Hey guys I tried to keep this one pretty simple didn't want to make a 3 hour video on something that doesn't really need to be that long. Discussed some basics about how the ECM works hopefully you find it helpful. Keep in mind it doesn't seem to be fully implemented in early access just yet, as the light indicators don't appear to be connected to the ECM knob.
If anyone wants a bit of background on ECM, there's a declassified US Navy video on defensive ECM on the RUclips channel AIRBOYD. Granted, the modern methods will be more sophisticated, but it does cover general principles.
Pimpaho thanks man I can't complain about the channels growth I never thought I'd have this many subs anyway. That being said it's nice when people like u realize exactly how much work goes into the things. Thanks for ur support man it's always appreciated.
You should change the title a bit to reflect the inclusion of the ECM overview you give after the Hornet tutorial (so no one misses it). Really good work here, man, thanks.
lots of effort here and research as usual, very great and simple explanation ! i like it ! cheers ,more more more tutorial please !!! From Canada east coast !
Quantum RADAR and modern frequency-changing and timing-changing RADARs make a lot of this obsolete. I forget the actual name for it, but RADARs can now alter their frequencies and the timing between pulses to be able to discard the false-positives (the first signal returned is the correct one, as any more-distant signals must be repeated due to the timing delay between the jammer receiving the RADAR pulse and the emitter mimicing it), and quantum RADAR is even better at weeding out the junk (though it's still in early stages, but China reportedly has a quantum RADAR with a range of 60 or so miles).
I can't seem to get my ECM working. No lights...still? Is there any task that needs to be performed before putting ECM into STNBY mode to initiate the 4 minute warm? Is there anything to confirm my ECM is in fact functioning within normal operating parameters without some visual cue(s)? Thanks for the vids and any help!
I hope ECM will help with AIM-54s, since chaffs are not very effective. Or maybe jam Tomcat radar enough to delay detection and firing the first Phoenix. For now, Phoenix missiles are overpowered and have amazing turning ability even at 3000 kph.
Is XMIT mode "silent", when its not jamming.? I just mean does it matter if I keep it on, is there a difference what comes to enemy seeing me if its on rec or xmit? So basically: can i fly xmit on.
The ECM lnow how the Radar beacon is seeing your aircraft and know exactly what is going to be transmited back, then it send calculeted false data back with the radar beacon that is aiming at you basicaly an RWR Integrated with a radar to perceive analyze and trick enemy radar
The false returns that are off your azimuth only occur by returning those blips to a rotating dish ... and by your false returnings arriving when it's scanning in another direction. A radar which focuses directly at a target isn't going to be fooled this way.
I'd imagine the falsifying of position has mostly to do with firing EM waves that are tuned to the Radar's outgoing signal in a modulation that makes the Radar receive false information in its own native signal. to clarify, imagine you are somebody in a cave hiding from a predator. This predator wants to find you by using the echoes it makes in the cave bounce off you and into it's ears. This ECM is basically you mimicking these sounds but with changes that, when heard by the predator, sound like it is coming from somewhere else in the cave.
my theory stems from experience as a Broadband spec who has to understand how signals work to make sure everyone gets their internet and tv service. It is a pretty interesting job as every problem is different and so is the environment surrounding the issues I deal with. fun fact, If you have a cable provider and they have a chewed up line on the poles, a simple short circuit of a television can output strong enough RF signal to completely jam ATC communications and Emergency Response frequencies when it is backfed through the taps and transformers as upstream. This was learned the hard way when a plane was crashed due to complete communication failure and an exposed cable line on a utility pole.
CaptainConcerned Sr. That's actually very interesting I never would have guessed that. Cool little fact there. Amazing how we live day to day not knowing the smallest thing can have such huge implications
CaptainConcerned Sr. I think the problem is that the radar wave modulation can only make the aircraft seem further away and the enemy plane still recieves 2 signals. One reflected from the plane, one from the ecm. The eurofighter can tow such an emitter behind it to also give away a false direction
I'm hearing conflicting things now. Another video here said XMIT always turns the "music on" and recv will receeive and turn on automatically when it has threats. I'm confused now.
razorseal having the ECM always "on" has major disadvantages such that it gives away ur position. Or even allows homing missiles to be fired at you. U never want to just leave it on. The ideal way to use ECM is to have it activate when there is a threat. This is why the xmit function will only really transmit if there is a threat. Otherwise it's technically in standby (sort of). This whole process is controlled automatically in the hornet. So my guess is that whatever video u saw that in, the guy was confused about the functionality of the ECM.
ur welcome, and I can't comment on how the light works because like I said I haven't seen it yet. it may stay on just to let u know its in that mode. I don't know were going to have to wait and find out when its fully implemented.
I wish ECM was as detailed as Falcon BMS. I know that the DCS implementation is trying to do alot, use publicly available info, be balanced, be realistic etc but DCS aircraft really lack in realistic IFF and ECM
@Jimmy De'Souza the ECM/RWR/IFF in DCS pretty much use a very simplified version. You basically only have mode 4 interrogation, but no implementation of modes 1,2 or other types of mode 3. It's basically magic where in real life and Falcon BMS there is variability in the system and they aren't perfectly reliable. RWR for example is based on radar strength essentially, as well as other factors which the computer uses to determine threat level. In BMS it's not nearly as reliable as I'm DCS, in DCS the second a missile goes pitbull you can expect a lock warning, not necessarily so in BMS. Direction is also less precise in BMS. ECM in BMS works against player aircraft, and significantly impacts ranging of a target, where as in DCS not only does it not work player to player, the FC3 implementation between AC is basically the same no matter what airframe you fly. It's a very detailed topic tbh
Thanks, what flight stick do you recommend. I bought a thrust master, but it looks like they sent me the wrong one (PS4). So, I’m going to buy a new one.
AAA= Anti-aircraft Artillery. Any ground based vehicle or platform that uses shells to bring down aircraft. Systems like the ZSU-23/4, 2S6 Tunguska, PGZ95, are SPAAG. But also the ZPU which is a towed fix position artillery piece. Hope that clarifies.
It's nice to watch this old GS video and see how much he has improved. All well deserved!
indeed
Hey guys I tried to keep this one pretty simple didn't want to make a 3 hour video on something that doesn't really need to be that long. Discussed some basics about how the ECM works hopefully you find it helpful. Keep in mind it doesn't seem to be fully implemented in early access just yet, as the light indicators don't appear to be connected to the ECM knob.
Big explanation help on ECM and whit nice basic system. Thanks.
I want a 3 hour video pls.
Cool ... but please also do a 1 hour version where you go into depth.
A nice basic overview od the ECM system to give us some familiarity with the system and its concepts. Thanks GS!
ur very welcome zack i'm glad you enjoyed it.
If anyone wants a bit of background on ECM, there's a declassified US Navy video on defensive ECM on the RUclips channel AIRBOYD. Granted, the modern methods will be more sophisticated, but it does cover general principles.
Oh wow, I learned so much in 31 minutes here thank you. Excellent as always.
You really do deserve more subs for the work you put in. Great Video!
Pimpaho thanks man I can't complain about the channels growth I never thought I'd have this many subs anyway. That being said it's nice when people like u realize exactly how much work goes into the things. Thanks for ur support man it's always appreciated.
Excellent, informative laid out well what we will see in the future as it develops, interesting to know what the SAM radar is seeing. Thank you
Another great one. Very interesting . Please keep em coming, thanks from Amsterdam.
Thank you Hans, glad you enjoyed it.
You should change the title a bit to reflect the inclusion of the ECM overview you give after the Hornet tutorial (so no one misses it). Really good work here, man, thanks.
Thanks for your tutorials mate ! They're the best ones out there, keep up a good work, I really, really appreciate it |
thanks a lot, I really appreciate that feedback. very kind
lots of effort here and research as usual, very great and simple explanation ! i like it ! cheers ,more more more tutorial please !!! From Canada east coast !
thanks so much im glad you enjoyed it. thanks for the support I'll try to keep putting out more decent tutorials.
Thanks for this useful introduction of ECM System :)
You make fantastic videos. Thank you!!
Thank u I'm glad u enjoyed it
Great explanation! Thank you for nice video :)
Thank you I'm happy you liked it.
Great channel dude !
This is an extremely helpful to us noob's to DCS. Thanks.
Awesome. Thanks for the explanation!
I'm using your vids to teach my friends. Just wanted to let you know first.
Perfectly ok with me brother. the more sharing the better.
I didn't relazine how dangerous and good u are in the hornet keep playing want to see more flying
Superb explanation
great video
Great job!! Thanks
Super explain Thank you
Thanks!
Quantum RADAR and modern frequency-changing and timing-changing RADARs make a lot of this obsolete. I forget the actual name for it, but RADARs can now alter their frequencies and the timing between pulses to be able to discard the false-positives (the first signal returned is the correct one, as any more-distant signals must be repeated due to the timing delay between the jammer receiving the RADAR pulse and the emitter mimicing it), and quantum RADAR is even better at weeding out the junk (though it's still in early stages, but China reportedly has a quantum RADAR with a range of 60 or so miles).
AAA doesn't just refer to vehicles like the Shilka. Systems like the Phalanx, I believe, are included now under that umbrella term.
thnks buddy
good dcs
Is there ever any downside to have it on ? or should i just always have it on ?
what about that red dispenser button on the left side cockpit wall? can we program that one too?
Thanks.
I can't seem to get my ECM working. No lights...still? Is there any task that needs to be performed before putting ECM into STNBY mode to initiate the 4 minute warm? Is there anything to confirm my ECM is in fact functioning within normal operating parameters without some visual cue(s)? Thanks for the vids and any help!
do you have to put it in stby first? and the bit test? or can you just slam it to xmit?
Is ECM implemented into the Hornet in DCS today? Whats the status on that?
I now this is an old post, but does your own planes radar work while you are jamming? I.E. can you lock onto an enemy target BVR?
Is there an on button for this? If so, where is it? Just turning the knob from stby, to bit to, Rec, to xmit doesn’t seem to work?
I hope ECM will help with AIM-54s, since chaffs are not very effective. Or maybe jam Tomcat radar enough to delay detection and firing the first Phoenix. For now, Phoenix missiles are overpowered and have amazing turning ability even at 3000 kph.
Is XMIT mode "silent", when its not jamming.? I just mean does it matter if I keep it on, is there a difference what comes to enemy seeing me if its on rec or xmit? So basically: can i fly xmit on.
The ECM lnow how the Radar beacon is seeing your aircraft and know exactly what is going to be transmited back, then it send calculeted false data back with the radar beacon that is aiming at you basicaly an RWR Integrated with a radar to perceive analyze and trick enemy radar
What is the keyboard command to turn the ecm knob? Great video, thumbs up!
thanks, I don't think there is one, you'll have to bind it yourself
Growling Sidewinder true, but I can't find the ecm knob to bind a command to it?
The false returns that are off your azimuth only occur by returning those blips to a rotating dish
... and by your false returnings arriving when it's scanning in another direction.
A radar which focuses directly at a target isn't going to be fooled this way.
That's an F/A-18D in your cover photo;) Juz say'n;)
Did you ever make that 3 hour video fam
I'd imagine the falsifying of position has mostly to do with firing EM waves that are tuned to the Radar's outgoing signal in a modulation that makes the Radar receive false information in its own native signal.
to clarify, imagine you are somebody in a cave hiding from a predator. This predator wants to find you by using the echoes it makes in the cave bounce off you and into it's ears. This ECM is basically you mimicking these sounds but with changes that, when heard by the predator, sound like it is coming from somewhere else in the cave.
CaptainConcerned Sr. It's a solid guess. And ur guess is as good as mine. I have no idea how that functionality of the ECM works. Good theory tho
my theory stems from experience as a Broadband spec who has to understand how signals work to make sure everyone gets their internet and tv service. It is a pretty interesting job as every problem is different and so is the environment surrounding the issues I deal with. fun fact, If you have a cable provider and they have a chewed up line on the poles, a simple short circuit of a television can output strong enough RF signal to completely jam ATC communications and Emergency Response frequencies when it is backfed through the taps and transformers as upstream. This was learned the hard way when a plane was crashed due to complete communication failure and an exposed cable line on a utility pole.
CaptainConcerned Sr. That's actually very interesting I never would have guessed that. Cool little fact there. Amazing how we live day to day not knowing the smallest thing can have such huge implications
CaptainConcerned Sr. I think the problem is that the radar wave modulation can only make the aircraft seem further away and the enemy plane still recieves 2 signals. One reflected from the plane, one from the ecm. The eurofighter can tow such an emitter behind it to also give away a false direction
How do you get incremental zoom like that? I've tried everything, but I can only get zoom on an axis, and I hate that :P
Remove your zoom axis you made.
"Zoom in/out slow" command keybind to whatever you like.
I'm hearing conflicting things now. Another video here said XMIT always turns the "music on" and recv will receeive and turn on automatically when it has threats. I'm confused now.
razorseal having the ECM always "on" has major disadvantages such that it gives away ur position. Or even allows homing missiles to be fired at you. U never want to just leave it on. The ideal way to use ECM is to have it activate when there is a threat. This is why the xmit function will only really transmit if there is a threat. Otherwise it's technically in standby (sort of). This whole process is controlled automatically in the hornet. So my guess is that whatever video u saw that in, the guy was confused about the functionality of the ECM.
Thanks! so xmit is automatic. got it! I would think the xmit light would come on only when it's actually actively transmitting?
ur welcome, and I can't comment on how the light works because like I said I haven't seen it yet. it may stay on just to let u know its in that mode. I don't know were going to have to wait and find out when its fully implemented.
I wish ECM was as detailed as Falcon BMS. I know that the DCS implementation is trying to do alot, use publicly available info, be balanced, be realistic etc but DCS aircraft really lack in realistic IFF and ECM
@Jimmy De'Souza the ECM/RWR/IFF in DCS pretty much use a very simplified version. You basically only have mode 4 interrogation, but no implementation of modes 1,2 or other types of mode 3. It's basically magic where in real life and Falcon BMS there is variability in the system and they aren't perfectly reliable. RWR for example is based on radar strength essentially, as well as other factors which the computer uses to determine threat level. In BMS it's not nearly as reliable as I'm DCS, in DCS the second a missile goes pitbull you can expect a lock warning, not necessarily so in BMS. Direction is also less precise in BMS. ECM in BMS works against player aircraft, and significantly impacts ranging of a target, where as in DCS not only does it not work player to player, the FC3 implementation between AC is basically the same no matter what airframe you fly. It's a very detailed topic tbh
Are the lights now in 2020 working correctly?
Flo D lol yes
I can't even get the standby light to come on once I set the knob to that positon.
yeah it's not implemented yet....I'm not sure why this video is here
👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍🌺🌺🌺🌺🌺🌺
When i set the ecm to standby, nothing happens (no standby light or anything). What am i doing wrong?
Meister General I don't think the lights are connected to the ECM yet. It's still in early access and I don't think they've gotten to that just yet.
But are the jamming capabilities already implemented? I haven't really noticed any difference between XMIT and OFF so far.
Interceptor
What simulator is this?
digital combat simulator
Thanks, what flight stick do you recommend. I bought a thrust master, but it looks like they sent me the wrong one (PS4). So, I’m going to buy a new one.
AAA= Anti-aircraft Artillery. Any ground based vehicle or platform that uses shells to bring down aircraft. Systems like the ZSU-23/4, 2S6 Tunguska, PGZ95, are SPAAG. But also the ZPU which is a towed fix position artillery piece. Hope that clarifies.