The Definitive Elder Dragon Power Tier List | Monster Hunter
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- Опубликовано: 1 окт 2024
- This is not actually definitive and represents my thoughts.
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How to train your dragon encyclopedia
move up Vaal to ecological disaster and my diarrhoea will stop
Truly, goated.
where would you rank primordial malzeno
Only disagreement is on Blackveil Vaal Hazak's placement. My man fuels an entire ecosystem, and by merely existing in a place would eventually turn it into a similar environment. You can see this with the infected wildlife wherever he goes, having just barely started reaching into the ancient forest. He may jot have the size, but he certainly has the environmental factor to at least crack fort destroyer tier
I also believe Nakarkos should be at least Fort Destroyer as well.
“Nakarkos are gluttons that can eat a whole ecosystem if left unchecked. Due to Nakarkos having huge appetites, they can easily wipe out all life in surrounding areas. Nakarkos have even been reported shooting down airships for food. Though Nakarkos can destroy an ecosystem, it doesn't actually want to do that. It prefers to leave its nest in search of prey so, it still have plenty of food at the environment it is living within. This affects those ecosystems greatly on a destructive level, making it harder for species to thrive in said areas, leaving very few creatures to survive. If the Hunter's Guild finds a Nakarkos' lair, they will immediately send hunters to repel it before it can bring further damage to that ecosystem. However, it is said that Nakarkos will eventually return to said area in order to feed themselves further.”
Vaal leaves his house to break a Fort:
*Knock knock
Who's there? We are waiting for a Shen Gaoren, is that you?
*See the Vaal breathless without his effluvium
They laugh
Vaal laugh with asma, then he goes back home.
@@L3Z1K Normal Vaal sure. Black Veil is specifically able to just take that shit with him and make it as he goes along
@@RageMagikarp Does effluvium affect walls?
@@L3Z1K Are they made of wood like Astera and Seliana? Then yes.
Are the walls in an environment that under rapid changes due to effluvium would cause those walls to break? Then also yes.
One thing to mention is that Chameleos and Namielle aren't exactly "weak", they're just non-hostile to the hunter and most other creatures. It's implied that because Chameleos is an insectivore (and a trickster by nature) and that Namielle naturally lives in the sea, they don't really see a reason to cause trouble, so they don't.
If they actually wanted to cause more havoc, they absolutely could do.
Same goes for Kirin and Vaal Hazak.
I mean, Vaal can literally enslave a whole ecosystem by just walking around, it doesn't need to fight or hunt, the food just comes to it.
@Grey The Skeleton I actually do think Vaal is a true elder, while it's not physically a powerful or threatening hunt, it's effluvium makes it a threat in-lore. Its only fine because its exclusively in the vale. If it went anywhere else itd be catastrophic.
And Blackveil Vaal Hazak is imo, really at the bottom of ecological disaster. Spreading effluvium fungus to a place that isn't adapted to it like the rotten vale is catastrophic for an ecosystem. We saw this when it ducked up the ancient forest
Bro a chameleos made a village of people disappear
*4U flashback*
@@joshuamu9273A mild amount of tomfoolery
Honestly surprised Val isn't ranked higher, not for pure physical attribute but the fact that the effluvium can potentially change entire ecosystems so long as the black veil is present
It''s the king of its own kingdom, but It is not a big threat. If It goes in another ad territory it would just be cast away or win a 50/50 fight, I guess it can kill a Kirin thou... Nergy or higher on that list will just toy with It.
@@L3Z1K depends where it goes imo. More humid environments it's a potential catastrophe due to ample conditions for effluvium spreading. Arid or cold would greatly hinder it. Any "neutral" elder save for nergi who is specialized to kill elders is likewise at a disadvantage due to lack of element to ward off or dispel the effluvium. So I guess TLDR context of the pair up is key as is the environment
@@metroid1859 I mean the heat of teostra would just make any place dry the least if not schorch...Velkhana could do the same with Ice...It could work on a Chameleos, I can give you...An ironmade Daora? Maybe...But I don't really see It above that list...I'm sure you've got your reasons thou and I don't wanna start a "who's stronger than who", because almost any of these guys will be slain by a random dude, whatever the the threat they pose xD
@@L3Z1K ha true. Generally I place large scale environment changers higher whenever I rank monsters personally so it surprised me a little val was so low given it completely changes the forests environment when veil appears in it.
Right? It could literally spread disease everywhere, right?
Despite not being an Elder, Plesioth should be a World Breaker rank.
Hyperspace Tackle moment
straight facts, that hip check is reality breaking.
Evasion skill up
Breaker of universes
Bruh I just got hit by a hip check I dodged 3 years ago
Makes sense that Safi was in world breaker tier. I mean if Alatreon, A BLACK DRAGON, felt threatened enough to burn and completely destroy the nest so that another one couldn’t be born even after the original’s death, then that says something about its power.
Safi'Jiva itself is a Dangerous First Class Monster, AKA Black Dragon.
Also, I thought Alatreon went to the Secluded Valley to fight Safi'Jiva, not to burn his nest. (Or at least that's what I remember the databook saying)
@@randomblackgaming4609 while yeah its one shot could be in a class of black dragon pretty sure capcom never openly said in anyway it was a black dragon tier monster for all we know a fight between him and alatreon would be like a case of rajang vs every elder dragon it's battled in iceborne plus the game npcs constantly refers safi as the red dragon when not using its given name
@@Darkwarp1994 While it was never explicitly stated, Safi Jiiva could be up there since not only did Alatreon arrive to fight it and destroy the other cocoons, but Fatalis did appear because of Safi.
The Iceborne Deep Dive book I believe is what stated this along with Safi being designed as a counterpart or rival to Fatalis.
@@Darkwarp1994 it's officially classified as a Dangerous First Class Monster, wich is the official name for Black Dragons ("Black Dragon" is a fanmade name). So, it's a Black Dragón.
Said by the Devs themselves, Safi was created to be an equal to fatalis, that's why it have a based central color, the red dragon.
Capcom you have absolutely no idea how much id pay to see a ful grown safi interact with a Fatalis....im 100% serious
Y'All wanna see this to
Certainly would be a spectacle
That would be definitely the greatest battle in mh history
Oh yeah , they are pretty close in strengh and power lorewise , close battle for sure
you mean Safi'Jiva itself?
@@timesnewramen4861 yeah I thought the safis we fight are the fully grown monster given how xeno jivia is the baby form
Amatsu, Nakarkos, Narwa and Ibushi not being classified as "ecological disaster" seems really weird
Right? Considering they're accompanied with cataclysmic storms like hurricanes and lightning galore simply for showing up.
Nakarkos literally caused an ecological disaster in its story by just eating everything. And remember they are native to the ocean trenches not land, so how is one coming to land to build a wyvern's end den not enough to rank it higher.
Yeah, their endless storms are the definition of an ecological disaster
Yeah but narwa and ibushi look weird
@@Timothy1717what does that have to do with anything
Considering how Blackviel is basically a conduit of Effluvium, rapidly infecting the area and creatures around it to make a habitat suitable for its needs, I very much question its placement in anything lower than Fort Destroyer, or even Ecological Disaster.
Looking at how the Rotten Vale is entirely sustained by Vaal Hazak’s existence, I’d argue that he’d be an Ecological Disaster.
@@makesthemusic6340 you just contradicted yourself.
vaal being able to form and maintain a grim environment mostly by itself is good enough for me for an ecological disaster tier. it's not destructive per se, but it most certainly has a large scale impact on biodiversity
Nakarkos can shatter a mountain with the initial impact of it's Lazer (not even the full seven seconds, just the initial impact was needed for shattering the mountain)
Along with that, he has eaten enough animals, to build a full blown island out of their bones
I'd say that should at least be enough to bring him up to "fort destroyer" if not "Ecological Disaster"
Yup, in lore they're supposed to have huge appetite, but not only that, they hunt excessive amounts of preys to conserve them in their fluids, they are worse than deviljhos
I agree that he should be higher but also below Ceadeus, who hunt and eat Nakarkos
@@pope4510 theres official art showing narkarkos pinning doen a ceadus pup
@@pope4510
You could totally make a case for that, or even Ceadeus being higher tier than Nakarkos, due to their whole predator/prey relationship.
But I need people to remember just how big Ceadeus is, when we talk about how Nakarkos gets eaten. Ceadeus is big enough, to quite literally able to chomp an abyssal lagi in half. Ceadeus can chomp off a quarter of Nakarkos's entire mantle, and depending on where that chomp lands, it could mean instant death, or crippled for life.
Also, Nakarkos has shown good evidence of being stronger on land, rather than in the water.
Same for Dahren Mohren, Jhen Mohren, Amatsu and Ceadeus then because all of them can destroy mountains aswell
If there's one i need to disagree with you put Nakarkos far too low, it's at least in the ecological disaster tier with the environmental destruction it's told and shown (by the corpses in wyvern's end) to have. The hyper beam is also capable of punching through a ludicrous amount of solid rock almost instantaneously during the death animation.
His entire tier list is bullshit.
I think environmental destruction in this case means more like capacity to destroy rather than kill. I think most elder dragons would be capable of destroying an ecosystem if they had reason to, but they generally don’t whereas Nakarkos does because of its massive appetite.
Nakarkos to me seems physically weak for its size, but again it does have size on its side as well as being dexterous with its tentacles.
The most damage I can see it causing is with its laser, but keep in mind the final hyper laser was too powerful for the Nakarkos to handle and was likely the cause of its death. So that final laser may not be the normal power output. Regardless, it’s still a very strong creature and I wouldn’t find it weird if it was moved up a level on the list. A big reason I think it wasn’t is that Nakarkos are hunted by adult Ceadeus, which effectively places them lower power-wise. Maybe it’s just a bad match up, but I don’t think Ceadeus hard counters him in the same way Rajang does to Kirin.
@@joshlewis8860
but Nakarkos is objectively not physically weak for it's size.
First of all, he has the same case as kulve taroth, by wearing heavy armor that should impair his movement, but it doesn't at all. In fact even with it, he is one of the fastest (if not the fastest) monster of his size caliper.
And then there was the official art peice of him pinning down a Ceadeus pup that was three times his size, (and it being a pup, Nakarkos probably won that fight).
Both of those provide plenty of evidence of his physical strength. But even if he was physically weak for his size, his death star Lazer immediately placed him in the top 5 strongest non black dragons.
That Lazer, shattered a mountain like a pane of glass, with merely the initial impact (the Lazer normally lasts for several seconds). It doesn't matter if his dying breath was stronger than his normal death star Lazer, it still means that with one attack, he can crumble a mountain. and the only other monsters that are capable of destroying a mountain, are in the top of 'ecological disaster' tier or in 'world breaker' tier.
Also, I believe many people forgot how absolutely massive Ceadeus is. His jaws are large enough, and strong enough to cut an abyssal lagi in half. A well placed bite could take out a quarter of Nakarkos's entire mantle. And depending on where the bite lands, it could leave our favorite cuttlefish immobile, crippled for life, or instantly dead.
@@jonah_the_Nakarkos_admirer true, he and Amatsu should be up there at Ecological Disaster. Amatsu’s storm displaced an entire pack of Zinogres, an APEX and its water beam could create earthquakes.
@@jonah_the_Nakarkos_admirer based name and based take
I'd say that Ruiner is remarkably intelligent rather than immortal. Between the fact that it slowly becomes more and more aggressive as it loses health, and the way it ambushed Shara after we "killed" it.
Ruiner is nigh-immortal
He has instantaneous regeneration and his spikes grow stronger the more he fights.
I've heard a few people make the comparison that "Ruiner can't be killed unless it dies." Most wild animals don't have drawn out fights, and either burst opponents down or de-escalate immediately (think like a cat fight). That said, most things that would fight Nergi probably aren't capable of a. Keeping a fight going for 20-30 minutes like Hunters can, or b. Capable of up front calamitous damage like the high elders are. So unless a monster can make it retreat immediately or one-shot it, it's probably not a winning scenario for that monster.
Funny thing I’ve read about Nergi: its spikes are its reproductive organ. They detach, absorb some of the energy in their surrounding, and grow up to be other Nergis
@@degeneratewithasideoftidep6795 I think the art book specifies its horns
Doesent Savage Deviljho also become more and More Agressive as fight goes on. Is he intelicent?
If Amatsu's hurricanes surpass any natural one is insane it's heavily underestimated, the hurricanes would probably affect nations just by existing and these can be more intense by it getting mad. And Amatsu is constantly in these nonchalantly, and Amatsu rarely has any scars or injures since it's body is so tough just living in these hurricanes. And when Amatsu is chose to be Sunbreak's Final Boss already tells us how terrifying this elder is
Could you imagine what insane weather conditions if both a alatreon and amatsu were around but not close enough to notice each other that would be a hurricane of armageddon proportions 😂
Reason I say that is cause alatreon mere presence destabilize weather and the environment around him which is why he tends to live in volcanos most of the time so my first reply is more of a what if thing
Amatsu's wind probably surpasses Kushala Daora's and it's not even a Wind Dragon.
@@timesnewramen4861 yeah won't deny that amatsu is stronger then kushala in wind power but kushala is no slouch when it comes to his wind barrier and his tornados and they turn black and get a bit stronger when he enraged and well I think we can both agree it went nuts with risen kushala when in the risen state with those black and gold wind abilities of his
Vaal and Namielle are WITHOUT A DOUBT true elders
Exactly🙌
I feel like nakarkos could be a fort destroyer maybe ecological disaster
Vaal is Ecological disaster imo
I could maybe understand vaal for the squishy frame and sluggishness, but how is namielle any different than kushala and teostra?
Vaal is a case where the threat depends on perspective, easily ruining a ecosystem but not being very destructive
@@joshwright520 You could even argue that an airborne miasma is more dangerous than brute force. First sign of a Lao: you see it. First sign of a Vaal: population gets sick.
Funny thing about Safi;
The game devs have a few paragraphs of game lore on a data book. (I’ll send the link if people ask for it as I’m pretty sure comments with links get auto deleted now. )
That pretty much confirms Safi=Fatalis
Since Safi is the new gen world class terror, they wanted him to be an equal to Fatalis.
He was originall going to be black as well, but they decided a new gen deserved a new color; red
Both Safi and Fatalis are considered beyond human intelligence
Both Fatalis and Safi are considered the pinnacle of life; and what essentially every being strives to evolve into as both are technically immortal in their own ways.
The only thing is change about this list is to put ‘eater of elders’ either below or above ecological disaster considering it was confirmed by the EXACT same guide that Nerg>Shara and he would’ve killed Shara had the hunters not intervened. Meaning that while Nerg doesn’t really cause that kind if destruction; he can take on that kind of calamity and come out on top.
i mean, considering safi canonically took 16 of the best hunters to kill it, it makes sense
Also do we know how old the Safi we fought is? Because we don’t really know its growth rate to properly assess how strong it could be if its already strong enough to incite fear in Alatreon
Then why do we fight Safi Canonicly Before Alatreon?
@@draw2death421
It was stated that Alatreon awoke because of the Energy Safi’Jiva gave off; but the hunters (you) killed Safi *before* Alatreon could reach the guiding lands. It’s also stated Alatreon burns Safi’s roost in order to prevent the chance of another from growing again; where Alatreon then encounters the hunter (unfortunately for him) and is slain as well. (Edit; Alatreon was intending to fight Safi
The large fluctuations of bio energy (two first/world class Monster appearing and disappearing rapidly) in turn awoke Fatalis. Whom is also slain by the hunter.
Safi is obviously inspired from Fatalis you can literally see it, from the design to the fight and to the gears.
I may not have grown up with these games but they introduced me to friends who saved my life. I have never had such a magical experience as playing through Iceborne blind, together, and seeing all of the newly introduced monsters. Since then I've played several previous entries and fell in love with the elders- namely Amatsu and Dalamadur. But nothing will ever compare to seeing Safi'Jiiva release a drop of Sapphire of the Emperor for the first time.
Congrats on making such friends and enjoying such experiences.
Your gonna love the sun break finale
Aren't all Elder Dragons supposed to be Ecological Disasters by nature?
I thought that was their whole thing.
You can definitely see this with the Elder Dragons we have in MH: World
The sheer presence of these monsters alters the sky in the map. Especially noticable with Teostra/Lunastra in the desert where you can see that the whole air is burning and Kirin just being *in* the Coral Highlands transforms the area into a permanent thunderstorm in the sky. And it's not actively doing that either.
Vaal Hazak also fuels the entire Rotten Vale through it's presence. It's so deadly that it can kill/control creatures just through the spores it emits. If you fight Blackveil VH in the Ancient Forest, it canonically just emerged/arrived there yet the monsters already start to behave unnatural
Yeah
If I remember right I think Elder Dragons are monsters that don't really fit into the base classifications. I think that's why Kirin is considered one despite being comparably weaker to most of the others.
@@broly829The kirin still is what comes to mind as an Elder as there is an immediate shift of the elements when it arrive. While it might appear weak the Kirin is blindingly swift - some say it even teleports potentially, but we don't know as Kirin sightings are canonically rare AF even for Elders.
Kirin ain't a fort destroying monster, but by God it can smite a heretic.
@@RyoIsamuGaming I'm not denying its prowess but you can't deny that it definitely doesn't compare to some of the others. It's actively hunted and bullied by Rajang who is a monster with a classification.
There's even a quote in World that says the title of "Elder Dragon" is given to those who don't fit into a classification.
""We've taken to using the term Elder Dragon for any creature that defies ordinary classification, but I suppose you could call them a type of phenomenon: disasters, cataclysms, living, breathing forces of nature.""
@@broly829 Counter to that; Rajang is in the Elder-Dragon level category alongside things such as Raging Brachydios and Deviljho; while Rajang is a monster with a classification, it exists in a weird in-between where its strength and prowess is on par with elders. with Elders.
It'd mean Kirin is a Low-Tier Elder; still an Elder, but something that often has to deal with monsters that enter that category. Another infamous duo of Elder-Dragon level threats are Silver Rathalos and Gold Rathians.
As for the quote in world: the title of Elder Dragon DOES fit that definition, but it in of itself is a very varied definition. TLDR: the three defining features of an Elder Dragon are
-Its ability to affect the environment
-Its biology being strange or alien
-Its unable to be trapped, period.
It's why Gore Magala is an 'Unknown' rather than some Elder or Flying Wyvern - something about the Gore Magala allows it to be trapped and shed wyvern tears when it's just the baby form of a Shagaru Magala which is a full blown Elder. Thus, it's REALLY hard to classify it as anything as it can't even fit the broad strokes of what makes an Elder - that being said a Gore Magala is still an 'Elder Dragon level threat' as its ability to affect the environment via its Frenzy Virus is still a very real danger.
I learned that the Lao Shen Lung in the first game was running from a Fatalis. Really puts into perspective how terrifying Fatalis is if it can make a mountain dragon run with its tail between its legs.
And that lao is a baby sized too...
Have to say Zorah is World Breaker for me. His sheer size guarantees him that spot. If he went on a rampage instead of wanting to commit seppuku, the world's geography is changing
we got him to change directions with swords and cannons from a single ship
You ever sidestepped slightly because you see a wierd bug?
@vast9467 I can make Saffi change directions with a clutch claw attack. Obviously Saffi scales beneath a clutch claw
@@pinkdarkboii1817 clutch claw outerversal threat confirmed
@@vast9467 the one we fight was also on death's door so....
my only problem is with the existence of the entire "elder by classification" tier besides kirin
because all of those guys are true elder dragons and just as strong as a toaster or a velkhana
literally
the exact same in-game tier just less popular and iconic as designs
Based on the rank difference, I wonder how Malzeno was able to hold back Gaismagorm and push it back to the depths.
All I can really say is that malzeno acts as something like a substitute host for the Qurio, probably dampened gaismagorms power
Malzeno didn’t actually fight off Gaismagorm in a strict sense, more so the Qurio got addicted to his blood and formed a symbiotic relationship with him. The Qurio then went back to Gaismagorm to feed it the bio energy they had collected, but since it had all been from the roughly the same source Gaismagorm deemed the location as an inappropriate locale to build its nest, and as such simply moved on.
(Very rough generalization, but that’s the basic idea of what happened.)
1000IQ malzeno tricked gaismagorm into thinking there's not much bioenergy at the top
All I know is that apparently before malzeno became the beast we know it was funny enough kinda like a protector of the land the citadel was in before gaismagorm happened and when malzeno investigated the orginal creator something went down could had been a fight idk but after that malzeno came out with the qurios and slowly turned onto the beast we hunt today and help turn the citadel into the ruin it is now
I mean look at ruined nergi and shara, nergi still delivered the final blow
Let's be fair, for gameplay porpouses we are able to kill all the monsters, and it is super fun to challenge these beasts. But if we take a more "grounded” and "realistic" approach to all monsters, anything with similar strength to a rathalos would be extremely dangerous already. The elders are basically unkillable whitout a really REALLY solid strategy, a shit ton of luck AND several excellent hunters or balistic weapons, dragonators, etc. Anything past the "True Elders" in my opinion are straight up unkillable by human beings, we are talking about creatures that are so powerful that anything build by humans would endure. Its like bro theyre legends by a reason in lore if im not mistaken but o think its a guild move to mark them as "legends" to not inflict sheer panic in the population.
If the stake were THIS relevant in MH, it would be make the gameplay/straighforward story a bit more interesting.
I'd argue that only the Kirin species should fall under "Elder by classification". All of the others in that tier are still capable of terrible feats of destruction. Chameleos is usually considered part of a sort of triangle with Kushala and Teostra, since its poison can hurt Kushala, Kushala's wind and ice hurt Teostra and Teostra's flame and blast hurt Chameleos.
Chameleos also seems to be a cut above other elder dragons in terms of intelligence, using its natural stealth to set up ambushes and avoid risky fights.
I will also say that I feel like Rise did him kinda dirty, I remember him being a much bigger threat in 4U.
Chameleos is not stronger than Kirin full stop.
No amount of intelligence or being part of a trio can make it a "super mega awesome ecosystem blowerupperer", and I'm fine with that.
He's one of my fav elders
Don’t know how true it is, but I heard the reason Chameleos steals items, and later pollen, from hunters is because it deduces that those are important to us, and figures that taking those things specifically will demoralize us, hopefully ending the fight early by forfeit, thus saving Chameleos’s energy, resources, and possible life.
TL;DR: I heard they take your max potions to make you rage quit
Kirin is way too underrated. It could defeat weaker Elder Dragons like Chameleos relatively easily. It is one with lightning itself when it comes to travel speed and is only outclassed by Narwa when it comes to thunder element power
@@leoperd3487Seems logic. Although many Elder Dragons portray similar levels of intelligence in different ways
fight arch tempered kirin
Namilelle in the sea would be a terrifying fight, the sheer amount of electricity being controlled by that obviously aquatic elder would be incredibly destructive.
@@jayroman3384 it’s odd that she don’t got gills, maybe she breaths like amphibians underwater?
Very spot on list expect Amastu is literally described as a natural disaster in the games and Sunbreak sorta confirms that with the Merchant and Chefs backstory of thier homeland being destroyed by one. It's way more dangerous than something like Kulv, since it's basically able to create hurricanes and massive lightning storms.
This has to be the only video that gives Zorah some justice even if it's more on a lore/power wise thing I just love the boyo
I love how you don’t try to kill it you try to direct it so it doesn’t explode like a power of a nuke
@@ppman698 while the captain somehow thought of capturing the goddam mountain 🤦
@@AI-hl5xl the admiral could probably do it he was ready to throw hands with shara 😂
Zorah if allowed to enter the everstream would've probably had an event similar to Godzilla meting down in Godzilla Vs Destroyah, the simulation they ran wherein if he isnt properly cooled down, it would straight up destroy the whole world. granted, its possible Jiva would have absorbed that power before that could happen, but then you'd have a white fatalis class Safi Jiva so thats not exactly a win for the hunters, lol
@@ORLY911so the commander was right if zorah breached the barrier all was lost just maybe not in the way he was thinking
The truth is that it seems very strange to me that Valstrax and its variant are so low, taking into account that this is stronger than Shagaru and possibly Nergigante, and not to mention that his ambush would end several ancient dragons that are higher up.
Think of it less as power and more as danger, shagaru spreads its frenzy virus by just existing and that affects a huge area, valstrax is more of a single target guy. It’s a strong monster but it’s less of a danger on a wide scale
@@var1areswould yu say one ambush could possibly injure a more than elder dragon at once
@@deee8324 i would say in a fight valstrax is one of the Stronger elders but in Terms of Destruction scale He cant do that much because of His Meteor Attack having a Strong Focus (because of this causing more Direct harm but coverung less area )
@@var1ares that makes a lot of sense. I was going to say the same about Chameleos, since his ranking seemed based around its non-aggression, but this list being based on danger and not overall power makes that choice make much more sense
Plus if we take the redone gen 3 desert scrolls into account c.g valstrax is the very reason it looks so different from how it looked in tri and 3 ultimate also makes me wonder if he the reason there's no great jaggi presence in rise/sunbreak
I’m can’t help but feel like Capcom has massively shafted Alatreon since Iceborne. Back in 3U, it seemed like the consensus surrounding it was that it was likely comparable to Fatalis. The developers themselves have even said that Alatreon was meant to “inherit the legacy of Fatalis”. He’s still got the world-breaker status for sure, but it seems like nowadays it’s only ever referenced in relation to Safi’jiiva and how much of a pushover it would be if it fought Fatalis straight up. This is likely just me being overly critical l, but I really hope that we eventually get some kind of hint that Ala isn’t just a potential meal for the Red Dragon.
I thinks it’s deal is that it’s super destructive power-wise but weak beyond that, so like in the teppen card art it might lose caught off-guard like that since it can’t leverage its powers
Ah, the classic sacrifice of the old characters to boost the new ones. It's such a shitty way to showcase a new monsters strength. Look at gta v with trevor and johnny.
@@RadishHead7 I'd say that the safi'jiiva buildup is perfect, if instead of being scaled over alatreon we would see it fighting with it, then shoot a beam to the alatreon scaring him away.
You forgot the strongest monster. The main hunter in each game, being capable of hunting down any monster known to humanity.
That would be a cop out for the top spot lmao
White Fatalis' red lightning goes even a step beyond instantly carting a hunter. It outright vaporizes them, erases them from existence. Getting hit by it will instantly forfeit the quest regardless of carts remaining, as your hunter ceases to exist.
*in Frontier
Yeah fatalis is the goat. He deserves an extra tier. From monster Hunter lore a Hunter is also more than a human. Thats why they are able to kill these dragons. But even this is not enough to bring down a fatalis.
Fatalis is not just an ordinary elder dragon.
And we’re yet to see the 7 horns legendary Fatalis
The instant fail quest is not true it counts as a cart. I have played and hunted white fatalis in frontier
@@threedog27He is not, Alatreon will always be the goat in the monster hunter franchise
Welp. I don’t agree with much of these placements (some are canonically inaccurate, such as Namielle and Blackveil occupying the “Super Elder Dragon-class” ala Dive), but I gotta respect the work that went into making this-wasn’t expecting this kind of editing on a tier list.
This is mostly gameplay based, and thank you, took me about a week to get this done from making footage to the final edit
Hello commenters, I'm not sure if this video has peaked in its growth yet, but since now a significant portion of my subscribers are from this video I'd like to ask for any ideas for Monster Hunter content you'd like to see going forward. As you may have seen, I didn't expect this video to be as wide reaching or well recieved as it was so I'm thankful for you tuning in to my little channel. If you've got an idea please post it as a reply to this comment to help me brainstorm.
Edit: Recently I’ve seen people asking about the Behemoth, the reason I didn’t include it’s both a crossover fight, so I wouldn’t consider it canon, and because its powers work off of magic rather than being more grounded like your normal monsters (e.g. elemental attacks come from specialised organs in regular monsters)
More rankings
“ranking every Elder Dragon based on the enjoyability and quality of their fights” (using the, in your opinion, most enjoyable iteration of x fight)
A great idea but kind of difficult since I don’t have easy access to the older games
There's definitely a niche for power scaling monster hunter, both more broad things like things and more focused ones on maybe a specific species/skeleton type
I feel like Vaal Hazak is way, way too low.
Yama incredibly underrated, as a monster it was always meant to be a more dangerous (to the hunter) flying sequel to Lao, he literally sucks up entire forests and drinks lakes
How is amatsu not an ecological disaster when its prescense literally creates hurricans, thunderstorms and rain by just being in an area.
If Versa Pietru, Makili Pietru and Oltura from Stories 1 and 2 were in this tierlist, I'd guess that Versa Pietru would be near the Top of "Fort Destroyer", Makili Pietru either at the Top of Ecological Disaster or World Breaker, And Olutra also around the same place as Makili Pietru.
Definitely the world breaker tier with both final bosses of stories one and two given how the legends make it sound if they are left unchecked and not taken down
yeah definitely world ender. plus both of them have strong shields that stop basically anything + regeneration + immortality to everything that is literally not plot armor
I like that nerg has its own category cause it's just an anomaly
Nerg was too hard to fit into the list naturally, it’s brutally strong but we don’t know what the strongest thing it could take down would be. I myself theorise that it could take anything as long it’s of relative size, as long as nerg is about 80% the size of whatever it’s after I think it could kill it
@Var1ares I agree as well it's like a male lion or perhaps a leopard it can take on foes bigger than itself it's opportunistic but make no mistake it has no problem getting its own hands and feet dirty all while having a higher than normal intellect
@@var1ares wouldn’t that mean it could take on Alatreon and Fatalis? I dunno, just seems dubious depending on the casr
@@var1ares But Mah Man Nergi killed shara so there for his tier list should be one over fort destroyer just because he is so unpredictable.
@@tenmonsters6404 correction: he kill weaken shara. Aka kill steal. He also have a hardtime with valkhana.
A healthy young zorah magdaros would be insane. The one we fought was old and dying. Imagine one that could move more freely and fight back
The one we encountered didn’t need to fight back, we just disrupted it. I can’t imagine them as an aggressive species but one actively attacking a place would be a massive problem for sure
I feel Dalamadur should be a bit higher in the world breaking tier considering its heavily implied by the skeleton in world that the one we actually faught wasnt fully grown if you compare the scale of its spines and teeth to a hunter in both games to get a rough estimate of its size even the smaller estimates would be large enough to swallow most other monsters on this list whole
According to the games and artbooks there are currently 3 power classes of Elder Dragons/ED Level Monsters.
Elder Dragon Level:
Teostra, Kushala Daora, Rajang, etc
Super Elder Dragon Level:
Shagaru Magala, Ruiner Nergigante, Primordial Malzeno, Scorned Magnamalo
Calamity/First Class Elder Dragon Level:
Amatsu, Fatalis, Dire Miralis, Dalamadur, Akantor, etc.
Now I want the White Fatalis with the same kind of battle that the normal Fatalis in Iceborn
There's a mod that add a quest to fight white Fatalis and it's not just a reskin of the original one, they also changed its attacks to match the true WF. Even though the fight is pretty similar in terms of mechanics it really feels different
@@Kellerent754 zap
I would’ve put Narkarkos way higher , he’s one class below black dragon tier.
I think MH4U has some of the best monster rosters of the series. I long to see some of them return in new entries. Specially Dalamadur and Gogmazius.
Bro safi potential it’s insane, imagine us finding about him some months later and seeing him fight agains alatreon,also IF he had fought and won against alatreon he could have adorned his life force, imagine a safi’jiiva after having assorbed alatreon☠️☠️
But alatreon would jave put an end to his life
You definitely got Valstrax and Crimson Glow wrong. The former is well above regular elders like kushala and Teo/Luna, but is not very aggressive and is rarely encountered. The latter is canonically noted to be on par with Allmother Narwa in terms of power, and has the aggression to be a danger to the entire ecosystem it occupies.
Fatalis doesn’t purposely melt hunters into itself. It’s literally a case of “shit happens”, where it’s chest is so hot they get stuck unintentionally.
Safi is the closest thing to an existential threat the series has ever had. It’s equivalent to Fatalis, so it’s outdone in terms of power by Crimson and White, but Safi is much more dangerous on a large scale. First, it kills the land it occupies. Any place that Safi visits is drained of bio energy, leaving it permanently barren. Second, Safi multiplies quickly. The secluded valley has many Xeno cocoons, which would all eventually grow into Safi’s if they weren’t stopped. Imagine dozens of Fatalis level monsters draining every place they go, only to move on when there’s nothing left to consume, all with the ability to multiply. They’d essentially be massive, unstoppable locusts which would kill the whole planet if not kept in check.
MH3U Is awesome. It has underwater combat, It had Ceadeus, First game with Alatreon, Jhen Mohran, AND The awesome Dire Miralis. I'm so glad it was my first Monster Hunter game, introducing me to the series as a kid.
Same here. It was the first game I ever bought. I remember the old nunchuck controls for the lance to this day
Having the Safi nuke with the drop was a glorious decision during that cinematic appreciation of the elder dragons.
Liking the video for that alone.
I like this tier list video (and your use of Halo ost) and wouldn't make but one change, Id place Dahren over Jhen. Like you said it looks more fierce.
I did place Darhen over jhen, I changed my mind after taking all the screenshots of the tier list with the blurs but I didn’t realise I’d messed up until I got to that point in the editing and was too lazy to take them again, I spoke about them in my intended order but the pics of the tier list were wrong
Well, in their hunt notes it's stated that dahren it's weaker than jhen but more aggressive
Awesome video, you should definitely do elder dragon level monsters next, though I’m sure that’ll be a bit of a longer wait due to the vast amount’s between variants, deviants & rare species.
I think some of the one-game appearances like Bloodbath Diablos will be very difficult to scale
@@QuantemDeconstructor Most of the Elders in this list are also one-game monsters so it's probably fine
i feel gaismagorm should be a bit higher, mainly because it grows stronger as it feeds. we never know how powerful it may get
Plus the ingame one has been severely weakened by malzeno cutting off a majority of its food supply and using some of its qurio against it
L on Kirin and vaal. Kirin, while hunted by rajang, are not just by lore but even shown in game of world, that just presence alone can summon raging thunderstorms within a massive radius. Vaal hazak as well because of how it interacts with the effluvium. If taken out of the vale yes I would lower it’s class like with blackveil, but normal vaal is able to use the effluvia to literally suck the life out of monsters infect with it, and is the most dominant force of the vale
Luna is an eco disaster as easily shown by legends of the guild.
Kulve is definitely formidable, but need to be a tier lower. Kulve is strong enough to definitely cause destruction, but almost never leaves the caverns, and will return if it does (if left alone)
Those are my only real gripes, everything else is done perfectly. Normal Kirin and normal Vaal should be higher, same especially with lunastra (destroying entire ecosystems in very little time. Again shown by legends of the guild) and kulve should just be one lower
The only reason it is an ecological disaster is that it can accidentally cause the caverns to collapse and thus cause problems above ground but this is just a fear and not realised much, unless you take the fact we can enter the caverns as a sign of that
Personally i think the only placement i disagree with here is Amatsu. Especially since he brings raging storms and typhoons with him everywhere he goes. I feel if anything he and Kulve should be swapped, and that he should instead be in Ecological Disaster tier? Thats just me tho. Otherwise very awesome and well explained list!
First off I don’t think there should be a elder by classification because all of em pack a punch without a doubt kirin would definitely be on the weaker end but still quite strong everything after Valkana in true should be fort and I’d put nakarkos in ecological disaster all the forts should be ecological disaster and dire shouldn’t be ahead of fatalis I’d also take Shara down a level
You say that just because a monster is in a lower rank doesn’t mean it can’t beat a higher tier monster, yet I feel you still took matchups into too much account.
For example, Kirin may get wrangled by Rajang regularly, but Rajang are adapted to fighting Kirin specifically. They are lightning-resistant and their huge arms and hands make it easier to hold one down and grab its horn to break it. On that note, Rajang only want the horn and don’t actually kill the Kirin. But a Kirin being in the area can cause thunderstorms and they can run so fast they practically teleport, which is considerably more powerful than any non-elder, even Rajang.
Similar case for Vaal Hazak; while it might not be much in a head-on fight, effluvium eats flesh, living or dead, and a Vaal brings with it a lot of effluvium. It feeds off of the nutrients the effluvium gathers, and the act of it absorbing the effluvium further harms or even kills whatever it pulls it from. The effluvium can affect entire locales, driving the monsters insane from the agony.
Neither of those two Elders are very confrontational by nature, but the amount by which they alter environments just by being there and performing their daily activities plus their other strange abilities puts them on equal grounds with physically stronger Elders like Teostra.
Edit: Oh yeah, and Oroshi Kirin is said to have frozen an entire city in a night. That sounds powerful to me.
I’d like to hit your points one by one, just before that, consider that this list isn’t actually definitive and is just my personal thoughts on how the elders rank after seeing their fights, I don’t have full context from the games respective stories.
Yes , I did take some matchups into account since turf wars are an easy way to “power scale.”
I ranked Kirin so low because it doesn’t demonstrate much destructive capacity and it doesn’t have much muscle or size to throw around.
Vaal Hazak for a similar reason, it sure can mess up the environment around it but it’s very slow and frail. It does win in its turf war against Odogaron but I’m sure that something like a Deviljho would handle it.
Oroshi Kirin suffers from lack of showings in gameplay and my lack of knowledge from its games story.
I appreciate the mature comment I know how heated people can become over fun videos like this. Just to reiterate, not saying you’re wrong, just saying that this video represents my thoughts.
@@var1ares Well, to be clear, the two Elders I listed are just examples. I honestly don’t think the “Elders by Classification” tier should exist.
Don’t forget how destructive lightning can be. A creature that can strike things with it at will is certainly capable of a lot of destruction, even if Kirin doesn’t go out of its way to do so.
I would also like to mention Chameleos. They are notably playful and mischievous for an Elder Dragon. Though they also avoid conflict, their voluminous amounts of powerful poison can have significant adverse effects on the environment by itself. Plus, as Rise demonstrates, they actually do have the muscle to back themselves up if they get into a serious head-on fight. Rise Chameleos slams the ground hard enough with its forelimbs and tail to shatter it. It makes sense when you consider that it has fucking tree trunks for limbs compared to most other Elders.
While many of the Elders in the “Elders by Classification” tier are not particularly big or brawny (except for Chameleos-just look at those forelimbs), I still think they make up for it with what they can do without confronting adversaries up close.
And thank you.
@@var1ares Oh yeah, and Yama Tsukami. I think that one especially suffers from being in such an old game. In lore, it doesn’t just suck lighter foes into its mouth; it devours landscapes by sucking it up. Animals, trees, even the dirt and stone; it doesn’t give a shit, it eats everything.
Yeah in the fight it doesn’t really do much so it was definitely one of the harder monsters to gauge
According to Capcom, Nergigante is actually closer to Alatreon than the "regular" Elders.
I'm interested where you've learned of this. I always thought Nerg was a cut above many elders.
No
@@Buzzzerino This was in the data/lore book that was Japan exclusive, it also confirmed Safi was created to be a direct rival to Fatalis and is (lore wise) as strong as one.
@@BriberX000I looked through the lore book about safi and they never outright stated he’s as strong fatalis. Here’s their exact quote “safi’jiiva is designed as the equal/counterpart/rival of fatalis. They wanted to make another siege fight where you could cooperate with other players, and came up with the idea of depleting energy levels. In terms of design, they wanted to make an equal to fatalis.” It’s vague if the first line was referring to its strength or gameplay design.
@@planelattice2783 There's nothing vague about that quote. It states both lore and gameplay wise that its equal
Chameleos just want to do his one to the left, one to the right, this is why it doesn’t has a turf war
I think Valstrax and Malzeno would be in the same tier as Nergigante. No, I'm quite sure of it. Nergigante doesn't feel any stronger than these two if not weaker.
Edit: Also Amatsu is an ecological disaster class ED, much higher than Allmother Narwa. This will soon be apparent.
Valstrax will make nergi explode into oblivion
@@caesar7786 sorry to burst your bubble, but valstrax is in the same tier as teostra etc. and therefore nergis meal. (not i am not even go off of this tier list or any tier list). its confirmed by the devs themselfs, that ruiner nergi, can actually beat shara (but we intervened as nergi searched for it), who in turn is a high class elder. go and read the official lore guide from the game.
Vaal Hazzak, Blackveil Vaal Hazzak, and Nakarkos definitely deserve Fort Destroyer when you take into account what exactly their role in the environments they're found in are. Vaal Hazzak's existence made the Rotten Vale what it is, and Blackveil was seen to become a terror to the local wildlife similarly to Shagaru Magala but on a slightly smaller scale within a very short time in the forest.
As for Nakarkos... Well, honestly I feel it's so obvious that I suspect your placement to be because you wanted to see people correct it specifically because you're a fan of the monster. Nakarkos effectively created a no-wyvern's-land full of skeletons by easily killing every single thing that made the mistake of venturing into its territory. It's similar to Vaal and the Rotten Vale but instead of just creating a corrosive gas to do the dirty work, Nakarkos just shot lasers at shit and killed it all itself.
I would place Vaal Hazzak & Blackveil right above Ceadeus. Amatsu causes damage on a similar scale to Vaal but doesn't need nearly as much time, and doesn't give nearly as much a fuck how close you are to it, so I can't really justify placing Vaal above Amatsu.
Nakarkos goes right above Gogmazios. If Gogmazios were more aggressive by nature and not just a massive lizard that eats gunpowder roaming the land assaulting military outposts for a snack, then I would never put Gogmazios below Nakarkos. While I would consider Gogmazios to be much more powerful than Nakarkos, it's just logically much easier to deal with and a much smaller threat to anything's life so long as it doesn't try to deprive it of its powdery meals. Just keep your armory on the outskirts of your city and establish a decent evacuation protocol, then even if it attacks you're not gonna have any casualties unless one of the hunters tasked to drive it away does something stupid. So yeah, Nakarkos gets its fairly high placement because its territorial nature, ravenous appetite, and exceptionally long range make it a bigger issue to have around than anything below it.
Logically speaking, they'd actually be Ecological Disasters, rather than Fort Destroyers -both literally reshape their surrounding habitat, one into a haven for scavengers, the other into a completely lifeless boneheap. They then generally remain in their turf, so you probably wouldn't expect to see it causing destruction beyond this initial terraforming.
Many of the Elder Dragons on this list are severely underestimated, as early as Chameleos and Namielle (literally True Elders) and Malzeno, who literally laid waste to a kingdom/fortress.
Interestingly, both Ibushi and base Narwa are classed only as True Elders while Shagaru Magala is an Ecological Disaster, if only for its Frenzy Virus. Nevermind the fact that Ibushi and base Narwa cause the Rampage, and the fact that both also literally destroyed a fort.
Sorry Chief. This is wrong on many levels, let’s get started. Velkhana, Malzeno, BlackVaal, and Namielle are all above Nergigante based on turf wars. Moreover Vaal Hazak in general should be in true elder tier, as most weaker elders are physically weak and only elementally capable, Vaal is a metal elder, it’s physically quite strong as a result. Narkarkos should be much higher, the laser is uses deletes a massive part of Wyvern’s End and the Elder proves to be more then capable of causing obscene levels of ecological havoc. CGV (Crimson Glow Valstrax) should be above Ruiner, and honestly most of Fort Destroyer tier should be bumped to ecological disaster (Amasu, both Lao’s, Ibushi, and Narwa). Ruiner Nerg, CGV, Valstrax, Malzeno, and Velkhana should sit at Fort Destroyer anyways, as Malzeno single handedly destroyed a castle using the Quiro. Xeno’Jiiva is not on the same level as something like Giasmagorm or Allmother, neither is Shagaru (Risen is though). This tier list is formatted poorly and I understand this is a year old so I’m painfully aware the words are wasted, buuuuuut…I wanted too : )
TLDR: Idk it’s baed.
Another add on, Rusted Kushala should be in Fort Destroyer, also Yama Tsukami is at LEAST fort destroyer.
Though not physically powerful Val Hazak and its counterpart are both ecological nightmares, also Safi'Jihva I would on part with possibly White Fatalis for one reason, the both harness life in the most purest way possible and if is stated that no monster can survive the blast then I would presume that would include even the strongest.
I do applaud putting Nergigante in its own spot because I see it as a "Doomsday" of monsters, I think when a hunter slays Nergi it will always come back once more as an even stronger variant. Hence why Ruiner Nergi is capable of killing Shara whilst both are in much weaker states.
I have to disagree with the safi statement
White fatalis is the only monster to vaporize the hunt and not just faint them
@@sullivanjohnblack9375 Fair point but that is literally a very aged and very powerful Fatalis, imagine how powerful Safi would be in that same amount of time, we essentially fight it as a newborn and then as a adolescent/young adult. White Fatalis was old and because of that outclassed all other Fatalis.
Gotta correct you there grim, white is not an aged fatalis, it’s an older version of the species that black fatalis is descended from
@@var1ares Fair point, it had been awhile. I am not as avid of a Monster Hunter and have not actually fought the beast myself. I have just played World and a little bit of every game nix the first game. The American releases that is.
I wouldn’t say namielle or Black veil are deserving of being that low on the list. Like namielle is obviously a water dragon out of the water which makes it much weaker than it should be (thank god we fight it in a dead coral reef instead of the sea, it would’ve been a nightmare if it was in MH3U) and Black Veil can after a long enough period of time completely saturate a biome with effluvium making it inhospitable to most life.
Safi should be higher
He heals off energy from living things and even in the desolate valley he can heal himself loads
If he was in the ancient forest or anywhere else he would be practical immortal.
He would have to leave eventually but even then he's still strong
The only reason he wasn't going around eating stuff was that an alatreon was going to destroy his nest and kids if he left
The tiermaker is in the description
Alatreon would have probably killed him so no if he should be somewhere else its under alatreon fatalis is on another level
Safi has normal creature intelligence whilst the fatalis trio have close to human (showing malice, mocking hunters etc.) that is a ginormous difference that places fatalis in a class of his own
27:10 Bloodborne music fuck yeah!!!
My only gripe with this is that Valstrax is shown to have an active rivalry with Amatsu on more than one occasion. CG Val is responsible for destroying the civilization in the Sandy Plains, and is regarded as being on the same threat level as Ibushi and Narwa.
monster hunter armor be like
Boys : fully decked out god killer armor
Girls :tank top with cleavage shown…
And I wouldn't have it any other way
I can only agree with your opinions and judgement. Well thought out and comprehensive. I enjoyed it greatly. Thank you Mr. Var1ares :)
Chameleos should've had his own tier just like Nergigante, in this case, Non-Hostile but when Unthreatened.
Just kidding, it's because he looks cool and adorable.
Chameleos is a little bit handsome that’s true
The only one that i truly disagree :
Nakarkos is more likely in Ecological disaster. I don't really know "how" the wyven's End was formed, and i doubt all the bone and skull we see were monsters killed by Nakarkos ( otherwise it means that he killed thousands of monsters, then it's world ending tier), plus we can see gigantic skeleton and Nakarkos don't focus prey bigger than him. Like Rotten vale, i assume, all these skeletons have accumulated over time, and again I doubt that he made this lair on his own. Perhaps several Nakarkos have used the wyvern's end as a lair. In any case it means that its influence is colossal, it still means that thousands of monsters have been killed and eaten and we don't know how long this place has existed. Especially since unlike the Rotten vale, this place doesn't seem to serve an ecological role, it's really just a hole in a mountain, it's not natural.
If you read into it almost every elder dragon is an ecological disaster, it was a cool name for a tier of power that I wanted to use.
I do see your point though, I just disagree
I think it mentions it causes entire villages to disappear overnight too
A lot of monsters can do that though
No, no they can’t nakarkos is at the very least fort destroyer
I didnt see the Monster Hunter Stories Elder Dragons and therefore this lsit is no longer falid. I mean, sure they are both super weak and shouldnt even be allowed near these other elder dragons, but still...
I did say say elders from main series games officially localised in English at the beginning
@@var1ares yeah I know, I was just making a joke about how unimpressive the Elder Dragons from the stories spinoffs are. In all seriousness, this is a pretty awesome list
My b hard to read sarcasm from just text
Is it bad that I can tell apart all of the monsters on the thumbnail even when they are all in 280p
Gotta disagree on Amatsu. If you've ever lived through or seen the aftereffect of a Hurricane, you'd know just how much devastation these kinds of storms leave behind. Amatsu has the potential to completely and utterly wreck ecosystems, especially if it stays in one place for prolongued stretches of time.
the first note got me ready for november rain
I will say while I agree with most of this I feel as though Yama and nakarkos should be in fort destroyers, they’re much more powerful than any of the others in that same category.
Great list, but Im a bit disappointed that you did'nt include the two Monster Hunter Stories Elders, as their games eere of english release. So I can understand not including any Frontier Elders (the list would be painfully overloaded otherwise) but since you included non mainline games, I thought Spin offs were included as well.
I'd place Versa/Makili Pietru at ecological disaster, as by merely existing, it affected the entire region with black blight, so I'd see that as a similar feat to Shagaru. As for Olturas, hes easily world breaker. Being gargantuan in size and no diffing a Nergigante as a Larva is impressive enough enough, but then as an adult, he posed a threat to the entire world.
My only dissagrement on the list is/are the 2 Val Hazak who i personally think are ecological destroyers if given enough time in an enviroment. to quote a comment i made on a ragegaming ranking of weakest elders (Its long so TLDR: Val hazak is like a caster, weak and squishy to begin, but given time can snowball out of control killing most everything and destroy any enviroment it moves into)
"I wanna make the argument for Val Hazak using the two arguments you gave him, I agree that he is a very weak elder dragon when the circumstances are not in his favor BUT given time in a new environment I believe there are very few elder dragons not called black dragons that are more dangerous for an environment and its ecology than a Val Hazak moving in.
1. You mentioned that his stores of effluvium are limited when outside the rotten vale leaving him at a strong disadvantage until he starts killing things which I agree but the potential for that snowballing is massive and getting out of hand is a real possibility, if a Nergi kills an elder dragon that's it one less elder dragon, if a Chamleos steals your items that's it you lost one item maybe two, but if Val kills something, ANYTHING AT ALL, the Effluviam doubles and begins to spread, and he kills more, and more and more and his plague spreads like a pandemic on the ecosystem that kills all it touches and slowly morphs the environment once teeming with life into a grave site piled with bodies of all that once lived, with enough time in an environment I think Val Hazak can literally corrupt its location into a miniature rotten vale that may never recover, with only select elder dragons being gifted with such an ability, the plant life DIES, the ecology DIES, the small monsters DIE, the big monsters DIE and even some elder dragons that dare step onto its home may DIE. and that's to say nothing about the fact that effluvium is unique to him and the vale so monsters not native to the vale will have no evolved defense mechanism or immunity to combat it as they would poison, paralysis, or any other blight outside of normal body functions, most elder dragons likely don't have that ability either, so it's going to affect everyone and everything with very few exclusions until there is nothing but the Val Hazak left draining life from the damned and lord help if it runs out and moves on for it to happen all over again.
2. Black Veil Val Hazak also shows that even out of their preferred environment Val Hazak could in theory also mold their mechanisms and effluvium productivity to the environment they iare in and once again corrupt things around them into a state of decay, they used mushrooms in the forest, what is to say if we didn't slay them when we did the ancient forest wouldn't have become a fungal forest filled with barely breathable air and who is to say they couldn't do this given time anywhere they go, spread the effluvium in dust particles in the sand in the wild spire or bury the bodies into the sand to spread his horror through the sand walked upon like little landmines or corrupting "seedlings", start some kind of symbiotic relationship with some kind of barnacle creature in the coral highlands, use the heated winds of the elder's recess to spread the toxins upwards to spread about the place and in the hoarfrost reach the bodies of the dead under the frozen temperatures will likely be preserved much longer than normally intended, perfect to drag away, pile high and create a factory of effluvium or create a coat of flesh still retaining some of the attributes of hits once fallen victims to protect it from all attackers and the cold of the winterlands.
Whereas most elder dragons are aggressive warriors of some kind that charge into battle with unrelenting power, Val Hazak is more like a caster, at first they are weak and squishy but give them the time to set up their game plan and they can destroy whatever they so choose by simply existing, they dont even need to go out of thier way to fight or spread the effluvium, they do it simply by existing, when a Val Hazak exists all else dies, for they are the elder dragon of decay, the elder dragon of rot and the elder dragon of death itself.
In another timeline, Val Hazak with this kind of tooling and threat could have been a flagship elder dragon or even a final fucking boss monster, a dragon of unending decay and rot that drains every environment it touches of every droplet of life simply as it exists, it walks and lives its life but leaves behind mass graves where ecosystems once stood."
A reply exclusive to this video tho is that Val hazak does this simply by existing in an area, at no point does it need to seriously exert itself unless challanged to corrupt and destroy an environment like most other elder dragons have to, if say fatalis himself wanted to burn the ancient forest to the ground he would still actively have to excert himself doing so, he would still have to breath fire, attack the landscape, kill what remained, if he were to just stand there and exist in the forest sure it would be a very, very, very large concern but the forest wouldnt burst into flames and become a desolate wasteland. Val hazak however simple exists somewhere and effluvian spreads, things die, everything slowly becomes a corrupted form of death and entropy simply because val hazak lived there, simply because it called that place its home present or past tense.
Dont get me wrong im not saying Val is some fatalis tier elder. im just stating that people really be sleeping on Val Hazak, especially when it feels like he could ruin the ecology of any place he parked his decaying arse
I’ve gotten a few comments saying I should rank the Vaal’s higher (the tiermaker is in the description) but I see it as a slower and more frail shagaru with less ability to spread since it doesn’t breed by using its effluvium like shagaru does with its frenzy. I understand the critiques but at the end of the day the video took me 5 days to make and 3 hours to upload so even if my opinion was changed I’m not about to go do it again lmao
@@var1ares Nah nah thats fair enough my dude, simply voicing my own opinion on the topic, no issue with how anyone sees thing or doesn't no harm no foul!
Do agree with ya on that point tho, Val does tend to be a a lesser shagaru but i suppose thats kinda balanced out by the fact that Magala is faster and stronger but monsters can overcome the frenzy virus and get stronger from it where as Val is weaker and slower but Effluvium doesnt really seem to be something monsters overcome unless specially adapted with it in mind,
Banger list and video tho!
one thing i like to point about Zora is it takes the *entire* guild to simply just get it to change direction while its already actively dying meanwhile it only takes up to 4 hunters to kill fetalis. Not saying its stronger, just saying its damn hell stronger than xenojiva
I’d use the word bulkier, or maybe more durable
that's a fair argument
I like how you added the halo theme song in the first bit of the video it matches perfectly of the intro of what you made
Both nakarkos and ceadeus should have been put in elder eater rank, as they prey on each other. Nakarkos preys on ceadeus pups, while adult ceadeus are the only creatures that prey on nakarkos. This makes them the only other elder dragons besides nergigante to have been specifically said to prey on other elder dragons, as opposed to only fighting for territory. Also, canonically kushala daora is among the weakest elder dragons, with non-rusted daoras regularly struggling for territory with even non-elder dragons like rajang and espinas.
Honestly, given that Malzeno wasn’t always the false host for the Quirio (according to the MHR Sunbreak storyline), it kinda makes me wonder what a “true Malzeno” looks like and what it attacks with. If I’m not mistaken, it fought against Gaismagorm, which is how it became exposed to the Quirios to begin with. Could be an idea for an alternate version of Malzeno.
That would be Primordial Malzeno.
@@everlastingdragon4520 Comment was written before the monster was revealed.
@@BriberX000 Noted.
And scorned magnamalo hunts these guys as a prey animal...
This makes total sense, i still want to see white fatalis lore accurate in the future (he can summon both crimson and normal fatalis to the fight)
seeing his beard and colour, I always wanted to call white fatalis an elder fatalis, an elder of the apex, which even the other apex answer to it's command
Yama Tsukami is way to low, have you played any MH2 or MHFU?
Yama Tsukami has the only actual insta-kill in MHFU, all the attacks of Akantor, Ukanlos and Fatalis are survivable with enough defense.
4:50 HES A WIGGLY GUY I LOVE IT LMAO
You played a Halo song for the intro, automatic like, it doesn’t matter the quality or accuracy of the video this one gets a like
intro goes unbelievably hard
So why is crimson glow valstrax in true elder despite us having text in game saying it destroyed a city? Also Nakarkos and Amatsu should be in ecology tier
Fatalis really don't seem like a world breaker - it is difficult in game because of mechanics, not because there's something uniquely powerful about him..
Yeah, I would also put it more at Fort Buster/Ecological Disaster. It can definitly destroy large cities easily with its power, but it doesn't seem as big as a threat to the world as for example Dalamadur, who destroys entire mountains like it's nothing
Downplaying fatalis so hard
Fatalis can literally melt steel with its fire's which is infinitely more than you can say about any other monster's, with those fires it can easily scorch entire echo systems, not to mention they get more powerful.
@@umb3rus108 that statement is hyperbole, Dalamandur's can shape large masses of rock with movement alone but not true mountains.
@@itapproaches3484 Plenty of monsters have that ability - again, you are just describing game mechanics - it's not really a world breaker tier - there's monsters ranked lower than can literally swallow Fatalis lol
i would place vaal hazak higher tier
might be the strongest, but that dragon is the ego system by itself, its Effluvium legit is something to be feared
the only reason i would guess its not as aggresive is, legit doesnt need to do anything, and everything around would just die and becomes its nutrients
can imagen if actually starts huntin it devistate any egosystems for years
If this was based off of the monster’s individual strength, i can’t imagine anyone beating Shah Dalamadur. I mean he’s 1445 ft long and overall big asf. Who’s gonna stop him from eating literally every monster on this list except Zorah Magdaros. His skin ist tough enough to withstand every attack with some exceptions like Safis special attack.
Ever stepped on a nail?
@@Ch4oTiK now imagine that the nail is actively trying to kill you
bro you are capping hard everyone knows dodogama is the strongest elder dragon
Wait, you forgot about Ahtal Ka. The final hub boss of Generations Ultimate.
Not an Elder Dragon and it's not even an ED threat level. Obviously, the ones that can take and manipulate a mech are dangerous like Lao Shan Lung level, but most of them don't have this chance
@@bobisuncanny2760 Hm. I must have missed that part in the monster's description. It's been a while since I've played it.
@@bobisuncanny2760 I Mean it’s Clearly a Fort Destroyer. Doesn’t Really Matter How Often it Does, Only that it Does in Fact do it.
@@oaktree149 it remains incredebly rare. I know it's obvious, but people got matrixed so hard by this monster that it seems many people forgot. Ahtal-Ka are not born with their mechs, the 2 can be separated. Without it ,the mantiscan still use its silk to just throw ruins at your face. The basis of the monster is not to create a mecha = It is to use its silk and its intelligence to trap and kill you.And i seriously doubt there are plenty of fortresses with dragonator lying around in the wild, which is not so unlikely after all. Yet Athal-Ka seems to prefer desertic areas... It's not because one indivudual did it once that all individuals does it regularly
It’s an Insect Wyvern
I'm at work, phone auto-playing in the background. Needless to say, I was confused when the Halo theme started playing, followed by someone talking about Monster Hunter.
Nice job on this. Any chance you’ll be doing the same to the frontier monsters sometime in the future?
27:04 Now we’re getting into the real shit
Probably not sorry
Havent even seen or fiught hazaak. But just by his description you gave he shiuld obviously be in ecological destoryer.
0:40 halo ahh music
Cus it is?
I disagree with nakarkos. It destroyed a big village and turned it into an abyss, ate everyone living there and obviusly ate other nearby monsters. You litterly fight it while stepping on the former villagers bones. It's a calamity clas elder.
I think that Dire Miralis should be placed below Alatreon because of how much more powerful Alatreon has become in Iceborne. It definitely shouldn't be higher than Safi or Fatalis
You are just taking Gameplay,dire miralis is Lorewise stronger than fatalis and safi
@@Amatsu_storm_approach No, it's not.
@@Ch4oTiK He is
@@Amatsu_storm_approach
Lol you can repeat it as much as you want. Lore has never once stated that Dire Miralis is on the level of Fatalis, especially considering that Iceborne is literally Fatalis' first canon fight against the Hunters post-Schrade's destruction, and Crimson and White have not even appeared canonically yet (the only other lore about Fatalis after Schrade implies the Lao Shan Lung fought in the original MH games was desperately fleeing from one, and the fort was in the way, forcing you to fight it).
Safi being stated to have been intended to live up to Fatalis was mostly in terms of "Design", not power (people mistranslate the context), as both are the only ones fully based on Western Dragon design. Safi is not as powerful as Fatalis which is why Fatalis is the final boss of Iceborne and its ultimate ability flash melts a massive steel door and sends castle debris flying across the arena, while with Safi you can hide behind boulders.
Dire MIGHT be Safi level, but no lore ever stated as much so I merely speculate - but it's not on Fatalis' level. Period.
@@Ch4oTiK The Lore literally implied him as a Monster able to fastly end the world,boiled an entire ocean with his presence and his weapons literally cut mountains with a merely move,enough for being stronger than black fatalis.
And again,you use Gameplay instead of lore
10:50 I never played sunbreak but really the bloodening I can’t be the only one that thinks that’s dumb
Reminder, the Safi we fought wasn’t full grown. He was still pretty young, so imagine the power of an elder Safi
Im so baked i got confused why the halo theme was playing 😂
Great job! Amazing video. Earnt you a new subscriber!