Archaic Greek in a modern world
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- An endangered Greek dialect which is spoken in north-eastern Turkey has been identified by researchers as a "linguistic goldmine" because of its startling closeness to the ancient language, as Cambridge researcher Dr Ioanna Sitaridou explains.
For more information please visit: www.romeyka.org
My Pontic ancestors ! Hello from Italia.
I'd heard about these Greek communities in Turkey. I didn't know their speech was this conservative though. It is such a shame that all these Anatolian Greek languages/dialects are disappearing.
I am pontic greek ,i found my people when i went to trapzon my great grandparents land, i spoke with them and we have so much love with our culture and language that even after the Turkish occupation we keept it strongly till today and influenced it to turks ,its so emotional to me seeing my culture so alive in pontus even after many of us left
As a Cypriot🇨🇾 I understood 100% of what they said ! Impressive !
Τι έκανες εσύ από την Κύπρο εσείς στην Κύπρο δεν έχετε καμία σχέση με Ελλάδα
Cause it is not “banned”. And no one bully or insult them when they speak in their own language. They have great gratitude towards the motherland Turkiye cause it’s their home. And for us, it’s their home too. We do not discriminate them. We learnt a way to live peacefully :)
I learned this language from my parents and grandparents....a lot people knows this language...I am proud to be Greek!!!
would you be willing to teach it? :)
Ancient Greek Pontian dialect. I understand everything as my grandfather learned me. Very similar worlds as in modern Greek language.
Fascinating subject. My parents speak the Pontic dialect. Pontic and Romeyika are all but the same thing. It would be sad to see this dialect fade into extinction. It is trully unique and should be preserved.
Am I the only one who thinks that this is basically the coolest thing ever?
Save the pontic greeks. There heritage must be saved! Protect their language.
My grandmother came from a little village near Trebizond and she and my mother spoke this archaic dialect! Very interesting to see the Old Country, so to speak!
What about the Greeks in Rhodos, Crete and Cypres, don't they speak an archaic form of the Greek language?
Yes they do Nichita. Cypriot dialect is probably the closest to the Pontianak dialect called romeicanand then Rodes. The Pontianak dialect, dialect because it is part of the Greek language, is the closest we come today to the language spoken by the greatest poet Homer. You should be proud being Pontian
If you have the opportunity to visit the village of Olymbos/Avlona on the island of Karpathos, you will hear this ancient form you speak of. Quickly though, as the ones who speak it are getting old. :-) Karpathos is in between Crete and Rhodos.
Thanks, I appreciate the tip.
There is a continuity in the language.ALL modern Greek words have roots in ancient Greek,it is ONE language that has been evolving through the centuries.
Re your question,well there is a variety in the easiness of undestanding.For e.x, Xenophon is rather easy to undestand while Homer is more difficult and with much richer vocabulary.Sadly ,Ancient Greek was pronounced more musically while modern Greek sounds a bit flat in comparison.
Best Regards from Athens
Proud to be a speaker of romeica long live trapeza
I've been studying ancient Greek in school for three years so this is fascinating to me!
we have many Greek neighbors in Trabzon
Hellenic spirit will never die even if Greece cease to exist! It's like the sun or the rain you can't live without it.
Wow...I was pretty astonished when I found out about this endangered dialect of Greek...I am Greek and I care a lot about my language.I would really like to find more information about the dialect!
I am from turkey and my family speaks romeika its not a dead language but its dying
😢😓
This is wonderful and beautiful. I wish you all the best in your research and endeavours to preserve this language. Thanks for posting!
You can take lessons of Pontiaka or Romeika as you call it in Thessaloniki Greece. Actually here it's very common among elders. I'm surprised you didn't know or mention it. Κρούει καλόν τοξάρ.
It's not completely true: Recent research has shown Romeyka diverged from standard Pontic dialect of Koine between 12 and 15th centruy, even way before the Turks came to the area. So you see Romeyka has some 800 years of it's own history in the remote villages of east Trabzon province. Pontic from the cities changed alot in the meantime, and even in villages as Greek schools were constructed in the 18th and 19th centuries, they only taught Modern Greek, not the local vernacular! This in contrast to the muslim schools in the Of-valley (Katahor), where some teachers even taught in Romeyka. So Romeyka has preserved more archaisms even compared to other Pontic languages, and it's divergence started before the conversion of this people to islam (17th centruy). And yes, there are some Christian Romeyka speakers who came from Of, Caykara, but the mayority there were muslim since many centuries. From archeological evidence it's suggested the region was only heavily settled after the 13th century. This coincides with the establishment of the republic of Trebizond, and the closing of the monastaries (centralised power in Trebizond required new churches and monastaries to be built and maintained in the capital). Incidentally there are no monastaries or even remains of churches in the area where Romeyka was origionally spoken (east of Trebizond), and no stone mosques that could have been constructed using stones of these buildings.... So this is truely a diffrent group with a distinct history and language. It's also mentioned in the memoires of many other Pontic Greeks who came to Thessaloniki; that there was a group of muslims who remained behind and spoke a very archaic version of their language.
I am a Pontian my family is from Black sea
My mom can understand and even speak some of the language but she never taught me. I'm glad I can speak modern Greek though 😔
classical greek never died, greek is a language that evolved, it's simply that. And this is a les evolved form of the language.
Fascinating but too short!!! I was really curious to get more details about this -- for example to understand how studying Romaiica could correct misconceptions about how ancient Greek actually sounded.
This scholar is doing a very important work! Go on!
its called romeika because it is the roman language when the roman empire was greek and the greek refered to themselves and their language as roman (we call it today falsely "byzantine" empire) , its not ancient greek but medieval greek , which is not used anymore except in greek orthodox church
My families homeland! Stunning!!!!
What a beautiful country, beautiful language.....
That's amazing! And very touching...
This is not ancient Greek but is closer than of the rest Greek accents..
More Mediaeval Greek. People should read the Epic of Digenis Akritas, a literature piece from the middle ages.
Και τα σαρακατσανικα μοιαζουν πολυ με τα αρχαια :-)
#acanpc333 Romeika = Pontic Greek dialect, you can call it Romeika or Pontiaka.
this is a wonderful breakthrough for evolutionary linguistics, please don't politicise it
25% of my DNA comes from that region. I am Greek Cypriot
This language must be preserved.
I agree!Nowadays idioms that survived from the classical languages arent only found in Pontos,but also in Arkadia & Lakonia,as tsakonik,which has a totally doric syntaxis,Cyprus,Crete and the Salentina Grecia,a region in south Italy.We shouldnt forget that greek in Greece varies a lot.Eexample: 3d person in plural, verb κάθομαι in παρατατικός(I seat somewhere) ηκαθόντανε,εκαθούντονε,εκαθόντασι,κάθουνταν,ήκανταν,κάουνταν & many others,despite the formal modern καθόντουσαν.
Συγκινητικό βίντεο, είμαι Πόντια και κατάλαβα τα ρωμεϊκα γιατί τα μιλάω κι εγώ.Ειμαι Περήφανη για την ράτσα μου!!! Ελληνίδα Πόντια ❤
Why are you proud to be a Greek? It is embarrassing that turks invaded pontus and I am a turk 😂
Romeika used to be spoken by many pontic greeks in the Black sea coasts of Russia and Ukraine. By now most of them are either assimilated or prefer to learn modern Greek
So interesting! Are these people aware of their Greekness?
*****
Do you speak loudly about your Greek origins there? Or is it kind of "forbidden"?
OMG! My mom would love this thread.
..just a little but very important correction, classical Greek are not dead…Greek language has a continuity until today!! ❤
this dialect had other infuelces, it has similarities with the modern greek dialect as it does with the ancient but there is something in the pronunciation that my guess is they got from the other languages in the area.
This dialect sounds incredibly familiar with the pontian dialect if its not some sort of it
I am Greek but not Pontiac and I have no heritage from M. Asia but understand a lot of what those ladies were saying, not everything but still! The sound very similar to pontiac dialect!!!
Love from Greece!
Trojans were Frygians, a nation relative with the Greek. They worshiped the same Gods though and their language was quite understantable. As far as the Turks you are totally right. They came in that peninsula in about 1000 AD
What about the Greeks in Rhodos, Crete and Cypres, don't they speak an archaic form of the Greek language?
As well as the little island in between Crete and Rhodes. The island of Karpathos. Particularly Northern Karpathos. Olymbos, Diafani Saria.
That is damn interesting ! I wish they had some videos of them speaking the language w/t all this distraction. I want to know if they have preserved the pitch accent pronunciation and how it sounds !
Pontic Greek is fascinating, as well as the history of its speakers.
But, actually, infinitive is also used in Calabrian Greek, although this mostly happens after the verb "sonno" ("to can"): i.e. "sonno ipi" ("I can say" < σώζω ειπείν).
Excellent video! We should all strive to protect and embrace our language origins. Thank you so much. The song with the lyra, is beautiful.
Pontos is alive
@erdal0
Actually these are greeks :) my english teacher is a greek of pontian descent and her both parents speak this dialect and they have no turkish influence on them.
My grandpa my great grandfather my mom spoke this i learnt it a bit
Η Ρωμιοσύνη έν' να χαθεί, όντας ο κόσμος λείψει!
In Thessaly, where my parents are from, They use the word "Koutzkos" meaning small, tiny, dainty and the word "Sita" meaning fencing.
These words are not "Nouveau Greek" but have roots in Romaic Greece.
Furthermore, my grandmothers last name was Argyros and that has Romaic roots....Ex Romanos Argyros as in the Romaic Emperor
congratulations for the uploading!
Amazing ! could we have more videos of the people talking with subtitles so that we can try to understand some of it please.
¿Qué tan aislada está esta comunidad de otras? Normalmente el poco cambio de una lengua se debe a su bajo contacto con otras variantes dialectales y a la relativamente poca población con la que cuenta. En México, por ejemplo, en las comunidades rurales más herméticas, se conservan formas de español que tienen mucho sabor a español del Quijote.
Greek language is the mother of all languages.
The land of light and humanity.
trojans were just another hellenic state that spoke a different dialect. the trojan war or the iliad was rather a civil war than a war between different nations. Hellas was the name used to establish the hellenic regions (hellas means the land of the light). The war wasnt between greeks and trojans, but between the achaeans and the trojans, both were greek from different states. It was common for 2 states to fight each other, for example sparta and athens, macedonia and thebes etc.
romeika is a dialect very close gramatically to pontian dialect spoken in salonica westerrn macedonia and in some athens regions...in 2004 groups form salonica visited those places .. and videotaped this meeting ..
The groupings as you mention them are roughly as followingly
Northwestern (Aetolian, Epirot, Macedonian, Doric)
Central (Aeolian, Boetian)
Eastern (Ionian)
Southern (Arcadian-Cypriot)
However even this more elaborate analysis is incomplete as it is a phographic fragment of the history of Greek language. For example Mycenaean Greek is a Greek dialect that relates to all but not at all to any particular of these descendant dialects as one would expect (particularly the Arcadian/Ionian one).
usefull romeika words ...Δεξάμενος - Νονός - Deksamenos - Godfather Εποίκα - Έκανα - Epika - I did ancient greek =εποιηκα Λαλάτς - Πέτρα - Lalats - Stone (απο την Ομηρική λέξη Λάας - Λίθος) Μωμόγερος - Momogeros (see Μομογέροι - Momegoeroi) (απο την Ομηρική λέξη Ομωγέρ) Ομνώ - Ορκίζομαι - Omno - I swear (on oath) ancients greek = ομνυω
God bless you !
Dr Loanna Sitaridou: How many years are you into this research ? Audibly record everything the Elders can speak NOW !
Actually Greek was read both left to right and right to left.It was called Boedromion,or as the bull plows.
Ελλάδα παντού,κουράγιο αδέρφια.
Is Romaeika linguistically close to Pontian? and how about the other greek dialects/languages spoken across Turkey before 1922? Like in Constantinople, and the Aegean and Mediterranean coasts? I assume a lot of "Turks" in those regions are descended from Greek who'd been assimilated centuries before. It'd be cool to learn how the peoples of Anatolia melded and were transformed into today's Turks. It'd be even cooler if Turks were more aware and involved with that side of their heritage
MashaAllah! This is amazing. I would love to learn this language.
Please......what is the name of the song that plays in the background? I hear an Aulos being played!
@ThePortakalos
With the knife above their head and the prospect of loosing everything, some of them changed faith (nothing to do about being turk and nothing to do about a free decision) and some others left forever. I am a proud descendant of "the others" but I know that people that still speak greek on those remote regions are my brothers no matter their faith.
These are pontiac...
My homeland. The pontiac genocide was commited from Turkey on 1915...
yok artık.
+ExVeritateLibertas well-said, long live Hellenic Pontos, 1914-1923: we will never forget!
ExVeritateLibertas I think that's not true.
There is a lesson to be learned here by us humans. that wars and violence can NOT kill the spirit of mankind and the human basic instincts of survival, productivity and ever-existence!
Greetings from Surmena Trabzon..
Is this really a different dialect from the Pontic Greek spoken by the Christians who were expelled from the same region a century ago? Dr Sitar-*idou* is presumably using her grandparents' Pontic dialect to communicate with these people.
where my grandparents are from! i love this video so much
You're so well learned!
Il greco del Ponto Eusino
What about Pontians in Greece. The most of them are able to speak Pontiaka. I am not a Pontian at all but I learnt the language approximately 58 Pontian dances and now I am learning Kemence.
amazing
@Codylangaugesblog Hey! I found this video through your channel! VIEL DANK!
I think in order to truly appreciate this language, one would have to learn both Ancient and Modern Greek. And Turkish as well.
Unfortunately, because of an Age-old tyrant named Time, my copy of TEACH YOURSELF ANCIENt GREEK has remained unopened for months...
there is in algeria also a region called thiberkent
Fascinating! How about the music in the background? Is that from the same group? Is this a typical folk or even the music is different?
languages are to connect people , to help them communicate and discover their roots, not to separate them.....
Unfortunately guns dominated our world, not dialogue....
@SeleneFaery You can't say that it is the most difficult language on the planet. For one thing, it is no longer spoken. Also, one cannot judge how complex or difficult a language is inherently because there is no basis to compare all languages. The best you can really do is compare how hard the language is to learn for speakers of different languages. Even then, there will be biased based off of how the person is learning the language.
This is pontic greek
Are there any extended videos of the speakers using their own language?
1:53 ahgghhghggghghg - does this mean "beautiful" ?
dude, this is cool
I am not linguistics teacher or professor or something similar. I understand 100 % of what they speak. I also undey every video of "rumtza" speaking , wihtout learning enything. Do you know why? Because my father speaks pontic , also my grandparents do.
The language of the Archaic and Classical periods was not at all formed by the so-called '"Dorian invasions''. Dorians always were a part of Greece and their presence is attested in central-south Greece since Mycenaean era (immigrants, mercenaries etc.). They were the Northwestern branch of Greeks of Epirot-Macedonian regional stock. Large parts of Greece did not see any Dorian influx. Ionian and Aeolian accents in Minor Asia evolved themselves.
Cypriot dialect of Greek is more closer to ancient Greek than the Greek they speak in Greece.
This is Medieaval Greek not ancient Greek.
Ancient Greek is from 600 to 300 BC. Koine Greek is later about Christ's time. This is Byzantine Greek. Read Digenis Akritas. You will understand.
***** I know Greek through all its different stages in history. eg. wine, oinos was Foinos (vinos) in archaic greek of the mycenean age. The digamma was lost and many hard consonants became less harsh sounding.
Ok. They are using some medieaval Greek nouns and some ancient. The sentence structure is not ancient greek. Its betweeen koine and medieaval greek. They are even using many Turkish words. Are you Pontian? The sounds they are making are very turkish influenced. Te way they say P for example is very Turkish.
Bill Barbagiannis It's classical Greek!
Its not classical Greek.
fascinating. Can I ask, in what alphabet is this dialect written?
Greek alphabet
Wow, that's amazing!
0:30 nope the Greek language is very much alive. Ancient Greek is not dead.
Just because it preserves the infinitive form???
This video is a scientific contribution to better understanding of Hellenic culture and κοινή. Let’s not forget it is the fundament of Western civilization. There is no place for chauvinist comments here; it is disappointing. Personally, I find modern Greeks being too obsessed with ancient Hellenic heritage; why do we NEVER hear an Italian claiming he or she is an Ancient Roman and everything in the Mediterranean should be Italy? They tried it only under the fascists.
I want to know more about it!
I remember now... modern Greek verbs have no infinitives... very striking. Θέλω να γράψω ένα γράμμα. So is that a subjunctive?
Everything there are Hellenic....language, cities, ancient buildings.. and only there. Turkish state affraid of these aituations, but they have comitted a genocide against Hellenic people (who were living there for 4000 years( and Armenians.
CYPRUS TO STILL SPEAK ANCIENT GREEK !!!!!!!!!
fascinating!
There is a little mistake in the description. Romeika, as mentioned in the video, is spoken in the area around Trebizond, which actually lies in North-western Turkey, not eastern.