his first season since lma 2006 i qas suprised that i could win the leauge with arsenal with no knowledge of the game
Yeah it’s not too difficult if you’ve played football management games before
who cares how the game looks cos thats not its issue its not FIFA its a Football Management game. The game is broken in so many ways, the attributes of both players and staff are not reflected in performances/style of play etc the games finances are nothing short of a joke the game is just not fun to play and no matter how good it might look, thats what matters.
it needs a massive upgrade, the game has become tired
There's purchased items on console fm24 so it'll sneak into pc
its stuff you can do in the editor though
Why's a girl on the thumbnail
That’s the woman from the Ziva tech demo. And women’s football will be in FM25. Looking forward to it